March 31, 2025 • 31 mins
In this episode of Investing in Accessibility, co-hosts Kelvin Crosby and Chris Maher sit down with two true leaders of the accessibility movement: Joe Devon and Jennison Asuncion, co-founders of Global Accessibility Awareness Day (GAAD). Together, they share the incredible story of how a blog post, a tweet, and a Saturday night on Twitter sparked a global movement that now reaches over 200 million people annually.
Joe and Jennison open up about their personal journeys—Joe’s path through tech and entrepreneurship, and Jennison’s lived experience as a blind technologist navigating a rapidly changing world. They reflect on the early days of GAAD, the role of big tech, and the power of grassroots efforts to create global impact.
This episode is packed with insight, humor, history, and hope for a more inclusive future. Whether you’re an entrepreneur, investor, technologist, or advocate, this conversation will challenge you to see accessibility not just as a compliance checkbox—but as a catalyst for meaningful innovation.
Links & Resources:
- GAAD Foundation: Click here
- Global Accessibility Awareness Day: Click here
- Joe Devon: Connect on LinkedIn
- Joe's Newsletter: Joe Dev On Tech
- Jennison Asuncion: Connect on LinkedIn
COMING SOON!
American Sign Language (ASL) and Captioning for each episode will be provided on our YouTube channel. Go to handle @SamaritanPartners.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Kelvin Crosby (00:06):
Welcome to Investing in Accessibility, a
Samaritan Partners podcast.
We're not waiting for change,we're investing in it.
Join us as we speak withentrepreneurs and thought
leaders that are focused oncreating a more accessible world
.
(00:34):
It's so good to see you, eventhough I can't see you.
It's another beautiful day inthe neighborhood and I'm so
excited that you are here atInvesting in Accessibility.
My name is Kalvin Crosby and Igot my co-host, Chris Maher.
How you doing man.
Chris Maher (00:48):
I am fantastic, Kelvin, good to be with you
today in person for the firsttime, which is amazing.
Kelvin Crosby (00:53):
I tell you, you smell great.
You know it was the first timeI was wondering how is Chris
Maher going to smell at CSUN andI was like this could be very
interesting.
Chris Maher (01:05):
It's awesome to see you in person, my friend.
Kelvin Crosby (01:06):
Yes, it's been great and we've had a good time
at CSUN.
And I tell you we got anamazing set of guests today and
I can't wait for you guyslistening tonight today or
tonight, whatever time you'relistening, that these two people
, they're changing the world ina way that you don't realize, so
why don't you introduce us toour guest?
Chris Maher (01:27):
It is my pleasure.
We have two of my favoritepeople on the planet that are
joining us today.
They are the founders of GAAD,Global Accessibility Awareness
Day, and they do a multitude ofother things, and I would
consider both of them to be OGsof the accessibility space in
terms of advocacy for disability, and so I'd like to welcome
(01:48):
Jennison Asuncion and Joe Devonto the podcast today.
Welcome guys.
Joe Devon (01:52):
Thank you, Chris.
Great to be here.
Chris Maher (01:55):
And so it really is such a treat.
A quick story about how I metJennison and Joe, and there is a
common thread there that Ihonestly didn't really realize
until we were, you know, goingto do this conversation today.
So I met Jenison first inOctober of 23.
We were at M Enabling and I satacross the table from Jenison
at a dinner that the folks fromthe Perkins School for the Blind
(02:17):
were hosting.
And so that's where I meetJenison.
And then fast forward a fewmonths to CES and I'm at another
dinner hosted by folks fromPerkins and Howe Innovation, and
I sit across the table from Joe.
And so I have such gratitudefor the folks at Perkins for
bringing you two into my life,and so that's a pretty neat way
that we all came together.
Joe Devon (02:38):
That is cool and they're a great organization.
Chris Maher (02:41):
Yeah, they are the best.
So let's kick things off here.
I think what would be wonderfulto start is for Joe and to
Jenison just to take a coupleminutes each to tell people
about your personal backgroundsbefore we get into how you two
came together and founded GAAD.
So, joe, let's start with you.
Joe Devon (02:56):
Sure.
So in terms of personalbackground, I'd say tech kind of
started for me at 13 years old.
I got an Apple IIe and justfell in love with it.
Within a month I wrote aprogram that essentially was
translating English to Hebrewwords, and back then there was
like no courses to take.
(03:17):
I was too young, I had noaccess to any books.
We just had to figureeverything out and I really took
to it from there.
And then I was this combinationof tech and entrepreneurship in
my blood, so I just startedlots of different companies.
I went to Europe, you probablydon't know this, Chris yeah.
Chris Maher (03:37):
I don't.
Joe Devon (03:38):
Russia was just opening up and it was really the
wild, wild west.
So I started a company when Iwas probably like 22 or so 23,
in Europe, and I traveled theworld doing international
trading, all over Russia allover Ukraine.
Chris Maher (03:55):
Were you based in Russia at that time?
Joe Devon (03:57):
I was based in Antwerp in Belgium and I met all
kind of interesting characters,because when government
collapses, a lot of people sortof take over different cities.
So I have lots of crazy storiesthat I probably shouldn't say
on a podcast.
But my goodness, yeah, I forgotmore stuff than that would go
(04:20):
in a book.
Thank God I forgot it.
You know.
Yeah, So then from there youwant me to get all the way to
GAAD?
Chris Maher (04:26):
Well, how did you, how did you really start to get
into the accessibility space?
And then we'll go to Jennisonand then come back for you guys
to tell us about how GAADstarted.
Joe Devon (04:34):
Yeah, , so really the accessibility is the GAAD gad
story, because I was actuallyworking American Idol.
com idolcom and I seen, seen I'dread one thing about
accessibility by this fellowMark mark Pilgrim, who wrote a
blog called Dive into Mark, buthe also would go like dive into
Python, dive into accessibility.
So that was the first placewhere I heard of it.
(04:56):
And then I saw this fellowVictor victor Tsaran.
He is a technical programmanager at Google and he did a
video showing what it was liketo.
was then at Yahoo.
He's like this is how you viewa page with a screen reader.
And I was blown away and I wasalways on the bleeding edge of
tech and I had not really heardof this.
(05:18):
So that percolated in my minduntil my dad was in his mid-80s.
He was losing his hearing andhis eyesight and he couldn't
bank, .
And I got really upset becausethe banking website was
inaccessible.
So I wrote this blog post thatturned into Global Accessibility
Awareness Day.
Chris Maher (05:39):
You know, the lived experience usually comes into
place right.
Joe Devon (05:43):
Absolutely.
And my dad had an incrediblehistory.
He was in the concentrationcamps.
He was in Auschwitz and Dachau.
He spoke 11 different languages, including Aramaic.
He was brilliant.
He was as good at science, asgood at Talmud as he was at
science Just a genius.
So watching my dad not be ableto bank and be independent was
(06:04):
really painful for someone ofhis stature.
You know, he's like a god to me, you know, but I think this
would be a good time to pass itto Jennison to tell his side of
it.
Jennison Asuncion (06:13):
Let's do it, hey everyone.
So I, what's my origin story?
So, just so folks know, I amsomeone who's completely blind.
I lost my vision when I wasabout a year and a half old, so
this is all I've ever known, andI raise that here because I
grew up as technology wasactually innovating in front of
me.
So I'm a kid of the 70s and thefirst computers I ever dealt
(06:37):
with didn't even have anysoftware that read back to me
what was on the screen.
My screen reading software weremy sister and my cousins.
And so I would play games likeAtari games.
I would learn how to do it justwith the sounds and stuff.
But then in school they hadthis silly idea of teaching a
blind guy logo on the Apple.
(06:59):
So I remember I'll never forgetFD40RT90 to create squares.
But then I would just for fun tosee if the teachers were paying
attention.
I would change the coordinatesand see if they would tell me if
I was really drawing a squareor something else.
So that was really my firstforay into technology.
And then so I learned BASIC andI remember those old computers
(07:21):
with the tape decks and all ofthat stuff.
But ultimately I learned I hadaccess to an Apple computer with
the very early screen readingsoftware like really old, old
stuff.
That must have been torture.
Absolutely, but I was learning.
I was looking at games and howthey were text games and how
they were being built, and I wasjust basically learning how to
(07:44):
program on the fly, fast forward.
I thought, you know, being a,an Asian immigrant, that my lot
was either going to be anengineer, a lawyer or doctor.
Obviously, doctor was out ofthe question.
.
Kelvin Crosby (07:59):
Wait, you don't want to do brain surgery?
Jennison Asuncion (08:01):
I don't think people would want me to do
brain surgery on them.
Kelvin Crosby (08:03):
I might trust a blind guy over esteemed person
for brain surgery.
Jennison Asuncion (08:07):
Fair, enough, fair enough.
But yeah.
So one of my issues was mathwas never strong with me.
For me.
I was one of those kids whounfortunately got the advice
from well-meaning professionalsat the time that said you know,
you're blind, don't expect to dowell in math and science, you
(08:27):
should consider doing psychologyor law, and nothing against
those two professions.
But I was basically told,because I was blind, that math
was not going to be part of whatI was going to do.
And so you build, I built mathphobia and all that kind of
stuff.
So.
But despite all that, I didtake a kick at the can twice,
once in college and one atuniversity level.
(08:49):
I got into computer engineeringand hated it both times.
But that was that.
I finished up with a degree inpolitical science.
This was back in Canada, inMontreal, and then I was like
what am I going to do now?
And fortunately I learned aboutthis degree in educational
technology.
I was already doing on the sidestuff training people with
(09:10):
disabilities on how to usetechnology at my local community
college.
So someone came to me and said,hey, you know you're a good
trainer and stuff.
You should consider this degree.
So I said, well, this will be afast track to getting into
corporate.
So I did the degree and leftMontreal, moved to Toronto,
spent five and a half years inthe e-learning space doing a
bunch of non-accessibility stuff, being a project manager,
(09:34):
things like that and then in2006, I quit cold turkey and my
friends at that point weresaying like why aren't you doing
accessibility?
You care about the stuff,you're passionate about it, blah
, blah, blah.
But there was a reason Idecided not to do accessibility
right away.
I wanted to have what Iconsidered real world experience
doing other stuff.
I didn't want to be pigeonholedas the blind guy doing
(09:56):
accessibility.
So I did all the other stuffwhich was important to me
because my life in projectmanagement was like going to
business school for me.
So I learned all of that stuffand then I transitioned into
digital accessibility full timein 2006, got my first gig at the
Royal Bank of Canada, did a lotof stuff working with designers
(10:18):
and developers all that goodstuff, had an amazing time and I
learned that part of what I wasgood at doing was making people
feel comfortable around theconcept of accessibility and
making it fun and exciting andinteresting.
I'm fast forwarding here a lot,but in 2009, I ended up going to
something called AccessibilityCamp in DC and it was this
(10:38):
totally weird experience.
I'm a bit of a type A guy.
I like structure and stuff, butI came to this event where
people were putting Post-itnotes up on a board and voting
on different sessions aroundaccessibility and I was like
this is wild.
It was a Saturday at the MLKPublic Librar y.
Shout out to John Croston whostarted that whole thing.
But yeah, so I came to DC.
(10:59):
I threw a networking receptioneven back then at a place called
Ben's Chili Bowl and I talkedto them and they decided to do
an accessibility camp.
They did that.
I got bitten by the bug.
I helped run one in Boston andthen Toronto and then it just
happened in 2011.
(11:21):
I happened to beuncharacteristically home on a
Saturday night.
Kelvin Crosby (11:28):
That's where the rumor has it.
You're always out on a Saturdaynight.
Jennison Asuncion (11:34):
But check this out.
So here I am, doing what alltech people do at the time was I
was trolling on Twitter andhere I was, and here I was, and
remember what I said before,that I built this passion around
like trying to find neat waysto make accessibility
approachable for your everydaytechnologist.
So here I am, I'm on Twitterand I come up upon this tweet
(11:56):
that says technology must gomainstream, now.
Something to that effect.
And I activated the link andcame upon a blog post by this
guy who I didn't know at thetime, Joe Devon, in Los Angeles.
Chris Maher (12:15):
Was that the beginning?
That was the blog post and thatwas the beginning of you guys
partnering for GAD.
Jennison Asuncion (12:21):
Yeah, so Joe wrote this blog post.
He he vented a little bittalking about how he, as a
developer, and other developersdon't know what accessibility is
or what it should be, andpeople don't know what a screen
reader is.
And then he said we need a day,an international day, to just
bring awareness to accessibility.
(12:42):
And I was like wow, this islike whew.
And so I replied to the blogand we have the blog post still.
If you go to accessibility.
day, you can see the blog postthere.
And I responded, I said, hey ifyou're really interested in
doing something you know this iswhat I've been doing in Canada,
(13:02):
get back to me.
And the rest is history.
Chris Maher (13:05):
I love how the universe conspires to bring
people together like that.
You guys are certainly kindredspirits, and that's just a
fantastic story.
Kelvin, do you have a question?
Kelvin Crosby (13:15):
Yeah, well, I think one thing that I would
love people to understand isthat, as we start connecting and
making universal access, whatwe're realizing is that, as a
business-led person, networkingis not easy for us, and I think
this is one of the biggestblessings of the blind person is
(13:35):
that everybody is neutral untilthey tell you who they are.
There's no judgment.
And then the next thing youknow, the world blows up once
you figure out who they are thevisually impaired person.
And I think that's kind of whathappened with you guys.
It's like, wow, all right, theworld is going to go viral, it's
going to go boom, it's going togo crazy.
Jennison Asuncion (13:56):
We never thought.
Joe and I, and I think Joeyou'll agree with me, we
honestly didn't think that thiswas going to go anywhere.
We got on the phone back in theday.
You actually picked up a phoneand we just started chatting and
Joe was very plugged into themainstream Los Angeles tech
community and had like reallygood street cred and was
involved with a lot of opensource and all of that stuff in
(14:18):
the mainstream side.
You know, I had built a bit ofa thing on my end on the
accessibility side, but we bothtruly didn't know, like what was
going to happen.
So we basically bothindividually just reached out to
people and said hey, we'regoing to choose this random day,
may 9th 2012, and we're goingto call it Global Accessibility
(14:39):
Awareness Day, and would you bewilling to run an event?
Chris Maher (14:42):
A true grassroots effort.
So, Joe, give us a little bitmore about GAAD and your mission
and some of the things that youfolks are doing.
Jennison Asuncion (14:50):
How was that history, though?
Did I get it right?
Joe Devon (14:54):
Yes, yeah, that was an interesting memory, like you
know, bring you down memory lane.
What's interesting, there's afew alignments here is that
Jennison was from Montreal.
I was born in Montreal as well.
I believe you were working at abank, right?
Jennison Asuncion (15:11):
RBC.
Joe Devon (15:11):
Yeah, so he was working at a bank ensuring
accessibility there, and here wehave a bank that is what
prompted the blog post.
And then we thought if we workreally, really hard, we might be
able to get a bit of a success.
But the reality with viralityis that you just don't know
what's going to hit.
And the blog post was onMySQLTalk.
com, a database blog with a hugeaudience of maybe 10 people in
(15:36):
its entire history, and a fewyears later this thing is
reaching over 200 million peopleon the hashtag.
And another interesting aspectis that by year three I never
mentioned the bank's namepublicly, but people from the
bank, and I wish I could findfind that email, they reached
out to us and they said we knowour accessibility sucks and
(15:58):
we're doing an internal event.
Please don't tell anybodypublicly, but we're going to
improve our accessibilityinternally,
Chris Maher (16:04):
Your dad's bank?
Joe Devon (16:05):
Yeah,
Chris Maher (16:06):
Oh my god, full circle there, huh?
Joe Devon (16:08):
Yeah, huge bank and and, like I've done all kind of
enterprise work but never had animpact on an organization as
this one little blog post out ofnowhere, and it's really about
tapping the vein of an unmetneed and people.
You know it is so frustratingsometimes because when you're
(16:29):
talking to enterprise, theydon't, not all the divisions
understand how big this is.
Like this didn't reach 200million people because it's a
small market, like it affects somany people.
So I wish that they couldunderstand how that translates
into income.
But it's so subtle becausethere's so many aspects to
(16:49):
disability and and so they wantto see the numbers in a very
concrete way and that's, I think, a bit of the challenge.
Kelvin Crosby (16:58):
Yeah, I mean, I think what we're realizing and I
think investing inaccessibility, what we're
realizing is that for so longwe've been pushing so hard and I
think the bucket is gettingfull on all the different
resources and it's starting topour out.
And I think we're at CSUN andI'm curious from your guys'
(17:22):
perspective at the 40thanniversary of CSUN and like are
you seeing that same?
Like the bucket's gettingreally full, the opportunities
are becoming better for peoplewith disabilities, and really
creating an opportunity forpeople with disabilities to be
successful in a way that wehaven't had for years.
(17:45):
But I feel like this is theseason and that bucket's getting
really full.
What would you guys say aboutthat?
Jennison Asuncion (17:51):
Yeah, absolutely so.
This is my, I think, 18th or19th CSUN conference and I
haven't yet had a chance tofully walk the exhibit hall, but
that's always where you see allthe latest assistive technology
and accessibility-relatedthings.
The one thing I have to say is,you know, back in the day a lot
(18:12):
of this technology was out ofreach of those of us with
disabilities from a price pointperspective.
But now you're seeing like $200pair of glasses that now are
bringing such independence andempowerment for people with
visual impairments.
Different sets of glasses,different smart, all these smart
devices and sure, there is aprice tag to it because people
(18:37):
need to pay in order to investin the technology and research
and all that stuff.
But where I'm going is theprices have come down
significantly on a lot of thetechnology, so it's putting it
in closer range for more people.
Is it getting to everyone?
Absolutely not.
Let's be realistic that we'restill dealing with this high
(18:57):
unemployment rate In differentcountries.
People with differentdisabilities are still shunned
or hidden away.
None of that stuffunfortunately has moved the
needle fully in every country onthat front.
But, what I see here is so muchnew technology that makes it
that much more possible againfor those of us with
disabilities to really seek outand really dream big and see
(19:25):
what might be out there.
I mean autonomous vehicles.
I mean, we got Waymo in SanFrancisco.
The idea of hopping into a car,a driverless car, is amazing,
and particularly for my peerswho have service animals, you
know, this is an amazingopportunity for them not to be
potentially discriminatedagainst by badly meaning drivers
(19:48):
.
I'll leave it there.
Chris Maher (19:48):
Janice, and I think that was really well put.
So thank you so much.
And, Joe, as we hand off overto you, whether it's here at
CSUN or just in the broadermarket, I know AI is something
that you're very focused onright now, and so like we'd love
to get your take around AI asit relates to assistive
technology.
Joe Devon (20:05):
Yeah, and let's just talk about innovation.
What I think a lot of peopledon't realize is, if you want
the coolest innovation, you gointo accessibility.
One of the things that I'veseen here in previous years is a
company called BrainPort.
I mean, this thing blew me away.
Brainport uses what's calledsensory substitution and it uses
(20:33):
electro-vibro-tactilestimulation and takes
essentially a camera.
So there's a camera mounted onglasses and then it films and
then attaches it to thislollipop that you put on your
tongue, because your tongue hasall these sensors and
essentially, you're seeingthrough your tongue.
Right, this is all aboutaccessibility, right?
This technology is amazing andcan be applied in so many
different ways.
(20:53):
There's a TED Talk byneuroscientist David Eagleman,
who also has an amazing podcastcalled what was it?
It'll come back to me now thatI need it.
I don't have it, but maybethere'll be a new technology of
AI that'll inject the rightthought at the right time.
But anyway, inner Cosmos, therewe go.
Inner Cosmos, fantastic podcastand he talks a lot about
(21:14):
sensory substitution.
And he has done this TED Talkwhere he took a vest and
connected up.
It's a haptic vest.
He connected it up to the sound, the audio of an iPhone, and
one hour a day showed someonewho's deaf had him put on this
vest and it translated thesounds into haptic touches and
(21:37):
after about three, four days,this person was able to hear
through his back and now hecreated a little bracelet.
Essentially that he reduced theform factor to a bracelet, and
these are just incredibletechnologies.
And there is an AI component toall of this.
And now there's, you know, AIresearchers.
(22:00):
I don't know that they realizeyou're sitting here with
artificial intelligence tryingto emulate a human being and if
you don't want to have thatuncanny valley effect, you have
to get this perfect.
You have to get it right.
And who other than theaccessibility industry, the
professionals who have spentdecades learning about the
differences in people'sabilities, who else is going to
(22:22):
give you the kind of data whereyou get all the edge cases and
you get every aspect of being ahuman right, because all of us
have extremely differentabilities?
So this is a really excitingtime.
Chris Maher (22:35):
Joe, I think I agree with you 100% and that's
part of the reason why the fundSamaritan Partners is 100%
focused on the disability sector.
Because there's so muchinnovation happening at that
early stage.
I think there's a super uniqueopportunity for private capital
to come into this market to notonly provide that catalytic
(22:56):
funding but also the operationalassistance to really advance
these innovations that are goingto change the lives of millions
of people, and not just peoplein the disability community.
As we know, when things aredesigned for the disability
community with inclusive designand universal design, they tend
to be really valuable to thebroader general public.
Jennison Asuncion (23:17):
Yeah, If I could add to that, what's
exciting to me is the olderadult, the aging adult community
, for lack of a better termthese days.
These are people now who havegrown up with the technology and
they have expectations oftechnology working a certain way
, which is amazing, right?
So we're at the point now wherethe 50, 60, 70-year-olds
(23:41):
they've been exposed to all thistechnology, and so we have this
opportunity to your point,Chris, that it's not only about
people who have permanentdisabilities, like myself who
grew up with a disability, it'sjust people who are aging and
acquiring disability later.
They don't consider themselvesas quote-unquote disabled, but
they'll certainly enlarge thefont sizes and they'll be taking
(24:03):
advantage of some of thisassistive technology, not on the
basis of them quote-unquotehaving a disability, but just
because it's easier and moreconvenient.
But because that populationwill be making, you know, they
have big wallets as well.
They want convenience, theywant to age gracefully, and so
that all is going to drive someamazing things in the next like
(24:27):
10, 15 years.
I'm really excited to see thatstuff.
Kelvin Crosby (24:32):
I think one of the things I want you guys, the
listeners, to really understandhere, what we just heard today
is something that I don't thinkpeople are putting the math
together.
You got aging people that arebecoming disabled later on or
that have tech skills, and wehave people that are growing up
with technology.
We have people that have anexpectation that they want to
(24:56):
live life more successful andtheir loved ones are trying to
help them as well.
And I think, if you add thatall up, I mean I don't have
concrete data, but that numberis not 25%.
You're at least half 50% of themarket.
And I think this is why this issuch a unique time in the
(25:19):
accessibility space becausewe're starting to hit
opportunities for people withdisabilities in ways we've never
been able to do for years.
And this is the time, this isthe season, to be able to have
this opportunity and to reallymake this growth happen, and I
think this is what I'm superexcited about.
Joe Devon (25:39):
So I'd like to give you a little bit on that.
I don't remember the exactnumbers, but I'm pretty sure
about this because I literallywent in to check the population
figures in America and whateverI could globally, and the
populations in most countriesare aging.
And in America right now themillennials, that everybody has
(25:59):
been focused on for so long, theoldest millennial is about 43,
40, maybe 44 already this year.
So it's not not that younganymore and literally at 40,
your eyes start to change andthey start to need more color
contrast and those font sizesthat Jennison was talking about.
So over 50 percent of thepopulation in America is over 40
(26:21):
and so and we bring with us, asJennison was saying, we bring
with us 30 years, three decadesplus of digital content with us.
We're not aging the same waythat our parents and
grandparents aged, and therefore, you know we we cannot be
ignored.
We will will not be ignored andwe are a huge part of the
population.
(26:41):
And there are definitely someheadwinds right now in
accessibility.
However, that pendulum is goingto swing back because of the
fact that this aging populationis going to demand that the
services are accessible for us.
So that's where I think it'sgoing.
Chris Maher (26:57):
Yeah, really well said, Joe.
Jennison?
Jennison Asuncion (27:00):
Yeah, just to build up on this a little bit.
What's really exciting to me,Chris you mentioned how you and
I first met, it's that stuff now.
It's these startups that arefocusing on the disability
community or disability in tech,whether it's our friends at the
Howe Innovation Center at thePerkins or ATS Labs in Canada or
(27:21):
Remarkable, I don't want toforget anyone there, but all of
them and I'm meeting, so I'mspending a lot more time.
Like I'm not just so this isJoe's wheelhouse all the startup
stuff that's his thing.
But I'm now like getting andlearning more and I'm meeting so
many people who are buildingstartups, whether it's on
assistive technologies, that forus with people with
disabilities, or they're tryingto solve some of the pressing
(27:45):
issues when it comes to makingdigital content and websites and
apps more accessible.
But I guess my point here isthat there's this groundswell
that to me, that's what peopleare like aren't you like jaded
and bored of the space and allthat stuff?
And to me, I'm thinking this isreally exciting stuff happening
(28:05):
and just meeting people andhearing about their ideas and
all of that certainly gives memore reason to double down even
more on the stuff that Joe and Iare doing, whether it's through
Global Accessibility AwarenessDay or through the GAAD
Foundation.
Chris Maher (28:21):
Yeah, I agree completely.
It is such an exciting time andobviously the four of us, we're
living it every day.
But that enthusiasm is growingand I think the work that you
folks are doing at GAAD and theGAAD Foundation is critically
important, because you'regetting the word out, you're
creating the awareness and we'regetting a groundswell, and it's
(28:41):
not slowing down, it's pickingup speed.
And so, as we wrap up, how canpeople learn more about GAAD and
the GAAD Foundation?
And if you guys want to shareanything about yourselves
personally in terms of linkswhere people can find you folks
online, as well, would be great.
Joe Devon (28:55):
Sure.
So I'm at Joe Devon,j-o-e-d-e-v-o-n, on all social
media essentially.
I just started a weeklynewsletter where I'm sharing all
kind of crazy stuff about tech,so that should be a fun link.
And then the GAAD Foundationitself, the link is
GAADFoundation, so G-A-A-D.
Foundation dot foundation.
(29:21):
And then the actual day, globalAccessibility Awareness Day, is
on accessibility dot day, andI'm not going to spell
accessibility.
You may have to look that up.
It's too many letters and I'llpass it to Jennison.
Jennison Asuncion (29:28):
Cool.
Well, people can find me onLinkedIn.
So, jenison, j-e-n-n-i-s-o-n,and then A-S-U-N-C-I-O-N, happy
to chat, drop me a message andhappy to hop on a communication
platform.
We can chit chat.
But yeah, this has been great.
Thank you for having us.
Remember Global AccessibilityAwareness Day is always the
(29:50):
third Thursday of May.
We salute all the companies andindividuals who have taken it
up.
We know some companies haveeven made it a whole month, some
made it a week, some take anhour.
Whatever you do to spreadawareness, particularly among
everyday technologists, becausewe're all amongst the converted,
all of us here around thesemicrophones now, but we need to
(30:11):
get the word out to everyoneelse.
Chris Maher (30:14):
Thank you guys.
What a treat to have you two onthe podcast today.
Thank you so much.
You guys are the best.
So, Joe, Jennison, thank you.
Joe Devon (30:24):
t
Jennison Asuncion (30:25):
Thank you, Kelvin.
Thank you, Chris.
Kelvin Crosby (30:26):
Well, that wraps up investing in accessibility
and, as I always say, go livebeyond your challenges and we'll
see you in two weeks.
Thank you for listening toInvesting in Accessibility, a
(30:49):
Samaritan Partners podcast,where we invest in change for
accessibility, not wait forchange.
If you want to follow us, youcan find us on YouTube or
LinkedIn at Samaritan Partners.
If you would like to invest inSamaritan Partners, email Chris
at chris@samaritanpartners.
com.
If you'd like to learn moreabout us, go to www.
(31:11):
s amaritanpartners.
com.
You can take the first step ininvesting in change by giving us
five stars and sharing thispodcast with everybody that you
know, so we can spread the word,so that we can give access to
all by Investing inAccessibility.
Welcome to Investing in Accessibility, a
Samaritan Partners podcast.
We're not waiting for change,we're investing in it.
Join us as we speak withentrepreneurs and thought
leaders that are focused oncreating a more accessible world
.
(00:34):
It's so good to see you, eventhough I can't see you.
It's another beautiful day inthe neighborhood and I'm so
excited that you are here atInvesting in Accessibility.
My name is Kalvin Crosby and Igot my co-host, Chris Maher.
How you doing man.
Chris Maher (00:48):
I am fantastic, Kelvin, good to be with you
today in person for the firsttime, which is amazing.
Kelvin Crosby (00:53):
I tell you, you smell great.
You know it was the first timeI was wondering how is Chris
Maher going to smell at CSUN andI was like this could be very
interesting.
Chris Maher (01:05):
It's awesome to see you in person, my friend.
Kelvin Crosby (01:06):
Yes, it's been great and we've had a good time
at CSUN.
And I tell you we got anamazing set of guests today and
I can't wait for you guyslistening tonight today or
tonight, whatever time you'relistening, that these two people
, they're changing the world ina way that you don't realize, so
why don't you introduce us toour guest?
Chris Maher (01:27):
It is my pleasure.
We have two of my favoritepeople on the planet that are
joining us today.
They are the founders of GAAD,Global Accessibility Awareness
Day, and they do a multitude ofother things, and I would
consider both of them to be OGsof the accessibility space in
terms of advocacy for disability, and so I'd like to welcome
(01:48):
Jennison Asuncion and Joe Devonto the podcast today.
Welcome guys.
Joe Devon (01:52):
Thank you, Chris.
Great to be here.
Chris Maher (01:55):
And so it really is such a treat.
A quick story about how I metJennison and Joe, and there is a
common thread there that Ihonestly didn't really realize
until we were, you know, goingto do this conversation today.
So I met Jenison first inOctober of 23.
We were at M Enabling and I satacross the table from Jenison
at a dinner that the folks fromthe Perkins School for the Blind
(02:17):
were hosting.
And so that's where I meetJenison.
And then fast forward a fewmonths to CES and I'm at another
dinner hosted by folks fromPerkins and Howe Innovation, and
I sit across the table from Joe.
And so I have such gratitudefor the folks at Perkins for
bringing you two into my life,and so that's a pretty neat way
that we all came together.
Joe Devon (02:38):
That is cool and they're a great organization.
Chris Maher (02:41):
Yeah, they are the best.
So let's kick things off here.
I think what would be wonderfulto start is for Joe and to
Jenison just to take a coupleminutes each to tell people
about your personal backgroundsbefore we get into how you two
came together and founded GAAD.
So, joe, let's start with you.
Joe Devon (02:56):
Sure.
So in terms of personalbackground, I'd say tech kind of
started for me at 13 years old.
I got an Apple IIe and justfell in love with it.
Within a month I wrote aprogram that essentially was
translating English to Hebrewwords, and back then there was
like no courses to take.
(03:17):
I was too young, I had noaccess to any books.
We just had to figureeverything out and I really took
to it from there.
And then I was this combinationof tech and entrepreneurship in
my blood, so I just startedlots of different companies.
I went to Europe, you probablydon't know this, Chris yeah.
Chris Maher (03:37):
I don't.
Joe Devon (03:38):
Russia was just opening up and it was really the
wild, wild west.
So I started a company when Iwas probably like 22 or so 23,
in Europe, and I traveled theworld doing international
trading, all over Russia allover Ukraine.
Chris Maher (03:55):
Were you based in Russia at that time?
Joe Devon (03:57):
I was based in Antwerp in Belgium and I met all
kind of interesting characters,because when government
collapses, a lot of people sortof take over different cities.
So I have lots of crazy storiesthat I probably shouldn't say
on a podcast.
But my goodness, yeah, I forgotmore stuff than that would go
(04:20):
in a book.
Thank God I forgot it.
You know.
Yeah, So then from there youwant me to get all the way to
GAAD?
Chris Maher (04:26):
Well, how did you, how did you really start to get
into the accessibility space?
And then we'll go to Jennisonand then come back for you guys
to tell us about how GAADstarted.
Joe Devon (04:34):
Yeah, , so really the accessibility is the GAAD gad
story, because I was actuallyworking American Idol.
com idolcom and I seen, seen I'dread one thing about
accessibility by this fellowMark mark Pilgrim, who wrote a
blog called Dive into Mark, buthe also would go like dive into
Python, dive into accessibility.
So that was the first placewhere I heard of it.
(04:56):
And then I saw this fellowVictor victor Tsaran.
He is a technical programmanager at Google and he did a
video showing what it was liketo.
was then at Yahoo.
He's like this is how you viewa page with a screen reader.
And I was blown away and I wasalways on the bleeding edge of
tech and I had not really heardof this.
(05:18):
So that percolated in my minduntil my dad was in his mid-80s.
He was losing his hearing andhis eyesight and he couldn't
bank, .
And I got really upset becausethe banking website was
inaccessible.
So I wrote this blog post thatturned into Global Accessibility
Awareness Day.
Chris Maher (05:39):
You know, the lived experience usually comes into
place right.
Joe Devon (05:43):
Absolutely.
And my dad had an incrediblehistory.
He was in the concentrationcamps.
He was in Auschwitz and Dachau.
He spoke 11 different languages, including Aramaic.
He was brilliant.
He was as good at science, asgood at Talmud as he was at
science Just a genius.
So watching my dad not be ableto bank and be independent was
(06:04):
really painful for someone ofhis stature.
You know, he's like a god to me, you know, but I think this
would be a good time to pass itto Jennison to tell his side of
it.
Jennison Asuncion (06:13):
Let's do it, hey everyone.
So I, what's my origin story?
So, just so folks know, I amsomeone who's completely blind.
I lost my vision when I wasabout a year and a half old, so
this is all I've ever known, andI raise that here because I
grew up as technology wasactually innovating in front of
me.
So I'm a kid of the 70s and thefirst computers I ever dealt
(06:37):
with didn't even have anysoftware that read back to me
what was on the screen.
My screen reading software weremy sister and my cousins.
And so I would play games likeAtari games.
I would learn how to do it justwith the sounds and stuff.
But then in school they hadthis silly idea of teaching a
blind guy logo on the Apple.
(06:59):
So I remember I'll never forgetFD40RT90 to create squares.
But then I would just for fun tosee if the teachers were paying
attention.
I would change the coordinatesand see if they would tell me if
I was really drawing a squareor something else.
So that was really my firstforay into technology.
And then so I learned BASIC andI remember those old computers
(07:21):
with the tape decks and all ofthat stuff.
But ultimately I learned I hadaccess to an Apple computer with
the very early screen readingsoftware like really old, old
stuff.
That must have been torture.
Absolutely, but I was learning.
I was looking at games and howthey were text games and how
they were being built, and I wasjust basically learning how to
(07:44):
program on the fly, fast forward.
I thought, you know, being a,an Asian immigrant, that my lot
was either going to be anengineer, a lawyer or doctor.
Obviously, doctor was out ofthe question.
.
Kelvin Crosby (07:59):
Wait, you don't want to do brain surgery?
Jennison Asuncion (08:01):
I don't think people would want me to do
brain surgery on them.
Kelvin Crosby (08:03):
I might trust a blind guy over esteemed person
for brain surgery.
Jennison Asuncion (08:07):
Fair, enough, fair enough.
But yeah.
So one of my issues was mathwas never strong with me.
For me.
I was one of those kids whounfortunately got the advice
from well-meaning professionalsat the time that said you know,
you're blind, don't expect to dowell in math and science, you
(08:27):
should consider doing psychologyor law, and nothing against
those two professions.
But I was basically told,because I was blind, that math
was not going to be part of whatI was going to do.
And so you build, I built mathphobia and all that kind of
stuff.
So.
But despite all that, I didtake a kick at the can twice,
once in college and one atuniversity level.
(08:49):
I got into computer engineeringand hated it both times.
But that was that.
I finished up with a degree inpolitical science.
This was back in Canada, inMontreal, and then I was like
what am I going to do now?
And fortunately I learned aboutthis degree in educational
technology.
I was already doing on the sidestuff training people with
(09:10):
disabilities on how to usetechnology at my local community
college.
So someone came to me and said,hey, you know you're a good
trainer and stuff.
You should consider this degree.
So I said, well, this will be afast track to getting into
corporate.
So I did the degree and leftMontreal, moved to Toronto,
spent five and a half years inthe e-learning space doing a
bunch of non-accessibility stuff, being a project manager,
(09:34):
things like that and then in2006, I quit cold turkey and my
friends at that point weresaying like why aren't you doing
accessibility?
You care about the stuff,you're passionate about it, blah
, blah, blah.
But there was a reason Idecided not to do accessibility
right away.
I wanted to have what Iconsidered real world experience
doing other stuff.
I didn't want to be pigeonholedas the blind guy doing
(09:56):
accessibility.
So I did all the other stuffwhich was important to me
because my life in projectmanagement was like going to
business school for me.
So I learned all of that stuffand then I transitioned into
digital accessibility full timein 2006, got my first gig at the
Royal Bank of Canada, did a lotof stuff working with designers
(10:18):
and developers all that goodstuff, had an amazing time and I
learned that part of what I wasgood at doing was making people
feel comfortable around theconcept of accessibility and
making it fun and exciting andinteresting.
I'm fast forwarding here a lot,but in 2009, I ended up going to
something called AccessibilityCamp in DC and it was this
(10:38):
totally weird experience.
I'm a bit of a type A guy.
I like structure and stuff, butI came to this event where
people were putting Post-itnotes up on a board and voting
on different sessions aroundaccessibility and I was like
this is wild.
It was a Saturday at the MLKPublic Librar y.
Shout out to John Croston whostarted that whole thing.
But yeah, so I came to DC.
(10:59):
I threw a networking receptioneven back then at a place called
Ben's Chili Bowl and I talkedto them and they decided to do
an accessibility camp.
They did that.
I got bitten by the bug.
I helped run one in Boston andthen Toronto and then it just
happened in 2011.
(11:21):
I happened to beuncharacteristically home on a
Saturday night.
Kelvin Crosby (11:28):
That's where the rumor has it.
You're always out on a Saturdaynight.
Jennison Asuncion (11:34):
But check this out.
So here I am, doing what alltech people do at the time was I
was trolling on Twitter andhere I was, and here I was, and
remember what I said before,that I built this passion around
like trying to find neat waysto make accessibility
approachable for your everydaytechnologist.
So here I am, I'm on Twitterand I come up upon this tweet
(11:56):
that says technology must gomainstream, now.
Something to that effect.
And I activated the link andcame upon a blog post by this
guy who I didn't know at thetime, Joe Devon, in Los Angeles.
Chris Maher (12:15):
Was that the beginning?
That was the blog post and thatwas the beginning of you guys
partnering for GAD.
Jennison Asuncion (12:21):
Yeah, so Joe wrote this blog post.
He he vented a little bittalking about how he, as a
developer, and other developersdon't know what accessibility is
or what it should be, andpeople don't know what a screen
reader is.
And then he said we need a day,an international day, to just
bring awareness to accessibility.
(12:42):
And I was like wow, this islike whew.
And so I replied to the blogand we have the blog post still.
If you go to accessibility.
day, you can see the blog postthere.
And I responded, I said, hey ifyou're really interested in
doing something you know this iswhat I've been doing in Canada,
(13:02):
get back to me.
And the rest is history.
Chris Maher (13:05):
I love how the universe conspires to bring
people together like that.
You guys are certainly kindredspirits, and that's just a
fantastic story.
Kelvin, do you have a question?
Kelvin Crosby (13:15):
Yeah, well, I think one thing that I would
love people to understand isthat, as we start connecting and
making universal access, whatwe're realizing is that, as a
business-led person, networkingis not easy for us, and I think
this is one of the biggestblessings of the blind person is
(13:35):
that everybody is neutral untilthey tell you who they are.
There's no judgment.
And then the next thing youknow, the world blows up once
you figure out who they are thevisually impaired person.
And I think that's kind of whathappened with you guys.
It's like, wow, all right, theworld is going to go viral, it's
going to go boom, it's going togo crazy.
Jennison Asuncion (13:56):
We never thought.
Joe and I, and I think Joeyou'll agree with me, we
honestly didn't think that thiswas going to go anywhere.
We got on the phone back in theday.
You actually picked up a phoneand we just started chatting and
Joe was very plugged into themainstream Los Angeles tech
community and had like reallygood street cred and was
involved with a lot of opensource and all of that stuff in
(14:18):
the mainstream side.
You know, I had built a bit ofa thing on my end on the
accessibility side, but we bothtruly didn't know, like what was
going to happen.
So we basically bothindividually just reached out to
people and said hey, we'regoing to choose this random day,
may 9th 2012, and we're goingto call it Global Accessibility
(14:39):
Awareness Day, and would you bewilling to run an event?
Chris Maher (14:42):
A true grassroots effort.
So, Joe, give us a little bitmore about GAAD and your mission
and some of the things that youfolks are doing.
Jennison Asuncion (14:50):
How was that history, though?
Did I get it right?
Joe Devon (14:54):
Yes, yeah, that was an interesting memory, like you
know, bring you down memory lane.
What's interesting, there's afew alignments here is that
Jennison was from Montreal.
I was born in Montreal as well.
I believe you were working at abank, right?
Jennison Asuncion (15:11):
RBC.
Joe Devon (15:11):
Yeah, so he was working at a bank ensuring
accessibility there, and here wehave a bank that is what
prompted the blog post.
And then we thought if we workreally, really hard, we might be
able to get a bit of a success.
But the reality with viralityis that you just don't know
what's going to hit.
And the blog post was onMySQLTalk.
com, a database blog with a hugeaudience of maybe 10 people in
(15:36):
its entire history, and a fewyears later this thing is
reaching over 200 million peopleon the hashtag.
And another interesting aspectis that by year three I never
mentioned the bank's namepublicly, but people from the
bank, and I wish I could findfind that email, they reached
out to us and they said we knowour accessibility sucks and
(15:58):
we're doing an internal event.
Please don't tell anybodypublicly, but we're going to
improve our accessibilityinternally,
Chris Maher (16:04):
Your dad's bank?
Joe Devon (16:05):
Yeah,
Chris Maher (16:06):
Oh my god, full circle there, huh?
Joe Devon (16:08):
Yeah, huge bank and and, like I've done all kind of
enterprise work but never had animpact on an organization as
this one little blog post out ofnowhere, and it's really about
tapping the vein of an unmetneed and people.
You know it is so frustratingsometimes because when you're
(16:29):
talking to enterprise, theydon't, not all the divisions
understand how big this is.
Like this didn't reach 200million people because it's a
small market, like it affects somany people.
So I wish that they couldunderstand how that translates
into income.
But it's so subtle becausethere's so many aspects to
(16:49):
disability and and so they wantto see the numbers in a very
concrete way and that's, I think, a bit of the challenge.
Kelvin Crosby (16:58):
Yeah, I mean, I think what we're realizing and I
think investing inaccessibility, what we're
realizing is that for so longwe've been pushing so hard and I
think the bucket is gettingfull on all the different
resources and it's starting topour out.
And I think we're at CSUN andI'm curious from your guys'
(17:22):
perspective at the 40thanniversary of CSUN and like are
you seeing that same?
Like the bucket's gettingreally full, the opportunities
are becoming better for peoplewith disabilities, and really
creating an opportunity forpeople with disabilities to be
successful in a way that wehaven't had for years.
(17:45):
But I feel like this is theseason and that bucket's getting
really full.
What would you guys say aboutthat?
Jennison Asuncion (17:51):
Yeah, absolutely so.
This is my, I think, 18th or19th CSUN conference and I
haven't yet had a chance tofully walk the exhibit hall, but
that's always where you see allthe latest assistive technology
and accessibility-relatedthings.
The one thing I have to say is,you know, back in the day a lot
(18:12):
of this technology was out ofreach of those of us with
disabilities from a price pointperspective.
But now you're seeing like $200pair of glasses that now are
bringing such independence andempowerment for people with
visual impairments.
Different sets of glasses,different smart, all these smart
devices and sure, there is aprice tag to it because people
(18:37):
need to pay in order to investin the technology and research
and all that stuff.
But where I'm going is theprices have come down
significantly on a lot of thetechnology, so it's putting it
in closer range for more people.
Is it getting to everyone?
Absolutely not.
Let's be realistic that we'restill dealing with this high
(18:57):
unemployment rate In differentcountries.
People with differentdisabilities are still shunned
or hidden away.
None of that stuffunfortunately has moved the
needle fully in every country onthat front.
But, what I see here is so muchnew technology that makes it
that much more possible againfor those of us with
disabilities to really seek outand really dream big and see
(19:25):
what might be out there.
I mean autonomous vehicles.
I mean, we got Waymo in SanFrancisco.
The idea of hopping into a car,a driverless car, is amazing,
and particularly for my peerswho have service animals, you
know, this is an amazingopportunity for them not to be
potentially discriminatedagainst by badly meaning drivers
(19:48):
.
I'll leave it there.
Chris Maher (19:48):
Janice, and I think that was really well put.
So thank you so much.
And, Joe, as we hand off overto you, whether it's here at
CSUN or just in the broadermarket, I know AI is something
that you're very focused onright now, and so like we'd love
to get your take around AI asit relates to assistive
technology.
Joe Devon (20:05):
Yeah, and let's just talk about innovation.
What I think a lot of peopledon't realize is, if you want
the coolest innovation, you gointo accessibility.
One of the things that I'veseen here in previous years is a
company called BrainPort.
I mean, this thing blew me away.
Brainport uses what's calledsensory substitution and it uses
(20:33):
electro-vibro-tactilestimulation and takes
essentially a camera.
So there's a camera mounted onglasses and then it films and
then attaches it to thislollipop that you put on your
tongue, because your tongue hasall these sensors and
essentially, you're seeingthrough your tongue.
Right, this is all aboutaccessibility, right?
This technology is amazing andcan be applied in so many
different ways.
(20:53):
There's a TED Talk byneuroscientist David Eagleman,
who also has an amazing podcastcalled what was it?
It'll come back to me now thatI need it.
I don't have it, but maybethere'll be a new technology of
AI that'll inject the rightthought at the right time.
But anyway, inner Cosmos, therewe go.
Inner Cosmos, fantastic podcastand he talks a lot about
(21:14):
sensory substitution.
And he has done this TED Talkwhere he took a vest and
connected up.
It's a haptic vest.
He connected it up to the sound, the audio of an iPhone, and
one hour a day showed someonewho's deaf had him put on this
vest and it translated thesounds into haptic touches and
(21:37):
after about three, four days,this person was able to hear
through his back and now hecreated a little bracelet.
Essentially that he reduced theform factor to a bracelet, and
these are just incredibletechnologies.
And there is an AI component toall of this.
And now there's, you know, AIresearchers.
(22:00):
I don't know that they realizeyou're sitting here with
artificial intelligence tryingto emulate a human being and if
you don't want to have thatuncanny valley effect, you have
to get this perfect.
You have to get it right.
And who other than theaccessibility industry, the
professionals who have spentdecades learning about the
differences in people'sabilities, who else is going to
(22:22):
give you the kind of data whereyou get all the edge cases and
you get every aspect of being ahuman right, because all of us
have extremely differentabilities?
So this is a really excitingtime.
Chris Maher (22:35):
Joe, I think I agree with you 100% and that's
part of the reason why the fundSamaritan Partners is 100%
focused on the disability sector.
Because there's so muchinnovation happening at that
early stage.
I think there's a super uniqueopportunity for private capital
to come into this market to notonly provide that catalytic
(22:56):
funding but also the operationalassistance to really advance
these innovations that are goingto change the lives of millions
of people, and not just peoplein the disability community.
As we know, when things aredesigned for the disability
community with inclusive designand universal design, they tend
to be really valuable to thebroader general public.
Jennison Asuncion (23:17):
Yeah, If I could add to that, what's
exciting to me is the olderadult, the aging adult community
, for lack of a better termthese days.
These are people now who havegrown up with the technology and
they have expectations oftechnology working a certain way
, which is amazing, right?
So we're at the point now wherethe 50, 60, 70-year-olds
(23:41):
they've been exposed to all thistechnology, and so we have this
opportunity to your point,Chris, that it's not only about
people who have permanentdisabilities, like myself who
grew up with a disability, it'sjust people who are aging and
acquiring disability later.
They don't consider themselvesas quote-unquote disabled, but
they'll certainly enlarge thefont sizes and they'll be taking
(24:03):
advantage of some of thisassistive technology, not on the
basis of them quote-unquotehaving a disability, but just
because it's easier and moreconvenient.
But because that populationwill be making, you know, they
have big wallets as well.
They want convenience, theywant to age gracefully, and so
that all is going to drive someamazing things in the next like
(24:27):
10, 15 years.
I'm really excited to see thatstuff.
Kelvin Crosby (24:32):
I think one of the things I want you guys, the
listeners, to really understandhere, what we just heard today
is something that I don't thinkpeople are putting the math
together.
You got aging people that arebecoming disabled later on or
that have tech skills, and wehave people that are growing up
with technology.
We have people that have anexpectation that they want to
(24:56):
live life more successful andtheir loved ones are trying to
help them as well.
And I think, if you add thatall up, I mean I don't have
concrete data, but that numberis not 25%.
You're at least half 50% of themarket.
And I think this is why this issuch a unique time in the
(25:19):
accessibility space becausewe're starting to hit
opportunities for people withdisabilities in ways we've never
been able to do for years.
And this is the time, this isthe season, to be able to have
this opportunity and to reallymake this growth happen, and I
think this is what I'm superexcited about.
Joe Devon (25:39):
So I'd like to give you a little bit on that.
I don't remember the exactnumbers, but I'm pretty sure
about this because I literallywent in to check the population
figures in America and whateverI could globally, and the
populations in most countriesare aging.
And in America right now themillennials, that everybody has
(25:59):
been focused on for so long, theoldest millennial is about 43,
40, maybe 44 already this year.
So it's not not that younganymore and literally at 40,
your eyes start to change andthey start to need more color
contrast and those font sizesthat Jennison was talking about.
So over 50 percent of thepopulation in America is over 40
(26:21):
and so and we bring with us, asJennison was saying, we bring
with us 30 years, three decadesplus of digital content with us.
We're not aging the same waythat our parents and
grandparents aged, and therefore, you know we we cannot be
ignored.
We will will not be ignored andwe are a huge part of the
population.
(26:41):
And there are definitely someheadwinds right now in
accessibility.
However, that pendulum is goingto swing back because of the
fact that this aging populationis going to demand that the
services are accessible for us.
So that's where I think it'sgoing.
Chris Maher (26:57):
Yeah, really well said, Joe.
Jennison?
Jennison Asuncion (27:00):
Yeah, just to build up on this a little bit.
What's really exciting to me,Chris you mentioned how you and
I first met, it's that stuff now.
It's these startups that arefocusing on the disability
community or disability in tech,whether it's our friends at the
Howe Innovation Center at thePerkins or ATS Labs in Canada or
(27:21):
Remarkable, I don't want toforget anyone there, but all of
them and I'm meeting, so I'mspending a lot more time.
Like I'm not just so this isJoe's wheelhouse all the startup
stuff that's his thing.
But I'm now like getting andlearning more and I'm meeting so
many people who are buildingstartups, whether it's on
assistive technologies, that forus with people with
disabilities, or they're tryingto solve some of the pressing
(27:45):
issues when it comes to makingdigital content and websites and
apps more accessible.
But I guess my point here isthat there's this groundswell
that to me, that's what peopleare like aren't you like jaded
and bored of the space and allthat stuff?
And to me, I'm thinking this isreally exciting stuff happening
(28:05):
and just meeting people andhearing about their ideas and
all of that certainly gives memore reason to double down even
more on the stuff that Joe and Iare doing, whether it's through
Global Accessibility AwarenessDay or through the GAAD
Foundation.
Chris Maher (28:21):
Yeah, I agree completely.
It is such an exciting time andobviously the four of us, we're
living it every day.
But that enthusiasm is growingand I think the work that you
folks are doing at GAAD and theGAAD Foundation is critically
important, because you'regetting the word out, you're
creating the awareness and we'regetting a groundswell, and it's
(28:41):
not slowing down, it's pickingup speed.
And so, as we wrap up, how canpeople learn more about GAAD and
the GAAD Foundation?
And if you guys want to shareanything about yourselves
personally in terms of linkswhere people can find you folks
online, as well, would be great.
Joe Devon (28:55):
Sure.
So I'm at Joe Devon,j-o-e-d-e-v-o-n, on all social
media essentially.
I just started a weeklynewsletter where I'm sharing all
kind of crazy stuff about tech,so that should be a fun link.
And then the GAAD Foundationitself, the link is
GAADFoundation, so G-A-A-D.
Foundation dot foundation.
(29:21):
And then the actual day, globalAccessibility Awareness Day, is
on accessibility dot day, andI'm not going to spell
accessibility.
You may have to look that up.
It's too many letters and I'llpass it to Jennison.
Jennison Asuncion (29:28):
Cool.
Well, people can find me onLinkedIn.
So, jenison, j-e-n-n-i-s-o-n,and then A-S-U-N-C-I-O-N, happy
to chat, drop me a message andhappy to hop on a communication
platform.
We can chit chat.
But yeah, this has been great.
Thank you for having us.
Remember Global AccessibilityAwareness Day is always the
(29:50):
third Thursday of May.
We salute all the companies andindividuals who have taken it
up.
We know some companies haveeven made it a whole month, some
made it a week, some take anhour.
Whatever you do to spreadawareness, particularly among
everyday technologists, becausewe're all amongst the converted,
all of us here around thesemicrophones now, but we need to
(30:11):
get the word out to everyoneelse.
Chris Maher (30:14):
Thank you guys.
What a treat to have you two onthe podcast today.
Thank you so much.
You guys are the best.
So, Joe, Jennison, thank you.
Joe Devon (30:24):
t
Jennison Asuncion (30:25):
Thank you, Kelvin.
Thank you, Chris.
Kelvin Crosby (30:26):
Well, that wraps up investing in accessibility
and, as I always say, go livebeyond your challenges and we'll
see you in two weeks.
Thank you for listening toInvesting in Accessibility, a
(30:49):
Samaritan Partners podcast,where we invest in change for
accessibility, not wait forchange.
If you want to follow us, youcan find us on YouTube or
LinkedIn at Samaritan Partners.
If you would like to invest inSamaritan Partners, email Chris
at chris@samaritanpartners.
com.
If you'd like to learn moreabout us, go to www.
(31:11):
s amaritanpartners.
com.
You can take the first step ininvesting in change by giving us
five stars and sharing thispodcast with everybody that you
know, so we can spread the word,so that we can give access to
all by Investing inAccessibility.
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