EP 7 | Hand Raised, Heart Grown: Rabbit Ridge Farms - Natural Obsession Podcast

Episode Transcript
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Angela (00:03):
I faced between now and death a little earlier than some
.
So that's my mantra Between nowand death, what do you want
life to look like?
And once you get that vision,go do it For us.
Between now and death, we wantto make a difference and we want
to make a difference togetherThrough our community that we've
created through food andagriculture.
It started as something for ourchildren, but it's gotten so

(00:24):
much bigger and I think, frankly, it's continuing to be bigger
than what either of us canimagine.
So as we lay on that deathbedwhenever, that is, tomorrow,
next week, next year, when I'min my 90s, I hope I can look at
my husband and say job well done.

TJ (00:45):
Hello and welcome to another episode of the Natural
Obsession Podcast, where we tellthe stories of people who love
the outdoors and strive to takecare of them.
This week, we're joined by theowners of Rabbit Ridge Farms in
Damascus, Arkansas.
Sit down with Daniel and I aswe listen to their story.
They truly do farmingdifferently, like it used to be,
from rotational grazing andbuilding soil health to raising
cattle, hogs and chickens thatare dense in nutrients, while

(01:06):
still taking care of the landand native wildlife.
Learn how what they do ishelping both the people who buy
their products and the animalsthat live on their farm live
healthier lives.

Alan (01:24):
Howdy, I'm Alan Mahan, and my wife and I own and operate
Rabbit Ridge Farms.

Angela (01:30):
And I would be the wife, Angela Mahan, co-owner of
Rabbit Ridge Farms.

Alan (01:35):
Good to have y'all yeah guys, thanks for having us,
thanks for having us.

Daniel (01:38):
So I guess we'll start off with tell us just a little
bit about you and your family.
How'd y'all get started in this?

Alan (01:45):
Well

Angela (01:45):
that may be a whole other podcast Long story there.

Alan (01:48):
She grew up at the country club.

Angela (01:50):
Oh gosh, here we go.

Alan (01:51):
Drinking non-alcoholic fruity drinks.
I grew up on the dairy farmpicking watermelons.

Angela (02:01):
I grew up on a row crop farm so my dad grew cotton,
soybeans, milo, corn and thefirst time I could get off the
farm I would.
It's where I'd never marry afarmer.
And I did, and my first husbandand I row crop farm over in
Mississippi County as well, okay, tell about your upbringing,
then we'll merge our stories.

Alan (02:20):
I grew up on a dairy farm.
We had a grade A dairy, nevermilked a bunch of cows.
We milked about 50 cows at themaximum.
Didn't like it, didn't want tohave any part of farming.
I never ever envisioned myselfas being a farmer.
We had six kids at home, wasn'tnecessarily enough money to go

(02:44):
around, so my dad truck patched.
Those truck patches wouldconsist of mainly watermelons.
So here in this hill country wewould grow 10, 15 acres of
watermelons and that was what wedid all summer.
We hoed melons and workedmelons, picked melons, peddled
melons.

Angela (03:02):
So he was selling melons while I was at the country club
.

Alan (03:05):
She's at the country club drinking Charlie Temples.
I was sitting on a pile ofmelons.

Daniel (03:11):
You call it truck patching.
I've never heard that termbefore.

Alan (03:13):
Yeah, that's an old term.
So truck patching is.
Farmers around here neededsomething to supplement their
income.
It might be a field of corn,might be a field of black eyed
peas, and I don't know where theterm truck patch actually
derives from.
But I just figure it's a cropthat you throw in your truck and
you hit the road and go out onthe road and pedal it.

(03:34):
When I was a kid there was a lotof roadside fruit stands, if
you remember, a lot of places on65 and there was a place in
clinton called myricks myricksfruit market and also in
Morrilton that just specificallypeddled fruit and locally grown
produce.
And my dad had all of thoseplaces figured out and then in

(03:58):
the springtime he would load upus and we would go to Fourche
River with a bunch of hoop netsand we would catch buffalo, carp
catfish and load up the backend of the truck and he would
sell them on the way home.
He was always trying to dosomething a little bit extra.
My mom was the workforce behindthe farm.
She was back here milking thecows, building the fire, feeding

(04:22):
the kids, picking berries.
In the summer she was just aworking machine.
But that's how I grew up.
I grew up on a dairy farm.
The dairy we sold the cows on agovernment buyout program in
1986.
Somewhere around 1992, I wokeup and said I got to have a cow.
And that's where it all startedagain with two cows on my

(04:48):
grandfather-in-law's seven acresin downtown Clinton.
And yes, they have been out andwe have caught them in the
Walmart parking lot.

Daniel (04:57):
Sounds exciting there.

TJ (04:59):
So your dad was doing watermelons and stuff all on his
land, or was that on otherpeople's land?

Alan (05:04):
Here on our property.
Okay, he would rotate differentareas for watermelons.
Sometimes the crop was smaller.
We've had five or six acres,we've had 10, 15 acres.
I can remember one time when Iwas a young boy 15, 16 years old
and we had just finishedworking these watermelons for
the last time.
So you call that laying a cropby.

(05:26):
We had laid it by, we hadturned the runners, we had put
down fertilizer in the middle.
All we had to do was just waitand pick the watermelons.
I was the last one out of thegate that time and I left the
gate open.
Cows got in there and ate 15acres of watermelons.

Angela (05:46):
Wow, and didn't your dad blame rock and roll music yeah.

Alan (05:50):
He took my tape case Back then.
It was cassette tapes.
It was full of all types ofeverything from ZZ Top to Elton
John and it went in the trashbarrel.
He said that rock and rollmusic has done ruined your brain
,

Daniel (06:02):
Just rotting it away.

Alan (06:04):
He was an older fellow.
He was born in 1919.
My grandfather was born in 1888.
I was a late in life child.
For my father he was 50 when Iwas born.
That has advantages anddisadvantages, but I did learn
how people made it in theDepression because he never got
out of that.
We killed hogs.

(06:24):
We preserve food.
My mom hogs.
We preserved food.
My mom canned everything thatyou can imagine.
When we had pancakes it washomemade syrup.
So yeah, they were very thriftywith the food that we ate.

Angela (06:36):
And your family is from Rabbit Ridge.
Your family has been here formulti-generations.

TJ (06:41):
Okay, so is this farm still on that land?
The farm?

Alan (06:45):
that you're sitting on was purchased by Angela and I after
we got married.
This is an 80 acre spot.
Where we live at is actuallythree generation ground.
That was where my grandfatherand grandmother lived and raised
the majority of their childrenin their later years.
I'll tell you this little funnystory.

(07:05):
They actually had 40 acres.
That was below the hill fromwhere we resided now.
They had 160 acres on top andhad 40 acres down below, had a
home on it and all of my dad'sbrothers and sisters were born
there.
Somewhere around the early 1910,somewhere in there 1920, my

(07:30):
grandfather had a run-in withhis neighbor and his neighbor
shot my grandfather's coon dog.
So I've got to tell you alittle bit about my grandfather.
I mean, he was a subsistenceguy.
If he had a crib full of corn,if he had a good plow horse or a
mule, he had a milk cow, heraised hogs and he didn't work.

(07:51):
He subsisted off the land.
He would take that coon dog,ride a train to Bisco and hunt
with his cousin all winter.
They would save pelts and thosepelts is what got him through
the spring and then in thespring he started fishing.
That's just the way that helived.
There's 160 acres up there thathe farmed and grew some crops on

(08:14):
, and his ideal success isprobably different than what
other people's ideas of successare today.
So anyhow, he moved up to thetop of the mountain and he
traded that 40 acres down therefor a bred mare.
My dad said that the neighborskidded him forever about trading
40 acres for a horse and hesaid well, that mare's going to

(08:37):
bring me a colt, but myneighbor's never going to be any
better.
So that's how we ended up onthat property and that's
three-generation property andthen we also have some two
generation property and I'm verythankful for my father because
he made it affordable for me tobuy yeah, yeah, that's that's a
blessing there for sure yeah.

Angela (08:56):
So then life happens.
Alan and I are a blended family, so we married in 2013 and he
was divorced.
I was widowed and we went towork on healing our family, and
we made a commitment then thatwe only wanted to feed our
family food that we raised asmuch as possible, and so we

(09:18):
started with cows, obviouslybecause he already was raising
cattle.
So the next step was, ok, let'sadd pigs to the mix, and in
order to subsidize what we weredoing, we would sell halves and
wholes to friends and family.
That rocked along for a while,and Alan was in construction for
almost 30 years.

(09:39):
He did construction projectsall over the state and to Texas.
I can brag on him because Iwill, but he's been on big
projects like Crystal Bridgesand Bass.
Pro Shop and it was a lot.
He made it through that 2008decline, but I knew that
construction had changed.
I knew he wasn't happy and mymantra is what do you want to do

(10:00):
between now and then?
And I asked him that one day,what do you want to do?
And he said I want to be on thefarm.
But we knew it wasn't in atraditional sense or a
commercial sense.
I'd grown up on a commercialfarm.
My first husband and I hadcommercially farmed.
He had as well.
But there was just a shift thatwe both felt a calling to.
That was better for the earth,better for us.

(10:21):
And he said I want to be on thefarm, but I want to do it
differently.
And so we started trying toexpand that selling of beef and
pork.
It made a natural sense to addchickens, so we added chickens.
You run out of friends andfamily.
We were dragging trailers allover the state of Arkansas,
begging people, letting us sitin your driveway and peddle meat

(10:44):
.
We tried that.
We went to festivals.
We were taking raw meat tofestivals in August.
That doesn't make sense either,but we were just trying to get
our products out as much as wecould.
And one day at a festival.
We were in between the kids'karaoke and the dog park, which
we love kids and dogs but that,in my opinion, was hell on earth
.
In August.
That was awful and we said thisis not working.

(11:08):
And we gave our product to agentleman in a kilt and walked
straight to a bar and said wegot to do things differently, we
got to bring people to the farm, and so now you are where we
have decided that needed to be.

Alan (11:22):
Yeah, well, she kind of skimmed over something that I
want to go back and touch.
When we married and we joinedfamilies, she came to our home
and made a home out of it.
She came to our house and madea home out of it.
Her kids had lost her father,my kids had a broken family and
she went to work.
Putting all that back together.

(11:43):
Our story is really a lovestory.
She was the only person thatcould have ever done that and
she did it, and now we have fourchildren that are very
different, that are all doingvery well and well-adjusted All
it all to Angela.
So she skimmed over that, but Iwant to make sure that we put
that in there.
That's awesome.

TJ (12:03):
That's sweet, thank you.

Alan (12:12):
Let's say, behind every great man's a better woman.
So, oh, angela is the mostpowerful, strongest.
I've just never known anybodylike Angela.
She makes me proud of her, notonly to be her husband, but just
.
I have to look back and I'mamazed at how she's able to do
things.
Every day we work together.
Literally every day we aretogether all day long, every day
.
We go home, we're together andshe still is the person that I

(12:38):
desire to spend my time with.

Angela (12:39):
We're very fortunate.
We are the children would arguethat we actually have five
children, this farm being themost needy the fifth baby that
we have created together, and itis the most needy it is a needy
baby, it's the youngest one, itis the.

Daniel (12:53):
Yes, that's, it's the baby that's right so are y'all
happy with how it has allevolved so far?

Alan (13:00):
yeah, but it's, I mean it has been fluid.

Angela (13:02):
I like to say we've had a fluid business plan.
Or did we even really have abusiness plan?
You just wouldn't believe theoriginal plan.
We were talking about missionand passion, and we knew that we
had this passion to bringsomething to people.
That was important to us.
We think the importance of goodquality food is just necessary,

(13:24):
and we had a mission and apassion to do that.
Creating community through foodand agriculture is what we want
to do and we're driven to do.
When we created this business Idon't even know if we realized
that and how to accomplish thatFor sure we did not know, and I
know for sure not once did I sayoh hey, let's go open a

(13:46):
restaurant and are we happy?
It is much bigger than what Iever anticipated, which is
overwhelming.
But at the same time, I dobelieve that there is a bigger
purpose behind this that even Ididn't realize.
We were unaware of that we havebeen charged with, and so,

(14:09):
while it's overwhelming, it isvery rewarding.
So am I happy with it?
I don't know that he and I areever completely happy as far as
we believe in contentment, butcould we always do more?
Absolutely.

TJ (14:23):
Without the restaurant, we wouldn't be here.

Angela (14:25):
That's right, that's true, we've already benefited
from the food.
Well, there's no better way togather people together and
create that sense of communitythan through food.

Daniel (14:35):
Yeah, I think that's becoming more of a hot topic
eating better quality food.
He sent me a picture of hischeese he got the other day.
Yeah, from Harps there wasn'tany cheese in the whole thing.

TJ (14:46):
Not one piece of cheese.
Yeah, I discovered that thecheese I bought from Harps had
no cheese.
No cheese In the cheese.

Daniel (14:52):
I feel like people are leaning into this, like they're
understanding, like if you buythis stuff, that's all processed
material you're probably notgoing to be your best self.
So places like this are awesome.
So places like this are awesomeBecause when people think of
cows and chickens, they think oflike how I grew up, we had
eight chicken houses or you hadthis commercially fed food plot

(15:12):
for your cows.
That's where they live, that'sall they do.
Something like this is muchmore holistic and brings
everything together and, I think, people's health will benefit
from it.

Angela (15:23):
Oh, I agree.
I do want to say we believe inagriculture.
We support all farmers.
That is very important for us.
To make sure that we are veryclear the American farmer.
You aren't going to find anyonethat's more hardworking, that's
more passionate about feeding.
We just choose to do thingsdifferently, and we also choose

(15:43):
to be very transparent andeducate people.
We won't ever have any sort oflabels or fancy stickers on our
packaging certifications.
We're not going to have thateither.
But you come see us.
We'll be glad to show you andtell you about how we raise our
animals.
Transparency and honesty arewhat's important for us, so if

(16:03):
that is important to you, we'rea good match.

Daniel (16:06):
I was thinking when you were talking about your dairy
farm earlier.
So they had a program that cameand paid you to get out of the
dairy farm.
That's right.
What was the goal behind that?

Alan (16:17):
I would probably need to fact check this because I was
just a child.
Basically, the government hadstopped supplementing farms.
The idea was there was too muchmilk in the production, so they
put a plan in place to buy outyour base production.
You had to give them a numberfor your production and that

(16:39):
varied for all the differentpeople that were getting out.
It wasn't really apples toapples, Like my father he wanted
out, so his number was muchlower than the guy who said, hey
, I can see where I can makesome money out of this.
Everybody's deal was a littlebit different, but those cows
that were in production theyleft here and they went to
slaughter.

TJ (16:58):
Now, this is dairy farm country, isn't it?

Alan (17:00):
At one time there was 242 dairies in a 10-mile radius of
Damascus.
That's what I thought.
Per Sam Hutto, who's a localguy around here, that is a great
historian, that can give youmore information on that.
242 dairies just pull a 10-milestring around Damascus.
That's a lot of dairies.

(17:21):
Everywhere you went, somebodyhad two 300 acres of ground.
Everybody dairied.
Yeah, you can still drive byand see the buildings.

TJ (17:29):
Oh yeah, you can drive by.

Alan (17:30):
If you know what you're looking for, you can see all
these dairies.
The majority of the dairieswent out on that government
buyout.
Okay, a lot of people convertedover to beef cattle.
Right here in this general areathere's not much chicken
productions.
We're a little bit farther awaythan what.
Like Tyson and those bigcompanies, they have a radius
that they won't sponsor chickenhouses.
So a lot of those farms wentinto beef cattle production and

(17:54):
some of them just lay fallow Bigdairy cattle country back in
the day and hard to believe ifyou went back another 30, 40
years, this was cotton country.
Can you believe that?

Angela (18:05):
That's really hard for me, as a former cotton farmer,
to grasp.

Alan (18:09):
You know there were three, five, 10 acre plots of cotton
all over the county.
My dad always said the bestthing that happened to cotton
here was the boll weevil,because it forced people to quit
trying to grow it here.
Wow.

TJ (18:21):
That's cool.

Alan (18:22):
Left this ground very, very deficient.

Daniel (18:24):
Yeah.

Alan (18:24):
You just think it just got sucked out.
This ground is very magnesiumdeficient.
We feed a magnesium supplementin our minerals year round.

Daniel (18:35):
So what was y'all's biggest mistake?
Getting this thing going?

Angela (18:38):
Well, I know what the biggest mistake I feel is we
underestimated what our overheadwould be.
We grossly underestimated whatour overhead would be.
We grossly underestimated whatour overhead would be.
It's great to have thiswonderful space, but the other
challenge is, because we are sounique, people don't know what
to do with this.

(18:58):
Insurance companies don'tnecessarily know what to do with
this.
As a business, we're just avery broad, overreaching
business.
Yes, the farm is the centralfocus, but we also have a
restaurant.
We also have a private clubslash bar.
We also have overnight suites.
We also have space where peoplecan walk around.
It's a lot, and so, becausewe're so unique, we don't fit in

(19:21):
a box and we underestimated howchallenging that would make
things and how expensive itwould make it.

Alan (19:28):
Yeah, our property taxes are astronomical for the size of
this building and with propertytax you're taxed on the number
of AC units that you have, bythe utensils in your kitchen,
the equipment that's on theinside, and our property taxes
are crazy high for this propertyand you come in over a dirt

(19:49):
road too.

Daniel (19:50):
Yeah, that's a shame.
The property tax, that's awhole other subject, but the
taxes in general are just out ofhand, Because if you had left
us in trees had the same amountof land, property tax would be
pretty low.
Would you try to improve it any?
You get like taxed for it, soit's silly.
And you put a lot of money.

Alan (20:07):
Yeah, every year, every year, forever, and we pay taxes
for everything that's in thebuilding.
Yeah, when we built it.

TJ (20:13):
Yeah.

Alan (20:13):
So we just continually get taxed for it, and it's very
very challenging Verychallenging when you take that
and you take the insurance andI'm sure that your home
insurance probably went up overthe last year or two.
Imagine it on this building.

TJ (20:28):
We have a building too, so we understand that as well.

Alan (20:30):
The insurance has been very challenging and the
electrical costs because we haveso many freezers and stuff
going on here.
There is a lot of overhead inthis building.

Angela (20:39):
And that's on us.
I can sit here and complain andI'm sure a listener is thinking
well, you should have figuredthat out ahead of time, and
that's the challenge of anentrepreneur who has a mission
or passion, and I think that'swhat makes us a unique bunch is
because when we run into thosechallenges, guess what?
We figure it out.

Daniel (20:57):
We figure it out, find out efficiencies and other areas
to compensate.

Angela (21:01):
That's exactly right.

TJ (21:02):
So I guess necessity dictates that you have a
restaurant that's open.

Angela (21:06):
Actually it did you know ?
The joke is, I never agreed toa restaurant.
We had to pay a light bill andwe have this wonderful space and
the goal was to bring people in.
I think probably part of thechallenge is, if you're a farmer
, it goes against what farmersdo, and that is bring people on
their property.
Usually you have gates and ifyou see someone on your turn row

(21:27):
or on your pasture, you'regoing to figure out why they're
there and shoo them off.
And we were doing completelythe opposite and I think that's
probably why initially we didnot think in those terms, but
now we realize it's the bestgift we can give.
People are so disconnected fromwhere their food comes from.
When we built the building, weknew we wanted to bring people

(21:49):
but.
I guess we just did not.
That's kind of part of thatthing that was bigger than what
I realized.
People need to come, they yearnto come out.
What I have every day I franklytake for granted we're sitting
on a beautiful patio with alovely view, seeing pastures
that are green, with cattleroaming and chickens grazing,
and that's not normal.
And people yearn, I think, tosee that and feel that and hear
that and smell that, and werealized just how much so it was

(22:12):
out of necessity, but also werealized it was a need.

Alan (22:15):
Yeah, we try to treat people differently when they
come here.
We never take for granted whenyou walk in that door, you made
a conscious effort to come here.
We're not on the way anywhere.
I mean, it's not like, well,I'll just go down the street and
swing through.
I'll swing through here andI'll go down the street and do
this or that or whatever.
Everybody that comes here makesa conscious effort and we want

(22:37):
to treat everybody that comesthrough that door with the
utmost respect and appreciationand treat them like family.

TJ (22:46):
Yeah, I think that's felt when you come in here.
I know every time I've beenhere I've seen you, alan, going
around and talking to everybodyin there and sitting with them
for a little while, and I thinkthat's important.

Angela (22:54):
You're seeing our lanes.
Yeah, he is the face, thegreeter, he's the heartbeat.
I'm the doer.

Alan (23:00):
I'm the worker.
She's the brains.
She's the brains on theoperation.
I'm the heavy lifter.

TJ (23:05):
Well, I think it's cool what you guys created here.
For sure We've benefited fromit and our families have really
enjoyed it.
My kids are always asking canwe go get breakfast at Rabbit
Ridge and get the platter?

Angela (23:13):
I love the platter.
That's a good one.

Daniel (23:16):
That's what we did last time we came we had two platters
and a bunch of other stuff.
The kids loved it all.

Angela (23:20):
Thank you.

Daniel (23:21):
I've been trying to tell everybody about it.
I've been wanting to come uphere for a while, but I live in
Little Rock now, so it is alittle bit of a travel, but it's
definitely worth it.

TJ (23:28):
You guys were talking about sitting down here and being in
the outdoors today.
Is this the thing thatsatisfies that need to be
outside?
Is the farm that for you, orare there other things that you
guys go to to get that fix ofbeing in the outdoors?

Alan (23:47):
Well, I hunt and fish, so that's still a big part of my
life being able to do that,whether it's catfishing, whether
it's catching trout on WhiteRiver or deer hunting here on
this property.
I get my fix that way, but Iwould say on a daily basis I
have a need to be all over thefarm, so we're constantly
looking at pastures, seeingwhat's growing, checking on our

(24:09):
wildlife, checking on ourlivestock, and I'm out on the
pastures every day.
I have a lot of great outdoorhobbies, but this is just my
life every day how livestock andwildlife react to different
times of the year and whatthey're eating and how the soul
is responding to animal movement, and it's very fulfilling to me

(24:33):
.

Angela (24:34):
It's not uncommon.
At the end of the day, even ifyou've had a day of working pigs
or a hard day outside, we'llget in the Ranger, and it used
to be margaritas and beer, nowit's electrolytes and adrenal
cocktails.
But we like to go for a ride outon the farm and just unwind and
see the animals, maybe catch asunset.

(24:55):
I don't necessarily have a lotof activities outside, but I
think there's somethingnaturally calming about nature.
So just being outside, I think,is important.
I'm a beach girl heading to thebeach.
I get a lot of calm andrejuvenation and reflection when
I'm surrounded by water,whether it's the beach or the
river, the lake.

(25:16):
So we do enjoy the outdoors alot.

TJ (25:20):
Alan, you were talking earlier about how you blend your
wildlife, like native specieson the land, with your farming
practices.

Alan (25:29):
Yeah, I'm a hunter so I want to try to take care of the
wildlife the best that I can,and we do a lot of cover crops.
We heavily impact the soilswith animal movement.
We remove the animals and thenthey don't return to that area,
sometimes for months at a time.
So we like to go back in thatarea and plant crops that are

(25:50):
going to benefit the wildlife.
So, for instance, we've gotsome property that we rotated
hogs off of, and so in thespring we come back and we'll
plant a mixture of clovers andthen we'll also plant oats,
sunflowers, headed seeded plants, and then we'll let those just

(26:11):
go to seed.
Wildlife come back in there,eat them.
We are very protective ofhabitat areas.
Not every fence row needs to bepushed out.
Not every brush pile needs tobe gone.
The wildlife have got to have aplace that they can stay also,
and we just make a consciouseffort of providing them food
and cover on our place yeah, Ithink that's huge.

TJ (26:32):
We talked to quail forever.
Last week.
Ryan parker and katrina simmswere both out on a podcast and
they were saying leave somefence rows dirty, push up those
brush piles, do those kind ofthings, plant some native plants
here and there.
You know, you guys areobviously making a living with
what you got here, and so youhave to have the livestock on
there, but there's also room tomake sure that our native
species are benefiting from ouroperation.

Alan (26:55):
There's room for both.
And just because you havecattle or hogs or sheep on your
property doesn't mean that youcan't have.
You can't have wildlife.
Also, the way that we move ourruminant animals is we want a
lot of pounds of flesh on asmall amount of area, we want to
move them away from that andthen we want to let the land go

(27:17):
through a rest period.
So there may be hundreds ofacres here that are accessible
to a ruminant animal, butthey're only on a small part of
it at one given time.
And that's the one advice Iwould tell anybody in farming if
you're farming a ruminantanimal and they graze manage

(27:38):
their grazing yeah, the cow isthe animal of a third.
They're going to poop on athird of it.
They're going to poop on athird of it.
They're going to trample athird of it and they're going to
eat a third of it.
So if you just put cattle in200 acres, all they're going to
do is walk around in circles,take a bite here, take a bite
there, and they're going to poopon a third of it.

(27:59):
They're going to trample athird of it.
But when you take animals and wecondense them and we're saying
we're going to give you thisamount of time in this area and
then we're going to move it on.
Now we're able to control thedepth that we're grazing on the
grass.
We don't want to graze out thecrowns.
We're going to take that 30%that they're pooping on, 30%
that they're trampling on, andnow we're going to reduce that

(28:21):
down to about 15 and 15.
And we're going to get more useout of the grazing and then
when they leave, that ground isgoing to be disturbed and ready
to go through the rest period.
We're leaving that parasitechain behind.
We're leaving the flies behind.
Electric fence is your friendand if you are going to graze
ruminant animals, figure out howto manage that grazing, yeah,

(28:44):
and that all benefits thewildlife.
It's 100% beneficial for thewildlife.
That rested area those animalsare going to come right back
into, yeah.

TJ (28:56):
I think that's not normal, though I think what you're
talking about is not what we seein most of the state.

Angela (29:02):
Yeah.

Daniel (29:02):
That's not how we did ours.
We had 240 acres, quite a bitof it filled and our cows just
kind of wandered around wherever.
Electric fences probably wouldbe a really good thing.
I see that on all the showsthat I watch now.
With that they just throw aline up there and section them
off and then move it.
It would be super good to have.
I think we had more cows on theland than we probably should

(29:22):
have and you just supplementwith grain and whatever else.
We kind of like the idea ofmoving away from that, moving
more toward all grass fed andthat kind of thing, but it's
hard.

Angela (29:33):
It is hard.

Alan (29:34):
I had to change my way of thinking.
I was the guy that looked at myproperty and said I think I
could put two more cows in thereyou know, I think we could push
it a little bit harder.
And then you look out there andthey don't have anything to eat
and your neighbor's got a fieldof grass.
You say what's he doingdifferent than what I'm doing?
There's a publication calledStockman Grass Farmer and it's

(29:58):
not a paid announcement oranything.
But when I started farmingthere was another farmer here in
Damascus.
His name was Tommy Hutto, stillliving today.
Tommy said Mahan, I hear you'regoing to try a little farming.
I said well, yeah, I've got mesome cows.
You know, I'm trying to kind ofgo that way and I'm interested

(30:19):
in it.
He said well, the way yourdaddy did it and the way my
daddy did it, it's not the onlyway to do it.
He said if you're going to besuccessful doing this, you're
going to have to learn how tothink out of the box.
It didn't resonate at that time.
He said I've got a magazinehere you need to read and I'm
going to buy you your first yearsubscription.

TJ (30:40):
Wow, that's cool.

Alan (30:44):
And the name of the magazine was called Stockman
Grass Farmer and it's a littlenewspaper type printed
publication.
It was created by a guy namedoh, I can't even think of his
name now, it slipped my mind butJoel Salatin is the editor
behind it now.

TJ (31:00):
Okay, yeah.

Alan (31:01):
But it not only talks about cattle.
It talks about sheep, talksabout goat, it talks about all
things grazing.
It's got some stuff in thereabout pigs and stuff they put on
schools for people to learn howto manage intensively graze.
We plan on doing that here, butit's got a lot of great
information.
I'd advise anybody to do that.

Angela (31:19):
And that was the beginning of your out-of-the-box
thinking, even though youprobably didn't implement the
majority of it until later inlife.

Alan (31:25):
Yeah, when Angela and I got married I had cattle
scattered out all over multiplecounties.
I mean, it's what I thought Ihad to do.
We had mama cows here, mamacows there.
You couldn't put togetherenough contiguous land to run
mother cows this is not mothercow country People continually.

(31:45):
They have small herds and itworks out for them.
But mother cows require a lotof room and that's the reason
why they probably do better inthe West where there's large
acreage.
But I had cows scattered outall over the place and I'd been
reading this magazine for yearsand years and go through page
after page on it and we lost oneof the places we were releasing

(32:11):
, no fault of ours.
When you lease a place, whenyou get it in good shape,
they're going to want it back.
Nine times out of ten lostanother place, lost the third
place, all in a matter about ayear or so, and so all this
stuff's coming here.
We're getting reallyoverpopulated.

TJ (32:27):
Yeah.

Alan (32:30):
And when she said what would make you happy to rest
your life, I said I just want tofarm and I want to farm right
here.
I want to try somethingdifferent.
I want to try somemulti-species animals.
I want to go back to the waythat my grandfather farmed.
I want to have back to the waythat my grandfather farmed.
I want to have a hog pasture.
I want to put hogs where hogscan thrive.
I want to put the right breedsin there that are able to thrive

(32:52):
in this rugged environment.
I want to have cattle, I wantto have sheep and I want to use
everything we have rather thanusing a small amount of it.
So that's when I really gotinterested in managing the
property and managing the soilsand trying to make more topsoil

(33:12):
here.
The person that grows ruminantanimals has to change their
thought process of I'm growingcattle or hogs or sheep or
whatever to I'm growing grass.
How am I going to harvest it?

Daniel (33:26):
Yeah, I like that.

Alan (33:35):
So we don't make any hay here, we don't cut any hay, we
bail no hay.
We graze 100% of our propertyand I will never change that.
I buy hay, I bring hay in, butI don't grow it.
It's an expense, it's somethingthat I don't want on our
property.
By grazing, I can build topsoil.
If I'm cutting the grass, I'mtaking it away.
Yeah.

Daniel (33:51):
So are they fully grass-fed?
Or do y'all grain finish, orhow do y'all finish y'all's cows
?

Alan (33:56):
Our cattle are grass-fed.
We do feed some commoditieswith our cattle and a lot of it
depends on the weather, okay, soif you're going to take a cow
and you're going to grass finishher and, folks, if you're
buying grass fed, grass finishedbeef, you really need to be
aware of what I'm fixing to tellyou If you're going to do it

(34:17):
correct.
That farmer has got to have aforage chain that's going to
follow that cattle throughoutthe year where she can continue
or he can continue to gain.
You cannot grass finish cattle,throwing them out on bermuda
grass in july.
It just doesn't work that way.
Yeah, so we are constantlychanging the types of forages

(34:38):
that we have here on this farm.
We're improving our permanentforages and then we leave ground
to plant things.
For instance, the summertimewe'll plant sedan or hay grazer,
which is we want a hot Africangrass to put in the ground.
In June, if we have a droughtand it goes 30, 45 days without

(35:00):
raining, I'll have somethingthat my cattle can still prosper
on.
After that, we go into coolweather forages.
We start planting in wheatryegrass, those cool weather
forages that hopefully we canget fall grazing out of it Most
of the time.
Here you don't.
So I say all that, saying yes,we keep our cattle on superior

(35:26):
forages all year round, but wealso supplement through
commodities.
Okay, Such as we feed some ricemeal feed.
It's a rice hole with rice bran.
It gives us some added fat fortheir diet.
We use… Sweet potatoes.
Sweet potatoes, sugars,starches.

Angela (35:45):
Gin trash.
Yeah, starches, gin trash.

Alan (35:46):
Yeah, a little bit of that .
And then we also feed somepotato chips that didn't make it
through the bagging process.
It's kind of a corn potato typemush Goes into a grinder
blender.
We put hay in it.
It makes a total ration.
So the cattle they're on grassand then we're able to
supplement with that as needed.

(36:07):
This is a time of year whereeverybody likes being a
cattleman, right.
So we don't want that animal todecline, we want it to
constantly be going up.
You never want to process ananimal on the downhill side.
You want it constantly,constantly gaining.
There's been some studies outthere that say if a cow's rate

(36:28):
of gain goes below 2.2 poundsper day, then it will adversely
affect her tenderness or histenderness of meat.
So we got to keep them growing.
So how do you do that?
Do you say I am a product ofthe weather?
Our hot weather stuff didn'tcome in.
We're not going to be able tograze and fall, so we just limp

(36:50):
them through it and theycontinue maybe to grow some
frame, but they're not buildingmuscle or fat to go with it.
I feel like that.
What we're doing is in the bestinterest of the cow to keep
them growing.
That's our feeding process forthe cattle.
It really takes a very blendeddiet for cattle to do well

(37:13):
throughout a year.
Yeah, think of it like this.
Think of it you're going to goto the salad bar and you're at
one of those salad bars that'sgot that brown iceberg lettuce
you know what I'm talking about.
It looks like it's been choppedup for three or four days and
maybe one or two types ofdressings and tomato here or

(37:33):
whatever fake bacon bits.
Or we're going to go to a saladbar that has got the spring mix
.
It's got a little bit ofRomaine, it's got a little bit
of spinach, cottage cheese, eggs.
We've got this beautiful saladbar.
That's what we want for a cow.
A cow will walk over good grassto eat something that you

(37:57):
wouldn't think she would eveneat.
If there's crabgrass growing,they'll eat that to the ground
and they'll let everything elsegrow up.
Wow.
So we want to have a veryblended pasture and we don't
want to give them access to allof it at one time.

Daniel (38:11):
Yeah, I like that.

TJ (38:13):
Scientists, all sorts of things going over there in the
head and I feel like oh yes.

Alan (38:21):
Sometimes I've worried about myself, cause it's all I
think about.

TJ (38:24):
Yeah.

Alan (38:24):
I am very, uh, dogged, very about.
I am very dogged.
I'm a dogged guy and I feellike there's not a lot I can do
about China and India dumpingall their trash in the rivers,
but I can make Rabbit Ridge alittle better.

TJ (38:39):
Yeah, that's a good mentality.
I think that's what we wanteverybody that listens to the
podcast to see is we have thismantra of when to seal to a
thousand acres, how do I makewhat I've got better, and that's
all we really want is just tosee us make the difference where
we are, however, we can do that.

Daniel (38:55):
Yeah, because not everybody's going to have 200
acre land.
It's just not.
But you can do it.

Alan (39:00):
You can do it in your backyard.
You can put a chicken backthere.
You can grow enough food foryour family.
Man, I just don't ever want tobe in a position where I'm
dependent on somebody else tofeed me.

Angela (39:11):
Last night we had dinner it was his birthday yesterday,
happy birthday.

Alan (39:16):
Thank you, thank you.
I love looking at our platesand saying I grew that, I grew
that, I grew this, I grew that,I bartered for that and my
neighbor grew this.
That's cool.
Yeah, that's special, myneighbor grew this.

Daniel (39:26):
That's cool.
Yeah, that's special, I think.

Angela (39:29):
And I think it's more accessible than people realize.
Yeah.

Alan (39:31):
Yeah, You're changing people's spending habits.
Who doesn't want to go toWalmart and get a bag of dog
food, a box of napkins and getmy oil changed while I pick up a
gallon of milk?
And I'm going to swing in herein the eye doctor shop and get
me a, you know.

Angela (39:48):
New pair of glasses.

Alan (39:49):
New pair of glasses.

Angela (39:50):
In today's world.
That's very attractive.

Alan (39:52):
I mean, that's handy.

Angela (39:53):
That's when we're all so busy.
It takes effort to source fromlocal farmers, local growers,
but there are benefits.
There are benefits to it.
we believe

Daniel (40:04):
, Major benefits.
I believe and the research I'vedone, it's major benefits.

Alan (40:08):
Absolutely.

Daniel (40:08):
People underestimate that quite a bit.

Angela (40:10):
Absolutely I'm fixing.

Alan (40:11):
to tell you why our animals are better than anything
you'll ever eat, I think you'regoing to agree with me after I
get through explaining it to you, I say lay it on us.

Daniel (40:19):
We want to hear it.

Alan (40:23):
Are y'all ready for this we're always ready for wisdom
and revelation well, I'm goingto tell you the difference in
our hogs.
Number one it starts withgenetics.
We have a hog that isgenetically built to survive in
the woods.
She has been genetically bredto protect her children, her
piglets.
She has been genetically brednot to lay on her pigs.

(40:46):
Now, now does that not soundcrazy?
Can maternal instinct be agenetic trait?
Ithink so.
I'm going to tell you how.
I know that the biggest problemthat we had was hogs that would
lay on their young.
I mean, we'd start out with 10hogs and we'd end up with two.
Started buying my boars from aguy in Alabama.

(41:06):
His name's Albert Haraway.
Albert, Durocs does , he doesYorkshires and then he does
Hampshire's also.

TJ (41:15):
These are all different kinds of pigs, just for whoever
may not know.

Alan (41:18):
Right, those are what we call heritage bred hogs.
These are bloodlines that havebeen around for hundreds of
years that are specific to thatgenotype.
So let's think of the Duroc hog.
The Duroc is what we like touse on the boar side.
The Duroc trait is amultipurpose hog fat and lean

(41:40):
and it's rugged and it is knownfor its fast weight gain.
A lot of Durocs are going togain two, three pounds a day.
The female component is theYorkshire is one of them.
So the Yorkshire breed.
We call that the mother breed.
No other breed will take careof her young as well as a
Yorkshire, so she has the bestpotential of weaning more live

(42:04):
pigs than most other breeds.
The other female component isthe Hampshire, the Hampshire hog
.
Let me back up a little bit.
The Yorkshire is a solid whitehog.
You might call it pink.
The Duroc is a solid red hog.
The Hampshire is the hog, yousee, that is black, that has the
white belt

Angela (42:22):
Like an Oreo.
Yeah, she's the milker, that isblack, that has the white belt
Okay, like an Oreo?

Alan (42:24):
Yeah, she's the milker.
She is bred to produce moremilk than any other sow and she
is going to grow the biggestpigs.
So those are the three breedsthat we deal with.
Albert has been selectivelybreeding his sows not to lay on
young since 1980.
Wow, so how many?

(42:45):
What's that?
A long time 40 plus years.

TJ (42:49):
That's crazy.

Alan (42:50):
So we started getting our boars from him, and it took
about two generations we weredone with mothers laying on hogs
.

Daniel (42:57):
Wow, that's crazy.

Alan (42:58):
So we put those sows and those boars in a 20 acre pen.
It's a wood pen and those sowsget a chance to breed naturally
in an environment that'sconducive to a hog.
That environment woods,nut-producing trees, persimmons,

(43:20):
some pasture also and livingwater.
You need living water for a hog.
They go to this pasture.
They produce these pigs.
We put huts outside for them tofarrow.
In Most of the time they opt todo it in a brush pile.
We have selectively made brushpiles.
Pigs like to get in there.

(43:42):
Littermates will stay togetherand have piglets together and
stay back and protect thepiglets while the other one
takes turns going and eating.
So it's a very, very naturalenvironment all on the earth.
So the difference is if a pigis born in captivity, so we have
these houses, that's all theydo.
They have sows there.

(44:03):
They produce piglets.
Sows, that's all they do.
They have sows there.
They produce piglets.
That piglet, as soon as it'sborn, has to have a shot of iron
because he wasn't or she wasn'tborn on dirt.
They're born anemic.
So our pigs don't require that.
Our pigs don't require gettingtheir needle teeth cut.
We don't ring our pigs.

(44:23):
We don't do anything with ourpigs until we capture them and
then we work them.
So they're outside on the dirt,they're learning from mom.
They're eating hickory nuts,white oak acorns, persimmons.
They're rooting, they're on thegrass.
We feed them in a separatecorral where they have a creep
feeder.
When, when they get about twomonths old, we capture them from

(44:47):
that area.
The males, we castrate.
The females and males both.
We dock their ears.
We don't vaccinate.
We do give them a shot ofwormer at that time, bring them
home, they go into a weaningprocess and then they get put
out on pasture so that pig, thatpork that you're eating, has

(45:08):
had a diet of I don't know howmany species of plants and
animals.
A pig is an omnivore.
That's the reason why they root.
They're eating worms and grubsand never find a snake in a hog
pen.
But they're also eating poisonivy.
They're eating different typesof oak mast.
They're eating persimmons.

(45:29):
They're eating all thisdifferent food that goes into
their body to make their proteinthat you're going to come back
and you're going to eat which isso different than the pork that
you would get from atraditional grocery store
package.

Angela (45:44):
For sure, remember the campaign.
The other white meat pork wasthe other white meat.
Ours is not and it shouldn't be.
It's got color, it's got a lotof fat and all of that
translates into higher omega-3s,the natural source of vitamin D
.
That pasture-raised pork lardhas nutrient properties that are

(46:05):
equivalent to that of someolive oils.
It is a nutrient-dense product.

Alan (46:11):
Yeah, On our hogs.
They're able to capturesunlight and store vitamin D in
their fat.

Angela (46:17):
Yeah, that's a rare natural source.

Daniel (46:20):
I was just talking to him about this on the way up
here, because a lot of peopledon't know like the omega-3 to 6
profile is huge.
Right you know we're consumingway more omega-6 than we're
supposed to now with seed oilsand all these other things and,
like when you do pasture age,it's a much lower ratio, so it's
more correct, you don't?
have inflammation.
You don't have the metabolicdysfunction.
Lots of things Right.

(46:40):
Yeah, I love to see people comein here and they say I don't
eat pork.

Alan (46:42):
I love to see people come in here and they say I don't eat
pork.
I don't eat pork.
That's what I don't blame you.
I wouldn't eat that out of thegrocery store either.

Daniel (46:49):
Yeah, exactly.

Alan (46:50):
I don't blame you, I wouldn't eat it.
But our pork's different.

Angela (46:54):
It is different and there is a level of education
that's required, because whenyou get a pork chop from us,
there is a layer of fat on itand people are not accustomed to
seeing that People are afraidof fat at times, that's the 90s
that did that to people.
Yeah, it's unfortunate, becausethat fat is such a good source
of nutrition we have to teachpeople don't be afraid of that

(47:16):
fat.

Daniel (47:17):
It's good for you From y'all's but in the store yes,
probably.

Alan (47:20):
Yeah, when you see a grown man eat one of our pork chops
and cry and says it reminds meof grandma.
Or you see a man who tears upeating our gravy because he
hadn't had gravy made with realsausage and real milk, I mean
that does me good.
Yeah, does me good, and it's.
The genetics is where they'reraised and how we grow.

(47:43):
They still get a buffet of allthey want, of a corn-soybean
mixture for feed.
A pig is a monogastric.
Their gut is very similar toours, so they have the same
basic needs as what we do.
They need proteins, fats andcarbs.

(48:04):
In order to go, they have toingest those foods Just like
that.
We want a steak.
We also want a salad.
We want vegetables.
A cow, being a ruminant animalwith a multi-chambered stomach,
is able to take the grasses.
She's able to digest them,regurgitate, ferment them and
extract all those things out ofgrass.

(48:25):
A hog can't do that yeah ifsomebody tries to tell you that
they've got a grass fed or grassfinished hog, it's not possible
.
It's why the wild hogs do allthat damage looking for food.
Yeah, yeah.

TJ (48:40):
So you were talking about going back to grandma's gravy
and all that kind of stuff, andwe were walking through your
store in here the other day.
We noticed that you had stufflike bone broth and jams and
cheeses and all this differentstuff.
Does that come from beingraised by people that were older
, or is that more from you,Angela?
Where does all that come from?

Angela (48:58):
Probably a good combination of both.
I think that knowing where ourfood comes it's always been a
mission and a driving force.
But I think as we've aged andgotten older and as we become
more educated, we realize youonly know what you know.
I think it's important for usto research and learn about our
food and where it comes from andhow it feeds us.

(49:19):
We all just make this wonderfulassumption that we should just
be able to trust that we can getfood and it's going to feed us.
Well, that's not always thecase, and so through this
journey of the farm, remember, Ikeep going back to it's bigger.
It all started with we want tofeed food that we raise, but
it's so much bigger than what Ieven thought that meant in that

(49:41):
moment.
I think, as we've learned withmineral deficiencies, that's one
of my passion projects now formy own personal health.
How am I mineral deficient?
How am I iron deficient?
I think it's a much biggerpicture of health.
That started when I was a child,eating foods that were more
processed.
And further away, even though Igrew up on a farm, it was a row
crop farm.

(50:02):
That's a lot different than alivestock farm.
And further away, even though Igrew up on a farm, it was a row
crop farm.
That's a lot different than alivestock farm.
I just think that as consumers,we've got to educate ourselves
and become passionate, becomeour own advocate about the food
that we eat.
So that's a long answer too.
It's a little bit of both.
I think it's a necessity, Ithink it's a passion, I think
it's a mission, I think it's adesire.

(50:22):
I think it's a passion, I thinkit's a mission, I think it's a
desire, I think it's all thosethings.

Alan (50:25):
I just know how dirty the food industry is.
Let's just say the facts righthere.
Three companies are responsiblefor over 90% of the red meat
processed in America.
One of those companies is ownedby convicted criminals in
Brazil.
They control the food that weeat in America.

(50:46):
You don't have to let themcontrol it, but they do.

Daniel (50:50):
Yeah.

Alan (50:51):
Over 90%.

Daniel (50:51):
Well, that's kind of why I was leaning into that dairy
farm thing earlier.
I get real suspicious whengovernment starts buying out
small farmers and trying to putit all in like a few hands.
I don't think it's good for thepopulation in general when you
do that.

Alan (51:05):
I mean let's look at the difference.
Was the milk that come fromthese dairies here cattle that
was on grass?
They come in.
They were milked twice a day.
Between the times that theywere being milked they were on
pasture, they were grazing.
They walk back on dirt to comeback to the dairy barn.
They're milked again.
They might go to a nightpasture where they're going to
graze.
Some more Process goes through.

(51:27):
They're dried off when they getdone with their lactation and
then they're in gestation withtheir other calf.
They're on pasture.
So the dairy industry justfigured out hey, we can do it a
lot more efficient than that.
Let's just build thousands andthousands of feet of concrete
and let's just put the cows inthere where they stand all the

(51:48):
time.
They're good for about threelactations.
Put a hog on concrete, put asow on a sow barn.
They do three lactations andthen that's that whole hog
sausage that you eat.
I have sows that are on their12th to 14th litter.
That's crazy and they're stillmaking great pigs, cows, same

(52:12):
way we milk cows at 12, 14 yearsold.
Put them on concrete.
They can't stand up that long.
I'm telling you.
Those farmers are working harddoing that.

Angela (52:22):
It's no knock against any American farmer, everybody
has to make their living, that'sthe thing, the way they've
steered the food industry isshameful, honestly.
They are responding to theneeds of the food industry of
today, and that's a shame.
That is a shame.

Alan (52:37):
Well, they need to take the picture of the cow standing
in the lush pasture on thepackage of cheese that doesn't
have dairy products.
They need to take the prettyidyllic red barn off of the
pictures of the milk.
If that's what you're going todo, you need to show a cow
standing on concrete getting herpoop scooped away let's label
it like we do tobacco products.

(52:58):
Let's label it that way

Angela (52:59):
with truth.
yeah, consumers only know whatthey can know and and so there's
blind trust.
You would think that'd be okay.
When you see packaging in thestores and it does have the
words organic or pasture raisedor free range, you think it's
supposed to be this what we havehere, and that's not always the
case.
We have, unfortunately, aresponsibility as consumers to

(53:22):
understand and know.
We're all about choice.
You choose to buy the productsthat you want to buy.
My concern and passion is know.
Know exactly what it is thatyou're getting.
You may be being misled.

Daniel (53:35):
But some people, I don't think even think to ask that
question because they're just sotrustful of where their food
comes in, like, why would thegovernment want to give you bad
food?
Well, it's putting money inpeople's pockets somewhere,
probably.
And efficiency, yeah, andefficiency.
It's not like you're trying tofeed a bunch of people, but
you're going to get way morenutrients out of a cow here than
you are a feedlot, no matter ifit weighed a pound or not.

(53:55):
You've still got differentthings in that meat.

Angela (53:58):
Well, it's twofold.
Alan's line is we aren't whatwe eat, we are what we eat eats.
And he's described the cattleand he's described the pigs.
We haven't even gotten into thechickens but the diet that
these animals are not given.
Yes, they're given a diet, butthey also are foraging and
grazing and roaming and rooting.
That provides vitamins,nutrients, minerals that they

(54:23):
would not get Sunshine.
They're exposed to the elements.
All of that translates into thequality of meat and the
nutrition value of the meat.

TJ (54:32):
My family.
I've got five kids, and sowe've eaten deer this whole year
.
Absolutely Off of our propertyand then we killed eight wild
hogs off of our property andwe've eaten that.

Angela (54:41):
Those are so nutrient-dense.

TJ (54:43):
And so we've had very little beef.
What we've had has beenstore-bought.
We haven't had good beef, butwe try not to if we can help it.

Angela (54:50):
It's hard.

Alan (54:50):
How cool though that you're feeding your children
what you kill or catch

TJ (54:55):
yeah.
Yeah.

Daniel (54:57):
Yeah, so did y'all know all the health benefits of this
way of farming when y'allstarted, like, into the Rabbit
Ridge part, or is that kind of alearned thing as y'all went
along?

Angela (55:06):
No, I knew it was different.
I'm a big believer in keepingthings simple and I know that
the closer you get back to theway things should be, the more
nutrient dense it is.
I think sometimes in life weovercomplicate cooking.
If you can just have goodquality meats and vegetables,
that's a great diet right there,and if you can just have good
quality meats and vegetables,that's a great diet right there.
So was that a focus then?
No, but again, it was the rightmove and again it goes back to.

(55:30):
This is bigger than what weeven realized or understood when
we created it.
That's an underlying theme.
Over time, it appears to mewhen I'm most frustrated, it
appears to me when I'm mostoverwhelmed and I have to pause
and okay, there's a reason.
There's a reason that we havebeen charged to do this.
It's a mission and purpose.
That's much bigger than what Ithink I even still realize yeah,

TJ (55:53):
Have you guys personally noticed any health benefits or
have consumers come back to youand been like, hey, this has
benefited our family and thiskind of way from the things that
they're eating from your farm?

Alan (56:03):
I weighed 352 pounds two years ago.

TJ (56:06):
Okay.

Alan (56:07):
I weigh 260 now.

Daniel (56:09):
Wow, that's awesome, congratulations.

Alan (56:11):
And changing the way that you eat and being mindful of the
way that you eat is lifechanging for me.

Angela (56:19):
Can we do better?
We're all still trying.
Here's a realization that wehad two years ago.
When you have a business that'sgot its own mind, it seems, we
laugh and say we've created abit of a monster.
A couple of years ago, we hadan epiphany that we were in the
worst health that we had been in, and yet we were surrounded by

(56:40):
the most nutrient-dense food,and we realized that we had
gotten away from our own missionand purpose.
And that easily happens.
I know that sounds crazy andmaybe even a little too
transparent to share.

Daniel (56:52):
No.
I think, that happens to all ofus.

Angela (56:55):
It does Put your head down.
And we got deep in the weedsand we were really passionate
and busy about taking care ofothers and providing the best
for others, but we weren'ttaking care of ourselves first.
And so we just brought it backto the original mission.
And the original reason we didthis was to feed ourselves.
Our children had moved along.
I was the mom at the baseballfield that had the little red

(57:15):
wagon of food.
We didn't go to the concessionstand.
I was that person.
And then over time, life inthis business that blew up.
We got away from that.
So a couple of years ago, whenwe had aha moments with our
health, I found out I was adiabetic, a type 2 diabetic.
And we said this is a simple fix.
Frankly, we just go back towhat we started with, and that

(57:36):
is feeding our family in themost nutritious way possible.

Alan (57:39):
How do you have access to the best food in the world?
And look at yourself in themirror and you're about to pop.

Daniel (57:46):
Were y'all not eating it .

Alan (57:48):
For me.
I was eating too much, I wasdrinking too much we ate out a
lot and had to sit back andreevaluate it.

Angela (57:57):
That's right.

TJ (57:58):
Yeah, I think that's awesome .
I think we can all do that.
There's seasons we have to gothrough in life where we all sit
back and reevaluate what'sgoing on, especially owning
businesses and being so busylike that.
You just got to do someself-evaluating.

Angela (58:11):
I think self-reflection is a powerful thing.

TJ (58:13):
Yeah, for sure.

Daniel (58:14):
Yeah, talk about diabetes, type 2 or whatever.
I'm reading a book called theObesity Code right now by Dr
Fung.
People think when you get type2 diabetes it's like forever.
That's not true and it's beenproven not true.
You could clean up your diet,get rid of all the extra carbs
and stuff and refined sugars andyou can get rid of it.
You mentioned alcohol.
Your body don't process thatwell.
It goes straight to the liver.

(58:35):
You can get fatty liver and beskinny and now you can still be
diabetic because your liver ismessed up.
So just a lot of people don'tknow that kind of thing If
you're eating stuff just fromhere almost impossible,

Angela (58:45):
that's right.

Daniel (58:46):
Like if you're taking care of yourself.

Angela (58:48):
We've had some powerful stories.
We talked about our broth.
Our broth has fed people.
It is so nutrient dense it isoverwhelming when you have
people come and buy cases ofyour broth because that is how
they're living, that is howthey're surviving.
That is a powerfulresponsibility, that is an

(59:10):
overwhelming space to be in thatwe take very, very seriously.
So we have folks that havecured autoimmune diseases using
nutrient-dense foods.
It's real.
It really is real.

Daniel (59:17):
I'm going to come hang out here all the time I like
this.
This is my alley, I like this.

Alan (59:21):
Seeing your broth being fed to a cancer patient, the
broth that you made directly ina feeding tube to their stomach,
and it's their only source ofnourishment that's crazy that's
cool.

Angela (59:33):
That's moving.

TJ (59:34):
It's very moving.
I'm getting chill bumps overhere talking about that we've
talked about doing some of thesame same things that you guys
are doing growing our own foodand having cattle and doing the
bone broth and all that kind ofstuff.
But we also have our own thingsthat we do for a living and
don't have a lot of time forthat kind of thing, and so
having somebody like you that wecan come to and trust to have
done it and thought through itthe way that you've thought

(59:57):
through it, I think is profoundfor us, because I don't have
time to go raise cattle when I'mrunning my other business and
raising five kids andhomeschooling and all the
different things that we do.
But if I can trust somebody, I'mmore than happy to pay the
price for what you guys have inthere in the store to take care
of my family so that I don'thave to do it myself.

Daniel (01:00:17):
Because not everybody has the you know to drive, to do
a farm Like it just may justnot be in their genes to want to
do it.
I think it's awesome for peopleto be out in nature, but they
may do that in other ways, notfarming.
But it is awesome to havesomewhere you can go, know
somebody that's doing it rightand have access to good food.

Angela (01:00:33):
I'd like to think that we reach a broad range of people
.
So for those folks that do wantto raise their own animals or
cattle, there's room for all ofus.
This is not a competitivebusiness.
There's room for everyone to dowhat they do.
Allen has a lot of knowledge,so we offer schools and things
like that.
If you want to do that on yourown, if you are the person that

(01:00:56):
wants to make your own bonebroth, we have those sorts of
animal parts where you can dothat on your own.
If you're the person that isblowing and going and doesn't
have time and you need to whipin here and get some good,
nutrient, dense bone broth, somerice from Ralston Family Farms
and some chicken from us, so youcan make dinner that night, we
can be that too.
So I think the accessibilityfor whatever season of life that

(01:01:20):
you're in or whatever your lifelooks like, I'd like to think
that this farm can support youin some way.

TJ (01:01:26):
Yeah, I think.
So I think I'm gonna have toshop here now.

Angela (01:01:30):
Store's open.

TJ (01:01:31):
So I know that I've been out to restaurants locally and seen
your products in thoserestaurants.
Tell us and our listeners howwe can get a hold of the food
that we've been talking aboutthis whole time.

Alan (01:01:42):
Starting in Conway, Bell Urban Farm is a locally owned
grocery establishment that theyhave lots of local food in there
, not just from us, but theyhave proteins from other farmers
.
They also have vegetables thatare in season from other farmers
Goods- of all sorts.

(01:02:03):
That's one way you can buy ourstuff retail at Bell Urban Farm
in Conway, Arkansas, and thenalso talk about some of our
Little Rock people.
Several restaurants in LittleRock carry our products.
Table 28, which is in theBurgundy Hotel that's Chef Scott
Raines there Does a fantasticjob with our proteins.

(01:02:26):
I think right now on the menuwe got chicken breast and uses a
lot of our hocks differentthings there.
Brave New Restaurant that'sPeter.
Brave Peter is a absolute titanof Little Rock food industry.
They serve our chicken.
So if you go to Brave NewRestaurant, we're dropping off

(01:02:49):
whole chickens there every otherweek for all their chicken
dishes.
The pantry in West Little Rockand also in the Heights use our
products.
A lot of beef products such asbeef shank, beef short ribs,
pork steak, pork loin, differentitems like that at the pantry.

Angela (01:03:09):
Sterling Market.
They use our pork.

Alan (01:03:12):
Sterling Market and then Fidel's Coffee.
They're right across from eachother.
I can't think of that area Backbehind Lost 40.

Angela (01:03:19):
Is it East Village, yeah , east Village East.

Alan (01:03:21):
Village area.
Yeah, Sterling Market and Fidelboth have our products there.
Our largest customer is theRoot in Little Rock, Jack and
Corey Sundell.
We've got John Arrington overthere as the executive chef.
They have been fantasticpartners for many years.
They have opened a secondlocation in the Breckenridge

(01:03:43):
Village.
Their original location that'sover on Main.

Daniel (01:03:46):
Yeah, their new one's very nice.
We've been over there a coupletimes.

Alan (01:03:48):
Jack is in the top 1% of the top 1% in farm-to-table
establishments in the country.
Really, really, when you gointo the root, that entire menu
is sourced from Arkansas.

Angela (01:04:03):
They have a few exceptions, like cheese, but
they get those directly fromfarmers as well.

Alan (01:04:08):
And a lot of their cheese comes from White River Dairy.

Angela (01:04:12):
Yep.
So yes, those are therestaurants that you can visit.
We also ship nationwide.

Alan (01:04:18):
Preston Rose oh sorry.
Preston Rose up in Clarksville.
Have you ever have you heard ofthem?
I have not.
I haven't either.
Yeah, preston Rose up inClarksville.

Daniel (01:04:24):
Have you ever?
Have you heard?

Alan (01:04:24):
of them.
I have not.
I haven't either.
Yeah, liz Preston, she's anamazing woman and she began
brewing beer several years agoat their farm, which is located
somewhere in the Paris area upthere.
And a couple of years ago theybroke ground on a place in
Clarksville, so it's called theMercantile the Bistro.

Angela (01:04:44):
The Bistro, the Bistro Preston Rose Bistro and
Mercantile, they have both.

Alan (01:04:46):
Yeah, anyhow, they serve our products.
They're great customers of ours.
We serve their beer here.
Very unique dining experience.
A lot of different things ontheir menu that we don't supply.
Emu you ever had Emu, emu.

Angela (01:04:59):
Emu.

Daniel (01:04:59):
Emu no.

Alan (01:05:00):
Emu, emu.

Angela (01:05:02):
I say emu, I say emu too .
I said emu, I say emu, me too.

Alan (01:05:07):
It's that big ostrich looking.
Yes, littler, we grew some,actually Did you.
How do you say?

Daniel (01:05:12):
it.
I said emu.
Emu, we had ostrich too, for alittle while they are coming.

TJ (01:05:21):
Probably have forgot somebody, but then people can
also come out here and eat.

Angela (01:05:26):
People can come here.
So we have a farm store, andthat's what this building was
originally built for was thefarm store?
Because, like I said, it wasbehind our house, it was in
trailers.
We knew that we needed a placewhere people could come to shop,
so we do have the farm store.
And then we also shipnationwide to the 48 contiguous
states.

Alan (01:05:44):
It's pretty cool.
We got stuff that goes fromWashington to Key West Really
Every week.

Daniel (01:05:49):
That's neat to see.

TJ (01:05:50):
Yeah.

Daniel (01:05:51):
That's cool.
That's an operation there.

TJ (01:05:53):
So what about, like, if somebody wants to come out here
for just an event and eat?
Is it just Friday nights andSaturday mornings that you guys
are open, or how does that work?

Angela (01:06:04):
So we serve a safe brunch lunch.
It's a breakfast brunch lunchmenu on Fridays and Saturdays,
nine to two.
We also have once a month, aFriday night at the farm concert
series.
It's a dinner music experiencethat's quite unlike anything
you've ever experienced here oranywhere.
We do that once a month andthen we have occasional events.
Otherwise, we hit it hard inthe fall to celebrate harvest.
We hit it hard in the fall tocelebrate harvest.

(01:06:24):
We hit it hard in June tocelebrate the end of planting.
So the best thing people can dois follow along our socials.
We are on Facebook.
We're on Instagram Also ourwebsite, wwwrabberidgefarmcom.
If you're unsure, go therebecause that's where we have the
specifics on our opening,what's going on.
We do farm tours.
We have overnight suites.
It's a lot there, becausethat's where we have the
specifics on our opening, what'sgoing on.
We do farm tours, we haveovernight suites.

(01:06:46):
It's a lot, but that's the hubto find out what's going on here
okay, I was gonna say, we'lllink that on the show notes too
thank you.

TJ (01:06:53):
Why don't you do something for us, angela?
Why don't you unpack that fromnow till death thing and explain
that to our listeners?

Angela (01:07:01):
so as someone who was a widow at 40, I quickly faced
between now and death, a littleearlier than some, and so that's
my mantra between now and death, what do you want life to look
like?
And once you get that vision,go do it.
So, for us, between now anddeath, we want to make a

(01:07:22):
difference, and we want to makea difference together, and that
is through our community thatwe've created through food and
agriculture.
It started as something for ourchildren, but it's gotten so
much bigger and I think, frankly, it's continuing to be bigger
than what either of us canimagine.
So as we lay on that deathbedwhenever that is, tomorrow, next

(01:07:44):
week, next year, when I'm in mynineties I hope I can look at
my husband and say job well done, and we look forward to seeing
what will come in the future.

TJ (01:07:57):
That's good.

Angela (01:07:58):
I think it's much bigger than what we can offer.

TJ (01:08:01):
Yeah, and as we close here, what advice would you give to
somebody else who is going from30 years in contracting or some
job that they're not reallyloving, looking to leave a
legacy?
What advice would you givesomebody else looking to make
that jump?

Angela (01:08:16):
How did they take that leap?

Alan (01:08:18):
Well, I had a great partner, so that's what made my
leap possible, and I think aperson needs to do what they
want to do.
For a while, I loved buildingand there was so many great
memories with building.

(01:08:39):
Families have built their homes, their father's homes, both
sides of the family, theirmedical clinics and just having
those relationships with peopleand putting people into their
first home.
Being able to say that mygreat-great-grandchildren are
going to go to Crystal Bridgesand be able to see, feel and

(01:09:01):
touch the work that we did there, I think that's really cool.
It was very, very satisfyingfor me, but I felt like I had
reached my point in constructionas far as leaving a legacy,
that I could do it, and I feellike that.
In farming, we have anopportunity to touch a lot of
people and being able to leave alegacy is important to me.

(01:09:24):
Farming is not for everybody.
If you say it real fast and youdon't think about it, it all
sounds fun and romantic doingwhat we do, but at the end of
the day, it is a lot, a lot ofwork.
So if I had to give somebodysome advice, I would tell them
to spend a lot of time inreflection and thinking they

(01:09:46):
need to realize what they'regetting into.
For me, it's the life I wasborn to live.
If you're going to make thatleap, you need to be pretty
dadgum, sure that it's the lifeyou were born to live too.

TJ (01:09:58):
That's great.
Yep, I like it.
Good Well, guys, if you don'thave anything else to say, I
think we've got to ask all thequestions that we've wanted to
ask, at least for this episode.

Alan (01:10:10):
We appreciate you guys thinking about us and letting us
tell our story, and especiallyin such a comfortable
environment.

Angela (01:10:16):
Like we talked earlier, I appreciate that everyone has a
story and I appreciate youtaking the time to share some of
those.

TJ (01:10:23):
I think we probably got more out of it than you guys.

Daniel (01:10:27):
We're the beneficiaries here.

TJ (01:10:28):
Yeah, and I'm sure all the listeners will feel the same way
.
I know my wife.
She's going to be super excitedto hear this.
Thank you.

Alan (01:10:34):
Thank you, thank you guys,

TJ (01:10:35):
we appreciate y'all so much Thanks for having us out to the
farm.

Alan (01:10:38):
Anytime we love for people to be here at the farm.

TJ (01:10:42):
We'll be back.
Thanks for listening to theNatural Obsession Podcast.
If you enjoyed this episode,come back and see us next week.
We release a new story everyMonday.
If you would like to learn moreabout Natural Obsession, go to
natobco.
That's N-A-T-O-B dot C-O.
Be sure to share this with afriend and we'll see you next
time.

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EP 7 | Hand Raised, Heart Grown: Rabbit Ridge Farms

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}EP 7 | Hand Raised, Heart Grown: Rabbit Ridge Farms