February 4, 2025 • 30 mins
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In Episode 2 of the Pickleball and Partnership Podcast, Charlotte and her husband Neil reflect on how the sport of Pickleball has helped them reconnect and strengthen their 27-year marriage after enduring a stressful long-distance period in their marriage and other various challenges. They discuss how learning and playing Pickleball has improved their communication, trust, and teamwork both on and off the court. Key topics include overcoming initial hesitations, the importance of encouragement over criticism, the benefits of defined but flexible roles, and applying lessons from Pickleball to daily life. The episode highlights the transformative power of shared activities in fostering deeper connections.
00:00 Introduction to Pickleball and Partnership
00:55 Strengthening Relationships Through Pickleball
02:06 Neil's Perspective on Pickleball
02:25 Early Pickleball Experiences
05:42 Challenges and Long-Distance Relationship
09:23 Learning Teamwork and Trust
12:36 Communication and Encouragement
16:16 Applying Pickleball Lessons to Life
23:37 Celebrating Wins and Community
27:49 Conclusion and Key Takeaways
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Music: Purple Planet Music
Thanks to Purple Planet Music for Pickleball & Partnership Intro and Outro music Purple Planet Music is a collection of music written and performed by Chris Martyn and Geoff Harvey.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:10):
This is the Pickleball andPartnership Podcast, the place
to talk about building betterconnections with your partner,
learning how to communicate witheach other, and how to inject
fun into your relationship allthrough the game of pickleball.
If that sounds like your cup oftea, pull up a chair, grab your
(00:31):
paddle, and join me, your host,Charlotte Jukes for pickleball
and partnership.
Welcome to this week's episodeof the Pickleball and
Partnership podcast.
Welcome to episode two.
(00:51):
Thank you for joining me.
I'm really excited to be hereagain.
I wanted to continue On fromlast week's episode and just
chat more about how playingpickleball has strengthened my
relationship with Neil.
So Neil and I have known eachother for over 30 years.
(01:12):
We've actually been married for27 or we're coming up to 28
years, in a couple of months.
And I wanted to.
share more of the journey of howwe discovered pickleball, how I
overcame my initial hesitationof playing the sport, and how it
(01:33):
actually became a pivotal um,Activity that helped Neil and I
to reconnect how it reallyhelped strengthen our marriage,
our relationship.
So I want to dive into some ofthe challenges that we
encountered of a period of timewhere we endured a long distance
(01:54):
relationship, where we struggledto define individual roles and
how pickleball actually requiredus to communicate and trust each
other effectively.
So this week I am joined by myhusband, Neil.
So welcome, Neil.
Hey.
How you doing?
(02:14):
I'm good.
How are you?
Yeah, good.
So tell our listeners why youcame up with this crazy idea of
wanting us to learn Pickleball.
Okay.
Thanks Charlotte.
it's a good question and I don'treally have a great answer.
Why did I want to do it?
Why did I want to do it?
You saw it in Arizona.
(02:34):
And it looked goofy enough to befun.
from a tennis badminton and pingpong background, uh, lots of
racket sports in my past.
I think it kind of led me tothink that doing something in
racket sports again would be agood move for us.
Uh, we just renovated a housetogether and I thought one way
that we could do more thingstogether was maybe head down
(02:57):
this pickleball path.
I'd seen it played down inArizona and thought it was goofy
enough that we could get intoit.
For years we would watch themand not even really know what
they were playing.
Right, right.
And you said it was too old andslow for you.
Yeah.
So anyway, I convinced you inthe end to go and take a couple
of courses.
Uh, the people in Arizona seemedlike they had a lot of fun
(03:19):
goofing around and ended up inthe pub after, which seemed like
something I could get down with.
Mm-Hmm.
So, Yeah, we headed down thatroad of Pickleball.
I remember when we first met, wemet in the June and that new
year, we went away toBournemouth.
Do you remember?
We were living in England at thetime.
And we went to, to Bournemouthfor some reason, I can't even
(03:42):
remember.
And, ended up staying in thishotel and there was a ping pong
table tennis table in thebasement.
And I remember playing hours oftable tennis.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I remember that.
Those good times.
Yeah.
We had, we, we played ping ponga lot.
I suppose pickleball is likeping pong really.
It's just supersized ping pong.
(04:02):
That's exactly what it is.
Yeah.
and you, you tried to get meinto golf.
I remember, in fact, it's afunny story because it was my
40th birthday and you were soexcited.
And you said, come with me, I'vegot your present.
And you led me towards thegarage door.
And I'm like, Oh my gosh, he'sbought me a car.
(04:24):
I'm having a sports car and youopen the door to the garage and
there were these set of golfclubs and I was like, Oh crap.
You're welcome.
Yeah.
And I never really, I've notreally got into golf, but you
went to play golf by yourself.
But pickleball.
Was something you wanted both ofus to play, right?
(04:45):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Golf's my thing, but pickleballis our thing.
Yeah.
I was quite insistent that wetake lessons to start with.
I thought if we're going to playthis game, we need to know, I
needed to know how to play thegame properly.
I wanted to know the rules.
And anyway, so I had signed usup in our community at the local
(05:08):
tennis courts.
I signed us up for, a series ofsix lessons.
And that's where we learned.
do you remember that firstlesson?
You don't, not really.
I remember showing up and theygave us a couple of goofy
paddles that were like kidstoys.
That was pretty much all Iremember and I'm feeling pretty
uncomfortable.
(05:28):
That was about it.
Yeah.
And the ball was like plastic.
Yeah.
The plastic hole, whiffle ball,kind of goofy.
I actually thought that was thepractice ball.
I didn't know that was the realball.
Right.
but I think it, it came at agood time in our lives really,
because like you say, and Ithink I'd mentioned last week
(05:50):
that we had just completed thishuge renovation and we had sold
that house and we were actuallyliving in a rental at the time.
But I think just to sort of givesome context, prior to doing
that, huge renovation, whichhonestly, to this day, I don't
know how we managed to getthrough that together.
(06:11):
But anyway, that's another storyprior to that.
You'd actually been working outof town for 10 years.
And, um, I was left at home.
And the children were small.
They were, you know, ouryoungest was five and the girls
were seven and nine or eight and10, something like that.
(06:32):
And, it was only going to be fora year or two anyway, that
turned into 10 years, but Iremember being so busy with
everything.
Um, you would go away for sortof three weeks at a time.
And I was looking after thesethree young children.
I was working part time as a, asa nurse, but it was evenings.
(06:56):
So I could look after thechildren during the day.
And then I had to find ababysitter for the evening time,
which was really tough.
I was, looking after the house,cooking all the meals, cleaning,
driving them around.
And.
Of course, we'd moved to Canadain 2000, and we had no family
(07:18):
here.
So it wasn't even as though, Ihad any help with that.
And I think that was a reallydifficult time in our lives.
My mom and dad had passed away.
They weren't available anyway.
and I think, you know, when Ilook back to growing up as well,
it was definitely a weakness ifyou asked for help, you know, I
(07:43):
was definitely taught that youjust got on with things.
You did it all yourself.
And I, I think, that was a hardtime for me because I was doing
everything.
And then you would come home, onyour leave, on your days off,
and we really weren't jibing.
(08:03):
Right.
It's tough.
Distance relationships aretough.
So we had to try and findsomething to pull us back
together in some way.
And this was, uh, this was thefirst thing that had really come
up to make that happen.
so I thought we'd kind of go forit and do what we could to make
it, make a go of it and pullourself a relationship out of
what we got left and, and itworked.
(08:24):
Yeah, it seemed to work.
You make it sound like we werehanging on by a thread.
Well, that's pretty much how itwas.
Yeah.
Well, I think.
I think it was definitely a wayto bring us back together, but I
don't think either of usrealized how far apart we'd
grown.
But looking back now, wedefinitely, we'd found our own
(08:45):
individual roles separately fromeach other.
And I think we both found itvery difficult to ask for help.
Yeah.
And it was tough for me to getback into, back into the home as
well and take the role again,the role that I left.
For me, it was really tough tobe able to find a lead role
again.
And I felt like I was just, inthe way.
(09:08):
That's what I felt.
I was in the way when I wasback.
So this was a way back into thehome and, uh, to kind of at
least put herself on a, on alevel playing field rather than
just being the out of town guythat came back.
Yeah, a way to reconnect again.
Yeah.
So I think I remember, and itcertainly still happens now, but
(09:29):
definitely more so when we firstgot on the court together, we
were playing our own game.
Right?
I remember thinking, Oh my gosh,if you would just get out of the
way, I could, I could take theshot.
Right.
There was no trust.
Yeah, exactly.
(09:49):
Yeah.
You were playing your game.
I was playing my game.
Obviously mine was better.
Obviously.
But here's the game ofpickleball where you absolutely
have to, you have to worktogether.
Yeah.
You have to move together.
Right.
you have to, you know, we'relearning to stand that same,
(10:11):
what is it they, they say likethat noodle length apart to
stand that, that distance apart.
And then, so when one goesright, the other goes right.
When one goes left, the othergoes left.
To dance.
You'd have to do the dance.
Right.
Yeah.
And we weren't very good atthat.
Were we?
No, you weren't.
(10:32):
Luckily I pulled us together.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
On the court and at home.
I think, you know, we, we werejust so used to, to doing our
own thing and relying onourselves and not being able to
ask the other one for help.
Because I think for me, it wasvery much like, if I don't prove
(10:52):
to you that I've been managingthis by myself, then I'm not the
person that you married.
Right.
Or I'm not a good enough personto, to be in this marriage.
So.
You know, you deal with whatlife gives you, you play with
the cards that you're dealt.
(11:14):
So you going away and workingout of town and there were
benefits to that for sure.
The money was good.
Right.
but I definitely felt like I hadsomething to prove to you when
you came back, that look, I'mmanaging this, I'm pulling
through, I'm managing the kids,I'm managing the house, I'm
(11:35):
managing my job.
And it was exhausting.
Oh my gosh, for both of us,right?
Yeah.
I'm glad we did it, but I'm gladit's gone.
You know, I'm glad that page hasturned now.
Yeah.
And I don't think we realized.
that as much as when we got onthe court and realized that we
were playing our individualgame.
(11:57):
And at some point we realizedthis and I think you got
frustrated with me.
Yeah.
Jumping in and I do like topoach.
Yeah.
Right, but we realized thatactually if we work together as
a team and relied on each other.
Yeah.
We were pretty successful.
(12:17):
Yeah.
We could be really successful.
So I'm thinking of thattournament actually early on
last year.
It was coming into the outdoorseason.
So it must've been like the endof April, 2024.
It was that first outdoortournament of the year.
And, I know this will come upagain because I know we're going
(12:39):
to talk about communication alot, but that particular day was
so windy.
Do you remember that?
Yeah.
yeah.
Willow Ridge.
Yeah.
The members, we had to sticktogether.
We had to rely on each other.
Yeah.
I get it.
I remember the wind and we talkconstantly saying the winds from
the left or the winds from theright, depending on how the wind
(13:01):
was changing.
And uh, it put us in a placethat, uh, I think we won it.
Did we win it?
No, we silver.
How did we get silver?
I think we got silver.
Yeah.
But we did really well against apretty good, a pretty good
lineup.
Hmm.
And it was because we weretalking and it was because we
were moving together and we wereso aware of what the other
(13:22):
person was doing.
Yeah.
Um, we really were, we weretrusting each other.
Really on a different level,weren't we?
And relying on each other, a lotmore communication.
And it helped in a massive way.
Yeah.
It makes me think of, we'veplayed opponents as well.
We've played, very strongopponents who, you know, whether
(13:45):
it's.
Friendly games, you know, I sayfriendly in adverted commas or
whether it's tournaments, butwe've played very strong
opponents who look for thatweaker player.
And I think, as a woman, I'vedefinitely felt this, that
immediately some opponents willlook at the female on the team,
(14:08):
they'll look at me, and assumethat I am the weaker player, and
that you are the strongerplayer.
Because you look stronger, youare taller, you are more
muscular, you look like thestronger player.
Charlotte J (14:26):
And for that reason, every shot will be
directed at me.
I definitely feel picked on bythe opponents.
And I think there was a lot oflearning there for me as well,
because I used to get superfrustrated and, and I know I
lost my shit a few times.
And it really took.
(14:47):
for me to one, be aware of that.
And then secondly, ask for help,right?
I mean, that's what we'retalking about here is asking for
help and that it's not, it's notweakness.
It's okay.
So I really had to talk tomyself and say, Okay, if we're
going to get through this, it'sno good.
(15:07):
If they're going to keep firingevery shot at me, there's no way
I can keep this up.
And so I had to relax and, askyou for help and trust you and
say, Hey, will you take overthree quarters of the court or
will you switch sides with me?
or maybe it was a case of, youknow, if they started lobbying.
(15:33):
I'd say you're going to have torun back for the loss.
Yeah, give you a chance to takea breather, right?
Yeah, I'll get it.
Yeah.
And then for me to, to stay inmy zone, which I know I'm not
very good at sometimes, becauseI do like to poach.
Take, take time out.
That's one of the things that wedid.
That's the first time we evertook a tournament and we didn't
(15:54):
know there was timeouts.
The first time that we ever tooka timeout was that tournament.
And that kind of changed ourmentality.
Yeah.
we started to lose and we took atimeout and we came back from it
because we just took a time to acouple of seconds to focus.
Yeah, actually, you know what,that makes me think of something
that we started to do at home aswell.
(16:16):
Because I know when we get intothat sort of cycle of blaming
or, thinking that the otherperson doesn't have our back, is
just to take, take that time outor, have, something like a
strategy huddle and say, okay,let's just step away and breathe
(16:39):
and reset.
Yeah.
Right.
So, I mean, I think that'shelped us a lot too at home.
Yeah.
If you start to think that, uh,somebody is working in your best
interest rather than out ofmalice, then the whole mentality
changes.
And if you know, you're workingin the same direction, it's so
(17:00):
easy to recover from it.
Yeah.
If you know that you have ashared end goal, right?
Yeah.
another thing we started doing,was calling out, like, you know,
like you said earlier,communicating on the court, but
just calling out the shots, ifyou could see them coming, you
know, mine, yours, leave it,leave it.
(17:22):
It's out.
Exactly.
Yeah.
Exactly.
And seeing that that was, that'sa very positive thing.
It's not, you know, it's not acriticism.
There's no need to get defensiveabout it.
Right.
I think the trust comes backbecause pickleball is such a
fast moving game.
Once, uh, once the rallies startthat you don't have time to
(17:42):
think you have to react.
And if somebody calls somethinglike an out or a leave or a mine
or whatever it is.
You have to go with it.
You have to have full trust.
And I think that's why it'shelped us so much.
Yeah, absolutely.
Cause I mean, that's, that'swhat it's like at home too,
right?
Sometimes, especially, you know,evenings after work.
(18:04):
And the children are grown upnow, they're adults, but still.
Semi adults.
But still, you know, I mean,it's busy and when they're all
at home and especially weekendsare busy and a lot's going on
and I think, you know, you and Iare a lot better at making that
eye contact, looking at eachother across the room and
(18:26):
signaling each other, Hey,timeout and taking a reset and
just re evaluating everythingthat's going on.
Yeah.
A twitch of an eyebrow is all ittakes sometimes.
Stops us going down that, thatrabbit hole, right.
Of, defensiveness or feelinglike, you know, I've got to do
it all again, Yeah, we are ateam and we can rely on each
(18:50):
other.
was going to say encouragementas well.
That's one of the bigger ones.
Um, just letting each other knowthat you've got each other's
back, whether it was good or itwas bad, encouragement wins
every time.
Yeah, definitely.
I know when I felt criticized onthe court, I don't play well
(19:11):
after that, but even if I'vemissed a shot, you know, you're
really good at saying, good tryor, oh my gosh, I thought that
was going out or, It's okay.
Reset.
We've got the next one, and justhaving those words of
encouragement is huge, isn't it?
Yeah.
Keep it fun.
I think that's the big one.
Keep it fun.
(19:31):
Keep it light.
It's just pick a ball.
There's another game.
You know, just like life reallythe day tomorrow, nothing you
can do.
You just got to get through thisone.
Don't look back.
Just keep looking forward.
Yeah.
It's hard though, because Ithink we're both competitive and
I think, that has definitelyshown itself in our relationship
too.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I respond really well topositive encouragement.
(19:55):
I know that about myself.
Um, and probably looking back,that wasn't something that I was
able to, to share as much in ourrelationship.
And I think, we become theparents that, you know, our
parents have modeled for us.
And I definitely didn't get theencouragement I needed growing
(20:16):
up.
So.
As crazy as that sounds, it washard for me to be that
encouraging on the court.
But when I received it and wasable to receive it from you and
other people I've played withsome amazing women.
and I think when we're allencouraging each other, it
definitely makes it all a bitmore exciting and a bit more
(20:37):
positive.
You walk away from a courtthinking it was a good
experience than an ordeal.
Even if you lose, it can begood.
Yeah.
So just thinking about, all,those things that we learned
about, teamwork and, and playingtogether and, playing pickleball
(20:57):
together on the court.
I think just to sort ofsummarize some of that into our
relationship and into home life,we.
We work so much better togetherwhen we are able to define our
individual roles.
So the same as, as playingtogether on the court, if each
(21:19):
one of us knows, okay, my job isto Cook dinner or whatever it
is, and your job is to maintainthe vehicles maybe or something
like that.
But to have very clear definedroles on and off the court, and
I'm thinking more so at home nowreally does help.
(21:40):
But on top of that is not onlyhaving those clearly defined
roles, but having someflexibility with those roles as
well.
So, you know, if I say, Oh, I'vecooked dinner five times this
week.
I'd like a break tomorrow.
it's your turn to cook to beable to.
Right.
And you can change the oil onthe car.
(22:01):
No problem.
I can take it to a man who knowshow to do that.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
And then the, the timeouts thatwe were talking about on the
court, having that time out athome to just allow the, the
tension to subside, just to beable to take a pause and take
(22:23):
some breaths.
And reset.
I mean, gosh, how many times do,do we have to reset on the
court?
Constant.
Yeah.
Every point.
Every point.
Focus.
Yeah.
Right.
Cause otherwise you just get inyour head and.
And it's very hard.
It's hard for me to get out ofmy head once I'm in it.
So I think it's taught me quitea few things about self control
(22:46):
as well.
playing pickleball, just whenyou get beaten or you're in the
process of being beaten oryou're losing a point that You
didn't think you should have toreset without becoming upset.
That's tough, but man, I'velearned a lot of that since
we've been in this.
Yeah.
And then just encouraging eachother at home.
Right.
It's, it's that.
A silly little thing, likefolding the laundry and putting
(23:10):
it away a thank you, or, uh, youknow, you did a great job go
such a long way.
You know, part of it as well isthe community, the pickable
community, everybody's likeminded and everybody enjoys it.
You know, there's nobody goesthere, trying to make somebody
else's life miserable, thateverybody does it for, to keep
(23:31):
themselves happy, sociable, andit's a generally good feeling.
Mm hmm yeah.
And I think it's reallyimportant to, as well as the,
the words of encouragement is tocelebrate each other's wins as
well.
You know, it's life is toughsometimes and you leave the
house in the morning and go towork and, it's not always easy.
(23:55):
And I think being able tocelebrate.
Our own wins, but each other'sas well, yeah.
I mean, you get the kids gettingthrough different years at
university or getting throughdifferent courses or, you know,
buying a new car or justbecoming aware of something else
or a new job, or there's lots ofwins, there's lots of small
(24:18):
wins.
And I think it makes you.
Understand that those things arethe big things in life.
All these small things are bigthings.
And, um, yeah, you've got totake the time to make sure that
the kids feel like they've beennoticed.
Acknowledged.
Yeah.
So it's taking the time to makethe kids feel like they've been
acknowledged for their effortsand their dedication and the
(24:40):
hard work they've put in.
So I've learned a lot of thatfrom pickleball as well.
I mean, we all do these things.
We all do these fantastic thingsin life.
But to, uh, to actually take thetime to,, make the kids feel
special because of that is, Ithink it's come from Pickleball
more than anywhere else.
Yeah I think another big thing,that I, I perhaps became more
(25:02):
aware of on the Pickleball courtwas each other's body language.
especially when you're in themiddle of a game, you can see
when your partner is feeling abit deflated, maybe, for
whatever reason, if you've hitthe net a couple of times for a
couple of shots and I can seethat you're getting frustrated,
(25:22):
you're not verbalizing that tome.
but definitely, I can see yourbody language that you're
feeling a bit defeated.
And I think that's especially.
Uh, an important time to step inand offer some encouragement or
perhaps, take a time out andreset.
But I think at home as well,just being aware, being more, I
(25:45):
know it's a buzzword right now,but being more mindful of, how
you are when you walk in thedoor from work, and just being
aware.
Being cognizant of whether, youknow, it appears you've had a
good day or perhaps, you've hada long frustrating day, or if
you didn't sleep the nightbefore, you're definitely tired.
(26:05):
And I think just being mindfulof that, not only helps us in
our play on the court, But thatdefinitely helps at home because
you know, then to give the otherperson a little bit more leeway,
right?
A little bit more space.
Or not.
Or not.
Or the opposite.
Or the opposite.
Yeah.
(26:25):
Maybe you need me to movecloser, and not move away.
I suppose the big one really forus is we've tried to make it
fun.
Whether we are in a great placewith each other when we go to
Pickleball or we are not in agreat place, we might not be as,
as good as it looks when we walkonto that court, but it's
basically, we say showtime.
(26:46):
And it is what it is.
We just deal with it.
We move forward.
And when we come off the court,it's usually a hug and we move
forward and we go again.
It's a pretty good reset for us.
It's, it's quite fun.
Actually.
I do enjoy the drives home.
I mean, like you say, sometimesthe drive there is a little
tense for whatever reason, butafterwards we've always got so
(27:08):
much to say, haven't we?
About the games or the pointsor.
Win or lose.
It's always a win.
Yeah.
And I think we've brought thatback into our relationship too.
We're finding, more fun doingother things together.
we regularly walk the dogtogether.
there's so many other thingsthat, we can do together cooking
(27:28):
together, that regular datenight.
I mean, I even golf together nowand again, we do, we do golf
together now and again.
And I am finding more fun in it,but especially when we go with
another couple, but yeah, it'sall about fun.
yeah.
We've done most of the work now.
Let's keep it fun.
definitely pickleball has helpedus with that.
(27:50):
Thank you for listening toepisode one of the Pickleball
and Partnership podcast.
Here are the key points andtakeaways from today's episode.
1.
Shared activities fosterconnection.
Learning Pickleball became a funand meaningful way for us to
spend time together, helping usto rediscover our partnership
(28:12):
after years of navigatingseparate roles in our marriage.
.Teamwork is a game changer.
Success on the Pickleball Courtrequires clear communication,
trust, and mutual reliance.
Skills that translate intobetter collaboration and
understanding at home.
(28:32):
3.
Overcoming challenges together.
From navigating windytournaments to facing
frustrations when targeted asthe weaker player, we have
learned to support and encourageone another, building resilience
and adaptability.
Lessons beyond the court.
(28:53):
Concepts like calling timeouts,defining roles, and staying
flexible with responsibilitieshave helped us to improve our
relationship dynamics and ourdaily life at home.
Encouragement over criticism.
Encouragement is my superpower.
(29:14):
Positive reinforcement duringplay boosted both of our
confidence and our performanceand reminded us to focus on
celebrating effort rather thandwelling on mistakes.
Thanks so much for.
Listening today.
I hope you enjoyed thatconversation as much.
As I did.
Anything mentioned, includinglinks.
(29:36):
Uh, notes and a full episodelist will be over on our
website.
At synergy health.org forwardslash podcast.
In the podcast section.
If you got something.
Out of this episode, be sure tofollow or subscribe.
To pickleball and partnership.
On apple podcasts.
It's.
Spotify or wherever you listen,so that you're notified.
(29:58):
of new and upcoming episodes.
And if you're fine.
Finding value in this podcast, acost-free way to.
To support us is to leave a fivestar review.
It truly.
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This will help more peopleaccess.
Access these real conversations.
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Take a screenshot of thisepisode on your phone.
(30:21):
And share it on social media tagme at.
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If you haven't connected with mepersonally, I would love.
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Thanks again for listening.
I remember, we're all learning,growing and showing.
Up in our own ways.
And that's what matters most.
This is the Pickleball andPartnership Podcast, the place
to talk about building betterconnections with your partner,
learning how to communicate witheach other, and how to inject
fun into your relationship allthrough the game of pickleball.
If that sounds like your cup oftea, pull up a chair, grab your
(00:31):
paddle, and join me, your host,Charlotte Jukes for pickleball
and partnership.
Welcome to this week's episodeof the Pickleball and
Partnership podcast.
Welcome to episode two.
(00:51):
Thank you for joining me.
I'm really excited to be hereagain.
I wanted to continue On fromlast week's episode and just
chat more about how playingpickleball has strengthened my
relationship with Neil.
So Neil and I have known eachother for over 30 years.
(01:12):
We've actually been married for27 or we're coming up to 28
years, in a couple of months.
And I wanted to.
share more of the journey of howwe discovered pickleball, how I
overcame my initial hesitationof playing the sport, and how it
(01:33):
actually became a pivotal um,Activity that helped Neil and I
to reconnect how it reallyhelped strengthen our marriage,
our relationship.
So I want to dive into some ofthe challenges that we
encountered of a period of timewhere we endured a long distance
(01:54):
relationship, where we struggledto define individual roles and
how pickleball actually requiredus to communicate and trust each
other effectively.
So this week I am joined by myhusband, Neil.
So welcome, Neil.
Hey.
How you doing?
(02:14):
I'm good.
How are you?
Yeah, good.
So tell our listeners why youcame up with this crazy idea of
wanting us to learn Pickleball.
Okay.
Thanks Charlotte.
it's a good question and I don'treally have a great answer.
Why did I want to do it?
Why did I want to do it?
You saw it in Arizona.
(02:34):
And it looked goofy enough to befun.
from a tennis badminton and pingpong background, uh, lots of
racket sports in my past.
I think it kind of led me tothink that doing something in
racket sports again would be agood move for us.
Uh, we just renovated a housetogether and I thought one way
that we could do more thingstogether was maybe head down
(02:57):
this pickleball path.
I'd seen it played down inArizona and thought it was goofy
enough that we could get intoit.
For years we would watch themand not even really know what
they were playing.
Right, right.
And you said it was too old andslow for you.
Yeah.
So anyway, I convinced you inthe end to go and take a couple
of courses.
Uh, the people in Arizona seemedlike they had a lot of fun
(03:19):
goofing around and ended up inthe pub after, which seemed like
something I could get down with.
Mm-Hmm.
So, Yeah, we headed down thatroad of Pickleball.
I remember when we first met, wemet in the June and that new
year, we went away toBournemouth.
Do you remember?
We were living in England at thetime.
And we went to, to Bournemouthfor some reason, I can't even
(03:42):
remember.
And, ended up staying in thishotel and there was a ping pong
table tennis table in thebasement.
And I remember playing hours oftable tennis.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I remember that.
Those good times.
Yeah.
We had, we, we played ping ponga lot.
I suppose pickleball is likeping pong really.
It's just supersized ping pong.
(04:02):
That's exactly what it is.
Yeah.
and you, you tried to get meinto golf.
I remember, in fact, it's afunny story because it was my
40th birthday and you were soexcited.
And you said, come with me, I'vegot your present.
And you led me towards thegarage door.
And I'm like, Oh my gosh, he'sbought me a car.
(04:24):
I'm having a sports car and youopen the door to the garage and
there were these set of golfclubs and I was like, Oh crap.
You're welcome.
Yeah.
And I never really, I've notreally got into golf, but you
went to play golf by yourself.
But pickleball.
Was something you wanted both ofus to play, right?
(04:45):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Golf's my thing, but pickleballis our thing.
Yeah.
I was quite insistent that wetake lessons to start with.
I thought if we're going to playthis game, we need to know, I
needed to know how to play thegame properly.
I wanted to know the rules.
And anyway, so I had signed usup in our community at the local
(05:08):
tennis courts.
I signed us up for, a series ofsix lessons.
And that's where we learned.
do you remember that firstlesson?
You don't, not really.
I remember showing up and theygave us a couple of goofy
paddles that were like kidstoys.
That was pretty much all Iremember and I'm feeling pretty
uncomfortable.
(05:28):
That was about it.
Yeah.
And the ball was like plastic.
Yeah.
The plastic hole, whiffle ball,kind of goofy.
I actually thought that was thepractice ball.
I didn't know that was the realball.
Right.
but I think it, it came at agood time in our lives really,
because like you say, and Ithink I'd mentioned last week
(05:50):
that we had just completed thishuge renovation and we had sold
that house and we were actuallyliving in a rental at the time.
But I think just to sort of givesome context, prior to doing
that, huge renovation, whichhonestly, to this day, I don't
know how we managed to getthrough that together.
(06:11):
But anyway, that's another storyprior to that.
You'd actually been working outof town for 10 years.
And, um, I was left at home.
And the children were small.
They were, you know, ouryoungest was five and the girls
were seven and nine or eight and10, something like that.
(06:32):
And, it was only going to be fora year or two anyway, that
turned into 10 years, but Iremember being so busy with
everything.
Um, you would go away for sortof three weeks at a time.
And I was looking after thesethree young children.
I was working part time as a, asa nurse, but it was evenings.
(06:56):
So I could look after thechildren during the day.
And then I had to find ababysitter for the evening time,
which was really tough.
I was, looking after the house,cooking all the meals, cleaning,
driving them around.
And.
Of course, we'd moved to Canadain 2000, and we had no family
(07:18):
here.
So it wasn't even as though, Ihad any help with that.
And I think that was a reallydifficult time in our lives.
My mom and dad had passed away.
They weren't available anyway.
and I think, you know, when Ilook back to growing up as well,
it was definitely a weakness ifyou asked for help, you know, I
(07:43):
was definitely taught that youjust got on with things.
You did it all yourself.
And I, I think, that was a hardtime for me because I was doing
everything.
And then you would come home, onyour leave, on your days off,
and we really weren't jibing.
(08:03):
Right.
It's tough.
Distance relationships aretough.
So we had to try and findsomething to pull us back
together in some way.
And this was, uh, this was thefirst thing that had really come
up to make that happen.
so I thought we'd kind of go forit and do what we could to make
it, make a go of it and pullourself a relationship out of
what we got left and, and itworked.
(08:24):
Yeah, it seemed to work.
You make it sound like we werehanging on by a thread.
Well, that's pretty much how itwas.
Yeah.
Well, I think.
I think it was definitely a wayto bring us back together, but I
don't think either of usrealized how far apart we'd
grown.
But looking back now, wedefinitely, we'd found our own
(08:45):
individual roles separately fromeach other.
And I think we both found itvery difficult to ask for help.
Yeah.
And it was tough for me to getback into, back into the home as
well and take the role again,the role that I left.
For me, it was really tough tobe able to find a lead role
again.
And I felt like I was just, inthe way.
(09:08):
That's what I felt.
I was in the way when I wasback.
So this was a way back into thehome and, uh, to kind of at
least put herself on a, on alevel playing field rather than
just being the out of town guythat came back.
Yeah, a way to reconnect again.
Yeah.
So I think I remember, and itcertainly still happens now, but
(09:29):
definitely more so when we firstgot on the court together, we
were playing our own game.
Right?
I remember thinking, Oh my gosh,if you would just get out of the
way, I could, I could take theshot.
Right.
There was no trust.
Yeah, exactly.
(09:49):
Yeah.
You were playing your game.
I was playing my game.
Obviously mine was better.
Obviously.
But here's the game ofpickleball where you absolutely
have to, you have to worktogether.
Yeah.
You have to move together.
Right.
you have to, you know, we'relearning to stand that same,
(10:11):
what is it they, they say likethat noodle length apart to
stand that, that distance apart.
And then, so when one goesright, the other goes right.
When one goes left, the othergoes left.
To dance.
You'd have to do the dance.
Right.
Yeah.
And we weren't very good atthat.
Were we?
No, you weren't.
(10:32):
Luckily I pulled us together.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
On the court and at home.
I think, you know, we, we werejust so used to, to doing our
own thing and relying onourselves and not being able to
ask the other one for help.
Because I think for me, it wasvery much like, if I don't prove
(10:52):
to you that I've been managingthis by myself, then I'm not the
person that you married.
Right.
Or I'm not a good enough personto, to be in this marriage.
So.
You know, you deal with whatlife gives you, you play with
the cards that you're dealt.
(11:14):
So you going away and workingout of town and there were
benefits to that for sure.
The money was good.
Right.
but I definitely felt like I hadsomething to prove to you when
you came back, that look, I'mmanaging this, I'm pulling
through, I'm managing the kids,I'm managing the house, I'm
(11:35):
managing my job.
And it was exhausting.
Oh my gosh, for both of us,right?
Yeah.
I'm glad we did it, but I'm gladit's gone.
You know, I'm glad that page hasturned now.
Yeah.
And I don't think we realized.
that as much as when we got onthe court and realized that we
were playing our individualgame.
(11:57):
And at some point we realizedthis and I think you got
frustrated with me.
Yeah.
Jumping in and I do like topoach.
Yeah.
Right, but we realized thatactually if we work together as
a team and relied on each other.
Yeah.
We were pretty successful.
(12:17):
Yeah.
We could be really successful.
So I'm thinking of thattournament actually early on
last year.
It was coming into the outdoorseason.
So it must've been like the endof April, 2024.
It was that first outdoortournament of the year.
And, I know this will come upagain because I know we're going
(12:39):
to talk about communication alot, but that particular day was
so windy.
Do you remember that?
Yeah.
yeah.
Willow Ridge.
Yeah.
The members, we had to sticktogether.
We had to rely on each other.
Yeah.
I get it.
I remember the wind and we talkconstantly saying the winds from
the left or the winds from theright, depending on how the wind
(13:01):
was changing.
And uh, it put us in a placethat, uh, I think we won it.
Did we win it?
No, we silver.
How did we get silver?
I think we got silver.
Yeah.
But we did really well against apretty good, a pretty good
lineup.
Hmm.
And it was because we weretalking and it was because we
were moving together and we wereso aware of what the other
(13:22):
person was doing.
Yeah.
Um, we really were, we weretrusting each other.
Really on a different level,weren't we?
And relying on each other, a lotmore communication.
And it helped in a massive way.
Yeah.
It makes me think of, we'veplayed opponents as well.
We've played, very strongopponents who, you know, whether
(13:45):
it's.
Friendly games, you know, I sayfriendly in adverted commas or
whether it's tournaments, butwe've played very strong
opponents who look for thatweaker player.
And I think, as a woman, I'vedefinitely felt this, that
immediately some opponents willlook at the female on the team,
(14:08):
they'll look at me, and assumethat I am the weaker player, and
that you are the strongerplayer.
Because you look stronger, youare taller, you are more
muscular, you look like thestronger player.
Charlotte J (14:26):
And for that reason, every shot will be
directed at me.
I definitely feel picked on bythe opponents.
And I think there was a lot oflearning there for me as well,
because I used to get superfrustrated and, and I know I
lost my shit a few times.
And it really took.
(14:47):
for me to one, be aware of that.
And then secondly, ask for help,right?
I mean, that's what we'retalking about here is asking for
help and that it's not, it's notweakness.
It's okay.
So I really had to talk tomyself and say, Okay, if we're
going to get through this, it'sno good.
(15:07):
If they're going to keep firingevery shot at me, there's no way
I can keep this up.
And so I had to relax and, askyou for help and trust you and
say, Hey, will you take overthree quarters of the court or
will you switch sides with me?
or maybe it was a case of, youknow, if they started lobbying.
(15:33):
I'd say you're going to have torun back for the loss.
Yeah, give you a chance to takea breather, right?
Yeah, I'll get it.
Yeah.
And then for me to, to stay inmy zone, which I know I'm not
very good at sometimes, becauseI do like to poach.
Take, take time out.
That's one of the things that wedid.
That's the first time we evertook a tournament and we didn't
(15:54):
know there was timeouts.
The first time that we ever tooka timeout was that tournament.
And that kind of changed ourmentality.
Yeah.
we started to lose and we took atimeout and we came back from it
because we just took a time to acouple of seconds to focus.
Yeah, actually, you know what,that makes me think of something
that we started to do at home aswell.
(16:16):
Because I know when we get intothat sort of cycle of blaming
or, thinking that the otherperson doesn't have our back, is
just to take, take that time outor, have, something like a
strategy huddle and say, okay,let's just step away and breathe
(16:39):
and reset.
Yeah.
Right.
So, I mean, I think that'shelped us a lot too at home.
Yeah.
If you start to think that, uh,somebody is working in your best
interest rather than out ofmalice, then the whole mentality
changes.
And if you know, you're workingin the same direction, it's so
(17:00):
easy to recover from it.
Yeah.
If you know that you have ashared end goal, right?
Yeah.
another thing we started doing,was calling out, like, you know,
like you said earlier,communicating on the court, but
just calling out the shots, ifyou could see them coming, you
know, mine, yours, leave it,leave it.
(17:22):
It's out.
Exactly.
Yeah.
Exactly.
And seeing that that was, that'sa very positive thing.
It's not, you know, it's not acriticism.
There's no need to get defensiveabout it.
Right.
I think the trust comes backbecause pickleball is such a
fast moving game.
Once, uh, once the rallies startthat you don't have time to
(17:42):
think you have to react.
And if somebody calls somethinglike an out or a leave or a mine
or whatever it is.
You have to go with it.
You have to have full trust.
And I think that's why it'shelped us so much.
Yeah, absolutely.
Cause I mean, that's, that'swhat it's like at home too,
right?
Sometimes, especially, you know,evenings after work.
(18:04):
And the children are grown upnow, they're adults, but still.
Semi adults.
But still, you know, I mean,it's busy and when they're all
at home and especially weekendsare busy and a lot's going on
and I think, you know, you and Iare a lot better at making that
eye contact, looking at eachother across the room and
(18:26):
signaling each other, Hey,timeout and taking a reset and
just re evaluating everythingthat's going on.
Yeah.
A twitch of an eyebrow is all ittakes sometimes.
Stops us going down that, thatrabbit hole, right.
Of, defensiveness or feelinglike, you know, I've got to do
it all again, Yeah, we are ateam and we can rely on each
(18:50):
other.
was going to say encouragementas well.
That's one of the bigger ones.
Um, just letting each other knowthat you've got each other's
back, whether it was good or itwas bad, encouragement wins
every time.
Yeah, definitely.
I know when I felt criticized onthe court, I don't play well
(19:11):
after that, but even if I'vemissed a shot, you know, you're
really good at saying, good tryor, oh my gosh, I thought that
was going out or, It's okay.
Reset.
We've got the next one, and justhaving those words of
encouragement is huge, isn't it?
Yeah.
Keep it fun.
I think that's the big one.
Keep it fun.
(19:31):
Keep it light.
It's just pick a ball.
There's another game.
You know, just like life reallythe day tomorrow, nothing you
can do.
You just got to get through thisone.
Don't look back.
Just keep looking forward.
Yeah.
It's hard though, because Ithink we're both competitive and
I think, that has definitelyshown itself in our relationship
too.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I respond really well topositive encouragement.
(19:55):
I know that about myself.
Um, and probably looking back,that wasn't something that I was
able to, to share as much in ourrelationship.
And I think, we become theparents that, you know, our
parents have modeled for us.
And I definitely didn't get theencouragement I needed growing
(20:16):
up.
So.
As crazy as that sounds, it washard for me to be that
encouraging on the court.
But when I received it and wasable to receive it from you and
other people I've played withsome amazing women.
and I think when we're allencouraging each other, it
definitely makes it all a bitmore exciting and a bit more
(20:37):
positive.
You walk away from a courtthinking it was a good
experience than an ordeal.
Even if you lose, it can begood.
Yeah.
So just thinking about, all,those things that we learned
about, teamwork and, and playingtogether and, playing pickleball
(20:57):
together on the court.
I think just to sort ofsummarize some of that into our
relationship and into home life,we.
We work so much better togetherwhen we are able to define our
individual roles.
So the same as, as playingtogether on the court, if each
(21:19):
one of us knows, okay, my job isto Cook dinner or whatever it
is, and your job is to maintainthe vehicles maybe or something
like that.
But to have very clear definedroles on and off the court, and
I'm thinking more so at home nowreally does help.
(21:40):
But on top of that is not onlyhaving those clearly defined
roles, but having someflexibility with those roles as
well.
So, you know, if I say, Oh, I'vecooked dinner five times this
week.
I'd like a break tomorrow.
it's your turn to cook to beable to.
Right.
And you can change the oil onthe car.
(22:01):
No problem.
I can take it to a man who knowshow to do that.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
And then the, the timeouts thatwe were talking about on the
court, having that time out athome to just allow the, the
tension to subside, just to beable to take a pause and take
(22:23):
some breaths.
And reset.
I mean, gosh, how many times do,do we have to reset on the
court?
Constant.
Yeah.
Every point.
Every point.
Focus.
Yeah.
Right.
Cause otherwise you just get inyour head and.
And it's very hard.
It's hard for me to get out ofmy head once I'm in it.
So I think it's taught me quitea few things about self control
(22:46):
as well.
playing pickleball, just whenyou get beaten or you're in the
process of being beaten oryou're losing a point that You
didn't think you should have toreset without becoming upset.
That's tough, but man, I'velearned a lot of that since
we've been in this.
Yeah.
And then just encouraging eachother at home.
Right.
It's, it's that.
A silly little thing, likefolding the laundry and putting
(23:10):
it away a thank you, or, uh, youknow, you did a great job go
such a long way.
You know, part of it as well isthe community, the pickable
community, everybody's likeminded and everybody enjoys it.
You know, there's nobody goesthere, trying to make somebody
else's life miserable, thateverybody does it for, to keep
(23:31):
themselves happy, sociable, andit's a generally good feeling.
Mm hmm yeah.
And I think it's reallyimportant to, as well as the,
the words of encouragement is tocelebrate each other's wins as
well.
You know, it's life is toughsometimes and you leave the
house in the morning and go towork and, it's not always easy.
(23:55):
And I think being able tocelebrate.
Our own wins, but each other'sas well, yeah.
I mean, you get the kids gettingthrough different years at
university or getting throughdifferent courses or, you know,
buying a new car or justbecoming aware of something else
or a new job, or there's lots ofwins, there's lots of small
(24:18):
wins.
And I think it makes you.
Understand that those things arethe big things in life.
All these small things are bigthings.
And, um, yeah, you've got totake the time to make sure that
the kids feel like they've beennoticed.
Acknowledged.
Yeah.
So it's taking the time to makethe kids feel like they've been
acknowledged for their effortsand their dedication and the
(24:40):
hard work they've put in.
So I've learned a lot of thatfrom pickleball as well.
I mean, we all do these things.
We all do these fantastic thingsin life.
But to, uh, to actually take thetime to,, make the kids feel
special because of that is, Ithink it's come from Pickleball
more than anywhere else.
Yeah I think another big thing,that I, I perhaps became more
(25:02):
aware of on the Pickleball courtwas each other's body language.
especially when you're in themiddle of a game, you can see
when your partner is feeling abit deflated, maybe, for
whatever reason, if you've hitthe net a couple of times for a
couple of shots and I can seethat you're getting frustrated,
(25:22):
you're not verbalizing that tome.
but definitely, I can see yourbody language that you're
feeling a bit defeated.
And I think that's especially.
Uh, an important time to step inand offer some encouragement or
perhaps, take a time out andreset.
But I think at home as well,just being aware, being more, I
(25:45):
know it's a buzzword right now,but being more mindful of, how
you are when you walk in thedoor from work, and just being
aware.
Being cognizant of whether, youknow, it appears you've had a
good day or perhaps, you've hada long frustrating day, or if
you didn't sleep the nightbefore, you're definitely tired.
(26:05):
And I think just being mindfulof that, not only helps us in
our play on the court, But thatdefinitely helps at home because
you know, then to give the otherperson a little bit more leeway,
right?
A little bit more space.
Or not.
Or not.
Or the opposite.
Or the opposite.
Yeah.
(26:25):
Maybe you need me to movecloser, and not move away.
I suppose the big one really forus is we've tried to make it
fun.
Whether we are in a great placewith each other when we go to
Pickleball or we are not in agreat place, we might not be as,
as good as it looks when we walkonto that court, but it's
basically, we say showtime.
(26:46):
And it is what it is.
We just deal with it.
We move forward.
And when we come off the court,it's usually a hug and we move
forward and we go again.
It's a pretty good reset for us.
It's, it's quite fun.
Actually.
I do enjoy the drives home.
I mean, like you say, sometimesthe drive there is a little
tense for whatever reason, butafterwards we've always got so
(27:08):
much to say, haven't we?
About the games or the pointsor.
Win or lose.
It's always a win.
Yeah.
And I think we've brought thatback into our relationship too.
We're finding, more fun doingother things together.
we regularly walk the dogtogether.
there's so many other thingsthat, we can do together cooking
(27:28):
together, that regular datenight.
I mean, I even golf together nowand again, we do, we do golf
together now and again.
And I am finding more fun in it,but especially when we go with
another couple, but yeah, it'sall about fun.
yeah.
We've done most of the work now.
Let's keep it fun.
definitely pickleball has helpedus with that.
(27:50):
Thank you for listening toepisode one of the Pickleball
and Partnership podcast.
Here are the key points andtakeaways from today's episode.
1.
Shared activities fosterconnection.
Learning Pickleball became a funand meaningful way for us to
spend time together, helping usto rediscover our partnership
(28:12):
after years of navigatingseparate roles in our marriage.
.Teamwork is a game changer.
Success on the Pickleball Courtrequires clear communication,
trust, and mutual reliance.
Skills that translate intobetter collaboration and
understanding at home.
(28:32):
3.
Overcoming challenges together.
From navigating windytournaments to facing
frustrations when targeted asthe weaker player, we have
learned to support and encourageone another, building resilience
and adaptability.
Lessons beyond the court.
(28:53):
Concepts like calling timeouts,defining roles, and staying
flexible with responsibilitieshave helped us to improve our
relationship dynamics and ourdaily life at home.
Encouragement over criticism.
Encouragement is my superpower.
(29:14):
Positive reinforcement duringplay boosted both of our
confidence and our performanceand reminded us to focus on
celebrating effort rather thandwelling on mistakes.
Thanks so much for.
Listening today.
I hope you enjoyed thatconversation as much.
As I did.
Anything mentioned, includinglinks.
(29:36):
Uh, notes and a full episodelist will be over on our
website.
At synergy health.org forwardslash podcast.
In the podcast section.
If you got something.
Out of this episode, be sure tofollow or subscribe.
To pickleball and partnership.
On apple podcasts.
It's.
Spotify or wherever you listen,so that you're notified.
(29:58):
of new and upcoming episodes.
And if you're fine.
Finding value in this podcast, acost-free way to.
To support us is to leave a fivestar review.
It truly.
He means the world to us.
This will help more peopleaccess.
Access these real conversations.
If you really got.
Something out of it.
Take a screenshot of thisepisode on your phone.
(30:21):
And share it on social media tagme at.
At Charlotte Jukes and I willabsolutely reshare your post.
If you haven't connected with mepersonally, I would love.
To meet you and say, hi.
Thanks again for listening.
I remember, we're all learning,growing and showing.
Up in our own ways.
And that's what matters most.
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