May 12, 2025 • 33 mins
Meet your hosts Meryl Branch-McTiernan and Ariana McLean. This episode delves into the challenges one faces as a writer trying to release her work into a world dominated by capitalist forces and how building this creative community is the antidote to despair.
--
Watch Meryl's movie Katie's Mom on Amazon Prime or Tubi.
Follow the show on Instagram @itsallwritepod.
Email us at itsallwritepod@gmail.com.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Ariana (00:00):
I imagine that's like wandering through a beautiful
forest, right?
And you're just like picking upflowers and you're looking at
the trees, and then you see adeer run by, as opposed to we
have to get to the summit.
We have to bridge.
And you're exactly like, you'relike, you're climbing Mount
Kilimanjaro.
Yes.
And you're like, freezing.
Your feet are freezing.
You can't breathe.
And you're like, oh, why did Istart doing this in the first
(00:21):
place?
Meryl (00:22):
And that may be a case of being happy with having
written, I got the story out,but the way I often or used to
often feel is I don't know.
I'm, I'm just, yeah.
Walking in the forest.
Hi, I am Meryl Branch McTiernan.
Ariana (00:40):
Hi, I am Ariana McLean you're listening to, it's All
Right.
Meryl (00:44):
This is a podcast about the writing life and those who
live it.
We are going to be interviewingsome writers at all stages of
the game, having them sharetheir stories about their
process the challenges, the ups,the downs.
Ariana (00:58):
All about what it takes to actually get some words on a
page.
and remind ourselves that it'sall right.
It's all right.
That you haven't been signedyet.
It's all right that you can'twrite today.
It's all right that you canwrite today.
So for this first episode.
We just wanted you to get alittle taste of who we are as
(01:19):
people and writers.
We share.
Similar ideas to what writingis in that writing really can be
anything.
And that we both appreciate thehighbrow art and the low brow
art and everything in betweenwhen it comes to writing.
So we have, actual books, wehave short stories, we have
(01:39):
those kinds of publicationsonline, offline.
But then you also havetelevision and films and both of
us have worked in spaces aroundin between and in I think all
these industries.
Is that right?
Meryl (01:54):
That is correct.
Ariana (01:56):
So for this episode, it's a special but moving
forward, you're gonna hear uslittle bit less.
All our future episodes aregonna have guests
Meryl (02:06):
we will be joined by other writers our friends,
colleagues, friends of friends,
Ariana (02:11):
but today we're just gonna chat in the studio.
So a little bit about me.
I am.
You know, That little, thatmeme of those two Guinea pigs
and one's like eating away andthe other one's staring into the
abyss.
That's how I feel right now.
Who am I?
Where am I, what is life?
I am an artist, a writer, aproducer, an educator, I have
(02:38):
over a decade experience workingin TV and film production in
New York City and around theworld.
I completed my MFA in creativewriting a couple years ago with
my friend here, Meryl.,
Meryl (02:53):
i'm Meryl Branch mc Tiernan.
I am a fiction writer andscreenwriter.
I am the co-writer and producerof Katie's mom, which is a
movie about a woman who has anaffair with her daughter's
boyfriend now available to renton Amazon or for free on Tuby.
I think when I start sayingqualifications, I bore myself.
(03:15):
Basically I became a writer insecond grade.
When I.
Realized that I had anassignment and I wanted to just
keep going and I wanted to like,put everything into this eight
page story.
And I was pegged then a writer.
So it just became somethingthat I took with me wherever I
(03:36):
went and whatever other jobs orother life things I was doing, I
was always doing it as awriter.
So since then I've, publishedsome things.
I made a movie, but I don'tknow that that matters as much
as just the instinct tocommunicate through words on a
page.
Ariana (03:54):
That's beautiful.
I feel like I've never calledmyself a writer confidently.
Since I was a kid.
Even though I've always writtenand writing has come to me
easier than others.
Is, how I would put it.
I didn't really find it thatdifficult in school.
I could knock out an essay, Icould knock out a story.
(04:15):
When I was younger, I used toget these little notebooks and
I'd write whole stories in themthat were wackadoodle.
I found some when we werecleaning out my grandma's house
and they were very sweet.
And I actually, I read them andI was like, oh, these are not
bad.
There was this one story about.
This girl whose parents they,the family moved away for the,
(04:35):
for their parents' work.
And she had to, she was inanother country, I think she was
in Japan, and she couldn'tspeak the language and she was
trying to make friends and shemet a butterfly and the
butterfly would translate forher.
And so that was how she wasable to make friends and
connections.
Meryl (04:50):
I love that.
Ariana (04:51):
I think I find calling myself a storyteller to be a
little bit more accurate.
A storyteller and a storyconsumer because I just love
hearing people's stories.
I like sharing stories.
And I've worked in TV and filmproduction for a really long
time, and I think what hasalways drawn me to that field is
(05:13):
at the center of it is we'rejust telling a story.
I like the collaborative natureof filmmaking which you don't
necessarily have when you'rewriting.
But there's also somethingspecial about doing something on
your own.
Writing by yourself is aspecial experience 'cause it's
just you doing stuff withoutanybody in your ear.
(05:36):
At least in those initialstages, I feel like that's a
beautiful place to be in.
It's my more long-windedresponse to Meryl's.
Beautiful.
Succinct.
She's the writer.
I'm the storyteller.
I'll elaborate
Meryl (05:53):
stories.
Yeah, stories.
Ariana (06:00):
So if everything is writing.
And everything is story likewhat makes.
A story.
A story which I, I don't thinkI could answer right this
second, but
Meryl (06:09):
Yeah, I feel like it's not always obvious We're not
doing book reviews, but I kindof wanna tell you about a short
story I read yesterday, please.
I was in the library actually Ihad to wait there for an hour
and a half, so I was just like aprisoner in the library.
So I started picking up randomthings.
I never read literary journals,but I got so bored that I
started reading one.
And there was a story it was byBenjamin Nugent.
(06:32):
I've never read anything by himbefore.
about a guy who didn't likeporn.
And he was trying to do IVFwith his wife, Starts off with
him bragging about how hedoesn't like porn.
I read a few other stories inthat book and they didn't all
feel like they were totallysatisfying.
But this one I thought wasstrong because He has to go on a
(06:52):
journey in which that thing isquestioned and there's
consequences of it, and he triesto fight against his nature.
Basically at the end he tellsher, could you just like.
do a make your own porn for me'cause that's what I want.
I feel like the problem with alot of stories are that they're
like just a character sketch andnothing really happens.
So you get to the end, you'relike, cool.
(07:14):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Ariana (07:16):
I find that I have this problem in my own personal
writing where
Meryl (07:20):
many of us do.
I think it's very common.
Ariana (07:22):
Yeah.
Like you think of either areally strong character or you
are inspired by somebody towrite a really strong character.
and it's like you write it,but.
And what?
I think that's for me, that'swhen writing gets difficult.
Yes.
It's like you have that initialthought, that initial idea,
but.
Now you gotta take it tofruition.
(07:44):
You have to fully likegerminate that idea.
And that's why it takes yearsto write anything sometimes to
really get it good.
Books can take a really, evenshort stories, poems, they all
take time to craft.
and I hate that the sort ofcontent driven world where
(08:04):
everything has to be like anugget of content.
what is I think everything'swriting in story.
Meryl (08:11):
Calling everything content is disgusting.
Ariana (08:13):
I think it is.
I think it's taking away theessence of it, which is the
story part, which is whatconnects us.
Meryl (08:19):
Right.
And this kind of reminds me,and I don't know if this is off
topic of something, there's notopics the idea of protein I,
oh, I'm so in that, I hate theword protein.
Because especially the idea ofcalling an animal who lived a
life protein, and when we talkabout just like eating, oh, just
(08:40):
eating protein or eating asfuel, taking away the joy of
cooking, of food and treating itlike, like gas from the fucking
smelly ass gas station.
Ariana (08:52):
Yeah, and I think that comes from this capitalist world
where everything is judged onefficiency and how it can make
more, right?
Whereas if you start thinkingabout things that are meaningful
in life, it's things thatprovide, stimulation, enjoyment,
and those things.
are Crafted like a deliciousplate of food.
(09:13):
I'm sorry.
That's amazing.
Meryl (09:15):
Right?
It's not 50 grams of protein.
Yeah, so I think of calling artcontent, it's the same as
eating macros and protein.
It's and I don't wanna be inthat field.
Yeah.
I don't wanna make content.
I wanna make art.
Ariana (09:29):
Yeah, me too.
And let's talk about what thattakes, because it does take
sacrifice.
To, like we were talkingearlier, off air about 'cause
I've come up in certainsituations in my career where
I'm at a place where it's likeyou either play the game.
And you put on this mask andyou're this certain kind of
(09:52):
person maybe I need to buy a newwardrobe to look the part of
that, that these like creatives,like what people wanna hire
when they call them creatives.
'cause there is an aestheticlook to it.
And it's also a way of talking,it's a way of being in the
world and selling yourself.
And as frustrated as I am withlike where I am.
(10:14):
Financially, and in my career Ican't imagine sacrificing who I
am to become something likethat, just to make money.
'cause I think I will just bemiserable.
And then what's the point?
Agreed.
Just having my protein shakesand maybe I look all buffed, but
(10:34):
like for what?
Meryl (10:36):
Right.
Meal planning with your proteinand your macro.
Yeah.
Like a,
Ariana (10:40):
a mass shooter could come and shoot us down and,
right.
And what
Meryl (10:42):
was the point?
Ariana (10:43):
What was the point, if not to enjoy what is here on
this shitty planet that it'sactually not a shitty planet.
It's a beautiful planet thatwe've created shitty situations
as human race, like we havepolluted it and we've created
things like spreadsheets and
Meryl (10:57):
Right.
Right.
Yeah.
So I guess we're here to talkabout art and making it and how
to keep making it in the face ofrejection, in the face of not
always paying the bills with ithow to keep ourselves going back
to the page.
Ariana (11:17):
I think that's the essence.
Of what we're doing.
And also in a very selfish way,it's a place for our voices to
be heard.
If they don't make room for youat the table, you start your
own table?
Yeah.
Meryl (11:33):
That Yes we're starting our own table and we are lucky
to know other artists, some whohave reached higher realms than
we have so far, and bring themin and hear about their
experiences and their challengesbecause the thing about.
Creating art is that you alwaysthink, once I get this, then
(11:53):
I'll be okay, or I'll be happy,or I'll be there.
But then there's the next, likethe goalpost is always
changing.
So becoming aware of that andsharing that with you guys.
Ariana (12:03):
Yeah.
And to add to that, creatingart while sometimes can be very
collaborative.
The initial stage is veryuncollaborative.
Yes.
Especially the writing fieldRough draft, first draft, second
draft, third draft.
That is solo work.
And it's so easy to fall intodespair and be like, I suck.
(12:30):
I don't know how to write.
Why am I doing this?
I'm all alone in this world.
And hopefully these discussionsfor at least us, for anyone
listening for our guests, ourfriends will be a chance to be
like, you're not alone in thiscrazy world in which we're
trying to make something and saysomething of meaning and value,
(12:52):
regardless of who values it.
Meryl (12:56):
I know I personally feel often that nobody cares if I
turn on my computer.
Nobody cares if I readanything.
It.
And I guess we're looking tobuild a community of people who
do care and care about eachother and care about, seeing
what other people are creating.
Ariana (13:14):
Yeah.
'cause otherwise, what are wedoing?
I don't know.
What are we doing?
Just paying bills.
Not like we gotta findenjoyment in these fascist
times.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Let's be the subculture inBerlin in the forties.
Let's
Meryl (13:29):
do it.
Ariana (13:34):
Have you ever been in a writer's room?
Meryl (13:36):
That's a good question.
Only our writer's room for theGirlfriend Collective.
That's the only writer's roomI've ever been in.
Ariana (13:43):
And it was virtual, so it
Meryl (13:45):
did not feel like what I would expect.
Ariana (13:48):
Well, that whole project was, non-traditional.
What's a, what's a good word?
Unorthodox.
Meryl (13:53):
Unorthodox word was an unorthodox.
it was an unorthodoxexperience.
Yes.
And I've never been in aorthodox experience.
I don't know, have you?
Ariana (14:02):
I was a writer's assistant for two seasons on a
game show, so it's Oh,interesting.
Was a writer's room.
The vibe felt very muchstereotypical writers.
It was WGA New Yorkers, mostlymale.
All white.
Okay.
And me, there was one womanAnna Lotto, who actually, she
(14:22):
wrote my recommendation for gradschool.
Oh.
it was a hundred thousanddollars pyramid, so it's lists
of words.
You have your, categoryquestion that's usually a little
punny, punchy, and then.
A list of words that you wantthese folks to guess For the
game, but yeah.
(14:44):
And they'd have to do, I can'teven remember how many, but,
they did have quotas and then myjob was to look for repeat
words and tally up repeat wordsand if categories had already
been done before.
Okay.
It was a weird job.
Now I'm trying to remember whatI did, the head writer was very
typically neurotic and stressedout all the time.
(15:06):
And his hair was just like,Albert Einstein.
And and I also had to make surehe ate, 'cause he would just
not eat
Meryl (15:13):
nice.
Ariana (15:14):
Nice.
But it was a fun room.
It was like a little bitstinky.
Meryl (15:17):
Yeah.
With the peanut butter and
Ariana (15:18):
jelly?
No, just the beo.
Oh,
Meryl (15:21):
interesting.
Ariana (15:21):
I felt like on 30 Rock, they always made fun of that.
Really?
It was a little bit likeeveryone looked grody and no one
was like, camera ready.
Meryl (15:29):
I feel like this is an issue I'm having in life.
I imagine like my dream man orthe, my dream people are like
the people that you see on theTV saying the smart things, but
the people who wrote the thingsdon't look like the people Ah,
who say things.
So the idea of a room ofattractive, interesting smart
(15:49):
writers I feel like doesn'talways happen.
Ariana (15:52):
Those are unicorns.
Meryl (15:53):
Yeah.
It's just us.
It's just two us.
Yeah.
We're the only ones.
So I think you have to justaccept that smart and pretty
aren't always together, but theycan be.
Ariana (16:02):
But then you also have to have like smart and feminist
to some extent smart.
'cause there's a lot of smartguys who just are assholes,
Meryl (16:12):
right?
That is true.
Ariana (16:13):
There's a there's, I guess there's layers to
assholeness that I can take,'cause sometimes, if you're a
little dick or like you're alittle bit of an ass or a little
bit cunty that's fun.
But if you're like an actualasshole or like a dick, right?
I can't get over that.
a man loves a director's cut.
(16:35):
A man loves a director's cut ina way that I do not think most
women do.
Meryl (16:40):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Except for, as a writer, Ireally like the director's cut
because Oh, yeah.
Of my work.
Oh, yes.
Yeah.
I'm like, oh, all of theselines need to be here.
We need to see all these seeds.
It's all gold.
Ariana (16:56):
Okay.
This is this is related so I'veworked on television and film
for the last, almost 15 yearsnow.
And so I worked on this onemovie in Vietnam.
And I like to say when I was anam, when I was
Meryl (17:11):
a when I was in Nam,
Ariana (17:12):
But it was my friend.
Who wrote this film, it was herthesis for her, MFA at NYU.
And she was doing that thingwhere she had all her credits,
but she wanted to actually makethe movie.
And I guess I now subsequentlyunderstand that process where
some people just wanna get thedegree and other people are
(17:32):
like, I might as well use theseresources.
And I don't think there'snecessarily a right or wrong
way,
Meryl (17:36):
I think that you reach a certain point and you're like,
do I wanna be here forever or doI wanna
Ariana (17:40):
Yeah.
Go.
Yeah.
Okay, back to Nam.
Back to Nam.
So she really wanted to dothis.
It was a period piece.
Lots of characters historicalfiction.
Shot in Vietnam.
It's her home country.
And the story was about aVietnamese family in the 19th
century.
Okay.
No, 18th century, sorry.
19 hundreds, 18th century Soyou can imagine the type of
(18:04):
budget that would require, Butobviously things are like, she
definitely got more bang for herbuck in Vietnam than in the us.
I forget where we're going withthis anyways.
She wrote the script.
I read it.
I really liked it.
She was a really good friendand a mentor to me.
I found so interesting isbecause she wrote it, she
directed it, she produced it.
(18:25):
But because she was financingit.
She kept ditching theschedules.
So it felt disrespectful as acrew.
This was like a crew of 90people.
Wow.
So it wasn't a small crew.
And I ended up being in themiddle of a lot of drama because
I was her friend.
Anyways all of that isunrelated to the point I was
trying to make.
The ADD is strong today whichwas that she wrote the script,
(18:50):
but she would change it a lot.
And then and she kept havingwhat she would call sort of
these epiphany moments whereshe'd wanna shoot something else
or she would spend, timeshooting a salamander on the
curtain instead of this scene.
Between the characters andeveryone sitting around waiting
and it, and in the final cut.
I went to go see it atpremiered at Toronto Film
(19:11):
Festival.
And it was good.
Good fest.
Yeah, it was a good fest.
Beautifully shot movie.
I thought it was very poetic,but it was to me so different
from that original script.
Which is almost the opposite ofwhat you were saying about how
if you wrote it, you would wantall your words in there.
She took out, like literallythere was nearly no dialogue.
Meryl (19:32):
Really?
Ariana (19:33):
Yeah.
Interesting.
There was almost no dialogue.
Which I mean, for film., youshouldn't be relying on
dialogue.
You, if you have dialogue, ithas to be purposeful.
Yeah.
Because you have the visualsto, to back you up.
Meryl (19:47):
I prefer heavy dialogue.
Which is tv.
Ariana (19:50):
Which is tv.
Meryl (19:51):
Yeah.
Ariana (19:53):
Traditionally.
Meryl (19:53):
Yes.
Traditional.
Ariana (19:54):
Yes.
Yes.
Yeah.
Oh my God, I never reallythought about that.
So TV's kind of
Meryl (19:59):
it's like a play.
It's a play.
It started as a play.
It's a play commercial really.
They the entertainment to getyou to watch commercial.
Ariana (20:06):
But it comes from the tradition of we had sort of
Meryl (20:10):
radio.
Ariana (20:11):
Yeah.
But it was like vaudeville,radio shows.
And then you had television.
So it's like the trajectory.
Meryl (20:17):
And it's interesting that this form is like the radio
form is coming back now as apodcast.
Oh yeah.
Not full circle.
Yeah,
Ariana (20:24):
full circle.
Because you can listen to itYeah.
And do other things.
Meryl (20:27):
Exactly.
Ariana (20:28):
Because we require stimulation always.
I need barriers toentertainment, like television,
because otherwise I will watchit forever.
Like the, just 'cause it's beena very hard few months for me.
I've just literally beenwatching an entire show a day.
Meryl (20:45):
Wow.
Ariana (20:46):
I've watched so many series because I'm like multiple
season series in a day.
Sometimes one to two in a day.
It's hard to do more than that,but I've been watching whole
series per day and I don't thinkthat's healthy.
Meryl (21:01):
Possibly not, but who
Ariana (21:03):
needs help when you're, who needs help when the world's
ending and Fascism's winning?
Meryl (21:07):
Yeah, I think I'm actually more addicted to
reading than I am to tv.
Ariana (21:13):
I'm trying to get addicted to reading.
'cause I used to be
Meryl (21:17):
a reading addict.
Ariana (21:19):
I used to be so good at reading in the sense that I read
all the time.
Yeah, it ebbs and flows.
I think I, I just needed the TV'cause my problems were so
cerebral.
I needed that to be louder thanmy thoughts.
Yeah.
So people talking need to belouder than my thoughts I think
the the act of reading is a veryunique personal experience and
(21:42):
I think I used to think everyoneexperienced it the same way,
but
Meryl (21:45):
No, I guess not.
Yeah.
I cannot listen to books likeI.
That's the last thing I'd everwanna do in my life.
Ariana (21:53):
Like the, like I don't mind listening to books, but I
don't listen to all books.
If it's a book I really aminterested in, I will read it.
'cause I do feel like listeningbecomes a little bit more
passive.
Meryl (22:03):
Yeah, it's just that, it's like the act of reading is
my, one of my favorite acts.
And I just don't associate thatas the same.
I'm like, oh, I like to look atwords.
Aw.
Like it's not about thecontent.
It's about my enjoyment of theprocess.
Ariana (22:19):
That's really sweet.
Meryl (22:21):
When I think about going blind, if that ever were to
happen, I'm like, I wouldn't beable to read.
And people are like, oh, butyou could listen.
I'm like, then I kill myself.
Ariana (22:30):
What did that, but what you were saying about how you
love to see words on page,that's probably why you like to
write.
Meryl (22:37):
You're creating the
Ariana (22:37):
words on the page.
Meryl (22:39):
Is it?
Ariana (22:40):
Do you like writing?
Meryl (22:41):
I don't know.
That's a good question.
I Yeah.
Because some people say, I likehaving written.
I like the flow state.
Once I get into that,
Ariana (22:49):
oh yeah.
Meryl (22:50):
You know what?
I think I like the writing,which I feel like I have not
done lately, where I don'treally know where it's going.
I feel like when I'm trying totell a story that I already
know, it's less interesting.
And it's a lot of what do, whatneeds to go in there?
And it's like being burdenedand having to take the burden
off versus just, I'm sitting andI'm feeling and it's coming to
(23:14):
me.
Ariana (23:16):
That's magical.
To me, I imagine that's likewandering through a beautiful
forest, right?
And you're just like picking upflowers and you're looking at
the trees, and then you see adeer run by, as opposed to we
have to get to the summit.
We have to bridge.
And you're exactly like, you'relike, you're climbing Mount
Kilimanjaro.
Yes.
Meryl (23:33):
Yes.
Ariana (23:34):
And you're like, freezing.
Your feet are freezing.
You can't breathe.
And you're like, oh, why did Istart doing this in the first
place?
Meryl (23:40):
And that may be a case of being happy with having
written, but it's like, allright, I got the story out, and
then you can enjoy editing.
But the way I often or used tooften feel is I don't know.
I'm, I'm just, yeah.
Walking in the forest.
Ariana (23:56):
Yeah.
I've always liked writing.
I don't wanna say it came easyto me.
Like I never found it to bethat difficult.
I felt like towards the end ofgrad school and working on that
damn thesis made me finallyrealize fuck writing's hard.
And I think maybe what you'resaying is what I was
experiencing because I knew Iwas trying to finish something
and
Meryl (24:13):
it wasn't just fun.
Ariana (24:15):
It wasn't just fun.
Yeah.
And this year I'm trying tofind that fun again.
Meryl (24:20):
How's it going?
Ariana (24:22):
It's going slowly.
I did feel like I got like aburst of an idea of the world in
which I wanna write in I'm alsoa very goal oriented person, so
I'm my own worst enemy whereI'll create rules and be like,
you have to do these things.
And then the other half of meis no, I don't wanna.
So that's where I find myself.
I
Meryl (24:41):
have that issue.
Yeah.
Ariana (24:42):
'cause I'm like, okay, these are the characters I'm
working with.
And I'm like, great, I didthat.
Meryl (24:47):
Then you have to work with them.
Then you have to work withthem.
No.
I find momentum really hard.
Flow and momentum, like beingin it, the times I am happiest
is when I actually feel in theproject where it's okay, I'm
excited to go back to this thingwhere I'm like living in it
when I'm not at the page.
But where I'm now is not a goodplace
Ariana (25:10):
right now.
Meryl (25:11):
Yeah.
I am theoretically writing anew book, but I'm not in that
book.
I don't even have a name.
My character doesn't have aname.
Like it's not, it's just likeI'm just showing up.
I'm not in it.
Ariana (25:24):
A lot of people say that's the first step.
Just show up every day.
Yeah.
On the page.
That's like the, I like,that's, do unto others as others
do unto you in writing?
It's show up.
Yeah.
Just do the work.
Yeah.
Meryl (25:35):
Yeah.
I think that I had said, when Iwas writing my first book,
which I started, I guess Iofficially started writing at
25.
This book, that book, andfinished at 30, called it Done.
Started looking for agents.
At that point, I said, if thisdoesn't sell, I will never write
another book.
This is a one time thing, neveragain.
(25:56):
Somehow life happened and Iwrote a second book.
And to sit down and do it athird time is really hard.
It's not something I everplanned to do.
Ariana (26:08):
I can't even imagine.
'cause I have not written anovel.
I have written short storiesand flash fiction.
I write short form.
Short.
Yeah.
But I have committed to writinga novel this year.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I was like, maybe I justwrite a novel, like maybe I just
try something different.
'cause I didn't feel likecoming back.
I didn't feel like.
(26:28):
Editing my short stories.
So maybe it's just new formtime.
And it's scary.
And last year I did the halfmarathon and that was scary.
You were, so I might as well
Meryl (26:39):
you achieved goals.
Ariana (26:41):
I'm a Capricorn.
But this goal does seem verydaunting, but, everyone takes
their own time at it.
So maybe I just, today mywriting was one sentence.
Meryl (26:54):
Okay.
All right one more sentencethan you had yesterday.
Ariana (27:04):
Oh, I have another question for you.
'cause you're like my writingsister.
Oh yeah.
You have much more experiencethan me.
My big sister who helps methrough hard times but in all
seriousness, yes.
Can you tell me about yourexperiences or maybe a, an
experience at a writer'sretreat?
'cause I know you've done acouple.
Meryl (27:22):
The South Hampton Writers conference, which is something
that Stony Brook a universityputs on, that's actually how I
ended up going to Stony Brook.
'cause I had so much fun that Iwas like, I wanna do this all
the time.
But that wasn't really how itwas.
So I did two weeks.
Which some people okay,different kinds of people are
different.
I like to really immerse For along time some people were like,
(27:46):
fuck, I would never want to dothis for two weeks.
But what was really great aboutit, so I literally knew no,
nobody.
So every meal you were sittingwith new and interesting people
and hearing about what they werewriting and just having really
deep conversations, so there wasthe meal part that was nice.
I would take a workshop.
Eat with other people, workalone in my room, and then go to
(28:07):
whatever they had like salonsat night.
So everything was aboutwriting, the world was writing.
Nothing in the world existedbesides writing, and I
apparently need that.
So when I went to the StonyBrook thing, I called it a
retreat at first.
And then I felt that I hadworked so hard.
I got really offended whenpeople would call it a retreat.
(28:27):
I'm like, this was not aretreat, it was a residency.
I was working.
Yeah.
So I don't know.
I guess I would think of aretreat as maybe not having all
the yeah.
The stuff.
Ariana (28:38):
'cause a residency it's an exchange, right?
You are committing to c to thecommunity.
Meryl (28:43):
Yeah.
Like you're immersing yourselfin community.
Ariana (28:45):
Whereas a retreat I feel is usually.
A little bit more like a likeit's basically Tourism Plus,
right?
Yes.
Meryl (28:51):
It's just to go to that place.
It's just
Ariana (28:53):
to go to that place.
Meryl (28:54):
But that's why I liked it being two weeks.
'cause there was like, one weekwas the workshop and the other
week was like just working onthe writing.
Ariana (29:01):
So actually hearing that story, I realize I've been to
the key West Literary seminarand I did a one week workshop.
And so similarly they put us upand, I'm living in, working
with my workshop mates.
But I found that I didn't get alot of work done because I was
(29:21):
always reading other people'swork.
Meryl (29:24):
That is, that's one of the challenges.
Ariana (29:26):
Also another side note.
Meryl (29:28):
Yeah.
Ariana (29:28):
I go to these workshops and there are some beautiful
people.
Meryl (29:31):
True.
There are beautiful writers.
Can be beautiful.
Ariana (29:34):
There are beautiful writers at the Key West Literary
seminar.
it wasn't black, but there thetheme was African American
literature.
So there was a lot ofbeautiful, interesting black
people who were intelligent andit just was magical in Key West,
which is a beautiful place.
And everyone's like sunkissedand
Meryl (29:53):
Right.
Everyone was just vibing, justso healthy and we were just
Ariana (29:56):
eating key lime pies and drinking Amazing I margaritas
or something.
I was gonna ask you what you,how you like to write.
I thought that was gonna be agood question.
Meryl (30:08):
I feel like I have a, when I'm really stuck in a big
fear situation, I will dohandwriting.
Because it's easier or it'ssafer.
Ariana (30:17):
Yeah, I agree.
'cause then I, it's likejournaling, you just write
whatever, and you can justscribble.
Meryl (30:22):
So I think that when it's most successful for me is when
like early in the day I'll handwrite and then type it up like a
couple hours.
Yeah.
So I could, even, if I can'tread it, I can like figure it
out.
Ariana (30:33):
Yeah.
Meryl (30:34):
Do you have typewriter fantasies?
Ariana (30:37):
I used a typewriter when I was a kid.
A lot.
My grandpa had a typewriter andhe would pay us 10 cents per
envelope to Oh wow.
'cause he had his own business.
So when he had to send thingsout to people, we would use the
typewriter to write theaddresses.
Addresses on the envelope.
And then I was really obsessedwith the typewriter, so I would
write letters to, my mom was ingrad school in Italy.
(30:59):
And I would, and I forgot aboutthis, she reminded me, she's
yeah, you used to send me like aletter a week and I would
write, I'm on the typewriter.
Wow.
Because I thought it was fancy.
Totally.
It's fancy.
Yeah.
I feel like I used to writestories on the typewriter.
My brother actually has a few,I don't have any currently.
Meryl (31:16):
He has a few typewriters.
Ariana (31:17):
Yes.
He definitely this is genetic.
Why?
He has several typewriters.
I don't know.
But he does.
Because we all have typewriterfantasy.
It's.
The tactileness is Yes.
So delicious.
Maybe that's how I write mynovel.
I'll be one of those likehipster boys.
The picture?
Yeah, those hipster boys.
Oh, no.
Like Wednesday.
Did you watch that show?
Wednesday?
Oh,
Meryl (31:37):
I have very little of it.
She has a typewriter and she'swriting
Ariana (31:40):
her novel.
And it's really bad because,you don't save it.
It's just pages.
That's the only copy you have,right?
That's it.
So if you lose that, it's gone.
It's a
Meryl (31:47):
lot.
Yeah, but it also feels like Ihave this thing with pens too.
If I just buy this pen and thisnotebook, the writing will
come.
Yeah.
It might be that way with thetypewriter.
If I just buy this typewriter.
Ariana (31:58):
Maybe it'll, what's there to lose?
Meryl (32:01):
And one day we'll be rich and we won't even care.
So right now we can dream andwe can talk about our dreams,
and we're gonna
Ariana (32:09):
manifest our lives through this podcast.
Welcome to, it's All right.
It's the podcast that is activemanifestation for Ariana and
Meryl in this bleak world we'reliving in.
But spring is here and summer'scoming.
Meryl (32:28):
That's a wrap on today's episode.
We'll be dropping new episodesevery other Tuesday.
You can find us on Instagram atIt's All right pod
Ariana (32:36):
And if you have anything to say or would like to be on
the show, feel free to send us amessage either to, it's all
right pod@gmail.com or you cansend us a message on Instagram
and that's it's all right.
W-R-I-T-E
Meryl (32:54):
Thanks for listening to, it's all right.
Ariana (32:56):
Make sure to, subscribe, like all those things.
Wherever you get your podcasts.
I imagine that's like wandering through a beautiful
forest, right?
And you're just like picking upflowers and you're looking at
the trees, and then you see adeer run by, as opposed to we
have to get to the summit.
We have to bridge.
And you're exactly like, you'relike, you're climbing Mount
Kilimanjaro.
Yes.
And you're like, freezing.
Your feet are freezing.
You can't breathe.
And you're like, oh, why did Istart doing this in the first
(00:21):
place?
Meryl (00:22):
And that may be a case of being happy with having
written, I got the story out,but the way I often or used to
often feel is I don't know.
I'm, I'm just, yeah.
Walking in the forest.
Hi, I am Meryl Branch McTiernan.
Ariana (00:40):
Hi, I am Ariana McLean you're listening to, it's All
Right.
Meryl (00:44):
This is a podcast about the writing life and those who
live it.
We are going to be interviewingsome writers at all stages of
the game, having them sharetheir stories about their
process the challenges, the ups,the downs.
Ariana (00:58):
All about what it takes to actually get some words on a
page.
and remind ourselves that it'sall right.
It's all right.
That you haven't been signedyet.
It's all right that you can'twrite today.
It's all right that you canwrite today.
So for this first episode.
We just wanted you to get alittle taste of who we are as
(01:19):
people and writers.
We share.
Similar ideas to what writingis in that writing really can be
anything.
And that we both appreciate thehighbrow art and the low brow
art and everything in betweenwhen it comes to writing.
So we have, actual books, wehave short stories, we have
(01:39):
those kinds of publicationsonline, offline.
But then you also havetelevision and films and both of
us have worked in spaces aroundin between and in I think all
these industries.
Is that right?
Meryl (01:54):
That is correct.
Ariana (01:56):
So for this episode, it's a special but moving
forward, you're gonna hear uslittle bit less.
All our future episodes aregonna have guests
Meryl (02:06):
we will be joined by other writers our friends,
colleagues, friends of friends,
Ariana (02:11):
but today we're just gonna chat in the studio.
So a little bit about me.
I am.
You know, That little, thatmeme of those two Guinea pigs
and one's like eating away andthe other one's staring into the
abyss.
That's how I feel right now.
Who am I?
Where am I, what is life?
I am an artist, a writer, aproducer, an educator, I have
(02:38):
over a decade experience workingin TV and film production in
New York City and around theworld.
I completed my MFA in creativewriting a couple years ago with
my friend here, Meryl.,
Meryl (02:53):
i'm Meryl Branch mc Tiernan.
I am a fiction writer andscreenwriter.
I am the co-writer and producerof Katie's mom, which is a
movie about a woman who has anaffair with her daughter's
boyfriend now available to renton Amazon or for free on Tuby.
I think when I start sayingqualifications, I bore myself.
(03:15):
Basically I became a writer insecond grade.
When I.
Realized that I had anassignment and I wanted to just
keep going and I wanted to like,put everything into this eight
page story.
And I was pegged then a writer.
So it just became somethingthat I took with me wherever I
(03:36):
went and whatever other jobs orother life things I was doing, I
was always doing it as awriter.
So since then I've, publishedsome things.
I made a movie, but I don'tknow that that matters as much
as just the instinct tocommunicate through words on a
page.
Ariana (03:54):
That's beautiful.
I feel like I've never calledmyself a writer confidently.
Since I was a kid.
Even though I've always writtenand writing has come to me
easier than others.
Is, how I would put it.
I didn't really find it thatdifficult in school.
I could knock out an essay, Icould knock out a story.
(04:15):
When I was younger, I used toget these little notebooks and
I'd write whole stories in themthat were wackadoodle.
I found some when we werecleaning out my grandma's house
and they were very sweet.
And I actually, I read them andI was like, oh, these are not
bad.
There was this one story about.
This girl whose parents they,the family moved away for the,
(04:35):
for their parents' work.
And she had to, she was inanother country, I think she was
in Japan, and she couldn'tspeak the language and she was
trying to make friends and shemet a butterfly and the
butterfly would translate forher.
And so that was how she wasable to make friends and
connections.
Meryl (04:50):
I love that.
Ariana (04:51):
I think I find calling myself a storyteller to be a
little bit more accurate.
A storyteller and a storyconsumer because I just love
hearing people's stories.
I like sharing stories.
And I've worked in TV and filmproduction for a really long
time, and I think what hasalways drawn me to that field is
(05:13):
at the center of it is we'rejust telling a story.
I like the collaborative natureof filmmaking which you don't
necessarily have when you'rewriting.
But there's also somethingspecial about doing something on
your own.
Writing by yourself is aspecial experience 'cause it's
just you doing stuff withoutanybody in your ear.
(05:36):
At least in those initialstages, I feel like that's a
beautiful place to be in.
It's my more long-windedresponse to Meryl's.
Beautiful.
Succinct.
She's the writer.
I'm the storyteller.
I'll elaborate
Meryl (05:53):
stories.
Yeah, stories.
Ariana (06:00):
So if everything is writing.
And everything is story likewhat makes.
A story.
A story which I, I don't thinkI could answer right this
second, but
Meryl (06:09):
Yeah, I feel like it's not always obvious We're not
doing book reviews, but I kindof wanna tell you about a short
story I read yesterday, please.
I was in the library actually Ihad to wait there for an hour
and a half, so I was just like aprisoner in the library.
So I started picking up randomthings.
I never read literary journals,but I got so bored that I
started reading one.
And there was a story it was byBenjamin Nugent.
(06:32):
I've never read anything by himbefore.
about a guy who didn't likeporn.
And he was trying to do IVFwith his wife, Starts off with
him bragging about how hedoesn't like porn.
I read a few other stories inthat book and they didn't all
feel like they were totallysatisfying.
But this one I thought wasstrong because He has to go on a
(06:52):
journey in which that thing isquestioned and there's
consequences of it, and he triesto fight against his nature.
Basically at the end he tellsher, could you just like.
do a make your own porn for me'cause that's what I want.
I feel like the problem with alot of stories are that they're
like just a character sketch andnothing really happens.
So you get to the end, you'relike, cool.
(07:14):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Ariana (07:16):
I find that I have this problem in my own personal
writing where
Meryl (07:20):
many of us do.
I think it's very common.
Ariana (07:22):
Yeah.
Like you think of either areally strong character or you
are inspired by somebody towrite a really strong character.
and it's like you write it,but.
And what?
I think that's for me, that'swhen writing gets difficult.
Yes.
It's like you have that initialthought, that initial idea,
but.
Now you gotta take it tofruition.
(07:44):
You have to fully likegerminate that idea.
And that's why it takes yearsto write anything sometimes to
really get it good.
Books can take a really, evenshort stories, poems, they all
take time to craft.
and I hate that the sort ofcontent driven world where
(08:04):
everything has to be like anugget of content.
what is I think everything'swriting in story.
Meryl (08:11):
Calling everything content is disgusting.
Ariana (08:13):
I think it is.
I think it's taking away theessence of it, which is the
story part, which is whatconnects us.
Meryl (08:19):
Right.
And this kind of reminds me,and I don't know if this is off
topic of something, there's notopics the idea of protein I,
oh, I'm so in that, I hate theword protein.
Because especially the idea ofcalling an animal who lived a
life protein, and when we talkabout just like eating, oh, just
(08:40):
eating protein or eating asfuel, taking away the joy of
cooking, of food and treating itlike, like gas from the fucking
smelly ass gas station.
Ariana (08:52):
Yeah, and I think that comes from this capitalist world
where everything is judged onefficiency and how it can make
more, right?
Whereas if you start thinkingabout things that are meaningful
in life, it's things thatprovide, stimulation, enjoyment,
and those things.
are Crafted like a deliciousplate of food.
(09:13):
I'm sorry.
That's amazing.
Meryl (09:15):
Right?
It's not 50 grams of protein.
Yeah, so I think of calling artcontent, it's the same as
eating macros and protein.
It's and I don't wanna be inthat field.
Yeah.
I don't wanna make content.
I wanna make art.
Ariana (09:29):
Yeah, me too.
And let's talk about what thattakes, because it does take
sacrifice.
To, like we were talkingearlier, off air about 'cause
I've come up in certainsituations in my career where
I'm at a place where it's likeyou either play the game.
And you put on this mask andyou're this certain kind of
(09:52):
person maybe I need to buy a newwardrobe to look the part of
that, that these like creatives,like what people wanna hire
when they call them creatives.
'cause there is an aestheticlook to it.
And it's also a way of talking,it's a way of being in the
world and selling yourself.
And as frustrated as I am withlike where I am.
(10:14):
Financially, and in my career Ican't imagine sacrificing who I
am to become something likethat, just to make money.
'cause I think I will just bemiserable.
And then what's the point?
Agreed.
Just having my protein shakesand maybe I look all buffed, but
(10:34):
like for what?
Meryl (10:36):
Right.
Meal planning with your proteinand your macro.
Yeah.
Like a,
Ariana (10:40):
a mass shooter could come and shoot us down and,
right.
And what
Meryl (10:42):
was the point?
Ariana (10:43):
What was the point, if not to enjoy what is here on
this shitty planet that it'sactually not a shitty planet.
It's a beautiful planet thatwe've created shitty situations
as human race, like we havepolluted it and we've created
things like spreadsheets and
Meryl (10:57):
Right.
Right.
Yeah.
So I guess we're here to talkabout art and making it and how
to keep making it in the face ofrejection, in the face of not
always paying the bills with ithow to keep ourselves going back
to the page.
Ariana (11:17):
I think that's the essence.
Of what we're doing.
And also in a very selfish way,it's a place for our voices to
be heard.
If they don't make room for youat the table, you start your
own table?
Yeah.
Meryl (11:33):
That Yes we're starting our own table and we are lucky
to know other artists, some whohave reached higher realms than
we have so far, and bring themin and hear about their
experiences and their challengesbecause the thing about.
Creating art is that you alwaysthink, once I get this, then
(11:53):
I'll be okay, or I'll be happy,or I'll be there.
But then there's the next, likethe goalpost is always
changing.
So becoming aware of that andsharing that with you guys.
Ariana (12:03):
Yeah.
And to add to that, creatingart while sometimes can be very
collaborative.
The initial stage is veryuncollaborative.
Yes.
Especially the writing fieldRough draft, first draft, second
draft, third draft.
That is solo work.
And it's so easy to fall intodespair and be like, I suck.
(12:30):
I don't know how to write.
Why am I doing this?
I'm all alone in this world.
And hopefully these discussionsfor at least us, for anyone
listening for our guests, ourfriends will be a chance to be
like, you're not alone in thiscrazy world in which we're
trying to make something and saysomething of meaning and value,
(12:52):
regardless of who values it.
Meryl (12:56):
I know I personally feel often that nobody cares if I
turn on my computer.
Nobody cares if I readanything.
It.
And I guess we're looking tobuild a community of people who
do care and care about eachother and care about, seeing
what other people are creating.
Ariana (13:14):
Yeah.
'cause otherwise, what are wedoing?
I don't know.
What are we doing?
Just paying bills.
Not like we gotta findenjoyment in these fascist
times.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Let's be the subculture inBerlin in the forties.
Let's
Meryl (13:29):
do it.
Ariana (13:34):
Have you ever been in a writer's room?
Meryl (13:36):
That's a good question.
Only our writer's room for theGirlfriend Collective.
That's the only writer's roomI've ever been in.
Ariana (13:43):
And it was virtual, so it
Meryl (13:45):
did not feel like what I would expect.
Ariana (13:48):
Well, that whole project was, non-traditional.
What's a, what's a good word?
Unorthodox.
Meryl (13:53):
Unorthodox word was an unorthodox.
it was an unorthodoxexperience.
Yes.
And I've never been in aorthodox experience.
I don't know, have you?
Ariana (14:02):
I was a writer's assistant for two seasons on a
game show, so it's Oh,interesting.
Was a writer's room.
The vibe felt very muchstereotypical writers.
It was WGA New Yorkers, mostlymale.
All white.
Okay.
And me, there was one womanAnna Lotto, who actually, she
(14:22):
wrote my recommendation for gradschool.
Oh.
it was a hundred thousanddollars pyramid, so it's lists
of words.
You have your, categoryquestion that's usually a little
punny, punchy, and then.
A list of words that you wantthese folks to guess For the
game, but yeah.
(14:44):
And they'd have to do, I can'teven remember how many, but,
they did have quotas and then myjob was to look for repeat
words and tally up repeat wordsand if categories had already
been done before.
Okay.
It was a weird job.
Now I'm trying to remember whatI did, the head writer was very
typically neurotic and stressedout all the time.
(15:06):
And his hair was just like,Albert Einstein.
And and I also had to make surehe ate, 'cause he would just
not eat
Meryl (15:13):
nice.
Ariana (15:14):
Nice.
But it was a fun room.
It was like a little bitstinky.
Meryl (15:17):
Yeah.
With the peanut butter and
Ariana (15:18):
jelly?
No, just the beo.
Oh,
Meryl (15:21):
interesting.
Ariana (15:21):
I felt like on 30 Rock, they always made fun of that.
Really?
It was a little bit likeeveryone looked grody and no one
was like, camera ready.
Meryl (15:29):
I feel like this is an issue I'm having in life.
I imagine like my dream man orthe, my dream people are like
the people that you see on theTV saying the smart things, but
the people who wrote the thingsdon't look like the people Ah,
who say things.
So the idea of a room ofattractive, interesting smart
(15:49):
writers I feel like doesn'talways happen.
Ariana (15:52):
Those are unicorns.
Meryl (15:53):
Yeah.
It's just us.
It's just two us.
Yeah.
We're the only ones.
So I think you have to justaccept that smart and pretty
aren't always together, but theycan be.
Ariana (16:02):
But then you also have to have like smart and feminist
to some extent smart.
'cause there's a lot of smartguys who just are assholes,
Meryl (16:12):
right?
That is true.
Ariana (16:13):
There's a there's, I guess there's layers to
assholeness that I can take,'cause sometimes, if you're a
little dick or like you're alittle bit of an ass or a little
bit cunty that's fun.
But if you're like an actualasshole or like a dick, right?
I can't get over that.
a man loves a director's cut.
(16:35):
A man loves a director's cut ina way that I do not think most
women do.
Meryl (16:40):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Except for, as a writer, Ireally like the director's cut
because Oh, yeah.
Of my work.
Oh, yes.
Yeah.
I'm like, oh, all of theselines need to be here.
We need to see all these seeds.
It's all gold.
Ariana (16:56):
Okay.
This is this is related so I'veworked on television and film
for the last, almost 15 yearsnow.
And so I worked on this onemovie in Vietnam.
And I like to say when I was anam, when I was
Meryl (17:11):
a when I was in Nam,
Ariana (17:12):
But it was my friend.
Who wrote this film, it was herthesis for her, MFA at NYU.
And she was doing that thingwhere she had all her credits,
but she wanted to actually makethe movie.
And I guess I now subsequentlyunderstand that process where
some people just wanna get thedegree and other people are
(17:32):
like, I might as well use theseresources.
And I don't think there'snecessarily a right or wrong
way,
Meryl (17:36):
I think that you reach a certain point and you're like,
do I wanna be here forever or doI wanna
Ariana (17:40):
Yeah.
Go.
Yeah.
Okay, back to Nam.
Back to Nam.
So she really wanted to dothis.
It was a period piece.
Lots of characters historicalfiction.
Shot in Vietnam.
It's her home country.
And the story was about aVietnamese family in the 19th
century.
Okay.
No, 18th century, sorry.
19 hundreds, 18th century Soyou can imagine the type of
(18:04):
budget that would require, Butobviously things are like, she
definitely got more bang for herbuck in Vietnam than in the us.
I forget where we're going withthis anyways.
She wrote the script.
I read it.
I really liked it.
She was a really good friendand a mentor to me.
I found so interesting isbecause she wrote it, she
directed it, she produced it.
(18:25):
But because she was financingit.
She kept ditching theschedules.
So it felt disrespectful as acrew.
This was like a crew of 90people.
Wow.
So it wasn't a small crew.
And I ended up being in themiddle of a lot of drama because
I was her friend.
Anyways all of that isunrelated to the point I was
trying to make.
The ADD is strong today whichwas that she wrote the script,
(18:50):
but she would change it a lot.
And then and she kept havingwhat she would call sort of
these epiphany moments whereshe'd wanna shoot something else
or she would spend, timeshooting a salamander on the
curtain instead of this scene.
Between the characters andeveryone sitting around waiting
and it, and in the final cut.
I went to go see it atpremiered at Toronto Film
(19:11):
Festival.
And it was good.
Good fest.
Yeah, it was a good fest.
Beautifully shot movie.
I thought it was very poetic,but it was to me so different
from that original script.
Which is almost the opposite ofwhat you were saying about how
if you wrote it, you would wantall your words in there.
She took out, like literallythere was nearly no dialogue.
Meryl (19:32):
Really?
Ariana (19:33):
Yeah.
Interesting.
There was almost no dialogue.
Which I mean, for film., youshouldn't be relying on
dialogue.
You, if you have dialogue, ithas to be purposeful.
Yeah.
Because you have the visualsto, to back you up.
Meryl (19:47):
I prefer heavy dialogue.
Which is tv.
Ariana (19:50):
Which is tv.
Meryl (19:51):
Yeah.
Ariana (19:53):
Traditionally.
Meryl (19:53):
Yes.
Traditional.
Ariana (19:54):
Yes.
Yes.
Yeah.
Oh my God, I never reallythought about that.
So TV's kind of
Meryl (19:59):
it's like a play.
It's a play.
It started as a play.
It's a play commercial really.
They the entertainment to getyou to watch commercial.
Ariana (20:06):
But it comes from the tradition of we had sort of
Meryl (20:10):
radio.
Ariana (20:11):
Yeah.
But it was like vaudeville,radio shows.
And then you had television.
So it's like the trajectory.
Meryl (20:17):
And it's interesting that this form is like the radio
form is coming back now as apodcast.
Oh yeah.
Not full circle.
Yeah,
Ariana (20:24):
full circle.
Because you can listen to itYeah.
And do other things.
Meryl (20:27):
Exactly.
Ariana (20:28):
Because we require stimulation always.
I need barriers toentertainment, like television,
because otherwise I will watchit forever.
Like the, just 'cause it's beena very hard few months for me.
I've just literally beenwatching an entire show a day.
Meryl (20:45):
Wow.
Ariana (20:46):
I've watched so many series because I'm like multiple
season series in a day.
Sometimes one to two in a day.
It's hard to do more than that,but I've been watching whole
series per day and I don't thinkthat's healthy.
Meryl (21:01):
Possibly not, but who
Ariana (21:03):
needs help when you're, who needs help when the world's
ending and Fascism's winning?
Meryl (21:07):
Yeah, I think I'm actually more addicted to
reading than I am to tv.
Ariana (21:13):
I'm trying to get addicted to reading.
'cause I used to be
Meryl (21:17):
a reading addict.
Ariana (21:19):
I used to be so good at reading in the sense that I read
all the time.
Yeah, it ebbs and flows.
I think I, I just needed the TV'cause my problems were so
cerebral.
I needed that to be louder thanmy thoughts.
Yeah.
So people talking need to belouder than my thoughts I think
the the act of reading is a veryunique personal experience and
(21:42):
I think I used to think everyoneexperienced it the same way,
but
Meryl (21:45):
No, I guess not.
Yeah.
I cannot listen to books likeI.
That's the last thing I'd everwanna do in my life.
Ariana (21:53):
Like the, like I don't mind listening to books, but I
don't listen to all books.
If it's a book I really aminterested in, I will read it.
'cause I do feel like listeningbecomes a little bit more
passive.
Meryl (22:03):
Yeah, it's just that, it's like the act of reading is
my, one of my favorite acts.
And I just don't associate thatas the same.
I'm like, oh, I like to look atwords.
Aw.
Like it's not about thecontent.
It's about my enjoyment of theprocess.
Ariana (22:19):
That's really sweet.
Meryl (22:21):
When I think about going blind, if that ever were to
happen, I'm like, I wouldn't beable to read.
And people are like, oh, butyou could listen.
I'm like, then I kill myself.
Ariana (22:30):
What did that, but what you were saying about how you
love to see words on page,that's probably why you like to
write.
Meryl (22:37):
You're creating the
Ariana (22:37):
words on the page.
Meryl (22:39):
Is it?
Ariana (22:40):
Do you like writing?
Meryl (22:41):
I don't know.
That's a good question.
I Yeah.
Because some people say, I likehaving written.
I like the flow state.
Once I get into that,
Ariana (22:49):
oh yeah.
Meryl (22:50):
You know what?
I think I like the writing,which I feel like I have not
done lately, where I don'treally know where it's going.
I feel like when I'm trying totell a story that I already
know, it's less interesting.
And it's a lot of what do, whatneeds to go in there?
And it's like being burdenedand having to take the burden
off versus just, I'm sitting andI'm feeling and it's coming to
(23:14):
me.
Ariana (23:16):
That's magical.
To me, I imagine that's likewandering through a beautiful
forest, right?
And you're just like picking upflowers and you're looking at
the trees, and then you see adeer run by, as opposed to we
have to get to the summit.
We have to bridge.
And you're exactly like, you'relike, you're climbing Mount
Kilimanjaro.
Yes.
Meryl (23:33):
Yes.
Ariana (23:34):
And you're like, freezing.
Your feet are freezing.
You can't breathe.
And you're like, oh, why did Istart doing this in the first
place?
Meryl (23:40):
And that may be a case of being happy with having
written, but it's like, allright, I got the story out, and
then you can enjoy editing.
But the way I often or used tooften feel is I don't know.
I'm, I'm just, yeah.
Walking in the forest.
Ariana (23:56):
Yeah.
I've always liked writing.
I don't wanna say it came easyto me.
Like I never found it to bethat difficult.
I felt like towards the end ofgrad school and working on that
damn thesis made me finallyrealize fuck writing's hard.
And I think maybe what you'resaying is what I was
experiencing because I knew Iwas trying to finish something
and
Meryl (24:13):
it wasn't just fun.
Ariana (24:15):
It wasn't just fun.
Yeah.
And this year I'm trying tofind that fun again.
Meryl (24:20):
How's it going?
Ariana (24:22):
It's going slowly.
I did feel like I got like aburst of an idea of the world in
which I wanna write in I'm alsoa very goal oriented person, so
I'm my own worst enemy whereI'll create rules and be like,
you have to do these things.
And then the other half of meis no, I don't wanna.
So that's where I find myself.
I
Meryl (24:41):
have that issue.
Yeah.
Ariana (24:42):
'cause I'm like, okay, these are the characters I'm
working with.
And I'm like, great, I didthat.
Meryl (24:47):
Then you have to work with them.
Then you have to work withthem.
No.
I find momentum really hard.
Flow and momentum, like beingin it, the times I am happiest
is when I actually feel in theproject where it's okay, I'm
excited to go back to this thingwhere I'm like living in it
when I'm not at the page.
But where I'm now is not a goodplace
Ariana (25:10):
right now.
Meryl (25:11):
Yeah.
I am theoretically writing anew book, but I'm not in that
book.
I don't even have a name.
My character doesn't have aname.
Like it's not, it's just likeI'm just showing up.
I'm not in it.
Ariana (25:24):
A lot of people say that's the first step.
Just show up every day.
Yeah.
On the page.
That's like the, I like,that's, do unto others as others
do unto you in writing?
It's show up.
Yeah.
Just do the work.
Yeah.
Meryl (25:35):
Yeah.
I think that I had said, when Iwas writing my first book,
which I started, I guess Iofficially started writing at
25.
This book, that book, andfinished at 30, called it Done.
Started looking for agents.
At that point, I said, if thisdoesn't sell, I will never write
another book.
This is a one time thing, neveragain.
(25:56):
Somehow life happened and Iwrote a second book.
And to sit down and do it athird time is really hard.
It's not something I everplanned to do.
Ariana (26:08):
I can't even imagine.
'cause I have not written anovel.
I have written short storiesand flash fiction.
I write short form.
Short.
Yeah.
But I have committed to writinga novel this year.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I was like, maybe I justwrite a novel, like maybe I just
try something different.
'cause I didn't feel likecoming back.
I didn't feel like.
(26:28):
Editing my short stories.
So maybe it's just new formtime.
And it's scary.
And last year I did the halfmarathon and that was scary.
You were, so I might as well
Meryl (26:39):
you achieved goals.
Ariana (26:41):
I'm a Capricorn.
But this goal does seem verydaunting, but, everyone takes
their own time at it.
So maybe I just, today mywriting was one sentence.
Meryl (26:54):
Okay.
All right one more sentencethan you had yesterday.
Ariana (27:04):
Oh, I have another question for you.
'cause you're like my writingsister.
Oh yeah.
You have much more experiencethan me.
My big sister who helps methrough hard times but in all
seriousness, yes.
Can you tell me about yourexperiences or maybe a, an
experience at a writer'sretreat?
'cause I know you've done acouple.
Meryl (27:22):
The South Hampton Writers conference, which is something
that Stony Brook a universityputs on, that's actually how I
ended up going to Stony Brook.
'cause I had so much fun that Iwas like, I wanna do this all
the time.
But that wasn't really how itwas.
So I did two weeks.
Which some people okay,different kinds of people are
different.
I like to really immerse For along time some people were like,
(27:46):
fuck, I would never want to dothis for two weeks.
But what was really great aboutit, so I literally knew no,
nobody.
So every meal you were sittingwith new and interesting people
and hearing about what they werewriting and just having really
deep conversations, so there wasthe meal part that was nice.
I would take a workshop.
Eat with other people, workalone in my room, and then go to
(28:07):
whatever they had like salonsat night.
So everything was aboutwriting, the world was writing.
Nothing in the world existedbesides writing, and I
apparently need that.
So when I went to the StonyBrook thing, I called it a
retreat at first.
And then I felt that I hadworked so hard.
I got really offended whenpeople would call it a retreat.
(28:27):
I'm like, this was not aretreat, it was a residency.
I was working.
Yeah.
So I don't know.
I guess I would think of aretreat as maybe not having all
the yeah.
The stuff.
Ariana (28:38):
'cause a residency it's an exchange, right?
You are committing to c to thecommunity.
Meryl (28:43):
Yeah.
Like you're immersing yourselfin community.
Ariana (28:45):
Whereas a retreat I feel is usually.
A little bit more like a likeit's basically Tourism Plus,
right?
Yes.
Meryl (28:51):
It's just to go to that place.
It's just
Ariana (28:53):
to go to that place.
Meryl (28:54):
But that's why I liked it being two weeks.
'cause there was like, one weekwas the workshop and the other
week was like just working onthe writing.
Ariana (29:01):
So actually hearing that story, I realize I've been to
the key West Literary seminarand I did a one week workshop.
And so similarly they put us upand, I'm living in, working
with my workshop mates.
But I found that I didn't get alot of work done because I was
(29:21):
always reading other people'swork.
Meryl (29:24):
That is, that's one of the challenges.
Ariana (29:26):
Also another side note.
Meryl (29:28):
Yeah.
Ariana (29:28):
I go to these workshops and there are some beautiful
people.
Meryl (29:31):
True.
There are beautiful writers.
Can be beautiful.
Ariana (29:34):
There are beautiful writers at the Key West Literary
seminar.
it wasn't black, but there thetheme was African American
literature.
So there was a lot ofbeautiful, interesting black
people who were intelligent andit just was magical in Key West,
which is a beautiful place.
And everyone's like sunkissedand
Meryl (29:53):
Right.
Everyone was just vibing, justso healthy and we were just
Ariana (29:56):
eating key lime pies and drinking Amazing I margaritas
or something.
I was gonna ask you what you,how you like to write.
I thought that was gonna be agood question.
Meryl (30:08):
I feel like I have a, when I'm really stuck in a big
fear situation, I will dohandwriting.
Because it's easier or it'ssafer.
Ariana (30:17):
Yeah, I agree.
'cause then I, it's likejournaling, you just write
whatever, and you can justscribble.
Meryl (30:22):
So I think that when it's most successful for me is when
like early in the day I'll handwrite and then type it up like a
couple hours.
Yeah.
So I could, even, if I can'tread it, I can like figure it
out.
Ariana (30:33):
Yeah.
Meryl (30:34):
Do you have typewriter fantasies?
Ariana (30:37):
I used a typewriter when I was a kid.
A lot.
My grandpa had a typewriter andhe would pay us 10 cents per
envelope to Oh wow.
'cause he had his own business.
So when he had to send thingsout to people, we would use the
typewriter to write theaddresses.
Addresses on the envelope.
And then I was really obsessedwith the typewriter, so I would
write letters to, my mom was ingrad school in Italy.
(30:59):
And I would, and I forgot aboutthis, she reminded me, she's
yeah, you used to send me like aletter a week and I would
write, I'm on the typewriter.
Wow.
Because I thought it was fancy.
Totally.
It's fancy.
Yeah.
I feel like I used to writestories on the typewriter.
My brother actually has a few,I don't have any currently.
Meryl (31:16):
He has a few typewriters.
Ariana (31:17):
Yes.
He definitely this is genetic.
Why?
He has several typewriters.
I don't know.
But he does.
Because we all have typewriterfantasy.
It's.
The tactileness is Yes.
So delicious.
Maybe that's how I write mynovel.
I'll be one of those likehipster boys.
The picture?
Yeah, those hipster boys.
Oh, no.
Like Wednesday.
Did you watch that show?
Wednesday?
Oh,
Meryl (31:37):
I have very little of it.
She has a typewriter and she'swriting
Ariana (31:40):
her novel.
And it's really bad because,you don't save it.
It's just pages.
That's the only copy you have,right?
That's it.
So if you lose that, it's gone.
It's a
Meryl (31:47):
lot.
Yeah, but it also feels like Ihave this thing with pens too.
If I just buy this pen and thisnotebook, the writing will
come.
Yeah.
It might be that way with thetypewriter.
If I just buy this typewriter.
Ariana (31:58):
Maybe it'll, what's there to lose?
Meryl (32:01):
And one day we'll be rich and we won't even care.
So right now we can dream andwe can talk about our dreams,
and we're gonna
Ariana (32:09):
manifest our lives through this podcast.
Welcome to, it's All right.
It's the podcast that is activemanifestation for Ariana and
Meryl in this bleak world we'reliving in.
But spring is here and summer'scoming.
Meryl (32:28):
That's a wrap on today's episode.
We'll be dropping new episodesevery other Tuesday.
You can find us on Instagram atIt's All right pod
Ariana (32:36):
And if you have anything to say or would like to be on
the show, feel free to send us amessage either to, it's all
right pod@gmail.com or you cansend us a message on Instagram
and that's it's all right.
W-R-I-T-E
Meryl (32:54):
Thanks for listening to, it's all right.
Ariana (32:56):
Make sure to, subscribe, like all those things.
Wherever you get your podcasts.
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