June 8, 2025 • 32 mins
From Sierra Leone to Dalston, the ups and downs of running her MK Sescare business selling food. "You have to be strong, I'm telling you, you have to be strong because sometimes you don't make money". #otherlivesareavailable #podcast #eastlondon #businesswoman
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Episode Transcript
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(00:06):
When I wake up this morning, then I pray to my God, I say
thank you to God to meet me to see this day today.
Then I went downstairs to go andprepare food for my family
before I come to work. And is this an early start for
your? Day.
Oh yeah, I think around 7:30. I wake them up around 7:00 for
(00:31):
them to get ready to go to school so.
And they're hungry in the morning.
They take kids to school, they don't eat that early time, but
just wrap that one like fish pile and a wrap that one.
Make their lunch, give it to them.
So this is for your children. You want to make sure they're
eating good foods. Oh yes.
And they like Mom's cooking. Oh yes, they love it.
(00:54):
That's good because I'm a good cooker, to be honest.
Yeah, what are the, what are the, what are the dishes?
Which are the family favourites?You know, like on a Sunday night
when everyone wants the comfort food.
What, what? What kind of food would you
cook? Well, let me say, every Sunday I
have to make jollof rice. Sometimes I make it into
chicken, sometimes I'm useless. They love, they love it.
(01:16):
Now we're in a, we're in a storehere, we're in a shop.
Is this yours? Oh, it's my.
Yeah. So tell, tell us what is in this
shop, what you're selling. I do sell palm oil from Sierra
Leone. Then I do sell coconut oil.
Then I do sell a lot of stuff like Maggie.
(01:36):
Everyone can get Maggie, everybody use Maggie.
Then I sell good screws. What's Maggie?
Benny that one is like seasoning.
We use that one to cook. Is it like a hot spice?
It's not hot. So if you're from Sierra Leone,
is it not true that in West Africa there is more spice in
the food? Oh yes, for me, I don't cook too
spicy. I don't cook too much hot paper
(01:56):
because of my G Wen. I used to love it too much.
Yeah, I can't eat without spicy but now because of the G Wen so
I just make it mild. Oh oh, so your children are not
keen on the spice? No, if it's too hot they can't
eat it. And is this because you're
living this side or is it like if they're in Sierra Leone,
(02:16):
would they be eating the hot food or would you?
They would. Oh yes.
So. They're actually, we just cook
one big pot for all of us if it's spicy.
If it's not spicy, you have to eat.
So you have to get use of the spices in it.
Everybody have his own portion. And and and you eat it with
(02:37):
rice. Yeah, we can cook like cassava
leaf. We cook put you to leaf.
We cook cream, Cream we cook to LA.
We have different type of sauce,but we have to cook every day.
No, like here. Here I can make my food for one
week, put it in the freezer whenhe finished, then I make another
one. And what's the difference?
(02:58):
Why is it different? Why?
Because of the time? Because I'm working.
My husband is working as well. So we don't have time.
Yeah, we only cook the rice every day.
Yeah. So you and your husband go out
to work, the kids go to school, everyone's busy.
Everyone is busy, so we don't have time to make food every
day. And when you come home, who does
(03:21):
the cooking? Is it you again?
I do the cooking. Is this because you control the
kitchen? Because you're Mama.
I think because I yes because I control the kitchen.
I'm the mom so my husband do night anyway working the night
to to the time I'm going home now my husband is going to work.
Uh huh. So that is the difference.
That's a hard working. Family, Yeah, Yeah.
(03:44):
So that is the way we operate our own.
And when do you get time as a family together?
When nobody's busy? When nobody.
'S Sunday, Sunday. It's only Sunday.
I work six days a week. Yeah.
In an ideal world, would you want to work less or are you
happy to work 6 days? I really want to work less.
(04:06):
Sometimes I'm tired, but I have to come here because I have to
pay the shop rent and I have to pay bills at home.
I can't leave everything for my husband because the money is not
enough. We have to put things together
so I have to be in the shop Monday to Saturday.
(04:27):
And tell me about this shop. Is it yours?
Did you start it like from from nothing?
Yes. What was the first thing you
bought? They bought the 1st when I have
this shop, to be honest, there'snothing inside the shop.
I used to take things from people.
They leave this stuff when I sell, then I pay them back.
(04:48):
So you started with an, you started with an empty shop.
Empty shop to be honest. That's brave.
Yeah, I'm telling you. That is brave.
I have to call them. Then I make order or when they
come to the market they said do you want to take order?
We we can take order today, OK. Then I can tell them bring this,
bring this. When they come, I have to bring
them. I say please give me the stuff
for one week. When I sell, I will give you
(05:08):
back next week. So I will make sure I get that
money. Then I give it to them.
I put another order again. So basically you, you have you.
You have to be good at what you're doing.
Oh yes, you have to be honest and quick to repay, otherwise
you won't get the business. Again.
Oh yes. So that.
Is the way I'm managing to be honest I do get the corona time.
(05:30):
I stay home because of the chewing. 3 months I didn't come
to the shop, I closed the shop. Tell me about the the good
things about the business and tell me about the challenges of
the business because if you started from scratch.
You know it. It's a lot of challenge.
You have to be strong. Like strong inside.
I'm telling you, you have to be stable because sometimes you
(05:50):
will make money. Sometimes you don't make money.
You have to. You have to save money.
The little money you have in your TV's the week you are not
making money, you have to take them that money to pay the the
show points. And when it's a struggle, when
things are bad, what gets you through?
How do you get through? What do you think about to make
(06:10):
sure you push through? When things are bad, well, what
I'm saying, because this one is food, I can't have money to save
in my account, but the money to pay the shop the end of the
week, I must make it. I might have that money.
(06:32):
And are you making the money foryourself?
Who are you making? It for for.
Your family. What do you mean?
Like when you're when you're trying to make this business
profitable and to make a successof it, who are you thinking
about for the success? I think I'm thinking about my
Chi win. Yeah, it's for my Chi win.
(06:53):
I mean, it is a success because the the shelves are now loaded
with produce, You've got drinks,you've got bags of of food.
It's all food, It's all food andeveryone has to eat.
Everybody have to eat. Who are your customers who come
in here? Well, I have the main customers.
Is my accounting people from Sierra Leone.
(07:15):
Yeah, because they know everything.
So it's like a shop that's made-up so that they can get the
stuff they know. The stuff they are looking for,
if they come here, they can haveit.
So if I went to a shop in SierraLeone, would it look like the
shop? I'm not too sure.
(07:39):
Yeah, I'm not too sure. I used to do business in Sierra
Leone, but we don't have like, Iknow now a lot of people have
shops, but not like this were like food stuff like this.
Yeah, because we used to have table.
You know, like the table outside.
OK. So an outside table with stuff,
yeah, like a market store, Yes. Good.
Yeah, well, they don't decorate like the way I decorate here,
(08:02):
no. And what was your thinking back?
What was the first job you ever did?
When did you first go into business?
Tell tell me about how you got from there to this place.
When I came to this country, I used to do cleaning job, but I
think I do that cleaning job about one to two years.
(08:23):
Then I changed to hairdressing job.
To hairdressing. So you started.
With I know how to do very well hairdressing, she's back home.
OK, OK. OK.
So that's the skill you had? Yes, that is my skill.
Would you like another one? I love that Yeah dressing shop.
It's my favorite. I was enjoying it, but the only
thing why I stopped the Yeah dressing shop, I was making
(08:45):
money in that yeah dressing. Why I stopped it because of I
started having my chewing. What difference?
So what you you couldn't you couldn't keep the same hours
because of the children or. Because of the chewing #1 I
can't keep the same hours and when they see customers, because
only two year different, my teamand the other one is going to be
(09:05):
18, the other one is going to be16 years.
So when I put them in the pushchair, because I used to, I
used to come with them in the shop.
I don't have somewhere to leave them.
I don't have the, I can't affordmore in the morning to pay
nanny, you know. So I used to bring them in the
address job. But as soon as they see the
customer, Oh my God, they are crying.
They don't want to sit down. So I was losing my customer.
(09:27):
Yeah, I started losing my customer.
Just close the address. I thought I thought the children
would like charm the customers and the customers would love to
have the. Children there no when we are in
the shop, me and them we they are laughing, playing, do
everything. As soon as they see customer,
they don't want to. Sit down.
Interesting. Yeah, so I start.
(09:48):
I started losing my customers and then I think something else,
OK, I didn't go to school, but I'm good to do business.
Now why didn't Why didn't you goto school?
I didn't go to school because I born in the village, I came from
the village. I didn't came from the city in
Sierra Leone like in the villagethose days.
(10:09):
My father, the the people back home, our parent, they know we
are not a priority to go to school.
When you say we. Like ladies, they don't put me
into school. OK, so it wasn't a priority to
put the girl children into school?
Yes, already men. And what do you think about
that? I think it's wrong, Yeah, it's
(10:31):
wrong, you know, So that's why Iwas focusing doing my business.
But anyway, I thanks me to Allahbecause when I came here that is
the one I was doing. I came here 2001 this year N30
is going to is going to make me in the UK for 24 year.
You know, I'm successful. I don't have money in the
(10:52):
account but we have something that want to eat and we are
managing to pay our bills. So I can't find no job in the
UK. The only job I can get in the UK
to do cleaning job. But because if you don't go to
school, which job are you going to do?
Which job are they going to offer you?
(11:12):
It's only cleaning job. So that lack of education at the
start put a barrier for the restof your life.
Yes. So that's when you turn to
yourself and you're like, I haveto make this.
I have to do this. I have to make this one work.
In some ways it forces you to becreative.
(11:33):
Oh yes. To be honest.
What was that machine that just went on?
It's the the freezer. Ah, OK, OK, OK, OK.
It was just. It was.
Just we go off and we start again, maybe for 10-15 minutes
and it. Goes so you've got boys and
(11:55):
girls. When I have I have one boy.
And two girls. 2 girls. And you're definitely getting
them educated. Oh yes, Oh yes, they are doing
well because the other one is going to university, yes, so the
other one is doing GCSE. The other boy, now his biggest
25 year, thanks be to God anyway.
(12:32):
When I have the visa to come here, because when my dad died
back home and my brother bring me here, my elder brother, I was
talking to myself when I have the visa, so good.
Now I'm coming to England. What am I coming to do to
England? I don't know how to read and
write. How am I going to make it?
Was it your choice to come here?Did you want to come here?
(12:53):
Or I want to come here, of course, to live better life, you
know. But I was thinking to myself,
what am I coming to do here? I didn't go to school, you know,
so. So the hairdressing then you had
children, the children stopped the hairdressing because they
(13:13):
ran around too much and then andthen this or is there anything
else in between? This one.
That's three different jobs, yes.
Go 24 year. That's quite a progression.
I'm telling you. And how do you feel in yourself?
(13:35):
Do you feel that? Do you feel confident in in how
your life is going now I. Feel comfortable to be honest.
Confidence. I don't know how to read and
write. Still.
Well, I was going to because of the poverty where I came from.
(13:55):
It's just too much for me. I was going my brother tried to
put me adult education. I was doing it maybe for one
year. I can't able to call because of
the I have that. I'm thinking I have to, if I
didn't sit down in this shop to look for customer, how am I
going to pay the shop rent? I'm going to lose the shop and
if I go to the college, I stayedthere and 23 hours every day,
(14:19):
I'm going to lose my customer. How am I going to pay the bills
at home? How am I going to give my
children money? You know what, let me just leave
this one and focus here. You know, even if you call the
Universal Credit for them to help me, they will say, oh, do
online go this one, go this one.I don't know how to do this.
Who is going to do it for me? Nobody.
(14:41):
My husband is he know how to read and write, but he's not
that etiquette, you know, like he know how to do things like
you know, so it's just too much.That's why just we just stay
away. Whatever my husband is working
as a security, you know, so we every month we just put together
pay the house went pay the council tax bills.
(15:01):
We manage our life, whatever little we have, we eat that one.
That is the way we are living our lives.
Keep it simple. I'm telling you because too much
hassle when you go to them, theywill say, oh, every month you
have to report how much money did you make today, How much
money did you make from the 15 to this 15.
You have to write it down. You have to I can't they can't
(15:22):
understand. It's not everybody know how to
use computer, you know. So that is the way we are living
our life. Thanks me to Allah now that you
when they are growing up only tohear more the other one is going
to university. So I'm telling you, I fight it
in England. I said this job I have to hold
(15:43):
that one. This is the only things I have
here to do so I have to fight. I'm telling you it's not easy
for me. It's not easy.
What a thanks be to good to be honest.
Well, you sound very determined.Oh, yes, you've made a success.
Oh, yes, of getting this far. Yes.
And every step of the way it must give you greater
(16:05):
confidence. Yes, business.
I know how to do business to be honest.
You don't need to learn. Learn to read and write.
I don't. Need to go to school, go and
educate how to do this. If you give me £5 now, in one
more time I'm going to give you 15 lbs to be honest.
OK, now I want to know the secrets.
(16:30):
I want you to tell me how to be good at business.
What's What's the basics of goodbusiness?
Let me tell you something, the time I open this shop, if I
should have have a little bit like 5000 lbs just for me to
start this time I'm telling you I can't turn this one to offline
symbol. I'm telling you to come here.
(16:52):
You can't have space space to sit down.
You're saying you would get so much stuff in because because
you would be so successful. Oh.
Yes. The time I have this shop, if I
have £5000 to start my business,this time if you come here, you
just come and buy and go back. There's no space.
You can have space. It would be crowded with oh.
(17:13):
Yes. So what is the OK, so, so we,
we're basically, if, if you're running a store like this, which
sells food, we're basically talking about trade, aren't we?
We're talking about buying at 1 price, selling at another price,
yes, but some other skills also.It's not as just as simple as
that. What's your top profit in here?
What, what are the, what are what are the expensive stuff
(17:33):
where you make a, a good profit?Like I see some things here are
3 lbs, one pound, £53.50. There's something there for 10
lbs. So there's, you know, it's all
kind of like under a 10 lbs, is it?
Well, let me tell you something,all this one is just decoration.
You don't have too much profits,you can't make much, especially
(17:55):
now things are so expensive. They take 1000 LB.
Go to 1 E the warehouse, go and buy stuff, put them maybe
sometimes you just make 5050 P it depend.
How many customers are you with CBD?
So it's you can. Have 5050 P.
So it's it's small margins, but it's the amount of people who
(18:16):
come in who makes a difference. Good.
How do you get them in? How?
Do we get them because like me here, it's only three or four in
those the markets? When you say just say that
again, it's. We are from Sierra Leone.
It's only two 2 Sierra Leone shop here and the other ladies 3
(18:36):
outside. We have a store outside.
So there's three stores here that sell stuff from Sierra
Leone. Oleos.
Yeah, and you know each other. Well, of course, yeah.
We came from the same country. And you compete against each
other or you're. We don't compete anyway and also
work together. If they ask for something.
If I don't have it, I can send them to the other lady here.
(18:57):
So you're helping? Oh yes, each other.
It's kind of. Supported something.
If they ask something there, shedon't have that one.
She can send the customers here.We work together as a team.
That's good business. Oh, yeah.
And you, you have a gentleman here also working here.
He's my husband, brother. Right.
(19:19):
Yeah, your brother-in-law. Yes, my brother-in-law.
And she stay. In Birmingham he just come last
week, he's going back on Friday.Do you have employees or is it
just? Your shop, so let me I can
manage the shop. Only me.
And you can manage it fine on your own.
I can manage the car, car affordto pay.
That is the problem. So you can't afford somebody
(19:40):
else? Yeah, we call the shop.
I pay £400 a week, £1600 a month.
OK. For Markley Council.
That's quite a lot. It's a lot here.
And that's just for the premises.
Just. So you've got to cover that.
(20:00):
Oh yeah. And then bills.
And then after that, profit. Oh yes.
Repeat customers are important. Very important, Very important.
So you've got to keep the same people coming.
Use Of course, this is food theyhave to eat every time.
And yeah, everyone's looking fora deal.
(20:21):
Everyone's looking for a smallerprice.
Everyone you know, food is expensive.
Everyone's struggling. Oh yes, everybody's struggling.
So you can't give people, you can't give even your regular
customers a good deal every. Time, we can't give deal.
That is the price, yeah. If you used to buy four or five,
you can cut it to two. It's the same price, Yeah.
(20:43):
We can't give no deal because sometimes we only make 5050 bit,
so there's no deal. Tell us about the market we are
in. What kind of market is this?
What's around your shop here? It's a good market to be honest.
Dusty market used to be busy, but now people don't have money
(21:04):
to spend a lot like before. So the whole market has seen a
difference. Yeah, and #1 the parking space,
because a lot of people, they are not coming inside the market
because of the parking. We've been reporting that one to
Hackney Council. They don't listen to us because
of the parking space. Can you imagine if we want to go
to toilet, we have to go to McDonald, we'll go to the
(21:24):
shopping centre. There's no toilets.
No toilets in the whole. Market, no toilets.
Well, like me, I have to stay here and manage because this is
the only place I'm making my money to give my achievement to
eat. My goodness.
There's no toilets. Can you imagine, England?
I want to go to toilet now we leave somebody here.
Go and look, maybe McDonald or in the shopping centre and they
(21:48):
are collecting this type of rentevery week.
Can you imagine? Could you put a toilet in here?
Or is it not? It's not plastic.
I don't know because that is theway they do it.
If I if we put toilet here and it's a foodstuff, it doesn't
work. You can't put toilet here.
You are selling food here. It doesn't work.
(22:15):
How do you divide off the stressof making money from home life?
Are you able to when you go home, are you able to to not
think about work? Or is work always with you even
when you're with your children trying to help them out with
their homework or whatever or cooking food?
Like can you separate? Or when you run your own
(22:35):
business like this, is it alwaysin your head?
It's always, it's always on my head.
Always. So last thing at night, first
thing in the morning. Of course I just have to think
about this business, but even sometimes I'm not feeling well.
I just have to come. That is the that is the problem.
You to be self-employed. I'm telling you it's not easy.
(22:57):
You have advantage and disadvantage.
What are the advantages? Because the advantage now when
you can open at any time you want to open, it's your own
business. But like when you are working
now, you can't just take the offtoday, tomorrow the off he will
lose the job, you know, and the disadvantage like me now if I
(23:22):
want to travel like the last time I was there on February to
my counter, I go and see my mom,my husband have to take because
I have two weeks holiday. Just have to take that holiday.
Don't even rest at home. Come and stay here in the shop
for me to go. Oh my goodness.
So. So.
I can't able to close the shop for me to go.
So you for you to go and see your elderly mother, your
husband has to take leave from his work good and work here.
(23:45):
Yes. That's hard.
Yeah, because I can't able to close the shop for two weeks or
three weeks for me to go. How much money am I going to pay
for that three weeks? I'm going to pay 1200 per to the
landlord. They don't care if I travel or
not, I have to pay them. They don't care if I make money
or not, I have to pay them. So you see, to be self-employed
(24:05):
is not easy. It's not easy to be honest.
And how is your mother? It's OK.
The family good yes. How do you keep in contact with
them Is it like daily WhatsApp? I just.
Call them on WhatsApp. Right.
Just a chat. Yeah.
(24:27):
How often do you speak? Every day I speak to my mom.
Sorry, every day I speak to my Mama.
Let me show you. Let me show you my mum when I
went to February. You're just getting out your
phone. You're just kidding.
(24:48):
I'm just saying you're just getting out your phone.
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. It's got more cracks on it than
my phone. Yeah, well I have to change the
the. Oh, she looks wonderful.
She has a kind face and she has she has a scarf over her head.
(25:15):
She's so. Happy and the two of you are
together in that video just chatting.
And is she proud of you? What does she think of you being
here? Very proud of me, yeah.
(25:37):
You have you have brothers and sisters.
Yes, what? We are three.
We are here with three of us. My elder brother is here and the
other one is older than me is here.
So two brothers. You're the only sister, yes.
Do you look after them or do they look after you?
I don't look after they, they don't look after me.
(25:57):
This is Londo. Yeah.
Explain a bit further. Then they check on me.
Are you OK? How is this family?
This and that? You know, this country, nobody
give money and the money's not enough.
I don't blame them. I don't blame them.
My elder brother's lawyer, the other one is working in the
hospital, so he's living in me thinking.
(26:21):
So everyone's living their lives.
Oh, yeah, you're in contact. You're there.
You're there if you need to support each other.
Like which supports. Like help me I'm I have a
problem and I need to talk to myfamily.
Please, please, please. I can't blame them because they
have their own bills, they have their family.
I can't blame them. I can't even call them to ask
(26:43):
them to say oh please help me, Ihave problem come and help me
for money. No way.
They have their own family, theyhave their own problem.
They call me, they check on me, I call them, I check on them,
but I don't tell them my problemfor money.
Please Google me money. I can't do that.
I can't take my problem. I take my problem, give it to
them. I can't do that and I have to
(27:06):
use my head. It's my daughter.
They are laughing at me. This is my daughter.
How are you doing? So they come from school.
Yes, put me on the Internet, yousee.
(27:27):
That's your daughter, say that'sfine.
You do it your thing every time.Mommy, why do you do?
This how you doing? I'm talking to your mum for a
podcast where we just talk to everyday people about their
lives. Yeah, she's been talking about
you guys. Yeah, yeah.
It's all, it's all good, it's all positive.
I. Know I'm in sleepy as well,
(27:56):
thank you. So customers just got customers
just come in. Yeah.
What was she buying? She was, she was on the phone
and somebody was. What's that?
It's food. OK, like you, you put water with
(28:17):
it. What is it?
I have to cook that one. Cook it with meat, fish, hot
pepper on your palm oil. We can eat it with rice or you
eat it with fish. Fufu is is like like a Stew.
This cassava. A fufu is cassava.
Yeah, yeah. You're deciding not to take that
(28:46):
call. You've just raised your your
eyes to the heavens. That's not something you want to
talk talk to now. These jars here.
What is this? To me it looks like.
This one is coconut oil from Sierra Leone.
OK. This one is palm oil from
(29:06):
civilian. This one you know.
Nice font to wash the dishes. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So, so the coconut oil is clear,is clear in a jar.
The Parm oil is in a plastic container and then you've got
dried goods here. Which one?
These ones are all dried goods. Well, this one is Maggie.
It's the sauce I was telling youabout.
You use it when you're cooking. Use that one.
(29:27):
We use that one to cook. And what else?
Got tins? Yeah, tins and the weaker, what
are that one? What are all these bags here?
Fruits. Fruit.
Yes. What kind of What dried fruit
it's? Dried fruit.
And then what do you do with it?You just mix it and put a little
bit of sugar and lamb and drink it.
(29:48):
It's very good, yes, and. Then on this side you've got
like cans of drink, bottles of drink, yes.
And towards the front you've gotthe powdered milk, the coconut
milk, yes. And these are all the spices
here, yes. And your kids, are they good at
cooking? Oh yes.
(30:10):
You taught them. Yeah, I'm teaching them.
There's kind of some smiles fromthe back of the I.
Know they look like. The thing is, nobody can cook
like their mum. Yes, I've tried to cook like my
mum. I can't do it, I know.
May I ask you about just your mum and her business here?
You've just come back from school, Yeah.
(30:32):
Do you, do you sometimes help out here?
What do you think of your mom and and the business that she
runs here? I.
Think she's really hard working.We've been in Boston since I was
born, so she's really hard working.
She's always here, bank holidays, Christmas, anytime
(30:53):
she's here. I do help out sometimes,
especially during the summer if she pays me.
But. Like a little part time job.
Yeah, I feel like she's really excellent.
This is what she loves doing. So I love it.
Yeah, I love my business. Oh, that's good.
Oh yes, I love it. Yeah, she meets new people.
(31:15):
She makes new connections. She's really like, she's really
nice. Like, she helps out a lot of
people, like that guy over there, like a little quick job,
gets money. Like she's really helpful.
She's nice, Yeah. It's great that you love your
job. So many people don't love their.
Job I love my. Job.
But even though all the struggles we've talked about.
(31:36):
That's actually already even if I don't make money, I feel
happy. I'm telling you, I love my job.
What? Because it's dealing with
people? Because.
Because I see people every day. I can't see it.
That's all. I've been stressing a lot of
people there in the hospital, which meant that hell, you know.
So when I come here, I feel happy, I'm telling you.
(31:59):
Even talking to people. You don't even talking to you
now make me I feel good, of course.
Makes me feel good too. Yes, you feel good.
You see, it's better than I stayat home doing nothing, you know
so. And we, we don't know each
other, but we've had a good chat, yes.
When I wake up this morning, then I pray to my God, I say
thank you to God to meet me to see this day today.
Then I went downstairs to go andprepare food for my family
before I come to work. And is this an early start for
your? Day.
Oh yeah, I think around 7:30. I wake them up around 7:00 for
(00:31):
them to get ready to go to school so.
And they're hungry in the morning.
They take kids to school, they don't eat that early time, but
just wrap that one like fish pile and a wrap that one.
Make their lunch, give it to them.
So this is for your children. You want to make sure they're
eating good foods. Oh yes.
And they like Mom's cooking. Oh yes, they love it.
(00:54):
That's good because I'm a good cooker, to be honest.
Yeah, what are the, what are the, what are the dishes?
Which are the family favourites?You know, like on a Sunday night
when everyone wants the comfort food.
What, what? What kind of food would you
cook? Well, let me say, every Sunday I
have to make jollof rice. Sometimes I make it into
chicken, sometimes I'm useless. They love, they love it.
(01:16):
Now we're in a, we're in a storehere, we're in a shop.
Is this yours? Oh, it's my.
Yeah. So tell, tell us what is in this
shop, what you're selling. I do sell palm oil from Sierra
Leone. Then I do sell coconut oil.
Then I do sell a lot of stuff like Maggie.
(01:36):
Everyone can get Maggie, everybody use Maggie.
Then I sell good screws. What's Maggie?
Benny that one is like seasoning.
We use that one to cook. Is it like a hot spice?
It's not hot. So if you're from Sierra Leone,
is it not true that in West Africa there is more spice in
the food? Oh yes, for me, I don't cook too
spicy. I don't cook too much hot paper
(01:56):
because of my G Wen. I used to love it too much.
Yeah, I can't eat without spicy but now because of the G Wen so
I just make it mild. Oh oh, so your children are not
keen on the spice? No, if it's too hot they can't
eat it. And is this because you're
living this side or is it like if they're in Sierra Leone,
(02:16):
would they be eating the hot food or would you?
They would. Oh yes.
So. They're actually, we just cook
one big pot for all of us if it's spicy.
If it's not spicy, you have to eat.
So you have to get use of the spices in it.
Everybody have his own portion. And and and you eat it with
(02:37):
rice. Yeah, we can cook like cassava
leaf. We cook put you to leaf.
We cook cream, Cream we cook to LA.
We have different type of sauce,but we have to cook every day.
No, like here. Here I can make my food for one
week, put it in the freezer whenhe finished, then I make another
one. And what's the difference?
(02:58):
Why is it different? Why?
Because of the time? Because I'm working.
My husband is working as well. So we don't have time.
Yeah, we only cook the rice every day.
Yeah. So you and your husband go out
to work, the kids go to school, everyone's busy.
Everyone is busy, so we don't have time to make food every
day. And when you come home, who does
(03:21):
the cooking? Is it you again?
I do the cooking. Is this because you control the
kitchen? Because you're Mama.
I think because I yes because I control the kitchen.
I'm the mom so my husband do night anyway working the night
to to the time I'm going home now my husband is going to work.
Uh huh. So that is the difference.
That's a hard working. Family, Yeah, Yeah.
(03:44):
So that is the way we operate our own.
And when do you get time as a family together?
When nobody's busy? When nobody.
'S Sunday, Sunday. It's only Sunday.
I work six days a week. Yeah.
In an ideal world, would you want to work less or are you
happy to work 6 days? I really want to work less.
(04:06):
Sometimes I'm tired, but I have to come here because I have to
pay the shop rent and I have to pay bills at home.
I can't leave everything for my husband because the money is not
enough. We have to put things together
so I have to be in the shop Monday to Saturday.
(04:27):
And tell me about this shop. Is it yours?
Did you start it like from from nothing?
Yes. What was the first thing you
bought? They bought the 1st when I have
this shop, to be honest, there'snothing inside the shop.
I used to take things from people.
They leave this stuff when I sell, then I pay them back.
(04:48):
So you started with an, you started with an empty shop.
Empty shop to be honest. That's brave.
Yeah, I'm telling you. That is brave.
I have to call them. Then I make order or when they
come to the market they said do you want to take order?
We we can take order today, OK. Then I can tell them bring this,
bring this. When they come, I have to bring
them. I say please give me the stuff
for one week. When I sell, I will give you
(05:08):
back next week. So I will make sure I get that
money. Then I give it to them.
I put another order again. So basically you, you have you.
You have to be good at what you're doing.
Oh yes, you have to be honest and quick to repay, otherwise
you won't get the business. Again.
Oh yes. So that.
Is the way I'm managing to be honest I do get the corona time.
(05:30):
I stay home because of the chewing. 3 months I didn't come
to the shop, I closed the shop. Tell me about the the good
things about the business and tell me about the challenges of
the business because if you started from scratch.
You know it. It's a lot of challenge.
You have to be strong. Like strong inside.
I'm telling you, you have to be stable because sometimes you
(05:50):
will make money. Sometimes you don't make money.
You have to. You have to save money.
The little money you have in your TV's the week you are not
making money, you have to take them that money to pay the the
show points. And when it's a struggle, when
things are bad, what gets you through?
How do you get through? What do you think about to make
(06:10):
sure you push through? When things are bad, well, what
I'm saying, because this one is food, I can't have money to save
in my account, but the money to pay the shop the end of the
week, I must make it. I might have that money.
(06:32):
And are you making the money foryourself?
Who are you making? It for for.
Your family. What do you mean?
Like when you're when you're trying to make this business
profitable and to make a successof it, who are you thinking
about for the success? I think I'm thinking about my
Chi win. Yeah, it's for my Chi win.
(06:53):
I mean, it is a success because the the shelves are now loaded
with produce, You've got drinks,you've got bags of of food.
It's all food, It's all food andeveryone has to eat.
Everybody have to eat. Who are your customers who come
in here? Well, I have the main customers.
Is my accounting people from Sierra Leone.
(07:15):
Yeah, because they know everything.
So it's like a shop that's made-up so that they can get the
stuff they know. The stuff they are looking for,
if they come here, they can haveit.
So if I went to a shop in SierraLeone, would it look like the
shop? I'm not too sure.
(07:39):
Yeah, I'm not too sure. I used to do business in Sierra
Leone, but we don't have like, Iknow now a lot of people have
shops, but not like this were like food stuff like this.
Yeah, because we used to have table.
You know, like the table outside.
OK. So an outside table with stuff,
yeah, like a market store, Yes. Good.
Yeah, well, they don't decorate like the way I decorate here,
(08:02):
no. And what was your thinking back?
What was the first job you ever did?
When did you first go into business?
Tell tell me about how you got from there to this place.
When I came to this country, I used to do cleaning job, but I
think I do that cleaning job about one to two years.
(08:23):
Then I changed to hairdressing job.
To hairdressing. So you started.
With I know how to do very well hairdressing, she's back home.
OK, OK. OK.
So that's the skill you had? Yes, that is my skill.
Would you like another one? I love that Yeah dressing shop.
It's my favorite. I was enjoying it, but the only
thing why I stopped the Yeah dressing shop, I was making
(08:45):
money in that yeah dressing. Why I stopped it because of I
started having my chewing. What difference?
So what you you couldn't you couldn't keep the same hours
because of the children or. Because of the chewing #1 I
can't keep the same hours and when they see customers, because
only two year different, my teamand the other one is going to be
(09:05):
18, the other one is going to be16 years.
So when I put them in the pushchair, because I used to, I
used to come with them in the shop.
I don't have somewhere to leave them.
I don't have the, I can't affordmore in the morning to pay
nanny, you know. So I used to bring them in the
address job. But as soon as they see the
customer, Oh my God, they are crying.
They don't want to sit down. So I was losing my customer.
(09:27):
Yeah, I started losing my customer.
Just close the address. I thought I thought the children
would like charm the customers and the customers would love to
have the. Children there no when we are in
the shop, me and them we they are laughing, playing, do
everything. As soon as they see customer,
they don't want to. Sit down.
Interesting. Yeah, so I start.
(09:48):
I started losing my customers and then I think something else,
OK, I didn't go to school, but I'm good to do business.
Now why didn't Why didn't you goto school?
I didn't go to school because I born in the village, I came from
the village. I didn't came from the city in
Sierra Leone like in the villagethose days.
(10:09):
My father, the the people back home, our parent, they know we
are not a priority to go to school.
When you say we. Like ladies, they don't put me
into school. OK, so it wasn't a priority to
put the girl children into school?
Yes, already men. And what do you think about
that? I think it's wrong, Yeah, it's
(10:31):
wrong, you know, So that's why Iwas focusing doing my business.
But anyway, I thanks me to Allahbecause when I came here that is
the one I was doing. I came here 2001 this year N30
is going to is going to make me in the UK for 24 year.
You know, I'm successful. I don't have money in the
(10:52):
account but we have something that want to eat and we are
managing to pay our bills. So I can't find no job in the
UK. The only job I can get in the UK
to do cleaning job. But because if you don't go to
school, which job are you going to do?
Which job are they going to offer you?
(11:12):
It's only cleaning job. So that lack of education at the
start put a barrier for the restof your life.
Yes. So that's when you turn to
yourself and you're like, I haveto make this.
I have to do this. I have to make this one work.
In some ways it forces you to becreative.
(11:33):
Oh yes. To be honest.
What was that machine that just went on?
It's the the freezer. Ah, OK, OK, OK, OK.
It was just. It was.
Just we go off and we start again, maybe for 10-15 minutes
and it. Goes so you've got boys and
(11:55):
girls. When I have I have one boy.
And two girls. 2 girls. And you're definitely getting
them educated. Oh yes, Oh yes, they are doing
well because the other one is going to university, yes, so the
other one is doing GCSE. The other boy, now his biggest
25 year, thanks be to God anyway.
(12:32):
When I have the visa to come here, because when my dad died
back home and my brother bring me here, my elder brother, I was
talking to myself when I have the visa, so good.
Now I'm coming to England. What am I coming to do to
England? I don't know how to read and
write. How am I going to make it?
Was it your choice to come here?Did you want to come here?
(12:53):
Or I want to come here, of course, to live better life, you
know. But I was thinking to myself,
what am I coming to do here? I didn't go to school, you know,
so. So the hairdressing then you had
children, the children stopped the hairdressing because they
(13:13):
ran around too much and then andthen this or is there anything
else in between? This one.
That's three different jobs, yes.
Go 24 year. That's quite a progression.
I'm telling you. And how do you feel in yourself?
(13:35):
Do you feel that? Do you feel confident in in how
your life is going now I. Feel comfortable to be honest.
Confidence. I don't know how to read and
write. Still.
Well, I was going to because of the poverty where I came from.
(13:55):
It's just too much for me. I was going my brother tried to
put me adult education. I was doing it maybe for one
year. I can't able to call because of
the I have that. I'm thinking I have to, if I
didn't sit down in this shop to look for customer, how am I
going to pay the shop rent? I'm going to lose the shop and
if I go to the college, I stayedthere and 23 hours every day,
(14:19):
I'm going to lose my customer. How am I going to pay the bills
at home? How am I going to give my
children money? You know what, let me just leave
this one and focus here. You know, even if you call the
Universal Credit for them to help me, they will say, oh, do
online go this one, go this one.I don't know how to do this.
Who is going to do it for me? Nobody.
(14:41):
My husband is he know how to read and write, but he's not
that etiquette, you know, like he know how to do things like
you know, so it's just too much.That's why just we just stay
away. Whatever my husband is working
as a security, you know, so we every month we just put together
pay the house went pay the council tax bills.
(15:01):
We manage our life, whatever little we have, we eat that one.
That is the way we are living our lives.
Keep it simple. I'm telling you because too much
hassle when you go to them, theywill say, oh, every month you
have to report how much money did you make today, How much
money did you make from the 15 to this 15.
You have to write it down. You have to I can't they can't
(15:22):
understand. It's not everybody know how to
use computer, you know. So that is the way we are living
our life. Thanks me to Allah now that you
when they are growing up only tohear more the other one is going
to university. So I'm telling you, I fight it
in England. I said this job I have to hold
(15:43):
that one. This is the only things I have
here to do so I have to fight. I'm telling you it's not easy
for me. It's not easy.
What a thanks be to good to be honest.
Well, you sound very determined.Oh, yes, you've made a success.
Oh, yes, of getting this far. Yes.
And every step of the way it must give you greater
(16:05):
confidence. Yes, business.
I know how to do business to be honest.
You don't need to learn. Learn to read and write.
I don't. Need to go to school, go and
educate how to do this. If you give me £5 now, in one
more time I'm going to give you 15 lbs to be honest.
OK, now I want to know the secrets.
(16:30):
I want you to tell me how to be good at business.
What's What's the basics of goodbusiness?
Let me tell you something, the time I open this shop, if I
should have have a little bit like 5000 lbs just for me to
start this time I'm telling you I can't turn this one to offline
symbol. I'm telling you to come here.
(16:52):
You can't have space space to sit down.
You're saying you would get so much stuff in because because
you would be so successful. Oh.
Yes. The time I have this shop, if I
have £5000 to start my business,this time if you come here, you
just come and buy and go back. There's no space.
You can have space. It would be crowded with oh.
(17:13):
Yes. So what is the OK, so, so we,
we're basically, if, if you're running a store like this, which
sells food, we're basically talking about trade, aren't we?
We're talking about buying at 1 price, selling at another price,
yes, but some other skills also.It's not as just as simple as
that. What's your top profit in here?
What, what are the, what are what are the expensive stuff
(17:33):
where you make a, a good profit?Like I see some things here are
3 lbs, one pound, £53.50. There's something there for 10
lbs. So there's, you know, it's all
kind of like under a 10 lbs, is it?
Well, let me tell you something,all this one is just decoration.
You don't have too much profits,you can't make much, especially
(17:55):
now things are so expensive. They take 1000 LB.
Go to 1 E the warehouse, go and buy stuff, put them maybe
sometimes you just make 5050 P it depend.
How many customers are you with CBD?
So it's you can. Have 5050 P.
So it's it's small margins, but it's the amount of people who
(18:16):
come in who makes a difference. Good.
How do you get them in? How?
Do we get them because like me here, it's only three or four in
those the markets? When you say just say that
again, it's. We are from Sierra Leone.
It's only two 2 Sierra Leone shop here and the other ladies 3
(18:36):
outside. We have a store outside.
So there's three stores here that sell stuff from Sierra
Leone. Oleos.
Yeah, and you know each other. Well, of course, yeah.
We came from the same country. And you compete against each
other or you're. We don't compete anyway and also
work together. If they ask for something.
If I don't have it, I can send them to the other lady here.
(18:57):
So you're helping? Oh yes, each other.
It's kind of. Supported something.
If they ask something there, shedon't have that one.
She can send the customers here.We work together as a team.
That's good business. Oh, yeah.
And you, you have a gentleman here also working here.
He's my husband, brother. Right.
(19:19):
Yeah, your brother-in-law. Yes, my brother-in-law.
And she stay. In Birmingham he just come last
week, he's going back on Friday.Do you have employees or is it
just? Your shop, so let me I can
manage the shop. Only me.
And you can manage it fine on your own.
I can manage the car, car affordto pay.
That is the problem. So you can't afford somebody
(19:40):
else? Yeah, we call the shop.
I pay £400 a week, £1600 a month.
OK. For Markley Council.
That's quite a lot. It's a lot here.
And that's just for the premises.
Just. So you've got to cover that.
(20:00):
Oh yeah. And then bills.
And then after that, profit. Oh yes.
Repeat customers are important. Very important, Very important.
So you've got to keep the same people coming.
Use Of course, this is food theyhave to eat every time.
And yeah, everyone's looking fora deal.
(20:21):
Everyone's looking for a smallerprice.
Everyone you know, food is expensive.
Everyone's struggling. Oh yes, everybody's struggling.
So you can't give people, you can't give even your regular
customers a good deal every. Time, we can't give deal.
That is the price, yeah. If you used to buy four or five,
you can cut it to two. It's the same price, Yeah.
(20:43):
We can't give no deal because sometimes we only make 5050 bit,
so there's no deal. Tell us about the market we are
in. What kind of market is this?
What's around your shop here? It's a good market to be honest.
Dusty market used to be busy, but now people don't have money
(21:04):
to spend a lot like before. So the whole market has seen a
difference. Yeah, and #1 the parking space,
because a lot of people, they are not coming inside the market
because of the parking. We've been reporting that one to
Hackney Council. They don't listen to us because
of the parking space. Can you imagine if we want to go
to toilet, we have to go to McDonald, we'll go to the
(21:24):
shopping centre. There's no toilets.
No toilets in the whole. Market, no toilets.
Well, like me, I have to stay here and manage because this is
the only place I'm making my money to give my achievement to
eat. My goodness.
There's no toilets. Can you imagine, England?
I want to go to toilet now we leave somebody here.
Go and look, maybe McDonald or in the shopping centre and they
(21:48):
are collecting this type of rentevery week.
Can you imagine? Could you put a toilet in here?
Or is it not? It's not plastic.
I don't know because that is theway they do it.
If I if we put toilet here and it's a foodstuff, it doesn't
work. You can't put toilet here.
You are selling food here. It doesn't work.
(22:15):
How do you divide off the stressof making money from home life?
Are you able to when you go home, are you able to to not
think about work? Or is work always with you even
when you're with your children trying to help them out with
their homework or whatever or cooking food?
Like can you separate? Or when you run your own
(22:35):
business like this, is it alwaysin your head?
It's always, it's always on my head.
Always. So last thing at night, first
thing in the morning. Of course I just have to think
about this business, but even sometimes I'm not feeling well.
I just have to come. That is the that is the problem.
You to be self-employed. I'm telling you it's not easy.
(22:57):
You have advantage and disadvantage.
What are the advantages? Because the advantage now when
you can open at any time you want to open, it's your own
business. But like when you are working
now, you can't just take the offtoday, tomorrow the off he will
lose the job, you know, and the disadvantage like me now if I
(23:22):
want to travel like the last time I was there on February to
my counter, I go and see my mom,my husband have to take because
I have two weeks holiday. Just have to take that holiday.
Don't even rest at home. Come and stay here in the shop
for me to go. Oh my goodness.
So. So.
I can't able to close the shop for me to go.
So you for you to go and see your elderly mother, your
husband has to take leave from his work good and work here.
(23:45):
Yes. That's hard.
Yeah, because I can't able to close the shop for two weeks or
three weeks for me to go. How much money am I going to pay
for that three weeks? I'm going to pay 1200 per to the
landlord. They don't care if I travel or
not, I have to pay them. They don't care if I make money
or not, I have to pay them. So you see, to be self-employed
(24:05):
is not easy. It's not easy to be honest.
And how is your mother? It's OK.
The family good yes. How do you keep in contact with
them Is it like daily WhatsApp? I just.
Call them on WhatsApp. Right.
Just a chat. Yeah.
(24:27):
How often do you speak? Every day I speak to my mom.
Sorry, every day I speak to my Mama.
Let me show you. Let me show you my mum when I
went to February. You're just getting out your
phone. You're just kidding.
(24:48):
I'm just saying you're just getting out your phone.
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. It's got more cracks on it than
my phone. Yeah, well I have to change the
the. Oh, she looks wonderful.
She has a kind face and she has she has a scarf over her head.
(25:15):
She's so. Happy and the two of you are
together in that video just chatting.
And is she proud of you? What does she think of you being
here? Very proud of me, yeah.
(25:37):
You have you have brothers and sisters.
Yes, what? We are three.
We are here with three of us. My elder brother is here and the
other one is older than me is here.
So two brothers. You're the only sister, yes.
Do you look after them or do they look after you?
I don't look after they, they don't look after me.
(25:57):
This is Londo. Yeah.
Explain a bit further. Then they check on me.
Are you OK? How is this family?
This and that? You know, this country, nobody
give money and the money's not enough.
I don't blame them. I don't blame them.
My elder brother's lawyer, the other one is working in the
hospital, so he's living in me thinking.
(26:21):
So everyone's living their lives.
Oh, yeah, you're in contact. You're there.
You're there if you need to support each other.
Like which supports. Like help me I'm I have a
problem and I need to talk to myfamily.
Please, please, please. I can't blame them because they
have their own bills, they have their family.
I can't blame them. I can't even call them to ask
(26:43):
them to say oh please help me, Ihave problem come and help me
for money. No way.
They have their own family, theyhave their own problem.
They call me, they check on me, I call them, I check on them,
but I don't tell them my problemfor money.
Please Google me money. I can't do that.
I can't take my problem. I take my problem, give it to
them. I can't do that and I have to
(27:06):
use my head. It's my daughter.
They are laughing at me. This is my daughter.
How are you doing? So they come from school.
Yes, put me on the Internet, yousee.
(27:27):
That's your daughter, say that'sfine.
You do it your thing every time.Mommy, why do you do?
This how you doing? I'm talking to your mum for a
podcast where we just talk to everyday people about their
lives. Yeah, she's been talking about
you guys. Yeah, yeah.
It's all, it's all good, it's all positive.
I. Know I'm in sleepy as well,
(27:56):
thank you. So customers just got customers
just come in. Yeah.
What was she buying? She was, she was on the phone
and somebody was. What's that?
It's food. OK, like you, you put water with
(28:17):
it. What is it?
I have to cook that one. Cook it with meat, fish, hot
pepper on your palm oil. We can eat it with rice or you
eat it with fish. Fufu is is like like a Stew.
This cassava. A fufu is cassava.
Yeah, yeah. You're deciding not to take that
(28:46):
call. You've just raised your your
eyes to the heavens. That's not something you want to
talk talk to now. These jars here.
What is this? To me it looks like.
This one is coconut oil from Sierra Leone.
OK. This one is palm oil from
(29:06):
civilian. This one you know.
Nice font to wash the dishes. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So, so the coconut oil is clear,is clear in a jar.
The Parm oil is in a plastic container and then you've got
dried goods here. Which one?
These ones are all dried goods. Well, this one is Maggie.
It's the sauce I was telling youabout.
You use it when you're cooking. Use that one.
(29:27):
We use that one to cook. And what else?
Got tins? Yeah, tins and the weaker, what
are that one? What are all these bags here?
Fruits. Fruit.
Yes. What kind of What dried fruit
it's? Dried fruit.
And then what do you do with it?You just mix it and put a little
bit of sugar and lamb and drink it.
(29:48):
It's very good, yes, and. Then on this side you've got
like cans of drink, bottles of drink, yes.
And towards the front you've gotthe powdered milk, the coconut
milk, yes. And these are all the spices
here, yes. And your kids, are they good at
cooking? Oh yes.
(30:10):
You taught them. Yeah, I'm teaching them.
There's kind of some smiles fromthe back of the I.
Know they look like. The thing is, nobody can cook
like their mum. Yes, I've tried to cook like my
mum. I can't do it, I know.
May I ask you about just your mum and her business here?
You've just come back from school, Yeah.
(30:32):
Do you, do you sometimes help out here?
What do you think of your mom and and the business that she
runs here? I.
Think she's really hard working.We've been in Boston since I was
born, so she's really hard working.
She's always here, bank holidays, Christmas, anytime
(30:53):
she's here. I do help out sometimes,
especially during the summer if she pays me.
But. Like a little part time job.
Yeah, I feel like she's really excellent.
This is what she loves doing. So I love it.
Yeah, I love my business. Oh, that's good.
Oh yes, I love it. Yeah, she meets new people.
(31:15):
She makes new connections. She's really like, she's really
nice. Like, she helps out a lot of
people, like that guy over there, like a little quick job,
gets money. Like she's really helpful.
She's nice, Yeah. It's great that you love your
job. So many people don't love their.
Job I love my. Job.
But even though all the struggles we've talked about.
(31:36):
That's actually already even if I don't make money, I feel
happy. I'm telling you, I love my job.
What? Because it's dealing with
people? Because.
Because I see people every day. I can't see it.
That's all. I've been stressing a lot of
people there in the hospital, which meant that hell, you know.
So when I come here, I feel happy, I'm telling you.
(31:59):
Even talking to people. You don't even talking to you
now make me I feel good, of course.
Makes me feel good too. Yes, you feel good.
You see, it's better than I stayat home doing nothing, you know
so. And we, we don't know each
other, but we've had a good chat, yes.
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