Episode Transcript
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Philippa (00:00):
Welcome to pondering
and play and therapy this week.
My guest is Charlotte Jenkins,from Beacon Family Services, and
Charlotte is the founder of anot-for-profit organization, she
started this, service forfamilies because in a world
(00:24):
where connection is everything,too many children and families
struggle to find the supportthey need to thrive.
She's also recently expandedsupport and co-founded Looming
and US, which is a digital appproviding parents with on-demand
therapeutic tools for earlyintervention.
(00:44):
Her mission is to provideinnovative, accessible solutions
that go beyond traditionalservices, helping children feel
safe and connected.
Charlotte has over 20 years inchildren's services as a social
worker and she's developed anddelivered play-based therapeutic
interventions that help childrenthrive at home and in school.
(01:06):
She's proactive on approaches toprevent more serious challenges
later.
She's also a the practitionersupervisor and is working toward
accreditation in DICdevelopment, psychotherapy.
She brings expertise ofneurodevelopmental needs and has
worked with many adoptivefostering and kinship families,
(01:30):
helping them through trauma.
An adverse early lifeexperiences and giving them the
tools that reduce reliance onreactive interventions.
She's really committed tochildren's mental health through
relational play-based therapiesand digital solutions that often
the statutory services oftencan't provide.
(01:54):
So Charlotte, that's a hugeamount of stuff that you are
doing there,
Charlotte (02:00):
hearing you say it
like that it, it feels quite,
different how it's felt in theprocess of getting to where I
am.
The story is I'm a social workerby background and worked the
local authority and becamefrustrated.
Came frustrated at seeing thelevel of need and the challenges
local authorities had with lackof funding and constant
(02:23):
restructures and these kinds ofthings that prevented you
innovating and really respondingin creative ways.
Philippa (02:32):
So how long or ago did
you create Beacon Family
Services?
Charlotte (02:39):
Yeah, we set up
Beacon Family Services in 2018
as a legal company.
But for a couple of years beforethat, I'd been working
independently and developingprojects.
And it became clear that wasgoing to need to be funded and.
Yeah, my local council was happyto support me with some funding,
(03:00):
which was to try some, the playgroups at the time and the play
groups, the parents and childrenin our local community who were
seeing the work that adoptivefamilies could access and the
impact it.
On family relationships andsaying, actually we need that
(03:20):
too.
Some of the issues that arehappening in our family,
divorces, bereavement recoveringfrom domestic abuse actually,
the kind of ways you'resupporting Adopt ation really
help us.
Philippa (03:34):
Okay so it was Beacon
Family Services was designed to
support the parent and child tohave.
Strength and detachments or Yes.
Those reciprocal relationshipsthat children need in order to
thrive.
Is that right?
Charlotte (03:51):
Absolutely.
So when I started, thechildren's commissioner had just
done a report and we'destablished that around about
75% of the children who werereferred to Cams in Birmingham
weren't even seen.
And of those that were seen, itwas only something like a
(04:12):
quarter of them that got anyfollow up.
So actually there were a lot ofparents who were really confused
about how to help theirchildren.
And it was that sense that theyneeded to have some kind of
medical health led intervention.
And actually what I wasobserving was that.
(04:32):
That for those families thefight and the push to get
services was actually getting inthe way of them being able to
focus on the relationship andthe things that parents can do
to make things better and oftenspending a little bit of time
making sense of.
What was beneath the child'sbehavior gave a parent a whole
(04:53):
new sense of what was happeningand they suddenly felt very
enabled and empowered toactually start changing the way
they did things.
In their daily routines, in theways they interacted that made a
huge difference to them andstress levels.
The parent came down and when weknow that when a parent is less
stressed a child feels morerelaxed as well.
(05:16):
And so things would start to getbetter without diagnosis.
And that doesn't mean that forsome families there, there isn't
still that necessity that themedical diagnosis.
And we also know that actuallyin terms of access to resources
in the school system, that canbe really important.
Actually in terms of thefundamentals of actually what do
(05:40):
children need for good lifelongmental health?
And that's a good relationshipwhere they feel understood.
Actually that always has to beour starting point, I think.
Philippa (05:51):
Absolutely.
So that relationship is key.
And you talked there aboutunderlying, kind of reasons that
behaviors are occurring.
So if a parent was listening tothis and thinking, yeah, my kid
is just off the scale, I can'tmanage him.
Yeah.
They can control it.
(06:12):
They are doing it on purpose.
They, yeah.
Would you, would, what would yousay to them?
What would be the, what wouldthey start to.
What would you help them tostart to think about?
Charlotte (06:26):
Yeah, so I suppose
we, we begin to think about what
that must feel like.
For them as a parent and reallythink about actually some of
their drivers.
In, in that some of the parentsthat we meet are going through
huge pressures and feel the, intheir parenting, they're not
(06:47):
being a good enough parentbecause their child's not
getting to school with ease.
Their child's not managing theday at school with ease their
child's, picking their child upat the end of the day and
they're having huge meltdowns,then family meal times are
hugely difficult and thenbedtime's hugely difficult and,
the day feels like it's a dayfull of conflict.
(07:10):
And I suppose we begin tounderstand some of the pressures
for the parent, first of all, offeeling that are they being
judged?
Are they are they living up towhat they feel the parental
expectations are and notice someof the pressure they feel.
And then we might also begin tothink about some of the pressure
the child's feeling.
In those situations and begin tothink about actually what it's
(07:33):
like for both parent and childto feel so pressured to achieve
something that actually perhapsthey're not with and isn't so
right for them.
Philippa (07:42):
Yeah.
So yeah.
Julie and I on a previouspodcast have talked about that
parental guilt.
Yeah.
'cause I think that can be sohard, can't it, for parents that
they.
Th that sometimes we have such anarrow band of what children
should be achieving, how theyshould be behaving.
(08:03):
Yes.
How your day should look, howyou should play.
Yeah.
All these things.
And I think with social media,it's an amazing thing.
We are doing this and withoutall the wonderful developments,
yes.
We wouldn't be able to be havingthis conversation.
But it also adds that pressurewhen you can see these perfect
parents or these yes, perfectachieving children.
(08:25):
And that's great.
Some kids are going to do withinthis expected norm.
They're going to achieve, aren'tthey?
Yep.
But other kids, mine being oneof them, was a lot more bouncy
and was never gonna walk with meholding my hand as we walked
down.
There was no way he was gonna dothat.
(08:46):
Absolutely not.
So we had to find games thatkept him safe and his movement,
rather than restricting hismovement.
But I think parents, can.
Maybe don't have the privilegethat I did of being in a world
where actually you've got, otherpeople that are saying, actually
(09:07):
it's okay that kids aren't fitfor this.
But maybe not every parent hasthat.
Charlotte (09:14):
No, and I think when
you've got that internal voice
about, am I being, what we calla good enough parent?
Oh my gosh.
Every, everyone else is gettingtheir, kids into school and
doesn't look as frazzled as Ifeel by the time, I've done the
handover and walked away.
And actually it's that internalself and I think so many.
Parents do look around and feellike it's going so much better
(09:37):
for everyone else.
Whereas actually the reality ismornings are hard.
What we've done the day beforehow good our quality of sleep
has been when we like to wakeup.
All those things.
Yeah.
Impact how we arrive in the day,don't they?
And, that's a parent's job toactually manage their own.
Sense of I'm doing okay thismorning and this is what I need
(09:58):
to be on an eat and keel, aswell as organizing a child who,
as you say, there actuallychildren don't yet have the
executive function, do theytalking.
So actually you have to do allthis massive amount of thinking
that I've got to get their teethbrushed and I've got to get'em
dressed and I've gotta make surethat they've had some breakfast
and there's a plan for lunch,and then I've gotta persuade
them to walk down the roadsafely.
(10:19):
And in the midst of this,they've probably got an agenda.
About what they want to do.
And sometimes that's going ontablets or watching tally or
particularly what they want forbreakfast.
And it's so much going on, isn'tit so much just in that that
space of time and sometimes justacknowledging the amount of
pressure that in the system canbe really helpful to letting
(10:43):
parents just go, okay, actuallyI am doing all right with all
I'm juggling.
And once parents feel less shameabout how good am I as a parent,
actually your ability to be morecreative and reflective as a
parent return, doesn't it?
When you are under pressure youcan't think of a game to play in
(11:06):
that moment.
You're in survival mode.
You're like, I've just gotta getyou into school.
Philippa (11:11):
Absolutely.
And I, I suppose it's that thingof, how do you do self-care to
build your own emotionalresilience, which is what you
need when you've got a3-year-old who isn't eating
their dinner and the healthvisitors said You need to make
the meat.
And you've seen that you've gotto cook all these amazing things
off TikTok or wherever it is.
(11:31):
And actually they're thrown itall on the floor and all they
want is a cheeser.
Your emotional resilience needsto be quite robust, doesn't it?
To manage that?
Absolutely.
But if if you are living inpoverty or in temporary housing
or fleeing domestic violence, oreven in a domestic violence
relationship, or you've got fivekids or whatever it is, your
(11:56):
capacity to deal with thoseeveryday moments is really
tricky, isn't it?
Charlotte (12:03):
Totally.
And I think parenting can becomereally overwhelming in that
sense.
And, then you get a lot ofadvice don't you, about self
care, about, okay, actually takeyourself for a lovely walk and
do some breathing.
And actually say when you've gotfive children to get through the
day there's not always a lot oftime for that.
Actually there's a big pieceabout how you talk to yourself
about how you're doing as aparent.
(12:24):
And I think, befriending yournervous system, we think about a
lot and getting to understandthat, actually things.
Don't feel great all the time,and it is okay that, you move in
your nervous system interstateswhere you feel a little more
agitated, you feel a little morefrustrated, but the bit is to be
(12:47):
able to recognize them.
And also I think as a parent,in, when we talk about
self-care, some of that's justsome of the basic actually, are
you able to get enough sleep?
If you've got kids that, thataren't sleeping and you are up
and down, that really does erodeyour own wellbeing.
And to have that acknowledgedthat actually, of course,
(13:08):
actually it's hard for you.
When you're not sleeping is muchmore helpful, isn't it, than
having someone say to you, wow,it'd be a really good idea if
you got eight hours sleep.
Yeah.
You probably wouldn't feel likeyelling by the time, you were
getting everyone shoes on if yougot eight hours, because it's
Philippa (13:24):
not realistic, is it?
Absolutely not.
Absolutely not.
So tell us a little bit moreabout the nervous system because
you are doing quite a lot ofwork around this, so if parents,
or, anybody's listening to thisand they haven't really thought
about, why is Charlotte talkingabout the nervous system?
We're talking about stressfulparenting.
Tell us a little bit about whyit's important and what Beacon
Family Services are doing tosupport parents and children
(13:46):
with that.
Charlotte (13:47):
Yeah.
So actually this is something Idid a lot of thinking about
particularly when Covidhappened.
Because when Covid happened Isuddenly wasn't able to be in
the room with families that Iwas supporting yet I was still
trying to reach out to them andtheir child online, and I had to
(14:08):
think a little bit aboutactually, what is it that's not
there?
For parents, and it's very muchthat experience of how we feel
in our bodies really influencesthe story that we tell ourselves
about what's happening aroundus.
So on a really simple level, ifwe think about, yeah.
(14:29):
What happens when we're dealingwith a, a phone call where we
are trying to resolve, a, anissue perhaps a around, a
passcode reset.
I've dealt with that thismorning.
And actually if you've had yourbreakfast and you're feeling
energized and what have you, youcan be okay if that happens
right before lunchtime.
(14:50):
Yeah.
When you're a little bit hungry.
Yeah, and you just want to getthings done.
Actually, it feels far moreinconvenient.
And so actually that being awareof what's happening within us
and how that changes our abilityto respond really matters.
And often when you move intothat state where you are more
(15:11):
stressed and you are moreagitated or frustrated.
If you come into contact withsomeone who's actually in a
place where they're like, thisis all okay, we can handle this.
We've gotta, you can feel thatshift in you immediately, can't
you?
Someone gets that this is apain, but they've got a plan and
(15:32):
they're going to help.
And all this stuff is really, IMimportant because our nervous
system guides how we interpretevents, but it's also reading
other people's nervous systems.
So trying to bring calm into asituation this stuff is hugely
important.
Philippa (15:49):
Now a nervous system
that you're talking about is
connected to all different partsof our body, isn't it?
So it's not just, the stuff inyour hand.
It's the bit, it's connected toour brain and it's running down
the middle of our body.
That's right.
It's connected to our heart andour lungs and our muscles and
other little bits that help withand our duct.
Charlotte (16:08):
Yeah.
Really importantly.
Yeah.
Philippa (16:10):
So that feeling that
parents or even professionals
have where you are like, oh,that just doesn't feel right.
You might, it's that I alwaysthink about it like, you know
when two people have been havingan argument in a room, but you
haven't been there.
Yeah,
and then you walk into
that room and you can feel the
tension, even if the people aresmiling at you and saying, oh,
(16:32):
welcome, Philippa.
What?
You can just feel that, oh,there's something a bit like not
quite right here.
That's our nervous system sayingthat's
Charlotte (16:42):
our nervous system,
and it is a proper spidey scent.
So there's a big word for it.
That's called neuroception.
Actually within us, our nervoussystem is taking in sensory
inflammation all the time.
It's scanning.
Yeah.
Within us.
So within our body, what are wefeeling?
It's scanning around us.
Sorry, my cat just ran acrossscreen then.
(17:04):
Did you see.
I
Philippa (17:05):
did.
He looked very cute.
Charlotte (17:10):
What was your nervous
system saying no to Charlotte?
I completely threw my my trainof thought for a minute.
The surprise of that.
Yeah.
What's gonna happen?
So yeah, so we're scanningwithin us we're scanning around
us, so what's in the environmentaround us and we're scanning
between us.
(17:30):
As well, and our sensory systemsare taking in this information
and sending it to our brain,which is dealing with it.
So I think that's a bit that'sreally important.
Often people think of theirthoughts as linked to their
feelings, but actually thisstarts in our body and it's what
we call an autonomic process.
So actually our body'sresponding to this information
and affecting our hearing, ourdigestion, our heart rate, all
(17:54):
these things before we've evencoalesced a thought in our
brain.
So actually our bodies are verycl clever in that way.
And that's a really importantthing to start to think about as
a parent because it can reallyrevolutionize understanding both
yourself and your child of howquickly you can respond to a
(18:16):
situation without actuallyhaving, thought things through.
And I think a really goodexample is that for all the
drivers out there.
Think about the last time youhad to press the brake really
suddenly.
Because actually the processdidn't go, oh, look, there's a
car stopping in front.
I better press the brake.
(18:36):
The first time you are thinkingabout it.
Normally the things that you arestarting to notice is, oh my
gosh, I feel a bit hot.
My heart's pumping and what justhappened.
Am I okay?
So yeah we're very responsive tothe, to, to what's going on
between us, within us and aroundus.
And we're looking to see howsafe we are all the time.
(19:00):
And you know that when we cancreate safety for the nervous
system, actually it's then thatconnection becomes possible.
Philippa (19:10):
Because, our.
Bodies in our, nervous system inour brain are really great,
aren't they?
Because they're designed to keepus safe, to keep, to keep us
alive, to keep us movingforward.
Yes.
So the signals we get when itsays actually we might die,
actually physically changes ourbody, doesn't it?
It changes the way that we thinkand we process information and
(19:33):
the fact that we can't think,yeah, because if a lion is about
to eat, you.
You don't want to be thinking,oh, I wonder what David
Attenborough said about lionsNow.
Yes.
Oh yes, I need to run becauseyou've gone, haven't you?
You want that instant response,don't you?
Of totally.
Oh, my blinking goodness, I needto leg it.
Or a little bit stronger thanthat.
Charlotte (19:54):
You need to leg it.
You're not gonna bother stayingaround to try and fight it, are
you?
Because actually your body knowsGet away.
Philippa (20:00):
Yeah.
Yeah.
But stress Charlotte can do someof this kind, it can trick the
body.
Yes.
Some ways into feeling likeeveryday situations can, are
more life threatening than theyare.
Yes.
And I'm not talking about alittle bit of stress, where I'm
(20:20):
thinking, oh my gosh I'm likefor Charlotte or whatever it is.
Yeah.
It's the.
It's those things that happenover time.
So over the day you might get 50stresses and those can build up
or that you are living in aplace that.
It is difficult to survive.
So you might be living intemporary accommodation.
(20:41):
You might be struggling to thinkabout, am I gonna put the
heating on or am I gonna feed mychild?
Or they're gonna need new shoesat the end of, at the end of
term and I dunno where I'm gonnaget the money from.
Those pressures you might beliving in domestic violence, but
those are stresses that you arefeeling as a parent and they
can.
Your body can then feel thatit's life threatening.
(21:03):
Is that right?
Charlotte (21:05):
Yes.
And I think one of the thingsthat we talk with families about
is we envisage this situationusing a lighthouse and we've got
some imagery and I can link youto some parts that you can put
in the.
Our nervous system as having astate that's like being in the
(21:26):
lighthouse or around thelighthouse, where actually
things feel okay, we feel safe.
We're content, we're able tosocially engage and we're able
to connect with.
And then as you say, we haveanother state, which we think of
that as slipping down onto therocks a little bit.
And that's the pressures thatinevitably come up in, in a day.
(21:47):
They might be running late, theymight be bad traffic, they might
be getting hungry, but theycause us to mobilize a little
bit.
But actually as you say, if weget chronically.
Stressed and those stresses arerepeated and we can't see a way
outta them.
We can get stuck in what we callthis struggling state.
(22:09):
Or we can slip down into what wethink of as a drowning state,
which is actually where you feelthat actually it's got pretty
hopeless and you can't imaginethat there's any help.
So you begin to shut down andjust go through motions.
Or if it's really serious, wecould be talking about
(22:29):
depression.
But actually this is ahierarchical process that we
move.
From safety into a morestruggling state where we become
mobilized or maybe we're stuckin this fight and flight process
into this drowning state.
And when we get, it's normal forall of us to move through those
(22:50):
state.
And we move through themhierarchically and we move up
again.
Often, if we have felt a littlebit hopeless about.
Something.
Being able to move into a placeof doing something about it
telling someone that reallywasn't okay can move us back up
over the rocks and that person'sresponse to us.
Gosh, that sounds move us.
(23:13):
Back to safety.
That's a simple way we, we moveabout.
But for some, when you've gotstuck in one of those states,
it's really hard to see see howyou move.
And that's where people who arefeeling safe need to be able to
connect with you and help youhelp you move.
And that's what parents aredoing for children.
But who is doing it for theparent who, who's around a.
(23:37):
Helping them is a really bigquestion.
Philippa (23:40):
And when you, so you
talked about earlier on that,
our nervous system is scanningboth ourselves and our others.
So for children.
If their parents are in thiskind of drowning or struggling
stage, yeah, they're gonna bescanning their parents, aren't
they?
They're gonna be feeling what'scoming from their parents.
(24:00):
Absolutely.
And I'm guessing then thatimpacts their lighthouse as well
and the way that, and thenAbsolutely.
Charlotte (24:08):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
If your parent is moredisconnected and more unable to
meet you in, in the moment,actually, that's your nervous
system is going to scanner.
Hang on a minute.
I, i'm not feeling connected.
Actually this isn't very safefor me.
Philippa (24:24):
So then we can, I
guess we can get into this
vicious cycle, can't we?
That parents Yeah.
Are feeling stressed maybe aboutother things in life.
Yes.
Children are picking this up.
And then children's behavior.
Is then they are designed toconnect.
Yes.
So they find ways to connect andsometimes that might be in what
(24:48):
we deem misbehavior, butactually it's just a survival
behavior of I need you as myparent.
But that can absolutely comeacross as aggression, as temper,
tantrums of refusal to go toschool, but actually what
they're worrying about.
Is, will my mom pick me up?
Will my dad be there when I gethome?
Or what?
What's gonna happen to them?
(25:08):
But then that creates morestress for the parent.
Yes.
So we are going round in thiscircle.
Charlotte (25:13):
Yes.
And if we come back to thatpoint that you are making there
Philippa that actually what isunder this is that actually.
Both the child and the parentwant to feel connected and want
to feel safe actually, if westart to address that and see it
in, in those terms.
But actually this child'sbehavior is a big, keep their
(25:35):
parents' attention on them andokay.
It, it might not be a way thatfeels good and, and, makes a
parent want to connect.
But actually if we can help aparent hold that in mind, hang
on a minute, my child is needingconnection in this moment.
And see the need and separate.
(25:56):
Separate it out from the factthat actually their behavior is
making me feel like the lastthing I want to do is connect
with them.
Actually, something becomespossible for parents in their
own nervous system.
They're actually beginning tothink about this and understand
what's happening and understandthat actually it's okay that I'm
not feeling like connecting withmy child.
(26:18):
I think it's one of the things Ihear parents talk about that,
guilt they feel when they're nothaving nice feelings about their
child.
But actually, parenting's reallyhard, isn't it?
If you stop and think about it,who in their right mind would
actually want to look after alittle individual who doesn't
know night from day, who needsall their P cleaned up, can't
(26:41):
really tell you what's going on.
You know who, who would want todo that yet we do because we
want to connect and care and, inbabies, when they begin to
smile.
Actually that the hard work ofthose those caring bits melts
away for parents.
And that's really at the essenceof it, that if we can create
(27:04):
that sense of connection thatallows oxytocin to happen in a
brain, then actually coping withthe bits that are hard, hope is
maintained.
Philippa (27:15):
So that's what Loom
Lumen in Us is an app that helps
to build some of those, but alsofamily beacon Family Services
you do that in person as well.
So it's about using play as away of building those
connections.
So tell us a little bit moreabout that.
Charlotte (27:34):
Yeah.
So tell you a little bit moreabout that.
To.
We started with some paperresources that we developed for
our families.
Introduced the lighthouse modeland help parents think about
where they were in the model,where they say struggling or
drowning, and where was theirchild.
And then help them select gamesthat match that state, because
(27:57):
that's one of the things that,you know, that I was
experiencing was that if youjust say to a parent who's very
stressed, why don't you tryplaying with your child?
They might say, the last thing Ifeel like doing is running round
and playing hide, sequel or whathave you with my child at the
moment.
I can't find that within me.
And that's what's reallyimportant.
It's the right kind of play tomatch the state.
(28:18):
So actually we designed theseresources that started to help
with that, and they becamereally popular.
And we worked with Adoption UKwith some focus groups of
parents from Adoption UK andlater from kinship as well.
To really understand, what wasit about having these paper
resources that were so helpful.
And what parents started to sayto us was that in the moment
(28:40):
where I most need to play withmy child, that's the moment I
feel least creative.
I can't think so I.
A resource and actually I don'twant it to be at home in the
drawer.
I need it to be with me becausea lot of these moments might
happen when I'm out and aboutwhen I'm, visiting someone and I
need something.
(29:01):
We would really like that to bean app.
So that's when we launched ourapp version with funding from.
Clarion Housing.
We built an app that's beenreally helpful, but it allows
parents to do a.
Of what is happening either forthem or their child, because the
(29:21):
app is not something that yougive to your child.
It's a resource for parents.
It's a resource for parents tohelp them in the moment and to
help them in building andstrengthening their
relationship.
With their child.
We've recently relaunched a newversion, which is allowing
parents to track a lot moreabout what is happening in the
(29:46):
relationship with their childand what their concerns are and
how their feeling aboutthemselves with the parent.
So that actually.
Over time, we can make betterand better recommendations
around the kind of play thatwill be helpful.
The other things that parentshave said to us is that in using
the app, they started to trackwhat was happening and notice
(30:07):
that there were times a day whenactually a little bit of play
completely changed things.
So I had a family who noticedthat if they made dents before
bedtime.
Bedtime was completely changed.
And so actually we've alsocreated that facility within the
app for parents to make noteswhen they're when they're
(30:29):
enjoying activities about whathas happened or also where it's
not worked so well for a child,but they can hold notes so that
actually they can begin to buildsome thinking themselves about
why is this working?
And then they can set littlereminders for themselves.
To actually play.
So you can get a little p yourchild loves to play just before
tea time, so it's really aresource that's about helping
(30:51):
parents to have the space toreflect because it's really busy
as a parent.
And that creative and thinkingspace is hard to come by.
Actually say you're just in theoften in the doing doing, get
through the.
We survived it, but actually wewant families to have a sense
(31:11):
that we had moments of joy andconnection.
We had fun today.
They were highlights.
Philippa (31:17):
And that's, the
purpose of play.
The purpose of this app and thepur, the play and all those
things is to build thatconnection.
Yes.
Because if we are building thatconnection, we are soothing that
nervous system and saying thatwe are feeling safe.
Yeah.
You are safe in thisrelationship.
You're safe in that connection.
Yes.
And that can be for both parentand child.
(31:38):
'cause play is not just aboutthe child, it's.
Also helps the adult.
Charlotte (31:45):
Totally.
Totally.
And I think we easily forgetthat, and you must know this
Philippa, how many times do youhave that conversation where you
ask a family about what do theydo to play?
And people think about veryformal play opportunities.
Oh, the last time we played agame was whereas actually
there's something about beingplayful.
As, as well.
(32:05):
And, as adults, I think we aremuch more playful.
And we, we, you.
People don't often think oftheir hobbies as their time for
play, but actually yoga'smassive for me.
It's really important to me.
And actually I'm playing inthose moments where like I'm
really trying to extend mybalance or, create a bind that
(32:29):
is, you know, more than the,actually that's me playing.
And exploring my body and makingsense of how I feel in in, in
the world when I cook for myfamily.
Yeah.
And actually, not when I'm justthrowing jacket potatoes, what
have you, but, I've got sometime to think about what does
everyone, like, how can I makethis really, that's playing.
(32:50):
And equally when we do that withsomeone else, that is that, that
is lovely.
And one of the reasons and thethings that I love most about my
job the bit that I never heardanyone talk about when I was
exploring moving into deliveringplay therapies was how lovely it
is.
(33:10):
Have that time with parents andchildren playing where you all
just get lost in the moment.
It just is so lovely.
It's it's, it's one of thebenefits that is priceless.
I think of the work we do.
Philippa (33:24):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
And I think it's just aprivilege, isn't it?
I, yeah.
I just think I have the best jobin the world.
I, yes.
I get to spend time with.
Families and children whothrough play, are honest and
open and connected, and youdon't often need words.
You can feel where they are.
(33:45):
You can feel, that today's beena really hard day for you.
I can feel the energy in theroom and then through play,
hopefully, you get.
50, 60 minutes, and when theyleave, it might not last very
long, but when they leave,there's less of that prickly
tension.
(34:06):
There's less of that disconnect
Charlotte (34:07):
Absolutely.
Philippa (34:08):
Between the parent and
the child and they've, you've
bought them back together, theymight run off by the time
they're down the end of thestreet and it's all back again,
but you've, yeah.
They've allowed you.
I think as a, as a practitioner,I just feel that to be allowed
in that space with a parent anda child and to have them
(34:29):
sometimes at their mostvulnerable is one of the
greatest privileges of my lifeReally?
And I love it.
Yes.
Charlotte (34:37):
Yes.
And it is a privilege, isn't it?
And.
To, to bring some joy andlaughter through play as an
antidote to the real stress anddistress that that children and
parents are feeling.
And I know that we are bothsocial workers, so we're very
conscious of the socialstructures that are around
(34:58):
families.
And I think so many parentsdon't feel that they can enjoy.
Play and being playful withtheir child just because it's
feels so good.
They feel that there has to bean educational objective.
They have to be progressing orlearning something new or
(35:19):
developing in some way.
And so actually a big thingabout our app, it's just plan B.
That is enough.
Philippa (35:29):
Yeah.
And just as we come to the endof the shot, that plain and
being can just be small moments,can't it?
Because again, yes.
Lots of the feedback that.
But that, we get or and I haveconversations with parents
around.
Just feeling that they've got todo these, big stints of play.
It's got to be organized.
(35:50):
Yeah.
But, being in your dramas on aSaturday.
And like you say, building a denor and you can build the den and
feed them snacks.
You don't always have to be inthat play, do you?
But you can.
You don't be connected, can'tyou?
Charlotte (36:06):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Or pulling silly faces at oneanother.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Doing some silly
walks as you go to school,
sharing, hand squeezes, allthese little moments of being
playful, make a huge difference.
And for all those parents thatare listening in all the trials
we've done around our resources,we've been looking for families
(36:26):
to, to play with their childrenfor five or 10 minutes.
Right
a
day and to use this
stuff.
So we're, this isn't somethingthat, you've got to we're gonna
take a whole afternoon and we'regonna do playing.
This stuff is, available whenyou've just got a couple of
minutes and a couple of minuteshere, there and everywhere
builds this.
And in fact, we run a program ofsubscription packs.
(36:50):
So we shared our activities someresources to play them and some
information about why the playwould be helpful with families
once a month for six months.
So they got six packs.
And we asked the parents tocomplete a questionnaire for us
at the beginning.
And at the end, and actually wesaw over 80% of parents felt
(37:12):
closer to their children.
At the end of that six months ofjust taking those few moments to
play during each month about 70%of families, a little bit more
than 70% experienced a decreasein conflict.
So it's really powerful to do.
That is what we know.
(37:33):
And we're doing more researchdeveloper.
Is it okay if I do a plug here?
Absolutely.
We're doing more research.
Research, absolutely.
So actually we will be invitingpeople to try our app and
contribute to the research.
The app, there is always a freeversion available.
But there are additionalfeatures and you can download
the free version of the app oryou can pay for it or you will
(37:55):
be able to join our researchtrial.
Philippa (37:58):
Perfect.
And I will put in thedescription of the podcast the
link to the app and, yeah.
The link to Beacon FamilyServices Yes.
So that people can access Yes.
The resources that you have.
Yes.
Available.
Because yeah,
Charlotte (38:16):
families that are in
the West Midlands and are in
Birmingham, we also run the playgroups and some parent workshops
as well that can be accessed.
And
Philippa (38:24):
they can access that
through your, through the
website, can't they?
Absolutely.
Charlotte (38:28):
Yes.
Philippa (38:29):
That's perfect.
So yes, I'll add those in.
Thank you so much for your time,Charlotte, today.
It is just been lovely chattingto you and hearing about all
those amazing things that I'msure for parents and
professionals really are just agreat resource.
So thank you very much.
Charlotte (38:49):
Thank you for having
me.
It's been lovely to chat to youabout it.