February 2, 2025 • 30 mins
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Randy Gooch talks with Dr. Jeff Lashley about the impact of leading with legacy in mind. Dr. Lashley, who recently retired as the president of Moberly Area Community College, discusses his post-retirement activities and the importance of mentorship, effective communication, and finding humor in leadership. The conversation highlights collaboration on community projects, the role of mentoring emerging leaders, and the necessity of having tough conversations. Dr. Lashley emphasizes the value of being genuine, appreciating the journey, and recognizing contributions from high-performing team members. He shares insights on continually learning from others and the importance of balancing work with levity for effective leadership.
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Episode Transcript
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RANDY HOST (00:00):
Welcome to Lead, Learn, Laugh, Grow podcast,
where we explore leadership,growth, and the legacies that we
leave behind.
I'm your host, Randy Gooch, Ifirmly believe that influence is
the purest definition ofleadership.
Today, we'll dive into the powerof leading with legacy in mind.
I'm joined by Dr.
(00:20):
Jeff Lashley, who recentlyretired from the presidency of
Moberly Area Community Collegein Moberly, Missouri.
Over the years, Dr.
Lashley and I have had theprivilege of working together on
projects that have not onlyshaped our community, but also
transformed the lives ofstudents.
In this episode, we reflect onour shared experience, discuss
(00:42):
his post retirement journey intoteaching and counseling, and
gain valuable insight into hisleadership philosophy.
From the role of mentorship andcommunication, to finding humor
and balance in the weightyresponsibilities of leadership,
Dr.
Lashley shares wisdom, Forleaders at every stage.
And of course, we'll wrap upwith his advice for emerging
(01:05):
leaders, appreciating thejourney, embracing people along
the way, and staying focused onthat legacy that you are
building.
Let's get started.
Welcome, Jeff.
JEFF (01:15):
Thank you.
I'm glad to be here.
RANDY HOST (01:16):
It's good to have you.
We retired at the same timelast, July and, I trust that's
going pretty well for you.
JEFF (01:22):
We retired at the same time and had a pretty good run.
Working together as colleagues,when you were at CPS as chief
operating officer and I was atMACC and even before that in our
other roles when you weredirector of the career and
technical Programs and my chiefacademic officer time before
president.
We got to do a lot ofcollaboration And that was
(01:43):
always something I reallyenjoyed that had a great impact
hopefully for both ourinstitutions and for Columbia.
RANDY HOST (01:47):
As I think back on, what it did for kids
particularly when we did theconversion from housing and
running the nursing program.
Which was being phased out.
We partnered with you I remembersome skeptical help that I had
that were concerned about thatbut then I remember the big
smile your director it and shewas just was the best thing that
(02:09):
this program and she goes mycareer.
That was a good, move, and oneof many projects we did over
time.
JEFF (02:14):
When you think about that practical nursing program, that
had been there for decades.
that was a program with a lot oftradition that had put many
nurses into the workforce.
Then you had the surgicaltechnology program, too.
Two, important health sciencesprograms that really just didn't
make sense.
To continue to be housed withcps Made perfect sense for us.
And so that transition wasreally smooth continued to
(02:37):
Produce the same number ofgraduates that you all had with
very little interruption Havepathways there for them to
continue along other healthscience Opportunities and if we
didn't have that relationshipbetween macc and cps, the
community, suffers that programhas been around for decades and
it'll continue to be there fordecades.
RANDY HOST (02:55):
Yeah.
And particularly in the realm ofthe surge tech, because the
industry itself was moving awayfrom just a certification
program, to something thatrequired an associate's degree.
we definitely would not havebeen able to do that.
One thing that really excitesme, and I saw it on social media
earlier this fall, Moberly'sresults, you're all ranking the
best in the state of Missouri asfar as completion of that
program, that's just awesome,because we were really
(03:16):
struggling when you took thatover with our completion rate.
Yeah, it was one of thoseprojects that was the right
thing to do, and I guess wemanaged to guide it good enough.
it worked and it's somethingthat's going to last.
JEFF (03:28):
I agree.
RANDY HOST (03:29):
Definitely.
So tell me a little bit moreabout what you're doing in
retirement so far because that'sa big switch and I know when I
was rolling up, I was thinkingabout some of those legacy
things that I'd done, and whatwas going to last beyond me.
And I know you've got some ofthose.
So tell me about retirement andthen, tell me a little bit about
some of that legacy thinking youmight've been doing, leading up
to that.
JEFF (03:49):
Okay.
Well, I didn't have clear visionof what I wanted to do post
retirement other than, Spendmore time with family, spend
more time with my wife, and nothave such an intensely
structured schedule, Probablythe thing I have noticed the
most About retirement that isdifferent and I think this is
probably true for you as wellThere was always the next thing
(04:11):
always the next hurdle alwaysthe thing that We had to be
preparing for that was a bighurdle.
It never ended because it neverends.
Now that was a challenge and Ienjoyed that and, had great
people which made that verymanageable.
But I didn't realize how Muchwhen that was gone how much that
would just feel different Idon't have those huge things in
(04:34):
front of me anymore peoplewonder well, how do you go from
100 miles an hour to ascreeching halt professionally
And manage that Well, I wasfortunate.
I had some opportunities come myway that I was able to take
advantage of that.
I'm enjoying that are very parttime that allow me to continue
to have some interesting andchallenging things to do.
(04:55):
related to higher education.
So I've been doing someteaching.
At Central Methodist University,and that was fun.
Super.
So I got to get back into mydiscipline, and teaching my
discipline.
I taught a class in counselingand psychotherapy this past
fall, and that was fun.
And doing some consulting workthere as well.
And then the Missouri CommunityCollege Association has a
leadership academy that eachyear the 12 districts send
(05:21):
future leaders to thisleadership academy and it's
Something that goes on for twofull semesters.
The person that worked theacademy with Brian Milner, who's
the president ceo of CollegeAssociation needed to step
aside.
So that opened up that role.
So I got invited to participatein that with Brian.
I'm co facilitating thatleadership academy for MCCA with
(05:42):
him.
So I have enough.
going on that I feel engaged andI feel like I'm still
interacting with people that Ireally enjoy and like, but at a
much less, intense and stressfullevel.
RANDY HOST (05:55):
I can relate with that too.
I've experienced that samething.
I'm working, a not for profit,situation, but just the pace is
much less.
I don't wake up at nightanymore.
Wondering.
What the next thing is worriedabout what's going to happen
tomorrow so that's fantastic.
JEFF (06:11):
I enjoyed that and I thrived, but I'd been doing it
for a long time.
I was ready to set that down.
RANDY HOST (06:18):
I noticed on the website, They named a, residence
hall Lashley Hall.
Is that correct?
That is correct.
JEFF (06:24):
One of the things that happened in the last few years
in my role as president is westarted a couple of additional
athletic teams.
We started baseball andsoftball.
We've always had basketball andit really revitalized, Our
campus in Moberly got us a lotmore traditional age students
and has been very successful.
And one of the things that wehad to do, to be able to
accommodate those two newprograms was to have another
(06:46):
residence hall.
we were able to build a newplace.
It's really nice.
It's transformed campus and alot more students walking around
there every day.
I was fortunate and lucky thatthe board of trustees saw fit.
To put my name on that buildingand that was a tremendous honor
that I greatly appreciate
RANDY HOST (07:04):
well, that is awesome Any other titles or
legacies that went along withthat as you left?
JEFF (07:10):
The board of trustees also Saw fit to appoint me as a
president emeritus which is atremendous honor that Means a
lot to me.
I attended macc as a student Andthen, went away and, completed
my degrees and a professionalcareer in, in the field of
mental health before I came backto MACC decades ago.
The college has always beenimportant to me from the time I
(07:32):
was in the sixth grade when wemoved to Moberly.
It means so much to me that myprofessional career was spent
there and that the trustees sawfit to recognize me in those
ways.
So I feel very fortunate.
RANDY HOST (07:45):
I can't think of anybody that would be more
deserving of that kind of honorbecause, working with you,
watching what you've done, andit was not an easy road for
Moberly Area Community College.
In fact, if you would talk alittle bit one of the huge
challenges you had and theamount of growth that you had
during your tenure.
Just talk a little bit aboutMoberly and how it's a very
(08:05):
small taxing entity, but yourscope and reach.
in a regional way has reallyexpanded and, some of the
challenges and victories you didworking in that regional
environment.
I think there's a very coolstory there about working beyond
just what seems to be your role.
JEFF (08:24):
Good observation and a good question.
I believe a person in my roleoften gets too much credit for
the good stuff that happens.
you have great opportunities andyou take advantage of them and
when you're able to do that,you're not doing it by yourself.
You're doing it with a group ofpeople who are committed really
smart and do a great job.
I was very fortunate.
during my time as president, Ialways had a very supportive,
(08:45):
board of trustees who understoodthe community college and
understood that we had aregional, mission to serve 16
counties and five bigcommunities.
I always had.
Great faculty and great staffwho were able to take
opportunities and turn them intonew programs and great things
for our communities.
So you're right.
M.
A.
C.
Grew much beyond just Moberly.
(09:06):
We have five campuses ofsignificant size.
We're in Moberly MexicoKirksville columbia and
hannibal.
all those communities have afull service MACC campus and we
have a big online presence wehave our early college presence
in columbia with columbia publicschools, but a very large dual
credit program throughout ourwhole service region, so You're
(09:27):
right.
We served a whole region andThat has been a great
opportunity for us It createdchallenges for us.
One of the challenges youalluded to was the funding The
way community colleges arefunded is you get support from
the state of missouri publicfunds a tax base to support the
college.
And then the tuition and feemoney you get from your students
and then some smaller auxiliarythings like dorms.
(09:49):
And MACC is an old institutionwe've been around since 1927.
our taxing district is justMoberly with the public schools
in Moberly, so we don't have ahuge tax base like many other
community colleges so thatcreated challenges for us that
also means that these othercommunities students have a
different tuition rate So theyhave out of district tuition and
fees whereas just has indistrict tuition and fees But
(10:11):
our job was to serve everywhere.
And so that meant creatingprograms everywhere that was
probably The biggest challengeand maybe the biggest part of a
legacy that people would noticeabout Macc during that Tenure
that I had of 11 years is wereally expanded programs.
RANDY HOST (10:27):
I think some of the people that listen to this
particularly if they're locallyor from regional part in
missouri you're expansion ofdual credit for high school
students, I think that'ssomething that's probably
immeasurable but it's been huge.
JEFF (10:42):
Yeah, it allowed us to have great relationships with
the school districts in ourservice region it allowed us to
Create a great scenario like incolumbia where we actually have
an early college and havestudents in the columbia school
district graduate with theirassociate's degree at the same
time they graduate with theirhigh school Diploma one of the
things where the credit isreally due to the staff that are
doing that program there'sSomething called nacep
(11:03):
accreditation that you can getfor dual credit programs It's
one of the more challengingthings i've ever witnessed in
terms of being able to meet thestandards to have that
accreditation But when you cansay you're nacep accredited it
indicates that the dual creditis of high quality we've had
nacep accreditation for a longtime, and that's because of the
work of the deans, and thedirectors, and the faculty who
(11:26):
did all the work to make thathappen.
RANDY HOST (11:28):
And, with working with some of those people
through the years, I know theirstruggle, because, sometimes we
thought it wasn't moving quiteas quickly as we would like.
But, they stayed with it, andthey did a fantastic job.
JEFF (11:38):
The dual credit programs are something that, the college
is really proud of.
RANDY HOST (11:41):
They should be.
And, uh, a personal thank you,I've got three daughters that,
access that and, considerablesavings than when they have gone
on to further their studies, soappreciate that very much.
I want to shift gears a littlebit and really focus on this
thing about legacy.
Sometimes I tell people that noone is ever doing things of
(12:04):
significance on their own.
For most people that have thetype of success and the legacy
that you're leaving, there weresome people that you're standing
on their shoulders.
Talk about some of those peoplethat were very influential for
you and gave you some of thosefundamental tools and some of
those philosophies and treatingpeople and working with people
(12:25):
that did help you have the levelof success that you did.
JEFF (12:28):
you're right.
We stand on the shoulders ofpeople who were there before us
and the people who were there atthe same time as us.
I had the fortune.
To work for a lot of reallystrong leaders for example the
president of the college when Ibecame employed at the college.
Evelyn Jorgensen was a greatmentor for me.
She was a great leader at macc.
The college did very well underher leadership.
(12:50):
I learned a lot working with herthat helped me along the way I
didn't work directly with, Dr.
Komar, but he was at the collegebefore.
Dr.
Jorgensen, so the college hasbeen very fortunate.
He was a great leader and had ahuge impact the college is
fortunate that they've had goodpeople in those positions The
board of trustees has alwaysbeen very strong but it's all
(13:11):
the other folks that carry thewater.
Really?
All the staff.
One of the things I learned, Icame to the college as a faculty
member and I thought faculty arethe most important thing here,
right?
Because we're the ones in theclassroom.
We're the ones doing the realjob of a college and as I
learned more and went intoadministration I realized It's
really staff that are just asimportant as anybody else here
and this college could notfunction without the staff
(13:32):
student services financial aidis important having the
facilities in great shapeEverything and so it's really a
whole package and if you don'thave people committed in all of
those areas I got to see people,lead in ways that helped to
create a positive culture wherepeople felt valued, where people
understood that leadership knowsthat what they do is really
important.
(13:52):
And if they don't do it well,our students and our communities
would not thrive.
Lots of good leaders I got towork for, probably my background
in mental health didn't hurt.
I got to work with a lot ofpeople in my training in that
area too, professors that Iremember Who just treated people
well, and that's what I alwayssaw growing up my dad was a
methodist minister.
(14:13):
So I got to see him in hischurches growing up and see how
he treated people see how hemanaged that aspect of being a
preacher that is more than justbeing in the pulpit on sundays,
if you pay attention, you justlearn.
I think all these leadershipskills are transferable
regardless of where you are.
And I had a lot of good modelsthat I was able to learn from
(14:35):
and continue to do what I saw.
RANDY HOST (14:36):
Very good.
So, Obviously, when you comefrom that lineage and that type
of approach, you're probablyalways looking for people to
push up.
What was your role, how did yougo about mentoring young leaders
and emerging leaders, notnecessarily those that were
associated with youprofessionally but how did you
go about doing that?
Cause I know you've poured intoothers as well.
JEFF (14:58):
I appreciate, the question that to me, that's really
important and it's really fun.
I really enjoyed any time that Iwould form a professional
relationship with someone whereI was able to maybe mentor them,
and in some instances give themopportunities, and see them work
their way, through differentjobs basically promotions and
(15:18):
moving into positions ofleadership.
I think you just treat them theway you would want them to treat
others.
And they get experienced by,Having the opportunity to work
with a leader
RANDY HOST (15:30):
caught not taught.
JEFF (15:31):
I guess if I would say what I consider to be one of my
strengths I do think I have agood eye for a person that's
going to be effective andsuccessful I was able to
identify people Give them whatthey need to be successful and
then get out of their way.
And let them grow and become,very successful people.
RANDY HOST (15:49):
I'm sure someplace in there, there may have been a
difficult situation, a difficultcoaching situation, performance
situation.
Talk a little bit about dealingwith those kinds of tough
things, because a lot of timeswe don't necessarily like to
have those tough conversations,do those tough things,
JEFF (16:05):
actually the term you used is the term I use, which is
tough conversations.
And it's tough conversations youdon't sometimes, Even want to
have with the high performerwho's doing really well Because
the last thing you want to do ismake that person feel like oh,
he doesn't think i'm doing amistake people make too often is
they avoid a tough conversationthat needs to happen because
(16:25):
They just don't want to havethat tough conversation.
I always have thoseconversations and I think you
can have them successfully ifyou have a good relationship
with the person you're about tohave it with.
And if they know you're going tobe honest and fair with them and
hear them out I would go into atough conversation with the
(16:46):
mindset of, I could be Notseeing part of the picture here.
So I have to be open minded andmaybe I'll think differently
after they have a chance torespond that happened over some
instances where in the course ofhaving one of these
conversations, somebody openedmy eyes to something that I
wasn't necessarily aware of.
RANDY HOST (17:03):
Sure.
JEFF (17:03):
But I guess it boils down to Randy.
I think you have to be reallyprepared.
You have to know what it is youwant to share.
You have to be able to do so ina way that hopefully it is a
growth experience for them.
And the whole point is not thatthis tough conversation is the
end of something.
It's just part of theprogression.
So I'm not talking about thetimes where, we're reaching a
failure point I just think it'simportant to have them, but I
think a lot of times peopledon't like to have them.
RANDY HOST (17:25):
I agree.
In my first episode, with DavidNivens, the theme was be the
bison, and I learned a storyabout the bison bison, when a
storm comes up, get in a herdcharge into the storm and run
through it, cattle.
On the other hand.
Get a little spooky.
They scatter sometimes.
They try to run from the storm.
Sometimes they spend more timein the heat, the bad, the
(17:46):
danger, because They didn't meetthe thing head on.
When I heard that story for thefirst time, it really lit me up.
I said, what a good example ofsometimes avoiding those tough
conversations or thinkingthey're going to go away.
And if we'll just meet them headon, so much better result, so
much better for everybody.
JEFF (18:04):
That's a good frame.
I had not heard before.
I have no doubt if you don'thave the hard conversations that
eventually, something will,
RANDY HOST (18:13):
conversation probably coming at some point.
JEFF (18:15):
So just have to do it, but if you have the right culture
and people trust you and as aleader, you're consistent and
you're trustworthy then they'reopen to it.
Sure.
But I never was a screamer,never a yeller.
I don't think that works.
RANDY HOST (18:28):
I can't imagine you doing that.
You have such a kind demeanorand a calming effect on people.
It's always contagious.
The name of this podcast islead, learn, laugh, and grow
what part of lightness, humor,enjoyment was a part of your
leadership style?
And how did you do that?
Maybe in today's context, itshould be called work life
(18:49):
balance.
In our generation, when we werecoming up, that was not a
concept that you would have evenconsidered in work and in
leadership, but it definitelyis.
What role is that lightness,that being able to find some
lightness in the work, that'shard.
JEFF (19:01):
You have to have a sense of humor.
And I think, for me it was likethe President's Council.
So, it's the Deans and theDirectors, and it's the people
you work with most closely on adaily basis.
these are the people that youwork with when something has
just gone wrong.
It may not sound like it makessense, but sometimes that's when
the humor really came outbecause that's how you have to
survive those things, and so youjust have to see the humor in
(19:23):
some bad situations sometimes.
And I think part of the reasonthat I feel like we got along as
well as we did is because we didsee humor in things.
There are some things that arenot funny ever, the phone call
at 1230 that's coming fromsomeone, which, it's not a good
call.
You might start off with just alittle humorous, response it's
good to hear from you.
(19:43):
Yeah.
But we just had a lot of fun.
At times and I think you justhave to have a sense of humor
about things accreditation, forexample is one of the biggest
challenges that an institutioncan go through It's a ton of
work And I remember peopleleading accreditation usually
try to come up with some funthings related to accreditation?
It's hard to say fun andaccreditation in the same
sentence, but they did it, theywould come up with activities
(20:04):
and things that we would do thatwould somehow, be actually fun
and still make the point of whatit was we were trying to
consider.
RANDY HOST (20:10):
Part of your job was always, learning.
Talk about learning and how areyou still learning, even in a
different role, even in adifferent pace in life?
JEFF (20:19):
If you had asked me the question, what was maybe the
most important lesson youlearned along the way?
RANDY HOST (20:24):
That's a great question.
JEFF (20:25):
Here's what I figured out.
I learned from absolutelyeveryone that I worked with.
Once I figured that out, thatwas huge for me.
Because there were lots ofpeople a lot of times that would
be saying things maybe youdidn't want to hear.
But if I listened I would learnsomething.
There were people who hadcompletely different
backgrounds, differentperspectives than me.
The more I understood, I didn'tknow enough.
(20:46):
And so I looked at every singleperson, regardless of how I
worked with them as somebodythat could teach me if I would
just listen to them and thatserved me really well.
And so that's still how Iapproach my life that I just
know If I pay attention, there'salways something to learn.
In terms of, am I still tryingto learn, things that are
(21:08):
relevant in higher education andrelevant in my discipline?
I listen to podcasts.
I still read.
I still try to keep up onwhatever the, Newest technology
is impacting whatever theParticular discipline or thing
I'm interested in I would domyself a big disservice if I
stopped learning or if I stoppedattempting to learn the lesson I
learned early on is I can learnfrom everybody And I think too
(21:32):
many people think they alreadygot things figured out, and I
don't know what I can learn fromthat person.
They're missing out.
RANDY HOST (21:38):
I would agree with you.
And as you're talking aboutthat, sometimes when you think
about dynamics of teams andorganizations, sometimes you
have some of those that a bit ofa detractor and when you're in
it, it's like golly, I wish theywould just be a little bit
different, but I was thinkingabout one of those scenarios
that I had and probably the mostdifficult person in that group.
I started thinking about it andthere were things I was better
(21:59):
at because I knew I would haveto get quizzed or checked.
So in essence, while I thoughtthat was difficult in the long
run, the long haul, it wasmaking me better because I was
having to dig in, I was havingto learn some things that maybe
I could have gotten by with justan easier answer with the other
group, but there was a reverseaccountability built in that,
was meaningful.
JEFF (22:19):
I think you described what I was trying to say maybe better
than I did the contrarian personsometimes if you tune them out
and you don't hear them anymoreyou still should be listening
because pretty often they'resaying something and they're
right It may not be something wewant to hear or a strength
necessarily, but it's somethingwe need to hear.
RANDY HOST (22:34):
Another thing I learned in that process too it's
not that they necessarily alwayswanted to be right, they just
wanted to be heard, I rememberthere was a time while I was
still at the Career Center andWe had some uproars with some of
our faculty and we were tryingto work through that.
at the end of that school year Isaid, Okay, I'm going to invite
everybody in.
We're going to schedule 30minutes.
Here are three questions I'mgoing to ask you and then it's
(22:57):
open.
What went well this year?
What didn't go so well?
How can I better assist you indoing your work?
I had a contrarian come in andshe had A legal pad with her we
went through what went good, hada lot that didn't go so well.
And then there were severalpages of things that I could do.
And it was like, oh boy.
JEFF (23:18):
Yeah.
RANDY HOST (23:18):
As I listened to her I realized she just wanted to be
heard.
I told her at the end, Iappreciate you sharing this.
But the bottom line is, that'stoo much homework for me.
But I do think I, and I'dwritten down about three things
that I thought I could manage.
said, here are three things outof that.
I'm gonna focus on that Is thatokay with you?
(23:40):
She goes, yeah, she's okay I didthat after that year twice, at
the end of the first semesterand then at the end.
So we get to our winter breakcheck in And, she made it, she
was first one to make herappointment.
Comes in, she didn't have herpad.
And we sat down, we startedtalking, and, went through, the
things that were going better,whole lot more to share things
that weren't going so well,almost shrank.
(24:02):
What can I do better?
She goes, keep doing thosethings that you committed to
last year.
I love them.
Thank you.
JEFF (24:07):
Yeah.
RANDY HOST (24:08):
consequently our relationship.
became very good, there weresome things she was dealing with
on a personal level that shechose to share with me, a good
reminder that the contrarian, alot of what they have to say, Is
valid.
It's just not always the way inwhich we want to receive it.
Yeah, and that was a big one forme and I carried that process
From then on out I wanted to dothat type of listening in those
(24:31):
type conversations
JEFF (24:32):
I think the key is the person has to Sincerely believe
you're interested in what theyhave to say even if you can't
Make some changes they wouldlike to see they understand that
they've been heard And why youcan't do what it is that they
would like to see I think thatgoes a long way and that can be
a challenge because people don'tthink you're sincere and they
roll their eyes.
Oh, they're asking us again.
What do we think?
The hard part is doing it in away that they believe you're
(24:54):
sincere and then doing what yousaid one of the things that I
would say was true for me ispeople would let me know what
they thought to the point thatsome people would say, Wow.
Anybody can come in and just layinto you if they want to.
Not that it happened that often,but people were pretty
comfortable telling me what theythought.
RANDY HOST (25:10):
Great spot to be in.
All right, Jeff, if you had,three key points for, emerging
leaders that are struggling,still wanting to grow what are
three magic bullets from JeffLashley that you would give
those folks?
JEFF (25:23):
You have to really be yourself.
It's not about playing a role.
You have the task that's beenassigned to you, but you have to
be genuine.
You have to really be who youare because I think people can
see when that's not the case.
if you're genuine with people,you get a lot more grace from
them and they know you're goingto treat them well.
They know you're going to treatthem fairly.
(25:44):
So I think you got to beyourself.
I don't know if this ties intothe leadership question as much,
but this is what I would say toa younger version of myself I
say the point of the journey isnot to arrive.
It's the journey.
I didn't come up with that, butthat's a quote I've always
liked.
I am struck by, and I bet youare too, as two guys who are
newly retired, how fast this allwent by.
(26:06):
There were too many times that Iwas looking ahead and not
looking at right now andappreciating it and enjoying it.
As much as I could have becauseit was really fun, for the most
part, every bit of it issomething I would do all over
again if I had the chance and itgoes by so, so fast and I
enjoyed it.
I really did, but I would justsay, if you're earlier in your
(26:27):
career and all you're thinkingabout is I want to get four
points down the road, that'sreally where I want to be.
What I would say to you, thatjourney is as much fun as, It's
going to be when you get thereEnjoy the moment as much as you
can So as you're a developingleader, who really has these
aspirations and has this plan ofwhere they want to end up that
may be a great plan and whereyou want to end up enjoy that
(26:49):
journey because it's really fun.
I had as much fun along the wayas I did when I was at the
pinnacle, where I was thepresident of an institution.
It was just as great Everywherealong the way.
sometimes we're too focused onthe end goal Understanding that
you have it all along the wayjust recognize it and enjoy it.
RANDY HOST (27:10):
That's Excellent, and I would agree with you, I
think you're probably a littlemore emotionally mature than I
was, because, it's only been inthe last, 10 or 12 years that
I've really figured that outbetter, I had glimpses of it all
the way along, but, in that timeframe, it was okay I've climbed
some ladders.
I've gotten some wrongs, I got alittle bit more serious about,
(27:31):
hey, who can I help get up theirladder?
JEFF (27:33):
Yeah.
RANDY HOST (27:33):
that's when I really started thinking about legacy
leadership because I had ayoung, leader that I'd been
mentoring and they needed somehelp they called and said, well,
I need some help.
And they said, when's this thingdue?
What's your project due?
they said, a couple days fromnow.
I said, I'll be right there.
I went over and we workedthrough it.
they just said you leaddifferently than a lot of
people.
And you pour in more.
(27:53):
And they said, It's because,when I think back, I had people
that did that.
they're the people that have themost impact on me.
Started with my dad.
But I had some guys like ColonelBob Bray, Boy, talk about
somebody that cared about myprogress, my career, my growth,
I think that is so importantthat we do take a little time to
smell the flowers because we getreal competitive trying to make
(28:15):
those benchmarks, make thoserungs on the ladder, climbing
that.
And, there's a lot to be enjoyedalong the way.
JEFF (28:21):
Yeah.
And one other thing I believe Ilearned, and I hope I practiced
well, is don't take, People forgranted who are working hard and
doing really well.
They need to hear that as muchas the person or, too often I
think we say, okay, here are myproblems.
I'm going to focus on that.
I got to get this person, helpthem straighten out.
And then your stars your peoplewho just do it and they're
(28:44):
amazing.
How much they've contributed tothe success they have to hear
it.
They have to know how much youValue what they're doing how
much you recognize it and knowso don't forget the people
around you the people that areperforming really well Never
forget about taking time toappreciate them because they
need it too and it's reallyimportant.
RANDY HOST (29:04):
Absolutely.
I study John Maxwell a lot hetalks about That 80 20 concept
and
JEFF (29:09):
Yeah,
RANDY HOST (29:10):
if you're spending 80 percent of your time on The
80 percent that aren'tperforming, you're not going to
get a lot of results.
But if you spend 80 percent onthat 20 that are performers and
highly motivated, it acceleratesso much.
And then it also has that effectto bring some of that middle
along with it.
Sadly if we read, some of thework that, Gallup has done on,
(29:32):
workforce engagement, there'salmost a third, 25 percent to a
third of the people inorganizations that are actively
disengaged.
I felt like I was getting a lotmore out of leadership when I
stopped trying to fix all ofthem.
JEFF (29:46):
Yeah.
RANDY HOST (29:47):
Because.
Sometimes there's not enoughresources.
There's not enough time.
But shift that up to that groupthat really is gonna go and
everything you give them,compound it and multiply it.
Had that great change for kindof that middle group that was
just waiting to see.
They responded well, it's beengreat talking with you.
I love to hear that you're doingwell and retirement's doing good
(30:07):
things for you you're stillactive and contributing because
you have so much to contribute.
Jeff, thank you for joining metoday.
JEFF (30:13):
It was fun.
We used to get to do this,because our jobs got us together
and yes, we'll have to figureout a way.
Not that I, need to be a regularguest on your podcast, but we
could still go out to lunch.
RANDY HOST (30:23):
Absolutely.
I don't know how this thing isgoing to add up and all of that.
I do want to circle back aroundto people that are on it.
I want to do some larger grouppanels
JEFF (30:32):
I appreciate you having me here.
It was one of my days when I gotup, I had something to do.
Besides be retired.
RANDY HOST (30:38):
Glad I could keep you in the game.
Great to be with you, Jeff.
Thank you.
Welcome to Lead, Learn, Laugh, Grow podcast,
where we explore leadership,growth, and the legacies that we
leave behind.
I'm your host, Randy Gooch, Ifirmly believe that influence is
the purest definition ofleadership.
Today, we'll dive into the powerof leading with legacy in mind.
I'm joined by Dr.
(00:20):
Jeff Lashley, who recentlyretired from the presidency of
Moberly Area Community Collegein Moberly, Missouri.
Over the years, Dr.
Lashley and I have had theprivilege of working together on
projects that have not onlyshaped our community, but also
transformed the lives ofstudents.
In this episode, we reflect onour shared experience, discuss
(00:42):
his post retirement journey intoteaching and counseling, and
gain valuable insight into hisleadership philosophy.
From the role of mentorship andcommunication, to finding humor
and balance in the weightyresponsibilities of leadership,
Dr.
Lashley shares wisdom, Forleaders at every stage.
And of course, we'll wrap upwith his advice for emerging
(01:05):
leaders, appreciating thejourney, embracing people along
the way, and staying focused onthat legacy that you are
building.
Let's get started.
Welcome, Jeff.
JEFF (01:15):
Thank you.
I'm glad to be here.
RANDY HOST (01:16):
It's good to have you.
We retired at the same timelast, July and, I trust that's
going pretty well for you.
JEFF (01:22):
We retired at the same time and had a pretty good run.
Working together as colleagues,when you were at CPS as chief
operating officer and I was atMACC and even before that in our
other roles when you weredirector of the career and
technical Programs and my chiefacademic officer time before
president.
We got to do a lot ofcollaboration And that was
(01:43):
always something I reallyenjoyed that had a great impact
hopefully for both ourinstitutions and for Columbia.
RANDY HOST (01:47):
As I think back on, what it did for kids
particularly when we did theconversion from housing and
running the nursing program.
Which was being phased out.
We partnered with you I remembersome skeptical help that I had
that were concerned about thatbut then I remember the big
smile your director it and shewas just was the best thing that
(02:09):
this program and she goes mycareer.
That was a good, move, and oneof many projects we did over
time.
JEFF (02:14):
When you think about that practical nursing program, that
had been there for decades.
that was a program with a lot oftradition that had put many
nurses into the workforce.
Then you had the surgicaltechnology program, too.
Two, important health sciencesprograms that really just didn't
make sense.
To continue to be housed withcps Made perfect sense for us.
And so that transition wasreally smooth continued to
(02:37):
Produce the same number ofgraduates that you all had with
very little interruption Havepathways there for them to
continue along other healthscience Opportunities and if we
didn't have that relationshipbetween macc and cps, the
community, suffers that programhas been around for decades and
it'll continue to be there fordecades.
RANDY HOST (02:55):
Yeah.
And particularly in the realm ofthe surge tech, because the
industry itself was moving awayfrom just a certification
program, to something thatrequired an associate's degree.
we definitely would not havebeen able to do that.
One thing that really excitesme, and I saw it on social media
earlier this fall, Moberly'sresults, you're all ranking the
best in the state of Missouri asfar as completion of that
program, that's just awesome,because we were really
(03:16):
struggling when you took thatover with our completion rate.
Yeah, it was one of thoseprojects that was the right
thing to do, and I guess wemanaged to guide it good enough.
it worked and it's somethingthat's going to last.
JEFF (03:28):
I agree.
RANDY HOST (03:29):
Definitely.
So tell me a little bit moreabout what you're doing in
retirement so far because that'sa big switch and I know when I
was rolling up, I was thinkingabout some of those legacy
things that I'd done, and whatwas going to last beyond me.
And I know you've got some ofthose.
So tell me about retirement andthen, tell me a little bit about
some of that legacy thinking youmight've been doing, leading up
to that.
JEFF (03:49):
Okay.
Well, I didn't have clear visionof what I wanted to do post
retirement other than, Spendmore time with family, spend
more time with my wife, and nothave such an intensely
structured schedule, Probablythe thing I have noticed the
most About retirement that isdifferent and I think this is
probably true for you as wellThere was always the next thing
(04:11):
always the next hurdle alwaysthe thing that We had to be
preparing for that was a bighurdle.
It never ended because it neverends.
Now that was a challenge and Ienjoyed that and, had great
people which made that verymanageable.
But I didn't realize how Muchwhen that was gone how much that
would just feel different Idon't have those huge things in
(04:34):
front of me anymore peoplewonder well, how do you go from
100 miles an hour to ascreeching halt professionally
And manage that Well, I wasfortunate.
I had some opportunities come myway that I was able to take
advantage of that.
I'm enjoying that are very parttime that allow me to continue
to have some interesting andchallenging things to do.
(04:55):
related to higher education.
So I've been doing someteaching.
At Central Methodist University,and that was fun.
Super.
So I got to get back into mydiscipline, and teaching my
discipline.
I taught a class in counselingand psychotherapy this past
fall, and that was fun.
And doing some consulting workthere as well.
And then the Missouri CommunityCollege Association has a
leadership academy that eachyear the 12 districts send
(05:21):
future leaders to thisleadership academy and it's
Something that goes on for twofull semesters.
The person that worked theacademy with Brian Milner, who's
the president ceo of CollegeAssociation needed to step
aside.
So that opened up that role.
So I got invited to participatein that with Brian.
I'm co facilitating thatleadership academy for MCCA with
(05:42):
him.
So I have enough.
going on that I feel engaged andI feel like I'm still
interacting with people that Ireally enjoy and like, but at a
much less, intense and stressfullevel.
RANDY HOST (05:55):
I can relate with that too.
I've experienced that samething.
I'm working, a not for profit,situation, but just the pace is
much less.
I don't wake up at nightanymore.
Wondering.
What the next thing is worriedabout what's going to happen
tomorrow so that's fantastic.
JEFF (06:11):
I enjoyed that and I thrived, but I'd been doing it
for a long time.
I was ready to set that down.
RANDY HOST (06:18):
I noticed on the website, They named a, residence
hall Lashley Hall.
Is that correct?
That is correct.
JEFF (06:24):
One of the things that happened in the last few years
in my role as president is westarted a couple of additional
athletic teams.
We started baseball andsoftball.
We've always had basketball andit really revitalized, Our
campus in Moberly got us a lotmore traditional age students
and has been very successful.
And one of the things that wehad to do, to be able to
accommodate those two newprograms was to have another
(06:46):
residence hall.
we were able to build a newplace.
It's really nice.
It's transformed campus and alot more students walking around
there every day.
I was fortunate and lucky thatthe board of trustees saw fit.
To put my name on that buildingand that was a tremendous honor
that I greatly appreciate
RANDY HOST (07:04):
well, that is awesome Any other titles or
legacies that went along withthat as you left?
JEFF (07:10):
The board of trustees also Saw fit to appoint me as a
president emeritus which is atremendous honor that Means a
lot to me.
I attended macc as a student Andthen, went away and, completed
my degrees and a professionalcareer in, in the field of
mental health before I came backto MACC decades ago.
The college has always beenimportant to me from the time I
(07:32):
was in the sixth grade when wemoved to Moberly.
It means so much to me that myprofessional career was spent
there and that the trustees sawfit to recognize me in those
ways.
So I feel very fortunate.
RANDY HOST (07:45):
I can't think of anybody that would be more
deserving of that kind of honorbecause, working with you,
watching what you've done, andit was not an easy road for
Moberly Area Community College.
In fact, if you would talk alittle bit one of the huge
challenges you had and theamount of growth that you had
during your tenure.
Just talk a little bit aboutMoberly and how it's a very
(08:05):
small taxing entity, but yourscope and reach.
in a regional way has reallyexpanded and, some of the
challenges and victories you didworking in that regional
environment.
I think there's a very coolstory there about working beyond
just what seems to be your role.
JEFF (08:24):
Good observation and a good question.
I believe a person in my roleoften gets too much credit for
the good stuff that happens.
you have great opportunities andyou take advantage of them and
when you're able to do that,you're not doing it by yourself.
You're doing it with a group ofpeople who are committed really
smart and do a great job.
I was very fortunate.
during my time as president, Ialways had a very supportive,
(08:45):
board of trustees who understoodthe community college and
understood that we had aregional, mission to serve 16
counties and five bigcommunities.
I always had.
Great faculty and great staffwho were able to take
opportunities and turn them intonew programs and great things
for our communities.
So you're right.
M.
A.
C.
Grew much beyond just Moberly.
(09:06):
We have five campuses ofsignificant size.
We're in Moberly MexicoKirksville columbia and
hannibal.
all those communities have afull service MACC campus and we
have a big online presence wehave our early college presence
in columbia with columbia publicschools, but a very large dual
credit program throughout ourwhole service region, so You're
(09:27):
right.
We served a whole region andThat has been a great
opportunity for us It createdchallenges for us.
One of the challenges youalluded to was the funding The
way community colleges arefunded is you get support from
the state of missouri publicfunds a tax base to support the
college.
And then the tuition and feemoney you get from your students
and then some smaller auxiliarythings like dorms.
(09:49):
And MACC is an old institutionwe've been around since 1927.
our taxing district is justMoberly with the public schools
in Moberly, so we don't have ahuge tax base like many other
community colleges so thatcreated challenges for us that
also means that these othercommunities students have a
different tuition rate So theyhave out of district tuition and
fees whereas just has indistrict tuition and fees But
(10:11):
our job was to serve everywhere.
And so that meant creatingprograms everywhere that was
probably The biggest challengeand maybe the biggest part of a
legacy that people would noticeabout Macc during that Tenure
that I had of 11 years is wereally expanded programs.
RANDY HOST (10:27):
I think some of the people that listen to this
particularly if they're locallyor from regional part in
missouri you're expansion ofdual credit for high school
students, I think that'ssomething that's probably
immeasurable but it's been huge.
JEFF (10:42):
Yeah, it allowed us to have great relationships with
the school districts in ourservice region it allowed us to
Create a great scenario like incolumbia where we actually have
an early college and havestudents in the columbia school
district graduate with theirassociate's degree at the same
time they graduate with theirhigh school Diploma one of the
things where the credit isreally due to the staff that are
doing that program there'sSomething called nacep
(11:03):
accreditation that you can getfor dual credit programs It's
one of the more challengingthings i've ever witnessed in
terms of being able to meet thestandards to have that
accreditation But when you cansay you're nacep accredited it
indicates that the dual creditis of high quality we've had
nacep accreditation for a longtime, and that's because of the
work of the deans, and thedirectors, and the faculty who
(11:26):
did all the work to make thathappen.
RANDY HOST (11:28):
And, with working with some of those people
through the years, I know theirstruggle, because, sometimes we
thought it wasn't moving quiteas quickly as we would like.
But, they stayed with it, andthey did a fantastic job.
JEFF (11:38):
The dual credit programs are something that, the college
is really proud of.
RANDY HOST (11:41):
They should be.
And, uh, a personal thank you,I've got three daughters that,
access that and, considerablesavings than when they have gone
on to further their studies, soappreciate that very much.
I want to shift gears a littlebit and really focus on this
thing about legacy.
Sometimes I tell people that noone is ever doing things of
(12:04):
significance on their own.
For most people that have thetype of success and the legacy
that you're leaving, there weresome people that you're standing
on their shoulders.
Talk about some of those peoplethat were very influential for
you and gave you some of thosefundamental tools and some of
those philosophies and treatingpeople and working with people
(12:25):
that did help you have the levelof success that you did.
JEFF (12:28):
you're right.
We stand on the shoulders ofpeople who were there before us
and the people who were there atthe same time as us.
I had the fortune.
To work for a lot of reallystrong leaders for example the
president of the college when Ibecame employed at the college.
Evelyn Jorgensen was a greatmentor for me.
She was a great leader at macc.
The college did very well underher leadership.
(12:50):
I learned a lot working with herthat helped me along the way I
didn't work directly with, Dr.
Komar, but he was at the collegebefore.
Dr.
Jorgensen, so the college hasbeen very fortunate.
He was a great leader and had ahuge impact the college is
fortunate that they've had goodpeople in those positions The
board of trustees has alwaysbeen very strong but it's all
(13:11):
the other folks that carry thewater.
Really?
All the staff.
One of the things I learned, Icame to the college as a faculty
member and I thought faculty arethe most important thing here,
right?
Because we're the ones in theclassroom.
We're the ones doing the realjob of a college and as I
learned more and went intoadministration I realized It's
really staff that are just asimportant as anybody else here
and this college could notfunction without the staff
(13:32):
student services financial aidis important having the
facilities in great shapeEverything and so it's really a
whole package and if you don'thave people committed in all of
those areas I got to see people,lead in ways that helped to
create a positive culture wherepeople felt valued, where people
understood that leadership knowsthat what they do is really
important.
(13:52):
And if they don't do it well,our students and our communities
would not thrive.
Lots of good leaders I got towork for, probably my background
in mental health didn't hurt.
I got to work with a lot ofpeople in my training in that
area too, professors that Iremember Who just treated people
well, and that's what I alwayssaw growing up my dad was a
methodist minister.
(14:13):
So I got to see him in hischurches growing up and see how
he treated people see how hemanaged that aspect of being a
preacher that is more than justbeing in the pulpit on sundays,
if you pay attention, you justlearn.
I think all these leadershipskills are transferable
regardless of where you are.
And I had a lot of good modelsthat I was able to learn from
(14:35):
and continue to do what I saw.
RANDY HOST (14:36):
Very good.
So, Obviously, when you comefrom that lineage and that type
of approach, you're probablyalways looking for people to
push up.
What was your role, how did yougo about mentoring young leaders
and emerging leaders, notnecessarily those that were
associated with youprofessionally but how did you
go about doing that?
Cause I know you've poured intoothers as well.
JEFF (14:58):
I appreciate, the question that to me, that's really
important and it's really fun.
I really enjoyed any time that Iwould form a professional
relationship with someone whereI was able to maybe mentor them,
and in some instances give themopportunities, and see them work
their way, through differentjobs basically promotions and
(15:18):
moving into positions ofleadership.
I think you just treat them theway you would want them to treat
others.
And they get experienced by,Having the opportunity to work
with a leader
RANDY HOST (15:30):
caught not taught.
JEFF (15:31):
I guess if I would say what I consider to be one of my
strengths I do think I have agood eye for a person that's
going to be effective andsuccessful I was able to
identify people Give them whatthey need to be successful and
then get out of their way.
And let them grow and become,very successful people.
RANDY HOST (15:49):
I'm sure someplace in there, there may have been a
difficult situation, a difficultcoaching situation, performance
situation.
Talk a little bit about dealingwith those kinds of tough
things, because a lot of timeswe don't necessarily like to
have those tough conversations,do those tough things,
JEFF (16:05):
actually the term you used is the term I use, which is
tough conversations.
And it's tough conversations youdon't sometimes, Even want to
have with the high performerwho's doing really well Because
the last thing you want to do ismake that person feel like oh,
he doesn't think i'm doing amistake people make too often is
they avoid a tough conversationthat needs to happen because
(16:25):
They just don't want to havethat tough conversation.
I always have thoseconversations and I think you
can have them successfully ifyou have a good relationship
with the person you're about tohave it with.
And if they know you're going tobe honest and fair with them and
hear them out I would go into atough conversation with the
(16:46):
mindset of, I could be Notseeing part of the picture here.
So I have to be open minded andmaybe I'll think differently
after they have a chance torespond that happened over some
instances where in the course ofhaving one of these
conversations, somebody openedmy eyes to something that I
wasn't necessarily aware of.
RANDY HOST (17:03):
Sure.
JEFF (17:03):
But I guess it boils down to Randy.
I think you have to be reallyprepared.
You have to know what it is youwant to share.
You have to be able to do so ina way that hopefully it is a
growth experience for them.
And the whole point is not thatthis tough conversation is the
end of something.
It's just part of theprogression.
So I'm not talking about thetimes where, we're reaching a
failure point I just think it'simportant to have them, but I
think a lot of times peopledon't like to have them.
RANDY HOST (17:25):
I agree.
In my first episode, with DavidNivens, the theme was be the
bison, and I learned a storyabout the bison bison, when a
storm comes up, get in a herdcharge into the storm and run
through it, cattle.
On the other hand.
Get a little spooky.
They scatter sometimes.
They try to run from the storm.
Sometimes they spend more timein the heat, the bad, the
(17:46):
danger, because They didn't meetthe thing head on.
When I heard that story for thefirst time, it really lit me up.
I said, what a good example ofsometimes avoiding those tough
conversations or thinkingthey're going to go away.
And if we'll just meet them headon, so much better result, so
much better for everybody.
JEFF (18:04):
That's a good frame.
I had not heard before.
I have no doubt if you don'thave the hard conversations that
eventually, something will,
RANDY HOST (18:13):
conversation probably coming at some point.
JEFF (18:15):
So just have to do it, but if you have the right culture
and people trust you and as aleader, you're consistent and
you're trustworthy then they'reopen to it.
Sure.
But I never was a screamer,never a yeller.
I don't think that works.
RANDY HOST (18:28):
I can't imagine you doing that.
You have such a kind demeanorand a calming effect on people.
It's always contagious.
The name of this podcast islead, learn, laugh, and grow
what part of lightness, humor,enjoyment was a part of your
leadership style?
And how did you do that?
Maybe in today's context, itshould be called work life
(18:49):
balance.
In our generation, when we werecoming up, that was not a
concept that you would have evenconsidered in work and in
leadership, but it definitelyis.
What role is that lightness,that being able to find some
lightness in the work, that'shard.
JEFF (19:01):
You have to have a sense of humor.
And I think, for me it was likethe President's Council.
So, it's the Deans and theDirectors, and it's the people
you work with most closely on adaily basis.
these are the people that youwork with when something has
just gone wrong.
It may not sound like it makessense, but sometimes that's when
the humor really came outbecause that's how you have to
survive those things, and so youjust have to see the humor in
(19:23):
some bad situations sometimes.
And I think part of the reasonthat I feel like we got along as
well as we did is because we didsee humor in things.
There are some things that arenot funny ever, the phone call
at 1230 that's coming fromsomeone, which, it's not a good
call.
You might start off with just alittle humorous, response it's
good to hear from you.
(19:43):
Yeah.
But we just had a lot of fun.
At times and I think you justhave to have a sense of humor
about things accreditation, forexample is one of the biggest
challenges that an institutioncan go through It's a ton of
work And I remember peopleleading accreditation usually
try to come up with some funthings related to accreditation?
It's hard to say fun andaccreditation in the same
sentence, but they did it, theywould come up with activities
(20:04):
and things that we would do thatwould somehow, be actually fun
and still make the point of whatit was we were trying to
consider.
RANDY HOST (20:10):
Part of your job was always, learning.
Talk about learning and how areyou still learning, even in a
different role, even in adifferent pace in life?
JEFF (20:19):
If you had asked me the question, what was maybe the
most important lesson youlearned along the way?
RANDY HOST (20:24):
That's a great question.
JEFF (20:25):
Here's what I figured out.
I learned from absolutelyeveryone that I worked with.
Once I figured that out, thatwas huge for me.
Because there were lots ofpeople a lot of times that would
be saying things maybe youdidn't want to hear.
But if I listened I would learnsomething.
There were people who hadcompletely different
backgrounds, differentperspectives than me.
The more I understood, I didn'tknow enough.
(20:46):
And so I looked at every singleperson, regardless of how I
worked with them as somebodythat could teach me if I would
just listen to them and thatserved me really well.
And so that's still how Iapproach my life that I just
know If I pay attention, there'salways something to learn.
In terms of, am I still tryingto learn, things that are
(21:08):
relevant in higher education andrelevant in my discipline?
I listen to podcasts.
I still read.
I still try to keep up onwhatever the, Newest technology
is impacting whatever theParticular discipline or thing
I'm interested in I would domyself a big disservice if I
stopped learning or if I stoppedattempting to learn the lesson I
learned early on is I can learnfrom everybody And I think too
(21:32):
many people think they alreadygot things figured out, and I
don't know what I can learn fromthat person.
They're missing out.
RANDY HOST (21:38):
I would agree with you.
And as you're talking aboutthat, sometimes when you think
about dynamics of teams andorganizations, sometimes you
have some of those that a bit ofa detractor and when you're in
it, it's like golly, I wish theywould just be a little bit
different, but I was thinkingabout one of those scenarios
that I had and probably the mostdifficult person in that group.
I started thinking about it andthere were things I was better
(21:59):
at because I knew I would haveto get quizzed or checked.
So in essence, while I thoughtthat was difficult in the long
run, the long haul, it wasmaking me better because I was
having to dig in, I was havingto learn some things that maybe
I could have gotten by with justan easier answer with the other
group, but there was a reverseaccountability built in that,
was meaningful.
JEFF (22:19):
I think you described what I was trying to say maybe better
than I did the contrarian personsometimes if you tune them out
and you don't hear them anymoreyou still should be listening
because pretty often they'resaying something and they're
right It may not be something wewant to hear or a strength
necessarily, but it's somethingwe need to hear.
RANDY HOST (22:34):
Another thing I learned in that process too it's
not that they necessarily alwayswanted to be right, they just
wanted to be heard, I rememberthere was a time while I was
still at the Career Center andWe had some uproars with some of
our faculty and we were tryingto work through that.
at the end of that school year Isaid, Okay, I'm going to invite
everybody in.
We're going to schedule 30minutes.
Here are three questions I'mgoing to ask you and then it's
(22:57):
open.
What went well this year?
What didn't go so well?
How can I better assist you indoing your work?
I had a contrarian come in andshe had A legal pad with her we
went through what went good, hada lot that didn't go so well.
And then there were severalpages of things that I could do.
And it was like, oh boy.
JEFF (23:18):
Yeah.
RANDY HOST (23:18):
As I listened to her I realized she just wanted to be
heard.
I told her at the end, Iappreciate you sharing this.
But the bottom line is, that'stoo much homework for me.
But I do think I, and I'dwritten down about three things
that I thought I could manage.
said, here are three things outof that.
I'm gonna focus on that Is thatokay with you?
(23:40):
She goes, yeah, she's okay I didthat after that year twice, at
the end of the first semesterand then at the end.
So we get to our winter breakcheck in And, she made it, she
was first one to make herappointment.
Comes in, she didn't have herpad.
And we sat down, we startedtalking, and, went through, the
things that were going better,whole lot more to share things
that weren't going so well,almost shrank.
(24:02):
What can I do better?
She goes, keep doing thosethings that you committed to
last year.
I love them.
Thank you.
JEFF (24:07):
Yeah.
RANDY HOST (24:08):
consequently our relationship.
became very good, there weresome things she was dealing with
on a personal level that shechose to share with me, a good
reminder that the contrarian, alot of what they have to say, Is
valid.
It's just not always the way inwhich we want to receive it.
Yeah, and that was a big one forme and I carried that process
From then on out I wanted to dothat type of listening in those
(24:31):
type conversations
JEFF (24:32):
I think the key is the person has to Sincerely believe
you're interested in what theyhave to say even if you can't
Make some changes they wouldlike to see they understand that
they've been heard And why youcan't do what it is that they
would like to see I think thatgoes a long way and that can be
a challenge because people don'tthink you're sincere and they
roll their eyes.
Oh, they're asking us again.
What do we think?
The hard part is doing it in away that they believe you're
(24:54):
sincere and then doing what yousaid one of the things that I
would say was true for me ispeople would let me know what
they thought to the point thatsome people would say, Wow.
Anybody can come in and just layinto you if they want to.
Not that it happened that often,but people were pretty
comfortable telling me what theythought.
RANDY HOST (25:10):
Great spot to be in.
All right, Jeff, if you had,three key points for, emerging
leaders that are struggling,still wanting to grow what are
three magic bullets from JeffLashley that you would give
those folks?
JEFF (25:23):
You have to really be yourself.
It's not about playing a role.
You have the task that's beenassigned to you, but you have to
be genuine.
You have to really be who youare because I think people can
see when that's not the case.
if you're genuine with people,you get a lot more grace from
them and they know you're goingto treat them well.
They know you're going to treatthem fairly.
(25:44):
So I think you got to beyourself.
I don't know if this ties intothe leadership question as much,
but this is what I would say toa younger version of myself I
say the point of the journey isnot to arrive.
It's the journey.
I didn't come up with that, butthat's a quote I've always
liked.
I am struck by, and I bet youare too, as two guys who are
newly retired, how fast this allwent by.
(26:06):
There were too many times that Iwas looking ahead and not
looking at right now andappreciating it and enjoying it.
As much as I could have becauseit was really fun, for the most
part, every bit of it issomething I would do all over
again if I had the chance and itgoes by so, so fast and I
enjoyed it.
I really did, but I would justsay, if you're earlier in your
(26:27):
career and all you're thinkingabout is I want to get four
points down the road, that'sreally where I want to be.
What I would say to you, thatjourney is as much fun as, It's
going to be when you get thereEnjoy the moment as much as you
can So as you're a developingleader, who really has these
aspirations and has this plan ofwhere they want to end up that
may be a great plan and whereyou want to end up enjoy that
(26:49):
journey because it's really fun.
I had as much fun along the wayas I did when I was at the
pinnacle, where I was thepresident of an institution.
It was just as great Everywherealong the way.
sometimes we're too focused onthe end goal Understanding that
you have it all along the wayjust recognize it and enjoy it.
RANDY HOST (27:10):
That's Excellent, and I would agree with you, I
think you're probably a littlemore emotionally mature than I
was, because, it's only been inthe last, 10 or 12 years that
I've really figured that outbetter, I had glimpses of it all
the way along, but, in that timeframe, it was okay I've climbed
some ladders.
I've gotten some wrongs, I got alittle bit more serious about,
(27:31):
hey, who can I help get up theirladder?
JEFF (27:33):
Yeah.
RANDY HOST (27:33):
that's when I really started thinking about legacy
leadership because I had ayoung, leader that I'd been
mentoring and they needed somehelp they called and said, well,
I need some help.
And they said, when's this thingdue?
What's your project due?
they said, a couple days fromnow.
I said, I'll be right there.
I went over and we workedthrough it.
they just said you leaddifferently than a lot of
people.
And you pour in more.
(27:53):
And they said, It's because,when I think back, I had people
that did that.
they're the people that have themost impact on me.
Started with my dad.
But I had some guys like ColonelBob Bray, Boy, talk about
somebody that cared about myprogress, my career, my growth,
I think that is so importantthat we do take a little time to
smell the flowers because we getreal competitive trying to make
(28:15):
those benchmarks, make thoserungs on the ladder, climbing
that.
And, there's a lot to be enjoyedalong the way.
JEFF (28:21):
Yeah.
And one other thing I believe Ilearned, and I hope I practiced
well, is don't take, People forgranted who are working hard and
doing really well.
They need to hear that as muchas the person or, too often I
think we say, okay, here are myproblems.
I'm going to focus on that.
I got to get this person, helpthem straighten out.
And then your stars your peoplewho just do it and they're
(28:44):
amazing.
How much they've contributed tothe success they have to hear
it.
They have to know how much youValue what they're doing how
much you recognize it and knowso don't forget the people
around you the people that areperforming really well Never
forget about taking time toappreciate them because they
need it too and it's reallyimportant.
RANDY HOST (29:04):
Absolutely.
I study John Maxwell a lot hetalks about That 80 20 concept
and
JEFF (29:09):
Yeah,
RANDY HOST (29:10):
if you're spending 80 percent of your time on The
80 percent that aren'tperforming, you're not going to
get a lot of results.
But if you spend 80 percent onthat 20 that are performers and
highly motivated, it acceleratesso much.
And then it also has that effectto bring some of that middle
along with it.
Sadly if we read, some of thework that, Gallup has done on,
(29:32):
workforce engagement, there'salmost a third, 25 percent to a
third of the people inorganizations that are actively
disengaged.
I felt like I was getting a lotmore out of leadership when I
stopped trying to fix all ofthem.
JEFF (29:46):
Yeah.
RANDY HOST (29:47):
Because.
Sometimes there's not enoughresources.
There's not enough time.
But shift that up to that groupthat really is gonna go and
everything you give them,compound it and multiply it.
Had that great change for kindof that middle group that was
just waiting to see.
They responded well, it's beengreat talking with you.
I love to hear that you're doingwell and retirement's doing good
(30:07):
things for you you're stillactive and contributing because
you have so much to contribute.
Jeff, thank you for joining metoday.
JEFF (30:13):
It was fun.
We used to get to do this,because our jobs got us together
and yes, we'll have to figureout a way.
Not that I, need to be a regularguest on your podcast, but we
could still go out to lunch.
RANDY HOST (30:23):
Absolutely.
I don't know how this thing isgoing to add up and all of that.
I do want to circle back aroundto people that are on it.
I want to do some larger grouppanels
JEFF (30:32):
I appreciate you having me here.
It was one of my days when I gotup, I had something to do.
Besides be retired.
RANDY HOST (30:38):
Glad I could keep you in the game.
Great to be with you, Jeff.
Thank you.
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