Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Ever feel like when you're starting a new project, it's like,
you know, staring into this like black hole of different methodologies, predictive, agile, hybrid.
It's like enough to make you want to just say,
forget it. I'm sticking to my spreadsheets exactly. We're diving
into that feeling because like picking the right approach for
(00:20):
your project, that's like less stress, better outcomes, maybe even
like actually enjoying the process.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
And you know what I think is really interesting is
we get so caught up in the like.
Speaker 3 (00:31):
The tools, Oh tell me about it, gaunt sharts and
con band boards and all that stuff that we forget
about like the most crucial part, which is choosing the
right framework first, right, like using a hammer when what
you really need is a screwdriver.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
Okay, I love that analogy. And speaking of cautionary tales,
we've got some pretty interesting excerpts from this book called
Choosing a Development Approach with AI.
Speaker 4 (00:55):
Oh yeah, I've heard of that one.
Speaker 1 (00:57):
And no, they're using the uh what is it? The
healthcare dot gov launch right as a prime example of
what not to do.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Oh man, right, remember that whole thing? Oh yeah, website
crashes the political fallout that.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
The whole nine yards, the whole she bang.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Yeah, and the book really argues that, you know, sticking
so rigidly to a waterfall approach even when you know
things were clearly going haywire, I think was a major
contributor to that chaos.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
See, this is why picking the right approach matters.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
It's a big deal.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
It's not just about you know, project management jargon. It's
about real world, like, real world consequences. Consequences. So, for
those of us who have thankfully blocked twenty thirteen from memory,
what exactly went wrong with healthcare dot gov?
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Well, they basically they went all in on this like
big Bang delivery big Bang where yeah, everything is developed
simultaneously and it's all meant to like come together perfectly
at launch. But you know, with something that complex that
meant moving parts and a huge reliance on predicting everything
up front, it will it backfired?
Speaker 4 (02:06):
Yeah, spectacularly.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
That's a pretty strong argument against like the whole waterfall method. Then. Yeah,
so for those of us who are, like, you know,
used to a more flexible way of working, explain it, like,
we're back in a super rigid corporate environment. What's the appeal?
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Well, so, waterfall is all about structure, okay, which you
know can be comforting.
Speaker 4 (02:29):
I could see that in some cases.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Right, if you've got a project with like super clear,
unchanging requirements, think like constructing a building, right, yeah, where
the blueprints are pretty much you know, set and stone.
Speaker 4 (02:42):
Waterfalls got its merits.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
Okay, everyone knows what to expect when and ideally how
much it'll cost.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Right, I could see that. But like you know, the
book points out with healthcare dot Gov, like a lack
of flexibility in a project that big is almost like
asking for trouble. Oh yeah, stuff changed time, right, and
that's you know, that's Waterfall's biggest weakness. It's like trying
to i don't know, trying to steer a cruise ship
with a bicycle handlebar.
Speaker 4 (03:08):
Oh wow.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
You could plan the route meticulously, but like if a
storm hits, you're kind of stuck.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
So if Waterfall is the cruise ship and a hurricane
is agile like the speedboat weaving through the waves, maybe
tell me more about this whole, like embrace the chaos approach.
Speaker 1 (03:25):
Okay, sure, yeah, I mean agile is it's definitely more
about like navigating the the choppy waters than like trying
to control the whole ocean, you know, right, so instead
of that like one massive launch, Yeah, you're delivering in
these smaller chunks, getting feedback, you know, making changes as
you go, course correcting constantly.
Speaker 4 (03:45):
So you're like adjusting the sales as you go or something.
Speaker 1 (03:48):
Yeah, exactly. Like think of it like I don't know,
navigating by the stars. You've got your north star, your
overall goal, but you're you know, you're adjusting to the
wind and the currents along the way. Okay, that makes
it more sense than just like saying agile and expecting
everyone to get it right. Right, But isn't that like
a whole other, uh you know, black hole of jargon.
(04:09):
It can be scrum can ban lead. Yeah, it's like
the project management version of alphabet soup.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
It can definitely feel that way, but really they're I mean,
they're really just different tools for implementing that that kind
of like adaptive mindset, you know. So imagine like you're
building a house, Okay, scrum would be like having this
like lead contractor who you know, breaks down the project
into these like two week sprints, focusing on the foundation
(04:37):
first and then like framing, then electrical and so on. Right,
canban is more like I always picture like a like
a giant whiteboard where you can visualize each task. No,
I like that visual you see, like where the bottlenecks
are keep things flowing smoothly.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
So, like, are you saying choosing between scrum and canban
is more about like how your team likes to work, Yeah,
I think so, not necessarily about the project itself exactly.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
It's all about finding that like the right fit for
your team's dynamics and and the you know, the specific
challenges of your project, right.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:13):
And that's that's where things I think get really interesting
because you know, most projects aren't purely predictable, right or
it's completely chaotic, right. They fall somewhere in between, right
in the middle, the gray area. Yeah, and that's where
those like hybrid approaches come in.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
Okay, so the best of both worlds.
Speaker 4 (05:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
So it's like having like, you know, a reliable engine
in your speedboat. Right, you can still like zoom around,
but you know you're not going to fall apart on
you totally. What are the what are the different ways
to do hybrid?
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Right? So the book talks about like two main types.
One is all about having that single delivery like like
in Waterfall, right, but you're building in flexibility along the way,
got it. So imagine, I don't know, imagine you're launching
like a new phone, right, so the launch data is fixed,
(06:00):
that's your north star, right, but you might use agile
methods to like develop and refine specific features based on
user feedback during that development process.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
So you're not stuck with like a clunky design just
because it was in the initial plan.
Speaker 4 (06:16):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
You can you can actually like make the phone better
based on what users want.
Speaker 4 (06:20):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (06:21):
That's smart. Yeah, what about that other hybrid type.
Speaker 4 (06:24):
The second one.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
It's more about breaking a big project down into smaller,
more manageable chunks, right, while still having like that that
clear overall structure. Think of it like.
Speaker 4 (06:37):
Like planning across country road trip.
Speaker 2 (06:39):
Oh yeah, yeah, you know your destination and you might
have some like key stops along the way, but you're
open to taking detours, exploring those like you know, interesting
side roads, and adjusting your itinerary based on you know,
how much time you have, what you discover along the way.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
So it's still structured, yeah, but you're not afraid to
like embrace those unexpected detours exactly.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
And here's where it gets I think, like really cool.
The book talks about how.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
AI can actually like analyze your project what and suggest
which approach predictive, adaptive, or hybrid might be the best fit.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (07:16):
It's like having a GPS for for project management.
Speaker 1 (07:19):
Hold on, AI can play project manager.
Speaker 4 (07:21):
Now kinda Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
That's both impressive and slightly terrifying.
Speaker 4 (07:26):
Don't worry.
Speaker 2 (07:26):
It's not about replacing human judgment yet. Hey, good good,
But AI can analyze.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
Tons of data.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
Oh, I bet, like think about your project requirements and
your deadlines, and your team's experience, even things like you know.
Speaker 4 (07:39):
Market trends.
Speaker 1 (07:40):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
And then it can like give you data driven recommendations.
Imagine like feeding you know, chat GPT your project charter. Right,
and it comes back and says, you know this, this
screams agile.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
Here are the key things to watch out for.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
That's wild. It's like having a like a a superpowered
consultant on call like twenty four to seven pretty much.
Speaker 4 (07:59):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
But let's say let's say like I'm you know, I'm
stuck in a company that's like married to waterfall. But
I'm convinced like even just a little agile would do wonders,
how do I how do I even begin to convince
them to try something new? So okay, how do we, like,
how do we plant the seeds of agile in a
(08:20):
world of like you know, gaunt charts and all that
and any any tips from our book.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Well, I think it's all about like framing it the
right way, right, So instead of like marching in with
pitchforks yelling you know, agile or bust, think about like,
what are the pain points that your team is already facing?
Speaker 1 (08:39):
Okay, yeah, good point?
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Remember like healthcare dot gov? Oh boy, what if what
if they had been able to adapt to feedback, you know,
during development instead of after that disastrous launch.
Speaker 1 (08:53):
Right, It's about highlighting the benefits, not not forcing a
complete like you know overhaul.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Yeah, so less we have to change everything and more
like what if we just tried this one thing to
you know, to make our lives a little bit easier,
to take it in there exactly. Start small, like maybe
maybe you introduce a daily stand up meeting where everyone
kind of shares what they're working on, or or you
try like a sprint retrospective to identify like where are
(09:21):
the bottlenecks?
Speaker 1 (09:22):
You know, I like it.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
The book calls these like agile ceremonies, which always sounds
a little intimidating. It does, but really they're just about
like improving communication and collaboration.
Speaker 1 (09:34):
So we're sneaking in the veggies exact. So agile sprinkled
into the familiar waterfall routine.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
Yes, exactly.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
And here's where, like, I think AI can be a
real game changer, right, imagine like showing your boss hard
data from other projects that proves that, like incorporating some
of these agile principles led to like faster delivery times
or happier teams. Right. Data speaks volumes, especially to those
(10:02):
who love their charts.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Right theaters, like the universal language of let's try something new.
Speaker 4 (10:08):
You know, yes exactly.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
But even with the best planning, things change.
Speaker 4 (10:12):
Oh for sure?
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Right?
Speaker 4 (10:13):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (10:14):
Could AI help with that? Like real time like course correction.
Speaker 4 (10:18):
That's where it gets really exciting.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Imagine like AI that's monitoring your project in real time. Okay,
So it's looking at deadlines, it's looking at team communication,
it's even looking at external factors wow, like market shifts.
And then it can like you know, flag potential issues
before they become major.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Roadblocks, like having an AI copilot, yes, saying oh, I'm
detecting some turbulence ahead time to like you know, just
our course.
Speaker 2 (10:46):
Exactly and not just like reacting to problems, but like
maybe like spotting opportunities, right, Like maybe a project that
started as waterfall suddenly needs like way more flexibility.
Speaker 4 (10:59):
AI could help if you.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
You know, transition smoothly, minimize disruption and and you know,
keep everyone on track.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
Okay, my mind is officially blown. We've gone from like
feeling overwhelmed by project management choice right too, like imagining
AIS are like you know, copilot on this journey.
Speaker 4 (11:17):
I know it's pretty wild.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
So for our listeners, who are you know, maybe about
to embark on their next big project? Yeah, what's the like,
you know, the most important thing to remember?
Speaker 2 (11:28):
I think it just it goes back to like there's
no one size fits all solution right right, It's about
you know, understanding your needs and knowing the tools that
are available and being willing to you know, adapt along
the way. And who knows, maybe soon we'll all have
those you know, AI project assistants like right guiding us.
Speaker 1 (11:45):
Now that's a future I can get behind. Yeah, thanks
for joining us on this deep dive into the world
of project management, my pleasure. Until next time, happy planning.