Carlo Tomaino, the City Manager of Signal Hill, California, discusses the successful initiative to achieve zero functional homelessness in the city by coordinating internal efforts and partnering with service providers. Though we spoke with Carlo prior to the June 28, 2024 Supreme Court ruling on City of Grants Pass, Oregon v. Johnson, our conversation highlights how the City of Signal Hill’s compassionate approach is relevant regardless of any court ruling. We also discuss the previous court case of Martin v. Boise and its implications for cities.
Links and Contact Information
Learn more about the City of Signal Hill’s Homeless Services at https://www.cityofsignalhill.org/447/Homeless-Services
Carlo Tomaino: ctomaino@cityofsignalhill.org
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Kelly Hickler (00:12):
Hey, everyone.
Welcome to Fireside Chats,brought to you by Engaging
Cities.
I'm your host, Kelly Hickler,the Community Manager with
Engaging Cities, as well as thefounder of Synnovation Studio.
On each episode of our show, wetalk to the people behind the
plans and learn how communityengagement helped bolster that
(00:33):
planning effort.
But today we're talking aboutsomething a little bit
different.
We have Carlo Tomaino, the citymanager of Signal Hill,
California.
Hi, Carlo.
Carlo Tomaino (00:45):
Hi Kelly.
Nice to be here.
Kelly Hickler (00:47):
Yeah.
Thanks for being on our showtoday.
So we have a little bitdifferent of a focus today where
instead of talking Engagementwith residents and external
stakeholders.
We're going to talk a little bitmore so about internal
coordination that needs tohappen within a jurisdiction and
(01:09):
maybe with some of your partneragencies in order to have a
successful.
So, Carlos here to talk aboutthe wonderful achievement that
you have in the city of beingthe first city in LA County to
achieve zero functionalhomelessness.
(01:30):
What does that mean?
Exactly.
Carlo Tomaino (01:33):
So,, what that means is that our homeless
population here in Signal Hillis it doesn't mean we don't have
any homeless people ever becauseyou're always going to have a
population that's moving in oraround or through your
community, but it means that wehave a population that's
manageable for our ability toaccommodate them and provide
(01:53):
services and housing.
And so for us right now, itmeans that.
we have anywhere from, you know,five to maybe three or two
people.
And, at the moment I know thatwe don't have anyone in
immediate need of services andsignal help.
Kelly Hickler (02:09):
Wow.
That's really impressive.
What is the population of signallevel?
Carlo Tomaino (02:14):
So the resident population here is just under
12, 000.
It's about 11, 800 people.
Uh, we're a 2.
2 square mile city and we'realso unique in the sense that
we're one of two enclave citiesin the United States, meaning
that we're entirely surroundedby another city.
So most cities just border eachother, but we're entirely as a
(02:35):
city surrounded by the city ofLong Beach.
Kelly Hickler (02:39):
Oh, okay.
I don't think I knew that.
Ah, okay.
So every border that you have iswith Long Beach.
Carlo Tomaino (02:48):
Long Beach.
Yeah, we're entirely surroundedby the city of Long Beach.
So we share a lot of the samesuccesses and challenges.
And I feel a lot of people thatgo through our community or shop
here or drive through assumethat Signal Hill is part of the
city of Long Beach, but it'sactually its own jurisdiction.
We're actually celebrating our100th anniversary this year.
Kelly Hickler (03:08):
Oh, wow.
Cool.
Okay.
What?
So what are you doing for that?
What are the festivities?
Carlo Tomaino (03:13):
We have a number of events planned throughout the
year.
We had our big celebration justtoward the end of April because
that was the city's actualbirthday.
And so we had a full day ofcommunity events that were
really well attended andsuccessful throughout the day.
And it was capped off by a bigdrone show.
Which was our first ever droneshow in the city.
(03:33):
And that was really exciting.
And we have a lot of otherevents planned throughout the
year, all the way throughDecember.
Kelly Hickler (03:39):
Oh, cool.
Okay.
Drone show.
Is that like, um, where it lookslike fireworks or something in
the sky or like, uh,
Carlo Tomaino (03:47):
It does.
Yeah.
So basically they're drones,right.
And there were about 500 of themworking in concert to generate
different shapes and messages.
And it's all coordinated withmusic and graphics and lasers.
It's, it's really, it's reallyinteresting.
Kelly Hickler (04:03):
Okay, cool.
So before we get really into ourconversation I think it might be
good for our listeners to hearmaybe a little bit more about
you and what your background isand how long have you been the
city manager there?
Carlo Tomaino (04:19):
Yeah, so I have, you know, in total, I've got
about 17 years in localgovernment.
I worked for most of that time,about 13 years working for the
city of Lake Forest, which is inSouth Orange County.
And then after that, I went tothe city of La Mesa, which is
about 9 miles east of downtownSan Diego.
I worked in that city for about.
(04:41):
Two and a half years.
And one of the major focuses ofmy work, in addition to economic
development, was addressinghomelessness in La Mesa.
And I created the HomelessAction Plan the Home Team, which
is a homeless engagement, mobileengagement team that works to
address calls for service thatcome to the police department.
But instead of sending policeofficers in La Mesa, they now
(05:02):
send the Home Team to address toaddress those kinds of issues,
which was a huge relief.
Down in Mesa to the policedepartment, a huge help for
them.
And I brought those experienceshere in Signal Hill.
I've been the city manager inthe city ever since January of
last year.
So about a short time for now.
But I've really been focusing myefforts on quality of life,
(05:24):
addressing homelessness as Imentioned, and also economic
development and diversifying ourcity revenues.
So it's.
You know, I've had a lot of Ithink experience in a lot of
really good areas that have beenhelpful to the communities that
I've served.
Kelly Hickler (05:39):
Yeah, that's wonderful that you bring all
that experience with you.
So can you tell us a little bitmore about what maybe start from
the beginning of what was allinvolved with this effort?
Or what was the starting pointfor this?
Carlo Tomaino (05:59):
Well, for me, you know, the starting point really
was was understanding where thecommunity is and what the most
important issues are in talkingto our city council and
reviewing our biannual residentsurvey.
It was very apparent that thenumber one issue in Signal Hill
was addressing homelessness andfinding a way to to work within
(06:20):
the constraints of the Boise vMartin decision, which impacts
not just California, but.
Many other states in the Westand identifying a way for us to
better coordinate our servicesso that homelessness as an issue
here of concern doesn't becomegreater.
There was one park in particularcalled Reservoir Park that is in
(06:40):
the northerly portion of ourcity, abutting Long Beach, that
when I arrived.
Had about 10 to 12 people justliving full time at the park,
um, and living under the shadestructures.
And this was a park that wassurrounded by homes on three
sides.
So it was definitely intended tobe a community park.
(07:01):
Um, there was a lot of concernfrom the community.
To serve that neighborhood, buthad been over time, I think, you
know, taken over by folks thatdidn't have any other place to
go and found the park to be agood safe refuge for them where
they felt like they could, youknow, they could be safe.
They could sleep there.
But there were definitely, youknow a lot of concerns from that
neighborhood about the activityand the presence of people who
(07:23):
were unhoused.
And so I, you know, knew that Ineeded to make that an immediate
focus of my work here.
And what I started to do is torecognize maybe what some of the
deficiencies were.
In our service model.
So, for instance, the city ofSignal Hill doesn't have
dedicated staff to homelessness.
We have a homeless liaisonofficer who was a sworn police
(07:47):
officer is out in the communityworking to address homelessness,
but He's also got other dutiesas a police officer, right?
Primarily.
And then we have these, we havea contract through the Gateway
Cities cog here in this regionthat allows us to access service
providers like people assistingthe homeless and others that are
(08:10):
nonprofits that work in concertwith cities, but those are
provided through a more regionalpartnership.
But what I identified fairlyquickly was that those regional
partnerships were not beingcoordinated.
And so our city was not reallyreceiving what I thought was the
appropriate level of service,um, for our community and our
needs.
(08:30):
And within a month of me beinghere, I had a meeting with our
service providers to.
Introduce myself to them, butalso to emphasize how important
it is for me to addresshomelessness and to have a
services first model, uh, tohelp engage with people and get
them into the right housing forthem.
And so that became an immediatefocus.
(08:50):
And we started reorganizing ourcoordination with the service
providers, first and foremost.
And then the other thing that Inoted about our city is that our
departments, which is not unlikea lot of other cities, but we
were siloed, even though we're asmall city, public works was not
always talking to planning andnot always talking to parks, not
(09:11):
always talking to codeenforcement and other
departments about the thingsthat we needed to do together.
And one thing that really struckme was that.
The the homeless liaison officerwho was, effectively in charge
of coordinating our homelessoutreach efforts felt very, very
overwhelmed by the task andthought, you know, maybe there's
really not much I can do hereand felt like it was his
(09:34):
problem.
And maybe his problem only tosolve.
And what I did in the course ofa short time here is I
coordinated all our departmentsinto what we call the
neighborhood enhancement team.
So the net team includes myoffice, the city manager's
office, the city attorney'soffice, public works planning,
code enforcement, um, parks andother departments, police as
(09:56):
well, to, uh, to talk about,identify solutions to issues
that are quality of life based,that are code enforcement,
homelessness included, that wecould address together.
Because my philosophy in, inspeaking to the police
department about homelessnesswas, well, it isn't your
problem.
It's our problem.
It's everybody's problem.
(10:17):
So if we work together and starthaving regular meetings about
what the issues are and whatsolutions we might be able to
affect and how we can bettercoordinate and organize our
efforts, then it's a huge weightlifted off their shoulders, and
it's something that we can carrycollectively as a team much more
effectively because I can put alot of folks in the room that
(10:39):
have it.
Great individual expertise.
And we bring that together andit's a great problem solving
group.
Kelly Hickler (10:46):
Yeah, that is amazing.
I have so many thoughts asyou're talking about this.
So let me back up a little bit.
And you had mentioned a courtcase that can you say the name
of that again?
Carlo Tomaino (11:01):
So the court case is Boise v Martin.
Okay.
So this was, this was a courtcase that was adjudicated back
in 2018 where the, the districtcourt found that if a city does
not have sufficient beds toaccommodate its homeless
population and that there's noalternative sleeping location,
(11:22):
then simply criminalizing theissue is a violation of the
eighth amendment.
Kelly Hickler (11:27):
Oh, wow.
Okay.
Yeah.
Carlo Tomaino (11:28):
And, and that, that decision right now is
actually being, um, it's beingargued at, at the Supreme Court.
Um, we expect that there mightbe a change in that ruling
sometime in June or July, so inthe summer of this year, but as
it stands now, the Boise versusMartin decision is critically a
limiting factor to many citieswho are trying to address
(11:51):
homelessness, because somecities have taken the position
that if you don't havesufficient beds to accommodate
Thank you.
Um, and if you're trying toprotect every homeless person in
your community, then the onlyalternative is to let people be
where they are.
And that includes many parks,sidewalks, you know,
underpasses, you know, placeswhere you might expect to find
(12:11):
people who are unhoused.
But my, my philosophy about thatis that doing nothing and being
too permissive, um, with respectto homelessness is actually
inhumane.
Because what you're doing isyou're saying to folks, well, We
can't really help you or perhapsyou're not ready to be help.
(12:32):
So the only alternative is foryou to live outside and possibly
die on the streets.
And that's wrong.
Kelly Hickler (12:38):
Yeah, absolutely.
And this approach that you tookI like what you said about this
is not any 1 department'sproblem.
This is not your problem or myproblem.
This is our.
Problem for us to solvetogether.
That is so critical.
That's such a good approach andnecessary approach to achieving
(13:01):
things.
Do you anticipate or maybe youalready have taken that same
approach with any other topicswithin the city?
Carlo Tomaino (13:14):
And typically I do.
Um, my, my approach has alwaysbeen, you know, that old adage,
a problem shared is a problemhalved.
Right.
So I don't know that, you know,I, I don't have all the answers.
Uh, no individual in thisorganization and many others
have all the answers, buttogether we have most of the
(13:34):
answers I recognize.
And the reason that we have allof these very high qualified
people, Working in ourorganization is to bring those
ideas and perspectives together.
So our neighborhood enhancementteam, the net team does a really
good job of addressing the mostprescient community issues.
Like I said, involvinghomelessness, involving, um,
(13:56):
code enforcement and a lot ofother issues that that affects
cities and we deal with it as ateam.
And that works really, reallywell.
That that addresses probably themost.
70 percent of the issues that weexperience in our city, and then
the other related philosophy isthat I always encourage
departments to share informationto talk to each other outside of
(14:17):
the net team setting and createa culture where open
communication is expected.
Right.
Um, what I what I don't like tosee our departments thinking
that, you know, they can't tellme there's a problem.
You know, they can't share orthat, you know, another
department won't be working withthem in collaboration to address
an issue.
(14:38):
That's not what we do here.
So the other, you know, part ofthat is an everyday thing of
creating a culture in ourorganization where we're
expected to share informationand ask questions and, and
sometimes debate amongst eachother about what the past
possible outcome is.
So it's, it's always ongoing.
Kelly Hickler (14:58):
Yeah.
How often do, does the NET team,I guess that's redundant, NET
team.
No, that's okay.
Carlo Tomaino (15:09):
That's how we say it too.
Kelly Hickler (15:10):
Okay.
How often do they meet?
Carlo Tomaino (15:14):
We, we regularly meet every two weeks or every
month.
But we also just meet asnecessary in, in between.
So when there's an issue thatcomes up, um, we just, we get
together and we talk about itbefore, um, before it becomes a
bigger issue because that's whyother philosophy is let's, let's
treat issues when they'remanageable so that they don't
(15:36):
become unmanageable and thatmight be anything from a
neighborhood code enforcementYou know, code enforcement case
involving hoarding.
It could be homelessness.
It could be unpermitted sidewalkvending in our city.
There was an interesting casethat we dealt with as the NET
team where there was aneighborhood peacock that had
been allowed to roam in theneighborhood for a couple of
(15:59):
years.
No one knew how the peacock evergot there, but we were getting
complaints from residents aboutone house that was Feeding and
caring for the peacock andallowing it to roam in the
middle of the night and wakeeverybody up.
And that was a careful balanceof, you know, we don't want to
upset this, this neighborhood,which seems to appreciate the
(16:19):
peacock.
The peacock even had its ownsocial media page.
Kelly Hickler (16:23):
No,
Carlo Tomaino (16:24):
yeah, yeah.
But at the same time,
Kelly Hickler (16:27):
can you share, can you share that name of its
page with us?
I
Carlo Tomaino (16:34):
don't think I have it off the top of my head,
but if you search Cigna HillPeacock, I'm sure I'm sure
you'll find it.
And it was really popular withpeople online and with some
people in the neighborhood.
But we also needed to respectthe fact that, you know, this is
a wild animal.
It can't be out there.
It could cause injury to othersitself.
It was making a lot of noise inthe middle of the night.
(16:55):
But the, you know, the residentswere also reticent to approach
the homeowner and say, Hey, wewant you to stop doing what
you're doing.
So we facilitated.
A solution and we involved, uh,we involved a group that that
actually has a, has a ranchwhere they take care of the
animals and peacocksspecifically.
And so, you know, that wassomething where code enforcement
(17:18):
said, well, I don't know what todo with this.
Kelly Hickler (17:19):
Yeah,
Carlo Tomaino (17:20):
I mean, There's there's many ways.
I guess you could address it,but it was an example of what we
have the city attorney.
There's a city attorney can giveus their perspective.
We have public works.
We have other departments and wecan come up with solutions
together to, you know, whatcould be a tricky issue.
Right.
And one that sensitive with theneighborhood
Kelly Hickler (17:40):
and
Carlo Tomaino (17:41):
that ended up being a good resolution.
Kelly Hickler (17:43):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I love, I love that.
Cause then again, okay.
It's not code enforcement.
It's not all on code enforcementto figure this out.
They can bring that to the, tothe team and you can figure it
out together.
Carlo Tomaino (17:57):
Yes.
Yeah.
And sometimes, you know, thebest solutions, they come from
unexpected places.
So I said, you know, we, weinvolve all of our departments
and, and sometimes it's parksand recreation that has the best
solution to something that wasactually a code enforcement
issue, right?
Because you're coming in from itfrom a very, very different
perspective.
So it's almost like you'recrowdsourcing a solution, right?
(18:20):
At the city level.
Kelly Hickler (18:22):
That's a great way to think about it.
And I'm not surprised that theparks and rec folks have the
most creative solutions.
Those are usually a fun bunch ofpeople.
Carlo Tomaino (18:33):
They are, but what's interesting is they also
don't get enough credit forbeing creative and smart and
just well rounded, right?
I think a lot of folks assume,well, they'll, they're putting
on the great community eventsand those kinds of things that
are visible and fun foreverybody, but, but they do a
lot of work in the backgroundwhere, you know, they are every
(18:55):
day working with, with people.
Populations, you know, littlekids, infants, right, senior,
right, folks with special needs.
And that's a really tough job.
And I give them a lot of creditfor being able to work
effectively with all thosedifferent groups, which is why
I'm not entirely surprised theywould sometimes come up with the
best solutions to these issues.
Kelly Hickler (19:16):
That's a really good point.
So, going back to the ZeroFunctional Homelessness
Initiative other than formingthe NET team and having success
with that approach, is thereanything else that you think
really stands out that wentreally well with how you
approached this?
Carlo Tomaino (19:39):
Well, I would say that the other thing that went
really well is, you know, with,with the net team, you know, we
don't just talk about well,homelessness is an issue.
And where is it an issue?
And what are we doing?
But we, we have our, ourhomeless, um, uh, liaison
coordinator who's funded throughthe county program attend each
of those meetings.
And we, we go over individualcases.
(20:01):
Individual people.
And as a team, we talk about,you know, let's say Mark and
Mark's been chronically homelessfor 10 years.
He's been around in the area.
We know where he is on a regularbasis.
And we talk about creating aspecific service model and
program that works for Mark,because maybe the issue with
(20:21):
Mark is, well, he doesn't wantto accept services at a shelter
because he's got a pet.
Right.
Or he's got another issue, anobstacle that that precludes him
from immediately acceptingservices.
So that's something that wereally talk about in detail at
the net meetings are individualpeople.
And how they're doing and whatthey're focused on and how we
(20:42):
can create an outreach modelthat respects their wishes, but
then ultimately gets themhoused.
Right.
And so that, that takes a lot oftime and additional effort, but
it's important to do andunderstand.
And, and as I said, you know,the other, I think really
successful thing is that we wereable to get as a result of those
conversations in the net team,Our regional, uh, homeless
(21:05):
outreach and service providerssaying, okay, well, then we need
to find a specific type ofhousing for Mark that allows for
him to bring his dog, et cetera,et cetera.
So we we've been doing a reallygood job of reducing our
homeless population just bydoing that.
Just through that effort.
Um, but then what would alsohappen that was very fortunate
for us is that the countyintroduced a new program called
(21:28):
Pathway Home, and it's similarto to a program that the state
started where they werepurchasing motels and hotels and
renovating them.
But it's county run and and it'sa it's a wraparound services
program where the county Umrents rooms from from certain
motels and they provide all thewraparound services and that
(21:48):
ended up being a very lowbarrier Um housing solution that
was well tailored to ourhomeless population But even in
advance of that i'm really proudof the fact that Because we had
done so much outreach and gottento know all of our homeless
residents so well, we were ableto get them, when that program
became available to us, get themdocument ready within a matter
(22:11):
of weeks to be eligible for theprogram, because we had such a
deep understanding of what theirindividual needs were.
And where they were in, in termsof receiving services that we
were able to get them ready forhousing very, very quickly.
And, and again, the solutionprovided by the County through
Pathway Home was great becauseit, it applied to, you know,
(22:34):
basically 95 percent of ourservice population in Signal
Hill.
So it was a program that, thathad more flexible, um,
requirements and regulationsthat accommodated their needs.
They could accommodate folksthat were couples.
They could accommodate folkswith with pets.
They could accommodateindividuals with special needs.
So that was another keycomponent is that we were able
(22:56):
to connect with this countyprogram that allowed us to, to,
to more, uh, to, to, toaccelerate the help that we were
already providing to people insignal health.
Kelly Hickler (23:06):
Wow.
That is so cool to hear about.
Um, was there anything.
That didn't quite go as you hadhoped or any unexpected issues
that came up or anything thatyou might do differently.
Carlo Tomaino (23:22):
I would say the approach we took is still the
approach I would I would take.
But what what happened,especially initially is in
working in Reservoir Park, whereI mentioned there were 10 to 12
people permanently living at thepark, you know, we had, I think
this this expectation that, youknow, once we had coordinated
our services that people wouldimmediately be open to housing
(23:43):
of some kind, whether it wastransitional or Or it was a
shelter or it was morepermanent.
Um, but what we learned is everycase is different.
And there were people who werewilling to accept services.
And then there were people fordifferent reasons that were not
ready to transition intohousing.
And so we had to keep adjustingour approach at Reservoir Park
(24:03):
specifically.
Um, and that took time.
That took a lot more time than Ithought would initially.
And the other thing that washappening is we were getting
complaints from theneighborhood, um, you know,
practically every day.
About the condition at the park.
And so that was frustrating forthem as it was for us because we
wanted to try to address thisissue more quickly.
(24:24):
But what we learned through theprocess is that not everyone's
in the same spot.
Not everyone's in the same placeand not everyone's ready to
accept services.
And sometimes you need to changethe physical conditions at the
park to encourage people toaccept housing.
And what I mean by that Is thatthere was a park shelter that
was being used, you know, ashousing, right?
(24:46):
That's not what that wasintended for.
That was intended for, uh, forthe residents and others to, to
rent and use for their, theirbirthday parties, their
celebrations, their gatherings.
And so we restricted the use ofthat park shelter to make it a
little bit more difficult to beout there at the park so that it
wasn't, you know, animmediately, you know, inviting
(25:09):
condition.
Right.
So it's a little bit of toughlove to say, look.
We want you to be housed.
That is our first and foremostpriority is that you be housed
and you have services at thesame time.
I cannot create a condition at apark where we make it too easy
to live out here, right?
So it's a little bit of frictionthat you need to create,
(25:31):
hopefully to push people, youknow, in a gentle way to the
outcome of saying, well, maybe Iam better off being housed.
Because if you, if you make itexceedingly easy to be unhoused
and you provide, uh, you know,an unintended shelter condition,
that's what's intended to be apublic park.
Yeah, I mean, you're going tohave more prolonged
(25:51):
homelessness, so we had toadjust our approaches to make
sure that that wasn't asinviting a condition as it was
when I first got here.
And then hopefully, and theydid, and people saw the benefit
of, yeah, maybe I do want to beindoors.
Kelly Hickler (26:06):
I see.
Can you share I don't know,maybe you already said the
numbers, the number of.
Of individuals that you are ableto get into housing.
Carlo Tomaino (26:18):
Absolutely.
So, so overall, including our,our nighttime population, which
is not something that citiesalways account for when I think
about homelessness, I would saythat we had, I would say we at
our height, we probably have 55to 60 people.
In this community, right?
Um, through through the net teamin about eight or nine months,
(26:39):
we were able to house 10 peopleon a permanent basis.
So we had reduced our populationto about 45 people.
And then through the pathwayhome program, we were able to
house the remaining 45 people.
Kelly Hickler (26:52):
So
Carlo Tomaino (26:54):
the day that we house the remaining 45 people
through the pathway homeprogram, we officially had zero
homeless residents in ourcommunity.
Kelly Hickler (27:02):
Yeah.
Oh, that's amazing.
Are there takeaways or words ofadvice or, you know, nuggets of
wisdom that you can share withother communities that they
might be able to implement?
And I'm just thinking.
And you've probably heard this,I'm guessing, maybe you face
some criticism of, well, yeahyou can do that there in your
(27:25):
city because you have a smallpopulation and you have a
smaller homeless population, howcould we possibly do that in our
city, but what is your responseto that?
What would you say to anothercity who, Is struggling with
some of the same issues, nomatter what size they are.
Carlo Tomaino (27:46):
Well, I would say that, you know, for cities,
especially our neighbor, right,and other cities in the region
that have significantly largerhomeless populations, I would
say, yeah, you're probablyright.
You may not be able to get tozero functional homelessness
because the issue is much largerbecause the resources are
limited for all the reasons thatyou already know.
(28:07):
So you might be entirely correctabout that, but you've got to be
persistent and you can't giveup.
So, I mean, even though ourpopulation was relatively
smaller than our neighbors, It'sa larger population for a city
our size, um, but perseveranceis really key, right?
So, so once you've organizedyour resources and you share the
problem among a larger group ofpeople and not just siloed
(28:31):
homelessness to one or twopeople and say, Hey, you guys
figure it out.
You made it everybody's problemto help solve.
You've made it a priority as aleader of the organization for
everybody.
Once you've done that, You'vegot to be persistent.
It's like anything else we do inlocal government.
We do not have, in mostinstances, the ultimate panacea,
(28:51):
the solution to this issue.
It is exceedingly rare to beable to have a concrete and
absolute resolution to an issue,because we deal with.
Mostly outside of, you know,regular duties, maintenance,
infrastructure, et cetera.
We deal with, uh, unsolvablesocietal issues at the ground
(29:11):
level.
And that's okay.
Sometimes all you can do is chipaway at something, right?
And you don't lose hope and youcontinue to persevere because at
the end of the day, that's whatthe residents Expect you to do
the residents won't have asolution to this issue.
They don't have the resources,but they pay taxes and they
expect and rely on the localleaders to help either resolve
(29:36):
or at least mitigate the issueright to the best of their
ability.
So we have, I think, uh, aprofessional and moral and
ethical obligation to chip awayat this issue in whatever way is
best for our own communities.
Kelly Hickler (29:50):
Well, that's so well said and this made me think
of more existential typequestions about the function of
local government, but that's adifferent episode, maybe
different podcasts.
So, Carla, what what is a goodway for people to either get in
(30:11):
touch with you or someone elseat the city if they wanted to
get more information or followup with further questions?
Carlo Tomaino (30:19):
Oh, sure.
My contact information is listedon the city website.
So we're city of signal hill dotorg.
And then I'll give you my email.
Uh, my email is C.
T.
O.
M.
as a Michael.
A.
I.
N.
O.
at city of signal hill dot org.
And I'm more than happy to chatwith anyone about this issue or.
(30:39):
Just give you my two cents onwhat you might be able to do to
better coordinate efforts inyour own city.
Kelly Hickler (30:45):
Yeah, thank you.
Thank you so much for taking thetime to talk to us today.
It was very insightful.
And it, like I said, it broughtup more questions for me, maybe
more interesting topics to, totackle on a future episode.
But thanks again for talkingwith us.
(31:06):
And thank you to all ourlisteners for tuning in.
Remember to head on over toengaging cities.
org where you can findadditional episodes and other
helpful resources related tocommunity engagement.
We'll see you guys next time.
Bye.
AT& T jingle
Hey, everyone.
Welcome to Fireside Chats,brought to you by Engaging
Cities.
I'm your host, Kelly Hickler,the Community Manager with
Engaging Cities, as well as thefounder of Synnovation Studio.
On each episode of our show, wetalk to the people behind the
plans and learn how communityengagement helped bolster that
(00:33):
planning effort.
But today we're talking aboutsomething a little bit
different.
We have Carlo Tomaino, the citymanager of Signal Hill,
California.
Hi, Carlo.
Carlo Tomaino (00:45):
Hi Kelly.
Nice to be here.
Kelly Hickler (00:47):
Yeah.
Thanks for being on our showtoday.
So we have a little bitdifferent of a focus today where
instead of talking Engagementwith residents and external
stakeholders.
We're going to talk a little bitmore so about internal
coordination that needs tohappen within a jurisdiction and
(01:09):
maybe with some of your partneragencies in order to have a
successful.
So, Carlos here to talk aboutthe wonderful achievement that
you have in the city of beingthe first city in LA County to
achieve zero functionalhomelessness.
(01:30):
What does that mean?
Exactly.
Carlo Tomaino (01:33):
So,, what that means is that our homeless
population here in Signal Hillis it doesn't mean we don't have
any homeless people ever becauseyou're always going to have a
population that's moving in oraround or through your
community, but it means that wehave a population that's
manageable for our ability toaccommodate them and provide
(01:53):
services and housing.
And so for us right now, itmeans that.
we have anywhere from, you know,five to maybe three or two
people.
And, at the moment I know thatwe don't have anyone in
immediate need of services andsignal help.
Kelly Hickler (02:09):
Wow.
That's really impressive.
What is the population of signallevel?
Carlo Tomaino (02:14):
So the resident population here is just under
12, 000.
It's about 11, 800 people.
Uh, we're a 2.
2 square mile city and we'realso unique in the sense that
we're one of two enclave citiesin the United States, meaning
that we're entirely surroundedby another city.
So most cities just border eachother, but we're entirely as a
(02:35):
city surrounded by the city ofLong Beach.
Kelly Hickler (02:39):
Oh, okay.
I don't think I knew that.
Ah, okay.
So every border that you have iswith Long Beach.
Carlo Tomaino (02:48):
Long Beach.
Yeah, we're entirely surroundedby the city of Long Beach.
So we share a lot of the samesuccesses and challenges.
And I feel a lot of people thatgo through our community or shop
here or drive through assumethat Signal Hill is part of the
city of Long Beach, but it'sactually its own jurisdiction.
We're actually celebrating our100th anniversary this year.
Kelly Hickler (03:08):
Oh, wow.
Cool.
Okay.
What?
So what are you doing for that?
What are the festivities?
Carlo Tomaino (03:13):
We have a number of events planned throughout the
year.
We had our big celebration justtoward the end of April because
that was the city's actualbirthday.
And so we had a full day ofcommunity events that were
really well attended andsuccessful throughout the day.
And it was capped off by a bigdrone show.
Which was our first ever droneshow in the city.
(03:33):
And that was really exciting.
And we have a lot of otherevents planned throughout the
year, all the way throughDecember.
Kelly Hickler (03:39):
Oh, cool.
Okay.
Drone show.
Is that like, um, where it lookslike fireworks or something in
the sky or like, uh,
Carlo Tomaino (03:47):
It does.
Yeah.
So basically they're drones,right.
And there were about 500 of themworking in concert to generate
different shapes and messages.
And it's all coordinated withmusic and graphics and lasers.
It's, it's really, it's reallyinteresting.
Kelly Hickler (04:03):
Okay, cool.
So before we get really into ourconversation I think it might be
good for our listeners to hearmaybe a little bit more about
you and what your background isand how long have you been the
city manager there?
Carlo Tomaino (04:19):
Yeah, so I have, you know, in total, I've got
about 17 years in localgovernment.
I worked for most of that time,about 13 years working for the
city of Lake Forest, which is inSouth Orange County.
And then after that, I went tothe city of La Mesa, which is
about 9 miles east of downtownSan Diego.
I worked in that city for about.
(04:41):
Two and a half years.
And one of the major focuses ofmy work, in addition to economic
development, was addressinghomelessness in La Mesa.
And I created the HomelessAction Plan the Home Team, which
is a homeless engagement, mobileengagement team that works to
address calls for service thatcome to the police department.
But instead of sending policeofficers in La Mesa, they now
(05:02):
send the Home Team to address toaddress those kinds of issues,
which was a huge relief.
Down in Mesa to the policedepartment, a huge help for
them.
And I brought those experienceshere in Signal Hill.
I've been the city manager inthe city ever since January of
last year.
So about a short time for now.
But I've really been focusing myefforts on quality of life,
(05:24):
addressing homelessness as Imentioned, and also economic
development and diversifying ourcity revenues.
So it's.
You know, I've had a lot of Ithink experience in a lot of
really good areas that have beenhelpful to the communities that
I've served.
Kelly Hickler (05:39):
Yeah, that's wonderful that you bring all
that experience with you.
So can you tell us a little bitmore about what maybe start from
the beginning of what was allinvolved with this effort?
Or what was the starting pointfor this?
Carlo Tomaino (05:59):
Well, for me, you know, the starting point really
was was understanding where thecommunity is and what the most
important issues are in talkingto our city council and
reviewing our biannual residentsurvey.
It was very apparent that thenumber one issue in Signal Hill
was addressing homelessness andfinding a way to to work within
(06:20):
the constraints of the Boise vMartin decision, which impacts
not just California, but.
Many other states in the Westand identifying a way for us to
better coordinate our servicesso that homelessness as an issue
here of concern doesn't becomegreater.
There was one park in particularcalled Reservoir Park that is in
(06:40):
the northerly portion of ourcity, abutting Long Beach, that
when I arrived.
Had about 10 to 12 people justliving full time at the park,
um, and living under the shadestructures.
And this was a park that wassurrounded by homes on three
sides.
So it was definitely intended tobe a community park.
(07:01):
Um, there was a lot of concernfrom the community.
To serve that neighborhood, buthad been over time, I think, you
know, taken over by folks thatdidn't have any other place to
go and found the park to be agood safe refuge for them where
they felt like they could, youknow, they could be safe.
They could sleep there.
But there were definitely, youknow a lot of concerns from that
neighborhood about the activityand the presence of people who
(07:23):
were unhoused.
And so I, you know, knew that Ineeded to make that an immediate
focus of my work here.
And what I started to do is torecognize maybe what some of the
deficiencies were.
In our service model.
So, for instance, the city ofSignal Hill doesn't have
dedicated staff to homelessness.
We have a homeless liaisonofficer who was a sworn police
(07:47):
officer is out in the communityworking to address homelessness,
but He's also got other dutiesas a police officer, right?
Primarily.
And then we have these, we havea contract through the Gateway
Cities cog here in this regionthat allows us to access service
providers like people assistingthe homeless and others that are
(08:10):
nonprofits that work in concertwith cities, but those are
provided through a more regionalpartnership.
But what I identified fairlyquickly was that those regional
partnerships were not beingcoordinated.
And so our city was not reallyreceiving what I thought was the
appropriate level of service,um, for our community and our
needs.
(08:30):
And within a month of me beinghere, I had a meeting with our
service providers to.
Introduce myself to them, butalso to emphasize how important
it is for me to addresshomelessness and to have a
services first model, uh, tohelp engage with people and get
them into the right housing forthem.
And so that became an immediatefocus.
(08:50):
And we started reorganizing ourcoordination with the service
providers, first and foremost.
And then the other thing that Inoted about our city is that our
departments, which is not unlikea lot of other cities, but we
were siloed, even though we're asmall city, public works was not
always talking to planning andnot always talking to parks, not
(09:11):
always talking to codeenforcement and other
departments about the thingsthat we needed to do together.
And one thing that really struckme was that.
The the homeless liaison officerwho was, effectively in charge
of coordinating our homelessoutreach efforts felt very, very
overwhelmed by the task andthought, you know, maybe there's
really not much I can do hereand felt like it was his
(09:34):
problem.
And maybe his problem only tosolve.
And what I did in the course ofa short time here is I
coordinated all our departmentsinto what we call the
neighborhood enhancement team.
So the net team includes myoffice, the city manager's
office, the city attorney'soffice, public works planning,
code enforcement, um, parks andother departments, police as
(09:56):
well, to, uh, to talk about,identify solutions to issues
that are quality of life based,that are code enforcement,
homelessness included, that wecould address together.
Because my philosophy in, inspeaking to the police
department about homelessnesswas, well, it isn't your
problem.
It's our problem.
It's everybody's problem.
(10:17):
So if we work together and starthaving regular meetings about
what the issues are and whatsolutions we might be able to
affect and how we can bettercoordinate and organize our
efforts, then it's a huge weightlifted off their shoulders, and
it's something that we can carrycollectively as a team much more
effectively because I can put alot of folks in the room that
(10:39):
have it.
Great individual expertise.
And we bring that together andit's a great problem solving
group.
Kelly Hickler (10:46):
Yeah, that is amazing.
I have so many thoughts asyou're talking about this.
So let me back up a little bit.
And you had mentioned a courtcase that can you say the name
of that again?
Carlo Tomaino (11:01):
So the court case is Boise v Martin.
Okay.
So this was, this was a courtcase that was adjudicated back
in 2018 where the, the districtcourt found that if a city does
not have sufficient beds toaccommodate its homeless
population and that there's noalternative sleeping location,
(11:22):
then simply criminalizing theissue is a violation of the
eighth amendment.
Kelly Hickler (11:27):
Oh, wow.
Okay.
Yeah.
Carlo Tomaino (11:28):
And, and that, that decision right now is
actually being, um, it's beingargued at, at the Supreme Court.
Um, we expect that there mightbe a change in that ruling
sometime in June or July, so inthe summer of this year, but as
it stands now, the Boise versusMartin decision is critically a
limiting factor to many citieswho are trying to address
(11:51):
homelessness, because somecities have taken the position
that if you don't havesufficient beds to accommodate
Thank you.
Um, and if you're trying toprotect every homeless person in
your community, then the onlyalternative is to let people be
where they are.
And that includes many parks,sidewalks, you know,
underpasses, you know, placeswhere you might expect to find
(12:11):
people who are unhoused.
But my, my philosophy about thatis that doing nothing and being
too permissive, um, with respectto homelessness is actually
inhumane.
Because what you're doing isyou're saying to folks, well, We
can't really help you or perhapsyou're not ready to be help.
(12:32):
So the only alternative is foryou to live outside and possibly
die on the streets.
And that's wrong.
Kelly Hickler (12:38):
Yeah, absolutely.
And this approach that you tookI like what you said about this
is not any 1 department'sproblem.
This is not your problem or myproblem.
This is our.
Problem for us to solvetogether.
That is so critical.
That's such a good approach andnecessary approach to achieving
(13:01):
things.
Do you anticipate or maybe youalready have taken that same
approach with any other topicswithin the city?
Carlo Tomaino (13:14):
And typically I do.
Um, my, my approach has alwaysbeen, you know, that old adage,
a problem shared is a problemhalved.
Right.
So I don't know that, you know,I, I don't have all the answers.
Uh, no individual in thisorganization and many others
have all the answers, buttogether we have most of the
(13:34):
answers I recognize.
And the reason that we have allof these very high qualified
people, Working in ourorganization is to bring those
ideas and perspectives together.
So our neighborhood enhancementteam, the net team does a really
good job of addressing the mostprescient community issues.
Like I said, involvinghomelessness, involving, um,
(13:56):
code enforcement and a lot ofother issues that that affects
cities and we deal with it as ateam.
And that works really, reallywell.
That that addresses probably themost.
70 percent of the issues that weexperience in our city, and then
the other related philosophy isthat I always encourage
departments to share informationto talk to each other outside of
(14:17):
the net team setting and createa culture where open
communication is expected.
Right.
Um, what I what I don't like tosee our departments thinking
that, you know, they can't tellme there's a problem.
You know, they can't share orthat, you know, another
department won't be working withthem in collaboration to address
an issue.
(14:38):
That's not what we do here.
So the other, you know, part ofthat is an everyday thing of
creating a culture in ourorganization where we're
expected to share informationand ask questions and, and
sometimes debate amongst eachother about what the past
possible outcome is.
So it's, it's always ongoing.
Kelly Hickler (14:58):
Yeah.
How often do, does the NET team,I guess that's redundant, NET
team.
No, that's okay.
Carlo Tomaino (15:09):
That's how we say it too.
Kelly Hickler (15:10):
Okay.
How often do they meet?
Carlo Tomaino (15:14):
We, we regularly meet every two weeks or every
month.
But we also just meet asnecessary in, in between.
So when there's an issue thatcomes up, um, we just, we get
together and we talk about itbefore, um, before it becomes a
bigger issue because that's whyother philosophy is let's, let's
treat issues when they'remanageable so that they don't
(15:36):
become unmanageable and thatmight be anything from a
neighborhood code enforcementYou know, code enforcement case
involving hoarding.
It could be homelessness.
It could be unpermitted sidewalkvending in our city.
There was an interesting casethat we dealt with as the NET
team where there was aneighborhood peacock that had
been allowed to roam in theneighborhood for a couple of
(15:59):
years.
No one knew how the peacock evergot there, but we were getting
complaints from residents aboutone house that was Feeding and
caring for the peacock andallowing it to roam in the
middle of the night and wakeeverybody up.
And that was a careful balanceof, you know, we don't want to
upset this, this neighborhood,which seems to appreciate the
(16:19):
peacock.
The peacock even had its ownsocial media page.
Kelly Hickler (16:23):
No,
Carlo Tomaino (16:24):
yeah, yeah.
But at the same time,
Kelly Hickler (16:27):
can you share, can you share that name of its
page with us?
I
Carlo Tomaino (16:34):
don't think I have it off the top of my head,
but if you search Cigna HillPeacock, I'm sure I'm sure
you'll find it.
And it was really popular withpeople online and with some
people in the neighborhood.
But we also needed to respectthe fact that, you know, this is
a wild animal.
It can't be out there.
It could cause injury to othersitself.
It was making a lot of noise inthe middle of the night.
(16:55):
But the, you know, the residentswere also reticent to approach
the homeowner and say, Hey, wewant you to stop doing what
you're doing.
So we facilitated.
A solution and we involved, uh,we involved a group that that
actually has a, has a ranchwhere they take care of the
animals and peacocksspecifically.
And so, you know, that wassomething where code enforcement
(17:18):
said, well, I don't know what todo with this.
Kelly Hickler (17:19):
Yeah,
Carlo Tomaino (17:20):
I mean, There's there's many ways.
I guess you could address it,but it was an example of what we
have the city attorney.
There's a city attorney can giveus their perspective.
We have public works.
We have other departments and wecan come up with solutions
together to, you know, whatcould be a tricky issue.
Right.
And one that sensitive with theneighborhood
Kelly Hickler (17:40):
and
Carlo Tomaino (17:41):
that ended up being a good resolution.
Kelly Hickler (17:43):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I love, I love that.
Cause then again, okay.
It's not code enforcement.
It's not all on code enforcementto figure this out.
They can bring that to the, tothe team and you can figure it
out together.
Carlo Tomaino (17:57):
Yes.
Yeah.
And sometimes, you know, thebest solutions, they come from
unexpected places.
So I said, you know, we, weinvolve all of our departments
and, and sometimes it's parksand recreation that has the best
solution to something that wasactually a code enforcement
issue, right?
Because you're coming in from itfrom a very, very different
perspective.
So it's almost like you'recrowdsourcing a solution, right?
(18:20):
At the city level.
Kelly Hickler (18:22):
That's a great way to think about it.
And I'm not surprised that theparks and rec folks have the
most creative solutions.
Those are usually a fun bunch ofpeople.
Carlo Tomaino (18:33):
They are, but what's interesting is they also
don't get enough credit forbeing creative and smart and
just well rounded, right?
I think a lot of folks assume,well, they'll, they're putting
on the great community eventsand those kinds of things that
are visible and fun foreverybody, but, but they do a
lot of work in the backgroundwhere, you know, they are every
(18:55):
day working with, with people.
Populations, you know, littlekids, infants, right, senior,
right, folks with special needs.
And that's a really tough job.
And I give them a lot of creditfor being able to work
effectively with all thosedifferent groups, which is why
I'm not entirely surprised theywould sometimes come up with the
best solutions to these issues.
Kelly Hickler (19:16):
That's a really good point.
So, going back to the ZeroFunctional Homelessness
Initiative other than formingthe NET team and having success
with that approach, is thereanything else that you think
really stands out that wentreally well with how you
approached this?
Carlo Tomaino (19:39):
Well, I would say that the other thing that went
really well is, you know, with,with the net team, you know, we
don't just talk about well,homelessness is an issue.
And where is it an issue?
And what are we doing?
But we, we have our, ourhomeless, um, uh, liaison
coordinator who's funded throughthe county program attend each
of those meetings.
And we, we go over individualcases.
(20:01):
Individual people.
And as a team, we talk about,you know, let's say Mark and
Mark's been chronically homelessfor 10 years.
He's been around in the area.
We know where he is on a regularbasis.
And we talk about creating aspecific service model and
program that works for Mark,because maybe the issue with
(20:21):
Mark is, well, he doesn't wantto accept services at a shelter
because he's got a pet.
Right.
Or he's got another issue, anobstacle that that precludes him
from immediately acceptingservices.
So that's something that wereally talk about in detail at
the net meetings are individualpeople.
And how they're doing and whatthey're focused on and how we
(20:42):
can create an outreach modelthat respects their wishes, but
then ultimately gets themhoused.
Right.
And so that, that takes a lot oftime and additional effort, but
it's important to do andunderstand.
And, and as I said, you know,the other, I think really
successful thing is that we wereable to get as a result of those
conversations in the net team,Our regional, uh, homeless
(21:05):
outreach and service providerssaying, okay, well, then we need
to find a specific type ofhousing for Mark that allows for
him to bring his dog, et cetera,et cetera.
So we we've been doing a reallygood job of reducing our
homeless population just bydoing that.
Just through that effort.
Um, but then what would alsohappen that was very fortunate
for us is that the countyintroduced a new program called
(21:28):
Pathway Home, and it's similarto to a program that the state
started where they werepurchasing motels and hotels and
renovating them.
But it's county run and and it'sa it's a wraparound services
program where the county Umrents rooms from from certain
motels and they provide all thewraparound services and that
(21:48):
ended up being a very lowbarrier Um housing solution that
was well tailored to ourhomeless population But even in
advance of that i'm really proudof the fact that Because we had
done so much outreach and gottento know all of our homeless
residents so well, we were ableto get them, when that program
became available to us, get themdocument ready within a matter
(22:11):
of weeks to be eligible for theprogram, because we had such a
deep understanding of what theirindividual needs were.
And where they were in, in termsof receiving services that we
were able to get them ready forhousing very, very quickly.
And, and again, the solutionprovided by the County through
Pathway Home was great becauseit, it applied to, you know,
(22:34):
basically 95 percent of ourservice population in Signal
Hill.
So it was a program that, thathad more flexible, um,
requirements and regulationsthat accommodated their needs.
They could accommodate folksthat were couples.
They could accommodate folkswith with pets.
They could accommodateindividuals with special needs.
So that was another keycomponent is that we were able
(22:56):
to connect with this countyprogram that allowed us to, to,
to more, uh, to, to, toaccelerate the help that we were
already providing to people insignal health.
Kelly Hickler (23:06):
Wow.
That is so cool to hear about.
Um, was there anything.
That didn't quite go as you hadhoped or any unexpected issues
that came up or anything thatyou might do differently.
Carlo Tomaino (23:22):
I would say the approach we took is still the
approach I would I would take.
But what what happened,especially initially is in
working in Reservoir Park, whereI mentioned there were 10 to 12
people permanently living at thepark, you know, we had, I think
this this expectation that, youknow, once we had coordinated
our services that people wouldimmediately be open to housing
(23:43):
of some kind, whether it wastransitional or Or it was a
shelter or it was morepermanent.
Um, but what we learned is everycase is different.
And there were people who werewilling to accept services.
And then there were people fordifferent reasons that were not
ready to transition intohousing.
And so we had to keep adjustingour approach at Reservoir Park
(24:03):
specifically.
Um, and that took time.
That took a lot more time than Ithought would initially.
And the other thing that washappening is we were getting
complaints from theneighborhood, um, you know,
practically every day.
About the condition at the park.
And so that was frustrating forthem as it was for us because we
wanted to try to address thisissue more quickly.
(24:24):
But what we learned through theprocess is that not everyone's
in the same spot.
Not everyone's in the same placeand not everyone's ready to
accept services.
And sometimes you need to changethe physical conditions at the
park to encourage people toaccept housing.
And what I mean by that Is thatthere was a park shelter that
was being used, you know, ashousing, right?
(24:46):
That's not what that wasintended for.
That was intended for, uh, forthe residents and others to, to
rent and use for their, theirbirthday parties, their
celebrations, their gatherings.
And so we restricted the use ofthat park shelter to make it a
little bit more difficult to beout there at the park so that it
wasn't, you know, animmediately, you know, inviting
(25:09):
condition.
Right.
So it's a little bit of toughlove to say, look.
We want you to be housed.
That is our first and foremostpriority is that you be housed
and you have services at thesame time.
I cannot create a condition at apark where we make it too easy
to live out here, right?
So it's a little bit of frictionthat you need to create,
(25:31):
hopefully to push people, youknow, in a gentle way to the
outcome of saying, well, maybe Iam better off being housed.
Because if you, if you make itexceedingly easy to be unhoused
and you provide, uh, you know,an unintended shelter condition,
that's what's intended to be apublic park.
Yeah, I mean, you're going tohave more prolonged
(25:51):
homelessness, so we had toadjust our approaches to make
sure that that wasn't asinviting a condition as it was
when I first got here.
And then hopefully, and theydid, and people saw the benefit
of, yeah, maybe I do want to beindoors.
Kelly Hickler (26:06):
I see.
Can you share I don't know,maybe you already said the
numbers, the number of.
Of individuals that you are ableto get into housing.
Carlo Tomaino (26:18):
Absolutely.
So, so overall, including our,our nighttime population, which
is not something that citiesalways account for when I think
about homelessness, I would saythat we had, I would say we at
our height, we probably have 55to 60 people.
In this community, right?
Um, through through the net teamin about eight or nine months,
(26:39):
we were able to house 10 peopleon a permanent basis.
So we had reduced our populationto about 45 people.
And then through the pathwayhome program, we were able to
house the remaining 45 people.
Kelly Hickler (26:52):
So
Carlo Tomaino (26:54):
the day that we house the remaining 45 people
through the pathway homeprogram, we officially had zero
homeless residents in ourcommunity.
Kelly Hickler (27:02):
Yeah.
Oh, that's amazing.
Are there takeaways or words ofadvice or, you know, nuggets of
wisdom that you can share withother communities that they
might be able to implement?
And I'm just thinking.
And you've probably heard this,I'm guessing, maybe you face
some criticism of, well, yeahyou can do that there in your
(27:25):
city because you have a smallpopulation and you have a
smaller homeless population, howcould we possibly do that in our
city, but what is your responseto that?
What would you say to anothercity who, Is struggling with
some of the same issues, nomatter what size they are.
Carlo Tomaino (27:46):
Well, I would say that, you know, for cities,
especially our neighbor, right,and other cities in the region
that have significantly largerhomeless populations, I would
say, yeah, you're probablyright.
You may not be able to get tozero functional homelessness
because the issue is much largerbecause the resources are
limited for all the reasons thatyou already know.
(28:07):
So you might be entirely correctabout that, but you've got to be
persistent and you can't giveup.
So, I mean, even though ourpopulation was relatively
smaller than our neighbors, It'sa larger population for a city
our size, um, but perseveranceis really key, right?
So, so once you've organizedyour resources and you share the
problem among a larger group ofpeople and not just siloed
(28:31):
homelessness to one or twopeople and say, Hey, you guys
figure it out.
You made it everybody's problemto help solve.
You've made it a priority as aleader of the organization for
everybody.
Once you've done that, You'vegot to be persistent.
It's like anything else we do inlocal government.
We do not have, in mostinstances, the ultimate panacea,
(28:51):
the solution to this issue.
It is exceedingly rare to beable to have a concrete and
absolute resolution to an issue,because we deal with.
Mostly outside of, you know,regular duties, maintenance,
infrastructure, et cetera.
We deal with, uh, unsolvablesocietal issues at the ground
(29:11):
level.
And that's okay.
Sometimes all you can do is chipaway at something, right?
And you don't lose hope and youcontinue to persevere because at
the end of the day, that's whatthe residents Expect you to do
the residents won't have asolution to this issue.
They don't have the resources,but they pay taxes and they
expect and rely on the localleaders to help either resolve
(29:36):
or at least mitigate the issueright to the best of their
ability.
So we have, I think, uh, aprofessional and moral and
ethical obligation to chip awayat this issue in whatever way is
best for our own communities.
Kelly Hickler (29:50):
Well, that's so well said and this made me think
of more existential typequestions about the function of
local government, but that's adifferent episode, maybe
different podcasts.
So, Carla, what what is a goodway for people to either get in
(30:11):
touch with you or someone elseat the city if they wanted to
get more information or followup with further questions?
Carlo Tomaino (30:19):
Oh, sure.
My contact information is listedon the city website.
So we're city of signal hill dotorg.
And then I'll give you my email.
Uh, my email is C.
T.
O.
M.
as a Michael.
A.
I.
N.
O.
at city of signal hill dot org.
And I'm more than happy to chatwith anyone about this issue or.
(30:39):
Just give you my two cents onwhat you might be able to do to
better coordinate efforts inyour own city.
Kelly Hickler (30:45):
Yeah, thank you.
Thank you so much for taking thetime to talk to us today.
It was very insightful.
And it, like I said, it broughtup more questions for me, maybe
more interesting topics to, totackle on a future episode.
But thanks again for talkingwith us.
(31:06):
And thank you to all ourlisteners for tuning in.
Remember to head on over toengaging cities.
org where you can findadditional episodes and other
helpful resources related tocommunity engagement.
We'll see you guys next time.
Bye.
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