May 21, 2025 • 46 mins
Welcome back for Season 2 of The Design Anatomy podcast!
After our incredible travel adventure with a fabulous group of design enthusiasts on our very first Design Anatomy Tour, we're buzzing to share what we discovered & experienced abroad.
Stepping into private Parisian and Milanese apartments was truly a pinch-us experience. From artist, Paul Mouginot's classic pre-Haussmann apartment to Architect & designer Sophie Dries' home in Paris, to Christian and Francesco's colour-drenched Milan apartment and the stunning former villa curated by the Droulers Architecture sisters – each space revealed secrets that photos simply cannot capture. These weren't just beautiful homes; they were masterclasses in spatial planning and cultural approaches to living.
The European approach turns Australian apartment design conventions upside down. Instead of knocking down walls for open-plan living, they embrace separate rooms that create distinct zones for specific purposes. Their kitchens exist as dedicated spaces rather than extensions of living areas. Dining spaces take precedence, reflecting the cultural importance of gathering for meals. Strategic use of mirrors, thoughtful lighting (no sea of downlights!), and brave applications of colour all worked together to create spaces with true character and depth.
What stayed with us wasn't just the beautiful design, but how these spaces reflected a fundamentally different philosophy about apartment living. Europeans aren't trying to emulate larger homes in smaller spaces – they're celebrating the unique qualities of apartment life through intelligent design choices that prioritize function, beauty and sociability. As Australia builds more apartments, perhaps it's time we looked beyond our shores for inspiration on creating spaces that truly work.
Want to experience these incredible private apartments for yourself? Our exclusive Milan/Paris tour returns in 2026, and we're heading to London this September! With just eight spots available on each tour, j
Thinking about joining Bree & Lauren in Milan 2026? Or perhaps London later this year, is more your design vibe?
Jump onto our wait lists below & be the first to know when all these amazing tours are happening.
Bree offers a 90-minute online design consult to help you tackle key challenges like colour selection, furniture curation, layout, and styling. Get tailored one-on-one advice and a detailed follow-up report with actionable recommendations—all without a full-service commitment.
Bookings now open for late July Learn more: https://breebanfield.com
Back by popular demand— Lauren's 'Colour and Materials Masterclass ' returns on August 2nd! If you're unsure how to pair paint colours with floors or finishes, this full-day online event is for you. Learn how colour really works and follow a clear, step-by-step method to confidently choose the right paint every time. It's a fun, practical day with a vibrant community of fellow colour lovers.
Tickets are on sale now and sold out fast last time—don’t miss out!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Lauren (00:00):
Okay, b, we're back.
We are Feels like forever thatwe've been gone, doesn't it?
I think we've shaken off jetlag and we're so excited to be
talking with you again, and, ofcourse, we're going to be
talking about our trip for a bit.
And guess what?
I just got some really nicefeedback in my inbox from one of
the gorgeous people that cameon our trip.
(00:21):
Yes, without giving away who itwas, I'm just going to say we
asked if she had any feedbackfor you and me and she wrote you
did a great job, girls, thanksfor the trip of a lifetime.
I just want to high-five youfrom here, brie.
I just honestly we've said thisto each other so many times and
(00:42):
it's very pinched me that wehad the most amazing group of
women on our tour, that wecouldn't have asked for a better
group, and I think we were abit spoiled.
I'm like worried that nobodycan match them.
I know we challenge you, though.
We challenge you to join us andmatch them, but yeah, they were
(01:02):
.
They were absolutely fabulousand we had some amazing,
gorgeous times with them.
So, yeah, I could.
Honestly, it was so good, itwas so good.
I can't I can't fault it interms of how wonderful they were
.
I agree.
I mean, I wouldn't go so far tosay we're speechless, because
we do have a lot to say about it.
So welcome you.
(01:24):
Thank you for coming back andlistening to us on the Design
Anatomy.
We took a little break, so we'rehere to talk about interior
design and it's Bree and I.
We're friends and fellowdesigners and we are going to be
talking to a couple of guestsas well.
So today we wanted to talkabout some of the experiences
that we had in apartments inMilan and Paris.
(01:48):
I've been traveling over therefor a bit.
In terms of Milan, it was soamazing to see and we'll drop
this in some beautiful tours ofamazing private apartments as
part of our Design Anatomy tourThings that you would not be
able to do if you just poppedover there on your own.
So I think that was reallyspecial and we got to do that in
(02:12):
both Paris and Milan.
But it just reinforced for me alot of things about how well
Europeans do small space livingor apartment living, because I
feel like in Australia and maybeit's also because, you know,
there's always going to be thatlayer of history that we don't
have.
Let's just get that out of theway.
(02:33):
People will always come at meand say, well, you know they
have this and they have that,sure, but I still think there's
lots of things we can do betterand learn from those spaces.
Right, I agree, and I mean tobe fair as well.
In Melbourne at least, we dohave older buildings, and if you
look at Paris, a lot of Pariswas built in 1850.
(02:56):
And we have buildings inMelbourne from 1850, but not
many, not many, have survivedthat kind of distance.
But it was really interesting.
The first apartment that wevisited was Paul's apartment.
So Paul is a really amazing,gorgeous, warm, welcoming person
(03:16):
that we were so honored to meet, and his background is in tech.
So he's actually a client ofSophie Dries.
So if you don't know who sophieis, you can go back a few
episodes.
Sophie is a french interiordesigner and her work features
on the front cover of my book,the what's it called?
Again, the french new look.
(03:38):
That's so funny I'll get itwrong.
The new french look.
The french new look, look, theFrench new look.
One of those Google that It'llcome up.
Your work is right on the coverof it.
So that's really amazing, andto be able to step inside.
That apartment was just quite apinch me moment.
(03:58):
As you sort of alreadymentioned before, we had quite a
few of those literal.
You just need to pinch mebecause I think I might be just
dreaming right now.
But you know that apartment wasbuilt actually before a lot of
the Ha apartments.
So those apartments in that era, like a lot of Paris, was all
wiped out because it was allmedieval little streets and
(04:19):
everything.
But Paul's apartment was, Ithink, 1840.
So it was just before Haussmann.
I don't know.
I think 1840, so it was justbefore Haussmann.
I don't know he'd come up withhis first name anyway designed
all of the streets of Paris andall the boulevards and
everything.
So his is actually quite an oldapartment in Paris.
But you know we talk about smallliving and it's not really that
(04:40):
small.
Did you find it that small?
Well, do we know how big it is?
Okay, I'm trying to like, Iguess, to give people a bit of
an idea, I guess, in the schemeof things, no, I've definitely
seen smaller and I think thatthere are a lot of people living
in cities like Paris, london,who live in quite small
apartments.
So in the scheme of that, Iguess he had two living spaces,
(05:04):
for instance, a living area andthen a dedicated dining area as
well as a bedroom, but only onebedroom.
But I think what makes it feelsmall as well, in terms of not
feel small overall in a negativeway, but why you notice it's
small is because their rooms arenot necessarily open plan, like
a lot of our apartments kind oftry to be, and the kitchens are
(05:27):
basically, you know, a galleykitchen, where you're just like
one side is kitchen and it's gotto also usually have a laundry
in it, which he did quitecleverly, and those are the
things I feel like.
You kind of know you're in asmaller space, but you're right,
the living area even in itselfwas a good size, um, so I guess
we could say it was a mediumsize apartment, for for a paris
(05:51):
living, do you think, but Ithink it's also.
I think if you're comparingthat apartment to an apartment
that would be built in melbourne, it's quite a big apartment.
But, as you say, with this theopen planning, though, what what
we do is we just put a kitchento the edge of a living area and
whereas his was just a separateroom for a kitchen, which is
(06:12):
something we don't do and Idon't think anybody does that
anymore.
That's traditionally done rightthere.
It's that's it kind ofinherited, that type of living
and then that's how they live.
So it's sort of a bit culturalas well, whereas we,
particularly with new apartmentsI think sometimes the issue
with our apartments is we tryand emulate a bigger home in a
(06:35):
smaller space instead ofembracing that it's a smaller
space and making that workbetter or smarter.
Do you know what I mean?
I agree, I agree.
I kind of feel like the openplan doesn't always work.
I have a client at the momentwho has an apartment in
Docklands and hers is kitchen,open to living, open to dining,
and it's actually a really hardspace to work in because it's
(06:58):
not super big.
It's hard to make it feel alittle bit more special.
There's really not enough spaceto put stools at the kitchen
bench, for instance, because theliving area is right there.
You could almost put the sofalike hard up against the bench,
whereas if it had have beendesigned maybe in a different
way, with a different approachto trying to make it feel like a
(07:19):
bigger home that has a openplan area, it might've worked
better.
I think you know.
Yeah, and it's it is adifferent way of life as well.
Like the majority ofaustralians live in a like a
single dwelling, uh, not, uh,attached.
You're in suburbia, that's true, yeah, yeah, I wonder if that's
changing.
Actually, and I woulddefinitely change on that I
(07:42):
reckon there'd be a lot morepeople now in in townhouses that
are at least two on a blockkind of thing than there are
single tellings, right?
Yeah, I think we have to changeand I think that you know,
looking at the way that you know, we, even that morning, when we
rocked up to Paul's apartmentand he was just gorgeous, he
opened up his door and he let uslook around, which is a big ask
(08:05):
, right, yeah, and then we, wesaw Sophie at the door and,
anyway, after we saw hisapartment, we walked to Sophie's
apartment, and that's anotherthing.
We walk from one home to anotherhome and it's that being on the
street, walking, it's adifferent lifestyle.
It's so much more active.
Um, I mean, you might catch themetro, but we, we just walked
(08:27):
and that's the way peoplecommute a lot more than what we
do in our little suburbanbubbles perhaps.
Um, yeah, so the walking isgood, but I often wonder, am I
doing it more because I'm thereas a visitor or does.
Everybody is as much.
I wanted that too.
But then Sophie's home to herclient's home is she would have
(08:49):
walked there.
Yeah, she would have.
Yeah for sure.
You know all of that.
I mean, we're talking obviouslyabout interior design, but I
think it all influences just adifferent way of living, and I
just love going when you gooverseas and you get to sort of
feel like, oh, what's, how dothey get around people that live
here?
How do they live, how do theyeat?
It is the culture that canaffect the interiors.
(09:09):
Like interiors don't exist in abubble, right, often the fact
that you might have to havespace for a bike and they don't
have storage cages.
It's not like here, where a lotof our apartments will have,
you know, a basement and there'sa storage cage and maybe that's
where the bike goes or whatever.
But, um, here there needs to bea space where the bike can hang
(09:30):
or it's integrated into thespace and it's not just sitting
in the hallway right, andstorage for things that you
carry with you when you'rewalking.
So if you walk a lot and youcome into the home, you need to
be able to like, have basket orbag or whatever it is.
I think it's.
I think that maybe that'sthought about a little bit more,
do you think?
And also the commuting, butalso the fact that in a place
(09:53):
like Paris, at least, and inFrance and probably Italy, it's
going to work, it's stopping forlunch and it's going home and
having a meal and then goingback to the office, or it's that
different, that ritual ofhaving lunch whereas we are oh,
I'm just going to eat standingup or eat walking whilst I'm
(10:15):
getting from A to B, orsomething that is so interesting
.
And I think that's why we see alot more dining spaces, like an
emphasis on the dining spacesin apartments, because it is
that opportunity to stop, have awine like just your regular
lunch.
It's just such a nice thing to.
I don't think we don't do that,and I think even stopping for
(10:36):
dinner, having the family cometogether for dinner, is
something that's not happeningas often in Australia as maybe
it should, in my opinion, or itused to, but I think there's a
real emphasis on stoppinggetting together for a meal in
France and Italy.
I'd say I think the other thingthat they I mean definitely
dining spaces and even whenthere's, and also having them
(10:59):
slightly separate.
I mean, if we think aboutPaul's apartment for a second,
there was connection between theliving area and the dining but
there were still different roomsand not completely open, and so
it kind of allows for even in asmall space if you've got lots
of.
So all these people that we saw, and a lot of these I guess is
(11:20):
the point you're making is theyentertain, whether it's family
or friends or whatever it is.
They entertain in these smallspaces and they do it quite well
.
And I think that havingslightly separate rooms helps
because you break out intolittle areas, right.
So there might be a group ofpeople talking, smoking whatever
, drinking, in the living room,and then there's a different
(11:42):
group in the dining room andeven a different group in the
kitchen, kind of thing, whereashere, if all those spaces are
one space, we still do it, butit's not, it's still kind of
part of the one group.
I don't know if that makessense, so that you can kind of
have, like you know, I guess,different things happening, even
you know, different discussions, and it's not, the noise isn't
going to be as much and it's alittle more intimate, so you can
(12:05):
have those kind of littlebreak-off groups I think that
happens a bit too in thesesmaller spaces rather than kind
of just this one big, open,small warehouse party in your
apartment.
Well, it's interesting because Isuppose the spaces we visited
are very elevated, they're verydesign-led, and I would have to
(12:26):
say that not everybody liveslike that.
So I feel like if people arehaving friends over to entertain
, I dare say that probablydoesn't happen as often as what
we might do in Australia.
I think that they go out fordinner, they go out for lunch
with friends and they probablydon't entertain as much just
because of the space not havingas much space.
(12:47):
I'm going to challenge you onthat, because paul actually said
that they have people over orthat he has people to the house
all the time and same with umsorry, jumping ahead a little
bit to milan, um, christian andfrancesco purple.
I've said that right.
Um said the same thing theyhave their friends to the home
(13:07):
and so that was important tothem to have it so that they
could have those conversationsand entertain.
So I think they may not cookmassive meals, maybe because
they don't have huge kitchens,but I think they do entertain at
home for sure.
I mean, I think they still goout, but I think that I think
it's a it's part of what, um,that the culture is still to
have people to your home andmaybe to show it off.
(13:29):
If you've got a house like that, I want people coming over,
that's right, and I mean evenfor Sophie.
So, yeah, in the morning wewent to Paul's, then we, as I
said, dashed across down thestreet and went to Sophie's.
So Sophie's home that sheshares with her husband and her
child, they, she does use thatfor, uh, yeah, meetings and
(13:50):
things, because in her studioroom for her too, yeah, her
studio is for working and shesaid she's got like samples and
things happening everywhere soit's a nice.
So it's a bit of a showcase.
So I guess, yeah, not everybodyhas that that need for their
space.
And her space was, I guess, topreface with um, her space was
quite large, I was.
(14:10):
It was a big apartment, that'ssure.
I feel like that's a slightlyunusual um thing to come across
in terms of a big living areawith actually open plan with the
dining, but then a separate,smaller, let's say, a meals
dining area and then still thesmall kitchen.
(14:31):
So they don't do the bigkitchen.
You know, even when they dohave the bigger space, then kind
of a little breakout area,small, just like the one
bathroom, cause that's the otherthing that would rarely happen
is that you would have ensuite.
It's like a one bathroomsituation, um, and then bedrooms
, but, um, yeah, her, her spacewas quite big but, as you said,
I think she, she needs to beable to bring clients through,
(14:54):
um, and she uses it like ashowroom to show, uh, because
she's not just interior designer, she's product designer and as
well, and, uh, and her husband'san artist, correct?
So, yes, how cool, I know howcool was their apartment.
We got to see, like, amazingmirror that she's designed that
is just being released.
I think that's throughinvisible collection.
(15:16):
Um, she also had, I think it was, a coffee table by max lambs.
Yeah, that was just incredible,very unique.
They're like art pieces, aren'tthey?
And then she's got, yes, it wasjust, oh, just to be immersed
in that and just to her see thetextures and her, if we sort of
compare, um, you know, paul'sspace was quite classic, um, it
(15:40):
was.
It wasn't full of color, but itwas full of personality and
interest, and he's an artist aswell.
So, you know, had a couple ofhis pieces and he's a collector,
so had some amazing artworksthat brought so much to you know
, again, small space living, Ithink artwork has a massive
impact.
You can have a space thatpotentially doesn't have a lot
(16:03):
of character and bring characterto it through what you put in
it like artwork or rugs andfurniture and things.
And then Sophie's Place stillquite classic but so eclectic
and almost like.
You know, our creative peoplelive here, not just collectors.
These are people who can seethe beauty in all sorts of
(16:25):
things and the way she broughtthose things together in that
space, um was also it.
There was no, there's nothingshowroom or um precious about it
.
It was also so relaxed and yetso elevated and I love that.
I love that feel because Ithink it's so hard to achieve
it's.
It's almost like a personalityof its own.
(16:46):
I think when you achieve that Ithink you just nailed it it's
when we're describing it andsaying that she uses it as a
showroom.
It's that doesn't.
It's not a showroom, it's ahome.
It's still a home.
Yeah, it, we've, we all.
I think in Paul's space, um, andI think he was so warm and
welcoming, but I think inSophie's space we all felt
(17:08):
really relaxed, very much so,yeah, and it also was so cute
how she like made coffee and shegot like the best croissants in
Paris for us.
It was just so, so special, itwas just an absolute dream.
And how gorgeous is Sophie?
Ah, sophie is one of the mostum, special people you'd meet, I
(17:29):
think, because she is sotalented I don't know how she
does all the things that shedoes like I feel like she
probably never stops and she's amom and, you know, a business
owner and an art.
I just feel like she's the mostgenerous person as well, like
to a fault, so um, and reallylooked after us.
We're so grateful to her wholelike beautiful, totally.
(17:52):
I mean, what an opportunity justto visit a Parisian apartment,
but let alone one of the best,two of the best.
And you know, I think there wassome fabric hanging over a
window and I said to her oh mygosh, I love this sheer fabric.
She said, oh, that's actually arange that I'm going to be
releasing soon.
I'm like, are you insane?
(18:13):
Do you stop?
Do you sleep?
And the fact that she's so, asyou said, generous, she wants to
share.
And you know, we bumped intoher in milan, which was so cool
as well, and, um, she's, sheknows everyone.
She knows everyone in theindustry, she's in published
widely across every magazine andyou know her collections of
(18:33):
furniture, and there's not anounce of pretentiousness there,
she's just a genuine person.
Anyway, we're probably going tostop raving up Hi, sophie,
we're raving about you, I know.
We just think that she'samazing and I have to say as
well, um, off the topic ofapartments, but just in general,
like all of the show show rooms, probably I would say one or
(18:56):
two were a little bitpretentious.
I'm not going to say who, but Iwas just blown away by how warm
and friendly they were.
In Paris, I think so too.
Yeah, because you don't knowwhat to expect sometimes.
Also, you know we're not.
When we were visiting theseshowrooms on this occasion,
we're bringing a group of peoplethrough, so it can be an
(19:18):
inconvenience sometimes.
No, we were absolutely welcomedand you know, sure, I guess
there's a little bit of I mean,sometimes with some high end
things comes a little bit ofpretentiousness, but I didn't
get that from anybody inparticular in terms of the way
we were kind of looked after.
Everybody was really happy toshare.
You know what was new, what washappening in the showroom and
(19:41):
you know hospitable offering ofdrinks and food.
I love that.
I'll always take some drinksand food.
Exactly Everyone was justgorgeous.
So I guess, talking about sothat was sort of one morning
that we had Paul's apartment andSophie's and then we were in
Milan, as you mentioned, we sawChristian and Francesco, who
(20:04):
were divine.
So Christian and Francesco havethey're also creatives but not
designers, so it was a bit of aDIY project for them, their
apartment, and the apartment wasin St Charlie.
So if you know anything aboutMilan, it's kind of a bit of a
new and upcoming area.
It's, I guess if you're inMelbourne, it's kind of like
(20:27):
being in the north.
I don't know what would it bein Sydney north.
I don't know what would it bein sydney, I don't know um, so
it's, there's a lot of otherdesigners and creatives kind of
moving into the area and theyfound the space and they did so
much work to it.
Um, we'll share their, theirinstagram and they have a great
um highlights reel on therewhere they show them literally,
like you know, sledgehammeropening up between two rooms.
(20:50):
So they had their space isagain, it's just the one bedroom
and, you know, entry, and theentry was amazing too.
So they actually have a bit ofa hall, bathroom, kitchen, and
then they had these two spacesthat they'd opened up, so
between a dining and living room, and that was also reasonably
(21:11):
big.
And then just the way their useof, for me, their use of colour
and even just gloss versusmatte kind of, and the floors
was very what I kind of see, andlighting was kind of very
Milanese to me and I mean, mean,the color combinations were a
little bit too.
But you know, a stone floorwhich they, which they designed,
(21:34):
um, based on kind of a geoponty, you know that classic geoponty
, geometric um.
And then having one of the greatthings about some of these
older apartments is when, um,the use of like a gloss paint on
walls and ceilings.
And here we freak out because,uh, maybe they're brand new
(21:54):
plasterboard and as soon as youput a gloss paint on it you can
maybe see the joins of theplasterboard or whatever, um,
because you're never going tohave a perfect wall, but there
the walls aren't perfect anyway.
So you do a gloss and it showsup all the imperfections, but
that's kind of what makes itamazing.
So I love and and quite moodyand immersive, that was sort of
their, their vibe in there.
(22:15):
Um, so it was very big contrastto what we'd seen in in Paris.
With, you know, I feel likequite um, quintessential
Parisian style apartment livingversus the um, I guess you know
in it on a designer level levelversus the Milanese.
So it was that amazing contrastto come into their apartment as
(22:35):
our first one in Milan and seehow they've transformed that
space.
Yeah, I was excited.
Oh my God, it was so amazing.
I'm just remembering what itsmelled like as well.
It was like an incense, almostlike a.
It was a fragrance, but it wasjust, oh my God, it was divine.
And they were beautiful as welland they were very
(22:57):
details-orientated couple, right.
So, like in their bedroom, theway the bed was made, the
perfection of it was justperfect.
I'd love to just drop in thereon a day where they were
expecting me and just to checkhey, do you make your bed like
that?
I'm sure they'd love that.
(23:18):
I'll try it out next time, yeah, yeah, and that again, you know
, they offered us coffee andchocolates and, uh, love, um,
gorgeous, sorry, well, I wasjust remembering, you know,
walking into that, as you say,that the marble floor it was
sort of like different, uh, bigslabs of um, different stones,
(23:40):
it sort of as you walked in andthen down that hallway, and then
this hallway was painted inthis gloss, really burgundy,
brownish color, and then juststrategic wall lights.
So that's another thingactually.
Oh, and the mirror right at theend.
Yes, when you, when you walk in, there's, yeah, the lighting is
, um, obviously a big part of it, but like, yeah, the gloss, the
(24:04):
depth of color, the floor, andthen the mirror at the end,
which kind of just, I don't know, gives you that extra sense of
depth as well, so it doesn'tfinish.
But, yes, lighting, I also.
Yeah, the lighting is sothoughtful and I think that is
something that we we sometimesskip through that, you know, in
(24:24):
australia the default is justfor a sea of down lights on the
roof, on the ceiling, sorry,which is just never flattering,
but we saw wall lights usedreally cleverly.
Yes, what I loved about theirapartment as well was in the
dining there was almost like a.
It was like an Asian influencewith the.
Yeah, they said that too.
(24:45):
Yeah, it was kind of like aframed wallpaper.
Their first date was in aJapanese restaurant.
So that was the inspiration.
Was their first date?
Yeah, yeah, so you had thetextured.
Would it have been Seagrass?
Yeah, like a seagrass or alinen or something.
Textured wallpaper or moreFinnish than with the very
simple kind of panel.
(25:05):
So it made it feel like thoseJapanese rice paper panels.
Right Screen yeah, I'm surethere's a word for that, but I
don't know.
Yeah, you'll just have to jumpon their Instagram and have a
look.
Yeah, it was so stunning.
So there was like a bit of anEastern influence woven in.
And, yeah, their bedroom wasnext level.
It was so simple in that it wasa wall colour and the bed linen
(25:31):
that matched.
I mean, they must have startedwith the bed linen because it
was the epitome of what everyoneis calling colour drenching.
Now, right, it was which Iwould call a tonal space or even
, you know, a colour blockedroom.
But yes, it was colour drenched.
Would you call it like an ochre, somewhere between an ochre and
(25:53):
an olive that colour?
I did see it more into thegreens as a green olive, and it
was just like to try tophotograph.
It was impossible, it wasreally hard.
Yeah, it was such an unusualcolour.
You couldn't capture it, yeah,no, it was so special.
So, and that's another thingthey did really well, okay.
So again, very detailed, quite,I want to say minimal, even
(26:14):
though it was a maximalist space, and I think obviously the
color made it feel maximalist,but the detail was quite
precision, which made it feel alittle bit more minimal.
But they had, um, symmetry, Ithink, was another thing they
did really well.
So in that space they had twocupboards either side of the bed
and then they were mirrored.
(26:35):
So then adding that mirror intothat small space again just
transformed it for me, like itbounced the light around and,
you know, gives you, I guess, alittle bit more of a feeling of
depth, whereas if that had justbeen a texture or a color, it's
still amazing, but it just wouldhave given it a completely
different feel.
It was clever, wasn't it?
Ah, super clever.
(26:55):
So, considered so clever, Iwant to use mirror more.
Yeah, it's inspiring, a lot oftakeaways, so inspiring.
And then the apartment we wentto, oh my God.
After that, the architecturepractice that the sisters run is
called Droolers Architecture.
So they're twin sisters.
They are very exquisite inthemselves.
(27:20):
The women are gorgeous,immaculate.
I would say Immaculate,beautiful, not a hair out of
place, presented, yes, the home.
It was like in an old uh, Ithink they said it was like an
old villa, so it was in like thedown and out part of town.
Um was so funny.
She was telling us previouslythe down and out.
I think it was previously thedown and out gentrified and it
(27:44):
used to be a brothel, and shesaid that sometimes some fat
prostitutes rock up on the door.
Still, I loved it how she saidthat and had to call them fat as
well.
It was so funny.
She was painting a picture.
Yes, she was, it was so, and Isort of imagined it could have
been like a st kilda inmelbourne.
You know how.
There's some amazing old houses, but they've had a history,
(28:07):
they have a story.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and therewere a lot of creatives, um, and
artists living in that umbuilding as well.
So I guess the other thing thatis different often in some of
the Milanese apartments is theyprobably were a lot of them were
one home at some point or a lotless homes, and they've been
(28:28):
broken up into smaller spaces,but they often had that central
courtyard which just makes itfeel quite different.
So you kind of enter, you enterfrom the outside, from the
street, but you don't enterinside.
You're still outside when youwalk through.
So you walk into that centralcourtyard and usually there's
sort of like a concierge or theycall it something else that I
(28:49):
can't remember now.
Um, and then you have, you know, usually two sets of stairs or
one set that takes you aroundone way, depending on how many
apartments there are, and that'swhat, um, this space was like,
and and also no big rooms.
They were all quite smallspaces, I think.
Once you came into thisapartment, an entry which also I
(29:10):
really love, how there's alwaysan entry, like you know some.
That's the other thing that alot of our apartments do is you
literally just walk into thespace and there's no.
You're like at the kitchenbench yeah, I really love an
entry.
It's a moment to kind of setthe scene or, you know, even
just to use to, like we talkedabout before, put things down
(29:30):
and you know the things thatyou're carrying or whatever.
Yeah, coats, jackets, likethese are needed, yeah, and then
kind of being introduced to thespace.
God, I love an entry.
Let's have more entries.
Oh, I totally agree, and theyhad that amazing checkerboard um
flooring in that entry whichI'm a messy fan of.
(29:52):
So, oh my god.
But they also had thecheckerboard rug which was in
their range.
They do a range of differentfabrics and rugs, these um two
sisters, the jeweller'sarchitecture, stunning, and it
was like a metallic wovencheckerboard rug.
Yes, and there were some smallerrooms, but actually that main
(30:12):
living area was quite generous.
It had a wraparound built in sofar.
The second one yeah, thecentral yes, there was a few
living areas, central one.
The second one, central, yes,because we'll say there were.
Yeah, it wasn't, we wouldn'tsay that was a um, a small,
small apartment.
So there was an entry, thenthere was what I would call like
a parlor or a sitting room andthen there was living space,
(30:36):
which is the one you're talkingabout with, you know, the um,
kind of almost built-in sofa allthe way around the edges and
that amazing artwork.
Who's the artist?
Oh, just a casual, anish Kapooron the wall.
Yeah, just casually, justcasually.
And the wallpaper, it wasactually fabric.
That's right, it was fabric.
They'd found a sample of thiswallpaper or fabric already in
(31:01):
the property and they had a millcrew recreated.
They created a, designed aborder that would go with it as
well, or something, and it wasjust amazing.
It was just so, uh, was quitelavish.
It still felt relaxing, though.
It was still comfortable.
(31:22):
You felt like you could stillsit down, relax into it, have a
glass of wine or your coffee oryour tea, read your book.
I think that's the other thingwe should probably bring up.
Side note is nobody makes afeature of their TV in these
spaces.
It might exist, but you mightnot know where it is, or it's in
(31:42):
a separate room, which we'vetalked about before with Brim,
and I feel like let's hope thisis a trend where people start
making, like I guess, a TV roomand then they have their other
main spaces as more socialspaces or quiet spaces or spaces
to kind of come together andchat rather than come together
and stare at the wall.
Totally, except I do need my TVto watch Hacks.
(32:05):
Yes, when we've discussed Hacks, if nobody's watching it, go
watch it.
Yeah, and I do too, but Ihardly ever actually I'll, maybe
once a week with one of thekids, sit in the room and watch
the big TV, but I tend to watchit on little screens while I'm
doing other things.
But I do love the idea of yes,I'm not saying get rid of TVs,
even though I think there's lotsof places that we've come
(32:28):
across that go.
We don't really have one, Icouldn't live without it either
but I do like the idea of it notbeing the central focus of the
main living space.
I really like that idea.
It's so luxurious not to have atv or, as you say, not to make
it.
If there was a tv in thosespaces, it was either bought in
I have one, like on an easelthat I I pack away sometimes or
(32:52):
whatever.
But, um, but, yes, you can,it's hidden away, it's not the
focal point of the room.
So if you, if you've got ananish kapoor, you make that the
focal point, and so you should.
But there was also a library inthat home as well.
Yes, that was amazing and itwas like I think it was.
(33:12):
The shelves were a burgundycolor and yet the mirrored
ceiling.
So apparently there was adecorative ceiling underneath
that.
Uh, what we saw was like afalse ceiling.
Yeah, it was a decorativeceiling underneath that.
Uh, what we saw, it was like afalse ceiling.
Yeah, it was a false ceilingand I think they had to cover it
for some reason I can'tremember, but it just gave that
illusion of this incrediblenever-ending library and mirror.
(33:33):
Again, mirrored ceilings can bequestionable.
However, in that space, um, itworked.
It really worked.
That just just like extendingbooks and um and the other, and
there was a big kind of almostlike a big dining table in there
.
I guess that you know you couldput books on and and read and
research, like a little minilibrary, that where you could
(33:55):
actually like pull things offthe shelves and spread them out.
So seeing that reflected andthe walls extended with the
mirror just was like, yeah,magic.
I loved that space actuallyincredible, and the kitchen was
beautiful there and there was arooftop garden.
It was just such a treat.
Talk about that for a second.
So again, separate room it wasbigger than other kitchens we've
(34:19):
seen.
It was a a little bit more of alayout that we'd recognise in
Australia, with, you know, akind of U-shape, I guess, with a
bench that came across that Ithink maybe you could have even
sat at the bench, like and hadyour breakfast or whatever, but
it was sort of hidden.
So when you left that maincentral living space to walk out
(34:39):
to the rooftop terrace or thebathroom, there was an automatic
door so you tapped it with yourfoot and it would slide open.
It was big, big slide open, andthen there was the kitchen, and
then it would slide closedagain.
And not to mention a maid inthere as well, that's not the
right word.
Let's say a house manager.
(35:00):
Don't believe it, I'm not aufait with these kind of terms,
but basically there was a ladyin there.
They had somebody helping out,for sure, behind that door, but
that kitchen was.
I loved the idea of that.
I really loved the idea of thatbecause really, if they left
that really big sliding dooropen and we've talked about this
before about, um, you know,trying to move away a little bit
(35:21):
from open plan living and whymaybe we should move away from
it a little bit and havekitchens that can still connect,
and we've talked about slidingdoors it was kind of a perfect
example of that.
Even though it opened into kindof a thoroughfare, it wasn't
far from the living area, so ifsomeone was in the kitchen you
could probably speak to theperson in the living area with
(35:42):
that door open.
This was kind of a good exampleof how, or just leaving it open
because it wasn't a kitchen tohide either.
The kitchen wasn't amazing, itwas beautiful, just to kind of
like have people be able towander in there.
But also, if you don't want itto be seen or you want someone
working away and they're makingdinner while you're doing other
things, it could be closed offlike yeah, yeah, I think I will
(36:06):
close off my maid in the kitchen.
Stop it.
Sorry, I can't say that, but itfelt like we were in a movie.
That's what it felt like for me.
That that was like I was in amovie.
It was so beautiful, um, and Ithink you know we got to go
upstairs to a whole otherapartment too, remember oh, that
was divine which was smaller,much smaller.
(36:28):
That was a gem, because thatwasn't even released yet for the
fair and they let us go in, no,so that was Domore's
collaboration with the fabricbrand which you're going to
remember for me, japanese fabricbrand.
Yeah, it was called husu and itwas a japanese.
They make kimono, so they'vebeen making kimonos for hundreds
(36:48):
, hundreds of years, since 1650sor something like that.
So they um, dug up the archiveswith the team from the moray
studio and, um, they curatedthat collection and so
re-released that.
But the quality of thosefabrics.
I mean, when I walked in and Isaw a chair upholstered, I
(37:10):
couldn't believe how beautifulit was and that was just an
amazing experience as well.
And I'm forgetting the name ofthe artist whose apartment it
was, who does all the metal work.
Oh, yes, oh, she, she was.
Her pieces were divine so itwas her.
So she lived upstairs and haddone quite a bit of work with um
(37:31):
, with the girls, with thesisters, but we will find that
and put it there because I feelbad that I can't remember now.
Ozana visconti.
Thank you, I was just trying tofind it, ozana.
Yes, so um, it was space, itwas her apartment.
Usually, in fact, I think, aswe were leaving, was it her
husband coming home with thepastries?
He'd gone out to get the coffeeand pastries for there, because
(37:53):
this was on a Sunday, so wewere getting ahead of everything
on a Sunday before Design Weekreally gets going.
So, yeah, we were very, very,very fortunate to get a
completely um to the point wherewe took photos but were told
they were embargoed until afterthe press had seen it.
So we saw don't share them.
Yeah, those are the sort ofthings we do on our tour.
(38:13):
By the way, just just saying Imean, if you wanted to see the
demore, um, you know a big show,big event at milan design week,
you, you're up for at least athree-hour wait.
Forget about that.
We just walked straight intothis exhibition here, this
amazing apartment, and I thinkit was better.
Yeah, it was good Because wegot to really be immersed in the
(38:34):
space, whereas, I don't know, Ididn't see the Demore show this
year.
We'll discuss that because Idid and it was probably one of
my highlights.
But we'll discuss that becauseI did and it was probably one of
my highlights, but we'lldiscuss that in another.
Okay, I haven't talked about it.
Yeah, I haven't even asked youwhat you thought.
I mean, the isana's apartmentwas, um, incredible, but the
laura piana collab with demorewas was probably a pretty big
(38:55):
highlight for me in the end, andI yeah to the point where so I
am a bit of a demore fan, Ithink, because, since I've been
going to to Milan, it used to bethat you could kind of just
wander up and see through theirshowroom, and then it got to the
point where it was three hoursplus wait in lines, and I kind
of managed every year to getmyself in there without having
(39:15):
to do that not ignoting myself,I'm just a good talker, I'm just
a good talker.
And this year I was like, okay,great, I'm going to get myself.
And I actually tried twice andwouldn't get in, and then the
third time I managed to secure aspot, but anyway, I did get to
see it.
I did, and it was literally thelast day it was the Saturday
(39:36):
evening that I ended up seeingit, one of the last things, but
I was glad I did experience it.
But we'll talk about that onanother.
We'll talk about some of theexperiences in another episode.
Yeah, well, I think the greatthing um, maybe just to wrap
this up was that travel andbeing able to go into a person's
home it's just so rare, it is,and I think that you know
(39:56):
talking about, as you weresaying, you know the, the
kitchen and the festival and theliving, and this is the way it
was organized.
It's like, well, you don't getthat from photography and it
just opens up it.
Yeah, it opens up ideas of howcould we design a space.
Yes, we do open plan all daylong in australia, but there are
other ways of living and youdon't have to live like that.
(40:17):
You don't have to live likethat.
People open, plan like thereare other ways, yeah, and that
look, and this is honestly wheredesigners come into.
You know, if you're looking ata space and you want a different
approach, this is what we do.
Right, we've put it.
We open ourselves up to otherideas and this is why we travel
and this is why we have, youknow, these tours as well,
(40:39):
because we want other people tobe inspired and we want to take
people on that journey and seethings that maybe you wouldn't
experience here.
And it's a big deal.
As you said, we've had peoplesay a trip of a lifetime.
I think I agree, if you haven'tdone that before, you'll be
blown away, because we justcan't as much as you can open
(40:59):
yourself up to ideas here.
There'll always be limitationsand there'll always be
limitations to what you can seeonline and in photos and in
magazines.
Experiencing that firsthand,even for myself and yourself,
who you know, would like tothink that we're pretty well
versed at, you know, travel andgetting out there was amazing
and it was definitely somethingI will never forget Absolutely.
(41:24):
Have I talked it up enough?
Oh well, true.
You know, people that know mewill know I don't don't talk
rubbish and I'm pretty straighttalker and I'm very authentic
about the fact that I think itwas actually some of the best
experiences I've had, even justfor myself.
On on that tour, yeah, it wasamazing, wasn't it?
It was great, I know't it, itwas great.
I know that we sort of said, oh, it feels surreal now that
(41:45):
we're home, but I'm like, whenwe were there, it felt surreal.
When I was there, yeah, I justas I said, it was just
incredible.
I mean, yeah, it's just such arare experience.
I think the apartment tours werereally one of the highlights
amongst many, and who doesn'tlike just to full stop snoop
around someone's house?
It's so fun.
Isn't this why people go toopen houses all the time, just
(42:09):
like poke around?
Yeah, this was next level,though, so I guess we should
mention that we are going to dothe Milan Paris tour again in
2026.
Yes, but if you can't wait forthat, did we decide we're
opening that up in July, in afew weeks?
(42:30):
Yeah, I think July.
Yeah, I think that sounds good.
So keep an eye out for that andget on the wait list.
So I think and we'll startpushing this out on social so
you'll see it, but also it'll bein the show notes.
But do get on the wait listbecause we only take eight
people.
We will not be taking any morethan eight.
We want to keep it a prettyintimate experience and we know
that that's the maximum amountand it sold out very quickly in
(42:52):
a short time last year and nowthat we're talking about it more
, I feel like it will probablybe snapped up again quite
quickly.
So if you're on the waitlist,you'll hear about it first and
we'll definitely open it up tothe waitlist at least a couple
of days, or at least 24 hours,before we open it up to everyone
else.
So jump on that.
Oh, and before Paris and Milanright, just to throw another
(43:15):
thing in there, if Paris andMilan is at your thing, where
are we going, lauren?
We're going to London, earthing.
Where are we going, lauren?
We're going to london.
London's calling.
So before we started our trip,I went over to london and I did
some research.
It was all strictly work that Idid for you, for you, for you
(43:37):
listening.
Such a sacrifice.
It was really hard.
It was such hard work.
I had to find all these coolplaces and just check they were
cool.
Um, so we are going inseptember for london design
festival, so there's a whole lotof speakers that do discussions
and different events thathappen over that week.
(43:59):
So we want to take you guysover there because London is
like such an exciting city Idon't even need to tell you guys
about it because it's London.
Yes, it is.
I was in London last year beforeMilan and can confirm very cool
.
My first time I was there, tobe honest, and I wasn't sure
what to expect, but I loved it.
(44:21):
It has an amazing energy.
It really is also a bit of adesign mecca that maybe we
overlook a little bit.
I know a lot of designers kindof think about going to work
there when they are younger, asyou did, lauren.
I probably would have had.
I had the opportunity, but Ithink it's sort of maybe we
focus a lot on Milan and Londonhas some amazing makers,
(44:44):
designers.
We know there are beautifulspaces there, so we'll be
tracking those down and takingyou on tours of that.
We've already made some amazingconnections with people there
who are very excited for us tojoin them during the Design
Festival.
And yeah, that's DesignFestival, so it's going to have
a great vibe, anyway, right, sogreat, during the design
festival.
And, yeah, that's designfestival, so it's going to have
(45:04):
a great vibe anyway, right, sogreat.
Yeah, I went down the pimlicoroad and there are some gorgeous
designers that I'm sure you'llknow there's pinch, there's oka,
there's devil kitchens, there'sjust like heaps of beautiful
places, but also, you know, theydo fabric, they do color and
patterns, so well, yeah, so I'mso excited to kind of dive into
that kind of world yes, me too.
(45:25):
So good, and to take you guyson the wait list.
Come along.
Yes, again, same thing, we'rehoping.
Well, frankly, we've had thewait list open already and, um,
there's a really good number ofpeople on there.
So, uh, you know again,there'll only be eight spots.
So please jump on and prepareyourselves.
September isn't that far away.
(45:45):
So we'll be opening that upvery, very soon.
Yeah, so excited.
Oh, london, I love it.
I love it so much.
What's the weather going to belike in September?
Hopefully, some sunny days,maybe.
Who knows what the weather isgoing to be like there, but you
know, london is just such avibrant city that we are going
to have a good time.
Weather is going to be likethere, but you know, london is
just such a vibrant city that weare going to have a good time.
(46:05):
I'm going to guarantee thatright now.
All right, so I think we willwrap up.
Let you get back on with it.
Thanks again for listening.
It was great to talk with youagain and all the links are in
the podcast notes so you can goand do that whenever.
See ya.
Okay, b, we're back.
We are Feels like forever thatwe've been gone, doesn't it?
I think we've shaken off jetlag and we're so excited to be
talking with you again, and, ofcourse, we're going to be
talking about our trip for a bit.
And guess what?
I just got some really nicefeedback in my inbox from one of
the gorgeous people that cameon our trip.
(00:21):
Yes, without giving away who itwas, I'm just going to say we
asked if she had any feedbackfor you and me and she wrote you
did a great job, girls, thanksfor the trip of a lifetime.
I just want to high-five youfrom here, brie.
I just honestly we've said thisto each other so many times and
(00:42):
it's very pinched me that wehad the most amazing group of
women on our tour, that wecouldn't have asked for a better
group, and I think we were abit spoiled.
I'm like worried that nobodycan match them.
I know we challenge you, though.
We challenge you to join us andmatch them, but yeah, they were
(01:02):
.
They were absolutely fabulousand we had some amazing,
gorgeous times with them.
So, yeah, I could.
Honestly, it was so good, itwas so good.
I can't I can't fault it interms of how wonderful they were
.
I agree.
I mean, I wouldn't go so far tosay we're speechless, because
we do have a lot to say about it.
So welcome you.
(01:24):
Thank you for coming back andlistening to us on the Design
Anatomy.
We took a little break, so we'rehere to talk about interior
design and it's Bree and I.
We're friends and fellowdesigners and we are going to be
talking to a couple of guestsas well.
So today we wanted to talkabout some of the experiences
that we had in apartments inMilan and Paris.
(01:48):
I've been traveling over therefor a bit.
In terms of Milan, it was soamazing to see and we'll drop
this in some beautiful tours ofamazing private apartments as
part of our Design Anatomy tourThings that you would not be
able to do if you just poppedover there on your own.
So I think that was reallyspecial and we got to do that in
(02:12):
both Paris and Milan.
But it just reinforced for me alot of things about how well
Europeans do small space livingor apartment living, because I
feel like in Australia and maybeit's also because, you know,
there's always going to be thatlayer of history that we don't
have.
Let's just get that out of theway.
(02:33):
People will always come at meand say, well, you know they
have this and they have that,sure, but I still think there's
lots of things we can do betterand learn from those spaces.
Right, I agree, and I mean tobe fair as well.
In Melbourne at least, we dohave older buildings, and if you
look at Paris, a lot of Pariswas built in 1850.
(02:56):
And we have buildings inMelbourne from 1850, but not
many, not many, have survivedthat kind of distance.
But it was really interesting.
The first apartment that wevisited was Paul's apartment.
So Paul is a really amazing,gorgeous, warm, welcoming person
(03:16):
that we were so honored to meet, and his background is in tech.
So he's actually a client ofSophie Dries.
So if you don't know who sophieis, you can go back a few
episodes.
Sophie is a french interiordesigner and her work features
on the front cover of my book,the what's it called?
Again, the french new look.
(03:38):
That's so funny I'll get itwrong.
The new french look.
The french new look, look, theFrench new look.
One of those Google that It'llcome up.
Your work is right on the coverof it.
So that's really amazing, andto be able to step inside.
That apartment was just quite apinch me moment.
(03:58):
As you sort of alreadymentioned before, we had quite a
few of those literal.
You just need to pinch mebecause I think I might be just
dreaming right now.
But you know that apartment wasbuilt actually before a lot of
the Ha apartments.
So those apartments in that era, like a lot of Paris, was all
wiped out because it was allmedieval little streets and
(04:19):
everything.
But Paul's apartment was, Ithink, 1840.
So it was just before Haussmann.
I don't know.
I think 1840, so it was justbefore Haussmann.
I don't know he'd come up withhis first name anyway designed
all of the streets of Paris andall the boulevards and
everything.
So his is actually quite an oldapartment in Paris.
But you know we talk about smallliving and it's not really that
(04:40):
small.
Did you find it that small?
Well, do we know how big it is?
Okay, I'm trying to like, Iguess, to give people a bit of
an idea, I guess, in the schemeof things, no, I've definitely
seen smaller and I think thatthere are a lot of people living
in cities like Paris, london,who live in quite small
apartments.
So in the scheme of that, Iguess he had two living spaces,
(05:04):
for instance, a living area andthen a dedicated dining area as
well as a bedroom, but only onebedroom.
But I think what makes it feelsmall as well, in terms of not
feel small overall in a negativeway, but why you notice it's
small is because their rooms arenot necessarily open plan, like
a lot of our apartments kind oftry to be, and the kitchens are
(05:27):
basically, you know, a galleykitchen, where you're just like
one side is kitchen and it's gotto also usually have a laundry
in it, which he did quitecleverly, and those are the
things I feel like.
You kind of know you're in asmaller space, but you're right,
the living area even in itselfwas a good size, um, so I guess
we could say it was a mediumsize apartment, for for a paris
(05:51):
living, do you think, but Ithink it's also.
I think if you're comparingthat apartment to an apartment
that would be built in melbourne, it's quite a big apartment.
But, as you say, with this theopen planning, though, what what
we do is we just put a kitchento the edge of a living area and
whereas his was just a separateroom for a kitchen, which is
(06:12):
something we don't do and Idon't think anybody does that
anymore.
That's traditionally done rightthere.
It's that's it kind ofinherited, that type of living
and then that's how they live.
So it's sort of a bit culturalas well, whereas we,
particularly with new apartmentsI think sometimes the issue
with our apartments is we tryand emulate a bigger home in a
(06:35):
smaller space instead ofembracing that it's a smaller
space and making that workbetter or smarter.
Do you know what I mean?
I agree, I agree.
I kind of feel like the openplan doesn't always work.
I have a client at the momentwho has an apartment in
Docklands and hers is kitchen,open to living, open to dining,
and it's actually a really hardspace to work in because it's
(06:58):
not super big.
It's hard to make it feel alittle bit more special.
There's really not enough spaceto put stools at the kitchen
bench, for instance, because theliving area is right there.
You could almost put the sofalike hard up against the bench,
whereas if it had have beendesigned maybe in a different
way, with a different approachto trying to make it feel like a
(07:19):
bigger home that has a openplan area, it might've worked
better.
I think you know.
Yeah, and it's it is adifferent way of life as well.
Like the majority ofaustralians live in a like a
single dwelling, uh, not, uh,attached.
You're in suburbia, that's true, yeah, yeah, I wonder if that's
changing.
Actually, and I woulddefinitely change on that I
(07:42):
reckon there'd be a lot morepeople now in in townhouses that
are at least two on a blockkind of thing than there are
single tellings, right?
Yeah, I think we have to changeand I think that you know,
looking at the way that you know, we, even that morning, when we
rocked up to Paul's apartmentand he was just gorgeous, he
opened up his door and he let uslook around, which is a big ask
(08:05):
, right, yeah, and then we, wesaw Sophie at the door and,
anyway, after we saw hisapartment, we walked to Sophie's
apartment, and that's anotherthing.
We walk from one home to anotherhome and it's that being on the
street, walking, it's adifferent lifestyle.
It's so much more active.
Um, I mean, you might catch themetro, but we, we just walked
(08:27):
and that's the way peoplecommute a lot more than what we
do in our little suburbanbubbles perhaps.
Um, yeah, so the walking isgood, but I often wonder, am I
doing it more because I'm thereas a visitor or does.
Everybody is as much.
I wanted that too.
But then Sophie's home to herclient's home is she would have
(08:49):
walked there.
Yeah, she would have.
Yeah for sure.
You know all of that.
I mean, we're talking obviouslyabout interior design, but I
think it all influences just adifferent way of living, and I
just love going when you gooverseas and you get to sort of
feel like, oh, what's, how dothey get around people that live
here?
How do they live, how do theyeat?
It is the culture that canaffect the interiors.
(09:09):
Like interiors don't exist in abubble, right, often the fact
that you might have to havespace for a bike and they don't
have storage cages.
It's not like here, where a lotof our apartments will have,
you know, a basement and there'sa storage cage and maybe that's
where the bike goes or whatever.
But, um, here there needs to bea space where the bike can hang
(09:30):
or it's integrated into thespace and it's not just sitting
in the hallway right, andstorage for things that you
carry with you when you'rewalking.
So if you walk a lot and youcome into the home, you need to
be able to like, have basket orbag or whatever it is.
I think it's.
I think that maybe that'sthought about a little bit more,
do you think?
And also the commuting, butalso the fact that in a place
(09:53):
like Paris, at least, and inFrance and probably Italy, it's
going to work, it's stopping forlunch and it's going home and
having a meal and then goingback to the office, or it's that
different, that ritual ofhaving lunch whereas we are oh,
I'm just going to eat standingup or eat walking whilst I'm
(10:15):
getting from A to B, orsomething that is so interesting
.
And I think that's why we see alot more dining spaces, like an
emphasis on the dining spacesin apartments, because it is
that opportunity to stop, have awine like just your regular
lunch.
It's just such a nice thing to.
I don't think we don't do that,and I think even stopping for
(10:36):
dinner, having the family cometogether for dinner, is
something that's not happeningas often in Australia as maybe
it should, in my opinion, or itused to, but I think there's a
real emphasis on stoppinggetting together for a meal in
France and Italy.
I'd say I think the other thingthat they I mean definitely
dining spaces and even whenthere's, and also having them
(10:59):
slightly separate.
I mean, if we think aboutPaul's apartment for a second,
there was connection between theliving area and the dining but
there were still different roomsand not completely open, and so
it kind of allows for even in asmall space if you've got lots
of.
So all these people that we saw, and a lot of these I guess is
(11:20):
the point you're making is theyentertain, whether it's family
or friends or whatever it is.
They entertain in these smallspaces and they do it quite well
.
And I think that havingslightly separate rooms helps
because you break out intolittle areas, right.
So there might be a group ofpeople talking, smoking whatever
, drinking, in the living room,and then there's a different
(11:42):
group in the dining room andeven a different group in the
kitchen, kind of thing, whereashere, if all those spaces are
one space, we still do it, butit's not, it's still kind of
part of the one group.
I don't know if that makessense, so that you can kind of
have, like you know, I guess,different things happening, even
you know, different discussions, and it's not, the noise isn't
going to be as much and it's alittle more intimate, so you can
(12:05):
have those kind of littlebreak-off groups I think that
happens a bit too in thesesmaller spaces rather than kind
of just this one big, open,small warehouse party in your
apartment.
Well, it's interesting because Isuppose the spaces we visited
are very elevated, they're verydesign-led, and I would have to
(12:26):
say that not everybody liveslike that.
So I feel like if people arehaving friends over to entertain
, I dare say that probablydoesn't happen as often as what
we might do in Australia.
I think that they go out fordinner, they go out for lunch
with friends and they probablydon't entertain as much just
because of the space not havingas much space.
(12:47):
I'm going to challenge you onthat, because paul actually said
that they have people over orthat he has people to the house
all the time and same with umsorry, jumping ahead a little
bit to milan, um, christian andfrancesco purple.
I've said that right.
Um said the same thing theyhave their friends to the home
(13:07):
and so that was important tothem to have it so that they
could have those conversationsand entertain.
So I think they may not cookmassive meals, maybe because
they don't have huge kitchens,but I think they do entertain at
home for sure.
I mean, I think they still goout, but I think that I think
it's a it's part of what, um,that the culture is still to
have people to your home andmaybe to show it off.
(13:29):
If you've got a house like that, I want people coming over,
that's right, and I mean evenfor Sophie.
So, yeah, in the morning wewent to Paul's, then we, as I
said, dashed across down thestreet and went to Sophie's.
So Sophie's home that sheshares with her husband and her
child, they, she does use thatfor, uh, yeah, meetings and
(13:50):
things, because in her studioroom for her too, yeah, her
studio is for working and shesaid she's got like samples and
things happening everywhere soit's a nice.
So it's a bit of a showcase.
So I guess, yeah, not everybodyhas that that need for their
space.
And her space was, I guess, topreface with um, her space was
quite large, I was.
(14:10):
It was a big apartment, that'ssure.
I feel like that's a slightlyunusual um thing to come across
in terms of a big living areawith actually open plan with the
dining, but then a separate,smaller, let's say, a meals
dining area and then still thesmall kitchen.
(14:31):
So they don't do the bigkitchen.
You know, even when they dohave the bigger space, then kind
of a little breakout area,small, just like the one
bathroom, cause that's the otherthing that would rarely happen
is that you would have ensuite.
It's like a one bathroomsituation, um, and then bedrooms
, but, um, yeah, her, her spacewas quite big but, as you said,
I think she, she needs to beable to bring clients through,
(14:54):
um, and she uses it like ashowroom to show, uh, because
she's not just interior designer, she's product designer and as
well, and, uh, and her husband'san artist, correct?
So, yes, how cool, I know howcool was their apartment.
We got to see, like, amazingmirror that she's designed that
is just being released.
I think that's throughinvisible collection.
(15:16):
Um, she also had, I think it was, a coffee table by max lambs.
Yeah, that was just incredible,very unique.
They're like art pieces, aren'tthey?
And then she's got, yes, it wasjust, oh, just to be immersed
in that and just to her see thetextures and her, if we sort of
compare, um, you know, paul'sspace was quite classic, um, it
(15:40):
was.
It wasn't full of color, but itwas full of personality and
interest, and he's an artist aswell.
So, you know, had a couple ofhis pieces and he's a collector,
so had some amazing artworksthat brought so much to you know
, again, small space living, Ithink artwork has a massive
impact.
You can have a space thatpotentially doesn't have a lot
(16:03):
of character and bring characterto it through what you put in
it like artwork or rugs andfurniture and things.
And then Sophie's Place stillquite classic but so eclectic
and almost like.
You know, our creative peoplelive here, not just collectors.
These are people who can seethe beauty in all sorts of
(16:25):
things and the way she broughtthose things together in that
space, um was also it.
There was no, there's nothingshowroom or um precious about it
.
It was also so relaxed and yetso elevated and I love that.
I love that feel because Ithink it's so hard to achieve
it's.
It's almost like a personalityof its own.
(16:46):
I think when you achieve that Ithink you just nailed it it's
when we're describing it andsaying that she uses it as a
showroom.
It's that doesn't.
It's not a showroom, it's ahome.
It's still a home.
Yeah, it, we've, we all.
I think in Paul's space, um, andI think he was so warm and
welcoming, but I think inSophie's space we all felt
(17:08):
really relaxed, very much so,yeah, and it also was so cute
how she like made coffee and shegot like the best croissants in
Paris for us.
It was just so, so special, itwas just an absolute dream.
And how gorgeous is Sophie?
Ah, sophie is one of the mostum, special people you'd meet, I
(17:29):
think, because she is sotalented I don't know how she
does all the things that shedoes like I feel like she
probably never stops and she's amom and, you know, a business
owner and an art.
I just feel like she's the mostgenerous person as well, like
to a fault, so um, and reallylooked after us.
We're so grateful to her wholelike beautiful, totally.
(17:52):
I mean, what an opportunity justto visit a Parisian apartment,
but let alone one of the best,two of the best.
And you know, I think there wassome fabric hanging over a
window and I said to her oh mygosh, I love this sheer fabric.
She said, oh, that's actually arange that I'm going to be
releasing soon.
I'm like, are you insane?
(18:13):
Do you stop?
Do you sleep?
And the fact that she's so, asyou said, generous, she wants to
share.
And you know, we bumped intoher in milan, which was so cool
as well, and, um, she's, sheknows everyone.
She knows everyone in theindustry, she's in published
widely across every magazine andyou know her collections of
(18:33):
furniture, and there's not anounce of pretentiousness there,
she's just a genuine person.
Anyway, we're probably going tostop raving up Hi, sophie,
we're raving about you, I know.
We just think that she'samazing and I have to say as
well, um, off the topic ofapartments, but just in general,
like all of the show show rooms, probably I would say one or
(18:56):
two were a little bitpretentious.
I'm not going to say who, but Iwas just blown away by how warm
and friendly they were.
In Paris, I think so too.
Yeah, because you don't knowwhat to expect sometimes.
Also, you know we're not.
When we were visiting theseshowrooms on this occasion,
we're bringing a group of peoplethrough, so it can be an
(19:18):
inconvenience sometimes.
No, we were absolutely welcomedand you know, sure, I guess
there's a little bit of I mean,sometimes with some high end
things comes a little bit ofpretentiousness, but I didn't
get that from anybody inparticular in terms of the way
we were kind of looked after.
Everybody was really happy toshare.
You know what was new, what washappening in the showroom and
(19:41):
you know hospitable offering ofdrinks and food.
I love that.
I'll always take some drinksand food.
Exactly Everyone was justgorgeous.
So I guess, talking about sothat was sort of one morning
that we had Paul's apartment andSophie's and then we were in
Milan, as you mentioned, we sawChristian and Francesco, who
(20:04):
were divine.
So Christian and Francesco havethey're also creatives but not
designers, so it was a bit of aDIY project for them, their
apartment, and the apartment wasin St Charlie.
So if you know anything aboutMilan, it's kind of a bit of a
new and upcoming area.
It's, I guess if you're inMelbourne, it's kind of like
(20:27):
being in the north.
I don't know what would it bein Sydney north.
I don't know what would it bein sydney, I don't know um, so
it's, there's a lot of otherdesigners and creatives kind of
moving into the area and theyfound the space and they did so
much work to it.
Um, we'll share their, theirinstagram and they have a great
um highlights reel on therewhere they show them literally,
like you know, sledgehammeropening up between two rooms.
(20:50):
So they had their space isagain, it's just the one bedroom
and, you know, entry, and theentry was amazing too.
So they actually have a bit ofa hall, bathroom, kitchen, and
then they had these two spacesthat they'd opened up, so
between a dining and living room, and that was also reasonably
(21:11):
big.
And then just the way their useof, for me, their use of colour
and even just gloss versusmatte kind of, and the floors
was very what I kind of see, andlighting was kind of very
Milanese to me and I mean, mean,the color combinations were a
little bit too.
But you know, a stone floorwhich they, which they designed,
(21:34):
um, based on kind of a geoponty, you know that classic geoponty
, geometric um.
And then having one of the greatthings about some of these
older apartments is when, um,the use of like a gloss paint on
walls and ceilings.
And here we freak out because,uh, maybe they're brand new
(21:54):
plasterboard and as soon as youput a gloss paint on it you can
maybe see the joins of theplasterboard or whatever, um,
because you're never going tohave a perfect wall, but there
the walls aren't perfect anyway.
So you do a gloss and it showsup all the imperfections, but
that's kind of what makes itamazing.
So I love and and quite moodyand immersive, that was sort of
their, their vibe in there.
(22:15):
Um, so it was very big contrastto what we'd seen in in Paris.
With, you know, I feel likequite um, quintessential
Parisian style apartment livingversus the um, I guess you know
in it on a designer level levelversus the Milanese.
So it was that amazing contrastto come into their apartment as
(22:35):
our first one in Milan and seehow they've transformed that
space.
Yeah, I was excited.
Oh my God, it was so amazing.
I'm just remembering what itsmelled like as well.
It was like an incense, almostlike a.
It was a fragrance, but it wasjust, oh my God, it was divine.
And they were beautiful as welland they were very
(22:57):
details-orientated couple, right.
So, like in their bedroom, theway the bed was made, the
perfection of it was justperfect.
I'd love to just drop in thereon a day where they were
expecting me and just to checkhey, do you make your bed like
that?
I'm sure they'd love that.
(23:18):
I'll try it out next time, yeah, yeah, and that again, you know
, they offered us coffee andchocolates and, uh, love, um,
gorgeous, sorry, well, I wasjust remembering, you know,
walking into that, as you say,that the marble floor it was
sort of like different, uh, bigslabs of um, different stones,
(23:40):
it sort of as you walked in andthen down that hallway, and then
this hallway was painted inthis gloss, really burgundy,
brownish color, and then juststrategic wall lights.
So that's another thingactually.
Oh, and the mirror right at theend.
Yes, when you, when you walk in, there's, yeah, the lighting is
, um, obviously a big part of it, but like, yeah, the gloss, the
(24:04):
depth of color, the floor, andthen the mirror at the end,
which kind of just, I don't know, gives you that extra sense of
depth as well, so it doesn'tfinish.
But, yes, lighting, I also.
Yeah, the lighting is sothoughtful and I think that is
something that we we sometimesskip through that, you know, in
(24:24):
australia the default is justfor a sea of down lights on the
roof, on the ceiling, sorry,which is just never flattering,
but we saw wall lights usedreally cleverly.
Yes, what I loved about theirapartment as well was in the
dining there was almost like a.
It was like an Asian influencewith the.
Yeah, they said that too.
(24:45):
Yeah, it was kind of like aframed wallpaper.
Their first date was in aJapanese restaurant.
So that was the inspiration.
Was their first date?
Yeah, yeah, so you had thetextured.
Would it have been Seagrass?
Yeah, like a seagrass or alinen or something.
Textured wallpaper or moreFinnish than with the very
simple kind of panel.
(25:05):
So it made it feel like thoseJapanese rice paper panels.
Right Screen yeah, I'm surethere's a word for that, but I
don't know.
Yeah, you'll just have to jumpon their Instagram and have a
look.
Yeah, it was so stunning.
So there was like a bit of anEastern influence woven in.
And, yeah, their bedroom wasnext level.
It was so simple in that it wasa wall colour and the bed linen
(25:31):
that matched.
I mean, they must have startedwith the bed linen because it
was the epitome of what everyoneis calling colour drenching.
Now, right, it was which Iwould call a tonal space or even
, you know, a colour blockedroom.
But yes, it was colour drenched.
Would you call it like an ochre, somewhere between an ochre and
(25:53):
an olive that colour?
I did see it more into thegreens as a green olive, and it
was just like to try tophotograph.
It was impossible, it wasreally hard.
Yeah, it was such an unusualcolour.
You couldn't capture it, yeah,no, it was so special.
So, and that's another thingthey did really well, okay.
So again, very detailed, quite,I want to say minimal, even
(26:14):
though it was a maximalist space, and I think obviously the
color made it feel maximalist,but the detail was quite
precision, which made it feel alittle bit more minimal.
But they had, um, symmetry, Ithink, was another thing they
did really well.
So in that space they had twocupboards either side of the bed
and then they were mirrored.
(26:35):
So then adding that mirror intothat small space again just
transformed it for me, like itbounced the light around and,
you know, gives you, I guess, alittle bit more of a feeling of
depth, whereas if that had justbeen a texture or a color, it's
still amazing, but it just wouldhave given it a completely
different feel.
It was clever, wasn't it?
Ah, super clever.
(26:55):
So, considered so clever, Iwant to use mirror more.
Yeah, it's inspiring, a lot oftakeaways, so inspiring.
And then the apartment we wentto, oh my God.
After that, the architecturepractice that the sisters run is
called Droolers Architecture.
So they're twin sisters.
They are very exquisite inthemselves.
(27:20):
The women are gorgeous,immaculate.
I would say Immaculate,beautiful, not a hair out of
place, presented, yes, the home.
It was like in an old uh, Ithink they said it was like an
old villa, so it was in like thedown and out part of town.
Um was so funny.
She was telling us previouslythe down and out.
I think it was previously thedown and out gentrified and it
(27:44):
used to be a brothel, and shesaid that sometimes some fat
prostitutes rock up on the door.
Still, I loved it how she saidthat and had to call them fat as
well.
It was so funny.
She was painting a picture.
Yes, she was, it was so, and Isort of imagined it could have
been like a st kilda inmelbourne.
You know how.
There's some amazing old houses, but they've had a history,
(28:07):
they have a story.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and therewere a lot of creatives, um, and
artists living in that umbuilding as well.
So I guess the other thing thatis different often in some of
the Milanese apartments is theyprobably were a lot of them were
one home at some point or a lotless homes, and they've been
(28:28):
broken up into smaller spaces,but they often had that central
courtyard which just makes itfeel quite different.
So you kind of enter, you enterfrom the outside, from the
street, but you don't enterinside.
You're still outside when youwalk through.
So you walk into that centralcourtyard and usually there's
sort of like a concierge or theycall it something else that I
(28:49):
can't remember now.
Um, and then you have, you know, usually two sets of stairs or
one set that takes you aroundone way, depending on how many
apartments there are, and that'swhat, um, this space was like,
and and also no big rooms.
They were all quite smallspaces, I think.
Once you came into thisapartment, an entry which also I
(29:10):
really love, how there's alwaysan entry, like you know some.
That's the other thing that alot of our apartments do is you
literally just walk into thespace and there's no.
You're like at the kitchenbench yeah, I really love an
entry.
It's a moment to kind of setthe scene or, you know, even
just to use to, like we talkedabout before, put things down
(29:30):
and you know the things thatyou're carrying or whatever.
Yeah, coats, jackets, likethese are needed, yeah, and then
kind of being introduced to thespace.
God, I love an entry.
Let's have more entries.
Oh, I totally agree, and theyhad that amazing checkerboard um
flooring in that entry whichI'm a messy fan of.
(29:52):
So, oh my god.
But they also had thecheckerboard rug which was in
their range.
They do a range of differentfabrics and rugs, these um two
sisters, the jeweller'sarchitecture, stunning, and it
was like a metallic wovencheckerboard rug.
Yes, and there were some smallerrooms, but actually that main
(30:12):
living area was quite generous.
It had a wraparound built in sofar.
The second one yeah, thecentral yes, there was a few
living areas, central one.
The second one, central, yes,because we'll say there were.
Yeah, it wasn't, we wouldn'tsay that was a um, a small,
small apartment.
So there was an entry, thenthere was what I would call like
a parlor or a sitting room andthen there was living space,
(30:36):
which is the one you're talkingabout with, you know, the um,
kind of almost built-in sofa allthe way around the edges and
that amazing artwork.
Who's the artist?
Oh, just a casual, anish Kapooron the wall.
Yeah, just casually, justcasually.
And the wallpaper, it wasactually fabric.
That's right, it was fabric.
They'd found a sample of thiswallpaper or fabric already in
(31:01):
the property and they had a millcrew recreated.
They created a, designed aborder that would go with it as
well, or something, and it wasjust amazing.
It was just so, uh, was quitelavish.
It still felt relaxing, though.
It was still comfortable.
(31:22):
You felt like you could stillsit down, relax into it, have a
glass of wine or your coffee oryour tea, read your book.
I think that's the other thingwe should probably bring up.
Side note is nobody makes afeature of their TV in these
spaces.
It might exist, but you mightnot know where it is, or it's in
(31:42):
a separate room, which we'vetalked about before with Brim,
and I feel like let's hope thisis a trend where people start
making, like I guess, a TV roomand then they have their other
main spaces as more socialspaces or quiet spaces or spaces
to kind of come together andchat rather than come together
and stare at the wall.
Totally, except I do need my TVto watch Hacks.
(32:05):
Yes, when we've discussed Hacks, if nobody's watching it, go
watch it.
Yeah, and I do too, but Ihardly ever actually I'll, maybe
once a week with one of thekids, sit in the room and watch
the big TV, but I tend to watchit on little screens while I'm
doing other things.
But I do love the idea of yes,I'm not saying get rid of TVs,
even though I think there's lotsof places that we've come
(32:28):
across that go.
We don't really have one, Icouldn't live without it either
but I do like the idea of it notbeing the central focus of the
main living space.
I really like that idea.
It's so luxurious not to have atv or, as you say, not to make
it.
If there was a tv in thosespaces, it was either bought in
I have one, like on an easelthat I I pack away sometimes or
(32:52):
whatever.
But, um, but, yes, you can,it's hidden away, it's not the
focal point of the room.
So if you, if you've got ananish kapoor, you make that the
focal point, and so you should.
But there was also a library inthat home as well.
Yes, that was amazing and itwas like I think it was.
(33:12):
The shelves were a burgundycolor and yet the mirrored
ceiling.
So apparently there was adecorative ceiling underneath
that.
Uh, what we saw was like afalse ceiling.
Yeah, it was a decorativeceiling underneath that.
Uh, what we saw, it was like afalse ceiling.
Yeah, it was a false ceilingand I think they had to cover it
for some reason I can'tremember, but it just gave that
illusion of this incrediblenever-ending library and mirror.
(33:33):
Again, mirrored ceilings can bequestionable.
However, in that space, um, itworked.
It really worked.
That just just like extendingbooks and um and the other, and
there was a big kind of almostlike a big dining table in there
.
I guess that you know you couldput books on and and read and
research, like a little minilibrary, that where you could
(33:55):
actually like pull things offthe shelves and spread them out.
So seeing that reflected andthe walls extended with the
mirror just was like, yeah,magic.
I loved that space actuallyincredible, and the kitchen was
beautiful there and there was arooftop garden.
It was just such a treat.
Talk about that for a second.
So again, separate room it wasbigger than other kitchens we've
(34:19):
seen.
It was a a little bit more of alayout that we'd recognise in
Australia, with, you know, akind of U-shape, I guess, with a
bench that came across that Ithink maybe you could have even
sat at the bench, like and hadyour breakfast or whatever, but
it was sort of hidden.
So when you left that maincentral living space to walk out
(34:39):
to the rooftop terrace or thebathroom, there was an automatic
door so you tapped it with yourfoot and it would slide open.
It was big, big slide open, andthen there was the kitchen, and
then it would slide closedagain.
And not to mention a maid inthere as well, that's not the
right word.
Let's say a house manager.
(35:00):
Don't believe it, I'm not aufait with these kind of terms,
but basically there was a ladyin there.
They had somebody helping out,for sure, behind that door, but
that kitchen was.
I loved the idea of that.
I really loved the idea of thatbecause really, if they left
that really big sliding dooropen and we've talked about this
before about, um, you know,trying to move away a little bit
(35:21):
from open plan living and whymaybe we should move away from
it a little bit and havekitchens that can still connect,
and we've talked about slidingdoors it was kind of a perfect
example of that.
Even though it opened into kindof a thoroughfare, it wasn't
far from the living area, so ifsomeone was in the kitchen you
could probably speak to theperson in the living area with
(35:42):
that door open.
This was kind of a good exampleof how, or just leaving it open
because it wasn't a kitchen tohide either.
The kitchen wasn't amazing, itwas beautiful, just to kind of
like have people be able towander in there.
But also, if you don't want itto be seen or you want someone
working away and they're makingdinner while you're doing other
things, it could be closed offlike yeah, yeah, I think I will
(36:06):
close off my maid in the kitchen.
Stop it.
Sorry, I can't say that, but itfelt like we were in a movie.
That's what it felt like for me.
That that was like I was in amovie.
It was so beautiful, um, and Ithink you know we got to go
upstairs to a whole otherapartment too, remember oh, that
was divine which was smaller,much smaller.
(36:28):
That was a gem, because thatwasn't even released yet for the
fair and they let us go in, no,so that was Domore's
collaboration with the fabricbrand which you're going to
remember for me, japanese fabricbrand.
Yeah, it was called husu and itwas a japanese.
They make kimono, so they'vebeen making kimonos for hundreds
(36:48):
, hundreds of years, since 1650sor something like that.
So they um, dug up the archiveswith the team from the moray
studio and, um, they curatedthat collection and so
re-released that.
But the quality of thosefabrics.
I mean, when I walked in and Isaw a chair upholstered, I
(37:10):
couldn't believe how beautifulit was and that was just an
amazing experience as well.
And I'm forgetting the name ofthe artist whose apartment it
was, who does all the metal work.
Oh, yes, oh, she, she was.
Her pieces were divine so itwas her.
So she lived upstairs and haddone quite a bit of work with um
(37:31):
, with the girls, with thesisters, but we will find that
and put it there because I feelbad that I can't remember now.
Ozana visconti.
Thank you, I was just trying tofind it, ozana.
Yes, so um, it was space, itwas her apartment.
Usually, in fact, I think, aswe were leaving, was it her
husband coming home with thepastries?
He'd gone out to get the coffeeand pastries for there, because
(37:53):
this was on a Sunday, so wewere getting ahead of everything
on a Sunday before Design Weekreally gets going.
So, yeah, we were very, very,very fortunate to get a
completely um to the point wherewe took photos but were told
they were embargoed until afterthe press had seen it.
So we saw don't share them.
Yeah, those are the sort ofthings we do on our tour.
(38:13):
By the way, just just saying Imean, if you wanted to see the
demore, um, you know a big show,big event at milan design week,
you, you're up for at least athree-hour wait.
Forget about that.
We just walked straight intothis exhibition here, this
amazing apartment, and I thinkit was better.
Yeah, it was good Because wegot to really be immersed in the
(38:34):
space, whereas, I don't know, Ididn't see the Demore show this
year.
We'll discuss that because Idid and it was probably one of
my highlights.
But we'll discuss that becauseI did and it was probably one of
my highlights, but we'lldiscuss that in another.
Okay, I haven't talked about it.
Yeah, I haven't even asked youwhat you thought.
I mean, the isana's apartmentwas, um, incredible, but the
laura piana collab with demorewas was probably a pretty big
(38:55):
highlight for me in the end, andI yeah to the point where so I
am a bit of a demore fan, Ithink, because, since I've been
going to to Milan, it used to bethat you could kind of just
wander up and see through theirshowroom, and then it got to the
point where it was three hoursplus wait in lines, and I kind
of managed every year to getmyself in there without having
(39:15):
to do that not ignoting myself,I'm just a good talker, I'm just
a good talker.
And this year I was like, okay,great, I'm going to get myself.
And I actually tried twice andwouldn't get in, and then the
third time I managed to secure aspot, but anyway, I did get to
see it.
I did, and it was literally thelast day it was the Saturday
(39:36):
evening that I ended up seeingit, one of the last things, but
I was glad I did experience it.
But we'll talk about that onanother.
We'll talk about some of theexperiences in another episode.
Yeah, well, I think the greatthing um, maybe just to wrap
this up was that travel andbeing able to go into a person's
home it's just so rare, it is,and I think that you know
(39:56):
talking about, as you weresaying, you know the, the
kitchen and the festival and theliving, and this is the way it
was organized.
It's like, well, you don't getthat from photography and it
just opens up it.
Yeah, it opens up ideas of howcould we design a space.
Yes, we do open plan all daylong in australia, but there are
other ways of living and youdon't have to live like that.
(40:17):
You don't have to live likethat.
People open, plan like thereare other ways, yeah, and that
look, and this is honestly wheredesigners come into.
You know, if you're looking ata space and you want a different
approach, this is what we do.
Right, we've put it.
We open ourselves up to otherideas and this is why we travel
and this is why we have, youknow, these tours as well,
(40:39):
because we want other people tobe inspired and we want to take
people on that journey and seethings that maybe you wouldn't
experience here.
And it's a big deal.
As you said, we've had peoplesay a trip of a lifetime.
I think I agree, if you haven'tdone that before, you'll be
blown away, because we justcan't as much as you can open
(40:59):
yourself up to ideas here.
There'll always be limitationsand there'll always be
limitations to what you can seeonline and in photos and in
magazines.
Experiencing that firsthand,even for myself and yourself,
who you know, would like tothink that we're pretty well
versed at, you know, travel andgetting out there was amazing
and it was definitely somethingI will never forget Absolutely.
(41:24):
Have I talked it up enough?
Oh well, true.
You know, people that know mewill know I don't don't talk
rubbish and I'm pretty straighttalker and I'm very authentic
about the fact that I think itwas actually some of the best
experiences I've had, even justfor myself.
On on that tour, yeah, it wasamazing, wasn't it?
It was great, I know't it, itwas great.
I know that we sort of said, oh, it feels surreal now that
(41:45):
we're home, but I'm like, whenwe were there, it felt surreal.
When I was there, yeah, I justas I said, it was just
incredible.
I mean, yeah, it's just such arare experience.
I think the apartment tours werereally one of the highlights
amongst many, and who doesn'tlike just to full stop snoop
around someone's house?
It's so fun.
Isn't this why people go toopen houses all the time, just
(42:09):
like poke around?
Yeah, this was next level,though, so I guess we should
mention that we are going to dothe Milan Paris tour again in
2026.
Yes, but if you can't wait forthat, did we decide we're
opening that up in July, in afew weeks?
(42:30):
Yeah, I think July.
Yeah, I think that sounds good.
So keep an eye out for that andget on the wait list.
So I think and we'll startpushing this out on social so
you'll see it, but also it'll bein the show notes.
But do get on the wait listbecause we only take eight
people.
We will not be taking any morethan eight.
We want to keep it a prettyintimate experience and we know
that that's the maximum amountand it sold out very quickly in
(42:52):
a short time last year and nowthat we're talking about it more
, I feel like it will probablybe snapped up again quite
quickly.
So if you're on the waitlist,you'll hear about it first and
we'll definitely open it up tothe waitlist at least a couple
of days, or at least 24 hours,before we open it up to everyone
else.
So jump on that.
Oh, and before Paris and Milanright, just to throw another
(43:15):
thing in there, if Paris andMilan is at your thing, where
are we going, lauren?
We're going to London, earthing.
Where are we going, lauren?
We're going to london.
London's calling.
So before we started our trip,I went over to london and I did
some research.
It was all strictly work that Idid for you, for you, for you
(43:37):
listening.
Such a sacrifice.
It was really hard.
It was such hard work.
I had to find all these coolplaces and just check they were
cool.
Um, so we are going inseptember for london design
festival, so there's a whole lotof speakers that do discussions
and different events thathappen over that week.
(43:59):
So we want to take you guysover there because London is
like such an exciting city Idon't even need to tell you guys
about it because it's London.
Yes, it is.
I was in London last year beforeMilan and can confirm very cool
.
My first time I was there, tobe honest, and I wasn't sure
what to expect, but I loved it.
(44:21):
It has an amazing energy.
It really is also a bit of adesign mecca that maybe we
overlook a little bit.
I know a lot of designers kindof think about going to work
there when they are younger, asyou did, lauren.
I probably would have had.
I had the opportunity, but Ithink it's sort of maybe we
focus a lot on Milan and Londonhas some amazing makers,
(44:44):
designers.
We know there are beautifulspaces there, so we'll be
tracking those down and takingyou on tours of that.
We've already made some amazingconnections with people there
who are very excited for us tojoin them during the Design
Festival.
And yeah, that's DesignFestival, so it's going to have
a great vibe, anyway, right, sogreat, during the design
festival.
And, yeah, that's designfestival, so it's going to have
(45:04):
a great vibe anyway, right, sogreat.
Yeah, I went down the pimlicoroad and there are some gorgeous
designers that I'm sure you'llknow there's pinch, there's oka,
there's devil kitchens, there'sjust like heaps of beautiful
places, but also, you know, theydo fabric, they do color and
patterns, so well, yeah, so I'mso excited to kind of dive into
that kind of world yes, me too.
(45:25):
So good, and to take you guyson the wait list.
Come along.
Yes, again, same thing, we'rehoping.
Well, frankly, we've had thewait list open already and, um,
there's a really good number ofpeople on there.
So, uh, you know again,there'll only be eight spots.
So please jump on and prepareyourselves.
September isn't that far away.
(45:45):
So we'll be opening that upvery, very soon.
Yeah, so excited.
Oh, london, I love it.
I love it so much.
What's the weather going to belike in September?
Hopefully, some sunny days,maybe.
Who knows what the weather isgoing to be like there, but you
know, london is just such avibrant city that we are going
to have a good time.
Weather is going to be likethere, but you know, london is
just such a vibrant city that weare going to have a good time.
(46:05):
I'm going to guarantee thatright now.
All right, so I think we willwrap up.
Let you get back on with it.
Thanks again for listening.
It was great to talk with youagain and all the links are in
the podcast notes so you can goand do that whenever.
See ya.
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