Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
This podcast is for
educational purposes only, does
not constitute legal advice anddoes not create an
attorney-client relationship.
If you need legal assistanceabout a legal problem, contact
an attorney.
Welcome back to Know yourRegulator.
The podcast that inspires youto engage.
I am your host, simone Murphy.
It is back to school season, sothis episode we're diving into
(00:23):
a topic that's critical forTexas educators contract
abandonment.
I'm joined by Tony Bertolino,the managing partner of the
Bertolino Law Firm.
Tony has built a firm solelydedicated to defending
professionals just like himselfwhen their license and
livelihood are on the line.
Tony, it's great to have youhere.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
All right, simone,
thank you, I appreciate you.
Having me back on, tony, it'sgreat to have you here.
All right, simone, thank you, Iappreciate you having me back
on Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (00:46):
I would love to pick
your brain about this subject.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
For those who don't
know what exactly is contract
abandonment for a teacher underTexas law, Sure Well, in Texas,
contract abandonment isbasically when a teacher walks
away from their job after theschool year has started or,
under the law, within a 45-dayperiod of the first day of
(01:11):
instruction, which basicallymeans the first day of school,
and they do that without meetingone of the state board for
educator certifications approvedexceptions, and this list of
exceptions is actually prettyshort.
It includes things like you knowserious illnesses, caring for a
sick family member, or evenrelocating to a new city because
(01:33):
of a spouse's new job.
And even if you fall into oneof those categories, you still
have to follow the right processand provide documentation, or
you could end up getting inserious trouble.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Yeah, I would say
that, like you said, you know
you've got to follow a processor there can be some
consequences.
What happens to a teacher'slicense if they don't follow
that process or they're, youknow, reported for contract
abandonment?
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Well, actually, if
the school district reports you
for this contract abandonment,the case actually goes through
two separate agencies.
The two agencies include theTexas Education Agency, and
that's the division there iscalled the Educator
Investigations Division, andwhat they do is they actually
handle the fact-finding portion.
(02:24):
They go in and they investigateand find the facts leading up
to the reasons why or how or towhat extent the contract
abandoning happened, and thenthey'll notify you and they'll
request a written response andagain they gather evidence from
both you and the school districtand then, once that's complete,
the other agency that steps inis called the State Board for
(02:45):
Educator Certification, or theSVEC, and what they do is they
review the evidence, they decideif discipline is appropriate.
Sbec is what they call it forshort is the particular body
that issues the sanctions, andthose sanctions can range
anywhere from an inscribedreprimand, which is a public
(03:05):
reprimand, all the way up to apotential suspension of your
teaching certificate and, inrare cases, even revocation of
your teaching certificate.
So even though TEA, the TexasEducation Agency, is the one
communicating with you duringthis investigation.
It's ultimately SBEC that makesthe final call on your
(03:28):
certificate.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
That's really good
information for people to know.
I think that's not very widelyknown.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
No, it really isn't.
There's a lot of misconceptionor misunderstanding about that.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
Yeah, and it seems
like a lot of teachers are
probably not abandoning thesecontracts lightly.
Like you said, it's usually thecircumstances that can arise
are more serious, like a seriousillness, a big move.
It's often for personal reasonsor emotional, possibly health
related.
So what are some of thosecommon reasons that you've seen?
(04:02):
And while we're talking aboutteachers and their
misconceptions, where can peopleget kind of tripped up legally?
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Well, you know the
different scenarios that I've
seen in my practice are, youknow I've seen burnout.
You know, relocation, againbecause of a spouse's new job,
family or childcare issues thatcome about, and sometimes it's,
you know, very toxic workenvironments.
You know these teachers are,you know, in an environment
(04:32):
where their colleagues may bevery toxic or even some of the
children that they teach may bevery, very toxic and the problem
is that even if your reasonfeels completely justified, it
may not fit within SBEC's legaldefinition of that exception.
And the biggest trap is assumingthat a good reason
(04:53):
automatically protects you.
You know we get teachers thatcall us up and they're they're
thinking in their minds oh Ihave a great reason, a great
justification as to why I'mgoing to leave my job and leave
teaching and abandon my, mywritten contract with the school
district and really it turnsout that they don't have a
really good, justifiable legalreason.
And certainly the biggest thingthat I'm seeing as to a trap is
(05:18):
if you don't give that propernotice or use the right
resignation process under thestatute and you certainly back
it up with the paperwork anddocumentation that SBEC requires
, you can still face disciplineand I'm seeing that as probably
the biggest trap.
Speaker 1 (05:33):
You can still face
discipline and I'm seeing that
as probably the biggest trap.
Yeah, that's very well said.
I think it's very important forour educators and our teachers
to know that intention does notalways protect you from
discipline.
Like you said, you may thinkthat you've got a very just
reason for abandoning thecontract, but may not see it
(05:54):
that way.
No, you're exactly right.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
You know you're
exactly right and SBIC isn't
looking at your heart.
You know they're looking atwhether you follow the rules and
whether your situation issupported by the evidence and
the documentation that you'resupposed to be gathering.
And you might be leaving for acompletely valid reason, but
it's not documented or it'soutside the approved exceptions
(06:18):
or categories and you're stillat risk for those potential
sanctions that are out there.
And that's why it's soimportant to slow down when
you're in this scenario.
Slow down and get advice beforeyou make a move.
Mario, slow down and get advicebefore you make a move, because
you know these sort ofknee-jerk reactions that I'm
(06:38):
seeing from teachers.
You know they're again, they'requickly thinking that they can
breach their contract, they canleave their jobs, and that's
just not the law, that's justnot the proper way to do it.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
Yeah.
So let's say a teacher isconsidering leaving mid-year for
whatever reason.
What's the first thing thatthey should do?
Speaker 2 (06:59):
I think the first
thing you need to do is pull out
your contract and read thesection that is specific to
resignation and then, of course,check SBEC's timelines.
Course, check SBEC's timelines.
Most teachers, under Texas law,have to give 45 days notice
(07:19):
before the first day of schoolto resign without a penalty
imposed against your certificate.
And if you're already in theschool year, you're going to
want to see if you qualify forone of those exceptions.
And, honestly, the smarteststep you can take is to really
call someone who handles teacherlicense defense before you
submit anything.
Go to a professional, go to anattorney who is able to speak
(07:43):
with you and give you the properguidance and advice before you,
certainly before you resign.
But, of course, dot your I's,cross your T's and talk with
someone who has experiencebefore you submit anything to
the agency.
And you know that conversationwith an attorney can make all
(08:04):
the difference.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
Absolutely.
I think a lot of people don'tknow that there are professional
license attorneys that do existand they do defend your
teaching license, your educatorlicense.
So absolutely explore whatoptions they may be able to
offer you in something like this.
When it comes to teachers whohave already been reported or
(08:27):
they've already resigned, whatcan they expect?
Speaker 2 (08:31):
Well, they're very
likely going to get a letter
from TEA or SBAC saying there'sbeen a report and giving them a
chance to respond.
Very likely it's going to comefrom TEA actually, and that's a
crucial point in the process,because what you'll want to do
at that point is pull togetherany proof, any documentation
that supports your reason orbelief for your reason for
(08:53):
leaving reason or belief foryour reason for leaving and
those include, you know,documents include, such as
medical records.
You know relocation paperworkfrom your spouse, if you know if
they're relocating to adifferent city.
You know text correspondence,email correspondence.
And then, of course, you know,once you've gathered all that
information and you know thenext step is to, you know, work
(09:14):
with an attorney to put togethera strong strategic response.
And you know the next step isto, you know, work with an
attorney to put together astrong strategic response.
And you know, done right, youcan often negotiate for a
reduced sanction or, in somecases, get the case completely
dismissed.
But again, you've got to bevery mindful, very methodical
and you know, do things in avery methodical way and process,
(09:34):
have a list of the items youneed to put together, gather all
this documentation and evidenceand have it ready to speak to
your attorney and to go overthose documents.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Yeah, that makes
sense.
You know we talked about kindof slowing down, making sure you
have all your I's dotted, yourT's crossed, and that makes
perfect sense.
You'd want to slow down andreview it with someone who's an
expert.
Before we wrap up, tony, what'sone key piece of advice that
you would give to teachers toavoid finding themselves in a
contract abandonment case likethis?
Speaker 2 (10:05):
My best advice and
it's free advice is don't make a
career decision in the heat ofthe moment.
Don't make that knee-jerkreaction.
You know, if you're burned outor frustrated or you're dealing
with personal issues, step back,take a breath before you resign
.
You know, know the rules,document your situation and get
(10:27):
guidance before you act or react.
You know, in my experience, youknow, a little planning now can
save your license and save yourcertificate, save your career
and, of course, you know, saveyour livelihood down the road.
So that's that's probably mybest advice is, you know, take a
deep breath.
Don't react.
(10:48):
You know, in that knee jerkreaction kind of way, you know,
really step back and look atwhere you're at and follow the
rules.
You know, take it step by step.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
Yeah, absolutely.
Very well said I think ittalked in one of my previous
episodes that proactiveness isso much less traumatic and less
expensive than being active orgetting into litigation If you
can.
You know, know, learn yourrights and understand your
rights um at the forefrontthey're definitely a problem to
(11:22):
deal with in the first place.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
So definitely,
definitely.
When you're already in thatscenario or that situation where
your certificate is at stake,it's not necessarily too late.
But you know, like you said,you're looking at more blood,
sweat, tears and expenseassociated with it, rather than,
if you had been proactive andagain gathered your evidence,
information, speak to capableattorneys, it may very well
(11:49):
likely, would end up putting youin a better position and you're
not just in the defense of yourcertificate but also, you know,
expense wise, monetarily wise.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
Yeah, which is big.
It's big when it comes tolawyers and litigation.
Well, thank you very much, tony, for these really important
insights and, to our listeners,remember that your license is
your livelihood.
Know your contract, know yourrights and, when in doubt, get
advice before you act.
You can find resources in theepisode description, including
(12:20):
TEA guidance on contractabandonment.
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