March 5, 2025 • 53 mins
Meet Kellie!
In this episode of Protea Conversations, Zane interviews Kellie Parks, a passionate advocate for cloud-based accounting. They discuss Kellie's journey in the accounting industry, the importance of community, and how technology is transforming the field. Kellie shares her insights on the role of bookkeepers, the significance of interpersonal skills in accounting, and her transition from marketing to bookkeeping.
The conversation highlights the evolving landscape of accounting and the need for professionals to embrace technology and collaboration. In this engaging conversation, Kellie Parks shares her journey from marketing to bookkeeping, highlighting the importance of technology and personal growth in the accounting industry.
She discusses her transition to full-time bookkeeping, the impact of her marketing background, and the significance of setting priorities and boundaries in her professional life. Kellie also offers valuable advice for aspiring bookkeepers, emphasizing the need for a solid understanding of accounting fundamentals and the role of technology in enhancing client relationships.
Takeaways
- The accounting industry is increasingly becoming a technology-driven field.
- Bookkeeping is a crucial aspect of the accounting process.
- Community and relationships are vital in the accounting industry.
- Interpersonal skills are essential for success in accounting.
- Technology has made accounting more accessible and efficient.
- The shift to cloud technology in accounting has greatly improved efficiency and client satisfaction.
- Embracing technology is crucial for modern accountants and bookkeepers.
- Setting clear goals and priorities is essential for professional growth.
- Kellie emphasizes the importance of understanding core accounting principles.
- Personal anecdotes can illustrate the challenges and benefits of adapting to new technologies.
- Networking and community support are vital for success in the accounting industry.
Sound Bites
"I like to think of myself more as a thought sharer."
"I realized actually that I loved doing that."
"It opened up all of this freedom."
"I want to do it differently."
"You need to work on expectations and boundaries."
"You bring some fresh air to the accounting space."
Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Cloud Accounting and Kellie Parks
03:00 The Role of a Rabble Rouser in Accounting
05:53 Building Community in the Accounting Industry
08:57 The Importance of Bookkeeping
11:45 Technology's Impact on Accounting
14:56 Journey into Bookkeeping
18:02 The Transition from Marketing to Accounting
28:22 The Evolution of Kellie's Career
30:00 Transitioning to Full-Time Bookkeeping
31:49 Leveraging Technology in Accounting
34:37 The Impact of Marketing Experience on Accounting
38:07 Adapting to Change: A Personal Anecdote
41:30 The Importance of Technology in Modern Accounting
43:06 Setting Goals and Priorities
51:25 Advice for Aspiring Bookkeepers
Connect with Kellie:
LinkedIn personal - https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellie-parks/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome to Proteon Conversations, the podcast where leadership in business and accounting
(00:09):
isn't just discussed, it's explored.
I'm your host, St. Stephens, and thank you for joining me as we delve into the minds of
some of the most influential leaders in the industry.
Our journey is one of discovery, from unraveling the unique stories that shaped our guest careers,
to invaluable advice that fueled their success.
We hereby provide you with a simple, actionable advice to accelerate your career and personal
growth.
Whether you're a budding professional or a seasoned executive, these conversations
(00:31):
are designed to offer insight and perspectives that resonate with everyone.
So tune in, engage, and be inspired as we build better leaders together.
Welcome to Proteon Conversations.
Today, I'm excited to be joined by Kelly Parks, the chief rabble rouser at Calmwater's
Cloud Accounting.
Kelly is a passionate advocate for cloud-based accounting, helping firms streamline their
work for us and embrace technology to create more efficient, profitable, and lifestyle-friendly
(00:56):
businesses.
With years of experience integrating cloud solutions and guiding firms through automation
and process improvement, Kelly has built a reputation as a thought lead in the industry.
Beyond accounting, she's a dedicated runner, skier, traveler, and live music fan, bringing
energy and enthusiasm to everything she does.
In this episode, we'll explore Kelly's journey, her insights of the future of cloud accounting,
and how firms can leverage technology to work smarter, not harder.
(01:19):
Kelly, welcome to Proteon Conversations, and thank you for being here.
Well, having me, Zane.
I want to come back to the thought leader thing.
I like to think of myself more as a thought-sharer.
Not sure I have an original thought in my head, but I'm happy to share all the good
ideas that I do here along the way.
Well, sometimes a great leader takes good ideas and puts them into a platform that is
(01:43):
easier for people to digest.
And when I think of the way you share your message to other people, I don't think about
is it an original thought by Kelly.
I do think about it in a way that that is a really unique and simple way to explain
a difficult topic.
And I think that is necessary because we get stuck in the complex of all these situations
(02:05):
rather than realizing that we stick to the simple, more people will understand, the
more chance they'll be successful.
Thank you.
I like the way you just spun that.
Yeah, so you're definitely, in my mind, a thought leader.
But I wanted to start with another title that was brought up in that introduction that you
have, which is a rabble rouser, which before I'd read that, I had no idea what it is.
(02:30):
So I did bring it up as a definition for myself to read it to everybody.
For those who don't know what a rabble rouser is and want to be educated the way I was.
And the term is, rabble rouser refers to a person who incites or stirs up a crowd, often
with the intention of causing trouble or provoking a reaction.
They can also describe someone or something that tends to inspire mobs and is considered
(02:51):
controversial or provocative.
Oh dear.
I'd better have changed that then because I really don't want to be any of those things.
I thought a rabble rouser was just somebody who was like more fun, stirring up a few things,
changing up the norm.
Well, I think it is.
I mean, I think that ties in perfectly.
I wouldn't say you're controversial, but provocative, maybe you get people thinking and that's always
(03:13):
positive.
And so I think it's fitting.
Actually, a couple of my friends have nicknamed me Switzerland.
So I try not to be too controversial, especially the older I get and the crappier.
It's just like, I don't need to be controversial here.
But some of my friends call me Switzerland because I just like trying to mediate.
Well, that's great.
(03:34):
I mean, Switzerland is a great place.
Switzerland wants to sort of be friends with everyone, which, you know, not that Kenny wants
to be friends with everybody, but if you're looking for a friend in the accounting industry
and you're sitting in a corner by yourself, which I tend to find myself often, you will
definitely come over and give you some comfort and be kind to you and then include you in
the group.
And that's something I've really, really appreciated about you.
(03:55):
Yeah.
Well, I love doing that, actually.
I don't suffer as you've probably noticed.
I don't suffer from shyness, but I can.
And so I can really feel it when it's coming off of people.
Even introverts would like to talk to other people probably or hear what other people
have to say, but it can be hard to just kind of enter a space, right?
(04:19):
So if I see somebody, I'd love to bring them into a space and introduce them to other people
and then see what happens with that.
Yeah.
And I really appreciate that.
I mean, as a sort of introvert that doesn't really enjoy being around people, generally
speaking, I normally need a little bit of a coaxing to get into the space, especially
(04:40):
in some of these groups that I've been to find myself in at the conferences where a
lot of you guys know each other.
You all on the speaking circuit for lack of a better term and you spend a lot of time
with each other and being that sort of fringe player, it can be quite intimidating.
Yeah.
I try.
You know what?
I try to be super conscious of that because some of us do get to spend a lot of time together.
(05:04):
And it's so, I know how much I value those relationships and how my business and myself,
I can tell you the things I've learned from my accounting friends that have nothing to
do with accounting.
Just having this cohort of people that we are at the conferences together and we do
(05:24):
do some private retreats.
And so I'm super conscious of how blessed I am to have that, but how intimidating it
might feel to be there with some of us when it shouldn't be.
I know how nice all of these people are, but I could picture how intimidating it would
(05:47):
be because we're also natural with each other too.
No, for sure.
And I can guarantee you it is very intimidating group to be around.
I always appreciate the time I do get with the group that it is hard because everybody's
talking about something that's happened in the past, right?
So which is great because it means there is a community.
There's people sharing knowledge that that's really good for the industry.
(06:12):
And you know, it's, you know, when I sit and watch it from a distance, I go, well, that's
amazing.
I'm glad there is a group of leaders out there that is taking this industry by the
scruff of the neck looking to do it in a better way.
But when you're on the fringes of it and looking in, it's a little scary to just to try and
walk into a conversation.
Right.
But I mean, let's take into it connect last year when we were up on the outside deck and
(06:40):
meeting some of those people how open and awesome they are.
But I can't imagine walking up to some of them if I didn't know them.
So you know, and you were a natural with them once you got introduced.
There you were, right?
Oh yeah.
I think I did okay.
I will, I would say it was a great evening and every person I met was amazing.
(07:01):
And that, you know, again, just underlined that I think, you know, the accounting industry
and we'll, we'll exclude all the big firms from this, right?
We're focusing on, on the sort of core lack of a better term, sort of small to middle
market people are in really good hands.
And I think we're all very fortunate that there is this group of people that are willing
(07:22):
to give their time to educate and lighten and try set, you know, have a roadmap on
how we can do better and bring people in and make this an industry where people want to
work in the industry that people want to spend their careers in.
And I think that's really great for all of us because let's face it, it's not the most
shiny object out there for new graduates to come into.
(07:45):
People will sort of look at like that's, you know, that's my option two in case option
one doesn't work out.
Right.
Yeah.
What's interesting is that people around me in my real life, they, so if they hear,
and I can't tell you how many times I correct people and sometimes I just give up, I am
(08:05):
a bookkeeper up here in Canada, we have a super strong association and a certifying body.
So I'm a certified professional bookkeeper.
I was on our board of directors.
I've been on our conference committee for a long time.
It means the world to me.
That was really my starting point when I went to the first bookkeeper conference up here
and started to meet some of these people and we get quite a few accountants at that conference
(08:28):
as well because it has been so tech forward for so long.
So, but people call me an accountant all the time.
Even my husband said, oh, no, I'm a bookkeeper, but whatever.
So, but a lot of like my daughter-in-law loved how much I loved doing what I was doing and
(08:49):
she also loved the lifestyle that I had.
I'm not necessarily talking about the money part.
I'm talking about the freedom part.
And she loved how much I enjoyed my clients.
And so she did that.
So she, I said, okay, if that's what you want to do, here's the courses that you need to
take.
Here's the certifications you need to do.
(09:10):
And now she's doing great at it and she's got a lovely lifestyle going along with that.
She gets to work at home with her dogs.
She's got a couple of wiener dogs, questionable choice of dogs.
And they're adorable, actually.
And so then- As a cat person, I think any dog is a questionable choice.
(09:31):
Really?
We have six cats.
Oh, man, you're a crazy cat, man.
We are.
That's fun.
Oh, okay.
So some of my friends are like, this is a really great lifestyle.
And I'm like, yeah, it's a really great lifestyle.
But also the client's connection is amazing.
So you would kind of think, oh, being a bookkeeper and accountant, isn't a people job.
(09:56):
It's totally a people job.
It's totally a people job.
And right now I'm super grateful because my daughter, who I just want to strangle for
it, she has a convenience store.
Believe me, I did not see this coming.
It is super complicated bookkeeping.
And she could never afford the work of what I'm doing.
But I have a skill because I always thought a useful skill.
(10:19):
My son's a framer.
I'm like, that's a useful skill.
An electrician.
That's a useful skill.
How am I going to help my family by being a bookkeeper?
Well, now it turns out it's awesome, right?
Yeah, not for sure.
Yeah.
Well, two things there.
One, I love their term bookkeeper.
I always a little upset that it's sort of got a bit of a negative connotation over the
years.
I try push for all the time.
(10:40):
I'm happy to be called a bookkeeper.
Bookkeepers are critical in the accounting process and without them, it's really hard
to pull all those fancy reports if you don't have any bookkeeping work.
So let's not ignore them.
And then yeah, I think one of the most biggest fallacies of the world of accounting in general
be it a bookkeeper, an accountant, a tax person, an auditor is that a lot of times you get
(11:05):
pushed that way.
It's like, you can just sit with your computer and you can work with numbers where it turns
out everything we do in this space is all about people.
It is a people business.
And if you do not work on your people skills and your communication skills, it is going
to be very difficult to be successful in this industry.
Yeah.
And the other thing that's fun is it's a technology business.
So if you like playing in tech, it's super fun.
(11:28):
Yeah, it's definitely gone that way over the last few years where technology is really
important.
We've seen that at our firm as well and implemented tech leads that are making sure that they're
looking at technology on a regular basis, weaning out the ones that are just shiny objects
and not really useful and focusing on the ones that actually make a difference.
So that is important and it's definitely a place if you like technology, you're like
(11:50):
working with people and you just happen to be good with numbers, it's probably a good
place to spend your time because you'll hit all those points that will make you happy
and make it a great career.
Actually, so it's almost a fallacy about being good with numbers.
You don't actually have to be good with numbers in terms of math.
Yep.
(12:10):
I took calculus first year university.
I have no idea how I passed because honestly, I can't do any math whatsoever.
And then I have not done a single math thing in my head since.
Yep.
I live and die by my 10 key or and I use my URL bar.
I just put in calculations in there.
(12:31):
I put in calculations in the cells and QBO or Daxter wherever.
And I wish because the numbers thing is important.
You have to love data, I guess.
And love analyzing what those numbers mean.
But you don't actually have to do math.
So there's a part of me that wishes you could take accounting without having to have math
(12:59):
background because it's not all that necessary anymore.
Really?
Yeah.
I think what does help though is like math does teach you logical thinking and if you
can start a string together it like you pass calculus, you don't know how.
Well, there's some logical thinking behind it.
Right.
So I think it's, I always think when I'm thinking math and accounting, it doesn't mean you have
(13:20):
to be the greatest mathematician in the world.
But if you could get through a basic math course because you can think through the logic
of what needs to happen, that is really helpful.
You know, I mean, I've seen people who struggle with math and get through it, but you can
see they had the logic.
Like they knew where they were going in the math.
They just couldn't put it together.
And then when they rolled into accounting, they're like, oh, well, I can see the logic.
(13:41):
I'm like, oh, I'm counting.
There's just logic.
You don't have to worry about all these all special things that happen.
Left front center.
Unless you're an auditor, then you've got to know about all the special stuff.
And this is effectively math that you get to forget about all the, you know, the weird
options that could happen in the situation.
So as long as you can think logically, you know, and it is a good skill.
I mean, me and my brother think very similarly the way we look at numbers.
(14:03):
I became an accountant.
He became an engineer.
Right.
So both of them problem solvers in their own right.
But he was probably better at math.
So he went the engineering out.
I was just good enough in math.
So I went there.
Yeah.
So I have a question.
Sure.
You're from South Africa.
100%.
Say South Africa.
I love the way South Africans say South Africa.
(14:25):
Well, I've got a very broken accent.
I'm at this point.
It's converted to California and better South Africa.
Yeah.
It's like you're missing a couple of letters when you say it.
The end of it.
It's like South Africa or something.
I can't even do it.
Can I ask you why you decided to come to, did you come or did you come with your parents?
My wife got a job and then I followed her.
(14:48):
Okay.
Yeah.
So she was a CFO of a winery and the investment group brought her over to be their CFO.
So is that what led to your niche?
Yeah.
That's how I tripped and doubled into it.
I was automotive and then technology and now got over a year and started working for
the same business as she did.
They were in the wine space.
So we ended up in the wine space and that's where I spent the last 11 years.
(15:11):
Now, do you only do accounting for wineries?
94% of our business is wineries.
Okay.
Would see other like a friend's business?
Sort of a little bit, but also more like if you're a business owner and you have another
business will help you with it as long as it's not construction or sales.
We'll come and help you do it.
So it's sort of just, it's almost like the plus ones.
(15:34):
Okay.
I like that you call them the plus ones.
That's cute.
Yeah.
Oh, okay.
Cool.
But we're the totally off track of what we're supposed to be talking about and that is talking
about Kelly.
I would think is really interesting for everybody to hear about is your background and how did
you end up becoming a bookkeeper because it is an interesting path.
Okay.
(15:54):
But I wouldn't say it's that interesting.
Can I come back to you for one more question?
Because my husband and I were talking about that this morning.
He's on podcasts occasionally.
He is on fly fishing podcasts, which apparently is way more interesting to our family and
friends than accounting podcasts.
So we need to change that.
And I was telling him that you do wineries and he sees like, oh, that's perfect.
(16:15):
For you.
You like wine.
Do you only do wineries in California?
No, we're in, I think eight or nine states at the moment.
Oh, okay.
Yeah.
So we'll do a winery anywhere really.
Got to maybe start looking at the Canada market as well.
Maybe an opportunity, but for now it's just in the US.
Right.
(16:36):
Oh, okay.
Cool.
Well, there you go then.
Yeah.
You can come back if you want.
I'm guessing you're way more interesting than me.
Cause I have lived in miles.
Honestly, I live like where I grew up, essentially, my parents are a couple of doors down.
My kids are right here.
I've got the same friends for like 60 years, like nothing.
(16:59):
I am the middle list of the middle class, the whitest of the whitest.
Like there is nothing interesting about that.
But until they spend five minutes with you and then they realize how interesting you
are and how you can show people the best way to live a life of absolute balance and happiness
and do things you want to do.
(17:21):
Well, I will say I get to do a lot of things that I want to do, but I am going to say that
part of that comes with the age that I'm at.
You and I were talking about you're running your kids around right now.
There was a point I was on my own with my kids for almost seven years.
I wouldn't have thought there was much life balance then other than the joy that my kids
gave me.
(17:42):
And then for the next, you know, it was 20 years of, as you know, driving them around
and going to their things and all of the things.
So it, but I will say I actually still prioritize some of my sports, especially.
I really like to ski.
I really like to go out for a run in the forest without anybody around.
(18:03):
And so I, I've always been pretty liberal with, with doing that kind of thing.
But I want to preface anything about my lifestyle with the fact that I am older and I'm at a
point where it's a little bit easier to do, right?
So because sometimes people are like, oh, that's so easy for her to say, right?
(18:24):
She's not hanging out with a couple of teenagers that are driving her around the corner.
So, or you're driving them around the corner.
You still had to know what you wanted and put that in action, right?
And it didn't necessarily start as a bookkeeper.
So wait, did your career start?
So I actually took sports therapy at university.
(18:45):
I did not finish.
In fact, then when you were trying to pick your courses, I actually picked too many science
courses and not enough liberal arts to finish my science degree.
So that was a pain in the butt.
But that was fine because I actually wound up with my trainer certificate.
So that was super cool.
I was working with professional athletes.
Basically, I was the bigger joints and it was really cool.
(19:09):
But then I kind of, no matter how gorgeous they were, I realized I really didn't like
one person on person business model.
I didn't felt like I wanted to be more in the business to business model.
And so somebody that I was working on owned a business and I wound up going into sales
(19:34):
for him and then one thing led to another.
And then the next thing I know, I'm in the marketing business.
And so, and then when I was working in the marketing business, I realized I didn't want
any small sales.
I wanted big sales.
I wanted to deal with bigger companies.
So I wanted the real B2B market, not just small business to small business market.
(19:56):
And so then that led to the marketing company that we had and we had an import program from
China.
Can I talk about the import program from China?
Because that was super interesting.
No, I'd love to hear about it.
So when you have an, so we had corporate clients.
We had companies that were basically led by securities commissions rule.
So we had banks, insurance companies, mutual fund companies, that kind of thing.
(20:18):
Very corporate.
And so tone on tone, everything was very low key.
But there was no flash to any of the stuff we were importing from China.
So this was the swag side or the portfolios.
You know how you get a portfolio and it used to be in a binder?
Well, we had a binder import program from China.
As odd as that sounds, it was super interesting because we're dealing with an entirely different
(20:43):
culture and way of doing things.
And there's some lessons for us in the accounting industry.
And that is just keep trying, man, because we would send over the drawings of what we
wanted and we would get prototypes back that were exactly what we wanted.
But every single time we would get something that had flash to it, that had color to it,
(21:07):
that like if there was pens to go with the binders, the pens would light up or they'd
have dingle balls hanging off the end or they'd be sparkly or they would send us other
swag not related to the program we were doing at all.
And at one point we wound up getting some of this fun swag because we were doing like
a kids program at one point for the one of the banks or whatever.
(21:31):
And so I kind of love that they never gave up on what they thought we wanted.
It did get to be annoying.
I think there's some lessons as accountants for that and that is maybe know what your
market is.
Yep.
And who you're marketing to.
But if you think you've got some really great idea, maybe just keep throwing it out there
(21:51):
a little bit.
Don't be as pushy as this program was.
But it was funny.
So you deal with a broker and our broker's name, we also learned this.
His name was Yan Li and his company was called Yan Li Trading.
And every single time he called us, he had call display and he would say, Kelly, it's
Yan Li of Yan Li Trading.
(22:14):
And it was so ingrained in him because I don't know how many times I said to him, Yan, I
only know one Yan and I only know one Yan Li who owns Yan Li Trading.
It was these fun relationships and he introduced me to bubble tea.
Yep.
So which I never did get a hang.
Do you drink bubble tea?
No, not a chance.
No, not it.
(22:35):
No, it's just no, not my gig.
Just a distraction to the caffeine that I want.
Oh, well, there you go.
So the import program was interesting, but what was happening was in our marketing company.
And so in 2009, because we were on max and I'm needing to do estimating and invoicing
(23:00):
properly.
So basically that stuff was being done in Excel while I was on numbers.
So I was on a max.
So it was in numbers and it was going out in the documents.
But that wasn't working for me.
So I, in 2009, took up with FreshBooks.
(23:21):
And that was great.
You could actually job cost fairly well in FreshBooks and certainly you could invoice
properly in FreshBooks and you could send them off on the World Wide Web.
That was fantastic.
And so, and then we were running parallels so that we could run QuickBooks online at
QuickBooks desktop here in Canada.
We didn't have QuickBooks for Mac.
(23:44):
So I was running parallels.
That was a, that was a bit of a pig though, like that.
Do you use a Mac at all?
Okay.
Parallels allows you to do Windows programs.
It basically parallels the Mac into two separate operating systems.
So then I wound up, that wasn't working.
I wound up getting a PC just to run QuickBooks.
(24:06):
And I absolutely loved, like the minute I met QuickBooks, I was like, this thinks like
I think.
So we moved our job costing into that.
But we, by 2009, were already spending a good chunk of the winter in Florida.
So I then, my girlfriend told me how to host QuickBooks desktop on Dropbox.
(24:26):
So we were basically on the cloud on QuickBooks desktop for a long time before QuickBooks
online was available for us here in Canada.
So that's how you got into it, just because you needed to solve your own problems.
So you sort of taught yourself.
Yeah.
So what was happening was stuff was going off to the account and say it was fine, but
it's six months behind.
(24:47):
And then we're getting, you know, the stuff back.
I was doing job costing anyways.
Basically our marketing business was all project management.
So you're starting with the end product, where it needs to be delivered and who needs
to be, and then you work your way up to the start.
So you start at the end and you work your way.
It was called work backs.
And then we work our way to the starting point and who are all the stakeholders, who's going
(25:12):
to do the design, where are you going to order it?
Because we ordered paper from China as well, by and large.
Depending on the size of the job, sometimes we could have it printed off shore as well.
And so then, you know, then I'm job costing everything.
And I realized how much I love that, but also how much those same skills translated into
(25:35):
doing books.
And so then I was doing a few books for a few other people just because now I'm loving
it so much.
And then eventually trans isn't transitioned into that's not with the marketing business
anymore.
So you're not solving all your problems for your clients in the marketing business.
You just decided I'm going to take on some accounting clients because I love it so much.
(25:59):
Yeah, well, and then it kind of grew a little because the accountant who was doing stuff
for me, then he's like, you get the creative industry.
Do you want to, can you do a few more of those?
And then I realized actually that I loved doing that.
So it just was this little, little thing that grew.
(26:20):
And my affinity for tech because in the marketing, particularly in the, in the print industry,
the same thing that happened in 2012 to 2014 with this whole transition to cloud technology
that was wonderful and awful all at the same time.
We were 20 years ahead of that.
It doesn't sound like a big deal now, but when PDF came out and we no longer had to
(26:45):
send these giant press sheets.
We went direct to play FTP sites.
So FTP sites came, we're no longer sending things by courier.
I'm free to be in Florida or we loved Colorado.
So we were spending a good chunk of the winter in Colorado.
It opened up all of this freedom, but and it improved our clients lives because they
(27:11):
were getting things done in a more timely manner.
Everything was driven by securities commissions.
So we were always tight on deadlines.
And then it's the same skill sets and it's the same love of technology that translates
into the accounting world.
Really interesting.
So when did you decide, okay, I'm a full-time bookkeeper.
He's running them both.
(27:32):
16 maybe?
Mostly.
Yeah.
I would say.
So there's some overlap for a while and then at one point you just decided, okay, this
is where I'm going.
Forget about the marketing stuff.
Yeah.
Well, not quite forgot about it because you're doing a great job of marketing yourself still.
(27:52):
But I'm sure those skills help.
But that's when we decided, 2016 we're going in, we're going to be a bookkeeper.
That's what clearly gives you energy and it allows you to live the lifestyle that you're
looking to live.
It's a really beneficial.
And now you have a bunch of stuff going on, right?
You still have the bookkeeping.
Yeah.
But you do a bunch of other things as well.
(28:12):
Yeah.
So because I was in marketing and because I was in the cloud technology so early, I was
working with the app partners, especially on, okay, it needs to do this.
Please don't let it do that.
So I was lucky enough to be working with companies like Intuit and HubDoc was one of my super
(28:37):
early app partners that I was working with.
I mean, I work with a ton of the app partners, but let's take HubDoc, for example, they
were like, okay, well, you're working with the dev guys over here, but we're all on a
call and then they're like, can you write an article for us?
And I'm like, sure, I can write an article for it.
(28:58):
And then so I started that my very first foray into working with the app partners outside
of dev stuff was writing for HubDoc and then Intuit picked up on that.
So I was doing some writing for them.
And then I was invited to be one of their part of their trainer writer network.
And so then the next thing, you know, I'm doing teaching work for Intuit.
(29:21):
And then I'm doing teaching work for all kinds of app partners was super fun and early in
the beginning.
And I just happened to be in the right place at the right time with the right background.
And so that that that was the little adventure that grew.
I didn't say to myself, oh, you know what?
I want to be and I don't think of myself as a speaker, but I like I'm going to be a speaker
(29:49):
that never crossed my mind.
It still doesn't feel like that.
It's like this natural transition into all of these super fun opportunities.
So if you don't think you're going to develop a speaker, what do you think of yourself as
like teacher or is there a way that you sort of think about it?
Yeah, two ways.
One is a teacher for sure.
And I've been given lots of fun platforms to do that.
(30:11):
And then the other one is some people I don't can't stand the word influencer, but I get
to be an advocate for what I think is going to change accounting lives and client lives.
And that has been really a really good ride because I am knee deep in development work
(30:34):
as well.
So I rather than the app partner saying, I think the accounting industry wants this,
I get to be a voice that says that's actually not what we want.
And by the way, that button over there really stinks.
Right.
So that's kind of fun.
You think it's an advantage that you're sort of coming from another industry before accounting
(30:56):
that you sort of, you can sort of see through all of the garbage that gets thrown your way
a little bit because you're an end user of a different product before you got into the
bookkeeping world.
So you know what does and doesn't work.
100%.
That totally led to where I am is coming from the marketing industry.
And especially since the marketing industry was so tech heavy.
(31:16):
Yep.
Right.
So tech driven, like forever, like Photoshop when so there was a product called InDesign.
I'm probably going to get too far into the weeds.
Right.
Okay.
So a product called InDesign came along that was set to disrupt some of the other creation
products, design products.
(31:40):
And there was a lot of blowback on InDesign, for example.
Are you looking up InDesign right now?
I am.
Yeah.
And so that was a huge disruption and everybody was like, oh, this is just going to stink.
And it did stink in the beginning.
QuickBooks Online was like a momentous step backwards from QuickBooks Desktop.
(32:01):
And so what happened was, and a friend of mine who was formerly into it and was one
of the handlers, he looked after the trainer writer network or the accountant network.
And he and I laughed.
I was early on in QuickBooks Online just because I already loved online technology.
And I had a US URL at that point.
(32:22):
I was in Florida.
And I'm munking about in QuickBooks Online and I'm playing with it.
I'm playing in the US version without knowing it.
And then as soon as it came to Canada, I got the Canadian version and it was like DOS met
Excel.
And so what happened was though, the original QuickBooks Online platform is not even the
(32:42):
same platform.
So as they got new customers, they put them on the new code, let's call it the new code,
the new actual QuickBooks Online.
They put them on that one.
But what they did was not migrate the old ones off nearly as quickly as we would have
liked.
So early adopters were last in on the new platform.
(33:09):
And what a difference.
I mean, I was having a day yesterday, to be honest.
I was having a day in QuickBooks Online and I called a friend and I was ranting to her.
But on those days when it's not doing what I want, I still try to keep in mind we have
come light years in the services we can provide for our clients and where we can provide them
(33:35):
from.
So even on those bad days, I try to keep in mind that I would not want to be back where
I was before.
That is good advice.
Sometimes we have to let go of the past and be thankful for what we got right now.
It is interesting that I never knew that there was a totally different platform for
QuickBooks Online.
It does explain a lot of the time when I run into more experienced accountants that love
(34:01):
QuickBooks Desktop because they're like, oh, QuickBooks Online was so terrible when it
first came out and they've never tried it again.
Where I only arrived in the US in 2013.
So my first introduction to QuickBooks Online was 2014.
I was like, this thing is amazing.
I don't know what you people are all going on about because I think it's better than
a desktop and I've been an advocate for it since then.
I love the platform, I think it does a lot of great stuff.
(34:22):
Now granted, I don't actually do a lot of work in QuickBooks anymore.
My job has moved on from there, but I do love it.
My team find it useful.
With a remote team in another country, having the online access is obviously a lot easier
than the desktop version and hosting as well.
So we see a lot of benefits for going from it.
But it at least explains why some people are so adamant that QuickBooks Online is a terrible
(34:43):
platform.
Yeah, actually can I give you a change management example that went on right here at our house?
We live in a 100 year old cabin that we bought seven years ago.
We bought it from my husband's family.
He has family, so we bought it.
So we bought this cabin and it was a seasonal cottage.
We both, our heart is in it.
Both our families grew up on the, we live on a lake on a point.
(35:06):
We both grew up here with family cottages.
So most people would have taken it down, but then my family banded together.
And we live in a 100 year old cabin that has some quirks, we'll call it.
But the irony of it is, it is completely tricked out as a smart home.
(35:26):
And my husband did not want me to do that.
He was like, no, I don't want a smart home.
I have a girlfriend who just basically built a house and didn't smart home any of it, like
not even an outlet because she's so just, he did not want it to happen.
So I did what every good wife does.
He went away for the weekend and I smart home the house.
(35:48):
So we put the new, my dad helped me.
We put on the new thermostat.
We changed out switches and plugs and light bulbs and tied everything into Alexa and
all of the things.
And so when he came home, he was not the least bit happy with me that I had done that.
And he's like, well, I just want to run around and turn on lights.
And I'm like, go ahead, you can still turn on a light.
(36:11):
It doesn't mean you can't.
And so now he, and that he and Alexa had like this whole tortured relationship and he would
yell at her and sometimes she doesn't do what you want and all the things.
So anyways, he got used to the smart home.
So now he loves that you, you know, Alexa, turn on good morning and all of the good morning
(36:32):
lights come on or whatever.
It doesn't matter.
So, but when, when the internet goes out and he now officially has to run around and turn
on a light bulb, he is not happy.
And I think that that's that same analogy that goes with some of this things like when
yesterday when QuickBooks was, was giving me a hard time.
It's like, okay, but I still don't really want to go back to the old way of doing it.
(36:57):
And so we get mad that the technology has gotten so great for us that the minute that
we don't have it running the way we want it to.
Now we're like, oh, why did I do this?
Right?
Yeah.
And I think we're pretty spoiled with what is available to us as an industry, not just
like QuickBooks, but just the apps that are out there and how much they make our lives
easier from a day to day process, from doing a job process, that when things don't work,
(37:20):
we get so upset.
And yeah, we all do it.
We all do it.
Like, man, this is just not working for me.
Like, I mean, we use carbon as our practice management software and I went down on Friday
afternoon and everybody was on a text going, I guess we're going for a weekend.
I'm at a point where I literally can't do my job unless carbon's working.
I'm that reliant on it.
And it quickly makes you realize in those points where they get frustrated with some
(37:44):
of the things they do, but then when I had to go to Outlook and all of a sudden try
to run my day, I was like, this is, I just can't operate without the technology.
So I probably need to take a deep breath when things aren't going my way properly and remember
what the alternative is.
Because even in that situation, it felt like I went back to carry a pigeon days to be able
to do my account work.
(38:04):
Like, okay, we've been all over the place.
And you said there's not going to be interesting.
You are really all one of the most interesting people I know, Kelly.
And mostly make me really happy to talk to you because you bring such good energy to
the room and make me smile and tell great stories.
And that is really good.
But I am interested, what is next for Kelly?
What is on your goals in the near future?
(38:26):
Yeah, actually, I've been really honing those.
And Zane, I hope also you think that I listened to you well.
Oh, you're amazing.
Oh, okay.
Good.
I, one of my big goals is to be a more active listener and find out.
So hopefully I am listening well as well.
(38:46):
You are.
And so I mean, you're listening well, but you're also following your title and sort of running
your own course at this point.
And this should, I'm going to be, normally it's a pretty conversations by Zane Stevens.
It's going to be pretty conversations by Kelly Parks.
It's a good thing.
I love it.
I'm learning a ton.
And I think this is really insightful stuff.
(39:08):
But back to your goals.
What are your goals going forward?
Yeah, because I've been really, I've been really thinking about them because I do, I am part-time
now and I have to decide in order to stay part-time, some stuff has got to go.
And I really working on what gives me joy.
So I had an opportunity with a new app partner and I basically said, you're going to have
(39:30):
to give me some super compelling reasons.
And I don't mean that the way it just came out.
I don't mean that.
But if I'm going to get behind this, the person left an app that I love and now they've gone
to a new app and it's got great possibilities.
But I got to learn to say no to some of this stuff, right?
So my biggest goal is to build the bookkeeping side back up.
(39:57):
I basically have four businesses going on underneath my umbrella and they are 25% each.
So it's the partnership, it's the working with firms, it's the teaching or the whatever
you want to call it, going to conferences, basically, you know, the junkets as my husband
calls them and the bookkeeping business.
(40:17):
If the only thing I can keep, like if I can only do one thing, it's going to be the bookkeeping.
I'm going back to that.
So I've been working on building that up and my target audience is accounting firms to
do their QuickBooks book, their own, not the client files theirs.
Because those are still who I love dealing with.
(40:38):
That's who I still want to hang out with.
I just, I want to do it differently and I love the books of accounting firms.
I'll take on some professional services.
That's what I do have anyways.
And I've got some accounting firm.
So I changed, so I've had some friends revisit my website on that.
I've started to take some stuff off my website or put so much friction behind it that somebody
(41:04):
really has to pay me well for me to do it.
There's no other way to say it, right?
And then I reduced the friction on my bookkeeping.
So although I talk about automated discovery processes and all of that, and I believe so
mightily in a discovery form and make sure the people that are getting through to you
(41:26):
are only the people that are going to value you, like getting rid of the tire kickers,
especially since so many bookkeepers, especially can be doormats and they'll just take the
calls and give them all the answers.
I don't need to do that anymore.
My niche is so tight, given that it's quick books online for accounting firms that yesterday,
(41:47):
so I had a few friends run through my discovery form and they're like, why are you doing that?
I'm like, why am I doing this?
So I took my discovery form off and I just put up my booking link and I put up my phone
number and I put up my email because I have said this is all I do.
And I don't think there's an accounting firm out there that's going to abuse that.
I think a discovery form is super important because accountants and bookkeepers get abused
(42:09):
because we're so darn nice.
And so that was a big step because that is going to reduce any friction.
So somebody can just call me and we can talk right then and there or they can book a call
with me and we can just say, because it's already on my site, what I do and don't do.
So I'm like, call me.
So that aligns with my goal of building back up the bookkeeping side because that was much
(42:34):
bigger before.
Very interesting.
I think there's a good lesson there for people is to understand your priorities and the way
you said it was just like, there has to be a compelling reason for somebody to take some
of that time from your other priorities.
And being in a place where you can set those priorities, you understand what's important
to you and say noted things that maybe don't align with where you want to go or what you're
(42:55):
trying to achieve.
I think that that is huge.
And I think we should all be working towards that.
I'm trying to be better at that as well because I like to say yes to everything as well and
take on a little bit too much at times.
Mostly because I like to work, but also because I'm not the greatest to saying no.
But I think it's a great lesson for all of us is understand what those priorities are,
make sure you're working towards them.
(43:16):
And if something else comes along, it could be worthwhile.
That is a worthwhile right now.
You need to be able to make that assessment and see if it does fit in within your priorities.
Yeah, well, and I'm going to be, so I'm at scaling new heights.
I've got a couple of sessions and one of them is automating your discovery process.
I still advocate for, my process is still fairly automated.
(43:39):
I mean, there's a bulking link.
I don't, you know, there's, and then you don't have to run back and forward at different
times or things like that.
And then the next step is a file review and that's completely like the process for that,
you know, they fill out a form, they pay for it.
And then it sets it up.
I use financial sense.
(43:59):
You use carbon.
It sets up a client and it kicks off a workflow in financial sense.
They upload things because it gives them instructions from the type form, what's going to happen.
They do that and then I do my thing.
So that side of it, but I still think the part of saying no, that having that discovery
(44:20):
form, the other thing that happened was sometimes, even I had a really good referral from an
accounting firm.
It sounded like it was going to be perfect.
But I still sent the discovery form.
This is a couple of years ago and they filled it out and we absolutely were not a fit because
they weren't going to connect their bank fees.
And that was a hard no for them, not even a maybe, right?
(44:41):
Because your forms can have maybes because you don't want to kick everybody out.
And so they weren't going to, but then they sent me a note and they said that they really
appreciated that we didn't wind up having a call because it wasn't going to work for
him.
And then he referred a really great client to me.
So I still believe in it, but in my niche being so honed.
I don't need it.
You know, if you are in the accounting space and you are looking at that automation of
(45:02):
that process, the intake process, go check out Kelly's stuff on that.
We used it at Protea and we're still working on it and trying to refine it more and more
as we go through the process.
You know, we're pretty niche, but there's a lot of different variables in it.
So that worked.
We're still trying to figure out what the best way to make that match fit into it.
You know, maybe we need to also ask the question on sort of Austin have questions around technology
(45:28):
to see if people open to it because we do see that that's where we have a lot of friction
with it.
Like, yeah, we'll do that until they actually have to do it.
So maybe yes and yes, no, maybe it's probably a better way to go versus yes or no.
Because if they're maybe they're probably going to say yes and that doesn't necessarily
actually mean yes.
Something for me to think about is something for all the listeners to think about as well.
Well, can I do a plug too?
I wouldn't come to me anymore.
(45:49):
I mean, come to a session.
There's great articles.
Just use them as a blueprint.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But also join some of the communities like Automation Town by Chad Davis.
I mean, that's where a lot of that is.
I mean, we know the groups.
There's some great community groups out there for all that kind of support.
I am still doing work with firms, but it's pretty, pretty specific.
(46:12):
It's more fixing things than building things now.
Okay.
If you were talking to somebody that was considering coming to the accounting space, we come a
bookkeeper.
What advice would you give them?
Well, race technology would definitely be a part of it.
Keep that human touch part of it in mind.
You could sit back and just be in the background, but if you actually want to own a firm or
(46:38):
run a firm, then you're going to need to work on your human skills, I think would be a big
part of it.
And you need to work on expectations and boundaries probably, and how can you make technology
set some of those boundaries and expectations for you so that you're not directly saying,
(47:01):
no, did that make sense?
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, it did.
Yeah.
And don't think of it as just strictly loving math, which is where we started this whole
conversation, right?
Drop that sentence.
Yeah.
So, yeah.
You know what, I think you still need to know core accounting though.
This is the one thing that I see.
You can't come in and then get QuickBooks certified and think you're going to deliver
(47:24):
a good product because you need to live in the balance sheet and no amount of certification
is ever going to teach you about debits and credits and the importance of the balance
sheet and why the balance sheet matters.
I think that's the fundamental thing that underlies accounting.
If the balance sheet is a piece of crap, then everything else is wrong.
(47:47):
Yeah.
I talk about that often.
The importance of reconciling that balance sheet and making sure it's all accurate.
I believe everybody should go get some education.
There's enough certifications through the different bookkeeping associations that you
can go get the basics that can help you.
There is a bit of a warning for people that are getting a bookkeeper in as well.
Some background in accounting does help because they can actually understand the way it works
(48:10):
all the way through the process and something you should consider.
The certification helps.
Knowing how to use the technology helps.
If you've got the accounting basics in the background, it goes from good to great pretty
quickly.
Yeah, exactly.
Kelly, this has been amazing.
I really do appreciate your time.
Definitely the most unique episode of career conversations, which I'm not surprised by
(48:32):
at all.
I was bracing myself for a little different today, which is why I appreciate you so much
because you do bring some different, you bring some fresh air to the accounting space.
Keep me on my toes and you sort of force me to be better.
I see the things that you're doing and it makes me want to be a better accountant and
a better person.
So thank you for always doing that and always putting your best foot forward.
(48:54):
Wow.
Well, thank you, Zane.
I'm blushing.
Thank you very much.
I appreciate you and I always love being in your presence.
You have a lovely, calm manner about yourself and of course you've got an excellent starting
point with the accent.
It definitely helps.
Kelly, we like to end off pretty conversations with some rapid fire questions.
(49:16):
I have five questions for you if you're ready.
Sure.
What is your dream vacation?
Okay, man.
Japan.
I want to go do some hiking in Japan.
Sounds like a great option.
Can't convince my wife on that trip yet, but I'm trying.
I can't convince my husband either.
We just came off of Sedona a couple of weeks hiking there, but he wants to go back to New
Zealand.
I think our Australia's lined up.
(49:37):
We have family out there.
What would your death row meal be?
What would your final meal be if you had to make that decision?
Oh, the Green Mile meal.
That's what my husband calls it, the Green Mile meal.
So I don't know.
I like a good chicken wing.
It's got to be breaded though, not a naked one.
So if it's going to be my Green Mile and it's going to be accompanied by something called
(49:58):
Miss Vicki's chips, which is a kind of kettle cook chip up here.
Unbelievable.
So, or maybe my husband's pot roast.
That's all great options.
What is the quality?
What's your Green Mile meal?
It would be pork chop, mashed potatoes, Brussels sprouts with a nice cold beer on the side.
(50:19):
All right.
Brussels sprouts.
It's interesting.
I love them, but interesting.
Okay, cool.
Yep, I might have to make that this weekend.
What is the quality you appreciate a good friend?
Empathy, for sure.
What like is honesty?
I don't need brutal honesty, but decent honesty.
I would like if people say the same things to me as they say when I'm not there.
(50:42):
Agreed.
Number four, is there a favorite book that you recommend everybody reads?
No.
I am a very, my kids say that I am the world's most shallow reader.
My favorite author is somebody called John Sanford.
I'm a murder mystery thriller gal.
So no, I read a lot.
I'm a writer of the book, don't know.
(51:03):
Yeah, it's a guy named John Sanford.
I'm going to tell a quick story.
So a friend of mine who sadly has passed away has this insane library collection.
We love the same authors, but John Sanford is the favorite of both of us.
He flew to California for a book signing and he brought me back.
A book signed for me.
(51:24):
And so that will be one of my most treasured things that I will ever own, even though I
generally get my books from the library.
Very nice.
That is a great story.
Thank you for sharing that.
Lost question.
What is a favorite piece of technology that makes your life better?
Definitely Alexa.
As shallow as that sounds, she does a lot of little stupid things for me.
(51:48):
I've talked about running around, turning on lights.
I don't want to.
When we travel quite a bit too.
So if we've got the heat turned down.
So smart tech maybe?
Because I can turn the furnace up from afar.
I can also turn the music on because our kids generally stay with us.
I can turn the music on when I'm not here and creep them out.
That's a great bonus right there.
(52:12):
What's your favorite piece of tech?
That's a tough one, right?
I would say it's probably my Apple Watch.
Yeah.
It just keeps me more accountable specifically to get up and walk around when I've been
sitting on my desk for six hours without looking up.
Right.
So I like it from that standpoint to keep me accountable, get the vibration, time to
do something.
(52:33):
So I've seen a definite improvement in my health since I've got the Apple Watch.
Oh nice.
Kelly, thank you so much for your time today.
I appreciate you being a guest on Proto Conversations.
Well thank you, Zane.
I appreciate you having me.
And with that, we ended another Proto Conversations.
Thank you for joining us on this journey of learning and inspiration.
Today we've gained insight from our guests and taken another step towards understanding
(52:55):
the diverse atmosphere of leadership and business and accounting.
Remember, each conversation is a step towards the positive transformation of business leaders.
We hope our discussion has given you valuable takeaways to apply in your own career and
life.
Don't forget to subscribe to Proto Conversations on YouTube and Spotify so you never miss an
episode.
We'd also love to hear your thoughts and experiences so connect with me on social media channels.
(53:16):
I'm most active on LinkedIn and for no but to join the conversation.
Join us next time for more engaging stories, advice, and conversations like that.
Until then, keep striving for excellence, and race, and growing.
Thank you for listening.
Be kind and goodbye for Proto Conversations.
Welcome to Proteon Conversations, the podcast where leadership in business and accounting
(00:09):
isn't just discussed, it's explored.
I'm your host, St. Stephens, and thank you for joining me as we delve into the minds of
some of the most influential leaders in the industry.
Our journey is one of discovery, from unraveling the unique stories that shaped our guest careers,
to invaluable advice that fueled their success.
We hereby provide you with a simple, actionable advice to accelerate your career and personal
growth.
Whether you're a budding professional or a seasoned executive, these conversations
(00:31):
are designed to offer insight and perspectives that resonate with everyone.
So tune in, engage, and be inspired as we build better leaders together.
Welcome to Proteon Conversations.
Today, I'm excited to be joined by Kelly Parks, the chief rabble rouser at Calmwater's
Cloud Accounting.
Kelly is a passionate advocate for cloud-based accounting, helping firms streamline their
work for us and embrace technology to create more efficient, profitable, and lifestyle-friendly
(00:56):
businesses.
With years of experience integrating cloud solutions and guiding firms through automation
and process improvement, Kelly has built a reputation as a thought lead in the industry.
Beyond accounting, she's a dedicated runner, skier, traveler, and live music fan, bringing
energy and enthusiasm to everything she does.
In this episode, we'll explore Kelly's journey, her insights of the future of cloud accounting,
and how firms can leverage technology to work smarter, not harder.
(01:19):
Kelly, welcome to Proteon Conversations, and thank you for being here.
Well, having me, Zane.
I want to come back to the thought leader thing.
I like to think of myself more as a thought-sharer.
Not sure I have an original thought in my head, but I'm happy to share all the good
ideas that I do here along the way.
Well, sometimes a great leader takes good ideas and puts them into a platform that is
(01:43):
easier for people to digest.
And when I think of the way you share your message to other people, I don't think about
is it an original thought by Kelly.
I do think about it in a way that that is a really unique and simple way to explain
a difficult topic.
And I think that is necessary because we get stuck in the complex of all these situations
(02:05):
rather than realizing that we stick to the simple, more people will understand, the
more chance they'll be successful.
Thank you.
I like the way you just spun that.
Yeah, so you're definitely, in my mind, a thought leader.
But I wanted to start with another title that was brought up in that introduction that you
have, which is a rabble rouser, which before I'd read that, I had no idea what it is.
(02:30):
So I did bring it up as a definition for myself to read it to everybody.
For those who don't know what a rabble rouser is and want to be educated the way I was.
And the term is, rabble rouser refers to a person who incites or stirs up a crowd, often
with the intention of causing trouble or provoking a reaction.
They can also describe someone or something that tends to inspire mobs and is considered
(02:51):
controversial or provocative.
Oh dear.
I'd better have changed that then because I really don't want to be any of those things.
I thought a rabble rouser was just somebody who was like more fun, stirring up a few things,
changing up the norm.
Well, I think it is.
I mean, I think that ties in perfectly.
I wouldn't say you're controversial, but provocative, maybe you get people thinking and that's always
(03:13):
positive.
And so I think it's fitting.
Actually, a couple of my friends have nicknamed me Switzerland.
So I try not to be too controversial, especially the older I get and the crappier.
It's just like, I don't need to be controversial here.
But some of my friends call me Switzerland because I just like trying to mediate.
Well, that's great.
(03:34):
I mean, Switzerland is a great place.
Switzerland wants to sort of be friends with everyone, which, you know, not that Kenny wants
to be friends with everybody, but if you're looking for a friend in the accounting industry
and you're sitting in a corner by yourself, which I tend to find myself often, you will
definitely come over and give you some comfort and be kind to you and then include you in
the group.
And that's something I've really, really appreciated about you.
(03:55):
Yeah.
Well, I love doing that, actually.
I don't suffer as you've probably noticed.
I don't suffer from shyness, but I can.
And so I can really feel it when it's coming off of people.
Even introverts would like to talk to other people probably or hear what other people
have to say, but it can be hard to just kind of enter a space, right?
(04:19):
So if I see somebody, I'd love to bring them into a space and introduce them to other people
and then see what happens with that.
Yeah.
And I really appreciate that.
I mean, as a sort of introvert that doesn't really enjoy being around people, generally
speaking, I normally need a little bit of a coaxing to get into the space, especially
(04:40):
in some of these groups that I've been to find myself in at the conferences where a
lot of you guys know each other.
You all on the speaking circuit for lack of a better term and you spend a lot of time
with each other and being that sort of fringe player, it can be quite intimidating.
Yeah.
I try.
You know what?
I try to be super conscious of that because some of us do get to spend a lot of time together.
(05:04):
And it's so, I know how much I value those relationships and how my business and myself,
I can tell you the things I've learned from my accounting friends that have nothing to
do with accounting.
Just having this cohort of people that we are at the conferences together and we do
(05:24):
do some private retreats.
And so I'm super conscious of how blessed I am to have that, but how intimidating it
might feel to be there with some of us when it shouldn't be.
I know how nice all of these people are, but I could picture how intimidating it would
(05:47):
be because we're also natural with each other too.
No, for sure.
And I can guarantee you it is very intimidating group to be around.
I always appreciate the time I do get with the group that it is hard because everybody's
talking about something that's happened in the past, right?
So which is great because it means there is a community.
There's people sharing knowledge that that's really good for the industry.
(06:12):
And you know, it's, you know, when I sit and watch it from a distance, I go, well, that's
amazing.
I'm glad there is a group of leaders out there that is taking this industry by the
scruff of the neck looking to do it in a better way.
But when you're on the fringes of it and looking in, it's a little scary to just to try and
walk into a conversation.
Right.
But I mean, let's take into it connect last year when we were up on the outside deck and
(06:40):
meeting some of those people how open and awesome they are.
But I can't imagine walking up to some of them if I didn't know them.
So you know, and you were a natural with them once you got introduced.
There you were, right?
Oh yeah.
I think I did okay.
I will, I would say it was a great evening and every person I met was amazing.
(07:01):
And that, you know, again, just underlined that I think, you know, the accounting industry
and we'll, we'll exclude all the big firms from this, right?
We're focusing on, on the sort of core lack of a better term, sort of small to middle
market people are in really good hands.
And I think we're all very fortunate that there is this group of people that are willing
(07:22):
to give their time to educate and lighten and try set, you know, have a roadmap on
how we can do better and bring people in and make this an industry where people want to
work in the industry that people want to spend their careers in.
And I think that's really great for all of us because let's face it, it's not the most
shiny object out there for new graduates to come into.
(07:45):
People will sort of look at like that's, you know, that's my option two in case option
one doesn't work out.
Right.
Yeah.
What's interesting is that people around me in my real life, they, so if they hear,
and I can't tell you how many times I correct people and sometimes I just give up, I am
(08:05):
a bookkeeper up here in Canada, we have a super strong association and a certifying body.
So I'm a certified professional bookkeeper.
I was on our board of directors.
I've been on our conference committee for a long time.
It means the world to me.
That was really my starting point when I went to the first bookkeeper conference up here
and started to meet some of these people and we get quite a few accountants at that conference
(08:28):
as well because it has been so tech forward for so long.
So, but people call me an accountant all the time.
Even my husband said, oh, no, I'm a bookkeeper, but whatever.
So, but a lot of like my daughter-in-law loved how much I loved doing what I was doing and
(08:49):
she also loved the lifestyle that I had.
I'm not necessarily talking about the money part.
I'm talking about the freedom part.
And she loved how much I enjoyed my clients.
And so she did that.
So she, I said, okay, if that's what you want to do, here's the courses that you need to
take.
Here's the certifications you need to do.
(09:10):
And now she's doing great at it and she's got a lovely lifestyle going along with that.
She gets to work at home with her dogs.
She's got a couple of wiener dogs, questionable choice of dogs.
And they're adorable, actually.
And so then- As a cat person, I think any dog is a questionable choice.
(09:31):
Really?
We have six cats.
Oh, man, you're a crazy cat, man.
We are.
That's fun.
Oh, okay.
So some of my friends are like, this is a really great lifestyle.
And I'm like, yeah, it's a really great lifestyle.
But also the client's connection is amazing.
So you would kind of think, oh, being a bookkeeper and accountant, isn't a people job.
(09:56):
It's totally a people job.
It's totally a people job.
And right now I'm super grateful because my daughter, who I just want to strangle for
it, she has a convenience store.
Believe me, I did not see this coming.
It is super complicated bookkeeping.
And she could never afford the work of what I'm doing.
But I have a skill because I always thought a useful skill.
(10:19):
My son's a framer.
I'm like, that's a useful skill.
An electrician.
That's a useful skill.
How am I going to help my family by being a bookkeeper?
Well, now it turns out it's awesome, right?
Yeah, not for sure.
Yeah.
Well, two things there.
One, I love their term bookkeeper.
I always a little upset that it's sort of got a bit of a negative connotation over the
years.
I try push for all the time.
(10:40):
I'm happy to be called a bookkeeper.
Bookkeepers are critical in the accounting process and without them, it's really hard
to pull all those fancy reports if you don't have any bookkeeping work.
So let's not ignore them.
And then yeah, I think one of the most biggest fallacies of the world of accounting in general
be it a bookkeeper, an accountant, a tax person, an auditor is that a lot of times you get
(11:05):
pushed that way.
It's like, you can just sit with your computer and you can work with numbers where it turns
out everything we do in this space is all about people.
It is a people business.
And if you do not work on your people skills and your communication skills, it is going
to be very difficult to be successful in this industry.
Yeah.
And the other thing that's fun is it's a technology business.
So if you like playing in tech, it's super fun.
(11:28):
Yeah, it's definitely gone that way over the last few years where technology is really
important.
We've seen that at our firm as well and implemented tech leads that are making sure that they're
looking at technology on a regular basis, weaning out the ones that are just shiny objects
and not really useful and focusing on the ones that actually make a difference.
So that is important and it's definitely a place if you like technology, you're like
(11:50):
working with people and you just happen to be good with numbers, it's probably a good
place to spend your time because you'll hit all those points that will make you happy
and make it a great career.
Actually, so it's almost a fallacy about being good with numbers.
You don't actually have to be good with numbers in terms of math.
Yep.
(12:10):
I took calculus first year university.
I have no idea how I passed because honestly, I can't do any math whatsoever.
And then I have not done a single math thing in my head since.
Yep.
I live and die by my 10 key or and I use my URL bar.
I just put in calculations in there.
(12:31):
I put in calculations in the cells and QBO or Daxter wherever.
And I wish because the numbers thing is important.
You have to love data, I guess.
And love analyzing what those numbers mean.
But you don't actually have to do math.
So there's a part of me that wishes you could take accounting without having to have math
(12:59):
background because it's not all that necessary anymore.
Really?
Yeah.
I think what does help though is like math does teach you logical thinking and if you
can start a string together it like you pass calculus, you don't know how.
Well, there's some logical thinking behind it.
Right.
So I think it's, I always think when I'm thinking math and accounting, it doesn't mean you have
(13:20):
to be the greatest mathematician in the world.
But if you could get through a basic math course because you can think through the logic
of what needs to happen, that is really helpful.
You know, I mean, I've seen people who struggle with math and get through it, but you can
see they had the logic.
Like they knew where they were going in the math.
They just couldn't put it together.
And then when they rolled into accounting, they're like, oh, well, I can see the logic.
(13:41):
I'm like, oh, I'm counting.
There's just logic.
You don't have to worry about all these all special things that happen.
Left front center.
Unless you're an auditor, then you've got to know about all the special stuff.
And this is effectively math that you get to forget about all the, you know, the weird
options that could happen in the situation.
So as long as you can think logically, you know, and it is a good skill.
I mean, me and my brother think very similarly the way we look at numbers.
(14:03):
I became an accountant.
He became an engineer.
Right.
So both of them problem solvers in their own right.
But he was probably better at math.
So he went the engineering out.
I was just good enough in math.
So I went there.
Yeah.
So I have a question.
Sure.
You're from South Africa.
100%.
Say South Africa.
I love the way South Africans say South Africa.
(14:25):
Well, I've got a very broken accent.
I'm at this point.
It's converted to California and better South Africa.
Yeah.
It's like you're missing a couple of letters when you say it.
The end of it.
It's like South Africa or something.
I can't even do it.
Can I ask you why you decided to come to, did you come or did you come with your parents?
My wife got a job and then I followed her.
(14:48):
Okay.
Yeah.
So she was a CFO of a winery and the investment group brought her over to be their CFO.
So is that what led to your niche?
Yeah.
That's how I tripped and doubled into it.
I was automotive and then technology and now got over a year and started working for
the same business as she did.
They were in the wine space.
So we ended up in the wine space and that's where I spent the last 11 years.
(15:11):
Now, do you only do accounting for wineries?
94% of our business is wineries.
Okay.
Would see other like a friend's business?
Sort of a little bit, but also more like if you're a business owner and you have another
business will help you with it as long as it's not construction or sales.
We'll come and help you do it.
So it's sort of just, it's almost like the plus ones.
(15:34):
Okay.
I like that you call them the plus ones.
That's cute.
Yeah.
Oh, okay.
Cool.
But we're the totally off track of what we're supposed to be talking about and that is talking
about Kelly.
I would think is really interesting for everybody to hear about is your background and how did
you end up becoming a bookkeeper because it is an interesting path.
Okay.
(15:54):
But I wouldn't say it's that interesting.
Can I come back to you for one more question?
Because my husband and I were talking about that this morning.
He's on podcasts occasionally.
He is on fly fishing podcasts, which apparently is way more interesting to our family and
friends than accounting podcasts.
So we need to change that.
And I was telling him that you do wineries and he sees like, oh, that's perfect.
(16:15):
For you.
You like wine.
Do you only do wineries in California?
No, we're in, I think eight or nine states at the moment.
Oh, okay.
Yeah.
So we'll do a winery anywhere really.
Got to maybe start looking at the Canada market as well.
Maybe an opportunity, but for now it's just in the US.
Right.
(16:36):
Oh, okay.
Cool.
Well, there you go then.
Yeah.
You can come back if you want.
I'm guessing you're way more interesting than me.
Cause I have lived in miles.
Honestly, I live like where I grew up, essentially, my parents are a couple of doors down.
My kids are right here.
I've got the same friends for like 60 years, like nothing.
(16:59):
I am the middle list of the middle class, the whitest of the whitest.
Like there is nothing interesting about that.
But until they spend five minutes with you and then they realize how interesting you
are and how you can show people the best way to live a life of absolute balance and happiness
and do things you want to do.
(17:21):
Well, I will say I get to do a lot of things that I want to do, but I am going to say that
part of that comes with the age that I'm at.
You and I were talking about you're running your kids around right now.
There was a point I was on my own with my kids for almost seven years.
I wouldn't have thought there was much life balance then other than the joy that my kids
gave me.
(17:42):
And then for the next, you know, it was 20 years of, as you know, driving them around
and going to their things and all of the things.
So it, but I will say I actually still prioritize some of my sports, especially.
I really like to ski.
I really like to go out for a run in the forest without anybody around.
(18:03):
And so I, I've always been pretty liberal with, with doing that kind of thing.
But I want to preface anything about my lifestyle with the fact that I am older and I'm at a
point where it's a little bit easier to do, right?
So because sometimes people are like, oh, that's so easy for her to say, right?
(18:24):
She's not hanging out with a couple of teenagers that are driving her around the corner.
So, or you're driving them around the corner.
You still had to know what you wanted and put that in action, right?
And it didn't necessarily start as a bookkeeper.
So wait, did your career start?
So I actually took sports therapy at university.
(18:45):
I did not finish.
In fact, then when you were trying to pick your courses, I actually picked too many science
courses and not enough liberal arts to finish my science degree.
So that was a pain in the butt.
But that was fine because I actually wound up with my trainer certificate.
So that was super cool.
I was working with professional athletes.
Basically, I was the bigger joints and it was really cool.
(19:09):
But then I kind of, no matter how gorgeous they were, I realized I really didn't like
one person on person business model.
I didn't felt like I wanted to be more in the business to business model.
And so somebody that I was working on owned a business and I wound up going into sales
(19:34):
for him and then one thing led to another.
And then the next thing I know, I'm in the marketing business.
And so, and then when I was working in the marketing business, I realized I didn't want
any small sales.
I wanted big sales.
I wanted to deal with bigger companies.
So I wanted the real B2B market, not just small business to small business market.
(19:56):
And so then that led to the marketing company that we had and we had an import program from
China.
Can I talk about the import program from China?
Because that was super interesting.
No, I'd love to hear about it.
So when you have an, so we had corporate clients.
We had companies that were basically led by securities commissions rule.
So we had banks, insurance companies, mutual fund companies, that kind of thing.
(20:18):
Very corporate.
And so tone on tone, everything was very low key.
But there was no flash to any of the stuff we were importing from China.
So this was the swag side or the portfolios.
You know how you get a portfolio and it used to be in a binder?
Well, we had a binder import program from China.
As odd as that sounds, it was super interesting because we're dealing with an entirely different
(20:43):
culture and way of doing things.
And there's some lessons for us in the accounting industry.
And that is just keep trying, man, because we would send over the drawings of what we
wanted and we would get prototypes back that were exactly what we wanted.
But every single time we would get something that had flash to it, that had color to it,
(21:07):
that like if there was pens to go with the binders, the pens would light up or they'd
have dingle balls hanging off the end or they'd be sparkly or they would send us other
swag not related to the program we were doing at all.
And at one point we wound up getting some of this fun swag because we were doing like
a kids program at one point for the one of the banks or whatever.
(21:31):
And so I kind of love that they never gave up on what they thought we wanted.
It did get to be annoying.
I think there's some lessons as accountants for that and that is maybe know what your
market is.
Yep.
And who you're marketing to.
But if you think you've got some really great idea, maybe just keep throwing it out there
(21:51):
a little bit.
Don't be as pushy as this program was.
But it was funny.
So you deal with a broker and our broker's name, we also learned this.
His name was Yan Li and his company was called Yan Li Trading.
And every single time he called us, he had call display and he would say, Kelly, it's
Yan Li of Yan Li Trading.
(22:14):
And it was so ingrained in him because I don't know how many times I said to him, Yan, I
only know one Yan and I only know one Yan Li who owns Yan Li Trading.
It was these fun relationships and he introduced me to bubble tea.
Yep.
So which I never did get a hang.
Do you drink bubble tea?
No, not a chance.
No, not it.
(22:35):
No, it's just no, not my gig.
Just a distraction to the caffeine that I want.
Oh, well, there you go.
So the import program was interesting, but what was happening was in our marketing company.
And so in 2009, because we were on max and I'm needing to do estimating and invoicing
(23:00):
properly.
So basically that stuff was being done in Excel while I was on numbers.
So I was on a max.
So it was in numbers and it was going out in the documents.
But that wasn't working for me.
So I, in 2009, took up with FreshBooks.
(23:21):
And that was great.
You could actually job cost fairly well in FreshBooks and certainly you could invoice
properly in FreshBooks and you could send them off on the World Wide Web.
That was fantastic.
And so, and then we were running parallels so that we could run QuickBooks online at
QuickBooks desktop here in Canada.
We didn't have QuickBooks for Mac.
(23:44):
So I was running parallels.
That was a, that was a bit of a pig though, like that.
Do you use a Mac at all?
Okay.
Parallels allows you to do Windows programs.
It basically parallels the Mac into two separate operating systems.
So then I wound up, that wasn't working.
I wound up getting a PC just to run QuickBooks.
(24:06):
And I absolutely loved, like the minute I met QuickBooks, I was like, this thinks like
I think.
So we moved our job costing into that.
But we, by 2009, were already spending a good chunk of the winter in Florida.
So I then, my girlfriend told me how to host QuickBooks desktop on Dropbox.
(24:26):
So we were basically on the cloud on QuickBooks desktop for a long time before QuickBooks
online was available for us here in Canada.
So that's how you got into it, just because you needed to solve your own problems.
So you sort of taught yourself.
Yeah.
So what was happening was stuff was going off to the account and say it was fine, but
it's six months behind.
(24:47):
And then we're getting, you know, the stuff back.
I was doing job costing anyways.
Basically our marketing business was all project management.
So you're starting with the end product, where it needs to be delivered and who needs
to be, and then you work your way up to the start.
So you start at the end and you work your way.
It was called work backs.
And then we work our way to the starting point and who are all the stakeholders, who's going
(25:12):
to do the design, where are you going to order it?
Because we ordered paper from China as well, by and large.
Depending on the size of the job, sometimes we could have it printed off shore as well.
And so then, you know, then I'm job costing everything.
And I realized how much I love that, but also how much those same skills translated into
(25:35):
doing books.
And so then I was doing a few books for a few other people just because now I'm loving
it so much.
And then eventually trans isn't transitioned into that's not with the marketing business
anymore.
So you're not solving all your problems for your clients in the marketing business.
You just decided I'm going to take on some accounting clients because I love it so much.
(25:59):
Yeah, well, and then it kind of grew a little because the accountant who was doing stuff
for me, then he's like, you get the creative industry.
Do you want to, can you do a few more of those?
And then I realized actually that I loved doing that.
So it just was this little, little thing that grew.
(26:20):
And my affinity for tech because in the marketing, particularly in the, in the print industry,
the same thing that happened in 2012 to 2014 with this whole transition to cloud technology
that was wonderful and awful all at the same time.
We were 20 years ahead of that.
It doesn't sound like a big deal now, but when PDF came out and we no longer had to
(26:45):
send these giant press sheets.
We went direct to play FTP sites.
So FTP sites came, we're no longer sending things by courier.
I'm free to be in Florida or we loved Colorado.
So we were spending a good chunk of the winter in Colorado.
It opened up all of this freedom, but and it improved our clients lives because they
(27:11):
were getting things done in a more timely manner.
Everything was driven by securities commissions.
So we were always tight on deadlines.
And then it's the same skill sets and it's the same love of technology that translates
into the accounting world.
Really interesting.
So when did you decide, okay, I'm a full-time bookkeeper.
He's running them both.
(27:32):
16 maybe?
Mostly.
Yeah.
I would say.
So there's some overlap for a while and then at one point you just decided, okay, this
is where I'm going.
Forget about the marketing stuff.
Yeah.
Well, not quite forgot about it because you're doing a great job of marketing yourself still.
(27:52):
But I'm sure those skills help.
But that's when we decided, 2016 we're going in, we're going to be a bookkeeper.
That's what clearly gives you energy and it allows you to live the lifestyle that you're
looking to live.
It's a really beneficial.
And now you have a bunch of stuff going on, right?
You still have the bookkeeping.
Yeah.
But you do a bunch of other things as well.
(28:12):
Yeah.
So because I was in marketing and because I was in the cloud technology so early, I was
working with the app partners, especially on, okay, it needs to do this.
Please don't let it do that.
So I was lucky enough to be working with companies like Intuit and HubDoc was one of my super
(28:37):
early app partners that I was working with.
I mean, I work with a ton of the app partners, but let's take HubDoc, for example, they
were like, okay, well, you're working with the dev guys over here, but we're all on a
call and then they're like, can you write an article for us?
And I'm like, sure, I can write an article for it.
(28:58):
And then so I started that my very first foray into working with the app partners outside
of dev stuff was writing for HubDoc and then Intuit picked up on that.
So I was doing some writing for them.
And then I was invited to be one of their part of their trainer writer network.
And so then the next thing, you know, I'm doing teaching work for Intuit.
(29:21):
And then I'm doing teaching work for all kinds of app partners was super fun and early in
the beginning.
And I just happened to be in the right place at the right time with the right background.
And so that that that was the little adventure that grew.
I didn't say to myself, oh, you know what?
I want to be and I don't think of myself as a speaker, but I like I'm going to be a speaker
(29:49):
that never crossed my mind.
It still doesn't feel like that.
It's like this natural transition into all of these super fun opportunities.
So if you don't think you're going to develop a speaker, what do you think of yourself as
like teacher or is there a way that you sort of think about it?
Yeah, two ways.
One is a teacher for sure.
And I've been given lots of fun platforms to do that.
(30:11):
And then the other one is some people I don't can't stand the word influencer, but I get
to be an advocate for what I think is going to change accounting lives and client lives.
And that has been really a really good ride because I am knee deep in development work
(30:34):
as well.
So I rather than the app partner saying, I think the accounting industry wants this,
I get to be a voice that says that's actually not what we want.
And by the way, that button over there really stinks.
Right.
So that's kind of fun.
You think it's an advantage that you're sort of coming from another industry before accounting
(30:56):
that you sort of, you can sort of see through all of the garbage that gets thrown your way
a little bit because you're an end user of a different product before you got into the
bookkeeping world.
So you know what does and doesn't work.
100%.
That totally led to where I am is coming from the marketing industry.
And especially since the marketing industry was so tech heavy.
(31:16):
Yep.
Right.
So tech driven, like forever, like Photoshop when so there was a product called InDesign.
I'm probably going to get too far into the weeds.
Right.
Okay.
So a product called InDesign came along that was set to disrupt some of the other creation
products, design products.
(31:40):
And there was a lot of blowback on InDesign, for example.
Are you looking up InDesign right now?
I am.
Yeah.
And so that was a huge disruption and everybody was like, oh, this is just going to stink.
And it did stink in the beginning.
QuickBooks Online was like a momentous step backwards from QuickBooks Desktop.
(32:01):
And so what happened was, and a friend of mine who was formerly into it and was one
of the handlers, he looked after the trainer writer network or the accountant network.
And he and I laughed.
I was early on in QuickBooks Online just because I already loved online technology.
And I had a US URL at that point.
(32:22):
I was in Florida.
And I'm munking about in QuickBooks Online and I'm playing with it.
I'm playing in the US version without knowing it.
And then as soon as it came to Canada, I got the Canadian version and it was like DOS met
Excel.
And so what happened was though, the original QuickBooks Online platform is not even the
(32:42):
same platform.
So as they got new customers, they put them on the new code, let's call it the new code,
the new actual QuickBooks Online.
They put them on that one.
But what they did was not migrate the old ones off nearly as quickly as we would have
liked.
So early adopters were last in on the new platform.
(33:09):
And what a difference.
I mean, I was having a day yesterday, to be honest.
I was having a day in QuickBooks Online and I called a friend and I was ranting to her.
But on those days when it's not doing what I want, I still try to keep in mind we have
come light years in the services we can provide for our clients and where we can provide them
(33:35):
from.
So even on those bad days, I try to keep in mind that I would not want to be back where
I was before.
That is good advice.
Sometimes we have to let go of the past and be thankful for what we got right now.
It is interesting that I never knew that there was a totally different platform for
QuickBooks Online.
It does explain a lot of the time when I run into more experienced accountants that love
(34:01):
QuickBooks Desktop because they're like, oh, QuickBooks Online was so terrible when it
first came out and they've never tried it again.
Where I only arrived in the US in 2013.
So my first introduction to QuickBooks Online was 2014.
I was like, this thing is amazing.
I don't know what you people are all going on about because I think it's better than
a desktop and I've been an advocate for it since then.
I love the platform, I think it does a lot of great stuff.
(34:22):
Now granted, I don't actually do a lot of work in QuickBooks anymore.
My job has moved on from there, but I do love it.
My team find it useful.
With a remote team in another country, having the online access is obviously a lot easier
than the desktop version and hosting as well.
So we see a lot of benefits for going from it.
But it at least explains why some people are so adamant that QuickBooks Online is a terrible
(34:43):
platform.
Yeah, actually can I give you a change management example that went on right here at our house?
We live in a 100 year old cabin that we bought seven years ago.
We bought it from my husband's family.
He has family, so we bought it.
So we bought this cabin and it was a seasonal cottage.
We both, our heart is in it.
Both our families grew up on the, we live on a lake on a point.
(35:06):
We both grew up here with family cottages.
So most people would have taken it down, but then my family banded together.
And we live in a 100 year old cabin that has some quirks, we'll call it.
But the irony of it is, it is completely tricked out as a smart home.
(35:26):
And my husband did not want me to do that.
He was like, no, I don't want a smart home.
I have a girlfriend who just basically built a house and didn't smart home any of it, like
not even an outlet because she's so just, he did not want it to happen.
So I did what every good wife does.
He went away for the weekend and I smart home the house.
(35:48):
So we put the new, my dad helped me.
We put on the new thermostat.
We changed out switches and plugs and light bulbs and tied everything into Alexa and
all of the things.
And so when he came home, he was not the least bit happy with me that I had done that.
And he's like, well, I just want to run around and turn on lights.
And I'm like, go ahead, you can still turn on a light.
(36:11):
It doesn't mean you can't.
And so now he, and that he and Alexa had like this whole tortured relationship and he would
yell at her and sometimes she doesn't do what you want and all the things.
So anyways, he got used to the smart home.
So now he loves that you, you know, Alexa, turn on good morning and all of the good morning
(36:32):
lights come on or whatever.
It doesn't matter.
So, but when, when the internet goes out and he now officially has to run around and turn
on a light bulb, he is not happy.
And I think that that's that same analogy that goes with some of this things like when
yesterday when QuickBooks was, was giving me a hard time.
It's like, okay, but I still don't really want to go back to the old way of doing it.
(36:57):
And so we get mad that the technology has gotten so great for us that the minute that
we don't have it running the way we want it to.
Now we're like, oh, why did I do this?
Right?
Yeah.
And I think we're pretty spoiled with what is available to us as an industry, not just
like QuickBooks, but just the apps that are out there and how much they make our lives
easier from a day to day process, from doing a job process, that when things don't work,
(37:20):
we get so upset.
And yeah, we all do it.
We all do it.
Like, man, this is just not working for me.
Like, I mean, we use carbon as our practice management software and I went down on Friday
afternoon and everybody was on a text going, I guess we're going for a weekend.
I'm at a point where I literally can't do my job unless carbon's working.
I'm that reliant on it.
And it quickly makes you realize in those points where they get frustrated with some
(37:44):
of the things they do, but then when I had to go to Outlook and all of a sudden try
to run my day, I was like, this is, I just can't operate without the technology.
So I probably need to take a deep breath when things aren't going my way properly and remember
what the alternative is.
Because even in that situation, it felt like I went back to carry a pigeon days to be able
to do my account work.
(38:04):
Like, okay, we've been all over the place.
And you said there's not going to be interesting.
You are really all one of the most interesting people I know, Kelly.
And mostly make me really happy to talk to you because you bring such good energy to
the room and make me smile and tell great stories.
And that is really good.
But I am interested, what is next for Kelly?
What is on your goals in the near future?
(38:26):
Yeah, actually, I've been really honing those.
And Zane, I hope also you think that I listened to you well.
Oh, you're amazing.
Oh, okay.
Good.
I, one of my big goals is to be a more active listener and find out.
So hopefully I am listening well as well.
(38:46):
You are.
And so I mean, you're listening well, but you're also following your title and sort of running
your own course at this point.
And this should, I'm going to be, normally it's a pretty conversations by Zane Stevens.
It's going to be pretty conversations by Kelly Parks.
It's a good thing.
I love it.
I'm learning a ton.
And I think this is really insightful stuff.
(39:08):
But back to your goals.
What are your goals going forward?
Yeah, because I've been really, I've been really thinking about them because I do, I am part-time
now and I have to decide in order to stay part-time, some stuff has got to go.
And I really working on what gives me joy.
So I had an opportunity with a new app partner and I basically said, you're going to have
(39:30):
to give me some super compelling reasons.
And I don't mean that the way it just came out.
I don't mean that.
But if I'm going to get behind this, the person left an app that I love and now they've gone
to a new app and it's got great possibilities.
But I got to learn to say no to some of this stuff, right?
So my biggest goal is to build the bookkeeping side back up.
(39:57):
I basically have four businesses going on underneath my umbrella and they are 25% each.
So it's the partnership, it's the working with firms, it's the teaching or the whatever
you want to call it, going to conferences, basically, you know, the junkets as my husband
calls them and the bookkeeping business.
(40:17):
If the only thing I can keep, like if I can only do one thing, it's going to be the bookkeeping.
I'm going back to that.
So I've been working on building that up and my target audience is accounting firms to
do their QuickBooks book, their own, not the client files theirs.
Because those are still who I love dealing with.
(40:38):
That's who I still want to hang out with.
I just, I want to do it differently and I love the books of accounting firms.
I'll take on some professional services.
That's what I do have anyways.
And I've got some accounting firm.
So I changed, so I've had some friends revisit my website on that.
I've started to take some stuff off my website or put so much friction behind it that somebody
(41:04):
really has to pay me well for me to do it.
There's no other way to say it, right?
And then I reduced the friction on my bookkeeping.
So although I talk about automated discovery processes and all of that, and I believe so
mightily in a discovery form and make sure the people that are getting through to you
(41:26):
are only the people that are going to value you, like getting rid of the tire kickers,
especially since so many bookkeepers, especially can be doormats and they'll just take the
calls and give them all the answers.
I don't need to do that anymore.
My niche is so tight, given that it's quick books online for accounting firms that yesterday,
(41:47):
so I had a few friends run through my discovery form and they're like, why are you doing that?
I'm like, why am I doing this?
So I took my discovery form off and I just put up my booking link and I put up my phone
number and I put up my email because I have said this is all I do.
And I don't think there's an accounting firm out there that's going to abuse that.
I think a discovery form is super important because accountants and bookkeepers get abused
(42:09):
because we're so darn nice.
And so that was a big step because that is going to reduce any friction.
So somebody can just call me and we can talk right then and there or they can book a call
with me and we can just say, because it's already on my site, what I do and don't do.
So I'm like, call me.
So that aligns with my goal of building back up the bookkeeping side because that was much
(42:34):
bigger before.
Very interesting.
I think there's a good lesson there for people is to understand your priorities and the way
you said it was just like, there has to be a compelling reason for somebody to take some
of that time from your other priorities.
And being in a place where you can set those priorities, you understand what's important
to you and say noted things that maybe don't align with where you want to go or what you're
(42:55):
trying to achieve.
I think that that is huge.
And I think we should all be working towards that.
I'm trying to be better at that as well because I like to say yes to everything as well and
take on a little bit too much at times.
Mostly because I like to work, but also because I'm not the greatest to saying no.
But I think it's a great lesson for all of us is understand what those priorities are,
make sure you're working towards them.
(43:16):
And if something else comes along, it could be worthwhile.
That is a worthwhile right now.
You need to be able to make that assessment and see if it does fit in within your priorities.
Yeah, well, and I'm going to be, so I'm at scaling new heights.
I've got a couple of sessions and one of them is automating your discovery process.
I still advocate for, my process is still fairly automated.
(43:39):
I mean, there's a bulking link.
I don't, you know, there's, and then you don't have to run back and forward at different
times or things like that.
And then the next step is a file review and that's completely like the process for that,
you know, they fill out a form, they pay for it.
And then it sets it up.
I use financial sense.
(43:59):
You use carbon.
It sets up a client and it kicks off a workflow in financial sense.
They upload things because it gives them instructions from the type form, what's going to happen.
They do that and then I do my thing.
So that side of it, but I still think the part of saying no, that having that discovery
(44:20):
form, the other thing that happened was sometimes, even I had a really good referral from an
accounting firm.
It sounded like it was going to be perfect.
But I still sent the discovery form.
This is a couple of years ago and they filled it out and we absolutely were not a fit because
they weren't going to connect their bank fees.
And that was a hard no for them, not even a maybe, right?
(44:41):
Because your forms can have maybes because you don't want to kick everybody out.
And so they weren't going to, but then they sent me a note and they said that they really
appreciated that we didn't wind up having a call because it wasn't going to work for
him.
And then he referred a really great client to me.
So I still believe in it, but in my niche being so honed.
I don't need it.
You know, if you are in the accounting space and you are looking at that automation of
(45:02):
that process, the intake process, go check out Kelly's stuff on that.
We used it at Protea and we're still working on it and trying to refine it more and more
as we go through the process.
You know, we're pretty niche, but there's a lot of different variables in it.
So that worked.
We're still trying to figure out what the best way to make that match fit into it.
You know, maybe we need to also ask the question on sort of Austin have questions around technology
(45:28):
to see if people open to it because we do see that that's where we have a lot of friction
with it.
Like, yeah, we'll do that until they actually have to do it.
So maybe yes and yes, no, maybe it's probably a better way to go versus yes or no.
Because if they're maybe they're probably going to say yes and that doesn't necessarily
actually mean yes.
Something for me to think about is something for all the listeners to think about as well.
Well, can I do a plug too?
I wouldn't come to me anymore.
(45:49):
I mean, come to a session.
There's great articles.
Just use them as a blueprint.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But also join some of the communities like Automation Town by Chad Davis.
I mean, that's where a lot of that is.
I mean, we know the groups.
There's some great community groups out there for all that kind of support.
I am still doing work with firms, but it's pretty, pretty specific.
(46:12):
It's more fixing things than building things now.
Okay.
If you were talking to somebody that was considering coming to the accounting space, we come a
bookkeeper.
What advice would you give them?
Well, race technology would definitely be a part of it.
Keep that human touch part of it in mind.
You could sit back and just be in the background, but if you actually want to own a firm or
(46:38):
run a firm, then you're going to need to work on your human skills, I think would be a big
part of it.
And you need to work on expectations and boundaries probably, and how can you make technology
set some of those boundaries and expectations for you so that you're not directly saying,
(47:01):
no, did that make sense?
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, it did.
Yeah.
And don't think of it as just strictly loving math, which is where we started this whole
conversation, right?
Drop that sentence.
Yeah.
So, yeah.
You know what, I think you still need to know core accounting though.
This is the one thing that I see.
You can't come in and then get QuickBooks certified and think you're going to deliver
(47:24):
a good product because you need to live in the balance sheet and no amount of certification
is ever going to teach you about debits and credits and the importance of the balance
sheet and why the balance sheet matters.
I think that's the fundamental thing that underlies accounting.
If the balance sheet is a piece of crap, then everything else is wrong.
(47:47):
Yeah.
I talk about that often.
The importance of reconciling that balance sheet and making sure it's all accurate.
I believe everybody should go get some education.
There's enough certifications through the different bookkeeping associations that you
can go get the basics that can help you.
There is a bit of a warning for people that are getting a bookkeeper in as well.
Some background in accounting does help because they can actually understand the way it works
(48:10):
all the way through the process and something you should consider.
The certification helps.
Knowing how to use the technology helps.
If you've got the accounting basics in the background, it goes from good to great pretty
quickly.
Yeah, exactly.
Kelly, this has been amazing.
I really do appreciate your time.
Definitely the most unique episode of career conversations, which I'm not surprised by
(48:32):
at all.
I was bracing myself for a little different today, which is why I appreciate you so much
because you do bring some different, you bring some fresh air to the accounting space.
Keep me on my toes and you sort of force me to be better.
I see the things that you're doing and it makes me want to be a better accountant and
a better person.
So thank you for always doing that and always putting your best foot forward.
(48:54):
Wow.
Well, thank you, Zane.
I'm blushing.
Thank you very much.
I appreciate you and I always love being in your presence.
You have a lovely, calm manner about yourself and of course you've got an excellent starting
point with the accent.
It definitely helps.
Kelly, we like to end off pretty conversations with some rapid fire questions.
(49:16):
I have five questions for you if you're ready.
Sure.
What is your dream vacation?
Okay, man.
Japan.
I want to go do some hiking in Japan.
Sounds like a great option.
Can't convince my wife on that trip yet, but I'm trying.
I can't convince my husband either.
We just came off of Sedona a couple of weeks hiking there, but he wants to go back to New
Zealand.
I think our Australia's lined up.
(49:37):
We have family out there.
What would your death row meal be?
What would your final meal be if you had to make that decision?
Oh, the Green Mile meal.
That's what my husband calls it, the Green Mile meal.
So I don't know.
I like a good chicken wing.
It's got to be breaded though, not a naked one.
So if it's going to be my Green Mile and it's going to be accompanied by something called
(49:58):
Miss Vicki's chips, which is a kind of kettle cook chip up here.
Unbelievable.
So, or maybe my husband's pot roast.
That's all great options.
What is the quality?
What's your Green Mile meal?
It would be pork chop, mashed potatoes, Brussels sprouts with a nice cold beer on the side.
(50:19):
All right.
Brussels sprouts.
It's interesting.
I love them, but interesting.
Okay, cool.
Yep, I might have to make that this weekend.
What is the quality you appreciate a good friend?
Empathy, for sure.
What like is honesty?
I don't need brutal honesty, but decent honesty.
I would like if people say the same things to me as they say when I'm not there.
(50:42):
Agreed.
Number four, is there a favorite book that you recommend everybody reads?
No.
I am a very, my kids say that I am the world's most shallow reader.
My favorite author is somebody called John Sanford.
I'm a murder mystery thriller gal.
So no, I read a lot.
I'm a writer of the book, don't know.
(51:03):
Yeah, it's a guy named John Sanford.
I'm going to tell a quick story.
So a friend of mine who sadly has passed away has this insane library collection.
We love the same authors, but John Sanford is the favorite of both of us.
He flew to California for a book signing and he brought me back.
A book signed for me.
(51:24):
And so that will be one of my most treasured things that I will ever own, even though I
generally get my books from the library.
Very nice.
That is a great story.
Thank you for sharing that.
Lost question.
What is a favorite piece of technology that makes your life better?
Definitely Alexa.
As shallow as that sounds, she does a lot of little stupid things for me.
(51:48):
I've talked about running around, turning on lights.
I don't want to.
When we travel quite a bit too.
So if we've got the heat turned down.
So smart tech maybe?
Because I can turn the furnace up from afar.
I can also turn the music on because our kids generally stay with us.
I can turn the music on when I'm not here and creep them out.
That's a great bonus right there.
(52:12):
What's your favorite piece of tech?
That's a tough one, right?
I would say it's probably my Apple Watch.
Yeah.
It just keeps me more accountable specifically to get up and walk around when I've been
sitting on my desk for six hours without looking up.
Right.
So I like it from that standpoint to keep me accountable, get the vibration, time to
do something.
(52:33):
So I've seen a definite improvement in my health since I've got the Apple Watch.
Oh nice.
Kelly, thank you so much for your time today.
I appreciate you being a guest on Proto Conversations.
Well thank you, Zane.
I appreciate you having me.
And with that, we ended another Proto Conversations.
Thank you for joining us on this journey of learning and inspiration.
Today we've gained insight from our guests and taken another step towards understanding
(52:55):
the diverse atmosphere of leadership and business and accounting.
Remember, each conversation is a step towards the positive transformation of business leaders.
We hope our discussion has given you valuable takeaways to apply in your own career and
life.
Don't forget to subscribe to Proto Conversations on YouTube and Spotify so you never miss an
episode.
We'd also love to hear your thoughts and experiences so connect with me on social media channels.
(53:16):
I'm most active on LinkedIn and for no but to join the conversation.
Join us next time for more engaging stories, advice, and conversations like that.
Until then, keep striving for excellence, and race, and growing.
Thank you for listening.
Be kind and goodbye for Proto Conversations.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Special Summer Offer: Exclusively on Apple Podcasts, try our Dateline Premium subscription completely free for one month! With Dateline Premium, you get every episode ad-free plus exclusive bonus content.
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!