July 1, 2025 • 33 mins
This week's episode comes from the Sidewalk Conversations podcast! I had the chance to sit-down with Piet and share so much from my book of remembrance. It was so fun, and I hope you enjoy it too!
Sidewalk Conversations is a podcast that shines a light on ordinary people who do extraordinary things. In these interviews, Piet Van Waarde (a 40 year veteran of pastoral ministry) has heart-to-heart conversations with regular people about what it takes to stay faithful and effective in the things that matter most. Find Sidewalk Conversations wherever you listen to podcasts or find Piet Van Waarde on Youtube.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Denise Jackson (00:00):
In 1998, we had the opportunity to.
Both of us are school teachers,but I had built this little
business with the schooldistricts in Texas and we had
the opportunity to move closerto our families who were in
Laredo and San Antonio.
And so we picked Wimberly andmoved there and our house
(00:22):
flooded away four months later.
We barely got out.
In fact his mother was pregnantwith him.
They had just gotten married.
They came down for the weekendand we had stayed up all night
talking to them and I said don'tyou wake me up in the morning,
lee Jackson, I'm sleeping late.
At five o'clock in the morninghe wakes me up and I'm like what
are you doing?
He said water's coming in thehouse.
(00:43):
We barely got out and his momwas coming across the Creek.
I'd already made it.
The road was a Creek now, soI'd already made it across.
She's coming across and sheslipped and fell and was zooming
down the river and I justreached out hoping to find
something and there was a pieceof rebar in the ground and I
(01:04):
grabbed it and her hand oh mygoodness that's preston rivers,
jackson is that your middle name?
that's where he got it I love itbut in 2006 we moved back, we
bought a house back.
Piet Van Waarde (01:21):
We're not more punishment.
Denise Jackson (01:22):
Yeah, we're well we're not right on the river,
we're across the street from the500-year floodplain, but our
neighborhood has access to theriver, which I love, so it's all
good.
Piet Van Waarde (01:32):
Best of both worlds.
Denise Jackson (01:34):
It was good, we got safely out and God led us on
another great journey that wecouldn't have imagined if we
hadn't gone through the flood,because we never would have
moved again.
Right, we loved it yeah uh, butwe had to because we lost
everything and then you have toget into that.
Yeah, it's a really reallygreat story, but okay anyway,
(01:55):
that's one of the stories, ofthe many stories of god blessing
our lives, and we just couldn'tsee it right in the middle of
it that's how it is, isn't it?
Piet Van Waarde (02:05):
That's right, oh my goodness.
So welcome to another episodeof Sidewalk Conversations.
We're so glad that you arejoining us and we have another
special guest that I am anxiousto introduce to you.
(02:28):
But before I do, I want to saythank you to our sponsor for
this program.
Today's sponsor is Stone StashCoffee.
We've talked about them before,but the proprietors are good
friends of mine and theydeveloped their own unique brand
of roasting coffee.
It is air roasted, so all thebeans get the same amount of
(02:49):
heat and therefore they are very, very good.
I have this coffee every singlemorning, and if you're looking
for a good cup of coffee in themorning and you're ready for a
change of what you're doing, I'dlike to recommend Stone Stash.
You'll find their informationhere in the notes, and if you
live in the Austin area, they'llhand deliver it.
Denise Jackson (03:08):
So there's that bonus as well.
Piet Van Waarde (03:11):
So I am delighted to introduce you to
Denise Jackson.
Hi Thank you, denise, forjoining me.
Denise is the grandmother ofour technician, preston Jackson,
who we generally make fun ofbehind the curtain, and so we
(03:33):
got introduced a couple weeksago and I am so glad I've heard
a little bit of her story, but Iam going to be learning more
about her story even as you do,and so welcome.
Denise Jackson (03:42):
Thank you for joining me today.
Thank you, it's so good to haveyou.
It's lovely to be here.
I'm so glad that Prestonconnected us today.
Yes, me too.
Piet Van Waarde (03:51):
So let's start at the beginning.
Tell me a little bit about howyou grew up, where you grew up,
maybe some of the significantinfluences in your life.
Denise Jackson (03:57):
Okay, so I grew up mostly in South Texas.
I was born in Hawaii because mydad was in the Navy and then,
when I was two, we moved toHouston because my dad went to
dental school.
And then, when I was six, weheaded for South Texas because
my parents were from Laredo.
Piet Van Waarde (04:19):
All right.
Denise Jackson (04:20):
And so that was— .
Piet Van Waarde (04:21):
So like basically a Texas girl through
and through.
Denise Jackson (04:24):
Pretty Texas, even though I was born in Hawaii
.
Yes, and I have you know, I'mvery biased towards Texas.
Piet Van Waarde (04:34):
I just think it's Most Texans are I grew up
with land around me you know,with the ranches.
Denise Jackson (04:41):
My granddaddy had a lot of land in different
parts of Texas and I wouldtravel with them sometimes and
see those places and I just fellin love with that Horses, you
know all of that stuff.
So those were influences.
I love it yeah.
Piet Van Waarde (04:56):
Now, from our previous conversation, I know
you're also a person of faith,and so tell me a little bit
about.
Was that something that yougrew up with, or was there a
significant transition at somepoint?
Denise Jackson (05:07):
So that's kind of interesting.
I am the oldest of six childrenand my father was Baptist and
my mother was Catholic.
Piet Van Waarde (05:17):
Okay, wow, we don't usually see that.
Denise Jackson (05:20):
You do not normally see that, you do not
normally see that, and so I wentto both churches until I was 10
years old and then dadconverted to Catholicism and so
(05:42):
then we liked I used to say hewas more extreme Catholic- than
anybody.
It's like when you convert.
So he would read us the Bible,which was kind of different for
breakfast, but then he was veryfaithful to going to the
Catholic church and so that'show I grew up and I knew God.
I remember, even at three yearsold, climbing a tree in the
(06:06):
backyard and I would sing songsto God, but didn't really know
about Jesus that well.
You know, I didn't have arelationship, but when I got
married at 16, pregnant with myoldest daughter, and Lee was 19.
Piet Van Waarde (06:25):
Which I guess when you hear about that now
you're like wow, that's reallyyoung, but back no, no, no, no,
I'm not that old, it was reallyreally.
Denise Jackson (06:34):
Oh my gosh.
Yes, it was such a big deal allright and um and everybody was
pretty sure that we would notstay together.
But I've shared with you.
We've been married 50 yearsthis last September and that is
only God, because it was hardgoing for a while there boy, two
(06:56):
teenagers.
But when I was 19, we had movedback to Laredo.
We had gone to college, spent acouple of years on our own, and
then we moved back to Laredo towe had gone to college, spent a
couple of years on our own, andthen we moved back to Laredo to
work with Lee's dad and bothLee and I started going to Bible
studies.
That one was hosted at myparents' home my mom and one
(07:17):
that Lee went to that was amen's group and I think that was
the first time we reallystarted reading the word and it
became personal and both of usdecided yes we want to follow
Jesus.
And, yeah, not that it changedeverything in our lives.
It's taken a lot of years, butyou know it was a profound
(07:38):
change, and at one.
Piet Van Waarde (07:39):
Bible study.
Denise Jackson (07:40):
I was 19.
Bible study I was 19.
And so I was in that Biblestudy with these ladies who were
at the time older ladies butyounger than me now, and they
were teaching on love the Lord,your God, with all your heart.
And I was a cynic and I walkedup to him afterwards and said I
(08:03):
don't know how you could lovethe Lord, your God, with all
your heart.
I can't see him, I can't touchhim.
I mean, I just don't understandthat.
And Jenny Leindecker said youask him and he will show you.
And sure enough, I prayed withthose ladies and asked him to
(08:25):
show me how to love him.
And what he did is he showed mehow he had loved me through the
word.
I read it before I thought itwas boring, and then I started
reading it again and everythingI read was like wow, you love us
so much, you've chased us forso long and we're so ugly to you
(08:46):
.
I was so mad at thoseIsraelites.
For a while I was real offendedfor God, for those Israelites.
And then he showed me Denise,you're the same.
Piet Van Waarde (08:56):
Oh, don't you hate that.
Denise Jackson (08:58):
Well, I've come to love it.
Just show me, show me.
Lord those things in my heart.
But yeah, at the time I didhate it Anyway.
So that was the beginning, andthank God, because a year later
I said I was the oldest of sixmy brother, who was 22 months
(09:19):
younger than me, was killed in acar accident.
I was so mad at God, but atleast I had a relationship with
him, you know.
So I talked to him about it, Iscreamed at him about it.
I was really, really upset.
But you know, like now, lookingback, I see that my
relationship became so muchcloser and he'd given me a dream
(09:42):
that really helped me and in itbasically said you have a job
to do where you are, and Fordhas a job to do where he is.
And it just relieved me, youknow.
And then I went on.
I was like, okay, I have a jobto do.
I don't know what it is yet,but I'm ready.
Piet Van Waarde (09:59):
Now there are a couple of ways I want to take
the conversation today.
First of all, you mentionedthat you were married for 50
years.
That is a rare thing in our day.
So tell me, are there and I'msure people ask you, but I'm
just curious myself are theresome things that you look back
(10:20):
at in your relationship and saythese were some key decisions we
made along the way that aidedour longevity?
Denise Jackson (10:28):
So early on we.
So I'm going to step back towhen Lee was saying let's get
married.
We need to get married becauseyou're pregnant.
And I was like, no, I'm 16.
And he said if we get married,god will take care of us.
Neither one of us had thatstrong of faith then, but those
(10:51):
words out of his mouth, I think,really made a difference.
They convinced me that I couldtrust him and that somehow we'd
make it.
Then, a little later in ourlives, we started praying
together.
It was from desperation,normally.
(11:13):
At first we were living inLakey, texas, and we'd lived
there a year and the economyaround Texas fell apart because
gas prices went up to $2 agallon and nobody would travel.
You know we laugh at that now,but back then it meant that his
construction job was going awayand we didn't have any money.
(11:33):
We couldn't live and so hedecided he needed to go back to
college.
So we had done everything wecould to go back to college and
every door closed.
So Kerrvillevil was 60 milesaway.
We decided to go finish up, uh,the basics there, and he
applied as a dorm director, Iapplied as a kindergarten
(11:56):
teacher.
Neither one of us had degrees.
Everybody wanted degrees yeah,yeah and um, so those doors
closed and so we really justdidn't have a way to move.
And it was two weeks beforeschool started and he took my
hands and said we're gonna praythat god will do something.
And I said, okay, let's, I meanwe're at that point.
(12:19):
So we started praying and thephone rang and it was Shriner
College, saying the guy that wassupposed to be the dorm
director had backed out at thelast minute.
Would he be willing to do itstill?
And he said yes, and so we gotoff the phone.
He got off the phone and he saidbut babe, we still need to pray
(12:40):
because we don't have any moneycoming in.
We had a, we had tuition, wehad a place to live, we even had
food.
We could eat at the cafeteriawith the kids.
So it was like huge.
But we needed money to drive acar or to do anything, pay the
electric bill, um, and so hesaid we still need to pray and
so he started.
We he held my hands againstarted praying.
(13:02):
The phone rang again and it wasZion Lutheran Children's Center
in Kerrville saying thekindergarten teacher that we had
hired has told us they can't behere.
Piet Van Waarde (13:14):
Oh, wow.
Denise Jackson (13:15):
Can you come be the kindergarten teacher?
So you know, along the way welearned prayer praying together.
God listened to those prayerseven more than our individual
prayers.
It was just holy.
It was like he was just rightthere in the middle of us.
He was in the middle of us fromthe beginning because of Lee's
(13:36):
words, I think.
And then we went through a hardtime in a church.
We went through this great timein this church because we
learned so, so much about theword, but then, a few years in,
it broke apart, and it was verydevastating.
And through that, though, welearned you can't trust any
(13:59):
wonderful individual man orwoman that's leading a church.
You have to put your faith inGod and spend time with Him.
So I would say the first thingis back to what I learned at 19,
love the Lord, your God, withall your heart, so when the
other person fails, you're nottrusting them, you're trusting
(14:19):
God.
Second thing is that you praytogether.
And the third thing, which isjust as important, is pouring in
the Word of God helps the Wordto be in your heart, and it
comes out of your mouth, andwhen it does, it's powerful.
And so I began first to pray formy husband and my children the
(14:44):
Word of God when we were in thatchurch where we learned so much
, and I've continued to do that.
And now, lee, over the years,we started praying together and
he started praying for me theword of God, and I just feel
like that's just been such agame changer, because we don't
trust each other more than wetrust God.
(15:07):
So when one of us hurts theother one, unintentionally or
intentionally, we go back to God.
We know that we need to praytogether to stay together.
That sounds kind of cliche, butit's the truth.
And then we know that the wordsthat we speak about each other
need to be what God says aboutus, and so that's just been
(15:30):
really powerful in our lives.
Piet Van Waarde (15:32):
Yeah, you know one of the things that I often
use as an illustration.
So my wife and I we did a lotof premarital counseling when I
was pastoring, and you'rebringing up a point that I think
is so crucial, and that is thata lot of times, when people
think about their relationshipand how God fits into that
relationship, they think aboutit in terms of a slice of life.
(15:52):
So I have my finances, I havemy career, I have my kids, I
have my hobbies and, oh yeah, Ishould have a slice that's
designated to God, and you know,then all the other things have
a way of edging out.
Or maybe the thought is I needto have a really big slice of
God and then how do I fiteverything else?
Denise Jackson (16:12):
in.
Piet Van Waarde (16:12):
But the analogy I like is to have God at the
center of the circle and Hisword, his influence, his spirit
informs all the other things.
So, whether we're talking aboutour finances or we're talking
about how to raise kids, orwe're talking about our finances
or we're talking about how toraise kids, or we're talking
about even things likerecreation, you know what are
(16:33):
the things that renew us fromGod's perspective To have that
as a centerpiece, and thenyou're both looking at that like
that's equally important toboth of you.
It just solves so many of theproblems it does.
Denise Jackson (16:44):
It doesn't mean that everything's easy, of
course we still have walkedthrough things, but we walk
through them so differently.
My mom just died the other dayand I keep thinking about we
don't grieve like other people,grieve that don't know the Lord.
We still grieve, we miss them,but we know we're going to see
(17:09):
them again and we know that weare not without hope, that they
are with the Father, they'rewith Abba and they know what we
don't know.
We just see through a glass dim.
That was hard.
We were really shaken in thatseason but you know, we just had
(17:39):
to hold on to Abba, to trustthat in Jesus' name we were
healed, or that Lee was healedand then he is.
Praise God.
But it was a really, reallyscary walk and then we had to
come to terms with well, if he'sgoing to meet the Father sooner
(18:03):
than I am, then how am I goingto make that journey and just
coming to a place where I couldbe peaceful about that and him
coming to a place where he couldbe peaceful about that?
I don't know how people evenwalk through the earth or
problems with kids.
Our four teenagers acted justlike me.
(18:23):
They were wild kids becausethey like to talk and they're
out there and they're leading myold kids because they like to
talk and they're out there andthey're leading and you know, I
would get so worried about themand then I would just take them
and hand them back to God andsay, okay, this is the word.
I'm praying over them.
Piet Van Waarde (18:54):
When they're old, they won't depart from it,
cling to that, you know, so thatyou know I could have peace and
joy and continue in life withthat.
I've noticed that too.
We've talked a little bit aboutmy journey with cancer, and one
of the things I'm discoveringand I'm guessing you knew the
same is that you can, on onehand, feel the reality of your
sickness, your disease, andyou're in front of a doctor and
(19:15):
he's telling you all theseominous things, and so that
creates a certain reaction,obviously.
But then you also have thisother thing that is at work in
you, which is God's promises,God's word, God's spirit, which
is reassuring you.
God's promises, God's word,God's spirit, which is
reassuring you.
It's like, yeah, this isn'treal, but there's this other
(19:37):
counterbalance that is just asreal, that provides perspective
and hope in the midst of thetrial.
And the more experiences youhave like that, the more
trustworthy it becomes isn't it?
Denise Jackson (19:47):
Yeah, that's true.
You have like that, the moretrustworthy it becomes, isn't it
?
Yeah, that's true?
I think, too, like goingthrough that.
We know heaven is a realitybecause we've walked through so
many things, because we know howGod reached down and made those
two phone calls.
And reached down, those twophone calls and reached down.
(20:12):
He told us to pay off our houseand then opened the door for a
job and then the job ended May15th of 2021.
I got laid off because it wasCOVID ramifications and no, on
May 30th and on May 15th, wemade the last payment on our
house and, like other peoplewould be like, oh, I lost my job
(20:34):
.
And I was like, yes, you toldme to get this job so we could
pay out the house.
And it was paid off.
Everything was done.
You know, just learning to.
Whatever we're going through,trusting that you know, as long
as I'm here, I have work to doand you have work to do.
And when we're going throughtrusting that, you know, as long
as I'm here, I have work to doand you have work to do, and
(20:54):
when we're not here, we havework to do.
It really mattered even allthat time ago, but still matters
to me that it doesn't stop youknow, and he's got it, and so if
one of us has to live withouteach, other.
Piet Van Waarde (21:12):
It won't be easy, but it will be something
that we can do, because ourfaith will be the thing that
holds us.
Yeah, I love that.
So you also have now a veryinteresting role in talking to
ladies.
Yes, so part of how weconnected was that you also have
.
Is it a podcast?
Denise Jackson (21:27):
Well, it's an upcoming podcast.
I look over at my podcastproducer over there.
We've done a lot of recordingsand they're on the website
already.
They're on YouTube, but wehaven't put them into a podcast
format.
Piet Van Waarde (21:44):
So tell me a little bit about what he did so.
Denise Jackson (21:47):
I'm sorry I'm going to have to scooch up and
give that little mic.
So I have been consulting withsmall businesses for the last
few years since I left thatother job in my own business and
I've enjoyed that.
But I have been so drawn for somany years to supporting women
(22:10):
in these different areas thatare hard in our lives, and so a
dream that I've had is to starta business where I could share
my stories of remembrance withGod, with God, and God has just
(22:34):
really spoken to me aboutexpanding that and talking to a
lot more women about theirexperiences when God was mighty
in their lives at differentseasons, and so we're recording
those and that's one of thepieces of it, because the E's
Greenhouse of it, because theE's Greenhouse E the letter E, s
(22:55):
for Sam greenhousecom is aplace where women can also learn
and they can also be coached inthese different areas of their
lives.
So the piece of the videos is agreat place to just hear and be
encouraged for women who aregoing through whatever season in
their lives, and then my hopeis that also they'll get trained
(23:18):
up in the ways of the Lordrather than their ways of the
world.
So when I'm running.
When I'm coaching in business,I'm coaching about God's way of
running a business which isreally important, very different
from the way the world wants usto run business.
Marriage with God is very, verydifferent than what the world
(23:39):
says a marriage should look like.
Raising up your children verydifferent.
Being a member of yourcommunity is very different.
You love your neighbors.
When you get into situations,well guess what?
It's you that's going to haveto figure out what the word
wants you, what God wants you todo about that, and that's
(24:01):
usually harder than you think.
But in doing that like you buildcommunity you build community
with the women that you'rearound, and so, anyway, I just
want to share that.
I just want to share thosestories and equipping and I was
a teacher for 13 years, inbetween running businesses and
(24:23):
corporate work, and I feel likethat's just the gift that has
sustained through the years, youknow.
Piet Van Waarde (24:30):
I love to teach .
Tell me a little bit about thestories.
Like do you have an example of,like a story that maybe that
you've heard recently that, soyeah, inspired me, um so one of,
uh, the ladies that I talked towho, uh she she was really
worried about doing theinterview.
Denise Jackson (24:49):
she said, oh, no one's going to want to hear me.
Even afterwards, when she sawit, she was like, oh, nobody's
going to care about that.
What she was talking about wasshe got a puppy when she was
young after her dad died at ayoung age, and she loved that
(25:10):
puppy.
But then five years later thatpuppy died and she loved that
puppy, but then five years laterthat puppy died.
Well then the next time shewanted to get a dog, after she
was married and was pregnantwith her first child, she like
did all of this genetic testing.
I mean, she was just like doingall of these things to try to
make sure that dog would live.
You need to watch the video tosee the rest of it.
(25:33):
But what she learned throughthat is she can't put her trust
in what the world has to offer.
She has to let go.
She can't control everysituation.
She has to let go.
You mean we can't, we can't, wecan't.
We have to kind of be on theriver and just let it take us,
(25:53):
and it's God's river and so,anyway, it's a wonderful
interview.
Some of the other ones thatjust stand out to me are Paisley
Jackson, who is Preston'ssister, went on mission for
three months to Burundi, in theCongo, and she's used with a
(26:15):
mission, and that video is sowild Like most of us can't
comprehend what it would be liketo go serve in some place.
That is very dangerous, but shefell in love with it.
It was so funny because Irecorded her while she was in
(26:37):
training and she had hilariousideas, and then I recorded her
after, when she had done thetrip and and faced some things,
and so you got to see both sideslike the way that we think
about going to someplace likethat.
and then what she found, whatshe came back with, was such a
love for the people in the Congoand Burundi.
(26:59):
And then she went to Mongoliafor a month to staff a prayer
room and again came back with somuch love for these people that
she met, and so it's a prettypowerful, powerful.
Piet Van Waarde (27:14):
That sounds like it, so where can people
find this?
Denise Jackson (27:17):
At easegreenhousecom Okay, right
now and you can look on YouTubefor Ease Greenhouse and you'll
find several videos.
I think we have 12 so far andour goal this year is to reach
100 women so that there's somuch content out there that
other women can watch and theycan sort through and find their
(27:40):
issue or their struggle and knowthat God's not a respecter of
persons.
He says that, but when youlisten to like me, broke and
needing a job, and Lee needing ajob for our lives to continue,
god was faithful.
If he would be faithful withDenise Jackson, he's going to be
faithful with you, and sothat's the message that I really
(28:04):
want women to hear is you areable to be strong because God is
strong on your behalf if youwill just trust in him and lean
in Because God is strong on yourbehalf, if you will just trust
in him and lean in.
Piet Van Waarde (28:15):
Which leads me to my last question I have for
you, which is and it may be justwhat you said, but maybe you
want to elaborate on it Givenall the things that you've
experienced, both in yourmarriage and leaning on God to
find direction and resources,and now in the work you're doing
with women, is there somethingthat's kind of been a common
(28:43):
theme through it all.
Denise Jackson (28:44):
That has become sort of a life message for you.
Well, for me, early on, godjust spoke to me to write a book
of remembrance so that when Iwent through the flood, when I
went through the fire, I wouldremember who he was, so that I
would not stumble.
And so I believe that's stillthe same message.
(29:04):
It's been a theme I thinkthrough my teaching, through the
companies I've run through thecompanies I've run through my
own startups, is just to writedown everything that I'm going
through, good or bad, and thenlook back and see God's hand in
(29:25):
it, and it does really build upmy spirit to remember that he
never has let me down, and wewere talking before this started
about.
You don't see the crooked pathuntil you are down the road, and
then you see every spot wherehis hand just guided you and
(29:48):
kept you safe and walked youthrough whatever you needed to
go through and, like we saidbefore, not that there aren't
hard things, but you're neveralone.
Piet Van Waarde (30:01):
You're not alone Right right.
Denise Jackson (30:03):
And when you know that it just changes
everything.
Piet Van Waarde (30:06):
Yeah, I love that.
You know the scriptures oftentalk about, you know, remember,
and you kind of wonder well, whyis that such a repeated theme?
And I think it's exactly whatyou're alluding to.
Is that we have a tendency toforget.
Yes, the need of the moment orthe disappointments tend to
(30:28):
outweigh all the good that Goddoes.
But if you have a place that youcan go on a regular basis where
you have a tool or a journalwhere you've written down these
things.
It's like okay, when I'm inthat place where I'm getting
ready to doubt or be discouraged, I can go back and read about
the faithfulness of God.
(30:48):
In fact, I think that's part ofwhat the scriptures are for
right.
Denise Jackson (30:51):
That's right, that's right.
That's the best book ofremembrance that we have.
But I think that what if nobodywrote that book of remembrance?
What if nobody was obedient tokeep track of what God was doing
?
None of us would have what wehave today, and of course, god
made sure that that happened.
(31:12):
But, yeah, we need our book ofremembrance to help us get
through these things and one dayface to face.
Amen, yeah.
Piet Van Waarde (31:20):
Well, that's a beautiful place to start a stop,
and thank you so much forjoining me today.
It's been such a pleasure tomeet you it has been a pleasure
meeting you too.
Denise Jackson (31:29):
I can't wait to meet your other half.
You've been married a lot ofyears too, so you know a lot.
Thank you for asking me to joinyou today.
Piet Van Waarde (31:37):
You're welcome and thank you for joining us.
We're so grateful that you werepart of our time together today
, and please join us again foranother episode of Sidewalk
Conversations.
In 1998, we had the opportunity to.
Both of us are school teachers,but I had built this little
business with the schooldistricts in Texas and we had
the opportunity to move closerto our families who were in
Laredo and San Antonio.
And so we picked Wimberly andmoved there and our house
(00:22):
flooded away four months later.
We barely got out.
In fact his mother was pregnantwith him.
They had just gotten married.
They came down for the weekendand we had stayed up all night
talking to them and I said don'tyou wake me up in the morning,
lee Jackson, I'm sleeping late.
At five o'clock in the morninghe wakes me up and I'm like what
are you doing?
He said water's coming in thehouse.
(00:43):
We barely got out and his momwas coming across the Creek.
I'd already made it.
The road was a Creek now, soI'd already made it across.
She's coming across and sheslipped and fell and was zooming
down the river and I justreached out hoping to find
something and there was a pieceof rebar in the ground and I
(01:04):
grabbed it and her hand oh mygoodness that's preston rivers,
jackson is that your middle name?
that's where he got it I love itbut in 2006 we moved back, we
bought a house back.
Piet Van Waarde (01:21):
We're not more punishment.
Denise Jackson (01:22):
Yeah, we're well we're not right on the river,
we're across the street from the500-year floodplain, but our
neighborhood has access to theriver, which I love, so it's all
good.
Piet Van Waarde (01:32):
Best of both worlds.
Denise Jackson (01:34):
It was good, we got safely out and God led us on
another great journey that wecouldn't have imagined if we
hadn't gone through the flood,because we never would have
moved again.
Right, we loved it yeah uh, butwe had to because we lost
everything and then you have toget into that.
Yeah, it's a really reallygreat story, but okay anyway,
(01:55):
that's one of the stories, ofthe many stories of god blessing
our lives, and we just couldn'tsee it right in the middle of
it that's how it is, isn't it?
Piet Van Waarde (02:05):
That's right, oh my goodness.
So welcome to another episodeof Sidewalk Conversations.
We're so glad that you arejoining us and we have another
special guest that I am anxiousto introduce to you.
(02:28):
But before I do, I want to saythank you to our sponsor for
this program.
Today's sponsor is Stone StashCoffee.
We've talked about them before,but the proprietors are good
friends of mine and theydeveloped their own unique brand
of roasting coffee.
It is air roasted, so all thebeans get the same amount of
(02:49):
heat and therefore they are very, very good.
I have this coffee every singlemorning, and if you're looking
for a good cup of coffee in themorning and you're ready for a
change of what you're doing, I'dlike to recommend Stone Stash.
You'll find their informationhere in the notes, and if you
live in the Austin area, they'llhand deliver it.
Denise Jackson (03:08):
So there's that bonus as well.
Piet Van Waarde (03:11):
So I am delighted to introduce you to
Denise Jackson.
Hi Thank you, denise, forjoining me.
Denise is the grandmother ofour technician, preston Jackson,
who we generally make fun ofbehind the curtain, and so we
(03:33):
got introduced a couple weeksago and I am so glad I've heard
a little bit of her story, but Iam going to be learning more
about her story even as you do,and so welcome.
Denise Jackson (03:42):
Thank you for joining me today.
Thank you, it's so good to haveyou.
It's lovely to be here.
I'm so glad that Prestonconnected us today.
Yes, me too.
Piet Van Waarde (03:51):
So let's start at the beginning.
Tell me a little bit about howyou grew up, where you grew up,
maybe some of the significantinfluences in your life.
Denise Jackson (03:57):
Okay, so I grew up mostly in South Texas.
I was born in Hawaii because mydad was in the Navy and then,
when I was two, we moved toHouston because my dad went to
dental school.
And then, when I was six, weheaded for South Texas because
my parents were from Laredo.
Piet Van Waarde (04:19):
All right.
Denise Jackson (04:20):
And so that was— .
Piet Van Waarde (04:21):
So like basically a Texas girl through
and through.
Denise Jackson (04:24):
Pretty Texas, even though I was born in Hawaii
.
Yes, and I have you know, I'mvery biased towards Texas.
Piet Van Waarde (04:34):
I just think it's Most Texans are I grew up
with land around me you know,with the ranches.
Denise Jackson (04:41):
My granddaddy had a lot of land in different
parts of Texas and I wouldtravel with them sometimes and
see those places and I just fellin love with that Horses, you
know all of that stuff.
So those were influences.
I love it yeah.
Piet Van Waarde (04:56):
Now, from our previous conversation, I know
you're also a person of faith,and so tell me a little bit
about.
Was that something that yougrew up with, or was there a
significant transition at somepoint?
Denise Jackson (05:07):
So that's kind of interesting.
I am the oldest of six childrenand my father was Baptist and
my mother was Catholic.
Piet Van Waarde (05:17):
Okay, wow, we don't usually see that.
Denise Jackson (05:20):
You do not normally see that, you do not
normally see that, and so I wentto both churches until I was 10
years old and then dadconverted to Catholicism and so
(05:42):
then we liked I used to say hewas more extreme Catholic- than
anybody.
It's like when you convert.
So he would read us the Bible,which was kind of different for
breakfast, but then he was veryfaithful to going to the
Catholic church and so that'show I grew up and I knew God.
I remember, even at three yearsold, climbing a tree in the
(06:06):
backyard and I would sing songsto God, but didn't really know
about Jesus that well.
You know, I didn't have arelationship, but when I got
married at 16, pregnant with myoldest daughter, and Lee was 19.
Piet Van Waarde (06:25):
Which I guess when you hear about that now
you're like wow, that's reallyyoung, but back no, no, no, no,
I'm not that old, it was reallyreally.
Denise Jackson (06:34):
Oh my gosh.
Yes, it was such a big deal allright and um and everybody was
pretty sure that we would notstay together.
But I've shared with you.
We've been married 50 yearsthis last September and that is
only God, because it was hardgoing for a while there boy, two
(06:56):
teenagers.
But when I was 19, we had movedback to Laredo.
We had gone to college, spent acouple of years on our own, and
then we moved back to Laredo towe had gone to college, spent a
couple of years on our own, andthen we moved back to Laredo to
work with Lee's dad and bothLee and I started going to Bible
studies.
That one was hosted at myparents' home my mom and one
(07:17):
that Lee went to that was amen's group and I think that was
the first time we reallystarted reading the word and it
became personal and both of usdecided yes we want to follow
Jesus.
And, yeah, not that it changedeverything in our lives.
It's taken a lot of years, butyou know it was a profound
(07:38):
change, and at one.
Piet Van Waarde (07:39):
Bible study.
Denise Jackson (07:40):
I was 19.
Bible study I was 19.
And so I was in that Biblestudy with these ladies who were
at the time older ladies butyounger than me now, and they
were teaching on love the Lord,your God, with all your heart.
And I was a cynic and I walkedup to him afterwards and said I
(08:03):
don't know how you could lovethe Lord, your God, with all
your heart.
I can't see him, I can't touchhim.
I mean, I just don't understandthat.
And Jenny Leindecker said youask him and he will show you.
And sure enough, I prayed withthose ladies and asked him to
(08:25):
show me how to love him.
And what he did is he showed mehow he had loved me through the
word.
I read it before I thought itwas boring, and then I started
reading it again and everythingI read was like wow, you love us
so much, you've chased us forso long and we're so ugly to you
(08:46):
.
I was so mad at thoseIsraelites.
For a while I was real offendedfor God, for those Israelites.
And then he showed me Denise,you're the same.
Piet Van Waarde (08:56):
Oh, don't you hate that.
Denise Jackson (08:58):
Well, I've come to love it.
Just show me, show me.
Lord those things in my heart.
But yeah, at the time I didhate it Anyway.
So that was the beginning, andthank God, because a year later
I said I was the oldest of sixmy brother, who was 22 months
(09:19):
younger than me, was killed in acar accident.
I was so mad at God, but atleast I had a relationship with
him, you know.
So I talked to him about it, Iscreamed at him about it.
I was really, really upset.
But you know, like now, lookingback, I see that my
relationship became so muchcloser and he'd given me a dream
(09:42):
that really helped me and in itbasically said you have a job
to do where you are, and Fordhas a job to do where he is.
And it just relieved me, youknow.
And then I went on.
I was like, okay, I have a jobto do.
I don't know what it is yet,but I'm ready.
Piet Van Waarde (09:59):
Now there are a couple of ways I want to take
the conversation today.
First of all, you mentionedthat you were married for 50
years.
That is a rare thing in our day.
So tell me, are there and I'msure people ask you, but I'm
just curious myself are theresome things that you look back
(10:20):
at in your relationship and saythese were some key decisions we
made along the way that aidedour longevity?
Denise Jackson (10:28):
So early on we.
So I'm going to step back towhen Lee was saying let's get
married.
We need to get married becauseyou're pregnant.
And I was like, no, I'm 16.
And he said if we get married,god will take care of us.
Neither one of us had thatstrong of faith then, but those
(10:51):
words out of his mouth, I think,really made a difference.
They convinced me that I couldtrust him and that somehow we'd
make it.
Then, a little later in ourlives, we started praying
together.
It was from desperation,normally.
(11:13):
At first we were living inLakey, texas, and we'd lived
there a year and the economyaround Texas fell apart because
gas prices went up to $2 agallon and nobody would travel.
You know we laugh at that now,but back then it meant that his
construction job was going awayand we didn't have any money.
(11:33):
We couldn't live and so hedecided he needed to go back to
college.
So we had done everything wecould to go back to college and
every door closed.
So Kerrvillevil was 60 milesaway.
We decided to go finish up, uh,the basics there, and he
applied as a dorm director, Iapplied as a kindergarten
(11:56):
teacher.
Neither one of us had degrees.
Everybody wanted degrees yeah,yeah and um, so those doors
closed and so we really justdidn't have a way to move.
And it was two weeks beforeschool started and he took my
hands and said we're gonna praythat god will do something.
And I said, okay, let's, I meanwe're at that point.
(12:19):
So we started praying and thephone rang and it was Shriner
College, saying the guy that wassupposed to be the dorm
director had backed out at thelast minute.
Would he be willing to do itstill?
And he said yes, and so we gotoff the phone.
He got off the phone and he saidbut babe, we still need to pray
(12:40):
because we don't have any moneycoming in.
We had a, we had tuition, wehad a place to live, we even had
food.
We could eat at the cafeteriawith the kids.
So it was like huge.
But we needed money to drive acar or to do anything, pay the
electric bill, um, and so hesaid we still need to pray and
so he started.
We he held my hands againstarted praying.
(13:02):
The phone rang again and it wasZion Lutheran Children's Center
in Kerrville saying thekindergarten teacher that we had
hired has told us they can't behere.
Piet Van Waarde (13:14):
Oh, wow.
Denise Jackson (13:15):
Can you come be the kindergarten teacher?
So you know, along the way welearned prayer praying together.
God listened to those prayerseven more than our individual
prayers.
It was just holy.
It was like he was just rightthere in the middle of us.
He was in the middle of us fromthe beginning because of Lee's
(13:36):
words, I think.
And then we went through a hardtime in a church.
We went through this great timein this church because we
learned so, so much about theword, but then, a few years in,
it broke apart, and it was verydevastating.
And through that, though, welearned you can't trust any
(13:59):
wonderful individual man orwoman that's leading a church.
You have to put your faith inGod and spend time with Him.
So I would say the first thingis back to what I learned at 19,
love the Lord, your God, withall your heart, so when the
other person fails, you're nottrusting them, you're trusting
(14:19):
God.
Second thing is that you praytogether.
And the third thing, which isjust as important, is pouring in
the Word of God helps the Wordto be in your heart, and it
comes out of your mouth, andwhen it does, it's powerful.
And so I began first to pray formy husband and my children the
(14:44):
Word of God when we were in thatchurch where we learned so much
, and I've continued to do that.
And now, lee, over the years,we started praying together and
he started praying for me theword of God, and I just feel
like that's just been such agame changer, because we don't
trust each other more than wetrust God.
(15:07):
So when one of us hurts theother one, unintentionally or
intentionally, we go back to God.
We know that we need to praytogether to stay together.
That sounds kind of cliche, butit's the truth.
And then we know that the wordsthat we speak about each other
need to be what God says aboutus, and so that's just been
(15:30):
really powerful in our lives.
Piet Van Waarde (15:32):
Yeah, you know one of the things that I often
use as an illustration.
So my wife and I we did a lotof premarital counseling when I
was pastoring, and you'rebringing up a point that I think
is so crucial, and that is thata lot of times, when people
think about their relationshipand how God fits into that
relationship, they think aboutit in terms of a slice of life.
(15:52):
So I have my finances, I havemy career, I have my kids, I
have my hobbies and, oh yeah, Ishould have a slice that's
designated to God, and you know,then all the other things have
a way of edging out.
Or maybe the thought is I needto have a really big slice of
God and then how do I fiteverything else?
Denise Jackson (16:12):
in.
Piet Van Waarde (16:12):
But the analogy I like is to have God at the
center of the circle and Hisword, his influence, his spirit
informs all the other things.
So, whether we're talking aboutour finances or we're talking
about how to raise kids, orwe're talking about our finances
or we're talking about how toraise kids, or we're talking
about even things likerecreation, you know what are
(16:33):
the things that renew us fromGod's perspective To have that
as a centerpiece, and thenyou're both looking at that like
that's equally important toboth of you.
It just solves so many of theproblems it does.
Denise Jackson (16:44):
It doesn't mean that everything's easy, of
course we still have walkedthrough things, but we walk
through them so differently.
My mom just died the other dayand I keep thinking about we
don't grieve like other people,grieve that don't know the Lord.
We still grieve, we miss them,but we know we're going to see
(17:09):
them again and we know that weare not without hope, that they
are with the Father, they'rewith Abba and they know what we
don't know.
We just see through a glass dim.
That was hard.
We were really shaken in thatseason but you know, we just had
(17:39):
to hold on to Abba, to trustthat in Jesus' name we were
healed, or that Lee was healedand then he is.
Praise God.
But it was a really, reallyscary walk and then we had to
come to terms with well, if he'sgoing to meet the Father sooner
(18:03):
than I am, then how am I goingto make that journey and just
coming to a place where I couldbe peaceful about that and him
coming to a place where he couldbe peaceful about that?
I don't know how people evenwalk through the earth or
problems with kids.
Our four teenagers acted justlike me.
(18:23):
They were wild kids becausethey like to talk and they're
out there and they're leading myold kids because they like to
talk and they're out there andthey're leading and you know, I
would get so worried about themand then I would just take them
and hand them back to God andsay, okay, this is the word.
I'm praying over them.
Piet Van Waarde (18:54):
When they're old, they won't depart from it,
cling to that, you know, so thatyou know I could have peace and
joy and continue in life withthat.
I've noticed that too.
We've talked a little bit aboutmy journey with cancer, and one
of the things I'm discoveringand I'm guessing you knew the
same is that you can, on onehand, feel the reality of your
sickness, your disease, andyou're in front of a doctor and
(19:15):
he's telling you all theseominous things, and so that
creates a certain reaction,obviously.
But then you also have thisother thing that is at work in
you, which is God's promises,God's word, God's spirit, which
is reassuring you.
God's promises, God's word,God's spirit, which is
reassuring you.
It's like, yeah, this isn'treal, but there's this other
(19:37):
counterbalance that is just asreal, that provides perspective
and hope in the midst of thetrial.
And the more experiences youhave like that, the more
trustworthy it becomes isn't it?
Denise Jackson (19:47):
Yeah, that's true.
You have like that, the moretrustworthy it becomes, isn't it
?
Yeah, that's true?
I think, too, like goingthrough that.
We know heaven is a realitybecause we've walked through so
many things, because we know howGod reached down and made those
two phone calls.
And reached down, those twophone calls and reached down.
(20:12):
He told us to pay off our houseand then opened the door for a
job and then the job ended May15th of 2021.
I got laid off because it wasCOVID ramifications and no, on
May 30th and on May 15th, wemade the last payment on our
house and, like other peoplewould be like, oh, I lost my job
(20:34):
.
And I was like, yes, you toldme to get this job so we could
pay out the house.
And it was paid off.
Everything was done.
You know, just learning to.
Whatever we're going through,trusting that you know, as long
as I'm here, I have work to doand you have work to do.
And when we're going throughtrusting that, you know, as long
as I'm here, I have work to doand you have work to do, and
(20:54):
when we're not here, we havework to do.
It really mattered even allthat time ago, but still matters
to me that it doesn't stop youknow, and he's got it, and so if
one of us has to live withouteach, other.
Piet Van Waarde (21:12):
It won't be easy, but it will be something
that we can do, because ourfaith will be the thing that
holds us.
Yeah, I love that.
So you also have now a veryinteresting role in talking to
ladies.
Yes, so part of how weconnected was that you also have
.
Is it a podcast?
Denise Jackson (21:27):
Well, it's an upcoming podcast.
I look over at my podcastproducer over there.
We've done a lot of recordingsand they're on the website
already.
They're on YouTube, but wehaven't put them into a podcast
format.
Piet Van Waarde (21:44):
So tell me a little bit about what he did so.
Denise Jackson (21:47):
I'm sorry I'm going to have to scooch up and
give that little mic.
So I have been consulting withsmall businesses for the last
few years since I left thatother job in my own business and
I've enjoyed that.
But I have been so drawn for somany years to supporting women
(22:10):
in these different areas thatare hard in our lives, and so a
dream that I've had is to starta business where I could share
my stories of remembrance withGod, with God, and God has just
(22:34):
really spoken to me aboutexpanding that and talking to a
lot more women about theirexperiences when God was mighty
in their lives at differentseasons, and so we're recording
those and that's one of thepieces of it, because the E's
Greenhouse of it, because theE's Greenhouse E the letter E, s
(22:55):
for Sam greenhousecom is aplace where women can also learn
and they can also be coached inthese different areas of their
lives.
So the piece of the videos is agreat place to just hear and be
encouraged for women who aregoing through whatever season in
their lives, and then my hopeis that also they'll get trained
(23:18):
up in the ways of the Lordrather than their ways of the
world.
So when I'm running.
When I'm coaching in business,I'm coaching about God's way of
running a business which isreally important, very different
from the way the world wants usto run business.
Marriage with God is very, verydifferent than what the world
(23:39):
says a marriage should look like.
Raising up your children verydifferent.
Being a member of yourcommunity is very different.
You love your neighbors.
When you get into situations,well guess what?
It's you that's going to haveto figure out what the word
wants you, what God wants you todo about that, and that's
(24:01):
usually harder than you think.
But in doing that like you buildcommunity you build community
with the women that you'rearound, and so, anyway, I just
want to share that.
I just want to share thosestories and equipping and I was
a teacher for 13 years, inbetween running businesses and
(24:23):
corporate work, and I feel likethat's just the gift that has
sustained through the years, youknow.
Piet Van Waarde (24:30):
I love to teach .
Tell me a little bit about thestories.
Like do you have an example of,like a story that maybe that
you've heard recently that, soyeah, inspired me, um so one of,
uh, the ladies that I talked towho, uh she she was really
worried about doing theinterview.
Denise Jackson (24:49):
she said, oh, no one's going to want to hear me.
Even afterwards, when she sawit, she was like, oh, nobody's
going to care about that.
What she was talking about wasshe got a puppy when she was
young after her dad died at ayoung age, and she loved that
(25:10):
puppy.
But then five years later thatpuppy died and she loved that
puppy, but then five years laterthat puppy died.
Well then the next time shewanted to get a dog, after she
was married and was pregnantwith her first child, she like
did all of this genetic testing.
I mean, she was just like doingall of these things to try to
make sure that dog would live.
You need to watch the video tosee the rest of it.
(25:33):
But what she learned throughthat is she can't put her trust
in what the world has to offer.
She has to let go.
She can't control everysituation.
She has to let go.
You mean we can't, we can't, wecan't.
We have to kind of be on theriver and just let it take us,
(25:53):
and it's God's river and so,anyway, it's a wonderful
interview.
Some of the other ones thatjust stand out to me are Paisley
Jackson, who is Preston'ssister, went on mission for
three months to Burundi, in theCongo, and she's used with a
(26:15):
mission, and that video is sowild Like most of us can't
comprehend what it would be liketo go serve in some place.
That is very dangerous, but shefell in love with it.
It was so funny because Irecorded her while she was in
(26:37):
training and she had hilariousideas, and then I recorded her
after, when she had done thetrip and and faced some things,
and so you got to see both sideslike the way that we think
about going to someplace likethat.
and then what she found, whatshe came back with, was such a
love for the people in the Congoand Burundi.
(26:59):
And then she went to Mongoliafor a month to staff a prayer
room and again came back with somuch love for these people that
she met, and so it's a prettypowerful, powerful.
Piet Van Waarde (27:14):
That sounds like it, so where can people
find this?
Denise Jackson (27:17):
At easegreenhousecom Okay, right
now and you can look on YouTubefor Ease Greenhouse and you'll
find several videos.
I think we have 12 so far andour goal this year is to reach
100 women so that there's somuch content out there that
other women can watch and theycan sort through and find their
(27:40):
issue or their struggle and knowthat God's not a respecter of
persons.
He says that, but when youlisten to like me, broke and
needing a job, and Lee needing ajob for our lives to continue,
god was faithful.
If he would be faithful withDenise Jackson, he's going to be
faithful with you, and sothat's the message that I really
(28:04):
want women to hear is you areable to be strong because God is
strong on your behalf if youwill just trust in him and lean
in Because God is strong on yourbehalf, if you will just trust
in him and lean in.
Piet Van Waarde (28:15):
Which leads me to my last question I have for
you, which is and it may be justwhat you said, but maybe you
want to elaborate on it Givenall the things that you've
experienced, both in yourmarriage and leaning on God to
find direction and resources,and now in the work you're doing
with women, is there somethingthat's kind of been a common
(28:43):
theme through it all.
Denise Jackson (28:44):
That has become sort of a life message for you.
Well, for me, early on, godjust spoke to me to write a book
of remembrance so that when Iwent through the flood, when I
went through the fire, I wouldremember who he was, so that I
would not stumble.
And so I believe that's stillthe same message.
(29:04):
It's been a theme I thinkthrough my teaching, through the
companies I've run through thecompanies I've run through my
own startups, is just to writedown everything that I'm going
through, good or bad, and thenlook back and see God's hand in
(29:25):
it, and it does really build upmy spirit to remember that he
never has let me down, and wewere talking before this started
about.
You don't see the crooked pathuntil you are down the road, and
then you see every spot wherehis hand just guided you and
(29:48):
kept you safe and walked youthrough whatever you needed to
go through and, like we saidbefore, not that there aren't
hard things, but you're neveralone.
Piet Van Waarde (30:01):
You're not alone Right right.
Denise Jackson (30:03):
And when you know that it just changes
everything.
Piet Van Waarde (30:06):
Yeah, I love that.
You know the scriptures oftentalk about, you know, remember,
and you kind of wonder well, whyis that such a repeated theme?
And I think it's exactly whatyou're alluding to.
Is that we have a tendency toforget.
Yes, the need of the moment orthe disappointments tend to
(30:28):
outweigh all the good that Goddoes.
But if you have a place that youcan go on a regular basis where
you have a tool or a journalwhere you've written down these
things.
It's like okay, when I'm inthat place where I'm getting
ready to doubt or be discouraged, I can go back and read about
the faithfulness of God.
(30:48):
In fact, I think that's part ofwhat the scriptures are for
right.
Denise Jackson (30:51):
That's right, that's right.
That's the best book ofremembrance that we have.
But I think that what if nobodywrote that book of remembrance?
What if nobody was obedient tokeep track of what God was doing
?
None of us would have what wehave today, and of course, god
made sure that that happened.
(31:12):
But, yeah, we need our book ofremembrance to help us get
through these things and one dayface to face.
Amen, yeah.
Piet Van Waarde (31:20):
Well, that's a beautiful place to start a stop,
and thank you so much forjoining me today.
It's been such a pleasure tomeet you it has been a pleasure
meeting you too.
Denise Jackson (31:29):
I can't wait to meet your other half.
You've been married a lot ofyears too, so you know a lot.
Thank you for asking me to joinyou today.
Piet Van Waarde (31:37):
You're welcome and thank you for joining us.
We're so grateful that you werepart of our time together today
, and please join us again foranother episode of Sidewalk
Conversations.
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