February 19, 2025 • 36 mins
EventNewsDXB Ep. 6 - Maxine English: A Maverick's Journey From Dubai To The West End
EventNewsDXB is supported by Warehouse Four - Dubai's best independent event venue.
What if you could bring some of Dubai's 'anything's possible' attitude to the heart of London's iconic West End? That's exactly what this week's guest did! Join host Ian Carless as he sits down with Maxine English, the maverick powerhouse behind the transformation of the Savoy Theatre.
From her early days immersed in Dubai's arts scene to helping shape Dubai's burgeoning cultural landscape, Maxine's story is one of passion, resilience and a touch of old-school glamour. Discover how her childhood love for drama classes evolved into a full-fledged career and how a chance encounter with a hospitality industry titan, paved her way to success.
Podcast Rundown
• Maxine's background and entry into the theatre world.
• The evolution of Dubai's entertainment landscape.
• Key challenges of making theatre commercially viable.
• The balance between international productions and local talent.
• The potential impact of casinos on the entertainment scene.
• Personal sacrifices and experiences in theatre leadership.
• The significance of creating memorable audience experiences.
Production Credits:
Presented by: Ian Carless
Studio Engineer & Editor: Roy D'Monte
Executive Producers: Ian Carless & Joe Morrison
Produced by: EventNewsDXB & W4 Podcast Studio
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Ian Carless (00:00):
Welcome to Event News DXB.
Before we begin, I've got aquick favour to ask.
There's one simple way that youcan support our show, and
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Thanks a bunch.
(00:32):
You're listening to the EventNews DXB podcast.
Your behind-the-scenes lookinto the world of events in
Dubai, the UAE and the MENAregion.
I'm Ian Carlos, and every weekI dive into the latest event
news, expert insights andindustry trends, while
spotlighting Dubai's mostinspiring success stories from
the people shaping one of theworld's most dynamic event
(00:53):
markets.
Our guest this week needsalmost no introduction.
After relocating to Dubai at anearly age from her hometown of
Newcastle, maxine English hasbeen a prominent figure from the
very outset of Dubai's oncefledgling event scene, with
stints at the now sorely missedMadinat Theatre, as well as
Flash Entertainment, ducktac andthe QE2.
(01:13):
Three years ago, she wasoffered what is probably her
dream role as the GM of theSavoy Theatre in London's West
End.
And to prove that we go all outfor Event News DXB.
I took a plane, train andautomobile to talk to Maxine
backstage at the iconic SavoyTheatre.
Maxine, welcome to the podcast.
Maxine English (01:32):
Excited yes.
Ian Carless (01:34):
Now I guess I should really start at the
beginning, since that's whatI've done with all, I guess, so
far.
How did you end up in Dubai?
I know you're not there now.
I know you're and actually, forthose listening, we are
actually having one of thoserare occurrences where we're
recording a podcast in person.
I'm in London, I'm in the SavoyTheatre with Maxine, where
she's been for the past threeyears, but, as I said, let's
(01:55):
circleped on a plane to go anddo two months of consulting in
Dubai.
Maxine English (02:11):
And we waved him off and said we'll see you in
two months.
And then two months later herang and said you're probably
going to have to come herebecause I'm a bit busy.
And that was that.
Mum and I got on a plane, leftmy brother behind in London, off
we went to Dubai and then Peterjoined us a year later and the
whole family was there and wenever looked back.
So when I, when I left to comehere, I'd been in Dubai for the
(02:31):
best part of 26 years at thatpoint, Wow, and like most of us,
I guess you've seen a lot ofchange.
Yeah, you know, when I landed wedid the obligatory must stay in
the World Trade Centerapartments.
We stayed in all three at somepoint over the next couple of
years, but at that pointShakespeare Road was one road.
There was nothing else there.
It was just that and you had todrive really far to go to a
(02:52):
Spinney's and if you went to theHard Rock Café you were very,
very, very far away.
Ian Carless (02:57):
So how did you get into entertainment then?
Because that's where you spentthe well, predominantly the bulk
of your career.
Maxine English (03:02):
Yes, I mean, it's always the same story,
isn't it Annoying?
Four-year-old who wants to befamous and is sent off to drama
class and then summer sent offto drama school, summer school,
circus school, singing school,acting school and always just
loved the arts.
And same thing, you know, inDubai, through school, acting,
acting, acting and then actingat A-level, and actually the
(03:27):
kind of the understanding of howit happens.
So for me that was the real joyand I always wanted to, not
always just wanted to perform, Iwanted to understand how we got
to that performance.
So you know, the school playwas me being stage manager and
director and operations and setbuilding rather than wanting to
(03:49):
be actually on the stage.
And then it was, you know, aside hustle as a radio presenter
when I was still at school, andthen it was into theatre and it
was.
It's just always been theatreand it's always been big events.
It's always been the, theputting together of something,
that kind of jigsaw piece thatallows the end bit to happen,
because what everybody sees onthe stage or, you know, wherever
(04:11):
you are in the event, there'sbeen a lot that's gone before to
get there and that's the bitthat interests me was how do we
get here?
What?
What has to happen for us toenjoy this moment?
Ian Carless (04:21):
what was your first break then?
What was?
What was it that that got yousort of over the line and into
the industry, would you say,where you felt like, OK, I'm a
bona fide part of this industrynow.
What was your first major sortof role?
Maxine English (04:33):
I'd been doing bits and bobs, you know, radio,
presenting events, et cetera, etcetera.
And there was this wonderfulman called Michael Voigt who
worked at Jumeirah and when Iwas at school we'd done this
huge school play and I decidedthat it was so good that it
shouldn't just stay at DubaiCollege.
So I toddled off down toJumeirah Beach Hotel and said
can I, uh, can I borrow yourtheater?
(04:54):
You know the the one in there.
And this wonderful man calledMichael sat and heard me out and
saw the business plan and I waslike I don't have any money,
but if you give it to me forfree, you can have the F&B, I'll
take the tickets, it'll begreat.
And we tried really hard tomake it happen, but it it never
did cue.
Five years later I see Michaelagain and he said what are you,
(05:15):
what are you up to?
And I said I'm, you know,looking for a job, not really
sure what.
I'm still doing, the radio, etc.
Etc.
And he said come and see metomorrow.
And I walked into the Madinat.
And he walked me into what wasthe Madinat MPV and then over to
the souk and showed me thetheatre and said this man, andy
(05:35):
McLeod, who you will know,everyone will know, andy McLeod
is looking for a coordinator tohelp run this theatre.
And that was that.
That man just took a chance.
Andy went yep, you're in.
And that was the beginning.
That was my first big theatrejob, was that wonderful Madenac
Theatre, which will alwaysremain in my heart.
Ian Carless (05:55):
How much of that was a baptism of fire?
Maxine English (05:57):
A lot of it, I think.
But I think, in terms oftheatre, you know everybody's
like, oh so how on earth does itall happen?
And I think it's the same withbig live events, whether you're
doing, you know, the Formula Oneor whether you're doing a
theatre show.
It's the common sense of it all, it's that that has to go here,
to go here, to go here.
We say it here a lot that it's80% business and 20% sparkles.
(06:20):
You know theater dust, but thatthat's you know.
Theater in dubai back then waswe were educating a city as well
who hadn't had much theaterbefore then and certainly not
west end levels of theater, youknow, certainly not box offices
and tickets and turning up ontime and late comers and that
(06:40):
kind of thing.
So in that aspect, doing whatwas happening on stage, I
remember opening with Abigail'sParty and people the expatriate
community was like this isbrilliant, this is just what we
needed.
And then there was anothersection of our wonderful nation
that went what is this, what ishappening, what are you all
(07:01):
doing?
And watching kind of theatreevolve.
From then as a 20-odd-year-oldand then watching it evolve and
other things happen across thecity was quite something.
But yeah, baptism of fire,trying to, you know, even just
things like ticketing systemsthat didn't sit well within the
theatre world and then switchingfrom the theatre across to the
(07:24):
arena where we were working withbig names like Peppermint back
then and you know, putting onthese huge, great, big shows in
there and these nightclubs andthen the film festivals, and it
just grew so rapidly because theinfrastructure had been put in
place.
Ian Carless (07:38):
Now I mean there's a lot of people that would say
making theatre commerciallyviable anywhere in the world is
a tough ask.
How difficult of a task is thatin Dubai?
Maxine English (07:46):
I don't know how difficult it will always be, if
that makes sense, because It'llnever be easy.
Yeah, I don't think it willever be easy, because you are
ranging from.
You know things that go on atthe Dubai Opera, like you know,
like the big stuff, like Les Mis, like Chitty Chitty Bang Bang,
(08:07):
that kind of stuff to put onsomething of that size and
quality is not cheap, it'sexpensive.
And then what happens is is thatthose tickets become expensive
because, also, it's not a longrun, it's not the West End, it's
not here.
You can't sit that down forfour months and hope to recoup.
That's the very difficultcommercial side of things is
that then it feels elite.
You know you're looking at a600 Durham ticket for something,
but then the question marks ofthat is you look at what we
(08:31):
charge here, which is, you know,an average ticket price of
around £100, and that has had tofly from here to the Middle
East to be put on.
Then you look at some of thesmaller scale stuff and we're
not yet.
There is a lot happening, butwe're not yet at the place where
you can fly out 10 principlesand surround it with a cast from
the middle east, which is whathappens on, you know, in other
(08:54):
areas.
So it is bringing the entirething with you commercially.
I think it will always be hard.
Theater is this is a hardindustry to make a lot of
revenue.
You'll have seen that from someof the notices this year, with
all the biggies like CameronMcIntosh and Lloyd Webber were
coming to the end of a financialyear and they're all producing
their results and it's hard.
(09:15):
Theatre's always going to behard and I think, unless you're
incredibly passionate about thetheatre as an industry, it's not
your.
Oh well, we'll just getinvolved in that because I'm
going to make a load of money.
It's really.
I don't think it's ever goingto be easy.
Ian Carless (09:29):
Do you think there could be an expectation, in the
same way that, for example, someof the other entertainment
sectors, when you know,certainly when they were getting
started, you had Flash, which Iknow you're involved with, and
some of the other ones where Ithink it was accepted that there
was going to be a certain levelof governmental support and
that was going to be, you know,in the form of, you know, a
marketing budget or however theywanted to account for it.
(09:52):
Do you think that's perhaps theonly way to keep theatre
sustainable in a small marketlike Dubai?
Because, admittedly, I mean,there is only 9 million people
and, whilst the demographics canbe a plus, they can also be a
con, because, you know, you'veobviously got, you know, not a
lot of people in the first place, and then, of that demographic,
only a very small percentagewho actually like theatre, and
(10:15):
then we all come from differentnationalities, don't we?
So it's not everybody's cup oftea.
So I guess there's twoquestions there, which is, you
know, do you think that therewill always need to be a level
of, of some kind of support?
And then, also, how difficultdoes that the demographics make
for the someone programming theshows that are going on?
Maxine English (10:32):
yeah, um, I think actually the way to look
at it is how flash did look atit, which, you know, is very
much the model that has beenused, not just in theater in
terms of things like the WorldCup for horse racing is that,
yes, originally there has to bethat get up off the ground
support you know whether youknow that is a marketing budget
comes from Dubai tourism.
(10:52):
It comes from Abu Dhabi tourismto promote their city.
But the theory is thateventually it will stand on its
own two feet like a toddler.
So, you know, we help it up, weget it moving and then you're
on your own because you have tomake this work, which is exactly
how it all has worked.
You know there's a very famousinterview with Sheikh Mohammed
where he talks about that.
The first Dubai World Cup wasinvited, paid for, et cetera, et
(11:16):
cetera.
Now that is one of the biggestmoney generating things in the
world.
You know there's no subsidythere anymore because people
want to be a part of it and Ithink that always has to be.
The theory with theatre is that,yes, it's going to need a
little help in hand to get upand off the ground, but I do
believe that that culturalvision for Dubai is that it
becomes, you know, that hub ofculture Dubai Opera, coca-cola
(11:38):
Arena.
You know the Palladium, which Iknow has been renamed, but but
you know the new, the new Mallof the Emirates Theatre, zabeel
Theatre, there is there's athriving community now that did
not exist 15 years ago.
So, in terms of it working, itdoes you can see it, it's
growing and it's developing andI think it's you know things
that, like Lisa and Johnny aredoing with DPA.
(12:00):
You know I've had two anddiverse, I've had two boys on my
stage in the West End that camefrom, came from Dubai and
performing arts schools in Dubai.
So you're starting to see thatexpand and that's only going to
get bigger.
As you know, dubai and Abu Dhabiand Ras Al Khaimah and the
wider UAE gets bigger and biggerand bigger.
You know Ras Al Khaim isgrowing at a, at a, at a rate,
(12:25):
you know, with all of the newthings that are happening down
there, and I think you, from ademographics point of view, I
think it's just that you have toknow who you are, um, you have
to know who your audience is inyour venue and I think that's
the thing, rather than lookingat it as a as a wider thing.
To buy opera knows who theiraudience is and that's who they
are, that that's who they haveto programme for.
(12:45):
You have to programme for thataudience.
You know, during my time at theQE2, we knew what the QE2 was
and who our audience was andwhat they wanted.
They didn't want new and modern, they wanted to step onto the
QE2 and feel that.
You know, as if they were onboard.
Yeah, as if they were on boardback then.
You, as if they were on board,yeah, as if they were on board
back then.
You know that lovely end ofpier.
(13:05):
You know we're going to do sometributes, we're going to do a
supper club.
This is what it would have beenlike back then.
We're all going to get dressedup and have a nice time, and I
think that's what eachindividual venue has to know.
It has to know what it is.
Is it a hiring venue?
Is it a theatre venue?
Are we talking to and then talkto them?
Because I find that theatre isabout, and events is about,
trust, and I found that on theQE2, a lot was that the
(13:29):
audiences that came began totrust in the programming and
then they would go to somethingthey might not necessarily have
gone to before, because theytrust the quality and what
they're seeing.
So you know I think that's thesame with with any venue, with
Dubai Opera, you know they'regoing to trust that what they go
and see is a huge, great, big,fantastic West End spectacular,
(13:51):
and so they will pay a littlebit more for that and they will
go and see a wonderful orchestraor, you know and I think you
have to play to your strength ofknowing who your audience is,
and in Dubai that's quite wide.
Ian Carless (14:02):
Now you mentioned Ras Al Khaimah.
I mean obviously theassociation there now and the
rumour mill is casinos, etc, etc.
If we look at casinos elsewherearound the world Vegas, macau
obviously there's a huge amountof entertainment that goes
alongside the whole gamblingaspect.
Do you think that will playinto developing the
entertainment scene, certainlythe theatre scene and the more
(14:23):
theatrical shows that we canexpect to see in the region?
Maxine English (14:26):
Absolutely.
I mean, you only have to lookat the big shows that land in
Las Vegas and it's every nightand everybody wants to go and do
a residency there, you know,and that's just in and amongst
everything else that's happening.
So you've got the.
Again, it's the two versions,isn't it?
You've got the day-to-day.
This is happening every day,this is happening every night.
We've got Roman performers,there's Cirque du Soleil
happening and, as we know, thisis the UAE that it's not going
(14:50):
to be.
Oh, we've got a couple ofacrobats in.
It will be.
We've had Franco Dragone in.
He's written an entire showjust specifically for this
casino, because that's who theyare.
You know, when they broughtFranco in to do Cavalia and
Mother of the Nation and all ofthese amazing shows that he put
together for them.
That's the UAE, right?
So, yes, you're going to seethat.
You're going to see residentshows, land, and I think it's
(15:14):
always the way, isn't it?
Whoever does it, biggest andbest.
The UAE is like, not literally,but hold my beer, you know,
watch me, you think that's good,watch this, and I think we'll
see a lot of that.
You know, I think, especiallywith you know the upcoming areas
like Blue Water and things likethat, we're going to see huge
amounts of entertainment.
(15:34):
That land, obviously, the riseof Saudi and the tourism there
is something that means thatwhilst we're all a wonderful,
friendly bunch, there'scompetition there as well.
So there's going to be thatelement of it.
You know we saw that with Expo.
The entertainment that wasdriven during Expo in that dome
(15:54):
I was very honored to work onthe Sami Youssef concert in that
dome and what went into thatand what we saw of all of the
concerts and shows that were puton there and the roaming
performers and the entertainmenton a daily basis was phenomenal
.
And that was just for a one off.
So if we saw that for Expo, youcan imagine what we're going to
see when these huge resortsopen, and I do think that there
(16:18):
will be that kind of.
I mean, look at Atlantis theRoyal, with what they did and
how they opened and how theywill continue to.
So I do think we're just goingto see more and more and more of
it on a huge scale.
Ian Carless (16:30):
And speaking of big shows, just rewinding a little
bit to the early part of yourcareer, you were involved quite
heavily with bringing RobbieWilliams to the bar in the
beginning, weren't you, robbie?
Tell us a little bit about that.
Maxine English (16:45):
How did that?
Ian Carless (16:45):
come about.
Oh, Ian, that man.
I think there's a few womenthat say that.
Maxine English (16:48):
Well, I tell you , there was this madcap idea
that a Robbie Williams showwould be put on, and a really
wonderful friend of mine andyours, damien Calderbank, rang
me up and said do you want togive me a hand?
And I really said, I said yes,and I really shouldn't have, but
it was amazing and we did thatwith some of the greatest people
(17:09):
of all time, you know.
And we went up to a golf courseand said can we take one of
your tees, can we use the frontrace course for standing and can
we build a, a giant?
And we flew in a roof fromItaly and we did some very, very
wild things and it wasincredible.
(17:30):
And I will never forget themorning that the tickets went on
sale and me getting a call atlike 5am from Mercato, from the
manager, being like we've got abit of a problem, and I was like
please, don't have a bit of aproblem.
And I was like please, don'thave a bit of a problem, we're
not here, not now.
We're about to try and sell25,000 tickets and we really
have to sell 25,000 tickets orwe're in trouble.
(17:52):
And they sent me a picture andthere were queues down the
street and it was like nothingDubai had ever seen before and
that reminded me of my youth,you know, queuing up for that
ticket.
You know, at five o'clock inthe morning and they were
ringing.
They said, oh, we're ringingthe gang from Starbucks to try
and get them in early becausewe've never seen this many
people before and it was soldout so fast and we just couldn't
(18:17):
believe it.
It was like nothing I'd everseen before.
And we then had, you know, wethen had all the boxes in the
grandstand and so we sold all ofthese private boxes and
corporate hospitality and Chrisfrom the golf club had taken
again a chance on a huge leap.
Yes, a kind of wild idea, whichis it was a bit maverick really,
(18:38):
and it was one of the mostamazing things I've ever
witnessed and just it was afront news of every paper.
It was everywhere.
But again, that was the leapright, because we'd gone from
the rugby club where we hadamazing things like Spandau
Ballet and Go West and all ofthese really great concerts that
were absolutely incredible andabsolutely what everybody wanted
.
And Dubai was getting biggerand there was younger people
(19:01):
there and all of a suddenthere's Robbie Williams and
there's 27,000 people standingon a golf slash race course
watching him, and it waswatching a teeny little bit of
history be made, and it wasquite something.
I remember standing in thegrandstand and Sheikh Mohammed
arriving and me being like whyis he here?
What is happening?
(19:21):
And they were like well,because we'd taken Robbie to
play football at his palace theday before and it was quite wild
and he had then gone.
Well, who is this guy?
And so there was this wholebrilliant meeting where he had
no idea who he was.
He had no idea who he was andthen he turned up to watch the
show and all hell broke looseand it was magic.
And I think that's what.
And all hell broke loose and itwas magic.
And I think that's what.
(19:41):
I think that's one of thereasons that we all do it in the
event world and the theatreworld is because it's a bit wild
.
Ian Carless (19:53):
Now and you're no stranger to rock royalty, are
you?
You've got a little bit of rockroyalty in the family haven't
you A little bit of rock royalty?
Maxine English (19:56):
Tell us a little bit, just a teeny bit, just a
sneak peek there Come on.
Yeah, there's a sneak peek.
Yeah, there's a whole BrianJohnson thing.
Ian Carless (20:02):
For anybody who has been under a rock for the last
25 or 30 years.
We are, of course, referring toBrian Johnson from ACDC.
Maxine English (20:09):
Yes, sorry, just in case, uncle Brian.
Uncle Brian, I forget.
I'm like, yeah, everybody knowshim, but it's quite funny
actually, because most of thekids in this building have never
heard of ACDC.
Ian Carless (20:19):
It's absolutely wild heard of him in CDC.
It's absolutely wild.
Well, most of the kids wouldhave heard of him TV.
Maxine English (20:22):
True, yeah, I haven't managed to get him in
here yet into the Savoy, whichis a bit of a shame, but yeah,
he's going out on tour again.
Yeah, he is going out on touragain.
How's his?
Hearing this is good he's doingreally final tour.
Ian Carless (20:40):
As ever, I'm not doing it again.
They're allowed to.
Maxine English (20:44):
I'm not doing it again, max, I'm done.
Oh, okay, enjoy the next one, Ithink.
But again, you know thattouring it's in the bones, isn't
it?
You go, oh, I'm not doing thisagain.
And then you're like, ah, go on, I'll do it one more time.
But yeah, yeah, brian, part ofthe family and you've got some
wonderful little anecdotes.
Ian Carless (21:01):
I know you've told me in the past where he's just
called you up and wished you foryour wedding or something he
couldn't make.
Your wedding is that right.
Maxine English (21:09):
No, he couldn't make the wedding and there's a
couple of really brilliantphotos of me because my family
were brilliant and mum hadspoken to him to get him to do
this video and he was touringrecording the rock and roll
documentary that he was doingRock and Rollers.
It was part of the book andhe's chatting away about how he
couldn't be there and he hopeswe're having a great day.
(21:30):
And then the entire cast of therock and roll documentary join
in to say like, happy wedding.
And I'm like who are all thesepeople?
I'm absolutely here for this.
And then, following that, wasthis huge video of Michael Ball,
who is the greatest love of mylife after my husband, and we'd
just done Michael does themusicals in Abu Dhabi with him
(21:53):
and I'm a big stickler for, likepeople not going.
Oh, you remember, maxine, couldyou do me a favor?
And when he came up on thescreen, I just looked at my
mother as like what have youdone?
What have you done?
And he goes.
Okay, maxine, I guess you'regetting married today and I'm
not invited.
And I was like what ishappening?
And he says it's a brilliantvideo and he looks furious and I
(22:16):
thought they've made him dothis and he's raging and I'm
never going to get to work withhim again because he's furious
and he goes well in Abu Dhabi.
I thought it was me and you andthen falls about laughing and I
was like, oh my word.
So, yeah, even my wedding wasnot free from theatre and music
and chaos, because that's who weare.
Ian Carless (22:37):
So let's fast forward.
I know your last gig, I think,in Dubai was your own company
that you set up Park Lane, andthen a new opportunity came
a-knocking.
Can you tell us about that?
Maxine English (22:48):
Yeah, a kind of phone call to be like ATG.
And I was like, oh OK, theworld's biggest theatre company,
that's exciting.
Had a few phone calls and myhusband was looking at me with
tilted head like you know,they're in London, right, and
I'm like we live in and we livein Dubai.
And I'm like yeah, yeah, I know, you know they're in the West
(23:10):
End, james, you know the thelike the holy grail of theatre.
It's either that or Broadway.
My love and he was.
James is not a theatre or eventman, so he's just looking at me
like I'm insane.
Then this wonderful companysaid do you think you might want
to come run the Savoy?
And I was like the Savoy of allof them, like that's the Holy
Grail.
So I put the phone down andturned to James and said they've
(23:34):
offered me the Savoy.
And he was like that's not athing, let's go and see your mum
and dad.
They'll tell you you're insane.
And I was like I'm, havingnever lived apart from my
parents in my life.
So we dutifully trotted aroundto mum and dad's house, who both
went the Savoy, you must go,cue.
Five weeks later I landed inLondon, and that was just coming
up to three years ago now.
(23:55):
But yeah, it was.
Yeah, the Savoy.
It's kind of one of thosemoments that you it was a bit
surreal really, because you'relike, well, the actual Savoy or
is there a different Savoy thatI don't know about that isn't
literally on the strand in theWest End, you know now.
Ian Carless (24:11):
I'm going to ask you forgive me, but did you ever
suffer from imposter syndrome?
Maxine English (24:15):
yeah, all the time still do oh, and here, yes,
I was like yeah, I spent thefirst kind of three months going
.
What have you done?
Are you insane?
Do you really think you can runthis?
1,200 seats, absolutelyglorious heart of the West End
(24:36):
with some of the biggest showsever, and at the time when I
landed, we had Pretty Woman, andPretty Woman was short-lived in
my time.
We only had, kind of you know,five months of her.
And then the next thing, Ididn't have time for the
imposter syndrome anymorebecause we were having a show
delivered to us called A LittleLife with James Norton of Happy
Valley fame, and it was anincredibly difficult show four
(25:00):
hours.
He's not clothed for the show,it has a lot of trigger warnings
.
It's incredibly, incrediblydifficult to watch.
So we then launched into caringfor my team, which was all of
them had to be mental healthfirst trained.
Some of us had to be Samaritantrained, some of us had to be
sexual trauma response trained.
And it was just this whole newworld of bringing in a new show,
(25:22):
getting that show ready and allof the elements that there is
to running a theatre in the WestEnd that is slightly different
to the UAE, and at that point wekind of kicked into a little
life.
And then we started knowingthat after that was coming
Sunset Boulevard with JamieLloyd and Nicole Scherzinger,
and then we knew that we werehaving Plaza Suite with Sarah
(25:44):
Jessica Parker and MatthewBroderick, and at that point
you're just 100 miles an hour.
But I also think that mynickname here is Maverick
because a lot of people in ATGone of the great things about it
is that.
So there's 10.
In the West End, we sit as asolid 10 brothers and sisters.
So there's another I call usthe big 10, and there's another
(26:07):
nine of me, which has been anincredible thing, but most of
those people have worked for ATGfor 14 and 15 years, so you
know I'm brand spanking new.
They were all absolutelyamazing, totally new, but what
that brought with it was some ofmy they call them the Dubai
ways out of the box thinkingyeah, just a tad um.
(26:28):
So sometimes I go why do we dothat?
And the answer is sometimes oh,we just always have.
And I think that Dubai way ofthinking that I learned in my
time there, which is there'snothing you can't achieve,
there's nothing you can't do,just but just look at it
differently has really, hasreally helped.
You know we've gone right.
Well, we're not doing that,we'll do it this way, and people
(26:48):
look at you like you'reabsolutely insane.
You know, for a little life.
For example, underneath thestage because it was a play we
had this big empty orchestra pit, gigantic the size of our stage
, and it's just sat there doingnothing and one of the hardest
things that we have in these oldbuildings is there's not a lot
of front of house space.
So we just built a bar under thestage and everybody thought I
(27:10):
was insane and my wonderful,I've got these two brilliant
humans who work with me, joe andMike.
Joe is my deputy generalmanager and Mike's my technical
and building manager and I saidto Mike he'd gone on holiday and
came back.
I said we're going to build abar under the stage and he was
like no, we are not.
And I was like no, we are not,you are.
I've had an idea.
(27:31):
And as Mike always says A don'tgo on holiday because you'll
come back and she'll have gonerogue B when she says I've had
an idea run.
So we did.
We built this incredible barunder the stage that became this
amazing piece of history thateverybody has loved so very much
, and we've rebuilt it twice,but yes, I think, in terms of
(27:52):
the imposter syndrome, it wasshort lived in the beginning
because it was this overwhelming.
This is the West End, maxine,this is the big time.
Ian Carless (28:03):
It's a funny thing, imposter syndrome, isn't it?
I think you know we all sufferfrom it.
I know I have you know in mycareer over the last 30 years in
television and media, and evennow I sometimes think you know,
really, am I the right person tobe doing this?
But I think you know there'stwo things going on there, I
(28:24):
think, in relation to yoursituation as well.
I think there's the doubt thatthen evaporates when you get put
in situations that you don't asyou said, you don't have time
to react to.
It just comes naturally.
Actually, it's not naturally,it's come from experience, isn't
it?
And I think then when you sitback later, you go actually, no,
I do know what I'm doing.
And I think, secondly, there'sa certain, there's an amount of
internal pressure that you puton yourself, I think, and
particularly perhaps in yourrole where you know, okay, Dubai
(28:47):
, yes, it's in the headlines,yes, it's in a lot of newspapers
around the world, but you know,if something really goes wrong
there, you're a little bitshielded.
The West End, you're not.
Maxine English (28:58):
Nope, Nope, you are not.
You are Fair game and it's awide open thing and you are
differently to, obviously therewhere you've got a short run and
you know what you're doing.
Here we are open seven days aweek and there's 1,200 people
come through the doors,sometimes twice a day, and
(29:18):
you've got your own team andthen there's an entire cast and
an entire production to lookafter and there's so much to
think about.
There's just elements of itthat is never-ending.
I'm a terrible workaholic, asyou know, but I'm in here at
8.15, and some days at 11 pm.
I'm like Maxine go home.
Because it can become all-consconsuming because there's so
(29:38):
much happening.
But I do think it is that andthere are moments where you get
to sit and look at.
I know I have and I don't knowwhether that's age experience or
this building or being in theWest End or having grown and
developed but there are momentswhere I've kind of just sat down
and gone wow, you know, thisteam that you support have done
(30:02):
this and I've looked at some ofthe stuff that during a little
life there's seats on stage soyou can sit as part of the set,
but you're not.
Your phone goes in a locked bagand obviously they my team took
my radio away from me, whichthey like to do a lot when
there's an event on, in case Iget involved and I remember
sitting there.
You have to go on stage firstand I'm sat down and I watched
(30:24):
my team fill 1200 seats of thetheater.
I watched them all walkingaround getting people in, then
that you know, giving clearance,checking glasses, doing
everything and then the lightswent down and this play happened
, and at the end of it you hadto stay on stage.
And then I lights went down andthis play happened, and at the
end of it you had to stay onstage.
And then I watched them geteverybody out and do everything,
and to be able to watch themfrom that different point of
(30:44):
view, that was a real look atthem.
That was immaculate and thatwas a real moment for me to go.
You've been here seven months,eight months, maxine, in the
West End, and that was a reallysuccessful thing that just
happened and you were a part ofit.
Ian Carless (30:59):
Um, that's really good now I want to ask you about
what you've you've learned fromyour time here in the three
years, because obviously it musthave been an absolutely
fantastic opportunity to to gaina wealth of experience that
perhaps you couldn't have gotanywhere else in the world
before.
That I also want to just touchon now.
You're married.
Your partner, james, lives inDubai.
(31:19):
You live here.
How have you managed that?
Maxine English (31:23):
it's very hard.
It's a lot of zooms.
Basically we said a yearbecause I'd never lived or
worked in the UK.
And again, imposter syndrome.
Could I actually run a West Endtheatre?
Or was I going to get sent homein four months being like, oh,
you were what we thought youwere.
Thank you very much, Goodbye.
Thankfully that hasn't happened.
It didn't.
(31:44):
You know.
That lives with you.
What if I can't do it?
What if they go?
This was a big mistake.
You're the wrong Maxine, offyou pop.
And so then at the end of thatyear he got offered a job that
meant he needed to stay andthose they fly and and
everything moves at speed.
So the next thing we knew wewere two years in.
(32:04):
But, um, it is a lot of.
We're going to eat dinnertogether.
On zoom, it is.
I'm walking to a meeting.
I've got 30 seconds.
I'm going to call you in everyavailable moment.
It is not leaving it longer thanthree months for one of us to
fly either way.
It is constant communicationand it is a rock solid marriage
and a man who went.
This is your dream and I'mgoing to do the hard bit, which
(32:27):
is stay here.
But actually, on reflection andtalking about it.
I don't think that what we'veachieved in this building in the
last kind of two and a halfthree years would have been
possible if he had been here inthe nicest possible way.
I've been able to work sevendays a week, 24 hours a day to
get to where we wanted to bewith this wonderful venue, and I
would have been torn if he wasat home waiting for me.
Ian Carless (32:49):
Yeah, so a huge learning curve personally and
then obviously professionally.
If there was one thing that youcould take away from your time
here so far at the Savoy, whatwould it be?
Maxine English (33:01):
I think it would be.
A very lovely producer, who hasbecome a friend, said to me
that the you know, theexperience in the Savoy is
something that he's notexperienced in a very, very long
time that you walk through thefront doors and it's glamour
again and the service isexceptional.
(33:21):
My team are like ninjas and hesaid it reminds him of what
theater used to be that you, youdress up, you go and you have
an experience, and it's not justwhat's on the stage, it's the
entire bit, from from thebeginning right to the end, and
that that is now one of thereasons he's producing the show
that we're producing tonight,because he wants to work with a
team that are as exceptional asmine and watching people have
(33:45):
that experience of old-schoolglamour theatre and knowing that
my team have done that andthere's you know we're not fans
of the old jogging bottoms inthe Savoy.
We like some glamour in ourworld.
You need to dress up, you needto dress up, that's the idea
Dress for the occasion, dressfor the occasion, and I think
it's the Savoy, and I loveseeing that, and I love hearing
(34:09):
him tell people that there's notheatre quite like this for the
experience.
And there's everyone who comeshere and leaves.
That's what they say to me.
They all say your team areexceptional and I've had a great
experience.
And it's not just about what'son the stage and that, for me,
is something I will always takeaway that coming to the Savoy is
not just to see whatever is onthat stage, it's coming to have
(34:32):
an experience, and I think thatwill probably one day be my
legacy as well.
Ian Carless (34:39):
Now, before we wrap up.
We've been talking about bignumbers and everything, and
music.
I'm a music fan.
My vinyl collection is growingonce again.
What do you listen to?
What do you like to unwind to?
Maxine English (34:49):
We've been asking all our guests this I'm
pretty eclectic and it reallydepends on the day, because
you're either I'm eitherlistening to a musical number,
because I do love the musicals.
You have to, otherwise you'd goinsane, or the big numbers is.
Usually I go to Rob Thomas forSolace.
Okay, I'm a huge Rob Thomas fan.
(35:09):
That man could sing the phonebook at me and have never seen
him live.
Of all of the hundreds ofthousands of people that I have
seen live he still remainselusive to me, but I will.
One day I will go to America andwatch that.
Ever seen him live.
Of all of the hundreds ofthousands of people that I have
seen live, he still remainselusive to me, but I will.
One day I will go to americaand watch that man sing
brilliant maxine.
Ian Carless (35:25):
I've had a fantastic time sitting here
recording the podcast today.
Thank you very much thank you.
Event news.
Dxb was presented by myself,ian carlos, the studio engineer
and editor was roy de, theexecutive producer was myself
and Joe Morrison, and thispodcast is a co-production
between Warehouse 4 and W4Podcast Studio Dubai, and if you
(35:46):
haven't done so already, pleasedo click that follow or
subscribe button.
See you next time.
Welcome to Event News DXB.
Before we begin, I've got aquick favour to ask.
There's one simple way that youcan support our show, and
that's by hitting that follow orsubscribe button on the app
you're listening to the show onright now.
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Thanks a bunch.
(00:32):
You're listening to the EventNews DXB podcast.
Your behind-the-scenes lookinto the world of events in
Dubai, the UAE and the MENAregion.
I'm Ian Carlos, and every weekI dive into the latest event
news, expert insights andindustry trends, while
spotlighting Dubai's mostinspiring success stories from
the people shaping one of theworld's most dynamic event
(00:53):
markets.
Our guest this week needsalmost no introduction.
After relocating to Dubai at anearly age from her hometown of
Newcastle, maxine English hasbeen a prominent figure from the
very outset of Dubai's oncefledgling event scene, with
stints at the now sorely missedMadinat Theatre, as well as
Flash Entertainment, ducktac andthe QE2.
(01:13):
Three years ago, she wasoffered what is probably her
dream role as the GM of theSavoy Theatre in London's West
End.
And to prove that we go all outfor Event News DXB.
I took a plane, train andautomobile to talk to Maxine
backstage at the iconic SavoyTheatre.
Maxine, welcome to the podcast.
Maxine English (01:32):
Excited yes.
Ian Carless (01:34):
Now I guess I should really start at the
beginning, since that's whatI've done with all, I guess, so
far.
How did you end up in Dubai?
I know you're not there now.
I know you're and actually, forthose listening, we are
actually having one of thoserare occurrences where we're
recording a podcast in person.
I'm in London, I'm in the SavoyTheatre with Maxine, where
she's been for the past threeyears, but, as I said, let's
(01:55):
circleped on a plane to go anddo two months of consulting in
Dubai.
Maxine English (02:11):
And we waved him off and said we'll see you in
two months.
And then two months later herang and said you're probably
going to have to come herebecause I'm a bit busy.
And that was that.
Mum and I got on a plane, leftmy brother behind in London, off
we went to Dubai and then Peterjoined us a year later and the
whole family was there and wenever looked back.
So when I, when I left to comehere, I'd been in Dubai for the
(02:31):
best part of 26 years at thatpoint, Wow, and like most of us,
I guess you've seen a lot ofchange.
Yeah, you know, when I landed wedid the obligatory must stay in
the World Trade Centerapartments.
We stayed in all three at somepoint over the next couple of
years, but at that pointShakespeare Road was one road.
There was nothing else there.
It was just that and you had todrive really far to go to a
(02:52):
Spinney's and if you went to theHard Rock Café you were very,
very, very far away.
Ian Carless (02:57):
So how did you get into entertainment then?
Because that's where you spentthe well, predominantly the bulk
of your career.
Maxine English (03:02):
Yes, I mean, it's always the same story,
isn't it Annoying?
Four-year-old who wants to befamous and is sent off to drama
class and then summer sent offto drama school, summer school,
circus school, singing school,acting school and always just
loved the arts.
And same thing, you know, inDubai, through school, acting,
acting, acting and then actingat A-level, and actually the
(03:27):
kind of the understanding of howit happens.
So for me that was the real joyand I always wanted to, not
always just wanted to perform, Iwanted to understand how we got
to that performance.
So you know, the school playwas me being stage manager and
director and operations and setbuilding rather than wanting to
(03:49):
be actually on the stage.
And then it was, you know, aside hustle as a radio presenter
when I was still at school, andthen it was into theatre and it
was.
It's just always been theatreand it's always been big events.
It's always been the, theputting together of something,
that kind of jigsaw piece thatallows the end bit to happen,
because what everybody sees onthe stage or, you know, wherever
(04:11):
you are in the event, there'sbeen a lot that's gone before to
get there and that's the bitthat interests me was how do we
get here?
What?
What has to happen for us toenjoy this moment?
Ian Carless (04:21):
what was your first break then?
What was?
What was it that that got yousort of over the line and into
the industry, would you say,where you felt like, OK, I'm a
bona fide part of this industrynow.
What was your first major sortof role?
Maxine English (04:33):
I'd been doing bits and bobs, you know, radio,
presenting events, et cetera, etcetera.
And there was this wonderfulman called Michael Voigt who
worked at Jumeirah and when Iwas at school we'd done this
huge school play and I decidedthat it was so good that it
shouldn't just stay at DubaiCollege.
So I toddled off down toJumeirah Beach Hotel and said
can I, uh, can I borrow yourtheater?
(04:54):
You know the the one in there.
And this wonderful man calledMichael sat and heard me out and
saw the business plan and I waslike I don't have any money,
but if you give it to me forfree, you can have the F&B, I'll
take the tickets, it'll begreat.
And we tried really hard tomake it happen, but it it never
did cue.
Five years later I see Michaelagain and he said what are you,
(05:15):
what are you up to?
And I said I'm, you know,looking for a job, not really
sure what.
I'm still doing, the radio, etc.
Etc.
And he said come and see metomorrow.
And I walked into the Madinat.
And he walked me into what wasthe Madinat MPV and then over to
the souk and showed me thetheatre and said this man, andy
(05:35):
McLeod, who you will know,everyone will know, andy McLeod
is looking for a coordinator tohelp run this theatre.
And that was that.
That man just took a chance.
Andy went yep, you're in.
And that was the beginning.
That was my first big theatrejob, was that wonderful Madenac
Theatre, which will alwaysremain in my heart.
Ian Carless (05:55):
How much of that was a baptism of fire?
Maxine English (05:57):
A lot of it, I think.
But I think, in terms oftheatre, you know everybody's
like, oh so how on earth does itall happen?
And I think it's the same withbig live events, whether you're
doing, you know, the Formula Oneor whether you're doing a
theatre show.
It's the common sense of it all, it's that that has to go here,
to go here, to go here.
We say it here a lot that it's80% business and 20% sparkles.
(06:20):
You know theater dust, but thatthat's you know.
Theater in dubai back then waswe were educating a city as well
who hadn't had much theaterbefore then and certainly not
west end levels of theater, youknow, certainly not box offices
and tickets and turning up ontime and late comers and that
(06:40):
kind of thing.
So in that aspect, doing whatwas happening on stage, I
remember opening with Abigail'sParty and people the expatriate
community was like this isbrilliant, this is just what we
needed.
And then there was anothersection of our wonderful nation
that went what is this, what ishappening, what are you all
(07:01):
doing?
And watching kind of theatreevolve.
From then as a 20-odd-year-oldand then watching it evolve and
other things happen across thecity was quite something.
But yeah, baptism of fire,trying to, you know, even just
things like ticketing systemsthat didn't sit well within the
theatre world and then switchingfrom the theatre across to the
(07:24):
arena where we were working withbig names like Peppermint back
then and you know, putting onthese huge, great, big shows in
there and these nightclubs andthen the film festivals, and it
just grew so rapidly because theinfrastructure had been put in
place.
Ian Carless (07:38):
Now I mean there's a lot of people that would say
making theatre commerciallyviable anywhere in the world is
a tough ask.
How difficult of a task is thatin Dubai?
Maxine English (07:46):
I don't know how difficult it will always be, if
that makes sense, because It'llnever be easy.
Yeah, I don't think it willever be easy, because you are
ranging from.
You know things that go on atthe Dubai Opera, like you know,
like the big stuff, like Les Mis, like Chitty Chitty Bang Bang,
(08:07):
that kind of stuff to put onsomething of that size and
quality is not cheap, it'sexpensive.
And then what happens is is thatthose tickets become expensive
because, also, it's not a longrun, it's not the West End, it's
not here.
You can't sit that down forfour months and hope to recoup.
That's the very difficultcommercial side of things is
that then it feels elite.
You know you're looking at a600 Durham ticket for something,
but then the question marks ofthat is you look at what we
(08:31):
charge here, which is, you know,an average ticket price of
around £100, and that has had tofly from here to the Middle
East to be put on.
Then you look at some of thesmaller scale stuff and we're
not yet.
There is a lot happening, butwe're not yet at the place where
you can fly out 10 principlesand surround it with a cast from
the middle east, which is whathappens on, you know, in other
(08:54):
areas.
So it is bringing the entirething with you commercially.
I think it will always be hard.
Theater is this is a hardindustry to make a lot of
revenue.
You'll have seen that from someof the notices this year, with
all the biggies like CameronMcIntosh and Lloyd Webber were
coming to the end of a financialyear and they're all producing
their results and it's hard.
(09:15):
Theatre's always going to behard and I think, unless you're
incredibly passionate about thetheatre as an industry, it's not
your.
Oh well, we'll just getinvolved in that because I'm
going to make a load of money.
It's really.
I don't think it's ever goingto be easy.
Ian Carless (09:29):
Do you think there could be an expectation, in the
same way that, for example, someof the other entertainment
sectors, when you know,certainly when they were getting
started, you had Flash, which Iknow you're involved with, and
some of the other ones where Ithink it was accepted that there
was going to be a certain levelof governmental support and
that was going to be, you know,in the form of, you know, a
marketing budget or however theywanted to account for it.
(09:52):
Do you think that's perhaps theonly way to keep theatre
sustainable in a small marketlike Dubai?
Because, admittedly, I mean,there is only 9 million people
and, whilst the demographics canbe a plus, they can also be a
con, because, you know, you'veobviously got, you know, not a
lot of people in the first place, and then, of that demographic,
only a very small percentagewho actually like theatre, and
(10:15):
then we all come from differentnationalities, don't we?
So it's not everybody's cup oftea.
So I guess there's twoquestions there, which is, you
know, do you think that therewill always need to be a level
of, of some kind of support?
And then, also, how difficultdoes that the demographics make
for the someone programming theshows that are going on?
Maxine English (10:32):
yeah, um, I think actually the way to look
at it is how flash did look atit, which, you know, is very
much the model that has beenused, not just in theater in
terms of things like the WorldCup for horse racing is that,
yes, originally there has to bethat get up off the ground
support you know whether youknow that is a marketing budget
comes from Dubai tourism.
(10:52):
It comes from Abu Dhabi tourismto promote their city.
But the theory is thateventually it will stand on its
own two feet like a toddler.
So, you know, we help it up, weget it moving and then you're
on your own because you have tomake this work, which is exactly
how it all has worked.
You know there's a very famousinterview with Sheikh Mohammed
where he talks about that.
The first Dubai World Cup wasinvited, paid for, et cetera, et
(11:16):
cetera.
Now that is one of the biggestmoney generating things in the
world.
You know there's no subsidythere anymore because people
want to be a part of it and Ithink that always has to be.
The theory with theatre is that,yes, it's going to need a
little help in hand to get upand off the ground, but I do
believe that that culturalvision for Dubai is that it
becomes, you know, that hub ofculture Dubai Opera, coca-cola
(11:38):
Arena.
You know the Palladium, which Iknow has been renamed, but but
you know the new, the new Mallof the Emirates Theatre, zabeel
Theatre, there is there's athriving community now that did
not exist 15 years ago.
So, in terms of it working, itdoes you can see it, it's
growing and it's developing andI think it's you know things
that, like Lisa and Johnny aredoing with DPA.
(12:00):
You know I've had two anddiverse, I've had two boys on my
stage in the West End that camefrom, came from Dubai and
performing arts schools in Dubai.
So you're starting to see thatexpand and that's only going to
get bigger.
As you know, dubai and Abu Dhabiand Ras Al Khaimah and the
wider UAE gets bigger and biggerand bigger.
You know Ras Al Khaim isgrowing at a, at a, at a rate,
(12:25):
you know, with all of the newthings that are happening down
there, and I think you, from ademographics point of view, I
think it's just that you have toknow who you are, um, you have
to know who your audience is inyour venue and I think that's
the thing, rather than lookingat it as a as a wider thing.
To buy opera knows who theiraudience is and that's who they
are, that that's who they haveto programme for.
(12:45):
You have to programme for thataudience.
You know, during my time at theQE2, we knew what the QE2 was
and who our audience was andwhat they wanted.
They didn't want new and modern, they wanted to step onto the
QE2 and feel that.
You know, as if they were onboard.
Yeah, as if they were on boardback then.
You, as if they were on board,yeah, as if they were on board
back then.
You know that lovely end ofpier.
(13:05):
You know we're going to do sometributes, we're going to do a
supper club.
This is what it would have beenlike back then.
We're all going to get dressedup and have a nice time, and I
think that's what eachindividual venue has to know.
It has to know what it is.
Is it a hiring venue?
Is it a theatre venue?
Are we talking to and then talkto them?
Because I find that theatre isabout, and events is about,
trust, and I found that on theQE2, a lot was that the
(13:29):
audiences that came began totrust in the programming and
then they would go to somethingthey might not necessarily have
gone to before, because theytrust the quality and what
they're seeing.
So you know I think that's thesame with with any venue, with
Dubai Opera, you know they'regoing to trust that what they go
and see is a huge, great, big,fantastic West End spectacular,
(13:51):
and so they will pay a littlebit more for that and they will
go and see a wonderful orchestraor, you know and I think you
have to play to your strength ofknowing who your audience is,
and in Dubai that's quite wide.
Ian Carless (14:02):
Now you mentioned Ras Al Khaimah.
I mean obviously theassociation there now and the
rumour mill is casinos, etc, etc.
If we look at casinos elsewherearound the world Vegas, macau
obviously there's a huge amountof entertainment that goes
alongside the whole gamblingaspect.
Do you think that will playinto developing the
entertainment scene, certainlythe theatre scene and the more
(14:23):
theatrical shows that we canexpect to see in the region?
Maxine English (14:26):
Absolutely.
I mean, you only have to lookat the big shows that land in
Las Vegas and it's every nightand everybody wants to go and do
a residency there, you know,and that's just in and amongst
everything else that's happening.
So you've got the.
Again, it's the two versions,isn't it?
You've got the day-to-day.
This is happening every day,this is happening every night.
We've got Roman performers,there's Cirque du Soleil
happening and, as we know, thisis the UAE that it's not going
(14:50):
to be.
Oh, we've got a couple ofacrobats in.
It will be.
We've had Franco Dragone in.
He's written an entire showjust specifically for this
casino, because that's who theyare.
You know, when they broughtFranco in to do Cavalia and
Mother of the Nation and all ofthese amazing shows that he put
together for them.
That's the UAE, right?
So, yes, you're going to seethat.
You're going to see residentshows, land, and I think it's
(15:14):
always the way, isn't it?
Whoever does it, biggest andbest.
The UAE is like, not literally,but hold my beer, you know,
watch me, you think that's good,watch this, and I think we'll
see a lot of that.
You know, I think, especiallywith you know the upcoming areas
like Blue Water and things likethat, we're going to see huge
amounts of entertainment.
(15:34):
That land, obviously, the riseof Saudi and the tourism there
is something that means thatwhilst we're all a wonderful,
friendly bunch, there'scompetition there as well.
So there's going to be thatelement of it.
You know we saw that with Expo.
The entertainment that wasdriven during Expo in that dome
(15:54):
I was very honored to work onthe Sami Youssef concert in that
dome and what went into thatand what we saw of all of the
concerts and shows that were puton there and the roaming
performers and the entertainmenton a daily basis was phenomenal
.
And that was just for a one off.
So if we saw that for Expo, youcan imagine what we're going to
see when these huge resortsopen, and I do think that there
(16:18):
will be that kind of.
I mean, look at Atlantis theRoyal, with what they did and
how they opened and how theywill continue to.
So I do think we're just goingto see more and more and more of
it on a huge scale.
Ian Carless (16:30):
And speaking of big shows, just rewinding a little
bit to the early part of yourcareer, you were involved quite
heavily with bringing RobbieWilliams to the bar in the
beginning, weren't you, robbie?
Tell us a little bit about that.
Maxine English (16:45):
How did that?
Ian Carless (16:45):
come about.
Oh, Ian, that man.
I think there's a few womenthat say that.
Maxine English (16:48):
Well, I tell you , there was this madcap idea
that a Robbie Williams showwould be put on, and a really
wonderful friend of mine andyours, damien Calderbank, rang
me up and said do you want togive me a hand?
And I really said, I said yes,and I really shouldn't have, but
it was amazing and we did thatwith some of the greatest people
(17:09):
of all time, you know.
And we went up to a golf courseand said can we take one of
your tees, can we use the frontrace course for standing and can
we build a, a giant?
And we flew in a roof fromItaly and we did some very, very
wild things and it wasincredible.
(17:30):
And I will never forget themorning that the tickets went on
sale and me getting a call atlike 5am from Mercato, from the
manager, being like we've got abit of a problem, and I was like
please, don't have a bit of aproblem.
And I was like please, don'thave a bit of a problem, we're
not here, not now.
We're about to try and sell25,000 tickets and we really
have to sell 25,000 tickets orwe're in trouble.
(17:52):
And they sent me a picture andthere were queues down the
street and it was like nothingDubai had ever seen before and
that reminded me of my youth,you know, queuing up for that
ticket.
You know, at five o'clock inthe morning and they were
ringing.
They said, oh, we're ringingthe gang from Starbucks to try
and get them in early becausewe've never seen this many
people before and it was soldout so fast and we just couldn't
(18:17):
believe it.
It was like nothing I'd everseen before.
And we then had, you know, wethen had all the boxes in the
grandstand and so we sold all ofthese private boxes and
corporate hospitality and Chrisfrom the golf club had taken
again a chance on a huge leap.
Yes, a kind of wild idea, whichis it was a bit maverick really,
(18:38):
and it was one of the mostamazing things I've ever
witnessed and just it was afront news of every paper.
It was everywhere.
But again, that was the leapright, because we'd gone from
the rugby club where we hadamazing things like Spandau
Ballet and Go West and all ofthese really great concerts that
were absolutely incredible andabsolutely what everybody wanted
.
And Dubai was getting biggerand there was younger people
(19:01):
there and all of a suddenthere's Robbie Williams and
there's 27,000 people standingon a golf slash race course
watching him, and it waswatching a teeny little bit of
history be made, and it wasquite something.
I remember standing in thegrandstand and Sheikh Mohammed
arriving and me being like whyis he here?
What is happening?
(19:21):
And they were like well,because we'd taken Robbie to
play football at his palace theday before and it was quite wild
and he had then gone.
Well, who is this guy?
And so there was this wholebrilliant meeting where he had
no idea who he was.
He had no idea who he was andthen he turned up to watch the
show and all hell broke looseand it was magic.
And I think that's what.
And all hell broke loose and itwas magic.
And I think that's what.
(19:41):
I think that's one of thereasons that we all do it in the
event world and the theatreworld is because it's a bit wild
.
Ian Carless (19:53):
Now and you're no stranger to rock royalty, are
you?
You've got a little bit of rockroyalty in the family haven't
you A little bit of rock royalty?
Maxine English (19:56):
Tell us a little bit, just a teeny bit, just a
sneak peek there Come on.
Yeah, there's a sneak peek.
Yeah, there's a whole BrianJohnson thing.
Ian Carless (20:02):
For anybody who has been under a rock for the last
25 or 30 years.
We are, of course, referring toBrian Johnson from ACDC.
Maxine English (20:09):
Yes, sorry, just in case, uncle Brian.
Uncle Brian, I forget.
I'm like, yeah, everybody knowshim, but it's quite funny
actually, because most of thekids in this building have never
heard of ACDC.
Ian Carless (20:19):
It's absolutely wild heard of him in CDC.
It's absolutely wild.
Well, most of the kids wouldhave heard of him TV.
Maxine English (20:22):
True, yeah, I haven't managed to get him in
here yet into the Savoy, whichis a bit of a shame, but yeah,
he's going out on tour again.
Yeah, he is going out on touragain.
How's his?
Hearing this is good he's doingreally final tour.
Ian Carless (20:40):
As ever, I'm not doing it again.
They're allowed to.
Maxine English (20:44):
I'm not doing it again, max, I'm done.
Oh, okay, enjoy the next one, Ithink.
But again, you know thattouring it's in the bones, isn't
it?
You go, oh, I'm not doing thisagain.
And then you're like, ah, go on, I'll do it one more time.
But yeah, yeah, brian, part ofthe family and you've got some
wonderful little anecdotes.
Ian Carless (21:01):
I know you've told me in the past where he's just
called you up and wished you foryour wedding or something he
couldn't make.
Your wedding is that right.
Maxine English (21:09):
No, he couldn't make the wedding and there's a
couple of really brilliantphotos of me because my family
were brilliant and mum hadspoken to him to get him to do
this video and he was touringrecording the rock and roll
documentary that he was doingRock and Rollers.
It was part of the book andhe's chatting away about how he
couldn't be there and he hopeswe're having a great day.
(21:30):
And then the entire cast of therock and roll documentary join
in to say like, happy wedding.
And I'm like who are all thesepeople?
I'm absolutely here for this.
And then, following that, wasthis huge video of Michael Ball,
who is the greatest love of mylife after my husband, and we'd
just done Michael does themusicals in Abu Dhabi with him
(21:53):
and I'm a big stickler for, likepeople not going.
Oh, you remember, maxine, couldyou do me a favor?
And when he came up on thescreen, I just looked at my
mother as like what have youdone?
What have you done?
And he goes.
Okay, maxine, I guess you'regetting married today and I'm
not invited.
And I was like what ishappening?
And he says it's a brilliantvideo and he looks furious and I
(22:16):
thought they've made him dothis and he's raging and I'm
never going to get to work withhim again because he's furious
and he goes well in Abu Dhabi.
I thought it was me and you andthen falls about laughing and I
was like, oh my word.
So, yeah, even my wedding wasnot free from theatre and music
and chaos, because that's who weare.
Ian Carless (22:37):
So let's fast forward.
I know your last gig, I think,in Dubai was your own company
that you set up Park Lane, andthen a new opportunity came
a-knocking.
Can you tell us about that?
Maxine English (22:48):
Yeah, a kind of phone call to be like ATG.
And I was like, oh OK, theworld's biggest theatre company,
that's exciting.
Had a few phone calls and myhusband was looking at me with
tilted head like you know,they're in London, right, and
I'm like we live in and we livein Dubai.
And I'm like yeah, yeah, I know, you know they're in the West
(23:10):
End, james, you know the thelike the holy grail of theatre.
It's either that or Broadway.
My love and he was.
James is not a theatre or eventman, so he's just looking at me
like I'm insane.
Then this wonderful companysaid do you think you might want
to come run the Savoy?
And I was like the Savoy of allof them, like that's the Holy
Grail.
So I put the phone down andturned to James and said they've
(23:34):
offered me the Savoy.
And he was like that's not athing, let's go and see your mum
and dad.
They'll tell you you're insane.
And I was like I'm, havingnever lived apart from my
parents in my life.
So we dutifully trotted aroundto mum and dad's house, who both
went the Savoy, you must go,cue.
Five weeks later I landed inLondon, and that was just coming
up to three years ago now.
(23:55):
But yeah, it was.
Yeah, the Savoy.
It's kind of one of thosemoments that you it was a bit
surreal really, because you'relike, well, the actual Savoy or
is there a different Savoy thatI don't know about that isn't
literally on the strand in theWest End, you know now.
Ian Carless (24:11):
I'm going to ask you forgive me, but did you ever
suffer from imposter syndrome?
Maxine English (24:15):
yeah, all the time still do oh, and here, yes,
I was like yeah, I spent thefirst kind of three months going
.
What have you done?
Are you insane?
Do you really think you can runthis?
1,200 seats, absolutelyglorious heart of the West End
(24:36):
with some of the biggest showsever, and at the time when I
landed, we had Pretty Woman, andPretty Woman was short-lived in
my time.
We only had, kind of you know,five months of her.
And then the next thing, Ididn't have time for the
imposter syndrome anymorebecause we were having a show
delivered to us called A LittleLife with James Norton of Happy
Valley fame, and it was anincredibly difficult show four
(25:00):
hours.
He's not clothed for the show,it has a lot of trigger warnings
.
It's incredibly, incrediblydifficult to watch.
So we then launched into caringfor my team, which was all of
them had to be mental healthfirst trained.
Some of us had to be Samaritantrained, some of us had to be
sexual trauma response trained.
And it was just this whole newworld of bringing in a new show,
(25:22):
getting that show ready and allof the elements that there is
to running a theatre in the WestEnd that is slightly different
to the UAE, and at that point wekind of kicked into a little
life.
And then we started knowingthat after that was coming
Sunset Boulevard with JamieLloyd and Nicole Scherzinger,
and then we knew that we werehaving Plaza Suite with Sarah
(25:44):
Jessica Parker and MatthewBroderick, and at that point
you're just 100 miles an hour.
But I also think that mynickname here is Maverick
because a lot of people in ATGone of the great things about it
is that.
So there's 10.
In the West End, we sit as asolid 10 brothers and sisters.
So there's another I call usthe big 10, and there's another
(26:07):
nine of me, which has been anincredible thing, but most of
those people have worked for ATGfor 14 and 15 years, so you
know I'm brand spanking new.
They were all absolutelyamazing, totally new, but what
that brought with it was some ofmy they call them the Dubai
ways out of the box thinkingyeah, just a tad um.
(26:28):
So sometimes I go why do we dothat?
And the answer is sometimes oh,we just always have.
And I think that Dubai way ofthinking that I learned in my
time there, which is there'snothing you can't achieve,
there's nothing you can't do,just but just look at it
differently has really, hasreally helped.
You know we've gone right.
Well, we're not doing that,we'll do it this way, and people
(26:48):
look at you like you'reabsolutely insane.
You know, for a little life.
For example, underneath thestage because it was a play we
had this big empty orchestra pit, gigantic the size of our stage
, and it's just sat there doingnothing and one of the hardest
things that we have in these oldbuildings is there's not a lot
of front of house space.
So we just built a bar under thestage and everybody thought I
(27:10):
was insane and my wonderful,I've got these two brilliant
humans who work with me, joe andMike.
Joe is my deputy generalmanager and Mike's my technical
and building manager and I saidto Mike he'd gone on holiday and
came back.
I said we're going to build abar under the stage and he was
like no, we are not.
And I was like no, we are not,you are.
I've had an idea.
(27:31):
And as Mike always says A don'tgo on holiday because you'll
come back and she'll have gonerogue B when she says I've had
an idea run.
So we did.
We built this incredible barunder the stage that became this
amazing piece of history thateverybody has loved so very much
, and we've rebuilt it twice,but yes, I think, in terms of
(27:52):
the imposter syndrome, it wasshort lived in the beginning
because it was this overwhelming.
This is the West End, maxine,this is the big time.
Ian Carless (28:03):
It's a funny thing, imposter syndrome, isn't it?
I think you know we all sufferfrom it.
I know I have you know in mycareer over the last 30 years in
television and media, and evennow I sometimes think you know,
really, am I the right person tobe doing this?
But I think you know there'stwo things going on there, I
(28:24):
think, in relation to yoursituation as well.
I think there's the doubt thatthen evaporates when you get put
in situations that you don't asyou said, you don't have time
to react to.
It just comes naturally.
Actually, it's not naturally,it's come from experience, isn't
it?
And I think then when you sitback later, you go actually, no,
I do know what I'm doing.
And I think, secondly, there'sa certain, there's an amount of
internal pressure that you puton yourself, I think, and
particularly perhaps in yourrole where you know, okay, Dubai
(28:47):
, yes, it's in the headlines,yes, it's in a lot of newspapers
around the world, but you know,if something really goes wrong
there, you're a little bitshielded.
The West End, you're not.
Maxine English (28:58):
Nope, Nope, you are not.
You are Fair game and it's awide open thing and you are
differently to, obviously therewhere you've got a short run and
you know what you're doing.
Here we are open seven days aweek and there's 1,200 people
come through the doors,sometimes twice a day, and
(29:18):
you've got your own team andthen there's an entire cast and
an entire production to lookafter and there's so much to
think about.
There's just elements of itthat is never-ending.
I'm a terrible workaholic, asyou know, but I'm in here at
8.15, and some days at 11 pm.
I'm like Maxine go home.
Because it can become all-consconsuming because there's so
(29:38):
much happening.
But I do think it is that andthere are moments where you get
to sit and look at.
I know I have and I don't knowwhether that's age experience or
this building or being in theWest End or having grown and
developed but there are momentswhere I've kind of just sat down
and gone wow, you know, thisteam that you support have done
(30:02):
this and I've looked at some ofthe stuff that during a little
life there's seats on stage soyou can sit as part of the set,
but you're not.
Your phone goes in a locked bagand obviously they my team took
my radio away from me, whichthey like to do a lot when
there's an event on, in case Iget involved and I remember
sitting there.
You have to go on stage firstand I'm sat down and I watched
(30:24):
my team fill 1200 seats of thetheater.
I watched them all walkingaround getting people in, then
that you know, giving clearance,checking glasses, doing
everything and then the lightswent down and this play happened
, and at the end of it you hadto stay on stage.
And then I lights went down andthis play happened, and at the
end of it you had to stay onstage.
And then I watched them geteverybody out and do everything,
and to be able to watch themfrom that different point of
(30:44):
view, that was a real look atthem.
That was immaculate and thatwas a real moment for me to go.
You've been here seven months,eight months, maxine, in the
West End, and that was a reallysuccessful thing that just
happened and you were a part ofit.
Ian Carless (30:59):
Um, that's really good now I want to ask you about
what you've you've learned fromyour time here in the three
years, because obviously it musthave been an absolutely
fantastic opportunity to to gaina wealth of experience that
perhaps you couldn't have gotanywhere else in the world
before.
That I also want to just touchon now.
You're married.
Your partner, james, lives inDubai.
(31:19):
You live here.
How have you managed that?
Maxine English (31:23):
it's very hard.
It's a lot of zooms.
Basically we said a yearbecause I'd never lived or
worked in the UK.
And again, imposter syndrome.
Could I actually run a West Endtheatre?
Or was I going to get sent homein four months being like, oh,
you were what we thought youwere.
Thank you very much, Goodbye.
Thankfully that hasn't happened.
It didn't.
(31:44):
You know.
That lives with you.
What if I can't do it?
What if they go?
This was a big mistake.
You're the wrong Maxine, offyou pop.
And so then at the end of thatyear he got offered a job that
meant he needed to stay andthose they fly and and
everything moves at speed.
So the next thing we knew wewere two years in.
(32:04):
But, um, it is a lot of.
We're going to eat dinnertogether.
On zoom, it is.
I'm walking to a meeting.
I've got 30 seconds.
I'm going to call you in everyavailable moment.
It is not leaving it longer thanthree months for one of us to
fly either way.
It is constant communicationand it is a rock solid marriage
and a man who went.
This is your dream and I'mgoing to do the hard bit, which
(32:27):
is stay here.
But actually, on reflection andtalking about it.
I don't think that what we'veachieved in this building in the
last kind of two and a halfthree years would have been
possible if he had been here inthe nicest possible way.
I've been able to work sevendays a week, 24 hours a day to
get to where we wanted to bewith this wonderful venue, and I
would have been torn if he wasat home waiting for me.
Ian Carless (32:49):
Yeah, so a huge learning curve personally and
then obviously professionally.
If there was one thing that youcould take away from your time
here so far at the Savoy, whatwould it be?
Maxine English (33:01):
I think it would be.
A very lovely producer, who hasbecome a friend, said to me
that the you know, theexperience in the Savoy is
something that he's notexperienced in a very, very long
time that you walk through thefront doors and it's glamour
again and the service isexceptional.
(33:21):
My team are like ninjas and hesaid it reminds him of what
theater used to be that you, youdress up, you go and you have
an experience, and it's not justwhat's on the stage, it's the
entire bit, from from thebeginning right to the end, and
that that is now one of thereasons he's producing the show
that we're producing tonight,because he wants to work with a
team that are as exceptional asmine and watching people have
(33:45):
that experience of old-schoolglamour theatre and knowing that
my team have done that andthere's you know we're not fans
of the old jogging bottoms inthe Savoy.
We like some glamour in ourworld.
You need to dress up, you needto dress up, that's the idea
Dress for the occasion, dressfor the occasion, and I think
it's the Savoy, and I loveseeing that, and I love hearing
(34:09):
him tell people that there's notheatre quite like this for the
experience.
And there's everyone who comeshere and leaves.
That's what they say to me.
They all say your team areexceptional and I've had a great
experience.
And it's not just about what'son the stage and that, for me,
is something I will always takeaway that coming to the Savoy is
not just to see whatever is onthat stage, it's coming to have
(34:32):
an experience, and I think thatwill probably one day be my
legacy as well.
Ian Carless (34:39):
Now, before we wrap up.
We've been talking about bignumbers and everything, and
music.
I'm a music fan.
My vinyl collection is growingonce again.
What do you listen to?
What do you like to unwind to?
Maxine English (34:49):
We've been asking all our guests this I'm
pretty eclectic and it reallydepends on the day, because
you're either I'm eitherlistening to a musical number,
because I do love the musicals.
You have to, otherwise you'd goinsane, or the big numbers is.
Usually I go to Rob Thomas forSolace.
Okay, I'm a huge Rob Thomas fan.
(35:09):
That man could sing the phonebook at me and have never seen
him live.
Of all of the hundreds ofthousands of people that I have
seen live he still remainselusive to me, but I will.
One day I will go to America andwatch that.
Ever seen him live.
Of all of the hundreds ofthousands of people that I have
seen live, he still remainselusive to me, but I will.
One day I will go to americaand watch that man sing
brilliant maxine.
Ian Carless (35:25):
I've had a fantastic time sitting here
recording the podcast today.
Thank you very much thank you.
Event news.
Dxb was presented by myself,ian carlos, the studio engineer
and editor was roy de, theexecutive producer was myself
and Joe Morrison, and thispodcast is a co-production
between Warehouse 4 and W4Podcast Studio Dubai, and if you
(35:46):
haven't done so already, pleasedo click that follow or
subscribe button.
See you next time.
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