January 8, 2025 • 58 mins
Imagine being caught in the whirlwind of attraction and infidelity, navigating the complexities of secret affairs in the bustling cityscape. Join us as Jack, our first male guest, bravely opens up about his journey through these tumultuous experiences. He shares the initial sparks that led him away from his marriage, the thrilling yet challenging logistics of maintaining a hidden relationship, and the emotional rollercoaster of choosing between two loves. Jack's story offers a raw, unfiltered look at the dilemmas that arise when personal desires clash with societal expectations and commitments.
In this episode, we unravel the intricacies of long-term relationships and the often-painful dissolution that follows infidelity. Jack reflects on his twenty-year marriage, the transformation from partners to mere roommates, and the impact of children on intimacy. We discuss the shocking moments of separation, the role of personal accountability, and the emotional journey that comes with accepting such significant life changes. Through Jack's candid reflections, we explore the necessity of attentiveness and shared interests to avoid drifting apart, offering insights into the challenges of maintaining connection amidst life's demands.
Rediscovering joy after a major breakup is a journey filled with unexpected turns. Jack shares his experiences re-entering the dating scene, navigating modern dating apps, and the excitement of forming new connections. We ponder the differing paces at which men and women move on after divorce and the joy of finding partners who bring a sense of adventure back into life. This conversation is a testament to the resilience and personal growth that can arise from the ashes of a broken relationship, as Jack considers the possibilities of love and happiness in the future. Join us for a thoughtful exploration of relationships, self-discovery, and opening new chapters in life.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Hello and welcome back to Dating.
Daycare where we help younavigate through the jungle of
jerks.
Ladies and gents, we are backtoday.
We have a very exciting episode.
I'm very excited for this.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Yeah, so this gentleman.
He has the distinction of beingthe very first guy on our show.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Very first.
You've been asking for it andwe have come through and
delivered the first male.
We are going to get the maleperspective, which we're excited
.
We're so excited and but tokeep him anonymous, we are going
to call him Jack.
Yes.
And we are so excited and thankyou so much for being here.
(00:48):
We really appreciate it.
It's brave.
It's brave coming on our show.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Absolutely.
I've asked a few guys and theyjust didn't have the cojones
yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
So we thank you, Jack Welcome.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
I'm getting nervous.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Don't get, nervous, don't get nervous.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
We just want answers, jack, we want answers.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
I have answers we're excited.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Okay, great, great, great.
So why don't you tell us?
Speaker 3 (01:15):
a little bit about your story.
I have been married twice now.
Okay, I met my first wife incollege, married her shortly
after three years.
To this day I say she'sprobably the best person I've
ever known.
I had met somebody else duringthat time that I was young and
(01:37):
dumb and she was very beautifuland very seductive and I fell
into that trap, which we'lldiscuss.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
We'll go into detail, ladies, because we know you
have a million.
We get question after questionafter question about that.
So should we start?
Let's start with that.
So, when you met your firstwife in college, how long did
you date her before you?
Speaker 2 (02:06):
proposed, and exactly how old were you and um.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
I was 25 when we got married young and I think we
were together for four years,five years, four and a half
years all together between uhbefore before.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Yes, yes, okay, so then you got married, happily
married, right, everything'sgoing well, whatever.
How did you meet the girl thatyou ended up having the affair
with?
Speaker 3 (02:36):
so I was introduced to her by some former co-.
At work At a bar.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
Okay, so outside of work but the coworkers Exactly.
And you had no children withthe first.
No, which makes a bigdifference.
Yes, it just does.
Started marriage.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Mm-hmm, and I saw her there before I was even
introduced to her and my mouthhit the floor, Mm-hmm.
And once we were introduced Iknew I was in a lot of trouble.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Now did she know you were married.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
Okay.
So it was like oh, this is Brad, brad, this is whatever her
name was.
You're at the bar, it'sChristmas party, whatever.
And you guys start talking hey,how you doing?
Are you married?
You know all the regular.
What do you do for a living?
You have kids, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Okay, Exactly.
So who?
Okay, so now you know, sheknows you're married.
(03:36):
Was she like, are we going tohang out again?
Brad, Like who was the onepursuing, Because when I go out,
was she single.
Speaker 3 (03:46):
What was pursuing, because when I go out single,
what was her status?
Yeah, she was single.
Yeah, um, she's a bit youngerthan I am.
Um, it was very mutual okay Icertainly needed to take the
head um so that you knew I wasmarried and I had to assure her
that.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
So you pursued more, I pursued Okay, I pursued Okay,
and she was like oh, okay.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Like sounds good.
It wasn't quite that easy, butit wasn't so difficult Okay.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
So I mean, I'm sure you had been attracted to other
women before that point, butwhat was the point of difference
that made you say, you knowwhat, let's screw those vows and
let's just take a chance onthis?
What made?
Speaker 3 (04:26):
it worth it.
Yeah, what made her so special?
The eyes, okay.
Speaker 1 (04:32):
And you said she was prettier than any woman.
See, we always discuss thiswhen people write into our show,
ladies and gents, and whenyou're like, oh, looks don't
matter, looks aren't everything.
And I always say this jack,when you're out somewhere,
unless you're doing this onlinedating and you're scrolling
looking at a picture.
(04:52):
But for me, who's out in, inthe, in the wild, the first
thing I'm seeing when a guy'sbuying me a drink from across
the bar is how you look, andthat depends whether I'm
accepting the drink or not.
Now you could look like I mean,I love you know the old Pierce
Brosnan but, you could look likeyou know the gods of the earth
(05:15):
and then come over and beat acomplete jerk once you open your
mouth.
That I'll agree with.
And I could be like I wouldn'tdate you with a 10-foot pole,
but looks matter, looks matter.
I wouldn't date you with a10-foot pole, but looks matter,
looks matter, looks matter.
And like he's saying, the looksis really what took you and
said you know what Screw thelike?
This is the one because look ather.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
I mean, there was a connection and she was nice,
right Of course she opened hermouth, she wasn't stupid, there
was an instant electricity there, right, yeah, I mean.
But I think that's the case foreveryone.
Whether you're married or not,you meet somebody You're not
marrying, somebody you're notattracted to.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
Absolutely.
But I mean, you were married,your wife was attracted to you.
But this girl, if she didn'tlook as good and the connection
was there, you might have let itgo.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
Yes was there, you might have let it go.
Yes, Also question what wasgoing on.
Was there trouble in paradise?
Were there little cracks in themarriage?
Speaker 3 (06:19):
Not really.
I mean, she was getting herdoctorate and so she was-, busy,
busy a lot of the time.
I was at the time working onWall Street street, um, and oh
no, I was actually working inrecruiting, but um, it was just
there was a lot of time alone.
Like my industry was verysocial, there was always nights
out and corporate usually isyeah, my ex is always out I was
(06:42):
very good for a while.
This again, it was like alightning bolt.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
And men like attention.
We've discussed this.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
I walked away and knew I was screwed, like.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
I was like at the end of the night I was like, yeah,
so you exchanged numbers thatfirst night and it was like I'll
get in touch, like I'll justyou know we'll be in touch.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
Bye, see you.
There may have been a kiss ortwo, okay, in touch.
Bye.
It may have been a kiss or two,but okay, so that was quick
okay that was quick it was?
It was, yeah, it was prettyquick okay, and um, it turned
out she was a really good womantoo, uh which nowadays is hard
to find yeah, she's very familyoriented.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
She um was ambitious and did any of the friends that
introduced you to her vouch forher.
Almost like you know, when youmeet someone in the wild you
don't know if they're a liar ornot.
But if you had a cousin and youwere like, oh, melissa, come to
this christmas party and youintroduced me, the cousin.
I know he's good because he'sfrom you.
(07:41):
Yeah to some degree.
Speaker 3 (07:43):
The one person you know had worked with her.
You know she's cool becausehe's from you.
Yeah, to some degree.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
The one person you know had worked with her, you
know she was cool, Right, so youknew somewhat that she wasn't
you know, some flake or whatever.
Speaker 3 (07:53):
But you know, people have different definitions of
what cool is.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
And even if she could have been cool.
It didn't mean there was aspark, but there was a fire.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Okay, and then.
So then you started hanging out.
So my next question is once yourealized you were in trouble
because all the ladies out thereyou're always asking and we
always see on social media Idon't understand how we had the
time, or you know?
Speaker 3 (08:21):
what was this woman?
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Keep it secret.
Keep it secret.
What was this woman?
Keep it secret.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Keep it secret.
What was this woman thinking?
Dating a married man?
These are all the questionsthat our viewers have.
What other questions do theyhave?
Oh, I can't believe he wouldleave me for her.
Well, in this instance, thatquestion's answered.
(08:44):
She was prettier than you,that's how he left her for you
in the beginning, and she was agood person.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
But how did you get away with it.
I would say that's partly true,but not fully true.
I think, it was that firstnight there was just an
electricity.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Okay, a super connection.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
It was.
I mean mean, I've met beautifulwomen right, of course, you
know I'm fairly looking guy butum yeah, there was just
something and I couldn't, Icouldn't cut myself away from it
okay.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
So then you exchanged numbers and you started texting
.
Did you meet up right away, didyou?
How did it?
Speaker 3 (09:20):
so how'd you get away with it?
With my job at the time, I wasout a lot of nights, so come
meet me here.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
I'm going to be here tonight.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
So the cover was or that was my cover.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
I'm meeting someone after work tonight and she was
busy at school with herdoctorate, exactly so she was
busy studying and doing her ownthing.
You're going to a Christmasparty 15 Christmas parties.
She's like okay, I'm busy, Iparty 15 christmas party.
She's like okay, I'm busy, I'mdoing my own thing.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
okay, right and how long did that go on for before
you were like?
It was probably six to eightmonths, maybe a little bit
longer, I don't remember exactly.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
And how often were you seeing her?
How often were you connectingwith her?
Speaker 3 (10:02):
multiple times a week .
Yeah, okay, four times a weekprobably.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
Which, like you said, you got out because of business
meeting.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
It got harder and harder as it went on.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Because you wanted right.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
Well, it was also like how many times can I really
have to go out, right?
Speaker 1 (10:20):
And were you living on the island and working?
Speaker 3 (10:22):
in the city.
No, all of us were living inthe city.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
Okay, the city, I feel, is much easier.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
It's much more conducive to have it.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
No, because, honestly , a lot of men that I meet out
in the wild, of course everybodyknows right, All the married
men hit on me 90%.
If I ever entertain theconversation, just for you know,
just to entertain, because youknow me, I'm like, yeah, tell me
, Please tell me, because youguys know I'll never date a
(10:52):
married man.
They're always like, oh, but wecan't go here.
If they, if they, if I meetthem in Melville, you know
they're like we got to go toGarden City.
You know we can't go here, wecan't.
Do I go?
This sounds wonderful from thestart.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
This sounds like so much fun.
Sign me up.
So, for reference to the peoplewho are listening to us from,
say, Ireland, that's about a15-mile difference 15, 20-mile
difference.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Yeah, it's far enough that it's not anywhere near
where we live, but still withinreason that you can drive.
But all these men are like youcan't go here, I can't go there.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
I can't be seen.
All these stipulations, oh, myfriends go there.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
My wife frequents there.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
So these are all changes that you'd have to make
in your life to be able to datethis amazing married man.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Okay, all right.
So the city, now Manhattan.
In case you're not familiar,there's about 8,000 restaurants
per city block.
I mean, you couldn't.
You probably couldn't find yourman cheating on you in
Manhattan if he even tried.
So okay, got it.
Okay.
So then the both of you are onthis journey.
(12:03):
She's single.
She can get up and go and dowhatever.
At what point in time were youready to be like I'm done with
my wife and I want to go withyou, like that's a big move, and
did she give you an ultimatumor anything like that?
Speaker 3 (12:19):
the second woman it was pretty amazing how long it
went on without getting that oh,tell us.
Speaker 1 (12:26):
Tell us, I mean I don't even remember the time
frame right but give us like it.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
It just didn't come out.
We were just kind of in ourgroove and doing our thing and
everybody and you were gettingaway with it.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
There was no push or pull on your end.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Not really no um, and then at some point she got
tired of it and was like youknow, shit or get off the pot.
I just made the decision.
I said this is who I want to bewith.
Speaker 1 (12:53):
And what did you tell your wife?
Was she shocked?
Speaker 3 (12:58):
Yes, she was shocked.
I think it was getting to mebecause, if I remember correctly
, we were fighting a lot, a lotmore than we usually do and we
didn't really fight that much.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
Well, because you were probably, I feel like, the
person who's cheating getsfrustrated.
You don't want to be thereanymore.
Or you're in that transitionmiddle of you're falling in love
with her and meanwhile you'remarried to her, and it has to be
annoying I don't want to.
Speaker 3 (13:29):
I don't know, but I think a lot of it was me because
, as I said, my first wife wasthe best person I've ever known
and I felt horrible about it andit wasn't intentional, it
wasn't like I was out lookingfor right it, it just happened
it happened.
Not an excuse, not validatingit by any means, but it wasn't
(13:50):
like I was miserable in my life.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
Marriage and out looking for it.
Speaker 3 (13:53):
Exactly, exactly.
So I think, because of myfrustration, we were probably
fighting a little bit more thanusual, and then the ultimatum
you felt pressure.
Like, if I don't I was gettingit from that side.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
If I don't tell my wife, I'm going to lose her, and
then, oh my God, I can't dothat which.
You know what?
I don't know.
The audience has to tell us.
I feel like that's rare, notlike so rare, what exactly?
I feel like a lot of men don'tpull the trigger.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Oh no, I feel the same.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
Right, a lot of men nowadays will string along.
Right the wife they're neverleaving the wife.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
And the side chick right is the one that gets
screwed.
I think that's more with guyslooking to do that.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Maybe, yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
I mean looking to have that kind of arrangement
where they have their cake andeat it too Like that wasn't me
Like.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
That, you know.
And again, I'm not justifyingthis by any means.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
No, but we want to hear your point of view.
That's why we have you on.
Speaker 3 (14:59):
It happened.
Speaker 1 (15:00):
It just happened and you know what Unlucky for his
wife what you're describingmakes.
You know what I'm saying.
Like you said, I wasn't lookingfor it.
There was a super connection.
It's almost like bad timing andbad luck for your wife A
question Was there anything?
Speaker 3 (15:24):
your first wife could have done to have avoided the
situation.
I think I don't think.
No, I don't think she couldhave done to have avoided the
situation.
I think I don't think, no, Idon't think she could have done
anything but I.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
What I would say is I don't know that there was ever
the passion that I had with thesecond with this, with that girl
, yeah it, just it was adifferent relationship it was a
different relationship, it was adifferent which is true.
We can all connect with that,right.
You've all had boyfriends orhusbands or whatever that you're
like.
Oh my God, that was amazing.
Versus eh, that was okay, likeit was okay.
Speaker 3 (15:52):
Listen, I mean I again.
I was young and dumb.
Right and it was, you know,looking back now, would I have
done the same thing?
I don't know.
I mean, I got a lot out of thesecond relationship, Right?
Speaker 1 (16:02):
which we're going to go into.
Speaker 3 (16:03):
But you know again I felt horrible about what
happened.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
Which is interesting.
If you were old like now you'reolder, right, it's 20-something
years down the road Would yougive up that marriage for?
Speaker 2 (16:19):
the hot Right.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
You would have been like you're hot, I've had a good
night with you, drink whateverand be on your merry way, right,
right.
Speaker 3 (16:28):
I mean yeah, no, the first wife was very intelligent,
very sweet and outgoing verywealthy.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Family oriented, I'm sure.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
Yeah, and you know, but it's.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
Was the girl that you're cheating on.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
Also intelligent, family-oriented she's very
family-oriented and theyaccepted me when they had no
reason to, when they had noreason to, um, but um.
(17:10):
I think intellectually I wasprobably had more in common with
the first one, um, but you knowit doesn't make it doesn't?
Right there's no comparing itdoesn't.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Yeah, it's stupid.
So, okay, delivered this newsto the your wife.
What?
What was the next?
What happened next?
Speaker 3 (17:25):
well, it wasn't like I was like hey, I've met
somebody else, it was just whatdid you say?
We're not because of me andwhatever I was feeling.
We weren't getting along verywell and I think, um, you know,
she was in school at the timegetting a master's or doctorate
and and I don't even rememberthe exact conversation.
(17:46):
But one day I was just like I'mdone, I'm done, and I moved out
shortly after into a shitholeapartment on the upper east side
.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
Sounds about right.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
And you know, Was that a?
Speaker 1 (18:04):
quick divorce, no kids.
It was quick, quick.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
Yeah, just split, boom, done, done.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
And you know what?
It's always easier to leavewhen I feel like for most people
, when you have something to goto.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
Do you know what I'm trying to say?
I wouldn't If I did not meether.
I would probably still be withher first wife.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Right, but I feel like for a lot of men also.
Speaker 2 (18:34):
There's no impetus.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
There's no impetus To leave, right, they'll stay.
Or I feel like when men leave,they're very quick to get
someone new?
Speaker 3 (18:47):
I don't think it's just men that do that.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
It could be women too .
Speaker 3 (18:50):
I think it's both.
Speaker 1 (18:51):
But I feel like when women have children, if they're
single, yes, but if they havechildren, I feel like not as
much they can exist being single.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
It's easier.
Speaker 1 (19:03):
It's easier when you have young kids that are living
like.
For me, it's much easier to besingle than it is to introduce
you know like that so many hoursin a day?
Speaker 3 (19:12):
I mean it's like you know yeah and uh so then you,
you gave okay.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
So now you're divorced from your wife, you're
with the girl, the that youcheated on her with.
Now what goes on?
Speaker 3 (19:28):
it turned out, there was a lot more to her than just
pretty eyes, and I'm sure therealways is um no, she was I.
From a family perspective, Iwent through a lot um from your
family.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
Yeah, I, this is a question I yes.
Speaker 2 (19:45):
How did your family react to that?
Speaker 1 (19:48):
my mother was like you're an idiot rest her soul
yeah, because that's what Iwould tell my son.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
Well, she got cancer and at one point she said that I
was the reason that she got itbecause she stressed her out
right, which isn't, but I mean,listen, you know my first wife
was her dream.
You know she's a nice blondejewish woman that had a shit ton
of money and right, right.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
So she was like what did you do, right, okay, yeah um
, so that was that was tough totake that was that was very
tough to take, because I wasdefinitely mom's boy.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
I mean I was her favorite and so hearing that you
know.
So she died shortly after thatand funeral was a little awkward
.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Oh, yeah, both came.
Speaker 3 (20:44):
The new one hid in the background.
I was still with, I wasseparated from the other one.
But, and then?
Speaker 1 (20:52):
That's ballsy of the new one I would never.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
Oh, you know what, I was happy she was there.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Yeah, well, support you were probably freaking out
because, the yeah, but I still Iwouldn't, I wouldn't, I
wouldn't.
Speaker 2 (21:04):
I put on a wig and a disguise.
Yeah, right.
Speaker 3 (21:06):
I'll say this Routro Mark glasses.
My mom and I were very, veryclose.
I was the baby, only boy, in aJewish family, so at their
funeral everybody had left and Icouldn't get out Like I was
just sitting in this chair.
Left, and I couldn't get outlike I was just sitting in this
(21:28):
chair and the girl that I wentwith, um, came over and
literally picked me up off thischair and walked me away.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
So, um, I know going back to the point of it wasn't
just looks right, no, she had aheart and she was in love with
you, obviously for her to evengo to the funeral and you know,
who knows if the I mean who wasgoing to go up to her and be
like Start something.
Right, or just give her theside eye, no less.
(21:54):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (21:55):
Exactly so.
From there, you know, we datedfor a while, and not even that
long, I think we kind of weprobably moved in together not
too long after that.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
And did you ever hear from this ex-wife again?
Speaker 3 (22:13):
I have not spoken to her since the day we got
divorced, since the funeral shewas at the funeral right Since
the funeral, because now, withno kids, that makes it very easy
.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
Like I always say, I don't think I would ever talk to
my ex ever again in my life ifI didn't have kids, and I'm sure
he feels the same way.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
I will say that she traded up.
She managed a brain surgeon, sokudos to her Right.
But yeah, I've never.
The odd thing was I saw heroffice when I was near where she
grew up and I was like, oh, butoffice when I was near where
she grew up and I was like, oh,you know but um, she was a
doctor.
Speaker 1 (22:47):
What?
Speaker 3 (22:48):
uh therapist psychologist, psychologist.
Okay, so she was in that yeah,brilliant, brilliantly smart and
um, so, so, yeah, so that wasthat, and um, I got married.
My dad died two years later andwe got married in between.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (23:10):
And how old were you at this point?
Give or take.
She had no kids.
You wanted kids, right?
Speaker 3 (23:17):
33, maybe Okay, Something like that.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
And then you got with her, lived together, had kids.
Speaker 3 (23:24):
Yeah, had two kids, beautiful kids, and you know,
life was good.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Now wait.
Was she ever worried that youwere going to cheat on her?
Nope See that's a dynamic Iwould be obsessed with that I
wouldn't be obsessed, but itwould always be in the back of
my mind.
Well because, or that she wascheating on you, because she's
the one that was willing to datethe married man.
Speaker 3 (23:49):
No, I think it was the situation.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
You felt comfortable, you felt whole.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
I mean, she never gave me an ultimatum.
It was well.
I mean, maybe she did, but itwas like.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
Light.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
It was like listen, we need to figure this out.
Right, like I'm not stickingaround to be your side chick.
And you just don't like if youwant to be with your wife, I'll
walk away.
Rightfully so.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
There's always that school of thought, though, and I
think women have especiallywomen have is how you get them,
is how you'll lose them, kind ofthing.
Speaker 1 (24:20):
But you know what I always?
I just when I'm out and thesemarried men come up to me and
they're like, forget about themorons that are like, oh, you
want to be my new side chick,you're perfect.
Yeah, I know.
Okay, forget those.
But the ones that are reallylike, let's go out for a drink,
I promise, I promise, like youknow the ones that You're like
(24:44):
have you heard my show?
Speaker 3 (24:45):
What they obviously haven't.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
But I always, I could never put in the back of my
mind that 10 years from now,when I'm old and the Botox isn't
holding up my face anymore,that you're not gonna do the
same thing to me, like you know.
Or you hear the story like ohwe, I live in the east wing, she
(25:08):
lives in the west wing and andwe have two separate lives and
we're just together because offinance.
I mean, I've heard it all, butI just I'm I.
I can never sit well with ityou know, nor nor, yeah, I.
Yeah, yeah, I get it, I get it,but you had kids.
You were good, everybody'shappy right.
Life went on for a long timeright, yeah, for a long time.
(25:32):
And everything was good.
What do you think now?
Were you ever approached?
So how long were you with thesecond one?
For 20 years, okay, long time.
Did you ever go out and did younot give your number out?
Is there anything you changed?
Or was it purely just vibes,relationship was different,
(25:54):
connection was different.
How did it last so long?
What would you tell our viewersBecause a lot of viewers do not
last 18, 20 years?
Speaker 3 (26:04):
I would like to say that I mean in the beginning.
It was a lot of passion thatcarried us for a few years, till
the kids came.
Speaker 1 (26:12):
Till the kids came, of course, see and I want to
normalize that because a lot ofwomen ask about that too.
I see a lot of women being likeoh, I just had kids, I'm
exhausted, I don't want to havesex, it's a job now.
And me included, I was the sameway.
I had two kids a year apart.
Almost I was up every fourhours giving bottles.
(26:33):
House was clean, dinner wasmade.
The way you left that house youcould lick the floors is the
way you came home.
You would never even know thatthere was a child or a dish made
right homemade baby food oranything.
I was dressed in sweatpants butshowered and looking the way I
look now.
But you know what?
I don't want to have sex withyou right now.
Speaker 3 (26:51):
I'm exhausted do you know?
What I'm saying, but a lot thathappens a lot yeah, I don't
think, and that wasn'tnecessarily in the beginning.
I mean, we had a lot of goodyears together and I think that
I'm not exactly sure.
To be honest with you, I thinkthat Did you have the same
(27:14):
interests.
No, we did not have a lot of thesame interests.
I realized that as time went on, we started living not separate
lives, but like independently,and I think that we and I take
as much blame for this asanything that I think we lost
(27:37):
ourselves.
I think we didn't get back todoing things that we like to do.
It was always a family thing.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Which happens, which happens?
Speaker 2 (27:48):
Kids.
Speaker 3 (27:49):
And I think that you don't know what's wrong until
you see it somewhere else.
Speaker 1 (27:57):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (27:58):
And in a lot of cases I mean obviously there can be
blatant stuff that's going on.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
Right.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
But for me it was just like this was life.
And you know, it's not all.
You know sex in the stairwelltype stuff, you know.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
Well, that only lasts so long.
Like I always say that you knowwhat I mean, like you know the
men that leave and we're stuckwith the kids at home.
Obviously, I'm not having sexon my stairwell, you know.
But I know my ex is oh, I'msure he's having sex in the
kitchen on the table in thedining room wherever he wants,
because he doesn't have the kidsthere.
You know what I mean.
(28:35):
So, but that doesn't last long.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
That's the fantasy of it.
It's not sustainable.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
So what would you say ?
Like what changed?
Did you not have sex?
As much Were you not going outto dinner, as much Were you not
like?
What is it?
Speaker 3 (28:51):
Yes, yes and yes, and over the last couple of years,
I think, I've had issues Notworth getting into but, Right,
and I think that we grew apart.
I think that, no, that's notwhat I was.
I think that we did not payenough attention to each other
um, and just daily life takesover.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
Yes, and then you just kind of you'd like
roommates right, almost.
And then I feel like that.
I feel like that happens toeveryone.
I feel like it happens toeveryone.
I feel like it happens toeverybody, and that's why
there's so many divorces.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
Yeah, there's probably some more to it, but I
think baseline is probablysomething along those lines.
Speaker 1 (29:34):
Okay, and then, how did that end?
What was the?
Speaker 3 (29:42):
This one was on her.
She wanted to separate.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
And Did you see it coming?
Were you surprised?
I was 1000% blindsided.
Speaker 3 (29:53):
Okay, so it's like karma.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
Oh yeah, did you feel ?
Speaker 2 (29:57):
Did you feel like this was a karmic episode At
some point?
Yeah, yes.
Speaker 3 (30:08):
And yeah, like this is a karmic episode, yeah, yes,
um and uh, yeah, I mean, I couldbarely get out of bed for like
months.
It was horrible, but, um, onceI came to grips with it and how
old are your kids now?
Uh 18 and 15 okay, so they'reolder yeah, how did they take it
?
The older one got it, I think.
(30:29):
I think she probably saw itmore Mm-hmm, I think they both
kind of did.
Speaker 1 (30:37):
How they reacted is Was there fighting or anything
that went on Like?
Speaker 3 (30:41):
was it smooth or oh no, it got pretty nasty okay um,
and yeah, I was, I was prettylost.
I was um, you know, I wastotally taken by surprise, you
know so what did she come?
Speaker 1 (30:57):
what did she say?
Did she come home?
Was she I'm done, I want adivorce.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
She was like I think we should separate and I was
like what?
Speaker 2 (31:08):
And had she cheated?
Was she seeing someone else?
Speaker 3 (31:12):
Remains to be seen.
I think so, without not gettinginto it, but yes, that's my
assumption of it, and it took mea few months to get my shit
together, and, um, I did, andhere we are so is there anything
(31:33):
that you learned like throughsuch a long relationship that
you wouldn't or would do again?
Yeah, um, I think I'll.
In time, I'll probably learnmore, but I take, I take
responsibility for for a bunchof it.
(31:54):
I'm not going to say all of itbut, um, I know that I wasn't
the perfect person.
I know that I could have beenmore helpful.
I probably could have been morehelpful.
I probably could have been moreattentive.
I you know.
Speaker 1 (32:07):
I feel like a lot of men would say that you know,
looking back, right, I mean ifyou self-reflect and you do the
job.
You said right, we're allsupposed to go through our
relationships, and then we'resupposed to learn about what we
want, what we don't want, thered flags take a post-mortem on
the on the relationship rightand then grow and in your next
(32:28):
relationship, become a betterperson right and I think we
started that way um and I feellike kids.
I feel like now jack on yournext, uh, so to say, now it's
back.
I feel like it reverts back tothe type of relationship you
(32:49):
could have with your first.
The kids are pretty much older.
You know what I mean.
One's going to college, right,and the other one's on their way
.
Now I feel like kids just putlike change relationships so
much they just screw everythingup.
Speaker 2 (33:06):
Moral of the story don't have them kids.
No, you're right, or?
Speaker 1 (33:10):
you just need a man that understands.
It's different now.
It's different.
Speaker 3 (33:16):
You're right, like I don't.
The runway is not as longanymore.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
Right.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
There's a lot of stuff I don't care about anymore
.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
You have time, yeah.
Speaker 3 (33:29):
I think I will be a better person the longer I am
away from this match.
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
And when did you officially move out and get
separated?
Speaker 3 (33:45):
Well, we separated.
I stayed in the house for abunch of months, so I was
advised to and I moved out fouror five months ago.
Four months ago.
Speaker 2 (33:59):
Okay, so that time where you were were quote
separated but still living underthe same roof.
I have to ask were you datingat all at that point and was she
not right away yeah um, butyeah, yeah, um.
Speaker 3 (34:18):
I can't confirm nor deny what she was doing, but I
think that she was with somebodyfrom before that and how does
that work?
Speaker 1 (34:28):
I see, I never had that, like I never we.
When my ex we broke up, hemoved out.
Do you know what I'm?
Speaker 2 (34:36):
saying Like I feel that's so, so common.
Now to the point.
I'm single and I can't tell youthe amount of times I've
encountered a guy oh, a lot.
And then, maybe on the thirddate, he's like yeah, I'm
sleeping in the basement, right,and my kids are upstairs, right
, my wife not my ex.
Speaker 3 (34:52):
That's what I was.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
Yeah, that's what I was.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
And it's just like bye.
Speaker 1 (34:59):
Like I couldn't watch my ex come and go as he pleases
, thinking while I'm sittingthere with the two kids.
But my kids are younger.
Speaker 3 (35:09):
Well, she's doing the same thing, Right?
Speaker 1 (35:11):
no, I know, like I couldn't-.
Speaker 3 (35:13):
Let me tell you I wasn't thrilled when I Right,
didn't that?
Speaker 1 (35:15):
hurt you Like where is she?
All you know?
Fuck yeah, you're not in thesweatpants going to Target
You're like in a dress dressedup and you know they're going
out somewhere and your heart hasto take that Like.
I don't want to see it.
Do you know what I'm trying to?
Speaker 2 (35:30):
say Totally.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
Because I always believe.
Listen, like I said earlier, ifme and my ex didn't have kids,
oh, we would never speak again.
But you know what, If you'renot human enough to say you
still don't want to look atsomebody getting dressed up and
going out while you're livingwith them.
It's a disrespectful, weirdthing.
(35:53):
You know it's not like I wantyou back thing I feel for a lot
of people, especially where welive, where it's so expensive.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
It's just like a financial necessity for people
to live together.
Yeah, no.
Speaker 3 (36:04):
I mean my lawyer was like don't do it, she's like
you'll lose it Well, that'sabandonment.
You, yeah, no.
I mean my lawyer was like don'tdo it, she's like you'll lose
it Well, that's abandonment.
You have kids Like you've gotto follow, but also the house,
right, you don't want to lose,right?
Speaker 1 (36:12):
I get all that If it's like that way.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
But when people are like, oh, I've been living with
my ex for three years, oh,that's crazy yeah.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
No, well, maybe you know what, who knows, I don't
know.
I don't know because he had twokids from a previous marriage,
which was a lot of upheaval, andshe was suing him for like 10
years from another state.
Lovely, that was a lot ofstress on us too.
(36:47):
But you know what?
I think he would always say tome could you not be a mother for
like five seconds and could yoube like my wife, like a woman?
And or he would come home fromwork he's, like you know, works
in like a big CEO, manhattan-yjob, and he'd be like you have
nothing to do, all you'retalking about is the house and
(37:09):
the kids.
I was, I stood home with thehouse and the kids.
What else did I have to talkabout?
Speaker 2 (37:14):
you know what I'm trying to say.
Speaker 1 (37:15):
So yeah, he was lovely believe me, it was lovely
, but I think, who knows, if Iwas still in the world, maybe he
would find chefing moreexciting to talk about than the
laundry and the dinner that Imade you and that the house is
spotless, like, I think, unlessyou grow together.
Speaker 3 (37:35):
Well, I think it's very important to have things
outside of the house.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
And listen.
You fall in love with somebody,you get married and, before the
kids come, like there's areason you got to this point.
You know you love each other,you're attracted to each other,
there's some passion, there'swhat have you, and when that
goes away whether it's from kidsor whatever else sometimes it's
(38:01):
like, okay, well, what's leftnow?
Speaker 2 (38:04):
you know right, I don't.
Speaker 3 (38:05):
And the passion without the passion people
realize.
Well, I don't really like thisperson, that much, you know.
Speaker 1 (38:12):
Um, yeah, I thought that we were best friends, but
but obviously we're not rightwhen you come home and you're
telling me I don't want to hearwhat you have to say because
you're telling me that you didthree loads of laundry and well,
I don't know what to tell you.
Like it's what I did today, Idon't, I don't know what to tell
you like it's what I did today.
I don't, I don't know, I don'thave any.
Speaker 3 (38:29):
And also, though, but before kids, you know, you had
a life and there was more stuffto talk about and to go out till
three o'clock in the morninghave sex all over the couch in
the chair and the whatever yeahno, absolutely, absolutely so.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
Who knows, I think, kids you know when, when, as the
woman, when, when your dynamicchanges and you know what,
before you have kids, everybodytells you.
I'm sure as a dad, you you cansee this point of view too from
your aspect.
People will tell you oh, it's alot of work, oh, you don't
(39:04):
understand.
But you know what?
I had no idea.
Like I thought having the kids,like I wanted kids, don't get
me wrong but I thought the kidsis like a bonding, like going to
bring us together type of thing, like I had.
I didn't even know the aspectof and I was older, I had my
first at 35, but I didn't evenknow that dynamic of it pulls
(39:25):
you apart, it doesn't bring youtogether.
So I thought this is great,this will only bring us together
.
Having kids how could it not?
Speaker 3 (39:32):
I think the other side is, and I don't know if you
worked or not before that.
Speaker 1 (39:35):
I did.
I was a chef.
Speaker 3 (39:37):
I think that you know , I look at my parents.
You know, my mother neverreally worked, so there wasn't
as much going on in her life andin her head and so that
relationship could still grow.
It started that way and itended that way, Right, exactly?
Speaker 1 (39:56):
Like my ex.
I think he became bored of mealmost because we decided I was
going to stay home and I wasn'tlike out and about and working
and bringing home money and eventhough it was a group decision,
and then he'd come home and Iwould just but I don't think
it's just that.
Speaker 3 (40:13):
I think it could be any job.
I mean, the kids are the mainthing.
Speaker 1 (40:17):
It was for me.
Speaker 3 (40:18):
Yeah, but you know he comes home, he's tired from
work and you're tired from thekids and neither of you
necessarily want to hear theother one bitch or moan about
what they were going through,right and you know, if there's
not any mutual respect well, no,not even respect, like uh,
common interest or likes thatyou can, you know?
Speaker 2 (40:41):
fall back, go play golf or like go, whatever it is
you know and this is all yourworld is.
Speaker 3 (40:47):
I think that's very hard, Like I think it's very
hard.
Speaker 1 (40:49):
It is hard and you're right, I think a lot of times
we don't.
Well, I didn't, I don't knowabout we, I didn't get to know,
I had my kids very quickly, likeI met him, and six months later
, yeah, that's the other thing,and you're right.
I've never even looked at itthat way, because as time went
(41:11):
on I remember like certainthings will shoot in my head.
He'd come home.
He'd be like you don't evenlike country music.
I love country music.
I'm like I've never likedcountry music.
Speaker 3 (41:17):
Like you know what I?
Mean like I never liked it butyou also didn't have that time
of like yeah time, like when Iwas in the city, for example,
all those years before kids.
You know we did shit.
Like we went out to coolrestaurants.
I used to go see music all thetime, I would you know, and
there's bonding there, there'syou know Right that you both
(41:39):
like to do the same thing.
And then 10 years later you turnaround and like we haven't done
any of this stuff in years andother than that we don't really
have that much in common youknow, and you know.
So there's you.
In my opinion, I obviouslyfailed at this, but you have to
keep the flame going while beingable to do the other stuff, and
(42:01):
without that it becomeseverything, becomes a chore it
does, including the, so thatcould be a takeaway for our
female listeners out there Malelisteners as- well, I think it's
for both sides.
I don't think this is not.
This isn't this world anymore,where the woman stays home and
takes care of the kids all thetime, to your exception.
But, like you know, we havejobs, we both have jobs and we
(42:25):
both have our own shit going on.
And how do you cut time out ofall that busyness and the
world's a lot busier now than itused to be to take time for
yourselves.
Speaker 1 (42:35):
And if you don't do that and it doesn't have to be
big major things, you know it'sand what kind of advice would
you give to our male listenersthat are listening, that may be
married or with a girl?
Well, married is more.
Speaker 3 (42:47):
Don't get married, that's why I've never been
married.
No, I would say you know Forthe married ones it's little
things.
Speaker 1 (43:00):
Don't give your phone number out to the hot blonde
that comes up to the bar.
But what would you tell themabout that whole experience?
Would you ever do it again?
Or would you turn around andjust end one thing and then
start another?
Speaker 3 (43:16):
I think it depends on the person.
Me, I learned my lesson?
I don't think.
Speaker 1 (43:25):
And you learned at both ends.
You learned how it feels whenyou thought the second time
around when you thought it wasdone, to which I'm sure your ex
what you, the first wife, wasdevastated the same way.
You were devastated and now yousaw it both folds.
It's a big difference whenyou're the one Devastated and
you had somebody to jump and goto right it just is versus when
(43:48):
you were devastated and possiblyshe had somebody to go jump to.
It's a very differentexperience.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
So that kind of segues into you know what was it
like for you getting out thereagain as a newly single man in
this new you know.
Speaker 3 (44:07):
You and I spoke briefly about this before.
It's a nightmare, right, jack?
It's a whole other world.
Speaker 2 (44:12):
How do you like the apps oh?
Speaker 3 (44:15):
yes.
Speaker 1 (44:15):
Jack, you're on the apps.
Speaker 3 (44:20):
I think they're like they make the time go by.
Speaker 1 (44:24):
It's time consuming.
Speaker 3 (44:25):
Well, yeah, in a good way.
Sometimes I mean listen, I livealone.
Your kids are older my kids andthey live with her and there's
a lot of nights.
I'm just sitting there alone.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
Why not go out for a drink?
Speaker 3 (44:36):
but it's not no but it's not even that like I'll be
watching tv and just likescrolling through apps, you know
right and um.
Thankfully I met somebody andyou.
Speaker 1 (44:44):
How long did that take?
Like when did you meet them?
Speaker 3 (44:52):
Let me see, just four months ago.
Speaker 1 (44:55):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (44:59):
But it was.
Speaker 1 (44:59):
See, you've been single without anybody for about
eight, nine months, give ortake.
Speaker 3 (45:12):
I went on a couple dates and, like you know, I
needed to get out of the house,you know know.
So initially, when I was on thesites that's what it was for I
wasn't looking for anybody, um.
And then I was like I was kindof I don't know.
Back in the day I would go outby myself all the time.
I love going out by myself, um.
The city is different, though,because you can kind of walk
from place to place.
Speaker 2 (45:26):
Here it's like all right now I'm going to drive
somewhere else.
Speaker 3 (45:29):
Right you know so, but I didn't really want to see
anybody.
You know, I went out partly toget out of the house and partly
to piss her off.
I'm sure Right.
And I will say I think it was agood thing because, you know,
(45:51):
obviously it depends on yoursituation, but I was curled up
in a ball Like I didn't want todo anything.
Speaker 1 (45:55):
Right, you were upset .
Speaker 3 (45:56):
I needed to get out Like I needed to do things, and
that allowed me to do it Easily.
Speaker 1 (46:04):
You know what I'm saying Because I mean, you get
on the app, and I'm sure it'snot, you know.
I'm just saying there's a lotof choices and it's rather than
going into the wild and findingsomebody, but I'd like that
better, like I like the idea Ilike the idea that my favorite
thing in new york was going outalone right, I loved it.
I lived in new york.
I went out alone too when Ilived there, just meeting people
(46:24):
.
Speaker 3 (46:24):
Sometimes it would lead to something, sometimes one
, but like I, always, but Ialways had great conversations.
I always met some interestingpeople Girls, guys.
It wasn't necessarily romanticor anything like that.
Speaker 2 (46:33):
Just conversation.
Speaker 3 (46:34):
I agree, I don't get that anymore in bars when I go
out.
Speaker 2 (46:37):
I don't, Because everyone's there meeting their
updates.
That's why Right Right, rightright, Probably yeah.
Speaker 3 (46:42):
Or they're couples already.
Speaker 1 (46:44):
Like I don't see Very hard in the wild, there's not a
lot of like single placesespecially at this age.
People don't interact.
There's the few around you andhow old are you for the record,
jack, how old are you?
Speaker 2 (46:55):
How old am I?
I?
Speaker 3 (46:56):
am 53.
Yeah, there's some places likethe Rare and Blackstone and
things like that.
But you know it's not the samefeel.
Speaker 1 (47:05):
It's not same feel it's not.
Speaker 3 (47:06):
It was so much.
I don't want to say easier, butmore comfortable.
Speaker 1 (47:09):
But now it's like no, it's very rare, maybe it's me.
Speaker 3 (47:12):
Maybe I'm more insecure now than I used to be.
Speaker 2 (47:13):
No, people are different.
The climate, the dating climatein general, just people in
general.
Speaker 1 (47:18):
I'll always be out at like a Blackstone, sitting in a
bar whatever, and like havewhere we went.
Speaker 2 (47:22):
A steakhouse people.
Speaker 1 (47:24):
And like, if I end up talking to anybody, it'll be
like a group of businessmen thatare like, are you waiting for
someone?
Speaker 2 (47:31):
And I'll be like no, and they'll be like are you
serious?
Speaker 1 (47:35):
Like you're here by yourself, Like what?
And they'll start talking to meand buy my meal and that's the
night I have talking to the 20s,but it's a lot different for a
woman than a guy.
Speaker 3 (47:44):
Like I could go to a bar by myself and be perfectly
fine, like nobody would thinktwice about it.
Speaker 1 (47:49):
Right.
Speaker 3 (47:50):
And you know I spent a lot of time on the road for
work and I loved doing thatbecause I would meet like the
most interesting people and justyou know, talk and you know,
nothing you know, nefarious oranything like that, but it was
just.
And now it's, like you know,especially, most of my friends
are married, so they're notgoing out.
So it's like, what do you do?
You stay at home all day.
Speaker 1 (48:10):
Right.
Well, you've been successful onthe date.
Like you said, you've beennewly dating somebody.
Speaker 3 (48:14):
Yes, yes.
Speaker 1 (48:15):
You found someone fairly quickly.
Speaker 3 (48:17):
That's quick.
I was shocked.
I was definitely shocked.
Speaker 2 (48:22):
Did you feel like a kid in the candy store?
Speaker 3 (48:24):
like on the apps, just with all the a little bit
yeah, um, not necessarily thatpeople were coming after me, but
it was just like oh, look atthat one, you know yeah and I
think it's a little demeaning,like I think it's like, I mean
it's certainly reallysuperficial, I mean of course,
it just reduces people to fivepictures and a couple of words
of copy and text, and that's ityeah, exactly um
Speaker 1 (48:46):
there's not like a big bio on the person.
Most people can't be bothered.
So, it's just a few like whereyou live your age, what you do
for a living Demographic info.
Speaker 3 (48:57):
Hinge is a little bit better.
I think they have the promptsand stuff.
Speaker 2 (49:00):
Yeah, exactly, but still people, especially guys,
unfortunately, I'd say the vastmajority of them, just they
can't be bothered to.
Speaker 3 (49:10):
Yeah well, just they can't be bothered to.
Yeah well, I can't.
Very lazy to me that's fun,like, and just put it out there
and be like well, at this pointit's like what you got to lose,
like what's you know right so um, but yeah, no, it's um because,
yeah, it's been 20 years sinceyou've been out in the Y, really
25.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (49:30):
Different.
It's a lot different.
Speaker 3 (49:33):
It's a lot different.
Yeah, Like I don't have theenergy anymore to go out and sit
at a bar, I mean as much as I'dlike to, Right.
I mean I met some really nicepeople, though, Like I'm friends
with some of the women thatI've met on these sites.
Right, I just went out fordrinks with one of them the
other night, right, and you knowwe were both going through hard
(49:53):
times and helped each other,and you know we have this nice
little friendship going on Rightwhich is nice.
Speaker 2 (49:59):
Yeah, meet new people ?
Yeah, so with your new partner,was she in a similar situation
as you like?
Newly separated?
Speaker 1 (50:10):
No, she's single, single a while.
Uh, she's single single, she'sum.
See, like I said, I think womentake a much bigger.
I know I think a year after I'mgonna say eight months after we
separated, my ex started, likeyou know, became friends with
somebody and, like me, it's beenlike four years.
Speaker 2 (50:29):
We'll change that On and off?
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (50:31):
But I feel like men meet women quicker usually.
Speaker 2 (50:37):
Maybe, I don't know, did she have an issue with you
being separated and notofficially divorced.
Speaker 3 (50:43):
I wouldn't call it an issue.
I think it was.
Speaker 2 (50:46):
Gave her a pause.
Gave her a pause for a minute,but you know.
Speaker 1 (50:53):
And what was her story?
She was divorced.
Speaker 3 (50:55):
She's been divorced a long time.
Speaker 1 (50:56):
Kids, yeah, kids yeah , young, old.
Speaker 3 (51:00):
No, like school kids.
Speaker 1 (51:02):
Okay, so younger.
Speaker 3 (51:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (51:05):
So she's, but they live with her.
Speaker 3 (51:06):
She's busy with them, Like like me, yeah so, but what
I learned is you know, like youdon't, like I said I might say
this before, but you don't knowwhat's missing until you see it
and you know, you kind of goalong with your life and
thinking that's it, and I'mhaving a lot more fun now, um,
(51:27):
than I've had in years and years, and didn't even realize.
Speaker 2 (51:29):
And why do you think that is?
Speaker 3 (51:31):
I think well, the person that I'm seeing is fun.
Speaker 2 (51:34):
She likes to go out.
Speaker 1 (51:36):
It's part of her life and Like in what Just like
dinner shows Broadway.
Speaker 3 (51:44):
Dinner, bars, concerts, whatever Right, okay,
just stuff, right.
Speaker 1 (51:48):
It doesn't even matter what it is, it's just fun
and it's like and I feel likeyou can't do that shit when you
have a three and four year oldyou know what I'm saying, like
unless you have a live-in nannyor you're paying a sitter,
you're pay.
Speaker 3 (52:01):
You know you're paying for the concert listen,
but growing up like my parents,I mean we had, I mean when we
didn't have a live-inhousekeeper, we had babysitters.
Speaker 1 (52:12):
Right.
Speaker 3 (52:13):
My parents went out every single Saturday night.
Speaker 1 (52:15):
They made an effort, though, too.
Speaker 3 (52:17):
Every single Saturday night, whether alone or with
friends or whatever.
Right that's cute.
They were married for a verylong time and I think at the end
my mother probably hated him.
Yeah, everybody does.
People stay together, butgrowing up watching them.
Speaker 1 (52:34):
Yeah, gave you a good sense of they gave me if that
was.
Speaker 3 (52:39):
they both had their individual issues, but you know
it was impressive, right, andnow you're having more.
Speaker 1 (52:47):
So you forgot so to say how to have fun.
So now you're recognizing.
Speaker 2 (52:53):
Yeah, and also are you having more fun now, in part
to the ways that you've changed?
Speaker 3 (52:59):
Yeah, I mean some of it's who I used to be.
Speaker 2 (53:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (53:04):
And some of it's new.
And you know, life's just toofucking short it is, and life's
just too fucking short.
Speaker 1 (53:09):
It is, it's just too fucking short.
It's true.
And you have to my friendalways tells me that One of my
best male friends but I didn't.
Speaker 3 (53:17):
It's like.
Speaker 1 (53:17):
Melissa, life's too short.
Speaker 3 (53:19):
When you're in a marriage for a long time.
You don't?
Maybe it was me.
I was like oh, I guess this iswhat life is.
Speaker 2 (53:26):
This is.
Maybe it was me.
Speaker 3 (53:27):
I was like well, I guess this is what this is it,
this is what right you know, andyou know, now it's more.
All right, what can I do?
Speaker 1 (53:34):
like what's right, what's out there?
What's out there?
Speaker 3 (53:37):
let's have fun let's like I want to go see bands, I
want to go to restaurants, Iwant to, you know um, and she
likes to do that and it's andwhat's her situation with her ex
like?
Speaker 1 (53:50):
is it amicable?
Does she still have to dealwith like?
Speaker 3 (53:52):
is there any amicable ?
That's as far as I can go withher right.
Yeah, I can't right.
Speaker 2 (53:58):
But there's no like anything no kind of no, no, no
you know, disturbing.
Speaker 1 (54:03):
No, no, no.
Your relationship with her?
No, no, no.
Which is perfect?
Which is perfect?
Speaker 3 (54:07):
um and yeah.
So you know it's just.
I think sometimes it takessomebody and whether or not it's
forever or not somebody just tokind of get you out of that
funk and wake up a little bitand realize that you know,
hopefully you still have 30 someyears left to live and what are
you going to do?
Speaker 2 (54:26):
sit in?
Speaker 1 (54:26):
your bed all day, right Exactly.
Speaker 3 (54:29):
Yeah, but you know, living alone it's not easy, it's
not, you know.
Speaker 1 (54:33):
Right.
Speaker 2 (54:34):
No, it's not.
Could you see yourself marriedagain?
Speaker 3 (54:37):
No, I have said that if it was that important, it's
open for discussion.
So I won't say never, but never.
Speaker 2 (54:51):
So what are our takeaways, guys?
Speaker 1 (54:59):
Yes.
What are our takeaways?
What did we learn?
What did we learn?
Well, we learned the maleperspective about cheating and
why some or our guests herecheat Women ask how, why?
Well, we answered that questionand we don't have all the
scenarios, but we have this one,you know.
Speaker 2 (55:14):
Looks do matter, passion does matter.
Speaker 1 (55:17):
Passion and looks.
Kids change things.
I think a relationship thatstarts and ends with no kids
versus a relationship thatstarts, has kids and ends is
very different.
Kids versus a relationship thatstarts, has kids and ends is
very different, and I think therelationship that the female and
the male is able to have beforeor after the kids is also plays
a part, and I don't thinkpeople put enough emphasis on
(55:40):
that.
Speaker 3 (55:40):
No, you know, I think that's 100, right, like I think
now um like you said you havenow.
Speaker 1 (55:45):
Things are very different.
Speaker 3 (55:46):
It's very different and I don't know if this lasts
or doesn't last, you know, butyeah, no, it's like the kids are
still there, they're a bitolder now but on my day-to-day.
It's not that, it's not um.
You know, I'm driving extraactivities.
Speaker 1 (56:05):
This one's sick the doctor, I can enjoy my time with
somebody you know I can rightand it's listen, I know it's new
and it's of course, it's alwaysnew, it's always exciting
you're having sex on the tablestill.
Speaker 3 (56:17):
Right, right, I get it um, but yeah, I mean, I have
no, I have no expectations rightat this point.
Speaker 1 (56:28):
It's different.
Speaker 3 (56:29):
I'm not expecting anything.
Everything that I get right nowis bonus.
Right, it's just a free for allI mean, I would love for it to
get there.
Speaker 1 (56:38):
Right.
Speaker 3 (56:40):
But yeah, right now I'm just happy with something
new and realizing I have thiswhole other stage.
Speaker 1 (56:48):
And so do you feel like through each relationship
you learned, you grew and you'removing on with each single one.
Speaker 3 (56:55):
Yeah, I think so.
I think it takes a while tokind of figure that out, but I
feel like every day I feel alittle different.
Some days are good, some daysare bad.
Right, sometimes it hits you,sometimes it doesn't.
Speaker 1 (57:07):
Of course that's with every relationship, right.
Feel a little different, youknow, some days are good, some
days are bad, but right, um,sometimes it hits you.
Speaker 3 (57:09):
Sometimes, of course that's with every relationship,
right but there are days whereI'm like what, this is okay
right, I'm okay.
Speaker 1 (57:17):
I'm okay.
This is gonna be okay.
Speaker 2 (57:19):
Yep, I think we're all like that right, yeah, yeah,
at the end of the day, we'restill here.
Speaker 1 (57:24):
Yes, exactly, exactly .
Thank you so much for tellingus your story.
Speaker 2 (57:31):
Thank you for being our very first brave guy.
Speaker 1 (57:33):
See, gentlemen, when I go on social media and I'm
like I'm looking for males thatblank, blank, blank, blank blank
, we don't kill you too much onhere, it wasn't that bad, we
weren't that bad, it wasn't thatpainful right.
Speaker 3 (57:45):
I'll let you know about the scars later.
No it's been great, actually,you guys have been very inviting
and very kind.
Speaker 1 (57:52):
Yes, thank you so much we really appreciate it.
We really do.
Thank you for joining us and wewill be back again yes, please,
don't forget to like.
Speaker 2 (58:05):
Give us only five star ratings, please, and write
something nice about us, becauseit makes our day.
Yes, come on Right, spread thelove.
Speaker 1 (58:13):
Email us, watch our social media and we will be back
again soon After the new year,right?
No wait after Christmas, yeah2025.
2025.
Yay, all right guys, can't waitto see what kind of ticket.
Speaker 2 (58:31):
We see come up within 2025.
I have some coming up for you.
Unfortunately, WonderfulAllison has some.
Speaker 1 (58:38):
All right.
Well, thank you so much and wewill see you soon.
And thank you to our guestsagain.
Speaker 2 (58:44):
Bye.
Hello and welcome back to Dating.
Daycare where we help younavigate through the jungle of
jerks.
Ladies and gents, we are backtoday.
We have a very exciting episode.
I'm very excited for this.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Yeah, so this gentleman.
He has the distinction of beingthe very first guy on our show.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Very first.
You've been asking for it andwe have come through and
delivered the first male.
We are going to get the maleperspective, which we're excited
.
We're so excited and but tokeep him anonymous, we are going
to call him Jack.
Yes.
And we are so excited and thankyou so much for being here.
(00:48):
We really appreciate it.
It's brave.
It's brave coming on our show.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Absolutely.
I've asked a few guys and theyjust didn't have the cojones
yeah.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
So we thank you, Jack Welcome.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
I'm getting nervous.
Speaker 3 (01:01):
Don't get, nervous, don't get nervous.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
We just want answers, jack, we want answers.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
I have answers we're excited.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Okay, great, great, great.
So why don't you tell us?
Speaker 3 (01:15):
a little bit about your story.
I have been married twice now.
Okay, I met my first wife incollege, married her shortly
after three years.
To this day I say she'sprobably the best person I've
ever known.
I had met somebody else duringthat time that I was young and
(01:37):
dumb and she was very beautifuland very seductive and I fell
into that trap, which we'lldiscuss.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
We'll go into detail, ladies, because we know you
have a million.
We get question after questionafter question about that.
So should we start?
Let's start with that.
So, when you met your firstwife in college, how long did
you date her before you?
Speaker 2 (02:06):
proposed, and exactly how old were you and um.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
I was 25 when we got married young and I think we
were together for four years,five years, four and a half
years all together between uhbefore before.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Yes, yes, okay, so then you got married, happily
married, right, everything'sgoing well, whatever.
How did you meet the girl thatyou ended up having the affair
with?
Speaker 3 (02:36):
so I was introduced to her by some former co-.
At work At a bar.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
Okay, so outside of work but the coworkers Exactly.
And you had no children withthe first.
No, which makes a bigdifference.
Yes, it just does.
Started marriage.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Mm-hmm, and I saw her there before I was even
introduced to her and my mouthhit the floor, Mm-hmm.
And once we were introduced Iknew I was in a lot of trouble.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Now did she know you were married.
Speaker 3 (03:13):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
Okay.
So it was like oh, this is Brad, brad, this is whatever her
name was.
You're at the bar, it'sChristmas party, whatever.
And you guys start talking hey,how you doing?
Are you married?
You know all the regular.
What do you do for a living?
You have kids, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Okay, Exactly.
So who?
Okay, so now you know, sheknows you're married.
(03:36):
Was she like, are we going tohang out again?
Brad, Like who was the onepursuing, Because when I go out,
was she single.
Speaker 3 (03:46):
What was pursuing, because when I go out single,
what was her status?
Yeah, she was single.
Yeah, um, she's a bit youngerthan I am.
Um, it was very mutual okay Icertainly needed to take the
head um so that you knew I wasmarried and I had to assure her
that.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
So you pursued more, I pursued Okay, I pursued Okay,
and she was like oh, okay.
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Like sounds good.
It wasn't quite that easy, butit wasn't so difficult Okay.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
So I mean, I'm sure you had been attracted to other
women before that point, butwhat was the point of difference
that made you say, you knowwhat, let's screw those vows and
let's just take a chance onthis?
What made?
Speaker 3 (04:26):
it worth it.
Yeah, what made her so special?
The eyes, okay.
Speaker 1 (04:32):
And you said she was prettier than any woman.
See, we always discuss thiswhen people write into our show,
ladies and gents, and whenyou're like, oh, looks don't
matter, looks aren't everything.
And I always say this jack,when you're out somewhere,
unless you're doing this onlinedating and you're scrolling
looking at a picture.
(04:52):
But for me, who's out in, inthe, in the wild, the first
thing I'm seeing when a guy'sbuying me a drink from across
the bar is how you look, andthat depends whether I'm
accepting the drink or not.
Now you could look like I mean,I love you know the old Pierce
Brosnan but, you could look likeyou know the gods of the earth
(05:15):
and then come over and beat acomplete jerk once you open your
mouth.
That I'll agree with.
And I could be like I wouldn'tdate you with a 10-foot pole,
but looks matter, looks matter.
I wouldn't date you with a10-foot pole, but looks matter,
looks matter, looks matter.
And like he's saying, the looksis really what took you and
said you know what Screw thelike?
This is the one because look ather.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
I mean, there was a connection and she was nice,
right Of course she opened hermouth, she wasn't stupid, there
was an instant electricity there, right, yeah, I mean.
But I think that's the case foreveryone.
Whether you're married or not,you meet somebody You're not
marrying, somebody you're notattracted to.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
Absolutely.
But I mean, you were married,your wife was attracted to you.
But this girl, if she didn'tlook as good and the connection
was there, you might have let itgo.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
Yes was there, you might have let it go.
Yes, Also question what wasgoing on.
Was there trouble in paradise?
Were there little cracks in themarriage?
Speaker 3 (06:19):
Not really.
I mean, she was getting herdoctorate and so she was-, busy,
busy a lot of the time.
I was at the time working onWall Street street, um, and oh
no, I was actually working inrecruiting, but um, it was just
there was a lot of time alone.
Like my industry was verysocial, there was always nights
out and corporate usually isyeah, my ex is always out I was
(06:42):
very good for a while.
This again, it was like alightning bolt.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
And men like attention.
We've discussed this.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
I walked away and knew I was screwed, like.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
I was like at the end of the night I was like, yeah,
so you exchanged numbers thatfirst night and it was like I'll
get in touch, like I'll justyou know we'll be in touch.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
Bye, see you.
There may have been a kiss ortwo, okay, in touch.
Bye.
It may have been a kiss or two,but okay, so that was quick
okay that was quick it was?
It was, yeah, it was prettyquick okay, and um, it turned
out she was a really good womantoo, uh which nowadays is hard
to find yeah, she's very familyoriented.
Speaker 1 (07:21):
She um was ambitious and did any of the friends that
introduced you to her vouch forher.
Almost like you know, when youmeet someone in the wild you
don't know if they're a liar ornot.
But if you had a cousin and youwere like, oh, melissa, come to
this christmas party and youintroduced me, the cousin.
I know he's good because he'sfrom you.
(07:41):
Yeah to some degree.
Speaker 3 (07:43):
The one person you know had worked with her.
You know she's cool becausehe's from you.
Yeah, to some degree.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
The one person you know had worked with her, you
know she was cool, Right, so youknew somewhat that she wasn't
you know, some flake or whatever.
Speaker 3 (07:53):
But you know, people have different definitions of
what cool is.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
And even if she could have been cool.
It didn't mean there was aspark, but there was a fire.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Okay, and then.
So then you started hanging out.
So my next question is once yourealized you were in trouble
because all the ladies out thereyou're always asking and we
always see on social media Idon't understand how we had the
time, or you know?
Speaker 3 (08:21):
what was this woman?
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Keep it secret.
Keep it secret.
What was this woman?
Keep it secret.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Keep it secret.
What was this woman thinking?
Dating a married man?
These are all the questionsthat our viewers have.
What other questions do theyhave?
Oh, I can't believe he wouldleave me for her.
Well, in this instance, thatquestion's answered.
(08:44):
She was prettier than you,that's how he left her for you
in the beginning, and she was agood person.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
But how did you get away with it.
I would say that's partly true,but not fully true.
I think, it was that firstnight there was just an
electricity.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Okay, a super connection.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
It was.
I mean mean, I've met beautifulwomen right, of course, you
know I'm fairly looking guy butum yeah, there was just
something and I couldn't, Icouldn't cut myself away from it
okay.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
So then you exchanged numbers and you started texting
.
Did you meet up right away, didyou?
How did it?
Speaker 3 (09:20):
so how'd you get away with it?
With my job at the time, I wasout a lot of nights, so come
meet me here.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
I'm going to be here tonight.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
So the cover was or that was my cover.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
I'm meeting someone after work tonight and she was
busy at school with herdoctorate, exactly so she was
busy studying and doing her ownthing.
You're going to a Christmasparty 15 Christmas parties.
She's like okay, I'm busy, Iparty 15 christmas party.
She's like okay, I'm busy, I'mdoing my own thing.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
okay, right and how long did that go on for before
you were like?
It was probably six to eightmonths, maybe a little bit
longer, I don't remember exactly.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
And how often were you seeing her?
How often were you connectingwith her?
Speaker 3 (10:02):
multiple times a week .
Yeah, okay, four times a weekprobably.
Speaker 1 (10:07):
Which, like you said, you got out because of business
meeting.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
It got harder and harder as it went on.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Because you wanted right.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
Well, it was also like how many times can I really
have to go out, right?
Speaker 1 (10:20):
And were you living on the island and working?
Speaker 3 (10:22):
in the city.
No, all of us were living inthe city.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
Okay, the city, I feel, is much easier.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
It's much more conducive to have it.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
No, because, honestly , a lot of men that I meet out
in the wild, of course everybodyknows right, All the married
men hit on me 90%.
If I ever entertain theconversation, just for you know,
just to entertain, because youknow me, I'm like, yeah, tell me
, Please tell me, because youguys know I'll never date a
(10:52):
married man.
They're always like, oh, but wecan't go here.
If they, if they, if I meetthem in Melville, you know
they're like we got to go toGarden City.
You know we can't go here, wecan't.
Do I go?
This sounds wonderful from thestart.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
This sounds like so much fun.
Sign me up.
So, for reference to the peoplewho are listening to us from,
say, Ireland, that's about a15-mile difference 15, 20-mile
difference.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Yeah, it's far enough that it's not anywhere near
where we live, but still withinreason that you can drive.
But all these men are like youcan't go here, I can't go there.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
I can't be seen.
All these stipulations, oh, myfriends go there.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
My wife frequents there.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
So these are all changes that you'd have to make
in your life to be able to datethis amazing married man.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Okay, all right.
So the city, now Manhattan.
In case you're not familiar,there's about 8,000 restaurants
per city block.
I mean, you couldn't.
You probably couldn't find yourman cheating on you in
Manhattan if he even tried.
So okay, got it.
Okay.
So then the both of you are onthis journey.
(12:03):
She's single.
She can get up and go and dowhatever.
At what point in time were youready to be like I'm done with
my wife and I want to go withyou, like that's a big move, and
did she give you an ultimatumor anything like that?
Speaker 3 (12:19):
the second woman it was pretty amazing how long it
went on without getting that oh,tell us.
Speaker 1 (12:26):
Tell us, I mean I don't even remember the time
frame right but give us like it.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
It just didn't come out.
We were just kind of in ourgroove and doing our thing and
everybody and you were gettingaway with it.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
There was no push or pull on your end.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Not really no um, and then at some point she got
tired of it and was like youknow, shit or get off the pot.
I just made the decision.
I said this is who I want to bewith.
Speaker 1 (12:53):
And what did you tell your wife?
Was she shocked?
Speaker 3 (12:58):
Yes, she was shocked.
I think it was getting to mebecause, if I remember correctly
, we were fighting a lot, a lotmore than we usually do and we
didn't really fight that much.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
Well, because you were probably, I feel like, the
person who's cheating getsfrustrated.
You don't want to be thereanymore.
Or you're in that transitionmiddle of you're falling in love
with her and meanwhile you'remarried to her, and it has to be
annoying I don't want to.
Speaker 3 (13:29):
I don't know, but I think a lot of it was me because
, as I said, my first wife wasthe best person I've ever known
and I felt horrible about it andit wasn't intentional, it
wasn't like I was out lookingfor right it, it just happened
it happened.
Not an excuse, not validatingit by any means, but it wasn't
(13:50):
like I was miserable in my life.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
Marriage and out looking for it.
Speaker 3 (13:53):
Exactly, exactly.
So I think, because of myfrustration, we were probably
fighting a little bit more thanusual, and then the ultimatum
you felt pressure.
Like, if I don't I was gettingit from that side.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
If I don't tell my wife, I'm going to lose her, and
then, oh my God, I can't dothat which.
You know what?
I don't know.
The audience has to tell us.
I feel like that's rare, notlike so rare, what exactly?
I feel like a lot of men don'tpull the trigger.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Oh no, I feel the same.
Speaker 1 (14:27):
Right, a lot of men nowadays will string along.
Right the wife they're neverleaving the wife.
Speaker 3 (14:34):
And the side chick right is the one that gets
screwed.
I think that's more with guyslooking to do that.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Maybe, yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
I mean looking to have that kind of arrangement
where they have their cake andeat it too Like that wasn't me
Like.
Speaker 3 (14:52):
That, you know.
And again, I'm not justifyingthis by any means.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
No, but we want to hear your point of view.
That's why we have you on.
Speaker 3 (14:59):
It happened.
Speaker 1 (15:00):
It just happened and you know what Unlucky for his
wife what you're describingmakes.
You know what I'm saying.
Like you said, I wasn't lookingfor it.
There was a super connection.
It's almost like bad timing andbad luck for your wife A
question Was there anything?
Speaker 3 (15:24):
your first wife could have done to have avoided the
situation.
I think I don't think.
No, I don't think she couldhave done to have avoided the
situation.
I think I don't think, no, Idon't think she could have done
anything but I.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
What I would say is I don't know that there was ever
the passion that I had with thesecond with this, with that girl
, yeah it, just it was adifferent relationship it was a
different relationship, it was adifferent which is true.
We can all connect with that,right.
You've all had boyfriends orhusbands or whatever that you're
like.
Oh my God, that was amazing.
Versus eh, that was okay, likeit was okay.
Speaker 3 (15:52):
Listen, I mean I again.
I was young and dumb.
Right and it was, you know,looking back now, would I have
done the same thing?
I don't know.
I mean, I got a lot out of thesecond relationship, Right?
Speaker 1 (16:02):
which we're going to go into.
Speaker 3 (16:03):
But you know again I felt horrible about what
happened.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
Which is interesting.
If you were old like now you'reolder, right, it's 20-something
years down the road Would yougive up that marriage for?
Speaker 2 (16:19):
the hot Right.
Speaker 1 (16:20):
You would have been like you're hot, I've had a good
night with you, drink whateverand be on your merry way, right,
right.
Speaker 3 (16:28):
I mean yeah, no, the first wife was very intelligent,
very sweet and outgoing verywealthy.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
Family oriented, I'm sure.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
Yeah, and you know, but it's.
Speaker 1 (16:48):
Was the girl that you're cheating on.
Speaker 3 (16:50):
Also intelligent, family-oriented she's very
family-oriented and theyaccepted me when they had no
reason to, when they had noreason to, um, but um.
(17:10):
I think intellectually I wasprobably had more in common with
the first one, um, but you knowit doesn't make it doesn't?
Right there's no comparing itdoesn't.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Yeah, it's stupid.
So, okay, delivered this newsto the your wife.
What?
What was the next?
What happened next?
Speaker 3 (17:25):
well, it wasn't like I was like hey, I've met
somebody else, it was just whatdid you say?
We're not because of me andwhatever I was feeling.
We weren't getting along verywell and I think, um, you know,
she was in school at the timegetting a master's or doctorate
and and I don't even rememberthe exact conversation.
(17:46):
But one day I was just like I'mdone, I'm done, and I moved out
shortly after into a shitholeapartment on the upper east side
.
Speaker 1 (17:58):
Sounds about right.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
And you know, Was that a?
Speaker 1 (18:04):
quick divorce, no kids.
It was quick, quick.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
Yeah, just split, boom, done, done.
Speaker 1 (18:10):
And you know what?
It's always easier to leavewhen I feel like for most people
, when you have something to goto.
Speaker 3 (18:20):
Do you know what I'm trying to say?
I wouldn't If I did not meether.
I would probably still be withher first wife.
Speaker 1 (18:28):
Right, but I feel like for a lot of men also.
Speaker 2 (18:34):
There's no impetus.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
There's no impetus To leave, right, they'll stay.
Or I feel like when men leave,they're very quick to get
someone new?
Speaker 3 (18:47):
I don't think it's just men that do that.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
It could be women too .
Speaker 3 (18:50):
I think it's both.
Speaker 1 (18:51):
But I feel like when women have children, if they're
single, yes, but if they havechildren, I feel like not as
much they can exist being single.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
It's easier.
Speaker 1 (19:03):
It's easier when you have young kids that are living
like.
For me, it's much easier to besingle than it is to introduce
you know like that so many hoursin a day?
Speaker 3 (19:12):
I mean it's like you know yeah and uh so then you,
you gave okay.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
So now you're divorced from your wife, you're
with the girl, the that youcheated on her with.
Now what goes on?
Speaker 3 (19:28):
it turned out, there was a lot more to her than just
pretty eyes, and I'm sure therealways is um no, she was I.
From a family perspective, Iwent through a lot um from your
family.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
Yeah, I, this is a question I yes.
Speaker 2 (19:45):
How did your family react to that?
Speaker 1 (19:48):
my mother was like you're an idiot rest her soul
yeah, because that's what Iwould tell my son.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
Well, she got cancer and at one point she said that I
was the reason that she got itbecause she stressed her out
right, which isn't, but I mean,listen, you know my first wife
was her dream.
You know she's a nice blondejewish woman that had a shit ton
of money and right, right.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
So she was like what did you do, right, okay, yeah um
, so that was that was tough totake that was that was very
tough to take, because I wasdefinitely mom's boy.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
I mean I was her favorite and so hearing that you
know.
So she died shortly after thatand funeral was a little awkward
.
Speaker 1 (20:41):
Oh, yeah, both came.
Speaker 3 (20:44):
The new one hid in the background.
I was still with, I wasseparated from the other one.
But, and then?
Speaker 1 (20:52):
That's ballsy of the new one I would never.
Speaker 3 (20:56):
Oh, you know what, I was happy she was there.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Yeah, well, support you were probably freaking out
because, the yeah, but I still Iwouldn't, I wouldn't, I
wouldn't.
Speaker 2 (21:04):
I put on a wig and a disguise.
Yeah, right.
Speaker 3 (21:06):
I'll say this Routro Mark glasses.
My mom and I were very, veryclose.
I was the baby, only boy, in aJewish family, so at their
funeral everybody had left and Icouldn't get out Like I was
just sitting in this chair.
Left, and I couldn't get outlike I was just sitting in this
(21:28):
chair and the girl that I wentwith, um, came over and
literally picked me up off thischair and walked me away.
Speaker 1 (21:33):
So, um, I know going back to the point of it wasn't
just looks right, no, she had aheart and she was in love with
you, obviously for her to evengo to the funeral and you know,
who knows if the I mean who wasgoing to go up to her and be
like Start something.
Right, or just give her theside eye, no less.
(21:54):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (21:55):
Exactly so.
From there, you know, we datedfor a while, and not even that
long, I think we kind of weprobably moved in together not
too long after that.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
And did you ever hear from this ex-wife again?
Speaker 3 (22:13):
I have not spoken to her since the day we got
divorced, since the funeral shewas at the funeral right Since
the funeral, because now, withno kids, that makes it very easy
.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
Like I always say, I don't think I would ever talk to
my ex ever again in my life ifI didn't have kids, and I'm sure
he feels the same way.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
I will say that she traded up.
She managed a brain surgeon, sokudos to her Right.
But yeah, I've never.
The odd thing was I saw heroffice when I was near where she
grew up and I was like, oh, butoffice when I was near where
she grew up and I was like, oh,you know but um, she was a
doctor.
Speaker 1 (22:47):
What?
Speaker 3 (22:48):
uh therapist psychologist, psychologist.
Okay, so she was in that yeah,brilliant, brilliantly smart and
um, so, so, yeah, so that wasthat, and um, I got married.
My dad died two years later andwe got married in between.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (23:10):
And how old were you at this point?
Give or take.
She had no kids.
You wanted kids, right?
Speaker 3 (23:17):
33, maybe Okay, Something like that.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
And then you got with her, lived together, had kids.
Speaker 3 (23:24):
Yeah, had two kids, beautiful kids, and you know,
life was good.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Now wait.
Was she ever worried that youwere going to cheat on her?
Nope See that's a dynamic Iwould be obsessed with that I
wouldn't be obsessed, but itwould always be in the back of
my mind.
Well because, or that she wascheating on you, because she's
the one that was willing to datethe married man.
Speaker 3 (23:49):
No, I think it was the situation.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
You felt comfortable, you felt whole.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
I mean, she never gave me an ultimatum.
It was well.
I mean, maybe she did, but itwas like.
Speaker 1 (24:00):
Light.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
It was like listen, we need to figure this out.
Right, like I'm not stickingaround to be your side chick.
And you just don't like if youwant to be with your wife, I'll
walk away.
Rightfully so.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
There's always that school of thought, though, and I
think women have especiallywomen have is how you get them,
is how you'll lose them, kind ofthing.
Speaker 1 (24:20):
But you know what I always?
I just when I'm out and thesemarried men come up to me and
they're like, forget about themorons that are like, oh, you
want to be my new side chick,you're perfect.
Yeah, I know.
Okay, forget those.
But the ones that are reallylike, let's go out for a drink,
I promise, I promise, like youknow the ones that You're like
(24:44):
have you heard my show?
Speaker 3 (24:45):
What they obviously haven't.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
But I always, I could never put in the back of my
mind that 10 years from now,when I'm old and the Botox isn't
holding up my face anymore,that you're not gonna do the
same thing to me, like you know.
Or you hear the story like ohwe, I live in the east wing, she
(25:08):
lives in the west wing and andwe have two separate lives and
we're just together because offinance.
I mean, I've heard it all, butI just I'm I.
I can never sit well with ityou know, nor nor, yeah, I.
Yeah, yeah, I get it, I get it,but you had kids.
You were good, everybody'shappy right.
Life went on for a long timeright, yeah, for a long time.
(25:32):
And everything was good.
What do you think now?
Were you ever approached?
So how long were you with thesecond one?
For 20 years, okay, long time.
Did you ever go out and did younot give your number out?
Is there anything you changed?
Or was it purely just vibes,relationship was different,
(25:54):
connection was different.
How did it last so long?
What would you tell our viewersBecause a lot of viewers do not
last 18, 20 years?
Speaker 3 (26:04):
I would like to say that I mean in the beginning.
It was a lot of passion thatcarried us for a few years, till
the kids came.
Speaker 1 (26:12):
Till the kids came, of course, see and I want to
normalize that because a lot ofwomen ask about that too.
I see a lot of women being likeoh, I just had kids, I'm
exhausted, I don't want to havesex, it's a job now.
And me included, I was the sameway.
I had two kids a year apart.
Almost I was up every fourhours giving bottles.
(26:33):
House was clean, dinner wasmade.
The way you left that house youcould lick the floors is the
way you came home.
You would never even know thatthere was a child or a dish made
right homemade baby food oranything.
I was dressed in sweatpants butshowered and looking the way I
look now.
But you know what?
I don't want to have sex withyou right now.
Speaker 3 (26:51):
I'm exhausted do you know?
What I'm saying, but a lot thathappens a lot yeah, I don't
think, and that wasn'tnecessarily in the beginning.
I mean, we had a lot of goodyears together and I think that
I'm not exactly sure.
To be honest with you, I thinkthat Did you have the same
(27:14):
interests.
No, we did not have a lot of thesame interests.
I realized that as time went on, we started living not separate
lives, but like independently,and I think that we and I take
as much blame for this asanything that I think we lost
(27:37):
ourselves.
I think we didn't get back todoing things that we like to do.
It was always a family thing.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Which happens, which happens?
Speaker 2 (27:48):
Kids.
Speaker 3 (27:49):
And I think that you don't know what's wrong until
you see it somewhere else.
Speaker 1 (27:57):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (27:58):
And in a lot of cases I mean obviously there can be
blatant stuff that's going on.
Speaker 1 (28:03):
Right.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
But for me it was just like this was life.
And you know, it's not all.
You know sex in the stairwelltype stuff, you know.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
Well, that only lasts so long.
Like I always say that you knowwhat I mean, like you know the
men that leave and we're stuckwith the kids at home.
Obviously, I'm not having sexon my stairwell, you know.
But I know my ex is oh, I'msure he's having sex in the
kitchen on the table in thedining room wherever he wants,
because he doesn't have the kidsthere.
You know what I mean.
(28:35):
So, but that doesn't last long.
Speaker 2 (28:38):
That's the fantasy of it.
It's not sustainable.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
So what would you say ?
Like what changed?
Did you not have sex?
As much Were you not going outto dinner, as much Were you not
like?
What is it?
Speaker 3 (28:51):
Yes, yes and yes, and over the last couple of years,
I think, I've had issues Notworth getting into but, Right,
and I think that we grew apart.
I think that, no, that's notwhat I was.
I think that we did not payenough attention to each other
um, and just daily life takesover.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
Yes, and then you just kind of you'd like
roommates right, almost.
And then I feel like that.
I feel like that happens toeveryone.
I feel like it happens toeveryone.
I feel like it happens toeverybody, and that's why
there's so many divorces.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
Yeah, there's probably some more to it, but I
think baseline is probablysomething along those lines.
Speaker 1 (29:34):
Okay, and then, how did that end?
What was the?
Speaker 3 (29:42):
This one was on her.
She wanted to separate.
Speaker 1 (29:48):
And Did you see it coming?
Were you surprised?
I was 1000% blindsided.
Speaker 3 (29:53):
Okay, so it's like karma.
Speaker 1 (29:56):
Oh yeah, did you feel ?
Speaker 2 (29:57):
Did you feel like this was a karmic episode At
some point?
Yeah, yes.
Speaker 3 (30:08):
And yeah, like this is a karmic episode, yeah, yes,
um and uh, yeah, I mean, I couldbarely get out of bed for like
months.
It was horrible, but, um, onceI came to grips with it and how
old are your kids now?
Uh 18 and 15 okay, so they'reolder yeah, how did they take it
?
The older one got it, I think.
(30:29):
I think she probably saw itmore Mm-hmm, I think they both
kind of did.
Speaker 1 (30:37):
How they reacted is Was there fighting or anything
that went on Like?
Speaker 3 (30:41):
was it smooth or oh no, it got pretty nasty okay um,
and yeah, I was, I was prettylost.
I was um, you know, I wastotally taken by surprise, you
know so what did she come?
Speaker 1 (30:57):
what did she say?
Did she come home?
Was she I'm done, I want adivorce.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
She was like I think we should separate and I was
like what?
Speaker 2 (31:08):
And had she cheated?
Was she seeing someone else?
Speaker 3 (31:12):
Remains to be seen.
I think so, without not gettinginto it, but yes, that's my
assumption of it, and it took mea few months to get my shit
together, and, um, I did, andhere we are so is there anything
(31:33):
that you learned like throughsuch a long relationship that
you wouldn't or would do again?
Yeah, um, I think I'll.
In time, I'll probably learnmore, but I take, I take
responsibility for for a bunchof it.
(31:54):
I'm not going to say all of itbut, um, I know that I wasn't
the perfect person.
I know that I could have beenmore helpful.
I probably could have been morehelpful.
I probably could have been moreattentive.
I you know.
Speaker 1 (32:07):
I feel like a lot of men would say that you know,
looking back, right, I mean ifyou self-reflect and you do the
job.
You said right, we're allsupposed to go through our
relationships, and then we'resupposed to learn about what we
want, what we don't want, thered flags take a post-mortem on
the on the relationship rightand then grow and in your next
(32:28):
relationship, become a betterperson right and I think we
started that way um and I feellike kids.
I feel like now jack on yournext, uh, so to say, now it's
back.
I feel like it reverts back tothe type of relationship you
(32:49):
could have with your first.
The kids are pretty much older.
You know what I mean.
One's going to college, right,and the other one's on their way
.
Now I feel like kids just putlike change relationships so
much they just screw everythingup.
Speaker 2 (33:06):
Moral of the story don't have them kids.
No, you're right, or?
Speaker 1 (33:10):
you just need a man that understands.
It's different now.
It's different.
Speaker 3 (33:16):
You're right, like I don't.
The runway is not as longanymore.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
Right.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
There's a lot of stuff I don't care about anymore
.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
You have time, yeah.
Speaker 3 (33:29):
I think I will be a better person the longer I am
away from this match.
You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
And when did you officially move out and get
separated?
Speaker 3 (33:45):
Well, we separated.
I stayed in the house for abunch of months, so I was
advised to and I moved out fouror five months ago.
Four months ago.
Speaker 2 (33:59):
Okay, so that time where you were were quote
separated but still living underthe same roof.
I have to ask were you datingat all at that point and was she
not right away yeah um, butyeah, yeah, um.
Speaker 3 (34:18):
I can't confirm nor deny what she was doing, but I
think that she was with somebodyfrom before that and how does
that work?
Speaker 1 (34:28):
I see, I never had that, like I never we.
When my ex we broke up, hemoved out.
Do you know what I'm?
Speaker 2 (34:36):
saying Like I feel that's so, so common.
Now to the point.
I'm single and I can't tell youthe amount of times I've
encountered a guy oh, a lot.
And then, maybe on the thirddate, he's like yeah, I'm
sleeping in the basement, right,and my kids are upstairs, right
, my wife not my ex.
Speaker 3 (34:52):
That's what I was.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
Yeah, that's what I was.
Speaker 2 (34:53):
And it's just like bye.
Speaker 1 (34:59):
Like I couldn't watch my ex come and go as he pleases
, thinking while I'm sittingthere with the two kids.
But my kids are younger.
Speaker 3 (35:09):
Well, she's doing the same thing, Right?
Speaker 1 (35:11):
no, I know, like I couldn't-.
Speaker 3 (35:13):
Let me tell you I wasn't thrilled when I Right,
didn't that?
Speaker 1 (35:15):
hurt you Like where is she?
All you know?
Fuck yeah, you're not in thesweatpants going to Target
You're like in a dress dressedup and you know they're going
out somewhere and your heart hasto take that Like.
I don't want to see it.
Do you know what I'm trying to?
Speaker 2 (35:30):
say Totally.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
Because I always believe.
Listen, like I said earlier, ifme and my ex didn't have kids,
oh, we would never speak again.
But you know what, If you'renot human enough to say you
still don't want to look atsomebody getting dressed up and
going out while you're livingwith them.
It's a disrespectful, weirdthing.
(35:53):
You know it's not like I wantyou back thing I feel for a lot
of people, especially where welive, where it's so expensive.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
It's just like a financial necessity for people
to live together.
Yeah, no.
Speaker 3 (36:04):
I mean my lawyer was like don't do it, she's like
you'll lose it Well, that'sabandonment.
You, yeah, no.
I mean my lawyer was like don'tdo it, she's like you'll lose
it Well, that's abandonment.
You have kids Like you've gotto follow, but also the house,
right, you don't want to lose,right?
Speaker 1 (36:12):
I get all that If it's like that way.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
But when people are like, oh, I've been living with
my ex for three years, oh,that's crazy yeah.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
No, well, maybe you know what, who knows, I don't
know.
I don't know because he had twokids from a previous marriage,
which was a lot of upheaval, andshe was suing him for like 10
years from another state.
Lovely, that was a lot ofstress on us too.
(36:47):
But you know what?
I think he would always say tome could you not be a mother for
like five seconds and could yoube like my wife, like a woman?
And or he would come home fromwork he's, like you know, works
in like a big CEO, manhattan-yjob, and he'd be like you have
nothing to do, all you'retalking about is the house and
(37:09):
the kids.
I was, I stood home with thehouse and the kids.
What else did I have to talkabout?
Speaker 2 (37:14):
you know what I'm trying to say.
Speaker 1 (37:15):
So yeah, he was lovely believe me, it was lovely
, but I think, who knows, if Iwas still in the world, maybe he
would find chefing moreexciting to talk about than the
laundry and the dinner that Imade you and that the house is
spotless, like, I think, unlessyou grow together.
Speaker 3 (37:35):
Well, I think it's very important to have things
outside of the house.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (37:40):
And listen.
You fall in love with somebody,you get married and, before the
kids come, like there's areason you got to this point.
You know you love each other,you're attracted to each other,
there's some passion, there'swhat have you, and when that
goes away whether it's from kidsor whatever else sometimes it's
(38:01):
like, okay, well, what's leftnow?
Speaker 2 (38:04):
you know right, I don't.
Speaker 3 (38:05):
And the passion without the passion people
realize.
Well, I don't really like thisperson, that much, you know.
Speaker 1 (38:12):
Um, yeah, I thought that we were best friends, but
but obviously we're not rightwhen you come home and you're
telling me I don't want to hearwhat you have to say because
you're telling me that you didthree loads of laundry and well,
I don't know what to tell you.
Like it's what I did today, Idon't, I don't know what to tell
you like it's what I did today.
I don't, I don't know, I don'thave any.
Speaker 3 (38:29):
And also, though, but before kids, you know, you had
a life and there was more stuffto talk about and to go out till
three o'clock in the morninghave sex all over the couch in
the chair and the whatever yeahno, absolutely, absolutely so.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
Who knows, I think, kids you know when, when, as the
woman, when, when your dynamicchanges and you know what,
before you have kids, everybodytells you.
I'm sure as a dad, you you cansee this point of view too from
your aspect.
People will tell you oh, it's alot of work, oh, you don't
(39:04):
understand.
But you know what?
I had no idea.
Like I thought having the kids,like I wanted kids, don't get
me wrong but I thought the kidsis like a bonding, like going to
bring us together type of thing, like I had.
I didn't even know the aspectof and I was older, I had my
first at 35, but I didn't evenknow that dynamic of it pulls
(39:25):
you apart, it doesn't bring youtogether.
So I thought this is great,this will only bring us together
.
Having kids how could it not?
Speaker 3 (39:32):
I think the other side is, and I don't know if you
worked or not before that.
Speaker 1 (39:35):
I did.
I was a chef.
Speaker 3 (39:37):
I think that you know , I look at my parents.
You know, my mother neverreally worked, so there wasn't
as much going on in her life andin her head and so that
relationship could still grow.
It started that way and itended that way, Right, exactly?
Speaker 1 (39:56):
Like my ex.
I think he became bored of mealmost because we decided I was
going to stay home and I wasn'tlike out and about and working
and bringing home money and eventhough it was a group decision,
and then he'd come home and Iwould just but I don't think
it's just that.
Speaker 3 (40:13):
I think it could be any job.
I mean, the kids are the mainthing.
Speaker 1 (40:17):
It was for me.
Speaker 3 (40:18):
Yeah, but you know he comes home, he's tired from
work and you're tired from thekids and neither of you
necessarily want to hear theother one bitch or moan about
what they were going through,right and you know, if there's
not any mutual respect well, no,not even respect, like uh,
common interest or likes thatyou can, you know?
Speaker 2 (40:41):
fall back, go play golf or like go, whatever it is
you know and this is all yourworld is.
Speaker 3 (40:47):
I think that's very hard, Like I think it's very
hard.
Speaker 1 (40:49):
It is hard and you're right, I think a lot of times
we don't.
Well, I didn't, I don't knowabout we, I didn't get to know,
I had my kids very quickly, likeI met him, and six months later
, yeah, that's the other thing,and you're right.
I've never even looked at itthat way, because as time went
(41:11):
on I remember like certainthings will shoot in my head.
He'd come home.
He'd be like you don't evenlike country music.
I love country music.
I'm like I've never likedcountry music.
Speaker 3 (41:17):
Like you know what I?
Mean like I never liked it butyou also didn't have that time
of like yeah time, like when Iwas in the city, for example,
all those years before kids.
You know we did shit.
Like we went out to coolrestaurants.
I used to go see music all thetime, I would you know, and
there's bonding there, there'syou know Right that you both
(41:39):
like to do the same thing.
And then 10 years later you turnaround and like we haven't done
any of this stuff in years andother than that we don't really
have that much in common youknow, and you know.
So there's you.
In my opinion, I obviouslyfailed at this, but you have to
keep the flame going while beingable to do the other stuff, and
(42:01):
without that it becomeseverything, becomes a chore it
does, including the, so thatcould be a takeaway for our
female listeners out there Malelisteners as- well, I think it's
for both sides.
I don't think this is not.
This isn't this world anymore,where the woman stays home and
takes care of the kids all thetime, to your exception.
But, like you know, we havejobs, we both have jobs and we
(42:25):
both have our own shit going on.
And how do you cut time out ofall that busyness and the
world's a lot busier now than itused to be to take time for
yourselves.
Speaker 1 (42:35):
And if you don't do that and it doesn't have to be
big major things, you know it'sand what kind of advice would
you give to our male listenersthat are listening, that may be
married or with a girl?
Well, married is more.
Speaker 3 (42:47):
Don't get married, that's why I've never been
married.
No, I would say you know Forthe married ones it's little
things.
Speaker 1 (43:00):
Don't give your phone number out to the hot blonde
that comes up to the bar.
But what would you tell themabout that whole experience?
Would you ever do it again?
Or would you turn around andjust end one thing and then
start another?
Speaker 3 (43:16):
I think it depends on the person.
Me, I learned my lesson?
I don't think.
Speaker 1 (43:25):
And you learned at both ends.
You learned how it feels whenyou thought the second time
around when you thought it wasdone, to which I'm sure your ex
what you, the first wife, wasdevastated the same way.
You were devastated and now yousaw it both folds.
It's a big difference whenyou're the one Devastated and
you had somebody to jump and goto right it just is versus when
(43:48):
you were devastated and possiblyshe had somebody to go jump to.
It's a very differentexperience.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
So that kind of segues into you know what was it
like for you getting out thereagain as a newly single man in
this new you know.
Speaker 3 (44:07):
You and I spoke briefly about this before.
It's a nightmare, right, jack?
It's a whole other world.
Speaker 2 (44:12):
How do you like the apps oh?
Speaker 3 (44:15):
yes.
Speaker 1 (44:15):
Jack, you're on the apps.
Speaker 3 (44:20):
I think they're like they make the time go by.
Speaker 1 (44:24):
It's time consuming.
Speaker 3 (44:25):
Well, yeah, in a good way.
Sometimes I mean listen, I livealone.
Your kids are older my kids andthey live with her and there's
a lot of nights.
I'm just sitting there alone.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
Why not go out for a drink?
Speaker 3 (44:36):
but it's not no but it's not even that like I'll be
watching tv and just likescrolling through apps, you know
right and um.
Thankfully I met somebody andyou.
Speaker 1 (44:44):
How long did that take?
Like when did you meet them?
Speaker 3 (44:52):
Let me see, just four months ago.
Speaker 1 (44:55):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (44:59):
But it was.
Speaker 1 (44:59):
See, you've been single without anybody for about
eight, nine months, give ortake.
Speaker 3 (45:12):
I went on a couple dates and, like you know, I
needed to get out of the house,you know know.
So initially, when I was on thesites that's what it was for I
wasn't looking for anybody, um.
And then I was like I was kindof I don't know.
Back in the day I would go outby myself all the time.
I love going out by myself, um.
The city is different, though,because you can kind of walk
from place to place.
Speaker 2 (45:26):
Here it's like all right now I'm going to drive
somewhere else.
Speaker 3 (45:29):
Right you know so, but I didn't really want to see
anybody.
You know, I went out partly toget out of the house and partly
to piss her off.
I'm sure Right.
And I will say I think it was agood thing because, you know,
(45:51):
obviously it depends on yoursituation, but I was curled up
in a ball Like I didn't want todo anything.
Speaker 1 (45:55):
Right, you were upset .
Speaker 3 (45:56):
I needed to get out Like I needed to do things, and
that allowed me to do it Easily.
Speaker 1 (46:04):
You know what I'm saying Because I mean, you get
on the app, and I'm sure it'snot, you know.
I'm just saying there's a lotof choices and it's rather than
going into the wild and findingsomebody, but I'd like that
better, like I like the idea Ilike the idea that my favorite
thing in new york was going outalone right, I loved it.
I lived in new york.
I went out alone too when Ilived there, just meeting people
(46:24):
.
Speaker 3 (46:24):
Sometimes it would lead to something, sometimes one
, but like I, always, but Ialways had great conversations.
I always met some interestingpeople Girls, guys.
It wasn't necessarily romanticor anything like that.
Speaker 2 (46:33):
Just conversation.
Speaker 3 (46:34):
I agree, I don't get that anymore in bars when I go
out.
Speaker 2 (46:37):
I don't, Because everyone's there meeting their
updates.
That's why Right Right, rightright, Probably yeah.
Speaker 3 (46:42):
Or they're couples already.
Speaker 1 (46:44):
Like I don't see Very hard in the wild, there's not a
lot of like single placesespecially at this age.
People don't interact.
There's the few around you andhow old are you for the record,
jack, how old are you?
Speaker 2 (46:55):
How old am I?
I?
Speaker 3 (46:56):
am 53.
Yeah, there's some places likethe Rare and Blackstone and
things like that.
But you know it's not the samefeel.
Speaker 1 (47:05):
It's not same feel it's not.
Speaker 3 (47:06):
It was so much.
I don't want to say easier, butmore comfortable.
Speaker 1 (47:09):
But now it's like no, it's very rare, maybe it's me.
Speaker 3 (47:12):
Maybe I'm more insecure now than I used to be.
Speaker 2 (47:13):
No, people are different.
The climate, the dating climatein general, just people in
general.
Speaker 1 (47:18):
I'll always be out at like a Blackstone, sitting in a
bar whatever, and like havewhere we went.
Speaker 2 (47:22):
A steakhouse people.
Speaker 1 (47:24):
And like, if I end up talking to anybody, it'll be
like a group of businessmen thatare like, are you waiting for
someone?
Speaker 2 (47:31):
And I'll be like no, and they'll be like are you
serious?
Speaker 1 (47:35):
Like you're here by yourself, Like what?
And they'll start talking to meand buy my meal and that's the
night I have talking to the 20s,but it's a lot different for a
woman than a guy.
Speaker 3 (47:44):
Like I could go to a bar by myself and be perfectly
fine, like nobody would thinktwice about it.
Speaker 1 (47:49):
Right.
Speaker 3 (47:50):
And you know I spent a lot of time on the road for
work and I loved doing thatbecause I would meet like the
most interesting people and justyou know, talk and you know,
nothing you know, nefarious oranything like that, but it was
just.
And now it's, like you know,especially, most of my friends
are married, so they're notgoing out.
So it's like, what do you do?
You stay at home all day.
Speaker 1 (48:10):
Right.
Well, you've been successful onthe date.
Like you said, you've beennewly dating somebody.
Speaker 3 (48:14):
Yes, yes.
Speaker 1 (48:15):
You found someone fairly quickly.
Speaker 3 (48:17):
That's quick.
I was shocked.
I was definitely shocked.
Speaker 2 (48:22):
Did you feel like a kid in the candy store?
Speaker 3 (48:24):
like on the apps, just with all the a little bit
yeah, um, not necessarily thatpeople were coming after me, but
it was just like oh, look atthat one, you know yeah and I
think it's a little demeaning,like I think it's like, I mean
it's certainly reallysuperficial, I mean of course,
it just reduces people to fivepictures and a couple of words
of copy and text, and that's ityeah, exactly um
Speaker 1 (48:46):
there's not like a big bio on the person.
Most people can't be bothered.
So, it's just a few like whereyou live your age, what you do
for a living Demographic info.
Speaker 3 (48:57):
Hinge is a little bit better.
I think they have the promptsand stuff.
Speaker 2 (49:00):
Yeah, exactly, but still people, especially guys,
unfortunately, I'd say the vastmajority of them, just they
can't be bothered to.
Speaker 3 (49:10):
Yeah well, just they can't be bothered to.
Yeah well, I can't.
Very lazy to me that's fun,like, and just put it out there
and be like well, at this pointit's like what you got to lose,
like what's you know right so um, but yeah, no, it's um because,
yeah, it's been 20 years sinceyou've been out in the Y, really
25.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (49:30):
Different.
It's a lot different.
Speaker 3 (49:33):
It's a lot different.
Yeah, Like I don't have theenergy anymore to go out and sit
at a bar, I mean as much as I'dlike to, Right.
I mean I met some really nicepeople, though, Like I'm friends
with some of the women thatI've met on these sites.
Right, I just went out fordrinks with one of them the
other night, right, and you knowwe were both going through hard
(49:53):
times and helped each other,and you know we have this nice
little friendship going on Rightwhich is nice.
Speaker 2 (49:59):
Yeah, meet new people ?
Yeah, so with your new partner,was she in a similar situation
as you like?
Newly separated?
Speaker 1 (50:10):
No, she's single, single a while.
Uh, she's single single, she'sum.
See, like I said, I think womentake a much bigger.
I know I think a year after I'mgonna say eight months after we
separated, my ex started, likeyou know, became friends with
somebody and, like me, it's beenlike four years.
Speaker 2 (50:29):
We'll change that On and off?
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (50:31):
But I feel like men meet women quicker usually.
Speaker 2 (50:37):
Maybe, I don't know, did she have an issue with you
being separated and notofficially divorced.
Speaker 3 (50:43):
I wouldn't call it an issue.
I think it was.
Speaker 2 (50:46):
Gave her a pause.
Gave her a pause for a minute,but you know.
Speaker 1 (50:53):
And what was her story?
She was divorced.
Speaker 3 (50:55):
She's been divorced a long time.
Speaker 1 (50:56):
Kids, yeah, kids yeah , young, old.
Speaker 3 (51:00):
No, like school kids.
Speaker 1 (51:02):
Okay, so younger.
Speaker 3 (51:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (51:05):
So she's, but they live with her.
Speaker 3 (51:06):
She's busy with them, Like like me, yeah so, but what
I learned is you know, like youdon't, like I said I might say
this before, but you don't knowwhat's missing until you see it
and you know, you kind of goalong with your life and
thinking that's it, and I'mhaving a lot more fun now, um,
(51:27):
than I've had in years and years, and didn't even realize.
Speaker 2 (51:29):
And why do you think that is?
Speaker 3 (51:31):
I think well, the person that I'm seeing is fun.
Speaker 2 (51:34):
She likes to go out.
Speaker 1 (51:36):
It's part of her life and Like in what Just like
dinner shows Broadway.
Speaker 3 (51:44):
Dinner, bars, concerts, whatever Right, okay,
just stuff, right.
Speaker 1 (51:48):
It doesn't even matter what it is, it's just fun
and it's like and I feel likeyou can't do that shit when you
have a three and four year oldyou know what I'm saying, like
unless you have a live-in nannyor you're paying a sitter,
you're pay.
Speaker 3 (52:01):
You know you're paying for the concert listen,
but growing up like my parents,I mean we had, I mean when we
didn't have a live-inhousekeeper, we had babysitters.
Speaker 1 (52:12):
Right.
Speaker 3 (52:13):
My parents went out every single Saturday night.
Speaker 1 (52:15):
They made an effort, though, too.
Speaker 3 (52:17):
Every single Saturday night, whether alone or with
friends or whatever.
Right that's cute.
They were married for a verylong time and I think at the end
my mother probably hated him.
Yeah, everybody does.
People stay together, butgrowing up watching them.
Speaker 1 (52:34):
Yeah, gave you a good sense of they gave me if that
was.
Speaker 3 (52:39):
they both had their individual issues, but you know
it was impressive, right, andnow you're having more.
Speaker 1 (52:47):
So you forgot so to say how to have fun.
So now you're recognizing.
Speaker 2 (52:53):
Yeah, and also are you having more fun now, in part
to the ways that you've changed?
Speaker 3 (52:59):
Yeah, I mean some of it's who I used to be.
Speaker 2 (53:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (53:04):
And some of it's new.
And you know, life's just toofucking short it is, and life's
just too fucking short.
Speaker 1 (53:09):
It is, it's just too fucking short.
It's true.
And you have to my friendalways tells me that One of my
best male friends but I didn't.
Speaker 3 (53:17):
It's like.
Speaker 1 (53:17):
Melissa, life's too short.
Speaker 3 (53:19):
When you're in a marriage for a long time.
You don't?
Maybe it was me.
I was like oh, I guess this iswhat life is.
Speaker 2 (53:26):
This is.
Maybe it was me.
Speaker 3 (53:27):
I was like well, I guess this is what this is it,
this is what right you know, andyou know, now it's more.
All right, what can I do?
Speaker 1 (53:34):
like what's right, what's out there?
What's out there?
Speaker 3 (53:37):
let's have fun let's like I want to go see bands, I
want to go to restaurants, Iwant to, you know um, and she
likes to do that and it's andwhat's her situation with her ex
like?
Speaker 1 (53:50):
is it amicable?
Does she still have to dealwith like?
Speaker 3 (53:52):
is there any amicable ?
That's as far as I can go withher right.
Yeah, I can't right.
Speaker 2 (53:58):
But there's no like anything no kind of no, no, no
you know, disturbing.
Speaker 1 (54:03):
No, no, no.
Your relationship with her?
No, no, no.
Which is perfect?
Which is perfect?
Speaker 3 (54:07):
um and yeah.
So you know it's just.
I think sometimes it takessomebody and whether or not it's
forever or not somebody just tokind of get you out of that
funk and wake up a little bitand realize that you know,
hopefully you still have 30 someyears left to live and what are
you going to do?
Speaker 2 (54:26):
sit in?
Speaker 1 (54:26):
your bed all day, right Exactly.
Speaker 3 (54:29):
Yeah, but you know, living alone it's not easy, it's
not, you know.
Speaker 1 (54:33):
Right.
Speaker 2 (54:34):
No, it's not.
Could you see yourself marriedagain?
Speaker 3 (54:37):
No, I have said that if it was that important, it's
open for discussion.
So I won't say never, but never.
Speaker 2 (54:51):
So what are our takeaways, guys?
Speaker 1 (54:59):
Yes.
What are our takeaways?
What did we learn?
What did we learn?
Well, we learned the maleperspective about cheating and
why some or our guests herecheat Women ask how, why?
Well, we answered that questionand we don't have all the
scenarios, but we have this one,you know.
Speaker 2 (55:14):
Looks do matter, passion does matter.
Speaker 1 (55:17):
Passion and looks.
Kids change things.
I think a relationship thatstarts and ends with no kids
versus a relationship thatstarts, has kids and ends is
very different.
Kids versus a relationship thatstarts, has kids and ends is
very different, and I think therelationship that the female and
the male is able to have beforeor after the kids is also plays
a part, and I don't thinkpeople put enough emphasis on
(55:40):
that.
Speaker 3 (55:40):
No, you know, I think that's 100, right, like I think
now um like you said you havenow.
Speaker 1 (55:45):
Things are very different.
Speaker 3 (55:46):
It's very different and I don't know if this lasts
or doesn't last, you know, butyeah, no, it's like the kids are
still there, they're a bitolder now but on my day-to-day.
It's not that, it's not um.
You know, I'm driving extraactivities.
Speaker 1 (56:05):
This one's sick the doctor, I can enjoy my time with
somebody you know I can rightand it's listen, I know it's new
and it's of course, it's alwaysnew, it's always exciting
you're having sex on the tablestill.
Speaker 3 (56:17):
Right, right, I get it um, but yeah, I mean, I have
no, I have no expectations rightat this point.
Speaker 1 (56:28):
It's different.
Speaker 3 (56:29):
I'm not expecting anything.
Everything that I get right nowis bonus.
Right, it's just a free for allI mean, I would love for it to
get there.
Speaker 1 (56:38):
Right.
Speaker 3 (56:40):
But yeah, right now I'm just happy with something
new and realizing I have thiswhole other stage.
Speaker 1 (56:48):
And so do you feel like through each relationship
you learned, you grew and you'removing on with each single one.
Speaker 3 (56:55):
Yeah, I think so.
I think it takes a while tokind of figure that out, but I
feel like every day I feel alittle different.
Some days are good, some daysare bad.
Right, sometimes it hits you,sometimes it doesn't.
Speaker 1 (57:07):
Of course that's with every relationship, right.
Feel a little different, youknow, some days are good, some
days are bad, but right, um,sometimes it hits you.
Speaker 3 (57:09):
Sometimes, of course that's with every relationship,
right but there are days whereI'm like what, this is okay
right, I'm okay.
Speaker 1 (57:17):
I'm okay.
This is gonna be okay.
Speaker 2 (57:19):
Yep, I think we're all like that right, yeah, yeah,
at the end of the day, we'restill here.
Speaker 1 (57:24):
Yes, exactly, exactly .
Thank you so much for tellingus your story.
Speaker 2 (57:31):
Thank you for being our very first brave guy.
Speaker 1 (57:33):
See, gentlemen, when I go on social media and I'm
like I'm looking for males thatblank, blank, blank, blank blank
, we don't kill you too much onhere, it wasn't that bad, we
weren't that bad, it wasn't thatpainful right.
Speaker 3 (57:45):
I'll let you know about the scars later.
No it's been great, actually,you guys have been very inviting
and very kind.
Speaker 1 (57:52):
Yes, thank you so much we really appreciate it.
We really do.
Thank you for joining us and wewill be back again yes, please,
don't forget to like.
Speaker 2 (58:05):
Give us only five star ratings, please, and write
something nice about us, becauseit makes our day.
Yes, come on Right, spread thelove.
Speaker 1 (58:13):
Email us, watch our social media and we will be back
again soon After the new year,right?
No wait after Christmas, yeah2025.
2025.
Yay, all right guys, can't waitto see what kind of ticket.
Speaker 2 (58:31):
We see come up within 2025.
I have some coming up for you.
Unfortunately, WonderfulAllison has some.
Speaker 1 (58:38):
All right.
Well, thank you so much and wewill see you soon.
And thank you to our guestsagain.
Speaker 2 (58:44):
Bye.
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