August 8, 2025 • 65 mins
For this special 50th episode, I’m joined by the incredible Seed Sistas – two dear friends who have profoundly shaped my understanding of magic, health, vitality, and the deep, reciprocal relationship we can cultivate with the natural world.
Forming friendships with wild plants has been a cornerstone of my pilgrimages. As I’ve walked across the UK, these living beings have offered me company, wisdom, and wonder. With them by my side, I’ve never felt alone. This way of experiencing the world has become utterly precious to me – a source of joy and transformation that I couldn’t now imagine life without.
It has also taught me a profound empathy for indigenous peoples who witness the destruction of their more-than-human kin – trees, plants, animals – and feel that loss as we would a friend or family member. All life is sacred. All relationships matter.
I absolutely adore the way the Seed Sistas see the world, and it’s a true privilege to introduce them to you. These visionary, warrior women bring so much wisdom, humour and heart – and I can’t wait for you to meet them
The music and artwork is by @moxmoxmoxiemox
Nonsense in the Chaos is available on all podcast platforms or you can listen to it here… https://nonsenseinthechaos.buzzsprout.com
I'd love to know what you think! If you want to get in touch with me about anything on the podcast then email nonsenseinthechaos@gmail.com or you can follow me on Instagram and Bluesky @kriyaarts or at the Nonsense in the Chaos Page on Facebook.
Please consider supporting me through patreon.com/JolieRose and like, follow, and review wherever you get your podcasts from. Share about Nonsense in the Chaos far and wide! The more people who hear about the podcast the better.
Thank you for all your support -x-
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:30):
The.
(00:55):
Welcome to The Nonsense in theChaos.
I'm your host Jolie Rose.
It's with extreme delight that Iam introducing you to two
incredible women today.
Fiona and Karen, who are theseed sisters and are dear
friends of mine.
I've known them since 2020 whenI began their apprenticeship in
herbalism in the UK before Imoved to soc and.
(01:20):
They completely changed my viewof the natural world and my
relationship to plants and myhealth.
I, I gave up wheat, dairy, andsugar because of working with
them and didn't lose my voicebecause I nearly lost my voice
from taking.
Steroids every day for myasthma, and it was completely
drying my voice out.
And I got to the point where Ipretty much accepted the fact
(01:43):
that I was not gonna be able tospeak in a few years time
because it was, I lost my voiceall the time and it was just
getting so difficult and painfulto speak.
And then through working withherbs and.
Support from Karen and Fiona andgiving up inflammation foods
though wheat, dairy, and sugar.
It just, it changed everything.
And I mean, I'm a little bitwheezy at the moment'cause I ate
(02:04):
a pizza yesterday, so I noticeit when I eat wheat, wheat and
dairy, it comes back.
You know, it affects my asthmaand that's something that I
discovered and learnt throughworking with these wonderful
ladies along with many otherthings.
So I can't wait for you to heartheir incredible wisdom and
just.
Beautiful perspective on theworld.
(02:24):
I love it.
So without further ado, here isFiona and Karen and the Seed
Sisters.
So welcome my darling friends,Fiona and Karen, the Seed
Sisters to the Nonsense in theChaos.
This is the first time I've everdone a podcast with more than,
(02:48):
uh, one person, so that's reallyexciting I met you through
coming and doing yourapprenticeship, which was just
before the pandemic.
And I mean, it feels like such along time ago now.
Uh, but yeah.
So five years ago.
But tell us about how you metand how the Seed Sisters came to
be and what you do.
We met at the turn of themillennium Oh wow.
(03:13):
In northeast London, in pondersend, in on a degree in medical
herbalism.
And it was really apparent whenwe met each other that we were
kindred spirits and what hadbrought us to herbalism and the
study of plant medicine in.
(03:34):
Quite a kind of dry scientificsetting.
Uh, what had brought us therewas quite similar was a love of
nature, a love of plants, a loveof wildness and political
activism.
And through that whole degreeperiod, we'd hang out together
(03:55):
for study sessions, butinevitably end up.
Rifling around the hedgerows,seeing what was there, hanging
out with the plants and playing.
Yeah, because one of the thingsthat struck me when, um, you
were talking about it when I wasdoing the apprenticeship was
that you hardly went out andactually spent any time with
plants.
When you were doing the, thekind of medical version of it,
(04:16):
it was like twice or something.
The degree was a full time, fouryear course, and it was set up
by.
A group of herbalists and theintention for the academic
degree was to bring herbalismand herbalists kind of in line
with the current medical modelso that herbalists would be able
(04:41):
to integrate with the NHS and beable to actually communicate
with doctors and variousdifferent people that are
working within medicine.
So it was highly.
Medicalized, lots of laboratorywork.
We were in the WhittingtonHospital wearing white coats and
(05:02):
stethoscopes.
It was all very, very proper,which is great.
It's a really amazing training,but it forgot the magic and it
forgot nature and that.
That was such a shame becauseeverybody that had come on to
study herbalism obviously lovedplants.
(05:25):
And what we learned was there'smany, many herbalists that
practice herbalism, and they'rekind of tongue in cheek dubbed
brown bottle herbalist.
So they're people that aretrained in this incredible
knowledge, but they don'tactually have any connection to
the plants.
And that's something that we.
(05:45):
Riled against.
We didn't want to go down thatroute at all.
Hmm.
Yeah.
'cause the reason why you werepointed out to me was'cause of a
friend of mine called Josie, whoshe'd heard me probably tell
this story a million times abouthow I'd been at an Ayahuasca
ceremony in my early twenties,and the shaman, who's from
Columbia had said that theydon't just go around the Amazon
(06:05):
randomly trying things out andseeing whether they live or die.
They would sit with the plantand they'd communicate with it.
Uh, the spirit of the plantwould tell it what its medicine
was and I just, you know, thatblew my mind.
I was like, what?
And had told people about it foryears.
I mean, it was probably,probably best part of 20 years
(06:26):
that I'd been telling peopleabout it before Joc said, you
should check out the SeedSisters on Instagram.
'cause they're saying the samekind of thing as what you're
talking about.
And then I found you and, and itwas, I think it was amazing
because my, I couldn't figureout how.
Someone would sit andcommunicate with a plant and um,
figure out what its medicinewas.
(06:46):
And then through your course, I,you taught me that.
And the one I always use as anexample is Daisy, that children
make daisy chains and they playwith daisies and they're very
happy plants and that they'rereally good for depression.
And I use daisy syrup.
For a couple of years and now Ican't look at daisies without
just seeing happy faces lookingup at me.
(07:06):
And I love it.
Like I love Daisy so much andyeah.
Do you wanna talk a bit aboutthat process and also how you
came,'cause obviously it wasn'ttaught in your degree course,
like how you came to understandthat part of it.
Yeah.
The, the Daisy, I mean, that's agreat example because in, you
know, any text that you go andread.
(07:28):
About, you know, plants that areherbal medicine techs, quite
often they'll have constituentsand actions and maybe conditions
you can work with those plantsfor.
And if you look up Daisy,firstly, many of them won't have
Daisy in it.
And it's, you know, here in theUK it's such a common plant that
(07:53):
grows everywhere, yet haddropped out of the more common
material medics.
So the list of plants that canbe used for medicine.
So it often wasn't writtenabout.
That has changed in the last 25years or so.
We've been shouting quite loudlyabout Daisy, but I think there's
become more awareness, but youwon't see Daisy written as for.
(08:15):
Depression, Jay-Z has thisemotional bolstering quality.
Daisy helps you bounce back whenyou've been emotionally bruised
and physically.
The sings help to break down.
The, the pooled blood thathappens when you actually
bruise.
(08:36):
So Daisy has this kind ofphysical effect of supporting
bruising and this more emotionaleffect of helping you to bounce
back from emotional bruising.
And when we were working withmore and more herbs, we were
getting.
Getting signs, getting, gettingmessages from the plants were
(08:57):
coming in all sorts of differentways through the tastes of the
plants and recognizingconstituents through feelings
that would arise, or evenconversations as we were
harvesting them.
And only after kind of workingwith the plants would we then go
to books or things that otherpeople had written and try and
decipher.
(09:18):
What we'd heard from the plants,and that really helped us to
start trusting our intuitionaround what we were sensing,
what we were tasting, what wewere feeling.
So we always recommend that youchoose a plant that you are
really, really sure of what theidentification is, so you're
(09:39):
not.
Poisoning yourself or takingsomething really toxic and then
sitting with it, getting to knowit.
And I think it's really easy toforget that we often talk about,
oh, humans will have observedanimals in order to know what's
toxic or not.
Or you know, humans will have.
Yeah, that's, you know, that's abig story that comes
(10:01):
historically from our past.
But what we forget is that whenwe had much less input from
technology and cars andday-to-day goings on, that we
are part of nature, we have allof that instinctual knowledge
that animals have about.
Oh, that tastes bitter.
It may have alkaloids in it orum, or even just colors or
(10:24):
senses or feelings from theplants that we get and.
It's, it's challenging sometimesto remove all of that and step
back into that place, but, youknow, with a bit of practice
it's possible for, for anyone todo that.
And I guess we are both reallylucky'cause we've both been
brought up with families thatlove nature.
(10:45):
And I had a grand who was a keengardener who made, you know,
witches brooms.
So she always made beams andtaught us how to make them.
And she taught us from.
Tiny that you talk to yourplants and you, uh, stroke them.
She called all of her cuttings,her babies.
(11:06):
So being brought up in a familythat normalizes.
What's now called NatureConnection is a kind of trend.
You, you kind of grow up andit's second nature to think
about our plant kin as equals tous.
You know, as humans we've gotall this kind of discussion
(11:28):
around, uh, gender equality or,um, racism or, but there's just,
it's all human centered.
Everything is human centric andI think we've been very lucky.
I, I count myself really luckythat my grandma was never about.
Humans being the most important.
We always looked at the ecologyand the environment that was the
(11:52):
garden and the wider garden.
And that's something that bothof us had when we came to the
degree.
So although it was this, youknow, like uber scientific
space, we knew that there's amagic out there.
We knew that the plants had ledus.
(12:12):
You know, down that path.
And when we qualified, it wasreally important to us because
it became apparent that nobodyknew what herbal medicine was.
Out in society and moreimportant than setting up a
practice and seeing patients wasto educate as many people as
possible about the amazing,incredible world that is
(12:36):
accessible to everyone who isable to go outside.
You know, in the most urbanenvironments, the weeds grow up
through the cracks and thepavements, they're still there.
They're everywhere.
Yeah, I love that.
(13:04):
And so maybe, yeah, just share abit about the offerings that you
have.
'cause you've, you do theapprenticeship and you've got
some other online things aswell.
So do you wanna share a bitabout the, the things that you
do that people could come andget involved in?
Um.
Yeah, so our apprenticeship iswhat you joined us for and
that's a, we call it a year longprogram.
And from when you kind of signup until it's finished it it is,
(13:28):
but it's over.
Over the four seasons of theyear, we have four residential
retreats and it's a foundationin heroism understanding.
How plants can work with thehuman body, but also what other
gifts they offer and what we canalso offer them.
(13:49):
And people come on our courseand you know, get a real sense
of how they can supportthemselves and their family with
plants, but also this longlasting, deep relationship with
plant kin.
So suddenly the hedge row.
It opens up.
(14:09):
It's not just a green hedge.
It's full of many differentspecies of plants that's what
you introduced me to when I walkthrough the florist.
Now I just, it's like I'm goingto a party.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That feeling.
Yeah.
And even that removes a sense ofbeing alone.
Yeah.
Because they're surrounded byplant life and Yeah.
(14:32):
I think that's one of the mostimportant.
Parts of it is that it'ssomething that you, you're
forever changed then becausethose relationships don't leave
you, you know?
Yeah.
It's the magic wand that youhave as a child.
'cause children haverelationships with plants and
you'll have relationships withtrees that you climb and, you
(14:52):
know, they'll be the bushes thatyou know, and they've got names
and, and then you just sort ofgrow out of it.
Yeah, coming and doing theapprenticeship put me right back
in that place where it suddenlybecame this imaginative world
again and, and yeah, madefriends with all of these plants
and I've got trees here on theislands that are, have got names
and go and visit them and I'vegot a fairy tree and yeah,
there's all just completely putit back into that childlike
(15:14):
state, which is wonderful.
And that's really key with allof the work we do, whether it's
the apprenticeship or our onlinemembership, our coven of herbal
secrets is the imagination andbeing able to.
Trust your own imagination andsilence those voices that
sometimes come in that tell youto stop being silly or to grow
(15:36):
up because silliness and play ispart of magic.
And we talk about the magic, andwhat we really mean is
creativity.
Our own innate ability tocommunicate creatively with all
of life, with the whole cosmos,and we get.
Quite a finite amount of timehere on this planet and we are
(16:00):
really keen to like delve deepand explore all of the possible
fantastic potential that iswithin the plant life.
Yeah, totally.
It's one of those things thatwhen we do the pilgrimage,'cause
um, the Seed Sisters were alsoinvolved in the pilgrimage, that
I went to Cop 26, with 30 oddother people and, One of the
(16:21):
things that I've learned fromdoing pilgrimages with other
people is that theirrelationship to the lines is
imagination as well.
And everyone has differentrelationships.
Some people feel like they canfeel the exact shape of the
lines.
Some people noticesynchronicities.
Some people are like, I feellike it has a kind of, um, oily
filter on some of the lines.
Not all of them, which isinteresting.
I thought that they would maybeall feel the same, but they
(16:43):
don't.
And the ones that go up northare more like.
Uh, angry and it feels likeyou're riding a dragon.
Like those lines are ferocious,whereas the Michael Mary line
that goes, horizontally acrossthe UK is a lot more tender and
gentle.
It feels like they're sort of,for you.
Whereas the lines, the Ellen andBellus lines that go up the
country feel like it's what you,what are you gonna do for the,
(17:05):
the world?
What are you doing back?
Mm-hmm.
Um, really different.
Like it was quite a shock.
But yeah, everyone had their ownrelationship with it and I feel
like that's everyone had, isgiving yourself permission to.
Feel and experience the thingsthat you are inwardly feeling
and experiencing.
So none of it's right or wrong.
It's your personal, kind ofimaginative world and, and I
(17:28):
just think that's so much morewhat we used to do with
indigenous culture.
You would have this, it would beone, like your inner world and
outer world.
Well, one thing, and you wouldhave this imaginative.
Landscape in your outer worldthat was full of plants and all
of the, yeah.
Medicine and yeah.
Beautiful things that you get toenjoy.
What's really interesting withthat is that that imaginative
(17:48):
world is the same across theglobe for individual plants.
So you have a relationship withDaisy, for example.
That relationship brings forthyour.
Understanding of that flower.
And she communicates in, in hertastes, in the way she looks, in
(18:09):
the way.
You know, when you stand on adaisy, she bounces back up.
So you notice, and that's thesame for everybody, gets the
same sensory information and wesee patterns.
We've seen many patterns throughthe years where we work with
groups of people doing a blindtasting, for example, drinking a
(18:31):
a cup of daisy tea, and thewhole group doesn't know what
they're drinking and they comeback with the same information,
the same feelings.
There's something that's likedeeply ancestral knowledge.
It's somehow held somewhere,somewhere in the ether that, um,
(18:51):
it's just beautiful to watchagain and again.
It's fascinating.
Yeah, I think there's somethingin that with what you said about
the lines there as well,because, you know, let's imagine
we don't know about longitudeand latitude on the earth or the
way that the earth spins, butyou know, and that you've
experienced going.
Almost east to west and north tosouth, and you have that
(19:15):
feeling.
And then when you go and thi andsomeone, you know, imagining you
didn't know about latitude andlongitude, and then someone
tells you about it and youthink, ah, well those lines are
more kind of temporarily stable.
Whereas this one moves a lotmore away from, you know, the,
the, the core or the same line.
(19:35):
And in, in a way.
They're more stable in many moreways than you might have just
imagined, horizontally, ratherthan longitudinally.
And you know, so there wouldprobably be a common experience
within those lines as well thatcouldn't be necessarily
explained until someone.
(19:56):
Told.
Told you about the geography orthe way that the earth is, and
then it makes sense.
And what we are saying,suggesting is that it's similar
with the plants.
If we forget what we know abouta plant, people really come to
many of the same answers.
That's so cool and interpretedthrough a different filter, like
(20:17):
you're saying, you know, whatsomeone experiences as joy
someone else is experiencing as,um, I dunno, bolstering them up
or whatever it might be.
But there's a, a quality, asimilarity with them when we
really tap into that.
That's really cool.
I love it.
Yeah.
It's, it is just so amazing.
'cause yeah, when I was youngerand I, this shaman said what he
(20:39):
said, I just, I just blew mymind and I couldn't imagine how,
and then through the work we didwith you, you know, and it was
drawing pictures and writingstories about the plants and
their personalities and it alljust came together and it was
like, oh yeah, this totallymakes sense.
This, that was really easy.
But it was very instinctual andit, it made sense and it made
(20:59):
sense because of.
Being in that state as a childand kind of coming back.
So it was like coming back hometo something rather than some
weird farfetched idea that wascompletely over there.
It felt like coming home it waslike, oh yeah, this is what I
did as a kid.
And that makes sense.
That makes total sense.
(21:24):
Yeah.
so let's do a card.
So, um, maybe if we go with you,Fiona, first you pick one.
'cause otherwise you might saystop at different times.
We probably will, unless you'reperfectly tuned in with each
other.
Um, so.
It's probably gonna be a bit ofa lag, but we'll try and get the
card you point out.
So I'll move my finger along andyou say when to stop.
(21:50):
Stop.
Back a bit.
Back a bit.
That one?
Yeah.
No.
Forwards towards me.
That one little sliver.
Ooh.
Oh, that's, yeah.
Just sticking out further along.
Back.
Stop that one.
It's not that one.
(22:10):
No, it's not that one.
Which one?
Got it?
Let's get it.
Let's get it.
Keep going.
Keep going.
You've lost it now, right?
It's sticking out.
It's sticking out.
That one that right at the end.
Right at the end.
Right on the end.
It's sticking out.
That one have to drop out rightat the end now.
Yeah, that one.
That one was it?
(22:33):
That one?
Not that one.
We'll have that one.
I love that one.
Interference.
Perfect.
So interference.
What do you feel is happeninglike in the world and just for
you in terms of interference?
What does that mean to you atthe moment?
Um.
(22:54):
Well, interference to me wouldmean challenges along the way.
Mm-hmm.
So, like what's, I mean, I thinkof interference as like, you
know, you've got a radio signalmm-hmm.
And something's getting in theway of that signal coming
through clearly.
Um, so I would see that aswhat's, what's coming to
(23:17):
challenge the flow.
And, um, how to, how to removethose blocks, which actually I
think is, is pertinent to wherewe're at and the work that we're
doing.
Um,'cause we've had a very longperiod of preparation of quite a
(23:38):
lot of things, um, particularlywith our, our own Oracle cards.
Mm-hmm.
The sensory hairball oracle.
These have been 19 years in themaking.
Oh wow.
Wow.
And they've just come out inMay, um, 2025.
(23:59):
And we, we.
Although we've got otherpublications in the pipeline,
that was really like what we hadplanned.
There was two other publicationson the way to them coming out,
and it was like, right nowwhat's, what's stopping us?
You know, and our, our onlineforum, that's been out now for
(24:23):
about a year and a half, and wereally planned to have this
preparation time with that andmake sure everything was flowing
well and.
Um, there's been multiple thingsthat have interfered with really
getting out there.
Mm-hmm.
One of which has been techissues, for example, which we've
(24:44):
smoothed over, over the lastyear or so.
And then visibility, you know,we, we went to pop festival,
which is, um, power of plants,and we realized that we're
actually like.
Quite well known in a very nichecorner of the world, which is
the herbal medicine world.
And all of our work, theintention is about getting
(25:05):
people reconnected with plants.
That's the message.
That's what we want.
And that's, that's the mainfocus of all of our work of the
intention.
And in order to do that, ourwork needs to be visible.
Mm-hmm.
So I feel like that interferenceis about what, what's getting in
(25:26):
the way of that and what can weshift, what can we move?
And I think we've been having abig focus on that the last month
or two actually, on how to, howto shift those blocks.
Mm-hmm.
And what do you feel aboutwhat's going on in the world at
the moment in terms of being outthere as kind of witchy women?
Um,'cause I've been very vocallyand openly out there and.
(25:51):
More like the last year.
My feeling about my safety withthat has definitely shifted.
Um, I was just wondering howthat felt for you guys.
Well, we, we often talk aboutworking sub rosa.
So sub rosa under the rose, um,comes from the historical
applications of bringing ceilingroses into stately homes, but it
(26:14):
goes right back to Roman timesAnd so for us.
There's a certain amount ofsecrecy with the rows because
sub rows are, there was oftenmeetings held.
Um, people knew that if you weretalking under the rows, that was
not to go further than whoeveryou are speaking to.
(26:35):
So it's connected in with thepower of keeping your magic
secret.
Because we have experiencedsticking our heads above the
parapet and getting shot down.
You know, many years ago when wewere, um, brought up by the
trading standards and themedical kind of.
(26:57):
Trading regulatory body, um,because they didn't like what we
were doing.
And we know full well that the,the power of the women, the
power of the medicine women, thepower of the cuing folk who
were.
Slurred witches.
It was a slur, but the power ofthe witch is holds deep fear.
(27:21):
There's a lot of fear that ispalpable because the power of
the women and the equality ofthe sexes leads to a very
different landscape that we havetoday, and there's many people
that don't want that.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, definitely.
Um, yeah, I'm feeling sort ofvery fear, not fearless.
(27:44):
I wouldn't say that's true, butI'm feeling very come on then
about it.
But it definitely feels lesssafe than it did in 2020 or
whatever when I was like.
There just sort of, yeah, went,went a bit more down this route
and kind of, yeah, put, putmyself out there online and that
sort of thing.
And then suddenly it's like, oh,things have changed a little
(28:05):
bit.
The landscape's a bit different.
So yeah, it was just, um, I, Ithink some of it is, yeah, about
what you are prepared for or.
Not prepared to, to take.
And yeah, we've certainly gonelike that in our journey with
it.
And it doesn't mean that we'veever removed power or presence,
(28:31):
we've just shapeshift.
Mm-hmm.
Um, in order to overcome.
And that is some of that subrosa stuff.
Um, because you can, we alwaysthink of like following.
You know, if we think ofourselves as part of nature,
like what do the plants do?
And the plants create their ownprotective forces.
(28:54):
They develop more essentialoils.
If there's been drought or ifthere's been pests eating them,
they, they'll develop more oftheir alkaloids.
Um, sometimes in response to thesun or being nibbled by
creatures and they, they createprotective measures for
themselves, but that doesn'tmean, in fact, in some cases it
(29:17):
can mean that they're morepotent.
Hmm.
Energetically, but we've, we'vealways drawn from that and
thought, where do we need toprotect ourselves and how, and
you know, we can be reallyfearless and strong and powerful
against that interference, butthat can get tiring.
(29:40):
Mm-hmm.
Holding that boundary.
So it's.
We, we often call it creative,um, resistance.
How can we do this in a.
In a creative way, which, youknow, I feel like with a lot of
your work, that's where you aregoing with the Beltane work and,
and all of that.
It's creating a, Pete Yatessaid, didn't he, at one of the,
(30:04):
um, at breaking conventions.
He said the the revolution willbe carnivalesque.
Yes.
That's totally my vibe.
That's totally your vibe and ourvibe, you know?
Yeah.
And it's, it's drawing peopleinto the carnival, the party.
But the messaging's there, ifthey, if they look or if you
(30:25):
know, they're absorbing that ona different level.
Um.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And it's about doing, you know,when we talk about creative
resistance, we're actuallylooking at the hedgerow.
So the hedgerow is the boundary,and that boundary is also
important for all of us to hold,but they're not doing it alone.
(30:46):
You know, the.
The slow and the rose hip andthe crab apple and the
Hawthorne.
All these thorny members of theRose family actually are arm in
arm.
They weave through one anotherand they hold this boundary
together with lots ofnourishment and just this
(31:08):
messaging of support and.
Often when, because we areresisting, we are resisting a
tide of gray.
Mm-hmm.
Um, and have been for manyyears.
Um, but in that resistance,it's, it's so important to
nourish ourselves one anotherand keep things light, keep
things fun.
(31:29):
Yeah.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
I do a month, uh, fortnightly.
Column in the Guernsey press andit's about the moon.
But I like, I was basicallywriting about anarchy in the one
that I submitted yesterday.
I was like just like, oh Leo.
The Leo Dark Moon.
A time for anarchy.
(31:49):
Exactly.
You know, let's have some niceastrology.
Right.
Yeah.
You're only gonna read this ifyou wanna read it, so, or hear
it if you wanna.
Yeah, exactly.
If you enjoy this podcast, thenplease consider supporting me
(32:11):
over at Patreon, which ispatreon.com/jolie Rose.
This is my passion.
It's my creative way ofexpressing myself and my outlet
in the limitations of being onand being on a tiny island.
And.
I love it actually.
(32:31):
I think it works well.
This is, uh, I just love, it'slike the seed sisters we're
talking about shape-shifting andum, working with what, what,
what you've got.
You know, we have to, asartists, we have to shapeshift
and actually Sark's greatbecause you have to be a Swiss
Army knife on Sark.
That's part of, um.
How people work living here, uh,as in work as in you physically
(32:53):
work, but also people who suitliving here and people who
don't.
The people who suit living hereare the ones that are able to be
Swiss Army knives who areflexible and have lots of
different skills that they canbring to the mix because you
can't really just be here and beone thing.
And, and that suits me as anartist.
So I love that I'm making it allup as I go along.
And.
I had to shift from being atheater and event organizer to,
(33:16):
I am still doing eventorganizing here.
So an event organizer andpolitician didn't see that one
coming, and a writer andpodcaster and though, you know,
writing.
It goes out into the world sothat that doesn't matter where
that's coming from.
In fact, being somewhere asinspiring and lush as this is a
(33:37):
perfect place to be a writer,that's the dream really is for
me to be making a living as awriter here and then doing the
podcast is I, in a way, I feellike it's like an audio book and
I, yeah, it, it feels like a, a,an essay or an article that I
do, um, verbally each week.
(33:58):
So.
Feels like a kind of journalismor a type of writing in its way.
Using words to get across ideasand explore things and explore
different things with people.
I like it.
I love it.
You know, it's been, it's beengreat to learn how to do this.
It's a new skill that I have nowacquired and.
(34:18):
Yeah, I should make also myaudio books.
That's what I should do.
So that's another thing I shoulddo.
But all of these things taketime, and time is money.
And I need to get some money forthis time because the only time
that I do get money for isworking in a bar.
And that's not very much money.
That time is not, uh, valued ashighly as it.
(34:40):
Would be nice if it was.
And so, uh, I don't have muchmoney and it would be great if
this time was valued highly too.
And, um, uh, if I was receivingmoney for doing this, that would
be great.
Um, so if you are supporting me,I would just wanna say huge
thank you, because it makes.
It makes my heart sing, and itdoes feel lovely to receive that
(35:02):
gratitude, you know, throughsupport from a Patreon.
It really does make my day andI'm, so every month when I get a
payment coming through, I'mlike, oh, that's so nice.
You know?
It's lovely and I really, it's,it's a, it's the best way I've
ever made money.
Um, you know, I, I've got artscouncil grants in the past and
that felt like a, a nice.
Thank you from the powers thatbe, but this feels nicer.
(35:23):
'cause this is the, the audiencesaying thank you.
This is like you buying ticketsor buying my album or buying my,
you know, buying my book.
It's got that kind of feel toit.
So I really appreciate it.
So thank you so much forsupporting me.
And if you are not able to, andit, you know, finances are a
barrier, which I totallyunderstand and appreciate, then
please just talk about it, shareabout it.
(35:45):
Uh, it'd be great if you couldgo on the British Podcast Awards
website and go to the listenersChoice Award, type in nonsense
in the chaos, and then you clickon it when it comes up, and then
you'll get a.
Confirmation email.
If you reply to that, then thevote will go through.
If you're able to do that, Iwould hugely appreciate it.
That would be amazing.
And that's something you can dofor free as a form of gratitude.
(36:07):
Um, and then just post about it,talk about it, share it.
That also is a huge thank youthat I would greatly appreciate.
So whatever you're able to do.
Of it is, you know, I just lovethat you are here and that
you're listening and especiallythat I get to share such awesome
people with you.
I love Fiona and Karen so much,and I'm, I'm chuffed a bits that
I'm getting to share them withyou.
So yeah, it makes it allpossible, um, through the
(36:29):
support that I get.
So thanks to all of you and I'vegot some things coming up.
I'll.
Boom town next week.
So do come and see me.
I'll be on the Lions gate stagein the opening ceremony, and
that's exciting.
Front of 60,000 people, that'sa, a really exciting thing to be
doing.
And then we run a venue calledLa Luna Coven.
(36:50):
So if you're gonna be at thefestival, do come and find us.
And it's a secret, uh, venue, soyou'll have to dig us out, but
come and find us and.
See what we're up to.
It's gonna be fun.
And then I'll be at KentwellHall Tutor Reenactment in
Suffolk, uh, which is in longMelford, near Sudbury, uh, the
week after, and living as amama's player, a tutor
(37:13):
performing player person.
Uh, so you can come and watch usperform our plays and we.
Yeah.
Uh, just entertainers, uh, butyou also get to see lots of
incredible historians and livinghistory and what a, yeah, it's,
it's an amazing place.
I do come along and check usout.
If you live in East Anglia oryou know, London, it's not far
(37:34):
from London.
Fancy coming down for the day isthe most beautiful place as
well.
Uh, it's, it's an amazing dayout.
Come and see glass blowers andtrumpet makers and arches and
potters and animal herders andyeah, it's, it's amazing.
So do come if you're able to,and then I'll be on the
pilgrimage for the whole ofSeptember and October with a
group of people as travelingplayers performing Georgia and
(37:56):
the Dragon Mamas play.
And we're looking for places toperform at and for people to
feed us and put us up.
So if you live anywhere alongthe Michael Lay line, um, the
Michael and Mary route.
Then please give us a shout.
Um, we'd love to come and hookup with you and if you wanna
come walk with us for a day ortwo, you're very welcome.
So yeah, all of these lovelythings coming up.
And then my book's coming out aswell towards the end of the
(38:18):
year.
Um, I'll share more about thatas we go along, but that looks
like it's gonna be published andout for Christmas.
So that's walking with Autumn.
Watch the space.
Uh, but more about that laternow on with the show.
(38:47):
Excellent.
Right.
So, Karen, if you wanna pick thenext card, stop that one.
Yeah.
Excellent.
I've got it.
I've got it this time.
Okay, so this is the prince ofdiscs and he's a very sexy
(39:07):
figure on a, um, so it's a bitlike the chariot, but he's sort
of going somewhere'cause thechariot doesn't tend to go
anywhere.
He's got this bull pulling himon a chariot with, and it's
earth, the earth element.
So does that mean anything toyou?
What does that bring up to you?
(39:28):
Well straight away my mind wentto playing Frisbee because he's
on discs.
Yes.
And so, and discs take me toTerry PRT as well.
Yeah.
Because of the whole, so yeah.
Movement, travel, time, space,reality, and the bull.
The tour.
Yeah.
Grounding it in absolute, um,luxury and deliciousness.
(39:51):
Mm-hmm.
Um.
Yeah.
What do you like to do?
What's the things that you liketo do to make yourself feel like
that?
Well, food is really, reallyimportant and this time of year
is so opulent.
You know, the garden's full.
I've been, um, every single daygoing and collecting.
We've got loads of, um, peppers,padron, mm-hmm.
(40:11):
These lovely little greenpeppers and bee fruits and
carrots and, you know, gettingour food and our medicine
straight out of the garden issuch an opulent state of an
abundance.
And, um.
That makes me feel whole andoften in the garden.
I think, what would my life looklike if I did nothing except for
(40:36):
garden?
Yeah.
What would it look like?
What would it feel like?
What could,'cause I believe thatyou could learn everything in
it.
Absolutely.
Every aspect of knowledge from agarden by attending and watching
and, and learning.
We're actually going to work,um, with the great Charles
(40:59):
doubting at a festival verysoon, which is very exciting.
I'm, I'm getting excited aboutthat.
And he's the prince of discs.
Hmm.
Yeah, sounds like it.
But, you know, part of ourmessaging as Seed Sisters, what
we do with our social enterpriseis about connecting people to
(41:20):
plants and one.
Really important plantconnection is to be able to grow
something, and that can be in apot on your window sill, you
don't need a garden, but havinga connection to the seed and
planting a seed and actuallywatching those first seed
leaves.
And then maybe you later on,pick a few leaves and chop'em up
(41:43):
and put them in your tea or putthem in your soup that.
That connection is somethingchanges in human beings.
And you see that if children arelucky enough to have a teacher
that grows beans with them, it'san exciting thing.
Mm-hmm.
And that stays with us, thatexcitement throughout the whole
(42:03):
of our lives.
This caring and I bio beanplants.
Yeah, definitely.
And I always love that thing of.
About the trees look like lungsand that they work together.
And then the gut is the soil andthey work together and I.
I love that.
Yeah, we've got quite a bit offood growing on sarc, but we
(42:24):
need to start thinking about itmore because we are the end of
the supply chain and, um, ifanything goes wrong, which, you
know, possibly might, we mightnot get food.
Like as simple as that.
So one of the things that I'mtrying to encourage.
From a government perspective iswhat do we do about food supply
and uh, we definitely need togrow a bit more food.
(42:47):
So that's something that we'regonna be looking at.
We used to have an amazingpermaculture lady who I actually
interviewed in one of theprevious podcasts.
Name was Roz and she was fromNew Zealand and she.
Set up a be like quite a fewpermaculture gardens, um, on
sar, and there was one that waswinning awards and stuff, and,
and then it all got closed andit's all overgra now and it's
(43:07):
forgotten about and want to tryand get it going again, which,
uh, yeah, it's a bit of, a bitof a dream.
So hopefully, yeah.
And a seed, a seed bank, youknow, for starters, just to make
sure the seeds are there.
If my chain stopped.
Yeah.
Because it happens reallyquickly.
You know, we saw it in thepandemic, um, during the
(43:29):
pandemic seed suppliers soldout.
Yeah.
'cause people weren't at work.
And they were like, well, whatdo we do?
The shelves and the shops areempty.
Yeah.
And people were coming to us,um, loads and loads of people
came to us locally to find outhow to grow.
So it's, having seeds is themost important thing.
(43:55):
Yeah.
Having the stock.
Good point.
That's a very good point.
And um, what about a gardeningbook?
I would love a Seed Sister'sgardening book.
That would be, that would becool.
Talking about what's next.
Yeah.
Along maybe like, I really likethat image of the bull.
Um.
Pulling because it's the earthenergy as well.
(44:17):
And that yeah.
That it's like that earth energyof, of growing and you know,
that's what's gonna push out theinterference.
Yeah.
Is just that like, headstronggoing for it?
Practicality.
Keeping on, yeah.
And, and bringing, you know, thediscs can be thrown out there
spreading.
Spreading the seeds of wisdom.
(44:38):
Yeah, totally.
Well, I've planted the seed fora gardening book, so hopefully
that might happen at some point.
All right, Fiona, you can haveanother go.
'cause I dunno if I actually gotthe card you wanted last time.
So irrelevant though.
It's all good.
(45:04):
We'll just go for right on theother end this time.
This one?
Yeah.
Excellent.
This is the Emperor, which feelslike a very Leo.
Um.
Dark moon, so it's very fiery.
Although actually, I mean he iskind of more airy.
He's got a ram on there and he'sextremely fiery.
But sticking forward a littlebit.
(45:24):
Yeah.
Oh yeah.
Oh, he's cool.
Yeah.
Very, very fiery.
And um, this was sort of what Iwas writing about in the.
Article for this week, which isabout sovereignty and us all
remembering and reclaiming andowning our own sovereignty, and
not expecting leaders to doeverything for us, but for us to
(45:44):
feel like the emperor on ourthrone and in our power, fiery
power.
So how does that feel for you?
Are you, you both of you alwaysfeel like you're in your fiery
power.
Like that's one of the thingsthat's um.
I think probably everyone whomeets you is just like, ah, I
wanna be, I wanna be in theirpresence.
'cause you just feel so strongand powerful.
(46:06):
So what uh, I mean I think itreally is lovely how much you
support each other with that aswell.
And yeah, it's nice'cause you'reobviously a team, but talk about
like what you, yeah.
What does any of that mean toyou?
How does that land for you?
Um, yeah, I think.
Something we were talking aboutin a meeting yesterday actually
(46:28):
was about the, um, the, theliving example.
'cause it's all very wellteaching and, you know,
preaching for want of a betterword, about connecting to plants
and, um, holding space andcaring for yourself and.
(46:49):
I often talk about like, whatdoes this kind of idea of the
warrior mean?
You know, it's thrown around somuch in kind of spiritual
circles, but actually the energyand and drive that it takes to.
To keep going, to nurtureyourself, to nurture your
gardens, to nurture your family,to nurture our community and the
(47:10):
work that we do.
We always talked about where theSeed Sisters, but our community
interest company is calledSensory Solutions Herbal
Evolution, and we always talkedabout sensory solutions being
our baby that needed nurturingand um, that.
We are a massive support foreach other in that because
(47:32):
obviously there is times whenone or both of us has huge
challenges, might be personalchallenges or might be work
stresses, whatever.
Um, we can lean on each other inthose situations.
But I think one of the mainthings is, as Karen was saying
about nourishing from thegarden, but that real.
(47:54):
Awareness of nourishing ourhealth and wellbeing.
And I think that's, you know,that's maybe what, what it is.
Mm.
I mean you both feel like you'vegot a lot of vitality so you
are, yeah.
It's working and the work thatyou do with what you are eating
(48:16):
and consuming is obviouslyworking.
'cause you both always gloat.
Yeah.
And we, we.
We made a commitment, you know,we made a, an intention, um, for
our lives and it's a very longtime ago.
We, we made that commitment andit was actually, we pulled tarot
cards at the time and we did areading to really feel into the
(48:40):
rage, so that emperor.
Fiery Ram pushing through thatenergy of, um, both of us were
pretty disillusioned with theworld and society as teenagers
and felt a deep burning rage andthat rage.
(49:02):
Pushed us to rebel.
And in the rebellion we damagedourselves as well because you
know, you burn yourself whenyou're full.
Full flying Supernova 1617, andthe rage was transmuted because
we both made an intentiontogether to create and.
(49:25):
Channel the rage into somethingthat was our baby sensory
solutions who was turned into a,a child, a teenager, and now a
young adult.
And, um, bigger and bigger and,and.
We have used that analogy overthe last 25 years.
We're like, oh, it's in its teenyears now.
This is, it's being a nightmare.
(49:48):
Yeah, exactly.
Puberty.
But the sisterhood, you know, wetalked about yesterday in the
meeting, this word sisterhoodand we, we, many years ago
discussed the order of theapple, which is part of the
sisterhood, where it's aboutbeing incredibly.
Careful and kind to all of yoursisters and having deep respect
(50:12):
for your sisters.
And putting them above other,other things.
The sisterhood.
And we, we live by that and wehave lived by that.
And, uh, yeah, it doesn't mean,uh, letting go of the shit a lot
of the time.
You know, we're both fiery.
We're both have got our opinionson things and quite a lot of the
(50:34):
time, either one of us just hasto go, okay, whatever, and just
let it.
Let it go and we'll take turnsat that.
Mm-hmm.
And that's the way that we canmake it work.
But I think that, yeah, thatfiery rage is, it is still what
drives us.
Um, and we do have to be carefulnot to burn out.
Mm-hmm.
Um, with it, it is something we,we have to take care over.
(51:00):
Um, I was also talking aboutthis the other day, that
herbalists often arrive at aplace of discovering plants
because they've not been, wellfor whatever reason that might
be.
Things haven't been working outor seeking out or support.
And, um, that, you know, thatoften means that their living
(51:21):
example of how.
Herbs and plants and thatfocused energy can support and
work.
But it does also mean that quiteoften there's a vulnerability
there with health and you knowthat the way that we have
managed that is by channeling.
All of that kind of potentialburning up energy into our, our
(51:46):
baby, this work, this passion.
Mm.
Yeah.
Alongside being clinicians.
You know, we're, we'reclinicians.
We see patients.
We've got a really amazingacademic education behind us,
and you never stop learning whenyou are in the field of health
and wellness.
You are constantly reading andlooking at the latest research
(52:10):
because we are solutionstrategists.
When people are ill, we, our jobis to find the correct herbs and
lifestyle advice to help themget on a path of health so we
can apply that to ourselves aswell.
So we're in really goodposition.
Yeah, it was one of the things Iloved on the course because
(52:32):
there was a guy who was verymedical, he was a doctor, and he
kept asking like, really, youknow, I dunno, questions that I
didn't understand and you alwayshad answers.
And I was just like, oh yeah,they know what they're talking
about.
It was really good.
But it, I, it feels like that'sso important because I think.
Uh, it just, it just felt, I, itfelt, um, like you had all bases
(52:52):
covered and I really appreciatedthat.
I was like, no, they really verymuch know what they're talking
about, and this has been theroute that they've gone down,
which felt.
Like, I dunno.
'cause otherwise you can feellike things might be a bit Wawa.
And so when you know that it'sactually based on, on something,
I dunno, because hard, hard,cold, scientific facts, hard
cold facts.
(53:12):
Yeah.
It's annoying, isn't it?
But, but I always think it'samazing how.
We've gone sort of full circleand a lot of the science has
caught up with what indigenouspeople already knew.
Um, I heard yesterday, myfriends from Australia and we
were talking about aboriginalculture and how amazing and rich
it is, and she said they still,uh, people still aren't
(53:34):
researching aboriginal medicineand that it's just being
forgotten.
And that I, it just, it hurts.
It hurts inside because you knowthat that's gonna be lost, you
know, how many generations doesit take before that's lost and
it.
Because you see it here as wellwith the language.
We have a language here, we havea, and there's about three or
four people left who can speakit.
And it's just really sad'causeit's like how do we make people,
(53:57):
you know, want to learn it andkeep it alive?
Because within that there willbe words for plants or there'll
be stories and folklore andthings in there that will be
hints at stuff that's around usand, and how it could be used
and how it was used in the past.
And yeah, it's just sad when allthis, it is what I always think
of of.
Biodiversity and how importantbiodiversity is in nature, but
(54:18):
it is in people as well, andthat's what this wave of gray
you were talking about, it'slike, no, we need the, we need
all of the colors and the voicesand the accents and the
languages and all the stuff forus to be resilient in the
future.
Mm-hmm.
So that brings us onto the ChaosCrusade.
(54:46):
So in a way of being resilientin the future, the, the point of
this podcast is about usrelaxing with the unknown and
not just sort of, um, followingthe Matrix that's being, you
know, the script that's beingplaced in front of us, but to.
See things differently and tokind of break the matrix and
step outside of it and do thingsdifferently and to learn to be
relaxed with change and theunknown.
(55:08):
So what is something that youwould suggest people could do to
mix things up a little bit andexperience reality in a
different way?
I, I think we're probably unitedon this, is that the, the
suggestion is to go out and makea new friend from the wild.
(55:29):
Hmm.
To find a plant maybe that youknow the name of or the species
of and go and be with thatplant, observe, look at where
it's growing.
Is there a sense of, uh, anenergy.
We often genderize plants, butit might be that it's more of a,
(55:51):
a spirit energy or you know, isthere something that that wants
to come through, thatpersonifies it?
What's growing around thatplant?
What's the soil like?
Is it growing in some harsh,wild merlin environment?
Is it nestled in amongst lots ofother bushes?
Has it been planted thereintentionally by human?
(56:14):
You know, and, and reallyexplore your own visual senses
around the herb.
If it's a herb, it's, you know,a medicinal herb, then that's,
that's really the one ratherthan a cult of our for the
garden.
Mm-hmm.
Because a lot of plants havecome so far away from their
original wild form if they'rejust grown for beauty, for
(56:37):
example, which is lovely and hasits place.
But this is about connectingwith the, the medicine of the
plants.
Really.
Hmm.
What did you call it?
A chaos.
Chaos crusade.
A chaos crusade that conjures upmug work for me at the moment.
(56:57):
Um, we are in the, the height ofsummer in recording this today
and the mug work is a beautifulplant lining all of the paths
and roads around where I'mliving.
And something that's quiteexciting to do is to develop a
dream practice, something thatreally kicks up the, the normal
(57:23):
day-to-day mundanity, because weall sleep for a good portion.
About a third of our lives we'reasleep and in.
Medicine historically, dreamTemples were the old hospitals,
and mugwort is a herb that helpsus with dream recollection and
(57:43):
taps us into the dreaming space.
So it might be nice for peopleto make themselves a dream
pillow.
Or just drink a cup of mug workbrew, and get a dream diary
together and really work outwhat that part of their
consciousness is opening tothem.
(58:04):
And the plants come throughthere in, in wild and wacky,
chaotic ways.
Mm-hmm.
I love mug wat so much.
When I first moved over here, Iwas, um, working, drinking mug
wat constantly and um, and theflying ointment that, that you
have, that you make, that wasone of my best memories ever.
Um, I've said this to youbefore, fi that, uh.
(58:27):
It felt like I was in Hogwartsand it was when we were making
the, um, flying ointment and youwas holding the bag full of
herbs that had been stewing inoil all day and you were just
poking it with a wooden fallasto squeeze the last of the oil
out.
And you're like, yeah, the bestway to insert this is to insert
a wooden fallas.
And I was just like, this is mydream school.
(58:48):
This is the best thing I've everseen in my life.
And yeah, uh, mug when I workwith her, um.
Without fail.
People see me in their dreams.
They just keep, I just keeppopping up in other people's
dreams.
And a friend of mine got intouch'cause they stopped seeing
me in their dream and I waslike, oh yeah, I just haven't
drunk any mug water for a while.
But yeah, I seem to like getreally busy and go visit people
(59:10):
when I'm working with mug work.
Maybe warrants more researchthat we've had that before when
we've been drinking mug war andwe'll appear in people's dreams.
So, uh, uh, you know, yeah.
Needs to, we need to getscientific about what's going on
there.
Yeah.
I mean, this would be an easierway to travel across the
universe, wouldn't it?
J and and go traveling.
I mean the dream, dream researchis a fascinating field.
(59:33):
There is, uh,'cause we work alot with the dreaming and I love
the fact that in 19 75, 2separate.
Dream laboratories on eitherside of the Atlantic discovered
the exact same way ofcommunicating in the lucid
dreaming through eye movements.
Mm.
And that was, so in 1975 is whenthey discovered that we can
(59:57):
communicate with someone who isin lucid dream state when you
are awake.
But that was found out in twoseparate places.
The dreaming is.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Well that's what, that's part ofthe aborigine culture is the
dreaming, and it's what infooling that that's what we are
working with.
We're going into that space ofcollective consciousness and the
(01:00:19):
soup that is collectiveconsciousness, and I love it.
Yeah, absolutely.
Like.
The, the inner world is just sopowerful and we're so fixated on
the outer world, but I feel likewe've seen, you know, I think
with the enlightenment, we, wewent with reasoning and we sort
of cut off the heads.
We literally cut, cut off theheads of our religious leaders
(01:00:41):
and we went with logic and, andwe became disembodied.
And I think we've achieved somuch.
We've done so much with justusing the hedge and the outer
world and the intellect, but.
It's time for us to find thatbalance of bringing that inner
world part back in again.
Because without it, there isn't,I dunno, it feels like it's
science without morals.
There's no love, there's no,it's not got kindness in there.
(01:01:02):
Whereas if we bring that allback together again, obviously
we don't wanna get toosuperstitious or, you know, it
was about finding the balancebetween the two.
But our life has become a bitmeaningless and we, that, that
was the thing that I lovedabout.
Befriending the hedges andfinding this imaginative world
in my outer world again, is thatit brought magic back into
(01:01:22):
everyday life and madeeverything as fantastic and
amazing as it was as a child.
So yeah, I think letting thedreaming flow out into the real
world, real world, whichever wayaround it is, which one's more
real?
Thank you so much.
What, um, I will be sharing inthe notes what your website is
and stuff, but do you wanna sayabout your website and how
people can connect with you?
(01:01:44):
Seed sisters.co do UK and that'sSisters with an a s seed
sisters.co.
Do UK and Instagram SeedSisters.
Um, yeah, and come sign up forour newsletters.
That's the best way to keep intouch with us on the website.
You can get lots of differentfree.
(01:02:06):
PDF downloads of interestingthings at the minute.
You can see what yourastrological power here is on
the popup that comes up when youget on our website and we send
out recipes, what we're up to,what's going on, what things
are, what things we're workingon.
Um.
Once or twice a week.
(01:02:27):
Yeah, brilliant.
With HIB Law and Love.
So come and join us.
Excellent.
Thank you so much my darling.
It's love you both and thank youso much for doing this Speak.
I love too.
Thank you.
So that was the incredible SeedSisters.
(01:02:49):
I've just loved thatconversation.
They are my heroes and mentorsand I'm so proud to be friends
with them.
I love and adore them and it'sjust always a joy to see them.
I see them at Glastonbury everyyear now, which is great because
I wouldn't really see them veryoften otherwise now that I live
here.
But I see them, uh, they're partof the Horner family and we get
(01:03:11):
to hang out and.
Chew the cud and discuss thematters at hand of what's going
on in the world.
And I just feel like, I alwaysfeel like I've got a big, wise
gray beard when I'm with them.
And we're stroking our beardsjust going, Hmm, you putting the
world to rights And yeah, it'sgood.
There are, there is a few womenin my life that I feel very,
(01:03:34):
like every time I'm with themand spend time with them, I feel
like I've slightly elevated andthey're, they're two people that
make me feel like that.
And so I'm.
Overjoyed that I got to sharethem with you, and I hope that
you check this stuff out.
All of their things are amazing.
Books are amazing.
Courses are amazing.
Their, um, healing products areamazing.
(01:03:55):
You can go on their shop and buytheir ointments and all sorts of
things, but just go meet them,go hang out with them and
experience there.
Incredible way of seeing theworld.
So what a joy hurrah and yeah,so I'm now off to Beam Town and
I'll uh, do some recordingthere, let you know how it goes,
and then I'll be in the 16thcentury.
(01:04:16):
I'll let you know how that's allgoing, although I think we
already know how it went.
Uh, we we're aware of that.
Um, and then I'll be back.
Uh, but yeah, I've got podcaststhat I've prerecorded and I have
lined up.
So all very exciting and I lookforward to sharing.
My adventures with you and yeah,until next week, see the anon.
The.
(00:55):
Welcome to The Nonsense in theChaos.
I'm your host Jolie Rose.
It's with extreme delight that Iam introducing you to two
incredible women today.
Fiona and Karen, who are theseed sisters and are dear
friends of mine.
I've known them since 2020 whenI began their apprenticeship in
herbalism in the UK before Imoved to soc and.
(01:20):
They completely changed my viewof the natural world and my
relationship to plants and myhealth.
I, I gave up wheat, dairy, andsugar because of working with
them and didn't lose my voicebecause I nearly lost my voice
from taking.
Steroids every day for myasthma, and it was completely
drying my voice out.
And I got to the point where Ipretty much accepted the fact
(01:43):
that I was not gonna be able tospeak in a few years time
because it was, I lost my voiceall the time and it was just
getting so difficult and painfulto speak.
And then through working withherbs and.
Support from Karen and Fiona andgiving up inflammation foods
though wheat, dairy, and sugar.
It just, it changed everything.
And I mean, I'm a little bitwheezy at the moment'cause I ate
(02:04):
a pizza yesterday, so I noticeit when I eat wheat, wheat and
dairy, it comes back.
You know, it affects my asthmaand that's something that I
discovered and learnt throughworking with these wonderful
ladies along with many otherthings.
So I can't wait for you to heartheir incredible wisdom and
just.
Beautiful perspective on theworld.
(02:24):
I love it.
So without further ado, here isFiona and Karen and the Seed
Sisters.
So welcome my darling friends,Fiona and Karen, the Seed
Sisters to the Nonsense in theChaos.
This is the first time I've everdone a podcast with more than,
(02:48):
uh, one person, so that's reallyexciting I met you through
coming and doing yourapprenticeship, which was just
before the pandemic.
And I mean, it feels like such along time ago now.
Uh, but yeah.
So five years ago.
But tell us about how you metand how the Seed Sisters came to
be and what you do.
We met at the turn of themillennium Oh wow.
(03:13):
In northeast London, in pondersend, in on a degree in medical
herbalism.
And it was really apparent whenwe met each other that we were
kindred spirits and what hadbrought us to herbalism and the
study of plant medicine in.
(03:34):
Quite a kind of dry scientificsetting.
Uh, what had brought us therewas quite similar was a love of
nature, a love of plants, a loveof wildness and political
activism.
And through that whole degreeperiod, we'd hang out together
(03:55):
for study sessions, butinevitably end up.
Rifling around the hedgerows,seeing what was there, hanging
out with the plants and playing.
Yeah, because one of the thingsthat struck me when, um, you
were talking about it when I wasdoing the apprenticeship was
that you hardly went out andactually spent any time with
plants.
When you were doing the, thekind of medical version of it,
(04:16):
it was like twice or something.
The degree was a full time, fouryear course, and it was set up
by.
A group of herbalists and theintention for the academic
degree was to bring herbalismand herbalists kind of in line
with the current medical modelso that herbalists would be able
(04:41):
to integrate with the NHS and beable to actually communicate
with doctors and variousdifferent people that are
working within medicine.
So it was highly.
Medicalized, lots of laboratorywork.
We were in the WhittingtonHospital wearing white coats and
(05:02):
stethoscopes.
It was all very, very proper,which is great.
It's a really amazing training,but it forgot the magic and it
forgot nature and that.
That was such a shame becauseeverybody that had come on to
study herbalism obviously lovedplants.
(05:25):
And what we learned was there'smany, many herbalists that
practice herbalism, and they'rekind of tongue in cheek dubbed
brown bottle herbalist.
So they're people that aretrained in this incredible
knowledge, but they don'tactually have any connection to
the plants.
And that's something that we.
(05:45):
Riled against.
We didn't want to go down thatroute at all.
Hmm.
Yeah.
'cause the reason why you werepointed out to me was'cause of a
friend of mine called Josie, whoshe'd heard me probably tell
this story a million times abouthow I'd been at an Ayahuasca
ceremony in my early twenties,and the shaman, who's from
Columbia had said that theydon't just go around the Amazon
(06:05):
randomly trying things out andseeing whether they live or die.
They would sit with the plantand they'd communicate with it.
Uh, the spirit of the plantwould tell it what its medicine
was and I just, you know, thatblew my mind.
I was like, what?
And had told people about it foryears.
I mean, it was probably,probably best part of 20 years
(06:26):
that I'd been telling peopleabout it before Joc said, you
should check out the SeedSisters on Instagram.
'cause they're saying the samekind of thing as what you're
talking about.
And then I found you and, and itwas, I think it was amazing
because my, I couldn't figureout how.
Someone would sit andcommunicate with a plant and um,
figure out what its medicinewas.
(06:46):
And then through your course, I,you taught me that.
And the one I always use as anexample is Daisy, that children
make daisy chains and they playwith daisies and they're very
happy plants and that they'rereally good for depression.
And I use daisy syrup.
For a couple of years and now Ican't look at daisies without
just seeing happy faces lookingup at me.
(07:06):
And I love it.
Like I love Daisy so much andyeah.
Do you wanna talk a bit aboutthat process and also how you
came,'cause obviously it wasn'ttaught in your degree course,
like how you came to understandthat part of it.
Yeah.
The, the Daisy, I mean, that's agreat example because in, you
know, any text that you go andread.
(07:28):
About, you know, plants that areherbal medicine techs, quite
often they'll have constituentsand actions and maybe conditions
you can work with those plantsfor.
And if you look up Daisy,firstly, many of them won't have
Daisy in it.
And it's, you know, here in theUK it's such a common plant that
(07:53):
grows everywhere, yet haddropped out of the more common
material medics.
So the list of plants that canbe used for medicine.
So it often wasn't writtenabout.
That has changed in the last 25years or so.
We've been shouting quite loudlyabout Daisy, but I think there's
become more awareness, but youwon't see Daisy written as for.
(08:15):
Depression, Jay-Z has thisemotional bolstering quality.
Daisy helps you bounce back whenyou've been emotionally bruised
and physically.
The sings help to break down.
The, the pooled blood thathappens when you actually
bruise.
(08:36):
So Daisy has this kind ofphysical effect of supporting
bruising and this more emotionaleffect of helping you to bounce
back from emotional bruising.
And when we were working withmore and more herbs, we were
getting.
Getting signs, getting, gettingmessages from the plants were
(08:57):
coming in all sorts of differentways through the tastes of the
plants and recognizingconstituents through feelings
that would arise, or evenconversations as we were
harvesting them.
And only after kind of workingwith the plants would we then go
to books or things that otherpeople had written and try and
decipher.
(09:18):
What we'd heard from the plants,and that really helped us to
start trusting our intuitionaround what we were sensing,
what we were tasting, what wewere feeling.
So we always recommend that youchoose a plant that you are
really, really sure of what theidentification is, so you're
(09:39):
not.
Poisoning yourself or takingsomething really toxic and then
sitting with it, getting to knowit.
And I think it's really easy toforget that we often talk about,
oh, humans will have observedanimals in order to know what's
toxic or not.
Or you know, humans will have.
Yeah, that's, you know, that's abig story that comes
(10:01):
historically from our past.
But what we forget is that whenwe had much less input from
technology and cars andday-to-day goings on, that we
are part of nature, we have allof that instinctual knowledge
that animals have about.
Oh, that tastes bitter.
It may have alkaloids in it orum, or even just colors or
(10:24):
senses or feelings from theplants that we get and.
It's, it's challenging sometimesto remove all of that and step
back into that place, but, youknow, with a bit of practice
it's possible for, for anyone todo that.
And I guess we are both reallylucky'cause we've both been
brought up with families thatlove nature.
(10:45):
And I had a grand who was a keengardener who made, you know,
witches brooms.
So she always made beams andtaught us how to make them.
And she taught us from.
Tiny that you talk to yourplants and you, uh, stroke them.
She called all of her cuttings,her babies.
(11:06):
So being brought up in a familythat normalizes.
What's now called NatureConnection is a kind of trend.
You, you kind of grow up andit's second nature to think
about our plant kin as equals tous.
You know, as humans we've gotall this kind of discussion
(11:28):
around, uh, gender equality or,um, racism or, but there's just,
it's all human centered.
Everything is human centric andI think we've been very lucky.
I, I count myself really luckythat my grandma was never about.
Humans being the most important.
We always looked at the ecologyand the environment that was the
(11:52):
garden and the wider garden.
And that's something that bothof us had when we came to the
degree.
So although it was this, youknow, like uber scientific
space, we knew that there's amagic out there.
We knew that the plants had ledus.
(12:12):
You know, down that path.
And when we qualified, it wasreally important to us because
it became apparent that nobodyknew what herbal medicine was.
Out in society and moreimportant than setting up a
practice and seeing patients wasto educate as many people as
possible about the amazing,incredible world that is
(12:36):
accessible to everyone who isable to go outside.
You know, in the most urbanenvironments, the weeds grow up
through the cracks and thepavements, they're still there.
They're everywhere.
Yeah, I love that.
(13:04):
And so maybe, yeah, just share abit about the offerings that you
have.
'cause you've, you do theapprenticeship and you've got
some other online things aswell.
So do you wanna share a bitabout the, the things that you
do that people could come andget involved in?
Um.
Yeah, so our apprenticeship iswhat you joined us for and
that's a, we call it a year longprogram.
And from when you kind of signup until it's finished it it is,
(13:28):
but it's over.
Over the four seasons of theyear, we have four residential
retreats and it's a foundationin heroism understanding.
How plants can work with thehuman body, but also what other
gifts they offer and what we canalso offer them.
(13:49):
And people come on our courseand you know, get a real sense
of how they can supportthemselves and their family with
plants, but also this longlasting, deep relationship with
plant kin.
So suddenly the hedge row.
It opens up.
(14:09):
It's not just a green hedge.
It's full of many differentspecies of plants that's what
you introduced me to when I walkthrough the florist.
Now I just, it's like I'm goingto a party.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That feeling.
Yeah.
And even that removes a sense ofbeing alone.
Yeah.
Because they're surrounded byplant life and Yeah.
(14:32):
I think that's one of the mostimportant.
Parts of it is that it'ssomething that you, you're
forever changed then becausethose relationships don't leave
you, you know?
Yeah.
It's the magic wand that youhave as a child.
'cause children haverelationships with plants and
you'll have relationships withtrees that you climb and, you
(14:52):
know, they'll be the bushes thatyou know, and they've got names
and, and then you just sort ofgrow out of it.
Yeah, coming and doing theapprenticeship put me right back
in that place where it suddenlybecame this imaginative world
again and, and yeah, madefriends with all of these plants
and I've got trees here on theislands that are, have got names
and go and visit them and I'vegot a fairy tree and yeah,
there's all just completely putit back into that childlike
(15:14):
state, which is wonderful.
And that's really key with allof the work we do, whether it's
the apprenticeship or our onlinemembership, our coven of herbal
secrets is the imagination andbeing able to.
Trust your own imagination andsilence those voices that
sometimes come in that tell youto stop being silly or to grow
(15:36):
up because silliness and play ispart of magic.
And we talk about the magic, andwhat we really mean is
creativity.
Our own innate ability tocommunicate creatively with all
of life, with the whole cosmos,and we get.
Quite a finite amount of timehere on this planet and we are
(16:00):
really keen to like delve deepand explore all of the possible
fantastic potential that iswithin the plant life.
Yeah, totally.
It's one of those things thatwhen we do the pilgrimage,'cause
um, the Seed Sisters were alsoinvolved in the pilgrimage, that
I went to Cop 26, with 30 oddother people and, One of the
(16:21):
things that I've learned fromdoing pilgrimages with other
people is that theirrelationship to the lines is
imagination as well.
And everyone has differentrelationships.
Some people feel like they canfeel the exact shape of the
lines.
Some people noticesynchronicities.
Some people are like, I feellike it has a kind of, um, oily
filter on some of the lines.
Not all of them, which isinteresting.
I thought that they would maybeall feel the same, but they
(16:43):
don't.
And the ones that go up northare more like.
Uh, angry and it feels likeyou're riding a dragon.
Like those lines are ferocious,whereas the Michael Mary line
that goes, horizontally acrossthe UK is a lot more tender and
gentle.
It feels like they're sort of,for you.
Whereas the lines, the Ellen andBellus lines that go up the
country feel like it's what you,what are you gonna do for the,
(17:05):
the world?
What are you doing back?
Mm-hmm.
Um, really different.
Like it was quite a shock.
But yeah, everyone had their ownrelationship with it and I feel
like that's everyone had, isgiving yourself permission to.
Feel and experience the thingsthat you are inwardly feeling
and experiencing.
So none of it's right or wrong.
It's your personal, kind ofimaginative world and, and I
(17:28):
just think that's so much morewhat we used to do with
indigenous culture.
You would have this, it would beone, like your inner world and
outer world.
Well, one thing, and you wouldhave this imaginative.
Landscape in your outer worldthat was full of plants and all
of the, yeah.
Medicine and yeah.
Beautiful things that you get toenjoy.
What's really interesting withthat is that that imaginative
(17:48):
world is the same across theglobe for individual plants.
So you have a relationship withDaisy, for example.
That relationship brings forthyour.
Understanding of that flower.
And she communicates in, in hertastes, in the way she looks, in
(18:09):
the way.
You know, when you stand on adaisy, she bounces back up.
So you notice, and that's thesame for everybody, gets the
same sensory information and wesee patterns.
We've seen many patterns throughthe years where we work with
groups of people doing a blindtasting, for example, drinking a
(18:31):
a cup of daisy tea, and thewhole group doesn't know what
they're drinking and they comeback with the same information,
the same feelings.
There's something that's likedeeply ancestral knowledge.
It's somehow held somewhere,somewhere in the ether that, um,
(18:51):
it's just beautiful to watchagain and again.
It's fascinating.
Yeah, I think there's somethingin that with what you said about
the lines there as well,because, you know, let's imagine
we don't know about longitudeand latitude on the earth or the
way that the earth spins, butyou know, and that you've
experienced going.
Almost east to west and north tosouth, and you have that
(19:15):
feeling.
And then when you go and thi andsomeone, you know, imagining you
didn't know about latitude andlongitude, and then someone
tells you about it and youthink, ah, well those lines are
more kind of temporarily stable.
Whereas this one moves a lotmore away from, you know, the,
the, the core or the same line.
(19:35):
And in, in a way.
They're more stable in many moreways than you might have just
imagined, horizontally, ratherthan longitudinally.
And you know, so there wouldprobably be a common experience
within those lines as well thatcouldn't be necessarily
explained until someone.
(19:56):
Told.
Told you about the geography orthe way that the earth is, and
then it makes sense.
And what we are saying,suggesting is that it's similar
with the plants.
If we forget what we know abouta plant, people really come to
many of the same answers.
That's so cool and interpretedthrough a different filter, like
(20:17):
you're saying, you know, whatsomeone experiences as joy
someone else is experiencing as,um, I dunno, bolstering them up
or whatever it might be.
But there's a, a quality, asimilarity with them when we
really tap into that.
That's really cool.
I love it.
Yeah.
It's, it is just so amazing.
'cause yeah, when I was youngerand I, this shaman said what he
(20:39):
said, I just, I just blew mymind and I couldn't imagine how,
and then through the work we didwith you, you know, and it was
drawing pictures and writingstories about the plants and
their personalities and it alljust came together and it was
like, oh yeah, this totallymakes sense.
This, that was really easy.
But it was very instinctual andit, it made sense and it made
(20:59):
sense because of.
Being in that state as a childand kind of coming back.
So it was like coming back hometo something rather than some
weird farfetched idea that wascompletely over there.
It felt like coming home it waslike, oh yeah, this is what I
did as a kid.
And that makes sense.
That makes total sense.
(21:24):
Yeah.
so let's do a card.
So, um, maybe if we go with you,Fiona, first you pick one.
'cause otherwise you might saystop at different times.
We probably will, unless you'reperfectly tuned in with each
other.
Um, so.
It's probably gonna be a bit ofa lag, but we'll try and get the
card you point out.
So I'll move my finger along andyou say when to stop.
(21:50):
Stop.
Back a bit.
Back a bit.
That one?
Yeah.
No.
Forwards towards me.
That one little sliver.
Ooh.
Oh, that's, yeah.
Just sticking out further along.
Back.
Stop that one.
It's not that one.
(22:10):
No, it's not that one.
Which one?
Got it?
Let's get it.
Let's get it.
Keep going.
Keep going.
You've lost it now, right?
It's sticking out.
It's sticking out.
That one that right at the end.
Right at the end.
Right on the end.
It's sticking out.
That one have to drop out rightat the end now.
Yeah, that one.
That one was it?
(22:33):
That one?
Not that one.
We'll have that one.
I love that one.
Interference.
Perfect.
So interference.
What do you feel is happeninglike in the world and just for
you in terms of interference?
What does that mean to you atthe moment?
Um.
(22:54):
Well, interference to me wouldmean challenges along the way.
Mm-hmm.
So, like what's, I mean, I thinkof interference as like, you
know, you've got a radio signalmm-hmm.
And something's getting in theway of that signal coming
through clearly.
Um, so I would see that aswhat's, what's coming to
(23:17):
challenge the flow.
And, um, how to, how to removethose blocks, which actually I
think is, is pertinent to wherewe're at and the work that we're
doing.
Um,'cause we've had a very longperiod of preparation of quite a
(23:38):
lot of things, um, particularlywith our, our own Oracle cards.
Mm-hmm.
The sensory hairball oracle.
These have been 19 years in themaking.
Oh wow.
Wow.
And they've just come out inMay, um, 2025.
(23:59):
And we, we.
Although we've got otherpublications in the pipeline,
that was really like what we hadplanned.
There was two other publicationson the way to them coming out,
and it was like, right nowwhat's, what's stopping us?
You know, and our, our onlineforum, that's been out now for
(24:23):
about a year and a half, and wereally planned to have this
preparation time with that andmake sure everything was flowing
well and.
Um, there's been multiple thingsthat have interfered with really
getting out there.
Mm-hmm.
One of which has been techissues, for example, which we've
(24:44):
smoothed over, over the lastyear or so.
And then visibility, you know,we, we went to pop festival,
which is, um, power of plants,and we realized that we're
actually like.
Quite well known in a very nichecorner of the world, which is
the herbal medicine world.
And all of our work, theintention is about getting
(25:05):
people reconnected with plants.
That's the message.
That's what we want.
And that's, that's the mainfocus of all of our work of the
intention.
And in order to do that, ourwork needs to be visible.
Mm-hmm.
So I feel like that interferenceis about what, what's getting in
(25:26):
the way of that and what can weshift, what can we move?
And I think we've been having abig focus on that the last month
or two actually, on how to, howto shift those blocks.
Mm-hmm.
And what do you feel aboutwhat's going on in the world at
the moment in terms of being outthere as kind of witchy women?
Um,'cause I've been very vocallyand openly out there and.
(25:51):
More like the last year.
My feeling about my safety withthat has definitely shifted.
Um, I was just wondering howthat felt for you guys.
Well, we, we often talk aboutworking sub rosa.
So sub rosa under the rose, um,comes from the historical
applications of bringing ceilingroses into stately homes, but it
(26:14):
goes right back to Roman timesAnd so for us.
There's a certain amount ofsecrecy with the rows because
sub rows are, there was oftenmeetings held.
Um, people knew that if you weretalking under the rows, that was
not to go further than whoeveryou are speaking to.
(26:35):
So it's connected in with thepower of keeping your magic
secret.
Because we have experiencedsticking our heads above the
parapet and getting shot down.
You know, many years ago when wewere, um, brought up by the
trading standards and themedical kind of.
(26:57):
Trading regulatory body, um,because they didn't like what we
were doing.
And we know full well that the,the power of the women, the
power of the medicine women, thepower of the cuing folk who
were.
Slurred witches.
It was a slur, but the power ofthe witch is holds deep fear.
(27:21):
There's a lot of fear that ispalpable because the power of
the women and the equality ofthe sexes leads to a very
different landscape that we havetoday, and there's many people
that don't want that.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, definitely.
Um, yeah, I'm feeling sort ofvery fear, not fearless.
(27:44):
I wouldn't say that's true, butI'm feeling very come on then
about it.
But it definitely feels lesssafe than it did in 2020 or
whatever when I was like.
There just sort of, yeah, went,went a bit more down this route
and kind of, yeah, put, putmyself out there online and that
sort of thing.
And then suddenly it's like, oh,things have changed a little
(28:05):
bit.
The landscape's a bit different.
So yeah, it was just, um, I, Ithink some of it is, yeah, about
what you are prepared for or.
Not prepared to, to take.
And yeah, we've certainly gonelike that in our journey with
it.
And it doesn't mean that we'veever removed power or presence,
(28:31):
we've just shapeshift.
Mm-hmm.
Um, in order to overcome.
And that is some of that subrosa stuff.
Um, because you can, we alwaysthink of like following.
You know, if we think ofourselves as part of nature,
like what do the plants do?
And the plants create their ownprotective forces.
(28:54):
They develop more essentialoils.
If there's been drought or ifthere's been pests eating them,
they, they'll develop more oftheir alkaloids.
Um, sometimes in response to thesun or being nibbled by
creatures and they, they createprotective measures for
themselves, but that doesn'tmean, in fact, in some cases it
(29:17):
can mean that they're morepotent.
Hmm.
Energetically, but we've, we'vealways drawn from that and
thought, where do we need toprotect ourselves and how, and
you know, we can be reallyfearless and strong and powerful
against that interference, butthat can get tiring.
(29:40):
Mm-hmm.
Holding that boundary.
So it's.
We, we often call it creative,um, resistance.
How can we do this in a.
In a creative way, which, youknow, I feel like with a lot of
your work, that's where you aregoing with the Beltane work and,
and all of that.
It's creating a, Pete Yatessaid, didn't he, at one of the,
(30:04):
um, at breaking conventions.
He said the the revolution willbe carnivalesque.
Yes.
That's totally my vibe.
That's totally your vibe and ourvibe, you know?
Yeah.
And it's, it's drawing peopleinto the carnival, the party.
But the messaging's there, ifthey, if they look or if you
(30:25):
know, they're absorbing that ona different level.
Um.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And it's about doing, you know,when we talk about creative
resistance, we're actuallylooking at the hedgerow.
So the hedgerow is the boundary,and that boundary is also
important for all of us to hold,but they're not doing it alone.
(30:46):
You know, the.
The slow and the rose hip andthe crab apple and the
Hawthorne.
All these thorny members of theRose family actually are arm in
arm.
They weave through one anotherand they hold this boundary
together with lots ofnourishment and just this
(31:08):
messaging of support and.
Often when, because we areresisting, we are resisting a
tide of gray.
Mm-hmm.
Um, and have been for manyyears.
Um, but in that resistance,it's, it's so important to
nourish ourselves one anotherand keep things light, keep
things fun.
(31:29):
Yeah.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
I do a month, uh, fortnightly.
Column in the Guernsey press andit's about the moon.
But I like, I was basicallywriting about anarchy in the one
that I submitted yesterday.
I was like just like, oh Leo.
The Leo Dark Moon.
A time for anarchy.
(31:49):
Exactly.
You know, let's have some niceastrology.
Right.
Yeah.
You're only gonna read this ifyou wanna read it, so, or hear
it if you wanna.
Yeah, exactly.
If you enjoy this podcast, thenplease consider supporting me
(32:11):
over at Patreon, which ispatreon.com/jolie Rose.
This is my passion.
It's my creative way ofexpressing myself and my outlet
in the limitations of being onand being on a tiny island.
And.
I love it actually.
(32:31):
I think it works well.
This is, uh, I just love, it'slike the seed sisters we're
talking about shape-shifting andum, working with what, what,
what you've got.
You know, we have to, asartists, we have to shapeshift
and actually Sark's greatbecause you have to be a Swiss
Army knife on Sark.
That's part of, um.
How people work living here, uh,as in work as in you physically
(32:53):
work, but also people who suitliving here and people who
don't.
The people who suit living hereare the ones that are able to be
Swiss Army knives who areflexible and have lots of
different skills that they canbring to the mix because you
can't really just be here and beone thing.
And, and that suits me as anartist.
So I love that I'm making it allup as I go along.
And.
I had to shift from being atheater and event organizer to,
(33:16):
I am still doing eventorganizing here.
So an event organizer andpolitician didn't see that one
coming, and a writer andpodcaster and though, you know,
writing.
It goes out into the world sothat that doesn't matter where
that's coming from.
In fact, being somewhere asinspiring and lush as this is a
(33:37):
perfect place to be a writer,that's the dream really is for
me to be making a living as awriter here and then doing the
podcast is I, in a way, I feellike it's like an audio book and
I, yeah, it, it feels like a, a,an essay or an article that I
do, um, verbally each week.
(33:58):
So.
Feels like a kind of journalismor a type of writing in its way.
Using words to get across ideasand explore things and explore
different things with people.
I like it.
I love it.
You know, it's been, it's beengreat to learn how to do this.
It's a new skill that I have nowacquired and.
(34:18):
Yeah, I should make also myaudio books.
That's what I should do.
So that's another thing I shoulddo.
But all of these things taketime, and time is money.
And I need to get some money forthis time because the only time
that I do get money for isworking in a bar.
And that's not very much money.
That time is not, uh, valued ashighly as it.
(34:40):
Would be nice if it was.
And so, uh, I don't have muchmoney and it would be great if
this time was valued highly too.
And, um, uh, if I was receivingmoney for doing this, that would
be great.
Um, so if you are supporting me,I would just wanna say huge
thank you, because it makes.
It makes my heart sing, and itdoes feel lovely to receive that
(35:02):
gratitude, you know, throughsupport from a Patreon.
It really does make my day andI'm, so every month when I get a
payment coming through, I'mlike, oh, that's so nice.
You know?
It's lovely and I really, it's,it's a, it's the best way I've
ever made money.
Um, you know, I, I've got artscouncil grants in the past and
that felt like a, a nice.
Thank you from the powers thatbe, but this feels nicer.
(35:23):
'cause this is the, the audiencesaying thank you.
This is like you buying ticketsor buying my album or buying my,
you know, buying my book.
It's got that kind of feel toit.
So I really appreciate it.
So thank you so much forsupporting me.
And if you are not able to, andit, you know, finances are a
barrier, which I totallyunderstand and appreciate, then
please just talk about it, shareabout it.
(35:45):
Uh, it'd be great if you couldgo on the British Podcast Awards
website and go to the listenersChoice Award, type in nonsense
in the chaos, and then you clickon it when it comes up, and then
you'll get a.
Confirmation email.
If you reply to that, then thevote will go through.
If you're able to do that, Iwould hugely appreciate it.
That would be amazing.
And that's something you can dofor free as a form of gratitude.
(36:07):
Um, and then just post about it,talk about it, share it.
That also is a huge thank youthat I would greatly appreciate.
So whatever you're able to do.
Of it is, you know, I just lovethat you are here and that
you're listening and especiallythat I get to share such awesome
people with you.
I love Fiona and Karen so much,and I'm, I'm chuffed a bits that
I'm getting to share them withyou.
So yeah, it makes it allpossible, um, through the
(36:29):
support that I get.
So thanks to all of you and I'vegot some things coming up.
I'll.
Boom town next week.
So do come and see me.
I'll be on the Lions gate stagein the opening ceremony, and
that's exciting.
Front of 60,000 people, that'sa, a really exciting thing to be
doing.
And then we run a venue calledLa Luna Coven.
(36:50):
So if you're gonna be at thefestival, do come and find us.
And it's a secret, uh, venue, soyou'll have to dig us out, but
come and find us and.
See what we're up to.
It's gonna be fun.
And then I'll be at KentwellHall Tutor Reenactment in
Suffolk, uh, which is in longMelford, near Sudbury, uh, the
week after, and living as amama's player, a tutor
(37:13):
performing player person.
Uh, so you can come and watch usperform our plays and we.
Yeah.
Uh, just entertainers, uh, butyou also get to see lots of
incredible historians and livinghistory and what a, yeah, it's,
it's an amazing place.
I do come along and check usout.
If you live in East Anglia oryou know, London, it's not far
(37:34):
from London.
Fancy coming down for the day isthe most beautiful place as
well.
Uh, it's, it's an amazing dayout.
Come and see glass blowers andtrumpet makers and arches and
potters and animal herders andyeah, it's, it's amazing.
So do come if you're able to,and then I'll be on the
pilgrimage for the whole ofSeptember and October with a
group of people as travelingplayers performing Georgia and
(37:56):
the Dragon Mamas play.
And we're looking for places toperform at and for people to
feed us and put us up.
So if you live anywhere alongthe Michael Lay line, um, the
Michael and Mary route.
Then please give us a shout.
Um, we'd love to come and hookup with you and if you wanna
come walk with us for a day ortwo, you're very welcome.
So yeah, all of these lovelythings coming up.
And then my book's coming out aswell towards the end of the
(38:18):
year.
Um, I'll share more about thatas we go along, but that looks
like it's gonna be published andout for Christmas.
So that's walking with Autumn.
Watch the space.
Uh, but more about that laternow on with the show.
(38:47):
Excellent.
Right.
So, Karen, if you wanna pick thenext card, stop that one.
Yeah.
Excellent.
I've got it.
I've got it this time.
Okay, so this is the prince ofdiscs and he's a very sexy
(39:07):
figure on a, um, so it's a bitlike the chariot, but he's sort
of going somewhere'cause thechariot doesn't tend to go
anywhere.
He's got this bull pulling himon a chariot with, and it's
earth, the earth element.
So does that mean anything toyou?
What does that bring up to you?
(39:28):
Well straight away my mind wentto playing Frisbee because he's
on discs.
Yes.
And so, and discs take me toTerry PRT as well.
Yeah.
Because of the whole, so yeah.
Movement, travel, time, space,reality, and the bull.
The tour.
Yeah.
Grounding it in absolute, um,luxury and deliciousness.
(39:51):
Mm-hmm.
Um.
Yeah.
What do you like to do?
What's the things that you liketo do to make yourself feel like
that?
Well, food is really, reallyimportant and this time of year
is so opulent.
You know, the garden's full.
I've been, um, every single daygoing and collecting.
We've got loads of, um, peppers,padron, mm-hmm.
(40:11):
These lovely little greenpeppers and bee fruits and
carrots and, you know, gettingour food and our medicine
straight out of the garden issuch an opulent state of an
abundance.
And, um.
That makes me feel whole andoften in the garden.
I think, what would my life looklike if I did nothing except for
(40:36):
garden?
Yeah.
What would it look like?
What would it feel like?
What could,'cause I believe thatyou could learn everything in
it.
Absolutely.
Every aspect of knowledge from agarden by attending and watching
and, and learning.
We're actually going to work,um, with the great Charles
(40:59):
doubting at a festival verysoon, which is very exciting.
I'm, I'm getting excited aboutthat.
And he's the prince of discs.
Hmm.
Yeah, sounds like it.
But, you know, part of ourmessaging as Seed Sisters, what
we do with our social enterpriseis about connecting people to
(41:20):
plants and one.
Really important plantconnection is to be able to grow
something, and that can be in apot on your window sill, you
don't need a garden, but havinga connection to the seed and
planting a seed and actuallywatching those first seed
leaves.
And then maybe you later on,pick a few leaves and chop'em up
(41:43):
and put them in your tea or putthem in your soup that.
That connection is somethingchanges in human beings.
And you see that if children arelucky enough to have a teacher
that grows beans with them, it'san exciting thing.
Mm-hmm.
And that stays with us, thatexcitement throughout the whole
(42:03):
of our lives.
This caring and I bio beanplants.
Yeah, definitely.
And I always love that thing of.
About the trees look like lungsand that they work together.
And then the gut is the soil andthey work together and I.
I love that.
Yeah, we've got quite a bit offood growing on sarc, but we
(42:24):
need to start thinking about itmore because we are the end of
the supply chain and, um, ifanything goes wrong, which, you
know, possibly might, we mightnot get food.
Like as simple as that.
So one of the things that I'mtrying to encourage.
From a government perspective iswhat do we do about food supply
and uh, we definitely need togrow a bit more food.
(42:47):
So that's something that we'regonna be looking at.
We used to have an amazingpermaculture lady who I actually
interviewed in one of theprevious podcasts.
Name was Roz and she was fromNew Zealand and she.
Set up a be like quite a fewpermaculture gardens, um, on
sar, and there was one that waswinning awards and stuff, and,
and then it all got closed andit's all overgra now and it's
(43:07):
forgotten about and want to tryand get it going again, which,
uh, yeah, it's a bit of, a bitof a dream.
So hopefully, yeah.
And a seed, a seed bank, youknow, for starters, just to make
sure the seeds are there.
If my chain stopped.
Yeah.
Because it happens reallyquickly.
You know, we saw it in thepandemic, um, during the
(43:29):
pandemic seed suppliers soldout.
Yeah.
'cause people weren't at work.
And they were like, well, whatdo we do?
The shelves and the shops areempty.
Yeah.
And people were coming to us,um, loads and loads of people
came to us locally to find outhow to grow.
So it's, having seeds is themost important thing.
(43:55):
Yeah.
Having the stock.
Good point.
That's a very good point.
And um, what about a gardeningbook?
I would love a Seed Sister'sgardening book.
That would be, that would becool.
Talking about what's next.
Yeah.
Along maybe like, I really likethat image of the bull.
Um.
Pulling because it's the earthenergy as well.
(44:17):
And that yeah.
That it's like that earth energyof, of growing and you know,
that's what's gonna push out theinterference.
Yeah.
Is just that like, headstronggoing for it?
Practicality.
Keeping on, yeah.
And, and bringing, you know, thediscs can be thrown out there
spreading.
Spreading the seeds of wisdom.
(44:38):
Yeah, totally.
Well, I've planted the seed fora gardening book, so hopefully
that might happen at some point.
All right, Fiona, you can haveanother go.
'cause I dunno if I actually gotthe card you wanted last time.
So irrelevant though.
It's all good.
(45:04):
We'll just go for right on theother end this time.
This one?
Yeah.
Excellent.
This is the Emperor, which feelslike a very Leo.
Um.
Dark moon, so it's very fiery.
Although actually, I mean he iskind of more airy.
He's got a ram on there and he'sextremely fiery.
But sticking forward a littlebit.
(45:24):
Yeah.
Oh yeah.
Oh, he's cool.
Yeah.
Very, very fiery.
And um, this was sort of what Iwas writing about in the.
Article for this week, which isabout sovereignty and us all
remembering and reclaiming andowning our own sovereignty, and
not expecting leaders to doeverything for us, but for us to
(45:44):
feel like the emperor on ourthrone and in our power, fiery
power.
So how does that feel for you?
Are you, you both of you alwaysfeel like you're in your fiery
power.
Like that's one of the thingsthat's um.
I think probably everyone whomeets you is just like, ah, I
wanna be, I wanna be in theirpresence.
'cause you just feel so strongand powerful.
(46:06):
So what uh, I mean I think itreally is lovely how much you
support each other with that aswell.
And yeah, it's nice'cause you'reobviously a team, but talk about
like what you, yeah.
What does any of that mean toyou?
How does that land for you?
Um, yeah, I think.
Something we were talking aboutin a meeting yesterday actually
(46:28):
was about the, um, the, theliving example.
'cause it's all very wellteaching and, you know,
preaching for want of a betterword, about connecting to plants
and, um, holding space andcaring for yourself and.
(46:49):
I often talk about like, whatdoes this kind of idea of the
warrior mean?
You know, it's thrown around somuch in kind of spiritual
circles, but actually the energyand and drive that it takes to.
To keep going, to nurtureyourself, to nurture your
gardens, to nurture your family,to nurture our community and the
(47:10):
work that we do.
We always talked about where theSeed Sisters, but our community
interest company is calledSensory Solutions Herbal
Evolution, and we always talkedabout sensory solutions being
our baby that needed nurturingand um, that.
We are a massive support foreach other in that because
(47:32):
obviously there is times whenone or both of us has huge
challenges, might be personalchallenges or might be work
stresses, whatever.
Um, we can lean on each other inthose situations.
But I think one of the mainthings is, as Karen was saying
about nourishing from thegarden, but that real.
(47:54):
Awareness of nourishing ourhealth and wellbeing.
And I think that's, you know,that's maybe what, what it is.
Mm.
I mean you both feel like you'vegot a lot of vitality so you
are, yeah.
It's working and the work thatyou do with what you are eating
(48:16):
and consuming is obviouslyworking.
'cause you both always gloat.
Yeah.
And we, we.
We made a commitment, you know,we made a, an intention, um, for
our lives and it's a very longtime ago.
We, we made that commitment andit was actually, we pulled tarot
cards at the time and we did areading to really feel into the
(48:40):
rage, so that emperor.
Fiery Ram pushing through thatenergy of, um, both of us were
pretty disillusioned with theworld and society as teenagers
and felt a deep burning rage andthat rage.
(49:02):
Pushed us to rebel.
And in the rebellion we damagedourselves as well because you
know, you burn yourself whenyou're full.
Full flying Supernova 1617, andthe rage was transmuted because
we both made an intentiontogether to create and.
(49:25):
Channel the rage into somethingthat was our baby sensory
solutions who was turned into a,a child, a teenager, and now a
young adult.
And, um, bigger and bigger and,and.
We have used that analogy overthe last 25 years.
We're like, oh, it's in its teenyears now.
This is, it's being a nightmare.
(49:48):
Yeah, exactly.
Puberty.
But the sisterhood, you know, wetalked about yesterday in the
meeting, this word sisterhoodand we, we, many years ago
discussed the order of theapple, which is part of the
sisterhood, where it's aboutbeing incredibly.
Careful and kind to all of yoursisters and having deep respect
(50:12):
for your sisters.
And putting them above other,other things.
The sisterhood.
And we, we live by that and wehave lived by that.
And, uh, yeah, it doesn't mean,uh, letting go of the shit a lot
of the time.
You know, we're both fiery.
We're both have got our opinionson things and quite a lot of the
(50:34):
time, either one of us just hasto go, okay, whatever, and just
let it.
Let it go and we'll take turnsat that.
Mm-hmm.
And that's the way that we canmake it work.
But I think that, yeah, thatfiery rage is, it is still what
drives us.
Um, and we do have to be carefulnot to burn out.
Mm-hmm.
Um, with it, it is something we,we have to take care over.
(51:00):
Um, I was also talking aboutthis the other day, that
herbalists often arrive at aplace of discovering plants
because they've not been, wellfor whatever reason that might
be.
Things haven't been working outor seeking out or support.
And, um, that, you know, thatoften means that their living
(51:21):
example of how.
Herbs and plants and thatfocused energy can support and
work.
But it does also mean that quiteoften there's a vulnerability
there with health and you knowthat the way that we have
managed that is by channeling.
All of that kind of potentialburning up energy into our, our
(51:46):
baby, this work, this passion.
Mm.
Yeah.
Alongside being clinicians.
You know, we're, we'reclinicians.
We see patients.
We've got a really amazingacademic education behind us,
and you never stop learning whenyou are in the field of health
and wellness.
You are constantly reading andlooking at the latest research
(52:10):
because we are solutionstrategists.
When people are ill, we, our jobis to find the correct herbs and
lifestyle advice to help themget on a path of health so we
can apply that to ourselves aswell.
So we're in really goodposition.
Yeah, it was one of the things Iloved on the course because
(52:32):
there was a guy who was verymedical, he was a doctor, and he
kept asking like, really, youknow, I dunno, questions that I
didn't understand and you alwayshad answers.
And I was just like, oh yeah,they know what they're talking
about.
It was really good.
But it, I, it feels like that'sso important because I think.
Uh, it just, it just felt, I, itfelt, um, like you had all bases
(52:52):
covered and I really appreciatedthat.
I was like, no, they really verymuch know what they're talking
about, and this has been theroute that they've gone down,
which felt.
Like, I dunno.
'cause otherwise you can feellike things might be a bit Wawa.
And so when you know that it'sactually based on, on something,
I dunno, because hard, hard,cold, scientific facts, hard
cold facts.
(53:12):
Yeah.
It's annoying, isn't it?
But, but I always think it'samazing how.
We've gone sort of full circleand a lot of the science has
caught up with what indigenouspeople already knew.
Um, I heard yesterday, myfriends from Australia and we
were talking about aboriginalculture and how amazing and rich
it is, and she said they still,uh, people still aren't
(53:34):
researching aboriginal medicineand that it's just being
forgotten.
And that I, it just, it hurts.
It hurts inside because you knowthat that's gonna be lost, you
know, how many generations doesit take before that's lost and
it.
Because you see it here as wellwith the language.
We have a language here, we havea, and there's about three or
four people left who can speakit.
And it's just really sad'causeit's like how do we make people,
(53:57):
you know, want to learn it andkeep it alive?
Because within that there willbe words for plants or there'll
be stories and folklore andthings in there that will be
hints at stuff that's around usand, and how it could be used
and how it was used in the past.
And yeah, it's just sad when allthis, it is what I always think
of of.
Biodiversity and how importantbiodiversity is in nature, but
(54:18):
it is in people as well, andthat's what this wave of gray
you were talking about, it'slike, no, we need the, we need
all of the colors and the voicesand the accents and the
languages and all the stuff forus to be resilient in the
future.
Mm-hmm.
So that brings us onto the ChaosCrusade.
(54:46):
So in a way of being resilientin the future, the, the point of
this podcast is about usrelaxing with the unknown and
not just sort of, um, followingthe Matrix that's being, you
know, the script that's beingplaced in front of us, but to.
See things differently and tokind of break the matrix and
step outside of it and do thingsdifferently and to learn to be
relaxed with change and theunknown.
(55:08):
So what is something that youwould suggest people could do to
mix things up a little bit andexperience reality in a
different way?
I, I think we're probably unitedon this, is that the, the
suggestion is to go out and makea new friend from the wild.
(55:29):
Hmm.
To find a plant maybe that youknow the name of or the species
of and go and be with thatplant, observe, look at where
it's growing.
Is there a sense of, uh, anenergy.
We often genderize plants, butit might be that it's more of a,
(55:51):
a spirit energy or you know, isthere something that that wants
to come through, thatpersonifies it?
What's growing around thatplant?
What's the soil like?
Is it growing in some harsh,wild merlin environment?
Is it nestled in amongst lots ofother bushes?
Has it been planted thereintentionally by human?
(56:14):
You know, and, and reallyexplore your own visual senses
around the herb.
If it's a herb, it's, you know,a medicinal herb, then that's,
that's really the one ratherthan a cult of our for the
garden.
Mm-hmm.
Because a lot of plants havecome so far away from their
original wild form if they'rejust grown for beauty, for
(56:37):
example, which is lovely and hasits place.
But this is about connectingwith the, the medicine of the
plants.
Really.
Hmm.
What did you call it?
A chaos.
Chaos crusade.
A chaos crusade that conjures upmug work for me at the moment.
(56:57):
Um, we are in the, the height ofsummer in recording this today
and the mug work is a beautifulplant lining all of the paths
and roads around where I'mliving.
And something that's quiteexciting to do is to develop a
dream practice, something thatreally kicks up the, the normal
(57:23):
day-to-day mundanity, because weall sleep for a good portion.
About a third of our lives we'reasleep and in.
Medicine historically, dreamTemples were the old hospitals,
and mugwort is a herb that helpsus with dream recollection and
(57:43):
taps us into the dreaming space.
So it might be nice for peopleto make themselves a dream
pillow.
Or just drink a cup of mug workbrew, and get a dream diary
together and really work outwhat that part of their
consciousness is opening tothem.
(58:04):
And the plants come throughthere in, in wild and wacky,
chaotic ways.
Mm-hmm.
I love mug wat so much.
When I first moved over here, Iwas, um, working, drinking mug
wat constantly and um, and theflying ointment that, that you
have, that you make, that wasone of my best memories ever.
Um, I've said this to youbefore, fi that, uh.
(58:27):
It felt like I was in Hogwartsand it was when we were making
the, um, flying ointment and youwas holding the bag full of
herbs that had been stewing inoil all day and you were just
poking it with a wooden fallasto squeeze the last of the oil
out.
And you're like, yeah, the bestway to insert this is to insert
a wooden fallas.
And I was just like, this is mydream school.
(58:48):
This is the best thing I've everseen in my life.
And yeah, uh, mug when I workwith her, um.
Without fail.
People see me in their dreams.
They just keep, I just keeppopping up in other people's
dreams.
And a friend of mine got intouch'cause they stopped seeing
me in their dream and I waslike, oh yeah, I just haven't
drunk any mug water for a while.
But yeah, I seem to like getreally busy and go visit people
(59:10):
when I'm working with mug work.
Maybe warrants more researchthat we've had that before when
we've been drinking mug war andwe'll appear in people's dreams.
So, uh, uh, you know, yeah.
Needs to, we need to getscientific about what's going on
there.
Yeah.
I mean, this would be an easierway to travel across the
universe, wouldn't it?
J and and go traveling.
I mean the dream, dream researchis a fascinating field.
(59:33):
There is, uh,'cause we work alot with the dreaming and I love
the fact that in 19 75, 2separate.
Dream laboratories on eitherside of the Atlantic discovered
the exact same way ofcommunicating in the lucid
dreaming through eye movements.
Mm.
And that was, so in 1975 is whenthey discovered that we can
(59:57):
communicate with someone who isin lucid dream state when you
are awake.
But that was found out in twoseparate places.
The dreaming is.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Well that's what, that's part ofthe aborigine culture is the
dreaming, and it's what infooling that that's what we are
working with.
We're going into that space ofcollective consciousness and the
(01:00:19):
soup that is collectiveconsciousness, and I love it.
Yeah, absolutely.
Like.
The, the inner world is just sopowerful and we're so fixated on
the outer world, but I feel likewe've seen, you know, I think
with the enlightenment, we, wewent with reasoning and we sort
of cut off the heads.
We literally cut, cut off theheads of our religious leaders
(01:00:41):
and we went with logic and, andwe became disembodied.
And I think we've achieved somuch.
We've done so much with justusing the hedge and the outer
world and the intellect, but.
It's time for us to find thatbalance of bringing that inner
world part back in again.
Because without it, there isn't,I dunno, it feels like it's
science without morals.
There's no love, there's no,it's not got kindness in there.
(01:01:02):
Whereas if we bring that allback together again, obviously
we don't wanna get toosuperstitious or, you know, it
was about finding the balancebetween the two.
But our life has become a bitmeaningless and we, that, that
was the thing that I lovedabout.
Befriending the hedges andfinding this imaginative world
in my outer world again, is thatit brought magic back into
(01:01:22):
everyday life and madeeverything as fantastic and
amazing as it was as a child.
So yeah, I think letting thedreaming flow out into the real
world, real world, whichever wayaround it is, which one's more
real?
Thank you so much.
What, um, I will be sharing inthe notes what your website is
and stuff, but do you wanna sayabout your website and how
people can connect with you?
(01:01:44):
Seed sisters.co do UK and that'sSisters with an a s seed
sisters.co.
Do UK and Instagram SeedSisters.
Um, yeah, and come sign up forour newsletters.
That's the best way to keep intouch with us on the website.
You can get lots of differentfree.
(01:02:06):
PDF downloads of interestingthings at the minute.
You can see what yourastrological power here is on
the popup that comes up when youget on our website and we send
out recipes, what we're up to,what's going on, what things
are, what things we're workingon.
Um.
Once or twice a week.
(01:02:27):
Yeah, brilliant.
With HIB Law and Love.
So come and join us.
Excellent.
Thank you so much my darling.
It's love you both and thank youso much for doing this Speak.
I love too.
Thank you.
So that was the incredible SeedSisters.
(01:02:49):
I've just loved thatconversation.
They are my heroes and mentorsand I'm so proud to be friends
with them.
I love and adore them and it'sjust always a joy to see them.
I see them at Glastonbury everyyear now, which is great because
I wouldn't really see them veryoften otherwise now that I live
here.
But I see them, uh, they're partof the Horner family and we get
(01:03:11):
to hang out and.
Chew the cud and discuss thematters at hand of what's going
on in the world.
And I just feel like, I alwaysfeel like I've got a big, wise
gray beard when I'm with them.
And we're stroking our beardsjust going, Hmm, you putting the
world to rights And yeah, it'sgood.
There are, there is a few womenin my life that I feel very,
(01:03:34):
like every time I'm with themand spend time with them, I feel
like I've slightly elevated andthey're, they're two people that
make me feel like that.
And so I'm.
Overjoyed that I got to sharethem with you, and I hope that
you check this stuff out.
All of their things are amazing.
Books are amazing.
Courses are amazing.
Their, um, healing products areamazing.
(01:03:55):
You can go on their shop and buytheir ointments and all sorts of
things, but just go meet them,go hang out with them and
experience there.
Incredible way of seeing theworld.
So what a joy hurrah and yeah,so I'm now off to Beam Town and
I'll uh, do some recordingthere, let you know how it goes,
and then I'll be in the 16thcentury.
(01:04:16):
I'll let you know how that's allgoing, although I think we
already know how it went.
Uh, we we're aware of that.
Um, and then I'll be back.
Uh, but yeah, I've got podcaststhat I've prerecorded and I have
lined up.
So all very exciting and I lookforward to sharing.
My adventures with you and yeah,until next week, see the anon.
Popular Podcasts
Law & Order: Criminal Justice System - Season 1 & Season 2
Season Two Out Now! Law & Order: Criminal Justice System tells the real stories behind the landmark cases that have shaped how the most dangerous and influential criminals in America are prosecuted. In its second season, the series tackles the threat of terrorism in the United States. From the rise of extremist political groups in the 60s to domestic lone wolves in the modern day, we explore how organizations like the FBI and Joint Terrorism Take Force have evolved to fight back against a multitude of terrorist threats.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal
Gregg Rosenthal and a rotating crew of elite NFL Media co-hosts, including Patrick Claybon, Colleen Wolfe, Steve Wyche, Nick Shook and Jourdan Rodrigue of The Athletic get you caught up daily on all the NFL news and analysis you need to be smarter and funnier than your friends.