September 25, 2025 • 41 mins
When Tammy Urwin swapped dreams of the auctioneer’s gavel for a Lapland winter as Santa’s assistant, little did she realise it would be great training for her future career in the event industry!
In this weeks episode of EventNewsDXB, Urban Events director Tammy Urwin, joins me to unpack how she wound up doing “experiential” before it had a name and how she designs her events for emotion and memory over format. We also talk zero-waste festivals, like Corona Sunsets, which saw 30,000 people attend over three days, with nothing going to landfill and why sustainability has to be in the brief throughout, not a line at the end.
She also talks candidly about saying no to procurement driven briefs and keeping her event agency intentionally small. And we dig into AI’s real utility - speed, not strategy; plus why hiring for attitude wins and how she's building a pipeline of female talent in a male-dominated industry.
If you care about creating moments that outlast the event, this conversation is a good place to start.
EventNewsDXB is supported by Warehouse Four and -45dB
Production Credits:
Presented by: Ian Carless
Studio Engineer & Editor: Roy D'Monte
Executive Producers: Ian Carless & Joe Morrison
Produced by: EventNewsDXB & W4 Podcast Studio
Support us!
It takes time and effort to put the EventNewsDXB podcast together and we hope it's worth something to you. If it is, please consider sponsoring the podcast to enable us to keep them coming. Contact us for details.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
Thank you, or part of an in-house team.
I hope that this podcast givesyou some practical takeaways,
fresh perspectives and a deeperunderstanding of how things
really get done in one of theworld's most fast-moving event
markets.
And for season two, I'm superpleased to let you know that
Event News DXB is brought to youby Warehouse 4, probably
(00:40):
Dubai's best independent eventmenu, and Minus 45DB, the team
transforming noisy event spacesinto slick, sound-reduced
environments.
From full-size conferencetheatres to compact meeting pods
, minus45db builds modularspaces that are quiet,
customisable and completelyturnkey.
(01:00):
And they're sustainable tooSmart design with zero waste.
Check them out at minus45dbcom.
When today's guest swappeddreams of the auctioneer's gavel
for a Lapland winter as Santa'sassistant, little did she
realize it would be greattraining for her future career
(01:20):
in the event industry.
In this week's episode of EventNews DXB, tammy Irwin joins me
to unpack how she wound up doingexperiential before it had a
name and how she designs herevents for emotion and memory
over format.
We also talk zero wastefestivals like Corona Sunsets,
which saw 30,000 people attendover three days with nothing
(01:43):
going to the landfill, and whysustainability has to be in the
brief throughout, not just aline at the end.
She also talks candidly aboutsaying no to procurement-driven
briefs and keeping her eventagency intentionally small.
We also dig into AI's realutility speed, not strategy,
hiring for attitude and buildinga pipeline of female talent in
(02:06):
a male-dominated industry.
If you care about creatingmoments that outlast the event,
this conversation is amasterclass, so let's get into
it.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
You're listening to the Event News DXB podcast.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Tammy welcome to the podcast.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Thank you very much, lovely to see you.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
I'm going to be really predictable here.
Start right at the beginningand ask so, how did you get into
events and how did you end upin Dubai?
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Oh, my career.
When I left university, well,the dream for me was to be an
auctioneer.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Oh.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
I did art history.
I loved art history, realized Icould never do art myself.
I love theater, I love anaudience.
I want to be an auctioneer.
I ended up working for atelecoms company after I
graduated.
You know, as you do, first job,getting in, yeah, and I was
there a number of years andended up in business development
and marketing and left to goand do my my gap year like three
(03:06):
years after I'd actuallygraduated in a ski season in
Lapland who does a ski season inLapland?
I thought I was going to Vald'Azur.
I was Santa's assistant for awhole season, so that ruined my
dreams there.
Um, and then when I came back,looking for a whole new job and
I ended up working for achildren's charity called CLIC
(03:26):
now CLIC Sargent and Children vsCancer and it was a community
fundraising role.
So within that was obviouslybusiness development, sales,
marketing and events, creatingevents, supporting people with
events, which was completely newto me.
Absolutely loved it.
I love galvanizing people, Ilove helping people bring their
(03:47):
idea, their vision together, andobviously that was on a small
community level.
And then I was promoted to headof national events, which was a
really big role, bearing inmind I had no kind of formal
events experience.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Who does?
Speaker 2 (04:01):
So I ended up coming up with campaigns around sport,
around music, with the ideabeing to engage hundreds and
thousands of children at a time.
So this was an amazinginduction into events, in the
scale of events, and even thenin my head that was still
fundraising, that wasn't eventsper se.
Worked with some amazing sportspeople, music people and, most
importantly, generated amazingfinancial results, which is what
(04:23):
the aim of it was.
And then I was approached by acompany in Manchester that
specialised in sporting eventsand that was they were running
their own events with majorsporting names who perhaps have
recently retired or during theirtestimonial years, and we do
dinners, lunches aimed at thebusiness community and then
(04:44):
testimonial matches and thingslike that.
So we're just talking thereabout some of the amazing people
that I've got to work with andmanhandle during that time, from
people like Sir Alex Ferguson,sir Henry Cooper Pele.
I was Desmond Tutu's assistantat a celebrity football match
Really Random and Tutu'sassistant at a celebrity
football match Really bizarre.
(05:07):
Holding ice pack on ShaneWarne's shoulders during the
Ashes so he could sign merch andthings like that.
So for the book, I'll keep thatfor the book.
So a real and organising theselunches and dinners and we do
hundreds within a year.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
And that was that for me was organising events,
because that was on a moreintimate scale and for me, the
thing I loved, while the eventsthemselves were quite formulaic.
This was in the early 2000s.
There were no bells andwhistles.
It was a group of people comingfor a lunch or a dinner Seeing
people's faces when they mettheir sporting hero, and we'd
(05:42):
have the CEO of HSBC Bank turninto putty.
Absolutely starstruck, becausethey best stood next to Alex
Ferguson, who has been theirhero, and I realized then the
impact of events and theopportunity and the privilege of
being able to bring thesepeople together in a room.
And then same company.
My then boss came over to theRug Sevens and he said it's an
(06:06):
amazing event, We've got anamazing opportunity.
They're not doing any sportingevents like we do over there.
Let's go to Dubai.
I was just getting married.
Husband gave up his job.
We rented out the house.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
Sounds like a leap of faith.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
Well, faith sounds even more organized than I was.
And we came over, we did arecce.
We met some amazing people.
I signed up my first clientstraight away, and the expat
network is fantastic, and thesporting network particularly,
then the introduction to peoplethrough particularly the rugby
community, and I met loads ofamazing people.
(06:39):
So we were like, yeah, we'llcome for and I'm sure everybody
says this we'll come for twoyears.
Yeah, that was me.
We've just got married.
It'll be an adventure.
And about a week, two weeksbefore we were due to come, I
said to my boss I think there'ssome paperwork I'm supposed to
do.
I think you have this thingcalled a visa to go to Dubai.
When I look back at that girland I said actually we think
(07:05):
there's a recession coming sowe're not going to do it now so
you can have your desk back inManchester, I said I don't think
so.
I've committed to clients.
I've met people.
My husband my now husband hasgiven up his job.
I see there's an opportunityout there, so if you won't
support, I will go and do it onmy own you opened this box.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Yes, yeah, absolutely .
There's no pulling me back init don't.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Yeah, don't make me clear up your mess.
So I called the people thatI've met and said, look, this
has happened.
I still want to come.
Will you support me and can Isupport you?
And they said, yep, see, whenyou get here.
And that was literally so.
When people say I had thisamazing plan, I saw this
opportunity in the market.
It wasn't.
It was a huge leap of faith,because I've met some amazing
people and I genuinely did seean opportunity over here.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
So that was 2008 obviously we all know what
happened.
That was the beginning of urbanevents.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Yes, yeah, um, we won a contract really quickly.
The rugby sevens world cup washere.
We ran the contract to run alltheir events and also their PR
as well.
So working very closely withteam and managing that.
So that was amazing.
So we went from, we increasedthe headcount of the company a
hundred percent within twomonths, so there were two of us
(08:17):
and that was an amazing time andwe had a great opportunity
there and it was really good fun, worked our socks off for for
it and then we ran the event.
So I replicated what I'd done inthe UK.
So we had sporting teams over,sporting legends over.
We do lunches and dinners, butvery quickly and I think it was
literally in my third eventwhere we would organize it, sell
(08:37):
tables and sponsorship head ofa bank came up to me, said I
love what you're doing, but canyou just do it for us?
Like well, yes, that's wayeasier than what we've been
doing.
And I mean within a year mywhole business model had changed
.
We're being approached bybrands and organizations to run
their events for them.
So initially with the sportingand and kind of the b2b angle,
(08:58):
and then it was more consumerand brand fed.
So really quickly, the wholebusiness model model changed and
there was never a major plan,there was never a niche we were
going for.
It was literally led by whocontacted us and what we could
do and who looked and felt likegood people to work with.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
So was that the reason for?
I mean obviously fast forwardnow and you've got quite a
reputation for doing theexperiential side of things.
So was that an evolution thatyou saw as a result of clients
contacting you, or was that abit more of a conscious decision
, as you went along to kind offocus on the experiential side
versus just the?
You know, let's sell tickets tothis event.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
Interestingly, experiential has always been the
bones of what we've done.
It didn't have a name then.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
Yeah, I mean, it's a more recent term, isn't it?
Speaker 2 (09:41):
But I wanted to make sure that, even if you were just
going to a lunch with shanewarne and you're all in the room
together, I want to make sureyou walked out of that room and
you'd felt something different,you'd seen something different,
you'd experienced something.
There was something you weregoing to talk about afterwards.
That was was going to carry on.
So it started with simple touchpoints, simple things we did,
and we were really proactivewith brands and said I know,
(10:03):
barclays, you're sponsoring it,but what else can we do for you?
What's your objective?
What would actually elevatethis experience?
What does what are your keycustomers like?
So we brought it to them andhow we could bring events to
life to really make sure theywere standout experiences for
those guests.
And then, when it got to brandand they have guidelines or
they've got very specificobjectives around a product or
(10:24):
something like that it was quiteeasy for us to do that because
we've always thought about thewhole the feeling walking into
that space, walking out of thatspace, what are they going to be
the takeaways?
So that's always been reallyintegral to what we've done.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
How do you approach new business now?
I mean, what do you look for ina brief?
There are some companies outthere I think yourself included
that don't always engage in thepitch process.
So what's your criteria whenyou look at new business?
We're really picky.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
And I have the luxury of being the decision maker
that decides whether we pitch onsomething or not, and it's very
much a team collaboration.
We have a criteria.
We have a lovely roster ofexisting clients, some of which
we've been working with for over10 years, and so my priorities
my existing clients aremaximizing all opportunities for
them.
New clients that we often getapproached I would say 80% of
(11:16):
people we don't pitch, we don'twork with, we don't get involved
in anything that's a longprocurement process.
We don't get involved in thingswhere we don't get to pitch
anything that's a longprocurement process.
We don't get involved in thingswhere we don't get to pitch.
I'm not asking my team to spendtwo weeks on a proposal and
putting all of their effort andcreative ideas into something
when we're not even going to beable to sit down with a
potential client and pitch ourideas and talk through it.
(11:39):
That seems to me a waste oftime if it's just on numbers.
So we look at the client briefand also the brief doesn't have
to be that detailed.
The client needs to know whatis their objective.
Do they know their own brand?
How do they feel about theirown brand?
What do they want what theirobjective is and budget.
I need some parameters ofbudget, because we all know
(12:00):
there's a massive differencebetween no budget and no budget,
because we all know there's amassive difference between no
budget and no budget.
So we need a number to makesure they're not just fishing
for ideas and things like that.
And then they'll be the clientswe work with.
We sit down with them first ofall, draw as much information
out of them, especially if it'sa new client and we don't know
their brands.
And then we, you know again, wetry to be as strict as possible.
(12:23):
We don't even send anythingover till.
We're pitching in person.
We're like a 90s ad agency.
That is how we like to work.
I want to see the whites ofpeople's eyes.
I want to see their visceralreaction to what they're showing
.
We're showing them and I know,even though assisting clients
sometimes that always isn'talways especially with some of
the major brands we deal withthere is a process we have to go
through.
But we know, know we're alwaysgoing to get that opportunity to
(12:43):
pitch and I purposely kept theagency small so we can give 110%
focus on our clients and we getto work with nice people and we
don't have an industry or aniche that we work with.
If it's a brand that excites usor product that excites us and
they seem a really nice team,even if they're not entirely
(13:04):
sure what they need to do, wecan fill the gaps in for them.
We can do that for them.
That's what we're here for.
But if you know what your brandstands for and you're a
creative or a good team to workwith, then we will go all out
for you it's interesting.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
I don't think you're alone in in that uh, in that
regard with in terms of keepingyour your business to a certain
size, we had Adam Griffiths onfrom Enigma recently and David
Balfour from Lightblue, and bothof them said exactly the same
thing that they actually reducedtheir client roster quite
significantly and that the levelthey were at at the moment was
where they wanted to keep thebusiness.
(13:38):
And again, all in relation tobeing able to service their
existing clients to the best oftheir ability, because I think
we all know, don't't we?
It's a lot cheaper and easierto keep your existing clients
than it is to go out and findnew ones, which kind of
dovetails into my next commentas well, which was we've had a
quite a few people on thepodcast comment on how cyclical
(13:59):
the nature of our industry is aswell at the moment, and many of
the people that have been onhave commented that we seem to
be in a in a at a time wheremany of the briefs that they're
getting are all procurementdriven.
What's your feelings on this?
What's been your experience?
Speaker 2 (14:12):
a hundred percent agree.
We're getting more of that, uh,especially um new clients
people that haven't worked withus before the, the new briefs
and things that are coming in,and some of our existing clients
, like I say, some of the bigbrands we work with, because the
, the mothership isn't basedhere, it is in the uk.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
It is in germany.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
It is wherever it is, and there is a process for um.
You know legal transparencythey have to go through as well,
but those we still.
If there is procurementinvolved but we still get to
picture the actual delivery team, the marketing team, then we
will, we'll take part.
If it's just procurement,absolutely not.
We don't get involved in that,because you need a relationship
with clients and you need.
Often what's on their briefisn't what they need or want or
(14:52):
will get the outcome that theywant.
It's not until you have thoseconversations and draw the
information at them and ask theright questions that you
actually say well, I know youthink you wanted this or you
asked for this.
We think this might actuallyhit the spot a lot more and if
they're doing a series of events, for example, this could
actually cost savings in thelong run.
If we do this and we can giveyou a much more effective and
(15:14):
creative solution, whereas ifyou're just sending spreadsheets
into an email address, no, andwe're creative agencies, that's
what we do.
We're coming up with ideas forthings.
We're creative agencies, that'swhat we do.
We're coming up with ideas forthings.
So, and that's not going tocome across on a piece of paper
or without you know, anexplanation, or meeting people
face to face where do you thinkthis push towards procurement
driven briefs comes from?
Speaker 1 (15:34):
is it just purely budget budget, is it?
I mean, obviously, look some ofthese clients.
They've they've had experienceof events already, and often
very successful experiences, soit kind of leaves me scratching
my head as to why they wouldthen gravitate towards more of a
procurement process rather thango with something that's been
tried and tested, that they knowthey've got results from as
well.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
I don't know the answer to that, but I think
whether it's a change in seniormanagement coming in in some
companies and that we're goingto do things the new way because
their remit is to shave off thebottom line, because you're
right, you can have a reallygood relationship with someone
and suddenly the process haschanged, or that that team
because again, the cyclicalnature of this of Dubai in the
(16:16):
Middle East, means you build agreat relationship with somebody
and they're they're gone.
A new person comes in andthey're going to shake things up
.
So I don't know where it'scoming from.
It's bottom line at the end ofthe day, isn't it?
So whether it is from a seniormanagement's perspective that's
just looking at that bottom linerather than what they're
creating for their customers andtheir brand.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Changing tacks slightly.
You've won plenty of awardsover the years.
What's been one that's probablymeant the most to you?
Speaker 2 (16:42):
I think like anything , probably your first time, Yep,
so it was the.
I think it was the what's OnAward for Best Live Music Event
and it's actually.
It's giving me chills thinkingabout that event now.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
Brilliant.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
We were lucky enough to do gosh back in probably 2016
to 19,.
2016 to 19,.
We did a series of huge musicevents for Smirnoff and for
corona, and so corona sunsetswas an existing global platform
that we activated three years.
Here and again, we we tookcorona's global toolkit and
(17:18):
elevated and said we can do waybetter than this.
Not only can we regionalize it,we can actually go way further
with your sustainability targetsand objectives.
We want to produce something.
Again, we have an amazingclient who we worked really
closely with and we all set thetarget.
Well, let's wipe this out.
So you're going back to Globalsaying look what we've done, so
that not only was it Best LiveMusic Event, it was also we won
(17:42):
a award for sustainability aswell.
So it was the first, as far asI know, still the only fully
zero waste music festival in theMiddle East, which is no mean
feat for 30,000 people overthree days.
Yeah, no kidding.
It was absolute, phenomenal andit was a huge amount of
collaboration and being happy todo what's not been done before
(18:05):
and, rather than coming up withwalls, coming up with okay
solutions how do we do this?
How do we make this happen?
That was fantastic.
And then my other standoutevent that we were able to win
awards for is the Smirnoff SoundCollective.
Again, that was a globalplatform, but New York had done
a tiny little pool party and wesaid let's just buy, we do
things way bigger.
(18:26):
And and we said, let's just buy, we do things way bigger.
And we came up with thisridiculous, in hindsight stage
design with arches, huge archtruss in a really windy location
.
That was probably one of themost terrifying setups of my
life.
Looked amazing, unbelievablestage.
And then just looking back andseeing I think the headline tj
was and just seeing rehab stoodon the TJ booth looking down at
(18:50):
these thousands and so oftenwhen you're in an event you
don't get that moment to juststop.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
Take it all in.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
Take it all in, and we did.
I was on the side of the stagegoing.
I love my job.
This is what we do it for.
The four sleepless nights I'vejust had, worrying about trust
and weight loads and things likethat.
This is worth it, absolutelyworth it.
The two week set up Absolutelyworth it.
Look at these people having agreat time and events like that
go back to global and thenthat's just redefined what they
(19:18):
do on a global platform.
Speaker 1 (19:20):
Now you mentioned your Zero Waste Music Festival.
Lots of companies claimsustainability as one of their
core values, but you, you know Ithink we both know that in many
cases it's often just lipservice.
How are companies tackling thewhole sustainability issue at
the moment within the eventindustry here in in the region?
Speaker 2 (19:38):
obviously I can only speak in detail about ourselves.
So I was on a um a panel.
There were four of us, was alecturer, uh, somebody from pico
and then somebody from a higherpower company as well.
So that was a reallyinteresting panel of people to
be on, because we've gone fromlarge-scale production right
down to delivery and there thereare agencies doing really great
things and they're justcracking on with it.
(20:01):
They're not making a big songand dance about it.
It's like ourselves.
It just becomes part of yourDNA.
You just get on with it andit's it's.
It's just underlying.
One of the one of the thingsyou do is your rois internally
along with mp, mvp scores andthings like that.
So it's something that we we'rereally conscious of when we're
designing an event and alsowe're taking to the client's
accounts as well.
(20:21):
So some clients don't care,they just want a really amazing
event.
They they don't need to reportanything back.
Well, whether or like it,they're going to get a zero
waste report from us.
So we do everything frommonitoring food waste to how
much production was hired av,where has it come from?
How many local artists have wesupported?
Local suppliers?
Have we supported how weminimized what?
(20:43):
You know?
Something we might have broughtin, but we found a solution
locally.
And we do that as a matter ofcourse because we want to track
as well.
And there are some of ourclients, some big brands, that
have been able to take thesereports and then they go back to
their global and they getawards for best practice and
then we get asked to helpimplement these things for their
(21:05):
agencies globally as well.
So we are delighted to do thatbecause sustainability is key to
what we do, because there is somuch waste in our industry.
Unfortunately and I think moreso here because the cost of
space is so expensive it'scheaper to rebuild something
than it is to store it so it canbe reused again.
(21:25):
So, again, if we've got longcampaigns, that's brilliant, and
we work with our productionpartners and we make sure the
materials are correct to do itand that they will have the
longevity that we need, becausethey're being transported from A
to B, things like that.
We also ask our partners right,we're designing this, do you
have anything in stock that canalready be repurposed for this?
So we're not reinventing thewheel and we're you know how can
(21:52):
we tweak things.
So it's it's cost effective,but it's also, most importantly,
it's sustainable as well.
So this is key to what we do.
I know there are agencies um,because I was, I've been a judge
on for two years so there aresome agencies that do a lot
about carbon footprintmonitoring and offsetting and
things like that, and they'reand they're doing great work
there.
But I know, obviously, for alot of agencies, it will be.
We have a recycling bin at theevent and things like that.
(22:14):
So, yeah, it needs to becomepart of everybody's DNA.
It needs to be to, you know,key to what we do.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
Yeah, I mean we try hard with Warehouse 4, which is
obviously my other business, theevent venue and we try and do
our bit to encourage, you know,people, even if it's just like
please don't bring plastic waterbottles.
You know we've got a hugedispenser there, we'll give you
the water, just don't bring inplastic water bottles.
I had another guest on recentlywho gave us quite a really good
tip actually Adam Parry, whoruns the event industry news in
(22:42):
the UK and also Event Tech Liveand he said recyclable lanyards.
Well, I thought that was quitegood there, speaking of tech.
Technology is now firmlyembedded in a lot of events.
So for somebody in experiential, do you use tech and if you do,
when do you decide to use it?
Speaker 2 (23:03):
When is it a benefit to enhancing the experience?
So we do use tech in events,but we use it very carefully.
So I know that one of yourprevious interviews ben was
talking about don't just put ledscrews everywhere and he's even
a tech company, yeah, um.
So if we've got content that Ireally we want to immerse people
in, then we bring in technologyfor that we also use it.
And this is not reinventing,you know.
This is.
This is not revolutionary, butif it's a a way of interacting,
(23:27):
to engage people, and that itenables people to interact
better with something,especially if there's an
educational element to the event, we're doing so.
We recently celebrated theMcAllen's 200th anniversary, an
amazing brand that we work very,very closely with and a great
example of a brand who embracetheir agency.
They've taken us to Scotland.
We live and breathe their brand, which is back to your question
(23:50):
about procurement versuslong-term partnerships.
There was a huge amount of over200 years.
There was a huge amount ofinformation to impart and I did
want people to walk out going ohmy God, I didn't know Macallan
was that old or that.
They partnered with that, withPeter Blake, 20 years ago on
this amazing campaign.
So we brought in tech elementsthere to really make the
(24:11):
storytelling process interactive.
It's brilliant for things likeif you're doing internal
conferences and you wantimmediate reactions so we're
doing surveys and things likethat to stop the old style
around the room with amicrophone kind of thing.
So where relevant, we bring intech.
We're constantly looking fornew tech ideas or ways that we
can integrate it seamlessly butwithout distraction.
(24:31):
That's my key element.
It's got to add value and notdistract people during the event
.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Yeah, and I guess we can't talk about tech without at
least having a few words aboutAI.
What are your thoughts on AI?
Speaker 2 (24:43):
I'm sick of thinking about AI.
Speaker 1 (24:44):
I know, but I mean, you know it is the buzzword of
the moment and I think you knowour industry is amongst you know
, a whole load of others, nearlyeveryone who is both
celebrating and concerned aboutthe rise of AI and what it means
to jobs within the industry.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
It's here, it's not going anywhere.
Nobody's putting the lid backon that Pandora's box and we are
, as all agencies will be, umare embracing ai.
It's adding massive value in inprograms, existing programs.
So, for example, sketch upadobe where they have the ai
functions.
It saves time and it just helpswith the finessing or changing
looks and feels and things likethat and it's adding great value
(25:21):
.
It's saving time, whichultimately saves clients money
or means we can give them moreoptions in a specific time.
So ai in those in that umcontext is really useful.
Chat gbt again.
It can be a useful quick anddirty tool to just look at
something.
I suddenly check something.
But for example, when I'm in alittle recruitment phase, yeah
(25:42):
and I can spot a chat gT CV orletter straight away, and so
then my concern is is it makingus more dumb?
And I think there's.
The Roy Stewart was talkingabout it only yesterday.
There's been some research onchat, gpt versus Google, versus
using your brain, and alreadythey can see a decline in mental
(26:03):
capability.
Speaker 1 (26:04):
Benoit had an interesting take on this.
He noticed that one of theareas where they introduced AI
into his business was in HR, wasexactly in recruitment.
At first he said you know, Iwas really kind of sceptical
about this.
And he said what they foundover the course of the time so
far that they've been using itis that the AI doesn't recognise
nationalities or gender etc.
(26:25):
Right, and it just picks whatit thinks is the right candidate
for the job.
And he said what transpiredwith his business, electra, is
that they've got a much widerrange of sort of nationalities
and people coming on board rightnow Because obviously in the
past you sort of gravitate tothe people that you know and if
you're European then you kind ofgo the European route.
If you're Indian you go theIndian route.
(26:47):
You just go within the circlethat you know.
Ai doesn't do that.
It puts what it thinks are thebest candidates in front of you.
And he said that's been a realeye-opener for him.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Oh, that's really interesting and automated
functions like that it couldprobably really support with
backend functions make thingsmore efficient, and that's a
great example of the use of aiyeah um, and we're actually
using some of those tools tohelp us with our selections at
the moment.
So, for example, the cvs I willbe receiving will have been
through that where I've askedyou know the criteria and
they're only spitting out theones that are, because you're
(27:17):
obviously right, you are, youare unbiasedly biased to things
because you will, you willrecognize the, the company they
work for, or something like that, if you're a certain
nationality and things like that.
So that, yeah, whether we likeit or not, that happens.
So for that and it makes thatprocess more efficient and
probably especially a regionlike here where you might get
applications that really aren'trelevant.
(27:37):
So I think that you know thereare benefits to AI and they are
going to help make functionsslicker and more time-effective
and therefore morecost-effective.
And in the creative industryyou could argue.
Well, if some of those thingsare made quicker or automated,
does that give us more time tobe creative?
Does that give us more time toactually think and have had
space to do it?
But you know, things likecopywriting really concern me
(28:01):
because that is an art.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Journalism.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
Copyright, journalism .
These are arts and even now youcan see in national newspapers
we read something and you think,yeah, so the editors, the desk,
hasn't checked that, becausethat doesn't seem quite right.
So, yes, it's here to stay.
It's how it's used.
Speaker 1 (28:16):
Yeah, I also take heart from the fact that you
know, as good as AI can be andas useful as it can be in the
event industry, it cannotreplace personal interaction.
It really can't.
And I take heart from peoplelike, what was it?
Mark Cuban recently andsomebody else who ran, whose
name I forget, who ran an AIcompany, and Cuban came out and
(28:37):
said, look, if I had to put mymoney anywhere in the next 10
years, it's going to be inevents, precisely because of the
.
Well, one of the reasons wasbecause of the rise of AI and
the fact that you know, as moreand more you know, fake content
is out there.
People will crave authentic andreal experiences, which, for us
, is this it's face-to-face, andAI, however good it gets, will
never be able to recreate thatface-to-face, that personal
(29:00):
touch of being in a room withfriends, colleagues, peers, et
cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 2 (29:05):
And if brands want to connect with their customers,
then they need to do that inperson, because otherwise it's
going to become faceless or theyou know.
It's a churn of content outthere and I think what brands
will start to do is really focus, because it's very difficult
now for brands to cut throughbecause there is so much noise
out there.
It's not like it was beforesocial media and you can have
those direct conversations moreit's there's a lot of noise.
(29:25):
So we'll probably see the riseof brands really focusing on
their niches.
So a smaller audience, butactually a really loving
audience, a really focused,engaged audience.
So we'll start to see more ofthat as well, which I think is a
great way for the brands.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
Now we work in an industry that is notoriously
male dominated.
Tough question when do youthink that comes from and why
aren't?
Speaker 2 (29:51):
there more women in the event industry?
I wish I could answer that one,and it's actually quite hard
for me because I've got, we'vegot one man, that's it.
The rest of us are all women,so I'm going.
What do you mean?
Speaker 1 (29:59):
there are no women.
I'm surrounded by women.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
And in fact one of my team.
He was going through anequipment process at the moment
and she even said yesterday.
She said I mean they're allwomen.
I mean I looked at the guys butthey just weren't as good as
the women.
So maybe we again unconsciousbias in our team.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
I would concur with that.
I would hire a female eventmanager.
If you want something done, yougive it to a busy woman.
Absolutely no-transcript.
Speaker 2 (30:45):
More of that as well.
You don't need to be all thequalified because, nothing beats
experience.
I think there needs to be moresupport for women coming through
and I'd be interested to see,through universities and
obviously because they're nowoff, for example, event
management courses and thingslike that and creative courses
that the support that are comingthrough.
I don't know the answer to that, because there's no need for
(31:08):
there's no obvious reason for agender divide.
It's not huge on-site elementsor things like that as well,
it's creative, which should be50-50.
It's management, it'sorganization it should be 50-50
or one way.
So we do what we can.
We've always had an internprogramme where we've taken
individuals and they've alwaysbeen female who are either
(31:31):
recent graduates or are currentstudying, and we're actually
recruiting for a full-time andour internship is the idea is
they stay on it's not just athree months and that they grow.
And I see my ex-interns now andthey've got really senior jobs
in the event industry and thedifferent elements of it.
It's in in power companies andthings like that, not
(31:51):
traditionally you know, femaleif we're, if we're thinking
about traditional female rolesand nothing makes me prouder and
they come bounding up and theysay oh my god, I remember you
were the first one to let me aninternship 10 years ago and
everything I've learned then andit's thanks to you that I had
the enthusiasm and the passionto get to where I am now.
So we are doing our individualbit.
(32:13):
More needs to be done, but I'malso interested on the influx of
people coming in the industrynow and what is happening there.
Speaker 1 (32:21):
I was just going to touch on that because you
mentioned, obviously, yourintern program.
Are you seeing a lot of peoplewanting to get into the event
industry?
Because there's a lot writtenabout Gen Z and specific
generations, about not beingwilling to put in the hard yards
, being lazy, et cetera, etcetera, and events are hard work
and very stressful and itobviously isn't for everyone.
(32:43):
So are you seeing that pipelinecoming through?
Speaker 2 (32:46):
Maybe I answer this question in a week's time, as
we've been through all the newintern CDs.
Speaker 1 (32:50):
Absolutely yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
I've definitely seen a change over my 18 years here.
A lot less coming through nowthan would have done before,
than we've had before, but a lotmore, a lot different
nationalities coming through nowthan before.
We would have been veryeuropean focused again, not just
by where we were advertising,probably because what people saw
we did.
So it's good to see we'regetting far more nationalities
(33:12):
coming through.
What I am finding is a lot ofthe graduates are how do I
explain this?
Hugely educated.
I've got people coming to mewith, but they've never done a
day's work and I need somebodyto be able to converse with
customers, to be able to work ina team.
There's also a lot of requestscan I work from home?
Well, no, it's your first job.
(33:33):
This is how you learn YouTubevideos won't cut it.
Absolutely Because the bestlessons I learned were watching
my boss negotiating and mewondering where he or she was
going with that conversation,and then comes the end point and
go ah, that's clever.
So, yes, you have to be inperson.
So we're seeing a change inpeople's expectations of what
(33:56):
they're worth financially, wherethey think they should sit
within the business and wherethey will be sitting physically
and historically within thebusiness.
But those gems are still outthere.
We've had some cracking teammembers and we have a really
good staff retention.
I tend to only lose people toother countries which I can't
(34:17):
compete with.
Speaker 1 (34:18):
No, you can't compete with a global move.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
I'm gone some places I'm like, could you work from
the uk, could you?
And that's you know.
And there's tears when peopleleave, which is great and and I
love it when people leave andthey go on and they do great
things and they keep in touchwith us.
So I like, I'm quite happy tobe an incubator, to go on to
other things.
So long answer to let me answerthat question for you next week
when I see the talent comingthrough.
(34:41):
But you can.
You, only I'm looking forattitude.
You can teach all the otherskills.
I need someone with the rightattitude when they walk through
my door and and the rest you canteach, and they don't always
have the right attitude now,when you look back on your
career to date, what are thebiggest things that you take
away from it?
Speaker 1 (35:00):
I don't't just mean like a you know, a specific
event that stood out, but maybeon a personal level, what are
the things that you take away?
I mean running your ownbusiness, for example.
It can be a lonely experience,yeah, yeah.
What are the things that you'vetaken away over the years?
Speaker 2 (35:12):
When I look back now, I just think what a ride the
opportunities that I've beengiven and the opportunities I've
created for myself.
As we know, it is 50% luck andit is 50% graft on that luck
Putting yourself in the rightplace at the right time or
putting your hand up to say Ican do that and thinking I'm not
(35:34):
entirely sure how I can do that, but I know I've got enough
support that we can make thathappen and we will do it.
And looking back at the resultsand that's how you build your
portfolio.
But, yeah, I've worked withsome amazing clients.
I've worked with some amazingindividuals, from creative to
sports stars, to music stars, toengineers, to content creators,
(35:56):
and it's this army of peoplethat you have, that family
around that specific event orproject or period of time that
you learn from and that you giveback to.
And you all stand back and lookat those results.
So, yeah, the opportunities I'vebeen given, the things I've
done, the things I've been partof.
I'm honoured to be in thisindustry that I fell into.
(36:17):
There was no great dream to bein events, but to have fallen
into this industry and to get todo things I do on a daily basis
and to get, to be able to go.
I've had an idea what we coulddo.
Do you like it, client?
And they go.
Yeah, let's do it.
And that's the greatestprivilege when a client trusts
you to take that and you knowyour vision, their vision, and
run with it.
(36:39):
I, yeah, that's the things Ilook back thank.
Thank you for putting yourtrust in me.
Clients, thank you for yoursupport, all of my colleagues,
internal and external as well.
And yeah, there's a booksomewhere with all the stories
over the last 30 years, I think.
Speaker 1 (36:53):
We all suffer from time to time from imposter
syndrome, don't we?
Do you think you could lookback over your time in events?
Was there a specific point atwhich you kind of went?
You know what?
Actually, I kind of know myshit.
Does it ever happen?
I know what I'm doing.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
I don't know if that ever I mean women again worse
than men on this I think it'sprobably only in the last few
years actually older and wiser,suffering falls a lot less
gladly now, and you just have totake stock of the things you've
delivered and the things thatyou've done and go yeah, we can
do this.
It might be a different form,it might be a different shape,
(37:29):
but we've been here and I thinksometimes we all have to
remember it's not brain surgery.
We are not saving lives.
We are showing people a damngood time and we were showing
the clients their money is wellinvested, but we are not saving
lives and I think sometimes wehave to take stock.
You know what, what theparameters of what we're doing
and how can I do it mostcreatively?
So I think that's probably onlybeen in the last few years yeah
(37:51):
, I think it's a fine line,isn't it?
Speaker 1 (37:53):
I mean, there is a point I think that we all reach
or I hope we reach anyway whereyou, you do realize that the sum
of your experience is quitevast and that you are capable.
You do know what you're doing.
At the same time, I'm alsohumble enough to know that I
will never stop learning.
There is always something thatI don't know, there is always
something that I can take awayfrom someone else, and I think
(38:15):
the smartest of us in the roomas well will surround ourselves
with people from whom we cangain even more knowledge from.
Speaker 2 (38:20):
If you're not doing something which makes you
nervous or apprehensive, you'renot learning, you're not
changing anything.
Get out of your comfort zone,yeah you need to be out of your
comfort zone.
You need to question is thisgoing to come out the way I
wanted it to have?
I got the right Because you'repushing your boundaries.
If it's all smooth sailing allthe way through, you're not
progressing.
Smooth sailing all the waythrough, you're not progressing,
you're coasting.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (38:41):
Well and finally, I ask all my guests this question
I'm a music fan, I know you are.
We've talked about it a littlebit earlier.
We all use music in differentways.
I get home and stick the vinylyes, vinyl Back to vinyl,
showing my age again, and then,just, you know, sit back, relax.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
I'm curious, though, what's on your?
Speaker 1 (39:05):
playlist I'm a club kid.
Oh, I'm a club and rave kid ofthe 90s.
Speaker 2 (39:07):
Yeah, my, my youth is hacienda um progress, rehab,
renaissance.
That that's my youth, so thatthat is my happy place.
That music I mean.
I even managed to wangle doingmy dissertation at university on
the haacienda Fantastic, themost engaged subject I've ever
been on.
I love that euphoria momentwith everybody together, those
(39:30):
big tunes, music dropping.
So whether it is HaciendaClassicals because that's what
we're getting nowadays here, orlarge live concerts, I love that
moment.
Everybody together, liveconcerts.
Uh, I love that momenteverybody's together.
So me, if I'm, if I'm relaxing,it's a little bit of graham
park pauletta, mike pickering,sasha that would be my go-to
playlist fantastic.
Speaker 1 (39:48):
I'm going to leave you with a bit of a sobering
thought.
I know you're not too active oninstagram, but did you see the
uh the clip recently withunderworld performing?
I did look at that tammy and Idid think, oh my god, are they
that old?
And then immediately thought amI that old?
Speaker 2 (40:01):
I was that old, oh God, yeah, I think I'm Peter Pan
, until yeah.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
Until you look in the mirror and then you go, oh, ok,
ok.
And finally, what are youlooking forward to in the next
12 months?
Speaker 2 (40:15):
Oh, we've got a good year planned, so, literally, the
next 2026 is looking reallygood and, as I mentioned,
expansion, so that's key for me.
At the moment, I keep theagency small, but we're bringing
on more creative talent andwe're bringing on younger talent
as well that we're bringing upthrough the business as well, so
that's really exciting.
At the moment, we've got somereally exciting projects in the
pipeline with clients we've beenworking with for a long time
(40:38):
who are giving us a cup lunchand they've said we know what
you can do just blow our socksoff, um, which is the greatest
form of flattery ever.
Speaker 1 (40:45):
And, yeah, I'm really excited about the next 12
months and what we're going tobe delivering creatively tammy's
been fantastic chatting withyou pleasure to see you thanks
for joining me on the podcastyou event news dxb is brought to
(41:11):
you by warehouse 4, probablydubai's best independent event
venue.
Thank you myself, ian Carlos.
The studio engineer and editorwas Roy DeMonte, the executive
producer was myself and JoeMorrison, and this podcast was
produced by W4 Podcast StudioDubai, and if you haven't done
so already, please do click thatfollow or subscribe button.
(41:33):
We'll see you next time.
Thank you, or part of an in-house team.
I hope that this podcast givesyou some practical takeaways,
fresh perspectives and a deeperunderstanding of how things
really get done in one of theworld's most fast-moving event
markets.
And for season two, I'm superpleased to let you know that
Event News DXB is brought to youby Warehouse 4, probably
(00:40):
Dubai's best independent eventmenu, and Minus 45DB, the team
transforming noisy event spacesinto slick, sound-reduced
environments.
From full-size conferencetheatres to compact meeting pods
, minus45db builds modularspaces that are quiet,
customisable and completelyturnkey.
(01:00):
And they're sustainable tooSmart design with zero waste.
Check them out at minus45dbcom.
When today's guest swappeddreams of the auctioneer's gavel
for a Lapland winter as Santa'sassistant, little did she
realize it would be greattraining for her future career
(01:20):
in the event industry.
In this week's episode of EventNews DXB, tammy Irwin joins me
to unpack how she wound up doingexperiential before it had a
name and how she designs herevents for emotion and memory
over format.
We also talk zero wastefestivals like Corona Sunsets,
which saw 30,000 people attendover three days with nothing
(01:43):
going to the landfill, and whysustainability has to be in the
brief throughout, not just aline at the end.
She also talks candidly aboutsaying no to procurement-driven
briefs and keeping her eventagency intentionally small.
We also dig into AI's realutility speed, not strategy,
hiring for attitude and buildinga pipeline of female talent in
(02:06):
a male-dominated industry.
If you care about creatingmoments that outlast the event,
this conversation is amasterclass, so let's get into
it.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
You're listening to the Event News DXB podcast.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Tammy welcome to the podcast.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Thank you very much, lovely to see you.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
I'm going to be really predictable here.
Start right at the beginningand ask so, how did you get into
events and how did you end upin Dubai?
Speaker 2 (02:38):
Oh, my career.
When I left university, well,the dream for me was to be an
auctioneer.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Oh.
Speaker 2 (02:45):
I did art history.
I loved art history, realized Icould never do art myself.
I love theater, I love anaudience.
I want to be an auctioneer.
I ended up working for atelecoms company after I
graduated.
You know, as you do, first job,getting in, yeah, and I was
there a number of years andended up in business development
and marketing and left to goand do my my gap year like three
(03:06):
years after I'd actuallygraduated in a ski season in
Lapland who does a ski season inLapland?
I thought I was going to Vald'Azur.
I was Santa's assistant for awhole season, so that ruined my
dreams there.
Um, and then when I came back,looking for a whole new job and
I ended up working for achildren's charity called CLIC
(03:26):
now CLIC Sargent and Children vsCancer and it was a community
fundraising role.
So within that was obviouslybusiness development, sales,
marketing and events, creatingevents, supporting people with
events, which was completely newto me.
Absolutely loved it.
I love galvanizing people, Ilove helping people bring their
(03:47):
idea, their vision together, andobviously that was on a small
community level.
And then I was promoted to headof national events, which was a
really big role, bearing inmind I had no kind of formal
events experience.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Who does?
Speaker 2 (04:01):
So I ended up coming up with campaigns around sport,
around music, with the ideabeing to engage hundreds and
thousands of children at a time.
So this was an amazinginduction into events, in the
scale of events, and even thenin my head that was still
fundraising, that wasn't eventsper se.
Worked with some amazing sportspeople, music people and, most
importantly, generated amazingfinancial results, which is what
(04:23):
the aim of it was.
And then I was approached by acompany in Manchester that
specialised in sporting eventsand that was they were running
their own events with majorsporting names who perhaps have
recently retired or during theirtestimonial years, and we do
dinners, lunches aimed at thebusiness community and then
(04:44):
testimonial matches and thingslike that.
So we're just talking thereabout some of the amazing people
that I've got to work with andmanhandle during that time, from
people like Sir Alex Ferguson,sir Henry Cooper Pele.
I was Desmond Tutu's assistantat a celebrity football match
Really Random and Tutu'sassistant at a celebrity
football match Really bizarre.
(05:07):
Holding ice pack on ShaneWarne's shoulders during the
Ashes so he could sign merch andthings like that.
So for the book, I'll keep thatfor the book.
So a real and organising theselunches and dinners and we do
hundreds within a year.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
And that was that for me was organising events,
because that was on a moreintimate scale and for me, the
thing I loved, while the eventsthemselves were quite formulaic.
This was in the early 2000s.
There were no bells andwhistles.
It was a group of people comingfor a lunch or a dinner Seeing
people's faces when they mettheir sporting hero, and we'd
(05:42):
have the CEO of HSBC Bank turninto putty.
Absolutely starstruck, becausethey best stood next to Alex
Ferguson, who has been theirhero, and I realized then the
impact of events and theopportunity and the privilege of
being able to bring thesepeople together in a room.
And then same company.
My then boss came over to theRug Sevens and he said it's an
(06:06):
amazing event, We've got anamazing opportunity.
They're not doing any sportingevents like we do over there.
Let's go to Dubai.
I was just getting married.
Husband gave up his job.
We rented out the house.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
Sounds like a leap of faith.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
Well, faith sounds even more organized than I was.
And we came over, we did arecce.
We met some amazing people.
I signed up my first clientstraight away, and the expat
network is fantastic, and thesporting network particularly,
then the introduction to peoplethrough particularly the rugby
community, and I met loads ofamazing people.
(06:39):
So we were like, yeah, we'llcome for and I'm sure everybody
says this we'll come for twoyears.
Yeah, that was me.
We've just got married.
It'll be an adventure.
And about a week, two weeksbefore we were due to come, I
said to my boss I think there'ssome paperwork I'm supposed to
do.
I think you have this thingcalled a visa to go to Dubai.
When I look back at that girland I said actually we think
(07:05):
there's a recession coming sowe're not going to do it now so
you can have your desk back inManchester, I said I don't think
so.
I've committed to clients.
I've met people.
My husband my now husband hasgiven up his job.
I see there's an opportunityout there, so if you won't
support, I will go and do it onmy own you opened this box.
Speaker 1 (07:26):
Yes, yeah, absolutely .
There's no pulling me back init don't.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Yeah, don't make me clear up your mess.
So I called the people thatI've met and said, look, this
has happened.
I still want to come.
Will you support me and can Isupport you?
And they said, yep, see, whenyou get here.
And that was literally so.
When people say I had thisamazing plan, I saw this
opportunity in the market.
It wasn't.
It was a huge leap of faith,because I've met some amazing
people and I genuinely did seean opportunity over here.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
So that was 2008 obviously we all know what
happened.
That was the beginning of urbanevents.
Speaker 2 (07:55):
Yes, yeah, um, we won a contract really quickly.
The rugby sevens world cup washere.
We ran the contract to run alltheir events and also their PR
as well.
So working very closely withteam and managing that.
So that was amazing.
So we went from, we increasedthe headcount of the company a
hundred percent within twomonths, so there were two of us
(08:17):
and that was an amazing time andwe had a great opportunity
there and it was really good fun, worked our socks off for for
it and then we ran the event.
So I replicated what I'd done inthe UK.
So we had sporting teams over,sporting legends over.
We do lunches and dinners, butvery quickly and I think it was
literally in my third eventwhere we would organize it, sell
(08:37):
tables and sponsorship head ofa bank came up to me, said I
love what you're doing, but canyou just do it for us?
Like well, yes, that's wayeasier than what we've been
doing.
And I mean within a year mywhole business model had changed
.
We're being approached bybrands and organizations to run
their events for them.
So initially with the sportingand and kind of the b2b angle,
(08:58):
and then it was more consumerand brand fed.
So really quickly, the wholebusiness model model changed and
there was never a major plan,there was never a niche we were
going for.
It was literally led by whocontacted us and what we could
do and who looked and felt likegood people to work with.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
So was that the reason for?
I mean obviously fast forwardnow and you've got quite a
reputation for doing theexperiential side of things.
So was that an evolution thatyou saw as a result of clients
contacting you, or was that abit more of a conscious decision
, as you went along to kind offocus on the experiential side
versus just the?
You know, let's sell tickets tothis event.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
Interestingly, experiential has always been the
bones of what we've done.
It didn't have a name then.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
Yeah, I mean, it's a more recent term, isn't it?
Speaker 2 (09:41):
But I wanted to make sure that, even if you were just
going to a lunch with shanewarne and you're all in the room
together, I want to make sureyou walked out of that room and
you'd felt something different,you'd seen something different,
you'd experienced something.
There was something you weregoing to talk about afterwards.
That was was going to carry on.
So it started with simple touchpoints, simple things we did,
and we were really proactivewith brands and said I know,
(10:03):
barclays, you're sponsoring it,but what else can we do for you?
What's your objective?
What would actually elevatethis experience?
What does what are your keycustomers like?
So we brought it to them andhow we could bring events to
life to really make sure theywere standout experiences for
those guests.
And then, when it got to brandand they have guidelines or
they've got very specificobjectives around a product or
(10:24):
something like that it was quiteeasy for us to do that because
we've always thought about thewhole the feeling walking into
that space, walking out of thatspace, what are they going to be
the takeaways?
So that's always been reallyintegral to what we've done.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
How do you approach new business now?
I mean, what do you look for ina brief?
There are some companies outthere I think yourself included
that don't always engage in thepitch process.
So what's your criteria whenyou look at new business?
We're really picky.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
And I have the luxury of being the decision maker
that decides whether we pitch onsomething or not, and it's very
much a team collaboration.
We have a criteria.
We have a lovely roster ofexisting clients, some of which
we've been working with for over10 years, and so my priorities
my existing clients aremaximizing all opportunities for
them.
New clients that we often getapproached I would say 80% of
(11:16):
people we don't pitch, we don'twork with, we don't get involved
in anything that's a longprocurement process.
We don't get involved in thingswhere we don't get to pitch
anything that's a longprocurement process.
We don't get involved in thingswhere we don't get to pitch.
I'm not asking my team to spendtwo weeks on a proposal and
putting all of their effort andcreative ideas into something
when we're not even going to beable to sit down with a
potential client and pitch ourideas and talk through it.
(11:39):
That seems to me a waste oftime if it's just on numbers.
So we look at the client briefand also the brief doesn't have
to be that detailed.
The client needs to know whatis their objective.
Do they know their own brand?
How do they feel about theirown brand?
What do they want what theirobjective is and budget.
I need some parameters ofbudget, because we all know
(12:00):
there's a massive differencebetween no budget and no budget,
because we all know there's amassive difference between no
budget and no budget.
So we need a number to makesure they're not just fishing
for ideas and things like that.
And then they'll be the clientswe work with.
We sit down with them first ofall, draw as much information
out of them, especially if it'sa new client and we don't know
their brands.
And then we, you know again, wetry to be as strict as possible.
(12:23):
We don't even send anythingover till.
We're pitching in person.
We're like a 90s ad agency.
That is how we like to work.
I want to see the whites ofpeople's eyes.
I want to see their visceralreaction to what they're showing
.
We're showing them and I know,even though assisting clients
sometimes that always isn'talways especially with some of
the major brands we deal withthere is a process we have to go
through.
But we know, know we're alwaysgoing to get that opportunity to
(12:43):
pitch and I purposely kept theagency small so we can give 110%
focus on our clients and we getto work with nice people and we
don't have an industry or aniche that we work with.
If it's a brand that excites usor product that excites us and
they seem a really nice team,even if they're not entirely
(13:04):
sure what they need to do, wecan fill the gaps in for them.
We can do that for them.
That's what we're here for.
But if you know what your brandstands for and you're a
creative or a good team to workwith, then we will go all out
for you it's interesting.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
I don't think you're alone in in that uh, in that
regard with in terms of keepingyour your business to a certain
size, we had Adam Griffiths onfrom Enigma recently and David
Balfour from Lightblue, and bothof them said exactly the same
thing that they actually reducedtheir client roster quite
significantly and that the levelthey were at at the moment was
where they wanted to keep thebusiness.
(13:38):
And again, all in relation tobeing able to service their
existing clients to the best oftheir ability, because I think
we all know, don't't we?
It's a lot cheaper and easierto keep your existing clients
than it is to go out and findnew ones, which kind of
dovetails into my next commentas well, which was we've had a
quite a few people on thepodcast comment on how cyclical
(13:59):
the nature of our industry is aswell at the moment, and many of
the people that have been onhave commented that we seem to
be in a in a at a time wheremany of the briefs that they're
getting are all procurementdriven.
What's your feelings on this?
What's been your experience?
Speaker 2 (14:12):
a hundred percent agree.
We're getting more of that, uh,especially um new clients
people that haven't worked withus before the, the new briefs
and things that are coming in,and some of our existing clients
, like I say, some of the bigbrands we work with, because the
, the mothership isn't basedhere, it is in the uk.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
It is in germany.
Speaker 2 (14:29):
It is wherever it is, and there is a process for um.
You know legal transparencythey have to go through as well,
but those we still.
If there is procurementinvolved but we still get to
picture the actual delivery team, the marketing team, then we
will, we'll take part.
If it's just procurement,absolutely not.
We don't get involved in that,because you need a relationship
with clients and you need.
Often what's on their briefisn't what they need or want or
(14:52):
will get the outcome that theywant.
It's not until you have thoseconversations and draw the
information at them and ask theright questions that you
actually say well, I know youthink you wanted this or you
asked for this.
We think this might actuallyhit the spot a lot more and if
they're doing a series of events, for example, this could
actually cost savings in thelong run.
If we do this and we can giveyou a much more effective and
(15:14):
creative solution, whereas ifyou're just sending spreadsheets
into an email address, no, andwe're creative agencies, that's
what we do.
We're coming up with ideas forthings.
We're creative agencies, that'swhat we do.
We're coming up with ideas forthings.
So, and that's not going tocome across on a piece of paper
or without you know, anexplanation, or meeting people
face to face where do you thinkthis push towards procurement
driven briefs comes from?
Speaker 1 (15:34):
is it just purely budget budget, is it?
I mean, obviously, look some ofthese clients.
They've they've had experienceof events already, and often
very successful experiences, soit kind of leaves me scratching
my head as to why they wouldthen gravitate towards more of a
procurement process rather thango with something that's been
tried and tested, that they knowthey've got results from as
well.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
I don't know the answer to that, but I think
whether it's a change in seniormanagement coming in in some
companies and that we're goingto do things the new way because
their remit is to shave off thebottom line, because you're
right, you can have a reallygood relationship with someone
and suddenly the process haschanged, or that that team
because again, the cyclicalnature of this of Dubai in the
(16:16):
Middle East, means you build agreat relationship with somebody
and they're they're gone.
A new person comes in andthey're going to shake things up
.
So I don't know where it'scoming from.
It's bottom line at the end ofthe day, isn't it?
So whether it is from a seniormanagement's perspective that's
just looking at that bottom linerather than what they're
creating for their customers andtheir brand.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Changing tacks slightly.
You've won plenty of awardsover the years.
What's been one that's probablymeant the most to you?
Speaker 2 (16:42):
I think like anything , probably your first time, Yep,
so it was the.
I think it was the what's OnAward for Best Live Music Event
and it's actually.
It's giving me chills thinkingabout that event now.
Speaker 1 (16:56):
Brilliant.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
We were lucky enough to do gosh back in probably 2016
to 19,.
2016 to 19,.
We did a series of huge musicevents for Smirnoff and for
corona, and so corona sunsetswas an existing global platform
that we activated three years.
Here and again, we we tookcorona's global toolkit and
(17:18):
elevated and said we can do waybetter than this.
Not only can we regionalize it,we can actually go way further
with your sustainability targetsand objectives.
We want to produce something.
Again, we have an amazingclient who we worked really
closely with and we all set thetarget.
Well, let's wipe this out.
So you're going back to Globalsaying look what we've done, so
that not only was it Best LiveMusic Event, it was also we won
(17:42):
a award for sustainability aswell.
So it was the first, as far asI know, still the only fully
zero waste music festival in theMiddle East, which is no mean
feat for 30,000 people overthree days.
Yeah, no kidding.
It was absolute, phenomenal andit was a huge amount of
collaboration and being happy todo what's not been done before
(18:05):
and, rather than coming up withwalls, coming up with okay
solutions how do we do this?
How do we make this happen?
That was fantastic.
And then my other standoutevent that we were able to win
awards for is the Smirnoff SoundCollective.
Again, that was a globalplatform, but New York had done
a tiny little pool party and wesaid let's just buy, we do
things way bigger.
(18:26):
And and we said, let's just buy, we do things way bigger.
And we came up with thisridiculous, in hindsight stage
design with arches, huge archtruss in a really windy location
.
That was probably one of themost terrifying setups of my
life.
Looked amazing, unbelievablestage.
And then just looking back andseeing I think the headline tj
was and just seeing rehab stoodon the TJ booth looking down at
(18:50):
these thousands and so oftenwhen you're in an event you
don't get that moment to juststop.
Speaker 1 (18:55):
Take it all in.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
Take it all in, and we did.
I was on the side of the stagegoing.
I love my job.
This is what we do it for.
The four sleepless nights I'vejust had, worrying about trust
and weight loads and things likethat.
This is worth it, absolutelyworth it.
The two week set up Absolutelyworth it.
Look at these people having agreat time and events like that
go back to global and thenthat's just redefined what they
(19:18):
do on a global platform.
Speaker 1 (19:20):
Now you mentioned your Zero Waste Music Festival.
Lots of companies claimsustainability as one of their
core values, but you, you know Ithink we both know that in many
cases it's often just lipservice.
How are companies tackling thewhole sustainability issue at
the moment within the eventindustry here in in the region?
Speaker 2 (19:38):
obviously I can only speak in detail about ourselves.
So I was on a um a panel.
There were four of us, was alecturer, uh, somebody from pico
and then somebody from a higherpower company as well.
So that was a reallyinteresting panel of people to
be on, because we've gone fromlarge-scale production right
down to delivery and there thereare agencies doing really great
things and they're justcracking on with it.
(20:01):
They're not making a big songand dance about it.
It's like ourselves.
It just becomes part of yourDNA.
You just get on with it andit's it's.
It's just underlying.
One of the one of the thingsyou do is your rois internally
along with mp, mvp scores andthings like that.
So it's something that we we'rereally conscious of when we're
designing an event and alsowe're taking to the client's
accounts as well.
(20:21):
So some clients don't care,they just want a really amazing
event.
They they don't need to reportanything back.
Well, whether or like it,they're going to get a zero
waste report from us.
So we do everything frommonitoring food waste to how
much production was hired av,where has it come from?
How many local artists have wesupported?
Local suppliers?
Have we supported how weminimized what?
(20:43):
You know?
Something we might have broughtin, but we found a solution
locally.
And we do that as a matter ofcourse because we want to track
as well.
And there are some of ourclients, some big brands, that
have been able to take thesereports and then they go back to
their global and they getawards for best practice and
then we get asked to helpimplement these things for their
(21:05):
agencies globally as well.
So we are delighted to do thatbecause sustainability is key to
what we do, because there is somuch waste in our industry.
Unfortunately and I think moreso here because the cost of
space is so expensive it'scheaper to rebuild something
than it is to store it so it canbe reused again.
(21:25):
So, again, if we've got longcampaigns, that's brilliant, and
we work with our productionpartners and we make sure the
materials are correct to do itand that they will have the
longevity that we need, becausethey're being transported from A
to B, things like that.
We also ask our partners right,we're designing this, do you
have anything in stock that canalready be repurposed for this?
So we're not reinventing thewheel and we're you know how can
(21:52):
we tweak things.
So it's it's cost effective,but it's also, most importantly,
it's sustainable as well.
So this is key to what we do.
I know there are agencies um,because I was, I've been a judge
on for two years so there aresome agencies that do a lot
about carbon footprintmonitoring and offsetting and
things like that, and they'reand they're doing great work
there.
But I know, obviously, for alot of agencies, it will be.
We have a recycling bin at theevent and things like that.
(22:14):
So, yeah, it needs to becomepart of everybody's DNA.
It needs to be to, you know,key to what we do.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
Yeah, I mean we try hard with Warehouse 4, which is
obviously my other business, theevent venue and we try and do
our bit to encourage, you know,people, even if it's just like
please don't bring plastic waterbottles.
You know we've got a hugedispenser there, we'll give you
the water, just don't bring inplastic water bottles.
I had another guest on recentlywho gave us quite a really good
tip actually Adam Parry, whoruns the event industry news in
(22:42):
the UK and also Event Tech Liveand he said recyclable lanyards.
Well, I thought that was quitegood there, speaking of tech.
Technology is now firmlyembedded in a lot of events.
So for somebody in experiential, do you use tech and if you do,
when do you decide to use it?
Speaker 2 (23:03):
When is it a benefit to enhancing the experience?
So we do use tech in events,but we use it very carefully.
So I know that one of yourprevious interviews ben was
talking about don't just put ledscrews everywhere and he's even
a tech company, yeah, um.
So if we've got content that Ireally we want to immerse people
in, then we bring in technologyfor that we also use it.
And this is not reinventing,you know.
This is.
This is not revolutionary, butif it's a a way of interacting,
(23:27):
to engage people, and that itenables people to interact
better with something,especially if there's an
educational element to the event, we're doing so.
We recently celebrated theMcAllen's 200th anniversary, an
amazing brand that we work very,very closely with and a great
example of a brand who embracetheir agency.
They've taken us to Scotland.
We live and breathe their brand, which is back to your question
(23:50):
about procurement versuslong-term partnerships.
There was a huge amount of over200 years.
There was a huge amount ofinformation to impart and I did
want people to walk out going ohmy God, I didn't know Macallan
was that old or that.
They partnered with that, withPeter Blake, 20 years ago on
this amazing campaign.
So we brought in tech elementsthere to really make the
(24:11):
storytelling process interactive.
It's brilliant for things likeif you're doing internal
conferences and you wantimmediate reactions so we're
doing surveys and things likethat to stop the old style
around the room with amicrophone kind of thing.
So where relevant, we bring intech.
We're constantly looking fornew tech ideas or ways that we
can integrate it seamlessly butwithout distraction.
(24:31):
That's my key element.
It's got to add value and notdistract people during the event
.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Yeah, and I guess we can't talk about tech without at
least having a few words aboutAI.
What are your thoughts on AI?
Speaker 2 (24:43):
I'm sick of thinking about AI.
Speaker 1 (24:44):
I know, but I mean, you know it is the buzzword of
the moment and I think you knowour industry is amongst you know
, a whole load of others, nearlyeveryone who is both
celebrating and concerned aboutthe rise of AI and what it means
to jobs within the industry.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
It's here, it's not going anywhere.
Nobody's putting the lid backon that Pandora's box and we are
, as all agencies will be, umare embracing ai.
It's adding massive value in inprograms, existing programs.
So, for example, sketch upadobe where they have the ai
functions.
It saves time and it just helpswith the finessing or changing
looks and feels and things likethat and it's adding great value
(25:21):
.
It's saving time, whichultimately saves clients money
or means we can give them moreoptions in a specific time.
So ai in those in that umcontext is really useful.
Chat gbt again.
It can be a useful quick anddirty tool to just look at
something.
I suddenly check something.
But for example, when I'm in alittle recruitment phase, yeah
(25:42):
and I can spot a chat gT CV orletter straight away, and so
then my concern is is it makingus more dumb?
And I think there's.
The Roy Stewart was talkingabout it only yesterday.
There's been some research onchat, gpt versus Google, versus
using your brain, and alreadythey can see a decline in mental
(26:03):
capability.
Speaker 1 (26:04):
Benoit had an interesting take on this.
He noticed that one of theareas where they introduced AI
into his business was in HR, wasexactly in recruitment.
At first he said you know, Iwas really kind of sceptical
about this.
And he said what they foundover the course of the time so
far that they've been using itis that the AI doesn't recognise
nationalities or gender etc.
(26:25):
Right, and it just picks whatit thinks is the right candidate
for the job.
And he said what transpiredwith his business, electra, is
that they've got a much widerrange of sort of nationalities
and people coming on board rightnow Because obviously in the
past you sort of gravitate tothe people that you know and if
you're European then you kind ofgo the European route.
If you're Indian you go theIndian route.
(26:47):
You just go within the circlethat you know.
Ai doesn't do that.
It puts what it thinks are thebest candidates in front of you.
And he said that's been a realeye-opener for him.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Oh, that's really interesting and automated
functions like that it couldprobably really support with
backend functions make thingsmore efficient, and that's a
great example of the use of aiyeah um, and we're actually
using some of those tools tohelp us with our selections at
the moment.
So, for example, the cvs I willbe receiving will have been
through that where I've askedyou know the criteria and
they're only spitting out theones that are, because you're
(27:17):
obviously right, you are, youare unbiasedly biased to things
because you will, you willrecognize the, the company they
work for, or something like that, if you're a certain
nationality and things like that.
So that, yeah, whether we likeit or not, that happens.
So for that and it makes thatprocess more efficient and
probably especially a regionlike here where you might get
applications that really aren'trelevant.
(27:37):
So I think that you know thereare benefits to AI and they are
going to help make functionsslicker and more time-effective
and therefore morecost-effective.
And in the creative industryyou could argue.
Well, if some of those thingsare made quicker or automated,
does that give us more time tobe creative?
Does that give us more time toactually think and have had
space to do it?
But you know, things likecopywriting really concern me
(28:01):
because that is an art.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Journalism.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
Copyright, journalism .
These are arts and even now youcan see in national newspapers
we read something and you think,yeah, so the editors, the desk,
hasn't checked that, becausethat doesn't seem quite right.
So, yes, it's here to stay.
It's how it's used.
Speaker 1 (28:16):
Yeah, I also take heart from the fact that you
know, as good as AI can be andas useful as it can be in the
event industry, it cannotreplace personal interaction.
It really can't.
And I take heart from peoplelike, what was it?
Mark Cuban recently andsomebody else who ran, whose
name I forget, who ran an AIcompany, and Cuban came out and
(28:37):
said, look, if I had to put mymoney anywhere in the next 10
years, it's going to be inevents, precisely because of the
.
Well, one of the reasons wasbecause of the rise of AI and
the fact that you know, as moreand more you know, fake content
is out there.
People will crave authentic andreal experiences, which, for us
, is this it's face-to-face, andAI, however good it gets, will
never be able to recreate thatface-to-face, that personal
(29:00):
touch of being in a room withfriends, colleagues, peers, et
cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 2 (29:05):
And if brands want to connect with their customers,
then they need to do that inperson, because otherwise it's
going to become faceless or theyou know.
It's a churn of content outthere and I think what brands
will start to do is really focus, because it's very difficult
now for brands to cut throughbecause there is so much noise
out there.
It's not like it was beforesocial media and you can have
those direct conversations moreit's there's a lot of noise.
(29:25):
So we'll probably see the riseof brands really focusing on
their niches.
So a smaller audience, butactually a really loving
audience, a really focused,engaged audience.
So we'll start to see more ofthat as well, which I think is a
great way for the brands.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
Now we work in an industry that is notoriously
male dominated.
Tough question when do youthink that comes from and why
aren't?
Speaker 2 (29:51):
there more women in the event industry?
I wish I could answer that one,and it's actually quite hard
for me because I've got, we'vegot one man, that's it.
The rest of us are all women,so I'm going.
What do you mean?
Speaker 1 (29:59):
there are no women.
I'm surrounded by women.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
And in fact one of my team.
He was going through anequipment process at the moment
and she even said yesterday.
She said I mean they're allwomen.
I mean I looked at the guys butthey just weren't as good as
the women.
So maybe we again unconsciousbias in our team.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
I would concur with that.
I would hire a female eventmanager.
If you want something done, yougive it to a busy woman.
Absolutely no-transcript.
Speaker 2 (30:45):
More of that as well.
You don't need to be all thequalified because, nothing beats
experience.
I think there needs to be moresupport for women coming through
and I'd be interested to see,through universities and
obviously because they're nowoff, for example, event
management courses and thingslike that and creative courses
that the support that are comingthrough.
I don't know the answer to that, because there's no need for
(31:08):
there's no obvious reason for agender divide.
It's not huge on-site elementsor things like that as well,
it's creative, which should be50-50.
It's management, it'sorganization it should be 50-50
or one way.
So we do what we can.
We've always had an internprogramme where we've taken
individuals and they've alwaysbeen female who are either
(31:31):
recent graduates or are currentstudying, and we're actually
recruiting for a full-time andour internship is the idea is
they stay on it's not just athree months and that they grow.
And I see my ex-interns now andthey've got really senior jobs
in the event industry and thedifferent elements of it.
It's in in power companies andthings like that, not
(31:51):
traditionally you know, femaleif we're, if we're thinking
about traditional female rolesand nothing makes me prouder and
they come bounding up and theysay oh my god, I remember you
were the first one to let me aninternship 10 years ago and
everything I've learned then andit's thanks to you that I had
the enthusiasm and the passionto get to where I am now.
So we are doing our individualbit.
(32:13):
More needs to be done, but I'malso interested on the influx of
people coming in the industrynow and what is happening there.
Speaker 1 (32:21):
I was just going to touch on that because you
mentioned, obviously, yourintern program.
Are you seeing a lot of peoplewanting to get into the event
industry?
Because there's a lot writtenabout Gen Z and specific
generations, about not beingwilling to put in the hard yards
, being lazy, et cetera, etcetera, and events are hard work
and very stressful and itobviously isn't for everyone.
(32:43):
So are you seeing that pipelinecoming through?
Speaker 2 (32:46):
Maybe I answer this question in a week's time, as
we've been through all the newintern CDs.
Speaker 1 (32:50):
Absolutely yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
I've definitely seen a change over my 18 years here.
A lot less coming through nowthan would have done before,
than we've had before, but a lotmore, a lot different
nationalities coming through nowthan before.
We would have been veryeuropean focused again, not just
by where we were advertising,probably because what people saw
we did.
So it's good to see we'regetting far more nationalities
(33:12):
coming through.
What I am finding is a lot ofthe graduates are how do I
explain this?
Hugely educated.
I've got people coming to mewith, but they've never done a
day's work and I need somebodyto be able to converse with
customers, to be able to work ina team.
There's also a lot of requestscan I work from home?
Well, no, it's your first job.
(33:33):
This is how you learn YouTubevideos won't cut it.
Absolutely Because the bestlessons I learned were watching
my boss negotiating and mewondering where he or she was
going with that conversation,and then comes the end point and
go ah, that's clever.
So, yes, you have to be inperson.
So we're seeing a change inpeople's expectations of what
(33:56):
they're worth financially, wherethey think they should sit
within the business and wherethey will be sitting physically
and historically within thebusiness.
But those gems are still outthere.
We've had some cracking teammembers and we have a really
good staff retention.
I tend to only lose people toother countries which I can't
(34:17):
compete with.
Speaker 1 (34:18):
No, you can't compete with a global move.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
I'm gone some places I'm like, could you work from
the uk, could you?
And that's you know.
And there's tears when peopleleave, which is great and and I
love it when people leave andthey go on and they do great
things and they keep in touchwith us.
So I like, I'm quite happy tobe an incubator, to go on to
other things.
So long answer to let me answerthat question for you next week
when I see the talent comingthrough.
(34:41):
But you can.
You, only I'm looking forattitude.
You can teach all the otherskills.
I need someone with the rightattitude when they walk through
my door and and the rest you canteach, and they don't always
have the right attitude now,when you look back on your
career to date, what are thebiggest things that you take
away from it?
Speaker 1 (35:00):
I don't't just mean like a you know, a specific
event that stood out, but maybeon a personal level, what are
the things that you take away?
I mean running your ownbusiness, for example.
It can be a lonely experience,yeah, yeah.
What are the things that you'vetaken away over the years?
Speaker 2 (35:12):
When I look back now, I just think what a ride the
opportunities that I've beengiven and the opportunities I've
created for myself.
As we know, it is 50% luck andit is 50% graft on that luck
Putting yourself in the rightplace at the right time or
putting your hand up to say Ican do that and thinking I'm not
(35:34):
entirely sure how I can do that, but I know I've got enough
support that we can make thathappen and we will do it.
And looking back at the resultsand that's how you build your
portfolio.
But, yeah, I've worked withsome amazing clients.
I've worked with some amazingindividuals, from creative to
sports stars, to music stars, toengineers, to content creators,
(35:56):
and it's this army of peoplethat you have, that family
around that specific event orproject or period of time that
you learn from and that you giveback to.
And you all stand back and lookat those results.
So, yeah, the opportunities I'vebeen given, the things I've
done, the things I've been partof.
I'm honoured to be in thisindustry that I fell into.
(36:17):
There was no great dream to bein events, but to have fallen
into this industry and to get todo things I do on a daily basis
and to get, to be able to go.
I've had an idea what we coulddo.
Do you like it, client?
And they go.
Yeah, let's do it.
And that's the greatestprivilege when a client trusts
you to take that and you knowyour vision, their vision, and
run with it.
(36:39):
I, yeah, that's the things Ilook back thank.
Thank you for putting yourtrust in me.
Clients, thank you for yoursupport, all of my colleagues,
internal and external as well.
And yeah, there's a booksomewhere with all the stories
over the last 30 years, I think.
Speaker 1 (36:53):
We all suffer from time to time from imposter
syndrome, don't we?
Do you think you could lookback over your time in events?
Was there a specific point atwhich you kind of went?
You know what?
Actually, I kind of know myshit.
Does it ever happen?
I know what I'm doing.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
I don't know if that ever I mean women again worse
than men on this I think it'sprobably only in the last few
years actually older and wiser,suffering falls a lot less
gladly now, and you just have totake stock of the things you've
delivered and the things thatyou've done and go yeah, we can
do this.
It might be a different form,it might be a different shape,
(37:29):
but we've been here and I thinksometimes we all have to
remember it's not brain surgery.
We are not saving lives.
We are showing people a damngood time and we were showing
the clients their money is wellinvested, but we are not saving
lives and I think sometimes wehave to take stock.
You know what, what theparameters of what we're doing
and how can I do it mostcreatively?
So I think that's probably onlybeen in the last few years yeah
(37:51):
, I think it's a fine line,isn't it?
Speaker 1 (37:53):
I mean, there is a point I think that we all reach
or I hope we reach anyway whereyou, you do realize that the sum
of your experience is quitevast and that you are capable.
You do know what you're doing.
At the same time, I'm alsohumble enough to know that I
will never stop learning.
There is always something thatI don't know, there is always
something that I can take awayfrom someone else, and I think
(38:15):
the smartest of us in the roomas well will surround ourselves
with people from whom we cangain even more knowledge from.
Speaker 2 (38:20):
If you're not doing something which makes you
nervous or apprehensive, you'renot learning, you're not
changing anything.
Get out of your comfort zone,yeah you need to be out of your
comfort zone.
You need to question is thisgoing to come out the way I
wanted it to have?
I got the right Because you'repushing your boundaries.
If it's all smooth sailing allthe way through, you're not
progressing.
Smooth sailing all the waythrough, you're not progressing,
you're coasting.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (38:41):
Well and finally, I ask all my guests this question
I'm a music fan, I know you are.
We've talked about it a littlebit earlier.
We all use music in differentways.
I get home and stick the vinylyes, vinyl Back to vinyl,
showing my age again, and then,just, you know, sit back, relax.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
I'm curious, though, what's on your?
Speaker 1 (39:05):
playlist I'm a club kid.
Oh, I'm a club and rave kid ofthe 90s.
Speaker 2 (39:07):
Yeah, my, my youth is hacienda um progress, rehab,
renaissance.
That that's my youth, so thatthat is my happy place.
That music I mean.
I even managed to wangle doingmy dissertation at university on
the haacienda Fantastic, themost engaged subject I've ever
been on.
I love that euphoria momentwith everybody together, those
(39:30):
big tunes, music dropping.
So whether it is HaciendaClassicals because that's what
we're getting nowadays here, orlarge live concerts, I love that
moment.
Everybody together, liveconcerts.
Uh, I love that momenteverybody's together.
So me, if I'm, if I'm relaxing,it's a little bit of graham
park pauletta, mike pickering,sasha that would be my go-to
playlist fantastic.
Speaker 1 (39:48):
I'm going to leave you with a bit of a sobering
thought.
I know you're not too active oninstagram, but did you see the
uh the clip recently withunderworld performing?
I did look at that tammy and Idid think, oh my god, are they
that old?
And then immediately thought amI that old?
Speaker 2 (40:01):
I was that old, oh God, yeah, I think I'm Peter Pan
, until yeah.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
Until you look in the mirror and then you go, oh, ok,
ok.
And finally, what are youlooking forward to in the next
12 months?
Speaker 2 (40:15):
Oh, we've got a good year planned, so, literally, the
next 2026 is looking reallygood and, as I mentioned,
expansion, so that's key for me.
At the moment, I keep theagency small, but we're bringing
on more creative talent andwe're bringing on younger talent
as well that we're bringing upthrough the business as well, so
that's really exciting.
At the moment, we've got somereally exciting projects in the
pipeline with clients we've beenworking with for a long time
(40:38):
who are giving us a cup lunchand they've said we know what
you can do just blow our socksoff, um, which is the greatest
form of flattery ever.
Speaker 1 (40:45):
And, yeah, I'm really excited about the next 12
months and what we're going tobe delivering creatively tammy's
been fantastic chatting withyou pleasure to see you thanks
for joining me on the podcastyou event news dxb is brought to
(41:11):
you by warehouse 4, probablydubai's best independent event
venue.
Thank you myself, ian Carlos.
The studio engineer and editorwas Roy DeMonte, the executive
producer was myself and JoeMorrison, and this podcast was
produced by W4 Podcast StudioDubai, and if you haven't done
so already, please do click thatfollow or subscribe button.
(41:33):
We'll see you next time.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!