July 29, 2025 • 16 mins
Massage isn't just about working muscles—it's a profound "brain game" that retrains our nervous system to recognize and release tension we didn't even know we were carrying. In this enlightening conversation with returning guest Melissa Kary, we explore the fascinating challenge many people face: achieving relaxation during a massage session but struggling to recreate that state independently.
The most powerful insight emerges when we discuss anxiety not as an enemy to overcome but as valuable information our bodies provide. Through a personal story about navigating a steep hill at a concert venue, Melissa demonstrates how listening to anxiety—rather than fighting it—led to finding a safer path and ultimately greater enjoyment. "Your body shouldn't be working against you," she explains. "It should always be working for you." This perspective shift transforms our relationship with stress, teaching us to work with our nervous system rather than against it.
Ready to stop dismissing your body's signals and start creating the calm you deserve? Subscribe to It Starts at Vegas for weekly episodes that help you soothe your nervous system and reclaim who you are at your core. Share this episode with someone who might benefit from learning to listen to their body's wisdom—because wellness truly does start from within.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Emily Feist (00:00):
Welcome back to 'It Starts at Vagus', the podcast
where we stop chasing calm andstart creating it, one small
shift at a time.
I'm your host, Emily, and I'myour guide to rewiring stress,
restoring calm and giving yournervous system the attention it
deserves.
We have a special guest intoday's episode my good friend,
Melissa Kary.
(00:20):
We first met Melissa in episode21, discussing her healing
journey, and today she talksmore about how she integrates it
with her work as a massagetherapist and how she is
reflecting and listening to herown body.
Let's start by discussing howmassage affects the mind and
body.
Go ahead and take it away,Melissa.
Melissa Kary (00:39):
So I've told it to my clients time and time and
time and time again, and I willcontinue to do so, that I think
massage is a brain game.
It's a 90, 60, whatever minutebrain game.
You know and so like does yourbody respond?
Does your brain allow your bodyto respond to this?
(01:01):
Does your brain allow your bodyto respond to that?
Because I feel like the nervoussystem is the control panel and
you have to get through that inorder to make those goals of
wellness happen, absolutely.
Emily Feist (01:17):
Nerves are powerful , so powerful, so powerful.
And I think that's a reallycool thing about massage therapy
is that just like when we startthe beginning of a massage and
we just start like, you know,just have some nice gentle
glides instantly, most peopleare like and we're settling down
.
Melissa Kary (01:33):
Yes.
Emily Feist (01:34):
You know it takes like a minute and they're
already like and I can feel thestress going away.
Melissa Kary (01:39):
Yeah.
So, that's like that power oftouch is just crazy, amazing.
You know, like I've started toincorporate more, like just okay
, finding a point where I feelthe muscle release or if it's
like them just kind of releasingMentally, mentally, yeah.
Emily Feist (02:12):
It's really powerful when you can feel them
just relaxing into it and you'relike.
Then they're like I didn'trealize I was holding on to as
much as I was, yeah, as much asI was.
When their fingers got like aclenched fist in a relaxed mode
and you're like, okay, just openyour hands up.
(02:35):
And they're like, oh, I didn'teven realize that my hands were
tight.
And you're like, yeah, you'reguarding pretty well when you're
relaxing and still haveclenched hands, open them up,
wiggle them up.
Melissa Kary (02:46):
Yeah, and then when that happens, like the
theme song just thunderstruck,just kind of, it's right.
Here I hear it.
Emily Feist (02:56):
I had a client reach out to me and ask me if I
can teach her how to relax her,how to relax, and the
interesting thing of this isthat I've seen her for at least
a year and I can get her intorelax mode.
(03:19):
She knows she can get there,but it's like she still doesn't
understand how to get thereherself.
And I find, like the very sameday that that she asked me, I
had another client.
She's like I don't know how torelax.
She works all the time.
She puts everybody first.
She's just I, I was like just,can you like be still for 10
(03:39):
minutes?
And she's like no, like okay,we'll start with two, see if you
can handle two minutes of justsitting there.
And she's like that's going tobe hard Because that lady, she
is in such pain you don't knowwhat it feels like to feel good
(04:01):
and your baseline is pain.
And so that is why you say it'sa five, because that's just
like a constant, steady pain allday, all the time.
And to teach them how to feelagain, that's a mind game, it is
.
Melissa Kary (04:17):
It is because you can get them there.
And then, like I was thinkingof putting some words on my wall
in my massage room saying likeI give myself permission to you
know.
And then I really sit there andI really really think about
those words and I'm like why dowe have to give ourselves
permission to do anything youknow?
(04:41):
Like, okay, I'm an adult.
I kind of know somewhat how toadult Sometimes.
I don't want to adult, but likein a massage room.
Why do I need to give myselfpermission to actually be still,
except to what you know, whatmy body needs?
Emily Feist (04:56):
So that's where the anxiety and muscle memory plays
part.
Melissa Kary (05:01):
Yes, so about that ?
Not a couple weekends ago agowe went to a concert, me and the
girls, and there it was like atgreat bear, which is a ski
resort, and we were going downone of the hills and to me it
was a steep hill.
I was not prepared for it, okay, um.
(05:22):
So my daughter gave me her armand so I was thankful I'm
perfect.
We got down and I was like thatwas pretty steep, but I was
glad nobody fell.
It ended well.
The next night the concert wasagain, and probably an hour
(05:43):
before that I could feel myheart start to kind of go and I
was thinking about that hill andI'm like, okay, what shoes
should I wear?
I don't want to fall.
That hill is kind of big, youknow, whatever.
And then I would tell myself,like stop, you're fine, you
didn't fall yesterday, you'renot going to fall today.
I was creating my own nerves oranxiety and about this stinking
(06:09):
hill, and so I wore like canvasshoes so I wouldn't fall, and I
.
But as we got closer again, my,my heart just started going off
and I had to tell myself youdid not fall yesterday, you're
creating this anxiety, you don'tneed it, you know whatever.
Um, if anything, one of thegirls will give you her arm, all
(06:31):
will be fine, yeah.
And we got there and I thought,oh, snapdragon, there it is.
And immediately, um, I don'tthink I really had time, but my
eyes looked over to the left,where the hill was not so steep,
and we were like we're goingthat way, and so I was thankful,
(06:53):
I kind of like trusted myselfthat it was not going to fall,
that that path was going to leadme to the ground where I needed
to be, and not on my face.
And it did, and everything wentfine and it was a great concert
(07:17):
and I did not fall.
And so I feel like sometimesyou just need to trust yourself.
Okay, maybe more than sometimes.
Every time you need to trustyourself and your gut instinct
and even trust your anxietysometimes, because, like you
said, it's got that memory bankin there and we can access it,
(07:42):
but only when we need to, and itsaves us a lot of the time.
But my first instinct is not togo with it.
It's to quiet it, it's I don'twant it to be there.
But if I pause and I take amoment and I listen to what my
brain and body are telling me todo and then go that route.
Things go much more smoothlyand that unnecessary angst about
(08:09):
situations or falling orwhatever is just not even
relevant.
Emily Feist (08:14):
I love it so much because you're realizing that
you're able to listen to yourbody.
Yeah, you know, and use it forgood and to let those bells and
alarms to go off and be like,okay, I hear you, I see you, and
I'm not just going to likesnooze, you Right, you know, use
your superpower for good, useyour superpower for good.
Melissa Kary (08:33):
Yes, yes, and it's like it's a little bit of, you
know, it's a little bit ofnervousness, but it's a lot of
mental clarity, because thenthings go more smoothly.
And then, and then I feel likethat that bank that you just
opened up a couple of days agoit kind of closes itself off and
says, okay, we're not going tofall, we can create a new
(08:54):
passage to kind of get to wherewe need to be.
So that, to me, was like an ahamoment.
Sometimes all you have to do isjust go with it, yeah, and
trust your body with safety.
You know, like your bodyshouldn't be working against you
.
It should always be working foryou.
Emily Feist (09:13):
So Absolutely 100%, that's all input that your
body's just giving you.
I like that so much becauseit's not about, like stopping
anxiety, it's not about neverhappening again.
It's saying okay, what are youtelling me?
Melissa Kary (09:27):
Yeah.
Emily Feist (09:28):
And not letting it like have a death grip on you in
the worst ways.
Melissa Kary (09:32):
Right, and you still had a great time.
We did.
We had such a great time and Iwould, and I even said okay,
2026, we're doing it again.
You know, I was the first oneto say we're absolutely doing it
again.
I would do it in a heartbeat.
You know, whatever it'smemories and times with our
girls and things like that, andso I don't know, it was a really
, really, really great time andI got to see TLC.
(09:53):
Hey, I know it was great, itwas so good yeah.
Emily Feist (09:59):
But now it's not something to run from.
Melissa Kary (10:02):
No.
Emily Feist (10:03):
You know, and I think that's where, like that
mind shift goes from angry,annoyance and that death grip of
not letting you do what youwant to do to saying okay, why
is this making me anxious?
What can I do?
What is it telling me to keepmyself safe from Right?
So I love reflecting.
Melissa Kary (10:25):
I do too.
Sometimes it can be a littlebit uncomfortable, but I feel
like, overall, when you canreflect on a moment or a time, I
feel like you'll learn so much,even if at the time it didn't
go in your favor.
But you can always learnsomething from that instance.
Emily Feist (10:48):
Yeah, a thought that comes into my mind is when
a client comes into my officeand they have like this laundry
list of things that hurt, andsometimes I ask them like well,
when did it first happen?
When was that first dominoeffect, you know?
And when they can pinpoint itoff the like right away, you're
like that's where we need tostart, like what were the
(11:10):
motions that you were doingduring that time?
Other times, when they're likeI can't remember and it takes a
while, then I'm like well, Iprobably didn't have as much
effect as it could have.
But when they can say it justright off their tip of their
tongue, I'm like that's, thoseare the muscle groups that we're
going to work on right now.
Melissa Kary (11:29):
Yes, that's very helpful.
Thank you for remembering that.
Emily Feist (11:33):
Yes, yeah, fix, fix the root of the problem and
everything else just gets better.
So, yeah, that's why reflectingis so helpful.
Melissa Kary (11:43):
Yes, I agree, yeah , yeah.
Emily Feist (11:47):
Sometimes it can feel icky, but it can be very
helpful, right?
Yes, yeah, I don't know.
That's really neat that yourecognize that, though.
Melissa Kary (11:56):
You know, sometimes I give myself a
finally, you know, but then Ithink about it like that's not
fair, why, you know, that's notfair to me to be like, well,
finally you trust yourself.
You know what I mean.
You know, like, why can't youdo it all the time?
Well, because it's not meant tobe that easy.
Sometimes people are verycomplicated.
(12:17):
I'm a I think I'm a verycomplicated person, like I have
to complicate everything and butit also gives me fulfillment.
Trusting yourself does not comefor me anyway.
It does not come naturally, Iguess.
I'm not sure why, but at thispoint it doesn't matter.
Emily Feist (12:42):
It's that I can do it when it needs to be done.
I don't know if this is ablanket statement or just kind
of how I feel at the moment, butit's like the more we have pain
, the more we can love, the morelight, the more darkness.
It goes back to those oppositeswhere we need one so that we
can enjoy the other.
Don't take it for granted allthose things.
I was thinking about it theother day.
If you could choose to be happyall the time, would I or would
(13:06):
you?
That was the time, would I orwould you?
You know, like that was thereflective question.
I don't remember what I waslistening to, but that was a
question that they brought up.
And the guy was like, no, I'dhate to be happy all the time.
And the guy's like why?
And he was like could youimagine going to a funeral and
being like I am the happiestperson?
This is a great idea.
(13:32):
There's appropriate times notto be happy.
Melissa Kary (13:36):
And it's funny that you said that, because her
quote was you can never be trulyhappy if you've never been hurt
.
Emily Feist (13:42):
And so we do need to be able to feel different
feelings, yes, and so I thinkthat's just part of it.
Like you got to learn somethingabout yourself, you know,
because you had that anxietymoment.
You were able to come back thenext day and be like hey look, I
did it, you know, yes, yes, andnow you've, now you're like I
(14:05):
know something more about myselfnow.
Melissa Kary (14:07):
Yeah, it's very powerful, but it's very like I
don't know what the right wordfor it is.
It seems silly, though Silly itseems.
It seems silly like a sillystatement.
I can trust myself.
Emily Feist (14:20):
Oh, OK, I see what you're saying.
Well, I think it's because mostof our culture says don't trust
yourself.
You got to use this app totrust yourself.
You got to use this product totrust yourself.
You've got to support all thethings and all the ways so that
you feel like you could takecare of yourself.
We're not a very empoweringculture.
We're really taught against it.
We're not a very empoweringculture.
(14:40):
We're really taught against it.
Like, we're not taught how togrow a garden, you know, or even
how to budget going to agrocery store.
It's not a skill that theyreally teach.
No, it's not.
Melissa Kary (14:52):
But buy this app and then you'll know, you'll
know, you'll have all theanswers, and then the goal is to
trust yourself.
Emily Feist (15:01):
Yeah, Versus, just be like, hey, I think I can
grocery shop by myself and staywithin that budget, you know,
Right.
And again, the more practiceyou get, then you're like, hey,
look, I did it.
So that's probably why it feelssilly that we don't.
At first I didn't understandwhat you were talking about.
I'm like silly that just thatwasn't the word I was
anticipating.
But now I see what you'retalking about, because why don't
(15:23):
we just automatically trustourselves?
Oh, no, like when you look atlittle kids, they do trust
themselves very well, they dofeel confident as a natural
default.
But again, it's just looking atlife and seeing okay, what are
the things that life has givenme for me to grow from?
True, so I can be better?
(15:44):
Because I always think of, youknow, the Bible story, david and
Goliath, and they're alwayslike oh, david, good job.
You know which I totally like.
Yes, right, that makes sense.
But like God gave him a wholebunch of practice before that,
like he fought lions.
You know, if I fought a lion, Iwould probably feel more
(16:06):
comfortable.
Guys would be taller than me,you know.
I'd be like who are you?
You're not going to eat me,right?
So I think, just throughoutlife we get, you know, the
little bite size problems, so wecan get better Right.
Melissa Kary (16:20):
So yeah, I love that actually, right, so I love
that actually.
I really do.
To me that makes sense.
Yeah, like the try, try, tryagain, you know.
So, yeah, yeah, I like that alot.
Emily Feist (16:31):
All right friends.
Thanks for hanging out with ustoday on the 'It Starts at
Vagus' podcast.
New episodes are released everyTuesday to give you tips so
that you can soothe your nervoussystem and reclaim who you are.
Make sure you're subscribed andshare this with someone who you
know could benefit.
And until next time, rememberwellness starts at Vagus.
Welcome back to 'It Starts at Vagus', the podcast
where we stop chasing calm andstart creating it, one small
shift at a time.
I'm your host, Emily, and I'myour guide to rewiring stress,
restoring calm and giving yournervous system the attention it
deserves.
We have a special guest intoday's episode my good friend,
Melissa Kary.
(00:20):
We first met Melissa in episode21, discussing her healing
journey, and today she talksmore about how she integrates it
with her work as a massagetherapist and how she is
reflecting and listening to herown body.
Let's start by discussing howmassage affects the mind and
body.
Go ahead and take it away,Melissa.
Melissa Kary (00:39):
So I've told it to my clients time and time and
time and time again, and I willcontinue to do so, that I think
massage is a brain game.
It's a 90, 60, whatever minutebrain game.
You know and so like does yourbody respond?
Does your brain allow your bodyto respond to this?
(01:01):
Does your brain allow your bodyto respond to that?
Because I feel like the nervoussystem is the control panel and
you have to get through that inorder to make those goals of
wellness happen, absolutely.
Emily Feist (01:17):
Nerves are powerful , so powerful, so powerful.
And I think that's a reallycool thing about massage therapy
is that just like when we startthe beginning of a massage and
we just start like, you know,just have some nice gentle
glides instantly, most peopleare like and we're settling down
.
Melissa Kary (01:33):
Yes.
Emily Feist (01:34):
You know it takes like a minute and they're
already like and I can feel thestress going away.
Melissa Kary (01:39):
Yeah.
So, that's like that power oftouch is just crazy, amazing.
You know, like I've started toincorporate more, like just okay
, finding a point where I feelthe muscle release or if it's
like them just kind of releasingMentally, mentally, yeah.
Emily Feist (02:12):
It's really powerful when you can feel them
just relaxing into it and you'relike.
Then they're like I didn'trealize I was holding on to as
much as I was, yeah, as much asI was.
When their fingers got like aclenched fist in a relaxed mode
and you're like, okay, just openyour hands up.
(02:35):
And they're like, oh, I didn'teven realize that my hands were
tight.
And you're like, yeah, you'reguarding pretty well when you're
relaxing and still haveclenched hands, open them up,
wiggle them up.
Melissa Kary (02:46):
Yeah, and then when that happens, like the
theme song just thunderstruck,just kind of, it's right.
Here I hear it.
Emily Feist (02:56):
I had a client reach out to me and ask me if I
can teach her how to relax her,how to relax, and the
interesting thing of this isthat I've seen her for at least
a year and I can get her intorelax mode.
(03:19):
She knows she can get there,but it's like she still doesn't
understand how to get thereherself.
And I find, like the very sameday that that she asked me, I
had another client.
She's like I don't know how torelax.
She works all the time.
She puts everybody first.
She's just I, I was like just,can you like be still for 10
(03:39):
minutes?
And she's like no, like okay,we'll start with two, see if you
can handle two minutes of justsitting there.
And she's like that's going tobe hard Because that lady, she
is in such pain you don't knowwhat it feels like to feel good
(04:01):
and your baseline is pain.
And so that is why you say it'sa five, because that's just
like a constant, steady pain allday, all the time.
And to teach them how to feelagain, that's a mind game, it is
.
Melissa Kary (04:17):
It is because you can get them there.
And then, like I was thinkingof putting some words on my wall
in my massage room saying likeI give myself permission to you
know.
And then I really sit there andI really really think about
those words and I'm like why dowe have to give ourselves
permission to do anything youknow?
(04:41):
Like, okay, I'm an adult.
I kind of know somewhat how toadult Sometimes.
I don't want to adult, but likein a massage room.
Why do I need to give myselfpermission to actually be still,
except to what you know, whatmy body needs?
Emily Feist (04:56):
So that's where the anxiety and muscle memory plays
part.
Melissa Kary (05:01):
Yes, so about that ?
Not a couple weekends ago agowe went to a concert, me and the
girls, and there it was like atgreat bear, which is a ski
resort, and we were going downone of the hills and to me it
was a steep hill.
I was not prepared for it, okay, um.
(05:22):
So my daughter gave me her armand so I was thankful I'm
perfect.
We got down and I was like thatwas pretty steep, but I was
glad nobody fell.
It ended well.
The next night the concert wasagain, and probably an hour
(05:43):
before that I could feel myheart start to kind of go and I
was thinking about that hill andI'm like, okay, what shoes
should I wear?
I don't want to fall.
That hill is kind of big, youknow, whatever.
And then I would tell myself,like stop, you're fine, you
didn't fall yesterday, you'renot going to fall today.
I was creating my own nerves oranxiety and about this stinking
(06:09):
hill, and so I wore like canvasshoes so I wouldn't fall, and I
.
But as we got closer again, my,my heart just started going off
and I had to tell myself youdid not fall yesterday, you're
creating this anxiety, you don'tneed it, you know whatever.
Um, if anything, one of thegirls will give you her arm, all
(06:31):
will be fine, yeah.
And we got there and I thought,oh, snapdragon, there it is.
And immediately, um, I don'tthink I really had time, but my
eyes looked over to the left,where the hill was not so steep,
and we were like we're goingthat way, and so I was thankful,
(06:53):
I kind of like trusted myselfthat it was not going to fall,
that that path was going to leadme to the ground where I needed
to be, and not on my face.
And it did, and everything wentfine and it was a great concert
(07:17):
and I did not fall.
And so I feel like sometimesyou just need to trust yourself.
Okay, maybe more than sometimes.
Every time you need to trustyourself and your gut instinct
and even trust your anxietysometimes, because, like you
said, it's got that memory bankin there and we can access it,
(07:42):
but only when we need to, and itsaves us a lot of the time.
But my first instinct is not togo with it.
It's to quiet it, it's I don'twant it to be there.
But if I pause and I take amoment and I listen to what my
brain and body are telling me todo and then go that route.
Things go much more smoothlyand that unnecessary angst about
(08:09):
situations or falling orwhatever is just not even
relevant.
Emily Feist (08:14):
I love it so much because you're realizing that
you're able to listen to yourbody.
Yeah, you know, and use it forgood and to let those bells and
alarms to go off and be like,okay, I hear you, I see you, and
I'm not just going to likesnooze, you Right, you know, use
your superpower for good, useyour superpower for good.
Melissa Kary (08:33):
Yes, yes, and it's like it's a little bit of, you
know, it's a little bit ofnervousness, but it's a lot of
mental clarity, because thenthings go more smoothly.
And then, and then I feel likethat that bank that you just
opened up a couple of days agoit kind of closes itself off and
says, okay, we're not going tofall, we can create a new
(08:54):
passage to kind of get to wherewe need to be.
So that, to me, was like an ahamoment.
Sometimes all you have to do isjust go with it, yeah, and
trust your body with safety.
You know, like your bodyshouldn't be working against you
.
It should always be working foryou.
Emily Feist (09:13):
So Absolutely 100%, that's all input that your
body's just giving you.
I like that so much becauseit's not about, like stopping
anxiety, it's not about neverhappening again.
It's saying okay, what are youtelling me?
Melissa Kary (09:27):
Yeah.
Emily Feist (09:28):
And not letting it like have a death grip on you in
the worst ways.
Melissa Kary (09:32):
Right, and you still had a great time.
We did.
We had such a great time and Iwould, and I even said okay,
2026, we're doing it again.
You know, I was the first oneto say we're absolutely doing it
again.
I would do it in a heartbeat.
You know, whatever it'smemories and times with our
girls and things like that, andso I don't know, it was a really
, really, really great time andI got to see TLC.
(09:53):
Hey, I know it was great, itwas so good yeah.
Emily Feist (09:59):
But now it's not something to run from.
Melissa Kary (10:02):
No.
Emily Feist (10:03):
You know, and I think that's where, like that
mind shift goes from angry,annoyance and that death grip of
not letting you do what youwant to do to saying okay, why
is this making me anxious?
What can I do?
What is it telling me to keepmyself safe from Right?
So I love reflecting.
Melissa Kary (10:25):
I do too.
Sometimes it can be a littlebit uncomfortable, but I feel
like, overall, when you canreflect on a moment or a time, I
feel like you'll learn so much,even if at the time it didn't
go in your favor.
But you can always learnsomething from that instance.
Emily Feist (10:48):
Yeah, a thought that comes into my mind is when
a client comes into my officeand they have like this laundry
list of things that hurt, andsometimes I ask them like well,
when did it first happen?
When was that first dominoeffect, you know?
And when they can pinpoint itoff the like right away, you're
like that's where we need tostart, like what were the
(11:10):
motions that you were doingduring that time?
Other times, when they're likeI can't remember and it takes a
while, then I'm like well, Iprobably didn't have as much
effect as it could have.
But when they can say it justright off their tip of their
tongue, I'm like that's, thoseare the muscle groups that we're
going to work on right now.
Melissa Kary (11:29):
Yes, that's very helpful.
Thank you for remembering that.
Emily Feist (11:33):
Yes, yeah, fix, fix the root of the problem and
everything else just gets better.
So, yeah, that's why reflectingis so helpful.
Melissa Kary (11:43):
Yes, I agree, yeah , yeah.
Emily Feist (11:47):
Sometimes it can feel icky, but it can be very
helpful, right?
Yes, yeah, I don't know.
That's really neat that yourecognize that, though.
Melissa Kary (11:56):
You know, sometimes I give myself a
finally, you know, but then Ithink about it like that's not
fair, why, you know, that's notfair to me to be like, well,
finally you trust yourself.
You know what I mean.
You know, like, why can't youdo it all the time?
Well, because it's not meant tobe that easy.
Sometimes people are verycomplicated.
(12:17):
I'm a I think I'm a verycomplicated person, like I have
to complicate everything and butit also gives me fulfillment.
Trusting yourself does not comefor me anyway.
It does not come naturally, Iguess.
I'm not sure why, but at thispoint it doesn't matter.
Emily Feist (12:42):
It's that I can do it when it needs to be done.
I don't know if this is ablanket statement or just kind
of how I feel at the moment, butit's like the more we have pain
, the more we can love, the morelight, the more darkness.
It goes back to those oppositeswhere we need one so that we
can enjoy the other.
Don't take it for granted allthose things.
I was thinking about it theother day.
If you could choose to be happyall the time, would I or would
(13:06):
you?
That was the time, would I orwould you?
You know, like that was thereflective question.
I don't remember what I waslistening to, but that was a
question that they brought up.
And the guy was like, no, I'dhate to be happy all the time.
And the guy's like why?
And he was like could youimagine going to a funeral and
being like I am the happiestperson?
This is a great idea.
(13:32):
There's appropriate times notto be happy.
Melissa Kary (13:36):
And it's funny that you said that, because her
quote was you can never be trulyhappy if you've never been hurt
.
Emily Feist (13:42):
And so we do need to be able to feel different
feelings, yes, and so I thinkthat's just part of it.
Like you got to learn somethingabout yourself, you know,
because you had that anxietymoment.
You were able to come back thenext day and be like hey look, I
did it, you know, yes, yes, andnow you've, now you're like I
(14:05):
know something more about myselfnow.
Melissa Kary (14:07):
Yeah, it's very powerful, but it's very like I
don't know what the right wordfor it is.
It seems silly, though Silly itseems.
It seems silly like a sillystatement.
I can trust myself.
Emily Feist (14:20):
Oh, OK, I see what you're saying.
Well, I think it's because mostof our culture says don't trust
yourself.
You got to use this app totrust yourself.
You got to use this product totrust yourself.
You've got to support all thethings and all the ways so that
you feel like you could takecare of yourself.
We're not a very empoweringculture.
We're really taught against it.
We're not a very empoweringculture.
(14:40):
We're really taught against it.
Like, we're not taught how togrow a garden, you know, or even
how to budget going to agrocery store.
It's not a skill that theyreally teach.
No, it's not.
Melissa Kary (14:52):
But buy this app and then you'll know, you'll
know, you'll have all theanswers, and then the goal is to
trust yourself.
Emily Feist (15:01):
Yeah, Versus, just be like, hey, I think I can
grocery shop by myself and staywithin that budget, you know,
Right.
And again, the more practiceyou get, then you're like, hey,
look, I did it.
So that's probably why it feelssilly that we don't.
At first I didn't understandwhat you were talking about.
I'm like silly that just thatwasn't the word I was
anticipating.
But now I see what you'retalking about, because why don't
(15:23):
we just automatically trustourselves?
Oh, no, like when you look atlittle kids, they do trust
themselves very well, they dofeel confident as a natural
default.
But again, it's just looking atlife and seeing okay, what are
the things that life has givenme for me to grow from?
True, so I can be better?
(15:44):
Because I always think of, youknow, the Bible story, david and
Goliath, and they're alwayslike oh, david, good job.
You know which I totally like.
Yes, right, that makes sense.
But like God gave him a wholebunch of practice before that,
like he fought lions.
You know, if I fought a lion, Iwould probably feel more
(16:06):
comfortable.
Guys would be taller than me,you know.
I'd be like who are you?
You're not going to eat me,right?
So I think, just throughoutlife we get, you know, the
little bite size problems, so wecan get better Right.
Melissa Kary (16:20):
So yeah, I love that actually, right, so I love
that actually.
I really do.
To me that makes sense.
Yeah, like the try, try, tryagain, you know.
So, yeah, yeah, I like that alot.
Emily Feist (16:31):
All right friends.
Thanks for hanging out with ustoday on the 'It Starts at
Vagus' podcast.
New episodes are released everyTuesday to give you tips so
that you can soothe your nervoussystem and reclaim who you are.
Make sure you're subscribed andshare this with someone who you
know could benefit.
And until next time, rememberwellness starts at Vagus.
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