January 28, 2025 • 33 mins
EventNewsDXB Ep.3 - Tyler Davis-Smith: From Stage to Spotlight & Turning Adversity Into Success.
EventNewsDXB is supported by Warehouse Four - Dubai's best independent event venue.
Join host Ian Carless as he talks to Tyler Davis-Smith, founder of Energie Entertainment, about his journey from aspiring performer in the UK to building a thriving entertainment agency in Dubai.
Hear how he turned adversity into opportunity during one of the worse times in living memory for the events industry and how he now manages the challenge of maintaining quality amid rising demand.
Tyler also discusses expanding into Saudi Arabia, the need for cultural and skills-based training, and initiatives like BeastEd to develop local talent. Plus, he shares personal anecdotes, music tastes, and upcoming ventures in an insightful and entertaining chat!
Podcast Rundown
• Tyler's early career and transition into event management
• The founding of Energy Entertainment during COVID-19
• Challenges and successes in starting a new business
• Importance of maintaining quality in a budget-conscious market
• Insights on the growth of the event industry in the GCC
• The role of Saudi Arabia in the Middle Eastern event landscape
• Knowledge transfer and training opportunities for local talent
• The balance between short deadlines and quality delivery
• Tyler's thoughts on upcoming events and personal interests
Production Credits:
Presented by: Ian Carless
Studio Engineer & Editor: Roy D'Monte
Executive Producers: Ian Carless & Joe Morrison
Produced by: EventNewsDXB & W4 Podcast Studio
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Ian Carless (00:00):
Welcome to Event News DXB.
Before we begin, I've got aquick favour to ask.
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(00:20):
Thanks a bunch.
You're listening to the EventNews DXB podcast.
Your behind-the-scenes lookinto the world of events in
Dubai, the UAE and the MENAregion.
I'm Ian Carlos and each weekI'll bring you the latest news,
(00:43):
industry trends and insiderstories shaping one of the
world's most dynamic eventmarkets.
From professional insights toDubai's most inspiring success
stories, we've got everythingyou need to stay ahead in that
ever-evolving event industry.
So, whether you're an eventplanner, a brand manager or just
someone who's utterlypassionate about the power of
(01:03):
events, you're in the rightplace.
This week we're talking to thefounder and CEO of Energy
Entertainment, tyler Davis-Smith.
After originally studying for acareer in musical theatre, a
freelance project saw him landin Dubai, where he quickly began
to see the potential forstarting his own company
delivering events.
Fast forward to 2025 and EnergyEntertainment has quickly
(01:25):
become one of the leadingcompanies specialising in talent
booking and deliveringhigh-profile entertainment
events.
Tyler, welcome to the show.
Thank you for having me, mostwelcome.
I want to start at thebeginning.
How did you get into events Now?
I did actually have a quicklook at your LinkedIn page last
night and you seem to be one ofthe few people that seem to know
exactly what you wanted to dofrom an early age.
(01:46):
You studied for well, certainlyfor theatre design, didn't you?
Which led into events?
Yeah, so initially.
Tyler Davis-Smith (01:52):
I mean, I actually wanted to be a
performer.
It's funny because every day onour accounting software I've
got secret questions and it sayswhat did you want to be when
you grow up?
And the answer was actor asopposed to.
I haven't grown up.
Yeah, exactly peter pan, thatwas what I wanted to be.
No, so it was performing from ayoung age.
I performed in lots ofdifferent things.
Obviously you start withamateur dramatic and then when I
(02:15):
left school, I had to sort ofmake some decisions on what
options I wanted to take tostudy and I initially started
with law, politics, sociology,sociology, critical thinking and
performance studies.
I lasted about a week of doingthat the AS levels of that and
then I changed to BTEC inmusical theatre.
I carried on with the law onthe side, but then I went to
(02:36):
drama school in London, touredin theatres, worked on cruise
ships, so singing, prancingaround, and that was kind of the
entertainment segment segment.
So all of that and that'sactually what brought me out to
Dubai, right, the UAE initiallyat what point did you realize?
Ian Carless (02:52):
actually, I want to make the switch here.
I don't just want to be thetalent, I want to be the
organizer.
Tyler Davis-Smith (02:57):
I never realized that there was no point
, there was no strategicdecision no, you know definitely
not.
It just sort of happened.
Suddenly someone says can youstage manage on a job?
I think people thought I had myhead screwed on and I started
stage managing.
And then the next thing was anold can you show call an event.
Then it was okay, can youproduction manage?
(03:19):
And it was like, okay, nowyou're building an event, which
always I found a little bitbizarre because I can't even
hang a picture frame up at homeand I am literally useless at
building anything.
So then doing the productionmanagement and then producing.
But I think that when you areproducing there's all different
sort of segments of my lifewhere I utilize and pick from
(03:41):
all of those strengths.
So I didn't study events andsometimes I wonder, you know, if
I'd studied events and donethat at 21, come out of
university and done that, youknow where would I be?
But actually I took a routethat has given me sort of lots
of experience in lots ofdifferent aspects of events,
which now I think put me in agood position to be where I am.
(04:02):
So I've done lots of kind oflearning on the job.
Ian Carless (04:05):
Yeah.
Tyler Davis-Smith (04:05):
Although I did apply to do a master's the
other day, although I'm notentirely sure if it's a good
idea whatsoever because I'mreally really busy.
But yeah, lots of it comes fromjust learning on the job, so it
just sort of happened.
Ian Carless (04:18):
Now.
Energy Entertainment isobviously your company now and
it's going from strength tostrength and we'll get on to
talk about that as well.
But interestingly, you actuallyformed the company during COVID
.
Tyler Davis-Smith (04:30):
Yeah, I think it was.
A lot of people thought I wasslightly mad.
Well, you certainly had time onyour hands.
That was the big thing thoughit was.
I think I'd gone into, I say,lots of what I did initially
with the stage management.
The show calling all revolvedaround, you know, still the show
of an event, because an eventisn't just made up of a show.
(04:50):
Events can be all sorts ofdifferent things and you know I
was involved in corporate eventsand summits and government
events and things like that.
And during COVID was a time,ultimately, where we all had a
chance to stop and a chance tothink about what we were doing
and I sort of looked at whathave I been doing for the past
few years?
(05:11):
What do I want to be doing in10 years time?
And ultimately I didn't want tobe doing some of the roles that
I had been doing.
It gave me a chance to sitthere and look and assess what
is in the market currently inthe sort of GCC region, what I
thought I can do better than,and ultimately, had there been
(05:33):
no COVID, there would be noenergy, because I thought I was
happy as a freelancer in certainroles.
It was that pause that chanceto reflect and that chance to
sort of you know, decide andreinvent your own future.
Ian Carless (05:48):
Yeah, and I think that was the case for many
people across many industries.
Wasn't it that chance forintrospection and that chance to
be just still and be present?
And I think people came outwith it with some quite
revealing truths home truths,didn't they?
Some people had complete careerchanges.
Other people just decided thata better work-life balance was
something they wanted to try andwork towards yeah, a hundred
percent.
Tyler Davis-Smith (06:08):
It's taking that time to just stop and
sometimes, you know, wouldn't itbe nice.
Now I said the other day uh,obviously we're now sort of four
and a bit years old as abusiness.
I said, do you know what?
I just like it to stop for aminute so I could reassess again
, yeah, on where we're at, andgo okay, what is the strategy
for the next five years of thebusiness?
(06:29):
Yeah, I don't have that time todo that anymore because we're
constant at what we're doing.
Yeah, but but that time duringCOVID, not only did I, you know,
assess where I wanted to be, itgave me a chance to build a.
I didn't want to build abusiness, I wanted to build a
brand and a sort of strategy.
So it gave a chance to to builda.
I didn't want to build abusiness, I want to be able to
build a brand and a sort ofstrategy.
So it gave a chance to look atwhat did I want the logo to be?
(06:49):
Like, you know, have time toconsult with other people,
competitor analysis, all of thatsort of stuff.
You know what?
What is it that makes usdifferent?
What am I going to go?
What's our unique selling pointand and all of that, I looked
at the different businesses thatare there.
I booked a lot of theentertainment agencies because
(07:10):
I'd worked event agency side andwhat was a challenge for me
when I was booking anentertainment agency.
So it gave me a chance toreally sort of, like you know,
look at that and do a lot ofresearch so that when I did
launch the business I was in areally good place.
Ian Carless (07:26):
How difficult was it to actually start the
business and get up and running?
Very difficult.
Tyler Davis-Smith (07:31):
There were no funds.
I ultimately ran out of money.
I took a bank loan from the UKon the mindset of if I go
bankrupt, at least I go bankruptin the UK rather than here,
because that would have been aproblem.
That was a, you know, astarting point.
Then, uh, launching thebusiness to being sort of first
of all, getting people to trustyou, and then the next thing was
(07:55):
, when were we coming out ofcovid?
So I, I launched in august andthen we had a little bit of a
break and it would be like, okay, the entertainment can happen.
Then there was an entertainmentban again, then there was a
little break and then, you know,it was really difficult to sort
of get gain any traction at thestart.
But we did a good job and I waslucky to have some really
(08:17):
really good people around me.
But it wasn't easy and it'sstill not easy.
Just, the problems are slightlydifferent problems than they
were then.
Ian Carless (08:26):
Yeah, you mentioned you're four years down the line
now.
How have you managed thatprocess of scaling the business
then?
Obviously, you know cashflow isone, but there's a whole host
of other things that you've gotto consider in terms of scaling
as well, and you know there's alot of businesses that grow too
quickly.
A hundred percent.
Tyler Davis-Smith (08:41):
Scaling is hard Knowing when to scale, when
not to scale.
Are you scaling too much?
It's a challenge.
And then also, I have bigambitions and I want to run away
and you know, scale immediately.
But, yeah, I don't necessarilyhave the money to do that.
There's no millionaire that'sbehind me, there's no investors
(09:02):
or anything like that.
So you know, we started out by alot of freelancers and a lot of
people you know, just jumpingin.
Then you take on your firstfull-time hires.
That's scary because you'rereally committing to something
and I think that, as an owner ofa business, you are committing
to looking after people, lookingafter their families.
(09:24):
It's really, really, reallyimportant to me that you know
all of those people we are.
We have security for them.
If they're working alongside me, they should know that it's a
safe space.
Um, so you, you scale up andthen, you know, your challenges
become different.
We're now, I think we're about13 or 14 full time and it's
(09:44):
difficult when to scale.
I always look to scale up inJanuary and July because we can
look at the end of a financialyear, sort of a January to
December year, but then also wework in an event season, so
we're looking at kind ofSeptember to June, so we'll
assess and see where we were.
I feel like we're always kindof playing catch up, because we
(10:04):
scale up, we get more work andthen we're like, wow, we were
really busy again.
You get more people and thenyou get more work, and then you
need more people and then youget more work.
And this year was a year wherewe didn't want to grow too much.
This year we decided that weactually wanted to.
It was really important to usto sort of stabilise everything
(10:27):
that we were doing, because wehad to change trade licences, we
needed to get new systemsoperate in procedures, we added
a bit more support in thefinance and admin department
because I felt like we werepotentially a house of cards
that could come tumbling downand we really, really needed to
get that sort of bottom layerstable.
This year, 2025, is a year ofgrowth again for us and how
(10:50):
about the industry?
Ian Carless (10:52):
we talk about this a lot and it's come up in quite
a few of the podcasts.
Where do you see the industrynow versus where we were
pre-covid?
Do you think the industry hasbounced back?
Inverted commas.
Tyler Davis-Smith (11:04):
I think, look , it's most definitely, you know
, the GCC region is the place tobe.
We only have to look at.
If we looked at pre-COVID, youknow there were a number of
events happening in the MiddleEast, but right now we've had a
World Cup, we've had a WorldExpo.
(11:25):
We're seeing, you know, if youlook at Saudi Arabia, we're
seeing major, major sportingevents.
So I think the sort of desirefor large scale events in the
Middle East is hugely there andI think it's still got lots and
lots of growth and I thinkSaudiia plays a huge part in
that.
(11:46):
The uae is most definitely nowa kind of secure hub.
We look at the travelstatistics.
Um, we've seen the dubaiairport is, you know, the
busiest airport in the worldwith the most amount of visitors
to tourism is back up.
There's lots of new thingsopening.
We look at ras al khaimahcasinos, etc.
Et cetera.
It's in a really positiveposition.
Ian Carless (12:08):
It's interesting that there was an article
released today that says,basically, the headline was
Dubai secures 437 globalbusiness events for 2024, which
they say is up 20%.
That's a 20% increase on lastyear, so clearly the appetite is
there.
I think one of the things thatI'm hearing, though, in the
industry is that, you know, asthis news article suggests, the
(12:30):
numbers might be up, but thespending doesn't seem to have
matched that, and also, I thinkthere's a question mark from
some quarters as well certainlythe event organizers that we've
spoken to about the quality ofthe events, and I think you know
we are in a market that isincredibly, you know, budget
conscious.
Tyler Davis-Smith (12:47):
It's budget conscious, it's competitive,
it's challenging.
You know, we pride ourselves onbeing kind of a higher end
entertainment agency and we'renot going to just sort of drop
down our standards or our costsbecause of that.
Because we believe that there'scertain you know, if you work
(13:08):
with us you get a certainservice.
We do find it.
It's going to happen.
It's always going to happen.
But I think that, from myperspective, as long as the
standards that we are deliveringdon't slip and you know we look
to be premium, people want towork with us because of that.
So the spend, yes, it isreflective, but we need to make
(13:32):
sure that we sit in that market.
We're not suddenly just goingto drop everything and we won't
take certain jobs if it doesn'talign with us.
Let's see where, where we gobecause of that.
But I do think that Peopleultimately appreciate quality
and, regardless of, you know,budgets going down, if you are a
(13:53):
high-end brand or you are agovernment entity, you cannot
risk your event failing.
It's happening once.
Probably the eyes of the worldcould be on that event.
You need people that know whatthey're doing, that are going to
deliver and, yeah, you're goingto have to pay for that.
Ian Carless (14:14):
Do you feel that's an attitude that's adopted by a
lot of procurement teams?
Tyler Davis-Smith (14:18):
No, no, most definitely not.
You know we that wasn't aleading question no, not even
slightly.
I mean, we're always going tohave the arguments with
procurement teams and then it'sup to us whether or not we take
it.
I recently had a situationwhere there was a procurement
department and they said youknow, they talked about
comparing apples to apples.
(14:38):
And I said you're not evencomparing fruit to anything.
I said you know, we're milesoff.
You want a circus artist?
We can get you a circus artistfrom down the road.
That's done.
A day's training, or I canbring you someone that's been in
Cirque du Soleil.
Correct?
You know, this is what I'moffering.
This is maybe what mycompetitors are offering.
Yeah, so be it.
(15:00):
And that means we lose things.
We will always lose thingsbecause of that.
But what we can do is guaranteeyou a high level and a quality
of delivery, a quality ofcommunication.
You know all of those things.
Certain people want it.
You know we have, we do.
We have certain people whereprocurement.
We know we're not winning thejob.
We have to apply on a portaland we just put a number in and
(15:21):
no one's really looking at thecreative or the quality.
Fine, that's for somebody elsethen yeah for us.
We, you know we pride ourselveson having good communication,
speaking to people, ensuring100% that there is a high level
of delivery and you pay for that.
Ian Carless (15:37):
And I think that's reassuring to hear as well,
because I think there'scertainly been a few people on
the podcast that have commentedthat there does seem to be a
little bit of a lack ofattention to quality these days.
You mentioned Saudi as wellearlier.
How important is Saudi, notjust as a market, both to the
region but also to energy?
Tyler Davis-Smith (16:00):
We licensed in Saudi Arabia this year.
We've been delivering eventsthere previously, but always
through the Dubai license.
I have worked there since about2017, but was working as a
freelancer have seen massivechange and you only have to look
at the scale of events thatthey are putting on to know that
it is a big marketplace.
You only have to look at theevent industry from Dubai and
(16:24):
virtually everybody is openingan office there now.
It comes with challenges, ofcourse it does.
It's a new marketplace.
It's a young, young marketplace.
Things are not quite ready andyou have to go into it with your
eyes opened and understand whatyou're going into.
But what's a good thing isthere is a huge desire there to
(16:46):
be successful, not just frompeople that are attending events
there, but from the population,and we've been at the saudi
event show a number of times.
I've hosted a few panels forthe saudi event show.
I've spoken to people and theyare desperate for success there
and you know laws are having tobe relaxed slightly, but it is
(17:09):
100% a huge destination for notjust the GCC but for the world.
You look at the boxing, thetennis, the F1, the E1.
It's on everybody's globaltouring calendar now.
Ian Carless (17:21):
And I think those events are obviously the ones
that grab the headlinesworldwide.
I think the bigger issue,perhaps, or the bigger question
mark, is is it sustainable?
We're talking about big eventsand obviously a lot of money Now
, over a short term period, yes,you can, probably if you want
to make a big wow in themarketplace, that's the way to
go.
But long-term, are theysustainable?
(17:41):
And if not, where does theindustry transition to?
Tyler Davis-Smith (17:44):
I mean, if we talk about the industry in
general, I think that it issustainable, but not at the pace
that it's going at the moment.
Everything has to plateau atsome point.
If I was to talk about thegrowth of energy, it was mad the
first few years.
If we went, okay, thepercentage of turnover increase
was, you know, okay, we're 400%on the year before.
(18:08):
But it can't go like that allthe time.
This year we kind of plateauedout.
We.
We did better than we did theprevious year, which we were
really happy with, consideringwe had cop in the previous year.
But it had to plateau out andit needs to for anything to be
sustainable.
And I do think that you know, sa, they can't just keep growing
(18:29):
and growing and growing at thepace that they are.
It will have to plateau out.
But ultimately, there is a hugepopulation there.
There are.
You know, if we look at it incomparison to the UAE, just in
terms of sort of the size of thecountry, the different areas,
they've just won the World Cup.
Well, they've just won theworld cup.
Well, they haven't won theworld cup, they've won the right
to host the world cup in 2032.
(18:51):
They've got the world expothere in 2030.
So we're looking at what it'sanother six, seven years of
global events that are goingthere.
So I don't think we see itslowing down right now, but
obviously they need to ensurethat they are ready to deliver
this scale of event.
(19:12):
But they are showing that andwe're excited to be involved in
it.
Ian Carless (19:16):
You mentioned.
Obviously there's a whole trainof event companies and other
industries all decamping inSaudi.
In order for that to besustainable, there has to be a
transfer of knowledge.
I mean, I'm sure initially it'sabout bringing teams in
delivering and then often thoseteams will leave.
How do you then ensure thattransfer of knowledge with the
local talent market so that youknow in three, four years time
(19:38):
you can actually now startsourcing some of the talent
there, rather than having toship everybody in?
Tyler Davis-Smith (19:42):
It's a really hard part and I've had this
conversation with a couple ofpeople and I actually, when
Energy were on soundstorm, whichis middle beast we were there
in december.
I was there personally and Iwas chatting to we employed all
of our talent managers locals,yeah, which a lot of people
don't do.
Yeah, transfer of knowledgeworks two ways.
We also need to have thetransfer of knowledge from them.
(20:04):
Yeah, and understand whatpeople there want and how we
work in this culture, because itis different to the UAE.
So there's, I think, there'sthe transfer of knowledge that
comes from the people that aregoing in, but there's a transfer
of knowledge the other way andI think with that, we will find
(20:24):
over the next three to five,maybe 10 years, the sort of
middle ground which works.
But it is a challenge.
Ian Carless (20:32):
Because I think it's happening on two levels.
The transfer is on two levels,isn't it?
I mean, there's a culturalknowledge transfer, but there's
also a basic skills transfer,like this is how you become a
show caller, this is how youbecome a lighting designer.
So, and I think, unfortunately,you know, training is a bygone
word, isn't it?
I mean across a lot ofindustries.
I know, for example, I used tobe in television and I can't
(20:54):
think of any training coursesnow.
Tyler Davis-Smith (20:59):
Well, training opportunities
vocational trainingopportunities for people who
want to be in the broadcastindustry.
Within Saudi.
You are seeing that now, middleBeast are doing a lot of
courses.
They're calling it BeastEd, soBeastEd.
We're seeing security companiesthat are training that now,
middle beast are doing a lot ofcourses.
They're calling it beast ed,right, so beasted.
We're seeing security companiesthat are training there with.
There's entertainment and eventacademies there.
Now, okay, I actually spoke withsome of the saudi entertainment
(21:20):
academy whilst I was there lasttime and they spoke about me
going in and doing somelecturing and things like that.
So, health and safety, security, security, crowd management,
production management they areinvesting in it in Saudi because
there is, you know, a quotathat has to be local.
The hard part and I find thisquite challenging is, you know,
(21:43):
yeah, you can find people for anevent, we can find ushers, we
can find ushers, we can findhostesses, we can find certain
roles.
We need to give people theopportunity to learn alongside
people, but to find full-timepeople there, that is a
challenge that I am looking atat the moment and one that I
(22:06):
don't have an answer to rightnow, and I need to navigate do
you think there are enoughopportunities currently for
talent to come in and shadowcompanies?
Ian Carless (22:13):
I mean often companies shy away from that
because it's an extra headache.
You've got to babysit someone,you've got to give them a task.
It's extra cost and I think alot of companies you know
they're just, I mean the bottomline kicks in and they just go
you know's.
Tyler Davis-Smith (22:28):
It's hard again, you know, I think some of
these courses that I am seeingfrom from the middle beast team
particularly, I think that'sreally really good for the
country because again there's adesire of people to work in
events and people are going tothese courses.
Opportunity to shadow is hardbecause people if they're
booking a stage manager, they'rebooking one stage manager at X
(22:51):
day rate, or how are we going topay the other person to shadow?
But then I guess, you know, forlong-term strategic growth,
potentially it's people likemyself that need to invest in
that.
Ian Carless (23:06):
And just bringing it back to Dubai and the UAE, do
you see talent moving into the,young talent in particular,
moving into events?
I mean we read a lot about GenZ and about them, you know not
necessarily wanting to put inthe hard yards.
I mean you know events liketelevision production.
It's a tough industry.
You know long hours, a lot ofstress.
Do you see young people nowwanting to move into this
(23:29):
industry?
Tyler Davis-Smith (23:35):
I mean, I like to still think that I'm a
young person.
So, and lots of my friends areyoung people and they want to
move into the industry.
But maybe I'm not young anymore, maybe I need to look at that.
But you know there are youngpeople moving into it.
It's a cool industry to work in, but I don't think.
Yeah, you know people maybedon't understand the hours that
go into it.
I think you know even my family.
I'm producing a show and Ithink they just think, oh, you
(23:56):
know, these people go up thereand they sing and dance and I
don't realise I'm like, I know Ihaven't spoken to you for three
weeks because I've beenincredibly stressed and I can't
speak to anybody right nowunless it's about this, to
anybody right now unless it'sabout this.
So that in itself, like it,that proves a challenge, because
some it's not.
For some people, I think it'sgot a positive sort of outlook,
(24:17):
because I think it is a is anexciting thing.
You know, I actually like goingto work and with events.
One thing that I've said tocolleagues of mine is we could
be on a bad job and I say do youknow, the best thing about
events is there's an end date,because if we've got a really,
really difficult job, then we gookay, right, we got through
(24:40):
that, at least that ended.
But then it means that you'renot doing the same thing every
day.
It's exciting, it's you know,what are we doing this time?
Okay, there's some kind oftwist, but that is you know.
I think that's quite excitingfor young people to be involved
in.
Ian Carless (24:57):
What about the talent pool locally?
I mean, clearly there is afreelance market now.
I mean, I've been here what 20,22 years, and if I certainly
move back to when I firstarrived, there wasn't a
freelance market.
How easy is it now, you know,for somebody like yourself who
needs to staff big shows notjust with talent but obviously
with production personnel aswell.
How much of that can you relyon the local market now, versus
(25:18):
having to bring people in?
We?
Tyler Davis-Smith (25:20):
have a number of freelancers that are core
freelancers for us.
I looked a little while ago andbetween artists and sort of
production team, over a two-weekperiod we'd employed 400 people
, which is quite a lot of people, and majority we'd managed to
(25:41):
source locally.
We are lucky that we have apool of people that want to work
with us.
We've been sort of really fromday one.
One of the core ethos of mybusiness was making sure that we
look after people and lookingafter freelancers.
People know they're going toget paid on time by us.
People know that they will belooked after on a job.
So we're lucky that we've gotsort of a really good bank of
(26:04):
people and there are a lot ofpeople locally.
Certain things, you know, we dohave to outsource
internationally.
When we were working on COP, wehad a huge workforce on COP and
we had to bring in because youknow it's a seasonal market here
, so everyone wants everyone atthe same time and late sign off
doesn't help as well.
So again, we might be sat heretoday and then suddenly we've
(26:29):
got an event in 10 days timewhich is all hands on deck and
potentially the good people arebooked, and and that's where
again, because we have a certainstandard that we like to think
that we hold.
Sometimes, you know, theseniors and things like that.
We've just got to bring it infrom international and we have
(26:50):
to do that.
But on a whole, we're in a goodplace in region.
Ian Carless (26:55):
How do you manage the short deadlines?
Because, I mean, I think I'mnot going to say anything
controversial by saying that youknow this region is notorious
for short deadlines.
I mean, you know, you and Iboth know that some of the
deadlines we get for events inthis region versus what we get
in other parts of the world aresignificantly different.
Tyler Davis-Smith (27:14):
We are constantly faced with short
deadlines, and one of the thingsthat I'll say to my team
because you know I can be inwork and people are like, oh no,
they've.
You know we're never going toget this over we need to manage
expectation and say first of all, you know what, what can we
(27:35):
achieve right now?
What's realistic?
You know we can get you aproposal and a budget, but you
know two hours is not acceptable.
You're not the only client thatwe're talking to either.
We can't just go okay, dropeverything right this second.
What's the budget?
Let's not waste time here.
Let's try and get down so thatwhen we do this proposal at a
(27:55):
short period of time we are, youknow, going to get signed off
pretty quickly.
But what I will say to my teamas well is if you don't like it,
it's the wrong industry for you, because unfortunately it's
part and parcel of things here,and I for some reason seem to be
a go-to phone call for lots ofpeople when they say we've got a
job no one will take, no onewould take this on because it's
(28:18):
so short notice.
You can do it, and I'll be likeoh, can I?
Okay, here we go then, and wetend to throw ourselves in work
really long hours and we get areally big sense of achievement
and a sense of pride when wedeliver.
Ian Carless (28:31):
I think what I've noticed from being in the region
for sort of 20 years is it's aconfluence of reasons.
I think generally the region isa little bit risk averse.
I also think that many of thatmiddle management aren't
empowered.
I think there's also not aculture that encourages failure,
and I think the result of thosethree things is that I think
(28:52):
everybody puts off makingdecisions until the very last
minute and then they also makethe decision that will have the
least impact on them if it goeswrong.
So that usually means that forus, unfortunately, who are at
the end of that chain, that weget three weeks or six weeks to
prepare for an event that shouldhave taken three or three
months and we get a minusculebudget which in many cases isn't
(29:14):
realistic.
Tyler Davis-Smith (29:16):
I don't think honestly.
You know we only it comes fromthe top and you know it's quite
demanding at the top workingwith governmental clients.
They, they can expect things.
You know there is a level of itneeds to check.
Like you know, we need thisevent.
It has to happen now andultimately we always do make it
happen so you're never going tochange it.
(29:38):
Because if we make it happenevery time, why does it need to
change?
Ian Carless (29:43):
yeah, absolutely, that's that you're guilty by
success yeah yeah, if you'dfallen over and failed, then
maybe people would have gone.
Oh, yes, next time, yeah, yeah,but the fact that you deliver
the job, yeah 100.
Tyler Davis-Smith (29:55):
I've, I've done things.
I remember being a freelancerand thinking I could do with
three stage managers on this andit's just me.
But I'd still deliver.
I'd make sure and I'd runaround like a madman and I'd be
in every single position thatreally there should be other
people on.
But I'd be flying across theback of the stage to make sure
that I'm, you know, on stageleft when I quickly get that
(30:16):
person on.
And then I'm running around theback of the stage to make sure
that I'm, you know, on stageleft when I quickly get that
personal.
And then I'm running around theback and, right, I'm at stage
right as well.
It's mad, but it's done, yeah,and then we don't teach anybody,
but I wouldn't have let it failbecause it's not in my nature.
Yeah, and that's the same forevery other business here.
Ian Carless (30:31):
So it's not going to change what are the events
you're looking forward to in2025?
Tyler Davis-Smith (30:35):
What events.
I mean that's a difficult one,because obviously lots of our
conversations are kind of undera non-disclosure agreement or
let's rephrase that a little bit.
Ian Carless (30:43):
So if there's events that you can talk about
in relation to energy, please do, but otherwise, what are the
events?
Perhaps you're looking forwardto just going to, perhaps as a
spectator?
Tyler Davis-Smith (30:53):
Well, I'm looking forward to seeing Oasis.
I was one of the fortunate onesthat got tickets to see Oasis
and I've got tickets to see themin Scotland and I've got
tickets to see them in London.
So for me, as a kind of bigOasis fan and actually meeting
up with the lads from footballand going and being a Britpop
kind of English man, that willbe thoroughly enjoyable in terms
(31:17):
of energy.
We we're we're looking forwardto delivering an event in saudi
arabia next weekend, which isone that we've delivered
previously.
I plan on visiting japan thisyear.
Uh, there's a world expo thereand I kind of thought to myself
I'm never really sure what to dowhen I'm going on holiday, so
why don't I just tie it up witha event because I feel
(31:40):
comfortable an event?
I'm not very good when I go onholiday on my own and just don't
really know what to do withmyself.
So I thought, right, I'll go toan event for my holiday.
That's a good idea.
So I'm going to go to Japan andlook at the World Expo there.
Ian Carless (31:52):
Now you mentioned Oasis, so you you've given the
game away a little bit, but likeyourself, bit of a music fan,
vinyl collection growing again.
What's on your playlist?
What's?
Tyler Davis-Smith (32:02):
on my playlist.
Oh, there'd be lots ofdifferent things on my playlist
because it could vary from lotsof kind of acoustic or indie.
I'm a big fan of the sort ofindie era.
So I was into the Zootons andthe Kookooks and razor light and
oasis and a bit blur like a bitof scar.
So, um, yeah, which is a bit ofa first mention on the podcast.
(32:25):
Yeah, so I'm into madness,specials and things like that,
and then I could end up withdefying gravity from wicked.
So you know, musical theaterwas a big part of my life.
So I am a male that likesmusical theatre, which is
probably a little bit odd formost people.
But you know, I coulddefinitely listen into some of
that as well.
And it ranges Half the time Idrive in the car in silence
(32:48):
because I've had people shoutingat me all day and I think
please, let me just have amoment to myself and I turn
everything off and I just drivehome and think, make it home
safely and just have that momentof pause and reflection and
don't crash.
The car on the way home is theusual plan.
Ian Carless (33:06):
Tyler, best of luck for you and energy in 2025 and
thanks for coming in on thepodcast.
Tyler Davis-Smith (33:10):
Thank you very much for having me, thank
you.
Ian Carless (33:12):
Event News.
Dxb was presented by myself,ian Carlos, the studio engineer
and editor was Roy DeMonte, theexecutive producer was myself
and Joe Morrison, and thispodcast is a co-production
between Warehouse 4 and W4Podcast Studio Dubai, and if you
haven't done so already, pleasedo click that follow or
subscribe button.
See you next time.
Welcome to Event News DXB.
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(00:20):
Thanks a bunch.
You're listening to the EventNews DXB podcast.
Your behind-the-scenes lookinto the world of events in
Dubai, the UAE and the MENAregion.
I'm Ian Carlos and each weekI'll bring you the latest news,
(00:43):
industry trends and insiderstories shaping one of the
world's most dynamic eventmarkets.
From professional insights toDubai's most inspiring success
stories, we've got everythingyou need to stay ahead in that
ever-evolving event industry.
So, whether you're an eventplanner, a brand manager or just
someone who's utterlypassionate about the power of
(01:03):
events, you're in the rightplace.
This week we're talking to thefounder and CEO of Energy
Entertainment, tyler Davis-Smith.
After originally studying for acareer in musical theatre, a
freelance project saw him landin Dubai, where he quickly began
to see the potential forstarting his own company
delivering events.
Fast forward to 2025 and EnergyEntertainment has quickly
(01:25):
become one of the leadingcompanies specialising in talent
booking and deliveringhigh-profile entertainment
events.
Tyler, welcome to the show.
Thank you for having me, mostwelcome.
I want to start at thebeginning.
How did you get into events Now?
I did actually have a quicklook at your LinkedIn page last
night and you seem to be one ofthe few people that seem to know
exactly what you wanted to dofrom an early age.
(01:46):
You studied for well, certainlyfor theatre design, didn't you?
Which led into events?
Yeah, so initially.
Tyler Davis-Smith (01:52):
I mean, I actually wanted to be a
performer.
It's funny because every day onour accounting software I've
got secret questions and it sayswhat did you want to be when
you grow up?
And the answer was actor asopposed to.
I haven't grown up.
Yeah, exactly peter pan, thatwas what I wanted to be.
No, so it was performing from ayoung age.
I performed in lots ofdifferent things.
Obviously you start withamateur dramatic and then when I
(02:15):
left school, I had to sort ofmake some decisions on what
options I wanted to take tostudy and I initially started
with law, politics, sociology,sociology, critical thinking and
performance studies.
I lasted about a week of doingthat the AS levels of that and
then I changed to BTEC inmusical theatre.
I carried on with the law onthe side, but then I went to
(02:36):
drama school in London, touredin theatres, worked on cruise
ships, so singing, prancingaround, and that was kind of the
entertainment segment segment.
So all of that and that'sactually what brought me out to
Dubai, right, the UAE initiallyat what point did you realize?
Ian Carless (02:52):
actually, I want to make the switch here.
I don't just want to be thetalent, I want to be the
organizer.
Tyler Davis-Smith (02:57):
I never realized that there was no point
, there was no strategicdecision no, you know definitely
not.
It just sort of happened.
Suddenly someone says can youstage manage on a job?
I think people thought I had myhead screwed on and I started
stage managing.
And then the next thing was anold can you show call an event.
Then it was okay, can youproduction manage?
(03:19):
And it was like, okay, nowyou're building an event, which
always I found a little bitbizarre because I can't even
hang a picture frame up at homeand I am literally useless at
building anything.
So then doing the productionmanagement and then producing.
But I think that when you areproducing there's all different
sort of segments of my lifewhere I utilize and pick from
(03:41):
all of those strengths.
So I didn't study events andsometimes I wonder, you know, if
I'd studied events and donethat at 21, come out of
university and done that, youknow where would I be?
But actually I took a routethat has given me sort of lots
of experience in lots ofdifferent aspects of events,
which now I think put me in agood position to be where I am.
(04:02):
So I've done lots of kind oflearning on the job.
Ian Carless (04:05):
Yeah.
Tyler Davis-Smith (04:05):
Although I did apply to do a master's the
other day, although I'm notentirely sure if it's a good
idea whatsoever because I'mreally really busy.
But yeah, lots of it comes fromjust learning on the job, so it
just sort of happened.
Ian Carless (04:18):
Now.
Energy Entertainment isobviously your company now and
it's going from strength tostrength and we'll get on to
talk about that as well.
But interestingly, you actuallyformed the company during COVID
.
Tyler Davis-Smith (04:30):
Yeah, I think it was.
A lot of people thought I wasslightly mad.
Well, you certainly had time onyour hands.
That was the big thing thoughit was.
I think I'd gone into, I say,lots of what I did initially
with the stage management.
The show calling all revolvedaround, you know, still the show
of an event, because an eventisn't just made up of a show.
(04:50):
Events can be all sorts ofdifferent things and you know I
was involved in corporate eventsand summits and government
events and things like that.
And during COVID was a time,ultimately, where we all had a
chance to stop and a chance tothink about what we were doing
and I sort of looked at whathave I been doing for the past
few years?
(05:11):
What do I want to be doing in10 years time?
And ultimately I didn't want tobe doing some of the roles that
I had been doing.
It gave me a chance to sitthere and look and assess what
is in the market currently inthe sort of GCC region, what I
thought I can do better than,and ultimately, had there been
(05:33):
no COVID, there would be noenergy, because I thought I was
happy as a freelancer in certainroles.
It was that pause that chanceto reflect and that chance to
sort of you know, decide andreinvent your own future.
Ian Carless (05:48):
Yeah, and I think that was the case for many
people across many industries.
Wasn't it that chance forintrospection and that chance to
be just still and be present?
And I think people came outwith it with some quite
revealing truths home truths,didn't they?
Some people had complete careerchanges.
Other people just decided thata better work-life balance was
something they wanted to try andwork towards yeah, a hundred
percent.
Tyler Davis-Smith (06:08):
It's taking that time to just stop and
sometimes, you know, wouldn't itbe nice.
Now I said the other day uh,obviously we're now sort of four
and a bit years old as abusiness.
I said, do you know what?
I just like it to stop for aminute so I could reassess again
, yeah, on where we're at, andgo okay, what is the strategy
for the next five years of thebusiness?
(06:29):
Yeah, I don't have that time todo that anymore because we're
constant at what we're doing.
Yeah, but but that time duringCOVID, not only did I, you know,
assess where I wanted to be, itgave me a chance to build a.
I didn't want to build abusiness, I wanted to build a
brand and a sort of strategy.
So it gave a chance to to builda.
I didn't want to build abusiness, I want to be able to
build a brand and a sort ofstrategy.
So it gave a chance to look atwhat did I want the logo to be?
(06:49):
Like, you know, have time toconsult with other people,
competitor analysis, all of thatsort of stuff.
You know what?
What is it that makes usdifferent?
What am I going to go?
What's our unique selling pointand and all of that, I looked
at the different businesses thatare there.
I booked a lot of theentertainment agencies because
(07:10):
I'd worked event agency side andwhat was a challenge for me
when I was booking anentertainment agency.
So it gave me a chance toreally sort of, like you know,
look at that and do a lot ofresearch so that when I did
launch the business I was in areally good place.
Ian Carless (07:26):
How difficult was it to actually start the
business and get up and running?
Very difficult.
Tyler Davis-Smith (07:31):
There were no funds.
I ultimately ran out of money.
I took a bank loan from the UKon the mindset of if I go
bankrupt, at least I go bankruptin the UK rather than here,
because that would have been aproblem.
That was a, you know, astarting point.
Then, uh, launching thebusiness to being sort of first
of all, getting people to trustyou, and then the next thing was
(07:55):
, when were we coming out ofcovid?
So I, I launched in august andthen we had a little bit of a
break and it would be like, okay, the entertainment can happen.
Then there was an entertainmentban again, then there was a
little break and then, you know,it was really difficult to sort
of get gain any traction at thestart.
But we did a good job and I waslucky to have some really
(08:17):
really good people around me.
But it wasn't easy and it'sstill not easy.
Just, the problems are slightlydifferent problems than they
were then.
Ian Carless (08:26):
Yeah, you mentioned you're four years down the line
now.
How have you managed thatprocess of scaling the business
then?
Obviously, you know cashflow isone, but there's a whole host
of other things that you've gotto consider in terms of scaling
as well, and you know there's alot of businesses that grow too
quickly.
A hundred percent.
Tyler Davis-Smith (08:41):
Scaling is hard Knowing when to scale, when
not to scale.
Are you scaling too much?
It's a challenge.
And then also, I have bigambitions and I want to run away
and you know, scale immediately.
But, yeah, I don't necessarilyhave the money to do that.
There's no millionaire that'sbehind me, there's no investors
(09:02):
or anything like that.
So you know, we started out by alot of freelancers and a lot of
people you know, just jumpingin.
Then you take on your firstfull-time hires.
That's scary because you'rereally committing to something
and I think that, as an owner ofa business, you are committing
to looking after people, lookingafter their families.
(09:24):
It's really, really, reallyimportant to me that you know
all of those people we are.
We have security for them.
If they're working alongside me, they should know that it's a
safe space.
Um, so you, you scale up andthen, you know, your challenges
become different.
We're now, I think we're about13 or 14 full time and it's
(09:44):
difficult when to scale.
I always look to scale up inJanuary and July because we can
look at the end of a financialyear, sort of a January to
December year, but then also wework in an event season, so
we're looking at kind ofSeptember to June, so we'll
assess and see where we were.
I feel like we're always kindof playing catch up, because we
(10:04):
scale up, we get more work andthen we're like, wow, we were
really busy again.
You get more people and thenyou get more work, and then you
need more people and then youget more work.
And this year was a year wherewe didn't want to grow too much.
This year we decided that weactually wanted to.
It was really important to usto sort of stabilise everything
(10:27):
that we were doing, because wehad to change trade licences, we
needed to get new systemsoperate in procedures, we added
a bit more support in thefinance and admin department
because I felt like we werepotentially a house of cards
that could come tumbling downand we really, really needed to
get that sort of bottom layerstable.
This year, 2025, is a year ofgrowth again for us and how
(10:50):
about the industry?
Ian Carless (10:52):
we talk about this a lot and it's come up in quite
a few of the podcasts.
Where do you see the industrynow versus where we were
pre-covid?
Do you think the industry hasbounced back?
Inverted commas.
Tyler Davis-Smith (11:04):
I think, look , it's most definitely, you know
, the GCC region is the place tobe.
We only have to look at.
If we looked at pre-COVID, youknow there were a number of
events happening in the MiddleEast, but right now we've had a
World Cup, we've had a WorldExpo.
(11:25):
We're seeing, you know, if youlook at Saudi Arabia, we're
seeing major, major sportingevents.
So I think the sort of desirefor large scale events in the
Middle East is hugely there andI think it's still got lots and
lots of growth and I thinkSaudiia plays a huge part in
that.
(11:46):
The uae is most definitely nowa kind of secure hub.
We look at the travelstatistics.
Um, we've seen the dubaiairport is, you know, the
busiest airport in the worldwith the most amount of visitors
to tourism is back up.
There's lots of new thingsopening.
We look at ras al khaimahcasinos, etc.
Et cetera.
It's in a really positiveposition.
Ian Carless (12:08):
It's interesting that there was an article
released today that says,basically, the headline was
Dubai secures 437 globalbusiness events for 2024, which
they say is up 20%.
That's a 20% increase on lastyear, so clearly the appetite is
there.
I think one of the things thatI'm hearing, though, in the
industry is that, you know, asthis news article suggests, the
(12:30):
numbers might be up, but thespending doesn't seem to have
matched that, and also, I thinkthere's a question mark from
some quarters as well certainlythe event organizers that we've
spoken to about the quality ofthe events, and I think you know
we are in a market that isincredibly, you know, budget
conscious.
Tyler Davis-Smith (12:47):
It's budget conscious, it's competitive,
it's challenging.
You know, we pride ourselves onbeing kind of a higher end
entertainment agency and we'renot going to just sort of drop
down our standards or our costsbecause of that.
Because we believe that there'scertain you know, if you work
(13:08):
with us you get a certainservice.
We do find it.
It's going to happen.
It's always going to happen.
But I think that, from myperspective, as long as the
standards that we are deliveringdon't slip and you know we look
to be premium, people want towork with us because of that.
So the spend, yes, it isreflective, but we need to make
(13:32):
sure that we sit in that market.
We're not suddenly just goingto drop everything and we won't
take certain jobs if it doesn'talign with us.
Let's see where, where we gobecause of that.
But I do think that Peopleultimately appreciate quality
and, regardless of, you know,budgets going down, if you are a
(13:53):
high-end brand or you are agovernment entity, you cannot
risk your event failing.
It's happening once.
Probably the eyes of the worldcould be on that event.
You need people that know whatthey're doing, that are going to
deliver and, yeah, you're goingto have to pay for that.
Ian Carless (14:14):
Do you feel that's an attitude that's adopted by a
lot of procurement teams?
Tyler Davis-Smith (14:18):
No, no, most definitely not.
You know we that wasn't aleading question no, not even
slightly.
I mean, we're always going tohave the arguments with
procurement teams and then it'sup to us whether or not we take
it.
I recently had a situationwhere there was a procurement
department and they said youknow, they talked about
comparing apples to apples.
(14:38):
And I said you're not evencomparing fruit to anything.
I said you know, we're milesoff.
You want a circus artist?
We can get you a circus artistfrom down the road.
That's done.
A day's training, or I canbring you someone that's been in
Cirque du Soleil.
Correct?
You know, this is what I'moffering.
This is maybe what mycompetitors are offering.
Yeah, so be it.
(15:00):
And that means we lose things.
We will always lose thingsbecause of that.
But what we can do is guaranteeyou a high level and a quality
of delivery, a quality ofcommunication.
You know all of those things.
Certain people want it.
You know we have, we do.
We have certain people whereprocurement.
We know we're not winning thejob.
We have to apply on a portaland we just put a number in and
(15:21):
no one's really looking at thecreative or the quality.
Fine, that's for somebody elsethen yeah for us.
We, you know we pride ourselveson having good communication,
speaking to people, ensuring100% that there is a high level
of delivery and you pay for that.
Ian Carless (15:37):
And I think that's reassuring to hear as well,
because I think there'scertainly been a few people on
the podcast that have commentedthat there does seem to be a
little bit of a lack ofattention to quality these days.
You mentioned Saudi as wellearlier.
How important is Saudi, notjust as a market, both to the
region but also to energy?
Tyler Davis-Smith (16:00):
We licensed in Saudi Arabia this year.
We've been delivering eventsthere previously, but always
through the Dubai license.
I have worked there since about2017, but was working as a
freelancer have seen massivechange and you only have to look
at the scale of events thatthey are putting on to know that
it is a big marketplace.
You only have to look at theevent industry from Dubai and
(16:24):
virtually everybody is openingan office there now.
It comes with challenges, ofcourse it does.
It's a new marketplace.
It's a young, young marketplace.
Things are not quite ready andyou have to go into it with your
eyes opened and understand whatyou're going into.
But what's a good thing isthere is a huge desire there to
(16:46):
be successful, not just frompeople that are attending events
there, but from the population,and we've been at the saudi
event show a number of times.
I've hosted a few panels forthe saudi event show.
I've spoken to people and theyare desperate for success there
and you know laws are having tobe relaxed slightly, but it is
(17:09):
100% a huge destination for notjust the GCC but for the world.
You look at the boxing, thetennis, the F1, the E1.
It's on everybody's globaltouring calendar now.
Ian Carless (17:21):
And I think those events are obviously the ones
that grab the headlinesworldwide.
I think the bigger issue,perhaps, or the bigger question
mark, is is it sustainable?
We're talking about big eventsand obviously a lot of money Now
, over a short term period, yes,you can, probably if you want
to make a big wow in themarketplace, that's the way to
go.
But long-term, are theysustainable?
(17:41):
And if not, where does theindustry transition to?
Tyler Davis-Smith (17:44):
I mean, if we talk about the industry in
general, I think that it issustainable, but not at the pace
that it's going at the moment.
Everything has to plateau atsome point.
If I was to talk about thegrowth of energy, it was mad the
first few years.
If we went, okay, thepercentage of turnover increase
was, you know, okay, we're 400%on the year before.
(18:08):
But it can't go like that allthe time.
This year we kind of plateauedout.
We.
We did better than we did theprevious year, which we were
really happy with, consideringwe had cop in the previous year.
But it had to plateau out andit needs to for anything to be
sustainable.
And I do think that you know, sa, they can't just keep growing
(18:29):
and growing and growing at thepace that they are.
It will have to plateau out.
But ultimately, there is a hugepopulation there.
There are.
You know, if we look at it incomparison to the UAE, just in
terms of sort of the size of thecountry, the different areas,
they've just won the World Cup.
Well, they've just won theworld cup.
Well, they haven't won theworld cup, they've won the right
to host the world cup in 2032.
(18:51):
They've got the world expothere in 2030.
So we're looking at what it'sanother six, seven years of
global events that are goingthere.
So I don't think we see itslowing down right now, but
obviously they need to ensurethat they are ready to deliver
this scale of event.
(19:12):
But they are showing that andwe're excited to be involved in
it.
Ian Carless (19:16):
You mentioned.
Obviously there's a whole trainof event companies and other
industries all decamping inSaudi.
In order for that to besustainable, there has to be a
transfer of knowledge.
I mean, I'm sure initially it'sabout bringing teams in
delivering and then often thoseteams will leave.
How do you then ensure thattransfer of knowledge with the
local talent market so that youknow in three, four years time
(19:38):
you can actually now startsourcing some of the talent
there, rather than having toship everybody in?
Tyler Davis-Smith (19:42):
It's a really hard part and I've had this
conversation with a couple ofpeople and I actually, when
Energy were on soundstorm, whichis middle beast we were there
in december.
I was there personally and Iwas chatting to we employed all
of our talent managers locals,yeah, which a lot of people
don't do.
Yeah, transfer of knowledgeworks two ways.
We also need to have thetransfer of knowledge from them.
(20:04):
Yeah, and understand whatpeople there want and how we
work in this culture, because itis different to the UAE.
So there's, I think, there'sthe transfer of knowledge that
comes from the people that aregoing in, but there's a transfer
of knowledge the other way andI think with that, we will find
(20:24):
over the next three to five,maybe 10 years, the sort of
middle ground which works.
But it is a challenge.
Ian Carless (20:32):
Because I think it's happening on two levels.
The transfer is on two levels,isn't it?
I mean, there's a culturalknowledge transfer, but there's
also a basic skills transfer,like this is how you become a
show caller, this is how youbecome a lighting designer.
So, and I think, unfortunately,you know, training is a bygone
word, isn't it?
I mean across a lot ofindustries.
I know, for example, I used tobe in television and I can't
(20:54):
think of any training coursesnow.
Tyler Davis-Smith (20:59):
Well, training opportunities
vocational trainingopportunities for people who
want to be in the broadcastindustry.
Within Saudi.
You are seeing that now, middleBeast are doing a lot of
courses.
They're calling it BeastEd, soBeastEd.
We're seeing security companiesthat are training that now,
middle beast are doing a lot ofcourses.
They're calling it beast ed,right, so beasted.
We're seeing security companiesthat are training there with.
There's entertainment and eventacademies there.
Now, okay, I actually spoke withsome of the saudi entertainment
(21:20):
academy whilst I was there lasttime and they spoke about me
going in and doing somelecturing and things like that.
So, health and safety, security, security, crowd management,
production management they areinvesting in it in Saudi because
there is, you know, a quotathat has to be local.
The hard part and I find thisquite challenging is, you know,
(21:43):
yeah, you can find people for anevent, we can find ushers, we
can find ushers, we can findhostesses, we can find certain
roles.
We need to give people theopportunity to learn alongside
people, but to find full-timepeople there, that is a
challenge that I am looking atat the moment and one that I
(22:06):
don't have an answer to rightnow, and I need to navigate do
you think there are enoughopportunities currently for
talent to come in and shadowcompanies?
Ian Carless (22:13):
I mean often companies shy away from that
because it's an extra headache.
You've got to babysit someone,you've got to give them a task.
It's extra cost and I think alot of companies you know
they're just, I mean the bottomline kicks in and they just go
you know's.
Tyler Davis-Smith (22:28):
It's hard again, you know, I think some of
these courses that I am seeingfrom from the middle beast team
particularly, I think that'sreally really good for the
country because again there's adesire of people to work in
events and people are going tothese courses.
Opportunity to shadow is hardbecause people if they're
booking a stage manager, they'rebooking one stage manager at X
(22:51):
day rate, or how are we going topay the other person to shadow?
But then I guess, you know, forlong-term strategic growth,
potentially it's people likemyself that need to invest in
that.
Ian Carless (23:06):
And just bringing it back to Dubai and the UAE, do
you see talent moving into the,young talent in particular,
moving into events?
I mean we read a lot about GenZ and about them, you know not
necessarily wanting to put inthe hard yards.
I mean you know events liketelevision production.
It's a tough industry.
You know long hours, a lot ofstress.
Do you see young people nowwanting to move into this
(23:29):
industry?
Tyler Davis-Smith (23:35):
I mean, I like to still think that I'm a
young person.
So, and lots of my friends areyoung people and they want to
move into the industry.
But maybe I'm not young anymore, maybe I need to look at that.
But you know there are youngpeople moving into it.
It's a cool industry to work in, but I don't think.
Yeah, you know people maybedon't understand the hours that
go into it.
I think you know even my family.
I'm producing a show and Ithink they just think, oh, you
(23:56):
know, these people go up thereand they sing and dance and I
don't realise I'm like, I know Ihaven't spoken to you for three
weeks because I've beenincredibly stressed and I can't
speak to anybody right nowunless it's about this, to
anybody right now unless it'sabout this.
So that in itself, like it,that proves a challenge, because
some it's not.
For some people, I think it'sgot a positive sort of outlook,
(24:17):
because I think it is a is anexciting thing.
You know, I actually like goingto work and with events.
One thing that I've said tocolleagues of mine is we could
be on a bad job and I say do youknow, the best thing about
events is there's an end date,because if we've got a really,
really difficult job, then we gookay, right, we got through
(24:40):
that, at least that ended.
But then it means that you'renot doing the same thing every
day.
It's exciting, it's you know,what are we doing this time?
Okay, there's some kind oftwist, but that is you know.
I think that's quite excitingfor young people to be involved
in.
Ian Carless (24:57):
What about the talent pool locally?
I mean, clearly there is afreelance market now.
I mean, I've been here what 20,22 years, and if I certainly
move back to when I firstarrived, there wasn't a
freelance market.
How easy is it now, you know,for somebody like yourself who
needs to staff big shows notjust with talent but obviously
with production personnel aswell.
How much of that can you relyon the local market now, versus
(25:18):
having to bring people in?
We?
Tyler Davis-Smith (25:20):
have a number of freelancers that are core
freelancers for us.
I looked a little while ago andbetween artists and sort of
production team, over a two-weekperiod we'd employed 400 people
, which is quite a lot of people, and majority we'd managed to
(25:41):
source locally.
We are lucky that we have apool of people that want to work
with us.
We've been sort of really fromday one.
One of the core ethos of mybusiness was making sure that we
look after people and lookingafter freelancers.
People know they're going toget paid on time by us.
People know that they will belooked after on a job.
So we're lucky that we've gotsort of a really good bank of
(26:04):
people and there are a lot ofpeople locally.
Certain things, you know, we dohave to outsource
internationally.
When we were working on COP, wehad a huge workforce on COP and
we had to bring in because youknow it's a seasonal market here
, so everyone wants everyone atthe same time and late sign off
doesn't help as well.
So again, we might be sat heretoday and then suddenly we've
(26:29):
got an event in 10 days timewhich is all hands on deck and
potentially the good people arebooked, and and that's where
again, because we have a certainstandard that we like to think
that we hold.
Sometimes, you know, theseniors and things like that.
We've just got to bring it infrom international and we have
(26:50):
to do that.
But on a whole, we're in a goodplace in region.
Ian Carless (26:55):
How do you manage the short deadlines?
Because, I mean, I think I'mnot going to say anything
controversial by saying that youknow this region is notorious
for short deadlines.
I mean, you know, you and Iboth know that some of the
deadlines we get for events inthis region versus what we get
in other parts of the world aresignificantly different.
Tyler Davis-Smith (27:14):
We are constantly faced with short
deadlines, and one of the thingsthat I'll say to my team
because you know I can be inwork and people are like, oh no,
they've.
You know we're never going toget this over we need to manage
expectation and say first of all, you know what, what can we
(27:35):
achieve right now?
What's realistic?
You know we can get you aproposal and a budget, but you
know two hours is not acceptable.
You're not the only client thatwe're talking to either.
We can't just go okay, dropeverything right this second.
What's the budget?
Let's not waste time here.
Let's try and get down so thatwhen we do this proposal at a
(27:55):
short period of time we are, youknow, going to get signed off
pretty quickly.
But what I will say to my teamas well is if you don't like it,
it's the wrong industry for you, because unfortunately it's
part and parcel of things here,and I for some reason seem to be
a go-to phone call for lots ofpeople when they say we've got a
job no one will take, no onewould take this on because it's
(28:18):
so short notice.
You can do it, and I'll be likeoh, can I?
Okay, here we go then, and wetend to throw ourselves in work
really long hours and we get areally big sense of achievement
and a sense of pride when wedeliver.
Ian Carless (28:31):
I think what I've noticed from being in the region
for sort of 20 years is it's aconfluence of reasons.
I think generally the region isa little bit risk averse.
I also think that many of thatmiddle management aren't
empowered.
I think there's also not aculture that encourages failure,
and I think the result of thosethree things is that I think
(28:52):
everybody puts off makingdecisions until the very last
minute and then they also makethe decision that will have the
least impact on them if it goeswrong.
So that usually means that forus, unfortunately, who are at
the end of that chain, that weget three weeks or six weeks to
prepare for an event that shouldhave taken three or three
months and we get a minusculebudget which in many cases isn't
(29:14):
realistic.
Tyler Davis-Smith (29:16):
I don't think honestly.
You know we only it comes fromthe top and you know it's quite
demanding at the top workingwith governmental clients.
They, they can expect things.
You know there is a level of itneeds to check.
Like you know, we need thisevent.
It has to happen now andultimately we always do make it
happen so you're never going tochange it.
(29:38):
Because if we make it happenevery time, why does it need to
change?
Ian Carless (29:43):
yeah, absolutely, that's that you're guilty by
success yeah yeah, if you'dfallen over and failed, then
maybe people would have gone.
Oh, yes, next time, yeah, yeah,but the fact that you deliver
the job, yeah 100.
Tyler Davis-Smith (29:55):
I've, I've done things.
I remember being a freelancerand thinking I could do with
three stage managers on this andit's just me.
But I'd still deliver.
I'd make sure and I'd runaround like a madman and I'd be
in every single position thatreally there should be other
people on.
But I'd be flying across theback of the stage to make sure
that I'm, you know, on stageleft when I quickly get that
(30:16):
person on.
And then I'm running around theback of the stage to make sure
that I'm, you know, on stageleft when I quickly get that
personal.
And then I'm running around theback and, right, I'm at stage
right as well.
It's mad, but it's done, yeah,and then we don't teach anybody,
but I wouldn't have let it failbecause it's not in my nature.
Yeah, and that's the same forevery other business here.
Ian Carless (30:31):
So it's not going to change what are the events
you're looking forward to in2025?
Tyler Davis-Smith (30:35):
What events.
I mean that's a difficult one,because obviously lots of our
conversations are kind of undera non-disclosure agreement or
let's rephrase that a little bit.
Ian Carless (30:43):
So if there's events that you can talk about
in relation to energy, please do, but otherwise, what are the
events?
Perhaps you're looking forwardto just going to, perhaps as a
spectator?
Tyler Davis-Smith (30:53):
Well, I'm looking forward to seeing Oasis.
I was one of the fortunate onesthat got tickets to see Oasis
and I've got tickets to see themin Scotland and I've got
tickets to see them in London.
So for me, as a kind of bigOasis fan and actually meeting
up with the lads from footballand going and being a Britpop
kind of English man, that willbe thoroughly enjoyable in terms
(31:17):
of energy.
We we're we're looking forwardto delivering an event in saudi
arabia next weekend, which isone that we've delivered
previously.
I plan on visiting japan thisyear.
Uh, there's a world expo thereand I kind of thought to myself
I'm never really sure what to dowhen I'm going on holiday, so
why don't I just tie it up witha event because I feel
(31:40):
comfortable an event?
I'm not very good when I go onholiday on my own and just don't
really know what to do withmyself.
So I thought, right, I'll go toan event for my holiday.
That's a good idea.
So I'm going to go to Japan andlook at the World Expo there.
Ian Carless (31:52):
Now you mentioned Oasis, so you you've given the
game away a little bit, but likeyourself, bit of a music fan,
vinyl collection growing again.
What's on your playlist?
What's?
Tyler Davis-Smith (32:02):
on my playlist.
Oh, there'd be lots ofdifferent things on my playlist
because it could vary from lotsof kind of acoustic or indie.
I'm a big fan of the sort ofindie era.
So I was into the Zootons andthe Kookooks and razor light and
oasis and a bit blur like a bitof scar.
So, um, yeah, which is a bit ofa first mention on the podcast.
(32:25):
Yeah, so I'm into madness,specials and things like that,
and then I could end up withdefying gravity from wicked.
So you know, musical theaterwas a big part of my life.
So I am a male that likesmusical theatre, which is
probably a little bit odd formost people.
But you know, I coulddefinitely listen into some of
that as well.
And it ranges Half the time Idrive in the car in silence
(32:48):
because I've had people shoutingat me all day and I think
please, let me just have amoment to myself and I turn
everything off and I just drivehome and think, make it home
safely and just have that momentof pause and reflection and
don't crash.
The car on the way home is theusual plan.
Ian Carless (33:06):
Tyler, best of luck for you and energy in 2025 and
thanks for coming in on thepodcast.
Tyler Davis-Smith (33:10):
Thank you very much for having me, thank
you.
Ian Carless (33:12):
Event News.
Dxb was presented by myself,ian Carlos, the studio engineer
and editor was Roy DeMonte, theexecutive producer was myself
and Joe Morrison, and thispodcast is a co-production
between Warehouse 4 and W4Podcast Studio Dubai, and if you
haven't done so already, pleasedo click that follow or
subscribe button.
See you next time.
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