H.Y.S.T? | S2E11 | The Muppet Christmas Carol & 8-Bit Christmas

The Muppets Christmas Carol

Written by Charles Dickens. Screenplay by Jerry Juhl.

Directed by Brian Henson

Starring Michael Caine, Dave Goelz, Steve Whitmire, Jerry Nelson, Frank Oz, and David Rudman

8-bit Christmas

Written by Michael Dowse

Directed by Kevin Jakubowski Starring Winslow Fegley, Neil Patrick Harris, Steve Zahn, Sophia Reid-Gantzert, and Bellaluna Resnick. With June Diane Raphael, Che Tafari, Santino Barnard, Max Malas, Brielle and Braelyn Rankins, Cyrus Arnold, Chandler Dean, and David Cross.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Welcome to H.Y.S.T? I'm Bradly Hackworth joined by Jonathan Ems, otherwise known as Doc.

(00:07):
Greetings fellow humans.
And this week, yes, yesterday was Christmas and potentially when you watch or listen to this, Christmas was a while ago.
But we are covering, we are doing our Christmas episode which is the Muppet Christmas Carol and 8-bit Christmas.
It is often tradition that when you do your Christmas episode you're supposed to do it just before the holiday.

(00:33):
And it occurs to me we have not done that yet.
Not even a little bit.
Every single celebration episode we have done has been well past the mark except for our last Halloween episode which we did on Halloween Day.
We also did Thanksgiving on Thanksgiving, didn't we?
Oh that's right we did, but we didn't do a Thanksgiving movie.

(00:56):
That is true. That is true.
Okay, I'll give you that.
But this week, like I said, Muppet Christmas Carol versus, not versus because we're switching things up a little bit this week.
And 8-bit Christmas.
Definitely, definitely. A Muppet Christmas Carol. Old, old favorite from, oh my god.

(01:19):
And this was the directorial debut, I believe, of Brian Henson, Jim Henson's son.
I think at least for theatrical, yeah.
I'm pretty sure that he had been directing some Muppet stuff like some of their TV specials and stuff before this.
But for his theatrical directorial debut, yeah, this was his first.

(01:41):
And way to hit the ground running.
This movie is absolutely incredible.
One of the things that I really love about it is when Michael Caine signed on to be a part of the Muppet Christmas Carol,
he said he would only do it if he could perform it like he was performing for the Royal Shakespeare Academy.
He wanted to give it his all or he didn't want to do it.

(02:05):
Oh 100%, yeah. And that's one of the things that made it work.
In fact, I remember, I'm trying to remember where it is I saw it.
It probably was just an Internet meme or something, but someone pointed out that probably the reason why two of the best Muppet productions out there are Muppet Christmas Carol and Muppet Treasure Island.
And the reason for that is because Michael Caine treats the Muppets like fellow actors and Tim Curry treats himself like a Muppet.

(02:34):
And that's why they work.
That one of the other really amazing, I love that, I really do love that.
One of the other really amazing things about Muppet Christmas Carol is when you watch any scene, the actors are walking on about two foot wide planks.
So when like Michael Caine is in his office with all the rats and everything like that as he's doing his walk with the cane,

(03:00):
that's only about a two foot wide walkway that he was on because all the puppeteers had to be a few feet below him, right?
Performing all this. So that was way trickier than you can kudos to Michael Caine, which I don't think I could ever stop giving because it's Michael Caine.
Right, yes. Oh, and I think that this is standard fare just about anybody who's done a guest spot on Sesame Street, which is a lot, a lot of people, you know, that's basically your practice run on that.

(03:29):
You know, if you've gotten to be enough of a name that you get to do your guest appearance on Sesame Street, that is your appearance with the Muppets training on doing your whole performance in the small space that that is at your height.
I could definitely see it. Yeah, Sesame Street was never as high pressure as the Muppets.
Right.
No, which that comedy special that you're always talking about, even he had a joke about the Muppets where he went in and dropped the F bomb in front of Fozzie Bear.

(03:55):
Exactly. Yeah, no, I do. I told you that you were going to like it. And yeah, there were so many times I'd like you would say something and I'm sitting there going, why hasn't he watched it yet? It's like so for him.
There are a lot of things that are for me, but I just I mean, there are there's just a lot of stuff out there.
No, it's true. And that is kind of why we're here to help folks narrow that down, I guess.

(04:17):
Fair enough. The Muppet Christmas Carol, written by Charles Dickens, screenplay by Jerry Jewell, directed by Brian Henson, starring Michael Caine, Dave Goltz, Steve Whitmire, Jerry Nelson, Frank Oz, Dave Rudman, and honestly, just a whole host of voiceover talent that kind of went through.

(04:40):
And I picked up a few more of them as we went through this film. There's a there's a reason why it sits so well in my heart. Just in loving memory of Jim Henson and Richard Hunt, man, like they really gave their all.
And let's not forget music by Paul Williams. Paul Williams is one of those songwriters that doesn't get enough credit. He had a time, you know, in the late 70s where he was kind of a little bit of a star kind of sort of.

(05:09):
What were some of the projects that he's mainly he the main he's he's the one who wrote Rainbow Connection.
So that like that's the main thing. That's the kind of like songwriter he is. And yeah, it's like we all give credit to Rainbow Connection because it was originally and always has been and always will be a Kermit the Frog song.
But it was written by Paul Williams and that was another smooth move on on Brian Henson's part to bring him back for this because that's that's kind of one of those that's part of the Muppet magic is Muppets performing music written by John.

(05:43):
That's one of my notes in here is like we get right into Muppet style music. The Overture. Yes, by Paul Williams and going through the credits, not as the actors, but as the Muppets, I will never not love that.
The great gonzo as Charles Dickens. I love that. That one special place in my heart with that.

(06:07):
Well, and they knew who they were making this for straight up. I mean, that's the thing is like you say Michael Caine. He wanted to perform it like he was doing with the Royal Shakespeare.
But I mean, let's be honest, he also knew it was like the Royal Shakespeare, you know, matinee show for the kids. There were some things he toned down, especially in like the graveyard scene.
Michael Caine could have could have made that scene like traumatizing if he wanted to, but he didn't because he knew it was going to be kids watching this. So he was able to keep it serious, able to keep it a good performance without going all the way.

(06:41):
I don't know. I think he I think I think he went pretty hard in that cemetery scene. Oh, he definitely went hard, but he didn't he didn't go as hard as he could have.
I think if he would have went harder, I don't think the scene would have been as nice as it was. Like, like, not nice because it's not supposed to be it wasn't. Well, let's get there.
Okay. All right. All right. We start off with the after this nice long shot and the hungry pigs finished breakfast and then it's time for lunch.

(07:09):
And it leads into a beautiful one shot establishing the world of the Muppets and the people together in this place.
And I mean, those those one shots are always great when you have a one shot included with puppetry and all of that. That is even better.
That's nuts. That's nuts. That is crazy. And we end on the great gonzo played by Dave Goles and Rizzo the rat played by Steve Whitmire.

(07:35):
Well voiced because both of them are played by like four people a piece.
So depending on where there is when it comes to the actions, right, depending on the actions when it comes to, you know, standard Muppets slash Sesame Street fairs that whoever the voices is also the main puppeteer.
They're the one with the hand in the mouth pretty much on any given moment. True.

(08:01):
Up until a point because most of those voice actors are voicing multiple Muppets. Yeah. So you have different puppeteers that are going and a lot of those guys oftentimes are off stage doing the voices while the others are doing the puppetry.
I guess it does depend on the situation. But generally speaking, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
That lesson and economics. Oh, God. God. God. Oh, do you remember?

(08:27):
Let's actually I'm going to skip that one. That one's a little bit too heavy.
I already did bring up late stage capitalism during the holidays, man. So, you know, that is a thing about this movie.
I mean, a lot of the issues over the billionaire class and the working class. This that is a very, very old problem.
This is not new. Right. Solutions to these things are not new. We know what they are. We just a lot of people fighting them.

(08:55):
Gonzo plays Dickens and I love Rizzo the Rizzo the Rats, a blue furry child Dickens who hangs out with a rat. Love it.
Do everything Rizzo said was I'm not going to lie to you, dude. I think this movie is perfect.
Perfectly made for me. Right. Every single line in this movie absolutely just hits home.

(09:19):
And I'm curious when you watched this, did you watch the version that had the oh, God, Meredith Sing or no bell her like her name is Bell in the in the story?
No, I don't think I saw Bell sing that. But I think because there is like in the VHS copies and like on the DVD on the laserdisc.

(09:44):
The version that I saw when I was a kid was with Bell singing and there's a song between her and young Scrooge and it just eviscerates Michael Caine.
I remember being crazy bored by that scene when I was a kid and I can't it's not on the Disney Plus Muppet Christmas Carol either.

(10:05):
So I'll have to go back and look because it's not coming to mind. But I, you know, I'm trying to remember how that scene went down.
That is the scene that made the movie a little bit too heavy. The test audiences and everything like that.
They're like that. That that makes it not for kids. That's one of those things that that bugs me.
And I've come across this before. This has been going on for years. This is not a new thing.

(10:27):
You know, Disney is not the only one who does this. But there is some weird practice of like the like the theatrical release, the VHS version,
the DVD version, and sometimes even depending on what store you bought the DVD at, these will all be different edits for no fucking reason.
And it's not like they're cutting out the nude scene.

(10:49):
Unless you're buying ripped off versions, then there's no way the DVD changes from place to place.
No, it absolutely does. This this actually happened with Iron Man.
I remember this is how I found out about this when I saw Iron Man on DVD with some friends afterwards.
My friend commented on how one of his favorite scenes from when we all saw it in the theater was missing.

(11:14):
And when we went online to find out to check out what happened, that's where we found out it was a there was a literal list of which scenes were missing and which scenes were added to the DVD, depending on which store you bought it at.
Walmart had a version. Hollywood Video had a different version, like all down the list, like depending on where you bought your DVD copy, you got a different cut of Iron Man.

(11:36):
OK, but that was like what, 15 years ago? Do you think that's still a practice?
I'm pretty sure it was a practice like from the very inception of home video when I found when I find like little clues here and there.
I don't think it's yeah, I'm pretty sure that it's a pretty constant running thing. I don't know why they do it.
I don't think it's just a copyright protection thing. I think literally there's some executive sitting somewhere goes like, let's change that like a signature kind of thing.

(12:05):
Like I honestly don't know. It's true because I mean, well, for one, there are definitely dozens of versions of like a dozen versions of a lot of movies.
Like major global blockbusters, they do change different scenes, whether it was released in China, America, Japan, like they do change things.
The flag that's shown, the advertisements that are in the movie, stuff like that.

(12:29):
So I know that there's a bunch of different versions, but I'll look into that.
Oh, like we'll have to look into that and see if that's still something or how like even if it is still something how that's going down because like you like to like hammer on like the like late stage capitalism and stuff like that.
Different versions just means people have more stuff to go by. If you want to be a complete collector and stuff like that.

(12:55):
There's that.
Which would make sense if this was something that was like advertised like if you bought the you know Walmart version of Iron Man and it had a sticker on there that said exclusive Walmart version and then you had to go out and buy your target version.
If you want to click the whole set, if that was a thing, but it wasn't there was literally nothing in the packaging or in the advertising to say that this was going on.

(13:16):
We found out about it by digging deep on the Internet.
We'll talk more about that in the after hour.
Okay.
So Gonzo says these dickens Rizzo denies it and then he's like I know the story like the back of my hand.
He's like, well then tell us I got a mole. I got it like no don't tell us your hand tell us the story.

(13:37):
Too many golden moments just right at the beginning of this.
Yeah, that's that's the one thing about Muppet show Muppet movies and Muppet show man is that be prepared for all the puns like if you're if you're not a pun humor person.
I'm not going to say it's not for you because there's definitely way more there.
But I mean brace yourself.

(13:58):
There is that the Marley's were dead as a doornail and the expo into the Scrooge introduction played by Michael Cain and then we get song Scrooge by the Muppet cast and I'm sorry man every single song that the Muppet sing is an absolute banger.
Oh for sure.
There's there's no change in that ends on him given that nasty look and our very first humbug love that humbug.

(14:27):
Like that is that is something that should like.
I feel like when you are handed a line like that it's very very easy to make it cheesy.
And like not be able to sell it properly but yeah and yes yes many do.
Patrick Stewart's version of a Christmas Carol.
It was good but I don't think that he sold the humbug as well as Michael Cain did.

(14:52):
Now did you ever see that one.
No actually I haven't.
Now I think about it.
I think I've seen scenes I've seen scenes from it but I never watched the whole thing.
I do still recommend it because I mean a Christmas Carol is I it is one of my favorite Christmas stories.
I love it.
I love the heart and thought and everything behind it.
But a Muppet Christmas Carol is still the winner.

(15:16):
I love that Gonzo using Rizzo to clean the window and then thank you for making me a part of the story.
I feel like their friendship is pretty much perfect.
Well they do make a great team.
I think that's I don't think this was the was this the first time we saw like a full Gonzo and Rizzo team.
Oh come on man this is definitely too old for me to know that.

(15:38):
OK I think it might have been but it was definitely like it cemented it.
That's why anything that has Rizzo has Gonzo and anything that has Gonzo has Rizzo.
They're kind of the the seminal comedy duo there.
They are a perfect team.
I love them.
Kermit played by Steve Whitmire as Bob Cratchit and the rats going over eviction notices and Scrooge says they can gift wrap the notices for Christmas.

(16:05):
Like dude this guy is a dick.
The things that like that yeah the things that Scrooge says his retorts and his lines throughout the scene are some cold blooded shit.
So cold but at the same time also just brilliant which by now I should know which lines are from Dickens and which lines were just put in there.

(16:29):
But unfortunately this is kind of where I study Dickens.
Right yeah I hear you.
Harvest time for the money lenders.
That was a line that just touched me like it hurt.
And they wonder how today's generation got radicalized.
Right the fuck here people.
Oh come on these lessons are literally everywhere.

(16:52):
Between this and Bugs Life like the rich folks have no chance with today's generation.
I don't know if you could say that's a radical like notion or anything like that.
It's pretty in your face just messages about right and wrong.
Ain't nothing radical about it.
There is messages about right and wrong and then there is outright saying things like harvest time for the money lenders or you know like in Bugs Life where the puny little ants scene you know like that's the one that everyone keeps bringing up.

(17:20):
So there's having the you know questions of right and wrong and then there's actually mapping out precisely what the message is no bones about it and selling it the way these the way these movies did.
Because it's like you take a look at some of the moral of the story stuff from my time you know when it was like G.I. Joe knowing is half the battle.
It was shit like you know look both ways when you cross the street.

(17:43):
Also good advice but you know doesn't exactly say you know take down the man the way the way these do.
Did you start watching the news again.
No.
Still can't do it.
You know every time I think about it like you know I get up in the morning I get my coffee it is the time in the morning I usually turn on the news podcast and my thumb hovers over the podcast room and I'm like, I know I can't do it.

(18:09):
I can't do it.
Because we're trying to talk Muppets you keep going back to the social justice thing like I'm trying to talk about the Muppets man.
You're the one who keeps bringing up the fact that this is like some hardcore commentary if that's the commentary.
I'm saying the dialogue is amazing you're the one saying it's the social commentary.
Okay well I mean what's true is true can't help it.

(18:31):
But Steve McIntosh as Scrooge's nephew shows up with an unbelievably cheery message and during his message just getting all the rats and Kermit all hyped up about Christmas and the charity professor and beaker who popped in.
And then oh he gets rushed right out of there.
And oh man the hatred in Michael Caine's eyes during that scene was in.

(18:56):
I felt uncomfortable I feel uncomfortable every time I go and watch this because his performance is that powerful.
And before that in the durians that that conversation with Scrooge and the rats and stuff and they're asking for like the extra shovel of coal because it's also cold in there and he goes how would they like to you know enjoy the unemployment line.

(19:19):
And they immediately cut to the rats are now all in the island regalia yelling heatwave and dancing around you know that the art of the cutaway joke that has been perfected by the Muppets.
I don't know if I've seen it's equal the way that they do that complete like it was a complete costume change and everything for the rats on that one and to really sell the joke that was it was almost I don't think even Looney Tunes has pulled it off with that kind of.

(19:48):
immediacy and delivery the way that they do in in Muppets and the way they did that one that was one of my favorite jokes them of the movie because I would love to give the Muppets the credit for that I just I don't I don't have the confidence in in tossing them that because I've seen it before.
And like they I mean they did do a good I mean the Muppets did a fantastic job with it yeah that's almost say they just did an incredible like they just did it so damn well I can see I can see where you're coming from on that.

(20:19):
Using the using Rizzo to stoke the fire as Gonzo narrates literally the physical gags on this they never stop they just they literally just never stop Scrooge makes the jokes about the prisons and take about the prisons taking in the homeless he's like my tax dollars go towards the prisons and the homeless shelters like let them stay there or the poorhouse.

(20:45):
And the guy the professors like but some would rather die and just flat out well then let them die.
Less of a strain on society like yeah yeah no this is this is our bad guy is a bad guy and that Christmas cheer he does not have it he does not understand it he has no love for his fellow man.

(21:22):
When it's warm out does he is he get a little more cuddly I don't know like doesn't seem like it not based off of the flashbacks we got now and then I like love is the only thing sillier than a Merry Christmas when he can as he kicks that charity out breaks me scares the carol or the caroling gives him hope when he opens the door back up and then he chucks that frickin wreath Adam like oh man I felt bad for a little bunny Muppet.

(21:51):
They got me.
That is such a rich guys mentality to think literally any expense to the operation of your company is a bad guy.

(22:22):
The only thing that's going to happen is the operation of your company is you being robbed like anytime any if it's like hey I'm working overtime you owe me overtime pay your you're ripping me off with this like no man.
There's a reason why not all rich people are rich but there's a like the people who get rich off of putting it in.

(22:55):
There was times when I was like when I was working as a waiter and you'd have the dudes were like gold ring that like pinky ring that like came up like six inches off his hand like just walking around sporting money dude never tipped dude was dude had money because he never let it go.
It's a sick mentality if you ask me.
I don't think I wouldn't call that that's the reason why they're rich I would say that's the reason why the only friends they have are the ones who are after their money.

(23:26):
If you literally are like so stingy with your money and all that because yeah the people go out drop money here drop money there drop like candy bars sodas all this the ones who don't do any of that they have all that extra money.

(23:53):
All your money away that's pretty damn unhealthy.
Yeah, I mean for sure I mean yeah there is a middle ground there but that that's honestly like I have an issue with people saying things like someone who is not at all willing to to pay what is owed unless you yank it out of them by the by the tooth.
You're saying something different than what I'm saying though.

(24:17):
Like the people who earn their money do their thing they're really really tight about it they hold on to it. They're just good with money.
Like what like your.
Yeah, it's the that's why they're rich thing that bothers me. It's it's it's when people say things like that with that's why that's why they're the rich no no it's the other way around.
And when you kind of look at that because when you look at because I know tons of people who have like they make pretty good money they do okay with it now at that and they are about the dumbest people on the planet when it comes to what they spend money on.

(24:50):
And then they sit there and then they bitch about wolf all these other people have money it's like no you had money.
You were done with it. Now you don't have money, you should not be angry at the people who do have money because you're bad with it.
That's the mentality that kind of gets me.
Okay, well I mean telling treating your employees like they're robbing you when they want to get paid. That's what I'm talking about. That's not why you're rich.

(25:16):
But that's not what he's doing. That's not what's going on here.
That's literally what he says he's he's saying you know to pick a man's pockets that's what he's accusing them of trying to pull one over on him by asking for the day off for Christmas.
Where I where I do see where you like no no I'm not disagreeing with you on that point at all.
The reasoning that they gave behind it was a solid one and because he is actually intelligent with money and not just an ass.

(25:43):
He they actually got the day off.
He capitulated.
If he was if he yeah if he if he was not the guy who would realize oh no I am I'm I'm.
If he didn't realize that he was going to lose money on it and he just wanted to make the employees suffer different kind of a dick.
Right here I'm sure you see where I'm coming from with that.
Okay yeah yep.
No but I definitely understand that the other side though.

(26:07):
One more sleep till Christmas song that one like as the shop is closing up the fra or Kermit and the rats are all singing one more day till Christmas one more sleep till Christmas.
Right yeah.
That was a that was a cultural moment great.
What do you mean.
I mean it was since this movie came out like that's when I started hearing like my friends and people talk like speak in those terms like only six you know it's only 30 more sleeps till Christmas you know them you know things like that.

(26:35):
That might be a you and your friends thing I don't think I have ever heard anybody say that a single time in my life.
Maybe immediately after watching this movie.
I don't know.
The skating penguins Kermit and then gonzo and Rizzo like that whole thing watching the Muppets off of their strings doing that.

(27:00):
Yes you can definitely see the camera work you can see all of that stuff and that didn't matter.
Lot of joy in there.
And then Scrooge returns to the former home of the Marley's which is now his home and the door knocker shifts into was that Waldorf or Statler.
You know here's the thing I've never known which was which my entire life.

(27:22):
I was really hoping that I was not going to be alone on that.
Yeah I know that they are Statler and Waldorf don't ask me which one's which yeah.
Okay good enough. Gonzo gets his nose knocked into the door changes his voice and Rizzo doubts he knows what's up.
And I like that doubt that Rizzo is constantly giving him and then Gonzo just keeps telling the stories like I got this and just that sheer confidence running through it.

(27:47):
Light turns on and then right into the camera.
How does he do that?
I love it man I love Rizzo and Gonzo I want them to narrate every classic story.
The fact that they didn't do more of this was weird.
It is yes it is very weird that this would seem to be a one off.

(28:09):
Scrooge attacks his best dressing gown and then time for bread and cheese and that bell ringing that bell ringing.
Even though it's never explained probably explained in the book or in you know the Dickens actual written story.
But in this I don't remember just creepy.
It's just an incessantly won't will not stop ringing the bell just keeps going and Michael Caine sells that terror.

(28:39):
But then that is since you bring up the book and the details of the book that was one of the things that always threw me because my first exposure to the Muppet Christmas Carol was actually the Disney version with you know Uncle Scrooge McDuck.
And and they had goofy playing Marley in that one.
And so you see goofy's big hold schnoz come out of the door knocker when that scene happened.

(29:02):
And I remember even as a kid understanding you know the concept of an adaptation I genuinely thought that that was a Disney thing that the whole Marley's face coming out of the door knocker was just something the Disney people put in just as a joke because of the whole giant goofy schnoz on there.
But when I guess why they chose goofy to be the one to do it right exactly and it wasn't until yeah reading the book in high school and actually reading the story and reading the part about seeing Marley's face in the door knocker.

(29:31):
I'm like wait wait what that that's actually in the book.
It's nuts.
I like it.
The Marley and Marley song by Statler and Waldorf Dave Goles and Jerry Nelson and all of Michael Caine's reactions like no no no I had some some moldy cheese or some bad bread yes there's more to gravy than grave of you and I'm like what that line I love it.

(30:00):
That delivery amazing and which again you know I think that may actually be from the Dickens book which means I think himself was writing Muppets level puns which it just kind of makes the whole thing makes sense on the marriage of these two things into one perfect creation of media.

(30:22):
If if Shakespeare plays weren't always you know ending in. I would like to see that like some Muppets do some Shakespeare Dickens they don't all end in death some of them end in mass marriages instead.
That's just as bad.
But Statler and Waldorf I love that they come back like graven gravy I like that.

(30:52):
And then it feels good to be heckling again.
And they keep talking about how they did not care about men they didn't care about their fellow man all this.
I really I don't know if I've ever noticed this before this viewing but Scrooge was really insistent that no you guys weren't unfeeling towards men, but he's kind of like he's like no I'm not unfeeling towards men like kind of like defending himself through defending them.

(31:19):
Yeah, well he's trying to and I think that's kind of the where the the commentary begins because they're basically saying like oh yeah sure we were good people to our friends the other wealthy money lenders like us we were good people, but the people we were lending money to the people we kept evicting the the orphans that you know were left out in the snow when we close their orphanage on Christmas Day stuff like that you know they're like no it doesn't matter how many lords your buddies with that shit.

(31:48):
That shit will fuck with you you know and that's and and yeah and this is news to Scrooge apparently.
I guess so dude never really took a look.
Yeah, but another thing that I'm not so sure I noticed until because I didn't become not a big Dickens reader I I should be but we're you have talked about I think it's called classic syndrome.

(32:10):
Yes, yeah, classic yeah as we're told by Mark Twain yeah.
Yeah, we're a classic is a classic is something everyone wants to have read but nobody wants to read and which I think extends to movies and TV shows as well, because nobody has seen roots.
You haven't seen roots.

(32:31):
Nope.
I remember when it was on I remember my parents watching it but I never saw it, you know, after the original broadcast.
I've seen roots.
I don't know a lot of white people who have.
But yeah I remember when I was younger like a lot of my black friends would say like it was really important their parents made them watch it, everything like that but yeah that's not really like, yeah, white community, I don't think our parents are really pushing that movie on us.

(33:01):
No, yeah, no that's not something that they're making required viewing.
No, I don't think so.
Yeah.
Like that. Should we be worried about the kids? No, this is culture.
That, that I feel like that that is something that I definitely experienced a lot as a kid. Like should I be watching this like, come on, it's culture. It's Candyman.

(33:25):
Right, exactly. You need, you need to be seeing this. Yeah, yeah you need to know who Jason is you need to know who Freddy Krueger is like, exactly. Yeah, that was my that was my upbringing.
This will, this will haunt your nightmares for for years to come. Good.
Scrooge goes to bed, another humbug, and then oh god Rizzo and the gate.

(33:47):
That whole thing. What a fantastic bit of dialogue. There are only two things in this world that I hate, heights and jumping from them.
I love that more.
That is such a simple thing and I love that more than I can say.
And then jumping down, running back through to go get his jelly beans, like nah, nah every bit, common gold, every single piece of that. Yep.

(34:12):
100% unnecessary to the plot or story but absolutely this movie would not have been the same without it.
So we get our first look, stroke of midnight, the ghost of Christmas pass has arrived. So creepy, so beautiful, so wonderfully shot. It's bad enough. Voiced by Jessica Fox and she did incredible.

(34:36):
The voice. Have we seen her in anything else since? I'm trying to remember. Not really, not much. Yeah. But yeah, no, it's bad enough that they brought a creepy child into this but a creepy child with a featureless rubber face.
Like I had a really, really hard time watching the ghost of Christmas pass. I thought she was beautiful.
So the two ways that they shot that the ghost of Christmas passed with that ethereal doll is for two scenes, they dropped the entire doll into a giant vat of baby oil with a green screen behind it.

(35:11):
Okay, sure. But it was really, which is what made a couple of those shots look amazing. But it was hard to keep that, the baby oil clean. So after a couple shots with the baby oil they switched it over to water, and that doll fell apart immediately after they got their final shot.
Damn. So they just got it under the wire. But could you imagine doing a scene with a muppet and baby oil with a green screen behind it? I mean, Michael Caine. Yeah. Well, what an actor.

(35:46):
How, I mean, was he was he actually doing a performance to like the puppet that they that they just green screened out or was they what or did they superimpose that and he was acting to blank air. I'm thinking that he was acting to blank air. Okay.
But I actually don't know. Yeah. That was still relatively new at that time, doing things blue screen, green screen, stuff like that. I guess it was. Yeah. This was still the 80s. 90s. 91. 91. 91. Yeah, okay. Yeah. Okay.

(36:21):
I like that. What is that light? It is the past. I always loved that that delivery all of it. Gonzo and Rizzo getting dragged through the forest. I love that. Come out with a chicken. This is Patrice. Yeah, we've met.
Sorry, man. I love the I love the Muppets way too much for an adult. I it's no no no no no no no that's it. That's well, you know, one thing is as that for there's no there's no two growing up for the Muppets. Okay. Okay. Maybe two grown up from Muppet babies. But then again, I don't even know that because it's been so long since I've even seen any of that. That's true. Yeah, I don't think I've watched it since it was actually like on air the original time. I'm pretty sure Rizzo getting chased by the cat.

(37:10):
And Gonzo narrates like it's not even happening. I swear to God their friendship is perfect for comedy. Kane absolutely absolutely lets the joy show up in his voice when he sees his childhood schoolmates. Right. He breaks that Scrooge persona so fast. My old school chums like all of this. Like you. Oh.

(37:33):
Pay attention to what he really does and it makes it even better. That's the thing like some movies you pay attention and it kind of makes it worse. Yeah. Gremlins outstanding movie so much fun. But there are some moments in Gremlins that you're like okay skip skip skip skip I want I want I want my I want my Gremlins movie back.

(37:55):
Hey, this is not one of those. Oh, he sees his young self and then goes into like self defense mode about being alone as a child. Right. No, it was fine. It gave me more time for my study and all this like you are literally watching this guy try to defend his.
And you see it doesn't tell you it just shows you. Right. Exactly. It is an it is an amazing aspect of something that was written that actually showed you everything that happened and barely told you a single thing.

(38:33):
Like I really really appreciated this. They were all very much the same. Nothing ever changed. That was a very heartbreaking piece of dialogue. And then she said you changed and then Frank Oz as Sam the eagle. Oh, perfect choice, which is yeah he's Sam the great American eagle.

(38:55):
He is the perfect choice for a British schoolmaster and and boy do they hang a hat on that at the end of that scene in the best of ways. It is business. Yeah, it is the American way.
But I love love that when Gonzo goes up to correct him. He's like, Hey, Sam, he actually says Sam. Right. Talking to the he's talking to the Muppet acting as it that level of like, I don't know what fourth wall, eighth wall. I don't know which one you brought.

(39:26):
Versing or this. Yeah, some sort of a meta joke kind of thing. Yes. The meta humor on that is like, it's the American way. It is the British way.
So good. So good. Sam the Eagles. He's too good. Oh, that moment the Rizzo like the lamp, not the right like the lamp, not the right. And then goes. Yep. Too good. Too good. Having Fozzy Bear be Fozzy wig.

(39:56):
I know. Love that. Oh, it's old Fozzy wig himself. Which is because it's like that. That is already like that. Those are the two like competing things because there you have like whenever people talk about, you know, the the fizzy wig character.
You're like, yeah, you can't help but think you mean Fozzy wig. But at the same time, also, I can still hear Scrooge McDuck saying it in a Scottish accent. Is he weak or fizzy wig? You know, like it's a like, I don't know why in the Christmas Carol, Carol, they decided to make him Scottish.

(40:30):
But but I hear that in the Scottish accent all the time. And so, you know, I completely have no idea what you're talking about. You've never seen the Disney Christmas Carol with Scrooge McDuck.
No. Well, he was he was I think he was the like introduction of Scrooge as Ebenezer Scrooge. They created a whole new Duck character and and Donald as the as the happy nephew kind of thing.

(40:53):
But yeah, that was and then it was that because that was so popular. That's how we got Uncle Scrooge McDuck in Duck Tales. It was spun off was a spinoff of the Disney Christmas Carol. See, I was a cool kid. I watched Darkwing Duck.
Oh, OK. Yeah, I was a teenager by the time Darkwing Duck came out, sir. Fair enough. But I'm pretty sure we both watched Duck Tales. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

(41:18):
I still got the theme song stuck in my head. No, there's no.
So as soon as I even thought about Duck Tales, my brain went, wee. Right. Exactly. Yeah. It just happens.
Yes, the Fosse with Christmas party Rizzo becomes a Ratsicle and the Marley's on the balcony. I love their response to that speech. It was like, I was dumb. It was stupid. It was simple. It was short.

(41:41):
I love it.
The two guys like Waldorf and Statler, like having them roast everything that that has carried on in every single media ever. I don't know who did that first, but the Muppets did it best.

(42:02):
Yes.
Like I. And that's a lot of things that you can. You can carve that in stone on just about anything. I don't know who did it first, but the Muppets did it best. That that was like that will be like one of those like laws of physics within time.
I feel like I need to watch more Muppets stuff because I've just been just I'm religious that with this every single year I watched this and the other Christmas stuff I watch is not as family friendly, but you know, I like Christmas horror movies.

(42:34):
It's it's it is not the greatest niche.
I don't know why. Yeah, I've seen a couple here or there, of course.
Did you see that one? I can't remember the title of it, but it just came out like last year or two years ago, the one with David Harbor as Santa Claus.
Oh, yeah. Violent Night. Violent Night. That's it. Yeah. You see that was actually a lot of fun. I had a really, really was. Yeah. Leguizamo killed it as always in there, you know, always. Yeah. Oh, oh, yeah. We'll talk a little bit more about that one later.

(43:08):
David Rudman with the Swedish chef cameo. Thank God he was in there because the Swedish chef is. Yeah, just like that. And I think like a Ralph. Ralph. How do you say his name? Ralph. Ralph. Ralph. Ralph. Yeah.
Like you got like you think like a kind of work. Yeah, you got to kind of bark when you say Ralph's name. Definitely. Yeah. But then animal comes coming in like and then also just starts jamming it up. And then we get a muppet song.

(43:39):
And that is like that muppet style song is everything.
The meeting. Oh, meeting Bell played by Meredith Braun. And then oh, oh, God. Yeah. Michael Caine when he says, oh, please, please do not show me that Christmas.
Where and then we cut to what we were talking about earlier, where there is a version of this movie where she has a song where Bell played by Meredith Braun. She has a nice song is a very nice song. But the reason it was cut after because it was in the theatrical release.

(44:15):
Right. It's in some way we were talking about earlier, some DVDs, some VHS, and you can find it on the laser disk and all that. But Disney lost the original negative of that of the film.
So there's no way they can't even do that. They can't bring it back and put it in because it will have a quality drop. Right. So they won't do it.

(44:38):
But if they ever. But that's that's why we don't have that song is because Disney actually lost the negative on the film strip.
That's heartbreaking. That is that is pretty heartbreaking. But you can still and I will jump on. And when I upload it to YouTube, I will drop it in the description.
But the absolute heartbreak and Michael Caine's voice when he doesn't want to see that Christmas, the Christmas where she says, like, why haven't you proposed? I haven't become wealthy enough yet. I haven't attained this yet and all that.

(45:10):
She ends it with you don't love me. I remember when you basically I remember when you did. Yeah. You used to be in love with me. But but now, yeah, it's.
Yeah. And then we get to see Scrooge crying over his lost love. And then just from there, from there.
What a dick move. Just dropping him right off in his own bed again.

(45:34):
Hey, I'm going to I'm going to kidnap you, show you some stuff in the past. And the moment that you just start breaking down crying, I'm a pop out and leave you to weep in your sheets.
Come on. That is that is every therapist who's ever said, well, our time is up.
OK, pretty much. Then then the clock strikes two.

(45:56):
And this is not going to be a popular opinion, but set aside from Gonzo.
This is my favorite Muppet of all time. The ghost of the ghost of Christmas present. Right.
Yes. Which I always I always thought was interesting how they went with his design, because I clearly, clearly this Muppet, this ghost of Christmas present Muppet, which maybe it was because they decided they wanted to make original Muppets for all of these.

(46:26):
And that's why they didn't do it. But this guy is so clearly based off of sweet.
I've often wondered why they didn't just have sweetums be the ghost of Christmas present.
But you know, yeah, I know is coming and know me better, man. Right. I'm sorry, dude.

(46:47):
I love that guy so much like his. You're a little you're a little absent minded spirit, aren't you?
No, I'm a large absent minded spirit. Everything out of his mouth is gold. Right.
But also, also, also real quick played by Jerry Nelson and he did outstanding with the physical performance and the singing on this character.

(47:08):
Yes. And I love that sort of like that gag of he's the ghost of Christmas present. He lives in the present. He's so living in the present. He has no short term memory.
He's constantly losing track of what he just said or did. I thought that was the greatest decision.
Yeah. Have I said that? Did I say that already? And the fact that.

(47:32):
Now, again, this isn't said, but I feel like this is what the movie was showing us because he was so absent minded.
Scrooge was like willing to joke with him a lot more than he had joked with anybody else because he would forget that Scrooge had a sense of humor.
That's kind of what I was feeling from that. But I might just be straight up making shit up.

(47:54):
I suppose it's possible. I don't know.
But like I said, this the story, it shows a lot, but it doesn't it doesn't shove it right in your face.
No. Yeah. Like that's that's the thing. So I don't know if what I'm taking away is the right thing or the wrong thing or the.
OK, there is no right or wrong, but the intended versus the unintended thing. Right. Yeah.

(48:17):
That's what you're saying. Tell me if you notice this when they're going and they're doing their walk and sing and he's.
The it feels like Christmas song and they have like the guards or the police or whatever with the bell
and he hits the Muppet with the bell and his whole face collapse in and he looks like he's got a sour face.

(48:40):
Oh, yeah. Yeah. No, that's that's a that's a classic Muppet. He's been around for a while.
And they they they use it as a site. Oh, yeah. They've used his as a site guy before.
Yeah. Oh, I didn't know that. I just I a lot of gags in the background of this movie.
A movie to watch a hundred times, a movie to watch every year around Christmas time.
Yeah, they stuck the landing and I've been watching this for 30 years straight.

(49:07):
Or more. Shut up.
Shrinking down to sing with the mice and through sways like he wants to dance with them.
He's smiling along with the song even better.
And then he has that joyous moment. He's like, I want to see friends, kin and family.

(49:28):
And he feels that joy creeping up on him and made me happy, made me feel it gave me the feels.
But then when he goes to see his nephew and that that game was not the way to kick in the nuts.
Yeah, they play basically a British version of 20 Questions.

(49:50):
Right. And it's like, oh, it's an unwanted thing that nobody likes in all of this and blah, blah, blah.
It's Ebenezer Scrooge. And it's like, dude, I thought you were the good nephew that actually was like, oh, man.
Were you just showing up to like maybe get some money from your rich uncle and then go off and shit talk him?
And I was rooting for you. That scene did not make me like that character the way that I think I was supposed to.

(50:17):
OK, I see what you're saying. Yeah, I like that character at the beginning, but all the way through to the end,
when he's sitting at that table and he's got that very confused look on his face, I'm like, I don't like you.
Right. Yeah. You know, I see.
And here's the thing is like I didn't even tune in on any of that.
What? What caught me for the first time and granted, I probably, you know, I haven't watched this every year.

(50:42):
I've watched it a smattering of times over the. This is my Christmas movie.
Yeah, I don't know if I should have caught on this a long time ago and I'm just like the last to the party as always.
But what struck me was how nobody at this party was a Muppet.
There was a there was a class divide between humans and puppets in this movie.

(51:06):
I can't agree because the Marley's and Fozzie and Sam the Eagle.
Right. OK. Yep, you're right. Yeah.
But OK, so I don't don't I don't remember there being a Muppet in the eye,
but I think because there was no Muppet in there, I think we were not supposed to like anybody in that room.
OK, yeah, no, you're right. I think you're probably right. Yeah, they weren't supposed to be the good guys.

(51:27):
They were, you know, they were just they were family. Yeah.
Well, he was family. Well, I guess technically his wife would be family, too.
That is how that works. Right. So I'm told. Sure.
Christmas present is starting to show those gray hairs and I loved how he aged throughout Christmas Day.

(51:49):
I thought that was I always loved that and they pop over to Cratchit's house and Mrs.
Cratchit played by Miss Piggy, who is also played by Frank Oz.
Right. Always and forever. Yep.
Which is a fact that will never not blow me away that that is that that is Frank Oz and David Rudman as Peter Cratchit.

(52:13):
And yeah, you get Rizzo falling down, you get a rat on a goose.
Right. Gag. Loved it. And and the the endless humor of the the children, you know, the boys are frogs like Kermit and the girls are pigs like Miss Piggy and the like.
The way the way the twin daughters are like little tiny Miss Piggy's, you know, they've got her attitude, they've got her, her, you know,

(52:40):
over excitement and everything and the two young boys, they're two frogs that are just trying to help.
You know, yes, mother, I'm doing what I can.
You know, like that whole dynamic.
No family therapy could parse that out the way the way, you know, an audience just connects to it.

(53:01):
I'm going to say, like, yes, they did typecast Miss Piggy into the regular role that she always like was.
Yeah. But the original version of this, they wanted Gonzo to play the ghost of Christmas yet to come.
And they wanted Miss Piggy to play the ghost.
I think it was a Christmas present or of Christmas pass.

(53:23):
OK, that was very glad they did not go that route.
No, I think they made the right call here. And it's true.
But I now that you've brought it up, I'm like, I would like to see some of the concept work on that.
What did that look like? That sounds interesting.
Maybe. No, I can jump on board with taking a look at that.
But what we got, I think, was the right call. Oh, for sure.
Yeah. Whoever was in that, they did.

(53:45):
They did a good job. The Christmas scat song with Kermit and Tiny Tim on that rotating log.
Love it. So the thing about this particular scene, it took 10 different puppeteers to make that one scene happen.
You had people controlling Kermit and Tiny Tim rotating that log to make it look like he was walking down the street.

(54:06):
And puppets for that one scene or 10 puppeteers for that one scene. Oh, yeah.
I am always going to be amazed at how much work and attention to detail and love always went into Jim Henson productions.
Oh, for sure. Yeah. Like they're they're next level.
And you can't have Kermit and Miss Piggy without it getting a little steamy.

(54:29):
I mean, it's the Muppets. I mean, it still is what it is.
But we all know what's going on in that household. Yes, I know. Oh, we do.
It's been going on for 50 years. It's not a mystery. Oh, no, it's not.
Scrooge comments on how remarkable a child like Tiny Tim is.
And Kermit toasts to him and Miss Piggy keeps it real. And those twin those twin piggy daughters, they're like, yep, he's evil.

(54:57):
He smells bad. And then she's like, and he tresses poorly.
Like, I love it. I love like those that dynamic. It never got old on me.
Bless us all by Tiny Tim. And this one will get you right in the feels, man.
That one absolutely does. That moment where he turns back to the ghost or to the ghost and tell me if Tiny Tim will live.

(55:22):
An aging Christmas present throws his words back at him.
If he's going to die, he better do it and decrease the surplus surplus population, which is what Scrooge said at the beginning of the movie.
And when those words get tossed back at him, it looks like he got hit by a train. Yeah.
And like. And I think the amazing thing is, is that the ghostly Christmas present doesn't even say it in a way.

(55:48):
Like, I'm throwing your words back at you. He's literally saying it as nonchalantly as Scrooge did.
Like. Fuck, man.
You have to remember that Scrooge said that because Scrooge does not go. I said that.
No, this movie does not like this movie trust its audience to the maximum.

(56:09):
And it's a children's movie. For God sakes. Learn the lesson.
If kids can figure it out and kids can pick up what Charles Dickens wanted them to pick up.
Oh, my God. Trust your audiences when it comes to movies made for adults.
I go crazy with this. To be fair, it is much more common fair for kids to watch their kids movies.

(56:33):
Over and over again, in order to catch every detail way more than grownups do.
That is true. There's far, far, far more shit coming out every day for us.
So, you know, but I've maybe got a market is so saturated for like children's stuff.
I don't even know what's out there. Like, yeah, I mean, there are a few out there, but I do remember even like with my kids growing up.

(56:58):
That was one of the one of the things I did was I made a point to record Blues Clues whenever it was on.
Because when Blues Clues was not on, then that meant I had to find a way to distract the kid by myself.
If I had to do like I was I was not getting anything done that day because the kid was like needing attention.

(57:19):
I just had a lot of Blues Clues over and over again.
Exactly. Yeah, I had I had a six hour tape of nothing but Blues Clues back to back. So I just popped that baby in.
And now, OK, now I can actually wash the dishes because the kids not not, you know, running around breaking shit now.
So enough. So, yeah, same. And Bugs Life. Same thing. Bugs Life.

(57:41):
Oh, yeah. Like you get those Disney movies and stuff like that. No, that's just the thing you do for kids.
So, yeah, there's a there's a library of like, you know, every household that has kids has a library of about like 10.
Maybe if they're a rich family, they got about 20 or 30.
But there is a set library of stuff for the kids that those kids have worn out.

(58:02):
It's not as it's not as easy to wear out a DVD like it was with VHS, but kids will wear out a DVD if you give them the opportunity to.
No. OK, that is fair. Christmas present is dying and Scrooge wishes him to stay as he's changed him.
And he's like, I've but I've changed. You've done so much for me and all this.
Hey, that he already it's like the thing is that he already knows what Ghost of Christmas Future is going to show him and he doesn't want to see it.

(58:32):
He already got it. We got the system figured out here and he's like, look, can you just accept that I'm a changed man now?
Can we skip the shitty part that I know it's coming right up? Oh, that's yeah, that is some hard stuff, because as soon as he disappears, that fog chases Scrooge right into the future.
And the ghost of Christmas Future is too scary for our narrators.

(58:56):
Gonzo and Rizzo, they dip out and like, we'll catch you guys in the aftermath. And the music is Paul Williams perfectly eerie.
He did a fantastic job. The Muppet of the Ghost of Christmas Future or Christmas Yet to Come.
Right. That Muppet. Oh, man, that terrified me as a child.

(59:19):
They did good with that one. The Money Pigs roasting the recently dead and David Shaw Parker as Old Joe the Spider taking in all Scrooge's belongings.
Fantastic, fantastic performance. Reapy as shit. Yeah. Absolutely.
Scrooge keeps acting like he doesn't know this is about him and he's like, keeps mentioning like this poor soul and all this, but he's looking at his bedsheets.

(59:46):
He knows they're his. He responds to them. He knows he knows he is he is in denial.
He's hoping there's a big reveal coming. The last last two ghosts pulled a fast one on him by showing him happy shit and then bringing him down.
He's seriously hoping that that's that that's the same like misdirected this guy's using.
He's like, OK, I know you're making it look like I'm dead and everyone's happy about it.

(01:00:08):
But I mean, come on, it's not me. Right. Yeah, that one. That's how this game is played.
But then he's taken over to Cratchit's to see that Tiny Tim has passed.
He's got the not Tiny Tim and they chose a spot on a hill so a deceased Tiny Tim can see the ducks on the river.
And this is something that I know I never noticed until this viewing.

(01:00:33):
Notice how that Scrooge says, how can we endure this? Not how can the Cratchit's not how can they?
He has started to include himself as part of the community in his own mind. Right.
Yeah, I thought that was a fantastic bit of like inclusion on the dialogue. Yep.

(01:00:54):
I'm curious. Did you ever notice that or is that no, I mean, no.
I mean, I remember that that was how it went. Now you said it. I didn't notice it in the moment.
But yeah, it is interesting that he's starting to think in terms of, yeah, the community as a family.
And I think that's kind of one of those interesting things about Scrooge is like that's his the realization that he's coming to is that in his mind,

(01:01:19):
he has kind of in the same way that Fizzy Wig treated everyone in his company like one big family in his mind,
he thinks he's treating his employees like a family, too.
He's just really bad at it. And he's he's coming to terms with the realization of how bad he is at it.
He hadn't thought about it in terms of, oh, wait, yeah, this guy Cratchit, who's been at my side for decades.

(01:01:44):
Super. OK. Oh, right. Oh, right. He's got kids and a wife and a house with a mortgage on it.
And I never even I never even knew his kid's name, let alone that one of them is lame and that he's this bright, brilliant ball of sun, you know,
happy kid that would, you know, the world would be missing if he if he died. And, you know, it's like like, why didn't I ever even so much as ask this?

(01:02:10):
Why? I never even asked Cratchit if he had kids. What the fuck is wrong with me?
Which is the absolute point of the story. Like he really does that whole change.
The overture of this movie is Michael Caine is Scrooge. Yeah.
And then returned to the cemetery and Scrooge's fear overseeing his name on the tombstone.

(01:02:31):
Like, I'm not the man I was. Why would you show me this if all is beyond hope?
Like, yeah, it's a good point. And is this the site of things that will be or what could be?
That's yeah, that's one of those that that's kind of like that's from the book.
It's a it's a it's the running theme in every version that's ever been been adapted to it because that's kind of like what it comes down to is, you know,

(01:02:57):
it's not too late to change is the is the theme of it. And that's what he's asking.
He's asking the ghost of Christmas future. Is it too late to change or not? You know, and that and I think that's really is the main question of this character.
Right. And the reality is, no, it's never too late, never too late. Exactly.

(01:03:19):
And returns to his bedchamber, a new man, a joyous man of Christmas.
And like that that shot where he goes into the mirror, he's like, oh, oh, oh, I always I really love that.
Hires the caroling bunny to get a turkey. And he is just excited to surprise the cratchits.
And every question is like, oh, you're a smart man. You're an exceptional lad.

(01:03:43):
Just every word that comes out of his mouth is now bolstering up the people because he knows how to bring him down.
Right. So maybe he knows how to bring him up to the charity professor and beaker.
Get a huge donation complete with from what he says, a bunch of back payments as well. Right.
Yeah. Thankful Heart sang by Michael Caine as Scrooge is one of the final songs.

(01:04:10):
Beautiful stops by the office to give gifts of coal.
I mean, it could have been something you understand the representation of what like the story and all that.
But like Santa gives coal to the bad ones. So like, I mean, they are right.

(01:04:31):
Racist.
By or it stops by the office to give gifts of coal by his nephews to give hugs and confusion by Sam and Fawzi's because apparently they grew old and now they live together and to drop gifts by the crooks.

(01:04:53):
Where is that story?
Yeah, I'm a little curious about that one. I don't know where that came out of rushes the crowd away to Frank Cratchit and then gives him a raise.
Well, Miss Piggy's threatening to give him a raise. Right. Yeah, I love it.
I love it. But yeah, he gives him a raise, pays the mortgage on his house and then delivers a giant turkey ends on the love we found by the Muppet.

(01:05:20):
Skipping over the pack, he's delivering an uncooked turkey at like noon on Christmas Day.
You know what? There is that. I had my thought on that. I had my thought on that. But whatever. Whatever.
Right. Okay. It's the thought that counts. Yeah, it's a thought that counts.
And I like how it actually actually ends with Gonzo saying, if you like this, you should read the book.

(01:05:47):
Right. Exactly.
I thought that was a really good throw to Dickens, which he doesn't need one. But still honor the source material.
Sure. Yeah, 100%. And especially, again, keeping in mind that while I have said there's no such thing as too grown up for the Muppets,
they are keeping in mind that this is for technically for kids. And so making sure to make the point, say like, hey, kids, read a book.

(01:06:15):
Like, it's never never a bad idea to toss that in there when you get the chance.
Come on. Tell adults to read books, man. Not enough adults read enough books.
That is a very good point there. Yes. And I'm not saying that as a guy trying to sell his own books.
I'm saying that as seriously, people need to read more, man.
All right. Final thoughts on the Muppet Christmas Carol.

(01:06:36):
Muppet Christmas Carol. Well, I don't think I need to tell anyone this is a must see.
I think this is already on everyone's view list.
This but yes, it is it is culturally iconic.
There have been dozens upon dozens upon dozens of adaptations of this story in one form or another.
And I think this is the one that has withstood the test of time.

(01:07:02):
And I'm and yes, I am including the Masterpiece Theatre version that was my you know, and the Disney version that I was mentioning before.
Like all of these, you know, all of these eventually get, you know, aged out, you know, for one reason or another after like maybe 10, 15 years.
This one, this one. Now, this one's going to outlive us all.

(01:07:25):
I very much agree. This is this is the best.
So the reason like the reason that I brought this one in because we are changing the formulas this week a little bit.
We are not doing the movie fights.
So we were talking more along the lines of why we brought like, you know, for the individual, why you brought us in.

(01:07:47):
So with that. Exactly. I brought this in just because the Muppets are iconic to American media.
Like what like what J. M. Henson brought to the world, all of this.
And there is no better Muppets movie than a Muppet Christmas Carol.
In my eyes, this is absolutely the best one.

(01:08:10):
It is one that I will revisit every single year until the day I die.
And. Like it's just it's too iconic.
It is absolutely a must see. There's no way around it.
And it's just to feel good. And yeah, I agree.
I definitely also, yeah, I've got a very special place in my heart for the Muppets.

(01:08:33):
There have been many, many other attempts to make puppet based entertainment for kids and adults.
For some reason, nothing has ever caught the magic the way the Muppets have.
They did it best and still are doing it best.
And yeah, probably one of the greatest outrages of my adulthood is how, you know,

(01:08:54):
since Disney acquired the Henson company, they did not give it.
They haven't treated it the same way that they're treating Marvel now.
They're not giving us an expanded Muppets universe every other, you know, every year the way they are with Marvel.
And that bothers. Yeah, it's hard.
It's hard to say what this movie means to me outside of just being the Muppets.

(01:09:15):
The Muppets is its own kind of thing. So, yeah, you're right.
It's iconic. It's cultural. It even goes beyond American borders.
Muppets, you know, Sesame Street is constantly showing in hundreds of countries.
Do you have a point?
We got another movie to get to.
I thought I would find one if I just kept talking.
But no, I guess I kept rambling. I might find a point. But no, I guess no.

(01:09:39):
Mission failed. Moving on.
It is 8-bit Christmas written by Michael Dows, directed by Kevin Jakubowski, starring Winslow Feigley,
Neil Patrick Harris, Steve Zahn, which my God, I do not see enough Steve Zahn these days.
Sophia Reed Gantzert. Gantzert? I don't know how to say that quickly.

(01:10:03):
And Bella Luna Resnick with June Diane Raphael, Che Tafari, Santino Bernard, Max Malas,
Brielle and Braylin Rankins, Cyrus Arnold, Chandler Dean and David Cross.
David Cross.
Which I think was the secret Santa in this movie.

(01:10:26):
I would know. Yeah, absolutely. 100 percent. I'm right there with you.
No, that's what. Yeah, no, this this movie was lovingly crafted by someone who grew up on Christmas movies in the 80s, for sure.
Oh, I could see that. I could really see. Well, here's the thing about this one.
This one, I was watching it, the whole thing. I was enjoying it. Many, many moments of this movie. I enjoyed it.

(01:10:54):
I was like, what is Doc seeing on this one? Then the end completely wiped me out.
And I was like, oh, OK, I get it.
You know, like when I say it wiped me out, I mean, there were some tears.
They were there. And then all of a sudden, no, dude, I was sobbing.

(01:11:18):
No, this man, the way this got me.
Yeah. And for all of that, one of the things that really got me about it.
And this is not my own like, you know, genius interpretation.
This is what when when I first heard about this movie, this is how it was told to me as how to take it in.
It is the new Christmas story. You know, for my generation and yours, you know, we, you know, a lot of us grew up watching the Christmas story,

(01:11:45):
which was about basically our parents generation as kids, you know, and the Christmas present thereafter.
This is a add 30 years to that. This is my generation growing up as a kid to show to my kids kind of thing.
And so, yeah, very much is that very next, you know, it's the new it's the new version of the Christmas story.

(01:12:06):
And I think that it sold on that perfectly. One hundred percent.
I saw it one year by myself the very next Christmas. I, you know, as the family was getting together, I'm like, OK, we're doing the Christmas.
We're all doing our favorite Christmas movie thing. This one's mine. I'm making everybody watch this.
And that and so and I'm probably going to be doing that for years to come.
Because, yeah, I think this is going to be my Christmas movie for a while.

(01:12:30):
I can see that it kind of pairs perfectly with your personality and a lot that goes with it.
So this one opens on wishes for Santa in Chicago and Neil Patrick Harris arguing with his daughter, Annie, played by Sophia Reed Gansert.
I'm not embarrassing. Bust his ass on the ice. That's how that has to go.

(01:12:52):
That's how that's how that has to go in real life every time.
That's just, yep, that's just how that's just how life works.
Making it to their grandparents and that bummer kid, you cannot do anything to make your kid happy.
Everything's it. All of it. Yep.
And then, ta-da, it's my first Nintendo. That looks like Tupperware.

(01:13:19):
Which had never occurred to me until she said it.
And I'm like, oh, my God, it is Tupperware. All these years that never hit me.
It looks like Tupperware. That's exactly what it looks like. My God.
But the thing that I really loved about this one was like, but first you gotta... why?
I don't know. You just gotta do it.
Right. That is exactly, that is exactly true. 100%.

(01:13:44):
I gotta say, this kid, like Sophia Reed Gansert, she plays, like she nails that disinterested kid so well.
All of the kids in this movie, that's the crazy thing, is like they got some sort of crazy, weirdly like talent machine for every kid in this movie.
And that, which I have never seen before.
We were just talking recently, Golden Compass, a couple episodes back.

(01:14:07):
And we were kind of, and I was saying, I don't really want a dog child, like I don't, I didn't really want a dog on that child actor because, you know, kid actors.
But at the same time, we have many examples of them absolutely crushing it.
Right. Any one of these kids could have done that movie better than that particular actor.
Well, I mean, like that one kid, we haven't introduced the kid characters yet, but Farmer, for instance.

(01:14:34):
That kid who plays Farmer, he's a little teeny tiny Jack Black.
They cut off Jack Black's toe, put it in the thing of water, and that kid sprouted out of it.
Like where the fuck did they find that kid? Oh, he was absolutely great.
The year was the late 80s.
How many times have I done that on this show?

(01:14:59):
It works, but it works. It works so well. It's so good.
Then we flash to a young Jake Doyle, Neil Patrick Harris's character, played by Winslow Feigley, riding with a helmet on, a green one.
And he just kept transitioning because he was lying and being like, no, we were super, super safe in the 80s.

(01:15:20):
It was a great way they did that.
Yeah. Like for me, again, flashbacks of, you know, when I was a kid riding on my skateboard and coming home with injuries
and having to explain to my mom why I wasn't wearing all the safety equipment that she bought me.
Because I didn't look cool.
Right. Pretty simple.
It kind of sucked to put on.

(01:15:41):
A little bit showing up to the psycho Timmy Keene played by Chandler Dean to play Nintendo.
Only the first kid, 10 kids get in and we get the best friends intro.
And this is another one of those. This is another one of those.
Like I've mentioned before about how like I miss Edgar Wright doing comedy because the way he directs comedy,

(01:16:06):
he's not just pointing the camera at funny people and letting them do their thing.
He actually conducts a scene where the cues have the humor in them.
This is an example of that.
This guy went to the Edgar Wright School of humor directing because when that crazy rich kid comes to the window,
he doesn't just step up to the window.
They had him glide up like a fucking supervillain like shit like that.

(01:16:29):
Little tiny things that probably cost them a million dollars each, but were fucking worth it every time.
Oh, they were great.
But the best friends intro, Mikey Trotter played by Che Tafari, Evan Olsen played by Santino Bernard,
Tammy Hodges played by Brielle Rankins, Teddy Hodges played by Braylon Rankins,

(01:16:50):
and the kid we were talking about earlier, Jeff Farmer played by Max Malus.
Watch out for this kid. He's going to be something.
Oh, I'm pretty sure all of these kids are going to go somewhere.
You're probably right. Yeah, for sure.
Like this one's going to go 8 a.m. It's game time.
Timmy picks the winners like a true dick.

(01:17:12):
And then he has the intercom.
Mommy's like, oh, we got friends over here. Can I get a pop some pop tarts?
How many? One. Right.
Oh, I knew kids like that.
And this goes right. This goes right back to we were talking about before of with Ebenezer Scrooge,
how that whole scene with the rats, how everything he says is just so cold blooded.

(01:17:33):
We're getting another version of that here.
This is the cold blooded rich kid who is just like he's going out of his way to be the biggest dick he can.
Like this is very relatable. I swear to God, we all know somebody like that.
Or we all knew somebody like that. Yeah.
And then tricking the mom.
So the kid gets back and he's like, all right, yeah, I have a plan.
I know how to do it.

(01:17:54):
He tricks his mom played by June Diane Raphael by understanding how she do.
Let's catch up all over his sweater and we get to see Steve's.
I was so excited when I saw Steve's on. I went into this blind.
I did not know that he was in this and I love Steve's on. Yeah, no, he's great.
Yeah, I love that.

(01:18:15):
Renovating dad, no safety glasses and instead a bag over his head instead.
Perfectly relatable. Completely understand that.
Dad, he passed the dad, he passed the mom and the perfect daughter and she knows how to highlight it.
Oh, oh, yeah. Which, by the way, again, a freaking they got themselves a Drew Barrymore clone to play the sister.

(01:18:41):
Like where the where the fuck where the fuck did they find these kids?
It's crazy. The casting call on this one.
They took their time and they nailed it. Yeah. Oh, they nailed it.
You didn't play outside. It's not even below zero.
Way relatable, way relatable. Oh, I grew up in that territory.

(01:19:02):
So this this is my own. This is my own.
This might be one of my favorite Christmas memories.
OK, watching this movie last year for the first time with the family, like I said, I got everybody like the whole family is the other.
And while this scene is playing, my son turns to me and goes, Jesus Christ, were parents really that bad back then?

(01:19:23):
And I'm like, motherfucker, your grandmother sitting right there.
What are you trying to do to me?
First off, parents were that good back then.
That no getting kicked out of the house to go actually have a childhood.
No, that was the right call.

(01:19:45):
Like, I know I get that. I like that.
You know, you know, and while that by itself is understandable,
but the fact that that mentality was paired with advertisements on TV saying it's 10 o'clock at night, do you know where your children are?
Kind of goes to show that this wasn't exactly parenting that was causing this to happen.

(01:20:06):
True. OK, yeah.
I like that the daughter, it looks like it's a no go on Tendo.
And then the dad like, oh, best kid ever.
I'm like, oh, come on, man, you're the kids right there.
But no, that that is the the younger sibling and the daddy daughter dynamic.

(01:20:28):
Like, yeah, no, that that is just there.
King of the Mountain played by Josh Jagorski or no, no, no, no.
King of the Mountain, Josh Jagorski played by Cyrus Arnold.
Right. Oh, man.
Just the inclusion of King of the Mountain.
I can't remember the last time I saw that.
I mean, I don't watch a lot of movies made for kids these days, but right.

(01:20:51):
That was a huge part of my childhood and that show in every movie.
The the number of just like and these are conversations I've had with my kids about the number of of just weirdly bizarre games that we came up with in the 80s because because, yeah, there was no Internet and we were constantly being kicked out of the house.
And so it's like, you know, and I know, like we didn't invent kick the can, but kick the can was a game.

(01:21:17):
King of the Hill was a game like these were things that we did because we literally had nothing else to do.
So we're like, I guess we'll just beat each other up for a couple hours and see what happens.
Pretty much. Yeah. Yeah.
That was the good times. Yeah. Oh, the first mention of the power glove.
And you got a bribe with gifts. Nobody knows.

(01:21:38):
No, I just told this person, this person, the coach of this person.
OK, yes. And then the coach is there trying to play the power glove to untraceable cash.
No, that was that that got me pretty good.
Again, another moment of just stellar directing to to add to the humor of everything.

(01:22:00):
The big thing about the directing on this scene that I really want to bring up is they have the older sister come out, put the stereo down, look back and go, this is stupid.
Like, no, grounded this all the way in reality.
Like this whole movie was all the way grounded in reality. For sure.
Yeah. And like little things like that made it amazing.

(01:22:22):
So he brings a summer sausage to try and bribe his way in, which it does come in handy.
Which I tell you is interesting because like at first it's like you got to bring him a gift and he's like summer sausage is the best I could do.
But it turns out it like that wasn't even the worst idea.
Everyone like went panicked and like grabbed garbage to bring this kid, try to pass off as a gift.

(01:22:46):
There was some there was some stuff there. Yeah.
I think people just went and grabbed like whatever present was under the tree and stuff like that. I don't know who is for.
It's for you. Right. The background music and the taekwondo.
It's like karate, but more expensive.
Oh, oh, get out of here.

(01:23:10):
This might that might be my favorite line of the movie.
It might be mine, too. I'm not sure, but it is pretty good.
Good God. Then then we found out the horror of our generation.
The power gloves sucked. Yeah. Yep.
Okay. There was only one moment in this movie that was not.

(01:23:33):
Oh, I guess the power glove was not the thing that it was supposed to be.
Both the both the excitement for it that it might be the greatest thing ever.
And the crushing blow of finding it finding out it's absolute garbage.
Yes. I went through that entire roller coaster in real time back then.
I'm glad that I was never able to afford the power glove because I never had to find that out.

(01:23:56):
That was it. That was a really good thing for me.
And then we get our John Wick moment.
But in reverse, the kid like karate kicks the TV and then oh, God.
Yeah. No, the sound Kelly made when she thought that dog died.
I am so mad that I missed that.

(01:24:18):
Oh, it was it was pretty funny.
And that whole bit afterwards with the daughter where the daughter is even like,
there's a dead dog in this story. And he's like, hey, the 80s were a complicated time.
Like, yeah, I thought you were all safe. It was complicated.
All the kids bolt and snowfall the next day.
The snow is falling and there's no snow day.

(01:24:40):
And I love the way the mom flips and she's like, come on, come on.
And then the name is good. She flips out.
She's like, told you not to get your hopes up.
Relatable. Yep. Oh, man. Super relatable.
In class with the snot rag teacher, which, yeah, Kelly and I, we both had one of those teachers.

(01:25:01):
Oh, sure. Yeah. Yep. Oh, disgusting.
Hated it. Teaching about the Dewey decibel system and how important it's going to be when they're adults.
It's like this like cursive will be important for the rest of your life.
Literally said that line. Fantastic line.
I'm pretty sure that I actually heard that line as a child as well.

(01:25:23):
They talk about how the pup survived and recessed with the girl boots.
And OK, the girl boots thing that was great having his daughter actually like, wait, what's the problem?
They were just boots. It's like, right. Yeah. Exactly.
What made them girls said they only fit girl feet. No, they were purple.

(01:25:44):
Yeah, no. Yeah, maybe maybe kids today and city kids today may not totally understand a lot of that country country kids.
They still get that. It's still like that.
Oh, at recess with Connor stumped, played by Jacob Laval.
And man, did that kid nail it. Another child actor grown in a lab.

(01:26:09):
I don't know who he's a clone of, but clearly he did not happen naturally.
He was too perfect for his role. Absolutely perfect.
Teddy comes in to try and save him.
But the big bully, Josh, finds out and he sees the boots and he's like, oh, I've been wanting to punch somebody and you're wearing purple boots.
I'm a punch you. It's like, OK, the bully logic. Yeah, it really didn't make sense.

(01:26:34):
No. Yeah. That's kind of one of those things.
It was never about anything you did. Yeah. No, just anything you did.
Yeah, exactly. That's what it was.
But then he gets saved by the flyer and watching the bully like just hug everybody, jump up and down all this.
And then we got it. I'm going to kill you. Yay.

(01:26:55):
That was outstanding inclusion. Yeah.
They got to sell wreaths for a first prize of a Nintendo, which, oh, God, now that I know.
Oh, oh, I'm angry after the fact now, even more.
The first house has a wreath and I love like that, like he comes up, he's like, there's a wreath on the door.

(01:27:16):
And as he shows the door, Ma, this kid thinks your wreath sucks.
I think that was probably more Chicago humor than it was 80s humor.
Well, that was William Pullen. So I'm guessing that might that might have something to do with that.
Little Jeff has the dude that little Jeff, Jeff Farmer, that little kid that like Salas or Mollus, whatever his name.

(01:27:41):
He came in, he had that sell that sales technique and he that is an adult in a little kid's body, man.
The way that he knows those lines.
I genuinely think they literally just told him to do Jack Black for the movie.
They were like, we want if we want a child, Jack Black for this role.
And the kid went, oh, I got you. Oh, he nailed it.

(01:28:03):
Yep. Shovel my car out and I'll buy a wreath. Oh, relatable.
I'm telling you, if you didn't grow up in a place where snow falls, I'm telling you right now, that is the most relatable thing.
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Like, well, especially somebody capable showed up at my front door.

(01:28:24):
Lucky me. Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, for me, it's add the fact that I had somewhat charitable parents that just sent me out with the shovel.
And we're like this person, this person, this person. They're old and they got no kids.
Go shovel their walk. And I'm like, but it's Saturday morning cartoons.
They're like, go close the door, lock it. I can't get in until those walks are shoveled.

(01:28:46):
Add that to. Yeah. No, that's just no. I mean, when you're a kid, when you're a kid, you're free labor. That's what you are.
Yeah, exactly. That is the thing. The mom loving the pathological liar. Yep. Oh, yeah. We've all been there. Yep.
Yep. No, you're like literally the worst one of your friend group. Yes. Your your mother will love them always.

(01:29:10):
I do not understand how that is guaranteed.
I mean, maybe not so much now, but at least for me growing up, it was called the Eddie Haskell effect because that was in a very, very old classic 60s TV show called Leave It to Beaver.
There was a character, a recurring character named Eddie Haskell. And that was his whole thing.
He was a literal actual piece of shit, except for when Beaver's parents showed up.

(01:29:33):
Then all of a sudden he was the most polite angel mankind had ever met. And so, yeah.
OK, so this is a very old thing. Oh, absolutely. Yeah.
I think I think this is one of those humanities constants. I can see that.
And the beginning of the recurring theme of he still hasn't picked up the poop and the look on his dad's face.

(01:29:58):
Here's the thing. I was I keyed in on Steve Zahn's character and he's like, come on, man, earn it. Earn it.
He just kept like his eyes just kept telling this kid, earn the thing that you are asking for.
And the kid just kept not doing it. And I was like, man, I'm really seeing this dad energy and really understanding it way better than I should.
Right. And he doesn't want to say it out loud. He doesn't want to say if you pick up the poop, I'll get you the Nintendo, because then that makes everything transactional.

(01:30:26):
You want the kid to have the mentality of doing good for good in return without the expectation of the return.
You know, just good dad stuff. Yeah. This is a fun one. If life was fair, it would be a fair.
And I don't see any carnival rides around here. And I get is like, you just made that up.

(01:30:48):
Like. No, I didn't. Oh, great. So great. And I like this another one. That's a lot of poop.
Well, you wanted the dog. So you have to clean up after it's like you got the dog before I was born.
But who wanted the dog is irrelevant. The dad, the just so much dad stuff in this and the way that it was done was just.

(01:31:14):
Perfect. Absolutely perfect. Oh, and I put that here. It's like more chores and it's really clear what the dad is doing.
And I'm just all the way with him. Like like Steve Zahn's character. I loved it.
Like you get one F bomb in this movie and the rest of the time, like he's really trying to like not curse.
And I just that inclusion was incredibly intelligent. Yeah, I thought that was great.

(01:31:41):
Manipulative sister wants a cabbage patch kid.
And then she comes in with like, no, this is a very manipulative little sister.
She knows how to manipulate people. She's got the goods. She's got the brains.
Who's a good character? And the little kid going to the nursing home and hi, everyone.
And the all the excited old zombies going towards them.

(01:32:08):
I don't I didn't know if I should have been like offended on behalf of the retirement community on that or not, the way they portrayed.
But at the same time, it's not like it was a secret how badly they were drugged up back then on a regular basis.
So, you know, I guess it's not really. No, they they were going for maximum convenience, not actual care.

(01:32:30):
Like, yeah, it was a dark time and like that he's picking up trying to hold up his end of the deal and get the cabbage patch for his sister.
And they're like. Does he want a cabbage patch kid now?
Like that was I was really hoping that the movie might go down that road down that route.
But he like they cleared it up really easy. She's like, what's going on?

(01:32:53):
He's like, oh, Lizzie really wants one of my hey movies aren't allowed to solve problems that easy.
Come on. No, no, no, no, no. Where's all of our conflict and problems and misunderstandings?
Come on. No, you literally you just characters characters are not supposed to communicate clearly with each other.
Where are we going to get our drama? Come on, man.

(01:33:14):
No, you just horror movie The Girl Called the Cops right away at the beginning.
Come on. Still like still the thunder right out from under me.
But it's not I think they maybe they thought about going that route, but then realized we've already got too much movie here.
Let's just go ahead and cut this. I could see that the dad going about the grown men acting that cheery.

(01:33:36):
It's just not natural. Yeah, I was on the dad's side on that one personally.
Like I think anybody acting that cheery is pretty unnatural, like just is what that is.
Empty shelves and the PTSD janitor.
Dude, that janitor man like that was a good one.

(01:33:58):
That was a really good one. Just you know that.
I mean, yeah, it was like it was something out of a horror movie.
He's just sitting there just like mopping and being like it was a crazy scene.
Stop mother punch a grandmother right in the throat. Same family, too.
It was great. So good.
Nintendo steals the good brother part of Big Brother.

(01:34:21):
I have all the games. Pick another one. Pick another one.
Dude, so relatable. I could not.
The flashbacks of my mind actually going places like we have all the games in every single game you want to play ain't there.
I don't know. I don't know if they have displays like that that do the same thing these days.

(01:34:43):
I just don't know. I don't go to those places as much.
But that was a huge thing in the 80s and 90s. And oh, it was constantly frustrating.
On a streak that retainer drop. There's no retainer needed for the Nintendo Master.
No, of course not. No, no.
And then he's like, nothing could snap me out of it. Then he gets his full name.

(01:35:08):
It's like, yeah, that'll snap you out of anything.
Yeah. Middle name and everything. And where is your sister?
Which I didn't have siblings growing up. My my oldest brother is 13 years younger than me.
So I didn't go through any of that like older brother stuff.
But I know enough about siblinghood to know where is your sister is probably the most shocking thing anyone can hear them say.

(01:35:39):
I had siblings. Yeah.
Even as someone who hasn't had to live with that, like I understood just how horrible that that moment was supposed to be.
Oh, yeah. No, my sister, two years, just two years difference.
But no, the responsibility. We were completely responsible for each other because the fact that I'm a boy two years younger,

(01:36:03):
it did like age barely matter because they're like, well, yeah, you're a boy.
You're supposed to take care of your sister. And I'm like, but she's babysitting me.
Right. Like, no, like the fun of growing up in that era.
Sure. Yeah. Lizzie interrogating Santa. Fantastic scene.
And the way that he was the way the Santa responded was great as well. Right.

(01:36:25):
Angry dad and the missing retainer eyes to that that moment like.
It's like that's your like that's your sister. It's not like losing your retainer beat beat.
Open your mouth. Yeah. Oh, the dread everything that was was too good.

(01:36:47):
Again, like and then, you know, and I've said this before, there was no need for this scene to be in the movie,
but the movie would not have been the same without it. That whole retainer bit.
Yeah. The chase scene and everything. And then the nasty retainer, he puts it in his mouth and smiles at his dad.
And his dad's just like, yeah, OK.

(01:37:10):
Like he didn't just chase him through the entire mall, but no, that was.
I was I had fun with this one.
The weird kid. How many reads have you sold? Oh, ninety three. What about you?
What's a wreath? Dude, this kid nailed it.
Doesn't make sense, but doesn't need to.

(01:37:32):
All you need to understand is that this is the weird kid of the class.
The dad trying to bond and then the kind of got a lot going on, dad.
Dude. You just hit you suck.
Like, oh, my God. And he's like, I don't negotiate with terror.
Like talking about the well, how come? How come Lizzie gets what she wants?

(01:37:58):
I don't know. Literally, yes.
And she's literally there literally in this scene, they're waiting under a bridge to buy a black market
cabbage patch doll for the little sister.
And the brother's like, you're going above and beyond to get my sister her Christmas present
while telling me to my face that I will never get the thing that I want.

(01:38:20):
Like, what the hell? And dad's like, so do you want to deal with your sister if she doesn't get what she wants?
And he literally says, I don't negotiate with terrorists.
And he goes, you mean by giving her whatever she wants? He's like, yeah, exactly.
A completely, completely different interpretation of never negotiate with terrorists.
Oh, yeah. And you know what? Fair enough.

(01:38:45):
When your daughter. David Cross selling black market cabbage patch kids.
And I thought the daughter was going to lose her mind because it was the wrong doll.
Like, because it was either red hair with freckles or like it was either red because she wanted the one with red hair and freckles.
But there was either blonde with freckles or red hair and no freckles.

(01:39:06):
I thought that was going to be a problem. The movie just didn't care.
No. Yeah, I was kind of like that was kind of unexpected.
Which I think it grounds in like we were talking about before the reality of this.
Like as much of a fantastical comedy movie this is, this is clearly based on a lot of whoever the writer or directors actual growing up is.

(01:39:30):
And it turns out that not everything has to be a point of drama.
You know, like, yeah, you know, there's a lot going on in this movie.
But, yeah, they didn't have to have a misunderstanding where the parents buy the son, the cabbage patch doll.
And they didn't have to have the sister be such a piece of shit that she's going to lose her that she's going to lose her mind because the toy that she asked for isn't perfect.

(01:39:55):
Right. And then we cut to Scoutmaster Halberg played by David McClinnis and the prize giveaways.
Oh, this whole scene hurt, man.
So Jeff, our, you know, our guest for the future master actor, he gets a subscription to Boy's Life.
The Hodges twins get a globe and it goes right in the trash.

(01:40:20):
I know that was great. Yeah.
They're like, it's a globe of the whole world.
And right in the garbage can that's sitting right there next to them, like doesn't even walk to his seat with it.
Just toss the garbage, tossing the whole world in the trash. Exactly.
Jake Doyle wins.
And dude, what?
He won more school.

(01:40:42):
That. Oh my God.
I hated life for that kid in that moment.
Just thinking you're going to win a Nintendo.
The thing that you want, the only thing that you want, the thing you've been thinking about.
And instead they flip the script and give you a set of encyclopedias instead.
Right. Which must be real, probably more expensive than a Nintendo.

(01:41:06):
Probably. For sure. Yes.
In fact, yes, I do know for a fact that that yes, a full encyclopedia stack at that time was probably about three times the cost of a Nintendo.
Which is nuts. Yeah.
And Tom, but so it went down.
Tom Rooney as Timmy Keene, senior, had a PowerPoint presentation, old school PowerPoint presentation.

(01:41:31):
The rich, the rich, the rich kid's dad is now on a tear against video game violence because of what happened at his house with the dog getting smushed by the TV.
Because his poor sweet boy couldn't be near. Right. Yeah.
It's not his son's fault at all.
It's the video games. The video games made him violent. Yes.

(01:41:52):
Yeah, gave him attention deficit.
Whatever, whatever. Something or whatever. Yeah.
A very new, very rare condition.
Yeah, apparently.
But they're like, yeah, no, our boy couldn't be. He was amazing.
Like, you gave him to you know, you can't give Timmy cheese. Right.

(01:42:13):
Like, it's like, OK, no, this kid's a nightmare. You know it. Come on.
Shut up. And Timmy, Timmy senior is now anti game protester.
And it goes all the way. So they like, no, the Nintendo is dangerous.
Three minutes on this and it ruins your children's lives.
And so they switch out and the entire town now is on a ban against Nintendo.

(01:42:40):
Which video games. Yeah. Including Nintendo.
Yes. And which is what this movie doesn't even bother mentioning Sega or or or in television because fuck them.
Wow. I mean, they weren't the big Sega Sega was.
No, no, I guess Sega was not yet. But there was the Intellivision and I think the Coleco is another one that was out.

(01:43:02):
Yeah. Yeah. So there were a couple others out there, but they they never caught on the way Nintendo did.
Well, they didn't say Nintendo in their protest.
That was a game over. Right. Yes.
Like it was it was just games. And Lizzie being a kind sister with a remote was really surprising.
And Annie's like, she gave him the she gave you the remote. Wow.

(01:43:28):
You must have really been going through it. Right.
Like very sweet moment. Very, very sweet moment on both his sister and his daughter. Yeah. That was nice.
And then a thing that has happened to me a few times already in talking to my niece and nephew.
Annie wants to know what happened in the story. And he's like, well, we went to the roller rink. What's a roller rink? Oh.

(01:43:58):
That makes me really sad that my niece and nephew have no experience at a roller rink. Yeah.
I loved that as a kid. Like that was it. That was a huge thing for me and my buddy. Swear we're all right. Right.
So the twin birthdays that are also close to Christmas, man, man, man, that would suck.

(01:44:20):
Like they get stuff they have to share and they have to share their birthday with the holiday.
Oh, man. Yeah. I don't have anything like that, but I feel bad for anybody who does.
Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, that's the thing I kind of like. For me, it's never happened to me.
It's never happened to me personally, but I have friends. But no, I mean, literally in my family, my mom, my daughter and my brother are all December birthdays.

(01:44:45):
And so it's been drilled into me since birth that these things are separate. You do not give one gift for both holidays.
You will be giving them two gifts on pain of death. Good. Yeah. Good. That's nice.
That's nice. They discover there's a swear word on the are OK.

(01:45:09):
So how does that go? It's a swear word on a baseball bat on a card and they call it a misprint.
But I mean, I'm pretty sure that's not what a misprint is.
But it's classified as a misprint because as soon as people realized what he had on his bat,
they discontinued it really quickly and put out another one and classified the old one as a misprint that wasn't supposed to go out.

(01:45:31):
And apparently it was like maybe like maybe a hundred of these cards actually got out into the public before they managed to stop the shipment.
And so that makes it extra rare. We're selling that for a hundred bucks. Yeah.
I would have been able to buy a house with that at some point.
Fifteen point plan to get a Nintendo. I think I like that.

(01:45:54):
It was it was great for them to toss it in there. I don't think that means what you think that means.
Fantastic. It's referencing an 80s movie. You got to do it. Right.
And then no, I don't know what it means. But who's with me? Just the confidence.
That's all you need, man. You just need the confidence and they'll roll with you.

(01:46:16):
Selling the card and building cash. The heist misdirect.
I thought they were going to steal the Nintendo when they all got together and like we're putting a plan. I thought it was going to be a heist.
I was wrong. Jakorski hones in and steals the binder.
And then, oh, man, the no boots, no field trip. It was a great way to pay off that setup from earlier because they really didn't need to at any point.

(01:46:43):
But they paid off twice. And I thought that was I thought that was really, really clever.
The weird kid. You want to hear about my aunt farm? All the aunts died, but the uncle survived.
Dude, that joke was so in my face, it took me like five minutes to get it.

(01:47:04):
I was like, oh, this kid is so weird. Wait a minute. No, that's a brilliant joke. What the hell?
Yeah, no, that got that got me. And it is upon us.
What about the money and the weird kid? Why don't you tell me your favorite letters of the alphabet?
This kid was so perfect. I'll tell you mine in order and then just starts naming off letters of the alphabet out of order and you just like, which who the hell's favorite letter is T?

(01:47:38):
I'm just putting that out there. That just makes him even weirder.
Favorite letters supposed to be like you, W, you know, one of the ones that's fun to say. Right.
He or or not used very often. Yeah, no, like they really like they really knew how to make this kid weird.
Even in his weirdness, it was great. It was fantastic writing.

(01:48:03):
Bully the bully. I loved my mom and she got me these boots.
I loved that man. That was great.
And also Cyrus Arnold, he did a great job as the bully and as the chicken.
Yeah. Oh, no, that he's doing pretty good with his career.
He's one of the he's one of those actors that, you know, he basically it's cast on his look.

(01:48:29):
He's got a very peculiar look, and so he tends to get cast in very peculiar roles, but he does nail it every time.
Whatever they put him in. And so he's kind of one of those unsung heroes of character actors, you know,
and he's kind of he's got he's shot up in height.
He's thinned out. He's like I'm a little bit curious how they're going to use him in Hollywood moving forward.

(01:48:52):
But I'm definitely interested because he is entertaining as hell. Oh, for sure.
But got to run and buy the Nintendo before Olsen runs out of puke because that's their plan.
The kid who's allergic to SpaghettiOs has to eat a bunch of SpaghettiOs and oh, yeah.
Yep. Oh, they did a good job of the bus by vomiting his his little guts out.

(01:49:14):
The poor kid. Yeah, they did a good job of portraying that.
I have to admit that. And then Jeff to the lying rescue.
Hello, ma'am. I'm from the nieces and nephews collective of Canada.
That's like it's work in there going like, oh, this is sweet.
Why I don't understand all this. Like she bought it. Someone believed me.

(01:49:36):
I can hear you. Fantastic. Absolutely fantastic.
Oh, almost makes it. But the Nintendo gets crushed and then exploded.
Right. I know that was great. Like just the added the added loony toons initiative of it.
He slips. It goes in the road.

(01:49:59):
It gets run over and then dramatically explodes like it's an action film.
Like perfect. Absolutely. This is exactly the kind of thing a middle aged dad would kind of, you know, add to the story when telling to his 10 year old kid just like and then it blew up. It was crazy.
Oh, that's a good point. I never even crossed into that, but that might just be his exaggeration on that.

(01:50:23):
That is the story being told. Good. That's exactly. I didn't think of that at all.
It's like the David Cross pops in and this this is what I think he was Santa. Totally.
Yeah, like I think I think we have crossed into the era that Santa is no longer a fat guy.
You got Kurt Russell as buff. He's a guy.

(01:50:47):
J.K. Rowling or not. J.K. Rowling, J.K. Simmons, J.K. Simmons. Yep. As buff Santa.
Now you got David Cross as like secret sketchy Santa. Right.
I think we exit. Yeah. Black Market Santa. I think we've exited the era of chubby Santa.
Totally. Yeah. Like I'm on board with that. Yeah. I like that.

(01:51:09):
I like that he's a fat guy. I like that. I like the jolly nature of the man.
It's just but it's it's what I'm used to. Sure. Yeah.
Well, and it's understandable. My my like my grandpa was the mall Santa for like 20 years.
And that was something that I was always crazy proud of.
I loved like when I found out that I was going asking my grandpa for gifts, like because he was Santa.

(01:51:34):
And that's how I was actually getting everything that I actually asked for.
Wow. That's some mafia shit right there. I thought that I thought it was really cool.
And then as I got older and when I was a teenager in my early 20s, all this,
I would go to the mall and I would see everybody getting in line to go like see my grandpa Santa.
That was just a wild point of pride for me to see in my grandpa like that.

(01:51:57):
And he was a big fat man. And he would grow like I mean, obviously our family grows a beard.
Sure. Yeah. He would grow a beard. He would like before he got old enough that it would be white.
He would dye it white every year.
So when kids would tug on his beard, it would actually be there. Nice. Nice.
No, that was there was something real special about that.

(01:52:19):
And I mall Santa's I got a lot of love for him. Sure. Oh, yeah.
And shit on. But yeah, that is that is a that is a thankless job mall Santa for sure.
I've I've never done it, but I've worked enough mall jobs to have witnessed it take place and have like
I'm sitting there at a at a key at a calendar kiosk, you know, a line 50 people deep,

(01:52:44):
all of them in a hurry and pissed off and trying to pay with a check.
And and I'm looking at the mall Santa guy going, well, I'm glad I'm not him.
Like, dude, right. I like that.
So David Cross is talking about story like when I was a kid, I wanted a donkey or a donkey.
So bad. Like in the Christmas morning came and guess what?
You got a donkey? No. Who gets a donkey?

(01:53:07):
I did love to. He's like he's like, yeah, can you he's like when I was a kid, I wanted a donkey for Christmas.
Can you believe that? And he's all like, well, that would be a pretty weird thing to make up.
So, yeah, I guess I believe you.
No, that was good. But I like that.
Like, you know, the character comes in, pays for a taxi, tells them, you know, get in on the side of the door,

(01:53:30):
tell them you got lost. All this like really kind of sets the kid up for success.
He brings in a hardcore dose of Christmas spirit is what he does.
He's like when was he's like, have you even told anyone Merry Christmas this year?
You know, and and yeah, gets him a cab, you know, gets him the plan to sneak back into his field trip
and then goes in like I need you to do me a favor, you know, do me a favor, kid. Have a Merry Christmas.

(01:53:54):
And it's like, yeah, no, absolutely. 100 percent.
He is the Santa Claus of the story. That's what I was thinking. You nailed it.
Yeah. But I like what he said is like, like, are you sure?
Like, I don't like how can I pay back? He's like, I fleeced your dad for that patch.
I like that line. That was a good one.
Christmas morning, the camcorder, that moment where his sister says, I love you.

(01:54:19):
Like, ah, there's your Christmas movie like right there, like all the feel good all in one good, good scene.
Uncle Dan from Japan sent a gift and it's like, oh, my God, like it's the home of Nintendo.
It has to be one opens it up. And it was a Japanese light bright.

(01:54:40):
And the all the way that that sets in on him like and I'll be drawing pictures of a Nintendo when I'm 80 years old on my Japanese light bright.
Right. Yeah. Kelly and I both thought that there might be a Nintendo in that box.
That's what that's what we thought the story was going like as many misdirects as this movie has.
You still fall for every single one of them every time every single time.

(01:55:03):
You're just like the daughter in the story. You're going like, oh, he gets it this time.
No. Why the fuck are you telling me this story?
The movie did a really good job on that. The Hodges twins got a bike chair,
which, by the way, when you live in a place that is just hardcore winter and you get a bike for Christmas, it's like you're thankful.

(01:55:27):
But at the same time, great. Can't wait for five months from now.
Right. Exactly. Yeah. No, it's one of those.
Kind of gifts that it's like, oh, you suck. Thank you.
Go pick up the poop. And Steve Zahn's dad face is perfect. Perfect.
And they just full stop. Perfect.

(01:55:51):
And then you find out like the whole movie, he sounds like you don't need to go behind the shed.
You don't need to go. Like, don't worry about that back there.
And the kid like a kid is like, oh, I don't have to. Great.
Never does. And if you one time, just one time would have gone back there to like do it, he would have seen his dad had been building him a tree for it the whole year.

(01:56:15):
Everything that he'd been working on, even the gift that he got from his wife, the sander, which fantastic inclusion to have the mom sitting on the couch with the kids while the dad sanding just the nearest piece of wood.
And she's like, honey, do you have to do that right now? And he's like, but you gave this to me.
Like, I know. You got it for me. It was a gift. Like, oh, this movie was great.

(01:56:42):
Then, like the daughter finds out, like, well, what about the Nintendo is like, I had to work for that spent all next summer doing that all this and.
Yeah, the tree for it got me teary eyed when the daughter said that the real thing about that story, what made that story special was that was the year I'm already getting goosebumps.

(01:57:06):
That was the year that you and grandpa found your thing. Yeah, that.
And then they we we look around the house and we see all the little pieces of woodwork that have both his and his dad's initials carved into him. And yeah, it was like out of left fucking field.
Now, and now you start crying like, yeah, no.

(01:57:30):
So, yeah, OK, I'm with you. I'm crying. You have my tears. You won. And then what sent it even further down the hole, he was a magician. He was a hero.
He was my dad. Dude. Oh, this movie, like it absolutely crushed me.
Like it it was good. It was fun. It was entertaining the whole way through. And then it stuck the landing so hard.

(01:57:56):
Oh, yeah. Plus the bonus, you find out that because like him and that one girl were wearing the same boots, they wound up falling in love and getting married.
And we never even talked about it. No. Yeah, like we get we get that as another like surprise drop at the end when the daughter is retelling the story to mom and mom turns and goes, you left out the part where we had matching boots.

(01:58:23):
And he's and he's like, no, no, I told her that part. I told her that part. No, that was I.
Well, all right. Yeah, no. Why did it?
Why? So final thoughts? Why did you bring? Why did you want to bring this one on the channel?
Well, I mean, I kind of said it at the beginning is that after I saw this, like I immediately connected to it.
I really feel like this is going to be the new generation's Christmas story.

(01:58:46):
I think this is going to be the classic that lives on for decades that, you know, you know, our kids and grandkids, should we choose to have them, we'll be watching this every year and being like, man, it was crazy back then.
And we'll just be sitting there old and decrepit.
You know, we're going to, you know, take, you know, taking our teeth in and out for eating and going like, oh, yeah, those were the days.

(01:59:12):
Back then, you know, kids had to spend money on video games.
We didn't just get them streaming in a service like you do now.
It is pretty it should be. It is set up to be an instant classic.
It really is. Yeah. And it just needs to be seen more.
That's it. And even to compare it to to the Christmas story, I think it sticks the landing better than Christmas story does because you like, I don't remember.

(01:59:38):
Well, it's because it's a Christmas story mixed with.
Yeah. Well, I mean, but coming up with when I say like, like the like that ending where it was, you know, this was the Christmas that you and dad found your thing and the family, you know, mourning the fact that that has passed away since then.
And they're spending a Christmas without him and that and, you know, and all that.

(02:00:01):
They didn't have any of that closure in the original Christmas story in the original Christmas story. And I don't even remember how it ended.
But I know that's why I was saying mixed like it's mixed with like Prince like the Princess Bride.
Oh, OK. Yeah, I guess it's a little bit of that, too. You're right. Yeah. No, like they got they got the best elements from a couple of different classics, putting together and stuck the landing.

(02:00:23):
They really did. Yeah. No, this movie is a fantastic work of art. I'm going to call this a must see for years to come. If I'm going to call this a must see Christmas story for sure.
Yes, it is the mod. It is the it is the one for.
Your generation positively.

(02:00:45):
Bleeds into the older the older millennials a little bit, but we were the Super Nintendo generation. Right. Yeah.
So a lot of it is there because I mean, realistically, 80s and 90s, there was not a lot of difference.
Not a lot. Yeah. No, there I last I heard there is not even a really clear divide between Gen X and millennials because we are all mixed in there so much.

(02:01:08):
Yeah, it's really it's really the the introduction over the popularity and the convenience of cell phones like when everybody had them.
That's kind of when the generation like it.
So it's just like the age demographic doesn't work anymore. Like in those generation aspects.
All right. Final thoughts on 8 bit Christmas and a Muppet Christmas Carol.

(02:01:31):
I mean, yeah, no, I we're going to it's going to be really hard to come up with, you know, anything to talk about next year because those basically are the two Christmas movies.
Well, as true as that is, is 8 bit Christmas your favorite Christmas movie at the moment?
It is. Yes, it is.

(02:01:53):
Well, like I said, it was like when I saw for the first time, it grabbed me instantly. I have not stopped thinking about it.
So we did our first Christmas with just our favorites.
There are plenty of really good Christmas movies like I mean, come on, man.
Miracle on 34th Street. Okay. Yeah. Okay. I see your point there.
All right. Is that 30 seconds? No, no, it's 34th. You're right.

(02:02:17):
Okay. Yeah. Miracle on 34th Street. That's a good one. How the Grinch stole Christmas. Classic.
And the Ron Howard, how the Grinch stole Christmas is really good.
Yeah. Didn't care for it. Oh, I mean, I guess that's just me. But yeah, I didn't I didn't really care for it.
We'll have to get into that next year, maybe. Okay. All right. Any final any but yeah. Any final thoughts?

(02:02:40):
No, I guess just yeah. Merry Christmas yesterday, everyone.
Fair enough. All right. We will be back on next Thursday and we might be doing a little bit of a shift for next week's episode because we just got back from or well not just in between the last time we were live and now we went to L.A.

(02:03:06):
And we covered the premiere of a new horror flick, Tony Todd's last leading role.
And we got to cover that do some interviews. So maybe next week we'll be doing the podcast over doing our coverage.
That's not a bad idea. Yeah. Yeah.
Figure something out. I know. I know. I know. We've still been trying to figure out because, yeah, our show format doesn't exactly lend to the whole, you know, interviews slash red carpet thing that we were doing there.

(02:03:37):
So where we're going to where we were going to fit this in, I know, was a mystery to me. But I probably get probably just as a bonus episode on the podcast.
But I figure something for YouTube. Yeah. All right. We'll see you guys next Thursday at 7 p.m. Mountain Time from now until then.
Stay safe and stay sane.
Adios, friends.