#16 Matt Guffey Victory Submission Strength

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Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Today's guest is someone who'smastered the art of movement on
the ice, on the mats, and inlife.
Born in Sacramento and raised onthe East coast.
Matt found his passion forhockey at age 12.
His journey took him across thecountry from playing junior
hockey in Colorado and Texas tobeing recruited to playing in

(00:21):
worcester Worcester, WorcesterState University, but that was
just the beginning.
After college, Matt moved to theBay Area to pursue coaching full
time.
Joining the Junior Sharks, andworking alongside one of the top
power skating coaches in theworld.
It was here that he alsodiscovered Brazilian jiu jitsu

(00:43):
And what started as a hobby,quickly turned into a deep
transformative path.
He trained for over eight yearsat CTA before transitioning to
Odyssey jiu jitsu.
Where he now runs a highlyinnovative training program with
Josh Beam.
Neither of us are with Odysseyanymore.
Thank you, Greg Sirico, and nowVictory Submission Grappling.

(01:06):
Awesome.
Okay, In 2020, Matt launchedVictory Submission Strength, the
Bay Area's only strength andconditioning facility dedicated
to Grapplers.
He's helped everyone from elitecompetitors to 45-year-old
hobbyists, reach new levels ofperformance and longevity.

(01:27):
Matt's story is aboutresilience, reinvention, and
building something that lastsboth on and off the mats.
He's a coach, a creator, and acommunity builder, and today
we're diving deep into whatdrives him Now, let's get into
it.
Yeah.
You ready?
Yep.
So let's talk about your earlylife and your athletic roots.

(01:48):
What was life growing up inNorth Carolina and Virginia?
It was a blast.
I had a great childhood.
We moved to North Carolina whenI was three months old, so I
don't really rememberSacramento.
My wife hates it when I say I'mfrom California'cause she's
like, you don't remember, thatdoesn't count.
So anyways, growing up in NorthCarolina, you know, I played a

(02:11):
bunch of sports, soccer, t-ball,whatever.
I was, there until I was sevenand then moved to Virginia and I
was in Virginia until I was 18.
And there again, that's kindawhere I fell in love with
hockey.
There's a little bit of a storybehind that.
When I first moved to Virginia,I was in Cub Scouts and I think

(02:34):
I was at the local rink.
Mm-hmm.
Getting my ice skating badge.
And I took one lap around therink, I fell, I had a black eye,
knocked a tooth out.
I was crying.
I was like, I will never, evertouch the ice again.
And I think that's the last, anyof us ever really thought about
it until maybe five or six yearslater I was playing, street

(02:58):
hockey with my friends just infront of our house and one of
the neighborhood kids was like,let's go to the rink.
He played hockey and so he waslike, let's go to the rink.
And I was like.
Devastated inside.
I was like, I don't wanna be theonly one that doesn't go.
And so I just sucked it up.
And I went and I came back.
I loved it.
I had a blast and I came backand I was like, I wanna play
hockey.
And my parents were like, you'recrazy.

(03:19):
That's not what you do.
And I was like, no, I wanna doit.
And I guess doing their initialresearch realized that hockey is
not a cheap sport to play.
They weren't going to enroll mein something if I wasn't fully
in it.
And so we found a camp, like ahockey camp that summer,
whatever it was a week long.
Low barrier, right?
Low, investment.
And I loved it.

(03:40):
I had fun and I fell in lovewith it right then and there.
I was like, this is what I wannado for the rest of my life.
So I started playing hockey andI just like playing it
endlessly, any chance I couldget, it was on the ice.
I definitely skipped some schoolto play at certain times.
And which came out much laterwhen my dad had to get my
transcript in order to send toWorcester State University,
which I got eventually wasrecruited to play there.

(04:02):
It did work out.
It was fine and I did get reallygood grades, but, I would do
literally anything to be on theice.
I started coaching just to makesome extra money on the side.
By the time I was 16 I wasalready starting to do private
lessons and working with kids,trying to teach'em how to skate.
And then eventually that grewinto, coaching adult clinics.
Mm-hmm.
My dad was one of my, firstadult students.

(04:24):
So that was cool, getting to,make him go all over the ice and
stuff.
Then, moving forward, playedjunior hockey.
First in DC for the juniorcapitals, then Colorado and then
Texas.
While I was there in Texas, got,recruited to play at Worcester
State.
I went to college and played alittle bit there.
And, um, it eventually ended uptransferring to St.

(04:47):
Michael's College.
That's where I actuallygraduated from St.
Michael's College was inVermont.
I did not play hockey there.
That was where I realized thatif I was going to be in hockey,
I was gonna be as a coach.
So I kind of pivoted to coachingand one thing led to another.
I was originally going to teachFrench and coach hockey at a

(05:08):
private school on the EastCoast.
And I realized in the middle ofmy, interview process that I
really didn't want to be.
I think when I realized it.
Shout out to Leanne Beardsley.
She was my 11th grade Englishteacher, and I was substitute
teaching at my old high school.
And I remember asking her, doyou love it?

(05:29):
And she said, yeah.
I was like, you're, that wasn'tvery convincing.
I was like, you're not sellingit.
And so that was when it reallyhit me.
I was like, I don't wanna be ina classroom.
I want to teach.
It lights my heart on fire tosee people do things that they
couldn't do before.
Mm-hmm.
As a result of, you know, ourinteractions.
But I don't wanna be in aclassroom and I don't wanna be

(05:50):
around people who don't reallycare to be there.
I was a student that didn't careto be there.
I was like, I would rather beplaying hockey.
Right.
Yeah.
And I realized then I didn'twant to be in a classroom.
I decided, I was like, I wannago all in on hockey.
I happened to be out here in theBay Area and, I fell in love
with it.
I was out here visiting a friendAnd I was like, I can't believe

(06:11):
people live like this.
It was just cool.
I was staying in the missionwith him.
I was like, this is not the EastCoast.
This is different.
I was just trying to find anyway that I could to come back
and I stumbled upon the JuniorSharks, reached out to them,
they interviewed me, hired me.
The rest is history.
Nice.
So let's back up a little bit.
Your early years mm-hmm.
How you were raised and, did yougrow up with a mom and dad?

(06:33):
Did you have any siblings?
Just give me some familydynamics.
Yeah.
My wife likes to joke.
I.
And I agree with her that I wasa free range child.
My parents not that they weren'tpresent, they were definitely
present and they definitely,helped shape who I am today, But
they were very, they let me roamthe neighborhood.
Yeah.
I played outside.

(06:53):
I climbed trees, I fell, I gotscraped.
I did stuff that kids do.
I don't know if they do it asmuch anymore.
I feel like I was born at theright time.
I'm old enough to remember whatit was like before the internet,
but I'm young enough to be ableto adapt to the new things that
are happening.
So I would say, free rangechild.
So was I.
Yeah.

(07:13):
Playing outside.
Yeah.
Having a good time.
You learn so much that way.
Out at dawn.
Yep.
Back after dark.
Yep.
And riding our bikes everywhere.
Yes.
And, I have a brother, he'sthree and a half years younger
than me.
I think my parents early oninstilled the entrepreneurial
spirit in me.
One instance of this was, oneday my dad came home and I was

(07:38):
on the front porch and I wascounting$10 bills.
Like a lot of'em.
And he was like, what the, howdid you, what did you steal
that?
What are you doing?
And I was like, no.
We made a car wash.
And he was like, what do youmean?
We live in townhouses, right?
So there's 300 housesneighborhood.
And my bright idea was toprocure some cleaning supplies

(08:01):
and then go door to door and askpeople if I could use their hose
and wash their car.
And it was just 10 bucks and Idid it for every single house in
the whole neighborhood.
It took me all day.
Wow.
Not everybody did it, but enoughof them did that.
I made some serious cash.
That's great.
And it was enough to prompt aresponse like that from my

(08:21):
parents, wondering if I hadstolen it'cause they couldn't
believe that a 10-year-old gothis hands on that much money.
So I think from an early age,I've always known I wanted to be
my own boss.
I've always known I wanted to bein charge of my own destiny.
And, we'll get into it later,but what we're sitting in right
now is a manifestation of that.
Awesome.
That's amazing.
Anything else in your childhoodyou'd like to talk about?

(08:44):
No.
I think I lived largely a normalone.
I, there's some stuff that have,passed the statute of
limitations that now I can talkto my parents about all the
times I snuck out and played onthe golf course in the middle of
the night and, uh, you know'sstupid stuff that stupid kids
do, but, I'm fine.
We made it out.
Yeah.
yeah.
Okay.
Let's move on.

(09:05):
Let's go into your hockeycareer.
Can you describe your experienceplaying junior hockey across
different states?
Yeah.
junior hockey, so for anybodywatching, most freshmen in
college who play college hockeyare 20 to 21 years old.
So there's an intermediary stepin between youth hockey and

(09:26):
college hockey.
And that's junior hockey, youcan play junior hockey from the
age of 16 all the way to 20.
In some leagues, you can be anoverage and be 21 but for the
vast majority of people thereprobably between the ages of 18
and 20.
That was my first taste of lifeon my own.
I was living with a host family.
The first junior team I playedfor was in Virginia.
First and second rather.

(09:47):
And then the third one that Iplayed for was in Colorado.
So I lived with a host familythere.
Oh, nice.
And they were great.
They took me in, gave me a placeto stay.
It was very safe.
Everything was great but I mean,for all intents and purposes, I
was on my own, like my parentsweren't there.
I was like responsible for myown decisions.
I drove across the country.

(10:07):
Wow.
My dad and my brother came withme and, they were there to
accompany me to Colorado andthen they flew back.
But, by and large I was, youknow, doing it myself.
I take a couple classes at thecommunity college.
Stay current.
Do some pre-reqs that I knew Iwas gonna have to do when I
transferred into college.
Right.
And, yeah, other than that, Iwas an alternate captain on the

(10:29):
team in Colorado, and when Imoved to Texas, I was the
captain of that team.
That was interesting.
Not just being in charge ofmyself, but also, helping be in
charge of a whole team of other16 to 20 year olds was Wow.
Kind of wild.
But I'm still friends with a lotof those guys.
The bonds that were made inthose seasons run really deep.

(10:50):
Actually a, couple of theplayers that I played with in.
Texas, we're groomsmen ourwedding, just to give you an
idea as to how close, we are.
It was a blast.
I loved it.
It gave me a chance to, explorewhat it's like to be myself
without my parents being there.
Yeah.
Um, and do it in a way that wassafe and, I had a blast.

(11:10):
there's nothing like juniorhockey because you're basically
a full-time athlete.
with the exception of thosecollege courses.
But yeah, it was such a funtime.
I really enjoyed it.
What were those workouts like?
I am very fortunate that evenbefore junior hockey, I had a
lot of really good strengthcoaches.
Her name is Ruth Ennis.
Shout out, Ruth, thank you forhelping inspire me.

(11:33):
There are so many more that Icould list honestly, but,
largely what we do here arethings that I did when I was
with them.
They were definitely ahead oftheir time in a lot of ways.
So, yeah, I mean, as far as theworkouts go, you do some kind of
dynamic warmup, some mobilitystuff, some speed, power,
strength.
And as far as the strength stuffgoes, push, pull, hinge, squat,

(11:54):
lunge, carry, just basicmovement patterns get really
ruthlessly strong.
In fundamental ways.
Okay.
How about on the ice?
What kind of drills would you doon the ice?
Oh my goodness.
anything and everything from,flow drills, which are,
following a set path.
All the way to, small gameswhere we're having to battle

(12:15):
each other and, work in,different settings, smaller
space or, instead of five onfive, it's two on two and,
different rules and things likethat.
And so, um, games, which we'lllearn again later is the best
way to learn, I would argue.
It's unfortunate that wasn't,that didn't really start taking
hold until much later in mycareer.
I wish that it had been earlier.

(12:36):
Awesome.
Okay.
Yeah.
Onto the next question.
What was the recruitment processlike for Worcester.
Worcester.
Worcester.
Yeah.
There you go.
A state.
Yeah.
Okay.
I don't have that East coastaccent.
That's, that's okay.
That's okay.
Um, you know.
Coaches from colleges, oftenassistant coaches do a lot of

(13:01):
the recruiting, and so they'llgo to watch people play.
Sometimes at showcases,sometimes they'll go directly to
the town or whatever.
Showcases are nice because a lotof teams come together all at
once.
And they're easier to see.
can see a lot of players from alot of different teams without
having to travel to all thosedifferent towns.
I believe it was at one of theleague showcases and when I say
showcase, it's just atournament, like a mini

(13:21):
tournament, right.
You play five games in.
Three or four days and theycount as like regular season
games.
And then, the coaches fromvarious colleges will find
players that they like, markthem down and then go talk to
them afterwards and say, Hey,we'd like to talk to you about
coming to school here.
At the end of the day, you makea decision and Worcester State's
where I landed.

(13:41):
That's, one of my friendsgrowing up, actually a teammate
of mine when I was playingjunior hockey in DC.
He was there, at the time, andso he was the one who kinda
helped shepherd me, into thatspace.
Nice.
Okay.
Good.
Getting cut during your secondyear, how did that moment impact
your identity and future path?

(14:03):
That sucked.
But I bet it was for the best.
Honestly.
I'm happy.
I'm happy where I'm at.
Nobody likes to be told thatthey're not good enough.
That's not fun.
But it is the nature of thesport.
And at a certain point, none ofus are good enough to play at
the level that we want to.
Even pros, they age absolutely.
Just like we do.
And eventually their, theirskills decline.
And they drift off.

(14:25):
You hope when you're playinglike that, that you get to
decide when that is and it's notsomebody else.
Having, getting cut, definitely.
In my opinion, lit a fire undermy ass.
Not that there wasn't already afire, I was already a hard
worker.
I had to be a hard worker tomake it to that level.

(14:46):
Absolutely you did.
But even after starting at 12years old versus three or four
years old, like most of myteammates at Worcester, they
started when they were littlekids, right?
So I had eight years to make up,right?
I got there with, minus thateight years.
Um, and that is, thanks in largepart to a lot of the strength

(15:06):
coaches that I had, that Imentioned earlier.
So getting cut was not the mostfun, but it definitely kicked me
into what I believed to be ahigher gear.
And so I doubled down and keptworking and then got out and got
myself in front of other collegecoaches and tried to find a way
on any team that I could.
The coach that then recruited meto come to St.

(15:28):
Mike's was fired a week before Igot there.
Oh no.
And so a new coach comes in, hashis.
Preference.
Has his people.
Mm-hmm.
Right.
He brings in his own recruitsand so it didn't work out again.
And that was really when it wasover'cause I can't transfer
again.
Like you only have so manytimes.
I don't know how true this is,but part of what he told me was
that because I was already in mythird year of college hockey.

(15:51):
Once your clock starts, itdoesn't stop.
So I played my first year, myfreshman year, my sophomore year
I was cut.
I spent all year training allyear trying to get recruited.
Third year come in.
And then again, it's a new coachwho's got his own preferences
And program and everything.
You know, me being in my thirdof four, four years was not
helping me.
I would've had to have been headand shoulders better than the

(16:13):
next guy for him to leave ayounger person off the roster.
So again, that was devastating.
I cried.
It was really terrible'cause Youwork hard, you train hard and
Yeah.
It is disappointing.
You expect to be rewarded atsome point.
Yeah.
And it just gets ripped awayfrom you.
That's the nature of the sport Iguess.
That was a challenge for sure.
Had some long nights where I'mlike, what do I do now?

(16:37):
You know?
Mm-hmm.
Like my whole life since I was12 years old, just every single
day was this is the goal.
This is the only thing, and thenit's just gone.
So what did you do?
Just, um, focus on college,finish it up, and then you just,
moved out to the Bay Area?
Yeah.
Well, I knew in my heart ofhearts, I was like, if I don't
play professionally, I want tocoach, and if I don't coach,
I'll be a GM.
And if I am not a GM, I'll own ateam.

(16:58):
I don't know.
Whatever, I'll do whatever Ihave to do to make it to the
next level and make this part ofmy, make this profession or this
way of life happen.
And so that actually takes usback just a little bit because
after I was cut the second time.
I had to focus on school.
So I, had a double major, inpsychology and French, French

(17:19):
was an afterthought.
I didn't really think about thatuntil my second year of college
and the impetus for that was oneof my coaches growing up in
Virginia, Chris Borner.
Sup, he's from Switzerland.
He speaks seven languages.
Wow.
It's really impressive.
It is.
It's hard enough to think in twoor three languages, let alone

(17:40):
seven.
The guy is an anomaly for sure.
But he always, often would bringSwiss players over and the trade
off was, they didn't speak anyEnglish, so they would learn
English.
But they were always a littlemore skilled than we were.
And so we would get a chance toplay hockey with really skilled
players for the season.
And so one of them became a verydear friend of mine, somebody

(18:00):
that I gotta spend some timewith in Switzerland when I was
over in Europe.
And, that was the inspirationfor that.
Okay.
Like the French piece.
I thought, okay, if I'm gonnacoach, right?
Psychology is one way.
Learn how the human mind works.
I'm gonna be working withpeople.
So that would be wise.
That makes sense.
But then if I wanna make myselfmore marketable, it's helpful if
I can speak to more people.
And, Chris can speak to anyonehe wants, basically, and he can

(18:22):
go anywhere.
He speaks English, Spanish,French, German, Romansh, which
is like a Swiss dialect, andItalian I think, and maybe some
Japanese too.
He did say the guy, he's, ifyou've ever seen the most
interesting man in the world,the commercials, the Dos Equis
ones Uhhuh, that's Chris Borner.
So.
that was the inspiration behindthat.

(18:43):
So I started studying French.
I went to my advisor.
I had taken enough psychologycredits that I could have
graduated with this psychologydegree right then and there, but
I needed a couple more yearsleft.
I needed like a certain amountof time.
It's this whole logisticalnightmare.
But they were like, you coulddouble major and you could do
this whole French track orwhatever and, that would put you

(19:04):
on track to graduate on time andall that stuff.
And I was like, okay, let's doit.
And they're like, you gotta goto France.
And I was like, twist my arm.
And spent some time there.
And actually before I went toFrance, I'm the kind of person
who like I over prepare, so ifsomething's coming up, I go way
overboard in my preparation forit, right?

(19:24):
I was so nervous that I wasn'tgoing to score highly enough on
the placement test when I got toFrance.
Uhhuh, mind you.
I had never got anything below a99 out of a hundred on any test
that I had taken at You're anover achiever.
Right.
And so, but I was still like, Iwas in my head about it and I
was like, I have to get intothis like higher bracket or

(19:44):
whatever.
So I got myself a job.
I can't say if it was legal orillegal in French Canada.
And so I was there in QuebecCity working as a coach.
At one of the universities thereas a translator.
I had searched for ways that Icould mix the two things, and I
stumbled upon.
This school, and I was watchingthe testimonial and it was all

(20:08):
in French.
And then there was one kid, hewas like, I love this camp.
And there's like little Frenchsubtitles at the bottom and I
was like, okay, there's at leastone English speaker here, but if
the whole camp is in French,like it would be helpful to have
somebody who like, canfacilitate that.
Mm-hmm.
So I reached out to them, theywere very accommodating.
They were like, yep, let's doit.
And I was like, sweet.
So I showed up.
And the first day I was there,they put me on the ice with 20

(20:31):
kids and I was like, wow, 20English speakers.
that's a lot.
And he was like, no, there's noEnglish speakers in this group.
I was like.
What, like they don't teach youhockey French in school, okay.
I had to learn on the fly and Iwould highly recommend if
anybody's learning anotherlanguage out there to go work
with kids because they don'tcare about your feelings.

(20:53):
They will tell you if you'refucking it up.
Can I say fucking up?
Okay.
Yeah.
You can say anything you wanthere, uh, they will tell you if
you're fucking it up.
And it's very fortunate to havea platform like that where I
could practice.
And they would be like, no, no,no.
Don't say it like that.
Say it like this.
And they'd teach you and Yeah.
You know,'cause adults like youand I, if you make a mistake,
I'm not gonna correct you.
That's right.
That's rude.

(21:14):
So the kids don't care.
They'll tell you when you'rewrong and, that was really
helpful in my development as aFrench speaker.
And, the turning point for mewhen I realized that I really
had it, have always, I guessI've had an ear for accents and
things like that.
And at the very beginning when Ifirst got there, my accent at
the time was like from France.

(21:35):
Most of my teachers had learnedlike kind of the Parisian
dialect and or were from Parisor France.
And so when I got to QuebecCity, the kids were like, you
know, they weren't quite surehow to pin it on me.
They were like, is he fromFrance?
Or where is he from?
Because I would say some thingsthat didn't quite make any sense
to them.
But by the end, like the last, Idon't know, the last week or so,

(21:56):
somebody was like, where are youfrom?
And I was like, where do youthink?
And he was like.
I don't know, somewhere outsideMontreal.
And I was like, sweet.
I did it.
I'm like, if I could trick youinto thinking that I'm from
here, then I got this.
So I really ran with it.
And, I just speaking endlesslysince then.
And, when I got to France,actually, everybody was like,

(22:17):
he's from Quebec.
Like that's how they talkedthere.
And then when I got back toQuebec the next summer.
They were like, I don't get it.
You spent four months in France,but you sound like you're from
here still.
I'm like, yeah, I'm, I reallystudied it.
So I was listening to the radioand watching French Canadian TV
and French Canadian comedy isreally funny for any French
speakers out there who arelooking for a good laugh.
So, it's just, it's become likea really huge part of, I guess

(22:40):
who I am.
And, being able to speak anotherlanguage has definitely opened
some doors for me.
We have a member here actually,10 years later, after, I worked
with his kid.
They just moved here fromMontreal.
His kid didn't speak anyEnglish.
Wow.
They get on the ice.
They're like, who does anybodyhere speak French?
And I was like, I'll do it.
And I was his like littlepersonal translator for several

(23:00):
months.
That's great.
Kid starts working with me onthe ice.
Dad comes in here to the gym,next thing we're still very good
buddies, so that's awesome.
It's definitely opened somedoors for me and, even though
I'm not coaching hockey anymore,I'm still very thankful that I
have that skill, right on.
So do me a favor.
Say something in French to ourlisteners, like quelque chose en
français.
All right.
Awesome.
pour les auditeurs.

(23:21):
So tell us what you said, justsomething in French for the
listeners.
That's very cool.
Okay, so let's go into the BayArea.
And coaching evolution.
So what led you to your decisionto move to the Bay Area?
Like we talked about, my time inthe mission was really fun.
I just, I couldn't believeanybody lived like this.
Um, and so I was finding anyways that I could to get back

(23:44):
here.
And then when I realized Ididn't wanna be in the
classroom.
I literally just typed in HockeyBay area and the Junior Sharks
are the first thing that cameup.
I found their contact info, Iemailed them and I said, Hey, I
wanna come out here, I wannacoach.
And it's not every day that theyget a kid from Virginia saying
that.
So somebody called me, I saysomebody, he's my best friend

(24:04):
now.
He's at my wedding.
he called me and he is MikeJanda.
What's up Mike?
He was like, please explain whatare you doing?
And I was like, I want to coach.
I wanna make a living out ofthis.
And he, encouraged me to comedown, interview with him.
I was in San Francisco.
I like took it was like a, zipcar or whatever.
Yeah, they do you just like walkup to a car and press a button

(24:26):
and it opens up and you candrive it for the day.
Which is pretty sweet.
So I grab a zip car, which didnot exist on the east coast at
the time.
I was like, this is so foreignto me.
Um, so I drove down to San Jose,interview with Mike.
He was very clear about howexpensive it was here.
He was like, you're probablygonna have to get another job,
and if that's like teachingprivate lessons or whatever.

(24:47):
And I was like, I literallydon't care.
I'll do whatever it takes tocome here and coach.
I joined the Junior Sharks as anassistant coach with the 12 AAA,
15 AAA and 16 AAA team thatyear.
Okay.
So I was coaching a lot ofdifferent teams, Uhhuh, and then
I had started to build, a littlebit of a side business.
And then, I started to notice,kinda certain faces around the
rink and that kind of brings usto Kathy Andre, who was a

(25:10):
really, she played a prominentrole in my development as a
coach and Right.
as did Mike.
Mike and I coached for, theentire time I was with the
Junior Sharks.
But, as far as from a businessperspective Kathy's like one of
the top power skating coaches inthe world.
When I was on the East coast, Iworked with Wendy Marco.
Wendy Marco is another one ofthe best power skating coaches
in the world.

(25:31):
They happened to run in the samecircle.
Talking to Kathy, she found outI was from the East coast.
She asked if I knew Wendy.
They had worked together, insome capacity many years ago.
And so there was a connectionthere.
And we had like very similarphilosophies as far as like how
to teach and what to teach.
And, what was important whencoaching somebody.
And so, I kind of came to Kathyand I was like, I need help

(25:52):
growing a business.
You've got a wait list.
I'm, teach me how to coach andI'll coach your people and we
came to an agreement and she wasvery helpful in, filling my
roster and getting me to a placewhere I could afford to live
here.
Because coaching teams is notwhat pays the bills.
It's the private stuff that thatdoes that.
Yeah.
So tell me about, um, What wasit like working with Kathy?

(26:14):
It was fantastic.
Kathy is a phenomenal humanbeing.
She's a great coach.
She just commands respecteverywhere she goes.
is been in the game for a longtime and she's seen everything
and she's worked with the kidwho's just learning, they've
just put skates on for the firsttime.
All the way to NHLs and, she'scurrently the skating coach for

(26:37):
the Barracuda, the a HL teamhere.
And she does some of consultingstuff for, for the pro club.
And she's fantastic.
We're still very close.
You know, her whole family.
I'm very close with them, Good.
All right.
Let's go on to the nextquestion.
How did your coaching stylebegin to evolve during this
time?
That's a great question.
Um, so the Junior Sharks arewhat's called an ADM Club.

(27:02):
ADM just stands for AmericanDevelopment Model and is based
on, a lot of the ecologicaldynamic stuff that is very
popular in jiu jitsu right now.
Correct.
And I didn't know this at thetime.
I was unaware of theterminology.
I didn't know what washappening.
They were just like.

(27:22):
If you wanna teach skills, playgames and get people to do it in
a live scenario.
Where there's pressure and theyhave to figure stuff out.
They're gonna figure out a lotmore than you just telling them
exactly what to do or make themskate around cones like I was
saying earlier, like that's,some of the practices were like
that, skate up here and turnthis way and do that.
But like games aren't playedthat way.
The game of hockey is dynamic.
And it's never the same twice.

(27:45):
True.
that was the underlyingprinciple that was driven home
at that time was building skillsthrough games.
And I was very fortunate to beable to go work with USA hockey,
in Colorado Springs at theirheadquarters for the Rocky
Mountain High performance camp.
Alright.

(28:05):
so it's the top 200,15 year oldsfrom Alaska to Texas basically.
Come together and they do thiscamp and it's not only a camp
for the players, it's a bigshowcase for them.
There are a lot of NHL scoutsthere, a lot of college scouts
there.
Prep school scout scouts there,junior scouts there, who are
looking to see kinda the nextgeneration.

(28:25):
But also, referee development.
So there was like a big refereeprogram that was going on at the
same time.
And a coaching developmentprogram.
So, you know, coaches from allover the country would come
there.
And then you have like your headUSA hockey guys who are teaching
the newest stuff and then alsogiving you, the freedom to
experiment and go out there andtry a game and then have

(28:46):
somebody comment on whether ornot that works or why it works,
or how they change it, or howcan we get better, right?
And so all of that to say likethat coaching philosophy.
That I didn't know was evenreally happening at the time.
Is the reason that USA hockeynow is as good as it is?

(29:06):
I can't explain the changethat's happened amongst those
players and coaches because 15,20 years ago, American born
players were not known for beingskilled.
They were known for just beingbruisers.
They go out there, they hit,they fight, they do the low, for
lack of a better term, the lowskill work, right?
And USA hockey making this shiftto, the ecological dynamic stuff

(29:31):
is directly responsible for theskill level that's coming out of
places like Phoenix and placesin Texas and Florida.
And now you've got some reallyworld class athletes, American
born athletes.
Who have come up in that systemWow.
training under that philosophy.
and now we are one A withCanada.
From a skill perspective.

(29:51):
as far as my coaching philosophyand how it was shaped and
developed that played a hugerole.
That's very interesting.
Thanks.
Thank you for sharing that.
Yeah, of course.
Okay.
How did you first get exposed toMMA and BJJ in Virginia?
I was training in the offseason, with one of my friends,
Sean Shields and Sean, I can'tremember if he wrestled in high

(30:13):
school or what his connection tothis place was, but he was like,
you should come to Gold MedalGrappling.
And it was, close to my houseand I was like, okay, yeah.
In past summers I had gone to aboxing gym and they were like,
this is wiley kid.
Like this hockey player comes inhere and wants to like box.
Now that I know what I know.
I would never recommend thatanybody do that.
I think that was really not thebest way to go about it.

(30:38):
Right.
But I'm thankful for it havinghappened.
'Cause I wouldn't be here if Ididn't have that experience.
So he invited me to gold Medalgrappling.
Elijah Harshbarger is the headcoach there.
And then the pro, it was ChrisMcCray and Chris McCray if
anybody's an ultimate fighterfan.
Yes.
Chris McCray was on the UltimateFighter.
He lost his first fight, but itwas such a close fight that they

(31:00):
invited him to fight again.
And then he fought his way backinto the house and he won five
or six in a row.
He made it the finals and thenhe lost and correct.
But he did get himself a few UFCfights and as far as Virginia
grappling goes, is one of thebig names.
So it was really cool to get totrain with him and Elijah they
were influential in my, Isuppose I didn't know it at the
time I was like, I'm just atthis MMA gym.

(31:22):
I remember Elijah teaching melike my first arm bar or
whatever we didn't do a lot ofjiu jitsu, but there was enough
there that it, stuck in my head.
More like ground and pound.
Yeah.
And it was mostly boxing.
Boxing and wrestling wereprobably the two, biggest things
at the gym.
And then jiu jitsu was like anextra thing.
Okay.
Hopefully if Elijah's watchingthis, I'm doing that justice.
I don't know if that was reallyhis method but that's what I

(31:43):
remember, at least.
And so that kind of stuck in myhead.
And then I didn't really doanything with it.
I didn't think about it.
I went about my business.
I played hockey.
I went to Worcester, went to St.
Mike's, and after St.
Mike's, when I came out here.
I wasn't playing anymore.

(32:04):
I was already, coaching hockey,seven or eight hours a day.
I was in skates.
Oh, that's long on a, sheet ofice.
It was just cold and I didn'twanna play.
The times for adult league inhockey are not good.
They're like 10:00 PM 11:00 PMSometimes later than 11:00 PM
start times.
It's not fun and so anyways,after being on my feet for seven

(32:28):
or eight hours, the last thing Iwanted to do was lace up my
skates again and play foranother hour.
I was like, I wanna stay active,I wanna play a sport.
I wanna do something where I'mlearning, but I don't, what am I
gonna do?
I'm not gonna box, I am gonnaget hit in the head.
I'm too old for that.
I say that I was 25.
That's not even old.
But like too old to be gettinghit in the head.

(32:50):
True.
For not for money.
Anytime getting hit in the headfor no money.
For no money is not worth it.
Not worth it.
Sometimes getting hit in thehead for money is not worth it.
Correct.
And I just kinda went down thelist.
I was like, if I didn't box, Ido Muay Thai.
No, I don't really wanna getkicked either.
I was like, jiu jitsu seems likein the MMA world, you have to

(33:10):
know it, right?
If you don't know it, you're introuble.
Mm-hmm.
See Conor McGregor versus NateDiaz.
And, so I started looking up jiujitsu.
I was like, what about jiu jitsuhere?
I didn't know anything about thescene.
I didn't know anything about whowas here, all the skilled
grapplers who live and trainhere.
I didn't know anything about AKAor anything.

(33:30):
I didn't know anything.
So what'd you do?
Some research?
Yeah, just like Google jiu jitsuand it was like, do you want to
use your precise location?
And I was like, just this time,No.
So anyways, Caio's came up andyou start to notice.
That these schools, a lot of'emhave names attached to them,
right?
Correct.
And you see Ralph Gracie, andCaio Terra and you see all

(33:51):
these, you know all these names.
And so you like, who is thisperson?
And you look'em up and you'relike, oh, that guy's won 12
World Championships.
Correct.
And this isn't just school withhis name on it.
It's like he's here.
I'd be stupid not to go.
It was like down the street frommy house, so I walked in one day
and I was like, Hey, I wanna tryit.

(34:11):
I didn't have a, gi, I didn'thave anything.
Actually Kim Terra was one of myfirst coaches, Caio's brother,
love him to death.
He was so great.
Right on.
I remember one of my futureteammates, John Kaharian, he was
like, I got an extra GI in mycar if you want to use it.
And so I put it on and thenproceeded to like, bleed all

(34:32):
over it because my knees werenot ready for all the up and
down and the mats and you know,my burns.
Yeah.
And so I was just like bleeding,profusely from my knees and
afterwards he was like, youcould just keep it, it's fine.
I don't need it back.
And I wore that GI until itripped.
Dang! It got some mileage forsure.
So, that was how I found it.

(34:52):
Okay.
Yeah.
So what kept you going duringthose early days at CTA?
I think it's just a thirst tolearn.
Maybe it's a cliche thing tosay, I'm a lifelong learner.
I don't feel right if I'm nottrying to push the limits of
what I know.
Mm-hmm.
And that's a true athlete.
Yeah.
And I think it's common for, jiujitsu people especially are

(35:15):
just, there's no end to thisthing.
Correct.
There's no way you could learnit all.
You could never, you know, youcould train until you died and
you wouldn't know everything.
So that's attractive to me assomebody who like wants to keep
pushing it.
I think that's why I took to itso well.
That's really what keeps any ofus in it.
I think especially as a whitebelt, when you're getting
smashed constantly, you just getbludgeoned over and over.

(35:36):
And not that it was like a badexperience or anything Right.
But you know, you get beat, youdo a lot.
And you have to be okay withsucking for a long time.
True.
So yeah, I think that's probablythe main thing that kept me
going.
Okay.
Good.
Any moments when you felt inover your head or totally
hooked.
In over my head.
There was a time when I thinkKim was trying to see if I was

(36:01):
in over my head, and that was mysecond week.
He saw something in me,'cause hewas like, you should come to the
advanced class on Friday.
And I was like.
Okay.
I don't know what you're talkingabout, but sure.
I'll show up on Friday.
And it was me and Yuri Samoisewho I didn't know was two time
ADCC champion and Joe Herrity,who I just had lunch with

(36:24):
yesterday we've become dearfriends and I'm happy to have
met him and I'm glad that hereally gave me the business that
day.
It was me, Yuri Joe, and Andrew.
Andrew was a, I think a purplebelt at the time and Joe was a
blue belt at the time and I wasjust two weeks old in jiu jitsu.
And it was back takes orsomething, or back attacks and

(36:44):
we just, for an hour and a half,they just crushed me.
Ouch.
I remember just getting chokedfor the 20th time, and I look
over at Kim, and Kim is justsitting there is he gonna quit
or is he gonna show up tomorrow?
I was like, I'm gonna fuckingshow up tomorrow, man.
I'm gonna be here, I'm gonnalearn this.
And that was a moment where Iwas like, all right.

(37:05):
That sounds like it.
Yeah.
That was actually my hookedmoment.
I was like, what the hell isthis?
But I want to know how to do it.
Nice.
So, yeah.
Anything else in jiu jitsu youwould like to talk about or any
stories or anything that standsout in your mind?
Man, I would be remiss if Ididn't, just thank my coaches up
to this point.
Vitor Pasquale has played a hugerole in my development, and he

(37:27):
was the morning coach there atCTA.
I absolutely loved my time spentwith him.
He was also in my wedding.
I built a lot of really goodrelationships and, I have a lot
of very dear friends that I'vespent a lot of time with on the
mats, and I'm thankful for that.
Okay, so now let's make a shift.
Coaching philosophy.
Okay.
Yeah, this is good.
So wait, now we can tie the twotogether.
Absolutely.
Because, you know, we talkedabout the coaching philosophy at

(37:53):
USA hockey and, the shift intojiu jitsu and all that.
And so I guess for context, JoshBeam, who's a good friend of
mine, and, he is been my maintraining partner, for the past
five years or so, and he hadleft CTA and was competing quite
a bit.
Right.
And ended up getting injured.

(38:15):
And I think this was the,sequence of events.
I could be wrong, but a blackbelt, I think it was Ally Agira
from Want versus Need, and Ithink he has his, academy by any
means, jiu jitsu in Modesto orManteca or somewhere in the
Central Valley.
And I think he's the one whoreached out to Josh and was
like, Hey, if you're wonderinghow you're gonna learn jiu
jitsu, you're not outta school.

(38:36):
Um, you know, he wasrepresenting Odyssey jiu jitsu.
But Odyssey is in Atlanta.
Sending Greg video ofcompetition of training and then
getting direction based on that.
And then going to open mat andjust trying it.
Trying to figure out, what todo.
And but then he got injured andI think Al was the one who
reached out to him and was like,Hey, you should check this out.

(38:57):
If you want know how to learnjiu jitsu.
But you don't have a place youshould read.
I believe it was how we learnedto Move by Rob Gray.
So how we learned to move by RobGray is we'll call it the Eco
Bible.
And he talks about all thescience behind movement how we
learn it.
And so Josh started as he wasreading that he would like, read

(39:19):
or send me excerpts and he like,what do you think of this?
And I was like, dude, that'slike word for word.
USA hockey, that's what theytaught us.
And you'd go a little bitfurther and you'd be like, what
about this?
I'm like.
Verbatim what they told us whenI was at USA hockey and then, we
go on a little bit more and I'mlike, am I.
Doing this wrong.
Like what?

(39:39):
Like I've seen how it works inhockey.
I've seen the results of it.
I, I USA hockey's 15 years aheadof jiu jitsu in this respect.
Right, I've watched it from endto end.
I did drills where I'm justskating in a line basically and
I've also played the games.
And I've realized how much moreI get out of the games.
And then as a coach, beingcoached to coach that way, was

(40:01):
obviously, it was obviouslyhuge.
And so as we're talking aboutit, I'm like, fuck, we gotta try
this.
And so we, we go to open matsand we just try to play some
games.
We like create our own littlegames.
Like, this is the outcome thatwe're looking for.
Right.
What rules can we place aroundit so that we're forced to do it
that way?
Or forced to do, forced to getthat outcome, but by any means
necessary.

(40:21):
And then it clicked and I waslike, oh shit, I gotta do this.
And I realized, you know, Iwould listen.
I tell everybody I would bemore, I'm not usually an early
adopter.
I would be more hesitant toadopt something like this.
It seems nebulous, it's notreally concrete, it's not
necessarily a curriculum andstep-by-step instructions on how

(40:43):
to do jiu jitsu.
So I'm not typically an earlyadopter, but having seen it done
in other sports.
Made me realize, I was like, oh,this is actually not new.
It's just new in jiu jitsu.
It's just new in jiu jitsu and Ineed to get on this right now.
And so that's really, that'swhere the philosophy shifted and
now like I have to be verycareful about where I drop in
'cause I like cannot be botheredto drill.

(41:05):
I haven't drilled in a yearalmost.
I know that's gonna ruffle somefeathers, I'm sure, but,
whatever, you're doing it yourway.
Yeah.
And come train with us,honestly, like I feel like I
learn more in one hour doing itthat way than I do in a month.
Right.
I've, I've experienced, um.
the type of coaching I've beento Baem with Oh yeah.
Denny.
Yeah.
And it's great.
Yeah.
Fun.
Yeah.
Monday nights.
It's so fun and that's part ofit, right?

(41:26):
The more fun it is, the morelikely people are to adhere to
it.
Absolutely.
And the more likely they're toadhere, the longer they're gonna
stay in it, and the betterthey're gonna get.
Yeah.
Yeah.
What have you and Josh Beamlearned by experimenting with
this model?
I mean, there are severalthings.
Obviously there's like thetechnical aspect of things.
So I didn't really, I didn'treally train Nogi until six or

(41:50):
seven months ago.
In preparation for Nogi Worlds.
I was like, on a whim.
Josh asked me to do it and I waslike, yeah, I'll do it.
Let's do it.
And so I just went all nogi andI fell in love with it.
And now I like can't be botheredto put the gi on.
But like I didn't really learnleg locks.
As a brown belt, you get hitwith those.
You do.
And if you look at likecompetition results, most of my

(42:13):
losses are from toeholds, kneebars, heel hooks, just all leg
lock stuff, right?
And I personally have really,dove headfirst into the whole
leg entanglement world and beendoing it almost exclusively
through this method.
Because I needed experience inthe moment, I needed to go to

(42:34):
the space.
And this is actually somethingthat Vitor drilled into my head,
was like, we all have patternsthat we like and that we are
comfortable with.
And when we roll with the samepeople, we figure out what I can
do here and what I can't dothere.
And you just find those groovesyou almost stifle your own
growth because you just do whatworks and you don't do what's

(42:54):
actually best for your jiujitsu, which is actually to like
experiment and be okay withgetting tapped and all those
things.
True.
And Vitor would tell me all thetime, he'd be like, you need to
play other positions.
You can't just like invert andberimbolo everybody.
You gotta do something else.
And then, it wasn't until muchlater that I actually took that
to heart and was like willfullyputting myself in positions

(43:16):
where I had to like, figurestuff out and learn what works
and what doesn't.
And so this is a, I think, agreat framework for that.
Where you know, we can buildrules, we can build games, that
force certain behaviors.
So that would be the firstthing, right?
Is the technical aspect ofthings, right?
Just learning new skills in thesport.

(43:37):
The second thing is, the secondthing that I think both of us
have learned, I don't wannaspeak for Josh, but I think this
is, I would be hard pressed tobelieve if he disagree with me,
is that, you don't need to knowall the answers to be a coach.
In fact, it's probably healthyto admit you don't know all the
answers and I don't think thatit's healthy to look at any

(44:03):
sport for that matter, not justjiu jitsu as this person knows
everything and I have to getthis information from this
source.
And that's it.
Because everybody's gonna havetheir own way.
We all have different bodytypes, different skill levels,
different world experiences thatshape our thought processes and
correct.
there's just so many different.

(44:24):
Ways to do this.
The best example I can give ofthat is the buggy choke, right?
Right.
'cause I ask people, I'm like,is bottom side control a good
position or a bad position?
And most people are like, badposition.
I'm like, unless you can buggychoke somebody.
And then it becomes anadvantage.
There are more than one ways todo it.
And there was a time when thebuggy choke did not exist and

(44:45):
then a certain set of conditionsemerged that were, you know,
that it made the soil ripe orfertile for, that submission to
show up.
That's the other biggest thing Ithink that we've learned is
that.
I don't have to have all theanswers to be able to guide
somebody toward an answer oftheir own.
Yeah, just leading them to theirwater, that's the job of the

(45:06):
coach, right?
Is to guide, I'm not a fountainof knowledge.
I'm literally just lighting thepath and trying to get people to
go down the path that works forthem.
So how does your coaching stylenow compare to when you first
started?
I think it's changing all thetime, but, I would say as a
coach now, I am much more opento solutions that I wouldn't,

(45:33):
maybe I wouldn't think of or Iwouldn't recommend.
I can give an example like inhockey.
There were some of the kids thatI worked with are so skilled,
they could do stuff I couldnever dream of, right?
I could never think to do whatthey're thinking to do.
Who am I to tell them that's thewrong way to do it.
In jiu jitsu, same thing, right?
Like we just talked about thebuggy choke who says that's

(45:55):
wrong?
'Cause at the end of the day, itgets the job done, right?
It's working for somebody,right?
The thing that I keep fallingback on is there is no right or
wrong, there's only effective orineffective.
If it's effective, keep doingit.
And if it's not, do somethingelse.
So I think that's probably, thebiggest, shift.
In the thought process.
As far as coaching goes, itdoesn't have to just be the way

(46:16):
that I think it needs to be.
As long as it gets done.
Okay.
So now that we talked aboutcoaching, let's talk about your
business, Victory SubmissionStrength.
What inspired you to open up agym specifically for grapplers?
And you also launched it duringthe pandemic?
Yeah.
So two in one question.
Okay.
Again, I'd like to shout outjust all of the great strength

(46:36):
coaches that I had growing up.
Ruth Ennis, Beatle Bailey, RJGubo, Emily Morris, Brian Thely.
I'm sure I'm missing some.
Mike Craven, a lot of people whoreally contributed to my love
for the weight room.
When I was growing up, I wasn'tthe most skilled hockey player,
so I needed to do something toseparate myself, as an athlete.

(46:58):
And that came in the gym.
If I wasn't gonna be the mostskilled, I had to be faster.
I had to be stronger.
I had to be more resilient.
I had to be available.
And if I was stronger than most,then chances of me getting
injured were far lower and thenI'd have more opportunities to
play.
They all played a huge role ininspiring me to do that.
I always.
thought if I wasn't gonna play,I was gonna coach.

(47:18):
And if I wasn't gonna be inhockey, then I'd love to be in
the gym because that's where Ireally, I feel like I grew up
there.
I started training.
with a trainer when I was 14years old, and I've always had a
coach since then.
I'm very fortunate again tohave, both the time, the
resources and the right people,in my corner.
I would say that's like the rootinspiration, starts with all of

(47:41):
them and then COVID happened,and as we all know, the world
shut down and it was weird.
And, the rink closed when thathappened, and so I was already
feeling burnt out, on the iceand I didn't know if I loved it
anymore.
The rink shut down.
We all had to pivot.
If you could imagine, I was, Ican't believe I'm saying this,

(48:05):
giving hockey lessons on Zoom.
And so I'm very thankful for thefamilies who entrusted me with,
helping their kids get bettereven though we couldn't be on
the ice and we couldn't be inthe same place.
I credit that time with helpingmake me a better coach in that.
It's you, computer screen, kid,puck, and net.

(48:29):
Maybe some of'em didn't evenhave that.
And you've gotta find a way tonot only direct them in a way
that's gonna be helpful but alsoprovide value in a short period
of time.
You know, we've got 30 minutestogether, how am I gonna make
this as valuable as I canbecause these people are still
paying me money and I've gottafind a way to make it worth it
for'em.
You gotta be Pretty creative.

(48:50):
You gotta get creative and yougotta be very precise with your
words because you can't justmove somebody where you need to
move'em like you can in person.
You gotta be very sharp.
That was definitely anexperience that while I would
never want to do again, wouldcredit with helping me as a
coach.
And so what I started to do wasbecause we had limited

(49:11):
resources, I was like, I need tomake this valuable.
So for the last 10, maybe 15minutes of the lesson we're
gonna do some of the strengthwork that I've been recommending
people do for a long time.
But then they never did becausethey would go home and they'd be
like, I forgot.
Or I can't, or I'm a kid and Ijust don't remember, and now I'm

(49:32):
basically in your living roomand I'm gonna make you do it.
Like, we're gonna do thesethings good.
And you're gonna get strongerwhether you like it or not.
And I started to hear things acouple months in and they were
like, I couldn't do this before,but now I can.
And I was like, great.
That's it.
that's when the light bulb wentoff.
I was like, this is what I donow I can do that.
And so my then girlfriend, nowwife, her roommate Leah Levin,

(49:54):
she helped me.
Gave me the resources I neededto get certified as a personal
trainer.
Once I got certified, I startedprogramming remote for one of my
former players who was lookingto play in college.
Perfect.
And then that turned into acouple of remote gigs where I
was like, programming for thesepeople.
And they'd send me video and I'dwatch and critique and send it

(50:15):
back and do the whole thing.
And then.
That turned into, you know,things started to open up a
little bit.
Great.
And I had found a performancegym close by.
Shout out to Steven Ross.
Nice.
He's the one who helped me getinto a place where I could start
working with people.
Working with people one-on-one,and obviously we were doing

(50:35):
everything we could to minimizerisk and people wear masks and
we were outside and doing allthe stuff that we had to do here
in California.
But he really gave me a platformand he had gym and gym
equipment, everything that Icould use.
Steven and I are still veryclose.
We operate businesses indifferent sectors.
He works with gen pop people andI work with grapplers So we
still, we still chat.
That was the start of the gym.

(50:56):
Was at the movement hub, whichis maybe two miles away.
I started working with justhockey players because that's
what I knew.
I realized really quickly thatwas not going to be a
sustainable business modelbecause they all, as we talked
about off camera before leaveafter three or four months,
right?
They do their off seasontraining and then they go to
their respective corners of theworld and go play for their

(51:18):
teams, right?
And so people started to leaveand I was like, What am I gonna
do?
What am I gonna do?
Need to fill that gap, right?
Yeah.
I can't do this.
And my business coach at thetime.
Alan Cosgrove.
He told me, he was like, wheredo you spend most of your time?
What do you like to do?
And, who could you help thatalso does that?
And I was like, no brainer.
Oh my goodness.
Stupid, stupid, stupid.

(51:39):
Duh.
And at that time I had been injiu jitsu for, five years,
almost four years.
And he knew it.
Yeah.
and I was like, man, like I hearpeople all the time, my knees
hurt, my back hurts, my shoulderhurts.
Like all these things are sotrue breaking down and I gotta
get stronger and I'm notflexible enough to do this.
I can fix those problems.
Good.
And started working with peoplethat I was training with.

(52:01):
And that was really how we madethe shift from primarily hockey
to primarily jiu jitsu.
And now we still work with a lotof hockey players, but they just
come back for the summer.
And then jiu jitsu is like thething that keeps us going.
Right on.
Throughout the year.
So, yeah.
Cool.
Very cool.
Okay.
Let's see.
Can you share a moment when yourealized Victory was really

(52:21):
making a difference?
Oh, the times are honestlycountless at this point.
Like the number of people cometo us.
I mean, if you're watching this,go read our 116 or something,
five star reviews.
They're all very positive.
Uh, but somebody that reallystands out in your mind.
Yeah.
It's funnily enough, she's not agrappler, but Antonella

(52:43):
Facherri, she was one of myfirst clients and she came to
me, she's a, piano teacher.
She was a friend of my wife, andwas like, I'm gonna hate this.
But I know I need to do it.
And I was like, I got it.
Don't worry.
I'll take care of you.
We'll get you where you'regoing.
And she was like, oh, I wanna doa chin up.
I've never been able to do achin up in my life.

(53:04):
And I was like, okay.
And just for context, she's fromEastern Europe, so she's got
that Eastern European negativityabout her.
She would laugh at that, I thinkif she was watching.
She knows, it's a differentlifestyle over there.
Anyways, we worked for a wholeyear and she got her chin up by
the end of the year and thefirst time she did it, I don't
think she believed she did it.
She was like, what the hell?

(53:25):
I'm like, yeah, that shit works.
And then, two days a week withher.
Became three and then four.
And then, the thing that reallygot me was, before she moved to
North Carolina, she got a bulltattooed on her.
Yeah.
A victory bull.
Yeah.
It wasn't, it was not this bull.
It was like, it's a little moretasteful Yeah.
Not that this wouldn't betasteful, but like it's a logo

(53:48):
of a brand.
Right.
I guess Harley Davidson peopledo that, but, anyways, yeah, she
got a bull tattooed on her and Iwas like, holy shit.
Like if this impacted this womanthis much that she felt the need
to tattoo.
an image in homage to our brand.

(54:08):
that one really got me and everytime I, she posts on Instagram
all the time, now she's likestill doing her thing.
She'll hit us up and askquestions and, she's such a
great sport and, just seeing herexcel and gets stronger and do
the things, has been reallycool.
That one definitely sticks outfor me.
Really rewarding, huh?
Yeah.
It makes all of the crap thatcomes along with business

(54:31):
ownership worth it, for thatstory alone, honestly.
Cool.
Yeah.
And I say crap, but I do lovebeing a business owner, those of
you out there who are watchingknow that there are some things
that you gotta deal with, andso.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
How do you balance coachinggrapplers of all levels.
You just meet them where they'reat.
That's the key I think, with anycoaching, regardless of whether

(54:53):
it's in the gym or on the matsor on the ice, your goal as a
coach is to meet somebody wherethey're at and push them just
enough.
To get better, right?
Mm-hmm.
You don't wanna push them sohard that they can't handle it,
and you don't wanna not pushthem enough because then the
growth doesn't happen.
Correct.

(55:13):
So it doesn't matter the level.
We have people who are brandnew, they just started jiu jitsu
and we've got seasonedprofessionals who train here.
But the philosophy doesn'tchange.
Find out where they're at, whatcan they do, what can't they do?
Bridge the gap accordingly and,try to stretch their limitations
versus break them.
Okay.
Yeah, that's fair.

(55:34):
Yeah.
So if there's anything forvictory submission, strength
that you wanted to talk aboutand promote.
If those of you who are watchingwe're located here in San Jose
and, we work with Grapplers, wework with people, regardless of
the sport.
Some people are here, that don'tplay any sports, they just want
to kick at life.
And, we work with grapplers, jiujitsu athletes, judoka,

(55:57):
wrestlers, whoever.
That's probably the main,demographic that we work with.
I'll talk about this we'rerunning a grapplers combine in
September where we've got aseries of exercises we're gonna
put people through and try togather some data, give some
comparative data, back to themso they can see where they stack
up against other people, theirskill level, their size, their

(56:18):
age, their sex, all that stuff.
So that they have, trainingrecommendations, actionable
steps that they can take tobetter themselves off the mats
so that they can last longer onthe mats.
Okay, cool.
So that's something that we'reworking on right now.
Thank you for sharing that.
Yeah, of course.
Let's go into your supportsystem and personal milestones.

(56:38):
What role has your jiu jitsucircle played in your journey?
Oh my.
That's a tough one.
I mean, it's not tough.
It's so many examples, but Ithink there is I guess as a
broad answer to that question,to start an inherent trust that
comes with not only the physicalcontact that you're in with your

(57:02):
training partners and opponents,but also the fact that if they
don't respect the tap you like,are broken.
Correct.
Or maybe dead.
I think you build trust reallyquickly.
Mm-hmm.
And in building that trustreally quickly, I've been very
fortunate to, meet a lot ofreally cool people.
Become very good friends with, alot of my training partners and
spend time with them outside ofthe mats.

(57:23):
Mm-hmm.
Obviously I met my wife on themats and that's probably the
biggest win Nice.
That I've met as far as mysupport system.
For sure.
Goes.
Uh, proposed to her on the mats.
We got married, our little caketoppers we're in GI.
I feel my support system is sofar wide and deep as a result of

(57:43):
jiu jitsu and who I've been ableto meet and spend time with.
Good.
Yeah.
Can you tell me the story of howyou met your wife and how you
proposed on the mat?
Yeah.
she showed up one day and Ithought to myself, I would like
to talk to her.
And then she was gone for amonth.

(58:03):
She went to Europe with herfamily, like on vacation.
And I was like, damn, I missedmy shot.
And then when she came back Iwas like, I'm not gonna miss it
this time.
I am gonna talk to her.
And we got paired up to roll orwhatever and in between, during
the rest period, I just startedasking her questions, how was
your weekend?
What'd you do?
and, came out that she's a,piano teacher.

(58:25):
Oh.
And I grew up playing piano.
I didn't stick with it and I,like many adults wish that I
did, now that I'm old enough toappreciate how cool it is to be
able to play Nice.
I mentioned that.
I was like, I played as a kid,I'd love to, you know learn some
more and she was like, ah, it'snever too late.
Her canned response to all theadults who say that.
At the time I was actually,living in a van, I was doing the

(58:48):
van life thing, I was, buildingout a little tiny home in a van.
I wasn't like destitute oranything.
I had a full sink and electricalsystem in there.
It was very nice.
Yeah.
Uh, for what it was, I was in avan, and I was like, I'd love to
learn, but I don't really have aplace to play'cause I'm in a van
and she was like, I've got somelike portable keyboards that I

(59:10):
could lend you if you wanted.
And I was like, let me get yournumbers so we can coordinate
this.
And she gave it to me.
And then, we texted back andforth and next thing you know,
we're going on a not date.
And she says that it was not adate.
And then when she got back homeand she's talking to her
roommate, she was like, ah,fuck.

(59:31):
I think it was a date.
And then we got married.
So it worked out from the dateto the wedding.
Quick.
Oh man.
We just have so much funtogether.
Good.
We laugh every day.
I can't think of a day that I'velived since I met her that I
didn't laugh and that Iappreciate that so much.
She's very bright, very witty,very quick.

(59:53):
just such a bright soul.
And I am forever grateful.
The universe or whatever, uh,that, you know, we crossed paths
found each other again.
it feels like I've known her forthousands of years.
Which is really special.
my wife is, half Greek so thewedding was a big fat Greek
wedding.
If anybody has seen that movie,it is so true.

(01:00:18):
Wow.
I'm glad to hear that you havesomebody very special in your
life Thanks.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Great.
How do you stay grounded andsupported while juggling so
much?
Selena plays a huge role inthat.
My wife plays a huge role inthat.
If I'm ever too high or too low,she's the first one to like, she
should never like take the windoutta my sails, but it's hey

(01:00:40):
keep in mind.
We talk about being groundedand, she does such a good job
with that.
I think I do that for her too.
I think we, feed off each otherin that way.
So, um, she plays a huge role inthat.
Jiu jitsu itself is a groundingmechanism, right?
It is because everybody goesagainst a 16-year-old who just
absolutely pretzels you.

(01:01:01):
And, that's grounding knowingthat, no matter how much you do
this, like somebody's alwaysgonna be there to put you in
your place and check you.
I guess as an aside, jiu jitsuto me is a meditative
experience.
It's the only thing I can dowhere I cannot focus on anything
else other than the task athand, because if I lose

(01:01:23):
concentration for a second,somebody's passing your guard or
trying to choke you or dosomething that you know you
otherwise wouldn't want them todo.
You know that, that is helpfuland if I cannot train for, an
extended period of time, I likemany of you are going nuts.
Yeah.
it's really, it's a challenge.
I do have to, like, when we'reon vacation, I'm looking around,
I'm like, where can I go train?

(01:01:44):
Like I gonna need to get on themats here.
Yeah.
Because I'm gonna go nuts if Idon't.
Yes.
Ditto.
Yeah.
All right.
Matt, let's talk aboutreflection and future vision.
Where do you see victorysubmission strength in five
years?
Well, I think, I mean, I hopethat the idea eventually is to

(01:02:11):
merge jiu jitsu and strengthtraining under one roof, if
possible.
The vision for this place wouldbe to obviously have the mat
space and have the ability totrain and then also have the
strength and conditioning part.
It'd be two separate businessesthat are.
allowed to, and, encouraged tocross pollinate.

(01:02:32):
Right.
'Cause the goal of victorysubmission strength is to get
people grapplers specificallystronger, faster, more mobile so
they can spend more time on themats.
Then obviously just having thespace to train is an added
bonus.
And then on the flip side ofthings, people who are
interested in learning jiujitsu, we want to give them, the
resources needed to getstronger, faster, more mobile in

(01:02:53):
a safe way, right.
Are available to them.
it's very, accessible.
So to have them in one buildingwould be ideal.
Okay.
Yeah, that makes sense.
What do you want your long-termimpact to be in the BJJ or
hockey?
This answers both, it goes withboth of those sports.

(01:03:13):
Mm-hmm.
Or any sport for that matter.
But, I tell this to peoplewhenever we do seminars at jiu
jitsu academies around here inthe bay.
If one person, whether at theseminar or somebody who comes
and trains with us Learns onething that they can use to get
better, to get faster, stronger,more mobile or whatever.

(01:03:38):
And it keeps them out of harm'sway, even just one time.
If it keeps them from gettinginjured, or if it allows them to
bounce back after injuryquicker.
Let's just say for example,they, would've twisted their
ankle or, torn their meniscus orsomething.
And in avoiding that situation,because they've built the

(01:04:01):
physical qualities needed tostay away from it or to absorb
the demands of the sport.
If they're able to stay on themats for that much longer,
right?
Weeks, months sometimes.
And certain injuries could takeyou out for several months.
Correct.
An ACL tear takes you out fornine months minimum.
And in that time spent on themats versus injured.
Not only are you getting better,the athlete.

(01:04:24):
But your training partners aregetting better'cause you're
pushing them.
Their training partners aregetting better'cause they're
pushing them, right?
And so that one thing that youdid or learned or got better at
that helped you avoid thecatastrophic injury that could
otherwise keep you away from jiujitsu?
Is our way, of helping improvethe overall wellbeing of the jiu

(01:04:50):
jitsu community, right?
True.
Yeah.
And hockey community for thatmatter.
Same thing, right?
When the hockey guys come back,our goal is to like, fortify
them as best we can so that theycan go to a kind of a long,
grueling season and not gethurt.
I'm confident that we can help.
Any athlete for any sport, evenif you don't play a sport, it's
worth coming and training andgetting better.

(01:05:10):
But yeah, All of our marketingmaterials and everything goes to
toward jiu jitsu, athletes orgrapplers.
Right I was talking to Jessica,on my podcasts.
And she praised, your ability totrain people even in uh,
situations as she was in.
She tore her ACL and MCL andmeniscus.
Correct.
So anyway, she was talking abouthow you studied and talked to

(01:05:34):
her doctors and reached out, andjust the knowledge you had to
help rehabilitate her, and youdid an amazing job.
Thank you.
Yeah.
Thank you Jess, for the shoutout.
Just to, to touch on thatbriefly, I think you'd be hard
pressed to find, many strengthcoaches who will go the lengths
that I will, I've been in theoperating room now probably a

(01:05:55):
dozen times.
Mossy Reynolds, Dr.
Mossy Reynolds, he's a homie.
He's kind enough to let me comein and study and ask questions
and learn and, get to see howthings work on the inside.
I spent a lot of time with Mossyand his team, and they're all
top-notch.
They do such a good job.
And so now I've seen, severalacls and several MCLs and a
couple of shoulders and someelbows and all kinds of stuff I

(01:06:16):
didn't expect that I would beseeing.
But, here we are.
I think I'd pass out.
Yeah, it's some people do.
You know, uh, lucky enough thatI've got a, I guess a strong
constitution, so, yeah.
There you go.
We're gonna go into, a funcloseout.
Where do you feel most at homeice rink or jiu jitsu mat.
jiu jitsu mat.

(01:06:37):
I haven't touched the ice inprobably five years and I'm okay
with it.
I've laid that part of me torest.
There's some people who havebeen trying to get me to coach,
come out of, retirement andcoach a youth team here or
there, but I just, there's noway I won't touch the ice again.
Selena asked me to go to, totake her ice skating and I just,

(01:06:57):
I can't bear to put skates on myfeet again.
Yeah.
I won't do it.
It feels like work to me.
And jiu jitsu doesn't feel likework to me.
Not yet.
At least.
I'm just gonna keep doing thefun stuff, not the work stuff.
Okay.
That makes sense.
I'm with you.
Favorite BJJ submission in thegi bow and arrow choke, Nogi,

(01:07:21):
man.
Historically.
My game has centered aroundtaking backs and choking people.
Nice.
So I'd be remiss if I didn't saythe rear naked choke, but I've
been on a big leg lock kick andI've been only searching for he
hooks lately.
I'm just like, how can I find away to expose that, that one
part?
And so I think maybe currentlyheel hook, uh, and any inside,

(01:07:47):
outside, whatever uhhuh, butmaybe long-term rear naked joke.
All right, for the nogi peeps.
I like that.
Rear naked choke.
Okay.
Your most intense hockey memory.
Winning state finals with myhigh school team was really
cool.
That was such an incredibleexperience.

(01:08:08):
The high school season inVirginia is interesting because
everybody plays on a fewdifferent junior or high level
youth teams, and then they alsoplay on different high school
teams.
So, you might be on the ice withsomebody on Tuesday at, your

(01:08:29):
club practice.
And then on Friday be playingagainst them in high school.
And then, the season is only 10games long.
So you play one game a week.
There were probably, a coupledozen teams in that area.
Maybe four of them are reallygood, and then the rest of them
are average or really terrible.

(01:08:50):
Depending on, those 10 games youmight draw the four best teams
in the league out of those 10games.
And then now you're looking atmaybe a 500 season, right?
Maybe five and five.
Maybe six and four, right?
Or you may draw 10 terribleteams.
And now you're 10 and 0.
But regardless, when you get tothe playoffs and you get to the

(01:09:12):
last four teams, typically thebest ones are still left.
And those ones get reallyintense because most of the
players are playing at a reallyhigh level outside of high
school.
So super fun we beat Broad Runin the final Broad Run.
Hadn't lost a game.
In maybe two years.
And so it was really kind of aDavid Goliath thing.

(01:09:35):
Yeah.
Where we, were the, underdogsfor sure.
they had just blown througheverybody.
They went 10 and o both the lasttwo seasons and actually I think
they may have lost the finalsthe year before, so maybe they
only lost one game in two years.
But regardless, they were ajuggernaut to be on the ice and
to be a part of that team, totake them out win the
championship there that wasreally cool.

(01:09:55):
Right on.
Yeah.
Cool.
One thing people would besurprised to know about you.
I gave away the French thingearlier.
Yeah.
I haven't played the piano sinceI originally hit on my now wife.
Uh, but she does tell me.

(01:10:15):
And she's a music teacher, soyou can take her word for it,
that I am a musical human being.
I can do music.
That's great.
She and I are really kind ofsing songy, we're just bopping
around having a good time allday.
And we got a lot of little,scripts and songs that we'll
like sing throughout the day.
And so, yeah.
I don't know.

(01:10:36):
You're in sync with her.
Yeah.
Yeah.
What motivates you to push everyday?
I hate to be cliche, but I just,I wanna be the best version of
myself I can.
And whether that's as a businessowner, whether that's as a jiu
jitsu practitioner, whetherit's, as a coach, as a husband,

(01:10:56):
that's really what drives me isI just, I feel like there's
another level and it's almost myhuman responsibility to try to
get there.
And if I do reach that level,then just keep going.
yeah.
yeah.
Okay.
we're gonna close out with that.
But I want you to give everybodysome information on how to get

(01:11:18):
ahold of you, where you'relocated, and, come and give you
a shot.
Yeah, we're, Victory SubmissionStrength is at the corner of
race in the Alameda in San Jose.
And, as we talked about, we'reprimarily with grapplers, but
we're open to any sports or anywalk of life is totally welcome
here.
We're happy to help.

(01:11:38):
We are planning on running theGrapplers Combine in September.
As far as I know, it'll be thefirst of its kind.
You'll see more informationcoming out on Instagram and
email.
We've got a ton of resources onboth our Instagram and our
website.
So our Instagram is just atVictory Submission Strength
website,victorysubmissionstrength.com.
You can find there's a freeresources tab and everything

(01:12:00):
there.
We're always trying to put outas much free content as we
possibly can because we knowthat not everybody is going to
be able to work with us.
If we can provide some value forthe masses.
We're happy to do that.
If you do wanna work with us, ifyou're curious about, strength
training for jiu jitsu or forgrappling, any grappling sport,
you can book a strategy session.
We sit down on Google Meet, it'smaybe a thirty, forty five

(01:12:23):
minute call and we go over,goals, medical injury history,
any obstacles that you come upagainst.
We go through all the logisticsand then we get a movement
assessment schedule.
People come in, we do a fulldiagnostic, go through mobility
screen, strength screen, stufflike that and then we build a
custom program, and then you'vegot a coach who's there to help
you get from A to Z withoutgetting hurt, so that you can do

(01:12:46):
more of the things that youlove.
Really, that's the goal.
And then also you do seminars.
We've got three differentseminars that we run.
we've got Bulletproof, yourBody, win more matches.
That's kind of the broad strokesversion.
We talk about the three pillarsthat, play a really big role in
keeping it healthy on the matsstrength, power, mobility, and

(01:13:06):
we do a little practical foreach of those so that people can
feel what it's like to progresssomething in a safe way,
something that they can do ifthey're gonna do it on their
own.
This is how you do it so thatyou don't get hurt.
We've also got better mobilityfor BJJ, so that one's just
purely mobility.
We go down just one of thosepaths and we do, so it's just a
full hour of like hip mobilitystuff, which tends to be a real

(01:13:28):
trouble spot for jiu jitsuathletes.
We also have a more explosivefor BJJ, which we actually just
did one today at 10th Planet SanJose.
Shout out Alan Sanchez, forhosting us.
They're, fantastic group overthere.
And so that one, again, we'rejust going down the speed power
rabbit hole a little bit andtalking a little bit more in
depth, about how people can goabout getting more explosives so

(01:13:51):
that they can win morescrambles, finish more, take
downs, do the things that theywanna do on the mats.
Great.
Awesome.
Sounds like fun.
It's so fun.
Yeah, we had a blast.
Okay.
Matt, thank you for being here.
Yes, I appreciate it.
Um, I learned a lot and, lookforward to putting this one out.
Yeah, yeah.
Thank you so much for having me.
It's a blast chat about thisstuff, so Good.

(01:14:12):
Good.
Thank you so much.
Yeah, thank you.
Bye.
Bye.