February 4, 2025 • 41 mins
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From the emotional highs of leadership to the personal challenges of fatherhood, Andrew Marmont's journey offers a wealth of insights for anyone balancing these roles or leading someone who is a father. Andrew, a men's health expert and the founder of Tee30 Golf, shares his story of maintaining integrity through personal and professional ups and downs. His experiences remind us of the vital role empathy plays in leadership, and the necessity of self-care as a cornerstone of authentic living. By modeling these values, Andrew encourages us to lead by example in all areas of life, nurturing both our families and our teams.
Life often presents the delicate task of balancing work and family—a challenge Andrew knows all too well. Faced with burnout after becoming a father, he was faced with the decision of what really mattered to him, learning the importance of intentionality in one's priorities. This episode sheds light on the concept of work-life blend and the societal pressures fathers face, including "dad guilt." Andrew underscores the power of communication and community activities, such as golf clubs, as avenues for men to express themselves and cultivate supportive relationships.
We wrap up with an empowering conversation on how fathers can thrive through open communication and community support. The transition to parenthood is transformative, and Andrew stresses the significance of maintaining robust relationships both at home and work. He advocates for a work environment that supports new dads, ensuring they can be present with their families without fear of job insecurity. As Andrew explores the balance between external success and internal fulfillment, he invites us to redefine success through empathy, authenticity, and the everyday joys of life, like a child's embrace.
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🟦https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewmarmont/
🎤https://andrewmarmont.com/about
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jolynne Rydz (00:01):
One of the pivotal skills of a leader is empathy
that ability to see, feel andhear how someone might be
feeling, what they might bethinking, what has them excited
and motivated, and also what hasthem scared, embarrassed,
(00:21):
hiding away.
Part of stepping into our ownmagnetic authenticity is being
able to hold the space forothers to do the same, and each
and every one of the guests thatI invite onto this podcast are
leading that in some way, shapeor form, and this guest, no
(00:41):
matter who you are, I believeyou can resonate with.
So, whether you are a dad orsomeone, you're leading someone
who is a father or you knowsomeone who is a father very
highly likely that you do.
I believe we can all take awaya message from this when we can
see and hear someone's story andwhat they've been through and
(01:02):
what they see in their line ofwork as well, and hear someone's
story and what they've beenthrough and what they see in
their line of work as well.
I liken it to the matrix, whereyou can literally start to see
the code that goes beyond thestructures and the conditioning
that we have all received tobelieve that we need to live
life and lead and be successfulin one certain way, and there's
so many different ways to dothis.
(01:23):
So I'm really excited about ournext guest, Andrew Marmont.
He is a men's health expert, akeynote speaker and founder of
Tee30 Golf.
He knows the highs of reachingcareer Everest, presenting at
the Rugby League World Cup liveon national TV and radio, having
a column in Australia's numberone sports magazine and
(01:46):
travelling to four countries topromote his sports book.
Andrew Marmont also knows whatit's like to hit the lowest of
lows, suffering anxiety,nightmares and weight gain as a
new dad, while juggling businessand leadership roles, before he
rediscovered fun, fitness andconnection as a leader, a father
(02:09):
and a husband.
I'm sure you can relate.
We all hold so many roles inour lives, and so Andrew's goal,
through Tee30 Golf, is tocreate a safe space where people
can reconnect with themselvesso they can fill their cups and
give back to their teams andtheir loved ones.
So let's welcome our next guest.
(02:31):
Hi, Andrew, welcome into thepodcast.
So happy to have you here.
Andrew Marmont (02:36):
Thanks, Jolynne, it's great to be here.
Jolynne Rydz (02:38):
Yeah, fantastic.
So there's so much that I wantto talk to you about today, and
one of the things I wanted tostart with was just about the
way we lead in all differentroles in our life.
So our listeners might beleaders in business, in work, in
community, but also in family,and you'll be the first one
that's going to be speaking fromthis perspective in particular,
(03:00):
so it's great to have you here.
So my first question to you iswhat does leading as a dad
actually look like to you?
Andrew Marmont (03:18):
That's a great question, Jolynne.
I think, as a dad, leadingstarts with you.
So I think it starts withlooking after your own health,
because I'm a big believer inand I've seen it happen with my
dad and also other dads thatI've met along the way is that
if you can show up for you, sohave some strong sense of how do
you want to demonstrateleadership?
So, do you want to bephysically healthy?
(03:41):
Do you want to look after yourmental health?
Do you want to demonstratethrough your actions and your
behavior, through your integrity, all those sorts of things?
That, to me, is leadership,before you even look at work or
the external.
I think the first thing isreally about leading for the
person that you want to be, andthen everything else sort of
(04:05):
flows on from there.
Jolynne Rydz (04:06):
Yeah, I love that because it's about having that
real clarity about how you wantto show up as you and then
flowing on from that.
Yeah, that's so beautiful andyou talk about in the
discussions we've had aboutleadership really being about
being able to show up at workand at home.
I'd love for you to unpack themoment where you realised that
(04:27):
this was really important.
Andrew Marmont (04:29):
I think probably a few months after my little
boy came along.
I remember distinctly sittingdown on the couch here at home
with my hands on my head and Iwas really in a state of
(04:49):
something was not right, becauseI think I was burned out.
I think I was in the overwhelm,most likely because
responsibility is high on mycharacteristic traits or
personality traits, so I tend toput everyone else first anyway,
and I think that if you leavethat unchecked then it can lead
(05:11):
on to some stuff that you don'twant to have.
So that was probably the firsttime that I just realized.
I kind of almost sat with itand went okay, what's happening
here?
I think something needs tochange.
Take stock of things.
What's happening here?
I think something needs tochange.
Take stock of things.
And from there I just decidedto look at things from a bigger
(05:35):
picture level.
I think at that stage I wasstill in a state of almost like
external validation, so I wasstill wearing that business hat
on.
I'm the sort of big businessguy I was leading a small team
at work, but I also wanted to bethere at home for my wife and
(05:56):
my boy and I think I was justdoing too much and not actually
looking at.
Well, you've got to putyourself in that circle and once
I realized that, then I startedto make some changes.
So that's where I started toprioritize some physical health
again.
That's when also I, as thethings sort of rolled on, I
(06:24):
decided to look at from a familyperspective what was going to
be best right now, because bythen, you know, I was thinking
sort of at sort of 12 months.
Then my wife was looking to goback to work and I was going to
get to a decision where what wasgoing to happen with that and
with my business at the time.
So I think once, once I madethe decision that in this
(06:45):
instance I was going to walkaway from my business, so
selling the business that I had.
It became so much clearerbecause I realized that that's
when sometimes you've got tolook within and look at the
heart and go well, let's justtake a step back from what you
(07:05):
know, and you're like having theblinkers on and look at what's
best right now.
So I saw that that was a prettyeasy decision to kind of walk
away from that.
And then once I did that, thenthere was almost like a sense of
ease and contentment.
(07:26):
And a funny story Jolene, I sawsomeone over the weekend
actually, and I haven't seen himfor probably about a year, and
at that time I saw him at a.
It was a sort of speaking nightand you'll you sort of pitch
your idea, and back then I wasstill in my previous, I had my
previous sort of marketingbusiness owner hat on and anyway
(07:49):
.
So Julian sees me and he sayswell, wow, you look really good.
And he said I remember when welast, when you last, saw you,
you looked good too, but youwere stressed.
And I mentioned that to my wifeand she said, because you see
each other every day, you don'teven know, and maybe it's
(08:11):
because we put on this shell ofwho we think the world needs to
see, but it was very evidentbecause I can definitely feel
like I'm in a much differentplace than I was back then, but
still, there's still thatelement of leadership which I
think we were talking about atthe start.
So I feel like I'm much moreeffective now because I've
(08:33):
looked at what needs to happenand then you take action and you
kind of go from there, ratherthan what you think other people
want you to do or they sort ofencourage you to do.
I think sometimes you've justgot to step away from the noise
and go what's important for youright now.
There's lots of people withgreat ideas and they all want to
(08:54):
help, but it's really healthyto step away from that sometimes
.
Jolynne Rydz (08:58):
Yeah, and I mean that's a great leadership
practice in itself, isn't it?
In terms of just stepping back,taking stock and going what
really is the priority here?
What's the priority right now,even though you might have these
dreams of when things need tohappen and what you want to make
happen, but what's going to behelpful right now, and then
coming back to that with yourfamily as part of that
(09:18):
consideration.
So, yeah, I really want toacknowledge you for that.
I think that's an incredibleskill to be able to put into
practice and so, yeah, I guessI'd love to hear from your
perspective when you're notshowing up at work or when
you're not showing up at home,how do you think one impacts on
the other?
Andrew Marmont (09:38):
Well I think they're going to show up at,
either at work or at home,because that's where you spend
most of your time, and Iremember someone saying the
other day that they call itwork-life balance, but the
gentleman that was speaking tome said that he actually thinks
(09:59):
it more of a blend work-lifeblend, because you can't
separate it as much as maybe wethought we could 10 years ago.
Quite often we're working fromhome or we've got jobs that
require working.
Once we've put the kids to bed,we've got sort of commitments,
we've got that birthday withyour wife and you're going to
(10:20):
take her out, and you can't sortof.
I don't think it's not as easyto separate it as we once were.
I think what we can do, though,is a great analogy that my
friend Matt gave me last week.
He said so me having a coffeewith you.
Work me, that's 10% of me.
(10:41):
So if you get angry at me or I'mworking with you and suddenly
you're not happy, I don't care,because it's 10% of me.
90% of me, that's the home me,that's me with my family at the
dinner table, that's me havingtime for me, that's me reading
the book or meditating, orwhatever it is I do to look
(11:03):
after me, meditating or whateverit is I do to look after me.
So once I realized, or I sort oflooked at that as an analogy in
terms of leadership, if you'rethe other way, if 90% of you is
work you and 10% of you isfamily you, then maybe you've
got to look at what you thinkwhat leadership is right now,
(11:23):
because I can guarantee, if youask your spouse or your partner,
they will probably tell you theunvarnished truth that you're
focusing.
Yes, work's important for a lotof different reasons, but if
you approach it as 90% work and10% you, then there's nothing
(11:44):
left for the most importantpeople in your life.
And likewise, if you're 90% atwork, then people will feel that
too.
People will feel this realintensity.
That isn't always healthy,because they're probably trying
to figure out how do I blendwork and life.
So that was probably animportant lesson or story that I
(12:07):
took on board and it reallyhelps lighten things up a bit as
well.
Jolynne Rydz (12:11):
Yeah, and take life less seriously.
I've been one that's beenlearning that lesson.
I think, having been brought up, of career being so, so
important and then learning howto ease back and just have fun
with it?
Absolutely, there's a lot ofchallenges that get spoken about
when we talk about motherhood,and so I'd love to hear from
your perspective what are someof the hidden challenges that we
(12:33):
don't hear about that fathersare dealing with, and how does
that impact them at home and atwork.
Andrew Marmont (12:41):
That's another good question, jo, thank you.
And at work?
That's another good question,jo, thank you.
I think the first thing thatcomes to mind is I think as men,
we take on, we sort ofinternalize things and it's not
as easy for men to articulatewhat's going on in here and in
(13:01):
here, and so from thatperspective, in here and then in
here, and so from thatperspective, one hidden sort of
challenge is just being able tosay, hey, this is how I feel.
The day didn't go very well,this happened and this happened,
and I wanted to share how Ifelt at that stage.
That is such a foreignconversation for a lot of guys
(13:25):
and I've been through a lot ofwork on myself to bring that up
to the fore, because quite oftenit's just a really hard thing
to do.
So, that's the first thing Ithink there's.
There's a real from a societyperspective, society pressures,
particularly men, to put workand family first and therefore
themselves last.
(13:45):
And because they put work andfamily first, the unspoken sort
of conversation we, they, theywant some time for them, but
again they feel so guilty and Icall it dad guilt.
They feel so guilty and I callit dad guilt.
They feel so guilty becausethey feel like they need to be
working hard, because that'sgoing to help if you're the
number one provider, the roofover their head, the school fees
(14:06):
, the food in the fridge.
But of course, if you'reworking all the time, then what
happens if there's no time foryou again, then how do you
express I'd love to go for a run, or a couple of times a week,
I'd love to try and fit in a gym.
It's really around guilt.
Dad guilt is a big unspokenpiece.
And I think how do you alsotake work and lighten that for a
(14:37):
dad mentally?
Because we mentioned beforeJolene, if they're 90% work and
I see it, I've seen it lots thenthe family's not going to have
anything left.
So again, it's being able tocommunicate really effectively
and it can just be an openconversation is really important
(15:00):
, particularly with your partner.
With this, I think, there are acouple of things that sort of
come to mind.
And yeah, how do you sort ofwork through that as a dad?
How do you remove the idea ofthis pressure that society puts
on you to say, well, even ifyou're not the primary carer,
then how do you still build thatrelationship with your son or
(15:25):
your daughter or what have you?
So there's all these thingsthat dads are trying to figure
out, but unless you perhaps havesome context, or unless you
have some people like other dadsto speak about which is why I
think organizations like DadsGroup is great.
We get together and we talkabout dad stuff.
What's going on in?
your world as a dad, what'sgoing on at work?
(15:46):
How is that sort of translatingto home?
How are you expressing thingsother than anger?
What are those sort of thingsthat you can do?
And you know, sharing ideasaround relationships those
things are so, so powerful.
Um, like a great thing that I Ilike to, that I like to share,
(16:08):
is or just listen about someways that that the dads in my
sort of community you know howthey build their relationships
with their wives.
It could be doing like amonthly date night or booking a
sort of occasional trip whereit's just them and the
babysitter's sort of gone.
The difference between the dadsand the mums I think the mums
(16:31):
are a lot more forthcoming withbeing able to communicate about
this sort of stuff.
Dads would prefer an informalactivity to talk about stuff as
opposed to formal avenues.
I mean, just last week I was ina meeting and I remember the
(16:54):
guy I was with he sort of citedsome research that men just
don't prefer the formal avenueof being able to get some help.
They much prefer to go to a itmight be golf or some sort of
activity and then they can sharewhat's going on.
I think a lot of it boils downto communication.
Jolynne Rydz (17:11):
Yeah, totally, I think communication is key on so
so many levels and in careersand work and business we often
have access to tools to learnhow to communicate better.
But when it comes to families,I think it's the luck of the
draw of how your familycommunicated with you growing up
and that's your role model andI found, as a mother going
(17:34):
through the system, there's somuch support for mothers and
it's in that formal way and it'stailored to mothers and it's to
the point where I remember onetime I was trying to get a
maternal child healthappointment phone call going
through to my partner and I saidthis is the number, I'm not
available, you need to call him.
And they called me and theydidn't even register.
(17:57):
They took all the notes and itjust defaults to the mother.
So much and I think that'sreally sad because there's this
whole movement and expectationof men starting to be more in
tune with their emotions, beingable to talk about it, but
there's this lack of support Ifeel.
Being able to talk about it,but there's this lack of support
(18:19):
, I feel and recognition thatmen don't have that same access
to that learning that women gothrough as kids and
generationally.
We don't have that same kind ofknowledge when you look at
males and females.
So, in a long way, what I'mtrying to get to is that what's
lacking for you in terms ofsupport for dads and and is that
(18:40):
kind of what led you tostarting a t30 golf I think
having some informal groups wasthe is the first thing that
comes to mind to be able to, ifyou call, put it, could it?
Andrew Marmont (18:53):
mom's group?
That's where dad's group is sowonderful.
More resources aroundcommunication, specifically
communication about emotions andfeelings, because, again,
that's the basis of everything.
As we know, in allrelationships, business, work,
that's the same thing, isn't it?
Jolynne Rydz (19:14):
Yeah.
Andrew Marmont (19:15):
Business work and at home, and you know your
friends, like your support group, everything Self-talk, it's all
related to communication.
So if I was, you know, a coupleof months before you know my
son was born, having a workshoparound the first 12 months of
being a parent, how tocommunicate fairly articulate,
(19:39):
you know, like clearly, um, yeah, how to have those sort of
conversations when you've got nosleep.
You know you're sitting on twohours sleep, you're, you've got
all these things sort ofhappening.
Yeah, how do you best do that?
Because some people be moreadvanced than than others.
Um, and in relation to settingup the t30 golf, it was more it
(20:01):
was around the idea of of thatcommunity, yes, uh, but also
having that organized activitythat that brought that initially
will bring people joy anyway,because for me me in a selfish
way, the idea of driving past agolf course and looking at the
pristine greens and themanicured sort of gardens.
(20:23):
It just filled me with happinessand joy, anyway, just the idea
of that experience.
So to introduce people to thatexperience, that gets me really
excited.
And to introduce people to thegame of golf, that gets me
really excited.
And to introduce people to thegame of golf, that gets me
really excited.
Because a lot of I found that alot of guys that I'm speaking
to have.
(20:44):
They have never played beforebut they want to give it a go
and they and they see thebenefit, they see the social
aspect of it as well.
So, having options options, Ithink, for dads, and that's
definitely becoming moreprevalent now there's lots of
great things that are popping upfor men and for dads the last,
probably five years.
(21:04):
One of them, recently I heard,was a book group and I think it
was something like the Tough MenBook Clubs.
I could be wrong on the exactname, but it was just guys with
a book club.
So, there's definitely moreresources available now, and
that's a really good thing, butI think it just starts with the
(21:26):
communication.
It just starts with can youteach men to become better
communicators, particularly whenthe pressure goes on in
unfamiliar situations, becausemen like to problem solve and
men like responsibility andpurpose, and if we don't have
the tools to be able to do that,we get frustrated.
And I think I'm not speaking onthe whole male race here, but
(21:47):
that's just that's.
I think what I see across theboard is being able to
communicate better.
Jolynne Rydz (21:54):
Yeah, definitely.
It's so, so powerful, so needed, and for anyone that is a
leader out there that'slistening and they might have a
new dad in their team or afather, what do you think is the
number one thing someone's bosscan give that person in terms
of support?
Andrew Marmont (22:14):
The first thing, I think, is just probably
listening and asking, likeopening the questions, how's it
going?
Like, how are you feeling aboutbeing a dad?
And sort of anticipating whatthey might be thinking, because
they might be thinking, oh, Ican't take time off work or I
feel guilty because I've got totake three weeks off or four
weeks off or whatever it is, Istill want to be plugged in.
(22:37):
So, probably just normalizingthat idea of there's such an
important time, the first 12weeks you really need to be
there, if leave permits, andhaving that show of trust and
recognizing it's such a big timein everyone's lives it's going
(23:02):
to impact the employee in waysthat they probably don't realize
yet.
And acknowledging that and justsort of being there as well,
like just sort of not puttingall these expectations on them.
Well, like just just sort ofnot putting all these
expectations on them.
Obviously you've still got todo your job, if, if that's the
reality of the the situation.
But yeah, just just sort ofbeing just listening I think is
(23:25):
probably the first thing andreally don't have to give advice
or or say anything like that.
It's more, they might befeeling really scared.
They might be feeling reallyscared, they might be feeling
guilty, they might be feelingoverwhelmed, all these different
things.
So being able to just have moreof those kind of open
(23:47):
conversations, without judgment,without advice, because work is
important for a lot of people,so being able to just sort of
say, hey, your job's still here,it's not going anywhere, we've
completely got that on board.
Like, for example, when I wenton dad leave I think it was only
(24:08):
initially for a couple of weeksand then I had because I was
still running my marketingbusiness.
But I remember I sort of pulledmy team in my virtual meeting
like this, and I said I'm goingto take a couple of weeks off,
and all of them put their handup and said, look, we'll take on
(24:29):
it.
You know, we'll take on all theclients.
You just, you don't worry, youenjoy it, like so to me it was
amazing to have that support andI think if all people who are,
you know, dads who had that kindof support where we think, okay
, well, a, you're there for me,the job is safe, like secure,
(24:49):
maybe that's a real big part ofit.
So that's looked after.
I'm here, I'm going to supportyou, I'm not going to call you
in your leave because you've gotto be.
You know being present isreally important.
They don't want to be thinkingabout work.
So there's just differentpeople will have different
approaches, but being open,being just listening and
(25:10):
understanding that, yeah, it's abig time for everyone.
Jolynne Rydz (25:12):
Yeah, and it's almost like creating this
headspace by taking away thosesecond thoughts.
As if my job's secure, do Ineed to be guilty about how I'm
performing against everyone elsein the team?
If you take that all away, thenthere's just so much more
energy to do the job well andalso to be present with the
family too.
Andrew Marmont (25:29):
Absolutely, and that will be rewarded down the
line.
That's the big thing.
If you give some right now, inthat real overwhelming period,
then that's far greater than anypay rise or anything like that.
They just want you tounderstand that.
(25:50):
This is what I'm going through.
Yeah, as you say, jolene, thejob's secure.
You're giving me that time.
I'll come back refreshed, amuch more present, productive
employee, because I've had thattime to bond with my partner,
with my newborn.
That would be a great situationas a leader to have that trust,
integrity, all those things.
Jolynne Rydz (26:12):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I love it, and so we've talked a
lot about communication today,and it's important at work.
It's important in familyenvironment.
In your experience, what's theultimate thing that dads want
from their partner that maybethey struggle to ask for or
articulate?
Andrew Marmont (26:31):
That's a good question, jolene.
Probably just a safe space tobe able to talk through what's
on their mind.
So that would be a big thing, Ithink.
I think, whether it's pushingthe pram each night or maybe
it's a dedicated time in thecalendar each week, like how's
(26:52):
the week been, how are youfeeling, is there stuff that's
been happening that you wantedto talk about?
Like really having that realopenness is going to strengthen
throughout the whole time.
Again, because men, I don'tthink we're as strong in the
communication stakes.
Having the ability to have asafe space or even sort of
(27:18):
learning how to do that a bitbetter, I think is going to be
important.
So you can kind of take thatback to your partner.
When, a few months before mychild was going to come along, I
remember having golf with a myfriend called jeff and he had I
think his boy was maybe fouryears old and jeff said
something to me that I alwaysremember.
He said never forget who youloved first, because as soon as
(27:44):
that baby comes, that's a wholequadrant of your time, attention
, energy, et cetera.
So if you always have that inthe back of your mind, that's
going to hold you in good stead,and I tell that to every
unexpecting dad, new dad.
I relay that story because tome it's just a gentle reminder
(28:05):
to think well, yeah, you've gottwo people ideally bringing up
this little person.
So having a separate space forthat relationship to grow and
continue to deepen is reallyimportant.
So how can you create more waysto do that, along with the
(28:30):
exercise in raising this newborn?
Jolynne Rydz (28:32):
Yeah, and I love that because I work with leaders
currently but I've done a lotof life coaching as well.
So a lot of people come to mebecause they're going through a
life transition, so like they'regetting a newborn, and that
family dynamic is a lifetransition from being in a
relationship with a partner tonow a family.
(28:52):
But then also at the other endI noticed when the kids grow up
and leave home, if they haven'tkept that love and relationship
strong, there's this whole gapthat gets created of, oh, what
is our life purpose now that thekids have grown up and they
don't need us in the same waythat they needed us for 18 years
?
Like it's a really, a reallybig thing that people are
(29:13):
grappling with.
So I love that in terms of justkeeping that first love strong.
Andrew Marmont (29:19):
It's key.
And again, you can be reallycreative around how you do that.
It could be shared activitiestogether or, as I say, one of my
favorites is the monthly datenight, or it could be a
quarterly date night, orwhatever.
It is, where you pick a letterand it's alphabetical and the
other person has to organizeeverything you know, organize it
, drive you there or get youthere somehow, and then you walk
(29:42):
up and it's ah surprise, it'sGerman food.
German food gee yeah exactly or,or, if it's like q, you've got
to be a bit creative, so um justfun things like that.
I think there can be reallysome simple things, whatever.
Whatever you would findcreative and doable at at the
moment um, because not everyonecan do that, but it could be
(30:05):
something else, like you mighthave again a shared activity or
whatever it is.
I think there is space to becreative even when it's long
hours doing work and home.
Jolynne Rydz (30:20):
Yeah, I know, I love that.
It's fun, isn't it just beingcreative?
Andrew Marmont (30:23):
Totally, we're all creative.
Even if we don't think we areor we're in jobs that aren't
sort of being creative Totally.
We're all creative, Even if wedon't think we are.
We're in jobs that aren't sortof traditionally creative.
We all definitely can becreative.
Jolynne Rydz (30:34):
Yeah, totally.
And so, before I bring us intoour Swift 7 questions, there's
one final question I'd love toask you, Andrew, which is as a
leader, as a dad, as a businessowner what does success actually
look like for you when you'rewearing these multiple hats?
Andrew Marmont (30:51):
That's a great question, jolene, and someone
asked me a similar question.
They said what are your goalsnext year?
And I never really thoughtabout them.
The first thing is prioritizeself-care each day.
So have some different things.
That would mean that you'relooking after your own self-care
each day and try and tick thoseoff.
So that's probably the firstthing.
(31:13):
Second thing quality time withfamily.
So in terms of being presentwith family, that's a big
success.
And then from there I guess youcan put in your one work goal
and you've kind of got yourselfsorted Leadership-wise.
There was a coach that I usedto work with and I remember he
(31:37):
was looking at ways to thinkabout success and in his view it
was always external first andthen kind of internal last.
But you might know, jolene,that there's a, is it be?
Do have.
Jolynne Rydz (31:55):
Yeah.
Andrew Marmont (31:57):
And I think we get have, do be is sort of the.
A lot of people get sucked intothat.
So I think, yeah, if you lookat B, do have.
So who am I and what are mybehaviors and am I looking after
me?
Will allow me to then have thequality time or whatever it
looks like, and that will sortof go from there.
(32:19):
So, yeah, I think for next year, if you're a leader and you're
thinking about what does successlook like again, maybe you're
90% work or even 70% work thinkabout, well, what would it look
like if I switch that?
It doesn't have to be, thehours would be less or that time
(32:39):
.
But what if I paid moreattention to other things?
What if I made food on theweekends, you know like, or what
?
What can I, what can I do toreprioritize some of the things
that maybe I've been neglecting?
You'll be much more balanced,um, when you go back to, when
(32:59):
you go to work again, becauseyou know, that both both sides
or your circle is is lookedafter.
Some of them might be out ofequilibrium, but having that
balanced look to me that's whatsuccess looks like.
You balance the way that youlook at those things.
Jolynne Rydz (33:20):
Yeah, and what I love about what you just shared
is none of it was around likehaving a house, having a car,
having the job title and it'sall about these.
What can you be doing?
How are you being that?
And it's so much morecontrollable, isn't it?
Those little things that youcan do each day, that makes you
feel successful right now,rather than having to wait, you
know, five, 10 years to get afeeling of success.
Andrew Marmont (33:42):
You and I both know, jolene, you know being in,
doing programs and goingthrough.
I both know, jolene, you knowbeing and doing programs and
going through being surroundedby people who are probably more
external success focused, sothat can have a big impact what
it did on me around.
I'm chasing this, I'm chasingthis and that's why I think my
(34:04):
friend Julian said you lookstressed, and I didn't even know
it look stressed and I didn'teven know it because I so having
a balanced approach where, yeah, if you, if you know that
you're doing the right thing foryou, and then and you go
outwards in your circle, thenthat's going to you're going to
be more balanced and you'regoing to you're going to be
happier, for sure.
Jolynne Rydz (34:23):
Yeah, a hundred percent Awesome.
So let's now transition to ourSwift 7.
So these are seven Swiftquestions that you don't need to
overthink, just first thingthat comes to mind.
Feel free to share, and just away to really get to know you a
little bit better.
So, in your view, firstquestion what are three words to
describe an ideal leader?
Andrew Marmont (34:45):
Resilient, passionate, confident.
Jolynne Rydz (34:49):
Yeah, love it and fill in the blank.
Andrew Marmont (34:53):
Magnetic authenticity is Showing up as
you every day.
Jolynne Rydz (34:58):
Love that Number three.
When you notice yourself tryingto fit in, what's the first
thing that you do?
Andrew Marmont (35:05):
Take off your shoes.
Jolynne Rydz (35:08):
Oh, yes, yes, I'm like thinking physically, take
off your shoes, but yeah,metaphorically take off your
shoes.
Yeah, okay, cool.
Number four what's a song thatgets you really pumped?
Andrew Marmont (35:22):
I'll tell you that I'm just trying to think of
the name of the song.
Jolynne Rydz (35:26):
You can sing it if you like.
Andrew Marmont (35:29):
We won't be doing that.
Here we go.
Moby Stars, I think it's called.
Jolynne Rydz (35:40):
Yes, I do like Moby, nice one.
Andrew Marmont (35:41):
Okay, number five.
What's the most daring thingyou've ever done, andrew?
When I was nine, for a schoolproject I called up the famous
mountaineer, sir Edmund Hillaryand asked him three questions
about climbing Mount Everest.
Yeah, I was nine.
That's so cool, that was prettydaring, I thought for a
nine-year-old I think so Justgoing.
Jolynne Rydz (36:00):
Oh yeah, no boundaries, let's just call them
and see whether they respond.
Yeah, I love that.
And so number six do you have afavorite quote or mantra that
you live by?
Andrew Marmont (36:11):
I guess we could call it the Tee30 tagline,
which is go home happy.
That probably comes to mind.
Jolynne Rydz (36:17):
Yeah, I love that.
That's really, really cool.
And number seven you've alreadyshared one, so I'm going to
challenge you to share adifferent thing, which is what's
one small thing that brings youincredible joy.
Andrew Marmont (36:32):
When my boy runs and jumps into my arms after
daycare.
Jolynne Rydz (36:37):
Yeah, that's like one of my favorites as well.
It's such an amazing feeling.
Yeah, it's just like this pure,unbound, unconditional love and
presence.
Yeah, so powerful, yeah andpresence, yeah, so powerful.
Andrew Marmont (36:49):
Yeah, every time it goes in my diary.
Jolynne Rydz (36:53):
I love it.
So you actually write it down,do you?
Andrew Marmont (36:56):
Yeah, I've got a five-year diary and I'll write
it every time.
Yeah.
Jolynne Rydz (37:01):
Oh, that's cool.
I like that Very nice.
Well, this has been anincredible conversation and I
love where we've gone with itand I love just how relatable to
leadership in any role it is.
Like it's all you know, leadingas a dad is really, at its
fundamental, the same as leadingwith a team, like there's so
(37:23):
many skills that you can useacross the board, which is
amazing.
And so if people want to learnmore about what you do your
keynoting or T30 Golf where canthey find you?
Andrew Marmont (37:33):
For speaking, andrewmarmontcom, or connect
with me on LinkedIn, AndrewMarmont, and for Tee30 Golf,
it's t30golfcomau, sot-e-e-30golfcomau
Jolynne Rydz (37:50):
Yeah, wonderful.
I'll pop the links in the shownotes as well, so people can
find it nice and easy.
It's been amazing having youhere, Andrew.
Thank you so much for your timeand sharing your wisdom and
openness with the world.
Thank you for what you do.
Andrew Marmont (38:02):
Thank you, Jolynne.
Thanks so much.
I really appreciate it.
Jolynne Rydz (38:06):
I trust that you found some nuggets of gold in
that episode, and there are acouple of nuggets that I'd like
to reflect on because I thinkthey are really, really key.
So the first one is work lifeblend.
It's so similar to something Italk about in terms of work life
alignment, and how does thatblend show up for you?
How much of your time andenergy, emotional energy, goes
(38:30):
into work versus things outsideof work that matter to you, and
is that percentage the right fitfor you?
The power of open communicationcame up time and time again, and
that applies in life andleadership and the workplace.
It's no longer a nice skill.
It's actually critical if wecare about feeling heard,
(38:54):
understood and supported andbeing able to empower ourselves
to gain that support.
And the thing I noticed is thata lot of these skills are
available and taught throughlarger corporate organizations,
ones that have the big budgetsto deploy this kind of learning,
but there's a lot of peoplethat don't have access to that,
(39:15):
and actually it's one of thereasons why I do this kind of
work is because I think it'sunfair, and I think there is
room for everyone to be able toarticulate how they feel in a
way that gets them theacknowledgement and the support
and the love that they receiveand deserve.
And the third thing that I lovedabout this episode was that
(39:38):
there were some really easy tipsthere on how do you empower
fathers in the workplace, andthat reassurance of their job
security being really key,because there's so much
messaging around there abouttraditionally males being the
provider, and I loved that pointabout mum guilt as well and dad
(39:59):
guilt right.
Mum guilt gets talked a lotabout, but how often have you
heard the term dad guilt come upand really acknowledge that
someone is doing their best,they're trying to provide for
their family financially,they're trying to be there
emotionally and support theirfamily and lead them, but
sometimes feeling like that's atthe expense of their own
(40:19):
well-being and their cup.
A very familiar story that I'msure a lot of people can
resonate with, but one that'snot often articulated from the
traditional male fatherperspective.
So thank you so much to Andrewfor giving us this insight.
I hope that has allowed you insome way to see someone that you
(40:40):
know differently and maybe givethem space to step in and have
those open conversations thatare so, so important and
powerful.
Remember, you were born for areason it's time to thrive.
One of the pivotal skills of a leader is empathy
that ability to see, feel andhear how someone might be
feeling, what they might bethinking, what has them excited
and motivated, and also what hasthem scared, embarrassed,
(00:21):
hiding away.
Part of stepping into our ownmagnetic authenticity is being
able to hold the space forothers to do the same, and each
and every one of the guests thatI invite onto this podcast are
leading that in some way, shapeor form, and this guest, no
(00:41):
matter who you are, I believeyou can resonate with.
So, whether you are a dad orsomeone, you're leading someone
who is a father or you knowsomeone who is a father very
highly likely that you do.
I believe we can all take awaya message from this when we can
see and hear someone's story andwhat they've been through and
(01:02):
what they see in their line ofwork as well, and hear someone's
story and what they've beenthrough and what they see in
their line of work as well.
I liken it to the matrix, whereyou can literally start to see
the code that goes beyond thestructures and the conditioning
that we have all received tobelieve that we need to live
life and lead and be successfulin one certain way, and there's
so many different ways to dothis.
(01:23):
So I'm really excited about ournext guest, Andrew Marmont.
He is a men's health expert, akeynote speaker and founder of
Tee30 Golf.
He knows the highs of reachingcareer Everest, presenting at
the Rugby League World Cup liveon national TV and radio, having
a column in Australia's numberone sports magazine and
(01:46):
travelling to four countries topromote his sports book.
Andrew Marmont also knows whatit's like to hit the lowest of
lows, suffering anxiety,nightmares and weight gain as a
new dad, while juggling businessand leadership roles, before he
rediscovered fun, fitness andconnection as a leader, a father
(02:09):
and a husband.
I'm sure you can relate.
We all hold so many roles inour lives, and so Andrew's goal,
through Tee30 Golf, is tocreate a safe space where people
can reconnect with themselvesso they can fill their cups and
give back to their teams andtheir loved ones.
So let's welcome our next guest.
(02:31):
Hi, Andrew, welcome into thepodcast.
So happy to have you here.
Andrew Marmont (02:36):
Thanks, Jolynne, it's great to be here.
Jolynne Rydz (02:38):
Yeah, fantastic.
So there's so much that I wantto talk to you about today, and
one of the things I wanted tostart with was just about the
way we lead in all differentroles in our life.
So our listeners might beleaders in business, in work, in
community, but also in family,and you'll be the first one
that's going to be speaking fromthis perspective in particular,
(03:00):
so it's great to have you here.
So my first question to you iswhat does leading as a dad
actually look like to you?
Andrew Marmont (03:18):
That's a great question, Jolynne.
I think, as a dad, leadingstarts with you.
So I think it starts withlooking after your own health,
because I'm a big believer inand I've seen it happen with my
dad and also other dads thatI've met along the way is that
if you can show up for you, sohave some strong sense of how do
you want to demonstrateleadership?
So, do you want to bephysically healthy?
(03:41):
Do you want to look after yourmental health?
Do you want to demonstratethrough your actions and your
behavior, through your integrity, all those sorts of things?
That, to me, is leadership,before you even look at work or
the external.
I think the first thing isreally about leading for the
person that you want to be, andthen everything else sort of
(04:05):
flows on from there.
Jolynne Rydz (04:06):
Yeah, I love that because it's about having that
real clarity about how you wantto show up as you and then
flowing on from that.
Yeah, that's so beautiful andyou talk about in the
discussions we've had aboutleadership really being about
being able to show up at workand at home.
I'd love for you to unpack themoment where you realised that
(04:27):
this was really important.
Andrew Marmont (04:29):
I think probably a few months after my little
boy came along.
I remember distinctly sittingdown on the couch here at home
with my hands on my head and Iwas really in a state of
(04:49):
something was not right, becauseI think I was burned out.
I think I was in the overwhelm,most likely because
responsibility is high on mycharacteristic traits or
personality traits, so I tend toput everyone else first anyway,
and I think that if you leavethat unchecked then it can lead
(05:11):
on to some stuff that you don'twant to have.
So that was probably the firsttime that I just realized.
I kind of almost sat with itand went okay, what's happening
here?
I think something needs tochange.
Take stock of things.
What's happening here?
I think something needs tochange.
Take stock of things.
And from there I just decidedto look at things from a bigger
(05:35):
picture level.
I think at that stage I wasstill in a state of almost like
external validation, so I wasstill wearing that business hat
on.
I'm the sort of big businessguy I was leading a small team
at work, but I also wanted to bethere at home for my wife and
(05:56):
my boy and I think I was justdoing too much and not actually
looking at.
Well, you've got to putyourself in that circle and once
I realized that, then I startedto make some changes.
So that's where I started toprioritize some physical health
again.
That's when also I, as thethings sort of rolled on, I
(06:24):
decided to look at from a familyperspective what was going to
be best right now, because bythen, you know, I was thinking
sort of at sort of 12 months.
Then my wife was looking to goback to work and I was going to
get to a decision where what wasgoing to happen with that and
with my business at the time.
So I think once, once I madethe decision that in this
(06:45):
instance I was going to walkaway from my business, so
selling the business that I had.
It became so much clearerbecause I realized that that's
when sometimes you've got tolook within and look at the
heart and go well, let's justtake a step back from what you
(07:05):
know, and you're like having theblinkers on and look at what's
best right now.
So I saw that that was a prettyeasy decision to kind of walk
away from that.
And then once I did that, thenthere was almost like a sense of
ease and contentment.
(07:26):
And a funny story Jolene, I sawsomeone over the weekend
actually, and I haven't seen himfor probably about a year, and
at that time I saw him at a.
It was a sort of speaking nightand you'll you sort of pitch
your idea, and back then I wasstill in my previous, I had my
previous sort of marketingbusiness owner hat on and anyway
(07:49):
.
So Julian sees me and he sayswell, wow, you look really good.
And he said I remember when welast, when you last, saw you,
you looked good too, but youwere stressed.
And I mentioned that to my wifeand she said, because you see
each other every day, you don'teven know, and maybe it's
(08:11):
because we put on this shell ofwho we think the world needs to
see, but it was very evidentbecause I can definitely feel
like I'm in a much differentplace than I was back then, but
still, there's still thatelement of leadership which I
think we were talking about atthe start.
So I feel like I'm much moreeffective now because I've
(08:33):
looked at what needs to happenand then you take action and you
kind of go from there, ratherthan what you think other people
want you to do or they sort ofencourage you to do.
I think sometimes you've justgot to step away from the noise
and go what's important for youright now.
There's lots of people withgreat ideas and they all want to
(08:54):
help, but it's really healthyto step away from that sometimes
.
Jolynne Rydz (08:58):
Yeah, and I mean that's a great leadership
practice in itself, isn't it?
In terms of just stepping back,taking stock and going what
really is the priority here?
What's the priority right now,even though you might have these
dreams of when things need tohappen and what you want to make
happen, but what's going to behelpful right now, and then
coming back to that with yourfamily as part of that
(09:18):
consideration.
So, yeah, I really want toacknowledge you for that.
I think that's an incredibleskill to be able to put into
practice and so, yeah, I guessI'd love to hear from your
perspective when you're notshowing up at work or when
you're not showing up at home,how do you think one impacts on
the other?
Andrew Marmont (09:38):
Well I think they're going to show up at,
either at work or at home,because that's where you spend
most of your time, and Iremember someone saying the
other day that they call itwork-life balance, but the
gentleman that was speaking tome said that he actually thinks
(09:59):
it more of a blend work-lifeblend, because you can't
separate it as much as maybe wethought we could 10 years ago.
Quite often we're working fromhome or we've got jobs that
require working.
Once we've put the kids to bed,we've got sort of commitments,
we've got that birthday withyour wife and you're going to
(10:20):
take her out, and you can't sortof.
I don't think it's not as easyto separate it as we once were.
I think what we can do, though,is a great analogy that my
friend Matt gave me last week.
He said so me having a coffeewith you.
Work me, that's 10% of me.
(10:41):
So if you get angry at me or I'mworking with you and suddenly
you're not happy, I don't care,because it's 10% of me.
90% of me, that's the home me,that's me with my family at the
dinner table, that's me havingtime for me, that's me reading
the book or meditating, orwhatever it is I do to look
(11:03):
after me, meditating or whateverit is I do to look after me.
So once I realized, or I sort oflooked at that as an analogy in
terms of leadership, if you'rethe other way, if 90% of you is
work you and 10% of you isfamily you, then maybe you've
got to look at what you thinkwhat leadership is right now,
(11:23):
because I can guarantee, if youask your spouse or your partner,
they will probably tell you theunvarnished truth that you're
focusing.
Yes, work's important for a lotof different reasons, but if
you approach it as 90% work and10% you, then there's nothing
(11:44):
left for the most importantpeople in your life.
And likewise, if you're 90% atwork, then people will feel that
too.
People will feel this realintensity.
That isn't always healthy,because they're probably trying
to figure out how do I blendwork and life.
So that was probably animportant lesson or story that I
(12:07):
took on board and it reallyhelps lighten things up a bit as
well.
Jolynne Rydz (12:11):
Yeah, and take life less seriously.
I've been one that's beenlearning that lesson.
I think, having been brought up, of career being so, so
important and then learning howto ease back and just have fun
with it?
Absolutely, there's a lot ofchallenges that get spoken about
when we talk about motherhood,and so I'd love to hear from
your perspective what are someof the hidden challenges that we
(12:33):
don't hear about that fathersare dealing with, and how does
that impact them at home and atwork.
Andrew Marmont (12:41):
That's another good question, jo, thank you.
And at work?
That's another good question,jo, thank you.
I think the first thing thatcomes to mind is I think as men,
we take on, we sort ofinternalize things and it's not
as easy for men to articulatewhat's going on in here and in
(13:01):
here, and so from thatperspective, in here and then in
here, and so from thatperspective, one hidden sort of
challenge is just being able tosay, hey, this is how I feel.
The day didn't go very well,this happened and this happened,
and I wanted to share how Ifelt at that stage.
That is such a foreignconversation for a lot of guys
(13:25):
and I've been through a lot ofwork on myself to bring that up
to the fore, because quite oftenit's just a really hard thing
to do.
So, that's the first thing Ithink there's.
There's a real from a societyperspective, society pressures,
particularly men, to put workand family first and therefore
themselves last.
(13:45):
And because they put work andfamily first, the unspoken sort
of conversation we, they, theywant some time for them, but
again they feel so guilty and Icall it dad guilt.
They feel so guilty and I callit dad guilt.
They feel so guilty becausethey feel like they need to be
working hard, because that'sgoing to help if you're the
number one provider, the roofover their head, the school fees
(14:06):
, the food in the fridge.
But of course, if you'reworking all the time, then what
happens if there's no time foryou again, then how do you
express I'd love to go for a run, or a couple of times a week,
I'd love to try and fit in a gym.
It's really around guilt.
Dad guilt is a big unspokenpiece.
And I think how do you alsotake work and lighten that for a
(14:37):
dad mentally?
Because we mentioned beforeJolene, if they're 90% work and
I see it, I've seen it lots thenthe family's not going to have
anything left.
So again, it's being able tocommunicate really effectively
and it can just be an openconversation is really important
(15:00):
, particularly with your partner.
With this, I think, there are acouple of things that sort of
come to mind.
And yeah, how do you sort ofwork through that as a dad?
How do you remove the idea ofthis pressure that society puts
on you to say, well, even ifyou're not the primary carer,
then how do you still build thatrelationship with your son or
(15:25):
your daughter or what have you?
So there's all these thingsthat dads are trying to figure
out, but unless you perhaps havesome context, or unless you
have some people like other dadsto speak about which is why I
think organizations like DadsGroup is great.
We get together and we talkabout dad stuff.
What's going on in?
your world as a dad, what'sgoing on at work?
(15:46):
How is that sort of translatingto home?
How are you expressing thingsother than anger?
What are those sort of thingsthat you can do?
And you know, sharing ideasaround relationships those
things are so, so powerful.
Um, like a great thing that I Ilike to, that I like to share,
(16:08):
is or just listen about someways that that the dads in my
sort of community you know howthey build their relationships
with their wives.
It could be doing like amonthly date night or booking a
sort of occasional trip whereit's just them and the
babysitter's sort of gone.
The difference between the dadsand the mums I think the mums
(16:31):
are a lot more forthcoming withbeing able to communicate about
this sort of stuff.
Dads would prefer an informalactivity to talk about stuff as
opposed to formal avenues.
I mean, just last week I was ina meeting and I remember the
(16:54):
guy I was with he sort of citedsome research that men just
don't prefer the formal avenueof being able to get some help.
They much prefer to go to a itmight be golf or some sort of
activity and then they can sharewhat's going on.
I think a lot of it boils downto communication.
Jolynne Rydz (17:11):
Yeah, totally, I think communication is key on so
so many levels and in careersand work and business we often
have access to tools to learnhow to communicate better.
But when it comes to families,I think it's the luck of the
draw of how your familycommunicated with you growing up
and that's your role model andI found, as a mother going
(17:34):
through the system, there's somuch support for mothers and
it's in that formal way and it'stailored to mothers and it's to
the point where I remember onetime I was trying to get a
maternal child healthappointment phone call going
through to my partner and I saidthis is the number, I'm not
available, you need to call him.
And they called me and theydidn't even register.
(17:57):
They took all the notes and itjust defaults to the mother.
So much and I think that'sreally sad because there's this
whole movement and expectationof men starting to be more in
tune with their emotions, beingable to talk about it, but
there's this lack of support Ifeel.
Being able to talk about it,but there's this lack of support
(18:19):
, I feel and recognition thatmen don't have that same access
to that learning that women gothrough as kids and
generationally.
We don't have that same kind ofknowledge when you look at
males and females.
So, in a long way, what I'mtrying to get to is that what's
lacking for you in terms ofsupport for dads and and is that
(18:40):
kind of what led you tostarting a t30 golf I think
having some informal groups wasthe is the first thing that
comes to mind to be able to, ifyou call, put it, could it?
Andrew Marmont (18:53):
mom's group?
That's where dad's group is sowonderful.
More resources aroundcommunication, specifically
communication about emotions andfeelings, because, again,
that's the basis of everything.
As we know, in allrelationships, business, work,
that's the same thing, isn't it?
Jolynne Rydz (19:14):
Yeah.
Andrew Marmont (19:15):
Business work and at home, and you know your
friends, like your support group, everything Self-talk, it's all
related to communication.
So if I was, you know, a coupleof months before you know my
son was born, having a workshoparound the first 12 months of
being a parent, how tocommunicate fairly articulate,
(19:39):
you know, like clearly, um, yeah, how to have those sort of
conversations when you've got nosleep.
You know you're sitting on twohours sleep, you're, you've got
all these things sort ofhappening.
Yeah, how do you best do that?
Because some people be moreadvanced than than others.
Um, and in relation to settingup the t30 golf, it was more it
(20:01):
was around the idea of of thatcommunity, yes, uh, but also
having that organized activitythat that brought that initially
will bring people joy anyway,because for me me in a selfish
way, the idea of driving past agolf course and looking at the
pristine greens and themanicured sort of gardens.
(20:23):
It just filled me with happinessand joy, anyway, just the idea
of that experience.
So to introduce people to thatexperience, that gets me really
excited.
And to introduce people to thegame of golf, that gets me
really excited.
And to introduce people to thegame of golf, that gets me
really excited.
Because a lot of I found that alot of guys that I'm speaking
to have.
(20:44):
They have never played beforebut they want to give it a go
and they and they see thebenefit, they see the social
aspect of it as well.
So, having options options, Ithink, for dads, and that's
definitely becoming moreprevalent now there's lots of
great things that are popping upfor men and for dads the last,
probably five years.
(21:04):
One of them, recently I heard,was a book group and I think it
was something like the Tough MenBook Clubs.
I could be wrong on the exactname, but it was just guys with
a book club.
So, there's definitely moreresources available now, and
that's a really good thing, butI think it just starts with the
(21:26):
communication.
It just starts with can youteach men to become better
communicators, particularly whenthe pressure goes on in
unfamiliar situations, becausemen like to problem solve and
men like responsibility andpurpose, and if we don't have
the tools to be able to do that,we get frustrated.
And I think I'm not speaking onthe whole male race here, but
(21:47):
that's just that's.
I think what I see across theboard is being able to
communicate better.
Jolynne Rydz (21:54):
Yeah, definitely.
It's so, so powerful, so needed, and for anyone that is a
leader out there that'slistening and they might have a
new dad in their team or afather, what do you think is the
number one thing someone's bosscan give that person in terms
of support?
Andrew Marmont (22:14):
The first thing, I think, is just probably
listening and asking, likeopening the questions, how's it
going?
Like, how are you feeling aboutbeing a dad?
And sort of anticipating whatthey might be thinking, because
they might be thinking, oh, Ican't take time off work or I
feel guilty because I've got totake three weeks off or four
weeks off or whatever it is, Istill want to be plugged in.
(22:37):
So, probably just normalizingthat idea of there's such an
important time, the first 12weeks you really need to be
there, if leave permits, andhaving that show of trust and
recognizing it's such a big timein everyone's lives it's going
(23:02):
to impact the employee in waysthat they probably don't realize
yet.
And acknowledging that and justsort of being there as well,
like just sort of not puttingall these expectations on them.
Well, like just just sort ofnot putting all these
expectations on them.
Obviously you've still got todo your job, if, if that's the
reality of the the situation.
But yeah, just just sort ofbeing just listening I think is
(23:25):
probably the first thing andreally don't have to give advice
or or say anything like that.
It's more, they might befeeling really scared.
They might be feeling reallyscared, they might be feeling
guilty, they might be feelingoverwhelmed, all these different
things.
So being able to just have moreof those kind of open
(23:47):
conversations, without judgment,without advice, because work is
important for a lot of people,so being able to just sort of
say, hey, your job's still here,it's not going anywhere, we've
completely got that on board.
Like, for example, when I wenton dad leave I think it was only
(24:08):
initially for a couple of weeksand then I had because I was
still running my marketingbusiness.
But I remember I sort of pulledmy team in my virtual meeting
like this, and I said I'm goingto take a couple of weeks off,
and all of them put their handup and said, look, we'll take on
(24:29):
it.
You know, we'll take on all theclients.
You just, you don't worry, youenjoy it, like so to me it was
amazing to have that support andI think if all people who are,
you know, dads who had that kindof support where we think, okay
, well, a, you're there for me,the job is safe, like secure,
(24:49):
maybe that's a real big part ofit.
So that's looked after.
I'm here, I'm going to supportyou, I'm not going to call you
in your leave because you've gotto be.
You know being present isreally important.
They don't want to be thinkingabout work.
So there's just differentpeople will have different
approaches, but being open,being just listening and
(25:10):
understanding that, yeah, it's abig time for everyone.
Jolynne Rydz (25:12):
Yeah, and it's almost like creating this
headspace by taking away thosesecond thoughts.
As if my job's secure, do Ineed to be guilty about how I'm
performing against everyone elsein the team?
If you take that all away, thenthere's just so much more
energy to do the job well andalso to be present with the
family too.
Andrew Marmont (25:29):
Absolutely, and that will be rewarded down the
line.
That's the big thing.
If you give some right now, inthat real overwhelming period,
then that's far greater than anypay rise or anything like that.
They just want you tounderstand that.
(25:50):
This is what I'm going through.
Yeah, as you say, jolene, thejob's secure.
You're giving me that time.
I'll come back refreshed, amuch more present, productive
employee, because I've had thattime to bond with my partner,
with my newborn.
That would be a great situationas a leader to have that trust,
integrity, all those things.
Jolynne Rydz (26:12):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I love it, and so we've talked a
lot about communication today,and it's important at work.
It's important in familyenvironment.
In your experience, what's theultimate thing that dads want
from their partner that maybethey struggle to ask for or
articulate?
Andrew Marmont (26:31):
That's a good question, jolene.
Probably just a safe space tobe able to talk through what's
on their mind.
So that would be a big thing, Ithink.
I think, whether it's pushingthe pram each night or maybe
it's a dedicated time in thecalendar each week, like how's
(26:52):
the week been, how are youfeeling, is there stuff that's
been happening that you wantedto talk about?
Like really having that realopenness is going to strengthen
throughout the whole time.
Again, because men, I don'tthink we're as strong in the
communication stakes.
Having the ability to have asafe space or even sort of
(27:18):
learning how to do that a bitbetter, I think is going to be
important.
So you can kind of take thatback to your partner.
When, a few months before mychild was going to come along, I
remember having golf with a myfriend called jeff and he had I
think his boy was maybe fouryears old and jeff said
something to me that I alwaysremember.
He said never forget who youloved first, because as soon as
(27:44):
that baby comes, that's a wholequadrant of your time, attention
, energy, et cetera.
So if you always have that inthe back of your mind, that's
going to hold you in good stead,and I tell that to every
unexpecting dad, new dad.
I relay that story because tome it's just a gentle reminder
(28:05):
to think well, yeah, you've gottwo people ideally bringing up
this little person.
So having a separate space forthat relationship to grow and
continue to deepen is reallyimportant.
So how can you create more waysto do that, along with the
(28:30):
exercise in raising this newborn?
Jolynne Rydz (28:32):
Yeah, and I love that because I work with leaders
currently but I've done a lotof life coaching as well.
So a lot of people come to mebecause they're going through a
life transition, so like they'regetting a newborn, and that
family dynamic is a lifetransition from being in a
relationship with a partner tonow a family.
(28:52):
But then also at the other endI noticed when the kids grow up
and leave home, if they haven'tkept that love and relationship
strong, there's this whole gapthat gets created of, oh, what
is our life purpose now that thekids have grown up and they
don't need us in the same waythat they needed us for 18 years
?
Like it's a really, a reallybig thing that people are
(29:13):
grappling with.
So I love that in terms of justkeeping that first love strong.
Andrew Marmont (29:19):
It's key.
And again, you can be reallycreative around how you do that.
It could be shared activitiestogether or, as I say, one of my
favorites is the monthly datenight, or it could be a
quarterly date night, orwhatever.
It is, where you pick a letterand it's alphabetical and the
other person has to organizeeverything you know, organize it
, drive you there or get youthere somehow, and then you walk
(29:42):
up and it's ah surprise, it'sGerman food.
German food gee yeah exactly or,or, if it's like q, you've got
to be a bit creative, so um justfun things like that.
I think there can be reallysome simple things, whatever.
Whatever you would findcreative and doable at at the
moment um, because not everyonecan do that, but it could be
(30:05):
something else, like you mighthave again a shared activity or
whatever it is.
I think there is space to becreative even when it's long
hours doing work and home.
Jolynne Rydz (30:20):
Yeah, I know, I love that.
It's fun, isn't it just beingcreative?
Andrew Marmont (30:23):
Totally, we're all creative.
Even if we don't think we areor we're in jobs that aren't
sort of being creative Totally.
We're all creative, Even if wedon't think we are.
We're in jobs that aren't sortof traditionally creative.
We all definitely can becreative.
Jolynne Rydz (30:34):
Yeah, totally.
And so, before I bring us intoour Swift 7 questions, there's
one final question I'd love toask you, Andrew, which is as a
leader, as a dad, as a businessowner what does success actually
look like for you when you'rewearing these multiple hats?
Andrew Marmont (30:51):
That's a great question, jolene, and someone
asked me a similar question.
They said what are your goalsnext year?
And I never really thoughtabout them.
The first thing is prioritizeself-care each day.
So have some different things.
That would mean that you'relooking after your own self-care
each day and try and tick thoseoff.
So that's probably the firstthing.
(31:13):
Second thing quality time withfamily.
So in terms of being presentwith family, that's a big
success.
And then from there I guess youcan put in your one work goal
and you've kind of got yourselfsorted Leadership-wise.
There was a coach that I usedto work with and I remember he
(31:37):
was looking at ways to thinkabout success and in his view it
was always external first andthen kind of internal last.
But you might know, jolene,that there's a, is it be?
Do have.
Jolynne Rydz (31:55):
Yeah.
Andrew Marmont (31:57):
And I think we get have, do be is sort of the.
A lot of people get sucked intothat.
So I think, yeah, if you lookat B, do have.
So who am I and what are mybehaviors and am I looking after
me?
Will allow me to then have thequality time or whatever it
looks like, and that will sortof go from there.
(32:19):
So, yeah, I think for next year, if you're a leader and you're
thinking about what does successlook like again, maybe you're
90% work or even 70% work thinkabout, well, what would it look
like if I switch that?
It doesn't have to be, thehours would be less or that time
(32:39):
.
But what if I paid moreattention to other things?
What if I made food on theweekends, you know like, or what
?
What can I, what can I do toreprioritize some of the things
that maybe I've been neglecting?
You'll be much more balanced,um, when you go back to, when
(32:59):
you go to work again, becauseyou know, that both both sides
or your circle is is lookedafter.
Some of them might be out ofequilibrium, but having that
balanced look to me that's whatsuccess looks like.
You balance the way that youlook at those things.
Jolynne Rydz (33:20):
Yeah, and what I love about what you just shared
is none of it was around likehaving a house, having a car,
having the job title and it'sall about these.
What can you be doing?
How are you being that?
And it's so much morecontrollable, isn't it?
Those little things that youcan do each day, that makes you
feel successful right now,rather than having to wait, you
know, five, 10 years to get afeeling of success.
Andrew Marmont (33:42):
You and I both know, jolene, you know being in,
doing programs and goingthrough.
I both know, jolene, you knowbeing and doing programs and
going through being surroundedby people who are probably more
external success focused, sothat can have a big impact what
it did on me around.
I'm chasing this, I'm chasingthis and that's why I think my
(34:04):
friend Julian said you lookstressed, and I didn't even know
it look stressed and I didn'teven know it because I so having
a balanced approach where, yeah, if you, if you know that
you're doing the right thing foryou, and then and you go
outwards in your circle, thenthat's going to you're going to
be more balanced and you'regoing to you're going to be
happier, for sure.
Jolynne Rydz (34:23):
Yeah, a hundred percent Awesome.
So let's now transition to ourSwift 7.
So these are seven Swiftquestions that you don't need to
overthink, just first thingthat comes to mind.
Feel free to share, and just away to really get to know you a
little bit better.
So, in your view, firstquestion what are three words to
describe an ideal leader?
Andrew Marmont (34:45):
Resilient, passionate, confident.
Jolynne Rydz (34:49):
Yeah, love it and fill in the blank.
Andrew Marmont (34:53):
Magnetic authenticity is Showing up as
you every day.
Jolynne Rydz (34:58):
Love that Number three.
When you notice yourself tryingto fit in, what's the first
thing that you do?
Andrew Marmont (35:05):
Take off your shoes.
Jolynne Rydz (35:08):
Oh, yes, yes, I'm like thinking physically, take
off your shoes, but yeah,metaphorically take off your
shoes.
Yeah, okay, cool.
Number four what's a song thatgets you really pumped?
Andrew Marmont (35:22):
I'll tell you that I'm just trying to think of
the name of the song.
Jolynne Rydz (35:26):
You can sing it if you like.
Andrew Marmont (35:29):
We won't be doing that.
Here we go.
Moby Stars, I think it's called.
Jolynne Rydz (35:40):
Yes, I do like Moby, nice one.
Andrew Marmont (35:41):
Okay, number five.
What's the most daring thingyou've ever done, andrew?
When I was nine, for a schoolproject I called up the famous
mountaineer, sir Edmund Hillaryand asked him three questions
about climbing Mount Everest.
Yeah, I was nine.
That's so cool, that was prettydaring, I thought for a
nine-year-old I think so Justgoing.
Jolynne Rydz (36:00):
Oh yeah, no boundaries, let's just call them
and see whether they respond.
Yeah, I love that.
And so number six do you have afavorite quote or mantra that
you live by?
Andrew Marmont (36:11):
I guess we could call it the Tee30 tagline,
which is go home happy.
That probably comes to mind.
Jolynne Rydz (36:17):
Yeah, I love that.
That's really, really cool.
And number seven you've alreadyshared one, so I'm going to
challenge you to share adifferent thing, which is what's
one small thing that brings youincredible joy.
Andrew Marmont (36:32):
When my boy runs and jumps into my arms after
daycare.
Jolynne Rydz (36:37):
Yeah, that's like one of my favorites as well.
It's such an amazing feeling.
Yeah, it's just like this pure,unbound, unconditional love and
presence.
Yeah, so powerful, yeah andpresence, yeah, so powerful.
Andrew Marmont (36:49):
Yeah, every time it goes in my diary.
Jolynne Rydz (36:53):
I love it.
So you actually write it down,do you?
Andrew Marmont (36:56):
Yeah, I've got a five-year diary and I'll write
it every time.
Yeah.
Jolynne Rydz (37:01):
Oh, that's cool.
I like that Very nice.
Well, this has been anincredible conversation and I
love where we've gone with itand I love just how relatable to
leadership in any role it is.
Like it's all you know, leadingas a dad is really, at its
fundamental, the same as leadingwith a team, like there's so
(37:23):
many skills that you can useacross the board, which is
amazing.
And so if people want to learnmore about what you do your
keynoting or T30 Golf where canthey find you?
Andrew Marmont (37:33):
For speaking, andrewmarmontcom, or connect
with me on LinkedIn, AndrewMarmont, and for Tee30 Golf,
it's t30golfcomau, sot-e-e-30golfcomau
Jolynne Rydz (37:50):
Yeah, wonderful.
I'll pop the links in the shownotes as well, so people can
find it nice and easy.
It's been amazing having youhere, Andrew.
Thank you so much for your timeand sharing your wisdom and
openness with the world.
Thank you for what you do.
Andrew Marmont (38:02):
Thank you, Jolynne.
Thanks so much.
I really appreciate it.
Jolynne Rydz (38:06):
I trust that you found some nuggets of gold in
that episode, and there are acouple of nuggets that I'd like
to reflect on because I thinkthey are really, really key.
So the first one is work lifeblend.
It's so similar to something Italk about in terms of work life
alignment, and how does thatblend show up for you?
How much of your time andenergy, emotional energy, goes
(38:30):
into work versus things outsideof work that matter to you, and
is that percentage the right fitfor you?
The power of open communicationcame up time and time again, and
that applies in life andleadership and the workplace.
It's no longer a nice skill.
It's actually critical if wecare about feeling heard,
(38:54):
understood and supported andbeing able to empower ourselves
to gain that support.
And the thing I noticed is thata lot of these skills are
available and taught throughlarger corporate organizations,
ones that have the big budgetsto deploy this kind of learning,
but there's a lot of peoplethat don't have access to that,
(39:15):
and actually it's one of thereasons why I do this kind of
work is because I think it'sunfair, and I think there is
room for everyone to be able toarticulate how they feel in a
way that gets them theacknowledgement and the support
and the love that they receiveand deserve.
And the third thing that I lovedabout this episode was that
(39:38):
there were some really easy tipsthere on how do you empower
fathers in the workplace, andthat reassurance of their job
security being really key,because there's so much
messaging around there abouttraditionally males being the
provider, and I loved that pointabout mum guilt as well and dad
(39:59):
guilt right.
Mum guilt gets talked a lotabout, but how often have you
heard the term dad guilt come upand really acknowledge that
someone is doing their best,they're trying to provide for
their family financially,they're trying to be there
emotionally and support theirfamily and lead them, but
sometimes feeling like that's atthe expense of their own
(40:19):
well-being and their cup.
A very familiar story that I'msure a lot of people can
resonate with, but one that'snot often articulated from the
traditional male fatherperspective.
So thank you so much to Andrewfor giving us this insight.
I hope that has allowed you insome way to see someone that you
(40:40):
know differently and maybe givethem space to step in and have
those open conversations thatare so, so important and
powerful.
Remember, you were born for areason it's time to thrive.
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