March 17, 2025 • 33 mins
In this episode of Investing in Accessibility, co-hosts Kelvin Crosby and Chris Maher welcome Hale Pulsifer, Vice President of Customer Insights, Inclusion, and Advocacy at Fidelity Investments, to explore the intersection of business, accessibility, and economic opportunity. Hale shares his transformative journey from corporate finance strategist to a leader in disability inclusion, revealing how companies that embrace accessibility aren’t just doing the right thing—they’re making a smart business decision.
Backed by compelling data, Pulsifer highlights the untapped potential of disability-inclusive businesses. This episode is a must-listen for business leaders, investors, and advocates looking to understand why accessibility isn’t just a social responsibility—it’s a game-changing economic strategy.
Links to Research and Resources Hale Referenced:
Hale's LinkedIn
American Institutes of Research: A Hidden Market
Progressive Policy Institute: Disability-and-Changes-in-the-Workplace.pdf (progressivepolicy.org)
Accenture: The Disability Inclusion Imperative (accenture.com)
Disability:IN: https://disabilityin.org/
COMING SOON!
American Sign Language (ASL) and Captioning for each episode will be provided on our YouTube channel. Go to handle @SamaritanPartners.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Kelvin Crosby (00:06):
Welcome to Investing in Accessibility, a
Samaritan Partners podcast.
We're not waiting for change,we're investing in it.
Join us as we speak withentrepreneurs and thought
leaders that are focused oncreating a more accessible world
.
(00:32):
Hey, so good to see you, eventhough I can't see you.
It's another beautiful day inthe neighborhood and I'm so
excited that you are here atInvesting in Accessibility.
My name is Kelvin Crosby andsome people know me as the
DeafBlind Potter, and you know,one of the coolest things is
when we go through life, we'rebeing molded right, and I think
(00:55):
what we're going to realize isthe opportunities for people
with disability and also theopportunity from an investment
standpoint today, how that isgoing to mold the opportunities
in ways that we never realized.
And I'm excited about today'sguest, because what we're going
to realize is that a lot of usdon't know some of the data
(01:19):
points and how, when you thinkabout including people with
disabilities as an investmentopportunity, it really is going
to transform the world in awhole different way.
But before we get to our guest,let me introduce you to my
co-host, Chris Maher.
How are you doing, man?
Chris Maher (01:35):
Hey Kelvin, how are you, my friend, good to see you
.
Kelvin Crosby (01:38):
I'm doing good.
So I'm really excited abouttoday's show and I'm not going
to hold anybody else back.
So I'm going to let you kind ofgear us up, get us ready for
this.
Chris Maher (01:50):
You got it.
I'm super excited about today'sshow as well, because we, as
you said, we're going to getinto the numbers, and our guest,
I think, has a uniqueperspective to share some
insights as to why investing inaccessibility is not just the
right thing to do, but it's alsogood business.
And so our guest today is HalePulsifer, who is the Vice
(02:12):
President of Customer Insights,Inclusion and Advocacy at
Fidelity Investments.
Welcome, Hale.
Hale Pulsifer (02:19):
Hey, Chris Kelvin , great to be here.
Thanks for having me.
Chris Maher (02:22):
Oh, it's good to have you here, my friend.
A quick aside, you know, I hadthe good fortune of meeting Hale
probably in the last year.
We're both members of adisability business network
called Profound and had the goodfortune of connecting with Hale
through that and then westarted some conversations
outside of that and then whenKelvin and I kicked this podcast
(02:44):
off, Hale you were someone thatwas towards the top of that
list that we knew we wanted tohave as a guest.
So, really excited to have youhere today and let's kick things
off.
And I think where we shouldstart is a little bit about your
own personal background andyour journey and long career at
Fidelity and your connection todisability and accessibility.
Hale Pulsifer (03:04):
Great Thanks.
I'd love to do that and again,thank you so much for having me.
Conversations like this are soimportant.
There's no shortage ofconversations about disability
advocacy and disability socialjustice, but we're not having
enough conversations aboutdisability as an economic
opportunity.
And if you haven't had thisconversation before, even
(03:27):
calling it that might seem likewhat is that?
Is that exploitative?
What is that?
And what I see is that it's allreally really good news.
I get very excited about it, butI have not been in the
disability inclusion space mywhole career.
For the first 10 years, I was adrummer in a rock band that has
nothing to do with any of thisstuff.
(03:47):
Then I got my master's atBabson, very entrepreneurial
school, and entrepreneurship iswhat's going to get this
momentum started in terms ofinvesting in accessibility.
Then I went to FidelityInvestments.
I've been here for 23, 22, 23years now, and for the first 16
(04:08):
years or so, I was a corporatefinance and strategy guy, and
that means budgeting, expensereporting but, best of all,
business cases.
How do we decide where toinvest our money internally.
(04:28):
How do you know a good ideafrom a bad idea?
And doing that for years andyears and years, I think
ultimately was preparing me forsomething much bigger, which was
the day that two thingshappened.
Not the same day, of course,but one is I started working
really closely with a guy by thename of Jeff Wissel who has
retinitis pigmentosa, losing hisvision at work.
(04:50):
How can I be a world-classphone rep if I can't read the
monitor that tells me mycustomer balances and positions?
And now I'm going to get fired,I'm going to lose my livelihood
, like, ah, what's going tohappen?
I started working closely withJeff and I started considering
disclosing my own connection todisability.
But it was Jeff that was reallylike he was.
Jeff was really the thing thatgot it all going, because Jeff
(05:24):
showed me the world ofdisability-inspired innovation,
the world of the hacks that weuse when we have disabilities
that the rest of the worlddoesn't know about.
You know, with this knowledgecame this inspiration.
Oh, with a heavy dose ofDisability: IN.
I'm a huge fan of Disability (05:30):
IN and not-for-profit that drives
disability inclusion at thecorporate level, for both
customers and employees alike.
All this came together to askthe question what would it be
like if we transformed ourbusiness model to be disability
first, to be disabilityinclusive, and all of that
(05:53):
background manifested into abusiness case that involved
profitability and riskassessments, competitive
assessments, and the whole thingboiled down to one
recommendation — let's create avery small department focused on
making the customer experienceawesome for people with
disabilities.
So, to be clear, you've gotaccessibility departments, which
(06:15):
are critical.
Those are table stakes, butthere's so much more than just
accessibility and that's so.
That was the business case andwe shopped it around and within
a few months, we were co-leadingthis, this new department, and
there's been some iterationssince then, but that's basically
what I've been doing ever since.
Kelvin Crosby (06:35):
Well, I think the one thing I'm taking away it's
disability economics.
I mean that has a ring to itthat says, "what does that look
like?
" What can you see from that?
And I mean, I guess can youexplain to us a little bit more.
When somebody said disabilityand economics, how does that
(07:00):
create an empowerment forincluding everybody and really
give people the opportunities tobe like wow, there's actually a
way to make money this way andto build, cover my bottom line,
cover my overhead and make mycustomers have the best
opportunity possible?
Hale Pulsifer (07:22):
I love the question and there's a lot of
different ways to answer it.
So when I think about investingin accessibility with the
companies and trends that Ifollow like a fundamental
enhancement for disabilityinclusion benefits a lot more
people.
You know it's called the curbcut effect.
It's named after street cornersand the little ramp that's
(07:44):
there so wheelchairs can glideeffortlessly from the street to
the sidewalk and the sidewalk tothe street.
Oh yeah, that's right.
I use that ramp too when I'vegot my rollerboard suitcase, or
the UPS driver uses that rampwhen he's got the dolly full of
the heavy packages.
How about push-button doors?
It's the same thing.
You invest in a push buttondoor that's there by law for
(08:04):
somebody with either in awheelchair or someone with fine
motor disabilities or upper bodystrength issues, but we all use
it, right?
There are so many examples ofthat.
There's so many more of thesedisability inspired innovations
that have changed the way we dothings.
And here's where that starts toshow up in business.
(08:29):
First, let's talk aboutproductivity, profitability.
Accenture did this studyfocusing on this what happens to
companies that are prioritizingdisability inclusion and they
basically measured this based onwhat companies were taking the
Disability Quality Index andgetting a good score.
So they took all thosecompanies and they grouped them
(08:49):
by industry and they comparedthem to those in the same
industry that were not doingthis and they right-sized it.
So it was apples to applesAgain, this is Accenture.
This is a world-classorganization known for their
consulting and research.
What they found is that thecompanies that were prioritizing
disability inclusion wereachieving 1.6x more revenue,
(09:11):
2.6x more net income and 2x moreeconomic profit.
Kelvin Crosby (09:17):
Hale, can you say that one more time?
Hale Pulsifer (09:20):
1.
6x more revenue, 2.6x more netincome and 2x more economic
profit.
And those numbers aresignificantly increased from
when they measured this studyback in 2018.
This just came out a coupleyears ago, November 2023.
So now we're seeing morerevenue, more net income and
(09:43):
more economic profit, and theone thing these companies have
in common is that they'reprioritizing disability
inclusion, because everythingelse has been equalized for size
, et cetera.
And these same firms are alsoreporting increased problem
solving, increased innovation,higher retention rates, lower
turnover and 25% higherproductivity or revenue per
employee.
We can include the link to thisstudy in the in the show notes,
(10:06):
but it's called The DisabilityInclusion Imperative on the
Accenture website, right, andlike that's just the beginning.
Industries, companies that arerealizing we get better results
when we do this.
That's not why they starteddoing it.
They start doing it because youjust know, and now we've got
the numbers to quantify what thebenefit is.
(10:27):
But then what happens now islike now it's a party because we
have studies like this, and soother companies that are on the
sidelines are looking like ohwow, I've been on the fence
about really investing indisability inclusion or I didn't
know what it's a thing, and nowI'm really going to look into
it.
And this creates demand forhiring, which creates job
(10:48):
opportunities for people withdisabilities.
Like there's never been abetter time in history to be a
young person, college educatedor not, looking for work and
finding some of thesedisability-inclusive companies.
There's an organization calledthe Progressive Policy Institute
and they did this work calledDisability and Changes in the
(11:10):
Workplace.
And I was talking to the authorabout this report.
I'm like, man, this stuff isgreat.
Where'd you get it?
And he said we actually weren'teven looking for it.
We were looking for somethingelse and we found this
disability trend along the wayand then had to publish it.
But here's what they found.
In the period between 2020 andthe end of 2023, so it's roughly
a four-year period.
(11:30):
Total employment during thattime grew by about three and a
half million jobs.
That's fine.
That's a typical number duringthat time.
But what's not typical is thatover half of that net job
creation went to disabled people, so one quarter of the
population driving over half ofnet job growth.
(11:51):
That can only happen when youhave a significant supply of
people with disabilities lookingfor work and an even larger
demand of companies looking foremployees with disabilities.
Chris Maher (12:03):
Yeah, that's a staggering statistic that you
just said.
So over 50% of the net jobsover what?
Was that time period?
Again, 20 to 2023?
.
Hale Pulsifer (12:14):
It was early 2020 to the end of 2023.
Chris Maher (12:17):
Yeah, over 50% of those net new jobs were filled
with people with disabilities.
Hale Pulsifer (12:23):
Yes, how do you explain that?
Yeah, and there's a couple ofreasons.
One is COVID's in there, whichmeans remote work, and remote
work turns out to be a lot moreamenable to many disabilities
than work involving a commute.
So you've got that going.
We also have remote workunleashing new levels of
productivity, because where youhave Zoom, you have captions if
(12:46):
your employers turn it on.
And where you have captions,you have more employment
opportunities for people whohappen to be deaf, hard of
hearing or have learningdisabilities, auditory
processing disorders, that kindof thing.
Another factor is that in theprevious five, six years,
whatever you want to call, itthere were people who retired
(13:06):
because of disability, becausethe commute and everything it
was too much.
And now, with COVID andeverybody working remote, it
created an opportunity for themto return to the workforce and
many of them had a career'sworth of skills and experience
that are really valuable.
So you take out the commute andyou add this layer of assistive
(13:26):
technology and you reintroducepeople into the workforce who
had to leave because ofdisability but don't have to
anymore.
That's how you get such a sucha surge.
Chris Maher (13:36):
And so so Hale I mean Accenture put out this
report.
I mean they're a legitimateorganization, right?
How is this research not morepervasive across corporate
America?
Is it just a matter of time?
And the second part of thatquestion is the sense I get at
(13:59):
Fidelity, when you folks wereputting together this group that
you run, you know what eight,10 years ago, leader leadership
saw the value.
What were those key metricsthat really triggered the light
bulb that got senior leadershipto commit to it.
Because I think that's criticalfor senior leadership buy-in
(14:23):
across corporate America to makethis a much more pervasive
commitment across the industryor across the marketplace.
Hale Pulsifer (14:33):
Yeah, so I'll do the second question first, which
is what caused them to buy in?
It turns out this is a specialplace.
I love it.
I love working here.
The reason I chose to come hereso many years ago is that,
unashamedly, customer alwayscomes first.
We're obsessed with thecustomer.
Even if you work in corporatefinance and never talk to
(14:55):
customers, we want you to spendone or two days a year going out
into the field and listening tophone calls and like just being
really in touch with what ourcustomers believe.
Disability is a dimension ofour customers that we're not
paying attention to.
And if you love your customers,how useful is it to know a
(15:16):
customer's birthday and risktolerance and ability to pay for
services and all these thingsthat we know about our customers
?
What use is that if we don'talso capture that they have
interaction preferences that maybe driven by a disability?
So it doesn't.
We're not in the business oftracking who has, you know, RP?
But we are in the business oftracking— Do you prefer audio
(15:40):
statements or braille statementsor large print statements?
Do you prefer to have an ASLinterpreter?
If you really care about yourcustomers, you have to care
about these things.
Chris Maher (15:51):
The most recent statistics that I've seen is
that one in four adults in theUS has a disability, so that's
25% of your customer base.
But I think something you justsaid that's really important
that a lot of companies neglectto think about is are the
families and friends, thecaregivers, the people
supporting the person with thedisability.
(16:12):
When you add them in, that canthen become 50 to 60% of the
population, of your customerbase.
That's a really large group.
Hale Pulsifer (16:22):
Yeah,
Kelvin Crosby (16:23):
I think this is something that I want everybody
to understand is you look atWheel the World, if you haven't
heard that podcast the go andlisten to that, but if also you
look at how, when you look ataccessibility, and you include
both the accessibility part forthe person with disability, like
(16:48):
what Chris just said, theopportunity with their family
members or their friends orloved ones, and you include all
of that in, that's more thanhalf of the population, and
there's your market, and I thinkwhat we're talking about, and I
want people to understand this,is that when you include the
(17:13):
disability factor, you'reessentially solving the world's
problems.
Becuase the people who are ablebodied they don't have anybody
in their life at the momentbecause they're eventually going
to have somebody that has adisability, but they still can
have access and without barriersthemselves, and they can
(17:33):
leverage.
I mean, just look at the echoes, you know, speak some words out
of your mouth and you're set togo.
Hale Pulsifer (17:41):
You're touching on something that was also
fundamental to getting thisapproved, which I'd forgotten
about.
We're a financial servicescompany, which means retirement
around here is a pretty big deal.
We need to be a world-classretirement provider.
So if we solve for engagingwith deafness, hard of hearing
(18:05):
and blindness no vision we arealso solving for our customers
who are aging into disability.
So if you're a customer whoretires let's say you're 65, you
retire, in the next few yearsyou start losing your hearing.
What if you learned from yourfinancial services provider
about the array of technologiesavailable to you to supplement
your hearing or to supplementyour vision?
Hey, you ever heard of a screenreader?
Oh, I mean, imagine if it'syour financial services company
that's showing you that.
(18:25):
Yeah, you know your phone.
It has voiceover.
You can turn voiceover on andit'll read to you.
That part's really cool.
I get excited about that.
Kelvin Crosby (18:33):
Yeah, I mean I think this is where I think what
I would like to do next is kindof get into some of the numbers
here.
Where are we seeing growthalready?
And then, where is the futurekind of showing us potential in
the near future?
Hale Pulsifer (19:07):
One number that I look at, it's not future
looking, it's more recent past,is a study that came out by the
American Institutes of Researchcalled "hidden market, and one
of the things this study did wasit looked at purchasing power
and discretionary income fordifferent populations in the
United States that are nottypically looked at in terms of
economic impact.
And the study is dated at thispoint and I've spoken to the
authors about refreshing it andmaybe they will, but it has not
been updated since 2018.
So these are some older numbers, but as of 2018, the purchasing
(19:31):
power for the disabilitycommunity was almost $500
billion.
It was $490 billion.
That's purchasing power forworking-age people with
disabilities in the UnitedStates.
And, to put that in perspective, that same number for the Black
community is $500 billion andfor the Hispanic Latino
(19:52):
community is $580 billion.
So Latino $580, black $500,disability $490.
These are big numbers.
This is a big segment and mostpeople don't think about the
disability community as aconsumer segment and yet very
significant after-tax disposableincome.
(20:13):
Discretionary income, which is,after you've covered all your
essential expenses what do youhave left over for fun stuff for
working-age people?
That's $21 billion and that'smore than Black and Latino
segments combined.
Combined.
So if you're looking for thenon-essential stuff, the
(20:36):
disability community is a largerpotential market for you, and
the reason I'm sharing all thisis not because it's a
competition, but I'm sharing allthis because in recent years we
have seen significantinvestment and a lot of effort
in engaging with traditionallyunderrepresented communities in
(20:57):
the United States.
That's where change moves.
Starts with corporations anddisability.
We're relative newcomers tothis space, so disability isn't
new, but a critical mass ofdisability in the workforce,
that part's new, right, thatpart's new.
To understand this.
(21:18):
But if you fast forward fromthe passing of the ADA to an
academic generation which isaround 16 years give or take,
that gets you to right around2010-ish.
And it was at that point thatthis steady supply of highly
qualified, workforce-ready youngpeople with disabilities
(21:40):
entered the market.
And most employers didn't knowwhat to do about that just yet.
So the supply built and builtand built like water behind a
dam, and then employers startedfiguring it out and then the dam
kind of started breaking andthat led to this flood of people
with disabilities into theworkforce, which I think has
been happening for a while.
But it's especially evident inthat Progressive Policy
(22:02):
Institute number we talkedabout— over half of net job
creation over that four years.
We now have more people withdisabilities and a voice in the
workplace advocating for thisstuff.
So that's why we're getting somuch more attention now than we
have in the past, even thoughit's not as much as I would like
.
Chris Maher (22:20):
So Hale with that.
Are you optimistic?
Because we're coming up on,kind of that second 16-year
cycle, so are you optimisticthat these trends that we're
seeing around the workforce incorporate America will continue
to trend in that positivedirection?
Hale Pulsifer (22:54):
I am.
I think I am optimistic aboutthat and I also have a feeling
it's going to start slowing downa little bit.
That is to say, growth willcontinue, but the growth cannot
grow at the rate it's beengrowing at.
Companies become awesome atdisability inclusion for their
employees and for theircustomers.
Engagement with that company,expressed by the number of
corporate partners and thenumber of companies taking the
Disability Equality Index, hasbeen growing at 25% per year
(23:18):
over the last six years.
Per year.
Like, show me what grows at 25percent per year.
This is a party.
There are and they have theconference every year in July.
And like it's the most excitingtime of year for me because you
have 3 000 people that are inperson, that are all deeply
(23:40):
committed to disabilityinclusion and just relishing in
the advances and the successesthat have been experienced in
recent years.
And yes, there's still a longway to go, but there's still a
lot to celebrate.
It's a very exciting space.
So recent growth trends suggest,yeah, we're going to be seeing
this for a while, but you can'tsustain 25% growth per year
(24:02):
forever.
It has to start slowing.
And I noticed last year thegrowth rate dropped to 19%.
Who doesn't want 19% growth?
Right?
So it's starting to slow, right, it's starting to slow, but
it's still really impressivegrowth.
The way you know, I think.
The way you know that it'sreally leveling off and it's
(24:23):
reached a balancing point, Ithink, is when the unemployment
rate for people withdisabilities starts matching the
unemployment rate for peoplewithout, because that's when
you'll know that the barriers togetting jobs and staying in
jobs have been removed enoughthat we're essentially equal
populations.
But until then, I thinkdisability employment will
(24:45):
continue to outpacenon-disability employment.
Kelvin Crosby (24:50):
I'd be really interested in that.
I'm curious.
This is the thing that keepsgoing on in my mind as more
technology is being developedand more access is being
developed and more ways arebeing created, is there spaces
where your disability, thatwe're finding that disability,
(25:15):
is just being included and youdon't even know that they have a
disability because they're ableto do their work or they're
able to work in the environmentand they really don't have to
disclose?
I mean, I can give you a perfectexample.
I was able to go into a companyand say, hey, I would love to
work for you, and they didn'tsay anything.
(25:37):
Until day four I ran into awall and they had no idea that I
was blind.
But I did the job and because Ihad all the tools already at my
fingertips and they were usinga Windows computer, so I just
used Narrator and do the thingthat was already on their system
(25:59):
and having that access.
So I'd be curious if the flowis really still 25% because but
on paper it's only 19, becausewe're finding new ways, because
people are being included in theoverall system of employment.
Hale Pulsifer (26:22):
Yeah, I heard a company at Disability
to accommodations asproductivity tools, and the
reason I think that's sopowerful is that a productivity
tool is something like a laptopor a printer.
If you don't like readingthings on your screen, you can
(26:44):
have a printer and printingsomething on paper may improve
your productivity.
Well, a screen reader can alsobe an improvement in
productivity.
When these are starting to becategorized as productivity
tools, they sort of cast adifferent light on them and
they're a lot easier to talkabout and easier to come by.
But there's other things toohappening that are evidence of
(27:08):
rapidly evolving inclusion inthe workplace and more job
opportunities for people withdisabilities.
More and more companies thesedays are having something called
a centralized accommodationbudget, and here's what that
means.
If you request an accommodation, it does not hit your cost
(27:28):
center or your budget.
It's paid for centrally and theimplications of that are pretty
important.
Let's say, if I need an ASLinterpreter, every time I need
one and I ask for one, it's mycost center that pays for it.
Before long, our budget is shot.
We can't have that end of yearparty and we can't hire that
summer intern and there's allthese things we can't do because
(27:49):
I need an ASL interpreter and Idon't want to be in that
position and my manager doesn'twant to be in that position.
So when you have a centralizedcost center to pay for this
stuff, I ask for it, it'sgranted and it does not affect
our expense base as a team atall.
That's one innovation.
Another awesome innovation, andFidelity is one of the first
(28:09):
companies to do thisincidentally, is having a
self-service accessibilitymarketplace where you can figure
out what you need.
You can go online and look atthe options, you can request it
and it's paid for by thatcentralized cost center and it
comes right to you.
You don't even need to engageyour manager at all if you don't
(28:29):
want to.
So if for some reason you don'twant to disclose your
disability, you can go to thisself-service website and get
your copy of JAWS or DragonNaturally Speaking or an
ergonomic keyboard or whateverit is that you need, and your
business unit doesn't pay for it.
Your manager doesn't need toknow.
All your confidentiality isprotected.
That creates a layer of safety.
(28:50):
It also removes any real orperceived barriers to hiring a
person with a disability.
Because if you're a manager andyou don't know what's going on
in this space.
You'd be like, hmm, let's see,I've got Kelvin, I've got this
other guy.
They're equal in every respect,except Kelvin doesn't see as
well.
That's probably going to be aproblem.
(29:11):
I'm going to hire this otherguy.
You take that off the tableentirely, because any
productivity tool that youbenefit from is going to be
available to you.
Now he doesn't have to wonderabout that anymore.
Chris Maher (29:23):
And so, Hale, as we start to wrap things up here,
it sounds like Fidelity has beena leader as it relates to
accessibility in terms of largecorporates, and you threw out
the numbers earlier.
You're seeing, with disabilityinclusion and accessibility,
(29:47):
you're seeing 1.6x revenue, 2.6xnet income, 2x economic profit.
What would your, I guess,advice to other large corporates
be around disability, inclusionand accessibility and making
that commitment?
Hale Pulsifer (30:07):
That's a tough one.
That's a tough one becauseevery, every company, like every
business enterprise, is at adifferent place on this journey,
and what might be appropriatefor company A could be a
horrible idea for company C.
So I guess, if I could bubbleit up as generically as possible
(30:27):
, I would say take theDisability Equality Index to
find out where you are on theevolutionary spectrum.
And engage really deeply withother companies who are serious
about this.
The easiest place to find themis Disability: IN.
The National Organization onDisability has a similar tracker
and a similar community.
There's places to go, but byengaging with the community you
(30:52):
find peers who are more thanwilling to be helpful on this
journey.
Disclaimer I don't work forDisability: IN.
I don't get any kickback fromDisability: IN or anything like
that.
They've really influenced thedirection of disability
inclusion strategy at thecompany I work for and in my
life personally.
That's just my experience.
I'm just astonished that therehasn't been a 60 Minutes episode
(31:15):
about this.
And, Chris, you had askedearlier when is the country
going to wake up and see this?
And the answer is I don't know,but it's here, it's here, it's
out there, it's there for peoplewho are paying attention.
It's just what's going to getpeople to pay attention.
What's that tipping point goingto be?
I don't know.
Chris Maher (31:40):
Well, Hale, it has been an absolute pleasure
chatting with you and thank youfor sharing your insights and
the numbers, and certainlyshedding light on the fact that
investing in accessibility, aswe said at the beginning, it's
not just the right thing to do,it's also really good and really
smart business.
So thanks so much for joiningus and it's been a pleasure
chatting with you and Kelvin,why don't you take us out?
Kelvin Crosby (32:00):
Well, thank you so much for being at Investing
in Accessibility.
I tell you, after listening totoday's show, we're truly
molding each company, eachinvestment opportunity into a
beautiful piece.
It always started a lump ofclay and you start shaping it
into something beautiful, andinvesting in accessibility is
(32:20):
truly that.
We're shaping the world totruly invest in opportunities
for people with disabilities andtruly make the difference and
empower all of us to have equalaccess to all.
Well, like I always say, towrap up, go live beyond your
challenges and we'll see you intwo weeks.
(32:45):
Thank you for listening toInvesting in Accessibility, a
Samaritan Partners podcast,where we invest in change, for
accessibility, not wait forchange.
If you want to follow us, youcan find us on YouTube or
LinkedIn at @Samaritan Partners.
If you would like to invest inSamaritan Partners, email Chris
at chris@samaritanpartners.
com.
(33:07):
If you'd like to learn moreabout us, go to www.
samaritanpartners.
com.
You can take the first step ininvesting in change by giving us
five stars and sharing thispodcast with everybody that you
know, so we can spread the word,so that we can give access to
all by Investing inAccessibility.
Welcome to Investing in Accessibility, a
Samaritan Partners podcast.
We're not waiting for change,we're investing in it.
Join us as we speak withentrepreneurs and thought
leaders that are focused oncreating a more accessible world
.
(00:32):
Hey, so good to see you, eventhough I can't see you.
It's another beautiful day inthe neighborhood and I'm so
excited that you are here atInvesting in Accessibility.
My name is Kelvin Crosby andsome people know me as the
DeafBlind Potter, and you know,one of the coolest things is
when we go through life, we'rebeing molded right, and I think
(00:55):
what we're going to realize isthe opportunities for people
with disability and also theopportunity from an investment
standpoint today, how that isgoing to mold the opportunities
in ways that we never realized.
And I'm excited about today'sguest, because what we're going
to realize is that a lot of usdon't know some of the data
(01:19):
points and how, when you thinkabout including people with
disabilities as an investmentopportunity, it really is going
to transform the world in awhole different way.
But before we get to our guest,let me introduce you to my
co-host, Chris Maher.
How are you doing, man?
Chris Maher (01:35):
Hey Kelvin, how are you, my friend, good to see you
.
Kelvin Crosby (01:38):
I'm doing good.
So I'm really excited abouttoday's show and I'm not going
to hold anybody else back.
So I'm going to let you kind ofgear us up, get us ready for
this.
Chris Maher (01:50):
You got it.
I'm super excited about today'sshow as well, because we, as
you said, we're going to getinto the numbers, and our guest,
I think, has a uniqueperspective to share some
insights as to why investing inaccessibility is not just the
right thing to do, but it's alsogood business.
And so our guest today is HalePulsifer, who is the Vice
(02:12):
President of Customer Insights,Inclusion and Advocacy at
Fidelity Investments.
Welcome, Hale.
Hale Pulsifer (02:19):
Hey, Chris Kelvin , great to be here.
Thanks for having me.
Chris Maher (02:22):
Oh, it's good to have you here, my friend.
A quick aside, you know, I hadthe good fortune of meeting Hale
probably in the last year.
We're both members of adisability business network
called Profound and had the goodfortune of connecting with Hale
through that and then westarted some conversations
outside of that and then whenKelvin and I kicked this podcast
(02:44):
off, Hale you were someone thatwas towards the top of that
list that we knew we wanted tohave as a guest.
So, really excited to have youhere today and let's kick things
off.
And I think where we shouldstart is a little bit about your
own personal background andyour journey and long career at
Fidelity and your connection todisability and accessibility.
Hale Pulsifer (03:04):
Great Thanks.
I'd love to do that and again,thank you so much for having me.
Conversations like this are soimportant.
There's no shortage ofconversations about disability
advocacy and disability socialjustice, but we're not having
enough conversations aboutdisability as an economic
opportunity.
And if you haven't had thisconversation before, even
(03:27):
calling it that might seem likewhat is that?
Is that exploitative?
What is that?
And what I see is that it's allreally really good news.
I get very excited about it, butI have not been in the
disability inclusion space mywhole career.
For the first 10 years, I was adrummer in a rock band that has
nothing to do with any of thisstuff.
(03:47):
Then I got my master's atBabson, very entrepreneurial
school, and entrepreneurship iswhat's going to get this
momentum started in terms ofinvesting in accessibility.
Then I went to FidelityInvestments.
I've been here for 23, 22, 23years now, and for the first 16
(04:08):
years or so, I was a corporatefinance and strategy guy, and
that means budgeting, expensereporting but, best of all,
business cases.
How do we decide where toinvest our money internally.
(04:28):
How do you know a good ideafrom a bad idea?
And doing that for years andyears and years, I think
ultimately was preparing me forsomething much bigger, which was
the day that two thingshappened.
Not the same day, of course,but one is I started working
really closely with a guy by thename of Jeff Wissel who has
retinitis pigmentosa, losing hisvision at work.
(04:50):
How can I be a world-classphone rep if I can't read the
monitor that tells me mycustomer balances and positions?
And now I'm going to get fired,I'm going to lose my livelihood
, like, ah, what's going tohappen?
I started working closely withJeff and I started considering
disclosing my own connection todisability.
But it was Jeff that was reallylike he was.
Jeff was really the thing thatgot it all going, because Jeff
(05:24):
showed me the world ofdisability-inspired innovation,
the world of the hacks that weuse when we have disabilities
that the rest of the worlddoesn't know about.
You know, with this knowledgecame this inspiration.
Oh, with a heavy dose ofDisability: IN.
I'm a huge fan of Disability (05:30):
IN and not-for-profit that drives
disability inclusion at thecorporate level, for both
customers and employees alike.
All this came together to askthe question what would it be
like if we transformed ourbusiness model to be disability
first, to be disabilityinclusive, and all of that
(05:53):
background manifested into abusiness case that involved
profitability and riskassessments, competitive
assessments, and the whole thingboiled down to one
recommendation — let's create avery small department focused on
making the customer experienceawesome for people with
disabilities.
So, to be clear, you've gotaccessibility departments, which
(06:15):
are critical.
Those are table stakes, butthere's so much more than just
accessibility and that's so.
That was the business case andwe shopped it around and within
a few months, we were co-leadingthis, this new department, and
there's been some iterationssince then, but that's basically
what I've been doing ever since.
Kelvin Crosby (06:35):
Well, I think the one thing I'm taking away it's
disability economics.
I mean that has a ring to itthat says, "what does that look
like?
" What can you see from that?
And I mean, I guess can youexplain to us a little bit more.
When somebody said disabilityand economics, how does that
(07:00):
create an empowerment forincluding everybody and really
give people the opportunities tobe like wow, there's actually a
way to make money this way andto build, cover my bottom line,
cover my overhead and make mycustomers have the best
opportunity possible?
Hale Pulsifer (07:22):
I love the question and there's a lot of
different ways to answer it.
So when I think about investingin accessibility with the
companies and trends that Ifollow like a fundamental
enhancement for disabilityinclusion benefits a lot more
people.
You know it's called the curbcut effect.
It's named after street cornersand the little ramp that's
(07:44):
there so wheelchairs can glideeffortlessly from the street to
the sidewalk and the sidewalk tothe street.
Oh yeah, that's right.
I use that ramp too when I'vegot my rollerboard suitcase, or
the UPS driver uses that rampwhen he's got the dolly full of
the heavy packages.
How about push-button doors?
It's the same thing.
You invest in a push buttondoor that's there by law for
(08:04):
somebody with either in awheelchair or someone with fine
motor disabilities or upper bodystrength issues, but we all use
it, right?
There are so many examples ofthat.
There's so many more of thesedisability inspired innovations
that have changed the way we dothings.
And here's where that starts toshow up in business.
(08:29):
First, let's talk aboutproductivity, profitability.
Accenture did this studyfocusing on this what happens to
companies that are prioritizingdisability inclusion and they
basically measured this based onwhat companies were taking the
Disability Quality Index andgetting a good score.
So they took all thosecompanies and they grouped them
(08:49):
by industry and they comparedthem to those in the same
industry that were not doingthis and they right-sized it.
So it was apples to applesAgain, this is Accenture.
This is a world-classorganization known for their
consulting and research.
What they found is that thecompanies that were prioritizing
disability inclusion wereachieving 1.6x more revenue,
(09:11):
2.6x more net income and 2x moreeconomic profit.
Kelvin Crosby (09:17):
Hale, can you say that one more time?
Hale Pulsifer (09:20):
1.
6x more revenue, 2.6x more netincome and 2x more economic
profit.
And those numbers aresignificantly increased from
when they measured this studyback in 2018.
This just came out a coupleyears ago, November 2023.
So now we're seeing morerevenue, more net income and
(09:43):
more economic profit, and theone thing these companies have
in common is that they'reprioritizing disability
inclusion, because everythingelse has been equalized for size
, et cetera.
And these same firms are alsoreporting increased problem
solving, increased innovation,higher retention rates, lower
turnover and 25% higherproductivity or revenue per
employee.
We can include the link to thisstudy in the in the show notes,
(10:06):
but it's called The DisabilityInclusion Imperative on the
Accenture website, right, andlike that's just the beginning.
Industries, companies that arerealizing we get better results
when we do this.
That's not why they starteddoing it.
They start doing it because youjust know, and now we've got
the numbers to quantify what thebenefit is.
(10:27):
But then what happens now islike now it's a party because we
have studies like this, and soother companies that are on the
sidelines are looking like ohwow, I've been on the fence
about really investing indisability inclusion or I didn't
know what it's a thing, and nowI'm really going to look into
it.
And this creates demand forhiring, which creates job
(10:48):
opportunities for people withdisabilities.
Like there's never been abetter time in history to be a
young person, college educatedor not, looking for work and
finding some of thesedisability-inclusive companies.
There's an organization calledthe Progressive Policy Institute
and they did this work calledDisability and Changes in the
(11:10):
Workplace.
And I was talking to the authorabout this report.
I'm like, man, this stuff isgreat.
Where'd you get it?
And he said we actually weren'teven looking for it.
We were looking for somethingelse and we found this
disability trend along the wayand then had to publish it.
But here's what they found.
In the period between 2020 andthe end of 2023, so it's roughly
a four-year period.
(11:30):
Total employment during thattime grew by about three and a
half million jobs.
That's fine.
That's a typical number duringthat time.
But what's not typical is thatover half of that net job
creation went to disabled people, so one quarter of the
population driving over half ofnet job growth.
(11:51):
That can only happen when youhave a significant supply of
people with disabilities lookingfor work and an even larger
demand of companies looking foremployees with disabilities.
Chris Maher (12:03):
Yeah, that's a staggering statistic that you
just said.
So over 50% of the net jobsover what?
Was that time period?
Again, 20 to 2023?
.
Hale Pulsifer (12:14):
It was early 2020 to the end of 2023.
Chris Maher (12:17):
Yeah, over 50% of those net new jobs were filled
with people with disabilities.
Hale Pulsifer (12:23):
Yes, how do you explain that?
Yeah, and there's a couple ofreasons.
One is COVID's in there, whichmeans remote work, and remote
work turns out to be a lot moreamenable to many disabilities
than work involving a commute.
So you've got that going.
We also have remote workunleashing new levels of
productivity, because where youhave Zoom, you have captions if
(12:46):
your employers turn it on.
And where you have captions,you have more employment
opportunities for people whohappen to be deaf, hard of
hearing or have learningdisabilities, auditory
processing disorders, that kindof thing.
Another factor is that in theprevious five, six years,
whatever you want to call, itthere were people who retired
(13:06):
because of disability, becausethe commute and everything it
was too much.
And now, with COVID andeverybody working remote, it
created an opportunity for themto return to the workforce and
many of them had a career'sworth of skills and experience
that are really valuable.
So you take out the commute andyou add this layer of assistive
(13:26):
technology and you reintroducepeople into the workforce who
had to leave because ofdisability but don't have to
anymore.
That's how you get such a sucha surge.
Chris Maher (13:36):
And so so Hale I mean Accenture put out this
report.
I mean they're a legitimateorganization, right?
How is this research not morepervasive across corporate
America?
Is it just a matter of time?
And the second part of thatquestion is the sense I get at
(13:59):
Fidelity, when you folks wereputting together this group that
you run, you know what eight,10 years ago, leader leadership
saw the value.
What were those key metricsthat really triggered the light
bulb that got senior leadershipto commit to it.
Because I think that's criticalfor senior leadership buy-in
(14:23):
across corporate America to makethis a much more pervasive
commitment across the industryor across the marketplace.
Hale Pulsifer (14:33):
Yeah, so I'll do the second question first, which
is what caused them to buy in?
It turns out this is a specialplace.
I love it.
I love working here.
The reason I chose to come hereso many years ago is that,
unashamedly, customer alwayscomes first.
We're obsessed with thecustomer.
Even if you work in corporatefinance and never talk to
(14:55):
customers, we want you to spendone or two days a year going out
into the field and listening tophone calls and like just being
really in touch with what ourcustomers believe.
Disability is a dimension ofour customers that we're not
paying attention to.
And if you love your customers,how useful is it to know a
(15:16):
customer's birthday and risktolerance and ability to pay for
services and all these thingsthat we know about our customers
?
What use is that if we don'talso capture that they have
interaction preferences that maybe driven by a disability?
So it doesn't.
We're not in the business oftracking who has, you know, RP?
But we are in the business oftracking— Do you prefer audio
(15:40):
statements or braille statementsor large print statements?
Do you prefer to have an ASLinterpreter?
If you really care about yourcustomers, you have to care
about these things.
Chris Maher (15:51):
The most recent statistics that I've seen is
that one in four adults in theUS has a disability, so that's
25% of your customer base.
But I think something you justsaid that's really important
that a lot of companies neglectto think about is are the
families and friends, thecaregivers, the people
supporting the person with thedisability.
(16:12):
When you add them in, that canthen become 50 to 60% of the
population, of your customerbase.
That's a really large group.
Hale Pulsifer (16:22):
Yeah,
Kelvin Crosby (16:23):
I think this is something that I want everybody
to understand is you look atWheel the World, if you haven't
heard that podcast the go andlisten to that, but if also you
look at how, when you look ataccessibility, and you include
both the accessibility part forthe person with disability, like
(16:48):
what Chris just said, theopportunity with their family
members or their friends orloved ones, and you include all
of that in, that's more thanhalf of the population, and
there's your market, and I thinkwhat we're talking about, and I
want people to understand this,is that when you include the
(17:13):
disability factor, you'reessentially solving the world's
problems.
Becuase the people who are ablebodied they don't have anybody
in their life at the momentbecause they're eventually going
to have somebody that has adisability, but they still can
have access and without barriersthemselves, and they can
(17:33):
leverage.
I mean, just look at the echoes, you know, speak some words out
of your mouth and you're set togo.
Hale Pulsifer (17:41):
You're touching on something that was also
fundamental to getting thisapproved, which I'd forgotten
about.
We're a financial servicescompany, which means retirement
around here is a pretty big deal.
We need to be a world-classretirement provider.
So if we solve for engagingwith deafness, hard of hearing
(18:05):
and blindness no vision we arealso solving for our customers
who are aging into disability.
So if you're a customer whoretires let's say you're 65, you
retire, in the next few yearsyou start losing your hearing.
What if you learned from yourfinancial services provider
about the array of technologiesavailable to you to supplement
your hearing or to supplementyour vision?
Hey, you ever heard of a screenreader?
Oh, I mean, imagine if it'syour financial services company
that's showing you that.
(18:25):
Yeah, you know your phone.
It has voiceover.
You can turn voiceover on andit'll read to you.
That part's really cool.
I get excited about that.
Kelvin Crosby (18:33):
Yeah, I mean I think this is where I think what
I would like to do next is kindof get into some of the numbers
here.
Where are we seeing growthalready?
And then, where is the futurekind of showing us potential in
the near future?
Hale Pulsifer (19:07):
One number that I look at, it's not future
looking, it's more recent past,is a study that came out by the
American Institutes of Researchcalled "hidden market, and one
of the things this study did wasit looked at purchasing power
and discretionary income fordifferent populations in the
United States that are nottypically looked at in terms of
economic impact.
And the study is dated at thispoint and I've spoken to the
authors about refreshing it andmaybe they will, but it has not
been updated since 2018.
So these are some older numbers, but as of 2018, the purchasing
(19:31):
power for the disabilitycommunity was almost $500
billion.
It was $490 billion.
That's purchasing power forworking-age people with
disabilities in the UnitedStates.
And, to put that in perspective, that same number for the Black
community is $500 billion andfor the Hispanic Latino
(19:52):
community is $580 billion.
So Latino $580, black $500,disability $490.
These are big numbers.
This is a big segment and mostpeople don't think about the
disability community as aconsumer segment and yet very
significant after-tax disposableincome.
(20:13):
Discretionary income, which is,after you've covered all your
essential expenses what do youhave left over for fun stuff for
working-age people?
That's $21 billion and that'smore than Black and Latino
segments combined.
Combined.
So if you're looking for thenon-essential stuff, the
(20:36):
disability community is a largerpotential market for you, and
the reason I'm sharing all thisis not because it's a
competition, but I'm sharing allthis because in recent years we
have seen significantinvestment and a lot of effort
in engaging with traditionallyunderrepresented communities in
(20:57):
the United States.
That's where change moves.
Starts with corporations anddisability.
We're relative newcomers tothis space, so disability isn't
new, but a critical mass ofdisability in the workforce,
that part's new, right, thatpart's new.
To understand this.
(21:18):
But if you fast forward fromthe passing of the ADA to an
academic generation which isaround 16 years give or take,
that gets you to right around2010-ish.
And it was at that point thatthis steady supply of highly
qualified, workforce-ready youngpeople with disabilities
(21:40):
entered the market.
And most employers didn't knowwhat to do about that just yet.
So the supply built and builtand built like water behind a
dam, and then employers startedfiguring it out and then the dam
kind of started breaking andthat led to this flood of people
with disabilities into theworkforce, which I think has
been happening for a while.
But it's especially evident inthat Progressive Policy
(22:02):
Institute number we talkedabout— over half of net job
creation over that four years.
We now have more people withdisabilities and a voice in the
workplace advocating for thisstuff.
So that's why we're getting somuch more attention now than we
have in the past, even thoughit's not as much as I would like
.
Chris Maher (22:20):
So Hale with that.
Are you optimistic?
Because we're coming up on,kind of that second 16-year
cycle, so are you optimisticthat these trends that we're
seeing around the workforce incorporate America will continue
to trend in that positivedirection?
Hale Pulsifer (22:54):
I am.
I think I am optimistic aboutthat and I also have a feeling
it's going to start slowing downa little bit.
That is to say, growth willcontinue, but the growth cannot
grow at the rate it's beengrowing at.
Companies become awesome atdisability inclusion for their
employees and for theircustomers.
Engagement with that company,expressed by the number of
corporate partners and thenumber of companies taking the
Disability Equality Index, hasbeen growing at 25% per year
(23:18):
over the last six years.
Per year.
Like, show me what grows at 25percent per year.
This is a party.
There are and they have theconference every year in July.
And like it's the most excitingtime of year for me because you
have 3 000 people that are inperson, that are all deeply
(23:40):
committed to disabilityinclusion and just relishing in
the advances and the successesthat have been experienced in
recent years.
And yes, there's still a longway to go, but there's still a
lot to celebrate.
It's a very exciting space.
So recent growth trends suggest,yeah, we're going to be seeing
this for a while, but you can'tsustain 25% growth per year
(24:02):
forever.
It has to start slowing.
And I noticed last year thegrowth rate dropped to 19%.
Who doesn't want 19% growth?
Right?
So it's starting to slow, right, it's starting to slow, but
it's still really impressivegrowth.
The way you know, I think.
The way you know that it'sreally leveling off and it's
(24:23):
reached a balancing point, Ithink, is when the unemployment
rate for people withdisabilities starts matching the
unemployment rate for peoplewithout, because that's when
you'll know that the barriers togetting jobs and staying in
jobs have been removed enoughthat we're essentially equal
populations.
But until then, I thinkdisability employment will
(24:45):
continue to outpacenon-disability employment.
Kelvin Crosby (24:50):
I'd be really interested in that.
I'm curious.
This is the thing that keepsgoing on in my mind as more
technology is being developedand more access is being
developed and more ways arebeing created, is there spaces
where your disability, thatwe're finding that disability,
(25:15):
is just being included and youdon't even know that they have a
disability because they're ableto do their work or they're
able to work in the environmentand they really don't have to
disclose?
I mean, I can give you a perfectexample.
I was able to go into a companyand say, hey, I would love to
work for you, and they didn'tsay anything.
(25:37):
Until day four I ran into awall and they had no idea that I
was blind.
But I did the job and because Ihad all the tools already at my
fingertips and they were usinga Windows computer, so I just
used Narrator and do the thingthat was already on their system
(25:59):
and having that access.
So I'd be curious if the flowis really still 25% because but
on paper it's only 19, becausewe're finding new ways, because
people are being included in theoverall system of employment.
Hale Pulsifer (26:22):
Yeah, I heard a company at Disability
to accommodations asproductivity tools, and the
reason I think that's sopowerful is that a productivity
tool is something like a laptopor a printer.
If you don't like readingthings on your screen, you can
(26:44):
have a printer and printingsomething on paper may improve
your productivity.
Well, a screen reader can alsobe an improvement in
productivity.
When these are starting to becategorized as productivity
tools, they sort of cast adifferent light on them and
they're a lot easier to talkabout and easier to come by.
But there's other things toohappening that are evidence of
(27:08):
rapidly evolving inclusion inthe workplace and more job
opportunities for people withdisabilities.
More and more companies thesedays are having something called
a centralized accommodationbudget, and here's what that
means.
If you request an accommodation, it does not hit your cost
(27:28):
center or your budget.
It's paid for centrally and theimplications of that are pretty
important.
Let's say, if I need an ASLinterpreter, every time I need
one and I ask for one, it's mycost center that pays for it.
Before long, our budget is shot.
We can't have that end of yearparty and we can't hire that
summer intern and there's allthese things we can't do because
(27:49):
I need an ASL interpreter and Idon't want to be in that
position and my manager doesn'twant to be in that position.
So when you have a centralizedcost center to pay for this
stuff, I ask for it, it'sgranted and it does not affect
our expense base as a team atall.
That's one innovation.
Another awesome innovation, andFidelity is one of the first
(28:09):
companies to do thisincidentally, is having a
self-service accessibilitymarketplace where you can figure
out what you need.
You can go online and look atthe options, you can request it
and it's paid for by thatcentralized cost center and it
comes right to you.
You don't even need to engageyour manager at all if you don't
(28:29):
want to.
So if for some reason you don'twant to disclose your
disability, you can go to thisself-service website and get
your copy of JAWS or DragonNaturally Speaking or an
ergonomic keyboard or whateverit is that you need, and your
business unit doesn't pay for it.
Your manager doesn't need toknow.
All your confidentiality isprotected.
That creates a layer of safety.
(28:50):
It also removes any real orperceived barriers to hiring a
person with a disability.
Because if you're a manager andyou don't know what's going on
in this space.
You'd be like, hmm, let's see,I've got Kelvin, I've got this
other guy.
They're equal in every respect,except Kelvin doesn't see as
well.
That's probably going to be aproblem.
(29:11):
I'm going to hire this otherguy.
You take that off the tableentirely, because any
productivity tool that youbenefit from is going to be
available to you.
Now he doesn't have to wonderabout that anymore.
Chris Maher (29:23):
And so, Hale, as we start to wrap things up here,
it sounds like Fidelity has beena leader as it relates to
accessibility in terms of largecorporates, and you threw out
the numbers earlier.
You're seeing, with disabilityinclusion and accessibility,
(29:47):
you're seeing 1.6x revenue, 2.6xnet income, 2x economic profit.
What would your, I guess,advice to other large corporates
be around disability, inclusionand accessibility and making
that commitment?
Hale Pulsifer (30:07):
That's a tough one.
That's a tough one becauseevery, every company, like every
business enterprise, is at adifferent place on this journey,
and what might be appropriatefor company A could be a
horrible idea for company C.
So I guess, if I could bubbleit up as generically as possible
(30:27):
, I would say take theDisability Equality Index to
find out where you are on theevolutionary spectrum.
And engage really deeply withother companies who are serious
about this.
The easiest place to find themis Disability: IN.
The National Organization onDisability has a similar tracker
and a similar community.
There's places to go, but byengaging with the community you
(30:52):
find peers who are more thanwilling to be helpful on this
journey.
Disclaimer I don't work forDisability: IN.
I don't get any kickback fromDisability: IN or anything like
that.
They've really influenced thedirection of disability
inclusion strategy at thecompany I work for and in my
life personally.
That's just my experience.
I'm just astonished that therehasn't been a 60 Minutes episode
(31:15):
about this.
And, Chris, you had askedearlier when is the country
going to wake up and see this?
And the answer is I don't know,but it's here, it's here, it's
out there, it's there for peoplewho are paying attention.
It's just what's going to getpeople to pay attention.
What's that tipping point goingto be?
I don't know.
Chris Maher (31:40):
Well, Hale, it has been an absolute pleasure
chatting with you and thank youfor sharing your insights and
the numbers, and certainlyshedding light on the fact that
investing in accessibility, aswe said at the beginning, it's
not just the right thing to do,it's also really good and really
smart business.
So thanks so much for joiningus and it's been a pleasure
chatting with you and Kelvin,why don't you take us out?
Kelvin Crosby (32:00):
Well, thank you so much for being at Investing
in Accessibility.
I tell you, after listening totoday's show, we're truly
molding each company, eachinvestment opportunity into a
beautiful piece.
It always started a lump ofclay and you start shaping it
into something beautiful, andinvesting in accessibility is
(32:20):
truly that.
We're shaping the world totruly invest in opportunities
for people with disabilities andtruly make the difference and
empower all of us to have equalaccess to all.
Well, like I always say, towrap up, go live beyond your
challenges and we'll see you intwo weeks.
(32:45):
Thank you for listening toInvesting in Accessibility, a
Samaritan Partners podcast,where we invest in change, for
accessibility, not wait forchange.
If you want to follow us, youcan find us on YouTube or
LinkedIn at @Samaritan Partners.
If you would like to invest inSamaritan Partners, email Chris
at chris@samaritanpartners.
com.
(33:07):
If you'd like to learn moreabout us, go to www.
samaritanpartners.
com.
You can take the first step ininvesting in change by giving us
five stars and sharing thispodcast with everybody that you
know, so we can spread the word,so that we can give access to
all by Investing inAccessibility.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Special Summer Offer: Exclusively on Apple Podcasts, try our Dateline Premium subscription completely free for one month! With Dateline Premium, you get every episode ad-free plus exclusive bonus content.