January 19, 2025 • 20 mins
Celebrated actress, singer and author Mandy Gonzalez (who currently stars as Norma Desmond in the hit Broadway production, Sunset Boulevard) joins us for an inspiring discussion about her journey with curly hair and how embracing her natural texture became a source of confidence. Her candid insights reveal how her parents' resilient love story inspired her own fearless path on Broadway, where she has starred in iconic productions like Hamilton and In the Heights. Lorraine speaks with Mandy about her personal journey with breast cancer, which began just before the COVID-19 pandemic. As the first in her family to face this diagnosis, Mandy recounts the importance of her community and the emotional impact of the chemotherapy treatment on her hair.
In Calling All Curls, Lorraine offers practical tips for curly hair care, particularly for those who color their hair, sharing essential advice to preserve moisture and vibrancy. We recorded this episode before the fires, we hope that Marcy, her family and all of our listeners from the LA area are safe. We have posted links to organizations that are helping those in need.
Episode links:
ChemoCouture, https://krystacouture.com
Support for LA Fire Victims:
The Labelle Foundation
Project Hope
Altadena Girls
Gofundme - Donate directly to those affected
+ + +
Lorraine Massey is a curl advocate whose lifelong dedication to understanding and caring for curly hair has helped drive a global phenomenon of curly acceptance. As the founder of the groundbreaking Curly Girl Method, she has empowered countless individuals to embrace their natural texture. Lorraine is also the author of three critically acclaimed books: Curly Girl: The Handbook, Silver Hair: A Handbook, and Curly Kids: The Handbook.
CurlyWorld website:
https://www.curlyworld.com/
CurlyWorld Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/curlyworldllc/
Host: Lorraine Massey
Producer: Susan Kaplan
Engineer: Dan Strong
Original Music: Cyrille Aimee
Show: If Your Curls Could Talk
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hi, I'm Lorraine Massey, founder of the Curly
Girl Method.
Welcome to If your Curls CouldTalk.
Join us as we talk to our veryspecial guests, sharing their
curly hair journeys, and takequestions from you, our
listeners.
This is If your Curls CouldTalk.
My guest today is MandyGonzalez.
(00:22):
She's a singer and an actressand is known for playing
incredibly strong women.
She is best known for her rolesas Nina Rosario in the Heights,
Elphaba in Wicked and AngelicaSchuyler in Hamilton.
It is thrilling for me toannounce that she is guest
starring as Norma Desmond inSunset Boulevard on Broadway,
(00:43):
and on top of that, she's aprolific author of children's
books.
I'm excited to share thisconversation with you today, Hi
Mandy.
Thank you for being with ustoday on If your Girls Could
Talk.
How are you, Hi Lorraine?
Speaker 2 (00:57):
I'm so thrilled to be here with you.
I'm doing great.
I'm so excited for you and thisnew podcast.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Oh, thank you, Mandy.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
We have been friends for a long time and our
friendship started because I dida show with a friend and client
of yours, miss Judy Kuhn, and Iasked Judy, I said where do you
go in New York to get your haircut?
And she said, oh, I have thebest person.
And at that time my hair wasreally long and curly and I had
(01:30):
never gone to anybody thatspecialized in curly hair or
anybody like you, and it was alife-changing experience for me
because all of a sudden I feltlike my curls were beautiful and
that's the first time I reallyfelt like that.
I've read your books and theCurly book and I had so many
(01:52):
similarities, as do so manycurly kids in our world.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
I would love to talk to you about you as a child.
I want to know about you beinga curly girl when you were
little.
Do you have any memories?
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I think every curly girl has memories, especially if
they are in a family wherenobody else has curly hair.
A lot of the put downs stemmedfrom my hair the mean things
that your siblings say, and mymom had no idea how to do it, so
she would just brush it andthen it would just be overly
frizzy.
This was before hair gel Hairgel was invented.
(02:29):
My mother just didn't know whatto do, so I was constantly just
going around with really shortfrizzy bangs and really frizzy
hair.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
And look at you now.
Mandy wrote a book calledFearless, and it's for all kids,
all ages, isn't it?
Yeah, all kids up to you know100, I would say I'm just going
to let you talk because you area beacon of hope to so many.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Oh well, you know, lorraine, my journey with
Fearless started.
I mean, it's kind of been withme my whole life, I think.
Yes, you know I've talkedbefore.
I think about how my parentsmet and my parents met as pen
pals during the Vietnam War andmy father was drafted when he
was 19.
My mother was 17 and wanted tojoin the Peace Corps, but her
(03:23):
parents said absolutely not, andso she did the next best thing,
which was she wrote to soldiersthat maybe didn't have anybody
to write to, and one of thesoldiers was my dad and he sent
her letters and a picture andshe was like ooh, and their
friendship and their love grewthrough those letters.
At the end of every letter myfather said I'm going to survive
(03:48):
this and one day we'll betogether.
Love always, paul, with two L'sfor the always.
And he didn't have much when heended his time in service, but
he had a car and he had anaddress and he had a sense of
direction, thank goodness, andhe showed up on my mom's
doorstep and when she opened thedoor her life went in a
direction.
I think the fearless thingabout their story is so much
(04:09):
about that, but also the factthat their families were not
supportive of their love atfirst because they were from two
different cultures my father'sMexican, my mother's Jewish and
at that time it was like reallytaboo.
And so my parents ended upeloping and they had three of us
and they've been together nowfor 50 years.
(04:31):
And so I feel like that wordfearless has been with me since
birth from that story that Iguess I follow and I admire so
much.
And then when I got into theaterand I started to start my own
journey, when I moved to NewYork City from California, I
started to craft how I wanted tolive.
(04:53):
There's no blueprint how to dowhat you want to do and how to
get your dreams.
I start, but I just had thisinternal drive to move forward.
And when I talk aboutfearlessness and things like
that, it's never because I don'thave any fear.
I definitely have a lot of fearand I'm definitely a fearful
person.
I'm just the kind of personthat chooses to feel that fear
(05:16):
while I keep moving forward andthat has served me, I think,
throughout my life.
When I first started in NewYork on Broadway, I was in the
show my first show I thinkthroughout my life when I first
started in New York on Broadway.
I was in the show.
My first show, I think, wasAida.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
That's when we met, I think.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
Yes, that's when we met.
So Aida happened and at thattime, you know, fans and people
that admired you could write toyou to the theater.
They'd have to write a letterand they would take time to get
there and then I would writethem back and that would take
time.
And all of a sudden, now thatI'm in this new show, hamilton
you know, I started in 2017 withthat show and all of a sudden,
(05:53):
people can connect with youreally fast and right away, you
know, through your socialchannels and things like that,
and I had a lot of peoplereaching out to me with feelings
of loneliness, feelings thatthey didn't belong, and I wanted
to do something about it.
And so I did and I tweeted outif you don't have a safe space,
you can be part of mine.
(06:14):
And I put hashtag fearless squadand I didn't know that
thousands of people would wantto be a part of it.
So then I became this fearlesssquad leader and I had to think
about fearlessness and to befearless I think I always put it
in this kind of two words tofear less, because I try to do
(06:34):
that whenever I can, as often asI can, but I think that it just
kind of started.
I really took that leadershipto heart.
Then it was like what do I wantto do with this platform that I
have?
And I had been writing a lot ofchildren's stories and I wanted
to create characters that looklike me and my friends and tell
(06:57):
our stories, but in my way, yes,and so I created the character
Monica Garcia, who is an11-year-old from a small town in
California with big dreams ofgoing to Broadway, and she gets
that call.
She submits a self-tape whichyou can do nowadays and she gets
the call that they want to seeher in New York and she becomes
(07:20):
the understudy to the understudyon Broadway.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
And I imagine the identity of Marcia Garcia is
connected with her hair too, andI imagine this is you, isn't it
?
It's connected to you.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Curly hair was something that was so important
to me because it was like if Ihad seen that as a kid, if I had
seen another character that Iwas really into, that also had
(07:51):
curly hair and would play withthat all the time, didn't know
what to do with it, it was justkind of all over the place.
I would have been like, oh, I'mnot alone.
It would have been great that'samazing.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Yeah, you have the most beautiful curls, but during
covid, though, you went throughsomething I mean, would you
want to talk about it?
Is that okay?
Speaker 2 (08:19):
absolutely, absolutely so.
Right before covid, october22nd of 2019, I went in for my
first mammogram and I wasdiagnosed with breast cancer.
I'm the first person in myfamily to have been diagnosed,
so it was a huge shock, asanybody that's been diagnosed
with cancer knows.
Everything seems likeeverything happens really fast
(08:39):
because you're in a state ofshock and you have to circle
into all these appointments andfiguring out what your plan is,
and for me, I think in some ways, that was one of the scariest
parts was not knowing what wascoming next, not knowing what
the plan was For somebody who issuch a planner.
In some ways, I'd like to bebusy.
I'd like to have some sort ofcontrol.
(09:00):
This was like totally out of mycontrol and it's silly to say,
but one of my biggest fears waslosing my hair, because when I
found out that I would have tohave chemo, that was a big fear
of mine, because I have adaughter and I didn't want her
to be scared or I wanted toshield her from as much as
possible after that diagnosisand my doctor said that I would
(09:24):
be on a certain type ofchemotherapy where I would lose
parts of my hair but not all ofit and I wore a cold cap and
that really helped.
But then, after I was done withmy treatment, I had to cut my
hair so that it would make lessof an impact for the hair that I
was losing.
And then, as I was healing, andit all happened during pandemic
(09:46):
, so I was home and I couldn'tgo get my haircut, I couldn't
get trims or anything like that,so I just kind of had to be
with this hair that had beenthrough so much Within this past
nine months.
When I finally got to go and seeyou, I felt like at that time I
was doing a lot of things totry to make myself look like I
(10:08):
looked before, because what washappening was that my hair was
kind of straightening out incertain places, yeah, and I felt
really frustrated by that.
That's not who I am.
I have curly hair and that'spart of my identity.
And then I didn't know reallywhat to do, like on my own, so I
would just curl it with acurling iron and every time I
(10:29):
did that I would be like, oh myGod, the rain would be so bad.
I was like frying my hair.
I honestly didn't know what todo.
And then when I finally wasable to come in, I think as I am
even now, like I'm still in aprocess of healing from
something that was verytraumatic for me and I talked to
(10:50):
you about it I unloaded a lotbecause I felt like it was a lot
pandemic and cancer and allthis working stuff, and you were
like, okay, I have an idea.
And then you just started andyou said, oh my God, they're
coming back, like your curls arecoming back to life.
And a lot of people that Ibecame friends with in my
(11:10):
support groups and things likethat, a lot of people that had
lost their hair, it had comeback curly, and so Chemo curls.
I think, yeah, it's just sointeresting, my curls and my
hair and how that's been a partof my journey too.
You know, as a kid and beingthe only one with curly hair the
only person really in my familywas my abuelita that had curly
(11:32):
hair.
It's funny, as I get older Isee myself in her.
Sometimes when I look in themirror I go, oh my God, who is
that?
It looks like my abuelita in somany ways.
I've been through all of thesethings.
I've become a mom, I've becomea working mom, and I went
(11:53):
through cancer, we went throughpandemic, we have gone through
so much and now I feel like myhair is at this place of like
we're on this next step and itfeels like a little bit of a
balance beam.
I did have a lot of friendsthat I looked to during that
time, and one of my friends wasmy friend, krista Rodriguez.
Oh yeah, I was a fellow actressand she is a breast cancer
(12:14):
survivor and she is somebodythat was one of my first calls
because I didn't know anybodyelse in my community that had
gone through this, and so it wasreally important for me to kind
of create my fearless squadduring this so I could ask
questions, and she was so openand she's been so open through
everything and she created thiswebsite called Chemo Couture.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
Oh, chemo Couture.
Speaker 2 (12:36):
Oh, that's right, and it was so it was so inspiring
because she was also young goingthrough it and it was like,
okay, well, if I'm going to gothrough it, I want it to be
fashionable and in some ways,her advice that really helped me
(12:58):
during my process.
When I had to go to my chemosessions with a mask on and I
could wear a cute hat, I couldfeel like I could bring part of
myself into the room, becausefashion's always been important
to me, and I could paint mynails or I could do things like
that and feel good about myself.
But had I not had that resourceof knowing, had she not been so
vulnerable and shared her story, I wouldn't have known that
that existed.
Speaker 1 (13:20):
We're so grateful that you're on here and sharing
with us.
So I just have one question Ifyour curls could talk, what
would they say?
Speaker 2 (13:31):
I think my curls would have like a tear in their
eye in some ways and would saywe're proud of you and we're
happy to be with you on thisjourney.
Speaker 1 (13:42):
I just got goosebumps .
Speaker 2 (13:44):
But I think that they would say that we're proud of
you.
Oh, that's beautiful.
They would say that we're proudof you.
Speaker 1 (13:47):
Oh, that's beautiful, Mundy.
Speaker 2 (13:49):
I'm so, so proud of you, lorraine.
Thank you so much, mundy, thankyou guys so much for having me
on your podcast.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Next I love this section is called Calling All
Curls.
This is where curly girls fromall over the world call in and
ask me any question they wantabout curly hair.
If your girls could talk Hello,we have a caller and what is
your name?
(14:17):
Hi, my name is Marcy, and whereare you from?
La, oh, I love LA.
I love my hair when I'm in LA.
So what is your question today?
Speaker 3 (14:30):
So I've been really trying.
By the way, I love yourproducts, I use them.
I've been trying to not wash myhair often, and I used to wash
my hair every day with theconditioner, just so that it
restored the curls.
But I realized from one day tothe next I can't really sustain
(14:50):
the curls and I wonder.
It starts to feel a little bitdry and so the curls you know,
my hair just then gets a littlefrizzy.
Instead of Defined, yeah, yeah,instead of defined.
And so I guess I'm justwondering if I'm doing something
wrong, that it's requiring meto rewash my hair in order to
(15:12):
get the curl back.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Yes.
So when I hear this, my firstquestion is usually do you color
your hair?
Because it's like a blind spot.
Everything's fine, but we'renever thinking color could be
the culprit as to why our hairis a little drier.
So do you color your hair?
Yeah, I do.
And how often do you go in andget your hair colored?
Probably every six or sevenweeks, okay, and is it just the
(15:37):
roots?
Speaker 3 (15:38):
You know it's a good question Mostly, but I think
actually she does pull colordown.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Okay, and a lot of people like to put a glaze on or
a shellac, I call it over thecolor, which over time that
really starts to seal in thecuticle and dry the hair out.
So it looks great for the firstweek and then it becomes a glaze
and it really starts to takeits toll on the hair.
It just builds up and builds up, and I am convinced that
(16:04):
they're one of the culprits asto why beautiful curly girls
that color the hair start tofeel this dryness of the hair
because the hair's not breathingits own breath, the cuticles
are not being allowed to rise ina healthy way.
So if you can just say, pleasestop doing that for a while,
just color it, we don't need toshellac it.
It's not necessary.
(16:24):
If you have a really nice color, you don't need to shellac over
it.
I'm convinced of that.
And you've got this lovelyroutine.
You do your co-wash, you'vebeen replenishing it.
You don't use sulfates, youdon't use silicone.
So the one time you go for acolor, do they shampoo it too?
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Yes, they do.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
There you go, so you're building up this
beautiful thing with your hair.
So every six weeks you're doingeverything.
Great, it's lovely that onetime you're going to get a
chemical with color and thenthey shampoo the color off.
Why do we shampoo color offwhen we've just applied it?
So, basically, if I was to dyefabric, the last thing I would
do 25 minutes.
I would then go oh the timer,let me shampoo two thirds of it
(17:06):
out.
It doesn't make logical sense.
It is absolutely not necessaryto shampoo color off hair, which
then you've got two strikesagainst you.
You've got your shampoo andyou've got the color.
All the good you've done thosesix weeks prior.
We've just knocked it rightback down and it's going to
start drying out more and more.
It's not being able toreplenish itself.
The hair has history.
(17:27):
We carry it around with us.
It's like looking at apaleontologist the root, the
middle part of your hair, theends of your hair.
You're wearing it every day ofyour life.
So if you can ask them not touse shampoo to color, you're
going to see a huge difference.
Marcia, I promise you thatB-Y-O-B.
Bring your own products.
Speaker 3 (17:45):
So after she washes the dye off.
She shouldn't wash it, sheshould just rinse it out.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
No, you can use chamfru for that, but don't tell
her it's chamfru.
Take a little bottle and justsay this is what I want to use.
You're not going to see anyfoam, but I promise you the
agitation and the water flushingthrough the hair will bring the
color out.
I promise you your color willlook better because you're not
deoxidizing it immediately atthe moment.
You've just put it on.
It doesn't make any logicalsense, and this is the part in
(18:14):
hairdressing where I feel like Ineed logic.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
Oh, that's so interesting.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
And, to be honest with you, a lot of colors have
shampoos built in, but thelittle ingredient list is so
tiny that it's so hard to see alot of the things that are in
there.
Oh wow, I never thought aboutthat.
Nobody does, and that's why I'mhere doing this.
If your girls could talk, oh mygosh, but you have to be tough
(18:40):
because it's your hair.
You just say, listen, I don'twant to use this shellac and
also they charge you for that.
Speaker 3 (18:46):
I know Also you realize that every hairdresser
is wonderful they are.
They always try to upsell youto buy their products.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
And your hair looks good for a few days, it's like,
oh my God, but it begins toerode.
It's a slow burn.
And then, once you do see itlike you do now, and you're
seeing it now and you'renoticing it, more.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
Now it's taken its toll.
Oh interesting.
Speaker 1 (19:11):
But you're going to see a difference, I promise you.
Thank you, you're welcome andthank you so much.
Thank you Bye-bye.
Thanks for your question.
Bye, thank you for listeningand thank you to our guest,
mandy Gonzalez, and our call-in,marcy.
For those listeners interestedin learning more about the
organizations Mandy mentioned,please check out our show notes.
(19:32):
Be sure to follow and share.
If your Calls Could Talkwherever you get your podcasts,
it will mean the world to us andit really makes a difference.
If anybody would like to submita question, please send it to
info at curlyworldcom orvisitors on Instagram at
curlyworldllc.
Thank you so much and I'll seeyou next time.
(19:53):
This podcast is produced by myfavorite producer, susan Kaplan.
Thanks to Dan Strong, ourengineer, and to Michael Schubra
and Chea Ponte, and a veryspecial thank you to Sorrella
May for writing and performingour original theme music.
Hi, I'm Lorraine Massey, founder of the Curly
Girl Method.
Welcome to If your Curls CouldTalk.
Join us as we talk to our veryspecial guests, sharing their
curly hair journeys, and takequestions from you, our
listeners.
This is If your Curls CouldTalk.
My guest today is MandyGonzalez.
(00:22):
She's a singer and an actressand is known for playing
incredibly strong women.
She is best known for her rolesas Nina Rosario in the Heights,
Elphaba in Wicked and AngelicaSchuyler in Hamilton.
It is thrilling for me toannounce that she is guest
starring as Norma Desmond inSunset Boulevard on Broadway,
(00:43):
and on top of that, she's aprolific author of children's
books.
I'm excited to share thisconversation with you today, Hi
Mandy.
Thank you for being with ustoday on If your Girls Could
Talk.
How are you, Hi Lorraine?
Speaker 2 (00:57):
I'm so thrilled to be here with you.
I'm doing great.
I'm so excited for you and thisnew podcast.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Oh, thank you, Mandy.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
We have been friends for a long time and our
friendship started because I dida show with a friend and client
of yours, miss Judy Kuhn, and Iasked Judy, I said where do you
go in New York to get your haircut?
And she said, oh, I have thebest person.
And at that time my hair wasreally long and curly and I had
(01:30):
never gone to anybody thatspecialized in curly hair or
anybody like you, and it was alife-changing experience for me
because all of a sudden I feltlike my curls were beautiful and
that's the first time I reallyfelt like that.
I've read your books and theCurly book and I had so many
(01:52):
similarities, as do so manycurly kids in our world.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
I would love to talk to you about you as a child.
I want to know about you beinga curly girl when you were
little.
Do you have any memories?
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I think every curly girl has memories, especially if
they are in a family wherenobody else has curly hair.
A lot of the put downs stemmedfrom my hair the mean things
that your siblings say, and mymom had no idea how to do it, so
she would just brush it andthen it would just be overly
frizzy.
This was before hair gel Hairgel was invented.
(02:29):
My mother just didn't know whatto do, so I was constantly just
going around with really shortfrizzy bangs and really frizzy
hair.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
And look at you now.
Mandy wrote a book calledFearless, and it's for all kids,
all ages, isn't it?
Yeah, all kids up to you know100, I would say I'm just going
to let you talk because you area beacon of hope to so many.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Oh well, you know, lorraine, my journey with
Fearless started.
I mean, it's kind of been withme my whole life, I think.
Yes, you know I've talkedbefore.
I think about how my parentsmet and my parents met as pen
pals during the Vietnam War andmy father was drafted when he
was 19.
My mother was 17 and wanted tojoin the Peace Corps, but her
(03:23):
parents said absolutely not, andso she did the next best thing,
which was she wrote to soldiersthat maybe didn't have anybody
to write to, and one of thesoldiers was my dad and he sent
her letters and a picture andshe was like ooh, and their
friendship and their love grewthrough those letters.
At the end of every letter myfather said I'm going to survive
(03:48):
this and one day we'll betogether.
Love always, paul, with two L'sfor the always.
And he didn't have much when heended his time in service, but
he had a car and he had anaddress and he had a sense of
direction, thank goodness, andhe showed up on my mom's
doorstep and when she opened thedoor her life went in a
direction.
I think the fearless thingabout their story is so much
(04:09):
about that, but also the factthat their families were not
supportive of their love atfirst because they were from two
different cultures my father'sMexican, my mother's Jewish and
at that time it was like reallytaboo.
And so my parents ended upeloping and they had three of us
and they've been together nowfor 50 years.
(04:31):
And so I feel like that wordfearless has been with me since
birth from that story that Iguess I follow and I admire so
much.
And then when I got into theaterand I started to start my own
journey, when I moved to NewYork City from California, I
started to craft how I wanted tolive.
(04:53):
There's no blueprint how to dowhat you want to do and how to
get your dreams.
I start, but I just had thisinternal drive to move forward.
And when I talk aboutfearlessness and things like
that, it's never because I don'thave any fear.
I definitely have a lot of fearand I'm definitely a fearful
person.
I'm just the kind of personthat chooses to feel that fear
(05:16):
while I keep moving forward andthat has served me, I think,
throughout my life.
When I first started in NewYork on Broadway, I was in the
show my first show I thinkthroughout my life when I first
started in New York on Broadway.
I was in the show.
My first show, I think, wasAida.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
That's when we met, I think.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
Yes, that's when we met.
So Aida happened and at thattime, you know, fans and people
that admired you could write toyou to the theater.
They'd have to write a letterand they would take time to get
there and then I would writethem back and that would take
time.
And all of a sudden, now thatI'm in this new show, hamilton
you know, I started in 2017 withthat show and all of a sudden,
(05:53):
people can connect with youreally fast and right away, you
know, through your socialchannels and things like that,
and I had a lot of peoplereaching out to me with feelings
of loneliness, feelings thatthey didn't belong, and I wanted
to do something about it.
And so I did and I tweeted outif you don't have a safe space,
you can be part of mine.
(06:14):
And I put hashtag fearless squadand I didn't know that
thousands of people would wantto be a part of it.
So then I became this fearlesssquad leader and I had to think
about fearlessness and to befearless I think I always put it
in this kind of two words tofear less, because I try to do
(06:34):
that whenever I can, as often asI can, but I think that it just
kind of started.
I really took that leadershipto heart.
Then it was like what do I wantto do with this platform that I
have?
And I had been writing a lot ofchildren's stories and I wanted
to create characters that looklike me and my friends and tell
(06:57):
our stories, but in my way, yes,and so I created the character
Monica Garcia, who is an11-year-old from a small town in
California with big dreams ofgoing to Broadway, and she gets
that call.
She submits a self-tape whichyou can do nowadays and she gets
the call that they want to seeher in New York and she becomes
(07:20):
the understudy to the understudyon Broadway.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
And I imagine the identity of Marcia Garcia is
connected with her hair too, andI imagine this is you, isn't it
?
It's connected to you.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Curly hair was something that was so important
to me because it was like if Ihad seen that as a kid, if I had
seen another character that Iwas really into, that also had
(07:51):
curly hair and would play withthat all the time, didn't know
what to do with it, it was justkind of all over the place.
I would have been like, oh, I'mnot alone.
It would have been great that'samazing.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Yeah, you have the most beautiful curls, but during
covid, though, you went throughsomething I mean, would you
want to talk about it?
Is that okay?
Speaker 2 (08:19):
absolutely, absolutely so.
Right before covid, october22nd of 2019, I went in for my
first mammogram and I wasdiagnosed with breast cancer.
I'm the first person in myfamily to have been diagnosed,
so it was a huge shock, asanybody that's been diagnosed
with cancer knows.
Everything seems likeeverything happens really fast
(08:39):
because you're in a state ofshock and you have to circle
into all these appointments andfiguring out what your plan is,
and for me, I think in some ways, that was one of the scariest
parts was not knowing what wascoming next, not knowing what
the plan was For somebody who issuch a planner.
In some ways, I'd like to bebusy.
I'd like to have some sort ofcontrol.
(09:00):
This was like totally out of mycontrol and it's silly to say,
but one of my biggest fears waslosing my hair, because when I
found out that I would have tohave chemo, that was a big fear
of mine, because I have adaughter and I didn't want her
to be scared or I wanted toshield her from as much as
possible after that diagnosisand my doctor said that I would
(09:24):
be on a certain type ofchemotherapy where I would lose
parts of my hair but not all ofit and I wore a cold cap and
that really helped.
But then, after I was done withmy treatment, I had to cut my
hair so that it would make lessof an impact for the hair that I
was losing.
And then, as I was healing, andit all happened during pandemic
(09:46):
, so I was home and I couldn'tgo get my haircut, I couldn't
get trims or anything like that,so I just kind of had to be
with this hair that had beenthrough so much Within this past
nine months.
When I finally got to go and seeyou, I felt like at that time I
was doing a lot of things totry to make myself look like I
(10:08):
looked before, because what washappening was that my hair was
kind of straightening out incertain places, yeah, and I felt
really frustrated by that.
That's not who I am.
I have curly hair and that'spart of my identity.
And then I didn't know reallywhat to do, like on my own, so I
would just curl it with acurling iron and every time I
(10:29):
did that I would be like, oh myGod, the rain would be so bad.
I was like frying my hair.
I honestly didn't know what todo.
And then when I finally wasable to come in, I think as I am
even now, like I'm still in aprocess of healing from
something that was verytraumatic for me and I talked to
(10:50):
you about it I unloaded a lotbecause I felt like it was a lot
pandemic and cancer and allthis working stuff, and you were
like, okay, I have an idea.
And then you just started andyou said, oh my God, they're
coming back, like your curls arecoming back to life.
And a lot of people that Ibecame friends with in my
(11:10):
support groups and things likethat, a lot of people that had
lost their hair, it had comeback curly, and so Chemo curls.
I think, yeah, it's just sointeresting, my curls and my
hair and how that's been a partof my journey too.
You know, as a kid and beingthe only one with curly hair the
only person really in my familywas my abuelita that had curly
(11:32):
hair.
It's funny, as I get older Isee myself in her.
Sometimes when I look in themirror I go, oh my God, who is
that?
It looks like my abuelita in somany ways.
I've been through all of thesethings.
I've become a mom, I've becomea working mom, and I went
(11:53):
through cancer, we went throughpandemic, we have gone through
so much and now I feel like myhair is at this place of like
we're on this next step and itfeels like a little bit of a
balance beam.
I did have a lot of friendsthat I looked to during that
time, and one of my friends wasmy friend, krista Rodriguez.
Oh yeah, I was a fellow actressand she is a breast cancer
(12:14):
survivor and she is somebodythat was one of my first calls
because I didn't know anybodyelse in my community that had
gone through this, and so it wasreally important for me to kind
of create my fearless squadduring this so I could ask
questions, and she was so openand she's been so open through
everything and she created thiswebsite called Chemo Couture.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
Oh, chemo Couture.
Speaker 2 (12:36):
Oh, that's right, and it was so it was so inspiring
because she was also young goingthrough it and it was like,
okay, well, if I'm going to gothrough it, I want it to be
fashionable and in some ways,her advice that really helped me
(12:58):
during my process.
When I had to go to my chemosessions with a mask on and I
could wear a cute hat, I couldfeel like I could bring part of
myself into the room, becausefashion's always been important
to me, and I could paint mynails or I could do things like
that and feel good about myself.
But had I not had that resourceof knowing, had she not been so
vulnerable and shared her story, I wouldn't have known that
that existed.
Speaker 1 (13:20):
We're so grateful that you're on here and sharing
with us.
So I just have one question Ifyour curls could talk, what
would they say?
Speaker 2 (13:31):
I think my curls would have like a tear in their
eye in some ways and would saywe're proud of you and we're
happy to be with you on thisjourney.
Speaker 1 (13:42):
I just got goosebumps .
Speaker 2 (13:44):
But I think that they would say that we're proud of
you.
Oh, that's beautiful.
They would say that we're proudof you.
Speaker 1 (13:47):
Oh, that's beautiful, Mundy.
Speaker 2 (13:49):
I'm so, so proud of you, lorraine.
Thank you so much, mundy, thankyou guys so much for having me
on your podcast.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Next I love this section is called Calling All
Curls.
This is where curly girls fromall over the world call in and
ask me any question they wantabout curly hair.
If your girls could talk Hello,we have a caller and what is
your name?
(14:17):
Hi, my name is Marcy, and whereare you from?
La, oh, I love LA.
I love my hair when I'm in LA.
So what is your question today?
Speaker 3 (14:30):
So I've been really trying.
By the way, I love yourproducts, I use them.
I've been trying to not wash myhair often, and I used to wash
my hair every day with theconditioner, just so that it
restored the curls.
But I realized from one day tothe next I can't really sustain
(14:50):
the curls and I wonder.
It starts to feel a little bitdry and so the curls you know,
my hair just then gets a littlefrizzy.
Instead of Defined, yeah, yeah,instead of defined.
And so I guess I'm justwondering if I'm doing something
wrong, that it's requiring meto rewash my hair in order to
(15:12):
get the curl back.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Yes.
So when I hear this, my firstquestion is usually do you color
your hair?
Because it's like a blind spot.
Everything's fine, but we'renever thinking color could be
the culprit as to why our hairis a little drier.
So do you color your hair?
Yeah, I do.
And how often do you go in andget your hair colored?
Probably every six or sevenweeks, okay, and is it just the
(15:37):
roots?
Speaker 3 (15:38):
You know it's a good question Mostly, but I think
actually she does pull colordown.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Okay, and a lot of people like to put a glaze on or
a shellac, I call it over thecolor, which over time that
really starts to seal in thecuticle and dry the hair out.
So it looks great for the firstweek and then it becomes a glaze
and it really starts to takeits toll on the hair.
It just builds up and builds up, and I am convinced that
(16:04):
they're one of the culprits asto why beautiful curly girls
that color the hair start tofeel this dryness of the hair
because the hair's not breathingits own breath, the cuticles
are not being allowed to rise ina healthy way.
So if you can just say, pleasestop doing that for a while,
just color it, we don't need toshellac it.
It's not necessary.
(16:24):
If you have a really nice color, you don't need to shellac over
it.
I'm convinced of that.
And you've got this lovelyroutine.
You do your co-wash, you'vebeen replenishing it.
You don't use sulfates, youdon't use silicone.
So the one time you go for acolor, do they shampoo it too?
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Yes, they do.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
There you go, so you're building up this
beautiful thing with your hair.
So every six weeks you're doingeverything.
Great, it's lovely that onetime you're going to get a
chemical with color and thenthey shampoo the color off.
Why do we shampoo color offwhen we've just applied it?
So, basically, if I was to dyefabric, the last thing I would
do 25 minutes.
I would then go oh the timer,let me shampoo two thirds of it
(17:06):
out.
It doesn't make logical sense.
It is absolutely not necessaryto shampoo color off hair, which
then you've got two strikesagainst you.
You've got your shampoo andyou've got the color.
All the good you've done thosesix weeks prior.
We've just knocked it rightback down and it's going to
start drying out more and more.
It's not being able toreplenish itself.
The hair has history.
(17:27):
We carry it around with us.
It's like looking at apaleontologist the root, the
middle part of your hair, theends of your hair.
You're wearing it every day ofyour life.
So if you can ask them not touse shampoo to color, you're
going to see a huge difference.
Marcia, I promise you thatB-Y-O-B.
Bring your own products.
Speaker 3 (17:45):
So after she washes the dye off.
She shouldn't wash it, sheshould just rinse it out.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
No, you can use chamfru for that, but don't tell
her it's chamfru.
Take a little bottle and justsay this is what I want to use.
You're not going to see anyfoam, but I promise you the
agitation and the water flushingthrough the hair will bring the
color out.
I promise you your color willlook better because you're not
deoxidizing it immediately atthe moment.
You've just put it on.
It doesn't make any logicalsense, and this is the part in
(18:14):
hairdressing where I feel like Ineed logic.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
Oh, that's so interesting.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
And, to be honest with you, a lot of colors have
shampoos built in, but thelittle ingredient list is so
tiny that it's so hard to see alot of the things that are in
there.
Oh wow, I never thought aboutthat.
Nobody does, and that's why I'mhere doing this.
If your girls could talk, oh mygosh, but you have to be tough
(18:40):
because it's your hair.
You just say, listen, I don'twant to use this shellac and
also they charge you for that.
Speaker 3 (18:46):
I know Also you realize that every hairdresser
is wonderful they are.
They always try to upsell youto buy their products.
Speaker 1 (18:54):
And your hair looks good for a few days, it's like,
oh my God, but it begins toerode.
It's a slow burn.
And then, once you do see itlike you do now, and you're
seeing it now and you'renoticing it, more.
Speaker 3 (19:10):
Now it's taken its toll.
Oh interesting.
Speaker 1 (19:11):
But you're going to see a difference, I promise you.
Thank you, you're welcome andthank you so much.
Thank you Bye-bye.
Thanks for your question.
Bye, thank you for listeningand thank you to our guest,
mandy Gonzalez, and our call-in,marcy.
For those listeners interestedin learning more about the
organizations Mandy mentioned,please check out our show notes.
(19:32):
Be sure to follow and share.
If your Calls Could Talkwherever you get your podcasts,
it will mean the world to us andit really makes a difference.
If anybody would like to submita question, please send it to
info at curlyworldcom orvisitors on Instagram at
curlyworldllc.
Thank you so much and I'll seeyou next time.
(19:53):
This podcast is produced by myfavorite producer, susan Kaplan.
Thanks to Dan Strong, ourengineer, and to Michael Schubra
and Chea Ponte, and a veryspecial thank you to Sorrella
May for writing and performingour original theme music.
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