Jason Jackson: Walking Away from the Game

Jason Jackson walked away from everything the world said he was supposed to chase—D1 football, six-figure job, social media clout—all to follow something bigger.

This is more than just talk. Jason is 23, but his wisdom hits like he’s been here for decades. We got into:

🎙️ Quitting football & finding identity outside the game
🎙️  Why chasing money won’t ever fulfill you
🎙️  Social media fame vs. real purpose
🎙️  Why popularity is dangerous for Christians today
🎙️ Trusting God when nothing makes sense

Jason tells us aboutabout sacrifice, faith, and why most people are scared to live fully for God. If you’ve ever felt stuck between comfort and calling, this one’s for you.

This convo is a masterclass on faith, discipline, and doing life God's way. Hit play, lock in, and let’s talk about it.

🔥 Drop a comment below if Jason's journey hits home for you.
👉 Like, share, and subscribe to help us keep these stories coming.
🎧 On the move? Tap in on Apple Podcasts or Spotify for the audio version.

#MavericksOnTheMic #FaithOverFame #PurposeOverPopularity #TrustGod #ChristianInfluencer #FaithJourney #GodsPlan #KingdomWork #WalkByFaith #Entrepreneurship #BiblicalTruth #SocialMediaAndFaith #FootballTestimony #SpiritualGrowth #JesusFirst #MavericksOnTheMic

Chapter Markers
00:00 - The Decision to Walk Away 
02:00 - The Identity Crisis: Who Am I Without Football?
05:55 - Rock Bottom & the Moment That Changed Everything
07:07 - The Song That Broke Me: “Keep Praying” 
12:28 - Popularity vs. Purpose: What Are You Really Chasing?
19:39 - The Truth About Christian Collabs & Social Media
25:26 - Why You Should Pray About Everything (Yes, EVERYTHING) 
37:23 - Sin, Struggles & Making the Right Choices
44:37 - What the Church Needs to Get Right About Influence
52:05 - The Trap of Comparison & Finding Your Own Path
57:08 - Why My Social Media Strategy is Just Obedience to God
1:07:07 - The Truth About Entrepreneurship & What Nobody Tells You

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🎧 Want to watch the conversation? Watch on YouTube

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
I walked away from ball.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
It wasn't because I didn't feel like I could do
anything for the game.
No more Football was becomingwho I was and not what I did.
One term that I don't use isI'm a Christian social media
influencer, because I've seenpeople on the internet
jeopardize their faith to get abrand deal.

Speaker 3 (00:20):
It's been quoted that you said that popularity is one
of the biggest dangers to thefuture of Christianity.
What did you mean by that?

Speaker 2 (00:29):
If I didn't agree with Madman City's Philatelistic
Racialism, I wouldn't be on theshow.

Speaker 1 (00:33):
He said what is the lie?
It was Madman City, he said so.
A porn hub called you guys andasked y'all to do a collab.
Would you do it?

Speaker 2 (00:40):
And I said but in that moment I realized, bro, I'm
just people pleasing, All Ihave to do is fight for me and

(01:00):
for the Lord.

Speaker 3 (01:09):
What's up everybody.
Welcome to another episode ofMavericks on the Mic.
I'm JJ.

Speaker 1 (01:13):
I'm Norman and today we have our special special
guest.
It's a dude I reached out to.
I thought he was superinspiring, super motivational,
really knows the text ourproblem.

Speaker 2 (01:25):
Jason Jackson.
What up?

Speaker 1 (01:27):
what's up, man JJJ yes, sir JJ and JJ, we got 5J
and that's it that's it.

Speaker 2 (01:37):
What up, man?
Yeah, I'm living, I'm blessedto be here, man, absolutely it's
really an honor especiallycoming from where I come from,
and just a crazy story aroundmaverick city and me.
So being to be here and speakwith y'all is like like
something I couldn't even thinkto pray for, wow talk to me
about that you're gonna getright into it, yeah, yeah.

(02:00):
So most people probably don'tknow this because it's kind of
god has just kind of exalted meinto the light at a young age,
but I just started social media.
I just created my social mediaaccounts last year.
Wow, like 2023, january 2nd.
So I ain't have TikTok, I ain'thave Instagram, I ain't have
none of that.
Wow, it was my way of likegetting away from a person that

(02:23):
I used to be and becomingsomebody that I had never been
before.
Wow, so I created it.
I played college football,played in Arkansas, and then one
thing that kind of hit me waslike when things didn't go my
way Because I had, you know, youhear the coaches.
They come in, they tell you allthe stuff you got these shots

(02:44):
at NFL and all that.
But I asked Cass all the timelike who are you whenever things
go south?
Yeah, and I had a situationthat went south for me.
I walked away from ball Okay.
It wasn't because I didn't feellike I could do anything for
the game no more.
It wasn't because I hated myteammates.
It wasn't because I didn't likethe program.
It's because I felt likefootball was becoming who I was

(03:05):
and not what I did, like I wasbecoming a football player.

Speaker 1 (03:10):
That was an idol.

Speaker 2 (03:11):
Absolutely it was, and a lot of guys they don't
realize that that's what it is.
But I caught it early, luckily,you know.
So I ended up graduating with afinance degree, moved to
Houston, texas no family, nofriends, no, nothing.
Moved there by myself.
Start this job, pay me $40,000a year To my family.

(03:34):
I made it Like the town I comefrom.
That's what making it is.
So I get there, man.
I move to Houston January 6th,start the job January 9th.
I'm working two and a halfweeks, 13 hours a day, six days
a week.
I get to January 25th.

(03:55):
I'm like man ain't no way, likeain't no way.
This what God got for me, likewhen he created me.
There's no way that he saidthis is the best that I can do
for you.
So what did I do?
I quit.
I had no backup plan, I hadnobody I could call and say hey,
can I, can I come crash withyou?
For I had rent, I had a car, Ihad a max out credit card.

(04:15):
Wow, it's all I had.
I had just broke up with myex-girlfriend right before I
left school, girlfriend, andright before I left school.
And it was hard for me becauseit was a moment in which my
faith was tested.
It's like are you going toworship her or worship me?
You know that was the questionthat I was getting and you know

(04:37):
I broke up with her and as timewent on, I knew that she was
going to go back to the lifethat she was previously living,
Like I knew that the life that Ihelped her get away from
without me being there in herpresence, she's going to go back
to the life that she waspreviously living Like I knew
that the life that I helped herget away from without me being
there in her presence, she wasgoing to go back to it.
So I kind of felt guilty forthat.
I'm like man, bro, like I knowthis is going to happen and I
feel like it's my fault that ithappened.
So at this point, like I'm brokeand broken heart, I call on the

(05:00):
phone one day, man, I'm likelike I'll do anything, anything
back with you, blah, blah, blah.
And I'm glad god ain't turnedinto a pillow sock because, uh,
I was, it's definitely.
I was supposed to walk awayfrom hit her up.
She told me um, I just feellike you take this god stuff too
serious.
And before I got on the phonewith her.
I had prayed god, if this, ifthis ain't for me, let me know.

(05:23):
That's the first thing she saidwhen we got on the phone.
I'm like cool.
It's February 6th last year 2023for those who watching and I
just remember in that moment Ihadn't cried in eight years Tore
, my ACL, my freshman year ofcollege.
I wasn't crying, though,because I was broke.
I wasn't crying because I wasin a financial crisis.

(05:43):
I wasn't crying because I hadlost a relationship.
I was crying because I realizedthat everything that I had
previously identified with hadjust died.
Everything had died.
So it's like people look at meand I share that story and
people think, oh man, Iunderstand what you're going
through, but they're notlearning the same.
I was more at the loss of aperson, but it wasn't the

(06:05):
relationship, it was me.
It was the version of me that Ihad always knew.
So it's like I was attending afuneral that was ongoing.
It wasn't just a one-dayservice for me, it was all night
long, but the song that had mecrying they brought me to it's
all sitting there, you know I'mand stuff, but the song that
brought me to tears is KeepPraying.

(06:25):
Wow, had never heard that songbefore, of course, growing up in
an environment where Christ isglorified.

Speaker 1 (06:35):
Wow, I heard.

Speaker 2 (06:35):
Christian music and stuff like that all the time.
But I grew up Church of Christ,so they do things different.
I didn't know that.
I didn't know that until I gotolder.
Ain't no instruments in there.
Ain't nobody having a.
That's not the way that theyworship.
So when I'm hearing this, it'salmost as if it's the first time

(06:57):
that I'm being exposed tosomething that's different, and
it's like it's speaking to methe moment she said he hears, he
sees every tear that's falling.
Yeah, I broke.
Yeah, it broke me Like it brokeme.
I hadn't cried in eight years,bro.
I cried that day.
I cried to that song two daysago, thinking about the fact

(07:19):
that I got the opportunity tosit here and with y'all.
Come on, bro, like this issomething that I could never
even imagine.
I come from a town of 1,300people.
I graduated with 40.
My father got sentenced to 40years in prison on a murder
charge.
The day I started crawling Iwas 81 years old.
So to be able to do this type ofstuff and to be able to glorify

(07:41):
God while doing it, it meansmore to me than anybody else
could ever imagine.
So when people ask me if youcan go back, you know you had
this shot with the league.
You had an opportunity to dothis.
Would you go back and do it?
Now that you know it, there'sno way out with me because
there's no paycheck that youcould give me in exchange for
saving one soul.
That's what's important to me.

(08:03):
I could pick up a ball.
I can, throw it, I can.
God gifted me with the abilityto be able to go on a football
field at any given moment and beable to do something that a lot
of people can't do.
And that's not me bragging,that's me stating the facts, but
the thing that God gifted me todo, that I do the absolute best
with the least amount of effort.
It's communicating andconnecting people on a level
that they've never been reachedat before, and that's because I

(08:26):
went through something that mostpeople have never.
They ain't been through it yet.
So when I'm speaking about it,they realize and this is me
talking about something reallike he understand what's going
on in real life.
So that's the reason why I'mhere, like everything that I do
is to glorify God.
I'm 23 years old, yeah, andthere's.

(08:47):
I wouldn't trade this for theworld.

Speaker 1 (08:49):
Let's, let's let's dive a little deeper.
The reason why I like whatyou're discussing is because
we're in a generation, now,right, where the message that
you are speaking isn't popularanymore.
Speaking isn't popular anymore,right, right, and especially
for someone at your age, growingup in the social media era,

(09:09):
growing up with people of theirage me, me, me, yeah, especially
when and then you know, we talkabout it.
You heard this when we weretalking I don't know where
you're talking, like, especiallyin the black community right,
losing your father.
Most people tie their identityto their father.
That's by nature, becausethat's where our last names
generally come from.
Like, what has?

(09:35):
I think my next question wouldbe what started you on this
faith journey?
Was it from the Church ofChrist?
What church did you attend?
What started you on this?
Like, I don't know, I'll put itthis way I don't know that many
20, I guess when you're incollege, you're 18, 19.
I don't know that many 18,19-year-olds are deep enough in

(09:57):
their faith to even recognizethat.
The thing I mean.
If you in college playingfootball, this is what you've
been doing since you was five,six, seven, eight.
Most of us just look at that.
That is my purpose.
Many people wouldn't see thatas as an item Right.
Like you know, you hear theyput ten thousand hours in

(10:18):
anything to be willing, you know, to become a master.
It's just that's my purpose.
I'm a master, it's just that'smy purpose.
That's how a lot of people youknow look at especially
something like football or jobor you know whatever a really
intense hobby.
How did you?
What was that?
I know I'm asking you a lot ofquestions, but because I really
want to kind of understand thisfor you, what was that

(10:39):
differentiator between?
This is what I'm supposed to.
This is my purpose.
Like God has placed me here asa beacon, to be an NFL player
and spread his message versus ohno, I place my identity as a
football player above the callon my life and to get that

(11:00):
center I need to discard thattotally.
Like, because that's a fineline.
Right, there's a very fine linebetween building a purpose and
then find and consider somethingthe idol and then second then
like, what, like what instilledthat level of uh, discernment
within you um, for me it was toanswer the first question.

Speaker 2 (11:26):
It's like, what kind of like showed me that
difference?
Like what was the difference?
What's the difference?

Speaker 1 (11:31):
between you know just being really passionate about
your purpose and something youknow discerning that it's an
item.
Who was the glorifier PierreWow, when I was on the field.

Speaker 2 (11:44):
I'm the one that everybody want to take a picture
of.
I'm the one that I want to signthe autographs for the kids.
I want my name to be the onethat everybody is chanting in
the stands.
I want to be the one that makethe big.
It's glorifying me, so I got aquestion we going.

Speaker 1 (11:59):
Tempestino, right?
Yeah, you know Tempestino.
I mean, he really popularizedthe message of Christ through
football.
I mean, he was the person thatwas taking pictures of them, but
every time he talked, hismessage was about Christ.
That's what I'm asking you,like, what was the like?
Okay, yeah, of course you theone playing football, you know.
So, yeah, they're going to takethe pictures of you, right, but

(12:22):
you'll say how you felt aboutthem taking the picture or the
fact that they taking thepicture.
I felt about it.

Speaker 2 (12:28):
Ah okay.
That's what was taking the gloryfrom God.
Okay, Because I knew the amountof people that I was able to
come in contact with on anygiven Saturday, Okay, or on any
you know, walking throughoutcollege campus.
I'm naturally a quiet guy, LikeI mean y'all something else,
Like I just sit unreserved tomyself.
But I know that by me beingthat and being a football player

(12:51):
, it's going to draw someattention, Because why ain't
this dude like everybody else,Instead of me giving that, like
using that opportunity to sharethe word I'm going?
I ain't like them because itwas a sense of arrogance and
pride that I had that I had toget over and that was personal.
That was personal for me.
I'm not saying every footballplayer, everybody that plays
sports, does that?
But for me that's whatdifferentiated the two it was

(13:13):
your Abraham moment.
Absolutely, absolutely, yeah,absolutely.

Speaker 3 (13:17):
There's a player that he actually played with the
Hawks.
He just retired, I don't knowif you know.
He was like very similar story.
Just was like woke up one day,signed to the Hawks, whatever,
woke up one day and decided I'mgiving my life to Christ and I
don't want to do this basketballthing anymore and actually I'm
supposed to use the fame and theplatform and glory I've got to

(13:38):
spread the message.
So it's really interesting,really interesting yeah yeah, um
and to.

Speaker 2 (13:44):
to go back to what you said about, uh, the second
second portion of your questionwas like what instilled that?
And it was.
I met a mentor while I was incollege.
His name is can you appear forme, man I'm talking about?
I'm not saying god made nomistakes, but I truly believe if
there was anybody that couldlive in the biblical times and

(14:07):
be one of the disciples, itwould be him.
Like he showed me how to live aChrist-like life and not just a
Christian-ish life.
He wasn't trying to be likeother Christians, he was trying
to be like Christ, and he stillis every day.
And so once I saw that, speakon that, like what's the
different?

Speaker 1 (14:25):
speaking like you, you, you, you, you in the little
brain.
So what does that elaborate?
What does that look like?

Speaker 2 (14:32):
to be christian.
Ish means we think I'mchristian because my mom a
christian.
I believe in jesus because Igrew up in america.
There are people who think that, like I'm american, of course
I'm christian.
To be christ-like is mean tolive, love and lead like Christ
in everything you do.
That don't mean that one termthat I don't use is I'm a

(14:55):
Christian.
Social media influencer, I'm aChristian, blah, blah, blah.
No, I'm a social mediainfluencer, whatever you want to
call it, whatever you want tobe, but I live a life like
Christ.
Influencer, whatever title youwant to be, but I live a life
like Christ.
The world has made it so naturalto say that it's almost
whenever you use a statementlike that, as if that is.
I know that it's not the socialnorm, because the world is one

(15:18):
way, but to magnify it is to saythat.
To magnify it is to say that asocial media influencer is to be
this way.
He's Christian, though it'salmost like a though in there.
So to be Christ-like, you needto love, live and lead like
everything that you do.
If you're a father, your kidsare supposed to see an example

(15:41):
of the way that the Father Godraises kids.
If you're a teacher, you'resupposed to teach the way that
Christ teaches.

Speaker 3 (15:47):
You're saying that the identity derives from Christ
, not from anything else.
Absolutely Right, right, right.

Speaker 1 (15:55):
So to elaborate, so it's basically saying to say I'm
a Christian social mediainfluence is redundant.
I live with Christ.
Everything I do is Christian,absolutely.
I'm a Christian water drinker.
I'm a Christian getting drunk.
I live a life fully surrenderedto Christ.

(16:18):
So I don't need to say I'm aChristian social media
influencer.
I'm a social media influencer,everything I do is Christian.

Speaker 2 (16:24):
Yes, that's exactly right.
You know what I mean.
That's exactly.
Influencer I'm a social mediainfluencer.
Everything I do is Christian.
Yes, that's exactly right.
You know what I mean.
That's exactly right.
I like that.
I like that too.

Speaker 1 (16:29):
I think that's a unique perspective and flip on
something that has a lot ofpeople have wrestled with.
Right, they're doing it.
They're shredding the monikerof Christian because it's
limiting to them for purposes ofmainstream appeal, Absolutely.

(16:54):
Where you're saying no, I'msaying not only am I a Christian
on social media, but I'm aChristian.
You know everything.
Yeah, I love it, as long as Iexist, I am a Christian.

Speaker 2 (17:07):
I'm a Christ follower .
My life is devoted to Christ ineverything that I do.
I love that.

Speaker 3 (17:14):
It's been quoted that you said that popularity is one
of the biggest dangers to thefuture of Christianity.
What did you mean by that?

Speaker 2 (17:23):
I mean that because I've seen people on the internet
people, some of which I'mfriends with, jeopardize their
faith to get a brand deal.
They jeopardize upholding thename of Christ.
You distort his image becausethis company is paying you x

(17:43):
amount of money and you get totake a picture with whatever
object it is that they pay youto take a picture with.
But in doing so, how are youshowing other people like what
are you showing other believersor people who want to believe?

Speaker 1 (17:57):
it's okay to be okay, it's good because you know
we've been in this lane a lot,so I kind of want to hit this a
little bit.
Talk about it, alright, so youdon't have to mention the
influencer, but like, give me abrand, like what do you mean?

Speaker 2 (18:14):
I don't even know the name of the company, but there
was a.
It's a clothing company andthey they dress their stuff up
to be high quality, high fashionand but once you scroll through
their social media, you seepeople that's wearing their
clothes and demon outfits, likeit'll be something subtle too.

(18:35):
This one person had a deviltail and like she was sitting on
it, so you can only see itpeeking out.
It's like they're beingdeceived into believing that,
okay, this is some clothes thatI love they look, but okay, they
got that little.
This is just a little problem.
You know what I mean.
But something little alwaysturning us on duty later on if
you don't address it while it'sthere.

(18:55):
That's the type of stuff that Isee often with influencers with
uh people of influence ingeneral, but it's all.
It's always about the heartbehind what you're doing.
You can easily judge, and thisis one thing I want to say.
I want to say this too, like ohokay, because me personally, if
I didn't agree with what y'allwere doing, I promise y'all

(19:18):
wouldn't be on the show rightnow.
If I didn't agree with MaddenCity's flat operations, I
wouldn't be on the show.
But I see it.
Even hearing the conversationthat y'all had with Naomi, yeah,
I see why y'all doing thecollaborations, a lot of people
now don't get that.
Oh well, they Christian.
They not supposed to blah, blah, blah.
Yeah, do you understand whothey trying to reach with this?

Speaker 3 (19:38):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:39):
Like Globeta can kick any different audience Like
Globed out.
A completely different audience, like you said, may have never,
ever heard the gospel before.
Now she's listening to it andshe crying.
Who are you trying to reach andwhat's your own take behind
what you do?
That's the purpose of apartnership.

Speaker 3 (19:53):
What do you think people miss when they are
criticizing some of thecollaborations you've done?
What are they not seeing thatyou would say man don't miss
this, this is important.

Speaker 2 (20:03):
What would that be?
They don't see the stuff that'sbehind him.
They don't see theconversations that's had behind
him where it's like, okay, I, Idid a collaboration with xyz
corporation.
Maybe this person isn't isn't abeliever to the public eye, but
you don't know theconversations that I have with
this person on a weekly basisand I see their heart changing.
They want to believe they justare.

(20:25):
They have a catalyst therebecause everything that happened
in there from the past, that'swhat people don't see.
Joe, I love that from uh.

Speaker 1 (20:35):
So what do you?
All right, so let's hit it.
What do you say about peoplewho feel like, so you spoke to
and I get it.
There's a difference betweencollaborating with pure
integrity, collaborating withcompromise.
You know, we got to do a recordwhere an artist is cussing,
talking about promoting andpropagating sin.

(20:58):
Yeah, you know that's notsomething we're going to do, but
that very same person can, asthe Bible says, let everything
that have breath praise the LordEverything.
You know what I mean.
And so that eliminates those.
That leaves praise open foreveryone.
What do you think about?
I think the popularity thing isreally interesting in and of

(21:24):
itself, because when we talkabout compromise, I think that
is where we have to be extremelyspecific.
Yeah, and what I mean by thatis I don't want to God does
things in so many ways that aremysterious to us.
You know, like I remember mypastor preached a message on

(21:47):
Dylann Roof.
You remember that?
You remember Dylann Roof wasthe.
He was a white kid who wentinto a black Bible study.
He murdered nine people.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And what my pastor said wasshocking.
It was jarring, but what hesaid was if that was the thing
that got him saved, dylann Roof,like Dylann Roof, if, if him

(22:12):
going to commit that act is whatgot him saved, it was worth it.
Well, that was that.
Pro, pro You're talking about?
No, no, seriously, you'retalking about wrestling, because
what were those people's livesdevoted to?
That's what you got to thinkabout.
This is a church school.
They walked up to me and saidtheir lives were devoted to the

(22:33):
family, their families.
This is what they're.
You know I'm going to chill.
I'm thinking about theirfamilies.
We forgive instantly.
We forgive them.
You know our family.
They devoted their lives tobringing the gospel to people
and saving lives.
What he did wasn't what he did.
This is what my pastor said.
We're not good enough, wiseenough or even sovereign enough

(22:57):
to know good and bad.
And the rationale in this isthis we all talk about Jesus, we
all talk about Jesus, we alltalk about what he did, but none
of us are honest about the factwe wouldn't have done it with
our child.
We tell this story of Jesus alllike oh, the cross, the blood,

(23:22):
the blood, the blood.
Would you kill your son to savethe world?
Period?
We're talking about Abraham andhim being willing to take Isaac
up on the mount at over 100years old.
You know what I mean.
Wouldn't you be willing to killLike let's be real Kill.
Wouldn't you be willing to killLike let's be real, kill.

(23:44):
Would you be willing to killyour enemy Like you ran over her
.
Would you be willing to killyour enemy to save the world?
Like literally, you got to doit, like you know what I'm
saying.
Like think about the gravity ofwhat we're talking about and how
God does things in such a way.
That's just peculiar to us,yeah for sure you know what I

(24:04):
mean.
Like we look at these thingslike what happened to Jesus was
brutal.
They talk about the wounds onhis back were open.
It was brutal.
We talking about, like when wesaw what George Floyd imagined,
that all times a million right.
And the reason I speak to thisis because we get so in a tizzy

(24:31):
about the most trivial of things.
Right, the most trivial ofthings, and that's why I'm often
like at a pause.
I was talking to somebodyyesterday.
He said something reallythought provoking to me.
He said what is the lie?
It would not be said.

(24:51):
He said so.
A corner club called you guysand asked y'all to do a collab.
Would you do it?
And I said my fleshly gutreaction is heck, no, like it's
common sense that we wouldn't.
I said but my spiritualmaturity says to me pray first,
because God can do anything.
He said certain things youshouldn't have to pray about.

(25:12):
I said well, I don't agree withthat.
The Bible says always becorrect.
It says always.
That's how it says.
The Bible says always a lot oftimes.
It says always be correct,always be pressed, always.

Speaker 2 (25:25):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (25:26):
Because imagine this I can't imagine anybody would
think that God would tell themto kill their child to save the
world.
But he did it to him, he did itfor himself.
You know what I mean?
I can't imagine God would tellanybody and we like oh, that was
his child.
What did he ask Abraham to do?
He didn't ask Abraham to trustthat he was going to live with a

(25:47):
ram in the bush.
And oftentimes he will provokeyou into a yes to create a
circumstance by which he needsyou to show where it is to
believe a believer.
And you ain't even got toactually do a collab before her,
you ain't even got to actually.

(26:08):
He just needs you to ministerto someone in a circumstance
right, and you already have a no.
That ain't his intent.
And the scary thing for usChristians is sin is not doing
the will of God.
Sin is not following in thewill of God.

(26:28):
If Abraham didn't get in themountain, he'd sit there.
If Jesus don't get you, that'sit.
It's not one of those thingswhere people act like Jesus just
oh, yeah, man, ready to go.
You know what I'm saying theytalk about.
He was praying so hard, hissweat was as thick as blood.
In regard to the descendant.
Like we can't trivialize thisjourney of walking with Christ

(26:54):
and something what inspired thisin me is like, man, I can't
imagine being 19.
My whole life I've been playingfootball, I won a D1
scholarship and I say thateverything I devoted my life to
is right.
Like y'all gotta reallyrecognize the weight of what
he's saying.
That's like LeBron James being.

(27:14):
That's like LeBron James at.
You know, get drafted man.
This is like this is like Ihave placed basketball above my
like.
When you put it in thosecontexts, people start to hey.

Speaker 3 (27:29):
Like what did people say?
I'm sure there was like, bro,what are you doing, man, man?

Speaker 2 (27:38):
Of course you know you got coaches who tell you
that you're making the wrongdecision.
I'm not going to say no names,but I had one coach call me and
tell me this is at the beginningof the year.
Mind you, man, I'm 21.
I'm barely grown enough to signmy papers and stuff.
He says this is the worst newsI've heard all along.

(28:01):
And so, as a kid you, I'm stilllike in a way, I'm still a kid,
bro, and I, like the, my heartwants to satisfy everyone.
But in that moment I realized,like, bro, I'm just people
pleasing, like I only have to dowhat's right for me and for the
lord you know what I'm saying Ican't just I can't live my life

(28:22):
in somebody else's shadowbecause they think it's going to
shine light, like I can't dothat.
But yeah, man, teammates calledme.
You know what we got to do toget you Like it was a lot of
stuff.
Family man, family was, familywas between football and

(28:48):
quitting my job and doing.
And then I got another jobmaking $100,000 a year and I
quit it.
So to just imagine, oh you'recrazy, you done finally made it
da-da-da-da-da, and I'm likeyour success is not my success.
My success ain't valued bymoney, like I could make a
million dollars and be a fooltomorrow.
That's not what bringingsuccess to me being bring, uh,

(29:08):
me being successful is doingwhat I was created to do.
That's what's that's successfor anybody, anybody that has
ever created anything, createdand designed it with an intent
to perform a certain task.
A dishwasher you credit thedishwasher so to watch dishes.
God didn't create you just tomake money.
He created you for a greaterpurpose.
If I'm not doing that greaterpurpose, I'm not fulfilling my.

(29:30):
I'm not doing what god iscalling me to do you got?

Speaker 3 (29:34):
you got like a john the baptist anointing on you,
man.
You're like separated, pulledapart.

Speaker 2 (29:40):
You know what I mean and the thing is man, like I
remember being in school man,and yeah, I can think back to
eighth grade and it would betimes when I was in class and I
I didn't ever mean it in aconceited way, I never voiced it
, but I would just be sittingthere and I'm like bro, now I'll
stop doing my work and I'lljust be looking around at my
classmates like they don'trealize who they in the class

(30:01):
with right now, like they justdon't.
And I'm from decaf, texas.
Like there's no reason for meto be thinking about what I'm
thinking.
But the vision was so clearthat I just, I just knew it and
I wasn't saying it like I'marrogant, I'm saying it like I'm
literally watching the movieright now and I think, like
today I haven't even gottenthere yet.
I didn't even see this part ofit.
So like, like who's to say whatelse God is going to do along

(30:23):
that journey?
But I just knew that I was goingto be something one day and
that caused me to live my lifein a certain way.
So I didn't partle, I didn'tdrink, I didn't smoke, I didn't
even cuss, like I cussed for aperiod of time and then I was
like, why am I doing this?
And then I day because Irealized that there's no one in
this.
I knew, eventually, I was goingto get to a point and somebody

(30:44):
could use this against me if Ididn't live my life the right
way, and that's the life that Ilive in them that they could
have used it against me.

Speaker 1 (30:55):
I want to dive a bit deeper into, like I'm trying to
understand.
You're talking about it,mitchie.
I'm trying to understand whereyou got this.
Like Mitchie, I'm trying tounderstand where you got this.
I'm not familiar with theChurch of Christ.
I know the Church of God inChrist.
Church of Christ, like you know, is the more Caucasian
denomination.
Am I tripping?

Speaker 2 (31:15):
I think they may be right, I don't know.

Speaker 3 (31:18):
They're like the no music people right, yeah you
guys, don't do music.

Speaker 1 (31:25):
It's like all the hymns are well, you guys do
music, no instruments right, oris it no music?

Speaker 3 (31:28):
yes, it's music, but everything's vocal.
Yeah, yeah, interesting.
Yeah, I mean, bro, I'll saythis I know that there seems to
be this awakening amongst yourgeneration of people where there
is like a hunger for the thingsof God.
We saw it a little bit with theAsbury thing.

(31:48):
You've seen some of the more,some of the movements, even in
the Christian music industry,where there's a like, the influx
of just younger people who arespeaking up and kind of standing
for their faith.
And so, man, I just I resonatedwith that.
I had a question, though what?
What is what is for you?
How do you see the currentgeneration redefining what faith
looks like, and what culturalshifts would you want to

(32:11):
influence or contribute to?

Speaker 2 (32:16):
Redefining what faith looks like.
I think this generation can bevery spontaneous, very blunt and
very aggressive, and that canbe used in a positive sense,
whereas you may have somebodythat want to rob you and kill
you and they got their mindseton doing that and they ain't

(32:38):
doing it in public.
That can also be that samementality of the culture that
we're living in.
It could also be used to saythis is what I believe.
I don't care what nobody thinks, I'll do this and I'm going to
make it look like I don't careif you, if you, if you see it,
if you've got an opinion aboutit.
So that's that part.
But what I, the biggest thingthat I want to influence and man

(33:00):
, it's something that I can't.
I wouldn't be able to say it ifI hadn't lived it it's faith.
Yeah, oh, man, my life has been.
The life as I know it now hascompletely been built on faith,
and I'm not just saying that asthe old cliche christian saying.
I'm saying that from.
I took a whole lot of risks andstuff that was contrary to

(33:26):
everything that my familybelieved in and my friends
believed in, but I, I was likegod.
You know what I have beenliving my life trusting
everybody else, but you.
Now I'm gonna go all in andyou're gonna be scared.
I'm not saying that it's notonly scary, but god gives you
enough information for you toobey.
He don't give you enoughinformation for you to get
comfortable.

(33:46):
He don't always give yousomething along the journey, but
you got to keep going in orderto find out what it is.
So, whatever that leap is, I'mgoing to take it Because I know
if it's a 99% chance that it'llfail and it's a 1% chance that
you'll succeed, I'm going totake the risk Because somebody
got to live to tell the storyabout how God did something
miraculous.
So I'm like, in every situationI feel like God.

(34:10):
I'm going to try it.
You know I'm going to take achance with you before I take a
chance with anybody else.
Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 1 (34:17):
Let's go man say has been the most important.
What was your mentor's name?
Again, caneel, what would yousay has been the most important
example or most important thingthat he has impressed upon you
on this journey?

Speaker 2 (34:37):
To live my life and see others, view others through
the lens of Christ, and I'mreminded of a scripture in uh,
first corinthians.
What paul was talking about hebecame all things to all people
so that in some way, hopefully,he may save some.
He became white things.

(34:58):
It didn't mean that he dideverything that they did.
He did something that showedthem.
I understand where you at inthis journey, like I'll see
where you at and I'm not, and Iknow where I'm at, but I'm not
gonna jeopardize word angle tojust appease to you or where you
are sure he made himself likethem so that he could reach them
.
That's the thing that has stuckwith me the most and that's

(35:19):
what's helped me reach.
reach people in a way that godhas blessed me to do, so that's
really good, that's reallyreally good.

Speaker 1 (35:26):
That's no like.
What's special about this forme, man, is I'm going to ask a
personal question With you andyour girlfriend.
What was like?
Were y'all like living pure,like?
And the reason I'm asking thisis because I want to kind of
speak to some of that generationthat you're in like was that a

(35:47):
struggle for y'all?
The reason that that's just howdid you?
What were like some of theboundaries you would set in that
relationship that you think arehealthy for young couples these
days?
Because you're talking aboutyou bringing her out of a
lifestyle that she was in, youknow, such as and God wanted not
seeing that relationship aswhat was best for you.

(36:09):
Like, I know many.
I mean we got many youngviewers.
I think 72% of our following isactually 18 to 35.
And so I know, in the blackcommunity a lot of us grow up.
You know, you think we see yourmama probably shacking up or
shacking up.
That's so cutesy, but that isme living together before you

(36:31):
get married.
And you know, having sexoutside of marriage is so common
among youth these days.
You know, I've heard people sayit's not even said anymore.
It's definitely still said.
But how was that process youlike, did it.
Hey, I'm gonna ask you straightup how was that process?
How did that go for you?

Speaker 2 (36:50):
yeah, we wouldn't live in a period, but I'm gonna
say this though um, the impurityof the situation, what it was,
struggle, what does that mean?
I mean he was choosing it, yeah, wow, wow, anything that you
are actively aware of, wow, andyou don't change.
You're choosing that wow, likedidn't nobody tell you you had

(37:12):
to do that.
Wow, you didn't have anunderstanding to say, oh, I
didn't know, you knew better wow, you still chose that, went on
struggle wow struggle is I can'tfind a way to overcome this.
We knew how to overcome it.
We just chose to do it anyway.
Wow, there was a point when Iwas like we're going to have to

(37:32):
stop doing this.
We're going to have to stopliving like this.
We're going to have to stoptalking to each other like this.
When I say talking to eachother, it was in a way that was
arguing all the time Everyconversation.
I was like what is in a waythat was arguing all the time,
Like every every conversation is.
I was like we're going to haveto stop doing this.
Once I realized that it wassomething that almost couldn't

(37:53):
be stopped, that's when I had towalk away from it, Cause I knew
eventually, let's say,something happened.
Now my kid is going to be livingin it.
My kid going to have to see itCause, like I think, people
think sometimes, like I is goingto be living in that, my kid
going to have to see thatBecause, like I think, people
think sometimes like I'm goingto stop whenever this happens or
I'm going to start wheneverthis happens, I'm going to start
doing this, start doing that.
My advice is if you don't stopwhere you came, there's going to

(38:16):
come a time when you won't towhere you came.
So, whatever I'm going to do tostop living the life that I've
previously been living, I'mgoing to do that because I know
that there's something out therein the future that's much
greater for me to grasp a holdof.
And then, if Jesus Christwalked in the door right then,
how'd you know it was fulling?

Speaker 1 (38:37):
Wow, there it is, bro , that was heavy.

Speaker 3 (38:42):
Sure.

Speaker 2 (38:43):
My man said if you don't stop when you care,
there'll come a time.

Speaker 1 (38:49):
Well, that's actually what Paul said.
But what Paul said I don't dothe things that I want to do and
I do do the things that I don'twant to do, and what he's
essentially saying is that if Idon't, you know we don't, you
don't get to, and that's youknow.
Pray for the thorns and Godsays my grace is not sufficient.

(39:10):
I think a lot of times, youknow, people look at it as some
glaring issue, and I think thatGod allows for our ability to be
with us so that we alwaysrecognize that his strength
makes it.
We are full, our strength isstrength.
We are full.
Our weakness is full.
I don't know, I'm twisting upeverything, god.

Speaker 3 (39:33):
I don't know what it is.
Somebody give me the scripture.
Our weakness.

Speaker 1 (39:37):
We're not here tripping, because I was thinking
about what he said the samething, trying to get it out.

Speaker 2 (39:42):
It's the word, though we know that.

Speaker 1 (39:46):
My grace is sufficient for you, for my
strength is made perfect andweakness.
2 Corinthians 12 8-10.
I speak from the Bible.
You know what I'm saying.
See, that was hard.
I repeat myself.
What was I getting at?
Oh, I.
But what was I getting at?
Oh, I know what I was gettingat.
It's those strongholds,absolutely, and the deeper and

(40:09):
deeper, like God gives usopportunity after opportunity
after opportunity to overcomethese struggles, and if we don't
take the chance early, it isharder and harder and harder and
harder.

Speaker 2 (40:27):
So, hey, I just feel an unction over here in this.
Somebody did it.
That's why it's so dangerous tobe deceived, because when
you're deceived you're wrong,but you think you're right If
you go back to the garden ofEden, when Eve was deceived, she

(40:49):
was deceived because shethought God said something that
he didn't say.
So sometimes we look atsituations, whether it be
whatever form of impurity thatit is, whether it be sexually,
whether it be anything that youknow God has not called you to
do form of impurity that it is,whether it be sexually, whether
it be anything that you know godhas not called you to do,
that's impure, that comes from aclay.

(41:11):
Like you can, you can activelyindulge in those things, because
you have been taught one thingthat's not true and you haven't
learned what is true that couldbe, that could cause a sudden.

Speaker 1 (41:23):
So what you're saying is like this is real nuance,
like it's kind of like a lot ofpeople don't want to be like.
We did a podcast with agentleman and he basically said
that how did he put it?
If he was labeled a Christianartist, people would have an

(41:43):
expectation of him and he in it.
If he was labeled a christianartist, people would have an
expectation of him and he, inhis mind, he saw that as a
negative.
Right, he saw that as anegative because of what he had
been taught about therestricting of it.
The reality of it is you get afreedom in the life.
You have a freedom in living alife that is surrender to.

Speaker 2 (42:05):
Christ.

Speaker 1 (42:06):
And it's like, even using the word surrender, you
surrender to get freedom,whereas we have a connotation of
surrender to be a nigga, likeyou're giving away everything,
like you're giving away all ofyour control, when actually
that's the best thing you can do.
It's to lose control to Christand it's almost like even

(42:30):
submission.
The word submission has such anegative connotation but it has
a positive application in theword If we really take our time
and carve and peel back thelayers.
Everything that Jesus used, orGod used, to teach us in

(42:50):
relationship how to be more likehim, has been perverted and
turned into a negativeconnotation.
Right Like surrender.
Negative submission.
Negative marriage in this waynegative Right.
Negative submission.
Negative marriage in this pointnegative, right.
You know, uh, people see livingfor God as imprisoning yourself

(43:12):
.
Right, they're like you'regonna lose your freedom to be
who you are when your actions.
You can only be who you are inthe end.
Yeah, you can only be who youare in the end.
This is good, this is right,this is right.
I'm jumping out now.
I'm jumping out now.
I want to love who I want tolove.

(43:33):
There is no love outside of God.
There's no love outside of God.
God is love.
You can't have love without himin it.
You can't.
You can't have love withoutyour minute.
You can't.
You can't have it without aminute.
It's promise, god's promise,it's just.
You can't have it without aminute.

(43:53):
I think that's like we reallyhave to be careful man.
That's the season we reallyhave to be careful with the
truths that we hold on to.
Yes, and when it comes to wehold on to, yes, and when it
comes to a lot of generations,absolutely.
You know what I'm saying.
I'm okay with this.
My mama was okay with this.
My daddy was okay with this.
This is how I grew up.
You know what I'm saying.

(44:14):
My daddy was a cheater, so I'ma cheater.
My mama was a cheater.
We're getting to accept theseversions of ourselves, that he
is stronger than Uh-uh bro.
That's good.
So tell us about some thingsyou got going on.
What's coming up?
I know you got a YouTube series.
Is that anything in particularthat you have coming up working

(44:35):
on?
Talk to us about that.

Speaker 2 (44:37):
Yeah, I'm working on a project right now.
It's called the Prayers Club.
Okay, it's a podcast, but it'smore so.
We're getting it together now,getting it pitched to a few who
are you working with on that Oneof my friends who's a Netflix
director.
So, we're looking to get it tomainstream television and

(44:58):
incorporate in a way, a similarway that y'all do bring culture
to Christ, Because I know thatthe black community is familiar
with.
Most of them are familiar withthe Players Club, so that's a
play on words Don't go watchthat movie.
Yeah, don't go watch that.
But I wanted to create anavenue because I felt as though

(45:22):
I wasn't truly fulfilling mypurpose and as Christians,
sometimes we tell people stopgoing this, stop going that, but
we don't give them thedifferent avenue as to
experience the same feeling thatthey're chasing.
So we tell them to stop going tothe club and you expect them to
go home just bored all day.
And I said I want to create anenvironment where people you
ain't got to go to the club.
And I said I want to create anenvironment where people you

(45:44):
ain't got to go to the club youcan go sit on your couch and
experience that same joy, orthat same experience real joy
yeah, not that, whatever you'rechasing, because that's vanity.
Yep, experience this and geteducated in the same time.
So I know people my age arevery, very adamant about being

(46:04):
outside, and I'm not sayingnothing wrong with being outside
, but just watch what you'redoing outside.
That's my advice, true, yeah?

Speaker 1 (46:13):
So do you have like talk about, like, how are your
friends?
And the reason I'm asking youlike these seemingly innocuous
questions is because it's like Ithink a lot of people there's
not a lot of representation ofsomeone your age, that's made

(46:35):
decisions you made, that'sliving life, the way that you're
living it, and a lot of timespeople don't have examples
language, and a lot of timespeople don't have examples
language or even the know-how toget to living life surrender at
23.
You know what I mean.
There's always the notion oh,I'll do that, I'll do that later

(46:56):
, I'll do that once I getmarried, I'll do that once I get
married.
And my pastor always told meanother thing he would say is
that if you don't start livinglike a husband before you get
married, you certainly ain'tgoing to be living like one once
you're married.
And so, like, what are yourfriends?
Are all your friends like youAre they is it, are they like

(47:16):
what is it Like?
You know what I'm saying?
What's?

Speaker 2 (47:20):
your circle, like around you right now.
Kirby, if I had to really sayit, I think I probably got like,
probably got like three friends.
And it's not.
I'm not a person like oh, Iwant friends.
I'm not like that.
It's the reason why I got threefriends, because these are the
three that showed me they didnot go where I was trying to
take them to.
They didn't like following theone I'm following.

(47:41):
So it's not that I'm not friendswith the other people, it's
just I love you but I'm going tohave to love you from a
distance Because I know sin willtake me further than I want to
go and the key getting longerthan I want to stay, and the way
that you live your life is notin alignment with what I want to
do.
I still love you and I'm notsaying that I'm better than you,

(48:02):
but I am saying that I'm betterthan you, but I am saying that
I'm better than that way ofliving.
So, now that I have a littlerelation to that me and my
friends that I do have, that Italk to on a daily basis, a
weekly basis, um, you know, wemake sure that we keep you
straight, even if they mean Igot to check you to get you back
on track.
Um, those are the people that Iwant in my life.

Speaker 1 (48:20):
So they trust you enough for y'all to have mutual
accountability.
Do you have accountability?

Speaker 2 (48:25):
Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (48:26):
So what does that look like in practice?

Speaker 2 (48:28):
It means being committed to what I said I would
do long after the movie that Isaid at the end is left.
It means if I say that I'mgoing to do something, do it
regardless of whatever happens.

Speaker 1 (48:39):
So what I'm asking about accountability.
Is there people that hold youaccountable to that?
What is when I'm asking aboutaccountability?
Is there people that hold youaccountable to that?
Like, what is that like?
Do y'all have a group chat,like you know?
Like, what is your?
What does accountabilitystructure look like for you?

Speaker 2 (48:50):
Yeah, it's most of it .
Most of it is just being aloyal, to be honest with you,
because I'm not saying that it'swrong to have accountability.
I have friends who hold meaccountable, but majority I
would say 90% is me and him,because I came to the revelation
one day of if I can't stay inagreement with him, there's no

(49:11):
way that I'm going to be able tobe held accountable by these
people or even hold myselfaccountable to these people.
So I'm going to make sure thatme and God stay on terms, and
then that would just flow, uh,within, yeah, and had to stay on
turns.
And then that would just flow,uh, within scrutiny, yeah.
And another thing is my friends,man, one thing that I'll tell
them a lot is like don't gothrough life complaining.

(49:33):
Like if you really want to dosomething, go.
Don't go through lifecomplaining about because you
remain where you complain, likethat's where you're gonna be if
you're complaining about it.
If you're always complainingabout being broke, I promise you
every time you check your bankaccount, you're gonna have zeros
and periods in there, you know.
So, um, you have to.
You have to be willing to bedisciplined.

(49:53):
You got to wake up every dayand choose god and do whatever
it is that you don't want to do,as if it's the only thing in
the world that's available to be.
That's what discipline is to meyou mentioned popularity.

Speaker 1 (50:09):
What are some other threats to that 18 to 25 year
old that you think that Iwouldn't even say the word
threat?
What are some deterrents topurpose that you think will
really impact the 18 to 25 yearolds today?

Speaker 2 (50:27):
comparison man.
Like comparison is a thief ofjoy.
What do think will reallyimpact the 18 to 25 year olds
today?
Comparison man.

Speaker 3 (50:31):
Comparison is a thief of joy.
Say more on that.
What do you mean by?

Speaker 2 (50:33):
that I'll say this Negative comparison Because
there comes a point in timewhere you have to compare
yourself to somebody else inorder for you to see if you're
on track to where you want to go, like you Seeing the things
that y'all are doing.
That is not me comparing myselfand saying, oh man, I'm not
there yet, I'm upset.
That's me saying, okay, this iswhere they came from, this is

(50:57):
what they did and structuredtheir lifeline to get here.
And I on track to do these samethings.
And if I'm not, what'shindering me from that Negative
comparison is basically tryingto put somebody else's
assignment that God gave them onyourself, like, oh, I ain't got
the Lambo and I'm 23 and so Imust not be doing what I'm
supposed.
Most people don't ever have aLambo in their life like most

(51:20):
people.
I know people right now thatain't got no credit, like they
ain't got their own house.
You know they live in anapartment and that's completely
fine.
I live in an apartment.
But if you're gonna look at itfrom a negative perspective,
you're looking at it from thewrong lens.

Speaker 1 (51:33):
Oh, I, I mean, I wholeheartedly agree with that.
One of my struggles growing upwas materialism and money.
There's a big struggle now,seriously, I, I hear you, I know
it was.
It was a huge like, if I have alot of money, I literally would
like be breaking down a lot.
I, I, I literally would like bebreaking down.
I literally would be like Idon't want to get out of bed,

(51:54):
right.
And so, like now, you know Godtook us.
You know he took me and my wifethrough a process you know
where we basically losteverything.

Speaker 2 (52:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (52:12):
And through that process, he has clearly restored
tenfold.
There was time, though, where,if I had a lamborghini, like
that would have been my wholeidentity, like when I run, like
that would have been every.
I'll be posting that jokeeverywhere and I'll be you know,
I'm saying you couldn't catch apicture without me in it right?
And like now that those dayswhen I had a jeep, lambo, g,

(52:34):
wagon, whatever, what would itbe?
A for focus, I mean, we wentfrom like really expensive cars
down to like a 2005 infinitytruck.
This had been gifted by ourfather, thank god, uh.
So we had something to drive.
We had two kids, but we drovethat joke to the church Like
what?
Nobody busy, we kidding out.
And I remember like my wife ishere I remember thinking back on

(52:58):
that time in life Like wedidn't think nothing less of it,
you know what.
I'm saying we weren't like shit,my wife never came in, like how
you let us you know never camein like how you let us you know
now we're living with your mama.
Like no, seriously, she neverlike made me feel any less or
any less gracious than she waswhen we had.

(53:19):
And so when things came backand it's great now sitting there
, it's like I don't.
I don't feel like we've made it.
Now.
I feel like we've made it now.
I feel like we've made it then,like those were the moments
where we, you know, that's thecharacter moment, like when you
find out who you are.
You find out who you are whenyou ain't got it, I ain't going

(53:41):
to say when you don't haveanything.
You find out who you are whenwhat you began as changes.

Speaker 2 (53:46):
Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (53:47):
And when that change, you still see consistency and
character in a person that letsyou know alright, I can rock out
with them, I got that.
That's a friend, that's apartner, that's a like.
Change it or not, we've gone,we done seen great success,
we've seen great failure, we'vehad loss, we've had gain.

(54:08):
But the one thing that'sremained consistent amongst us
is we've seen great failure,we've had loss, we've had gain,
but the one thing that'sremained consistent amongst us
is that we've always beentransparent with each other.
We've always been authentic.
I've told him the worst thingI've ever done.
He's congratulating me for thebest thing I've ever done and
the beauty in that.
I think believers have to giverange for the dynamic nature of

(54:36):
what God does in somebody's life.
It's not linear, and I thinkthat we think life is linear.
Well, life isn't linear.
It's much more of a parab.
What is it parabola?
It's like this, you know,there's ebbs and flows, there's
mountains and valleys.
It's seasonal, absolutely, andevery pastor I always say that.

(55:00):
Every pastor says things areseasonal unless it comes your
time to leave his church.
That's funny.
Then you're outside the will of.

Speaker 2 (55:09):
God Duh man, yeah, but I grew up in that same
environment.
My mama she probably going towatch this.
But Mom, what up?
What's up?
Mom, both of them.
I was kind of raised by mycommunity, really moved out of
the crib and living.
I was just living withdifferent families and stuff

(55:30):
going up with my mom and thatlike kind of bothered my mom she
talked about all the time wasthe way that I appeared like I
ain't never my brothers show uptree stuck, j's on with the
freshest like that has neverbeen.
Like I ain't been that dude.
You know these came from timu.
This was free, this was free.
The shirt don't like.
I just like I show up in a waythat I do and I haven't shared

(55:53):
this publicly.
But the whole black hoodie thingpeople like why you always
wearing black hoodie?
It's because, man, if youscroll to the bottom on my
tiktok.
The reason why I started makingthese videos wasn't to be an
influencer.
It was because I was goingthrough something and I was the
only person that I had to talkto myself and in that moment I
was in the darkest place in mylife and the only light that I

(56:15):
had was the lord.
So when you see in my videosand I'm always, I'm always
wearing a black hoodie, justbecause this black hoodie
represents the darkness that Iknow I'm speaking to in your
life I always got one light on,because that's the light that
I'm shining back to you.
That's good.
It's always a purpose.
Every single thing that I do onthe internet, there's a purpose
behind it.
I don't just post because I'mlike I ain't posted in a minute.
People ask me just the otherday, like when you go make

(56:36):
another video, you gotta give mesomething to share.
Well, I'm not posting just like.
I'm not no influencer.
I'm a person who loves the lord.
I read the bible, I dissect it.
When I feel like the Lord hascalled me to share it, I'm going
to share it with you.
I'm not going to post something.
I'm going to post three times aday.
No, I ain't posted in a monthand a half Because God ain't
gave me nothing to post yet.
I had a lot of videos that Icreated and I get to the end and

(57:03):
God went.
I ain't tell you to post.
I ain't tell you to post it.
That's good and that's thefruit.
I had a meeting with Instagram,like two meetings with Instagram
.
One, they had me in person, theother one was just on the phone
the other day.
They're like you don't practice, you don't do any of our best
practices.
What?
What is your like?
What's your system?
What's your madness, yourmethod behind your madness to

(57:25):
for the, they say, christianinfluence or whatever they say.
You're in the top 1% ofcreators in the world.
That's crazy.
And you're creating videosthat's longer than a minute and
30 seconds, so they're not evenshowing up on real.
I said because you're going tofind the same answer that I find
, and that's that the Lord hasjust breathed on what I'm doing.
I can't give you no algorithmicpractice.

(57:46):
I can't tell you this is whatyou need to do.
I can't give you an algorithmpractice.
I can't tell you this is whatyou need to do.
I can give you your bestpractice, but I can't tell you
what I did to get to where I am.
Everything that I have done tothis point has been through
communication with God.

Speaker 3 (57:56):
As far as social media, it's the real thing,
absolutely that's what it is.
I think that's what people areconnected with.
It's not tightened up.

Speaker 2 (58:05):
It's not bowed up, it's not.

Speaker 3 (58:06):
Bodo, it's not contrived.
Yeah, it's not contrived.
You're just sharing the realthing.
Man, this is where you need tobe, this is where life change
starts.
This is how it happens, and Ithink people are hungry for that
, man.
I think people are reallydesperate for that, and
especially in a world where Ithink things feel watered down
and not fully true, right, kindof seeker-friendly, and I just I

(58:30):
love the standard that you,that you take, and I love the
stance you take in the world,man, thank you.

Speaker 2 (58:34):
I appreciate that.

Speaker 1 (58:35):
Do you have any like questions for us?
Yes, I do.

Speaker 2 (58:41):
Okay, let's see be entrepreneur and I'm not going
to say that.
I'm not gonna say that, I'm notgonna call it on this.
I'm not calling y'all blackentrepreneurs.
Y'all are entrepreneurs, okay.
Y'all are people and y'allentrepreneurs.
Being a black entrepreneur isdiminishing the fact that when
god is in love, okay, the wholeworld can see that.

(59:01):
Yes, you glad.
But I'm saying it.
I'm saying it from theperspective of being an
entrepreneur.
It's a lot of people out therenow.
There's become a trend of Iain't working on L25.
I ain't working for nobody.

Speaker 1 (59:15):
All these sorts of things.

Speaker 2 (59:17):
To get to where you are.
What are some uncomfortablethings that you had to do before
you got here, Like things thatyou don't want to do, but you
had to do it to provide foryourself before you could get
here.

Speaker 1 (59:29):
That's a good question.
That's a good question.
That was a great question.
It's twofold One.
I'll say something that a lot ofpeople are not going to like is
that 99.9% of people weren'tcreated to be entrepreneurs the
mentality and the grace neededto.

(59:51):
When I go to sleep, I'mthinking about we have what
three young ladies with us rightnow.
They're about to give birth.
I'm thinking about theirfamilies.
If we don't do what's necessary, follow what God is asking us
to do, people can lose theirjobs.

(01:00:11):
Who rely on that paycheck thatI'm providing them?
We have 35, 40 employees thatthey count on that to live, and
you know it's not something thatyou think about when you say
you want to start your ownbusiness, but it becomes a real
thing to you rather quickly whenyou do.

(01:00:32):
We have those human resources,thoughts and questions, and so
the things that I had to do.
I'll say I grew up fortunateenough to see entrepreneurship.
My mom actually stopped, but mygrandmother was an entrepreneur
, and so was my dad, and so Ihad to do the things that I did

(01:00:52):
not like to do.
I started in this business asan assistant, carrying book bags
, washing cars, going to getfood.
I did it for free.
So how did you serve?
I had to serve.

Speaker 3 (01:01:05):
That's actually you're taking my answer.

Speaker 1 (01:01:07):
I had to serve, serve , serve and through serving I
learned everything I do today.
I was a social media manager, Iwas a production manager, I was
a tour manager, I was acreative director, I made
graphics, I edited videos andnone of these were my core
skills, Like none of this soyou're talking about I had been

(01:01:30):
out of basketball these times.
I had two, like it was noexcuse, it's all.
I had two kids.
I had a wife, I had four kids,I had a car.
You know, I had the whole nine.
But when God called on me, Icouldn't return with an excuse.
I had to take what I knew yetgiven me and say why am I here

(01:01:54):
now?
But it was because I had tolearn a posture, a servitude.
That's not fancy, that's notsexy, but what I got from that
season that I may take today isthat I know, at rock bottom, my
partner going to be there, welose it, all His house gone, all

(01:02:14):
the cars gone, me and brothergoing to get back in there and
get us out the mud again.
You know what I mean.
Like I know she want me to getout the mud and the main thing I
know is that what servingtaught me was the greatest joy
comes from doing somethingpleasing to God.

(01:02:35):
I had joy, I had peace.
I also got to exercise thatfaith muscle.

Speaker 3 (01:02:43):
That's something a lot of people talk about.

Speaker 1 (01:02:46):
One thing my brother often shares about me to me is
that, you know, it's not myintellect that makes me special,
it's not my businessdevelopment skills, it's not my
uh handsome face and smile, butno, he often tells me that, uh,
it's my faith that makes meunusual.

(01:03:06):
Like I'm one of those people.
I Like I'm one of those peopleI know a lot.
I'm one of those people, if Godsaid it, we doing it.
Yeah, bro, we doing it.
I remember he told me that.
You know, our first two was inthe ring.
That wasn't me, I know.
We talk about that.
People hear that like from abraggadocious standpoint.
You have to recognize theaudaciousness of the statement.

(01:03:29):
First and foremost, no onewanted to bother to.
It was the year of 2021.
So it was right.
After COVID, everybody wasfearful.
We were a Christian group andthe biggest show that they had
done to that time was probablywith 200 people, 200, 300 people
and uh, so I say that to sayman serving and seeing god

(01:03:55):
perform in such small capacitieslike at the time it wasn't
working.
Our bills get paid somehowstill don't know how, she
doesn't know how, but somehowbills are getting paid.
Faith, uh, you know, trustinggod in every circumstance, every
situation, just being there inthe trenches seeing him work it
out in so many people's lives,man, it just changed me.

(01:04:18):
Him dropping them in my spiritand then our relationship
forming.
It changed me, man.
Seeing life's transformationchanged me.
I got to travel the world, Igot to see Africa, I got to
build relationships that last alifetime.
So, man, I would say for anyentrepreneur out there, sir, sir

(01:04:38):
, devote your life to fixing theproblem that that company you
want to create is doing.
And once you do that andunderstand the underpinnings and
the underbelly, now I alwayssay the thing that makes us
special is that there's no partof the business we don't
understand, aren't?

Speaker 3 (01:04:58):
even willing to do either.

Speaker 1 (01:04:59):
You know I'm saying like I dmg and I trust you have
a very hard social media thingright.
I go through all of our DMsevery night before I go to sleep
.
I try to go back down and findwhere that blue dot is.
Every night the one I see it in, and that's on every page that

(01:05:20):
we have, and also on TikTok I gothrough.
I try to tell you that to somepeople I pray with some people.
I, you know, give out freetickets.
You know we give.
We have a thing called God'sPromise Fund.
We give out donations to peopleLike I want to know what's
really going on in our communitybecause I want to steward well
what God has given us.
That's what he said.

Speaker 3 (01:05:39):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:05:40):
So I think what advice for an entrepreneur is
this If you're not willing to doit for free, like for free.
If you're not willing to do itfor free, like for free, free.
If you aren't willing to do itfor free, you hit me with the
whole what time good, bad,proper.
If you ain't willing to do itfor free, you ain't going to get
out of this business.
Yeah, period.

(01:06:01):
If the money is what's drivingyour decision-making, I think
once you become an entrepreneur,anyway, you probably get paid.
I don't know, you probably getpaid 10, 12 times a year.
So find out, y'all ought tobudget that thing, y'all ought

(01:06:22):
to manage that thing, andthey'll see.
You know they're not like thefirst.
What happened to me on thefirst of the 15th is I'm paying
people.
That's what happened to me onthe first of the 15th, so it's a
big change.
You excited, I'm not excitedfor the first of the 15th.

Speaker 3 (01:06:38):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:06:39):
That's a hard time for me.
Instead, you know there's arandom 22nd where I'll get an
account receivable, that aninvoice can pay.
That needs to be bludgeonedappropriately so I can carry our
business through the next fewmonths.
So if you want to have a frame,if you want to put up every
dime you got to make sure itstays alive because you're doing

(01:07:02):
the purpose that God has givenyou then that's you.
Entrepreneurship is hard.

Speaker 3 (01:07:07):
Yeah, I'd say service is something that's uniquely
don't know.
Most, most most of thesuccessful entrepreneurs I know
had years where they were hiddenand they served, and I know
that you know.
For even for me I know that'ssomething uniquely like in my,
my whole story was like did itfor free?
Did it?
Didn't get any of the credit,put money in, you know, and I

(01:07:30):
think I think the culture, whatyou were saying is like, bro, we
gotta get it, we gotta make ithappen.
And I think what he's saying iswhat he's trying to underscore
is like, man, it's like where'syour heart in it?
You know what I mean.
Also, too, the thing I'd say inaddition to that is a lot of
times people ask for things thatthey don't know what they're
really asking for.
Do you know what I'm saying?

(01:07:50):
So be careful what you ask for.
Like you know what I'm sayingyou want to be an entrepreneur
you want to be the guy.
It's like, man, you gottasometimes you gotta pay the cost
to be the boss man and and it'sheavy and it's weighty, and not
everybody really wants to dothat.
So, yeah, man, that's what I'dsay I appreciate that.

Speaker 1 (01:08:06):
I know they appreciate that absolutely man,
we just had an amazingconversation with our brother,
jason jackson, julia j3 jackson,julian jjj and jj j5, you know.
But, man, this is aconversation about surrender.
Uh, really impressed by hislike forthright worldview.

(01:08:33):
That's not common anymore,where it's just God is giving
him a revelation of who he isand what following him looks
like.
And, man, please check out hisYouTube channel where he really
does his thing.
His Instagram, that's where Ifind he does this thing.
His Instagram, that's what Ifind is watching his videos.
One night I was like, man, Iwould love just to talk to the

(01:08:54):
guy.
Man, I think for a 23 year oldis wisdom abounds.
And so, uh, please check outthis episode.
Backs on the mic, logging offPeace, bye.