June 2, 2025 • 34 mins
Sarah sits down with Shira Gans to discuss Shira’s work as a nationally recognized social impact strategist and as the Senior Executive Director for Policy and Programs at the NYC Mayor’s Office of Media and Entertainment. She has led pioneering initiatives that promote equity, opportunity, and sustainability across entertainment, government, and finance—including founding NY Music Month, the city’s official celebration of its vibrant music scene, The initiative now encompasses nearly 60 events with 55 industry partners, features concerts, conferences, workshops, and community programming throughout the month of June.
Gans also launched NYC’s $12 million music industry social impact strategy and designed a $10 million grant program for women-led entertainment projects. Her work includes creating the NYC Office of Nightlife, advancing green film practices, and helping over 12,000 unbanked New Yorkers gain access to banking. A City & State “40 Under 40” Rising Star, she’s been featured in The New York Times, Forbes, Variety, and Billboard.
Ready to experience New York Music Month? Visit nyc.gov/musicmonth for the full lineup of June events happening across the city.
https://www.nyc.gov/site/mome/industries/ny-music-month.page
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
She creates noise.
She creates noise.
She's moving through the worldwith a powerful voice.
She creates noise.
She creates noise she createsnoise.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Hi, you're listening to Sarah DeGuerney and welcome
to.
She Creates Noise, a podcastabout women who make the music
business run, coming to you fromNew York City.
Now, if you're not familiarwith me, here's a little
background.
I'm a songwriter, producer,manager, educator and mentor to
many artists.
I've written platinum-sellingsongs, had tracks on
Grammy-nominated records andmentor to many artists.
I've written platinum-sellingsongs, had tracks on
Grammy-nominated records andreleased music on both major and
independent labels.
(00:51):
I was a jazz singer, a jinglesinger and a pop artist.
I've had record deals, touredwith big bands and performed at
music festivals across US,europe and Asia.
More recently, my focus hasbeen on writing with and
developing young talent.
In the coming weeks, I'll bepulling back the curtain on the
music industry's femalechangemakers, women who have
(01:13):
reshaped the business inprofound ways.
My goal here is to helplisteners better understand how
the music business really worksand just how instrumental women
behind the scenes have been.
You'll hear from both sides ofthe desk artists, producers,
managers, label executives,lawyers.
Women making things happen,often without the spotlight on
(01:37):
them.
Thank you for joining me onthis journey.
Now let's dive in.
Journey Now, let's dive in.
Today's guest is Shira Gans.
Now, shira Gans is a nationallyrecognized social impact
strategist and currently thesenior executive director for
policy and programs at the NewYork City Mayor's Office of
(01:59):
Media and Entertainment.
She's led pioneeringinitiatives that promote equity,
opportunity and sustainabilityacross entertainment, government
and finance, including New YorkCity's $12 million music
industry social impact strategy.
She founded New York is MusicMonth and a $10 million grant
program for women-ledentertainment projects.
(02:19):
Her work also includes creatingthe New York City Office of
Nightlife, advancing green filmpractices and helping over
12,000 unbanked New Yorkers gainaccess to banking A city and
state 40 under 40 rising star.
She's been featured in the NewYork Times, forbes, variety and
Billboard.
Today we're going to talk alittle bit about how she came to
(02:40):
this interesting role at themayor's office and about New
York is Music Month, which isgoing on right now, and there
are lots of events to check out.
We'll put a link in the shownotes, so please come to the
events and see some great musicthis month in New York City.
Shira, it's really great tohave you.
Thank you so much for beinghere.
Thanks, sarah.
Happy to be here Now.
(03:00):
You've described yourself assomeone driven to address
inequality.
You've had a very interestingbackground.
You've done a lot of cool,different things.
Can you tell us a little bitabout your journey?
Speaker 3 (03:11):
I guess started after college and my drive
professionally really was alwaysto address social issues and to
(03:31):
try to focus in on issues thatto me were at the center of a
Venn diagram of pressing needsand concerns in society.
And I was very drawn to theissues around prisoner rights
and that to me they seem to beat the center of issues around
sort of botched drug policy,tensions between rural and urban
(03:53):
areas, systemic racism throughour justice system and the
strange kind of infiltration ofmanufacturing and corporate jobs
into prisons actually.
So I started my career.
I moved from being East Coasterout to San Francisco where I
monitored mental health care inCalifornia prisons Wow yeah, and
(04:14):
it was definitely a pretty eyeopening job that was also.
It was like a mix of reallyheavy subject matter that was
also kind of rote in a way andsort of boring.
There's a lot of correspondingwith mentally ill inmates and
kind of having this formulaicresponses because there was only
so much we could do.
And then after that I realizedmy aspirations at first had been
(04:38):
to be a national prison expert,but that involves spending a
lot of time in prisons andplaces where prisons are, which
actually is not really a greatway.
I think I found that I wantedto spend my time I didn't think
I was up for the task.
So I became a federalinvestigator at the Equal
Employment OpportunityCommission where I investigated
claims of employmentdiscrimination.
(04:59):
I think those experiences bothtaught me a lot about kind of
empathy and understanding.
You know people's subjectiveexperience.
There's not necessarily like anobjective reality of who's
right or wrong in a situation orone way to view it.
But I also realized that doingkind of casework was probably
not my calling.
So I got a graduate degree at UCBerkeley in public policy and
(05:22):
moved to New York City after,where I've been ever since and
I've mostly just worked in citygovernment.
I worked at the budget office.
I did food policy and financialinclusion work for Scott
Stringer when he was president.
I worked at the Federal ReserveBank doing financial inclusion
work and community developmentfor small businesses, and then I
was the policy director for thecity's consumer protection
(05:44):
agency working for CommissionerJulie Mennon, who was then
reappointed to the mayor'soffice of media and
entertainment, and she asked meif I would go with her and at
first my thought was kind ofwell, why would I do that?
You know I do sort of theseimportant, weighty things.
And then I was kind of like whywouldn't I do that?
You know, that sounds reallyfun and like a new and
(06:05):
interesting front.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
A lot lighter too.
A lot lighter.
Speaker 3 (06:09):
Yeah, a lot lighter.
I mean, court pretension in NewYork City isn't necessarily as
daunting as, say, prisonerrights or employment
discrimination, but it's reallypretty in the weeds of city
regulatory framework.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
Impressive.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
So, anyway, I came over to this agency, which we
refer to as MOAM, the Mayor'sOffice of Media and
Entertainment.
It's a little bit of a mouthful.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
I like that MOAM Okay .
Speaker 3 (06:34):
And I mean that's kind of a journey to get here,
so it's pretty circuitous.
I don't think I would have everthought at the beginning of
that journey that I would havespent this is the longest job
I've had.
I've been here for about nineyears that it would be doing
music industry and entertainmentindustry work, but I guess you
never really know where thingsare going to take you.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
Absolutely, and it's great to have you because I see
you around all the events.
You're very present and doing alot of great things for us.
You've helped foster a strongconnection between government
and the arts, and is thissomething completely new for the
city of New York, bringing thearts together with government
like this?
Speaker 3 (07:10):
It's new for the city .
For arts in general, the cityhas the Department of Cultural
Affairs, which is a grantingagency that has I don't want to
misquote it, but it's severalhundred million dollar budget
and it supports everything fromLincoln Center to the Met, to
the Museum of Natural History,as well as numerous arts
nonprofits.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Makes it.
The music business is kind of anew and groovier thing.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
Indeed.
So before I had this role therewas no person or agency in city
government whose job it was tosupport the music industry.
I think we look at it a littlemore from an economic
development business lens and ofcourse for something like the
music industry you can't reallythe art side and the business
side are not necessarilydistinct, but it's less of a
(07:54):
focus just on art for art's sakeand more of cultivating the
creative sectors that arecritical to New York City's
economy.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Because I read somewhere that it's like $21
billion that the music industrybrings in.
Speaker 3 (08:06):
That was actually one of the first things I did when
I started.
The role was I.
We commissioned a musiceconomic impact study looking at
the role of the industry in NewYork City, and now it's a
decade old, so it's definitelyon my agenda to try to secure
funding to redo it.
But what we found was that theindustry overall supported $21
billion in economic output,60,000 jobs and $5 billion in
(08:29):
wages.
So it's not just about, course,music as a driver of culture,
but it's also a big business forme.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
That's great to hear because so many people, I think
you know, have left New YorkCity from the music business.
They've gone to.
Nashville and LA and we'retrying to bring them back.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
Here, they're still here.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
We're here, we're hanging on.
It's tough.
I mean I did a song camp duringCOVID which was trying to like
tell everyone we are here.
So I had a lot of.
It was called Songs Across theWater.
I had a lot of people from allover the world working with New
York writers.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
You know, I think it did raise a little bit of
awareness, trying to get them tostop flying over us when
they're coming from foreigncountries.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Now, one of the things I really want to talk
about is how you are the founderof one of the most exciting
initiatives, which is MusicMonth, and this is a terrific
idea.
How did you come up with thatand can you tell us what kind of
programs it offers, and alsomaybe give us a sense of what we
should keep our eyes open forcoming up in the month of June,
(09:34):
because this is when it will air.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
The New York Music Month is the city's official
music industry festival.
It happens the entire month ofJune and that's something that I
created and founded in 2017.
And that really came out of aconversation I like to give him
credit with Justin Klifowitz,who was the head of Downtown
Music Publishing at the time.
That's what the company was andJustin's always been a big
(09:57):
advocate for New York City as amusic city.
And when I started this role,as we discussed, I had no
background in music.
I wouldn't even say at the timemusic was a driving force in my
life personally, like everyonelikes music, right, but I wasn't
going out every night to showsor so I really had to kind of
tap my own network of people whoI like.
(10:18):
I had a good friend from when Ilived in San Francisco who
worked at Ingrooves and she kindof connected me to some folks
and everyone was just like youhave to talk to Justin.
So we had a meeting and he wassaying you know, the industry
does so much in June.
There's all these festivals,there's award shows, there's
conferences, campus City dosomething to recognize that.
And I was like, yeah, that's agreat idea, let's make June New
(10:38):
York Music Month.
And so it started pretty smalland the idea originally was just
to kind of reflect and honorall the economic and cultural
activity the industry brings toNew York during June and then
around the margins kind of doour own thing.
So we started this conferencewith NYU at the Steinhardt Music
Business Program and maybe Ihad like 10 events.
(10:59):
And then year over year it'skind of been really exciting to
see it become its own thing.
So the conference has grown.
This year it's June 3rd.
It's going to be at NYUSkirball now.
This will be the second year,so that's an 850 capacity room.
It's like a real stage.
It's a beautiful venue and wehave around 40 speakers who kind
of dive into all differentaspects of the industry.
(11:22):
And I try to keep it a fast day.
So we have these five-minutekind of TED Talks which usually
feature folks working on asocial impact component of the
industry.
This year we have someone fromCarnegie Hall I'm having someone
from ACLU come to discuss theimportance of how do you protect
freedom of expression in themoment that we're in now, and
then we have fireside chats andpanels looking more at industry
(11:42):
business topics.
So we have a really cool one onAI, we're going to have one on
music and gaming, and then therest of the month is both
performances and talks that arereally just a collaboration
between folks in the industryand our office, specifically
myself.
So people kind of approach mewith an idea Like well, I've
always wanted to talk about thistopic or I thought it would be
(12:03):
really interesting if we didsomething on X and then I work
with them collaboratively toshape that idea and make it kind
of right for the Music Monthaudience.
I'm able to give you know some.
I have budget for the programso I want to make sure that
everyone's paid, particularlyanyone who performs.
No one's getting rich off ofMusic Month, you know, but I
don't want anyone to come out inthe red.
So it's always something thatfeels collaborative and, I think
(12:25):
, to fuel the ecosystem.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
With the Music Month things, the events?
Is it mostly like students thatare showing up to Skrull Center
?
No, no, no.
Or industry people.
Speaker 3 (12:34):
It's all industry folks really.
I'd say it runs the gamut frompeople who are emerging artists
or early stage career, butthere's really people who, you
know, are pretty senior in theindustry because we're able,
since it's really unique.
There's no other city that doesanything like this.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
I've attended a lot of these things, but I haven't
been to the Skirball Center.
You know that I need to go to.
Speaker 3 (12:55):
We should come June 3rd.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
Okay, I'm going to do that.
Speaker 3 (12:58):
The conference is about, at least you know.
Last time we did a survey ofthe people who attended.
I would say at least 60% of thepeople in the room have been
working in the industry for 10or more years.
So it's definitely not studentsthough students are welcome, of
course but it's a professionalindustry conference.
But it's interesting becauseit's not segmented the way a lot
of other conferences are.
It's not just about sync orit's not just about publishing
(13:20):
indie labels yeah, it's likeeverything.
So the events themselves, whichwould be in the, they're kind of
these four verticals for MusicMonth, there's the conference,
there's talks, there'sperformances and then we
underwrite free rehearsal space.
So for the talks, like this year, overall between performances
and talks, we're going to havealmost 60 events, I think in
(13:41):
partnership with 55 differentindustry partners, and those
range from kind of smallerindependent companies up to,
like Downtown or Empire or UAA,you know, companies who want to
give back, who want toparticipate, who want to give a
platform for their teams ortheir artists and really just
share information about either.
You know there's one event thiswoman, sherry Hugh, who started
(14:05):
Water Music, that looks at AIand the tech ecosystem in New
York for music she's going to doan event on kind of like where
tech investment for music standsright now in the city.
So it's something like that,but it's a little more developed
or thought leadership to thingsthat are like hey, here's a
basic event on understandingyour merch strategy.
So it really runs from like akind of one-on-one to diving
(14:28):
more into interesting topics.
Or Rock Nation School at LA hewas going to do some interesting
like fireside chats, so it's.
It really is a very diverselineup and then on the
performance side there's so manyamazing festivals that we don't
want to compete with.
So we partner with differentcurators and labels and folks to
create a platform for emergingartists, because I think that
(14:51):
can be a hard thing in New York.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Because GovBall in June right, for example.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
Yeah, govball Summer Stage kicks off.
Celebrate Brooklyn kicks offOut in Forest Hill like they
have a whole lineup for thesummer.
Coney Island there's a bigstadium there has a whole lineup
, so there's just a ton of stuffgoing on.
Little Island, which is a greatoutdoor space on the river, has
a lineup.
(15:16):
So the goal is never to competewith anything that's.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
Yes, it's to support it and to also give
up-and-coming artists anopportunity.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
And to give folks who are in the like.
I'm not someone who I thinkshould be curating live music.
No one wants live music to dothis.
I'm not that's not the role ofcity government or someone in my
role but I can empower peoplewho are working with emerging
artists to have a space and somemoney so that people can
perform, can get in front of anaudience, can get for their time
(15:47):
.
I heard someone once say youknow, people can die of exposure
like.
I don't like the idea.
I never want someone to performand not get paid because I want
us to value art that's great,and actually I heard on another
interview you did.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
You have very cool music taste, so don't be so.
Yeah, don't be so shy.
Speaker 3 (16:04):
Thanks it's definitely thanks to people I
met in the industry andsometimes, weirdly, my palatine,
but mostly it's just like.
One of the things I like aboutthe music industry work is it
doesn't matter how senior theperson is I'm meeting.
They're always excited to talkabout a new band they're into or
someone they're listening to.
So I'm always keeping thislittle list on my phone, like,
ok, I'm going to go home and I'mgoing to check out that artist
(16:25):
or that band and I know you havea son is he a big music fan?
He is a big music fan, he likesto listen to.
He's really into Kendrick Lamarand some music that's probably
not appropriate and he knowswhen it's like a radio edit
he'll be like why, where's thebad words?
(16:45):
I want a version with the badwords.
So we have discussions about,like okay, this is art and they
can use those words and that'sartistic expression.
So I'm not going to censor it,but you can't say those words.
So we have those conversationsa lot.
He also.
He has a pretty diverse musictaste too.
He was really into Queen for awhile, I mean.
So, yeah, we listen to musictogether.
(17:07):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
It keeps us young to have young people around showing
us what's cool.
Now I want to make at the endof this.
I'm going to ask to make surethat we have a list.
We'll get some links to what'sgoing on in Music Month and I
know you're busy so I'm tryingto go down the list of all the
(17:32):
things I wanted to talk aboutNow.
You recently recognizedVariety's Power of Women New
York Impact List.
From your perspective, whatunique challenges and
opportunities do women in mediaand entertainment face today?
Speaker 3 (17:49):
I think the challenges that women face in
media and entertainment probablyaren't so distinct from the
challenges that women face ingeneral, which I think you know
are multifaceted.
One would just be the basics ofdo you have a seat at the table
?
Are you included?
So I like to look at annenberg.
Usc annenberg center puts outannually reports looking at
(18:12):
gender representation acrossmedia and entertainment.
So they have one um, it's likeinclusion in the studio and they
look at the billboard top 100every year.
So this year is like only six%of producers on those songs were
women and they looked over morethan a decade of doing the
study and a thousand songs.
The ratio of male to femaleproducers on those songs was 27
(18:35):
to one.
So you know you might be seeingmore female artists and those
numbers I think are gettingbetter.
But in terms of in the studioor in the boardroom, those
numbers don't look great.
And then I think there's more,you know, like subtle things
which are, I think, at thismoment in time, like there's a
(18:56):
lot to talk about authenticity,and I think one of the ways you
can connect professionally orthrough social media channels,
if that's the way you need tomessage is by being authentic.
But there's not really a lot ofspace for women to truly be
authentic, I think, withdifferent ideas about how women
should behave or what's sociallyacceptable and sort of this
(19:19):
constant, I think, calculus thatwomen in position of power are
making about how to create spacefor yourself, how to be taken
seriously, but also how not tobe sort of dinged for the
behaviors that might advancemen's careers but probably
aren't going to help you out, orjust you know, and this is not
(19:41):
just for women like learning tosort of be okay with people not
liking you, and I think that's alittle more challenging for
women because we're kind ofraised to be people pleasers or
to be caretakers.
So I don't think I'm sayinganything particularly new, but I
know that that's you know.
For me in government I thinkthose issues are sort of
compounded because there's ideasabout how people in government
(20:03):
behave or you know, there's alot of rules and bureaucracy and
ideas about what's acceptableor not acceptable, and then
that's compounded by being awoman and then you know you have
to kind of pick and choosewhich things you're going to toe
the line on and which thingsyou're going to be like.
Oh well, Right.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
Well, I mean, you seem to have sailed through all
these issues very, verybeautifully.
Uh, because you, you, I meanyou're, you're doing great,
you're doing so much and youknow, I never get it.
I don't get a sense of you, anycomplaint or anything from you.
You're just, you're just doingwhat you do and it's just
working.
You know, I think you, you'rejust confident.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
Yeah part of the sound, right, I mean I could
complain but I wouldn't help meout and I think you know the
other thing that gets talkedabout some, but I think is a
challenge that I definitely faceespecially.
I didn't go into public serviceto because I wanted to be like
one of the world's richestpeople you know, but there is a
different um pay scale whenyou're in the public sector, and
(21:04):
part of, I think and kind ofyou mentioned, I think part of
the way you build trust and youconnect with folks is that you
have to show up, and so a lot ofthe showing up is at night, and
if you're a parent, especiallylike I'm a single parent, then
that can create a real challenge, and so that's not something I
think people talk about.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
So that's not something I think people talk
about and I think the lack ofdiscussion around that and what
that means, even if you're not asingle parent, like what
happens if you need to be at anevent every night and you have a
kid.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
Good babysitters yeah , I know I totally get it Okay
being a single parent.
Yep, my son hates music.
He's like oh, that's a monthyou abandon your kid.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
I guess that's one of the things I do during that
month For a very worthy cause.
Now there's also the $10million fund that was created to
support women in music.
How is, can you tell us?
Speaker 3 (22:05):
a little about that and how it's being implemented.
It's not just, it's actuallyfor women in music, media and
theater.
So when we first created thefund it was focused on film,
television and theater.
And the idea originally behindothers actually more research
out of annenberg was that forwomen in film, um, they would
kind of get close to finishing aproject and then, because they
don't have the same networks oraccess to capital as men, they
would kind of get close tofinishing a project and then,
(22:26):
because they don't have the samenetworks or access to capital
as men, they would be, you know,$20,000, $50,000 out from the
money they needed and theywouldn't be able to complete it.
So we created sort of afinishing fund.
It was the first of its kind inthe country for a local
government to do that.
It's kind in the country for alocal government to do that.
(22:49):
And then in the second year Iadded music to it.
So we did do five rounds.
Um, it was 10 million.
I have some of the stats herethat I could find that I pulled
together.
So for music, um, over the fivecycles we awarded just a little
less than 1.3 million million toabout 118 projects, and we did
(23:09):
that in two categories, like theclassical, experimental, jazz,
new music, which is typically, Ithink, what gets grants, and
that was 50 projects.
But we also it was important tome we added a general category,
so that was everything fromlike pop to hip hop to
electronic music, and that was68 projects.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Yes, it's true that jazz and classical do tend to
get more funding, everythingfrom like pop to hip hop to
electronic music, and that was68 projects.
Speaker 3 (23:33):
Yes, it's true that jazz and classical do tend to
get more funding.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
Yeah, yeah, it was important for me that there was
popular music was part of that.
Cool, and is that something Ithink you said there's?
There's only a final, there'sone more year of that, or?
Speaker 3 (23:44):
No, we, we it's issued our last round.
We did that.
So we did five rounds, okay,but hopefully we're going to be
doing an evaluation of it and awhite paper so that other cities
can kind of look at it and seewhat the lessons are that we
learned.
There were some challengesaround music, where for the
other categories say, for a film, it's like okay, you finished
(24:04):
your film and then did you get.
For a film, it's like okay, youfinished your film and then did
you get into a film festival,did somebody buy your, you know
like the film and pick it up fordistribution.
Whereas for music, okay, wehelped you complete the funds
are for a new album or ep or fora video for yet to be released
work, um, and so you did that.
But then you know people arereleasing right songs, yeah, so
(24:27):
how?
yeah, so how do we really gaugeif that was a success, if we're
giving them the support thatthey needed to really take that
music that they created and thenmake sure that it could be
monetized and heard and createlike revenue streams for them.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
So what was the average budget for?
For, like the music side, let'ssay someone was trying to do an
EP what would be the average?
Speaker 3 (24:49):
The grants could go up to $20,000.
I don't actually have insightinto whether or not I assume
most people ask for that amount.
For film it was a littledifferent.
Those went up to $50,000.
People didn't always ask forthe total amount.
Those were the grant size.
Speaker 2 (25:08):
It's great but of course it does cost more to then
get promotion teams and to getmore people involved, to get the
PR etc to have it released.
But it's a great start that'sreally cool.
What advice would you givepeople who would like to be in
your area, do something likewhat you do?
They're young listeners.
I'm sure there are.
(25:28):
How do you, how do people,prepare for this kind of a field
?
Public either, serving inpolicy, partnership, working in
media and entertainment you knowin the type of capacity that
you have well, not to discourage.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
there aren't really that many roles like what I do.
There's like a few of us aroundthe country and the world who
kind of have these music policyjobs.
I think what I found in doingthis work is and across my
career, the things that I foundthe most gratifying, the most
motivating and successful havebeen public-private partnerships
(26:06):
.
So I think there really is adesire on the part of industry
to give back and to be connectedand also to be recognized by
government, and so I think thosedesires really set the table
for partnerships, and I thinkthere's also just like a lot of
misunderstanding.
I mean, I still don't totallyunderstand the music industry.
it's really interesting yeah and, but I'm always learning about
(26:31):
it and I think you knowgovernment is um, oh sorry.
New york noise.
It's like there's a helicopterin my apartment um, didn't hear
it.
They know there's been all kindsof sirens going around here too
uh, yeah, I think that there's,I think, a lot of opportunity
for creativity and to also thinkabout music as a vehicle not
(26:54):
just for economic development orcreative expression but for a
way to engage youth, for a wayto to revitalize a neighborhood
and to bring kind of a sense ofcommunity and value.
That has kind of components thatcan't always be quantified in
economic terms.
And I think there's some folkslike these guys at Sound
(27:17):
Diplomacy, which is anorganization that looks at music
cities, and they've starteddoing social impact assessments
with dollar values associated,looking at what a music project
can bring to a city.
So I think you know, opening upyour mind about how do you view
these projects, who do youthink can be at the table?
Like one project we did was tohelp save Avatar Studios was on
(27:41):
the market, it was probablygoing to become Condos, and I
was able to work with BerkleeCollege of Music, who wanted to
be in New York with our EconomicDevelopment Corporation,
someone who was a board memberat Berklee and also a musician
himself, and he wanted to put insome funding on Berklee's
behalf and so I got the city toput in $6 million.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
That's a great thing, and now it's Power Station at
Berklee NYC.
Speaker 3 (28:04):
We sold the behalf, and so I got the city to put in
six million dollars.
That's a great thing.
Power station at berkeley nyc.
We sell the studio broadwaycast albums are reported there.
Berkeley nyc is reallysupportive of the ecosystem here
.
Um, you know they work with thedepartment of education to help
build out programming there.
So I think you know thinkingabout institutions like
educational institutions,government, government and
(28:24):
industry working together.
I think you can do a lot ofcool things.
I guess the thing I'd say now,at this moment in time, is I
still believe that government isa vehicle for positive change.
You know who care about societyand about fostering a kind of
(28:48):
environment where creativity canflourish, to be mindful of what
happens in government and to beengaged.
And even if you're not going togo work for the government, you
know government's supposed to beresponsive to you.
So I think you never reallyknow what can happen if you
don't know who represents you orwhat the agencies are that are
supposed to support yourindustry.
So kind of thinking to buildthose bridges is really
important.
And you've created such aninteresting role that's so
(29:11):
unique and incredibly helpful tothe New York ecosystem, which
is I'd say, like one thing thatI've found really gratifying and
cool about Music Month isbeyond all the events we do.
Really gratifying, cool aboutMusic Month is beyond all the
events we do is that it's reallyjust been.
I've seen all these connectionsbe made and I was at this event
(29:32):
the other day and I met someonewho knew about Music Month, who
was a lot younger, and she waslike oh, you created a third
space.
Which is this idea of like thissort of challenge in our
culture of the lack of thirdspaces like libraries or coffee
shop or places that people cometogether that aren't work or
home.
And that I had found that thereare a lot of people who feel
(29:52):
passionate about music, eitherbecause they're artists or
they're fans and there'scommunity around that.
But the industry itself feelssiloed or maybe not as inclusive
and through Music Month, peoplehave found a way that's like
they're welcome because thegovernment's doing it, it's free
, it's open, and then all theseconnections have been made.
So I've seen people get jobs,I've seen people collaborate on
(30:16):
albums and other projects andalways be like oh, that's cool,
I know that person and they'relike yeah, I know, I met them
because of a Music Month event.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
They're like yeah, I know I met them because of a
Music Month event.
Speaker 3 (30:25):
It's great, and so that's really yeah fun and
gratifying to see, because Ididn't expect that necessarily.
Speaker 2 (30:29):
Yeah, it's great, shira.
Thank you so much for joiningus and sharing your insight.
It's exciting to see and hearhow New York is so actively
shaping the future of media andhow you're doing so much.
I definitely want to get somelinks for what the New York
music month looks like and youknow well.
I'll talk to you more about howto do that and put them.
(30:51):
I'll put it on the podcast, butthis will be airing early June
everyone.
So I want people to know aboutit and go to the events and and
look for Shira.
She'll probably be in a lot ofthem.
Speaker 3 (31:03):
I'll say we redid the brand and the website.
So, in addition to curating andproducing like the 60 events,
we've launched a new websitewith a whole new look and feel,
which is both cooler but also, Ithink, it's easier to access
all the content and seeeverything that's going on.
And if you're a listener andyou own a venue or you produce a
(31:24):
music event, we also have anAround the City calendar where
you can submit your event that'shappening in June and we post
it for free, so folks can seenot just our events for Music
Month but also everything elsehappening.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
That's great.
So, shira, beyond Music Month,is there anything else that
you'd like to highlight?
Speaker 3 (31:43):
Thanks for asking.
I've been excited aboutsomething I announced last year
at Music Month.
Is there anything else thatyou'd like to highlight?
Thanks for asking.
I've been excited aboutsomething I announced last year
at Music Month, which is thatour office is seed funding a
music business degree atBrooklyn College, which is a
CUNY.
So that will be the first publicmusic business degree available
in the five boroughs and theminor is going to launch next
fall and then the following fallthe major will be available too
(32:06):
and it's a collaborationbetween the business school
there and the liberal artscollege and we're really going
to be leaning in on the industryto get engaged, to kind of
create experiential learning forkids who want to have
internships or want to havecapstone projects, for experts
in the industry to come and beguest lecturers.
We're hoping there'll be amusic festival that the kids can
(32:27):
produce and a radio station andthings like that.
So I think it's going to bereally exciting.
And I think you know, music isso diverse and New York City is
so diverse and the CUNY systemis such a great way to create a
pathway that's accessible andkind of reflect where a lot of
the sounds of music come fromand get those kind of onto the
(32:48):
business side.
Speaker 2 (32:48):
So we're excited about it and I think it's going
to be really cool, it's greatand it's great to have another
music business program in thecity also.
Speaker 3 (32:55):
Yes, of course NYU is such an amazing program, such
an anchor for the city, butgoing to a university like NYU
is not always attainable forpeople, either academically or
financially, or for all sorts ofreasons it's such a preeminent
institution and challenging toget into, so it's just great to
have a public option too.
We see it as a supplement andhopefully a partnership with NYU
(33:18):
and the other programs in thecity.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
That's great.
Well, they all kind of will besupportive to each other because
it's all doing the same kind ofthing.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Yeah, the industry is growing, so hopefully, the more
trained folks we can get, themore New York becomes more and
more of a music city and wedon't see the people go
elsewhere, which I don't thinkthey're doing anyway.
I mean, I know they are, but Istill think New York is the best
music city in the world andthere's thousands of people
working on it here.
Speaker 2 (33:42):
Absolutely, that's great.
Thank you again, shira.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
I'd like to thank today's sponsor, heard City, the
premier audio post-productioncompany servicing the
advertising, motion picture andtelevision industries right here
in NYC.
I'd also like to thank Antelloaka XON for singing the she
Creates Noise theme that I wrote.
Thanks for listening to sheCreates Noise.
If you enjoyed this episode, besure to subscribe, rate and
(34:12):
share.
I want to thank the team hereBlair Reinly, jelena Stavanovich
, emily Wilson and the Master ofEngineering and Grammy-winning
Cooper Anderson.
We'll see you next time.
She creates noise.
Speaker 1 (34:24):
She creates noise.
She creates noise.
We hear her voice.
She creates noise.
She creates noise.
She creates noise.
We hear her voice, she createsnoise.
She creates noise.
She creates noise.
She's moving through the worldwith a powerful voice.
She creates noise.
She creates noise she createsnoise.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
Hi, you're listening to Sarah DeGuerney and welcome
to.
She Creates Noise, a podcastabout women who make the music
business run, coming to you fromNew York City.
Now, if you're not familiarwith me, here's a little
background.
I'm a songwriter, producer,manager, educator and mentor to
many artists.
I've written platinum-sellingsongs, had tracks on
Grammy-nominated records andmentor to many artists.
I've written platinum-sellingsongs, had tracks on
Grammy-nominated records andreleased music on both major and
independent labels.
(00:51):
I was a jazz singer, a jinglesinger and a pop artist.
I've had record deals, touredwith big bands and performed at
music festivals across US,europe and Asia.
More recently, my focus hasbeen on writing with and
developing young talent.
In the coming weeks, I'll bepulling back the curtain on the
music industry's femalechangemakers, women who have
(01:13):
reshaped the business inprofound ways.
My goal here is to helplisteners better understand how
the music business really worksand just how instrumental women
behind the scenes have been.
You'll hear from both sides ofthe desk artists, producers,
managers, label executives,lawyers.
Women making things happen,often without the spotlight on
(01:37):
them.
Thank you for joining me onthis journey.
Now let's dive in.
Journey Now, let's dive in.
Today's guest is Shira Gans.
Now, shira Gans is a nationallyrecognized social impact
strategist and currently thesenior executive director for
policy and programs at the NewYork City Mayor's Office of
(01:59):
Media and Entertainment.
She's led pioneeringinitiatives that promote equity,
opportunity and sustainabilityacross entertainment, government
and finance, including New YorkCity's $12 million music
industry social impact strategy.
She founded New York is MusicMonth and a $10 million grant
program for women-ledentertainment projects.
(02:19):
Her work also includes creatingthe New York City Office of
Nightlife, advancing green filmpractices and helping over
12,000 unbanked New Yorkers gainaccess to banking A city and
state 40 under 40 rising star.
She's been featured in the NewYork Times, forbes, variety and
Billboard.
Today we're going to talk alittle bit about how she came to
(02:40):
this interesting role at themayor's office and about New
York is Music Month, which isgoing on right now, and there
are lots of events to check out.
We'll put a link in the shownotes, so please come to the
events and see some great musicthis month in New York City.
Shira, it's really great tohave you.
Thank you so much for beinghere.
Thanks, sarah.
Happy to be here Now.
(03:00):
You've described yourself assomeone driven to address
inequality.
You've had a very interestingbackground.
You've done a lot of cool,different things.
Can you tell us a little bitabout your journey?
Speaker 3 (03:11):
I guess started after college and my drive
professionally really was alwaysto address social issues and to
(03:31):
try to focus in on issues thatto me were at the center of a
Venn diagram of pressing needsand concerns in society.
And I was very drawn to theissues around prisoner rights
and that to me they seem to beat the center of issues around
sort of botched drug policy,tensions between rural and urban
(03:53):
areas, systemic racism throughour justice system and the
strange kind of infiltration ofmanufacturing and corporate jobs
into prisons actually.
So I started my career.
I moved from being East Coasterout to San Francisco where I
monitored mental health care inCalifornia prisons Wow yeah, and
(04:14):
it was definitely a pretty eyeopening job that was also.
It was like a mix of reallyheavy subject matter that was
also kind of rote in a way andsort of boring.
There's a lot of correspondingwith mentally ill inmates and
kind of having this formulaicresponses because there was only
so much we could do.
And then after that I realizedmy aspirations at first had been
(04:38):
to be a national prison expert,but that involves spending a
lot of time in prisons andplaces where prisons are, which
actually is not really a greatway.
I think I found that I wantedto spend my time I didn't think
I was up for the task.
So I became a federalinvestigator at the Equal
Employment OpportunityCommission where I investigated
claims of employmentdiscrimination.
(04:59):
I think those experiences bothtaught me a lot about kind of
empathy and understanding.
You know people's subjectiveexperience.
There's not necessarily like anobjective reality of who's
right or wrong in a situation orone way to view it.
But I also realized that doingkind of casework was probably
not my calling.
So I got a graduate degree at UCBerkeley in public policy and
(05:22):
moved to New York City after,where I've been ever since and
I've mostly just worked in citygovernment.
I worked at the budget office.
I did food policy and financialinclusion work for Scott
Stringer when he was president.
I worked at the Federal ReserveBank doing financial inclusion
work and community developmentfor small businesses, and then I
was the policy director for thecity's consumer protection
(05:44):
agency working for CommissionerJulie Mennon, who was then
reappointed to the mayor'soffice of media and
entertainment, and she asked meif I would go with her and at
first my thought was kind ofwell, why would I do that?
You know I do sort of theseimportant, weighty things.
And then I was kind of like whywouldn't I do that?
You know, that sounds reallyfun and like a new and
(06:05):
interesting front.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
A lot lighter too.
A lot lighter.
Speaker 3 (06:09):
Yeah, a lot lighter.
I mean, court pretension in NewYork City isn't necessarily as
daunting as, say, prisonerrights or employment
discrimination, but it's reallypretty in the weeds of city
regulatory framework.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
Impressive.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
So, anyway, I came over to this agency, which we
refer to as MOAM, the Mayor'sOffice of Media and
Entertainment.
It's a little bit of a mouthful.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
I like that MOAM Okay .
Speaker 3 (06:34):
And I mean that's kind of a journey to get here,
so it's pretty circuitous.
I don't think I would have everthought at the beginning of
that journey that I would havespent this is the longest job
I've had.
I've been here for about nineyears that it would be doing
music industry and entertainmentindustry work, but I guess you
never really know where thingsare going to take you.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
Absolutely, and it's great to have you because I see
you around all the events.
You're very present and doing alot of great things for us.
You've helped foster a strongconnection between government
and the arts, and is thissomething completely new for the
city of New York, bringing thearts together with government
like this?
Speaker 3 (07:10):
It's new for the city .
For arts in general, the cityhas the Department of Cultural
Affairs, which is a grantingagency that has I don't want to
misquote it, but it's severalhundred million dollar budget
and it supports everything fromLincoln Center to the Met, to
the Museum of Natural History,as well as numerous arts
nonprofits.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Makes it.
The music business is kind of anew and groovier thing.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
Indeed.
So before I had this role therewas no person or agency in city
government whose job it was tosupport the music industry.
I think we look at it a littlemore from an economic
development business lens and ofcourse for something like the
music industry you can't reallythe art side and the business
side are not necessarilydistinct, but it's less of a
(07:54):
focus just on art for art's sakeand more of cultivating the
creative sectors that arecritical to New York City's
economy.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
Because I read somewhere that it's like $21
billion that the music industrybrings in.
Speaker 3 (08:06):
That was actually one of the first things I did when
I started.
The role was I.
We commissioned a musiceconomic impact study looking at
the role of the industry in NewYork City, and now it's a
decade old, so it's definitelyon my agenda to try to secure
funding to redo it.
But what we found was that theindustry overall supported $21
billion in economic output,60,000 jobs and $5 billion in
(08:29):
wages.
So it's not just about, course,music as a driver of culture,
but it's also a big business forme.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
That's great to hear because so many people, I think
you know, have left New YorkCity from the music business.
They've gone to.
Nashville and LA and we'retrying to bring them back.
Speaker 3 (08:45):
Here, they're still here.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
We're here, we're hanging on.
It's tough.
I mean I did a song camp duringCOVID which was trying to like
tell everyone we are here.
So I had a lot of.
It was called Songs Across theWater.
I had a lot of people from allover the world working with New
York writers.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
You know, I think it did raise a little bit of
awareness, trying to get them tostop flying over us when
they're coming from foreigncountries.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Now, one of the things I really want to talk
about is how you are the founderof one of the most exciting
initiatives, which is MusicMonth, and this is a terrific
idea.
How did you come up with thatand can you tell us what kind of
programs it offers, and alsomaybe give us a sense of what we
should keep our eyes open forcoming up in the month of June,
(09:34):
because this is when it will air.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
The New York Music Month is the city's official
music industry festival.
It happens the entire month ofJune and that's something that I
created and founded in 2017.
And that really came out of aconversation I like to give him
credit with Justin Klifowitz,who was the head of Downtown
Music Publishing at the time.
That's what the company was andJustin's always been a big
(09:57):
advocate for New York City as amusic city.
And when I started this role,as we discussed, I had no
background in music.
I wouldn't even say at the timemusic was a driving force in my
life personally, like everyonelikes music, right, but I wasn't
going out every night to showsor so I really had to kind of
tap my own network of people whoI like.
(10:18):
I had a good friend from when Ilived in San Francisco who
worked at Ingrooves and she kindof connected me to some folks
and everyone was just like youhave to talk to Justin.
So we had a meeting and he wassaying you know, the industry
does so much in June.
There's all these festivals,there's award shows, there's
conferences, campus City dosomething to recognize that.
And I was like, yeah, that's agreat idea, let's make June New
(10:38):
York Music Month.
And so it started pretty smalland the idea originally was just
to kind of reflect and honorall the economic and cultural
activity the industry brings toNew York during June and then
around the margins kind of doour own thing.
So we started this conferencewith NYU at the Steinhardt Music
Business Program and maybe Ihad like 10 events.
(10:59):
And then year over year it'skind of been really exciting to
see it become its own thing.
So the conference has grown.
This year it's June 3rd.
It's going to be at NYUSkirball now.
This will be the second year,so that's an 850 capacity room.
It's like a real stage.
It's a beautiful venue and wehave around 40 speakers who kind
of dive into all differentaspects of the industry.
(11:22):
And I try to keep it a fast day.
So we have these five-minutekind of TED Talks which usually
feature folks working on asocial impact component of the
industry.
This year we have someone fromCarnegie Hall I'm having someone
from ACLU come to discuss theimportance of how do you protect
freedom of expression in themoment that we're in now, and
then we have fireside chats andpanels looking more at industry
(11:42):
business topics.
So we have a really cool one onAI, we're going to have one on
music and gaming, and then therest of the month is both
performances and talks that arereally just a collaboration
between folks in the industryand our office, specifically
myself.
So people kind of approach mewith an idea Like well, I've
always wanted to talk about thistopic or I thought it would be
(12:03):
really interesting if we didsomething on X and then I work
with them collaboratively toshape that idea and make it kind
of right for the Music Monthaudience.
I'm able to give you know some.
I have budget for the programso I want to make sure that
everyone's paid, particularlyanyone who performs.
No one's getting rich off ofMusic Month, you know, but I
don't want anyone to come out inthe red.
So it's always something thatfeels collaborative and, I think
(12:25):
, to fuel the ecosystem.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
With the Music Month things, the events?
Is it mostly like students thatare showing up to Skrull Center
?
No, no, no.
Or industry people.
Speaker 3 (12:34):
It's all industry folks really.
I'd say it runs the gamut frompeople who are emerging artists
or early stage career, butthere's really people who, you
know, are pretty senior in theindustry because we're able,
since it's really unique.
There's no other city that doesanything like this.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
I've attended a lot of these things, but I haven't
been to the Skirball Center.
You know that I need to go to.
Speaker 3 (12:55):
We should come June 3rd.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
Okay, I'm going to do that.
Speaker 3 (12:58):
The conference is about, at least you know.
Last time we did a survey ofthe people who attended.
I would say at least 60% of thepeople in the room have been
working in the industry for 10or more years.
So it's definitely not studentsthough students are welcome, of
course but it's a professionalindustry conference.
But it's interesting becauseit's not segmented the way a lot
of other conferences are.
It's not just about sync orit's not just about publishing
(13:20):
indie labels yeah, it's likeeverything.
So the events themselves, whichwould be in the, they're kind of
these four verticals for MusicMonth, there's the conference,
there's talks, there'sperformances and then we
underwrite free rehearsal space.
So for the talks, like this year, overall between performances
and talks, we're going to havealmost 60 events, I think in
(13:41):
partnership with 55 differentindustry partners, and those
range from kind of smallerindependent companies up to,
like Downtown or Empire or UAA,you know, companies who want to
give back, who want toparticipate, who want to give a
platform for their teams ortheir artists and really just
share information about either.
You know there's one event thiswoman, sherry Hugh, who started
(14:05):
Water Music, that looks at AIand the tech ecosystem in New
York for music she's going to doan event on kind of like where
tech investment for music standsright now in the city.
So it's something like that,but it's a little more developed
or thought leadership to thingsthat are like hey, here's a
basic event on understandingyour merch strategy.
So it really runs from like akind of one-on-one to diving
(14:28):
more into interesting topics.
Or Rock Nation School at LA hewas going to do some interesting
like fireside chats, so it's.
It really is a very diverselineup and then on the
performance side there's so manyamazing festivals that we don't
want to compete with.
So we partner with differentcurators and labels and folks to
create a platform for emergingartists, because I think that
(14:51):
can be a hard thing in New York.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Because GovBall in June right, for example.
Speaker 3 (14:56):
Yeah, govball Summer Stage kicks off.
Celebrate Brooklyn kicks offOut in Forest Hill like they
have a whole lineup for thesummer.
Coney Island there's a bigstadium there has a whole lineup
, so there's just a ton of stuffgoing on.
Little Island, which is a greatoutdoor space on the river, has
a lineup.
(15:16):
So the goal is never to competewith anything that's.
Speaker 2 (15:20):
Yes, it's to support it and to also give
up-and-coming artists anopportunity.
Speaker 3 (15:25):
And to give folks who are in the like.
I'm not someone who I thinkshould be curating live music.
No one wants live music to dothis.
I'm not that's not the role ofcity government or someone in my
role but I can empower peoplewho are working with emerging
artists to have a space and somemoney so that people can
perform, can get in front of anaudience, can get for their time
(15:47):
.
I heard someone once say youknow, people can die of exposure
like.
I don't like the idea.
I never want someone to performand not get paid because I want
us to value art that's great,and actually I heard on another
interview you did.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
You have very cool music taste, so don't be so.
Yeah, don't be so shy.
Speaker 3 (16:04):
Thanks it's definitely thanks to people I
met in the industry andsometimes, weirdly, my palatine,
but mostly it's just like.
One of the things I like aboutthe music industry work is it
doesn't matter how senior theperson is I'm meeting.
They're always excited to talkabout a new band they're into or
someone they're listening to.
So I'm always keeping thislittle list on my phone, like,
ok, I'm going to go home and I'mgoing to check out that artist
(16:25):
or that band and I know you havea son is he a big music fan?
He is a big music fan, he likesto listen to.
He's really into Kendrick Lamarand some music that's probably
not appropriate and he knowswhen it's like a radio edit
he'll be like why, where's thebad words?
(16:45):
I want a version with the badwords.
So we have discussions about,like okay, this is art and they
can use those words and that'sartistic expression.
So I'm not going to censor it,but you can't say those words.
So we have those conversationsa lot.
He also.
He has a pretty diverse musictaste too.
He was really into Queen for awhile, I mean.
So, yeah, we listen to musictogether.
(17:07):
That's great.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
It keeps us young to have young people around showing
us what's cool.
Now I want to make at the endof this.
I'm going to ask to make surethat we have a list.
We'll get some links to what'sgoing on in Music Month and I
know you're busy so I'm tryingto go down the list of all the
(17:32):
things I wanted to talk aboutNow.
You recently recognizedVariety's Power of Women New
York Impact List.
From your perspective, whatunique challenges and
opportunities do women in mediaand entertainment face today?
Speaker 3 (17:49):
I think the challenges that women face in
media and entertainment probablyaren't so distinct from the
challenges that women face ingeneral, which I think you know
are multifaceted.
One would just be the basics ofdo you have a seat at the table
?
Are you included?
So I like to look at annenberg.
Usc annenberg center puts outannually reports looking at
(18:12):
gender representation acrossmedia and entertainment.
So they have one um, it's likeinclusion in the studio and they
look at the billboard top 100every year.
So this year is like only six%of producers on those songs were
women and they looked over morethan a decade of doing the
study and a thousand songs.
The ratio of male to femaleproducers on those songs was 27
(18:35):
to one.
So you know you might be seeingmore female artists and those
numbers I think are gettingbetter.
But in terms of in the studioor in the boardroom, those
numbers don't look great.
And then I think there's more,you know, like subtle things
which are, I think, at thismoment in time, like there's a
(18:56):
lot to talk about authenticity,and I think one of the ways you
can connect professionally orthrough social media channels,
if that's the way you need tomessage is by being authentic.
But there's not really a lot ofspace for women to truly be
authentic, I think, withdifferent ideas about how women
should behave or what's sociallyacceptable and sort of this
(19:19):
constant, I think, calculus thatwomen in position of power are
making about how to create spacefor yourself, how to be taken
seriously, but also how not tobe sort of dinged for the
behaviors that might advancemen's careers but probably
aren't going to help you out, orjust you know, and this is not
(19:41):
just for women like learning tosort of be okay with people not
liking you, and I think that's alittle more challenging for
women because we're kind ofraised to be people pleasers or
to be caretakers.
So I don't think I'm sayinganything particularly new, but I
know that that's you know.
For me in government I thinkthose issues are sort of
compounded because there's ideasabout how people in government
(20:03):
behave or you know, there's alot of rules and bureaucracy and
ideas about what's acceptableor not acceptable, and then
that's compounded by being awoman and then you know you have
to kind of pick and choosewhich things you're going to toe
the line on and which thingsyou're going to be like.
Oh well, Right.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
Well, I mean, you seem to have sailed through all
these issues very, verybeautifully.
Uh, because you, you, I meanyou're, you're doing great,
you're doing so much and youknow, I never get it.
I don't get a sense of you, anycomplaint or anything from you.
You're just, you're just doingwhat you do and it's just
working.
You know, I think you, you'rejust confident.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
Yeah part of the sound, right, I mean I could
complain but I wouldn't help meout and I think you know the
other thing that gets talkedabout some, but I think is a
challenge that I definitely faceespecially.
I didn't go into public serviceto because I wanted to be like
one of the world's richestpeople you know, but there is a
different um pay scale whenyou're in the public sector, and
(21:04):
part of, I think and kind ofyou mentioned, I think part of
the way you build trust and youconnect with folks is that you
have to show up, and so a lot ofthe showing up is at night, and
if you're a parent, especiallylike I'm a single parent, then
that can create a real challenge, and so that's not something I
think people talk about.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
So that's not something I think people talk
about and I think the lack ofdiscussion around that and what
that means, even if you're not asingle parent, like what
happens if you need to be at anevent every night and you have a
kid.
Speaker 3 (21:44):
Good babysitters yeah , I know I totally get it Okay
being a single parent.
Yep, my son hates music.
He's like oh, that's a monthyou abandon your kid.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
I guess that's one of the things I do during that
month For a very worthy cause.
Now there's also the $10million fund that was created to
support women in music.
How is, can you tell us?
Speaker 3 (22:05):
a little about that and how it's being implemented.
It's not just, it's actuallyfor women in music, media and
theater.
So when we first created thefund it was focused on film,
television and theater.
And the idea originally behindothers actually more research
out of annenberg was that forwomen in film, um, they would
kind of get close to finishing aproject and then, because they
don't have the same networks oraccess to capital as men, they
would kind of get close tofinishing a project and then,
(22:26):
because they don't have the samenetworks or access to capital
as men, they would be, you know,$20,000, $50,000 out from the
money they needed and theywouldn't be able to complete it.
So we created sort of afinishing fund.
It was the first of its kind inthe country for a local
government to do that.
It's kind in the country for alocal government to do that.
(22:49):
And then in the second year Iadded music to it.
So we did do five rounds.
Um, it was 10 million.
I have some of the stats herethat I could find that I pulled
together.
So for music, um, over the fivecycles we awarded just a little
less than 1.3 million million toabout 118 projects, and we did
(23:09):
that in two categories, like theclassical, experimental, jazz,
new music, which is typically, Ithink, what gets grants, and
that was 50 projects.
But we also it was important tome we added a general category,
so that was everything fromlike pop to hip hop to
electronic music, and that was68 projects.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Yes, it's true that jazz and classical do tend to
get more funding, everythingfrom like pop to hip hop to
electronic music, and that was68 projects.
Speaker 3 (23:33):
Yes, it's true that jazz and classical do tend to
get more funding.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
Yeah, yeah, it was important for me that there was
popular music was part of that.
Cool, and is that something Ithink you said there's?
There's only a final, there'sone more year of that, or?
Speaker 3 (23:44):
No, we, we it's issued our last round.
We did that.
So we did five rounds, okay,but hopefully we're going to be
doing an evaluation of it and awhite paper so that other cities
can kind of look at it and seewhat the lessons are that we
learned.
There were some challengesaround music, where for the
other categories say, for a film, it's like okay, you finished
(24:04):
your film and then did you get.
For a film, it's like okay, youfinished your film and then did
you get into a film festival,did somebody buy your, you know
like the film and pick it up fordistribution.
Whereas for music, okay, wehelped you complete the funds
are for a new album or ep or fora video for yet to be released
work, um, and so you did that.
But then you know people arereleasing right songs, yeah, so
(24:27):
how?
yeah, so how do we really gaugeif that was a success, if we're
giving them the support thatthey needed to really take that
music that they created and thenmake sure that it could be
monetized and heard and createlike revenue streams for them.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
So what was the average budget for?
For, like the music side, let'ssay someone was trying to do an
EP what would be the average?
Speaker 3 (24:49):
The grants could go up to $20,000.
I don't actually have insightinto whether or not I assume
most people ask for that amount.
For film it was a littledifferent.
Those went up to $50,000.
People didn't always ask forthe total amount.
Those were the grant size.
Speaker 2 (25:08):
It's great but of course it does cost more to then
get promotion teams and to getmore people involved, to get the
PR etc to have it released.
But it's a great start that'sreally cool.
What advice would you givepeople who would like to be in
your area, do something likewhat you do?
They're young listeners.
I'm sure there are.
(25:28):
How do you, how do people,prepare for this kind of a field
?
Public either, serving inpolicy, partnership, working in
media and entertainment you knowin the type of capacity that
you have well, not to discourage.
Speaker 3 (25:44):
there aren't really that many roles like what I do.
There's like a few of us aroundthe country and the world who
kind of have these music policyjobs.
I think what I found in doingthis work is and across my
career, the things that I foundthe most gratifying, the most
motivating and successful havebeen public-private partnerships
(26:06):
.
So I think there really is adesire on the part of industry
to give back and to be connectedand also to be recognized by
government, and so I think thosedesires really set the table
for partnerships, and I thinkthere's also just like a lot of
misunderstanding.
I mean, I still don't totallyunderstand the music industry.
it's really interesting yeah and, but I'm always learning about
(26:31):
it and I think you knowgovernment is um, oh sorry.
New york noise.
It's like there's a helicopterin my apartment um, didn't hear
it.
They know there's been all kindsof sirens going around here too
uh, yeah, I think that there's,I think, a lot of opportunity
for creativity and to also thinkabout music as a vehicle not
(26:54):
just for economic development orcreative expression but for a
way to engage youth, for a wayto to revitalize a neighborhood
and to bring kind of a sense ofcommunity and value.
That has kind of components thatcan't always be quantified in
economic terms.
And I think there's some folkslike these guys at Sound
(27:17):
Diplomacy, which is anorganization that looks at music
cities, and they've starteddoing social impact assessments
with dollar values associated,looking at what a music project
can bring to a city.
So I think you know, opening upyour mind about how do you view
these projects, who do youthink can be at the table?
Like one project we did was tohelp save Avatar Studios was on
(27:41):
the market, it was probablygoing to become Condos, and I
was able to work with BerkleeCollege of Music, who wanted to
be in New York with our EconomicDevelopment Corporation,
someone who was a board memberat Berklee and also a musician
himself, and he wanted to put insome funding on Berklee's
behalf and so I got the city toput in $6 million.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
That's a great thing, and now it's Power Station at
Berklee NYC.
Speaker 3 (28:04):
We sold the behalf, and so I got the city to put in
six million dollars.
That's a great thing.
Power station at berkeley nyc.
We sell the studio broadwaycast albums are reported there.
Berkeley nyc is reallysupportive of the ecosystem here
.
Um, you know they work with thedepartment of education to help
build out programming there.
So I think you know thinkingabout institutions like
educational institutions,government, government and
(28:24):
industry working together.
I think you can do a lot ofcool things.
I guess the thing I'd say now,at this moment in time, is I
still believe that government isa vehicle for positive change.
You know who care about societyand about fostering a kind of
(28:48):
environment where creativity canflourish, to be mindful of what
happens in government and to beengaged.
And even if you're not going togo work for the government, you
know government's supposed to beresponsive to you.
So I think you never reallyknow what can happen if you
don't know who represents you orwhat the agencies are that are
supposed to support yourindustry.
So kind of thinking to buildthose bridges is really
important.
And you've created such aninteresting role that's so
(29:11):
unique and incredibly helpful tothe New York ecosystem, which
is I'd say, like one thing thatI've found really gratifying and
cool about Music Month isbeyond all the events we do.
Really gratifying, cool aboutMusic Month is beyond all the
events we do is that it's reallyjust been.
I've seen all these connectionsbe made and I was at this event
(29:32):
the other day and I met someonewho knew about Music Month, who
was a lot younger, and she waslike oh, you created a third
space.
Which is this idea of like thissort of challenge in our
culture of the lack of thirdspaces like libraries or coffee
shop or places that people cometogether that aren't work or
home.
And that I had found that thereare a lot of people who feel
(29:52):
passionate about music, eitherbecause they're artists or
they're fans and there'scommunity around that.
But the industry itself feelssiloed or maybe not as inclusive
and through Music Month, peoplehave found a way that's like
they're welcome because thegovernment's doing it, it's free
, it's open, and then all theseconnections have been made.
So I've seen people get jobs,I've seen people collaborate on
(30:16):
albums and other projects andalways be like oh, that's cool,
I know that person and they'relike yeah, I know, I met them
because of a Music Month event.
Speaker 2 (30:22):
They're like yeah, I know I met them because of a
Music Month event.
Speaker 3 (30:25):
It's great, and so that's really yeah fun and
gratifying to see, because Ididn't expect that necessarily.
Speaker 2 (30:29):
Yeah, it's great, shira.
Thank you so much for joiningus and sharing your insight.
It's exciting to see and hearhow New York is so actively
shaping the future of media andhow you're doing so much.
I definitely want to get somelinks for what the New York
music month looks like and youknow well.
I'll talk to you more about howto do that and put them.
(30:51):
I'll put it on the podcast, butthis will be airing early June
everyone.
So I want people to know aboutit and go to the events and and
look for Shira.
She'll probably be in a lot ofthem.
Speaker 3 (31:03):
I'll say we redid the brand and the website.
So, in addition to curating andproducing like the 60 events,
we've launched a new websitewith a whole new look and feel,
which is both cooler but also, Ithink, it's easier to access
all the content and seeeverything that's going on.
And if you're a listener andyou own a venue or you produce a
(31:24):
music event, we also have anAround the City calendar where
you can submit your event that'shappening in June and we post
it for free, so folks can seenot just our events for Music
Month but also everything elsehappening.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
That's great.
So, shira, beyond Music Month,is there anything else that
you'd like to highlight?
Speaker 3 (31:43):
Thanks for asking.
I've been excited aboutsomething I announced last year
at Music Month.
Is there anything else thatyou'd like to highlight?
Thanks for asking.
I've been excited aboutsomething I announced last year
at Music Month, which is thatour office is seed funding a
music business degree atBrooklyn College, which is a
CUNY.
So that will be the first publicmusic business degree available
in the five boroughs and theminor is going to launch next
fall and then the following fallthe major will be available too
(32:06):
and it's a collaborationbetween the business school
there and the liberal artscollege and we're really going
to be leaning in on the industryto get engaged, to kind of
create experiential learning forkids who want to have
internships or want to havecapstone projects, for experts
in the industry to come and beguest lecturers.
We're hoping there'll be amusic festival that the kids can
(32:27):
produce and a radio station andthings like that.
So I think it's going to bereally exciting.
And I think you know, music isso diverse and New York City is
so diverse and the CUNY systemis such a great way to create a
pathway that's accessible andkind of reflect where a lot of
the sounds of music come fromand get those kind of onto the
(32:48):
business side.
Speaker 2 (32:48):
So we're excited about it and I think it's going
to be really cool, it's greatand it's great to have another
music business program in thecity also.
Speaker 3 (32:55):
Yes, of course NYU is such an amazing program, such
an anchor for the city, butgoing to a university like NYU
is not always attainable forpeople, either academically or
financially, or for all sorts ofreasons it's such a preeminent
institution and challenging toget into, so it's just great to
have a public option too.
We see it as a supplement andhopefully a partnership with NYU
(33:18):
and the other programs in thecity.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
That's great.
Well, they all kind of will besupportive to each other because
it's all doing the same kind ofthing.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Yeah, the industry is growing, so hopefully, the more
trained folks we can get, themore New York becomes more and
more of a music city and wedon't see the people go
elsewhere, which I don't thinkthey're doing anyway.
I mean, I know they are, but Istill think New York is the best
music city in the world andthere's thousands of people
working on it here.
Speaker 2 (33:42):
Absolutely, that's great.
Thank you again, shira.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
I'd like to thank today's sponsor, heard City, the
premier audio post-productioncompany servicing the
advertising, motion picture andtelevision industries right here
in NYC.
I'd also like to thank Antelloaka XON for singing the she
Creates Noise theme that I wrote.
Thanks for listening to sheCreates Noise.
If you enjoyed this episode, besure to subscribe, rate and
(34:12):
share.
I want to thank the team hereBlair Reinly, jelena Stavanovich
, emily Wilson and the Master ofEngineering and Grammy-winning
Cooper Anderson.
We'll see you next time.
She creates noise.
Speaker 1 (34:24):
She creates noise.
She creates noise.
We hear her voice.
She creates noise.
She creates noise.
She creates noise.
We hear her voice, she createsnoise.
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