July 6, 2025 • 17 mins
The digital landscape is undergoing a profound transformation. Millions of online searches now end without a single click as AI-generated answers satisfy users' needs instantly. For brands and marketers, this shift represents both an existential challenge and a remarkable opportunity.
Welcome to the age of Generative Engine Optimization (GEO) – where being visible online means being cited directly by AI systems rather than simply ranking well in search results. With 58% of US searches resulting in zero clicks and 42% of AI users relying on platforms like ChatGPT for product discovery, traditional SEO strategies alone no longer guarantee digital visibility.
Drawing on expert insights from Don Phelps, a pioneer in this emerging field, we explore the practical strategies that enable content to thrive in AI-first environments. From structuring content for optimal AI comprehension (clear HTML hierarchy, Q&A formats, conversational language) to building trust signals that convince AI of your authority (properly tagged quotations, statistics, credible citations), we break down the technical and strategic elements of successful GEO implementation. You'll discover why schema markup matters more than ever, how off-page signals influence AI trust, and what fundamental shifts in content strategy can position your brand as the authoritative voice in AI-generated answers.
As we look toward a future of multimodal AI that processes text, images, video, and audio simultaneously, one thing becomes clear: GEO isn't just another marketing tactic – it's a complete mindset shift that will determine which brands thrive and which fade into digital obscurity in the coming years. The question isn't whether you'll optimize for AI, but how effectively you'll do it. What steps will you take today to ensure your content becomes the trusted source for the next generation of answers?
Thanks for tuning in to Local SEO Unlocked! If you enjoyed today’s episode, don’t forget to subscribe, leave a review, and share it with others who want to master Local SEO. Stay connected with us weekly for more insights on SEO! Until next time, keep optimizing and stay ahead in local search!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Deep Dive.
Today, we're really plungingheadfirst into something big.
It's well.
It's fundamentally reshapinghow we all get information
online.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Yeah, absolutely.
We're talking about generativeengine optimization GEO.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
Exactly GEO.
And you know, think about it,you search for something and
instead of just links, boom.
The AI gives you the perfectanswer.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
And maybe it cites your brand directly.
That's the goal.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
That's the new reality we're diving into.
So this deep dive, it's allabout understanding what geo
actually is, why it's suddenlyso critical for you know online
visibility and, reallyimportantly, how you can make
sure your content gets seen,gets used by these new AI
systems.
Right, we've pulled together alot of expert insights for this.
Practical, practical guides too.
We're featuring quite a bitfrom Don Phelps.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Oh yeah, Don Phelps, a real veteran in SEO and now a
leader in this AI-driven searchspace.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
For sure His research , his practical work on GEO
strategies.
It's really helping brands stayvisible when AI answers are
becoming, well, the main waypeople find stuff.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
It's a massive shift.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
So our mission today?
Basically give you a shortcutto understanding this huge move
from traditional SEO to GEO, soyou can adapt, you know, thrive
in this AI first world.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
And what's truly fascinating here, I think, is
that we're talking about acomplete paradigm shift, like a
whole new way of thinking.
It's not just about ranking andsearch results anymore.
It's about actually being theanswer that the AI delivers.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Being the answer.
That's a really powerful way toput it.
So okay, let's tackle the bigquestion first.
Why GEO?
Now, what's actually changedfrom good old SEO?
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Well, traditional SEO , the stuff we've been doing for
years that was all aboutgetting visibility in the SRPs,
the search engine results pages.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Uh-huh.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
Keywords links Exactly Keywords links, trying
to rank high so people clickthrough to your website.
Simple enough, right?
But GEO targets somethingtotally different.
It's about getting your contentcited or summarized or just
surfaced directly in those AIanswers you know from Google's
AI overviews chat, gpt, bing,copilot, things like that.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Got it.
So less about the click, moreabout being used in the answer.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Precisely, and Don Phelps's core insight here is
just critical.
He points out that millions,literally millions of searches.
They don't end in a clickanymore.
Instead, people just get the AIresponse and they're done so.
If your content isn't cited orused there, you're basically
invisible where decisions areactually being made now hmm,
(02:33):
it's like the difference betweenbeing listed in the
bibliography versus being quoteddirectly in the papers.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Summary that's a great analogy and that shift
from click, to quote.
Wow the data.
The data really backed it up.
Our sources show like 58% of USsearches zero clicks.
Now 58%.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
That's staggering.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
It really is.
More than half the time peopleget what they need without
visiting a single website.
And it's not just that usersare getting answers this way 60%
of users now expect AI results.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
They expect it.
It's becoming the norm.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
Yeah, and get this 42% of AI users rely on things
like chat, gpt for productdiscovery.
That's huge for businesses.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
Absolutely, and we're seeing the impact already.
Organic traffic is down,sometimes as much as 25% for
certain brands, just because AIsummaries are replacing those
traditional blue links 25%,that's a serious hit.
It is, and the implication ispretty stark Brands that don't
adapt, they risk just vanishing,becoming invisible online.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Right.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Don Phelps puts it bluntly.
He says we're not justoptimizing for search engines
anymore, we're optimizing forthe systems that summarize the
internet.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Summarize the internet.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
Yeah, he adds if we're not present in those
summaries, we don't exist.
In the new search paradigm, theAI is essentially the new home
page for a huge chunk ofsearches.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
OK, so for you listening, what does this all
mean?
It means you've got to shiftyour content strategy.
You need to ensure your brandbecomes the source gets cited by
AI, even if people never clickyour link.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
Because that kind of placement being cited by the AI,
it builds trust authority brandrecall probably faster than any
old link could.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
It's about becoming that trusted voice inside the
machine.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
Okay, the why is crystal clear.
Now Urgent even so, let's getpractical.
How do we actually do this?
What are the core strategiesfrom Don Phelps, from the other
sources, to make content AIready?
Speaker 2 (04:26):
All right, let's dig in.
The first big piece is content,structure and readability.
This is like absolutelyfundamental for AI models to
easily process and well reuseyour information.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Okay, structure and readability.
Why is that so critical for anAI?
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Think of the AI as this super efficient librarian,
maybe a bit impatient it doesn'thave time to decode messy,
poorly organized stuff.
Oh, okay.
So structured writing isn'tjust nice to have, it's
basically a requirement for theAI to even consider your content
as a reliable source.
It's the difference betweengetting found and just being
ignored.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
Makes sense.
So what does good structurelook like for AI?
Speaker 2 (05:02):
Well, these generative engines, they really
favor clear, fluent, structuredwriting.
Messy, overly complex stuff, itmight just get skipped.
So the advice is write forfluency and readability.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Tools, maybe Like Grammarly.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
Yeah, tools like Grammarly or Hemingway can help
simplify your language and,crucially, follow a clean HTML
hierarchy.
That's like giving the AI aclear table of contents for your
page.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
You mean like H1, H2 tags?
Speaker 2 (05:27):
Exactly 1H1 for the main title, then H2s for main
sections, h3s for subsectionsand so on.
Don't skip levels, like goingfrom an H2 straight to an H4.
That confuses things.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
Got it, keep it.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Logical like going from an H2 straight to an H4.
That confuses things, got it?
Keep it logical, right, andbreak your ideas into short
paragraphs Two to four lines max, ideally Much easier to digest,
and definitely definitely avoidkeyword stuffing.
Ai is way past that.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Okay, short paragraphs, no stuffing, what
else?
Speaker 2 (05:54):
AI-optimized content often works really well in a Q&A
format or an answer-firstformat Directly answer common
questions people ask.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Like an FAQ section.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
Precisely Don Phelps' research actually shows a
really strong link betweenwell-structured FAQs and getting
included more often in thingslike Google's AI overviews.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Interesting.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
And finally write in natural conversational language
Mirror how real people talk andask questions.
Use those longer, moreconversational keywords people
actually type or speak.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
That makes total sense.
The AI is trying to sound human, so our content should probably
meet it halfway right.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Exactly You're trying to make it easy for the AI to
understand and to repurposenaturally.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Okay, so we make it easy to understand, but how do
we convince the AI that ourcontent is actually trustworthy?
How does it decide what tobelieve?
Speaker 2 (06:37):
Ah, that's the next crucial piece Building trust and
authority.
It's huge AI models.
They really value factualaccuracy and credible sources.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
So EEAT again experience, expertise,
authoritativeness, trust.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Absolutely.
Eeat is maybe even moreimportant for GEO than it was
for traditional SEO.
The AI acts like a supermeticulous fact checker.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
Okay, so how do we signal that trustworthiness?
Speaker 2 (07:04):
For starters, including quotations and
statistics.
This is interesting.
Speaker 1 (07:12):
The source material suggests this alone can boost
performance by up to 40%.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
40%, wow just from quotes and stats.
Yeah, it seems so.
It's not just about what yousay, but how you back it up, how
you prove it to the AI.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
So how do we format those?
Does it matter?
Speaker 2 (07:21):
It does seem to, the advice is to add source-ready
quotes using specific HTML tagslike block quote for longer
quotes or queue for shorterinline ones.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
Okay, like actually tagging the quote itself.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Right.
For example, qai will reshapeevery industry within five years
.
Dot Q, ceo, acme, ai and usetags like strong or M for key
data points to make them standout.
Speaker 1 (07:44):
Make the numbers pop for the AI.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
Exactly.
Numbers add weight, make itfeel factually grounded.
Especially important in fieldslike law, finance, health.
You get the idea Like,according to the WHO, strong
over 70% of the globalpopulation, strong will live in
urban areas by 2050.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Ah, I see.
Using the tags isn't justvisual, it's semantic.
It tells the AI this bit isimportant data, or this is a
direct quote.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
You got it.
It's like giving the AI clearlabels.
Then they're citing reliablesources.
This is fundamental.
Ges prefer content that linksout to credible places.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
Like government sites Studies.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Yeah, government sites, academic studies,
reputable publishers, usestandard links or maybe the site
tags specifically for citations, like according to WHO, 70% of
people will live in cities by2050.
And maybe link WHO to theirofficial site.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
Okay, makes sense.
What about authority signals onthe page itself?
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Good point.
Authoritative signals, thingslike clear author information,
published dates, timestamps forupdates these all matter, plus
having clear about contact andprivacy policy pages Basic trust
stuff, but important for AI too.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
And what about off-page stuff like PR?
Speaker 2 (08:52):
Yes, digital PR and external mentions Summarization
tools often pull info from pressreleases.
Media coverage awards yourcompany might have won.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
So having a press page is actually useful for GEO.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Definitely Post a press page or newsroom on your
site Link out to articles whereyou've been featured interviews
you've given.
Don Phelps really emphasizesbuilding that brand credibility
offsite too.
How often your brand is citedelsewhere seems to be a strong
signal for inclusion in AIanswers.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
Fascinating.
So it's about making it easyfor the AI to understand us,
easy for it to trust us, almostlike building a case providing
evidence for the machine.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
That's a really good way to think about it.
Evidence-based content.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
But OK, even the best , most trustworthy content, it's
useless if the AI can'ttechnically get to it right.
So what about the technicalside, the nuts and bolts?
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Right, you need solid technical foundations.
It's all about making sure AIcan technically access and
efficiently process your content.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
First up.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
Structured data, also known as schemaorg markup.
This one sounds technical, butit's super important.
Speaker 1 (09:55):
Beema.
Okay, break that down.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
Think of it like adding hidden labels to your
content that explicitly tell theAI what things are Not just
words, but concepts.
Is this an article, a product,a person?
An FAQ section?
Speaker 1 (10:09):
Ah, like metadata for the AI.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
Exactly, yeah.
Generative engines use thisstructured data to grasp the
context and pull out facts moreaccurately.
So you'd use schemaorg tags forarticle, person, organization,
faq page, how-to product,whatever fits your content.
And how do you add that?
Usually using a format calledJSON-LD.
It's a standardized way toembed these labels on your page,
(10:31):
and definitely use Google'srich results test tool to make
sure you've set it up correctly.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
Okay, so schema first , what's next?
Speaker 2 (10:37):
Optimize meta descriptions and titles.
These are still crucial.
They're like the AI's firstimpression, helping it quickly
understand your page's mainpoint or intent.
Speaker 1 (10:46):
So write good titles and descriptions still matters.
Speaker 2 (10:48):
Still matters.
You can even use AI tools likeChatGPT to help draft unique,
concise meta descriptions, maybe150, 160 characters, that
really nail the key value.
Make sure your title tag, yourmeta name description tag, are
solid and open graph tags toogtitle.
Ogdescription for socialsharing appearance MELANIE.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
WARRICK Got it.
What else on the technicalchecklist?
Speaker 2 (11:09):
MARK MIRCHANDANI Page speed and core web vitals.
Speed matters a lot.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
MELANIE WARRICK why, for AI, does it get impatient
too?
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Huh, maybe, but seriously, fast loading content
is favored AI systems, just likeus, prioritize good user
experience.
Key things to watch are firstcontentful paint how fast stuff
appears, largest contentfulpaint, how fast the main thing
loads.
And cumulative layout shift.
Does the page jump aroundannoyingly?
Yeah, Faster, more stable pages, signal quality.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
Okay, speed.
What else Quick hits?
Speaker 2 (11:39):
All right, quick list Canonical URLs tell the AI
which page is the main one ifyou have similar content.
Avoids duplicate issues.
Https, secure connection.
It's a basic trust signal now,non-negotiable, really Right.
Mobile friendly, responsivedesign.
Critical Google uses mobilefirst indexing, meaning it looks
at your mobile site first.
If it's bad on mobile, ai mightignore it too.
(12:01):
Rick says alt text on all yourimages Describe what's in the
image.
Good for accessibility.
Traditional SEO and for thesenewer multimodal AIs that can
understand images Good point,multimodal.
And finally, internal linkingLinking related pages together
on your own site helps AIunderstand your topic.
Clusters how your contentconnects and make sure it can
find all your valuable deepercontent.
(12:22):
Builds a map for the AI.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
Wow, okay, that's a comprehensive list.
It really covers a lot, fromcontent structure to deep
technical details, which bringsup a big question how does all
this GEO stuff fit with what wealready know about traditional
SEO?
Are we throwing SEO out?
Is GEO replacing it, or what'sthe relationship?
Speaker 2 (12:43):
That's a great question and a really important
clarification.
No, GEO absolutely does notreplace traditional SEO.
It builds on it.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
Builds on it.
How so?
Speaker 2 (12:52):
Think of it like this Traditional SEO is mostly about
discoverability making suresearch engines and now large
language models can actuallyfind your content in the vast
ocean of the Internet.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
Okay, SEO gets you found.
Speaker 2 (13:02):
Right.
Geo is about selection Onceyour content is found.
Geo is about making sure the AIengine chooses your content,
trusts it and cites it as theauthoritative answer.
Discoverability first, thenselection.
Speaker 1 (13:15):
Ah okay.
Seo opens the door.
Geo convinces the AI to quoteyou.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
That's a good way to put it.
Seo opens the door.
Geo convinces the AI, to quoteyou.
That's a good way to put it.
Don Phelps' research actuallybreaks down how these AI engines
process content, which helpssee the difference.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Okay, what are the steps?
Speaker 2 (13:27):
First, crawling and parsing, basic technical
accessibility.
If a crawler can't get to yourpage, ai won't either.
That's classic SEO territory.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
Step one be accessible.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
Step two ranking and relevance.
Things like authority, e-e-a-tfreshness they influence whether
your content is even consideredrelevant enough.
Again, overlaps heavily withSEO principles.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
Okay, relevance and authority.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Step three, summarization, and here's where
GEO really kicks in.
The AI isn't just linking, it'ssynthesizing an answer,
creating new text based on yourcontent.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
It's actively using the information.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
Exactly.
And step four, presentation.
The AI presents the answer innatural language, you know,
without even showing the sourcelink prominently up front.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Right, you just get the answer.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
So this whole process , especially steps three and
four, demands content that's notjust keyword rich, but
semantically rich, fact denseuses that structured data we
talked about, speaks in naturallanguage and is also visible on
platforms where LLMs learn andcross-reference info.
So, yeah, your website, butalso maybe places like Reddit,
quora, trusted news sites, ifyour brand gets mentioned there
(14:38):
credibly.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
It's really fascinating how much it boiled
down to the AI understanding,meaning and trustworthiness.
Isn't it Not just matchingkeywords?
It feels much moresophisticated.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
It absolutely is.
It's a shift from optimizingfor query strings to optimizing
for comprehension and synthesis.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
So, looking ahead, where does this go?
What's the future of GEO,according to Don Phelps and
others?
Speaker 2 (15:01):
Well, the prediction is that GDO will keep evolving
rapidly.
One big area is multimodaloptimization.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Multimodal meaning beyond just text.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Exactly AI pulling answers from your voice content,
your videos, your imagesalongside your text.
Imagine asking a question andthe AI answers by, like
describing a key part of yourinfographic or playing a
relevant clip from your podcast.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
Wow, okay, that changes things.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
Big time.
We should also anticipatehyper-personalized AI answers
tailored specifically to theuser's immediate context, their
history, maybe even theirlocation.
Speaker 1 (15:33):
Creepy, but probably useful.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Ah, potentially both.
Yeah, potentially both.
And deeper integration withthings like augmented reality,
virtual reality, search journeysstarting and ending entirely
within an AI model, maybewithout even looking at a screen
.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
So this isn't a set it and forget it kind of
optimization.
It's an ongoing journey, isn'tit?
Constant adaptation.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
Absolutely.
That's a key takeaway from DonPhelps.
He really stresses GEO isn't achecklist, it's a mindset shift.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
A mindset shift.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Yeah, it means constantly updating your
strategies, trying to understandhow machines are interpreting
your brand and your content, andfocusing on creating content
that genuinely answers questionsclearly and authoritatively,
not just content that tries torank for keywords.
It's about being helpful,concise, trustworthy.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
That feels like a good place to start wrapping up.
The core message today seemsincredibly clear Generative
engine optimization, GEO.
It's not just a buzzword.
It's fundamental to stayingrelevant now, in the age of AI.
It's about making sure yourvoice, your expertise is heard
and recognized, even as thedigital landscape shifts under
our feet.
This isn't just some passingtrend.
(16:39):
It really feels like the newoperating system for our feet.
This isn't just some passingtrend.
It really feels like the newoperating system for online
visibility.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
Well said.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Thanks so much for joining us on this deep dive
today.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
My pleasure.
And maybe just one finalthought to leave everyone with,
please.
With generative search becomingso central, the question really
isn't if you'll optimize for AIanymore.
The question is how well you'lldo it.
So what steps will you take,starting now, to make sure your
content becomes the source forthat next generation of answers?
Welcome to the Deep Dive.
Today, we're really plungingheadfirst into something big.
It's well.
It's fundamentally reshapinghow we all get information
online.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Yeah, absolutely.
We're talking about generativeengine optimization GEO.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
Exactly GEO.
And you know, think about it,you search for something and
instead of just links, boom.
The AI gives you the perfectanswer.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
And maybe it cites your brand directly.
That's the goal.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
That's the new reality we're diving into.
So this deep dive, it's allabout understanding what geo
actually is, why it's suddenlyso critical for you know online
visibility and, reallyimportantly, how you can make
sure your content gets seen,gets used by these new AI
systems.
Right, we've pulled together alot of expert insights for this.
Practical, practical guides too.
We're featuring quite a bitfrom Don Phelps.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Oh yeah, Don Phelps, a real veteran in SEO and now a
leader in this AI-driven searchspace.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
For sure His research , his practical work on GEO
strategies.
It's really helping brands stayvisible when AI answers are
becoming, well, the main waypeople find stuff.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
It's a massive shift.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
So our mission today?
Basically give you a shortcutto understanding this huge move
from traditional SEO to GEO, soyou can adapt, you know, thrive
in this AI first world.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
And what's truly fascinating here, I think, is
that we're talking about acomplete paradigm shift, like a
whole new way of thinking.
It's not just about ranking andsearch results anymore.
It's about actually being theanswer that the AI delivers.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
Being the answer.
That's a really powerful way toput it.
So okay, let's tackle the bigquestion first.
Why GEO?
Now, what's actually changedfrom good old SEO?
Speaker 2 (01:43):
Well, traditional SEO , the stuff we've been doing for
years that was all aboutgetting visibility in the SRPs,
the search engine results pages.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Uh-huh.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
Keywords links Exactly Keywords links, trying
to rank high so people clickthrough to your website.
Simple enough, right?
But GEO targets somethingtotally different.
It's about getting your contentcited or summarized or just
surfaced directly in those AIanswers you know from Google's
AI overviews chat, gpt, bing,copilot, things like that.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Got it.
So less about the click, moreabout being used in the answer.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Precisely, and Don Phelps's core insight here is
just critical.
He points out that millions,literally millions of searches.
They don't end in a clickanymore.
Instead, people just get the AIresponse and they're done so.
If your content isn't cited orused there, you're basically
invisible where decisions areactually being made now hmm,
(02:33):
it's like the difference betweenbeing listed in the
bibliography versus being quoteddirectly in the papers.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Summary that's a great analogy and that shift
from click, to quote.
Wow the data.
The data really backed it up.
Our sources show like 58% of USsearches zero clicks.
Now 58%.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
That's staggering.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
It really is.
More than half the time peopleget what they need without
visiting a single website.
And it's not just that usersare getting answers this way 60%
of users now expect AI results.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
They expect it.
It's becoming the norm.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
Yeah, and get this 42% of AI users rely on things
like chat, gpt for productdiscovery.
That's huge for businesses.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
Absolutely, and we're seeing the impact already.
Organic traffic is down,sometimes as much as 25% for
certain brands, just because AIsummaries are replacing those
traditional blue links 25%,that's a serious hit.
It is, and the implication ispretty stark Brands that don't
adapt, they risk just vanishing,becoming invisible online.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Right.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Don Phelps puts it bluntly.
He says we're not justoptimizing for search engines
anymore, we're optimizing forthe systems that summarize the
internet.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Summarize the internet.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
Yeah, he adds if we're not present in those
summaries, we don't exist.
In the new search paradigm, theAI is essentially the new home
page for a huge chunk ofsearches.
Speaker 1 (03:52):
OK, so for you listening, what does this all
mean?
It means you've got to shiftyour content strategy.
You need to ensure your brandbecomes the source gets cited by
AI, even if people never clickyour link.
Speaker 2 (04:03):
Because that kind of placement being cited by the AI,
it builds trust authority brandrecall probably faster than any
old link could.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
It's about becoming that trusted voice inside the
machine.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
Okay, the why is crystal clear.
Now Urgent even so, let's getpractical.
How do we actually do this?
What are the core strategiesfrom Don Phelps, from the other
sources, to make content AIready?
Speaker 2 (04:26):
All right, let's dig in.
The first big piece is content,structure and readability.
This is like absolutelyfundamental for AI models to
easily process and well reuseyour information.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Okay, structure and readability.
Why is that so critical for anAI?
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Think of the AI as this super efficient librarian,
maybe a bit impatient it doesn'thave time to decode messy,
poorly organized stuff.
Oh, okay.
So structured writing isn'tjust nice to have, it's
basically a requirement for theAI to even consider your content
as a reliable source.
It's the difference betweengetting found and just being
ignored.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
Makes sense.
So what does good structurelook like for AI?
Speaker 2 (05:02):
Well, these generative engines, they really
favor clear, fluent, structuredwriting.
Messy, overly complex stuff, itmight just get skipped.
So the advice is write forfluency and readability.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Tools, maybe Like Grammarly.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
Yeah, tools like Grammarly or Hemingway can help
simplify your language and,crucially, follow a clean HTML
hierarchy.
That's like giving the AI aclear table of contents for your
page.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
You mean like H1, H2 tags?
Speaker 2 (05:27):
Exactly 1H1 for the main title, then H2s for main
sections, h3s for subsectionsand so on.
Don't skip levels, like goingfrom an H2 straight to an H4.
That confuses things.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
Got it, keep it.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Logical like going from an H2 straight to an H4.
That confuses things, got it?
Keep it logical, right, andbreak your ideas into short
paragraphs Two to four lines max, ideally Much easier to digest,
and definitely definitely avoidkeyword stuffing.
Ai is way past that.
Speaker 1 (05:49):
Okay, short paragraphs, no stuffing, what
else?
Speaker 2 (05:54):
AI-optimized content often works really well in a Q&A
format or an answer-firstformat Directly answer common
questions people ask.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Like an FAQ section.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
Precisely Don Phelps' research actually shows a
really strong link betweenwell-structured FAQs and getting
included more often in thingslike Google's AI overviews.
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Interesting.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
And finally write in natural conversational language
Mirror how real people talk andask questions.
Use those longer, moreconversational keywords people
actually type or speak.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
That makes total sense.
The AI is trying to sound human, so our content should probably
meet it halfway right.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Exactly You're trying to make it easy for the AI to
understand and to repurposenaturally.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Okay, so we make it easy to understand, but how do
we convince the AI that ourcontent is actually trustworthy?
How does it decide what tobelieve?
Speaker 2 (06:37):
Ah, that's the next crucial piece Building trust and
authority.
It's huge AI models.
They really value factualaccuracy and credible sources.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
So EEAT again experience, expertise,
authoritativeness, trust.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Absolutely.
Eeat is maybe even moreimportant for GEO than it was
for traditional SEO.
The AI acts like a supermeticulous fact checker.
Speaker 1 (07:01):
Okay, so how do we signal that trustworthiness?
Speaker 2 (07:04):
For starters, including quotations and
statistics.
This is interesting.
Speaker 1 (07:12):
The source material suggests this alone can boost
performance by up to 40%.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
40%, wow just from quotes and stats.
Yeah, it seems so.
It's not just about what yousay, but how you back it up, how
you prove it to the AI.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
So how do we format those?
Does it matter?
Speaker 2 (07:21):
It does seem to, the advice is to add source-ready
quotes using specific HTML tagslike block quote for longer
quotes or queue for shorterinline ones.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
Okay, like actually tagging the quote itself.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Right.
For example, qai will reshapeevery industry within five years
.
Dot Q, ceo, acme, ai and usetags like strong or M for key
data points to make them standout.
Speaker 1 (07:44):
Make the numbers pop for the AI.
Speaker 2 (07:46):
Exactly.
Numbers add weight, make itfeel factually grounded.
Especially important in fieldslike law, finance, health.
You get the idea Like,according to the WHO, strong
over 70% of the globalpopulation, strong will live in
urban areas by 2050.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Ah, I see.
Using the tags isn't justvisual, it's semantic.
It tells the AI this bit isimportant data, or this is a
direct quote.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
You got it.
It's like giving the AI clearlabels.
Then they're citing reliablesources.
This is fundamental.
Ges prefer content that linksout to credible places.
Speaker 1 (08:15):
Like government sites Studies.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
Yeah, government sites, academic studies,
reputable publishers, usestandard links or maybe the site
tags specifically for citations, like according to WHO, 70% of
people will live in cities by2050.
And maybe link WHO to theirofficial site.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
Okay, makes sense.
What about authority signals onthe page itself?
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Good point.
Authoritative signals, thingslike clear author information,
published dates, timestamps forupdates these all matter, plus
having clear about contact andprivacy policy pages Basic trust
stuff, but important for AI too.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
And what about off-page stuff like PR?
Speaker 2 (08:52):
Yes, digital PR and external mentions Summarization
tools often pull info from pressreleases.
Media coverage awards yourcompany might have won.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
So having a press page is actually useful for GEO.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Definitely Post a press page or newsroom on your
site Link out to articles whereyou've been featured interviews
you've given.
Don Phelps really emphasizesbuilding that brand credibility
offsite too.
How often your brand is citedelsewhere seems to be a strong
signal for inclusion in AIanswers.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
Fascinating.
So it's about making it easyfor the AI to understand us,
easy for it to trust us, almostlike building a case providing
evidence for the machine.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
That's a really good way to think about it.
Evidence-based content.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
But OK, even the best , most trustworthy content, it's
useless if the AI can'ttechnically get to it right.
So what about the technicalside, the nuts and bolts?
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Right, you need solid technical foundations.
It's all about making sure AIcan technically access and
efficiently process your content.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
First up.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
Structured data, also known as schemaorg markup.
This one sounds technical, butit's super important.
Speaker 1 (09:55):
Beema.
Okay, break that down.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
Think of it like adding hidden labels to your
content that explicitly tell theAI what things are Not just
words, but concepts.
Is this an article, a product,a person?
An FAQ section?
Speaker 1 (10:09):
Ah, like metadata for the AI.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
Exactly, yeah.
Generative engines use thisstructured data to grasp the
context and pull out facts moreaccurately.
So you'd use schemaorg tags forarticle, person, organization,
faq page, how-to product,whatever fits your content.
And how do you add that?
Usually using a format calledJSON-LD.
It's a standardized way toembed these labels on your page,
(10:31):
and definitely use Google'srich results test tool to make
sure you've set it up correctly.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
Okay, so schema first , what's next?
Speaker 2 (10:37):
Optimize meta descriptions and titles.
These are still crucial.
They're like the AI's firstimpression, helping it quickly
understand your page's mainpoint or intent.
Speaker 1 (10:46):
So write good titles and descriptions still matters.
Speaker 2 (10:48):
Still matters.
You can even use AI tools likeChatGPT to help draft unique,
concise meta descriptions, maybe150, 160 characters, that
really nail the key value.
Make sure your title tag, yourmeta name description tag, are
solid and open graph tags toogtitle.
Ogdescription for socialsharing appearance MELANIE.
Speaker 1 (11:07):
WARRICK Got it.
What else on the technicalchecklist?
Speaker 2 (11:09):
MARK MIRCHANDANI Page speed and core web vitals.
Speed matters a lot.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
MELANIE WARRICK why, for AI, does it get impatient
too?
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Huh, maybe, but seriously, fast loading content
is favored AI systems, just likeus, prioritize good user
experience.
Key things to watch are firstcontentful paint how fast stuff
appears, largest contentfulpaint, how fast the main thing
loads.
And cumulative layout shift.
Does the page jump aroundannoyingly?
Yeah, Faster, more stable pages, signal quality.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
Okay, speed.
What else Quick hits?
Speaker 2 (11:39):
All right, quick list Canonical URLs tell the AI
which page is the main one ifyou have similar content.
Avoids duplicate issues.
Https, secure connection.
It's a basic trust signal now,non-negotiable, really Right.
Mobile friendly, responsivedesign.
Critical Google uses mobilefirst indexing, meaning it looks
at your mobile site first.
If it's bad on mobile, ai mightignore it too.
(12:01):
Rick says alt text on all yourimages Describe what's in the
image.
Good for accessibility.
Traditional SEO and for thesenewer multimodal AIs that can
understand images Good point,multimodal.
And finally, internal linkingLinking related pages together
on your own site helps AIunderstand your topic.
Clusters how your contentconnects and make sure it can
find all your valuable deepercontent.
(12:22):
Builds a map for the AI.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
Wow, okay, that's a comprehensive list.
It really covers a lot, fromcontent structure to deep
technical details, which bringsup a big question how does all
this GEO stuff fit with what wealready know about traditional
SEO?
Are we throwing SEO out?
Is GEO replacing it, or what'sthe relationship?
Speaker 2 (12:43):
That's a great question and a really important
clarification.
No, GEO absolutely does notreplace traditional SEO.
It builds on it.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
Builds on it.
How so?
Speaker 2 (12:52):
Think of it like this Traditional SEO is mostly about
discoverability making suresearch engines and now large
language models can actuallyfind your content in the vast
ocean of the Internet.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
Okay, SEO gets you found.
Speaker 2 (13:02):
Right.
Geo is about selection Onceyour content is found.
Geo is about making sure the AIengine chooses your content,
trusts it and cites it as theauthoritative answer.
Discoverability first, thenselection.
Speaker 1 (13:15):
Ah okay.
Seo opens the door.
Geo convinces the AI to quoteyou.
Speaker 2 (13:19):
That's a good way to put it.
Seo opens the door.
Geo convinces the AI, to quoteyou.
That's a good way to put it.
Don Phelps' research actuallybreaks down how these AI engines
process content, which helpssee the difference.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Okay, what are the steps?
Speaker 2 (13:27):
First, crawling and parsing, basic technical
accessibility.
If a crawler can't get to yourpage, ai won't either.
That's classic SEO territory.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
Step one be accessible.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
Step two ranking and relevance.
Things like authority, e-e-a-tfreshness they influence whether
your content is even consideredrelevant enough.
Again, overlaps heavily withSEO principles.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
Okay, relevance and authority.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
Step three, summarization, and here's where
GEO really kicks in.
The AI isn't just linking, it'ssynthesizing an answer,
creating new text based on yourcontent.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
It's actively using the information.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
Exactly.
And step four, presentation.
The AI presents the answer innatural language, you know,
without even showing the sourcelink prominently up front.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
Right, you just get the answer.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
So this whole process , especially steps three and
four, demands content that's notjust keyword rich, but
semantically rich, fact denseuses that structured data we
talked about, speaks in naturallanguage and is also visible on
platforms where LLMs learn andcross-reference info.
So, yeah, your website, butalso maybe places like Reddit,
quora, trusted news sites, ifyour brand gets mentioned there
(14:38):
credibly.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
It's really fascinating how much it boiled
down to the AI understanding,meaning and trustworthiness.
Isn't it Not just matchingkeywords?
It feels much moresophisticated.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
It absolutely is.
It's a shift from optimizingfor query strings to optimizing
for comprehension and synthesis.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
So, looking ahead, where does this go?
What's the future of GEO,according to Don Phelps and
others?
Speaker 2 (15:01):
Well, the prediction is that GDO will keep evolving
rapidly.
One big area is multimodaloptimization.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Multimodal meaning beyond just text.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
Exactly AI pulling answers from your voice content,
your videos, your imagesalongside your text.
Imagine asking a question andthe AI answers by, like
describing a key part of yourinfographic or playing a
relevant clip from your podcast.
Speaker 1 (15:22):
Wow, okay, that changes things.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
Big time.
We should also anticipatehyper-personalized AI answers
tailored specifically to theuser's immediate context, their
history, maybe even theirlocation.
Speaker 1 (15:33):
Creepy, but probably useful.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Ah, potentially both.
Yeah, potentially both.
And deeper integration withthings like augmented reality,
virtual reality, search journeysstarting and ending entirely
within an AI model, maybewithout even looking at a screen
.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
So this isn't a set it and forget it kind of
optimization.
It's an ongoing journey, isn'tit?
Constant adaptation.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
Absolutely.
That's a key takeaway from DonPhelps.
He really stresses GEO isn't achecklist, it's a mindset shift.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
A mindset shift.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
Yeah, it means constantly updating your
strategies, trying to understandhow machines are interpreting
your brand and your content, andfocusing on creating content
that genuinely answers questionsclearly and authoritatively,
not just content that tries torank for keywords.
It's about being helpful,concise, trustworthy.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
That feels like a good place to start wrapping up.
The core message today seemsincredibly clear Generative
engine optimization, GEO.
It's not just a buzzword.
It's fundamental to stayingrelevant now, in the age of AI.
It's about making sure yourvoice, your expertise is heard
and recognized, even as thedigital landscape shifts under
our feet.
This isn't just some passingtrend.
(16:39):
It really feels like the newoperating system for our feet.
This isn't just some passingtrend.
It really feels like the newoperating system for online
visibility.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
Well said.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
Thanks so much for joining us on this deep dive
today.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
My pleasure.
And maybe just one finalthought to leave everyone with,
please.
With generative search becomingso central, the question really
isn't if you'll optimize for AIanymore.
The question is how well you'lldo it.
So what steps will you take,starting now, to make sure your
content becomes the source forthat next generation of answers?
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