September 9, 2024 • 40 mins
Comments, questions? Let's connect!
Can authenticity transform your leadership style? Join us as we continue our insightful journey with Margot Thomas and Monique Longhurst, the visionary founders of Ikigai Leading.
To get the most out of this episode, it's important that you listen to part 1 first. If you haven't listened to Part 1 yet, I encourage you to go back now and listen to it first:)
These remarkable women are dedicated to developing purposeful and connected leaders by fostering environments that promote self-reflection and experimentation. They share their unique approach to creating lasting impact within organisations, focusing on the distinction between acquiring new skills and undergoing true personal transformation.
Learn the significance of asking three pivotal questions: "What do I really think?", "What do I truly feel?", and "What do I deeply need?" We discuss the journey from fitting in to fully embracing one's identity, highlighted by daring life choices and the importance of micro-moments of mindfulness.
Margot and Monique’s personal stories, underscore the profound connection between self-acceptance and impactful leadership. Don't miss this compelling conversation filled with practical insights and heartfelt reflections.
Want to connect with Monique and Margot?
Ikigai Leading Website
Monique Longhurst - LinkedIN
Margot Thomas - LinkedIN
References
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ikigai
Hopi Elders Poem - We are the Ones We've Been Waiting For
Margaret Wheatley - Perseverance
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jolynne Rydz (00:00):
In today's episode , we continue where we left off
in conversation with MargotThomas and Monique Longhurst,
founders of Ikigai Leading, whoare on a mission to develop
purposeful, conscious andconnected leaders.
So if you have just joined usin this episode and you haven't
listened to part one, go backand listen to part one first,
(00:21):
because it's going to make a lotmore sense, because part two is
really building on part one.
And if you're new to thepodcast, welcome, go back and
listen to part one, listen tothis one, and then I'd invite
you to listen to the firstepisode, which is Could Magnetic
Authenticity be Your Superpower?
And that will help give you thecontext about what Magnetic
(00:42):
Authenticity is and why it'ssomething that you might want to
consider developing.
So, as a bit of a recap forthose that have been eagerly
awaiting part two, part one weheard about the relationship
between authenticity andleadership and how to find your
own flavor of it.
So, Monique and Margot, throughtheir own work, they co-create
(01:05):
programs that really transformthe way leaders, teams and
organisations function as awhole system, and as we dive
into part two, we will hearabout how they create
sustainable impact.
By doing that, we're also goingto learn how we can step more
into our own authenticity, andalso some cutting edge research
(01:26):
in leadership and relationshipwith self and the foundational
practice that is so needed rightnow.
It's no longer a nice to have.
It's something that's reallyactually critical for people to
be practicing.
And we're also going to diveinto a conversation around
increasing the need for thefeminine, what that even means
(01:47):
and how everyone can harnessthat, regardless of your gender.
So let's dive in and continuethe conversation.
You do a lot of developmentwork in this space and what
happens next?
So what else needs to happen toto actually make create that
space that you talk about?
Once you leave?
So you obviously come intoorganizations, you work with
(02:10):
them, but you're not alwaysthere for the to hold the hand.
So what has to else has tohappen to support this
development?
Margot Thomas (02:17):
oh, that's I would say.
Can I just say that even whenwe are there, we're not holding
anyone's hand?
Yeah, kind of a that that.
So what is our?
We see a contribution is andany leader's contribution, as
they support, you know, have apartake on on their people's
(02:38):
development, which is differentfrom learning.
Yeah, so there's learning iskind of a adding to your toolkit
.
It's learning is kind of addingto your toolkit.
It's kind of a new skill, a newcompetence.
And developing is expanding.
You know it's when we expand,for example, the way our belief
system or we redefine our beliefsystem, right.
(03:00):
So this is kind of in the realmof development.
It's hard.
It's a behavior, culture,transformation, sort of a kind
of a development dimension whichis hard.
Nobody can do that for you,it's your work.
So what we see is just how dowe offer the right questions,
(03:21):
the right processes?
You know processes to helppeople.
Ah, oh, that's how it's done.
You know that's the reflection,observation, experimentation
and play it again.
So it's almost like you know,it's enabling people to kind of
find their own way of doing.
(03:42):
So it doesn't matter how longyou're there being in the
individual coaching engagementjourney or inside a longitudinal
work in an organization, aleadership program, you're just
setting people up in order to beable to do that for themselves
and others.
Yeah, so, uh, yeah, so,naturally, because this is not.
(04:05):
So.
Most of the work that we do isnot training or is not kind of a
transactional.
There's nothing wrong withthose things, by the way.
It's just not where we'recalled to serve.
So a lot of our work is in therealm of development and takes
time, as you say.
You know, to shift mindsets, toshift behaviors, behaviors, to
shift kind of your belief systemtakes a little bit longer.
(04:28):
Yeah, we tend to be inpartnership for long.
Not long time is longer time.
Yeah, so we, most of ourclients you know we've been
working with them companies andorganizations, you know it's
often this is a three to four,sometimes five year horizon.
Yeah, and the coaching is not aone-off.
(04:50):
The coaching is like is a sixto a year, year and a half
partnership, because to allowthat, you know that deeper work
to occur.
But it still has to continueand it's not us doing the work,
it's not us.
You know what I mean.
We say we're helping, we're nothelping, we're not healing
(05:10):
people, people healingthemselves, you know, just to
finish healing.
For us, our interpretation ofhealing, it is your ability to
look at the things in you thatare no longer serving you as a
person, as a leader, and, overtime, having the courage to let
(05:30):
them behind and let the new tocome.
This is, for us, is healing.
So that's sometimes we callwe're healers because we're kind
of in there.
That's just to be clear what wemean by healing.
Sorry, I'm wondering.
And Jo, maybe add what I meanby healing.
Monique Longhurst (05:45):
Sorry, I'm interrupting.
And, Jo, maybe to add to that,there are some conditions that
will support that journeyongoing as well, and I think
that's something that we areobserving within organisations.
But I think some of the lensesthat we use when we work in the
leadership development space isvery simple but a leading self
leading others and leadingsystems or leading systemically,
(06:06):
and what we do know is for thework to happen at the individual
, like for the work to happen atthe system space.
The work needs to happen at theindividual space.
So we unapologetically alwaysstart with a leading self, but
you never.
That work is never done either.
When we know about, what weknow about adult development is,
you know it's an ongoing,lifelong journey, um, and so
(06:31):
that that sense of how does howdoes the work continue when
we're maybe out of theintervention space, whether
that's in a coachingconversation or in, uh you know,
a team workshop or whateverform that takes.
There are some things thathappen from a self-perspective
and I think that reflectivepractice, I think the
(06:53):
willingness to lean into thehard work, I think there's a
mindset around experimentationthat's really critical for this
work and that's also a mindsetthat's really helpful when teams
or groups of people are workingtogether to do that journey
together.
So, even if we think about theleading others or leading with
others, there's a sense of theme in the we there.
(07:15):
So there's still the work to bedone at the individual level,
but there's also work to be donein that collective.
So holding an experimentationmindset, making some commitments
to work differently, anexperimentation mindset, making
some commitments to workdifferently.
So how do we work together thatallows us to witness each
other's development, to holdeach other accountable, to offer
really valuable feedback on thejourney that we want to be
(07:35):
making as leaders.
And then, systemically, if wethink about the system, it's
also about getting really greatfeedback within a system.
System, it's also about gettingreally great feedback within a
system.
It's about having really cleargoals.
But not goals is really for us,it's around a shared direction.
What's the impact that we'rehere to have?
So when we've got that clearvision of whether it's our team
(07:57):
purpose, whether it's ourorganisational purpose, whether
it's our key priorities, it's ameasure for us.
So, as a leader, is my work andthe impact I'm having on my
team leading us towards thatdirection?
So having that clarity, I thinkis really critical too, so that
we know whether we're aligned,whether we're making progress.
(08:19):
So I think there are someconditions that wrap around the
individual journey that can bereally helpful.
I think the experimentation isprobably the one we're seeing
highlighted most.
Would you agree, margot, withleaders at the moment Just
holding that experimentationmindset, adapting, adjusting,
keeping the conversation alive.
(08:39):
What's working, what's notworking, what do we want to
adjust today?
What's the unintendedconsequences of some of the
decisions we're making?
Both really positive, some ofthose unintended consequences
can be wonderful as well.
So that reflective practice,building that in the stepping up
onto the balcony, if I can usethe Kegan metaphor, you know
(09:01):
when are we on the dance floor,when are we on the balcony?
How do we set ourselves?
Margot Thomas (09:04):
Heifetz, sorry, don't name the wrong man, Wrong
man sorry Wrong reference.
Monique Longhurst (09:15):
How do we build that into our ways of
being together, so that that'snot just happening when we're in
a room together, you know, inan intervention space, but it's
actually our way of workingtogether?
Margot Thomas (09:26):
as well.
You see, there is a little tipthat we often use in coaching to
you know that I find it veryempowering in the way.
Your invitation.
So, because what Mon said isthat personal, interpersonal and
systemic right.
So we often hold the leadershipdevelopment in context.
(09:48):
Yeah, because otherwise it'sjust a nice theoretical.
It's just you bring the contextand the reality of leadership.
It's trying to be exercisedbeing community and organization
team with one person, but youbring the context in, yeah, so
that the expansion anddevelopment occurs.
How can we bring ourselves in away that is more effective?
(10:09):
Right, that's what the, so whatwe invite people is, there is
the potential, the opportunityor the, the challenge that we're
just exploring here.
So how much of that it's me inthat problem.
So that's the personalleadership, the self-awareness,
(10:29):
and then my mindset is that my,you know what.
So you bring your you.
You know what is need to shift,adapt, evolve.
Is that an interpersonal thing?
Is that me in relationship withpotentially people in there?
That needs to be redefined.
Or is there more systemic?
There is kind of something as aculture in that system, or is
(10:52):
there?
You know particularly the waythe structure is done.
So you look at, so that youknow there's never just one
thing.
Yeah, that's the multidimensionfor you to to come.
You know your leadership impactit's determined by all those.
You know, your ability to lookat all those dimensions and and
(11:14):
some you can control andinfluence, and some you can't.
Right and and and we'll make acall when we are operating in a
space where we can have, wecan't have the, the influence
and the control that we wish tohave.
Jolynne Rydz (11:30):
Yeah, I'm hearing.
It's just so embedded andknowing that self.
So then you can go, doesn'tmatter how much personal work
you're gonna work doing.
Margot Thomas (11:40):
The system won't change.
Just, it's an example, right?
So it's time, perhaps, oreither.
Okay, it's time to stay,because I will learn how to work
in a box.
It's time to move on, you know.
So that's, and sometimes wehave these conversations as well
.
You know, encourage people.
(12:00):
You know it's time for you tofind some fertile soil, because
the one that you're tending tokind of at this point in time is
not going to bloom what youwish for yeah, beautiful, and so
do you have one first stepsomeone could take if they are
(12:22):
wanting to step more into theirauthenticity one first step.
Wow, is it funny, isn't it?
Steps, processes, why we're so.
We need that, right.
It's almost like it's a way ofcontrolling instead of it's it's
and I'm not saying that in a ina bad way, but it's so um, my
(12:46):
response to that there's norecipe.
There's kind of a guidingprinciple.
She did this for me is aroundawareness.
The more you know I become moreintimate to who I am, more
likely I can work towards, youknow, becoming honoring more of
that person.
That's really the true me.
(13:08):
So that's kind of a principle,but not necessarily a step to go
towards that, because you canarrive to that or start that in
so many different ways.
Yeah, but um, yeah, that was mythought.
Your beautiful question howabout you, mon?
Monique Longhurst (13:26):
I, I totally agree.
There's no recipe.
If, if I come to what could youmaybe play with um as you're
exploring that?
There's a process that justcame straight to me and I think
it's because it speaks to me.
So I have the personality typewhere I'm a thinker.
(13:50):
That's my dominance.
I can find a script that fitsin the moment as well.
So I think that building thatawareness and that pause point
so there's two things Breath isreally a key part of just
slowing down and coming in.
So I think, if there's abreathwork practice, even if
(14:11):
it's just a couple of deepbreaths in the moment to come
back to centre, but thenengaging my brain because, even
if I choose not to, it's therewith three key questions and it
comes from, you know, accessingthe beautiful wisdom of our head
, our heart and our body.
But in the moment, what do Ireally think, with the emphasis
(14:35):
on really.
So getting past the firstthoughts and the surface scripts
and that you know, in thismoment, what do I really think,
and if I hold that question deepenough and long enough, really
letting thoughts come, what do Itruly feel, with the emphasis
(14:59):
on truly, and what do I deeplyneed so that really, truly
deeply, just takes us to anotherspace and as we hold.
You know, margo, you would youuse the word you know, if you
sat and asked those questions tosomeone else, the intimacy that
(15:22):
that's inviting, but sittingwith that for ourselves.
You know, in this moment, whatdo I really think?
If I get behind all the yeah,what do I truly feel and what do
I deeply need?
Jolynne Rydz (15:39):
I love that.
Margot Thomas (15:40):
I want to try it straight after this no, that's
beautiful, yeah, and, and for me, so, if the invitation you see,
I got, um, I some, I got, I gottriggered by what is one first
step.
I love the one.
You just flip that into.
Okay's, no one.
But there's so many options,let me give you one.
(16:00):
That's so one.
Another option is not anotheroption, but another way is.
For me it's really meditation,yeah, so it is that.
And meditation or sittingcross-legged with just whatever
is the state where I really getinto silence and within and just
(16:23):
create a space for connectingdeeply.
So that could be different foreveryone, but it's just the
mindful practices help us comeback to, you know, again, to
have intimacy, how we're reallyfeeling, how are you thinking
and we and I, and kind of, andthe body you see, being a body,
(16:45):
person, personality, wise, um,which is kind of a have a, you
know, orientation towards action, orientation to be, you know,
in the present moment, I reallytrust my gut, yeah, so, uh, this
is, yeah, oh, interesting.
We could do a round ofauthenticity with the different
centers of intelligence you knowas your primary.
(17:06):
If you have a primary headcenter, what is that?
Your relationship ofauthenticity with your body,
what would be?
And then with your heart, whatwould that be?
oh, cool, that's the nextpodcast but yeah, so just that
that tuning into really cominghome.
(17:27):
And then for me, coming home isto come from my to my body.
Yeah, so, and she reallynoticed and pay attention
there's also as a way to tune inwhat is really what is really
going on for me.
Yeah, in terms of going back tothat intimacy, yeah, and Jo,
I'm called to.
Monique Longhurst (17:46):
You know, in the past, and we hear this all
the time, oh, I don't haveenough time to you know, the
practice of meditation, thepractice of reflective.
You know, yes, and thecutting-edge research on
leadership right now is actuallytaking us to that space you
know back to that space and it'sno longer an optional extra,
(18:08):
it's no longer when I have timeactually, and it's no longer the
you know, the oh, that's lovelyif you've got the opportunity,
or it's actually now the, thepiece, that self-awareness, that
self-care, the option to thenself-regulate.
You know, the relationship withself is so key in our impact
(18:33):
externally, consciously orotherwise, that the, as we said,
the cutting edge research.
There's some fascinating workcoming out into this space.
That's really about.
It is such an essential callfor leadership now to have that
practice and that reflectivepractice, whatever form it takes
for you.
But I just want to speak to thelovely nice, to the yeah buts.
(18:56):
Yes, sounds great, we all knowthat, but have you got four kids
?
And you know?
You know traveling?
Yes, and never before has itbeen more important to add that
in there as well.
So I just wanted to speak topotentially some of the
resistance that people might befeeling as we talk about breath
work and meditation, whichsounds lovely.
No, it's, it's essential in thespace now.
Jolynne Rydz (19:21):
It's beautiful.
Thank you for sharing.
Margot Thomas (19:22):
And the micro moments.
Right can be done in the shower, if you can shower, find a time
to shower and then the shower.
You know, as you get the showerover you and it's just kind of
a this is my little moment withme, me, yep, yep.
So it doesn't need to be thehour meditation that many of us
can't afford, but it's just thatintimacy in the micro moments
(19:44):
right before bed, after you know, first thing you do when you
get up in the car um, the traintrip you know the reflection on
my day.
Monique Longhurst (19:54):
How did I show up?
Margot Thomas (19:55):
you know all of that, yeah yeah, everyone did
experiment, yeah, and evenexperiment with just have a go,
have a quick and see.
Is that an impact?
No, thank you, mine and margo,it didn't work.
But you know, just go and havea play just to kind of see if
there's a.
What is the impact?
What it does to you in terms ofyou noticing what is really
(20:16):
going on for you and we say thelast thing I want to say because
, as you mentioned before, theaudience that you're cultivating
is a lot of a female kind of amultitasking, et cetera, if I
can speak specifically to thatcohort is that there is this
(20:38):
thing about putting the oxygenmask first before you attend to
the other, meaning our abilityto sustain our effort and serve
and help others and be withothers and be the mother, and be
the, the daughter and be.
It's so much sustained, it'sbetter sustained if we tend to
(21:00):
ourselves really, yeah, and andinto in one way, for those of us
they have children, is thattheir kids, our kids, are
beautiful kids will do what theysee us doing, not what we ask
them to do.
And to be able to remodel thatbeautiful relationship with self
and tending to self and, youknow, setting healthy boundaries
(21:24):
and showing that to ourchildren.
How is that done?
I think is an awesome gift thatwe can give them.
You know, even in the micromoments, I find it personally a
commitment of mine.
Jolynne Rydz (21:39):
Beautiful, so powerful and, before I bring us
home with our Swift 7 questions,we've talked about so much
today.
So we've talked about all ofthat internal operating system,
how that relates to other people, how that the system and
putting that in context, and somuch more.
I think I'll need to re-watchthis and delve into this again.
(22:00):
It's going to be so much fun.
Uh, I'd love to know what'syour legacy.
Where are you taking thisco-creation legacy?
Margot Thomas (22:08):
whoa?
What do you mean by that?
Can I, can I prompt?
What is?
What is the intention and theinvitation of the question?
Jolynne Rydz (22:18):
The invitation is to share.
What is it that you want toleave behind as you do all of
this work?
What is the future vision andthe impact that you're seeing
the ripple effect, I guess fromwhat you're doing?
Monique Longhurst (22:39):
Maybe, margot , let me speak and please add in
um, please do that.
So I think grounded in what westand for is developing
purposeful, conscious andconnected leaders.
So that's that's both ourmission but the legacy we want
to leave behind.
(22:59):
You know, leaders who areconnected with their personal
purpose and the embodiment ofthat and the impact that that
has, the level of consciousness,so that the impact that they're
having is intentional, and theconnection, because we know that
(23:21):
we can do more together and incommunity and that that journey
is.
You know, there's definitelywork we can do individually and
privately, but what happens incommunity and when we do our
work together, the impacts ofthat on self and others, I think
if we come to the ripple effect, we unapologetically know that
(23:45):
there's such a calling for thefeminine and there's a need and
we have a deep passion anddesire to make space, to create
space, to have an impact in thatwork and to respect what's
available for us if we embraceand indeed honour the feminine.
(24:06):
We're both mothers and takethat role.
Really.
You know that's a core part ofwho we are and I think I can
speak in the we space here thatthe ripple effect of the work
that we have.
Yes, there's individuals,there's teams, there's
organisations, but thoseorganisations serve communities.
We work, we're intentionalabout the sectors we want to
(24:27):
work with.
We work in communities that youknow.
We do a lot of work incommunity-based organisations as
well the not-for-profit sectorbecause of the impact that they
have.
So the ripple effect from aleader into a team, into the
community, into the clients, butalso as a partner, as a father,
as a mother, you know ourclients, we know that, their
(24:50):
impact, and there's nothing morefulfilling than hearing the
stories when they come back andgo.
My relationship with my kidshave shifted in the last six
months and I know it's becauseof the work that we're doing in
the room here, you know, as aleader, but the ripple effect of
that and I think that's exactlythe legacy that we want to
leave it's weaved through thework.
(25:15):
So I think that mission ofpurposeful, conscious, connected
leaders but the leader isn'tthe multiple roles that we hold,
um, anything you want to add tothat- Margot, I think it's
beautiful that's.
Margot Thomas (25:28):
And the feminine meaning not, uh, female, no, the
feminine is the part of us thatboth men and women can embody,
which I tend to, what iscyclical, which has a desire to
be in community, which iscreative, which is want to birth
(25:54):
.
That's why the creative, fromthe sense want to birth, that is
the feminine that we talk about, it right, absolutely, and the
masculine, the reason I'm sayingit's kind of a little bit out
of whack.
Yeah, because even as to thecore, the feminine and the cycle
(26:15):
, nature, feminine, that MotherNature teaches us the winter,
the summer, we are natural, weare beings, we are cyclical
beings and we don't honor thatin terms of it's just always on,
on, on, on.
We don't honor our personalwinter.
It's just time to kind of justbe quiet and germinate and just
(26:38):
go in.
Just time to kind of just bequiet and germinate and just go
in, or our summer, or our spring, or autumn, which is time to
let it go, so that we so that'shonour the feminine is honours
the dimensions of us.
That is not mechanical, that isnot, you know, that's a passion
of us as well.
Jolynne Rydz (27:00):
Thank you so much for sharing.
It's been so powerful so I wantto transition us into the Swift
7.
So these questions are notabout deep, dark thoughts Not
dark, we haven't been dark todayDeep thought, but just what
first comes to mind.
So question number one in yourview, what are three words that
describe an ideal leader?
Monique Longhurst (27:25):
did we just say it purposeful, conscious and
connected yes, easy, okay, fillin the blank.
Margot Thomas (27:32):
Magnetic authenticity is intimate
relationship with yourself myneck's nodding.
Jolynne Rydz (27:43):
Anything to add?
Um, and regenerative is theother word that's coming to me,
so yeah, when you noticeyourself trying to fit in,
what's the first thing that youdo?
Margot Thomas (27:56):
I don't, I don't, I don't.
That's a.
I yeah being a.
You know, being having lived inmany countries and being doing
the shift from fitting intobelonging I, I, I don't, I, I
(28:17):
hand on heart, I do not desireto fit in anymore so I don't
quite have that relationshipwith fitting in yet.
Monique Longhurst (28:26):
So for me, because that's that fine line I
said before about the superpowerof the fitting in to where and
I know your differentiation ofhere so where I've gone from
adapting to my situation and thepeople around me to fitting in,
there's two things I now dodidn't used to but now I do is
reconnect to self.
(28:47):
So it's back to that connectionto authenticity, and then I
stand out, I will bring out myred heels, I will do something
that's just like do not breakout, I will make myself stand
out intentionally.
Jolynne Rydz (29:01):
Next time I see you in the red heels, are you
okay?
Margot Thomas (29:05):
Because, Jo, if you allow me to be philosophical
or mystical, to fit in, to tryto fit in, comes from an
illusion that we're separate.
We're not.
So, fundamentally, I believethat you know we're made of all
the same fabric and all.
(29:26):
So the reason to fit in is toassume that I'm not part of you
know what I'm saying.
So that's the reaction was Idon't need to fit in, we are.
And then the deep, deep work ofself-acceptance, right as well,
(29:46):
follows.
You know, as of that, that inwhich I had to do very hard.
There was a, you know, butbelieve me, you know, for many,
many years I tried to fit in andit worked, had lots of
strategies to how, pretend thatI'm not, but I am, etc.
Happy to talk to you about itanother time.
But I think for me today tobeing able to sit here with you
(30:09):
and just have this beautifulresponse this is, this is not
part of my book anymore and mybible.
It comes from their deepknowing that we're not separate
beautiful you couldn't help it.
Jolynne Rydz (30:25):
How could you?
Yeah, it's a good profound andI love it.
I love it.
It's truly amazing.
All right, um number four.
What song gets you reallypumped?
Margot Thomas (30:37):
so, oh well, a song, perhaps can I go that.
Yeah, I love Brazilian music,beautiful.
Monique Longhurst (30:58):
So much music moves me, but I think the first
place I went was 80s, like ifyou want to put Cyndi Lauper on,
um, girls just want to have fun.
You'll have me on the dancefloor in a matter of seconds and
my beautiful opportunity now isinviting my 16 year old
daughter and her friends ontothe dance floor.
So that's what will get memoving and get me pumped some 19
(31:21):
big 80s female voices amazingbut it was before my time.
Jolynne Rydz (31:28):
I don't know okay, question number what are we up
to five?
What's the most daring thingyou've ever done?
Monique Longhurst (31:39):
oh, other than talking to my boss, like I
did.
Margot Thomas (31:47):
Daring, daring.
How about that?
I quit my job, I changedcountries, pregnant yeah,
arrived in Australia, left thejob, left the country and I was
(32:07):
pregnant and I bought a houseconcurrently that is daring.
Monique Longhurst (32:10):
That is daring.
So there's two things for me.
Physically daring jumping outof an airplane I don't know if
that's daring, or just sillyskydiving, intentionally jumping
out of an airplane.
But, to be honest, starting myown business at the age of 23
and again, that was a valueschoice.
I was being told what I couldor couldn't do and I was like
(32:31):
I'll go and figure that out formyself and started my own
consultancy at 23 amazing andthe red heels probably came on
it's funny because it feels, youknow, if you ever there was a
daring that doesn't feel dairy,it's almost like there's a.
Margot Thomas (32:49):
There's a daring that doesn't feel daring, it's
almost like there's a fire thatcomes, you know, fuse your belly
.
Yeah.
So my transition to Australia,I just had that knowing it's
going to be fine.
I know it's daring.
There's not many people thatcould do that.
Often you just do one at a time.
You either have a kid, youeither buy a house, you either
(33:10):
change, change country, or youeither quit your job.
You don't do that.
But there is something you knowback to the body, kind of, and
back to all that, that deepknowing, that kind of a.
It's not it's, and that's whatI love about the discerning
daring from being stupid, youknow I mean.
So there is the daring, thereis something that ground there.
(33:30):
Yeah, decision that feels at a,you know, naked eye, whoa.
But there is a I don't know ina knowing that ground you to do
that absolutely, absolutely.
Monique Longhurst (33:44):
And there's a reality of all the other things
around it right deeply.
No, this is the right choice,but what am I doing beautiful?
Jolynne Rydz (33:56):
so question six do you have a favorite quote or
mantra that you live by?
Monique Longhurst (34:05):
mine is actually a prayer at the moment,
and it's a prayer that's beenwith me for a very long time at
different stages of my life, andit's just a serenity prayer.
So grant me the serenity toaccept the things I cannot
change, the courage to changethe things I can, and the wisdom
to know the difference.
And that's just lived with mein moments, um, any major life
(34:27):
cycles as well.
Margot Thomas (34:28):
So, yeah, that's what I come back to yeah, but
for me, I love the hobie nationpoem, which is a long one and it
is a stunning, and there is apart of it that it speaks to.
You know, we're jumping intothe river and letting go of the
shores and go with the flow, butthe part that we are the ones
(34:54):
that we were waiting for, yeah,it really, that's forever my
favorite.
And Margaret Whitley she wrotea book called Perseverance and
she broke this poem into tinylittle pieces introducing each
chapter of her book and just sobeautifully, you know, uh,
orchestrated.
(35:15):
So, yeah, hopey nation, uh poem, happy to provide the details,
this is stunning.
That's my favorite poem everthat would be great.
Jolynne Rydz (35:24):
We can pop a link in the show notes.
Okay, we are coming to thefinal question, which is what's
one small thing that brings youincredible joy?
Margot Thomas (35:36):
oh, it's my son's smile, which is not as mild,
beautiful every time.
You have, you know, you havethose meditations to say oh,
connect with your heart.
Perhaps, if you're grateful forsomething straight away, is
this face that I see, andthey're just and for me it'll be
the physical touch of mydaughters.
Monique Longhurst (35:58):
Um, we were walking down the king street
holding hands this morning andthey're both teenagers, so that
physicality of their presence,absolutely small and, as you
said, not so small.
Jolynne Rydz (36:09):
But brings joy.
Beautiful, and I think I mightbe a combination of you two.
So mine is seeing at the uhwhen my kids get home so they'll
run big grins, but then they'llhug me at the end and almost
bowl me over that's weird yeah,beautiful, such a good.
This has been such a wonderful,insightful, deep and moving
(36:31):
conversation.
Thank you so much for forjoining in this space and
creating this space for thisconversation.
Um, where can people find youif they would like to connect
with you?
What is the best way to reachout to?
Monique Longhurst (36:43):
you Our website, absolutely ikigileading
.
com.
au.
You can find us on LinkedIn.
We tend to share in that space.
Yeah, they're the main placesyou can find us at the moment.
Jolynne Rydz (36:58):
Beautiful.
All right, we'll pop all thelinks there and thank you so
much for joining us.
Have a wonderful day and we'llsee you next time.
Margot Thomas (37:05):
Thanks so much for the invite, Jo.
It was awesome.
Thanks for the conversation.
Jolynne Rydz (37:09):
Jo, I trust that you had as much fun listening to
that as we had recording that,and wasn't that a such a mind
blowing conversation?
There's there's so much inthere.
Lucky, we split it into twoparts.
So just for part two, there'sthree key points that I really
wanted to highlight, and I'msure you have your own as well.
(37:31):
So, if you do, please let meknow on LinkedIn so you can add
a comment to any of my posts, orDM me, because I truly do want
to hear your feedback and what'sresonating for you, because
that will help me to create evenbetter content that you're
going to love.
So, in closing, there's threepoints that I think were so
(37:52):
beautifully made by Monique andMargot.
The first one was about delvinginto our authenticity, and
Monique had this beautifulsaying of what do I really think
, what do I truly feel and whatdo I deeply need.
What wonderful questions.
The second point I wanted tohighlight was the ripple impact
(38:16):
from the leader, just the powera leader has to influence and
impact an organization and acommunity, and the flow on
effects of that, and why, asleaders, it's so critical that
we're aware of the impact wehave and that we're continually
(38:36):
trying to learn and grow,because when we don't know the
impact we're having, it can be anegative ripple effect.
That's going on from us to ourteams, to our organizations,
community.
So what better way to servethan to really be aware and
constantly getting feedback onhow we're showing up as a leader
?
Now, the third point I wanted tohighlight was a.
(38:58):
What Margot actually shared waswhen we were talking about
fitting in, and she said sobeautifully.
To try to fit in comes from anillusion that we are separate
and we're not.
So I'll leave you to ponder onthat one.
Thank you for joining and untilnext time.
(39:19):
Remember you were born for areason.
It's time to thrive.
In today's episode , we continue where we left off
in conversation with MargotThomas and Monique Longhurst,
founders of Ikigai Leading, whoare on a mission to develop
purposeful, conscious andconnected leaders.
So if you have just joined usin this episode and you haven't
listened to part one, go backand listen to part one first,
(00:21):
because it's going to make a lotmore sense, because part two is
really building on part one.
And if you're new to thepodcast, welcome, go back and
listen to part one, listen tothis one, and then I'd invite
you to listen to the firstepisode, which is Could Magnetic
Authenticity be Your Superpower?
And that will help give you thecontext about what Magnetic
(00:42):
Authenticity is and why it'ssomething that you might want to
consider developing.
So, as a bit of a recap forthose that have been eagerly
awaiting part two, part one weheard about the relationship
between authenticity andleadership and how to find your
own flavor of it.
So, Monique and Margot, throughtheir own work, they co-create
(01:05):
programs that really transformthe way leaders, teams and
organisations function as awhole system, and as we dive
into part two, we will hearabout how they create
sustainable impact.
By doing that, we're also goingto learn how we can step more
into our own authenticity, andalso some cutting edge research
(01:26):
in leadership and relationshipwith self and the foundational
practice that is so needed rightnow.
It's no longer a nice to have.
It's something that's reallyactually critical for people to
be practicing.
And we're also going to diveinto a conversation around
increasing the need for thefeminine, what that even means
(01:47):
and how everyone can harnessthat, regardless of your gender.
So let's dive in and continuethe conversation.
You do a lot of developmentwork in this space and what
happens next?
So what else needs to happen toto actually make create that
space that you talk about?
Once you leave?
So you obviously come intoorganizations, you work with
(02:10):
them, but you're not alwaysthere for the to hold the hand.
So what has to else has tohappen to support this
development?
Margot Thomas (02:17):
oh, that's I would say.
Can I just say that even whenwe are there, we're not holding
anyone's hand?
Yeah, kind of a that that.
So what is our?
We see a contribution is andany leader's contribution, as
they support, you know, have apartake on on their people's
(02:38):
development, which is differentfrom learning.
Yeah, so there's learning iskind of a adding to your toolkit
.
It's learning is kind of addingto your toolkit.
It's kind of a new skill, a newcompetence.
And developing is expanding.
You know it's when we expand,for example, the way our belief
system or we redefine our beliefsystem, right.
(03:00):
So this is kind of in the realmof development.
It's hard.
It's a behavior, culture,transformation, sort of a kind
of a development dimension whichis hard.
Nobody can do that for you,it's your work.
So what we see is just how dowe offer the right questions,
(03:21):
the right processes?
You know processes to helppeople.
Ah, oh, that's how it's done.
You know that's the reflection,observation, experimentation
and play it again.
So it's almost like you know,it's enabling people to kind of
find their own way of doing.
(03:42):
So it doesn't matter how longyou're there being in the
individual coaching engagementjourney or inside a longitudinal
work in an organization, aleadership program, you're just
setting people up in order to beable to do that for themselves
and others.
Yeah, so, uh, yeah, so,naturally, because this is not.
(04:05):
So.
Most of the work that we do isnot training or is not kind of a
transactional.
There's nothing wrong withthose things, by the way.
It's just not where we'recalled to serve.
So a lot of our work is in therealm of development and takes
time, as you say.
You know, to shift mindsets, toshift behaviors, behaviors, to
shift kind of your belief systemtakes a little bit longer.
(04:28):
Yeah, we tend to be inpartnership for long.
Not long time is longer time.
Yeah, so we, most of ourclients you know we've been
working with them companies andorganizations, you know it's
often this is a three to four,sometimes five year horizon.
Yeah, and the coaching is not aone-off.
(04:50):
The coaching is like is a sixto a year, year and a half
partnership, because to allowthat, you know that deeper work
to occur.
But it still has to continueand it's not us doing the work,
it's not us.
You know what I mean.
We say we're helping, we're nothelping, we're not healing
(05:10):
people, people healingthemselves, you know, just to
finish healing.
For us, our interpretation ofhealing, it is your ability to
look at the things in you thatare no longer serving you as a
person, as a leader, and, overtime, having the courage to let
(05:30):
them behind and let the new tocome.
This is, for us, is healing.
So that's sometimes we callwe're healers because we're kind
of in there.
That's just to be clear what wemean by healing.
Sorry, I'm wondering.
And Jo, maybe add what I meanby healing.
Monique Longhurst (05:45):
Sorry, I'm interrupting.
And, Jo, maybe to add to that,there are some conditions that
will support that journeyongoing as well, and I think
that's something that we areobserving within organisations.
But I think some of the lensesthat we use when we work in the
leadership development space isvery simple but a leading self
leading others and leadingsystems or leading systemically,
(06:06):
and what we do know is for thework to happen at the individual
, like for the work to happen atthe system space.
The work needs to happen at theindividual space.
So we unapologetically alwaysstart with a leading self, but
you never.
That work is never done either.
When we know about, what weknow about adult development is,
you know it's an ongoing,lifelong journey, um, and so
(06:31):
that that sense of how does howdoes the work continue when
we're maybe out of theintervention space, whether
that's in a coachingconversation or in, uh you know,
a team workshop or whateverform that takes.
There are some things thathappen from a self-perspective
and I think that reflectivepractice, I think the
(06:53):
willingness to lean into thehard work, I think there's a
mindset around experimentationthat's really critical for this
work and that's also a mindsetthat's really helpful when teams
or groups of people are workingtogether to do that journey
together.
So, even if we think about theleading others or leading with
others, there's a sense of theme in the we there.
(07:15):
So there's still the work to bedone at the individual level,
but there's also work to be donein that collective.
So holding an experimentationmindset, making some commitments
to work differently, anexperimentation mindset, making
some commitments to workdifferently.
So how do we work together thatallows us to witness each
other's development, to holdeach other accountable, to offer
really valuable feedback on thejourney that we want to be
(07:35):
making as leaders.
And then, systemically, if wethink about the system, it's
also about getting really greatfeedback within a system.
System, it's also about gettingreally great feedback within a
system.
It's about having really cleargoals.
But not goals is really for us,it's around a shared direction.
What's the impact that we'rehere to have?
So when we've got that clearvision of whether it's our team
(07:57):
purpose, whether it's ourorganisational purpose, whether
it's our key priorities, it's ameasure for us.
So, as a leader, is my work andthe impact I'm having on my
team leading us towards thatdirection?
So having that clarity, I thinkis really critical too, so that
we know whether we're aligned,whether we're making progress.
(08:19):
So I think there are someconditions that wrap around the
individual journey that can bereally helpful.
I think the experimentation isprobably the one we're seeing
highlighted most.
Would you agree, margot, withleaders at the moment Just
holding that experimentationmindset, adapting, adjusting,
keeping the conversation alive.
(08:39):
What's working, what's notworking, what do we want to
adjust today?
What's the unintendedconsequences of some of the
decisions we're making?
Both really positive, some ofthose unintended consequences
can be wonderful as well.
So that reflective practice,building that in the stepping up
onto the balcony, if I can usethe Kegan metaphor, you know
(09:01):
when are we on the dance floor,when are we on the balcony?
How do we set ourselves?
Margot Thomas (09:04):
Heifetz, sorry, don't name the wrong man, Wrong
man sorry Wrong reference.
Monique Longhurst (09:15):
How do we build that into our ways of
being together, so that that'snot just happening when we're in
a room together, you know, inan intervention space, but it's
actually our way of workingtogether?
Margot Thomas (09:26):
as well.
You see, there is a little tipthat we often use in coaching to
you know that I find it veryempowering in the way.
Your invitation.
So, because what Mon said isthat personal, interpersonal and
systemic right.
So we often hold the leadershipdevelopment in context.
(09:48):
Yeah, because otherwise it'sjust a nice theoretical.
It's just you bring the contextand the reality of leadership.
It's trying to be exercisedbeing community and organization
team with one person, but youbring the context in, yeah, so
that the expansion anddevelopment occurs.
How can we bring ourselves in away that is more effective?
(10:09):
Right, that's what the, so whatwe invite people is, there is
the potential, the opportunityor the, the challenge that we're
just exploring here.
So how much of that it's me inthat problem.
So that's the personalleadership, the self-awareness,
(10:29):
and then my mindset is that my,you know what.
So you bring your you.
You know what is need to shift,adapt, evolve.
Is that an interpersonal thing?
Is that me in relationship withpotentially people in there?
That needs to be redefined.
Or is there more systemic?
There is kind of something as aculture in that system, or is
(10:52):
there?
You know particularly the waythe structure is done.
So you look at, so that youknow there's never just one
thing.
Yeah, that's the multidimensionfor you to to come.
You know your leadership impactit's determined by all those.
You know, your ability to lookat all those dimensions and and
(11:14):
some you can control andinfluence, and some you can't.
Right and and and we'll make acall when we are operating in a
space where we can have, wecan't have the, the influence
and the control that we wish tohave.
Jolynne Rydz (11:30):
Yeah, I'm hearing.
It's just so embedded andknowing that self.
So then you can go, doesn'tmatter how much personal work
you're gonna work doing.
Margot Thomas (11:40):
The system won't change.
Just, it's an example, right?
So it's time, perhaps, oreither.
Okay, it's time to stay,because I will learn how to work
in a box.
It's time to move on, you know.
So that's, and sometimes wehave these conversations as well
.
You know, encourage people.
(12:00):
You know it's time for you tofind some fertile soil, because
the one that you're tending tokind of at this point in time is
not going to bloom what youwish for yeah, beautiful, and so
do you have one first stepsomeone could take if they are
(12:22):
wanting to step more into theirauthenticity one first step.
Wow, is it funny, isn't it?
Steps, processes, why we're so.
We need that, right.
It's almost like it's a way ofcontrolling instead of it's it's
and I'm not saying that in a ina bad way, but it's so um, my
(12:46):
response to that there's norecipe.
There's kind of a guidingprinciple.
She did this for me is aroundawareness.
The more you know I become moreintimate to who I am, more
likely I can work towards, youknow, becoming honoring more of
that person.
That's really the true me.
(13:08):
So that's kind of a principle,but not necessarily a step to go
towards that, because you canarrive to that or start that in
so many different ways.
Yeah, but um, yeah, that was mythought.
Your beautiful question howabout you, mon?
Monique Longhurst (13:26):
I, I totally agree.
There's no recipe.
If, if I come to what could youmaybe play with um as you're
exploring that?
There's a process that justcame straight to me and I think
it's because it speaks to me.
So I have the personality typewhere I'm a thinker.
(13:50):
That's my dominance.
I can find a script that fitsin the moment as well.
So I think that building thatawareness and that pause point
so there's two things Breath isreally a key part of just
slowing down and coming in.
So I think, if there's abreathwork practice, even if
(14:11):
it's just a couple of deepbreaths in the moment to come
back to centre, but thenengaging my brain because, even
if I choose not to, it's therewith three key questions and it
comes from, you know, accessingthe beautiful wisdom of our head
, our heart and our body.
But in the moment, what do Ireally think, with the emphasis
(14:35):
on really.
So getting past the firstthoughts and the surface scripts
and that you know, in thismoment, what do I really think,
and if I hold that question deepenough and long enough, really
letting thoughts come, what do Itruly feel, with the emphasis
(14:59):
on truly, and what do I deeplyneed so that really, truly
deeply, just takes us to anotherspace and as we hold.
You know, margo, you would youuse the word you know, if you
sat and asked those questions tosomeone else, the intimacy that
(15:22):
that's inviting, but sittingwith that for ourselves.
You know, in this moment, whatdo I really think?
If I get behind all the yeah,what do I truly feel and what do
I deeply need?
Jolynne Rydz (15:39):
I love that.
Margot Thomas (15:40):
I want to try it straight after this no, that's
beautiful, yeah, and, and for me, so, if the invitation you see,
I got, um, I some, I got, I gottriggered by what is one first
step.
I love the one.
You just flip that into.
Okay's, no one.
But there's so many options,let me give you one.
(16:00):
That's so one.
Another option is not anotheroption, but another way is.
For me it's really meditation,yeah, so it is that.
And meditation or sittingcross-legged with just whatever
is the state where I really getinto silence and within and just
(16:23):
create a space for connectingdeeply.
So that could be different foreveryone, but it's just the
mindful practices help us comeback to, you know, again, to
have intimacy, how we're reallyfeeling, how are you thinking
and we and I, and kind of, andthe body you see, being a body,
(16:45):
person, personality, wise, um,which is kind of a have a, you
know, orientation towards action, orientation to be, you know,
in the present moment, I reallytrust my gut, yeah, so, uh, this
is, yeah, oh, interesting.
We could do a round ofauthenticity with the different
centers of intelligence you knowas your primary.
(17:06):
If you have a primary headcenter, what is that?
Your relationship ofauthenticity with your body,
what would be?
And then with your heart, whatwould that be?
oh, cool, that's the nextpodcast but yeah, so just that
that tuning into really cominghome.
(17:27):
And then for me, coming home isto come from my to my body.
Yeah, so, and she reallynoticed and pay attention
there's also as a way to tune inwhat is really what is really
going on for me.
Yeah, in terms of going back tothat intimacy, yeah, and Jo,
I'm called to.
Monique Longhurst (17:46):
You know, in the past, and we hear this all
the time, oh, I don't haveenough time to you know, the
practice of meditation, thepractice of reflective.
You know, yes, and thecutting-edge research on
leadership right now is actuallytaking us to that space you
know back to that space and it'sno longer an optional extra,
(18:08):
it's no longer when I have timeactually, and it's no longer the
you know, the oh, that's lovelyif you've got the opportunity,
or it's actually now the, thepiece, that self-awareness, that
self-care, the option to thenself-regulate.
You know, the relationship withself is so key in our impact
(18:33):
externally, consciously orotherwise, that the, as we said,
the cutting edge research.
There's some fascinating workcoming out into this space.
That's really about.
It is such an essential callfor leadership now to have that
practice and that reflectivepractice, whatever form it takes
for you.
But I just want to speak to thelovely nice, to the yeah buts.
(18:56):
Yes, sounds great, we all knowthat, but have you got four kids
?
And you know?
You know traveling?
Yes, and never before has itbeen more important to add that
in there as well.
So I just wanted to speak topotentially some of the
resistance that people might befeeling as we talk about breath
work and meditation, whichsounds lovely.
No, it's, it's essential in thespace now.
Jolynne Rydz (19:21):
It's beautiful.
Thank you for sharing.
Margot Thomas (19:22):
And the micro moments.
Right can be done in the shower, if you can shower, find a time
to shower and then the shower.
You know, as you get the showerover you and it's just kind of
a this is my little moment withme, me, yep, yep.
So it doesn't need to be thehour meditation that many of us
can't afford, but it's just thatintimacy in the micro moments
(19:44):
right before bed, after you know, first thing you do when you
get up in the car um, the traintrip you know the reflection on
my day.
Monique Longhurst (19:54):
How did I show up?
Margot Thomas (19:55):
you know all of that, yeah yeah, everyone did
experiment, yeah, and evenexperiment with just have a go,
have a quick and see.
Is that an impact?
No, thank you, mine and margo,it didn't work.
But you know, just go and havea play just to kind of see if
there's a.
What is the impact?
What it does to you in terms ofyou noticing what is really
(20:16):
going on for you and we say thelast thing I want to say because
, as you mentioned before, theaudience that you're cultivating
is a lot of a female kind of amultitasking, et cetera, if I
can speak specifically to thatcohort is that there is this
(20:38):
thing about putting the oxygenmask first before you attend to
the other, meaning our abilityto sustain our effort and serve
and help others and be withothers and be the mother, and be
the, the daughter and be.
It's so much sustained, it'sbetter sustained if we tend to
(21:00):
ourselves really, yeah, and andinto in one way, for those of us
they have children, is thattheir kids, our kids, are
beautiful kids will do what theysee us doing, not what we ask
them to do.
And to be able to remodel thatbeautiful relationship with self
and tending to self and, youknow, setting healthy boundaries
(21:24):
and showing that to ourchildren.
How is that done?
I think is an awesome gift thatwe can give them.
You know, even in the micromoments, I find it personally a
commitment of mine.
Jolynne Rydz (21:39):
Beautiful, so powerful and, before I bring us
home with our Swift 7 questions,we've talked about so much
today.
So we've talked about all ofthat internal operating system,
how that relates to other people, how that the system and
putting that in context, and somuch more.
I think I'll need to re-watchthis and delve into this again.
(22:00):
It's going to be so much fun.
Uh, I'd love to know what'syour legacy.
Where are you taking thisco-creation legacy?
Margot Thomas (22:08):
whoa?
What do you mean by that?
Can I, can I prompt?
What is?
What is the intention and theinvitation of the question?
Jolynne Rydz (22:18):
The invitation is to share.
What is it that you want toleave behind as you do all of
this work?
What is the future vision andthe impact that you're seeing
the ripple effect, I guess fromwhat you're doing?
Monique Longhurst (22:39):
Maybe, margot , let me speak and please add in
um, please do that.
So I think grounded in what westand for is developing
purposeful, conscious andconnected leaders.
So that's that's both ourmission but the legacy we want
to leave behind.
(22:59):
You know, leaders who areconnected with their personal
purpose and the embodiment ofthat and the impact that that
has, the level of consciousness,so that the impact that they're
having is intentional, and theconnection, because we know that
(23:21):
we can do more together and incommunity and that that journey
is.
You know, there's definitelywork we can do individually and
privately, but what happens incommunity and when we do our
work together, the impacts ofthat on self and others, I think
if we come to the ripple effect, we unapologetically know that
(23:45):
there's such a calling for thefeminine and there's a need and
we have a deep passion anddesire to make space, to create
space, to have an impact in thatwork and to respect what's
available for us if we embraceand indeed honour the feminine.
(24:06):
We're both mothers and takethat role.
Really.
You know that's a core part ofwho we are and I think I can
speak in the we space here thatthe ripple effect of the work
that we have.
Yes, there's individuals,there's teams, there's
organisations, but thoseorganisations serve communities.
We work, we're intentionalabout the sectors we want to
(24:27):
work with.
We work in communities that youknow.
We do a lot of work incommunity-based organisations as
well the not-for-profit sectorbecause of the impact that they
have.
So the ripple effect from aleader into a team, into the
community, into the clients, butalso as a partner, as a father,
as a mother, you know ourclients, we know that, their
(24:50):
impact, and there's nothing morefulfilling than hearing the
stories when they come back andgo.
My relationship with my kidshave shifted in the last six
months and I know it's becauseof the work that we're doing in
the room here, you know, as aleader, but the ripple effect of
that and I think that's exactlythe legacy that we want to
leave it's weaved through thework.
(25:15):
So I think that mission ofpurposeful, conscious, connected
leaders but the leader isn'tthe multiple roles that we hold,
um, anything you want to add tothat- Margot, I think it's
beautiful that's.
Margot Thomas (25:28):
And the feminine meaning not, uh, female, no, the
feminine is the part of us thatboth men and women can embody,
which I tend to, what iscyclical, which has a desire to
be in community, which iscreative, which is want to birth
(25:54):
.
That's why the creative, fromthe sense want to birth, that is
the feminine that we talk about, it right, absolutely, and the
masculine, the reason I'm sayingit's kind of a little bit out
of whack.
Yeah, because even as to thecore, the feminine and the cycle
(26:15):
, nature, feminine, that MotherNature teaches us the winter,
the summer, we are natural, weare beings, we are cyclical
beings and we don't honor thatin terms of it's just always on,
on, on, on.
We don't honor our personalwinter.
It's just time to kind of justbe quiet and germinate and just
(26:38):
go in.
Just time to kind of just bequiet and germinate and just go
in, or our summer, or our spring, or autumn, which is time to
let it go, so that we so that'shonour the feminine is honours
the dimensions of us.
That is not mechanical, that isnot, you know, that's a passion
of us as well.
Jolynne Rydz (27:00):
Thank you so much for sharing.
It's been so powerful so I wantto transition us into the Swift
7.
So these questions are notabout deep, dark thoughts Not
dark, we haven't been dark todayDeep thought, but just what
first comes to mind.
So question number one in yourview, what are three words that
describe an ideal leader?
Monique Longhurst (27:25):
did we just say it purposeful, conscious and
connected yes, easy, okay, fillin the blank.
Margot Thomas (27:32):
Magnetic authenticity is intimate
relationship with yourself myneck's nodding.
Jolynne Rydz (27:43):
Anything to add?
Um, and regenerative is theother word that's coming to me,
so yeah, when you noticeyourself trying to fit in,
what's the first thing that youdo?
Margot Thomas (27:56):
I don't, I don't, I don't.
That's a.
I yeah being a.
You know, being having lived inmany countries and being doing
the shift from fitting intobelonging I, I, I don't, I, I
(28:17):
hand on heart, I do not desireto fit in anymore so I don't
quite have that relationshipwith fitting in yet.
Monique Longhurst (28:26):
So for me, because that's that fine line I
said before about the superpowerof the fitting in to where and
I know your differentiation ofhere so where I've gone from
adapting to my situation and thepeople around me to fitting in,
there's two things I now dodidn't used to but now I do is
reconnect to self.
(28:47):
So it's back to that connectionto authenticity, and then I
stand out, I will bring out myred heels, I will do something
that's just like do not breakout, I will make myself stand
out intentionally.
Jolynne Rydz (29:01):
Next time I see you in the red heels, are you
okay?
Margot Thomas (29:05):
Because, Jo, if you allow me to be philosophical
or mystical, to fit in, to tryto fit in, comes from an
illusion that we're separate.
We're not.
So, fundamentally, I believethat you know we're made of all
the same fabric and all.
(29:26):
So the reason to fit in is toassume that I'm not part of you
know what I'm saying.
So that's the reaction was Idon't need to fit in, we are.
And then the deep, deep work ofself-acceptance, right as well,
(29:46):
follows.
You know, as of that, that inwhich I had to do very hard.
There was a, you know, butbelieve me, you know, for many,
many years I tried to fit in andit worked, had lots of
strategies to how, pretend thatI'm not, but I am, etc.
Happy to talk to you about itanother time.
But I think for me today tobeing able to sit here with you
(30:09):
and just have this beautifulresponse this is, this is not
part of my book anymore and mybible.
It comes from their deepknowing that we're not separate
beautiful you couldn't help it.
Jolynne Rydz (30:25):
How could you?
Yeah, it's a good profound andI love it.
I love it.
It's truly amazing.
All right, um number four.
What song gets you reallypumped?
Margot Thomas (30:37):
so, oh well, a song, perhaps can I go that.
Yeah, I love Brazilian music,beautiful.
Monique Longhurst (30:58):
So much music moves me, but I think the first
place I went was 80s, like ifyou want to put Cyndi Lauper on,
um, girls just want to have fun.
You'll have me on the dancefloor in a matter of seconds and
my beautiful opportunity now isinviting my 16 year old
daughter and her friends ontothe dance floor.
So that's what will get memoving and get me pumped some 19
(31:21):
big 80s female voices amazingbut it was before my time.
Jolynne Rydz (31:28):
I don't know okay, question number what are we up
to five?
What's the most daring thingyou've ever done?
Monique Longhurst (31:39):
oh, other than talking to my boss, like I
did.
Margot Thomas (31:47):
Daring, daring.
How about that?
I quit my job, I changedcountries, pregnant yeah,
arrived in Australia, left thejob, left the country and I was
(32:07):
pregnant and I bought a houseconcurrently that is daring.
Monique Longhurst (32:10):
That is daring.
So there's two things for me.
Physically daring jumping outof an airplane I don't know if
that's daring, or just sillyskydiving, intentionally jumping
out of an airplane.
But, to be honest, starting myown business at the age of 23
and again, that was a valueschoice.
I was being told what I couldor couldn't do and I was like
(32:31):
I'll go and figure that out formyself and started my own
consultancy at 23 amazing andthe red heels probably came on
it's funny because it feels, youknow, if you ever there was a
daring that doesn't feel dairy,it's almost like there's a.
Margot Thomas (32:49):
There's a daring that doesn't feel daring, it's
almost like there's a fire thatcomes, you know, fuse your belly
.
Yeah.
So my transition to Australia,I just had that knowing it's
going to be fine.
I know it's daring.
There's not many people thatcould do that.
Often you just do one at a time.
You either have a kid, youeither buy a house, you either
(33:10):
change, change country, or youeither quit your job.
You don't do that.
But there is something you knowback to the body, kind of, and
back to all that, that deepknowing, that kind of a.
It's not it's, and that's whatI love about the discerning
daring from being stupid, youknow I mean.
So there is the daring, thereis something that ground there.
(33:30):
Yeah, decision that feels at a,you know, naked eye, whoa.
But there is a I don't know ina knowing that ground you to do
that absolutely, absolutely.
Monique Longhurst (33:44):
And there's a reality of all the other things
around it right deeply.
No, this is the right choice,but what am I doing beautiful?
Jolynne Rydz (33:56):
so question six do you have a favorite quote or
mantra that you live by?
Monique Longhurst (34:05):
mine is actually a prayer at the moment,
and it's a prayer that's beenwith me for a very long time at
different stages of my life, andit's just a serenity prayer.
So grant me the serenity toaccept the things I cannot
change, the courage to changethe things I can, and the wisdom
to know the difference.
And that's just lived with mein moments, um, any major life
(34:27):
cycles as well.
Margot Thomas (34:28):
So, yeah, that's what I come back to yeah, but
for me, I love the hobie nationpoem, which is a long one and it
is a stunning, and there is apart of it that it speaks to.
You know, we're jumping intothe river and letting go of the
shores and go with the flow, butthe part that we are the ones
(34:54):
that we were waiting for, yeah,it really, that's forever my
favorite.
And Margaret Whitley she wrotea book called Perseverance and
she broke this poem into tinylittle pieces introducing each
chapter of her book and just sobeautifully, you know, uh,
orchestrated.
(35:15):
So, yeah, hopey nation, uh poem, happy to provide the details,
this is stunning.
That's my favorite poem everthat would be great.
Jolynne Rydz (35:24):
We can pop a link in the show notes.
Okay, we are coming to thefinal question, which is what's
one small thing that brings youincredible joy?
Margot Thomas (35:36):
oh, it's my son's smile, which is not as mild,
beautiful every time.
You have, you know, you havethose meditations to say oh,
connect with your heart.
Perhaps, if you're grateful forsomething straight away, is
this face that I see, andthey're just and for me it'll be
the physical touch of mydaughters.
Monique Longhurst (35:58):
Um, we were walking down the king street
holding hands this morning andthey're both teenagers, so that
physicality of their presence,absolutely small and, as you
said, not so small.
Jolynne Rydz (36:09):
But brings joy.
Beautiful, and I think I mightbe a combination of you two.
So mine is seeing at the uhwhen my kids get home so they'll
run big grins, but then they'llhug me at the end and almost
bowl me over that's weird yeah,beautiful, such a good.
This has been such a wonderful,insightful, deep and moving
(36:31):
conversation.
Thank you so much for forjoining in this space and
creating this space for thisconversation.
Um, where can people find youif they would like to connect
with you?
What is the best way to reachout to?
Monique Longhurst (36:43):
you Our website, absolutely ikigileading
.
com.
au.
You can find us on LinkedIn.
We tend to share in that space.
Yeah, they're the main placesyou can find us at the moment.
Jolynne Rydz (36:58):
Beautiful.
All right, we'll pop all thelinks there and thank you so
much for joining us.
Have a wonderful day and we'llsee you next time.
Margot Thomas (37:05):
Thanks so much for the invite, Jo.
It was awesome.
Thanks for the conversation.
Jolynne Rydz (37:09):
Jo, I trust that you had as much fun listening to
that as we had recording that,and wasn't that a such a mind
blowing conversation?
There's there's so much inthere.
Lucky, we split it into twoparts.
So just for part two, there'sthree key points that I really
wanted to highlight, and I'msure you have your own as well.
(37:31):
So, if you do, please let meknow on LinkedIn so you can add
a comment to any of my posts, orDM me, because I truly do want
to hear your feedback and what'sresonating for you, because
that will help me to create evenbetter content that you're
going to love.
So, in closing, there's threepoints that I think were so
(37:52):
beautifully made by Monique andMargot.
The first one was about delvinginto our authenticity, and
Monique had this beautifulsaying of what do I really think
, what do I truly feel and whatdo I deeply need.
What wonderful questions.
The second point I wanted tohighlight was the ripple impact
(38:16):
from the leader, just the powera leader has to influence and
impact an organization and acommunity, and the flow on
effects of that, and why, asleaders, it's so critical that
we're aware of the impact wehave and that we're continually
(38:36):
trying to learn and grow,because when we don't know the
impact we're having, it can be anegative ripple effect.
That's going on from us to ourteams, to our organizations,
community.
So what better way to servethan to really be aware and
constantly getting feedback onhow we're showing up as a leader
?
Now, the third point I wanted tohighlight was a.
(38:58):
What Margot actually shared waswhen we were talking about
fitting in, and she said sobeautifully.
To try to fit in comes from anillusion that we are separate
and we're not.
So I'll leave you to ponder onthat one.
Thank you for joining and untilnext time.
(39:19):
Remember you were born for areason.
It's time to thrive.
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