August 4, 2025 • 45 mins
How can podcasting help you to establish credibility and craft an authentic personal brand?
Our guest podcaster is Christine Gritmon, host of Let's Talk About Brand.
After building "a fantastic audience of peers" who weren't hiring her for social media strategy but wanted to develop their own personal brands, Christine pivoted her focus—a decision that transformed her business.
With a journalist's curiosity she now delves into the stories behind successful personal brands, particularly fascinated by "the person before the person I see before me today."
Christine talks about how podcasting can build your reputation even when nobody's listening. "People do look at the fact that you have a podcast, even if they don't listen to it," she explains. The medium provides proof that you can engage in unscripted, intelligent conversation about your area of expertise—a powerful demonstration of knowledge that written content alone can't provide. For independent creators struggling with the feeling of "shouting into the void," this perspective offers a refreshing reframe.
The episode also introduces the concept of "value exchange" as a new framework for understanding creator–audience relationships beyond simple transactions. Through platforms like TrueFans, creators deliver content value while audiences reciprocate with both financial support (micropayments, subscriptions) and engagement (comments, sharing).
In the wider world, we touch on the Ear Worthy Awards for independent podcasters, what Spotify do with your show art, Secure RSS and three simple ways to get your podcast featured on the TrueFans home page.
Here's some of what you'll hear in this episode:
- Even when download numbers aren't impressive, having a podcast builds credibility and associates your name with your area of expertise
- Podcasting demonstrates your ability to have intelligent, unscripted conversations that showcase your knowledge
- Podcasting offers creative freedom that allows creators to experiment and evolve their content according to their own vision
- Using tools like Descript can streamline the editing process while preserving the natural character of conversations
- Sam introduces the concept of "value exchange" to frame TrueFans as a platform where creators deliver content value and fans reciprocate with both tangible and intangible support
- New industry developments include Spotify's shift to 16:9 cover art and Secure RSS technology for combined premium and freemium podcast content
- Independent podcasters can now purchase featured placements on the TrueFans home page
- The Ear Worthy Awards nominees for indie podcasters have been announced
Discover how podcasting offers unparalleled creative freedom while building your professional credibility, and learn about new opportunities for independent creators to boost their visibility through TrueFans' featured placements.
Listen to Let's Talk About Brand here
Find TrueFans here
Music: How It Is from Ketsa Music
Feedback: TrueFans Support
Read: Creators Blog
Recommendations: Creators Podroll
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Christine Gritmon (00:06):
I feel like it also shows that you can have
a conversation, that you canactually speak.
I have ample evidence of me onactual literal stages as well,
but for someone who doesn'tgetting on podcasts, having
those live, unfilteredconversations, showing that you
know what the heck you'retalking about without reading it
off, I think is incrediblypowerful.
Claire Waite Brown (00:30):
It's your show.
You can do it how you want.
You haven't got anybody sayingit has to be out every week.
It has to be 30 minutes exactlyand you have to cover these
points.
Sam Sethi (00:39):
So there's many ways that you can give value back to
creators.
That isn't just a monetaryvalue.
So I like the word valueexchange really to describe
TrueFans.
It's value from creators tofans and fans giving value back
to creators.
Claire Waite Brown (00:54):
Welcome to Creators from TrueFans.
I'm independent podcaster,claire Waite Brown.
Sam Sethi (01:01):
And I'm Sam Sethi, the CEO of TrueFans.
Claire Waite Brown (01:03):
Each episode , we'll chat with an independent
creator, whether a podcaster ormusician, about their creative
experiences.
Sam Sethi (01:11):
And we'll answer questions from independent
creators about the TrueFansfeatures that can help them with
discovery, interactivity andmonetization.
Claire Waite Brown (01:21):
We'll get interactive and see what our
listeners have been saying inthe comments and super comments.
Sam Sethi (01:27):
And discuss what's happening in the wider world.
That could be a benefit toindependent creators.
Claire Waite Brown (01:33):
Hi Claire, Hi Sam, how are you?
Sam Sethi (01:36):
Very well.
A little bit tired, but very,very well.
Brilliant this week, Claire,our featured independent podcast
is let's Talk About Brand.
Claire Waite Brown (01:48):
That's right , and here is my chat with
Christine.
I'm here chatting withChristine Grittman.
Hi, christine, how are you Good?
Claire, how are you doing?
I'm very well, thank you.
Start by telling us, please,the name of your podcast, and
what is it all about?
Christine Gritmon (02:03):
All right, my podcast is let's Talk About
Brand and there's severalseasons of it and it has evolved
over the years, so, dependingon what season you look at, but
it has always been aboutpersonal branding, and what it
is now is.
I hear the stories of peoplewho have strong personal brands
and how they built them, andthen we do what I like to call
the Christine Gritmon bit, wherewe dig into the deeper
(02:26):
motivations behind them and whatthey do and what truly lights
them up and what they actuallydeliver beyond what it says on
the tin, because that, to me, isthe most important and
interesting bit of a strongpersonal brand, which is what's
beneath it, beyond, like thewindow dressing and the colors
and the fonts and all that stuff.
Claire Waite Brown (02:45):
Yeah, interesting.
Why did you start the podcast?
Christine Gritmon (02:56):
My first show .
It was a live stream calledSocial, and it was about social
media, and I started that in2017, mostly to take advantage
of the fact that I just met aload of really brilliant people
at Social Media Marketing Worldand I wanted to keep in touch
with them and I wanted to sharetheir brilliance with others,
partially to build my name,honestly, as the person who
brought them to you, and so thatwent on till 2020.
And in 2020, I made a decisionto go harder into the personal
(03:19):
branding element of what I did,because I built a really
fantastic audience of my peers,which was great in terms of
opportunities, like my peerswere the ones who could give me
big stages and give me, you know, visibility and all of that.
But my peers weren't the oneshiring me for social media
strategy.
But my peers did notice I had astrong personal brand and they
wanted one.
(03:39):
So I said you know what?
I'm going to go harder on thispersonal branding thing.
So when I came back from myannual August hiatus in August
2020, it was with a brand newshow.
Let's Talk About Brand, and that, too, was originally a live
stream that I then laterreleased in podcast form, and it
(04:00):
also had a companion Twitterchat chat about brand that I
absolutely loved.
It was a highlight of my weekand over the years, various
things about it evolved,including a couple of years in
it went podcast first, so I nolonger had a live stream of it,
I had a podcast of it and youcould then watch the full video
of it on YouTube if you wished.
I've only recently gotten ridof that element because now the
(04:23):
podcast is a bit more edited.
I used to barely touch it andnow I edit it a little bit more,
so now it is straight up apodcast, and the Twitter chat,
of course, went by the waysidein 2023 and I miss it terribly,
in addition to the fact that Iwas focusing more on personal
branding being why I started.
Let's Talk About Brand.
(04:44):
I love people's stories.
I was a journalist before this.
I literally have quote markstattooed behind my ears because
I love hearing people's stories.
I'm fascinated by you know theperson behind the person I see
before me today and the personbefore the person I see before
me today, and how they got there, and especially people who are
known, who are respected, whohave developed that visibility
(05:08):
and trust in their industries.
I'm fascinated to hear how theygot there, and I think it's
very useful for other people aswell, because it's very easy to
look at them and not realizethat they actually started out.
You know no further along thanthe person listening is, and
that's another thing.
As I got more into getting toknow people who had done great
(05:29):
things and who were on huge,amazing stages and commending
huge fees and all that, as I gotto know more successful people,
the more I realized that theyare, in fact, just people, and
getting them down to that level.
I love that because they've alldone a million interviews that
are identical People asking themabout the things that they are
known for and that they speak onstages about, and I want to
(05:51):
hear the stuff that not everyonehears, the story of before they
had any of that and how theybuilt it.
The early days the early daysare so much more interesting to
me than you know the presentsuccess interesting to me than
you know, the present success.
Claire Waite Brown (06:09):
I think.
Often it's a story of eventsand things leading up to what
happens now, that you wouldn'texpect those events to lead to
what happens now, and how thoseall come together in retrospect.
Speaking of the people, how doyou choose the people that you
want to be guests on your show?
Christine Gritmon (06:23):
choose the people that you want to be
guests on your show.
Goodness, that's evolved aswell.
Originally it was people I knewhad relationships with.
Occasionally it would besomeone who I wouldn't say I had
a real relationship with, buthad met at an event who was a
big deal, and through a mutualfriend I got kind of in, but
generally it was my friends.
Then I had a bit of a detourbecause my podcast was then
(06:46):
picked up by the Adweek PodcastNetwork, which was a very big
deal visibility wise, but alsomeant a ton of PR agencies were
in my inbox pitching executives,and so there was a season there
.
I believe it's season three,maybe maybe season two, I don't
know, but there's a ton ofpeople on there talking more
corporate.
So it really is less aboutpersonal branding and more about
(07:08):
branding in general.
I still did invite people who Ifound interesting.
So there was still that elementof personal interest scattered
in there.
But then also scattered inthere were people where I saw
the PR pitch.
I said, all right, there is anangle here that could be useful,
because I did say no to a lotof them.
But I said there's an angle inhere that could be useful and so
I had them on.
(07:29):
But I also, briefly at this time, was working with a podcast
producer who I can't afford towork with anymore, but she's one
of my best friends, we talkconstantly and she was saying to
me.
She said, when I'm editing yourpodcast, I can tell if it's
(07:51):
someone you invited or if it wassomeone who came from a PR
pitch.
Yeah, she's like that's not tosay the episodes are bad, but
there's a different level ofpersonal engagement.
I can feel it.
And so, first of all, adweekand I stopped working together,
not because of that they hadmassive budget cuts, but in
addition to that, I said youknow what I want to get back to,
what I care about.
And the aforementioned producer,who's a friend, said also you
need it to benefit your business.
(08:12):
You were not putting yourselfout there to work with
corporates on their branding.
You want to work withindividuals on their personal
branding.
Focus on that.
And she's also the inspirationbehind the Christine Grittman
bit at the end, where I show alittle bit of what I work on
with clients, which is gettingto that deeper side.
I brand from the inside out ismy thing now, where we start
(08:33):
with getting in touch with yourpurpose, your passions, your
unique gifts and what reallylights you up and build your
brand outward from there.
And so what I was doing beforedidn't play to that at all and a
lot of people, a lot of myguests also, weren't getting
deep enough.
They were doing the very kindof service level, corporate
talking points, and I wanted toget a lot deeper.
Claire Waite Brown (08:57):
From a practicality point of view of
making a podcast while alsodoing everything else in life,
with your own business, withyour family.
How do you fit it all in, andare there any tools or any
processes or any softwares thatyou find help you with fitting
(09:19):
it all in?
Christine Gritmon (09:20):
I have not been fitting it all in.
I have been dropping a lot ofballs here.
In fact, at this time thatwe're talking, I have not been
fitting it all in.
I have been dropping a lot ofballs here.
In fact, at this time thatwe're talking, I have not
released an episode in weeks.
I might get one out today, butI'm sitting on like four amazing
ones that I really want to getout there, but I just keep just
the last bits of editing it.
Just it doesn't even have to behard.
(09:40):
It doesn't have to be hard.
It's just my ADHD brain.
Like when I say, okay, we'regoing to sit down and do the
podcast, now it says, or wecould do this other thing.
So I will say don't always getit done.
But the thing that does reallyhelp me get it done is Descript.
I've also heard that programpronounced as Descript, but I
think it's just Descript and thething about Descript that I
love.
So I'm the biggest AI Ludditeyou will ever meet.
(10:03):
I hate generative AI and all ofthat.
I really need to get over it,but I like the level of AI that
Descript does.
It doesn't make stuff up.
It can probably, but I don't dothat I like the fact that as
soon as I upload the file itdoes the transcript right there
and I can edit the transcriptand it edits the podcast and it
(10:24):
automatically underlines thingslike ums and uhs and bits that
are repetitious, so I can justgo and target those.
I can have it just do it itself,but I don't, because I find
that a lot of times the thingsthat it tries to get rid of
actually add character and colorto the speech pattern.
So I can't get rid of that muchof it.
So I do still do it verymanually, which is part of why I
(10:46):
don't just get it out.
It's incredible to be able toedit the words, to be able to
see oh, this bit went on a bitlong, how can I tighten this up?
It's editing like you wouldedit a written document, which
I'm quite good at, and veryrarely I have had a situation
(11:07):
where there's a word in therethat's very important but it got
swallowed up either by bad WiFi or by crosstalk or whatever.
It can regenerate that word andI've only ever used the vocal
generation on like a single wordwhen it's that type of
situation, but it has beenincredibly helpful, like a
(11:28):
couple of times when I don'twant to cut that sentence.
That sentence is great, whatthey're saying is great, but
that important word at the endof the sentence is just lost
Brilliant.
Claire Waite Brown (11:40):
It's good to have those options as well,
because you edit by seeing.
I tend to edit big chunks outby the words and then I edit
everything else by listening,but it gives people the
(12:00):
flexibility to be able to createa show based on how they work
best, which is super.
What is one thing thatfrustrates you about podcasting
and one thing that excites youabout it?
Christine Gritmon (12:06):
It frustrates me that it does still feel like
putting it out into the void.
I feel like it's a bit trickyto figure out how to boost
listenership.
What leads to greaterlistenership or downloads on a
given episode or not?
At first I thought maybe it was, you know, the guest.
No, it's not the guest.
Then I thought maybe it's ifthe guest shares or not.
(12:27):
No, not necessarily Is it.
You know, when I send an emailversus when I don't, that does
make a bit of a difference, butnot enough of one.
So how do you get people tolisten?
That's very frustrating to me.
It does very much feel like I'moperating in the dark in so
many ways, because there's alsonot a lot of data to make
data-driven decisions on.
What I do like about it is, asI said, I love people's stories.
(12:49):
I love learning from people.
Hearing how other people havedone.
It makes me so much better atmy job, quite frankly, and it
does get me out there.
People do look at the fact thatyou have a podcast, even if they
don't listen to it.
The fact that you have apodcast makes people go ah.
Then when they see what it'sabout, and it further gets your
name connected with those words.
(13:09):
Your name is connected withcreativity.
My name is connected withbranding, partially because of
these podcasts.
And then there's the fact thatthey see the guests that you
have and they see the podcaststhat you yourself have guested
on, which you get more of if youhave a podcast, and that also
builds your reputation.
So even if people never listento your podcast, it has so much
(13:34):
juice in there.
I mean, I was on Pat Flynn'spodcast and he was on mine.
That's a big honking deal andso it's kind of nice to it's.
It's a good cap to put feathersin.
Claire Waite Brown (13:45):
Essentially, yeah, that's quite funny about
people don't actually have tohave listened to the podcast,
but you can show them whereyou've been.
Christine Gritmon (13:52):
I would like them to, not only not only
because I actually do have adsin my podcast, so like I will
get you know a few pence if youlisten, but also like I do want
people to listen because I thinkthese conversations are amazing
.
I've enjoyed having them.
I think I also sound prettysmart on them, because that's
another thing about a podcast.
(14:13):
People do scripted podcasts,but the fact is something like
this it's obviously not scripted.
We're having a conversation andsame with my podcast, so I feel
like it also shows that you canhave a conversation, that you
can actually speak.
I have ample evidence of me onactual, literal stages as well.
But for someone who doesn'tgetting on podcasts, having
(14:34):
those live, unfilteredconversations, showing that you
know what the heck you'retalking about without reading it
off, I think is incrediblypowerful.
Claire Waite Brown (14:44):
Yeah, this is all building into what you're
talking about, which is yourbrand and the person's brand,
and part of that brand is youknow what you're talking about.
My understanding of this show,as well as being a passion of
yours, is that it promotes you,so, from a financial point of
view, it probably feeds intothat's my question, okay, no, no
(15:07):
, so keeping it real, folks, nothank you for that.
Okay, so like the basicquestion on my piece of paper is
does your podcast receive anyfinancial support?
Christine Gritmon (15:24):
if time is money, I'm dumping a ton of it
into my podcast.
So, first of all, I was part ofthe Adweek podcast network,
right?
So I had the ads that thatnetwork had purchased on there,
and there was a small ad for meon some other people's podcasts
in the network.
That was lovely.
And Adweek did it with Acastand Acast has their own ad
(15:46):
network as well.
And so when I was no longerwith Adweek, acast generously
said okay, so normally ourthreshold for being able to
monetize your podcast is moredownloads than you have, but
because you came to us as partof the Adweek network and we
don't want you to go leave, wewill extend that to you.
(16:08):
So I do not have enoughdownloads regularly to be able
to monetize as part of the ACASTpodcast network, but I am
anyway in theory, because theywere very kind.
You got a little backdoor inthere, yeah, and again, it would
be lovely if I had moredownloads, because then I was.
(16:29):
But at the same time, if I keepnot getting the episodes out in
a timely fashion, you know I'mpart of the problem.
There's things I could be doing.
Claire Waite Brown (16:37):
Ok, I'm going to go on to the Now.
You sent me the answer to thisquestion on an email and I
wonder whether it's changedsince a few days ago.
And that question is aboutpodcasting 2.0, which is a
phrase I don't know what that is.
Christine Gritmon (16:52):
You don't know what that is.
What is podcasting?
Claire Waite Brown (16:55):
2.0?
That hasn't changed, then,basically, there are some extra
features that can now beincluded in your RSS feed If
your hosting company, forexample Creativity Found, is
hosted on Buzzsprout, and theymake it really easy for me to
put in a transcript, to put inchapters, to put in a photograph
(17:15):
of my guest, which I will bedoing for this one.
You're welcome everybody.
Recommendations as well, sorecommendations for other shows.
So all of these things can bereally useful for independent
creators, for helping them toget discovered, for helping them
to interact with theirlisteners and, in some cases,
(17:39):
earning a little bit of money aswell.
Christine Gritmon (17:41):
I think those are incredible features and I
think they really point to thefact that podcasting has become
a rich form of media.
It's not passive entertainment,it's become its own thing and
tying it into also evendifferent learning styles,
different ways people consumeinformation.
Accessibility even, you know,having those transcripts in
(18:03):
there mean that someone hearingimpaired can enjoy your podcast.
So I think that there's so many.
I love everything you just saidabout podcasting 2.0 and the
things that it can do.
Claire Waite Brown (18:16):
The other thing of course you know now,
christine, because you sent thecomment on TrueFans that got you
onto this episode is thatwithin that app, people can talk
to you as a podcaster or talkto other listeners, can leave
comments.
You could tell your listeners,like, if you listen on TrueFans,
(18:36):
you can leave me a comment, andthen you won't want to do this
because it will be extra work.
You could then say and if youleave me a comment, I'll read it
out.
for example If you want to payme to do it, I mean I'm down for
example, if you want to pay meto do it, I mean I'm down Well.
Well, okay, I have paid you.
I have paid you, okay, I'vebeen listening to your show for
(18:58):
my research and I have paid youone penny per minute that I've
been listening, thank you.
So when you claim your show onTrueFans, you'll be given this
digital wallet and it'll have alittle bit of money from me in
it.
Thank you, TrueFans.
Then, generally, if in thefuture you tell your listeners
(19:19):
to listen on TrueFans and thatthey can do this thing where
they pay you a little tinyamount for the time that they
listen, then at some point youcan go to that wallet and you
can go withdraw and you can sendthat money to Stripe and then
you can take it and buy yourselfa cup of tea.
Christine Gritmon (19:34):
I did set that up.
When you told me about TrueFans, I did go and set up my profile
and all that, and I'm not sureif it took the RSS feed.
I think that Acast was having abit of a hiccup that day, so
I'll take a look again.
Claire Waite Brown (19:46):
It'll get the RSS from Acast.
That's fine, you don't need todo anything else.
Christine Gritmon (19:50):
Were you listening to my podcast on
TrueFans?
Because then it worked, okay.
Well, then it worked Good.
All right, I'll have to checkmy wallet then, yeah.
Claire Waite Brown (19:58):
Brilliant.
Thank you so much, Christine.
Thank you, Claire.
Christine Gritmon (20:02):
Give me some places, all the places where
people can find you All rightBest places, gritmon.
com, g-r-i-t like whensomething's gritty like sand,
and M-O-N like Monday.
You can see I've had to spellit before.
I just redid gritmon.
com, so that is much nicer thanit used to be, thanks to the
(20:25):
lovely Hannah Dossery of ShinyHappy Digital.
And so, yeah, gritmon.
com, I'm Christine Gritmon.
I'm the only Christine Gritmon,so I'm pretty easy to find
LinkedIn, instagram.
I'm not on Facebook so muchlately anymore, unfortunately,
but I am there and Let's TalkAbout Brand has its own
Instagram and its own LinkedInspotlight page, so follow, Let's
Talk About Brand on Instagramand on LinkedIn and in all of
(20:48):
these places there are places tojoin my email list, which will
also keep you up to date on allof that, if I do it when I get
around to emailing people.
Claire Waite Brown (21:00):
Fantastic.
Thank you so much, Christine.
It's been fabulous to chat.
Thank you.
Sam Sethi (21:06):
I like what Christine had to say there about
podcasting being beneficial forbuilding your reputation.
I fully agree, whether guestingon other people's shows or
hosting your own.
Yes, we've done a lot of thatas well, haven't we?
Absolutely.
There's more from Christine atthe end of this episode when she
talks about the future of herpodcast and the flexibility that
(21:27):
podcasting offers independentcreators, as well as how that
relates to running your ownbusiness.
Claire Waite Brown (21:34):
That's right .
It is easy to find let's TalkAbout brand on TrueFans right
now because it is featured inthe banner at the top of the
home screen and in the Podcastswe're Loving list, which is also
on the home screen.
If you'd like to chat with usabout your independent podcast
or your music, send a comment orsuper comment in TrueFans to
(21:57):
any Creators episode by clickingon the speech bubble icon or on
the comments tab.
Sam Sethi (22:04):
Questions Claire questions questions.
It's where we have a little bitof interactivity.
Which question have you chosento ask me this week?
Claire Waite Brown (22:12):
Well, I've got two questions actually, sam.
Sam Sethi (22:14):
Okay.
Claire Waite Brown (22:15):
I've seen you talking about this and it's
about a way you're describingTrueFans.
So what do you mean?
I mean, are we talking about alistening app, a marketplace or
a platform?
Tell me a bit more about yourthoughts.
Sam Sethi (22:34):
Yeah, so traditionally, you know, we
would talk about Facebook beinga platform.
We would talk about Patreon orMemberful being a marketplace
where you can go and buy or sellcontent.
And then you get thetraditional listening apps, you
know, pocket Casts or Overcastsor Apple, and I didn't really
think any of those fitted whatTrueFans really is.
And I came across this word orwords this week.
(22:54):
It was sort of an epiphanymoment and I think it fits very
well.
I'm calling TrueFans a valueexchange, a bit like a stock
exchange.
Let me explain Instead of amarketplace or platform, I think
we will use this word todescribe TrueFans, because
creators, independent orotherwise, the value they create
(23:14):
is in the content they deliver.
So you could be delivering apodcast, music, an audiobook,
film, whatever, and then thevalue you receive back, the
exchange in value from your fans, can be both tangible or
intangible.
So tangible value value ismoney, so it could be a
micropayment, so in our case,streaming micropayments or super
(23:35):
comments or a subscription.
But there are intangible valuesthat you give back as well to
creators.
So I might share your podcastto my social endpoints, you know
, on X or threads I mightactually just leave you a
comment without a payment.
So there's many ways that youcan give value back to creators.
That isn't just a monetaryvalue.
(23:56):
So I like the word valueexchange really to describe
TrueFans.
It's value from creators tofans and fans giving value back
to creators.
Claire Waite Brown (24:05):
I think it sums it up very well, thank you.
Sam Sethi (24:08):
What's your other question?
Claire Waite Brown (24:09):
Claire Sums it up very well, thank you.
What's your other question,claire?
Well, I am aware that you'vecome up with another good idea.
Sam Sethi (24:14):
Well, can I just be clear it's you who came up with
a good idea that I just nicked.
Claire Waite Brown (24:20):
Really Okay.
I don't remember coming up withthat good idea.
Sam Sethi (24:24):
Oh, we must have had one too many of those glasses of
champagne there.
Claire Waite Brown (24:27):
Oh, okay, yes, Okay, super it those
glasses of champagne there.
Oh, okay, yes, okay, super itis about uh, once again, we talk
a lot about discovery forpodcasters, and you have come up
with or we have apparently comeup with a new way that we can
help podcasters to be found.
So, sam, how can any podcasterget their show featured on the
(24:52):
homepage or the carousel, or thecarousels on TrueFans?
Sam Sethi (24:57):
OK, there are two current ways and we've added a
third.
The first way is obviously tobe a guest on this show and then
Claire, you will feature themon the carousel or homepage or
both.
The second way is, between meor Claire, we might actually
just feature you.
You don't have to be a guest.
We might think it's a greatpodcast we want to feature.
But the third way is we willallow you to now buy your place
(25:20):
on the homepage or a carousel.
We are putting that together.
That will go live, hopefullythis week, if not certainly next
week.
It will be live.
And so you go into your podcastdashboard on TrueFancy.
You've claimed your podcast.
You go into the back end.
You'll be able to see a new buybutton.
When you click on that buybutton it'll say hero image, the
header images or carousel, andso the header image is easy.
(25:43):
You know I want to be on here.
You just say yes, pay theamount it comes out of your
wallet, or you can pay throughstripe.
Whichever way you want, andthen that will get featured.
Now we have only five featuredpodcasts on the home page and
five features on the music page.
So once all five are gone, thebuy button will be disabled
until that person has stoppedpaying.
(26:03):
So you can only pay for acouple of weeks.
We're not allowing you to buymonths and years of it.
So that's one one way.
The other way is on thecarousel.
So you can choose a countrycarousel based on your IP.
But you can choose to be onanother country.
You just drop the down list andsay I want to be featured in
Cambodia or Guatemala orSingapore, and you can be
(26:23):
featured there as well.
We are going to add an updateto that which will allow you to
also be featured on the categorycarousels.
So eventually we will allow youto say actually, I just want to
be in the UK on health andfitness rather than just the UK
carousel.
So there's multiple ways.
We're working on it, but Ithink it's a great idea, claire,
and we've just implemented itbased on what you told us.
Claire Waite Brown (26:46):
That's really good that other
podcasters can spend a bit oftheir marketing budget to
promote themselves, and I lookforward to finding even more new
shows to listen to.
Sam Sethi (26:57):
Yeah, but I think the nice thing about it is it means
that the creators can choose aswell as us choosing, and the
way we'll differentiate, and wehave to do it this way.
One will say featured, which iswhere you or I have placed it,
and one will say pay.
We have to do that yes, Iunderstand um.
Claire Waite Brown (27:13):
Am I allowed to ask you the question about
costs?
Sam Sethi (27:17):
you are and I can't give you a categorical answer.
I would love to um, we've gotsome ideas and the reason is
Claire, and I'll be honest,there's a uh whatsapp group
where you and other super fansof TrueFans are listed.
I want to share those costswith you.
First, as a group, get yourfeedback as independent podcast
creators.
Does this really feel right?
(27:39):
Are we too high, too low?
Have we got the Goldilocksprice?
And if you then, as a group,tell me no, that's good or no,
you should do this, we willchange it and once we've agreed
at all, then we'll publish it.
So probably in the next episodeof this show, we will be able
to tell you what the price is.
Claire Waite Brown (27:57):
Brilliant, okay, thank you very much.
Sam Sethi (28:00):
Claire.
Time for the fan box.
Have we heard from any of ourlisteners since the last episode
?
Claire Waite Brown (28:06):
Yes, we have .
We have heard from Matt Watts,who was our featured podcaster
on the previous episode ofCreators, his show what's On
your Screen.
Matt said thank you again forinviting me on.
I really enjoyed chatting andhopefully it's made for decent
listening too.
Of course it has.
I'll be sure to direct folkstowards TrueFans in my next
(28:29):
episode, which should be laterthis week, and I'll also be
delving further into the app nowthat that's out in the wild too
, meaning the native app, asopposed to the PWA that we had
previously.
And actually Matt does verykindly point listeners to
TrueFans in his latest veryimaginative and clever episode
(28:50):
of what's On your Screen.
That I really enjoyed, not justbecause it did play a clip from
creators.
So thank you very much for that, matt.
Sam Sethi (28:59):
Thank you very much indeed.
Now let's whiz around the worldvery quickly.
Claire, have you got some newsfrom the world of independent
podcasting that we should talkabout this week?
Claire Waite Brown (29:10):
Yes, absolutely.
It's very exciting.
It's news from Ear Worthy,which can be found on Substack
and other blog sites, and it isa review site that focuses on
independent podcasts.
Focuses on independent podcasts.
Frank Racioppi, who I spokewith about Ear Worthy for our
next episode of Creators, andhis board have announced the
(29:32):
nominees for this year's EarWorthy Awards.
Sam Sethi (29:36):
Nice.
Claire Waite Brown (29:37):
So very nice because obviously it's an award
for independent podcasts.
So Podcasting 2.0 in Practiceand Creativity Found are both
nominated.
Sam Sethi (29:48):
I feel like I should have a round of applause for you
at this moment From your radiodays.
Claire Waite Brown (29:54):
So, yeah, that is super exciting.
And also, pod News WeeklyReview is nominated Something
about this.
Lots of things are really nice,but in my interview with
Christine, she mentionedshouting into the void, and I've
been feeling like that a littlebit recently.
I have to admit I feel like Iam shouting into the void.
So when something like thiscomes in, it really, really
(30:17):
helps and it really boosts apodcaster's feeling of
self-worth and that they aredoing something valuable, as
we've just talked about valueexchange.
You can see all of the nomineesand perhaps find a few new
podcasts to listen to, whichI'll be doing again by looking
up Ear Worthy on Substack, ifyou are not already subscribed
(30:38):
to the newsletter, which I, ofcourse, am.
Winners will be announced onTuesday 26th 26th August, and
good luck to all of you fabulousindie podcasters who are on
that list.
Sam Sethi (30:52):
Just had an idea, Claire.
Claire Waite Brown (30:53):
What Carousel.
Sam Sethi (30:55):
Yes, I think we should create a awards carousel
and, for various differentawards, put the playlist of all
of the awards nominees.
Claire Waite Brown (31:09):
Brilliant, yes, we will do that.
Well, you'll start it and I'llpopulate it.
Excellent, perfect, sam.
What have you spotted this weekthat independent creators or
their fans might also want toknow about?
Sam Sethi (31:20):
yeah, one of the things is is Spotify are now
using 16.9, 16.9, not 0.9, coverart that you see on videos the
ones that you see on YouTube therectangular ones rather than
the square ones, and this isbecause I think Spotify wants to
be YouTube, so they've decidedto squeeze the square cover art
(31:43):
that we all use for podcastinginto a 16.9 letterbox view,
which means it cuts off top andtail of your cover art.
Not very nice, and so I thinkthey didn't announce it until
this week.
They haven't warned creators togo and do anything about it,
but they have done it for theirown internal purposes, so I
(32:05):
think creators should be awarethat this is going to be
something that they need to do,and if it's coming to YouTube
and Spotify, you can imagine itwill come to other platforms
eventually as well.
There is a fix for this.
Thankfully, there is a newpodcast tag called the Image Tag
Just came out a couple of weeksago Within your own RSS feed,
(32:25):
so your host will allow you toupload multiple images.
So you'll have a square coverart, you might have a 16.9 cover
art, you might have a towercover and other formats, and
they will all live within yourrss feed once your host enables
it, and apps like Spotify, ifthey support it, will then go oh
(32:47):
, claire's got a 16.9 image.
We'll use that instead of thesquare one.
Or TrueFans might use the imageas a banner behind your podcast
, right, because that's 16.9 aswell.
So there's a solution to itcoming out.
It's available now.
No one's implemented yet, butit's only brand new.
But I thought people should beaware of what's happening and
(33:09):
start to think about creatingmaybe a canvas 16 9 letterbox
cover art in preparation.
Again, it just means that ascreators, we need to be aware
that we have to have theseassets ready to go and then,
when our hosts support it andthen the apps equally will
support it, then, yeah, we'regoing to get new UIs and
(33:30):
different ways of viewingcontent.
Claire Waite Brown (33:32):
So what will happen is you can put your
pictures of different sizes inwith your hosting company and
then from there, each of theplaces, youtube, spotify will be
able to take the necessaryimage.
So you don't have to doeverything separately, it's all
done in one place Super, duper,brilliant.
Sam Sethi (33:54):
Exactly Now.
The other thing I wanted tohighlight to people was a
technology called Secure RSS.
Now, I won't go into much moredetail than that, but the
challenge for creators today ishow do I make money?
And a lot of creators havetheir freemium content in Apple
or TrueFans or wherever theymight have it.
(34:16):
But they also have premiumcontent which some people are
putting into sites like Patreonor Memberful or Substack, and
the problem with that is, as anindependent podcast creator,
you've got more work means youhave to create a new account on
one of those paywall services,you have to upload a ad free
version of your podcast.
(34:36):
You then have to set a valuefor that and then you have to
instruct your fans to go to thatpay site to listen there when
they're already in another applistening to you.
So you're splitting youraudience, you're doubling your
work, and it feels like therehas to be a better solution, and
so one of the things that we'vedone in TrueFans and others are
(34:59):
adopting now is this newtechnology called Secure RSS,
which means, simply, your hostwould allow you to upload your
episodes as per normal and thentag one as premium and one as
freemium, so you might say themajority of my podcast episodes
are free, but this one here is aspecial interview, or this
(35:19):
one's a some online course orsomething like that, or an audio
book.
This is going to cost you Xamount of money and then apps
like TrueFans will say okay, wewill disable the play button
until you've made that payment.
Once you've got the paymentconfirmed, we'll enable the play
button.
It's all within the same app,not having to drive your
(35:39):
customers to a different place.
It's all within the same hostas well.
So you've got one host,multiple apps, as opposed to
having a Patreon account and ahost account and then sending
your users to have to haveanother account as well.
Yes, I just thought I'dhighlight.
This is the arrow of directionfor the podcast industry to
(36:00):
combine both freemium andpremium in one place.
Claire Waite Brown (36:04):
Yeah, and you've told me before there
would also be the possibility ofapplying that on a chapter
level.
Sam Sethi (36:10):
Yes, so we actually in TrueFans have that working at
the moment.
We haven't pushed it live, sothe idea is even within an
episode.
Yes, you might have chaptersthat are free and then the end
of the book.
Yeah, just as you get to thejuicy bit right, pay me yeah,
and so the way to make money isyeah, we'll tell you later so
(36:35):
yeah, so that's a couple ofthings that I think people
should just be aware of yeah,thank you very much uh Eurowaves
friend of of our creators isAndreea Coscai.
Time came out with the top 100podcasters and, of course,
nobody in Europe was mentioned,and that's not a problem, but
you know it was a little bitmyopic, as usual from the
(36:56):
Americans.
So Valentin Farkas from Orbithas created his list of 100 top
European creators.
You can find that on PodNewsdaily or on Eurowaves.
I highly recommend you go andhave a look.
You might be in there, younever know.
Go and check it out.
And lastly, again just a headsup, two quick things.
(37:16):
Netflix Claire, do you have aNetflix account?
Claire Waite Brown (37:20):
I do currently, so that I can watch
Squid Game.
Sam Sethi (37:23):
Oh, okay, well, uh.
Netflix are on the hunt for apodcast executive for video
podcasts though, so one moreplace to put your podcasts yeah,
we did have a chat in aprevious episode.
Claire Waite Brown (37:37):
You and I talked about what we thought
about netflix and I said, if Ican get it in there for free,
it's just another place it canbe.
Sam Sethi (37:45):
Yeah, yeah but it's also, if you look at it from the
netflix side of the fence, whatthey're looking at is I've
watched a film, I've seen thedocumentary.
I don't know what to do.
Oh, I'll go over to youtube.
Oh, I'll go to spotify.
Oh, I'll go somewhere else.
And if they can keep you withintheir walled garden, that's
(38:05):
what they will do.
And finally, claire, are yougoing to Podcast Movement?
Claire Waite Brown (38:12):
which is in Dallas this year on the 18th of
August.
Sam Sethi (38:14):
Well, having been to America twice this year already,
no, no, I won't be going either, but those that are going, adam
Curry, the inventor ofpodcasting, will be doing a
keynote speech there, which isvery exciting.
There are a lot of peoplemeeting up there, that we know.
Claire.
And yeah, james, my partner onPod News Weekly, and I will be
(38:34):
doing a live podcast fromPodcast Movement.
Claire Waite Brown (38:37):
Oh, brilliant.
Let's hope it gets recordedthis time.
Sam Sethi (38:41):
Oh yes, the London event didn't get recorded,
although we did do it live.
Claire Waite Brown (38:45):
It was very good live and I was privileged
enough to be in the live zone.
Sam Sethi (38:50):
You're in the 100 club.
Claire Waite Brown (38:53):
Brilliant.
Yeah, there's a few.
I've spoken to a few of myindie podcast friends who are in
the States who will be going.
So a little bit jealous buthave a super time.
Sam Sethi (39:01):
Yes, do indeed.
You don't use Rode, do you?
I use Rode.
No, rode is one of the top mics.
I use a Rode XLR mic and I usea Rodecaster Pro, which is great
.
It's probably overkill now, butI used to use it for the radio
station, and they've just addeda new free firmware update to
(39:22):
your Rodecaster Pro 2 orRodecaster Duo.
The idea is like today we'rerecording on Riverside and you
sent me a link to that and Iclicked on the link and now
we're recording.
I can now set up on my Rode afirmware update and then send
you a link to a webpage where wecan then both record the show
(39:43):
to my Rodecaster.
Claire Waite Brown (39:45):
So you already have the hardware, yes,
and the firmware gives you freethis extra capability.
Sam Sethi (39:51):
Exactly, and so if you have that, it may be
something to think about.
Yeah, but they call thisservice Rode, call Me.
Claire Waite Brown (40:00):
Okay, yeah.
Sam Sethi (40:02):
And that's it for this week.
Claire Waite Brown (40:04):
Our audio is recorded on Riverside, edited
by Claire, and we're hosted byour friends Buzzsprout you can
support this show by streamingsats from your TrueFans wallet,
or leave us a super comment or,better still, become a monthly
supporter of the show and ifyou'd like to be a supporter or
sponsor, please email me at sam,at TrueFans, or if you have a
(40:27):
problem with TrueFans, it's thesame inbox.
Sam Sethi (40:29):
Don't worry, I do answer it as well.
Claire Waite Brown (40:31):
You can find out more about how to use the
features of the TrueFansplatform by listening to our
sister podcast Fanz one.
And if you're keen to learnmore about Podcasting 2.0 from a
beginner's point of view, amore general outlook, check out
my course-based podcast calledPodcasting 2.0 in Practice.
(40:53):
Don't forget, you can keeplistening to hear more from this
episode's featured creator.
Christine Gritmon (41:02):
Yeah, I'm back to inviting people and I do
still get the occasional pitchand they're almost always not
built around what the show is.
Now I do want to diversify mylist a lot more, not just in
terms of how we typically thinkof diversity, but also so many
of them are white British womenbecause I live in the UK now,
(41:23):
even though I'm American women,because I live in the UK now
even though I'm American and mynetwork is still mostly in the
US.
But so many white British womenon my show and I love them and
they're wonderful and I don'tregret a single guest.
But I do need to expand that abit more in all directions.
I need more Americans again.
I need more non-white people, Ineed more men and also another
(41:46):
thing that I'm trying to do thatI did a bit at the first half
of this season, but it justhasn't been happening the second
half, despite my best efforts,is more people who aren't
marketers.
So at the beginning of thisseason I had a friend of mine
who's an incredibly successfulmagician and performer.
I had an author.
We talked about her etymologycareer.
(42:08):
I had an astrologer and Ireally loved talking about
people who have built theirbrand, who aren't marketers.
Yeah, and I'm actually trying tofigure out what the future of
my podcast is, you know, becauseif you're not raring to get it
out, I feel like that's a signworth listening to, so doesn't
need another slight shift infocus.
(42:30):
What is it that's making meless excited to get it done?
Because, as much as I say andbelieve that it is simply a
matter of energy and ADHD,distraction and whatnot, I think
that's worth listening to.
So at the moment, I'm stillmaking.
Let's Talk About Brand.
(42:51):
I've got some lovely episodesnearly ready to go, and it's
actually nominated for a DigitalWomen Podcast of the Year award
.
So alongside you.
So I certainly don't want toabandon it.
I want it and if it's going togo out, I want it to go out
strong.
There's never episodes inAugust, so I think August is
going to be a matter of thinkingabout what I want it to be when
(43:13):
it returns.
Do I want it to be the sameshow and I just get back on it?
Do I want to shift the focus ofthe show again?
Or do I want to launch tosomething totally different and
just say, okay, it's been alovely five years?
Who knows, I don't know.
Claire Waite Brown (43:27):
We'll find out.
That's one of my things.
That would be my answer to myown question of things that
excite me about podcasting orthings that I like about
podcasting is that you canchange.
It's your show.
You can do it how you want.
You haven't got anybody sayingit has to be out every week, it
has to be 30 minutes exactly,and you have to cover these
points and that's an importantlesson, also on running your own
(43:48):
business and on even buildingyour own personal brand.
Christine Gritmon (43:51):
People get very stuck when they start
thinking that they have to fitinto a certain format or they
have to do things a certain wayand it's like why are you doing
your own thing?
If that's the case, the entirepoint of striking out on your
own whether it's with contentyou're creating or it's running
your own business or it's justbuilding your own personal brand
(44:11):
even if you're employed, youmake the rules and part of it.
Yes, it can be easy sometimesto play into some of the mental
shortcuts that people alreadyhave by playing on pre-existing
suppositions and by certaintropes that tend to communicate
a certain message.
Like, if you're a bank, yeah,you might want to be blue, you
(44:32):
know things like that.
But there's also value in notblending in.
There's value in just kind ofdo and regardless.
Whatever you do, if you followyourself, it's going to be just
right.
I want to be able to create thecontent that I want to create
and have the conversations thatI want to have.
Similarly, you know why are yourunning your own business?
(44:53):
If you feel trapped by certainelements of it, figure out how
to minimize those elements Someof them you have to do like you
can't, just slag off bookkeepingWell, some of us do, but the
fact is that's something you can.
You know, figure out how toautomate or automate, delegate
or eliminate is such a big thing, and really that's true for so
(45:16):
many things.
It's even true for yourpersonal brand.
I feel like it also shows that you can have
a conversation, that you canactually speak.
I have ample evidence of me onactual literal stages as well,
but for someone who doesn'tgetting on podcasts, having
those live, unfilteredconversations, showing that you
know what the heck you'retalking about without reading it
off, I think is incrediblypowerful.
Claire Waite Brown (00:30):
It's your show.
You can do it how you want.
You haven't got anybody sayingit has to be out every week.
It has to be 30 minutes exactlyand you have to cover these
points.
Sam Sethi (00:39):
So there's many ways that you can give value back to
creators.
That isn't just a monetaryvalue.
So I like the word valueexchange really to describe
TrueFans.
It's value from creators tofans and fans giving value back
to creators.
Claire Waite Brown (00:54):
Welcome to Creators from TrueFans.
I'm independent podcaster,claire Waite Brown.
Sam Sethi (01:01):
And I'm Sam Sethi, the CEO of TrueFans.
Claire Waite Brown (01:03):
Each episode , we'll chat with an independent
creator, whether a podcaster ormusician, about their creative
experiences.
Sam Sethi (01:11):
And we'll answer questions from independent
creators about the TrueFansfeatures that can help them with
discovery, interactivity andmonetization.
Claire Waite Brown (01:21):
We'll get interactive and see what our
listeners have been saying inthe comments and super comments.
Sam Sethi (01:27):
And discuss what's happening in the wider world.
That could be a benefit toindependent creators.
Claire Waite Brown (01:33):
Hi Claire, Hi Sam, how are you?
Sam Sethi (01:36):
Very well.
A little bit tired, but very,very well.
Brilliant this week, Claire,our featured independent podcast
is let's Talk About Brand.
Claire Waite Brown (01:48):
That's right , and here is my chat with
Christine.
I'm here chatting withChristine Grittman.
Hi, christine, how are you Good?
Claire, how are you doing?
I'm very well, thank you.
Start by telling us, please,the name of your podcast, and
what is it all about?
Christine Gritmon (02:03):
All right, my podcast is let's Talk About
Brand and there's severalseasons of it and it has evolved
over the years, so, dependingon what season you look at, but
it has always been aboutpersonal branding, and what it
is now is.
I hear the stories of peoplewho have strong personal brands
and how they built them, andthen we do what I like to call
the Christine Gritmon bit, wherewe dig into the deeper
(02:26):
motivations behind them and whatthey do and what truly lights
them up and what they actuallydeliver beyond what it says on
the tin, because that, to me, isthe most important and
interesting bit of a strongpersonal brand, which is what's
beneath it, beyond, like thewindow dressing and the colors
and the fonts and all that stuff.
Claire Waite Brown (02:45):
Yeah, interesting.
Why did you start the podcast?
Christine Gritmon (02:56):
My first show .
It was a live stream calledSocial, and it was about social
media, and I started that in2017, mostly to take advantage
of the fact that I just met aload of really brilliant people
at Social Media Marketing Worldand I wanted to keep in touch
with them and I wanted to sharetheir brilliance with others,
partially to build my name,honestly, as the person who
brought them to you, and so thatwent on till 2020.
And in 2020, I made a decisionto go harder into the personal
(03:19):
branding element of what I did,because I built a really
fantastic audience of my peers,which was great in terms of
opportunities, like my peerswere the ones who could give me
big stages and give me, you know, visibility and all of that.
But my peers weren't the oneshiring me for social media
strategy.
But my peers did notice I had astrong personal brand and they
wanted one.
(03:39):
So I said you know what?
I'm going to go harder on thispersonal branding thing.
So when I came back from myannual August hiatus in August
2020, it was with a brand newshow.
Let's Talk About Brand, and that, too, was originally a live
stream that I then laterreleased in podcast form, and it
(04:00):
also had a companion Twitterchat chat about brand that I
absolutely loved.
It was a highlight of my weekand over the years, various
things about it evolved,including a couple of years in
it went podcast first, so I nolonger had a live stream of it,
I had a podcast of it and youcould then watch the full video
of it on YouTube if you wished.
I've only recently gotten ridof that element because now the
(04:23):
podcast is a bit more edited.
I used to barely touch it andnow I edit it a little bit more,
so now it is straight up apodcast, and the Twitter chat,
of course, went by the waysidein 2023 and I miss it terribly,
in addition to the fact that Iwas focusing more on personal
branding being why I started.
Let's Talk About Brand.
(04:44):
I love people's stories.
I was a journalist before this.
I literally have quote markstattooed behind my ears because
I love hearing people's stories.
I'm fascinated by you know theperson behind the person I see
before me today and the personbefore the person I see before
me today, and how they got there, and especially people who are
known, who are respected, whohave developed that visibility
(05:08):
and trust in their industries.
I'm fascinated to hear how theygot there, and I think it's
very useful for other people aswell, because it's very easy to
look at them and not realizethat they actually started out.
You know no further along thanthe person listening is, and
that's another thing.
As I got more into getting toknow people who had done great
(05:29):
things and who were on huge,amazing stages and commending
huge fees and all that, as I gotto know more successful people,
the more I realized that theyare, in fact, just people, and
getting them down to that level.
I love that because they've alldone a million interviews that
are identical People asking themabout the things that they are
known for and that they speak onstages about, and I want to
(05:51):
hear the stuff that not everyonehears, the story of before they
had any of that and how theybuilt it.
The early days the early daysare so much more interesting to
me than you know the presentsuccess interesting to me than
you know, the present success.
Claire Waite Brown (06:09):
I think.
Often it's a story of eventsand things leading up to what
happens now, that you wouldn'texpect those events to lead to
what happens now, and how thoseall come together in retrospect.
Speaking of the people, how doyou choose the people that you
want to be guests on your show?
Christine Gritmon (06:23):
choose the people that you want to be
guests on your show.
Goodness, that's evolved aswell.
Originally it was people I knewhad relationships with.
Occasionally it would besomeone who I wouldn't say I had
a real relationship with, buthad met at an event who was a
big deal, and through a mutualfriend I got kind of in, but
generally it was my friends.
Then I had a bit of a detourbecause my podcast was then
(06:46):
picked up by the Adweek PodcastNetwork, which was a very big
deal visibility wise, but alsomeant a ton of PR agencies were
in my inbox pitching executives,and so there was a season there
.
I believe it's season three,maybe maybe season two, I don't
know, but there's a ton ofpeople on there talking more
corporate.
So it really is less aboutpersonal branding and more about
(07:08):
branding in general.
I still did invite people who Ifound interesting.
So there was still that elementof personal interest scattered
in there.
But then also scattered inthere were people where I saw
the PR pitch.
I said, all right, there is anangle here that could be useful,
because I did say no to a lotof them.
But I said there's an angle inhere that could be useful and so
I had them on.
(07:29):
But I also, briefly at this time, was working with a podcast
producer who I can't afford towork with anymore, but she's one
of my best friends, we talkconstantly and she was saying to
me.
She said, when I'm editing yourpodcast, I can tell if it's
(07:51):
someone you invited or if it wassomeone who came from a PR
pitch.
Yeah, she's like that's not tosay the episodes are bad, but
there's a different level ofpersonal engagement.
I can feel it.
And so, first of all, adweekand I stopped working together,
not because of that they hadmassive budget cuts, but in
addition to that, I said youknow what I want to get back to,
what I care about.
And the aforementioned producer,who's a friend, said also you
need it to benefit your business.
(08:12):
You were not putting yourselfout there to work with
corporates on their branding.
You want to work withindividuals on their personal
branding.
Focus on that.
And she's also the inspirationbehind the Christine Grittman
bit at the end, where I show alittle bit of what I work on
with clients, which is gettingto that deeper side.
I brand from the inside out ismy thing now, where we start
(08:33):
with getting in touch with yourpurpose, your passions, your
unique gifts and what reallylights you up and build your
brand outward from there.
And so what I was doing beforedidn't play to that at all and a
lot of people, a lot of myguests also, weren't getting
deep enough.
They were doing the very kindof service level, corporate
talking points, and I wanted toget a lot deeper.
Claire Waite Brown (08:57):
From a practicality point of view of
making a podcast while alsodoing everything else in life,
with your own business, withyour family.
How do you fit it all in, andare there any tools or any
processes or any softwares thatyou find help you with fitting
(09:19):
it all in?
Christine Gritmon (09:20):
I have not been fitting it all in.
I have been dropping a lot ofballs here.
In fact, at this time thatwe're talking, I have not been
fitting it all in.
I have been dropping a lot ofballs here.
In fact, at this time thatwe're talking, I have not
released an episode in weeks.
I might get one out today, butI'm sitting on like four amazing
ones that I really want to getout there, but I just keep just
the last bits of editing it.
Just it doesn't even have to behard.
(09:40):
It doesn't have to be hard.
It's just my ADHD brain.
Like when I say, okay, we'regoing to sit down and do the
podcast, now it says, or wecould do this other thing.
So I will say don't always getit done.
But the thing that does reallyhelp me get it done is Descript.
I've also heard that programpronounced as Descript, but I
think it's just Descript and thething about Descript that I
love.
So I'm the biggest AI Ludditeyou will ever meet.
(10:03):
I hate generative AI and all ofthat.
I really need to get over it,but I like the level of AI that
Descript does.
It doesn't make stuff up.
It can probably, but I don't dothat I like the fact that as
soon as I upload the file itdoes the transcript right there
and I can edit the transcriptand it edits the podcast and it
(10:24):
automatically underlines thingslike ums and uhs and bits that
are repetitious, so I can justgo and target those.
I can have it just do it itself,but I don't, because I find
that a lot of times the thingsthat it tries to get rid of
actually add character and colorto the speech pattern.
So I can't get rid of that muchof it.
So I do still do it verymanually, which is part of why I
(10:46):
don't just get it out.
It's incredible to be able toedit the words, to be able to
see oh, this bit went on a bitlong, how can I tighten this up?
It's editing like you wouldedit a written document, which
I'm quite good at, and veryrarely I have had a situation
(11:07):
where there's a word in therethat's very important but it got
swallowed up either by bad WiFi or by crosstalk or whatever.
It can regenerate that word andI've only ever used the vocal
generation on like a single wordwhen it's that type of
situation, but it has beenincredibly helpful, like a
(11:28):
couple of times when I don'twant to cut that sentence.
That sentence is great, whatthey're saying is great, but
that important word at the endof the sentence is just lost
Brilliant.
Claire Waite Brown (11:40):
It's good to have those options as well,
because you edit by seeing.
I tend to edit big chunks outby the words and then I edit
everything else by listening,but it gives people the
(12:00):
flexibility to be able to createa show based on how they work
best, which is super.
What is one thing thatfrustrates you about podcasting
and one thing that excites youabout it?
Christine Gritmon (12:06):
It frustrates me that it does still feel like
putting it out into the void.
I feel like it's a bit trickyto figure out how to boost
listenership.
What leads to greaterlistenership or downloads on a
given episode or not?
At first I thought maybe it was, you know, the guest.
No, it's not the guest.
Then I thought maybe it's ifthe guest shares or not.
(12:27):
No, not necessarily Is it.
You know, when I send an emailversus when I don't, that does
make a bit of a difference, butnot enough of one.
So how do you get people tolisten?
That's very frustrating to me.
It does very much feel like I'moperating in the dark in so
many ways, because there's alsonot a lot of data to make
data-driven decisions on.
What I do like about it is, asI said, I love people's stories.
(12:49):
I love learning from people.
Hearing how other people havedone.
It makes me so much better atmy job, quite frankly, and it
does get me out there.
People do look at the fact thatyou have a podcast, even if they
don't listen to it.
The fact that you have apodcast makes people go ah.
Then when they see what it'sabout, and it further gets your
name connected with those words.
(13:09):
Your name is connected withcreativity.
My name is connected withbranding, partially because of
these podcasts.
And then there's the fact thatthey see the guests that you
have and they see the podcaststhat you yourself have guested
on, which you get more of if youhave a podcast, and that also
builds your reputation.
So even if people never listento your podcast, it has so much
(13:34):
juice in there.
I mean, I was on Pat Flynn'spodcast and he was on mine.
That's a big honking deal andso it's kind of nice to it's.
It's a good cap to put feathersin.
Claire Waite Brown (13:45):
Essentially, yeah, that's quite funny about
people don't actually have tohave listened to the podcast,
but you can show them whereyou've been.
Christine Gritmon (13:52):
I would like them to, not only not only
because I actually do have adsin my podcast, so like I will
get you know a few pence if youlisten, but also like I do want
people to listen because I thinkthese conversations are amazing
.
I've enjoyed having them.
I think I also sound prettysmart on them, because that's
another thing about a podcast.
(14:13):
People do scripted podcasts,but the fact is something like
this it's obviously not scripted.
We're having a conversation andsame with my podcast, so I feel
like it also shows that you canhave a conversation, that you
can actually speak.
I have ample evidence of me onactual, literal stages as well.
But for someone who doesn'tgetting on podcasts, having
(14:34):
those live, unfilteredconversations, showing that you
know what the heck you'retalking about without reading it
off, I think is incrediblypowerful.
Claire Waite Brown (14:44):
Yeah, this is all building into what you're
talking about, which is yourbrand and the person's brand,
and part of that brand is youknow what you're talking about.
My understanding of this show,as well as being a passion of
yours, is that it promotes you,so, from a financial point of
view, it probably feeds intothat's my question, okay, no, no
(15:07):
, so keeping it real, folks, nothank you for that.
Okay, so like the basicquestion on my piece of paper is
does your podcast receive anyfinancial support?
Christine Gritmon (15:24):
if time is money, I'm dumping a ton of it
into my podcast.
So, first of all, I was part ofthe Adweek podcast network,
right?
So I had the ads that thatnetwork had purchased on there,
and there was a small ad for meon some other people's podcasts
in the network.
That was lovely.
And Adweek did it with Acastand Acast has their own ad
(15:46):
network as well.
And so when I was no longerwith Adweek, acast generously
said okay, so normally ourthreshold for being able to
monetize your podcast is moredownloads than you have, but
because you came to us as partof the Adweek network and we
don't want you to go leave, wewill extend that to you.
(16:08):
So I do not have enoughdownloads regularly to be able
to monetize as part of the ACASTpodcast network, but I am
anyway in theory, because theywere very kind.
You got a little backdoor inthere, yeah, and again, it would
be lovely if I had moredownloads, because then I was.
(16:29):
But at the same time, if I keepnot getting the episodes out in
a timely fashion, you know I'mpart of the problem.
There's things I could be doing.
Claire Waite Brown (16:37):
Ok, I'm going to go on to the Now.
You sent me the answer to thisquestion on an email and I
wonder whether it's changedsince a few days ago.
And that question is aboutpodcasting 2.0, which is a
phrase I don't know what that is.
Christine Gritmon (16:52):
You don't know what that is.
What is podcasting?
Claire Waite Brown (16:55):
2.0?
That hasn't changed, then,basically, there are some extra
features that can now beincluded in your RSS feed If
your hosting company, forexample Creativity Found, is
hosted on Buzzsprout, and theymake it really easy for me to
put in a transcript, to put inchapters, to put in a photograph
(17:15):
of my guest, which I will bedoing for this one.
You're welcome everybody.
Recommendations as well, sorecommendations for other shows.
So all of these things can bereally useful for independent
creators, for helping them toget discovered, for helping them
to interact with theirlisteners and, in some cases,
(17:39):
earning a little bit of money aswell.
Christine Gritmon (17:41):
I think those are incredible features and I
think they really point to thefact that podcasting has become
a rich form of media.
It's not passive entertainment,it's become its own thing and
tying it into also evendifferent learning styles,
different ways people consumeinformation.
Accessibility even, you know,having those transcripts in
(18:03):
there mean that someone hearingimpaired can enjoy your podcast.
So I think that there's so many.
I love everything you just saidabout podcasting 2.0 and the
things that it can do.
Claire Waite Brown (18:16):
The other thing of course you know now,
christine, because you sent thecomment on TrueFans that got you
onto this episode is thatwithin that app, people can talk
to you as a podcaster or talkto other listeners, can leave
comments.
You could tell your listeners,like, if you listen on TrueFans,
(18:36):
you can leave me a comment, andthen you won't want to do this
because it will be extra work.
You could then say and if youleave me a comment, I'll read it
out.
for example If you want to payme to do it, I mean I'm down for
example, if you want to pay meto do it, I mean I'm down Well.
Well, okay, I have paid you.
I have paid you, okay, I'vebeen listening to your show for
(18:58):
my research and I have paid youone penny per minute that I've
been listening, thank you.
So when you claim your show onTrueFans, you'll be given this
digital wallet and it'll have alittle bit of money from me in
it.
Thank you, TrueFans.
Then, generally, if in thefuture you tell your listeners
(19:19):
to listen on TrueFans and thatthey can do this thing where
they pay you a little tinyamount for the time that they
listen, then at some point youcan go to that wallet and you
can go withdraw and you can sendthat money to Stripe and then
you can take it and buy yourselfa cup of tea.
Christine Gritmon (19:34):
I did set that up.
When you told me about TrueFans, I did go and set up my profile
and all that, and I'm not sureif it took the RSS feed.
I think that Acast was having abit of a hiccup that day, so
I'll take a look again.
Claire Waite Brown (19:46):
It'll get the RSS from Acast.
That's fine, you don't need todo anything else.
Christine Gritmon (19:50):
Were you listening to my podcast on
TrueFans?
Because then it worked, okay.
Well, then it worked Good.
All right, I'll have to checkmy wallet then, yeah.
Claire Waite Brown (19:58):
Brilliant.
Thank you so much, Christine.
Thank you, Claire.
Christine Gritmon (20:02):
Give me some places, all the places where
people can find you All rightBest places, gritmon.
com, g-r-i-t like whensomething's gritty like sand,
and M-O-N like Monday.
You can see I've had to spellit before.
I just redid gritmon.
com, so that is much nicer thanit used to be, thanks to the
(20:25):
lovely Hannah Dossery of ShinyHappy Digital.
And so, yeah, gritmon.
com, I'm Christine Gritmon.
I'm the only Christine Gritmon,so I'm pretty easy to find
LinkedIn, instagram.
I'm not on Facebook so muchlately anymore, unfortunately,
but I am there and Let's TalkAbout Brand has its own
Instagram and its own LinkedInspotlight page, so follow, Let's
Talk About Brand on Instagramand on LinkedIn and in all of
(20:48):
these places there are places tojoin my email list, which will
also keep you up to date on allof that, if I do it when I get
around to emailing people.
Claire Waite Brown (21:00):
Fantastic.
Thank you so much, Christine.
It's been fabulous to chat.
Thank you.
Sam Sethi (21:06):
I like what Christine had to say there about
podcasting being beneficial forbuilding your reputation.
I fully agree, whether guestingon other people's shows or
hosting your own.
Yes, we've done a lot of thatas well, haven't we?
Absolutely.
There's more from Christine atthe end of this episode when she
talks about the future of herpodcast and the flexibility that
(21:27):
podcasting offers independentcreators, as well as how that
relates to running your ownbusiness.
Claire Waite Brown (21:34):
That's right .
It is easy to find let's TalkAbout brand on TrueFans right
now because it is featured inthe banner at the top of the
home screen and in the Podcastswe're Loving list, which is also
on the home screen.
If you'd like to chat with usabout your independent podcast
or your music, send a comment orsuper comment in TrueFans to
(21:57):
any Creators episode by clickingon the speech bubble icon or on
the comments tab.
Sam Sethi (22:04):
Questions Claire questions questions.
It's where we have a little bitof interactivity.
Which question have you chosento ask me this week?
Claire Waite Brown (22:12):
Well, I've got two questions actually, sam.
Sam Sethi (22:14):
Okay.
Claire Waite Brown (22:15):
I've seen you talking about this and it's
about a way you're describingTrueFans.
So what do you mean?
I mean, are we talking about alistening app, a marketplace or
a platform?
Tell me a bit more about yourthoughts.
Sam Sethi (22:34):
Yeah, so traditionally, you know, we
would talk about Facebook beinga platform.
We would talk about Patreon orMemberful being a marketplace
where you can go and buy or sellcontent.
And then you get thetraditional listening apps, you
know, pocket Casts or Overcastsor Apple, and I didn't really
think any of those fitted whatTrueFans really is.
And I came across this word orwords this week.
(22:54):
It was sort of an epiphanymoment and I think it fits very
well.
I'm calling TrueFans a valueexchange, a bit like a stock
exchange.
Let me explain Instead of amarketplace or platform, I think
we will use this word todescribe TrueFans, because
creators, independent orotherwise, the value they create
(23:14):
is in the content they deliver.
So you could be delivering apodcast, music, an audiobook,
film, whatever, and then thevalue you receive back, the
exchange in value from your fans, can be both tangible or
intangible.
So tangible value value ismoney, so it could be a
micropayment, so in our case,streaming micropayments or super
(23:35):
comments or a subscription.
But there are intangible valuesthat you give back as well to
creators.
So I might share your podcastto my social endpoints, you know
, on X or threads I mightactually just leave you a
comment without a payment.
So there's many ways that youcan give value back to creators.
That isn't just a monetaryvalue.
(23:56):
So I like the word valueexchange really to describe
TrueFans.
It's value from creators tofans and fans giving value back
to creators.
Claire Waite Brown (24:05):
I think it sums it up very well, thank you.
Sam Sethi (24:08):
What's your other question?
Claire Waite Brown (24:09):
Claire Sums it up very well, thank you.
What's your other question,claire?
Well, I am aware that you'vecome up with another good idea.
Sam Sethi (24:14):
Well, can I just be clear it's you who came up with
a good idea that I just nicked.
Claire Waite Brown (24:20):
Really Okay.
I don't remember coming up withthat good idea.
Sam Sethi (24:24):
Oh, we must have had one too many of those glasses of
champagne there.
Claire Waite Brown (24:27):
Oh, okay, yes, Okay, super it those
glasses of champagne there.
Oh, okay, yes, okay, super itis about uh, once again, we talk
a lot about discovery forpodcasters, and you have come up
with or we have apparently comeup with a new way that we can
help podcasters to be found.
So, sam, how can any podcasterget their show featured on the
(24:52):
homepage or the carousel, or thecarousels on TrueFans?
Sam Sethi (24:57):
OK, there are two current ways and we've added a
third.
The first way is obviously tobe a guest on this show and then
Claire, you will feature themon the carousel or homepage or
both.
The second way is, between meor Claire, we might actually
just feature you.
You don't have to be a guest.
We might think it's a greatpodcast we want to feature.
But the third way is we willallow you to now buy your place
(25:20):
on the homepage or a carousel.
We are putting that together.
That will go live, hopefullythis week, if not certainly next
week.
It will be live.
And so you go into your podcastdashboard on TrueFancy.
You've claimed your podcast.
You go into the back end.
You'll be able to see a new buybutton.
When you click on that buybutton it'll say hero image, the
header images or carousel, andso the header image is easy.
(25:43):
You know I want to be on here.
You just say yes, pay theamount it comes out of your
wallet, or you can pay throughstripe.
Whichever way you want, andthen that will get featured.
Now we have only five featuredpodcasts on the home page and
five features on the music page.
So once all five are gone, thebuy button will be disabled
until that person has stoppedpaying.
(26:03):
So you can only pay for acouple of weeks.
We're not allowing you to buymonths and years of it.
So that's one one way.
The other way is on thecarousel.
So you can choose a countrycarousel based on your IP.
But you can choose to be onanother country.
You just drop the down list andsay I want to be featured in
Cambodia or Guatemala orSingapore, and you can be
(26:23):
featured there as well.
We are going to add an updateto that which will allow you to
also be featured on the categorycarousels.
So eventually we will allow youto say actually, I just want to
be in the UK on health andfitness rather than just the UK
carousel.
So there's multiple ways.
We're working on it, but Ithink it's a great idea, claire,
and we've just implemented itbased on what you told us.
Claire Waite Brown (26:46):
That's really good that other
podcasters can spend a bit oftheir marketing budget to
promote themselves, and I lookforward to finding even more new
shows to listen to.
Sam Sethi (26:57):
Yeah, but I think the nice thing about it is it means
that the creators can choose aswell as us choosing, and the
way we'll differentiate, and wehave to do it this way.
One will say featured, which iswhere you or I have placed it,
and one will say pay.
We have to do that yes, Iunderstand um.
Claire Waite Brown (27:13):
Am I allowed to ask you the question about
costs?
Sam Sethi (27:17):
you are and I can't give you a categorical answer.
I would love to um, we've gotsome ideas and the reason is
Claire, and I'll be honest,there's a uh whatsapp group
where you and other super fansof TrueFans are listed.
I want to share those costswith you.
First, as a group, get yourfeedback as independent podcast
creators.
Does this really feel right?
(27:39):
Are we too high, too low?
Have we got the Goldilocksprice?
And if you then, as a group,tell me no, that's good or no,
you should do this, we willchange it and once we've agreed
at all, then we'll publish it.
So probably in the next episodeof this show, we will be able
to tell you what the price is.
Claire Waite Brown (27:57):
Brilliant, okay, thank you very much.
Sam Sethi (28:00):
Claire.
Time for the fan box.
Have we heard from any of ourlisteners since the last episode
?
Claire Waite Brown (28:06):
Yes, we have .
We have heard from Matt Watts,who was our featured podcaster
on the previous episode ofCreators, his show what's On
your Screen.
Matt said thank you again forinviting me on.
I really enjoyed chatting andhopefully it's made for decent
listening too.
Of course it has.
I'll be sure to direct folkstowards TrueFans in my next
(28:29):
episode, which should be laterthis week, and I'll also be
delving further into the app nowthat that's out in the wild too
, meaning the native app, asopposed to the PWA that we had
previously.
And actually Matt does verykindly point listeners to
TrueFans in his latest veryimaginative and clever episode
(28:50):
of what's On your Screen.
That I really enjoyed, not justbecause it did play a clip from
creators.
So thank you very much for that, matt.
Sam Sethi (28:59):
Thank you very much indeed.
Now let's whiz around the worldvery quickly.
Claire, have you got some newsfrom the world of independent
podcasting that we should talkabout this week?
Claire Waite Brown (29:10):
Yes, absolutely.
It's very exciting.
It's news from Ear Worthy,which can be found on Substack
and other blog sites, and it isa review site that focuses on
independent podcasts.
Focuses on independent podcasts.
Frank Racioppi, who I spokewith about Ear Worthy for our
next episode of Creators, andhis board have announced the
(29:32):
nominees for this year's EarWorthy Awards.
Sam Sethi (29:36):
Nice.
Claire Waite Brown (29:37):
So very nice because obviously it's an award
for independent podcasts.
So Podcasting 2.0 in Practiceand Creativity Found are both
nominated.
Sam Sethi (29:48):
I feel like I should have a round of applause for you
at this moment From your radiodays.
Claire Waite Brown (29:54):
So, yeah, that is super exciting.
And also, pod News WeeklyReview is nominated Something
about this.
Lots of things are really nice,but in my interview with
Christine, she mentionedshouting into the void, and I've
been feeling like that a littlebit recently.
I have to admit I feel like Iam shouting into the void.
So when something like thiscomes in, it really, really
(30:17):
helps and it really boosts apodcaster's feeling of
self-worth and that they aredoing something valuable, as
we've just talked about valueexchange.
You can see all of the nomineesand perhaps find a few new
podcasts to listen to, whichI'll be doing again by looking
up Ear Worthy on Substack, ifyou are not already subscribed
(30:38):
to the newsletter, which I, ofcourse, am.
Winners will be announced onTuesday 26th 26th August, and
good luck to all of you fabulousindie podcasters who are on
that list.
Sam Sethi (30:52):
Just had an idea, Claire.
Claire Waite Brown (30:53):
What Carousel.
Sam Sethi (30:55):
Yes, I think we should create a awards carousel
and, for various differentawards, put the playlist of all
of the awards nominees.
Claire Waite Brown (31:09):
Brilliant, yes, we will do that.
Well, you'll start it and I'llpopulate it.
Excellent, perfect, sam.
What have you spotted this weekthat independent creators or
their fans might also want toknow about?
Sam Sethi (31:20):
yeah, one of the things is is Spotify are now
using 16.9, 16.9, not 0.9, coverart that you see on videos the
ones that you see on YouTube therectangular ones rather than
the square ones, and this isbecause I think Spotify wants to
be YouTube, so they've decidedto squeeze the square cover art
(31:43):
that we all use for podcastinginto a 16.9 letterbox view,
which means it cuts off top andtail of your cover art.
Not very nice, and so I thinkthey didn't announce it until
this week.
They haven't warned creators togo and do anything about it,
but they have done it for theirown internal purposes, so I
(32:05):
think creators should be awarethat this is going to be
something that they need to do,and if it's coming to YouTube
and Spotify, you can imagine itwill come to other platforms
eventually as well.
There is a fix for this.
Thankfully, there is a newpodcast tag called the Image Tag
Just came out a couple of weeksago Within your own RSS feed,
(32:25):
so your host will allow you toupload multiple images.
So you'll have a square coverart, you might have a 16.9 cover
art, you might have a towercover and other formats, and
they will all live within yourrss feed once your host enables
it, and apps like Spotify, ifthey support it, will then go oh
(32:47):
, claire's got a 16.9 image.
We'll use that instead of thesquare one.
Or TrueFans might use the imageas a banner behind your podcast
, right, because that's 16.9 aswell.
So there's a solution to itcoming out.
It's available now.
No one's implemented yet, butit's only brand new.
But I thought people should beaware of what's happening and
(33:09):
start to think about creatingmaybe a canvas 16 9 letterbox
cover art in preparation.
Again, it just means that ascreators, we need to be aware
that we have to have theseassets ready to go and then,
when our hosts support it andthen the apps equally will
support it, then, yeah, we'regoing to get new UIs and
(33:30):
different ways of viewingcontent.
Claire Waite Brown (33:32):
So what will happen is you can put your
pictures of different sizes inwith your hosting company and
then from there, each of theplaces, youtube, spotify will be
able to take the necessaryimage.
So you don't have to doeverything separately, it's all
done in one place Super, duper,brilliant.
Sam Sethi (33:54):
Exactly Now.
The other thing I wanted tohighlight to people was a
technology called Secure RSS.
Now, I won't go into much moredetail than that, but the
challenge for creators today ishow do I make money?
And a lot of creators havetheir freemium content in Apple
or TrueFans or wherever theymight have it.
(34:16):
But they also have premiumcontent which some people are
putting into sites like Patreonor Memberful or Substack, and
the problem with that is, as anindependent podcast creator,
you've got more work means youhave to create a new account on
one of those paywall services,you have to upload a ad free
version of your podcast.
(34:36):
You then have to set a valuefor that and then you have to
instruct your fans to go to thatpay site to listen there when
they're already in another applistening to you.
So you're splitting youraudience, you're doubling your
work, and it feels like therehas to be a better solution, and
so one of the things that we'vedone in TrueFans and others are
(34:59):
adopting now is this newtechnology called Secure RSS,
which means, simply, your hostwould allow you to upload your
episodes as per normal and thentag one as premium and one as
freemium, so you might say themajority of my podcast episodes
are free, but this one here is aspecial interview, or this
(35:19):
one's a some online course orsomething like that, or an audio
book.
This is going to cost you Xamount of money and then apps
like TrueFans will say okay, wewill disable the play button
until you've made that payment.
Once you've got the paymentconfirmed, we'll enable the play
button.
It's all within the same app,not having to drive your
(35:39):
customers to a different place.
It's all within the same hostas well.
So you've got one host,multiple apps, as opposed to
having a Patreon account and ahost account and then sending
your users to have to haveanother account as well.
Yes, I just thought I'dhighlight.
This is the arrow of directionfor the podcast industry to
(36:00):
combine both freemium andpremium in one place.
Claire Waite Brown (36:04):
Yeah, and you've told me before there
would also be the possibility ofapplying that on a chapter
level.
Sam Sethi (36:10):
Yes, so we actually in TrueFans have that working at
the moment.
We haven't pushed it live, sothe idea is even within an
episode.
Yes, you might have chaptersthat are free and then the end
of the book.
Yeah, just as you get to thejuicy bit right, pay me yeah,
and so the way to make money isyeah, we'll tell you later so
(36:35):
yeah, so that's a couple ofthings that I think people
should just be aware of yeah,thank you very much uh Eurowaves
friend of of our creators isAndreea Coscai.
Time came out with the top 100podcasters and, of course,
nobody in Europe was mentioned,and that's not a problem, but
you know it was a little bitmyopic, as usual from the
(36:56):
Americans.
So Valentin Farkas from Orbithas created his list of 100 top
European creators.
You can find that on PodNewsdaily or on Eurowaves.
I highly recommend you go andhave a look.
You might be in there, younever know.
Go and check it out.
And lastly, again just a headsup, two quick things.
(37:16):
Netflix Claire, do you have aNetflix account?
Claire Waite Brown (37:20):
I do currently, so that I can watch
Squid Game.
Sam Sethi (37:23):
Oh, okay, well, uh.
Netflix are on the hunt for apodcast executive for video
podcasts though, so one moreplace to put your podcasts yeah,
we did have a chat in aprevious episode.
Claire Waite Brown (37:37):
You and I talked about what we thought
about netflix and I said, if Ican get it in there for free,
it's just another place it canbe.
Sam Sethi (37:45):
Yeah, yeah but it's also, if you look at it from the
netflix side of the fence, whatthey're looking at is I've
watched a film, I've seen thedocumentary.
I don't know what to do.
Oh, I'll go over to youtube.
Oh, I'll go to spotify.
Oh, I'll go somewhere else.
And if they can keep you withintheir walled garden, that's
(38:05):
what they will do.
And finally, claire, are yougoing to Podcast Movement?
Claire Waite Brown (38:12):
which is in Dallas this year on the 18th of
August.
Sam Sethi (38:14):
Well, having been to America twice this year already,
no, no, I won't be going either, but those that are going, adam
Curry, the inventor ofpodcasting, will be doing a
keynote speech there, which isvery exciting.
There are a lot of peoplemeeting up there, that we know.
Claire.
And yeah, james, my partner onPod News Weekly, and I will be
(38:34):
doing a live podcast fromPodcast Movement.
Claire Waite Brown (38:37):
Oh, brilliant.
Let's hope it gets recordedthis time.
Sam Sethi (38:41):
Oh yes, the London event didn't get recorded,
although we did do it live.
Claire Waite Brown (38:45):
It was very good live and I was privileged
enough to be in the live zone.
Sam Sethi (38:50):
You're in the 100 club.
Claire Waite Brown (38:53):
Brilliant.
Yeah, there's a few.
I've spoken to a few of myindie podcast friends who are in
the States who will be going.
So a little bit jealous buthave a super time.
Sam Sethi (39:01):
Yes, do indeed.
You don't use Rode, do you?
I use Rode.
No, rode is one of the top mics.
I use a Rode XLR mic and I usea Rodecaster Pro, which is great
.
It's probably overkill now, butI used to use it for the radio
station, and they've just addeda new free firmware update to
(39:22):
your Rodecaster Pro 2 orRodecaster Duo.
The idea is like today we'rerecording on Riverside and you
sent me a link to that and Iclicked on the link and now
we're recording.
I can now set up on my Rode afirmware update and then send
you a link to a webpage where wecan then both record the show
(39:43):
to my Rodecaster.
Claire Waite Brown (39:45):
So you already have the hardware, yes,
and the firmware gives you freethis extra capability.
Sam Sethi (39:51):
Exactly, and so if you have that, it may be
something to think about.
Yeah, but they call thisservice Rode, call Me.
Claire Waite Brown (40:00):
Okay, yeah.
Sam Sethi (40:02):
And that's it for this week.
Claire Waite Brown (40:04):
Our audio is recorded on Riverside, edited
by Claire, and we're hosted byour friends Buzzsprout you can
support this show by streamingsats from your TrueFans wallet,
or leave us a super comment or,better still, become a monthly
supporter of the show and ifyou'd like to be a supporter or
sponsor, please email me at sam,at TrueFans, or if you have a
(40:27):
problem with TrueFans, it's thesame inbox.
Sam Sethi (40:29):
Don't worry, I do answer it as well.
Claire Waite Brown (40:31):
You can find out more about how to use the
features of the TrueFansplatform by listening to our
sister podcast Fanz one.
And if you're keen to learnmore about Podcasting 2.0 from a
beginner's point of view, amore general outlook, check out
my course-based podcast calledPodcasting 2.0 in Practice.
(40:53):
Don't forget, you can keeplistening to hear more from this
episode's featured creator.
Christine Gritmon (41:02):
Yeah, I'm back to inviting people and I do
still get the occasional pitchand they're almost always not
built around what the show is.
Now I do want to diversify mylist a lot more, not just in
terms of how we typically thinkof diversity, but also so many
of them are white British womenbecause I live in the UK now,
(41:23):
even though I'm American women,because I live in the UK now
even though I'm American and mynetwork is still mostly in the
US.
But so many white British womenon my show and I love them and
they're wonderful and I don'tregret a single guest.
But I do need to expand that abit more in all directions.
I need more Americans again.
I need more non-white people, Ineed more men and also another
(41:46):
thing that I'm trying to do thatI did a bit at the first half
of this season, but it justhasn't been happening the second
half, despite my best efforts,is more people who aren't
marketers.
So at the beginning of thisseason I had a friend of mine
who's an incredibly successfulmagician and performer.
I had an author.
We talked about her etymologycareer.
(42:08):
I had an astrologer and Ireally loved talking about
people who have built theirbrand, who aren't marketers.
Yeah, and I'm actually trying tofigure out what the future of
my podcast is, you know, becauseif you're not raring to get it
out, I feel like that's a signworth listening to, so doesn't
need another slight shift infocus.
(42:30):
What is it that's making meless excited to get it done?
Because, as much as I say andbelieve that it is simply a
matter of energy and ADHD,distraction and whatnot, I think
that's worth listening to.
So at the moment, I'm stillmaking.
Let's Talk About Brand.
(42:51):
I've got some lovely episodesnearly ready to go, and it's
actually nominated for a DigitalWomen Podcast of the Year award
.
So alongside you.
So I certainly don't want toabandon it.
I want it and if it's going togo out, I want it to go out
strong.
There's never episodes inAugust, so I think August is
going to be a matter of thinkingabout what I want it to be when
(43:13):
it returns.
Do I want it to be the sameshow and I just get back on it?
Do I want to shift the focus ofthe show again?
Or do I want to launch tosomething totally different and
just say, okay, it's been alovely five years?
Who knows, I don't know.
Claire Waite Brown (43:27):
We'll find out.
That's one of my things.
That would be my answer to myown question of things that
excite me about podcasting orthings that I like about
podcasting is that you canchange.
It's your show.
You can do it how you want.
You haven't got anybody sayingit has to be out every week, it
has to be 30 minutes exactly,and you have to cover these
points and that's an importantlesson, also on running your own
(43:48):
business and on even buildingyour own personal brand.
Christine Gritmon (43:51):
People get very stuck when they start
thinking that they have to fitinto a certain format or they
have to do things a certain wayand it's like why are you doing
your own thing?
If that's the case, the entirepoint of striking out on your
own whether it's with contentyou're creating or it's running
your own business or it's justbuilding your own personal brand
(44:11):
even if you're employed, youmake the rules and part of it.
Yes, it can be easy sometimesto play into some of the mental
shortcuts that people alreadyhave by playing on pre-existing
suppositions and by certaintropes that tend to communicate
a certain message.
Like, if you're a bank, yeah,you might want to be blue, you
(44:32):
know things like that.
But there's also value in notblending in.
There's value in just kind ofdo and regardless.
Whatever you do, if you followyourself, it's going to be just
right.
I want to be able to create thecontent that I want to create
and have the conversations thatI want to have.
Similarly, you know why are yourunning your own business?
(44:53):
If you feel trapped by certainelements of it, figure out how
to minimize those elements Someof them you have to do like you
can't, just slag off bookkeepingWell, some of us do, but the
fact is that's something you can.
You know, figure out how toautomate or automate, delegate
or eliminate is such a big thing, and really that's true for so
(45:16):
many things.
It's even true for yourpersonal brand.
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