H.Y.S.T? | S2E3 | The Wrong Guy & Stir of Echoes - H.Y.S.T?

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome to Heist. I'm Bradly Hackworth joined by Jonathan Ems, otherwise known as Doc.

(00:06):
Hello fellow humans.
And today we are going to be covering The Wrong Guy and, wonderfully enough, The Stir of Echoes.
The reason that I'm saying wonderfully enough is not because it is the top tier film of all time or anything like that.
It's just because it's really fun to cover horror movies with Doc.
You know what, here's the thing, I'm not 100% sure I would call this a horror movie.

(00:29):
I was gonna say the same thing, but let's save that for the second part and let's jump in on The Wrong Guy.
Written by, this is a really, really fun movie. Oh my god, this was a fun movie.
The writers room for this, this is like Deadpool before Deadpool.
It was so much fun.

(00:51):
But The Wrong Guy, written by Dave Foley, David Anthony Higgins, and Jay Cogan, directed by David Steinberg,
and starring Dave Foley, David Anthony Higgins, Jennifer Tilly, and Combe Fiore, with Joe Flaherty, Dan Redican, Alan Scarfe, and Kenneth Walsh.

(01:13):
Doc, why don't you give us the synopsis going into it.
Well, I mean, the really quick and dirty of if you know who the Kids in the Hall sketch comedy group are,
this is essentially one really, really long kids in the hall bit that somehow does not get old after five minutes.
In fact, it stays pretty damn hilarious for the entire 90 minute run of this movie.

(01:38):
It's about a corporate vice president dude who doesn't get his promotion, openly threatens to kill his boss over not getting the promotion,
and then barges into his boss's office to find a body there. His boss has been killed.
He panics, he goes on the run, absolutely no one is chasing him. They know he didn't do it.

(02:02):
They have video footage of the actual murderer doing the actual murder. He's on the run for nothing.
That's the movie, and it's goddamn hilarious.
And a lot, a lot, a lot of Alfred Hitchcock references, a lot of tosses to North by Northwest, and The Man Who Knew Too Much, that kind of stuff.

(02:23):
It's not quite a Hitchcock satire, but there's a lot of nods to the Hitchcock style of suspense adventure in this, and it's just a wildly fun movie.
And while we're covering it, go ahead, call those out, because I'm pretty sure I missed a great deal of them.
I mean, the biggest one that comes to mind is at the very end, with the miniature golf Statue of Liberty head. That's a direct parody from North by Northwest.

(02:55):
Okay, fair, that is fair.
The opening titles with this one are outstandingly fun with horror thriller elements, and Foley rolls in with the amazing, entitled optimism, and the fact that nobody knows who he was, it never got old.
Yeah.

(03:16):
But when he gets into that boardroom and right off the bat, loses the promotion and man his reaction, what? I'm sorry. What?
And it's not even just kind of like a weird reaction. It is a... because in the middle of everyone congratulating the guy who got the promotion, he's still sitting there going, what? What did you say? I think I misheard you.

(03:47):
Which is, how he played that off was truly hilarious. I absolutely give it that.
But then the way that he freaks out about it and he's like, I dated the wrong daughter?
Right, exactly. Yes. Oh my god. He's like, my god, my god man.
The corporate parody was perfect.
My god man, I am engaged to marry your daughter. Yes, but he's married. He's engaged to marry my favorite daughter.

(04:17):
Like, god damn.
Yeah, that one.
And that hurt. And the assistant letting everybody listen to him cry because he's got like his... and the way that he was crying.
Right, yes.
I forgot how hilarious Dave Foley is.
Oh, truly, yes.
Which I forgot, I didn't really take a look, but he kind of just pops in as side characters and things now.

(04:42):
He had a stint, in fact, I mentioned this before, the TV show News Radio. He was the star of that for three seasons.
Basically, he finished off Kids in the Hall. I think he basically did this movie and a couple other side characters.
And then he did News Radio for three seasons. And now he seems to be kind of semi-retired. He'll pop up every once in a while.

(05:08):
That's kind of what it seems like.
And he's the voice of the main character in Bugs Life, so that's probably one of his biggest credits since Kids in the Hall.
He was one of the main characters in A Blast from the Past with Brendan Fraser and Alicia Asimovich.
Right, I remember that, yeah.
That was a good one for him.
I love that when he goes up and he's like, I want to see Nagel. Now. You have to wait. Okay.

(05:32):
Goes into sound and he's like, I've already read all these, I'm not waiting.
That just added like 30 seconds of hilarity into the runtime.
Yeah, this was one of those movies where it's like, yeah, like you said, it's very Deadpool-ish in which they kind of clearly they brainstormed.

(05:54):
Like, what can we do here? There were no bad ideas. And even if something shouldn't have worked, Foley made it work.
Yes. Yes, that is the thing. Like the people who were in this, the people who played the major parts of this, they nailed everything.
Yeah. Hands down. I really appreciated that.

(06:18):
Finds the dead, or this is what Foley finds the dead body, freaks out, like the knife out, puts tries to put the knife back in like and the whole time he is screaming hilariously.
I don't know. I don't know if there is like, you know, I assume the internet being what it is.
Somewhere out there is a list of things of appropriate things to do. Should you happen to be unlucky enough to find a dead body?

(06:43):
He does every single one of those things wrong. Yeah. Yeah. You find a dead body. The thing to do, like the internet says something, if it says anything other than back up.
Right. Back away and call the police. Three numbers. Yeah.
He doesn't do that. He stands in place. He screams. He runs to the body and pulls the murder weapon out of the body and holds it in his hand and then screams and then tries to put it back in the body.

(07:08):
Like, I think that's kind of the inside joke. I think that's been ripped off a few times.
You think? I don't remember seeing it. I don't know if it's first here, but yeah, I've seen that in a few different places.
Okay. All right. But yeah, I think that's kind of like the inside joke on this is the movie is called The Wrong Guy to suggest that he's not the killer that they're looking for.

(07:29):
And I think in truth, it's about the fact that he does everything wrong. Like, that's the main joke of this movie is that of all the possible things he could do in every scenario, he picks the absolute wrong thing.
I do think it's really weird. The cover of this movie. It has five guys like the usual type thing. Yeah. Yeah. And that none of those guys in the poster.

(07:55):
Yeah. None of it. None of the other people. There's Dave Foley and four other guys in a lineup. Those four other guys are not in the movie at all. Yeah.
I yeah, I'm looking at it right now going, who are these guys? Yeah. Don't even they don't even they don't even have calm fury in there. And he is the actual killer.
So yeah, which I do not remember this movie. I do not remember the marketing for this movie. I don't I don't remember opting out of seeing this movie. I just don't remember this at all.

(08:23):
That's the thing. I incorrectly thought that this movie came out in like 2001 2002 because that's when I saw it for the first time when I found it in the video store.
It actually came out in 97. So this movie had been around for half a decade before I even noticed it sitting on a on a video store shelf. So yeah, I'm right there with you.

(08:44):
And I'll go and I'll give it it's I'll give it its praise. I will say that it was ahead of its time. Yeah.
I love that like Foley goes into the elevator runs away is covered in blood. Nobody cares.
Not even a little bit like you dropped your knife, sir. Right. That's not mine. Like what is covered in the same blood that you're covered.

(09:05):
Like the mean the level of oh my God, that was killing me. How like how much the assassin and Foley kept running into each other.
That was one of the best gay running gags that I've seen in a long time. Very Hitchcockian as well.
I think that that happened a lot and man who knew too much, I think was also one of those things. See you're saying Hitchcock.

(09:29):
But for me, that felt way Woody Allen. If Woody Allen would have directed this, if I would have found that out, I would have been like, oh, yep.
You see what I'm saying, though, right? Yeah, no, I absolutely do. You're right. Yeah.
The fake Sue. I got to say this. I don't see that. I've never seen this in a movie, but that fake sewer got me.

(09:57):
100% completely fooled me. I was like, oh, no, that would work on me in real life.
What I think is great about the the assassin character, the fact of like how much of his like professional assassin expertise is all about like the James Bond gadgetry and subterfuge.
How did he kill the guy? He stuck a knife in his neck. That was it. The killing part was not at all a big deal for him.

(10:23):
The big deal was the escape route that involved like all the props and gadgets and like three costume changes.
Like that was what made this guy the expert assassin that he is, is that he is the theater kid to end all theater kids, basically.
I'll give you that. The. Oh, my God. When Foley threw throws that knife off the bridge and it lands on the police boat.

(10:49):
Good God. I, I like after a few seconds of watching this movie, I should have been prepared for everything that was coming.
But every single thing that happened, I was like, what? Every single time it worked 100%.
It was this was a this was a oh, man, this was a good movie.
But they have the video evidence that Foley is innocent. And why?

(11:15):
Why do they have the video audience the way they keep watching it and just laughing at Foley?
The news coverage keeps like they bring it up. The newspapers laughing it off.
You got like the guy who's basically kind of ripping off unsolved mysteries just watching the video and you're not going to believe this guy.

(11:36):
I was having so much fun with this. Oh, my God. OK.
The kind of gags that I'm talking about showing up in this movie, Dave Foley on the run kind of jumps into a dumpster to hide.
And you get a group of cops that show up, they start playing games in the alley, and then they have like a cop barbershop quartet that they which in the dumpster singing.

(12:00):
Yeah, that it and you got you got to admit that song they were singing is a banger like that.
Well, I enjoyed the hell out of that. I like barbershop quartets, though. I mean, that was like still a more common thing.
I know it's still a thing. I wish it was a more common like that guy who hired the barbershop quartet to go and help him quit his job.

(12:21):
Oh, I heard about that. Yeah, yeah, that's that is here.
Like if they're if they do not exist for any other reason than to do that, that is an industry I will donate to as if it were charity.
I can I can give you the name of a of an acapella quartet band that you might enjoy.
Yeah, send that over that I'm about to have a 12 hour drive so I could use some things to to goof around to

(12:51):
the assassin changing to plan B over the phone call and talking a little bit about Foley's like who is this guy?
Right. Yeah. The CEO is like, well, it's not him.
But who is he's like, no, no, I just want you to say that it's not him.
Right. Yeah. It's just a minute. It's just a minute. It's not him. It's not him.
Yeah, important. It's important to me that you admit that I'm right.

(13:13):
Very corporate behavior. But honestly, I don't think I've ever seen something like that ever happen.
We're like because you have like a lot of examples and was like, it's this guy.
It's like, I don't think it's that guy. You must be looking at somebody like right.
Yeah. Having to be like, no, no, no. I need you to tell me I need you to admit to me that how different that was really worked for me.

(13:38):
I like that we never got to meet Constance. I thought that was the the CEO's daughter.
I like I never got to meet her because we never had to sympathize with her. So I thought that was a call. Yep. Yeah.
But he calls her ditches his identification and then heads to a fancy restaurant covered in blood. Yeah.
But this is where I got to start talking about the detectives, which I think you should be the first one to talk about the detect the detectives, man.

(14:05):
OK, so this guy's got it wired. This is another one of the new kids, right?
No, I know I was I've seen him before and other things, but I can't remember what he's definitely he's definitely an established comedy actor.
I just can never remember what I've seen him in before for some reason.
But but yeah, so these these homicide day Anthony Higgins, he is one of the writers of the film.

(14:31):
OK, so he's OK. So he was on the writing staff. So OK, yeah.
But yeah, these homicide cops are.
Well, we have to we've got the grizzled old cop that, you know, the usual standard of you've got the you got the old veteran and then you've got the young guy.
And the young guy is very much like, all right, let's do this. We're going to catch this guy in the in the grizzled old guys like a slow your roll young.

(14:55):
But they take this a step further.
Where this this veteran detective literally has no intention of trying.
He's like, no, this is too hard. I don't want to do this.
But his main motivation is that he does, in fact, have an expense account.
So he's going to use that expense account to its fullest.
So when he hears that a man covered in blood showed up to a fancy restaurant, you know, just a couple just a short distance away from the murder scene, he's like, oh, make reservations and see.

(15:26):
And we'll talk to the complete talk to the staff.
Yeah, we'll talk to the staff, see if anybody saw anything.
But while we're there, what let's you see, he says, have him have him order whatever the killer ordered.
We want to really get in this guy's head.
And that kicks on a theme that goes through the entire movie, because, yes, as all of this is happening,

(15:48):
manicurist going to plays, getting a helicopter, a little every single thing, a unit with that at a certain point, we catch the detective in the shower.
Like it's right. Yes. Every advancement that this every advancement that this detective makes in this case is 100 percent motivated to seeing how much he can get away with putting on his expense account.

(16:14):
And then this is like Rick and Morty level writing for Rick and Morty.
The assassin, like these driving away fully go down the bus and then the assassin to fully see each other.
Well, the assassin sees fully fully just kind of checking his own reflection on the bus.
Right. The assassin panics.
But the truly hilarious and brilliant piece of writing that's in there, that was.

(16:37):
Jazz, some kind of jazz.
Like they didn't even try. They were just like, OK, here we go.
We got like, let's go. But oh, my God, it was hilarious.
Makes it crows nest.
Oh, crows nest to the stop, the proposed town. Yes.

(16:58):
Oh, oh, OK. Yeah. So he catches a ride because he has almost no money and he gets to the town of crows nest and he gets on the guys like, yeah, I've been driving this this bus route for years.
This is crows nest. There's that broken branch. There's that tire.
Crows nest. Right. And he's like, but there's nothing out here.
You know, where's the town of crows nest?

(17:19):
Oh, crows nest isn't the town. It's a proposed town. Anyway, this is your stop. Get out.
And while he's doing this, the detectives go off and hit a strip joint.
Right. Yep. Clues.
And I thought we were going to get a hardcore like trip and balls scene when Foley is in the woods and he's eating all the berries and just like walking across things like again, doing doing everything wrong.

(17:44):
He's eating all the red berries off of all the other holly branches. He's picking up random mushrooms off the ground and chewing on them. Yes.
And not escalating. It just keeps escalating like you keep sitting there going like, oh, God. Oh, God. Like, even though you know you're watching a movie where the main character probably isn't going to die, you're still kind of going, oh, what are you doing?

(18:08):
Every moment. But then then, oh, my God, he's so inconsequential at work that he's getting praised just for not doing his job.
Right. Which how many corporate movies have we seen that when they literally stop doing anything, things get better. Right. Exactly.
A big part of corporate work is to try to just busy work, but busy work gets in the way of things. It's always one of those messages that they toss into movies all the time.

(18:38):
Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, it's it's no yeah, it's no mystery to anybody who's been involved in any part of the corporate world that you could make a company about 50% more efficient and at the same time save them roughly millions upon millions of dollars per month, not just year, but per month.
If you just fire the board of directors and let their assistants and let their assistants keep doing what they were doing.

(19:06):
I will agree with that.
Checking into the motel and wrote it down like, okay, he steals the assassin's Jeep walking through the woods runs into the assassin's Jeep steals it and then goes and checks into the motel.
The assassin is staying at.
I mean, my God, just and you cannot believe anything in this movie, right? It is not that kind of movie, but it is and there and there also we get this sort of routine because the the manager of this motel is another kids in the hall guy, Kevin McDonald, and they do this check in routine that is straight out of freaking vaudeville.

(19:50):
It is amazing. It where you know, I'd like to buy a room, please. What I'd like to buy a room. Oh, one better to one bed is fine. Thank you.
No, that was that that did crack me up. And I guess I mean, Kevin McDonald in that position like he was that was the right amount of Kevin McDonald.
Shoot out with the killer and fully zigging and zagging out of there. There's a she like the cut like he's not any part of this shootout and he is running down the road like they're shooting at him and he's just magically dodging everything like he's the most capable guy in the world.

(20:26):
It was funny.
And I just look like the detective.
I'm never going to find you. You're too hard. I give up.
Right. Literally like that.
Yeah.
And then yeah. And then what was that? What was the clue that came in? Oh, that was when that's when they say he they they found him at a hotel and he's like, oh, okay, great.

(20:52):
And then with his unlimited resources, he's like, oh, God, yeah, no, let's go to Cincinnati. I haven't seen your sister in months.
Right.
Just looking at a very, very bad cop. But it's the kind of bad cop that, you know, I could live with this. Okay.
Yeah, I could live with this kind of bad cop. Yeah. Yeah.

(21:14):
Okay, right.
And then fully running and then he jumps onto that train, which the first time he jumps onto that train and then he completely whiffs funny again a whole this is practically Charlie Chaplin level humor in this whole bit here of him trying to get on the train because first he jumps on the
man. Yeah, yeah. First he jumps on the train and falls out of the train on the other side. Then he tries to run up and catch the train from the caboose barely manages to hold on to it and is constantly bumping his face because his feet are dragging behind him and so he's just constantly going

(21:50):
thump thump thump against the back of the train until finally the train stops because the train drivers got to get out and change his own track and try to flip the track himself. So I haven't I have maybe a real help me out here and tell me if you think I'm right here.
This is live action looney tunes.

(22:12):
Dave Foley is basically playing Daffy Duck.
Like it seems like it's like that that's how this was written.
I mean maybe I don't think you're too far off.
It kids it pretty much perfect I mean gets onto the train eats a whole thing of tainted ham and then gets into the hospital. And I love how he tried to do the usual suspects type thing right yes we got a usual suspects there.

(22:40):
Jones. Yeah, and I'm a bag.
Jones.
I'm not going to stop laughing about that for a while.
Then he steals the old man's clothes and then winds up dressing up basically as Toby McGuire and Seabiscuit as he walks out of there.
Looked just like him.

(23:01):
Yep.
And then he turns around and goes and decides to just steal the clothes from like 30 other different different patients so he can just sort of root through them to find an outfit that he likes.
Good time.
Yeah.
But then the assassin shows up at the hospital to take out Foley and cops are like we need you to save this man's life and then the guy like he's not a doctor so he can't save this man's life.

(23:30):
And then the cops comforting him like he's good man he's really taking this hard.
Right. And I was I had a good time with that.
And then, oh hitchhiking with the conspiracy man. That's the thing. That's another thing that actually, that was one of the things about this movie.
Because for all intents and purposes, the assassin character is the straight man in this. Like, if Foley is the is the is the comedy foil.

(24:00):
Colin Fury is the straight man he's the guy who was the serious killer, who is having to deal with this wacky loony protagonist that is Foley, but they are not afraid to get him involved in the comedy to like that whole bit with the cops, and, you know, and having to pretend to be a surgeon and
failing it failing at saving a cop and then, you know, in that like, for the guy who's supposed to be the serious part of the movie. He gets plenty of unserious shit to end.

(24:31):
So, he plays it seriously like he's like, you know, he's he's like the he's like the nod to airplane where you have a crazy comedy but everyone's acting seriously that's him in this movie.
I'll give you that I give you that.
Then we get our introduction to Jennifer Tilly into the movie.

(24:52):
And fully fun like winds up on a farm, and the heavens opened and the angels sang. Yes.
Yeah, then he like he's sitting here he's trying to come up with a name but he's just looking around the car and everything is like, and he just gives his name. Right.
Yeah, that was my name is on with that. Having Jennifer Tilly be a narcoleptic driver. We've had that gag, we've had that gag, but yeah but but it still worked.

(25:19):
And that's how they also kind of, they kept playing it like this was usually when, when you have a character like that. It's kind of more like an like a Chekhov's narcolepsy, where they'll only like it, the attacks will only happen at the, the, the points they need to happen in the, in the plot.
And then they'll just happen here. She passes out in almost every scene that she's in. Yeah, and it makes sense every time so yeah I mean I got I got nothing on that one.

(25:51):
But she is very much a train wreck and fully is a tempting empathy.
Which, and then she invites him to stay as a handyman on a farm I'm like Miss Tilly.
Right. Well, and this I think is one of my favorite jokes in the entire thing when she's asking him can you stay in work and he might want to make it this is one of those lines that I will think about and giggle at random moments, you know, in my life, where he says

(26:21):
like well you know I can't lift anything heavy, and she says, Oh, do you have a bad back, and he goes, No.
I just can't. Yeah. But one of my, this might be my favorite part of it. Oh, your brother's gay, and she loses her mind laughing so no he's a Marine.

(26:43):
And this man has the prettiest pinkest room with like posters of shirtless dudes on the ceiling and everything and fully is like, okay, let me tell you something one of my, like, and this is one of those like
moments where where parenthood is almost worthwhile. I in for this most recent viewing of this movie I watched it with my son.

(27:07):
And on that, he's a Marine line. I've never seen my son laugh harder in his life.
Good moments like that. Yeah, nice.
But then, oh my god.
Tilly's dad kicks him off the farm but he offers to step up for the bank.
Because he built a fence with glue.

(27:33):
Again, another good moment another good moment for this movie. He's just sitting there with the almost glue going like, Oops.
Perfect. I mean, and then and then he even ends the conversation level of goof in this movie just perfect.
And he and even he ends the conversation with like well fence ain't gonna glue itself and gets back to work.

(27:54):
Confidence was wildly hilarious.
But then I got to see okay. All right. Now I know my doc wanted to watch this movie.
Jennifer telling the doorway. Hey, you know what?
And that was a funny gag. That was a good.
I was like,
Oh, I'm sorry. Like, let me turn the lights like off because I can't see you are on because I can't see you. He's like, never mind.

(28:20):
Yeah, yeah. The light is so harsh. Click turns it off. Yeah. Go off. Yeah. No, that was that was a little too funny.
I enjoyed the hell out of that.
Oh my god. The assassin fighting the dog for that rat.
Protein.
That's our position. That's the juxtaposition. Like our hard-bitten assassin is basically out in the elements.

(28:44):
It's raining. He's having to fight animals for food. Meanwhile, Nelson, the dork is sleeping soundly in that in that very nice comfy frilly bed.
And the cops have gone to go see Moby with escorts with taxpayer funded escorts.
That's right. God bless America.

(29:08):
But then oh my I love this like when Foley goes to work at the bank is like and your outfit is in the locker and he comes out wearing that clerks uniform from like the 30s.
Exactly. Yep. Love that. I was having fun with that.
And then till he bring in lunch and it was spaghetti. Oh, right.
Dude, they literally like it's not that they didn't open any punches. It's that they literally they threw everything at the wall and it's kind of weird how much stuck.

(29:34):
Yeah. Yep.
Which I think I think yeah and it's all in the performance. We've got all of these comedy powerhouses.
You've got Foley. You've got Joe Flatterty in this one. He's an SCTV alumni from from years ago.
These are all hardcore like comedy actors who know how to take the dumbest premise and make it hilarious.

(29:56):
And Jennifer Tilly who like between this and Liar Liar.
We do not give Jennifer Tilly enough credit for her comedy chops like she does a lot of good dramatic stuff.
But her comedy is on fucking point to and she doesn't I got I got I got to think that given the fact that she is one of the primary voices of family guy.

(30:17):
I think people know she's funny. Oh, I forgot about that. Okay.
Good point. Yeah, she is. She actually has a huge career in the comedy industry and right.
God, I think but yeah, like a lot of her movies, you know, they don't let her bring the comedy in in the movies, but she does nail it every time because I'm thinking about the movies that I'm thinking of her.

(30:38):
Bio Dome bound the wrong guy. I mean, she was funny and the wrong guy.
Michael with John Travolta. Well, I never saw that one.
Pretty good one, actually. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, I gotta I gotta give that I haven't seen it in a long time, but I have no bad memories of that.
I remember really enjoying that movie. Okay, maybe we'll give that one.

(31:02):
And then we get the newspaper owner who's like the rival to the bank and he wants to buy it and their whole little despicable must.
Armor whirling thing around. They literally they literally reverse it in every other one of these kinds of movies.
It's the evil banker trying to take out the family farm in this movie.
It's the giant conglomerate farmer trying to take out the little family owned bank, which I got.

(31:26):
That was that was gold that I it really was the tag on this scene was perfect.
To the broccoli field, get a dial.
That being how they ended the scene was just amazing for me.
And kind of one of those very, very, very relatable things is the bank going to be like, and this is the chair.

(31:52):
They replaced the old chair. I just don't like this chair.
All of that, that.
And somewhat unnecessary, but highly hilarious.
OK, the walk with Tillie and Foley through the farm and oh, my God. Yes.
Go ahead. I went on a run. Go ahead. Yeah, no, that's the way the way it's kind of like there.

(32:19):
He's starting to realize that he's in love. She's clearly attached to him.
She's she's been, you know, a lost puppy dog throughout this entire thing that we've seen her.
So she's she's imprinted on him and they're having a very nice romantic walk.
And this is the point where he thinks, all right, maybe this is the real thing. I got to level with her.
I'm going to confess to her that I am a wanted man for murder.

(32:41):
And just as he's about to start his confession, she has another narcoleptic fit passes out.
But they are in a field of like lilies that are like waist high.
I was just grass. I feel like it was something maybe alfalfa or something like that.
But it's waist high is what it is.
And he just keeps walking as he's telling the story about how he's been on the run.

(33:03):
She's already unconscious several steps behind him.
And after it takes a moment for him to for him to finally turn around dramatically to say like wanted for murder.
And she's gone. She's just vanished because she's asleep somewhere under the eyeline.
And you see him go. He starts wandering aimlessly going, Lynn, where are you? Where are you?

(33:24):
Like, I liked it. I had a lot of fun with that.
The newspaper owner realizes who Foley is and then writes his own story in his own paper about all of it.
Right. Saying that he's the murderer and all this.
And he does he does get a good chance.

(33:49):
Gets a chance to tell Tilly a little bit hinting a little bit more.
She's right. I'm a good judge of character.
Well, except for that one guy who was, you know, recon for aliens.
Well, he just wanted to get in my pants.
What what a little side story right there.
Yeah. Yep. I was it was it was a whole bunch.

(34:13):
There was too much to unpack there. So let's just take it and run.
Yes. Excuse me.
Then we're back into the mobile command unit with the detectives and Farmer Brown and Farmer Brown gives his you know, his evil laugh.
Right. And I like that the detective acting went.
Why are you laughing like that? Like what?

(34:35):
Oh, weird and creepy.
That was probably my favorite line from the detective.
Just really subtle, everything like that.
But I also think that might have been his only actual bit of acting in the movie.
Oh, just like fun punchlines. But that one, he actually delivered real acting,

(35:00):
which is weird because nobody else was doing that except for Colm, maybe. Right.
Yes, exactly. Which I. Yeah, that was always fun.
And OK, the paper like we said, the paper order makes up that story.
And then that half inspirational speech, which just. Oh, right.

(35:22):
Yeah. God, thank God. They actually just let that be a joke because, man, it was a joke.
Like the bank has been here for you.
I signed that loan. Sure, I had to foreclose on your farm, but I mean, that's business.
Right. Yeah. I thought that was I thought that was.
And I love the whole like, but you have, you know, but your teller is a murderer.

(35:45):
And he's like, Nelson, tell these people you're not a murderer.
Oh, I'm not a murderer. I'm an alleged murderer.
Got to love that honesty, I guess, you know.
But let's see. Oh, this is where that work outfit pays off from the bank,
because they wind up getting on a convention that everybody's kind of dressed like that.
Oh my God. Pretty lucky.

(36:07):
That gag, first of all, the first delivery on it was just like, haha, clever.
And then the second delivery on it with the next bus that the killer gets on.
Emotionally disturbed veterans retreat.
Right. You get that's one of those things where you got to ask yourself,

(36:31):
what was the anatomy of building that joke?
Did they start with the emotionally disturbed veterans or did they start with the Barbershop Quartet
and then just kept running with it?
Like where like because that because that payoff was too good to think to yourself,
like was that the point beforehand or was that just a happy accident?
Don't care. It was good. It was fun. It was funny.

(36:59):
I had but then Foley and Tilley go on the run and they like we need to stop and get supplies.
Oh, don't worry. I have condoms. Well, not that but good.
Right. So many always, always the best miners on this one.
When you're sitting there going like I'm getting some mixed signal here.

(37:22):
I don't know whether she's really into me or not.
When she brings up the condoms, you're like, excellent.
That mystery is solved.
I know what this trip is going to be.
Right. Exactly.
But then Foley leaves Constance over the answering machine.
Again, I'm glad that we never got to see, hear, meet her in any way
because this movie was not about empathy for her,

(37:44):
even though man, did I have empathy for her if I would have met her.
Right. Yes.
I like that. OK, so the cop and the assassin and everything has the Mexican standoff.
It's like a Mexican standoff.
That's not a Mexican standoff. And you get a little lesson about it.
And the cops like, OK, what if I put my gun down and then I leave?
What's that called? Like you're just a yellow coward.

(38:06):
It's like, cool. Yeah, I'll take it.
This this. Oh, go ahead. Go ahead.
I know what I do like. Like, this is the point, too.
Like now we start getting more like it was after this that the sort of like
spicker slash banter between Tillie and Foley starts happening when he's trying to say like,

(38:29):
go run away. Like Glove is like a gun to your head.
And she's like, what are you saying?
And then the killer goes like, he's saying I have a gun to your head.
And she's like, oh, well, that was convoluted.
And like and the rest of the movie is the two of them bickering like an old married couple.
It worked. And and again, Jennifer Tillie holding her own with the with these like

(38:52):
longtime comedy powerhouses and she doesn't get enough credit for.
I'll give you that. But the thing is, in this moment, like what I thought was hilarious is
they're having this whole speech while you can literally see the gun under our full his armpit.
And she's like, that was so confusing.
I said there was a gun. You said it was. I had.

(39:13):
I'm like, hey, hey, I've had this argument.
Hey, OK, they did a good job with this one.
And then they're like back to the detectives and they find out a little bit.
Like, what was it? Oh, the manicurist was the one who gives them a little like,
oh, they're going like they're going to Mexico. Right.

(39:35):
Yeah, sounds like they're going to Mexico. And yeah.
And he says, yeah, and you said that a manicurist wouldn't wouldn't contribute to this case.
She's on the expense report now, too. Yeah, I enjoyed the fact that.
So you get Tillie Foley and the assassin in the car.
They're driving down the road and the assassin's like, you're some form of super cop and all this.

(40:00):
And he's like. Hmm. Right. Yes, I guess it's.
Super cop Nelson has finally met his match.
The awkwardness of that. And then, yeah, the assassin like.
Oh, shit. I enjoyed the misdirect of Mr.

(40:26):
Tiny's not being a person or his place or anything like that, but instead it was a mini golf course that was right.
I do. I'm not going to say that I hit the floor laughing, but it just that made me happy.
I thought that was really clever. Oh, and then, of course, we get the sleeping spell, the narcoleptic stuff.
That in all right pays off because that's how. Oh, and they even like really even full on up.

(40:52):
Call it up because on top of all the times we've seen her fall asleep, including while driving.
Even as the killer is kidnapping them, he says to her, you drive and fully goes, oh, bad idea.
And he's like, shut up and get in the car. Yeah, they they paid that off and they paved the way on that one pretty well.

(41:14):
I got to say. Yep. Then they're going into the mini golf and the assassin knocks out fully and then picks him up.
Yeah, that is like you're awake. Like for a while now.
It's like, why have I been carrying you? I thought you wanted to do that.
That is that that is like Daffy Duck. One hundred percent.

(41:36):
Yes, yes, you are correct. That those are definitely Looney Tunes style jokes for sure.
Yeah, we get all the way through.
We get to the CEO fully thinks, oh, the CEO is going to pay him off and save our lives.
I thought the gag about the passport.
Where he wanted a Swiss passport, but the CEO gives him a passport to Iraq instead. Right.

(42:01):
Yeah. And he's like, they were all out. They were all out. Yeah.
I'm sorry. That was too. That was too funny.
Then when they commandeer that are the detective commandeers that scooter.
Just one of the final little bits of this cop being just the worst man commandeering a mobility scooter from a disabled person.

(42:25):
You know, so and then what was this with the standoff with the cops and the assassin gets shot and he's just annoyed by it.
And immediately afterwards, like the like the cops in the bullhorn going, sorry, sorry, one of our guys got a little overzealous.

(42:46):
Correct.
I the chopper conversation is like, I don't want to I don't want to is like, or he's like, and a chopper is like, I don't want a chopper.
Well, the chopper is already on the way. If I see a chopper, I will shoot.
Oh, my God, dude, if you let one of the hostages go, we'll cancel the chopper.

(43:08):
I mean, my God, this is what you were talking about on the ledge and that epic drop.
And like where the guys act like he's going to die. But instead, I fell on my keys.
Right. Yes. Oh, my. What is this movie?
Genius is what it is. It's unfiltered insanity dancing on the line of genius.

(43:30):
Agreed. Absolutely agreed. And then, well, I guess you'll be leaving me.
Oh, OK. And then he tries to walk away.
Perfect. Well, you don't have to leave. Oh, great.
Right. Oh, oh, the optimism. Yeah.
And then like we can go we can go back and live the quiet life in that little farm town.

(43:51):
I hate the farm town. Back to Chicago than it is.
Yeah. But then there's also that trying to describe an epiphany.
And she's like, an epiphany is like, no, I had a realization. Yeah.
An epiphany. No, more like a spiritual like on a real.
Yeah. He blows like an epiphany.
You're describing an epiphany. Yeah.

(44:13):
This movie was funny and that weird ass proposal.
It matched and matched the characters that match the movie.
I thought it was fun. I really had a good time.
It's it's one of my favorites.
It's like I own the DVD to this movie.
So that that's how much I have loved it since I first saw it.
All right. Give us your final thoughts on The Wrong Guy.

(44:35):
My final thoughts on The Wrong Guy. Look, here's the thing.
I cannot in all good conscience say this is a must see film by the standards that we have that I have set for for this on on the on the show.
I cannot in good conscience say that that your your media literacy culture cannot be benefited by this.
That said, holy shit, it is so goddamn funny.

(44:58):
You probably should see it anyway, because it is it is good.
It is a good enough movie that you will it will not be a waste of time for you.
Agreed. Jumping the gun towards to the movie fight.
Realistically, this one is going to win round three.
I will recommend everybody go see this.
Stir of Echoes. Pretty much everybody.
But there are certain people that just aren't going to care.

(45:21):
Wrong Guy, you can fade out, fade in, take a bathroom, not even pause the movie.
Come back and you are going to be having a fantastic time.
Yeah, that goes is a little triggering to some people.
I can see that for sure. Yeah.
So I like given that.
All right. For part two, we're going to be covering stir of echoes,

(45:42):
which is going to go with our October theme of trying to do more horror,
thriller, supernatural type stuff to pair up with our movies.
So stir of echoes, Richard.
Written by Richard Matheson and David Cope, directed by David Cope,
starring Kevin Bacon, Zachary David Cope, not the same type of cope,

(46:07):
like different spelling, so no nepotism on that one.
Catherine Urb and Jennifer Morrison, which it took me so long to realize
that was Jennifer Morrison. Yeah, it took me a while to like I I was like,
wait, she's familiar. I know who that is. I've seen her. Yeah.
And I had to go look it up, too. And I was like, oh, OK, that's who that is.
Oh, yeah. No, once I once I realized I was like, oh, I didn't realize I knew her so young.

(46:33):
Yeah. And one of the crazy thing, too, was like I even had to go look it up
because I even look at the credits like at the end of the movie, reading the credits,
didn't recognize her name in the credits because in the credits she's Jenny Morrison.
And that didn't click for me. I had to go. I still had to go look it up.
Oh, fair enough. I I didn't even look at the credits on that one.

(46:55):
I just went to the IMDb and everything like that.
But no, one like I took my time because I'd already seen this movie when I was younger.
Oh, yeah. Same here. But yeah.
With Ileana Douglas, Kevin Dunn, Conor O'Farrell and Liza Weill,
which, interestingly enough, one of the characters in this movie was Liza Weill

(47:19):
and one of the actors in Liza Weill.
I'm wondering if they got that because of that or if they changed a character name to kind of do something like that.
This movie was based off of a book that was written in 1958.
Really? Yeah. Interesting.
I know. So as I was watching it, I was like, dude, this is The Shining.

(47:44):
See, and there were moments of that that I thought that, too,
especially when we had like later on that the cop who who like recognizes the kid.
And I'm just like, that's that's straight out of the fucking Shining right there.
Every part of this so much. I mean, I did not know I was going to say something so jacked up
when I suggested that we cover this movie.

(48:06):
The Shining is Stir of Echoes in a hotel.
Oh, yeah, I guess. Yeah. Timeline wise, if the book came out then, then yeah,
then then Stir of Echoes was first. So that means, yeah, The Shining is the ripoff.
Which is kind of weird to say, isn't it? Yeah.
Although not. I mean.

(48:29):
Well, let's go over the comparison quick.
You have the child who the child and the father who have the connection to supernatural, but not the mother.
Right. You have the child in the little red jacket that meets the black man who shares the gift with him,
talks to the mother about the gift. Yeah.

(48:51):
All of that is in both of these movies. Yeah.
But I haven't read the book, so I can't say. And the mother's main concern about all this is the fact that her husband is acting crazy.
Yep. Yeah. We got we got snapping. We got all of these things.
We got a little bit of psychological stuff going. This is like The Shining is Stir of Echoes.

(49:14):
If it went a slightly different direction. Right.
We talked about this many times on this channel.
Dancers with our avatar is Dances with Wolves in Space. Right.
Like you can go through a million examples of all of that. Yeah.
But there's nothing wrong with rehashing an old idea as long as you are bringing something new to it.

(49:38):
And that is definitely what is happening here. Yes. Yeah.
Because I mean, you go back to like writing exercises back in school and college and stuff like that.
Everybody starts a story about a pen on a desk. Yep.
And everybody writes a different story. Exactly.
Even though it's all about the same thing. Yep.

(50:00):
Now, that's one of those. You kind of see you got to decide on how you feel about it.
I got to say, though, for all the horror movies, thriller movies, supernatural things that I watch, this movie's opening.
Hmm is perfect. I'm trying to think of any other movie I've seen where they've done this thing where they start with the little kid talk to the ghost.

(50:26):
But when the kid is talking to the ghost, he's talking directly to the camera.
Incredibly powerful. I don't.
Yeah, I can't think of any other movie I've seen that has done that.
It is so much more unsettling than any other way I've seen it.
Like, how has this only been done once? How has no one else thought of doing it this way?

(50:51):
There's no way that it's only been done once. I guarantee we just aren't remembering. Probably.
Or we have. I mean, I like horror movies, but I don't actively like push myself to go in on them and all this stuff. Sure.
I'm a comedy guy. Yeah. But I got to say, that is how it should be done. Yes, I agree.
Like, you got, I mean, when you put that into the context of storytelling, filmmaking, all this, you have the characters in the world.

(51:20):
And then you have the character that's a little bit separated in a different world, which it makes sense to break the fourth wall and talk to them and not us. Yeah.
That was beautiful.
And the way that, can I ask you an important question? Bacon thinking that he's talking to him, everything like that. Makes sense. All of it made sense.

(51:42):
It was just crafted so perfectly together. Yeah. Does it hurt to be dead?
Whoa. Absolutely no fucks given. Like, we're not just doing foreshadowing here. We are telling you straight up what this movie is about.
Yeah, and Bacon goes downstairs and then we get our introduction into Ileana Douglas and Maggie Earp. Wait, no. Maggie Earp?

(52:12):
Catherine Earp, who plays Maggie. And, ah, man. We get right into character development. I'm not used to hating Ileana Douglas.
But I hated her the second she showed up on it. It got better. Yeah. Oh, I hated her intro.
Well, and you know, I think this was, and this was kind of one of those things I was wondering, they do kind of hint at it a little bit to kind of justify it.

(52:40):
But that was kind of the vibe I was getting because there were moments in this movie where I was forgetting whose sister she was because she says right at the at the at the.
Outset that she's Maggie's sister. You know, you got my sister pregnant again, you bastard, you know.
But the way she talks with him, there are moments where I'm like, wait, is she his sister? They're talking to each other like siblings.

(53:04):
They felt very, very tight. I got it right. I got to say that. And so it's like that that whole sort of like.
And this again goes to we've talked about we talked about this with.
Frequency even like there's a lot of correlations between this and frequency where you've got that sort of like tight knit neighborhood where this is a neighborhood where, you know, everyone is.

(53:27):
Everyone's grown up with each other. Everybody knows each other like houses been passed down from parents to kids for multiple generations.
So everybody there has known everybody for ever.
And so basically the feeling I was getting was like this really like adversarial.

(53:51):
Relationship between Ileana, between Ileana and and bacon bacon. Thank you.
Was that that sort of like longtime friendship like, yes, I married your I married your sister.
But maybe back in grade school, we had a thing going on and we've just been kind of like this weird kind of pseudo siblings ever since.

(54:12):
That is about how tight they felt. Yeah, I got to give you that. I will completely agree with that.
But the way she says, like, can I tell them if you want me to hate you forever?
And then she tells him. Right. Yeah. And then bacon, because that's what sisters do. You're not pregnant.
And then she's like, say something different. Bummer.

(54:33):
They write. We get we get years upon years of character development in just a few lines of dialogue right there.
Like, that's that's kind of what's amazing about this is we know who these people are right out of the gate.
There's no. And as soon as Ileana is not in the room, we see bacon being a very like a lot lighter, like more open.

(54:56):
Right. And it really kind of shows that he's just not open with anybody but her. Yeah. What I got from that.
And I and I see you there. Yeah. And that makes sense.
I mean, in this moment, like at that, they're both trying to be supportive, but it definitely hurts.
And where he's like walking out trying to like convince himself, he's like, I'm a happy guy.

(55:21):
Oh, felt the pain on that one man.
Well, and the way he walks out to where he's like, like he's he's kind of feeling his age and all that sort of stuff.
And like he was, you know, he was a musician. He thought he's going to be a rock star.
And he's sitting there going like, look, I'm sorry, I'm not I'm not a rock star.
He's like, I just want you to know when I was telling you that stuff, we were younger, we were dating and I was like, I'm going to be famous.

(55:45):
I wasn't blowing. I wasn't just saying that to get in your pants.
Like, I really think it's time to artist who's just really feeling their regret.
Right. Yeah. You know, and he even caps it off with like he's like, I'm OK with not being famous.
I just never thought I'd be this ordinary. Like, that's the you know.
And I'm like, fuck, dude, I feel that. Holy shit.

(56:06):
I really, really do feel where he's coming from on that.
But I also really sympathized with Herb's character on that because he's right.
What she eventually does say is every time you say that this is ordinary, you have regret this or your regrets and all this problems with your life.
I'm your life. Right. He's your life.

(56:28):
This is your life. And every time you talk about your intense regrets, you're regretting us. Right.
And the reality is, yes, when you do put that out there and you're saying that you're pushing all that out there.
Oh, my life sucks and all that. And you're saying it to that person.
Look, your buddies are there for a reason. Bitch to them about things like that.

(56:53):
Don't take that to your wife. Right. Oh, my God. What a way to set yourself up for disaster.
Totally. Yeah. Yeah. No, I mean, that's the great thing is like this this subplot of their relationship.
Like, it's a subplot. It's a it's a hindsight kind of thing.
But that's what makes this movie work. If these parts of the movie weren't in the movie, I would not have given a shit about the movie.

(57:19):
Oh, no, you really cared about the people in this movie. Totally.
I don't know how you could like where I'm kind of guaranteeing round three goes to the wrong guy.
I don't know how to say round one isn't guaranteed for these guys. No, it's true.
I think round two is really going to be the deciding factor because man, both of these movies really did like their tech like technically what they did.

(57:45):
They both did perfect. And that's the thing, man, is like, I gotta say, like, I think this is one of those moments where I think we really need to question the movie fight thing because these movies are from different planets.
It's really not fair to compare them. No, I know. It's just that's what we like.
Well, I mean, we can fix whatever.

(58:06):
But key moments like when the kid tells the ghost to shh, and they go to the part where they go to the party across the street with the baby monitor.
Right. So many things I was expecting out of that. Nothing happened. Right.
Just it just just great, just great character building world building set building that whole kind of, again, you know, a life that I do not know that close knit neighborhood feel that happens in all of these movies that are based in places like New York or Chicago or something like that.

(58:40):
I grew up in the suburbs. That is a fantastical alien world to me of actual neighborhood camaraderie. Fuck. I wish I had lived that life.
I got some though it seems to be even though it seems to be. Yeah, even though it seems to be rife with abuse and murder. Still, it looks nice.
It seems fun. It's not like I got I got a buddy that in his neighborhood, the dads in this neighborhood, they get together and every they have a weekly House of the Dragon or things like that.

(59:14):
Like they have their shows that the kids can't watch and things like that. Nice. The dads all get together and have a watch party. I think that is one of the coolest things, man. That is fantastic. Yeah, that is that is that is a really cool part of life.
I don't have that in my life where I'm at either. But. You know, you see where you see where life winds up. Yeah. At this party, you get Kevin Dunn being a jester and Eliana Douglas scouring for a mate while bacon is just out on the porch sulking, which Douglas out there scouring.

(59:51):
Not drunk enough. Oh, scary. That was that was a great little scene and it led right into the hypnosis in a really good way because we really got to discover all like our three kind of main characters.
Even though herb is one of the stars, I still say Douglas was one of the main characters over herb.

(01:00:14):
I don't know if she's over. She's definitely a strong supporting character. I don't know if I put her over her.
Well, the thing is, I don't know if I'd put herb as a star, even though I have her in the like on the title, because Eliana Douglas has more to do with the story than herb does.
I suppose.

(01:00:36):
But I mean, that's that's that's super nitpicking and that's like Alice's type stuff. I suppose plot wise, yes, Douglas does more, but herb contributes more to what makes the story important.
Is. I agree.
This was a line that was changed from the book for the movie, where in the movie, Kevin Bacon says, what's the worst that could happen, which is a very classic line.

(01:01:02):
See it all the time. Yep. In the book, he says, what have I got to lose?
Interesting. OK, I don't know why they changed it. I think it was a better statement.
What do I have to lose? Because it feeds into what he said.
It's like, dude, you just found out your wife is pregnant. You have a kid. You are married. You have a lot to lose.

(01:01:26):
It goes it goes. Yeah, it goes right into what she says later of, you know, you keep saying that, you know, your life is boring and ordinary.
And that's all you're talking about. Having the line be what have I got to lose is is it would be a big contributor to that.
Maybe they maybe they felt like at the last minute that that was too much. You know, maybe, you know, maybe they didn't want they didn't want to lay it on that thick.

(01:01:51):
But we did. I mean, the thing is, we wanted Kevin Bacon to be the bag like the movie wanted Kevin Bacon to be the bad guy in the film until he wasn't right.
Yeah, like they really wanted. But they didn't go hard enough.
They I feel like they went hard enough that, you know, watching the movie, feeling it out and like that, like, yeah, there were some bad memories that came up about some like domestic fights and stuff like that.

(01:02:16):
Yeah, we didn't. And yeah, like I said, this movie is a little bit triggering in certain ways. Right. Good.
What good movies are triggering. They're supposed to send you in certain memories.
They're supposed to hit you. And I think that's that is probably the one little big straight through line difference between like we're comparing it to The Shining. The difference between this movie and The Shining is that while yes, Kevin Bacon's character is on edge and is getting more extreme and is getting more weird and more and even more like verbally abusive to his family.

(01:02:55):
At what point in the movie did I feel like his kid was in danger from him? Never.
You know, as opposed to in The Shining, you kind of get that like almost immediately.
You I don't know. I don't know. There's that moment where like he's first up and then Bacon's like screaming at him on the couch and he like snaps like slaps his hands together in front of his face, which is definitely over the top for sure that that is.

(01:03:21):
And I would agree like that. Don't do that. But I don't call that danger. That's the thing. It's like I was more afraid for the kids, you know, general well-being, not for his like physical safety.
I can agree with that. Yeah. Here's the thing. And we talked about like we keep talking about The Shining.
This could have been a prequel to The Shining easily. The Shining could have very easily be easily been written as its sequel.

(01:03:50):
The father, the father, the kid, all of them driving away, trying to find a new neighborhood to get away from this.
It would be completely understandable. Change Nicholson's character from a writer to a musician.
This like this is a perfect prequel to The Shining. Totally. Yeah.
Which is just really fricking weird. I might recommend certain horror people to go watch Stir of Echoes before watching The Shining and see how they feel. True.

(01:04:20):
Did you know that The Shining had a sequel? Dr. Sleep. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I watched it like a week ago.
Okay. Yeah. See, I watched Dr. Sleep a couple of years ago, not knowing it was a Shining sequel.
I thought it was just some other new weird, you know, Stephen King thing I decided to check out. And then it was like maybe like 10 minutes in.

(01:04:41):
I was like, wait, wait, wait a second. Yeah. Right. Yeah. I think I think I knew the first time I saw Dr. Sleep.
The weird thing was I knew I had seen it and went to go watch it again. And I was like, I cannot remember any of this.
That is weirdly a Stephen King thing. Yeah. With me. I have seen so many Stephen King movies, but I can't remember them.

(01:05:04):
But I'll sit down, I'll start watching them and I'll like, it's weird. Stephen King movies, movies based off Stephen King novels.
I don't know what it is about them. I can watch them again for the first time.
That's a good question. Yeah. It's a weird thing. I don't know. It's their formula, how it sits on me. I don't know what it is, but that is kind of a cool thing about them.

(01:05:27):
Yeah. Let's talk. I mean, speaking of Dr. Sleep, let's talk about the hypnosis and the scene of the theater, which I was blown away by.
Yeah, that is like some high grade, like probably the most, with the number of visual effects in just that, those first couple of those, those like two, three minutes of that scene.

(01:05:52):
Absolutely unnecessary. So freaking good. Like we're setting the mood and the scene and the mentality and all this like, holy shit.
Like that was it. That was practically a short film all by itself. Like you could just watch the hypnosis scene by itself and walk away satisfied.
Like that was that was amazing. The way that the architecture of the theater, when she says that it's black, the way that it gets painted black, the way that the seats change to black.

(01:06:27):
Even the way that the color, like the lights shown on this black seats, shown them as brown. Yeah. That, my mind, in my mind made that completely perfect.
And the reason why is like that's real. If you shine yellow light or not yet, no, no, not white light necessarily, but yellow light on to black seats, it comes off as brown.

(01:06:54):
Yeah. That's why I love, which is so much, which is interesting because yeah. And it was like, because that kind of yellowish light comes from shining a white light from a projector on to an aged yellowing screen.
You get a yellow light reflection onto the seats. Yeah. And that is, you know, well, and I, and I think I'm going to say that might have been unintentional to a degree.

(01:07:23):
I don't know. I don't know. That's just, that's just what I like about practical effects is that when you use practical effects, it gives you real. Exactly. Yes.
And it grounds the scene for me better. Yeah.
But all of these horror visions, which play out the movie that we're about to watch, and it tells us everything that had happened before.

(01:07:48):
And the safety pin through the hand.
I got some information on that one. Okay. Not a prop.
They hired a stuntman to come in for the day and do that to himself.
Hey, you know what, he got, he got paid to do his job. I'm

(01:08:13):
talking practical effects and we're talking about the incredible, like just what you get out of using practical effects. Right.
That, that the feeling, the way it hits you is so much harder when you are looking at a real hand.
It does not matter how good the hand like the hand is generated or anything like that.
You can still see the difference. We are not out of this area yet.

(01:08:38):
Some. Yeah. Something, something in our, in our brains, no matter how good the fake hand is, we can tell it's a fake hand.
The uncanny valley. Exactly. Yes. And yeah. And it is, and it is a big, big difference.
It's so like the lack of a soul. Like it's, it's kind of, it's kind of weird. Like it's and I, I don't know what it is, but referring to it as the lack of a soul does make sense.

(01:09:06):
Kind of in, in, without any actual, you know, otherwise definable way to describe it. That is the best we can do. Yeah. Like until, you know, it's like, it's like, you know, dark matter, like until we know what it is, we're just going to call it that.
So we know that works. Hey, fair enough. Yeah. The rough night of sleep and memories of the hypnosis coming in.

(01:09:28):
Oh, that was painful. But then, Oh, hi wifey. That's a good moment. Yeah. You know, like, okay. I mean, it's understandable. They just came back from a party. They've been smoking. They've been drinking.
There was this whole thing with the hypnosis. Like, sure. Of course. Why, why not cap it off? We've all been there. She's pregnant. The hormones are going like, sure. Yeah. Both awake in the middle of the night. What else are you going to do?

(01:09:53):
Yeah. The only weird part about it was that she waited like two hours. You know, yeah. The thing that, uh, the thing that really get got me about the scene, like the fingernail, when that like cracked in his brain and the fact that that broke him out of the lovemaking.
Right. But also her reactions like, I can't, I can't, it's too weird. She's like, baby, that wasn't weird. I can, I can show you weird. I know they're like perfect wife. Ladies and gentlemen.

(01:10:22):
I know. Ladies and gentlemen, we just found out why these two were married right there. Outstanding. Absolutely outstanding.
Oh my God. When he goes into the bathroom and he sees that his tooth is just like Jennifer Morrisons was and all that. And then he goes to pull it out. That frickin string of saliva blood.

(01:10:47):
How did they do that? How? Really good question. I was wondering myself. I actually went back and checked because my first thought, my first thought was that it wasn't a mirror. They tricked us that that's Kevin Bacon on the other side of an empty wall.
And the guy in the foreground is a lookalike with a fake tooth. That was my first thought. I would have liked that. I couldn't confirm it for sure. I watched that scene three times to try to figure it out.

(01:11:16):
I couldn't figure it out for sure. That was. That was a visceral like, oh my God, how that hit me.
But the living room TV and then we get our first real glimpse of Jennifer Morrison as that ghost. And this is what I like. There was no like there was a jump scare.

(01:11:37):
But what happened in that is even in the subtitles, you see, you can hear me, can't you? Like there is a terrifying moment in this. Yeah, that's that kind of surprised me because like that was like, this was the first time of watching it with subtitles for me.
The one I'd seen it before. I didn't have that. And so the fact that we actually understand what she's saying there in this moment and that it is a very human like, oh my God, you can hear me kind of thing that changes it completely. Like without the subtitles, it's just kind of a weird glitch thing that just kind of freaks you out.

(01:12:11):
So it's like we get like, depending on whether you're watching it with subtitles or not, you get two entirely different experiences in that scene. And both of them are are good. Both of them are good experiences. Yeah, I'll agree with that.
But then, oh, that creepy kid comes out. You're awake now, daddy. Right. Oh, God. Oh, God. Like what you were just saying, two different things you could take away from that.

(01:12:39):
Neither wrong. Both very good. Both very creepy. Someone told that child about his double speak.
The way that kid goes up and touches bacon's like the side of his head and all that. Right.
Gives him a little Vulcan mind meld. Yeah. Which, interestingly enough, again, back to The Shining and Dr. Sleep, this kid was a better cast of Danny than the kid that they cast as Danny in Dr. Sleep.

(01:13:09):
That kid wasn't even close. I did not understand how the hell he got that part.
You know what I mean? Yeah, you saw Dr. Sleep, you know, like that kid does not look like Danny Rand. Wait, Danny Rand is as Iron Fist.
I do not remember the kid in Dr. Sleep at all. I only remember.

(01:13:33):
So the kid in Dr. Sleep was a little bit more like squinty eyed.
His eyes were kind of like this. The kid for Dr. Sleep was like, hold on, like full on anime eyes.
Things like that. That is like because of me. Like I said, like we've got we've gone into this before. I really stare into people's eyes when I talk to them.

(01:13:54):
And when I watch movies, everything like that, I really kind of key into that because to me that's where a lot of the acting where it's believable or not.
It's so I've been told. Yes. Yes. So I really enjoy that.
The breakfast of brushing it off and then like he's talking about hallucination and all that.
And then the wife, did you fuck her like jealous of my hallucination?

(01:14:19):
Wow, you really are pregnant. Here's the thing is like he's sitting there going like she must have been someone from a memory.
I just don't remember who and her response is like, well, did you fuck her? Like, OK, here's the thing.
I understand this is supposed to be kind of a weird like marriage moment.
If that had been me, if this has been my marriage, like I my response would have been, babe, if I had fucked her, I'd remember who she was.
Please. This is what do you take me for?

(01:14:44):
I don't know if that would have been the right thing to say or the wrong thing to say.
I'm going to be real honest with you there. Like, I don't have the answer on that one.
But then I like that she's like, did you fuck her? And then she walks away. Don't swear so much. Right.
Like little little moments like that. I swear to God, that is David Cope writing.

(01:15:08):
Oh, absolutely. That is like from what we understand, like him writing the paper and Ghost Town, like things like that.
No, like very much. And I'm still very happy I didn't do that live on live when we were going that would.
So dumb. Because Eliana and like finds out that she left something in just to be more open.

(01:15:32):
Right. Now, I do things about the scene.
How every every time we see Eliana from here on out, she's completely unprepared for what's happening.
Like in this scene, he's waking her up with the phone call.
And like next time we see her, she's like having some sort of social engagement, maybe a date.

(01:15:53):
We're not really sure with this lady that she has to kick out and then even says, like, look, when you came in here, we had just like smoked a fatty.
So I'm like, I thought that was a date. Yeah.
But I think she was hunting for men the last time we saw her is the fact that she's got a chick with her.
That kind of is like, OK, you know, yeah, she wins at life. Yeah.

(01:16:15):
I'm sorry. Straight people. Yeah. You got it.
We have limitations. Yeah. Yeah. You got it. Good.
Gay people. You know, you got you got your group.
Bisexual people win. They get the full palette.
They get to experience all of life.

(01:16:36):
You got to I mean, just kind of got a flat out. Give it to them. They win.
Like nothing's off the table. Yeah, there's no sorry. I'm a little bit to that. You have to live with.
No. Yeah. No. For them, it's just about the personality.
They kind of won. But the two things that I wanted to talk about with this scene.
Ebert said that this scene when Bacon was on that telephone pole and all that, he called that a shocker scene.

(01:17:02):
Had nothing to do with the movie, anything like that.
But a scene like that was just nothing but creative, beautiful, and it informed the character's job and everything.
Like it was not a necessary thing to the film.
However, because of how good that scene was and how much of what he called it a shock, a shocker scene. Right.
Ebert said that was one of his favorite scenes of the year.

(01:17:25):
You know, I can kind of see it because, yeah, it tells us everything about.
Like it's there's no exposition work like that.
Like, yeah, there's no need to drop exposition.
We're just seeing him in his job.
And while when he's like clandestinely calling the sister in law instead of calling her from home in front of his wife, he decides to do it from work, which involves tapping into the phone lines directly.

(01:17:54):
Which is really cool because I forgot that you can do that.
I forgot that that was something that they could do. But, you know, that is totally something they can do.
Yeah.
The second thing I wanted to bring up about this is in the book, Bacon's character, the way that he met his wife and the way that got together is he had a premonition about her drowning.

(01:18:19):
And he was a lifeguard and he saved her life.
So when Eliana opened him, she opened him the rest of the way. He was already he had the shine.
Okay, I see. So this wasn't just a thing that yeah that sort of like was latent passed on to his kid.
No, this was something that was active and it was just turned up to 11 by her.

(01:18:43):
Which we she kind of hints at that after the like after the scene where he got hypnotized.
Excuse me, man. What's going on?
But after you got hit, she's like only like 8% of people out there are like that suggestible, which realistically 8%.
That's a pretty damn big number.

(01:19:04):
That's a lot.
Probably should not have gone that high of number. Maybe 0.8% would have been a better way to go.
Maybe. Yes.
But 8% of 8 billion people.
That's a lot of people. I don't like that's that's that's that's that's entire continents worth of population.
But that would explain why like professional like show hypnotists are able to get work.

(01:19:27):
Oh, my God. That actually reminds me the three things about this scene.
The suggestion that Eliana Douglas used that is real world hypnotist stuff and they added music and certain things in there to prevent people in the audience from being hypnotized during that scene, which people got hypnotized in like screenings.

(01:19:52):
So they had to add a couple things in to prevent that from happening.
Interesting. Interesting. OK.
I thought that was cool. I thought that was I thought that was kind of cool.
Oh, then the kid talking to the ghost and then getting the reference for the babysitter.
Like the way that you had the ghost actually like keying in and helping solve her murder.

(01:20:16):
Yeah, I liked it, man. I liked it. This was really, really.
This was put together very, very well.
The ghost is surprisingly aware.
Like that's the thing is this ghost isn't just some sort of like emotional repeat recording like you sometimes see ghosts doing ghost stories. Yeah, not a death echo or anything like.
Yeah, this ghost is involved.
But like and that starts with like what we were saying before, it turns out like she's saying you can hear me.

(01:20:40):
She's she's surprised that that that he can hear her.
And so now and so now she's getting involved. She's telling the kid like, oh, oh, oh, she's looking for a babysitter.
Tell her to call my sister. Get my sister over here.
I don't know if this hit you, but the way that this hit me was the ghost sat down next to Kevin Bacon just to watch TV.
And then when Bacon like responded, she's like, wait, you can hear me.

(01:21:02):
Oh, I did not clue in on that. That is see that just adds to it.
Yeah, that's even better. Yeah, like that.
That's like the ghost is literally just as surprised as he was.
Yeah, all the way up into the point that Kevin Bacon reacts to her.
She's literally just chilling with this family and hanging out with this kid.
It isn't until Kevin Bacon reacts to her that she's all of a sudden like, oh, oh, we can solve my murder.

(01:21:23):
I swear to God, I want to go read the book just to find out if like if there is any kind of description that like, oh, and she was just had her head up.
She was twirling her hair when I turned over and I saw the ghost.
She's like, wait, what? But again, excuse you, what are you looking at me like that for?

(01:21:44):
I mean, I read the was bacon like was the character actually watching TV or was he like sitting next to the radio?
I'm like, I really want to go back.
It's been a long it's been a long time since I've read a book from the fifties.
Yeah, but I do enjoy reading books from like the fourth like all the way back before.
Let's let's say the seventies where film like toxic masculinity, all this stuff, basically like the term that things that we reference as toxic masculinity.

(01:22:14):
Right before that, every book, everything like that, you had the wise older characters that we looked up to and everything like that.
Cracking on the jackass is being like that's like those are fools.
Warriors who don't understand these things, all that right fools.
This whole toxic masculinity and being a tough guy is the right way to go and all the stuff.
That's a relatively new concept.

(01:22:36):
Well, I mean, if we want if we want to take a kind of a sides side step on this from what I have heard.
And granted, this is just from like a few, you know, like online personalities just kind of throwing their own theories out there is that it literally coincides with the rise of the feminist movement of the 60s and 70s.
Because that was that was the times in which the men felt like they had to distance themselves by being more manly.

(01:23:05):
One of the one of the the the points that that this one guy made was how musicals movies that were musicals were universally popular until the feminist movement.
And then men decided that dancing and singing was unmanly and they stopped going to musicals.
Also, basically we're saying the pendulum swing.

(01:23:27):
Exactly. Yes.
Okay, I can see that I can get that it's dumb, stupid and I hate it.
But but here we are.
Back to this. I really enjoyed the the representation over like the red like the red flashes when we see the babysitter show up.
What was crazy to me was the fact that it felt like and I don't know this for sure. I need to go back. I need to go read the book.

(01:23:54):
But it felt like those red flashes were literally red flags warning bacon that is like, oh, God, my sister is gonna she's gonna freak and she's gonna take the kid like maybe you should be here and stuff like that.
Like I actually felt like that was like the ghost kind of teaming up a little bit.
I don't think that was the ghost. I don't think the ghost was was doing that.

(01:24:18):
What I think is that was just kind of a further see where where my assumption of this had to do with kind of a sort of a semi connection to like epilepsy.
There are folks who have such bad epilepsy that they literally cannot even look at a flashing red light at all.
It will give them a seizure. And so red light is literally like just like your brain going ah all at once.

(01:24:45):
And so I don't think it was that the ghost was trying to warn him.
I think this was like like he's well to go and I think it was his premonition that the kid was going to get taken.
He was it was premonition. Yeah. I want to make sure we weren't debating that. Right.
Yeah. No, it definitely was premonition. But I don't think it was it was the ghost giving him that premonition.
I think it literally was just his own latent power just kind of saying saying alarm bells alarm alarm alarm something bad is about to happen.

(01:25:12):
And maybe he didn't know exactly what it was.
But like the fact that he was on the edge all the way up until she actually grabs the kid and starts running out of the house with him that he goes shit.
He she's taking him right now. And he and he bolts. And so. Okay. Yeah. I'll give you that.
But okay. On the way to the game, Don never stops talking on that walk and he plays the creep really well.

(01:25:38):
And the thing that I like I really enjoyed this about it because he never stopped drinking the whole movie.
Oh, yeah. He had been in denial. He'd been everything like that.
You can see the like defense mechanisms and stuff like that. It was there the whole movie. Right.
Yeah. It's crazy how yeah going back and looking at it like the warning signs are all over the place on this one.

(01:26:03):
Yeah. But this is where we're talking about the babysitter listening in on the conversation and then goes to check on Jake.
And he says like I talk to Samantha all the time here in the house. And this is where we find we don't find out here.
But in about 30 seconds, we find out she is Samantha's sister.

(01:26:24):
Right. Which by the way, or by the ghost for the people who would care, by the way, that this this babysitter who is the ghost's sister is played by the same whose name I'm forgetting now.
I looked her up and I should have looked up played by the same person who played Paris Geller in the Gilmore Girls.
So now as much as I was like, God, I know this. Right. Yeah.

(01:26:50):
She's she's too she's a little too old to be Brie Larson, but she kind of looks like her.
I was like, Paris, Paris, Paris. Yeah. Got it. We love Paris Geller.
Man, Gilmore Girls was a much better show than I ever expected.
Same here. Yeah. Same here. That was that was yeah. That got me immediately and it never let go.

(01:27:13):
Yeah, I didn't watch it until it was on Netflix, but everyone was everyone was telling me like, oh, no, you should check it out. And I was like, yeah, OK, whatever.
You know, and then when I finally did like, yeah, I think I tore through the entire series in like three weeks on Netflix because it was.
Yeah, I think that's about the same for me as well. Yeah.
But that was like when I very first moved to L.A., I didn't have any money and I was like, OK, got to find a job, got to get some things in order.

(01:27:39):
Let's kill time by going to the beach and then at night watching Gilmore Girls.
Fucking A, that's the life, bro. Nice. It wasn't the worst.
But then, yeah, the babysitter takes Jake and all the way to a train station, which, yeah, it makes sense why everybody's freaking out.
But the reason she goes to the train station is because her mom works there and this whole confrontation right in front of the cops and tell me where she is.

(01:28:07):
Almost press charges. But dude, Bacon was being super suspicious.
And the most unbelievable, the most unbelievable part of this movie is the fact that the cops never did like a welfare check on the home.
Oh, I know. Yeah. Like, it was crazy.
So it's crazy, too, because it was like we've got this whole thing, the kidnap, you know, we got the supposed kidnapping.

(01:28:28):
Mom is freaking out. Other mom is freaking out. Teenage girl is clearly like going nuts.
Kid is screaming scared. Like accusations are flying all around, you know, and they're like, we're going to, you know, we want to press charges.
You kidnapped her son and she's like, but, you know, my sister and they're like, and like all of a sudden in the middle of it, Kevin Bacon looks at the picture of the sister, recognizes the ghost, goes, no, I've never seen her before.

(01:28:54):
You know, in a very terse, non convincing way. And then when the cop goes, all right, are we pressing charges? And then Kevin Bacon goes, no, let's not press charges. Let's just drop the whole thing.
There is nothing more suspicious on planet Earth than that kind of turnaround right there.
One hundred percent agree. Like like that. That was a bad cut. We were talking about a bad cop in the last movie.

(01:29:15):
That was a bad cop right there. A good cop. No, no, no, no. The last movie was a bad cop. A good cop would have pulled his gun right there.
This is a shitty cop. There's right. Like that cop should have pulled his gun right there.
But then, like you say, like, yeah, Bacon realizes who the ghost is and all this. And they go back and they try to talk to Jake.

(01:29:36):
And then there's that one one thing she says, don't talk like don't talk to the boy. Talk to me. Right.
That. Oh, I wanted more of that. And the movie didn't give us that. And I thought that was a really smart way to go to just kind of.
Flew into that, but like not let it become too much of the movie.
I thought that was really good because they could have brought in an exorcist and had so many things. Right.

(01:30:01):
And one of the things I do, I do appreciate about this and I appreciate these things in movies because the unnecessarily adversarial relationship between married couples is such
is so overused when they when they want to try to create drama in a movie or a TV show, they almost always make that or build that drama around conflict in a domestic relationship,

(01:30:33):
whether it's parents and their teenage kids or between a married couple.
And there was already plenty of that in this movie with the whole like bad reaction to the pregnancy, you know, all that sort of all that sort of stuff.
In most movies, they would add to that by having him keeping it a secret from her when he recognized the girl as the ghost.

(01:30:57):
He in most movies, he wouldn't have said anything, you know, either because like, I don't want to worry you or you're going to think I'm crazy, da da da da, whatever.
He didn't do that in this. They're not even all the way out of the train station when he turns to her and goes, that was the girl.
The ghost that I saw was her. He's got her on his team.
Boom, like that. We don't need any extra unnecessary conflict between this couple.

(01:31:22):
We're getting right to business. No, see, that's the thing.
The story did a good enough job that we didn't need that crap like that. Exactly.
Almost every time that a movie puts that in there, it's because they needed filler.
They're trying to up the stakes. But the story was compelling enough that they didn't need any of that.
But then and this is where it's interesting, because when we talk about the very next scene, that kind of turns around because the kids clamming up, they're trying to get him to talk.

(01:31:48):
They're trying to say, hey, we know you're talking to the ghost, Samantha. Talk to us.
He is using. Yeah. And then the kid finally says, he says out loud, I don't want to talk about it because it scares mommy.
Yep. And that that probably is probably is one of the like the greater cascading moments, because that is when at that moment, son and and father both shut her out.

(01:32:16):
Like the very next scene we get is is her kind of starting to lose her shit because she's noticed that a her husband is getting crazier and B her husband and her son are getting crazier in secret.
So, you know, and so now she's starting to take shit into her own hands and which.

(01:32:38):
Well, not now, but it does. But eventually it's it's start like this is where maybe you start doing into that.
Right. Because next up, they can completely like I love this.
He sits back down on the couch and he's like, he's trying to he's trying to repeat what happens.
Yeah, that was good. Like that was very house of stairs moment.
Yes. Good moment. Very, very good moment.

(01:33:01):
But then they show up at a tailgate, I think it was, and they can just like the way he pops in on the scene is just yet another neighborhood party.
Yeah. And showing up asking about Samantha and I think like you key in immediately.
They bring up Samantha's name and that kid that gives that look right.
Yeah. No, it's like I wrote here. I was like, OK, the football kid did it. OK. Yeah. Little too easy.

(01:33:29):
He was a football kid. He was a prime suspect to start with. Hey.
Yeah, Urb is this crazy depressed and worried about him.
Everything that you were talking about with like the secrets and all that. And Eliana is like, at least he's finally getting interesting.

(01:33:54):
What is it with you two? She doesn't really help much.
Like she she furthers the plot a lot by being unhelpful. That is pretty true.
That is that is a good point. I do love her character role like that. Yeah, I do. I do love her character, though.
Like I honestly if I'm being if I'm being totally honest, if I were the neighborhood, I'd probably date her.

(01:34:16):
So, oh, yeah, yeah, no, no, no, I do agree with that.
And I would hate myself for having done that because that is the kind of woman that I would have dated and been just annoyed every day at how flighty they are.
Like, yeah, no, I have been attracted to women like that in spite of myself many times over. Oh, I'm I'm an idiot like that. I have been.

(01:34:41):
But then we get into what we find out is Bacon's dream.
And then Dunn shows up. They're going to kill you and Maggie both.
And we that kid like like he, you know, bang, bang himself and like his ribs in the dream and Robin the all over the no, no, no, no, no.

(01:35:03):
I hated that. He really hated that.
And then he wakes up from his dream and then almost everything happens.
That's the thing. Boots are in exactly where he was when he woke up from his dream. He goes downstairs. He's hoping Dunn's not there and he's not right.
And he goes on that walk and he is like he does discover the kid bang banged himself.

(01:35:26):
Right. And the thing is.
I don't like how much every piece of that made sense.
Really? Yeah.
How do you how so?
The way that OK, I love how every piece of that came together.

(01:35:48):
But where I say a good movie triggers you.
The way the kid tried to kill himself without damaging his face for a funeral or his for his like parents.
Oh, I see.
How accurate that was to where a lot of people, a lot of people like a lot of teens.
Yeah, they try it.

(01:36:11):
The movie went with some hard, intense realism that they never really put a voice to.
And if you didn't realize that, kind of sorry, but that is what they did.
I was brilliant, painful, and I didn't like it.
OK, I see what you're saying. Yeah. OK. But I loved it.
That's what I'm saying. Right.

(01:36:33):
And you hate it in a in a respectfully artistic way.
Yes, absolutely. Respect the art.
But the way it made me and I respect the way that it made me feel and I enjoy the fact that it did make me feel.
I didn't like the way. Right.
I didn't like the way it made me feel.
I am I am losing a little bit of my audio.

(01:36:55):
Oh, so you're seeing up in the levels. OK, I am. Yeah.
That's why I have to keep track of this. I can't do what you do and I can't look at the camera.
I do see the benefit there, though, because I have so much information in front of me.
I'm trying to keep track of everything during the show. Right. Yeah.
That final line that he says, though, after the kid tries to off himself like my my awake or asleep.

(01:37:21):
Yeah. You could have extended that by like two minutes of him just freaking out about whether he was awake or asleep.
And it would have been.
But the fact that they let it just be small and subtle like that, I thought that was beautifully brilliant.
With everything that's happening, you almost miss it.
I think I missed it the first time, you know, wasn't until the second watching that I caught that.
That's what he said, you know.

(01:37:44):
Well, in all fairness, the first time you tried to watch this, it was not well, let's not get it.
It was not conducive to catching detail.
Yeah, we don't need we don't need to give that inside baseball to the audience.
All right. Now. Now we get our true shining connections.
Yes. Like the mom and the kid off on a walk and she's just trying to have fun with the kid and really like saving the kids like innocence and really doing the thing, doing the mom, doing the parent thing.

(01:38:13):
Because there's massive drama happening on the street, so she's like, let's get him out of the house, you know, and just go have fun. Yeah.
And then I think off on that walk. Hello there.
I didn't mean to do that like Obi Wan that I did.
And the kid. We're back to a doctor sleep reference.

(01:38:34):
Nice. Maybe that's why my brain forced that one out of me.
Yeah.
Following the music to that funeral and Jake's just super happy and very comfortable in the cemetery.
And I'm like,
really?
But then like, yeah. OK, so you get the tall black man looking over top like realizes the kid has the shining.

(01:38:59):
But in this movie, they call it x-ray vision.
Right. Yes.
Very 50s, very 50s, very 50s.
And also probably, you know, they, you know, I would be interested to know what they call it in in the book, because I feel like that was an attempt to make sure like they had to have known while they were making this movie how many parallels it had to the shining.

(01:39:21):
Are you kidding me? They had the kid they had like Jake in this movie goes to the cemetery dressed as Danny in The Shining.
I didn't even notice that.
The red jacket, everything like that's exactly how he goes into the cemetery. He's literally dressed like Halloween Danny.
It was weird.
So, yeah, they they probably they probably were just like, what should we have him say? He's got the twinkle in his eye.

(01:39:45):
He's got the speck like, let's say x-ray vision. How about that?
What is, you know, really, really just like wave a flag.
You bring up a good point. I may I may buy the book.
I may just read that this week just to find out.
I am curious. But wow, to make this scene creepy in the wrong way.

(01:40:06):
What about daddy? Does daddy have the eyes daddy has tell daddy to come see me?
Like, OK, that is the wrong kind of creepy man.
Yeah, this his whole character was just kind of out of left field because first of all, there was no like it's enough that, OK, he's at a funeral.
He like they run into the guy because he's at a funeral while they're just having a casual stroll through the graveyard, as you do.

(01:40:34):
Did he have to be a cop at a cop funeral? Was that totally necessary?
Because that never plays into anything after this. It's just why he's there.
He's there for a funeral, but they made it a police funeral and he's a cop.
And he does not have policemen demeanor at all.
He's got like, you know, owns a secondhand clothing store in the south demeanor.

(01:41:03):
Where I get you there, if you don't have a few cops on the on your force that are like that, I think you're wrong.
Fair point. Fair point.
Where I grew up, we had some cops that, yeah, we all hated. We all knew them by name.
If you saw him, you knew you had to act better than good because this guy was just out for everybody.

(01:41:25):
And then you had the ones that would show up. And like if you got pulled over by them, you'd have a couple of jokes.
You'd find out how he's doing, even if you got your ticket or when you got your ticket, because he'd never let you off with anything.
But you never minded because he was a good dude doing his job. Right.
All right. You know, that's why I got this kind of thing. There's no such thing as a good cop. There are only cops and bad cops.

(01:41:49):
That's fair. Like a good cop is just a cop doing what a cop is supposed to be doing.
That's just somebody doing the actual job. I don't think good.
I don't think the term good cop is even a thing that should be around because you're either a good cop or you're either a cop doing your job or you're a bad cop.

(01:42:10):
Kind of plain and simple. Yeah.
Oh, my God. Now, this made me angry. Kevin Bacon's character as a musician. Kevin Bacon is a musician.
The kid changes the notes that Bacon is playing on the guitar and he does not realize immediately that he is playing paint it black.
I know. Like, what genre did you play in that you do not already sleep to that song?

(01:42:39):
I mean, good God, who doesn't know that lick? Come on.
Then Herb leaves without telling about the cop and the whole situation, even though the cops like tell him to come.
He's like, no, no, no, I'm going to be the one. It's like.
That is classic horror movie decisions. Everything like that. Like, no, he's already losing it. I don't want to push him over the edge.

(01:43:03):
So the thing that's going to bring him back from going over the edge, I'm going to do that.
No, that happens all the time. But weirdly, that is also a very real world thing, too.
It is. Yes. Yeah. I got I got to give that the realism of that.
And then, of course, it's a 90s movie. This is America going to in a horror movie.

(01:43:25):
Creepy situation. Having somebody not speak English. Just scarier. That's right. Yeah.
Which you got to do it. Whatever it to to be to be fair, having having lived in China, I will tell you.
Yes, people speaking totally normally in Chinese sound like they're bitching each other out.

(01:43:49):
When I was in Iraq. Yeah, no. Like people speak in Arabic.
Like often it sounded angry, but that's just how the language sounds like.
Yeah, like like that that lady like yelling at her in Chinese, I'm sure sounded bad.
She probably was saying, oh, yes, ma'am, you just want to take the corner right there.
You have a lovely day. It's probably what I don't know.
I don't speak Chinese, but that is probably what she was saying.

(01:44:12):
It's just that, you know, Chinese is very tone specific and not all those tones are nice to hear.
Have you messed around with A.I. on your computer yet? No.
You can actually ask them like go and just go into your copilot or whatever.
Ask them like, hey, that scene like at this minute mark of the movie, what is she saying?

(01:44:33):
They will tell you.
Like if you like the people who are trying to get it to draw like all of these things and do all this stuff and ask about like formulas about A.I.
and the end of the world and all that stuff, you guys are all idiots and you're doing it wrong.
Literally, if you're curious about anything that's in the actual world.

(01:44:54):
I mean, it's like I'm I'm enjoying it.
OK, I am having my fun. And that and that's fair.
We have talked about before how like I could go on about A.I. for a while.
We'd have to. Yeah, we need to designate an after hour for that.
Yeah. Say that. OK. All right. Fine. Moving on.
The movie time and bath time.

(01:45:15):
The jump scares that they had successfully pulling off and herb just not reacting in any way.
Fantastic decision.
The Dick move with the cold bath water.
Yeah. Also, the representation of her stealing the steam was.
Beautifully crafted. Yeah.

(01:45:39):
I wanted to get your thoughts on that.
Well, I mean, I thought it was I mean, yeah, because we're going into a couple of baseline ghost tropes here about how
when there's a ghost around, it takes the heat from from everything.
That's how you get the cold breath in the room when in a haunted room, stuff like that.

(01:46:01):
And they really did take that like a step further where this was a water that we've already established is hot,
because when she first started running it, she touched it and she was like, oh, that's too hot.
And she kind of adjusts it a little bit.
And then when the tub is finally full, she goes and now it's ice cold because we've seen the ghost there.
Now, granted, she's not a ghost expert.

(01:46:23):
OK, that's her sister.
But I feel like especially considering this is right, right.
Immediately within hours after the psychic dude that she was just talking to telling her you have an angry ghost in your house.
I feel like that should have been taken a little bit more seriously than she took it.

(01:46:46):
I agree. Like for all the things that this movie did perfectly, her character was not always handled perfectly.
And I agree. And yeah, OK, I got to get that again.
But then again, at the same time, she is supposed to be the one normal person in the whole family.
The one like kind of the one doubter, even though she's actually acting like she believes it more than anybody, because.

(01:47:12):
OK, I know it's twenty twenty four.
And yes, white women will go down into dark alleys all the time because of true crime podcasts and everything like that.
No, I know the intrigue has won.
I get it.
But there was a time that no, they didn't.
Everybody knew don't go down dark alleys. Right.

(01:47:33):
And she was making like I struggled with her character, but I know that I was meant to.
So, I mean, that's how that went.
She goes down to check the pilot light and oh, my God, like I couldn't stop laughing about this.
When the kid unplugs the TV and the TV stays on, he's like, right.
That was that that cracked. I was laughing that kid that that kid that that is a standard horror movie trope of the electric object that will not turn off.

(01:48:02):
You try to turn, you know, trying to, you know, whether it's been going back with record players, radios, TVs, we've been doing it.
We've been doing this for years of the of escalating the situation all the way up to yanking the power plug out of the wall.
And it's still on this kid pulled that off.
You know, I don't know. He's like, what, six years old. This kid.

(01:48:23):
Not a clue. Yeah. He pulls that routine off perfectly and also kind of gives it a little bit of air comedy to it.
Like he actually makes it a little funny in a way that, you know, genuinely in a way that it has never been before, where he's he's arguing with a ghost.
And that was like, you know, like in a very long channel and he doesn't want to watch a horror movie. Yep. Right.

(01:48:50):
And it's almost like their siblings now. Like, that's his annoying big sister. She just happens to be dead and haunting his TV.
Yeah. I mean, and this is where, like, we start seeing little hints of vengeful spirit coming in and stuff like that, like a little bit more poltergeist.
But this this hallucination that Bacon has when he goes into that, the way that they filmed that, they sped the camera up and then they had Jennifer Morrison walk slow, but as normal as humanly possible.

(01:49:21):
So. Right. Yeah. So it was an interesting effect. Yeah.
So it's like they told her, try to walk like you're in slow motion, but then we're going to speed it up so that you have this kind of weird jerky movement to you, like you're being sped up, even though you're now walking normal speed.

(01:49:42):
You know, I thought that was a pretty good effect, too. Yeah, I appreciated that, because that's one of those like.
Yeah, it sets off the uncanny valley effect without there being an uncanny valley. And that's and that's yeah.
Yeah. I mean, tricks. Yep. Flat out.
But then Bacon, after being hit, the hallucination, Bacon goes back to Ileana Douglas's place and he's like, he wants to be hypnotized game.

(01:50:07):
But this is what you were talking about earlier, where he shows up and they like just smoked a blunt and they are not prepared for any of this.
Right. Well, and I do back into the hipness. But I do love my personal like I don't I don't know a lot of Spanish, but I do know just enough Spanish to know that what she said to her to get her to leave is I'm sorry, my brother in law is a little crazy.

(01:50:32):
Yeah, I just like how she said they're not like she's like, she's like, hey, Gracious, and I. Right. Right. Yeah.
Yeah, that was, you know, goes into the the hypnotist gets hypnotized again back into the theater and threw a little bit of high anxiety stuff, which I don't actually want to spoil.

(01:50:56):
He finds out that he needs to go dig. And when he comes out of the hallucination, goes to the fridge and grabs that beer, starts chugging it.
And Doug is like, oh, my God, that was the craziest thing while he's drinking beer. Do you want a beer? Right. Oh, my God.
Because she's still so high. Yeah. Like that was that was a fat blunt that they smoked, apparently.
Apparently. No, what I remember the first time I saw this movie, one of the things that that really caught me that like was part of that whole just like really good use of building anxiety is the fact that she's putting him back under a hidden hypnosis.

(01:51:30):
And she's telling she's guiding him through the hypnosis the same way as before.
But things that are happening in the hypnosis vision are in direct contradiction to what she's saying.
Like the hypnosis is now no longer under anyone's control.
Like, I thought that was a really amazing touch where she's just like, you're OK.
You just think about the theater, you're relaxed, you're alone in the theater.

(01:51:53):
And he's like, no, there's somebody here like, oh, shit.
You know, like. That's everything I didn't want to talk about and spoil you.
Oh, it's not that much of a spoiler. There's more.
It's it's but it is big, though, like it's like the surprise of that you don't see it coming.
And I love like it caught me.

(01:52:15):
But. And they get back and there's just a million cartons of orange juice that have taken over the fridge
and bacon and the boy are in the backyard.
And I got to say, man, I loved his response.
Like, what are you doing?
You know what I'm doing.
Even if we don't want to say what I'm looking for, we both know what I'm right for.

(01:52:38):
And what about Jake? Jake is helping.
That's that's that's parenting right there.
That's what this scene is. This scene is.
Look, we know this is crazy, but we're parents.
And we got it.
We got to sit here and try to keep a lid on the crazy as much as we can while going crazy.

(01:53:04):
I said that for me, that was the one big unanswered question was what was with the orange juice?
That's the thing I still am wondering about, because it was an escalating thing where he's constantly getting thirsty.
He's constantly going for orange juice and it caps off with her coming home to a refrigerator full of orange juice cartons.

(01:53:25):
Don't know what that was about.
I liked it. It was a good touch.
But I'm like, I would have liked to see a little bit more about about that just to just to get what was up.
I would have to go back and check.
But the thing that I want to say is, I don't know, maybe like before she got killed, she had like a thing of orange juice with her that she was walking with or something.

(01:53:46):
That's that's what I want to say.
But also maybe seeing ghosts takes the vitamin C out of you.
I mean, and that maybe that was maybe if we're going back, if we're keeping with the shining rules, being psychic burns calories.
Yeah. I mean, I guess.
Yeah. But then the I like this.
She wants to call the cops and everything like that, and then he's like, run it by me.

(01:54:07):
I want to hear how it sounds out loud.
And I mean, dude, that is legitimate.
He's thought about this. He's put that through all that.
And the kid just yelling, be quiet.
I mean, that hurt me. That hurt my heart.
That hurt my soul.
I mean, this this movie had moments in it that just had nothing to do with the horror elements.
It just had to do with a real family going through real problems.

(01:54:31):
And that was a very this is a good movie.
And oh, yeah, we talked about in the kitchen for the apology.
Yeah. Well, I was at the phone for the grandma and to find out that she's going to the hospital and all this.
And he's like, she's not going to.
And then he cuts himself off and she's like, what?

(01:54:53):
And then she kind of keys in on she's like, you knew.
And she just, yeah, how worried and scared she is makes all the sense in the world.
Yeah. And how quickly that turns to because like that is such because there's that moment where they're like,
she's dealing with the fact that her grandmother just died while also dealing with the fact that her husband's psychic powers are getting to that degree.

(01:55:19):
And that takes a complete 180 when she's like the funeral's on Sunday and he's like, do I have to go?
But it's such a lack of understanding.
But her lack of understanding, I'm still weighing whether it's understandable, her whether her lack of understanding is understandable.

(01:55:42):
Right. She is seeing this. She knows there's a ghost there.
She knows who the ghost is. She knows all of this stuff.
She has seen how it connects to the real world, all of these things.
And she's like. Every she is trying.
I can't tell whether she was being supportive, trying to get in the way of it, running away from it.
It was like I would say probably more more than anything.

(01:56:08):
It was probably a touch of like, look, she'll still be dead next week and then we can look for the body.
I'm in crisis right now.
You know, my grandmother just died.
Can we put your month long crazy on hold for two fucking days?

(01:56:29):
Like that, that's not an unreasonable ask.
I don't really want to. I don't think she went about it very well.
And that's probably where the conflict was.
But at the end of the day, that's real people.
I mean, it just is the thing. Yeah.
Real people are not going to respond perfectly.
You're not going to be able to sit there and especially not an emotional moment.
But no, God, no, no, no, no.

(01:56:51):
But Kevin Bacon being mad about eight hundred dollars a month for a house and it's not perfect.
In in Chicago. Yeah.
I mean, my God. Yeah.
The fact that she cut the water even by 1990s standards, eight hundred dollars a month for that place is a goddamn steal.

(01:57:15):
Like that's nuts.
I don't know. I don't know.
I don't know. Like if you're talking Oaks Park, Chicago, sure.
I think it was Logan Square, wasn't it?
That was the that was the name on the train station when they went there.
It said Logan Square.
Logan Square is a nice neighborhood.
That's I mean, I don't know much about Chicago.
I know you live there for a bit.
I've only worked there from time.

(01:57:38):
Renting the jackhammer and that maniacal laughter was that was fun.
I'm guessing like if they actually did bring a real jackhammer and I'm guessing like Kevin Bacon was having a great time.
Yeah, this is a bit of a this is a bit of a tangent.
Can I go on one tangent real quick?
Yeah. All right. Go ahead.
Okay. The scene where Kevin Bacon starts taking the pickaxe to the concrete floor in the basement, that very start when it all of a sudden occurs to him to dig there and he's taking the and he's just driving the pickaxe into the into the floor.

(01:58:13):
This to me was a great example of the paradox of being a working actor in that under no circumstances should anybody be asked to do that without safety goggles on.
But they had to do it to show how crazy he was.

(01:58:37):
In that scene, like in any like to be an actor and go we need you to start using a pickaxe full strength at a concrete floor where let's be honest, you could be blinded by that if a large enough piece of concrete flies into your eye.

(01:58:58):
No one should ask you to do that without safety goggles on, but he had to do it without safety goggles on for that scene to prove that to show just how nuts, his character is going in the, in the.
What's the word I'm looking for.
The heat of the moment kind of thing that brought him into to starting that at that job, which is then kind of like added to the next scene where he's gone full on he's brought in a jackhammer and we watch him put the safety goggles on before starting the jackhammer

(01:59:32):
like, like that that to me has always been an amazing part of being an actor where you have to actively viciously fly in the face of OSHA rules in order to in order to get the scene right, you know.
That's why they get paid up.

(01:59:55):
So much more money to swing that jackhammer than somebody who does for 20 years. No, that's a very good point. That is a very good point. Yeah, I mean, yeah, you do one movie where you're swinging a jackhammer you're the star of the movie and it's a big movie.
You're making more than somebody who's going to be swinging pickaxe or working jackhammer will in 20 years.

(02:00:16):
No, that's that's true.
That is a very good point. You know, is what it is.
So, herb calls from the funeral and she decides to go on her way to pick him up, and we get a good look at how rough the condition the house is in and bacon's been destroying everything that was, which is funny because it was but also, I didn't realize it until the second watch.

(02:00:46):
He, he made a crack about that to Larry at the beginning of the movie is like, yeah, we're just poking holes all over your house. Right. Yeah, literally. Like I like I thought that was a fantastic thing that I completely didn't catch was wildly unnecessary, but did not belong in this movie at all.
But that's just cheeky stuff. That was fun.
Is that was that just a good joke.

(02:01:08):
Was that was that just was that just a random good joke or was that supposed to be another was his perma positions. Okay, I think it was a setup. I think that was like him like the people who like you know the people who decide just on the day to take a different route to work and so like when they allude to the fact that like there are millions of psychics out there but they're just the ones who decide to go this way instead of this way and things like little stuff like that.

(02:01:35):
The ones who make jokes about things that then come true.
Like I thought I felt there was more of like a touch to that. And I just I just didn't like that it was a mission. Okay, yeah.
Because like, Elias, because he said that before he got hypnotized and then right, like I thought that it would make sense but like I said, I would like to go watch or read the book, because I kind of want to see like all the differences like because it was it took him 40 years to turn this book into a movie so right.

(02:02:05):
Yeah, I'd like to see that. Read that. Excuse me.
JP kid. Again, one more time Jake is like, I don't want to go back. Why the feathers. And I was like, huh. And then they paid that off very very well. Yeah, here's kind of a thing like you were talking about like OSHA standards and all that.
In this scene for this part of the movie, they were way screwed, because they needed the kid to be there for certain parts of it and not go in there for the funeral. But that actor was over his legal amount of time to be on set so they scoured that neighborhood they just went

(02:02:44):
door to door knocking on people's houses until they found a kid that looked close enough, they gave him a quick haircut. That is not that is not the actor in the end of the movie. That is an extra that just got jacked from the house down the street in that neighborhood, got a quick haircut
and tossed in the movie. So they so they could keep to legal standards.

(02:03:08):
I didn't even notice I didn't like it never occurred to me that that was a different child. Wow. I thought that was a cool one. Yeah.
Oh my god. Yeah. Going through the entire house and doing like breaking everything and then just the accidental bump is the thing that did it and revealed it. I mean, come on. Then the brick finds the brick wall finds her. And then we get that tooth which reminds me of that fricking bathroom scene which was

(02:03:41):
Wow of a scene. Then the full flash to a very recognizable Jennifer Morrison and we learned the full story. Right. Yeah. The two football brothers. They tried to SA her and then they wound up accidentally on a live no not accidentally. It was. It's a rough intentional. Yeah. Yeah. The done boys are the worst kind of men.

(02:04:09):
So we find out the full story of what happened to her. The flash is over and we get to hear the remnants of the kid humming from the beginning. Ah, because the movie opened on the kid humming and for some reason when he came out of this flash we got to hear the same kid humming.
I don't know why. Like, like, do you is there anything that kind of clicks on that? No, no, no, I don't know. I noticed it. I noticed it because like the creepy kid humming is one of the creepiest things in all movies. I mean, it's a very safe bet. Yeah. That's I didn't know why they did that and still curious.

(02:04:50):
But, okay. I like the sound of jackhammering and all that brought one of the done boys over to see bacon in the basement and that he you know, and I thought that was I thought that was great. Like it was actually explainable why somebody was in that window because of all the jackhammering.

(02:05:11):
Right. Yeah, like it seemed like everybody noticed and that kid was the one who like actually took it the extra mile of going and looking probably because he had the he had the he was justified. He had the reason to do that. He knew he made sense all the way through. Yeah. Yep.
And just kind of did.
He goes to get the dad. Yeah, show him what happened. Give him the tell him so he doesn't find out from anybody else. Right. And then we definitely do think that the dad on alive himself because it was just you know what were we supposed to do.

(02:05:51):
What and it's and it is interesting because it's like yeah we kind of do like that. That's what's interesting about his character about Dunn's character is the fact that he is kind of an a hole throughout the movie.
We do find out pretty quickly that he knew about this and helped cover it up. But we're also now finding out that this has been destroying him like he may be an a hole but he's not inhuman.

(02:06:16):
He has been dealing with an ungodly amount of throughout this entire thing.
I get that you're calling him an a hole and I get that the girls parents would call him an a hole and I get that a lot of people would.
What would I have done in that situation. I don't know if I would have done anything different.
Like that's I mean I mean like I want to think that I would do something different. I absolutely would. I would like to give myself that kind of credit.

(02:06:50):
But I also would like to give myself the kind of credit to say that I would never have been a slave owner. You don't know.
Okay. I see what you're saying. You just don't know who you would have been who you would be in those situations and everything like that because you just are looking at it and talking about it with the luxury of not being affected by anything around it.

(02:07:12):
I see your point there. But when I when I say a hole I don't mean like he's a bad guy bad guy. I mean like the fact that he's you know constantly. Oh Captain Creepy on all the girls and stuff like that.
Exactly. Yeah. We're not. Yeah. We're not meant to be like surprised like it's not one of those things where it's like oh he's the nicest guy in the world and it's such a shock that he's involved in this.

(02:07:38):
No no no when we find out he's involved in this we're like oh he okay. Yeah. Now that guy. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I'll give you that.
But then Harry and the other brother show up and I got to give I got to give Harry the performance notes or credit on this one right shows up and he actually does kind of deliver a little bit just like a concerned landlord.

(02:08:05):
But at the same time he acted too well as like in character. Honestly the character should not have been able to pull off that level of surprise and concern about his house and all that stuff.
That was the actor dominating the character. Like when you have a truly amazing singer. Well they have a little bit harder time singing poorly. True. Because they are so good at it. This is kind of what I saw there you had too good of an actor who could not act like a bad one.

(02:08:40):
Probably true. But on the other hand like the big giveaway is when he does basically like force his way into the house and walk into the house and sees what Bacon's been doing to the house ripping the floors up and all that sort of stuff.
The fact that he doesn't immediately fly off the handle is the dead giveaway that he's acting like that's what that's where you know oh oh yeah no this this is clearly an act because yeah because he's he's not he has not lost his temper.

(02:09:14):
He's actually being really really chill. He's obviously pretending like where I get that there was still like there was a moment of genuine like there was it felt too genuine.
And not like it didn't feel eerie enough because of how genuine of what I mean. I see what you're saying there but I guess I didn't get that because there was the really good inclusion of having the kid standing right next to him the kid that we know did it.

(02:09:42):
No the situation no no hold on the situation was perfectly tailored to I'm talking specifically about the performance you're going to the situation. I'm saying he gave too legitimate of a performance for the concern over the physical parts of the house that I think that he went too far in on that.
Okay when he came in like no he wasn't flipping and screaming and stuff like that but he came in and it seemed like legitimate concern over the house. Not what we didn't see I guess I just wasn't I did I personally didn't get that because like because the situation,

(02:10:18):
the kids sitting there the kids looking nervous we know why he's there. Like for me it was more of like we're looking for a legitimate reason for bacon to say get the fuck off my porch without it being like too rude or weird, but he's not given him that he's not given him any excuse to to be outwardly suspicious of this guy and that was kind of the point of the scene was that if he was just a little bit off, then bacon would have gone like I'm calling the cops.

(02:10:47):
I don't think we're talking about the same thing because I agree with literally everything that you're saying. I'm saying the performance he gave was not the right one for that scene. Not bacon, bacon's performance was right. Not the kid, the kid's performance was right. The uncle, I think he gave a slightly different performance than what would have actually been appropriate in that moment because there was too legitimate of concern over the physical part of the house.

(02:11:16):
There was too legitimate of concern that went in there. But and that's what I'm saying. Like you keep like you keep coming back with like argument sounding stuff and I'm not disagreeing with any of it.
Okay. Yeah, I guess I just didn't see it. Like I didn't see anything wrong with that scene personally and I and I'm just trying to figure out. Yeah.
Because I believed him over what was happening. Like I believed him about the wrong things. That's why. Okay. See, I didn't get that at all. That's the thing. I didn't get that at all. I got the scene what it was supposed to be. I felt anyway.

(02:11:53):
You know, it got there and it landed and it arrived there. But like I said, if like the concern that he came in, it felt like it went in the in the wrong direction and then it roped around really, really quick.
So like I said, the actor delivering the scene. Okay, but the character was not a master class actor. So when he came in with the coolest of heads and all and everything like that, that felt and that felt inappropriate to the scene because you have a regular ass dude who just happened to own the house knew about it helped cover it up.

(02:12:31):
Be this unbelievable like espionage level actor on all of these. Oh my God. My house like all of these things. It felt like he should have had a little bit more to him to actually sell the creep factor because the average person would not be able to hide that perfectly.
Okay, I guess I disagree. I'm not saying I get that you disagree. Stop going into your disagreements. I'm just saying.

(02:12:59):
I'm stopping it. I disagree.
And herb shows up in the nick of time and gets the right vibe and the knife.
And I like the knife was put in our purse because she was going to meet Neil in that alley and everything like that. Like, right. Every part of this movie was set up perfectly. I will give it that.

(02:13:21):
But then done shows up with the gun like out of the basement and all that which we thought he unalived himself because of that single shot when which is yeah interesting I'm wondering like now I'm wondering what what the hell did what did he shoot in my mind I'm like did he shoot the girl because he was just mad or something like that I don't know.
But

(02:13:42):
the camera work for the representation of Sam spirit being freed was gorgeous. Yeah, I was very well done. Very simple cinematography tricks everything like that. Yep. However, it was just that is how you do that. Yep. That is a fantastic way of like moving on being like that was didn't need to be super flashy didn't need to be expensive.

(02:14:06):
It was like we are setting a mood here and here's a very simple way to do it effective. Yeah.
And I appreciate it.
The line or the. What do you call this not tagline on stone.
Kicker.
I don't know but with the headstone for the, the girl that had been missing our ghost play. Oh right. And it says, at rest, and I thought that was the right thing to put there.

(02:14:38):
Just kind of plain and simple I thought that was right I thought that was subtle and clever. Yep, and this is where I think they could have had a lot of fun, and just had them like in the mountains, on the way to Colorado or something like that.
It's really unclear about where they're going from Chicago. Right. But apparently they just move into the way wrong neighborhood. Right. Yeah, it sounds like there's a dead body in every single one of these houses. Right.

(02:15:12):
So final thoughts on stir of echoes. Final thoughts on stir of echoes. Well, it's interesting, like I've come to the conclusion, like I said before, I don't think this counts as a horror movie. I think this is an interesting sub genre.
It has tension, and there are jump scares. I wouldn't call it a horror movie. This is a mystery suspense and you've got your got your layers first you've got your mystery movies and that's your you know gumshoe solving a mystery type thing, then you've

(02:15:45):
got your mystery suspense, where it's a mystery, but there's still an element of danger, where solving the mystery brings you closer to danger, you know, that's your mystery suspense. This is this sort of like next level sub genre, which frequency
falls into the same category, where the instigating event that both brings our protagonist to the mystery while also bringing our protagonist to the danger is some sort of sci fi fantasy elements such as ghosts, or, you know, a radio that talks through

(02:16:21):
whatever. This is a whole other sub genre of its own this sort of mystery suspense slash supernatural, not quite horror, pretty close, but it is its own thing in my opinion, and I'm actually kind of interested to see how many other movies there are to
fit that because, like, of my mindset like this and frequency are the only ones I can think of now because they are so alike in that regard. So now I'm like I need to go on a hunt to find more movies like this because it turns out, I really like them, apparently, well, I'm thinking

(02:16:52):
the longer that we go with the show, the more we're gonna find like that. Here's hoping fingers crossed knock on wood, the whole thing.
All right, so jumping into the movie fight is going to be pretty easy and hard, because round one very clearly goes to Sir of Echoes.
Right. Yep. Yep. Definitely a lot of work put into making us really invested in these people.

(02:17:15):
Yes, round three. It goes to the wrong guy that this movie has not had enough acclaim, it is way too funny for how many people have not seen it.
The fact that this is not one of those like household classics alongside, you know, a lot of Jim Carrey movies. Right, exactly. Yeah.
Like this. I put that as kind of like, no, the one that I'm going to recommend them more going going forward is the wrong guy. I feel like most people have already seen Sir of Echoes.

(02:17:46):
Probably. Yeah. Yep.
But round two, which one pulled off what it wanted to in a better way. Which one just nailed what they were going for.
Because here's the thing, they're both perfect in that. Yeah, exactly.
Hmm.
And it's tough because it's like a lot of times I have I have I would tie break this one on the risks factor.

(02:18:13):
And I don't think I can even do that with this because in this one, we have the technical risks that Sir of Echoes took like mostly with the movie theater and stuff like that.
But then we also have the risks that wrong guy took in the fact that like we've said, most of the jokes and the gags in this movie should not have worked.

(02:18:37):
They just did somehow because of the performance or the timing of them worked out so well.
Like they both took risks and nailed it.
So the cinematography tricks that Sir of Echoes went with that were way more intense than anything that was tried and wrong guy.

(02:18:58):
Right. Specifically with Jennifer Morrison as the ghost, having her move slow and normal while speeding the camera up to give that kind of ghost effect.
Right.
Incredible. The representation of her spirit being freed at the end of the movie.
I thought that was absolutely amazing.

(02:19:19):
Sure.
But also like the Woody Allen vibe of the wrong guy is just that's almost that is kind of a lost art form.
Right.
We don't really get movies like that.
And I feel like this is one of the last ones.
Right. And top it off with like what you were saying, like the Looney Tunes shit, you know, the very, you know, like I've been carrying you.
I thought you wanted me to like like no one does shit like that anymore.

(02:19:43):
Just goes like this is so dumb.
Well, OK, there's that too. But even then, like, like, well, no.
OK, I guess that's true. Yeah.
It's that whole like, you know, maybe an offhand joke in the writers room that they go, maybe we should actually go ahead and put it in.
Like it felt like an inside joke amongst us here.
But let's throw it in and see what happens. And it somehow works.

(02:20:06):
There was a lot of that in Deadpool, but I'd say there there was more of that in the wrong guy.
I think I'm going to I think I'm going to go with the wrong guy on this one.
Mr. Rebecca. Wait, hold on. The hypnotizing. Right.

(02:20:29):
I'm never going to forget that.
I.
Reap factor the the building of the tension effects of bringing that stuntman in to really stab himself through the hand.

(02:20:50):
And even when you get like even just outside the the the hypnotized scene, when he's having the dream where he remembers getting hypnotized,
they throw in the third person view of him literally floating through the theater on that chair.
And that was that was pretty cool. Yeah.

(02:21:15):
Yeah, I guess I guess I think I think I think we're going to go with stirvekos on that one by a nose.
You really want to give the wrong guy a lot of credit.
That's the thing.
Like that is a movie that has been missed out on that more people should see.

(02:21:38):
All right. All right. Stirvekos for the win.
But that was close. Yeah.
Having two movies that are so wildly different be that close.
Yeah. Which I guess they just got like we mentioned before, like, you know, liar, liar.
You know, if you are like liar, liar and wrong guy would make a great Jennifer Tilly double feature.

(02:22:04):
Oh, easily. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I'd easily give you that.
Yeah, God, she like why didn't she star in more stuff, though?
Because she's a side character in both those movies. Yeah.
I think probably her biggest I think her biggest starring moment, I think, is probably the Chucky movies.

(02:22:25):
Ever since she became bride of Chucky. I think that's I think that's been like her main go to thing.
I think she you could almost say she's like semi retired.
She basically just comes out of retirement after. Yeah, she comes she comes out.
She'll do she'll do a Chucky movie every couple of years and that's all she needs to do.
She's happy now. She spends the rest of her time playing poker.
Look at all the I mean, she has residuals on thousands of episodes of stuff.

(02:22:48):
Yeah. Doing fine. She's fine.
Yep. All right. So that's going to be stir of echoes is going to take it for this one.
I have an idea for a lot of the ones that I don't want to call them the losers because they're too good to be called.
Right. The ones that don't make it to the tournament.
I have an idea. Okay. Think about that after.

(02:23:10):
But I do have a little bit of a challenge for you because I brought you the Halloween movie this week.
You what do you got for me that's more spooky or October.
Oh, well, that wasn't what I had in mind for today, but I do have something on my list for that.
Well, I figured you should be like, I mean, I know how uncomfortable you are with horror movies and I keep pushing them to you.

(02:23:34):
Maybe you should just tell me one of the ones that you're like that you like and we'll go with that.
Okay. In that case, probably if there is such a thing as a favorite scary movie for me, this is it.
And it's called Arachnophobia. You've seen Arachnophobia, right?

(02:23:55):
Oh, yeah. I think this is our fourth John Goodman movie that we're doing on our family.
Maybe more. It's maybe number five. Because here's the funny thing.
Before you said that, before you said I wanted a scary movie, the movie I was going to recommend also has John Goodman in it.
Okay. So why don't we do a John Goodman double feature then?
Oh, yeah. You want to do both my recommendations? No.

(02:24:19):
Okay. Oh, you've got a John Goodman.
There's a movie I've been trying to show you since before we ever even started this show.
Oh, I know where this is going. Okay. All right.
Let's get let's get some royalty in this with King Ralph.
Okay.
Show you what an American in the 80s who would have been King of England would have been like.

(02:24:42):
Okay. Also, this is not like yeah, there are moments in King Ralph that are absolutely that should be absolutely iconic.
Anybody who has seen it will basically go and like bring up the scene. It's awesome.
Okay. I am very excited for covering that one with you.
So all right. Next week is a double feature for John Goodman, King Ralph and arachnophobia.

(02:25:09):
All right. Live long and prosper, everyone.
Thanks for joining us, guys.

All Episodes

H.Y.S.T? | S2E3 | The Wrong Guy & Stir of Echoes

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal

On Purpose with Jay Shetty

Dateline NBC

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}H.Y.S.T? | S2E3 | The Wrong Guy & Stir of Echoes