July 17, 2025 • 58 mins
Our discussion with veteran advocate John Dorle reveals the current state of VA claims processing, highlighting both ongoing frustrations and notable improvements in appeals wait times.
• VA claims process still operates on a "delay, delay, delay until veterans quit" philosophy
• Board of Veterans Appeals wait times have improved from 40 months to 8-12 months
• Filing claims without a formal diagnosis can be strategic, especially for conditions like hearing loss
• Understanding the three appeals tracks: supplemental claim, higher-level review, and Board appeal
• Professional representation from accredited claims agents offers veterans strategic advantages
• Veterans with R2 ratings should avoid filing new claims to prevent potential benefit reductions
• Strategic timing matters - waiting too long can make it harder to connect conditions to service
• Secondary conditions from diabetes include neuropathies, vision issues, and kidney complications
• Claims Accuracy Review (CAR) can expedite certain clear-cut cases within a month
• Veterans 85+ or with terminal illnesses qualify for expedited claim processing
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Visit J Basser's Exposed Vet Productions (Formerly Exposed Vet Radioshow) YouTube page by clicking here.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
J Basser (00:01):
Episode Exposed Vet Productions and Weekly Show.
My name is John Stacey, theycall me Jay Basher.
My co-host today is Mr Ray Cobb, out of the great state of
Alabama, or Tennessee, the wayyou want to call it.
He lives out on theTennessee-Alabama line.
He can step one way and be inTennessee and fall back into
Alabama.
There you go, that's the way itworks down here.
(00:26):
Yeah, trip over logs.
Yeah, we got a trip for youtoday, guys.
We got Mr John Doherty.
He is accredited to be apaleo-vegan.
He has a plethora of experiencedoing this.
He started out working for, Iguess, the county's veteran
service office back when hefirst started doing this many,
many moons ago, probably 30, 40years ago.
(00:46):
So you've been doing this for along time.
But today we're going to startoff, we're going to get the
state of the VA.
And, john, what do you thinktoday's state of the VA is?
I guess we'll do it from theregional office side, from the
claims side.
John Dorle (00:59):
Yeah, you know, as I was talking to you earlier, I
think it's always a good idea tokind of at least from my
perspective the state of the VAthe good, the bad and the ugly.
I think the bad and the ugly ispretty clear.
That's always been the caseever since I started in 1992 is
(01:22):
the delay, delay, delay, delayuntil the veterans quit.
You know that seems to be therunning mantra with the VA but
yeah, it's continuing to be adelay process.
But one thing I can report theBoard of Veterans Appeals has
(01:43):
gotten a lot better.
One thing I can report the Boardof Veterans Appeals has gotten
a lot better as they whittleddown.
Their priority had always beenthe legacy appeals and for those
people that remember the legacyappeals, that was the appeals
process prior to the currentAppeals Management Act.
They've whittled down thelegacy appeals process to the
(02:05):
level that it's not nearly asbad anymore.
So in the day, probably asrecently as a year and a half
ago, it was about 40 months,three and a half years for a
decision to come from the board.
But as of late, within the pastthree to four months, I've been
(02:30):
seeing decisions coming back ineight to 12 months.
So that's wonderful and thedecisions are good.
I'm getting some good decisionsfrom the board.
That's good, but of course whatI mentioned earlier.
The delays are are never good,but uh as as many of us are
(02:51):
aware, uh, they will expediteyour claims if they can show
financial hardship or terminalillness or their their age is 85
years or if they're at thelocal VA and 75 or older, and if
it's at the board.
So that's kind of a nutshell ofat least my take of what's going
(03:11):
on with the VA.
It continues to be a processand we just whittle down the
claims and win as many as we canfrom this end of it.
So yeah, any questions at all.
So yeah, Any questions at all.
J Basser (03:34):
Can't hear you.
We know there's three levelappeals to the VA.
John Dorle (03:37):
There we go.
I can hear you now.
I'm sorry, I'm sorry you gotthe direct documents.
J Basser (03:42):
Just a few seconds.
John Dorle (03:43):
I didn't hear you, I'll ask a question, you got the
direct docket, go aheadwhichever.
J Basser (03:52):
I was going to say there's three levels of appeals.
Each one had a different timeframe and we'll get them done,
because I think the quickest wasused to be take a trip to DC
and do the appeal and they hadthe direct docket review that I
had and I think about what Ithink about what I think about
40 months from I get, if Iremember correctly.
John Dorle (04:09):
Yeah, yeah, that's what I was referring to the
direct docket review is about 40months out and even longer for
a personal hearing.
Then there's the other optionof a 90 day admin review to
submit new evidence.
You can just add 90 days tothat.
But yeah, direct review isabout 40 months and, like I said
(04:30):
, it's not that long anymore.
I think that's as a result ofthey were able to eliminate the
legacy appeals to a large degreeso they can concentrate more on
the AMA Appeals Management Actappeals, more on the AMA Appeals
Management Act appeals.
But yeah, 40 months probably acouple years ago was at about 40
(04:50):
months and it's gotten a lotbetter.
J Basser (04:55):
Alright, guys, remember, if you're in an appeal
process and you're waiting fora direct docket review and you
just got some good news there,it's going to be a little
quicker than what I had to gothrough a couple years ago,
because it was a discombobulatedmess, in my opinion.
Ray Cobb (05:12):
John, do you think right now, what's going on?
I got a call today from aveteran.
Fortunately, one of my friendsreferred him to me.
That's a doctor and theinteresting part about it he had
(05:40):
been told by the county serviceoffice to go ahead and file a
claim for loss of use of hearing.
He was around jet engines allthe time in the Air Force back
during the Vietnam era, aroundjet engines all the time in the
Air Force back during theVietnam era.
Well, the problem with thatwhen I talked to him, he has no
diagnosis and I'm wondering whyare these county service
(06:01):
officers in Tennessee andprobably around the entire
country telling people to file aclaim when they don't even have
a diagnosis yet and the factthat it's not going to do
anything except setting updelays and bogging down the
system?
Do you think that's whatthey're trying today?
John Dorle (06:21):
Well, I think what the county service officers are
trying to do is.
Well, I think what the countyservice officers are trying to
do is at least in the day.
I was a county service officerfor about 20 years and I started
doing this independent forabout 15 years now, and one of
(06:41):
the first questions I'd ask themis how their hearing is.
I can usually tell by justtalking to them.
I'd know what the answer wouldbe.
But I need to get the veteran toadmit that they have a hearing
loss.
A lot of times they'll havetheir spouse with them and the
veteran might say, oh, myhearing is fine, and the wife in
most cases will be lookingside-eye at the veteran like, no
(07:04):
, it's not.
And and so, to answer yourquestion, once I have determined
that they have a hearing loss,I absolutely file a claim for
even though they don't have adiagnosis, because most of the
time veterans who are sufferingfrom hearing loss, they don't
have a formal diagnosis loss,they don't have a formal
(07:25):
diagnosis.
So if they don't have a formaldiagnosis, that's not going to
prevent me from filing the claim.
And honestly, ray, that's partof the program with the VA is
those compensation exams.
They will get them in for anexam and they will diagnose them
or not diagnose them.
So don't feel like they'retrying to bog the system down.
(07:49):
I think what they're trying todo is the same thing I would
have tried to do is get theseguys service connected to
hearing loss or even bringing intheir um.
I think it's important to followthe plane.
Let them do the complicationexaminations and let the
audiologist determine whetherthey have a diagnosis or not.
(08:09):
Don't place the onus on theveteran to go get a diagnosis
and then follow the claim.
I think that would be theopposite of what I'd want to do
Okay, but would that notnegatively affect his date?
J Basser (08:27):
say, for example, if he didn't have a diagnosis but
he goes to a cnp exam after stay, file the claim six months
later you know just thegeneralized date I put in there
that he goes for a cnp exam.
The next thing you know he doeshave compensable hearing loss.
Well, they will probably takeadvantage of the situation there
and say okay, your effectivedate for the hearing loss is the
(08:49):
date of your hearing test filmat five.
John Dorle (08:53):
Well, we're assuming that that initial hearing exam
was 100% accurate too, Mm-hmm.
You know, I think that I getyour point.
I think the point is that wewant to put the cart before the
horse.
Do we want to rush them in foran exam without a diagnosis?
And then they go in, they don'thave a diagnosis.
(09:15):
And then you file a claim ayear later and then they have a
diagnosis.
And then the VA comes back andsays well, whoa, you know, you
didn't have a diagnosis a yearago.
Now you do.
So, something happened withinthat year that caused the
hearing losses.
It wasn't the military.
So yeah, I mean it is strategic.
(09:35):
I like to strike while theiron's hot If the veteran feels
like they have a hearing loss tome.
99 times out of 100, they have ahearing loss.
Now, if they're kind of upthere, they don't know if they
have a hearing loss.
Sometimes they hear things,sometimes they don't.
Yeah, then that would be a timemaybe to go get a diagnosis
(09:57):
first, because we don't want tofall into that trap of you.
Know, you file a claim today,your decibel losses are low, and
then five years later you filea claim and they're off the
charts, and then it's harder topoint the finger at the military
.
So I get your point.
My theory is, like I said,strike while the iron's hot, the
(10:22):
veteran and the wife, thespouse usually knows whether
they have hearing loss.
So I've never been one to delaymyself.
I don't know that I can everremember a case where that kind
of hit the benching in the hindend.
And even if it did, you knowwe'd have to put you know.
(10:43):
The VA would have todemonstrate that that audiology
exam they had at that time?
Wasn't that accurate ascompared to the one they have a
year later?
So yeah.
I think the risk reward ratiois more in favor of the veteran.
Just get the claim in.
Let them get in for thecompensation exam, yeah.
J Basser (11:08):
Ray, I'm going to send you a BVA claim here Case
tomorrow.
Maybe the day after, when youget it, print it off and give it
to the guy you said the guy wasan MD right.
Ray Cobb (11:20):
MD, metal doctor, right?
No, that's who we referred himto.
The gentleman is 79, almost 80years old.
He's never filed a claim he'snever, you know.
He's to the point where he'sthinking he could possibly use
some medical assistance.
Now the other question I have.
I saw this happen once.
(11:40):
I took a veteran down to theAlvin C York to put in for
medical.
And he goes in and he's good.
The guy's going through all thenumbers and everything, he said
, well, you don't quite qualify,you make too much or your
retirement's too much.
And then the guy says somethingWell, when I was in Vietnam, he
(12:01):
said wait a minute, you were inVietnam.
He said yeah.
He said wait a minute, you werein Vietnam.
He said yeah.
He said well, then youautomatically qualify for
medical.
Is that true?
So if he served during theVietnam era, then he
automatically qualifies formedical right.
John Dorle (12:19):
Yeah, john, I think you'd agree.
I mean, there's a differencebetween Vietnam era and
in-country Vietnam.
Yeah, you have.
(12:41):
And really what?
Like I said when I was a county, the law has changed.
You're in a protected categoryif you served in Vietnam because
of your exposure to AgentOrange.
That automatically enrolls youinto the VA medical.
I mean you have to get enrolled, you have to fill out the
paperwork, bring your 214 in.
(13:01):
But I mean your exposure toAgent Orange, but I mean your
exposure to Agent Orange as faras I remember, John.
you tell me if I'm wrong, but asfar as I remember, you're
exempt from the means test withthe VA Medical Center if you can
show Agent Orange exposure, andthat would even any type of
(13:22):
Agent.
Orange exposure Korea, vietnamairplanes that carried the Agent
Orange.
You know that kind of thing.
J Basser (13:27):
So get on the registry get on the PACT Act and Agent
Orange registry.
Get on the registry and they'lldo that.
But no, he should be gettingfree medicine care.
I mean as far as that he muststill have co-pays to pay.
But you know, anytime you'reinvolved in herbicide or testing
(13:48):
like that, it's the same thingas a project captain.
Ray Cobb (13:53):
Well, he was around a lot of jet fuel.
He was a mechanic and he workedon the motors jet motors.
So he he said, oh yeah, I wasaround fuel every day, so I
don't, but he doesn't have anycancer.
(14:13):
His hearing from being aroundthe engines is really is only
what I was.
From what he told me today,it's the only thing that I
recognize as being a disabilitythat he may be entitled to.
You know, spending six yearsworking around in the Air Force
(14:34):
working around jet engines.
J Basser (14:37):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
John Dorle (14:41):
I yeah, Ray, he should definitely, and at that
age he could rate real high forhearing loss.
And then automatically 10% fortinnitus.
Ray Cobb (14:54):
Well, he had to ask me a lot of times to repeat what I
was saying, and I'm not forsure if his hearing was a point
that he couldn't understand whatI was saying or he actually was
dropping off words, you know sohe didn't understand what I was
saying.
J Basser (15:12):
Given his age, go ahead and get the plane filed.
Help him do it, Get it turnedinto it.
Let's figure it out, because hegoes to the top of the line, he
goes to the head of the train,he gets to ride in the engine.
Ray Cobb (15:26):
Well, that's what I told him, and I also told him he
likes his.
He's actually from anothercounty, coffey County, up the
road from us here in.
J Basser (15:34):
Manchester.
Ray Cobb (15:36):
And he likes that county service officer.
They have a new one up there.
He's been around only a coupleof years.
So I said, if you feelcomfortable with him, if you
think he's doing you a good job,go see him.
J Basser (15:50):
Yeah, the rest of us get a ride.
Hanging on to the booth withMagnus on our feet.
John Dorle (16:00):
You get rated for hearing loss.
You get rated for tinnitus andgiven his age and his poor
hearing, I suspect he could getrated pretty high for hearing
loss automatic 10% for tinnitus.
Aren't comfortable with it, butwhen they hear so poorly it
(16:25):
causes them depression, anxietyAnxiety in the sense that they
get worked up because they don'tthink people are going to hear
them, or depression because theycan't associate society the way
they want to, and you can getrated for depression and anxiety
as well.
And then you get rated fordepression and anxiety as well.
(16:47):
Then you get rated fordepression and anxiety.
Typically, the older guys havesleep apnea.
You can see how the gears areturning.
This guy is 100% part of thetotal weight, right?
John?
J Basser (17:02):
He's waiting in the wings for 100% front and total.
He's got a very short period oftime to do it.
It has nothing to do with VAclaims.
When you get that age youbetter get her done, because
time is not on your side,especially if you've got a wife.
Ray Cobb (17:20):
His wife has passed away already.
He's 79 years old.
His wife has passed awayalready.
He's 79 years old.
So you know, I mean he's reallyfor 79 years old.
He sounded pretty good.
J Basser (17:34):
I'm 76.
He needs to go to a 30-year-oldand put her on.
Get 100% and let her keep ongiving until she passes away.
In 50, 60 years, get some of itback.
John Dorle (17:47):
That's what I was thinking.
That's a good question, ray.
I think in general your countyservice officers they try to do
right by veterans.
But but, like john said, thereis strategy there and, uh, he
makes good points.
Yeah, sometimes you can keepyourself in the foot by filing a
(18:10):
claim too soon, as opposed towaiting till you're like 79, 80
years old, because it's a loteasier to pin it on the military
as compared to working in amechanic shop for the past 20
years.
You know that kind of thing.
Not that we're trying to cheatthe VA or anything like that,
but I think that you know weneed to give veterans every
(18:34):
advantage that we can andreasonable doubt, point the
finger at the military everychance you get.
So it is strategic as to whenyou file a claim, but I think at
the age of 79, that's ano-brainer.
Yeah, he needs to file a claimand, like I said, it's quite
(18:57):
possible he could get rated realhigh for it given his poor
hearing.
Ray Cobb (19:04):
Yeah, I feel like he would.
J Basser (19:06):
Yeah.
John Dorle (19:07):
I hope the county service officer feels that way
too.
Some are really good and someare, you know, I don't know.
So I had a little bit of a warstory.
I had a gal call me, a veterangal call me the other day,
wanted me to represent her, andI explained to her.
(19:29):
I said, you know I'm not takingcases anymore, but you know I'm
looking to retire in the nextfour years or so.
But I'll get you in line, I'llget you hooked up with someone
and she was out of Texas and notto pick on Texas, the Texas
Veterans Commission are verygood when it comes to
representing veterans, but notthis time, unfortunately.
(19:54):
They ran her around and she wascrying and she just was
suicidal and the whole thing andthey just didn't give her the
TLC they needed.
So I ended up taking the caseand so we'll see what I can do
with her.
But I guess the point I'mtrying to make is that, as in
with any profession myprofession or anyone else's
(20:14):
there's good advocates andthere's not so good advocates.
So if you're listening to this,podcast just remember that if an
advocate tells you no, don'ttake it as gossip.
(20:35):
Look at every avenue.
You can do your research.
Talk to other advocates, talkto your friends, talk to your
family, get the claims in.
The worst the VA can do is sayno.
At the very least you get adecision.
You have a year to appeal itand you can build on that.
Once you get into an appealstatus, you get plenty of
(20:55):
attorneys and claims agents,such as myself, that probably
would be more than happy to takethe case.
J Basser (21:01):
But don't hesitate in getting your claim in.
John Dorle (21:04):
Like I said, the worst the VA can do is say no.
They have to go into detail asto why they say no, and we can
go off of that as a power ofattorney.
So as far as timeliness guys, Iguess I could build a little
(21:28):
bit on a little history on theappeals process.
I like to think that's my swingzone, but in the day I talked
about that earlier we had thelegacy appeals process.
J Basser (21:39):
It switched over to the Appeals Management Act of
the.
John Dorle (21:42):
EMA right around 2018-2019.
It's a whole different way ofdoing things with the VA.
As far as appeals.
When you get a decision fromthe VA and it's a denial, or if
it's a grant but not as great ashow you want, you can always
appeal that decision.
Ray Cobb (22:02):
There's three different types of appeals.
John Dorle (22:05):
You've got the supplemental lane review the
higher level review and theBoard of Veterans Appeal, so a
supplemental lane review isbasically you're telling the VA
that I have new evidence thatyou haven't looked at before.
I'm going to supplement myappeal with this evidence and I
want you to make a differentdecision.
Or you can go a higher-levelreview and say I don't have any
(22:27):
new evidence, but I think youapplied the line correctly and
therefore I want a higher-levelreview.
This is a decision reviewofficer.
And what's got a DRock?
There's three of them in thecountry.
Ray Cobb (22:40):
St.
John Dorle (22:40):
Petersburg, seattle and Washington DC DROs DROS
they're called are higher levelraters.
They've got more seasonings.
They don't always make theright decision, but they have
more seasonings.
So under don't always make theright decision, but they have
more seasonings.
So under a higher level reviewyou can have a DRO.
Look at your case.
The third option is you canskip both of those and go right
(23:01):
to the Board of Veterans Appealsand get a decision from them.
I don't typically go to theBoard of Veterans Appeals, right
?
Ray Cobb (23:11):
away.
John Dorle (23:11):
I do a higher level review before we go to the Board
of Veterans Appeals because,like I said earlier, the wait
time seven to twelve months now,which is still a lot but not
too bad, but up until about ayear ago.
It was about what we mentionedearlier about three and a half
years.
So I avoid the Board ofVeterans Appeals as much as I
(23:32):
can, just because of the wait.
If we can win it under a higherlevel review, that gives us
another swing at the plate, andif we have to go to the board of
veterans appeals later, we cando that.
So that's kind of it and that'swhere I'll bond on the three
options you have when you get adecision from the VA.
Now, the timeframe forsupplemental lane reviews is
(23:54):
about 125 days, depending uponthe complexity of the case, and
the same with the higher-levelreviews.
The VA's goal is 125 days,which is not too bad, but I
think that I'm seeing thesetypes of cases coming in at
about 125 days.
They're sticking to that asmuch as they can, but again,
(24:15):
that depends on the complexity.
One other thing that I shouldmention is that you came up with
this what's called a claimsaccuracy review, we call it CAR.
When you file a higher levelreview and if you feel like, as
the advocate, that this case,the slam dunk, is closed, uh,
(24:39):
you can label it as a car claimsaccuracy review and the v is
obligated to keep that within amonth.
Not everything qualifies as acar, but uh, but that's another
option that we, as advocates,but that's another option that
(25:02):
we, as advocates, you know weuse to help expedite claims.
So most veterans are unaware ofthat, but I think that most
experienced advocates and powersof attorney are going to be
aware of what a CAR CAR CRIBESAccuracy Review is.
So that's another tool that weuse as advocates to try to
(25:22):
expedite claims.
Then, of course, like I saidearlier, I mean the standard
expedite is always the case.
If your case is at a local VAregional office, if you're 85
years of age or older, they haveto expedite it, except the
Board of Veterans Appeals is 75years of age or older, and then
under either scenario you have afinancial hardship, a threat of
(25:44):
homelessness, that type ofthing they have to expedite.
Or if you have a situationwhere the veteran is terminal or
in very, very severe health,they will expedite the procedure
.
From that too, I'll give you acredit.
When we can demonstrate anexpedite, they do get on their
horses on that.
Ray Cobb (26:08):
I think they do pretty good about that.
Quick question On a higherlevel review have you noticed
the percentage or do you haveany idea about how much of a
turnover that's granted on theveterans that go to the higher
level review versus one who doesa supplemental claim?
John Dorle (26:29):
I don't have any statistics, ray, I just don't.
I go with my gut on that.
My theory is this when we get adecision and I'm talking to a
veteran about it, the firstthing I do is I try to see if
they can produce new andrelevant evidence.
If they think they can, or ifthey want to go see a doctor for
(26:53):
a medical opinion Nexus MedicalOpinion or if they've got some
medical records they think theycan.
Or if they want to go see adoctor for a medical opinion
Nexus Medical opinion or ifthey've got some medical records
they think that will back themup, then I would do a
supplemental name review,because what that does is it
gives us another swing at theplate before we have to go to a
higher level review.
But if the veteran says you know, john, I can't get anything.
(27:15):
I've tried.
I don't think I can geteverything, but I would like to
appeal this and say, okay, well,let's strategize this, we can
do a higher level review.
We've got eight issues.
I see at least three of them wecan go to a higher level review
.
I really think the other fouror five you're going to need new
(27:36):
, relevant evidence.
We kind of huddle up andstrategize those types of things
.
But if a veteran tells me Ican't get any new evidence, then
we do go a higher level review.
But as far as statistics,numbers, as far as the win
percentage, on the higher levelreview as compared to a
supplemental lane review.
(27:58):
I think it's just too variedbecause with a supplemental,
lane review, it's introducingnew and relevant evidence, and
we don't know what that kind ofevidence would be.
It could be really weakevidence that the VA is still
mandated to make a decision, orit could be really really solid
evidence.
So those percentages vary inthose cases as well.
(28:19):
I think the better questionmight be the difference between
a higher level review and aBoard of Veterans Appeals.
In a higher level review, youcan't submit new evidence.
Under a Board of VeteransAppeals appeal and a direct
review, you can't submit newevidence under a Board of
Veterans Appeals appeal.
Under a direct review, youcan't submit new evidence either
.
So then we're on a firm playingground, meaning what's better
(28:43):
higher level review or Board ofVeterans Appeals.
Like I said, I always go higherlevel review.
First because it gives usanother swing at the plate
before we have to go to theBoard of Veterans Appeals,
because if the Board of VeteransAppeals denies this, we're
going to have to come in withnew and relevant evidence to
have it looked at again.
(29:03):
I mean, you're a bit morelimited when you get to a Board
of Veterans Appeals and you getdenied.
So exhausting your options withthe supplemental lane review
and a higher level review arebest and then, if need be, go to
the Board of Veterans Appeals.
Ray Cobb (29:25):
Unless someone is very sharp.
I usually recommend that afterthey get their denial.
Recommend that after they gettheir denial, even if it's
obvious that they overlooksomething in your medical
records, which they have mine Ialways recommend they get an
agent at that time because youhave pointed out some excellent
(29:49):
things that an agent can talk tothem about that a county
service officer can't and won't,and you can kind of rationalize
out which is going to be thebest way and the fastest way.
And you know, I usually tellanyone that I've helped get
started or that calls me about adenial that they've received.
(30:13):
You know, what should we donext or what can I do next?
I usually start looking for anagent that specializes in that
in order to try to get them onboard and get them started that
way.
I just think in the way theappeal process works today, they
(30:34):
need that extra help.
I just at least the ones that Ihave read into.
Now I'm going to take back thefact that I've had two or three
that I've talked with andreferred to James Cripps' web
page, va the Redneck Way, andthey followed that script and
(30:56):
done that, and then they've alsolooked at John's and they win
the first time around.
You know, even 100%, with fouror five different problems, and
you know.
But the guys that you know, youcan kind of I can't kind of
evaluate what they need to do.
Basically, if I'm talking to agentleman that finished high
(31:22):
school and that's the onlyeducation that he really has and
the rest of it's you know, aswe say around here back behind
the barn, then those are theguys that I'm going to say you
need to get an agent In theappeals process today.
Regardless of which one, whatI've seen that works, you almost
(31:45):
have to write a legal brief orpretty close to it in order to
win the case in a reasonableperiod of time.
It in order to win the case ina reasonable period of time.
And I don't know of how manyveterans, especially, let's say,
(32:07):
75 and older, can actually dothat.
I mean, a lot of guys I talkwith can't even use a computer.
They're not on VAgov.
John Dorle (32:12):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, your point's well taken.
Uh ray, I I think that, assomeone who used to be a county
veteran service officer, I Ihope I wouldn't have been judged
by my peers.
I certainly think that thereare very good county service
officers out there.
They're they're very goodnational service officers out
(32:34):
there, primarily with thedisabled American veterans on a
national level.
But that said and John Stacey,you know this but us claims
agents and attorneys, we haveskin in the game.
Okay, most of us are veterans.
We want to do right by you.
(32:56):
I'm a veteran, I want to win theclaim for you.
But from a business standpoint,we have skin in the game.
So it's our business incentiveto win those claims, whereas the
free services they're going toget a check every two weeks,
regardless of how well they do.
(33:17):
So I think my primary incentivecertainly is for the veteran
but to keep the lights on andpay the rent, feed the kids.
You know I need to win theseclaims.
So I'm going to do everythingand anything I can do to win
those claims, and that meansresearch, always keeping my ear
(33:41):
to the ground, networking withmy peers, building relationships
with the Department of VeteransAffairs, just doing anything
and every law, rule andregulation that comes out, and I
think most of your successfulcompensated attorneys and agents
are probably going to say thesame things we have skin in the
(34:04):
game.
It's our incentive to win itand we're going to do everything
we can to win it, not onlybecause we care for our trends,
but because we want to earn aliving and, to put it blindly,
that's exactly what we'relooking to do is try to earn a
living, but we also want toserve our veterans as well.
(34:29):
So I think when you're sayingthat you should automatically
always get an attorney or anagent, I think that's good
advice, but I would also suggestthat there are plenty of free
services out there that they'revery good.
Like I said, when I was acounty service officer, I worked
(34:50):
with my peers.
I worked with national serviceofficers, and they were very
sharp as well.
So I think that you knowveterans nowadays they get a
denial.
You can have your cake and eatit too.
You can save that 20% fee thatI'm going to charge on that
thing and give services throughyour free services as well.
(35:15):
You save that fee and then youalso get your maximum
compensation as well.
That's a possibility.
It doesn't always happen thatway, but you can have your best
of both worlds and have yourcake and eat it too, so to speak
, but I think if you really wantto hit the nail on the head,
you're going to want to getsomeone with my experience or
(35:38):
someone equivalent.
I mean, there's plenty of lawfirms out there that are
well-established, you know thatwould be more than willing to
hear your case.
What I am seeing, though, ray,is that a lot of law firms
they're not going to take everycase, and, unfortunately, some
of them are only going to takethe big buck cases, the ones
(36:00):
that have been pending for avery long time, the ones that
they have a very, very goodchance at winning, and so you
know that's unfortunate thatthey don't take those cases that
are going to require you toroll up your sleeves and and get
into the mud with the v8 butthere are a lot of firms out
there that will will fight foryou, I believe.
(36:21):
I know I would.
Ray Cobb (36:28):
That's some great points.
I mean it's you know I can nameone national service officer
down in Nashville in theNashville Regional Office.
I think she's great.
She helped me win my firstAgent Orange case exposed in the
United States, you know, andshe's helped me with other cases
(36:48):
.
And then as time went on and Iwent to a higher level, I had to
quit doing it for myself andactually the last two cases I
filed I ended up having to getsomeone to help with it.
But then I'm talking about I'mup in the R2 and the level 2
range, which is quite differentand quite more intact and
(37:12):
requires a lot moredocumentation.
John Dorle (37:18):
Yeah, yeah, that's a good point.
I think that when you get intothe real complicated cases as
well-meaning as a lot ofadvocates are and that goes for
claims agents and attorneys aswell advocates are, and that
goes for claims agents andattorneys as well when they get
really, really complicated,they're out of their realm.
(37:39):
So I think when you get into thecomplicated cases where you're
falling into the SMC, the M'sand the L's and the L and a half
and the M and a half and the R1, r2, all that stuff, uh you're
going to want to get, uh, anattorney or agent or even a
national service officer thatthat knows the rules and
(38:00):
regulations real well, because,uh, while not every veteran uh
falls into that area of of smcand higher levels of SMC and the
different precedent opinionswith the court, there does come
a time where you have to applythat, and so that's a situation
(38:24):
where you're going to want tostart interviewing different
advocates and representatives,and I always tell people that
you know attorneys are prettyintelligent.
They have to be, you know, toget a law degree.
But just because they have asheepskin on their wall doesn't
mean they have what it takes tofight off the VA.
(38:45):
It takes a lot of experience,it takes a lot of know-how, it
takes a lot of relationships andit takes a lot of book
knowledge as well.
So, if you find an advocatewith all those types of features
, sink your teeth into him orher, because they're the ones
that'll get you where you needto go.
Ray Cobb (39:05):
Yeah, I was able to get up to my R1 and to my
caregiver level one withoutgetting anyone involved, but to
get those next two I definitelyhad to get somebody involved
because, you know, I turned itin and when I turned in should
have been awarded right off thebat but it wasn't.
So I had to get someone thatpointed out where they had made
(39:29):
their mistake and what theydidn't look at, someone that
pointed out where they had madetheir mistake and what they
didn't look at, um, and whenthey did that, then you know I
won, and both of them were wonin less than than 12 months.
So you know I was quitesatisfied, but I don't think if
I had not gotten someone of yourcaliber or like you, I don't
(39:50):
think I would have ever gottento the R1 or R2, because it
required more capabilities thanwhat I personally have.
John Dorle (40:01):
Good point, good point.
I think that the VA tends to tryto walk all over veterans when
it comes to more complicatedcases, even less complicated
cases, they'll do that.
But when the veteran comes intoa situation where they have
especially a well-known law firm, someone they've worked with
(40:24):
before that knows they meanbusiness, that gets their
attention and, eitherconsciously or subconsciously, I
think, some of those decisionreview officers and or BVA
judges or people that are makingthose decisions, they tend to
think they can kind of bigleague the veteran but they're
(40:45):
not going to big league some ofthe more experienced advocates,
some of the more experiencedadvocates.
So and yeah, I mean you didwell to get yourself up to R1
and it's unfortunate they didn'tgrant R2 with you representing
yourself.
It sounds like the evidence wasthere.
It probably could have savedyou the fee that maybe your your
(41:07):
attorney charged.
But I think you might thinkthat I would guess that you
think it was well worth itbecause that person got you to
where you needed, whereas youdon't think you could have
gotten there by yourself.
Ray Cobb (41:22):
Well, in my case, I think I could have gotten there
eventually, but I think it'dprobably been 36 months, not 10
months.
And I think, because I got him,I got it in 10 months instead
of 36 months.
And you know, yeah, that's athousand dollars and you know he
(41:43):
gets 20%, that's not, that'snot going to keep the lights on
very long, yeah, but you knowit's it's what I felt like was
the best way to do it, so that'sthe way I went and you were
smart.
John Dorle (41:58):
You understand that as long as you keep that appeals
window open, your back pay isgoing to be even larger.
So it's always better to getsomething in 10 months as
compared to 36 months months,even though the back pay would
be larger.
Uh, you know, we we want to getcompensated as soon as we can.
(42:19):
Uh, life is funny.
We're all, we're all alivetoday, but who knows, tomorrow
is guaranteed nothing, right?
So absolutely, we need to holdthe va to a higher standard
right off the bat.
J Basser (42:35):
That's what I call stacking 50s and dragging the
wagon.
There you go.
As long as you drag that wagon,the heavy is still a gift.
John Dorle (42:44):
John, we lost your picture there a few times.
I'm glad you came back.
J Basser (42:49):
Yeah, I know I had a couple of technical issues when
I did it.
I guess I had a power surge orsomething.
I guess we had a storm, sowe're okay now.
John Dorle (42:57):
All right, all right .
J Basser (42:59):
Yeah, we're good.
John Dorle (43:04):
John, you're kind of quiet.
You have any questions at all.
You want to throw anything atme?
J Basser (43:11):
You're pondering two other issues.
You know, like other cases ofother diabetic stuff and things
like that.
Of course I've got a list ofstuff.
I'll run your way.
But diabetes is a very I guesswe say it's a very diverse
(43:39):
disease because you've got somany secondary issues.
You can claim off of that oneissue and I don't think a lot of
folks understand that.
You know, because you basicallyyou got insulin dependent
diabetes or diabetes itself.
You know you've got.
You've got all the neuropathies.
You've got eye issues, you'vegot bowel and bladder issues.
(44:02):
You've got the small fiberneuropathy, which they don't
really focus on too much of theyou know.
The problem is you got diabeticneuropathy and small fiber
neuropathy.
They'll send you and do thetest on your feet and your legs
and things like that for thenerves.
However, your large fibernerves might be operating to a
(44:22):
good extent, but the smallfibers are the ones messed up.
So the rate schedule, but therate schedule doesn't pick that
out.
They just consider it asdiabetic neuropathy.
There's some things in thatarea that the VA can improve on.
There's a lot of things theycan improve on in the rate and
schedule.
John Dorle (44:45):
From a medical side, getting a good, qualified
endocrinologist that deals withdiabetes type 2 on a regular
basis and all the residuals thatcome along with it, including
the kidneys and the heart andthe vision and the neuropathy
and the different levels ofneuropathy and the nerves
(45:06):
involved.
And yeah, it is somethingthat's a very insidious disease.
I've had veterans that have hadamputations.
I've had them die because ofdiabetes.
I've had veterans spend time innursing homes because of
(45:29):
diabetes and so if it goesunchecked and untreated, it can
really it'll get you.
So you're right.
From a medical side, it'simportant to find an
endocrinologist that isexperienced and can document
everything and provide theappropriate letters and nexus
letters that we can use to helpwin claims.
(45:52):
And then, of course, from theRaiders side, they have to be up
and experienced on all theresiduals that go along with
diabetes.
I know for myself.
I continually try to educatemyself on a variety of different
diseases that come about.
I mean, medical science ischanging all the time.
(46:13):
Diabetes is something that isimportant to learn.
I know I've learned a lot fromour colleagues over the years.
John, I've learned from you.
I won't get into details, butyou've got disabilities that
maybe kind of scratch my headand think, yeah, let me research
(46:35):
that a little bit closer.
Ray Cobb (46:36):
You know, let's look at that a little bit closer, and
a lot of it I knew.
John Dorle (46:40):
but you don't deal with them all the time and so
you kind of there's so much toremember.
But then it keys your memoryand it's like, yeah, you brought
up something, I want toresearch that a little bit.
Your memory.
And it's like, yeah, he broughtup something, I want to
research that a little bit.
Yeah, so I learned a lot frommy clients doing this 33 years,
and some of your biggestteachers are your clients, as
well as your peers and yourteachers what's your opinion on?
Ray Cobb (47:07):
like John and myself here, we are pretty highly rated
as far as I'm, more than Johnwith the diabetes and things.
However, things are continuingto worsen and I'm continuing to
lose use of my hands, forexample.
Now is there any reason for meto go back and file a claim or
(47:33):
ask for an increase?
The best example my hands are,I think, ones at 30 and ones at
40%.
Now, realistically, that wasdone back prior to 2010.
I think it was about 2008.
(47:56):
So they definitely worsened alot and I've lost, you know,
almost complete grip in my lefthand.
Does it even benefit me in anyway to take the time and the
effort and put another claiminto the wheel?
John Dorle (48:17):
I see, john shaking his head no, yep, I agree.
Ray Cobb (48:20):
I agree too, John.
I don't want to get into ahassle but some people say well,
why don't you put in for more?
There's nothing else I can get.
John Dorle (48:28):
Yeah, you can't, unless the law changes are to
the highest you can get.
J Basser (48:33):
Here you need your little.
Unless you keep that, claimfile closed.
John Dorle (48:40):
Unless you had a wife that was in need of aid and
attendance, you might get ahigher dependency allowance.
There's some hospital benefitsthat you could get Not
necessarily from a caregiverstandpoint If your wife was
taking care of you.
There's a caregiver allotmentthat's afforded her and there's
(49:04):
medical services that you mightqualify for as you get worse off
Nursing home care and stufflike that.
But as far as a monthlycompensation, r2 is the highest
unless they change the law.
J Basser (49:21):
I think it would be.
Anytime you're an R2 vet,there's basically no reason at
all to file another claimbecause you do not want to give
them the opportunity to openthat claims folder up.
It says green had a certainamount of time, at least 10
years, or because 20 year, 20year protection rule.
(49:43):
You know it worked.
But the uh.
You know I just hit one of my100 just a couple days ago and
so you know the protectors arein there for a reason.
But I would not touch anythingor open any claim up, just the
higher you get rated.
You know I wouldn't openanything else up because you
never know, I mean, if they're.
John Dorle (50:04):
All it takes is one person to look at something the
wrong way and you got a headacheyeah, and there's always the
chance that I've seen it happentoo, where the VA committed a
clear and unmistakable error.
I'm not saying that's the casewith you, ray, but you could be
(50:26):
rated for R2 or any percentage.
And you poke the bear and allof a sudden you get some bean
counter that looks at it andsays, well, we shouldn't have
rated that person at thatpercentage.
At that time we made an error.
We're going to propose to lowerthat person's upper extremity
(50:51):
from 60 down to 10 or somethinglike that.
You know, it's something crazylike that.
It can happen.
So I think that be careful whenyou poke the berry R2, there's
no doubt you wouldn't.
But I mean, if you're 100%permanent total and you're not
drawing special monthlycompensation unless you qualify
(51:11):
for smc special monthlycompensation, I wouldn't touch
it.
I think most advocates wouldtell you that as well.
Uh, unless you know, evensometimes I get veterans are 100
permanent total and and theythink, well, I've got erectile
dysfunction so maybe I can getan extra 180 bucks a month.
I'm like maybe, possibly, butis 180 a month worth it to for
(51:38):
them to open up the pandora'sbox again?
I, I wouldn't, I wouldn't riskit myself.
Ray Cobb (51:45):
But that's a great example.
Uh, I have a gentleman thatI've been helping.
He actually has worsened a lot.
He had not hit the 10-year mark.
He was at eight years with hisfeet, but his feet had gotten
worse and so he asked for anincrease and, trying to get from
(52:06):
a 40% to a 60% or to an L, hisankles are locked out.
Well, they reduced him, theytook him down 10% and he
couldn't understand why.
And I said, well, let's look atthis.
What did you not tell me?
I asked you if you'd been goingto the doctor.
Well, I have.
I've been seeing Dr Andersonhere locally.
(52:28):
I said have you gone to any VAdoctor?
No, I didn't like them.
Well, did you get VA torecommend your community care?
No, well, those are two veryimportant things, guys, because
if there's no record in a yearthat you've received treatment,
(52:50):
these guys in the VA are goingto assume that you have improved
your condition and they'regoing to worry you.
I mean, it was only 10%, butthen what I've encouraged him to
do is ask for a hearing,because that's taken three or
four years and that gives himenough time to get back into the
(53:11):
va and get updateddocumentation about how bad his
ankles are and also gettingprosthetics and, uh, I'm sure
they won't reduce him and theymay give him the increase that
he was seeking he should havegot the records from.
J Basser (53:28):
He should have got the records from outside doctor and
turned to me and say, no, youdon't.
Well, that's a good point, buthe didn't and so now he's going
to do that.
Ray Cobb (53:40):
That's on him Right, but the less they have to do
with the VA, the better theylike it.
J Basser (53:48):
You've got to be careful, you've got to be
careful You've got.
John Dorle (53:52):
To be careful You've got to play the game.
J Basser (53:53):
You've got to play the game.
Ray, you know that you don'tplay the game.
John Dorle (54:00):
That 10 and 20-year rule, if I remember right.
J Basser (54:03):
After 10 years they can never reduce you and after
20 years they can never severyou, if I remember right 20
years is the only way they cansever you, and the only way they
can either sever or touch itreally is due to fraud.
John Dorle (54:19):
Yeah, yeah.
So those are things to keep inmind as well.
But well, how would a Q applyto that though?
Because I tell you I'mconfident I've seen cases where
the guys have been rated for anumber of years but they come in
and they do something withtheir claims and they realize
(54:40):
that that bad condition thatthey had rated 40% should have
been rated 10%.
You know, I've seen them monkeywith that too.
J Basser (54:51):
if it's a Q, but you know I've seen them monkey with
that too.
If it's a cue, well, cue is adifferent issue too, because cue
goes back to the date wheneverit arose.
So if I made a cue in anoriginal claim and the guy had
it for so many years they founda cue, then I guess they can
take it.
They could.
But that's held open court too.
So you know, I mean they can dothat.
It was a mistake.
(55:12):
But it also depends on onething too.
Now if there's a cue and if itdoesn't affect the overall
service-needed disability say,if a person's a stacker and he's
got 100 plus an SMC plus, he'sgot 300 or 400 percent more of
the different ratings andwhatever he does reduction or
whatever he makes is going toaffect his rating.
John Dorle (55:37):
If they leave it alone.
J Basser (55:38):
Yeah, unless you're me .
Yeah, yeah.
John Dorle (55:43):
The story is yet to be told, but yeah, we covered a
lot.
J Basser (55:52):
Yeah, we did, man, we did.
We'll cover it again next weektoo, though.
So what's on tap?
John Dorle (56:00):
next week, who's going to be your guest?
J Basser (56:03):
I've got a couple of ideas.
I haven't had any confirmationyet as far as the actual guest
itself, but if anybody listens,say a little prayer for Mr James
Cripps.
He's in the weather pretty badand he's going to need all the
prayers and get his hands on him, because this time he's got
some serious stuff going on.
Yeah, yeah, I agree, I agree,yeah.
(56:25):
So, ray, I'm glad you made itbuddy.
Ray Cobb (56:32):
Yeah, glad to be back Back in the chair again.
J Basser (56:39):
And the bears didn't get you all up there in eastern
Tennessee.
Ray Cobb (56:43):
Did not see any bears.
Saw some beautiful elk, though,even at both nights in Cherokee
we actually had elk walk rightin front of our balcony, so that
was kind of neat.
J Basser (56:59):
If you need to take a trip up to Stacy Home Place in
Perry County, Kentucky.
You want to see some elk.
Ray Cobb (57:06):
You got some big ones up there, huh.
J Basser (57:10):
Yeah, they got plenty of elk on them Right there.
Actually it's on our land so wecan go up and check it out.
Yeah Well, listen guys.
Thank you guys for coming on.
John, you always man.
I know you're retired and youdon't take any new clients, so
we're still gonna milk it forall it's worth.
(57:30):
Buddy, we're gonna keep you onas much as we can.
Sounds good.
John Dorle (57:35):
Until you give it up , you know, thanks for having me
on.
Hopefully I helped a little bit.
J Basser (57:40):
Take care of that grandbaby buddy.
All right, I will Thanks guys.
All right Thanks for listeningto the show.
We'll be back again next week.
This is John, on behalf of Rayand Mr John Doherty.
We'll be shutting it down fornow.
Ray Cobb (57:55):
Good night.
Good night, thank you.
Episode Exposed Vet Productions and Weekly Show.
My name is John Stacey, theycall me Jay Basher.
My co-host today is Mr Ray Cobb, out of the great state of
Alabama, or Tennessee, the wayyou want to call it.
He lives out on theTennessee-Alabama line.
He can step one way and be inTennessee and fall back into
Alabama.
There you go, that's the way itworks down here.
(00:26):
Yeah, trip over logs.
Yeah, we got a trip for youtoday, guys.
We got Mr John Doherty.
He is accredited to be apaleo-vegan.
He has a plethora of experiencedoing this.
He started out working for, Iguess, the county's veteran
service office back when hefirst started doing this many,
many moons ago, probably 30, 40years ago.
(00:46):
So you've been doing this for along time.
But today we're going to startoff, we're going to get the
state of the VA.
And, john, what do you thinktoday's state of the VA is?
I guess we'll do it from theregional office side, from the
claims side.
John Dorle (00:59):
Yeah, you know, as I was talking to you earlier, I
think it's always a good idea tokind of at least from my
perspective the state of the VAthe good, the bad and the ugly.
I think the bad and the ugly ispretty clear.
That's always been the caseever since I started in 1992 is
(01:22):
the delay, delay, delay, delayuntil the veterans quit.
You know that seems to be therunning mantra with the VA but
yeah, it's continuing to be adelay process.
But one thing I can report theBoard of Veterans Appeals has
(01:43):
gotten a lot better.
One thing I can report the Boardof Veterans Appeals has gotten
a lot better as they whittleddown.
Their priority had always beenthe legacy appeals and for those
people that remember the legacyappeals, that was the appeals
process prior to the currentAppeals Management Act.
They've whittled down thelegacy appeals process to the
(02:05):
level that it's not nearly asbad anymore.
So in the day, probably asrecently as a year and a half
ago, it was about 40 months,three and a half years for a
decision to come from the board.
But as of late, within the pastthree to four months, I've been
(02:30):
seeing decisions coming back ineight to 12 months.
So that's wonderful and thedecisions are good.
I'm getting some good decisionsfrom the board.
That's good, but of course whatI mentioned earlier.
The delays are are never good,but uh as as many of us are
(02:51):
aware, uh, they will expediteyour claims if they can show
financial hardship or terminalillness or their their age is 85
years or if they're at thelocal VA and 75 or older, and if
it's at the board.
So that's kind of a nutshell ofat least my take of what's going
(03:11):
on with the VA.
It continues to be a processand we just whittle down the
claims and win as many as we canfrom this end of it.
So yeah, any questions at all.
So yeah, Any questions at all.
J Basser (03:34):
Can't hear you.
We know there's three levelappeals to the VA.
John Dorle (03:37):
There we go.
I can hear you now.
I'm sorry, I'm sorry you gotthe direct documents.
J Basser (03:42):
Just a few seconds.
John Dorle (03:43):
I didn't hear you, I'll ask a question, you got the
direct docket, go aheadwhichever.
J Basser (03:52):
I was going to say there's three levels of appeals.
Each one had a different timeframe and we'll get them done,
because I think the quickest wasused to be take a trip to DC
and do the appeal and they hadthe direct docket review that I
had and I think about what Ithink about what I think about
40 months from I get, if Iremember correctly.
John Dorle (04:09):
Yeah, yeah, that's what I was referring to the
direct docket review is about 40months out and even longer for
a personal hearing.
Then there's the other optionof a 90 day admin review to
submit new evidence.
You can just add 90 days tothat.
But yeah, direct review isabout 40 months and, like I said
(04:30):
, it's not that long anymore.
I think that's as a result ofthey were able to eliminate the
legacy appeals to a large degreeso they can concentrate more on
the AMA Appeals Management Actappeals, more on the AMA Appeals
Management Act appeals.
But yeah, 40 months probably acouple years ago was at about 40
(04:50):
months and it's gotten a lotbetter.
J Basser (04:55):
Alright, guys, remember, if you're in an appeal
process and you're waiting fora direct docket review and you
just got some good news there,it's going to be a little
quicker than what I had to gothrough a couple years ago,
because it was a discombobulatedmess, in my opinion.
Ray Cobb (05:12):
John, do you think right now, what's going on?
I got a call today from aveteran.
Fortunately, one of my friendsreferred him to me.
That's a doctor and theinteresting part about it he had
(05:40):
been told by the county serviceoffice to go ahead and file a
claim for loss of use of hearing.
He was around jet engines allthe time in the Air Force back
during the Vietnam era, aroundjet engines all the time in the
Air Force back during theVietnam era.
Well, the problem with thatwhen I talked to him, he has no
diagnosis and I'm wondering whyare these county service
(06:01):
officers in Tennessee andprobably around the entire
country telling people to file aclaim when they don't even have
a diagnosis yet and the factthat it's not going to do
anything except setting updelays and bogging down the
system?
Do you think that's whatthey're trying today?
John Dorle (06:21):
Well, I think what the county service officers are
trying to do is.
Well, I think what the countyservice officers are trying to
do is at least in the day.
I was a county service officerfor about 20 years and I started
doing this independent forabout 15 years now, and one of
(06:41):
the first questions I'd ask themis how their hearing is.
I can usually tell by justtalking to them.
I'd know what the answer wouldbe.
But I need to get the veteran toadmit that they have a hearing
loss.
A lot of times they'll havetheir spouse with them and the
veteran might say, oh, myhearing is fine, and the wife in
most cases will be lookingside-eye at the veteran like, no
(07:04):
, it's not.
And and so, to answer yourquestion, once I have determined
that they have a hearing loss,I absolutely file a claim for
even though they don't have adiagnosis, because most of the
time veterans who are sufferingfrom hearing loss, they don't
have a formal diagnosis loss,they don't have a formal
(07:25):
diagnosis.
So if they don't have a formaldiagnosis, that's not going to
prevent me from filing the claim.
And honestly, ray, that's partof the program with the VA is
those compensation exams.
They will get them in for anexam and they will diagnose them
or not diagnose them.
So don't feel like they'retrying to bog the system down.
(07:49):
I think what they're trying todo is the same thing I would
have tried to do is get theseguys service connected to
hearing loss or even bringing intheir um.
I think it's important to followthe plane.
Let them do the complicationexaminations and let the
audiologist determine whetherthey have a diagnosis or not.
(08:09):
Don't place the onus on theveteran to go get a diagnosis
and then follow the claim.
I think that would be theopposite of what I'd want to do
Okay, but would that notnegatively affect his date?
J Basser (08:27):
say, for example, if he didn't have a diagnosis but
he goes to a cnp exam after stay, file the claim six months
later you know just thegeneralized date I put in there
that he goes for a cnp exam.
The next thing you know he doeshave compensable hearing loss.
Well, they will probably takeadvantage of the situation there
and say okay, your effectivedate for the hearing loss is the
(08:49):
date of your hearing test filmat five.
John Dorle (08:53):
Well, we're assuming that that initial hearing exam
was 100% accurate too, Mm-hmm.
You know, I think that I getyour point.
I think the point is that wewant to put the cart before the
horse.
Do we want to rush them in foran exam without a diagnosis?
And then they go in, they don'thave a diagnosis.
(09:15):
And then you file a claim ayear later and then they have a
diagnosis.
And then the VA comes back andsays well, whoa, you know, you
didn't have a diagnosis a yearago.
Now you do.
So, something happened withinthat year that caused the
hearing losses.
It wasn't the military.
So yeah, I mean it is strategic.
(09:35):
I like to strike while theiron's hot If the veteran feels
like they have a hearing loss tome.
99 times out of 100, they have ahearing loss.
Now, if they're kind of upthere, they don't know if they
have a hearing loss.
Sometimes they hear things,sometimes they don't.
Yeah, then that would be a timemaybe to go get a diagnosis
(09:57):
first, because we don't want tofall into that trap of you.
Know, you file a claim today,your decibel losses are low, and
then five years later you filea claim and they're off the
charts, and then it's harder topoint the finger at the military
.
So I get your point.
My theory is, like I said,strike while the iron's hot, the
(10:22):
veteran and the wife, thespouse usually knows whether
they have hearing loss.
So I've never been one to delaymyself.
I don't know that I can everremember a case where that kind
of hit the benching in the hindend.
And even if it did, you knowwe'd have to put you know.
(10:43):
The VA would have todemonstrate that that audiology
exam they had at that time?
Wasn't that accurate ascompared to the one they have a
year later?
So yeah.
I think the risk reward ratiois more in favor of the veteran.
Just get the claim in.
Let them get in for thecompensation exam, yeah.
J Basser (11:08):
Ray, I'm going to send you a BVA claim here Case
tomorrow.
Maybe the day after, when youget it, print it off and give it
to the guy you said the guy wasan MD right.
Ray Cobb (11:20):
MD, metal doctor, right?
No, that's who we referred himto.
The gentleman is 79, almost 80years old.
He's never filed a claim he'snever, you know.
He's to the point where he'sthinking he could possibly use
some medical assistance.
Now the other question I have.
I saw this happen once.
(11:40):
I took a veteran down to theAlvin C York to put in for
medical.
And he goes in and he's good.
The guy's going through all thenumbers and everything, he said
, well, you don't quite qualify,you make too much or your
retirement's too much.
And then the guy says somethingWell, when I was in Vietnam, he
(12:01):
said wait a minute, you were inVietnam.
He said yeah.
He said wait a minute, you werein Vietnam.
He said yeah.
He said well, then youautomatically qualify for
medical.
Is that true?
So if he served during theVietnam era, then he
automatically qualifies formedical right.
John Dorle (12:19):
Yeah, john, I think you'd agree.
I mean, there's a differencebetween Vietnam era and
in-country Vietnam.
Yeah, you have.
(12:41):
And really what?
Like I said when I was a county, the law has changed.
You're in a protected categoryif you served in Vietnam because
of your exposure to AgentOrange.
That automatically enrolls youinto the VA medical.
I mean you have to get enrolled, you have to fill out the
paperwork, bring your 214 in.
(13:01):
But I mean your exposure toAgent Orange, but I mean your
exposure to Agent Orange as faras I remember, John.
you tell me if I'm wrong, but asfar as I remember, you're
exempt from the means test withthe VA Medical Center if you can
show Agent Orange exposure, andthat would even any type of
(13:22):
Agent.
Orange exposure Korea, vietnamairplanes that carried the Agent
Orange.
You know that kind of thing.
J Basser (13:27):
So get on the registry get on the PACT Act and Agent
Orange registry.
Get on the registry and they'lldo that.
But no, he should be gettingfree medicine care.
I mean as far as that he muststill have co-pays to pay.
But you know, anytime you'reinvolved in herbicide or testing
(13:48):
like that, it's the same thingas a project captain.
Ray Cobb (13:53):
Well, he was around a lot of jet fuel.
He was a mechanic and he workedon the motors jet motors.
So he he said, oh yeah, I wasaround fuel every day, so I
don't, but he doesn't have anycancer.
(14:13):
His hearing from being aroundthe engines is really is only
what I was.
From what he told me today,it's the only thing that I
recognize as being a disabilitythat he may be entitled to.
You know, spending six yearsworking around in the Air Force
(14:34):
working around jet engines.
J Basser (14:37):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
John Dorle (14:41):
I yeah, Ray, he should definitely, and at that
age he could rate real high forhearing loss.
And then automatically 10% fortinnitus.
Ray Cobb (14:54):
Well, he had to ask me a lot of times to repeat what I
was saying, and I'm not forsure if his hearing was a point
that he couldn't understand whatI was saying or he actually was
dropping off words, you know sohe didn't understand what I was
saying.
J Basser (15:12):
Given his age, go ahead and get the plane filed.
Help him do it, Get it turnedinto it.
Let's figure it out, because hegoes to the top of the line, he
goes to the head of the train,he gets to ride in the engine.
Ray Cobb (15:26):
Well, that's what I told him, and I also told him he
likes his.
He's actually from anothercounty, coffey County, up the
road from us here in.
J Basser (15:34):
Manchester.
Ray Cobb (15:36):
And he likes that county service officer.
They have a new one up there.
He's been around only a coupleof years.
So I said, if you feelcomfortable with him, if you
think he's doing you a good job,go see him.
J Basser (15:50):
Yeah, the rest of us get a ride.
Hanging on to the booth withMagnus on our feet.
John Dorle (16:00):
You get rated for hearing loss.
You get rated for tinnitus andgiven his age and his poor
hearing, I suspect he could getrated pretty high for hearing
loss automatic 10% for tinnitus.
Aren't comfortable with it, butwhen they hear so poorly it
(16:25):
causes them depression, anxietyAnxiety in the sense that they
get worked up because they don'tthink people are going to hear
them, or depression because theycan't associate society the way
they want to, and you can getrated for depression and anxiety
as well.
And then you get rated fordepression and anxiety as well.
(16:47):
Then you get rated fordepression and anxiety.
Typically, the older guys havesleep apnea.
You can see how the gears areturning.
This guy is 100% part of thetotal weight, right?
John?
J Basser (17:02):
He's waiting in the wings for 100% front and total.
He's got a very short period oftime to do it.
It has nothing to do with VAclaims.
When you get that age youbetter get her done, because
time is not on your side,especially if you've got a wife.
Ray Cobb (17:20):
His wife has passed away already.
He's 79 years old.
His wife has passed awayalready.
He's 79 years old.
So you know, I mean he's reallyfor 79 years old.
He sounded pretty good.
J Basser (17:34):
I'm 76.
He needs to go to a 30-year-oldand put her on.
Get 100% and let her keep ongiving until she passes away.
In 50, 60 years, get some of itback.
John Dorle (17:47):
That's what I was thinking.
That's a good question, ray.
I think in general your countyservice officers they try to do
right by veterans.
But but, like john said, thereis strategy there and, uh, he
makes good points.
Yeah, sometimes you can keepyourself in the foot by filing a
(18:10):
claim too soon, as opposed towaiting till you're like 79, 80
years old, because it's a loteasier to pin it on the military
as compared to working in amechanic shop for the past 20
years.
You know that kind of thing.
Not that we're trying to cheatthe VA or anything like that,
but I think that you know weneed to give veterans every
(18:34):
advantage that we can andreasonable doubt, point the
finger at the military everychance you get.
So it is strategic as to whenyou file a claim, but I think at
the age of 79, that's ano-brainer.
Yeah, he needs to file a claimand, like I said, it's quite
(18:57):
possible he could get rated realhigh for it given his poor
hearing.
Ray Cobb (19:04):
Yeah, I feel like he would.
J Basser (19:06):
Yeah.
John Dorle (19:07):
I hope the county service officer feels that way
too.
Some are really good and someare, you know, I don't know.
So I had a little bit of a warstory.
I had a gal call me, a veterangal call me the other day,
wanted me to represent her, andI explained to her.
(19:29):
I said, you know I'm not takingcases anymore, but you know I'm
looking to retire in the nextfour years or so.
But I'll get you in line, I'llget you hooked up with someone
and she was out of Texas and notto pick on Texas, the Texas
Veterans Commission are verygood when it comes to
representing veterans, but notthis time, unfortunately.
(19:54):
They ran her around and she wascrying and she just was
suicidal and the whole thing andthey just didn't give her the
TLC they needed.
So I ended up taking the caseand so we'll see what I can do
with her.
But I guess the point I'mtrying to make is that, as in
with any profession myprofession or anyone else's
(20:14):
there's good advocates andthere's not so good advocates.
So if you're listening to this,podcast just remember that if an
advocate tells you no, don'ttake it as gossip.
(20:35):
Look at every avenue.
You can do your research.
Talk to other advocates, talkto your friends, talk to your
family, get the claims in.
The worst the VA can do is sayno.
At the very least you get adecision.
You have a year to appeal itand you can build on that.
Once you get into an appealstatus, you get plenty of
(20:55):
attorneys and claims agents,such as myself, that probably
would be more than happy to takethe case.
J Basser (21:01):
But don't hesitate in getting your claim in.
John Dorle (21:04):
Like I said, the worst the VA can do is say no.
They have to go into detail asto why they say no, and we can
go off of that as a power ofattorney.
So as far as timeliness guys, Iguess I could build a little
(21:28):
bit on a little history on theappeals process.
I like to think that's my swingzone, but in the day I talked
about that earlier we had thelegacy appeals process.
J Basser (21:39):
It switched over to the Appeals Management Act of
the.
John Dorle (21:42):
EMA right around 2018-2019.
It's a whole different way ofdoing things with the VA.
As far as appeals.
When you get a decision fromthe VA and it's a denial, or if
it's a grant but not as great ashow you want, you can always
appeal that decision.
Ray Cobb (22:02):
There's three different types of appeals.
John Dorle (22:05):
You've got the supplemental lane review the
higher level review and theBoard of Veterans Appeal, so a
supplemental lane review isbasically you're telling the VA
that I have new evidence thatyou haven't looked at before.
I'm going to supplement myappeal with this evidence and I
want you to make a differentdecision.
Or you can go a higher-levelreview and say I don't have any
(22:27):
new evidence, but I think youapplied the line correctly and
therefore I want a higher-levelreview.
This is a decision reviewofficer.
And what's got a DRock?
There's three of them in thecountry.
Ray Cobb (22:40):
St.
John Dorle (22:40):
Petersburg, seattle and Washington DC DROs DROS
they're called are higher levelraters.
They've got more seasonings.
They don't always make theright decision, but they have
more seasonings.
So under don't always make theright decision, but they have
more seasonings.
So under a higher level reviewyou can have a DRO.
Look at your case.
The third option is you canskip both of those and go right
(23:01):
to the Board of Veterans Appealsand get a decision from them.
I don't typically go to theBoard of Veterans Appeals, right
?
Ray Cobb (23:11):
away.
John Dorle (23:11):
I do a higher level review before we go to the Board
of Veterans Appeals because,like I said earlier, the wait
time seven to twelve months now,which is still a lot but not
too bad, but up until about ayear ago.
It was about what we mentionedearlier about three and a half
years.
So I avoid the Board ofVeterans Appeals as much as I
(23:32):
can, just because of the wait.
If we can win it under a higherlevel review, that gives us
another swing at the plate, andif we have to go to the board of
veterans appeals later, we cando that.
So that's kind of it and that'swhere I'll bond on the three
options you have when you get adecision from the VA.
Now, the timeframe forsupplemental lane reviews is
(23:54):
about 125 days, depending uponthe complexity of the case, and
the same with the higher-levelreviews.
The VA's goal is 125 days,which is not too bad, but I
think that I'm seeing thesetypes of cases coming in at
about 125 days.
They're sticking to that asmuch as they can, but again,
(24:15):
that depends on the complexity.
One other thing that I shouldmention is that you came up with
this what's called a claimsaccuracy review, we call it CAR.
When you file a higher levelreview and if you feel like, as
the advocate, that this case,the slam dunk, is closed, uh,
(24:39):
you can label it as a car claimsaccuracy review and the v is
obligated to keep that within amonth.
Not everything qualifies as acar, but uh, but that's another
option that we, as advocates,but that's another option that
(25:02):
we, as advocates, you know weuse to help expedite claims.
So most veterans are unaware ofthat, but I think that most
experienced advocates and powersof attorney are going to be
aware of what a CAR CAR CRIBESAccuracy Review is.
So that's another tool that weuse as advocates to try to
(25:22):
expedite claims.
Then, of course, like I saidearlier, I mean the standard
expedite is always the case.
If your case is at a local VAregional office, if you're 85
years of age or older, they haveto expedite it, except the
Board of Veterans Appeals is 75years of age or older, and then
under either scenario you have afinancial hardship, a threat of
(25:44):
homelessness, that type ofthing they have to expedite.
Or if you have a situationwhere the veteran is terminal or
in very, very severe health,they will expedite the procedure
.
From that too, I'll give you acredit.
When we can demonstrate anexpedite, they do get on their
horses on that.
Ray Cobb (26:08):
I think they do pretty good about that.
Quick question On a higherlevel review have you noticed
the percentage or do you haveany idea about how much of a
turnover that's granted on theveterans that go to the higher
level review versus one who doesa supplemental claim?
John Dorle (26:29):
I don't have any statistics, ray, I just don't.
I go with my gut on that.
My theory is this when we get adecision and I'm talking to a
veteran about it, the firstthing I do is I try to see if
they can produce new andrelevant evidence.
If they think they can, or ifthey want to go see a doctor for
(26:53):
a medical opinion Nexus MedicalOpinion or if they've got some
medical records they think theycan.
Or if they want to go see adoctor for a medical opinion
Nexus Medical opinion or ifthey've got some medical records
they think that will back themup, then I would do a
supplemental name review,because what that does is it
gives us another swing at theplate before we have to go to a
higher level review.
But if the veteran says you know, john, I can't get anything.
(27:15):
I've tried.
I don't think I can geteverything, but I would like to
appeal this and say, okay, well,let's strategize this, we can
do a higher level review.
We've got eight issues.
I see at least three of them wecan go to a higher level review
.
I really think the other fouror five you're going to need new
(27:36):
, relevant evidence.
We kind of huddle up andstrategize those types of things
.
But if a veteran tells me Ican't get any new evidence, then
we do go a higher level review.
But as far as statistics,numbers, as far as the win
percentage, on the higher levelreview as compared to a
supplemental lane review.
(27:58):
I think it's just too variedbecause with a supplemental,
lane review, it's introducingnew and relevant evidence, and
we don't know what that kind ofevidence would be.
It could be really weakevidence that the VA is still
mandated to make a decision, orit could be really really solid
evidence.
So those percentages vary inthose cases as well.
(28:19):
I think the better questionmight be the difference between
a higher level review and aBoard of Veterans Appeals.
In a higher level review, youcan't submit new evidence.
Under a Board of VeteransAppeals appeal and a direct
review, you can't submit newevidence under a Board of
Veterans Appeals appeal.
Under a direct review, youcan't submit new evidence either
.
So then we're on a firm playingground, meaning what's better
(28:43):
higher level review or Board ofVeterans Appeals.
Like I said, I always go higherlevel review.
First because it gives usanother swing at the plate
before we have to go to theBoard of Veterans Appeals,
because if the Board of VeteransAppeals denies this, we're
going to have to come in withnew and relevant evidence to
have it looked at again.
(29:03):
I mean, you're a bit morelimited when you get to a Board
of Veterans Appeals and you getdenied.
So exhausting your options withthe supplemental lane review
and a higher level review arebest and then, if need be, go to
the Board of Veterans Appeals.
Ray Cobb (29:25):
Unless someone is very sharp.
I usually recommend that afterthey get their denial.
Recommend that after they gettheir denial, even if it's
obvious that they overlooksomething in your medical
records, which they have mine Ialways recommend they get an
agent at that time because youhave pointed out some excellent
(29:49):
things that an agent can talk tothem about that a county
service officer can't and won't,and you can kind of rationalize
out which is going to be thebest way and the fastest way.
And you know, I usually tellanyone that I've helped get
started or that calls me about adenial that they've received.
(30:13):
You know, what should we donext or what can I do next?
I usually start looking for anagent that specializes in that
in order to try to get them onboard and get them started that
way.
I just think in the way theappeal process works today, they
(30:34):
need that extra help.
I just at least the ones that Ihave read into.
Now I'm going to take back thefact that I've had two or three
that I've talked with andreferred to James Cripps' web
page, va the Redneck Way, andthey followed that script and
(30:56):
done that, and then they've alsolooked at John's and they win
the first time around.
You know, even 100%, with fouror five different problems, and
you know.
But the guys that you know, youcan kind of I can't kind of
evaluate what they need to do.
Basically, if I'm talking to agentleman that finished high
(31:22):
school and that's the onlyeducation that he really has and
the rest of it's you know, aswe say around here back behind
the barn, then those are theguys that I'm going to say you
need to get an agent In theappeals process today.
Regardless of which one, whatI've seen that works, you almost
(31:45):
have to write a legal brief orpretty close to it in order to
win the case in a reasonableperiod of time.
It in order to win the case ina reasonable period of time.
And I don't know of how manyveterans, especially, let's say,
(32:07):
75 and older, can actually dothat.
I mean, a lot of guys I talkwith can't even use a computer.
They're not on VAgov.
John Dorle (32:12):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, your point's well taken.
Uh ray, I I think that, assomeone who used to be a county
veteran service officer, I Ihope I wouldn't have been judged
by my peers.
I certainly think that thereare very good county service
officers out there.
They're they're very goodnational service officers out
(32:34):
there, primarily with thedisabled American veterans on a
national level.
But that said and John Stacey,you know this but us claims
agents and attorneys, we haveskin in the game.
Okay, most of us are veterans.
We want to do right by you.
(32:56):
I'm a veteran, I want to win theclaim for you.
But from a business standpoint,we have skin in the game.
So it's our business incentiveto win those claims, whereas the
free services they're going toget a check every two weeks,
regardless of how well they do.
(33:17):
So I think my primary incentivecertainly is for the veteran
but to keep the lights on andpay the rent, feed the kids.
You know I need to win theseclaims.
So I'm going to do everythingand anything I can do to win
those claims, and that meansresearch, always keeping my ear
(33:41):
to the ground, networking withmy peers, building relationships
with the Department of VeteransAffairs, just doing anything
and every law, rule andregulation that comes out, and I
think most of your successfulcompensated attorneys and agents
are probably going to say thesame things we have skin in the
(34:04):
game.
It's our incentive to win itand we're going to do everything
we can to win it, not onlybecause we care for our trends,
but because we want to earn aliving and, to put it blindly,
that's exactly what we'relooking to do is try to earn a
living, but we also want toserve our veterans as well.
(34:29):
So I think when you're sayingthat you should automatically
always get an attorney or anagent, I think that's good
advice, but I would also suggestthat there are plenty of free
services out there that they'revery good.
Like I said, when I was acounty service officer, I worked
(34:50):
with my peers.
I worked with national serviceofficers, and they were very
sharp as well.
So I think that you knowveterans nowadays they get a
denial.
You can have your cake and eatit too.
You can save that 20% fee thatI'm going to charge on that
thing and give services throughyour free services as well.
(35:15):
You save that fee and then youalso get your maximum
compensation as well.
That's a possibility.
It doesn't always happen thatway, but you can have your best
of both worlds and have yourcake and eat it too, so to speak
, but I think if you really wantto hit the nail on the head,
you're going to want to getsomeone with my experience or
(35:38):
someone equivalent.
I mean, there's plenty of lawfirms out there that are
well-established, you know thatwould be more than willing to
hear your case.
What I am seeing, though, ray,is that a lot of law firms
they're not going to take everycase, and, unfortunately, some
of them are only going to takethe big buck cases, the ones
(36:00):
that have been pending for avery long time, the ones that
they have a very, very goodchance at winning, and so you
know that's unfortunate thatthey don't take those cases that
are going to require you toroll up your sleeves and and get
into the mud with the v8 butthere are a lot of firms out
there that will will fight foryou, I believe.
(36:21):
I know I would.
Ray Cobb (36:28):
That's some great points.
I mean it's you know I can nameone national service officer
down in Nashville in theNashville Regional Office.
I think she's great.
She helped me win my firstAgent Orange case exposed in the
United States, you know, andshe's helped me with other cases
(36:48):
.
And then as time went on and Iwent to a higher level, I had to
quit doing it for myself andactually the last two cases I
filed I ended up having to getsomeone to help with it.
But then I'm talking about I'mup in the R2 and the level 2
range, which is quite differentand quite more intact and
(37:12):
requires a lot moredocumentation.
John Dorle (37:18):
Yeah, yeah, that's a good point.
I think that when you get intothe real complicated cases as
well-meaning as a lot ofadvocates are and that goes for
claims agents and attorneys aswell advocates are, and that
goes for claims agents andattorneys as well when they get
really, really complicated,they're out of their realm.
(37:39):
So I think when you get into thecomplicated cases where you're
falling into the SMC, the M'sand the L's and the L and a half
and the M and a half and the R1, r2, all that stuff, uh you're
going to want to get, uh, anattorney or agent or even a
national service officer thatthat knows the rules and
(38:00):
regulations real well, because,uh, while not every veteran uh
falls into that area of of smcand higher levels of SMC and the
different precedent opinionswith the court, there does come
a time where you have to applythat, and so that's a situation
(38:24):
where you're going to want tostart interviewing different
advocates and representatives,and I always tell people that
you know attorneys are prettyintelligent.
They have to be, you know, toget a law degree.
But just because they have asheepskin on their wall doesn't
mean they have what it takes tofight off the VA.
(38:45):
It takes a lot of experience,it takes a lot of know-how, it
takes a lot of relationships andit takes a lot of book
knowledge as well.
So, if you find an advocatewith all those types of features
, sink your teeth into him orher, because they're the ones
that'll get you where you needto go.
Ray Cobb (39:05):
Yeah, I was able to get up to my R1 and to my
caregiver level one withoutgetting anyone involved, but to
get those next two I definitelyhad to get somebody involved
because, you know, I turned itin and when I turned in should
have been awarded right off thebat but it wasn't.
So I had to get someone thatpointed out where they had made
(39:29):
their mistake and what theydidn't look at, someone that
pointed out where they had madetheir mistake and what they
didn't look at, um, and whenthey did that, then you know I
won, and both of them were wonin less than than 12 months.
So you know I was quitesatisfied, but I don't think if
I had not gotten someone of yourcaliber or like you, I don't
(39:50):
think I would have ever gottento the R1 or R2, because it
required more capabilities thanwhat I personally have.
John Dorle (40:01):
Good point, good point.
I think that the VA tends to tryto walk all over veterans when
it comes to more complicatedcases, even less complicated
cases, they'll do that.
But when the veteran comes intoa situation where they have
especially a well-known law firm, someone they've worked with
(40:24):
before that knows they meanbusiness, that gets their
attention and, eitherconsciously or subconsciously, I
think, some of those decisionreview officers and or BVA
judges or people that are makingthose decisions, they tend to
think they can kind of bigleague the veteran but they're
(40:45):
not going to big league some ofthe more experienced advocates,
some of the more experiencedadvocates.
So and yeah, I mean you didwell to get yourself up to R1
and it's unfortunate they didn'tgrant R2 with you representing
yourself.
It sounds like the evidence wasthere.
It probably could have savedyou the fee that maybe your your
(41:07):
attorney charged.
But I think you might thinkthat I would guess that you
think it was well worth itbecause that person got you to
where you needed, whereas youdon't think you could have
gotten there by yourself.
Ray Cobb (41:22):
Well, in my case, I think I could have gotten there
eventually, but I think it'dprobably been 36 months, not 10
months.
And I think, because I got him,I got it in 10 months instead
of 36 months.
And you know, yeah, that's athousand dollars and you know he
(41:43):
gets 20%, that's not, that'snot going to keep the lights on
very long, yeah, but you knowit's it's what I felt like was
the best way to do it, so that'sthe way I went and you were
smart.
John Dorle (41:58):
You understand that as long as you keep that appeals
window open, your back pay isgoing to be even larger.
So it's always better to getsomething in 10 months as
compared to 36 months months,even though the back pay would
be larger.
Uh, you know, we we want to getcompensated as soon as we can.
(42:19):
Uh, life is funny.
We're all, we're all alivetoday, but who knows, tomorrow
is guaranteed nothing, right?
So absolutely, we need to holdthe va to a higher standard
right off the bat.
J Basser (42:35):
That's what I call stacking 50s and dragging the
wagon.
There you go.
As long as you drag that wagon,the heavy is still a gift.
John Dorle (42:44):
John, we lost your picture there a few times.
I'm glad you came back.
J Basser (42:49):
Yeah, I know I had a couple of technical issues when
I did it.
I guess I had a power surge orsomething.
I guess we had a storm, sowe're okay now.
John Dorle (42:57):
All right, all right .
J Basser (42:59):
Yeah, we're good.
John Dorle (43:04):
John, you're kind of quiet.
You have any questions at all.
You want to throw anything atme?
J Basser (43:11):
You're pondering two other issues.
You know, like other cases ofother diabetic stuff and things
like that.
Of course I've got a list ofstuff.
I'll run your way.
But diabetes is a very I guesswe say it's a very diverse
(43:39):
disease because you've got somany secondary issues.
You can claim off of that oneissue and I don't think a lot of
folks understand that.
You know, because you basicallyyou got insulin dependent
diabetes or diabetes itself.
You know you've got.
You've got all the neuropathies.
You've got eye issues, you'vegot bowel and bladder issues.
(44:02):
You've got the small fiberneuropathy, which they don't
really focus on too much of theyou know.
The problem is you got diabeticneuropathy and small fiber
neuropathy.
They'll send you and do thetest on your feet and your legs
and things like that for thenerves.
However, your large fibernerves might be operating to a
(44:22):
good extent, but the smallfibers are the ones messed up.
So the rate schedule, but therate schedule doesn't pick that
out.
They just consider it asdiabetic neuropathy.
There's some things in thatarea that the VA can improve on.
There's a lot of things theycan improve on in the rate and
schedule.
John Dorle (44:45):
From a medical side, getting a good, qualified
endocrinologist that deals withdiabetes type 2 on a regular
basis and all the residuals thatcome along with it, including
the kidneys and the heart andthe vision and the neuropathy
and the different levels ofneuropathy and the nerves
(45:06):
involved.
And yeah, it is somethingthat's a very insidious disease.
I've had veterans that have hadamputations.
I've had them die because ofdiabetes.
I've had veterans spend time innursing homes because of
(45:29):
diabetes and so if it goesunchecked and untreated, it can
really it'll get you.
So you're right.
From a medical side, it'simportant to find an
endocrinologist that isexperienced and can document
everything and provide theappropriate letters and nexus
letters that we can use to helpwin claims.
(45:52):
And then, of course, from theRaiders side, they have to be up
and experienced on all theresiduals that go along with
diabetes.
I know for myself.
I continually try to educatemyself on a variety of different
diseases that come about.
I mean, medical science ischanging all the time.
(46:13):
Diabetes is something that isimportant to learn.
I know I've learned a lot fromour colleagues over the years.
John, I've learned from you.
I won't get into details, butyou've got disabilities that
maybe kind of scratch my headand think, yeah, let me research
(46:35):
that a little bit closer.
Ray Cobb (46:36):
You know, let's look at that a little bit closer, and
a lot of it I knew.
John Dorle (46:40):
but you don't deal with them all the time and so
you kind of there's so much toremember.
But then it keys your memoryand it's like, yeah, you brought
up something, I want toresearch that a little bit.
Your memory.
And it's like, yeah, he broughtup something, I want to
research that a little bit.
Yeah, so I learned a lot frommy clients doing this 33 years,
and some of your biggestteachers are your clients, as
well as your peers and yourteachers what's your opinion on?
Ray Cobb (47:07):
like John and myself here, we are pretty highly rated
as far as I'm, more than Johnwith the diabetes and things.
However, things are continuingto worsen and I'm continuing to
lose use of my hands, forexample.
Now is there any reason for meto go back and file a claim or
(47:33):
ask for an increase?
The best example my hands are,I think, ones at 30 and ones at
40%.
Now, realistically, that wasdone back prior to 2010.
I think it was about 2008.
(47:56):
So they definitely worsened alot and I've lost, you know,
almost complete grip in my lefthand.
Does it even benefit me in anyway to take the time and the
effort and put another claiminto the wheel?
John Dorle (48:17):
I see, john shaking his head no, yep, I agree.
Ray Cobb (48:20):
I agree too, John.
I don't want to get into ahassle but some people say well,
why don't you put in for more?
There's nothing else I can get.
John Dorle (48:28):
Yeah, you can't, unless the law changes are to
the highest you can get.
J Basser (48:33):
Here you need your little.
Unless you keep that, claimfile closed.
John Dorle (48:40):
Unless you had a wife that was in need of aid and
attendance, you might get ahigher dependency allowance.
There's some hospital benefitsthat you could get Not
necessarily from a caregiverstandpoint If your wife was
taking care of you.
There's a caregiver allotmentthat's afforded her and there's
(49:04):
medical services that you mightqualify for as you get worse off
Nursing home care and stufflike that.
But as far as a monthlycompensation, r2 is the highest
unless they change the law.
J Basser (49:21):
I think it would be.
Anytime you're an R2 vet,there's basically no reason at
all to file another claimbecause you do not want to give
them the opportunity to openthat claims folder up.
It says green had a certainamount of time, at least 10
years, or because 20 year, 20year protection rule.
(49:43):
You know it worked.
But the uh.
You know I just hit one of my100 just a couple days ago and
so you know the protectors arein there for a reason.
But I would not touch anythingor open any claim up, just the
higher you get rated.
You know I wouldn't openanything else up because you
never know, I mean, if they're.
John Dorle (50:04):
All it takes is one person to look at something the
wrong way and you got a headacheyeah, and there's always the
chance that I've seen it happentoo, where the VA committed a
clear and unmistakable error.
I'm not saying that's the casewith you, ray, but you could be
(50:26):
rated for R2 or any percentage.
And you poke the bear and allof a sudden you get some bean
counter that looks at it andsays, well, we shouldn't have
rated that person at thatpercentage.
At that time we made an error.
We're going to propose to lowerthat person's upper extremity
(50:51):
from 60 down to 10 or somethinglike that.
You know, it's something crazylike that.
It can happen.
So I think that be careful whenyou poke the berry R2, there's
no doubt you wouldn't.
But I mean, if you're 100%permanent total and you're not
drawing special monthlycompensation unless you qualify
(51:11):
for smc special monthlycompensation, I wouldn't touch
it.
I think most advocates wouldtell you that as well.
Uh, unless you know, evensometimes I get veterans are 100
permanent total and and theythink, well, I've got erectile
dysfunction so maybe I can getan extra 180 bucks a month.
I'm like maybe, possibly, butis 180 a month worth it to for
(51:38):
them to open up the pandora'sbox again?
I, I wouldn't, I wouldn't riskit myself.
Ray Cobb (51:45):
But that's a great example.
Uh, I have a gentleman thatI've been helping.
He actually has worsened a lot.
He had not hit the 10-year mark.
He was at eight years with hisfeet, but his feet had gotten
worse and so he asked for anincrease and, trying to get from
(52:06):
a 40% to a 60% or to an L, hisankles are locked out.
Well, they reduced him, theytook him down 10% and he
couldn't understand why.
And I said, well, let's look atthis.
What did you not tell me?
I asked you if you'd been goingto the doctor.
Well, I have.
I've been seeing Dr Andersonhere locally.
(52:28):
I said have you gone to any VAdoctor?
No, I didn't like them.
Well, did you get VA torecommend your community care?
No, well, those are two veryimportant things, guys, because
if there's no record in a yearthat you've received treatment,
(52:50):
these guys in the VA are goingto assume that you have improved
your condition and they'regoing to worry you.
I mean, it was only 10%, butthen what I've encouraged him to
do is ask for a hearing,because that's taken three or
four years and that gives himenough time to get back into the
(53:11):
va and get updateddocumentation about how bad his
ankles are and also gettingprosthetics and, uh, I'm sure
they won't reduce him and theymay give him the increase that
he was seeking he should havegot the records from.
J Basser (53:28):
He should have got the records from outside doctor and
turned to me and say, no, youdon't.
Well, that's a good point, buthe didn't and so now he's going
to do that.
Ray Cobb (53:40):
That's on him Right, but the less they have to do
with the VA, the better theylike it.
J Basser (53:48):
You've got to be careful, you've got to be
careful You've got.
John Dorle (53:52):
To be careful You've got to play the game.
J Basser (53:53):
You've got to play the game.
Ray, you know that you don'tplay the game.
John Dorle (54:00):
That 10 and 20-year rule, if I remember right.
J Basser (54:03):
After 10 years they can never reduce you and after
20 years they can never severyou, if I remember right 20
years is the only way they cansever you, and the only way they
can either sever or touch itreally is due to fraud.
John Dorle (54:19):
Yeah, yeah.
So those are things to keep inmind as well.
But well, how would a Q applyto that though?
Because I tell you I'mconfident I've seen cases where
the guys have been rated for anumber of years but they come in
and they do something withtheir claims and they realize
(54:40):
that that bad condition thatthey had rated 40% should have
been rated 10%.
You know, I've seen them monkeywith that too.
J Basser (54:51):
if it's a Q, but you know I've seen them monkey with
that too.
If it's a cue, well, cue is adifferent issue too, because cue
goes back to the date wheneverit arose.
So if I made a cue in anoriginal claim and the guy had
it for so many years they founda cue, then I guess they can
take it.
They could.
But that's held open court too.
So you know, I mean they can dothat.
It was a mistake.
(55:12):
But it also depends on onething too.
Now if there's a cue and if itdoesn't affect the overall
service-needed disability say,if a person's a stacker and he's
got 100 plus an SMC plus, he'sgot 300 or 400 percent more of
the different ratings andwhatever he does reduction or
whatever he makes is going toaffect his rating.
John Dorle (55:37):
If they leave it alone.
J Basser (55:38):
Yeah, unless you're me .
Yeah, yeah.
John Dorle (55:43):
The story is yet to be told, but yeah, we covered a
lot.
J Basser (55:52):
Yeah, we did, man, we did.
We'll cover it again next weektoo, though.
So what's on tap?
John Dorle (56:00):
next week, who's going to be your guest?
J Basser (56:03):
I've got a couple of ideas.
I haven't had any confirmationyet as far as the actual guest
itself, but if anybody listens,say a little prayer for Mr James
Cripps.
He's in the weather pretty badand he's going to need all the
prayers and get his hands on him, because this time he's got
some serious stuff going on.
Yeah, yeah, I agree, I agree,yeah.
(56:25):
So, ray, I'm glad you made itbuddy.
Ray Cobb (56:32):
Yeah, glad to be back Back in the chair again.
J Basser (56:39):
And the bears didn't get you all up there in eastern
Tennessee.
Ray Cobb (56:43):
Did not see any bears.
Saw some beautiful elk, though,even at both nights in Cherokee
we actually had elk walk rightin front of our balcony, so that
was kind of neat.
J Basser (56:59):
If you need to take a trip up to Stacy Home Place in
Perry County, Kentucky.
You want to see some elk.
Ray Cobb (57:06):
You got some big ones up there, huh.
J Basser (57:10):
Yeah, they got plenty of elk on them Right there.
Actually it's on our land so wecan go up and check it out.
Yeah Well, listen guys.
Thank you guys for coming on.
John, you always man.
I know you're retired and youdon't take any new clients, so
we're still gonna milk it forall it's worth.
(57:30):
Buddy, we're gonna keep you onas much as we can.
Sounds good.
John Dorle (57:35):
Until you give it up , you know, thanks for having me
on.
Hopefully I helped a little bit.
J Basser (57:40):
Take care of that grandbaby buddy.
All right, I will Thanks guys.
All right Thanks for listeningto the show.
We'll be back again next week.
This is John, on behalf of Rayand Mr John Doherty.
We'll be shutting it down fornow.
Ray Cobb (57:55):
Good night.
Good night, thank you.
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