May 12, 2025 • 35 mins
In this episode, Kate Nienhauser gets really raw about her journey into sobreity, coming out as gay, and how her spirituality deepens the more she gets to know herself.
Beautiful music by Doug Harvey
Hosted by Ari Hader and Olivia Spirz. Follow us on IG @spodapod !
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:11):
Hey friends.
Hello there.
And welcome to the SpiritualPractices of the Disgruntled
Artist, where we interview a newartist each episode to learn how
they are keeping themselves saneand spiritually healthy during
this epically challenging timeto be an artist.
What's up y'all?
What's up?
Uh, before we get into ourguest, we're gonna talk about
our homework from the lastepisode.
(00:34):
Professor Grant Jossy, who madea sweat every sweat d.
Day, sweat.
Sort of sweat.
Yeah.
Sort of.
I had a difficult time, buthere's what I learned.
Okay.
Okay.
Here's what one, if you are abusy mom or a person, just a
busy person who can't leavetheir house for some reason.
Mm-hmm.
(00:54):
The answer is a dance video.
If you wanna sweat Yes.
15 minutes a day.
Yes.
But you can't leave your housebecause running also helps.
But I hate running, but I, someof my walks with my little one
mm-hmm.
I would do the first 15 minutesrunning.
Immediate sweat also hate it.
Just gen, genuinely.
Mm-hmm.
Worst thing I but my sweatalways hated running since.
(01:15):
You know what?
I used to make myself run andthen after Fiona with the birth
from actual hell, I was like,I'm not gonna make my body do
this anymore.
I hate this.
And I also was like, I'm gonnagive you a donut a week body.
And I do that.
Aww, that's another spiritualpractice.
Why didn't the heck I, where'sMyy Cream?
(01:36):
What?
That's what this is what I alsolearned.
Okay.
Rest days are important.
And when I went back andlistened to Grant's episode, he
says he doesn't do it on theweekends.
And we didn't do that in ourhomework.
We said we're gonna do twoweeks, 14 days every single day.
And I think when I add mine up,I probably missed about four
days, but then I felt kind ofbad about it.
(01:58):
But, but the point is, I'velearned this, I've heard this
before, that you need rest STAsboth for your body to
recuperate, but also for yourmind to not.
To like, wanna do that again,you know, right.
To want to sweat again.
Yeah.
So I already, I mean, it alsowas very close to me, close to
what I'm already doing.
'cause I do like warm yoga threedays a week.
You're already very active.
I already, I go for like threemile walks, three days a week.
(02:20):
So it was like filling in thegaps and I think maybe I rely on
those gaps in a little bit.
A little bit.
And that's okay though.
You Right, right.
How about you?
How, how was it for you?
It was pretty good.
Um, I maybe wasn't as consistentas you were.
But I did mostly dance.
Dance.
We danced and, and I realizedlike, if I'm gonna sweat, I have
(02:44):
to trick myself.
Hmm.
Into, because you don't wannasweat.
Uh, well, and not really sweat.
Uh, I'm not someone who I, Ihave gone to the gym and stuff
like that.
I, like I said, I've alwayshated running.
Mm-hmm.
I just, I, I, I just never willlike running.
I, I, I've accepted that.
That's okay.
You never know.
(03:05):
Someone's gonna come on here andbe like.
You have only running.
It's only running.
We're gonna be like, what areyour spiritual practices?
They're gonna be like running.
I'll be like, what else?
And they'll be like, listen,it's just running.
I've done a 5K once in my life.
That's, that's it.
Sorry, donut.
When I was a kid, when we had todo the mile run.
Did you have to do that fromschool?
I would find out what's the,what's the minimum time just to
(03:25):
pass and didn't make that, Ididn't care how fast I went.
But anyways, love to dance.
And I think too, what I learned.
Is that I, I think maybe'cause'cause I just, I love to dance
in general.
It, it's the expression too, youknow, to me running is just, I'm
(03:46):
just, uh, it just hurts and I'mnot into it.
And I can't think with, withdancing, with dance videos, it's
fun'cause it's like, oh, I'mlearning new moves or whatever.
But there was actually a coupletimes where I didn't feel like
doing a video and I just put on.
Music and just like dancedaround.
Oh, I see.
I should, I should have donethat.
I would like that more.
Plus the girls would like it.
Yeah, and I also, I included, Idon't know if this counts, but
(04:09):
I, I included it.
Okay.
I was like.
You know what can make me sweatis if I clean really hard.
Hard.
Yeah, that counts.
That absolutely counts.
Yes.
So I tried to incorporate likethings I needed to do.
Yeah.
But sweat while I was doing it,I was like, imagining you
frantically cleaning, you havelike a handkerchief in your hair
in my mind, and you're just likerunning around.
(04:30):
It was actually kind of hard tosweat for 15 minutes.
It took a while to get to thatsweat.
I'm also not a, I don'tnaturally sweat.
Oh, I do very easily, especiallymy feet.
I have an actual problem,really, my hands.
Oh, really?
Wow.
We're soulmates.
We are.
I, I think, uh, as far asgetting up a sweat, I, to me, I
(04:50):
also, I didn't really thinkabout sweating as much as I
thought of my, of your, at myheart.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Okay.
And, and then at the end Idefinitely was like, oh, I'm a
little sweaty.
Mm-hmm.
And that to me, was it.
And I was like, that feels good.
I feel like I exerted myself alittle bit more, you know?
Not like, just like yoga wetalked about like, oh, that's
not quite.
Well definitely yoga videos arenot it for me.
(05:11):
I mean, it's just not it for meIf I need to relax, but it's not
gonna be a workout for me.
But at my studio, Satori, I sendMonica, it's warm yoga.
Yeah.
So I sweat a lot there.
But Will you do this again?
Will you take anything fromthis?
Yes.
I think I, I think movement isjust, it makes you happy.
Mm-hmm.
(05:32):
And I love to dance and I thinkof anything, I just was like,
God, this is an easy win for me.
Yeah, totally.
Yeah.
I will take away like the timeswhen the week's really busy or
the kids are sick or whatever.
There's a lot of auditions.
I can't get to yoga.
I can do a dance video for 15minutes a day.
Yeah.
And my children tolerated it.
They didn't love me doing that.
Oh, really?
Yeah.
(05:52):
Fiona was like, kind of into it.
Ellie was like, I, I go and siton a couch.
I was like, yeah, girl.
She's the donut for, she's, yes.
Where's your donut?
Where's, yeah.
I love that.
Yeah.
Okay.
Okay.
Good job.
High five.
Bye.
Welcome to August.
(06:13):
Yay.
The day Kate Anhauser.
She's a poet.
She's a musician.
She's taken some classes in thecommunity.
She's a creator.
We met through improv.
Yes, we've all been friends fora very long time.
We have Welcome.
Yes, thanks.
Hello.
Thanks for coming on, sda.
Thank you.
Thanks.
So what's the, what's, what's inyour brain at this time?
(06:36):
Um, well, I'm always writingpoetry.
This is so intense.
So sorry.
I, sorry.
No, I love it.
I love it.
Um, for the listeners at home,Ari and Olivia are just.
Really cutely really close to meand staring at me with very cute
heart eyes.
Um, I, I'm always writingpoetry.
(06:56):
I'm sometimes take out myguitar, have a go through phases
and sing and write songs.
I record a lot of voice notes ofsongs, actually.
Mm-hmm.
Actually, you did send me onethat I thought.
That I really enjoyed.
Oh, or maybe you put it onTikTok.
Oh, yeah.
I have lots of like, why did Ithink that this was good?
But I actually thought about,but Oh, oh, it was, um, it was o
it was, I sang it into avoicemail in the middle of the
(07:17):
night.
Yeah.
What was it?
Yeah, it was about Can you singit?
Yeah.
It was like, it was about beinggay and being a cowboy.
It was like queers and cowboys,some and upright steers, dykes
and lassos, and it's literally.
Me singing, but it, I soundasleep.
(07:38):
Yeah.
Like, and really?
Yeah.
That was good.
It was good.
I, I recently was looking at oneand it said one from a long time
ago and it said, oof, this isgood.
That was the title That shouldalways remain the title.
That was the title.
And I'm like, wow.
I really liked it.
And I listened to it and I waslike, this is not good.
It's funny.
It's like actually comical.
(07:59):
Anyway, I do that.
Okay, I'm doing a thing.
I am trying to do a piece or I'mgonna go, I'm moving to New
Jersey in April.
We're sad about it.
Don't talk about it too much.
It's very sad.
And um, and I am gonna go to allthe places I used to live and
film and take some photographs.
And, um, write a poem and kindof try to edit it in a cool way.
(08:23):
Maybe sing a little acapella.
California.
Do you wanna, you don't wannasing queers and cowboys unless
you finds a perfect and the brasteers, upright steers, I don't
actually know what a steer is.
Uh, isn't in a horse, just acow.
Oh shit.
Well, none, none of us know.
See, see what's this here andwhy is it upright down?
I, is it upright?
(08:43):
It's on all, it's in two.
It's on its back legs and itsone legs are up.
Oh my God.
Upright.
Okay.
Yep.
Alright.
That's what I'm working on here.
I have a side question for you.
Mm-hmm.
Do how when you write something,do you know if it's a poem or a
song?
Yes.
Oh, really?
Always.
Is it because you have do anddo, is it intention based, like
you're like, I'm gonna write apoem, or I'm gonna write a song,
or no.
(09:04):
Well, when I say, well, well, Idon't think my poetry lends
itself to, to.
Music period.
Oh, oh.
So I don't think, like, when Isit down to write a poem, I sit
down to write a poem, and thensongs usually pop in my head
more than poems do.
Hmm.
Sometimes poetry will pop in myhead and I'll do like a quick,
you know, write it on my phone.
But, but I usually sit down andvery intentionally I'm like, I'm
(09:25):
gonna write poetry.
Music is more, um, I guessorganic.
Mm-hmm.
But my po, most of my poetry is,is so, um.
Casual.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
And kind of just sounds likejournaling, which some people do
write as songs, but I don't, I,I've never tried.
I could try, I guess.
Mm-hmm.
It's hard for me to write a songwithout making a rhyme.
(09:46):
Which I try to work on thatsometimes.
Do you, when you write a song,when you say it comes naturally,
is there like already like atune in your head or is it
mostly the words or just theidea?
I would say they both come atthe same time, which is
frustrating because I'm not an,a good enough guitarist.
Mm-hmm.
Which is why I, I will, I try tostart taking guitar lessons, but
(10:06):
I do have it in my head and thenI have to change it a little bit
when I like, pull out the guitar'cause it doesn't match what's
in my head.
That's all right.
Okay.
I have questions.
I have questions.
I mean, I, I feel like we needto.
Okay.
Okay.
We have the question of thepodcast, which we'll get to.
Yes.
We'll get to that eventually.
And I also have a question too,after.
Okay.
Me too.
Okay.
(10:29):
Okay, great.
So four hours?
Yes.
Seven minutes.
Okay.
You were a performer.
Mm-hmm.
For a very long time.
What changed for you spirituallywhen you gave that up?
When I gave up acting.
Yeah.
Um, I mean, it all happenedaround the sim the same time I
got sober.
Mm.
So, like me stopping acting waspretty soon, like after I got
(10:50):
sober, I kind of realized itkind of, I realized a lot of
things when I got sober and thatwas one of them.
Um, and it actually feltextremely freeing and I actually
felt like it freed up a lot ofmy brain space to feel more
creative with poetry.
With, um, singing, with like,doing whatever freed up me to
(11:11):
feel less constraint aboutimprov.
Mm-hmm.
Um, which we've talked a lotabout.
Yeah.
Um, and is that because you feltlike it was part of your
identity and, and therefore youcouldn't be a poet and a
musician and an improviser oranything else because you.
It was part of your identity orjust freed up time and energy?
I think just, yeah, I think justfreed me up creatively, period
(11:33):
just freed me up from feelinglike I had to only work on
something that was gonna help mycareer.
Mm-hmm.
Like I have to take an actingclass.
I can't take a guitar class, Ican't take a workshop on, you
know, poetry.
I can't spend time sittingwriting poetry.
I should be looking at somescript and filming it into the
(11:54):
camera.
Or choosing a scene for a classor, yeah, I think that's, was
there any sort of confession youhad to make to like your parents
and your friend?
Like was that hard to do, to belike, I'm not pursuing this
thing anymore?
No.
I think because everyone in thistown understands.
Yeah, yeah.
I think everyone in this townunderstands that it's really
(12:16):
hard and it's really tiring.
And I think I also had a lot offriends who around the same
time, or very soon after me, orvery right before me, who, um,
also realized that they didn'tactually like acting that much
and they just was something thatthey were kind of good at.
And they, it was like, not too.
It wasn't like it, it didn'tfeel free.
(12:38):
It didn't feel like expression.
It just felt like this is whatI'm supposed to do.
And so I think I had peers thatfelt that way, which really
helped.
I mean, my parents wereecstatic.
Really?
Oh, yeah.
And it wasn't a fun journeythough, because stopping acting
was like in the midst of me alsolike going more into producing,
which I really hated.
Yes.
(12:58):
Right.
And was really upsetting andreally difficult and way too
stressful and just like notenough, like not enough bang for
your buck.
Not an emotional, not in a, um,in a financial way.
In an emotional way, yeah.
Like it's just way too stressfulto be.
To be like anything that I wouldever do.
(13:18):
Did you feel like your addictionto alcohol, like was there a
tie?
Were you addicted to the high ofperforming and getting
validation, getting attention?
Mm, no, but there is a verystrong connection between.
My, you know, using and artistryin that.
(13:40):
A really big fear of mine when Igot sober was that I was going
to be bad at performing, bad atpoetry, bad at acting bad on
stage.
Because, I believed that like,art comes from pain.
Mm.
And that, that was a way toconnect.
(14:00):
I also was like, you know,you're not scared to go on stage
when you're drunk.
Right.
You're not scared to dry standup, you're not scared to
whatever it is mm-hmm.
When you're drinking or using.
So there was definitely a feararound what, what is my, what am
I gonna look like as an artistwhen I'm not drinking?
Do you still think that artcomes from pain?
(14:20):
No.
No, I think that a, a lot ofgood art, a lot of good stuff is
written at all times, but like,I mean, I think about this,
like, I think about musicians.
I think a lot of people writeheartfelt, upsetting music.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
But I also think they don'tfinish it when they're in that
place.
You know what I mean?
Same with my poetry.
(14:41):
Like I wrote some, my, my poetrybook that is now feels so
ancient, but I wrote it when Iwas like, really in my
alcoholism really like, feltreally sorry for myself.
Mm-hmm.
And um, was like, you know, likein Italy, like I can't even go
outside because I just need todrink wine in this apartment and
(15:01):
like, make art and, um.
And I never finished it until Iwas sober.
You know, like I didn't publishit.
I was more brave, sober, mm-hmm.
Than not, which I, I thoughtwas, would be the opposite.
Yeah.
Well I guess that makes sense'cause they say the thing about
bravery, how there's no braverywithout fear.
(15:22):
Hmm.
Right.
Oh, I love that.
Is that really deep of me?
That's just, should I say itagain?
So where this was supposed tostart, but I'm glad we had all
this.
Yes.
What are your spiritualpractices that you do now?
Okay.
To keep yourself mentally sane.
Yeah.
There's a lot of'em.
(15:42):
Um, I was thinking about thisbecause I was like, I think two
of these you guys can't reallydo Okay.
But other ones you can do.
Okay.
Okay.
We still wanna hear about'em.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
We'll see.
I want you to actually live aweek in my shoes.
I got bunions.
So do I.
Oh, good.
Okay.
Look at that honey.
Look at that.
Um, okay, so, well we gottachoose, okay.
(16:05):
For people who aren't here, theyboth have little yellow
notebooks and a pen and they'reso primed and ready.
You, because you said I have alot of them.
You're giving us options we getto choose.
The only note I have for thissession right now is upright
steer to look it up and see whatit means.
Um, okay.
Uh, surf, be in the water.
Okay.
Um, you know, air airing.
You can do that.
Will you do it?
(16:25):
No.
It's too cold.
No, that's immediately crossedup.
I should have run that down.
Absolutely.
Um, surf, be in the water.
The water is my higher power.
My God.
Um, like water, sun, moon areall my higher power.
So connecting anyway to like thesun being outside, absorbing
sunlight in max capacity.
(16:45):
Um, those are all spiritual orlike basking in moonlight.
Um, any of those, um, a big onefor me is movement.
Any sort of movement, like forme specifically, it's like
weightlifting or right now yoga.
Um, another one is, uh, this isa second one you guys can't
really do.
I mean, I won't tell you what todo, but, um, like being gay and
(17:12):
like.
Like being queer and being,being, being, being gay, gay and
being queer, being in mycommunity, being around people I
love is a very spiritualexperience for me.
I think what it comes down to,honestly, and this is something
that anyone can do, is justbeing myself.
And being, you know, likefeeling truly myself, surrounded
by people I love who, um,understand me and can validate
(17:38):
me and, and I can validate them.
That's a very spiritual thingfor me.
Um, and then I also do a lot ofthe classics, meditation and
prayer.
Mm-hmm.
So I meditate every single day.
Um, usually only for fiveminutes, but I try to do it
every day.
I think that is honestly morespiritual like to me than the
(18:00):
amount of time right now.
Mm-hmm.
Uhhuh, like just the fact ofdoing it every single day and
then I pray a lot.
I talk to God, you know, to myhigher power or a lot.
So when you say, okay, so youbelieve in, do you, you believe
in God?
Yeah.
And then, my God.
Yeah.
Do you feel that, you said likeyou believe in the water, sun,
moon.
(18:20):
Mm-hmm.
Is that all a part of God?
Is it all one thing, or do youfeel like there are different
entities that you believe in?
Oh, um, I, I don't, I don't knowbecause I don't think about it
that hard.
Okay.
I find that if I like, thinkabout it too hard, then I, I
make it too complicated and Ijust need to keep it really
simple.
Because I know that there issomething bigger than me,
(18:41):
greater than myself.
And you know, like water, sun,moon, those all just feel like
so out of my control and theyfeel safe and they feel like
love.
And that's, I leave it at that.
Mm-hmm.
So, I, I don't know.
I Do you believe in spiritguides?
Yeah.
I believe in spirit guides.
I don't know who mine are.
Mm-hmm.
But yeah, absolutely.
(19:02):
I maybe the moon's my spiritguide.
When my spirit guides, you know?
Mm-hmm.
But when you talk to God, youfeel like you're talking to an
entity or to a person or just,or not any of that.
Not any of that.
Okay.
Yeah.
Just talking out loud and I knowsomething is listening.
Mm-hmm.
I mean, when I'm in the water, Italk a lot to the ocean.
Ooh, interesting.
A lot.
(19:23):
I like, um, I have the psychic Iadore and I will plug her right
now because I think everyoneshould go.
Chrissy Tulley.
Oh, yes.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
She helped me figure out a, howto channel a little bit, like
from my spirit guides, which Ido from time to time, but it
still really scares me, um, forsome reason.
But she also taught me, I washaving like this really crazy,
(19:45):
intrusive thought and, um, Ilike could not let it go and it
was giving me.
An extreme amount of anxiety.
And one of her suggestions andsomething that we figured out
through me channeling as well,was like, to go to nature, go to
the earth, or you know, even aplant and ask it to take your
self hatred.
(20:05):
And, um, because like the earthis a composter, like, it, it, it
takes trash and, and makes itinto, into flowers and plants
and, and beautiful and air, youknow, so.
Um, and have you done that?
And like, do you feel thatimmediately?
Oh yeah.
Is it like a, when she saidthat, I was like, next morning
I'm going out, I'm surfing,getting in the water, and I just
(20:26):
like sat in the water and I justwas like, God, ocean, please
take myself hatred from me.
And I literally, that intrusivethought.
I still get it like from time totime occasionally, but it does
not plague me.
It like happens once and then itpasses, and if I feel like I
need to again, I just go.
And I, that's my prayer towardsGod all the time, is please
release me from X.
(20:48):
Oh, okay.
Release me from anxiety, releaseme from my self hatred, release
me from my self pity.
I like that.
It's a release.
Yeah.
Yeah, it's a release.
It's because I feel like, Ialways thought of prayer as
asking for something.
Hmm.
Yeah.
And so I really like that thisis a release.
Yeah.
I tend to try to not ask foranything unless it's for someone
else or unless it would helpsomeone else.
(21:09):
Right.
Yeah.
So like that's why release, Ifeel like releasing my, and
that's not, I did not come upwith that.
That's stolen from many, manypeople, but I like.
I ask for release from anxietyand, you know, whatever it may
be because it will help someone,right?
I can be of service to somebody.
Mm-hmm.
I will be able to be present andnot like in my own self
(21:31):
obsession if I, um, can havesome relief.
Mm-hmm.
Did you feel like you were aspiritual person before you came
out?
Yes.
Oh yeah.
Did it change when you came out?
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, I just felt like I couldbe, I, I just felt like myself.
(21:52):
I mean, I felt connected tomyself.
I think the deeper I.
Get to know myself the, the moreI am like unabashedly connected
to God.
You know, like I, um, the more Iam myself, the more I can
connect with my higher power.
It's kind of interesting.
Like I feel like when I, I thinkI talk to my spirit guides the
(22:16):
most, I would say.
Mm.
And the more I take their, theirnudges, the more nudges I feel
like are given to me.
Mm-hmm.
And it's kind of interesting howyou're saying the more you feel
like yourself, the moreconnected to God you feel.
Mm-hmm.
Is what I took away from Yeah.
Yeah.
That's exactly it.
Yeah.
I agree with that.
Yeah.
The more I let my higher powerknow.
(22:37):
That I listen to my intuition,that I listen to my gut, you
know, gut is God in a way.
The more I hear myself.
And I mean, that was like thebiggest thing my gut has
probably ever told me is You'regay.
Mm-hmm.
This audio book I keep listeningto, it's called Code of the
Extraordinary Mind.
I keep talking about it'causeno, it's just on my brain a lot.
(22:59):
But they, they did a studyabout.
It was like poker players.
There was one player who waslike, lying or something.
Mm.
And they, they had some sort ofsensor on their hands and before
they even knew that, like thiswas the situation, that there
was a player that was lying,their hands were sweating He was
saying your body knows beforeyour mind does.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Your intuition is so strong.
(23:20):
Yeah.
In a way that like is somehownot even connected to you
registering what's happening.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That like your body just knowssomething.
Your brain also apparently knowswhat it's about to say.
Do.
Act out on seven seconds beforeyou do it.
Yeah, I read, I read that.
Oh really?
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's crazy.
It's really trippy.
You can't think about it toomuch or else you just wanna say,
'cause then you start thinkingabout, like, my brain knows what
(23:41):
I'm about to say in sevenseconds, but I don't know what
I'm about to say in sevenseconds.
What am I gonna say?
Was it this that I'm about tosay in seven seconds?
I was just gonna comment on.
Just, I was just thinking aboutspecifically water, sun, and
moon and it, I think it, to me,if the idea of intuition had a
(24:03):
symbol, it would be the moon orthe ocean, the sun.
Like it just, and, and, and alsolike you're surfing.
I've only done it once, but thatis, I can imagine the most
intuitive.
Because you're listening so muchto the water into yourself.
I don't know.
Just like I thought I found thatreally interesting that, that
there's something so connectedto listening.
(24:26):
I like that.
That's really beautiful.
Yeah.
Were you raised, I mean, I knowyou were raised Jewish.
Yeah.
But were you raised.
Spiritual praying?
No.
What was that like?
I think I was raised likeagnostic Jewish.
I think a lot of people were.
Culturally, I feel like that's,yeah.
Yeah.
Culturally Jewish.
But there was never like adiscussion of like, I mean, I
went to Hebrew school.
(24:47):
So we talked about God, but mychild's brain understood or
thought or perceived, I don'tknow if this is actually true,
but my child, brain perceivedthat my parents didn't really
care about God or believe inGod.
Atheism was discussed in ourhousehold, like okay.
Um, we were very open to havingdiscussions.
So have you talked to yourparents about it now?
(25:09):
Well, my dad is sober, so he'sextremely spiritual guy.
Like actually when he got soberand I was, um, 16, 17, whenever
he would talk about God, it wasso annoying.
Mm-hmm.
Because I'd be like, shut up.
Like there's no God.
You never believed in God beforethis, and now all of a sudden
you believe in God.
Like, what does that, you know,and then eventually that
happened to me, which is funny,and I hated the word God.
(25:30):
I hated when people say, youshould pray.
I hated when people were like, Iget to all my muse to pray.
I was like, wow, you guys aresuch losers.
And now I do all of that myself,but I, I really struggled with
the concept of God.
Um, my mom, I, I don't know.
I think she is this generallyspiritual person.
She really connects to nature,but I actually dunno.
I should ask her.
Mm-hmm.
Thanks for the prompt.
(25:50):
Yeah.
Has there been a time in your,it doesn't have to be your
artistic life, any part of yourlife where you feel like your
spirituality is what you leanedon to take you out of it?
And if so, what did you do?
Not to bring it all back, alwaysto being queer.
No, but you know, when I cameout, so I, y'all both know this,
(26:13):
but, um, I was with someone fortwo years and I like.
Kind of woke up one day and Iwas like, whoa, I'm gay.
I mean, there was things thatled up to that, but it was kind
of a light bulb moment.
And, um, it was so extremelyhard.
I mean, it was like grieving whoI was, grieving this
relationship, grieving thefuture I thought I was gonna
have, right?
(26:33):
Like, if I don't get married tocis man, it's a very different
process to have children.
It's a very different process toget married.
It's a very different process ofwhere we can live and be
accepted and yada, yada, yada.
So it was, it was a lot of.
Grief.
So yeah, I absolutely had torely on my spirituality.
I prayed a lot.
I screamed at God a lot.
I screamed, cried at God a lot.
Um, I don't think I was reallymeditating at that time, to be
(26:55):
honest, but I was, I did do alot of prayer and leaned on my
community, you know, leaned on.
I didn't have a queer communityat the time, but I've, you know,
sober community and leaned onthem.
I think community is extremelyspiritual, extremely.
Do you feel that you have soughta partner who is, is spiritually
similar to you at all?
(27:15):
Mm, no.
Really?
Yeah.
My, I, I've actually always hadpartners with a religious
trauma.
Really every partner I've everhad.
Yeah.
I didn't know that.
Yeah.
So my, my current partner has alot of religious trauma Jay grew
up Southern Baptist, which isvery different from how I grew
up, so.
Mm-hmm.
And they're gay, they're queer.
(27:36):
Do they have any resistance toyou praying to God at all?
No.
No.
Like does, okay.
No, no, no.
They have zero.
They don't have any qualms.
And I pray at night, like Ipray, like before.
Not always, but I'll just sit inbed and whisper.
Like while we're both layingthere, like with our eyes closed
and I'm like, God, thank youfor, and my, my prayer to God at
night is always like a, just agratitude list.
(27:57):
Mm-hmm.
Oh, just like a thank you.
Is it always out loud?
Yes.
It is always out loud.
Okay.
Always out loud.
I realized recently that I have,I mean I feel like for all of
it, for me can really easilybecome a form of control and
prayer can be because then it'slike I say the same prayer at
the same time and I feel like ifI don't say it, something bad
might happen.
It almost feels like.
Superstitious.
(28:18):
Mm-hmm.
Um, but yeah, I've recently beentrying to, instead of praying
the same prayer, just like kindof have a conversation with my
spirit guides.
But yeah, I don't know.
I don't know why I feel thatpressure.
I mean, I'm sure it's some sortof learned ingrained system in
me.
I, I'm very curious and, and Ithink this question for both of
(28:41):
you, is there a formality to itin any way I think it's elusive
for me now.
I mean, I think it's interestingyou said that you kind of try
not to think about it too hardbecause for me, I feel like I
believe in God, I believe in theuniverse.
I believe in spirit gods.
I think they're all probably thesame thing.
I don't really quite know theparticulars about.
Mm-hmm.
What is happening when or withwho or who I'm talking to more
(29:02):
You know, like it feels like ifyou're talking to one thing,
you're talking to all of it., Ithink I would probably say that
it's all the same thing.
Like all the religions, all thespirit, like it's all about just
making our lives better.
But yeah, I think it's startingto feel less formal, but I think
there's part of it, like we weretalking about with the cards,
the Oracle cards, that there waspart of me that felt like.
(29:24):
Some sort of voodoo witchcraft,like our evil spirit's gonna
come in, we ingest all thisinformation, from the media and
our families and our lives andour partners and whatever that,
I think it's like you don't evenquite know why you believe the
things you believe until youreally like take a look at them.
So I've never had formality toit.
Okay.
Because I had never prayed.
Mm-hmm.
Um, I mean, I say the SerenityPrayer because, which is.
(29:49):
God, grant me the serenity toaccept the things I cannot
change, the courage to changethe things I can and wisdom to
know the difference.
Mm-hmm.
But that's like a sober thing.
Um, and so I just say it becauseit's something I memorized and
now it's just easy to say outloud.
Yeah, yeah.
But I, I, it's never, yeah, it'sno formality whatsoever.
Yeah.
I guess, yeah, I think this cameup when you said you were like
(30:10):
screaming at God.
Yeah.
And I was like, oh, I wonder howYeah.
That's changed in like, is thatconsidered prayer still?
Oh, absolutely.
You know what I mean?
So that's, that was just curiousabout that.
Yeah.
I only started praying when Igot sober.
Because they, everyone was like,you have to pray.
And I was like, that's dumb.
Yes.
Right.
But I just like still did itbecause I really needed and
wanted to be sober.
(30:31):
And they were like, this is oneof the ways you stay sober.
And I was like, okay.
And the, the, what I learned wasAnything, you can say anything.
It could be a prayer, like justtalk to God.
Just open this line ofcommunication.
And like meditation.
I like to think of it as,meditation is listening to God
and prayer is talking to God.
Um, oh, but I, but I also, Idon't think about it that
(30:53):
strict.
Yeah.
I just started talking to Godand then like, you know.
Yeah.
So of course, yeah.
It's evolved.
Yeah.
When you meditate, you said youdo five minute meditations?
Mostly.
Mostly, yeah.
Is it guided or silent?
Um, usually silent.
Okay.
Usually silent.
Yeah.
I'll do guided sometimes if Ireally feel like I'm feeling
(31:14):
sticky or kinda mm-hmm.
In a difficult spot, but usuallysilent.
And part of my meditationpractice right now is just like.
Anything Is meditation similarto like anything is prayer,
Anything that comes up is stillmeditation.
So like, yes, I sit, I sitstill.
Sometimes I like stretch alittle.
I like move my neck around andI'm like, yeah, that's fine.
That's still meditation.
Sometimes I think about anentire list of what I have to do
(31:37):
for the day and I'm like, that'sfine.
That's still meditation.
Sometimes I like amazing andfeel zen and breathe, but I
don't think, um, I tried tobring as little judgment to it.
Mm.
Chew it as possible.
Do you feel like God speaks toyou during that with the
meditation is for listening?
Mm.
Um, sometimes, but not nothinglike quite always clear.
(31:59):
I mean, if it is, it's like slowdown, breathe, it's okay.
Mm-hmm.
That kind of stuff.
But I never hear like a, youknow, Moses voice come down and.
Tell'em, or, or spirit guide Ishould say.
Have you ever slipped into likea really deep meditation?
Um, no, because I fall asleep.
(32:22):
That is the form.
The highest.
Yeah.
That's the highest, yeah.
Whenever like Ari and I will goto yoga or do something air's
like sound baths, sound bathair's.
Like, I think you should thinkabout this specific thing while
you're in meditation.
Yeah.
I'm like, okay, I'm good.
Give it a go.
And then I, I don't think aboutit or I fall asleep.
Yeah.
Or I forget to.
I think that's fine.
I mean, I think part of it'sjust like, I think my life has
(32:44):
to be compartmentalized in someways with this phase of my life
with two little kids.
You know what I mean?
Yeah.
So like the time for me to thinkabout those things is.
That makes sense.
Oh, yeah.
But yeah, the sound bath, Islipped into a deep meditation.
It's only happened a coupletimes, but it's, it feels like
there's, I guess it's like theconscious and the subconscious,
it feels like I am underneathmyself, but I'm still awake.
(33:05):
Cool.
Oh, underneath, not above.
Yeah.
Cool.
It feels like my, like I am notsleeping.
But like I can kind of feelmyself here, laying down and
then I'm like underneathreceiving the information.
Cool.
That's cool.
Yeah.
I think we should try'cause wehave to choose one of your
practices.
I mean for, I, we can discuss,but I feel like meditating in
(33:28):
silence, I never do, I like thefive minutes of it all because I
feel like that is not tooimpeding on my life with two
small children.
But what, right now, what I'vebeen doing is meditating with
like this kind of meditatedmusic, just so I cannot hear the
children in the background.
But I would like to trymeditating in absolute silence
for ness to see.
(33:49):
If that changes things.
What do you think?
I, I, I've done that a lot insilence.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And the five minute bit.
So if you wanna take that.
Okay.
Do you wanna take something elseor?
I think I wanna take the water.
Going to the water.
I've been craving the watersince you said water.
Okay.
I was like.
How often do you surf?
Yeah.
How often do you go to thewater?
(34:09):
Uh, I try to go once or twice aweek.
Okay.
Twice a week.
Okay.
So for two weeks you'll go twicea week to the water.
Okay.
And I will meditate in silencefor five minutes Oh, I'm so
excited.
Good.
Is there anything you wanna plugor.
Any cause that you feel calledto tell us about, that you
(34:31):
donate your time or money orvolunteer at support trans
youth.
Okay.
Yes.
Love that.
I love that.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Trans and, and everyone who'strans.
Yeah.
Just give'em trans people.
Yeah.
Give them your money.
Give'em your time.
Give'em your, your love.
You know, stand up for them.
(34:52):
Mm-hmm.
Um.
Amen.
Listen to them.
Well, thank you so much forbeing here.
Yay.
I love you.
I love you guys.
This was really nice.
You guys are so smart.
Thank you for listening.
Yes, we call it boda.
Thanks for listening in Todaboda Spiritual Practices of the
Disgruntled Artist.
We'll see you next time andwe'll inform you how our, our
practices of the water.
(35:14):
Yes, I'm excited to listen.
Silent meditation.
Go.
Cool.
Yay.
Thanks Kate.
We love you.
Thank you so much.
Thank you.
Love you guys.
Spoa forever.
Hey friends.
Hello there.
And welcome to the SpiritualPractices of the Disgruntled
Artist, where we interview a newartist each episode to learn how
they are keeping themselves saneand spiritually healthy during
this epically challenging timeto be an artist.
What's up y'all?
What's up?
Uh, before we get into ourguest, we're gonna talk about
our homework from the lastepisode.
(00:34):
Professor Grant Jossy, who madea sweat every sweat d.
Day, sweat.
Sort of sweat.
Yeah.
Sort of.
I had a difficult time, buthere's what I learned.
Okay.
Okay.
Here's what one, if you are abusy mom or a person, just a
busy person who can't leavetheir house for some reason.
Mm-hmm.
(00:54):
The answer is a dance video.
If you wanna sweat Yes.
15 minutes a day.
Yes.
But you can't leave your housebecause running also helps.
But I hate running, but I, someof my walks with my little one
mm-hmm.
I would do the first 15 minutesrunning.
Immediate sweat also hate it.
Just gen, genuinely.
Mm-hmm.
Worst thing I but my sweatalways hated running since.
(01:15):
You know what?
I used to make myself run andthen after Fiona with the birth
from actual hell, I was like,I'm not gonna make my body do
this anymore.
I hate this.
And I also was like, I'm gonnagive you a donut a week body.
And I do that.
Aww, that's another spiritualpractice.
Why didn't the heck I, where'sMyy Cream?
(01:36):
What?
That's what this is what I alsolearned.
Okay.
Rest days are important.
And when I went back andlistened to Grant's episode, he
says he doesn't do it on theweekends.
And we didn't do that in ourhomework.
We said we're gonna do twoweeks, 14 days every single day.
And I think when I add mine up,I probably missed about four
days, but then I felt kind ofbad about it.
(01:58):
But, but the point is, I'velearned this, I've heard this
before, that you need rest STAsboth for your body to
recuperate, but also for yourmind to not.
To like, wanna do that again,you know, right.
To want to sweat again.
Yeah.
So I already, I mean, it alsowas very close to me, close to
what I'm already doing.
'cause I do like warm yoga threedays a week.
You're already very active.
I already, I go for like threemile walks, three days a week.
(02:20):
So it was like filling in thegaps and I think maybe I rely on
those gaps in a little bit.
A little bit.
And that's okay though.
You Right, right.
How about you?
How, how was it for you?
It was pretty good.
Um, I maybe wasn't as consistentas you were.
But I did mostly dance.
Dance.
We danced and, and I realizedlike, if I'm gonna sweat, I have
(02:44):
to trick myself.
Hmm.
Into, because you don't wannasweat.
Uh, well, and not really sweat.
Uh, I'm not someone who I, Ihave gone to the gym and stuff
like that.
I, like I said, I've alwayshated running.
Mm-hmm.
I just, I, I, I just never willlike running.
I, I, I've accepted that.
That's okay.
You never know.
(03:05):
Someone's gonna come on here andbe like.
You have only running.
It's only running.
We're gonna be like, what areyour spiritual practices?
They're gonna be like running.
I'll be like, what else?
And they'll be like, listen,it's just running.
I've done a 5K once in my life.
That's, that's it.
Sorry, donut.
When I was a kid, when we had todo the mile run.
Did you have to do that fromschool?
I would find out what's the,what's the minimum time just to
(03:25):
pass and didn't make that, Ididn't care how fast I went.
But anyways, love to dance.
And I think too, what I learned.
Is that I, I think maybe'cause'cause I just, I love to dance
in general.
It, it's the expression too, youknow, to me running is just, I'm
(03:46):
just, uh, it just hurts and I'mnot into it.
And I can't think with, withdancing, with dance videos, it's
fun'cause it's like, oh, I'mlearning new moves or whatever.
But there was actually a coupletimes where I didn't feel like
doing a video and I just put on.
Music and just like dancedaround.
Oh, I see.
I should, I should have donethat.
I would like that more.
Plus the girls would like it.
Yeah, and I also, I included, Idon't know if this counts, but
(04:09):
I, I included it.
Okay.
I was like.
You know what can make me sweatis if I clean really hard.
Hard.
Yeah, that counts.
That absolutely counts.
Yes.
So I tried to incorporate likethings I needed to do.
Yeah.
But sweat while I was doing it,I was like, imagining you
frantically cleaning, you havelike a handkerchief in your hair
in my mind, and you're just likerunning around.
(04:30):
It was actually kind of hard tosweat for 15 minutes.
It took a while to get to thatsweat.
I'm also not a, I don'tnaturally sweat.
Oh, I do very easily, especiallymy feet.
I have an actual problem,really, my hands.
Oh, really?
Wow.
We're soulmates.
We are.
I, I think, uh, as far asgetting up a sweat, I, to me, I
(04:50):
also, I didn't really thinkabout sweating as much as I
thought of my, of your, at myheart.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Okay.
And, and then at the end Idefinitely was like, oh, I'm a
little sweaty.
Mm-hmm.
And that to me, was it.
And I was like, that feels good.
I feel like I exerted myself alittle bit more, you know?
Not like, just like yoga wetalked about like, oh, that's
not quite.
Well definitely yoga videos arenot it for me.
(05:11):
I mean, it's just not it for meIf I need to relax, but it's not
gonna be a workout for me.
But at my studio, Satori, I sendMonica, it's warm yoga.
Yeah.
So I sweat a lot there.
But Will you do this again?
Will you take anything fromthis?
Yes.
I think I, I think movement isjust, it makes you happy.
Mm-hmm.
(05:32):
And I love to dance and I thinkof anything, I just was like,
God, this is an easy win for me.
Yeah, totally.
Yeah.
I will take away like the timeswhen the week's really busy or
the kids are sick or whatever.
There's a lot of auditions.
I can't get to yoga.
I can do a dance video for 15minutes a day.
Yeah.
And my children tolerated it.
They didn't love me doing that.
Oh, really?
Yeah.
(05:52):
Fiona was like, kind of into it.
Ellie was like, I, I go and siton a couch.
I was like, yeah, girl.
She's the donut for, she's, yes.
Where's your donut?
Where's, yeah.
I love that.
Yeah.
Okay.
Okay.
Good job.
High five.
Bye.
Welcome to August.
(06:13):
Yay.
The day Kate Anhauser.
She's a poet.
She's a musician.
She's taken some classes in thecommunity.
She's a creator.
We met through improv.
Yes, we've all been friends fora very long time.
We have Welcome.
Yes, thanks.
Hello.
Thanks for coming on, sda.
Thank you.
Thanks.
So what's the, what's, what's inyour brain at this time?
(06:36):
Um, well, I'm always writingpoetry.
This is so intense.
So sorry.
I, sorry.
No, I love it.
I love it.
Um, for the listeners at home,Ari and Olivia are just.
Really cutely really close to meand staring at me with very cute
heart eyes.
Um, I, I'm always writingpoetry.
(06:56):
I'm sometimes take out myguitar, have a go through phases
and sing and write songs.
I record a lot of voice notes ofsongs, actually.
Mm-hmm.
Actually, you did send me onethat I thought.
That I really enjoyed.
Oh, or maybe you put it onTikTok.
Oh, yeah.
I have lots of like, why did Ithink that this was good?
But I actually thought about,but Oh, oh, it was, um, it was o
it was, I sang it into avoicemail in the middle of the
(07:17):
night.
Yeah.
What was it?
Yeah, it was about Can you singit?
Yeah.
It was like, it was about beinggay and being a cowboy.
It was like queers and cowboys,some and upright steers, dykes
and lassos, and it's literally.
Me singing, but it, I soundasleep.
(07:38):
Yeah.
Like, and really?
Yeah.
That was good.
It was good.
I, I recently was looking at oneand it said one from a long time
ago and it said, oof, this isgood.
That was the title That shouldalways remain the title.
That was the title.
And I'm like, wow.
I really liked it.
And I listened to it and I waslike, this is not good.
It's funny.
It's like actually comical.
(07:59):
Anyway, I do that.
Okay, I'm doing a thing.
I am trying to do a piece or I'mgonna go, I'm moving to New
Jersey in April.
We're sad about it.
Don't talk about it too much.
It's very sad.
And um, and I am gonna go to allthe places I used to live and
film and take some photographs.
And, um, write a poem and kindof try to edit it in a cool way.
(08:23):
Maybe sing a little acapella.
California.
Do you wanna, you don't wannasing queers and cowboys unless
you finds a perfect and the brasteers, upright steers, I don't
actually know what a steer is.
Uh, isn't in a horse, just acow.
Oh shit.
Well, none, none of us know.
See, see what's this here andwhy is it upright down?
I, is it upright?
(08:43):
It's on all, it's in two.
It's on its back legs and itsone legs are up.
Oh my God.
Upright.
Okay.
Yep.
Alright.
That's what I'm working on here.
I have a side question for you.
Mm-hmm.
Do how when you write something,do you know if it's a poem or a
song?
Yes.
Oh, really?
Always.
Is it because you have do anddo, is it intention based, like
you're like, I'm gonna write apoem, or I'm gonna write a song,
or no.
(09:04):
Well, when I say, well, well, Idon't think my poetry lends
itself to, to.
Music period.
Oh, oh.
So I don't think, like, when Isit down to write a poem, I sit
down to write a poem, and thensongs usually pop in my head
more than poems do.
Hmm.
Sometimes poetry will pop in myhead and I'll do like a quick,
you know, write it on my phone.
But, but I usually sit down andvery intentionally I'm like, I'm
(09:25):
gonna write poetry.
Music is more, um, I guessorganic.
Mm-hmm.
But my po, most of my poetry is,is so, um.
Casual.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
And kind of just sounds likejournaling, which some people do
write as songs, but I don't, I,I've never tried.
I could try, I guess.
Mm-hmm.
It's hard for me to write a songwithout making a rhyme.
(09:46):
Which I try to work on thatsometimes.
Do you, when you write a song,when you say it comes naturally,
is there like already like atune in your head or is it
mostly the words or just theidea?
I would say they both come atthe same time, which is
frustrating because I'm not an,a good enough guitarist.
Mm-hmm.
Which is why I, I will, I try tostart taking guitar lessons, but
(10:06):
I do have it in my head and thenI have to change it a little bit
when I like, pull out the guitar'cause it doesn't match what's
in my head.
That's all right.
Okay.
I have questions.
I have questions.
I mean, I, I feel like we needto.
Okay.
Okay.
We have the question of thepodcast, which we'll get to.
Yes.
We'll get to that eventually.
And I also have a question too,after.
Okay.
Me too.
Okay.
(10:29):
Okay, great.
So four hours?
Yes.
Seven minutes.
Okay.
You were a performer.
Mm-hmm.
For a very long time.
What changed for you spirituallywhen you gave that up?
When I gave up acting.
Yeah.
Um, I mean, it all happenedaround the sim the same time I
got sober.
Mm.
So, like me stopping acting waspretty soon, like after I got
(10:50):
sober, I kind of realized itkind of, I realized a lot of
things when I got sober and thatwas one of them.
Um, and it actually feltextremely freeing and I actually
felt like it freed up a lot ofmy brain space to feel more
creative with poetry.
With, um, singing, with like,doing whatever freed up me to
(11:11):
feel less constraint aboutimprov.
Mm-hmm.
Um, which we've talked a lotabout.
Yeah.
Um, and is that because you feltlike it was part of your
identity and, and therefore youcouldn't be a poet and a
musician and an improviser oranything else because you.
It was part of your identity orjust freed up time and energy?
I think just, yeah, I think justfreed me up creatively, period
(11:33):
just freed me up from feelinglike I had to only work on
something that was gonna help mycareer.
Mm-hmm.
Like I have to take an actingclass.
I can't take a guitar class, Ican't take a workshop on, you
know, poetry.
I can't spend time sittingwriting poetry.
I should be looking at somescript and filming it into the
(11:54):
camera.
Or choosing a scene for a classor, yeah, I think that's, was
there any sort of confession youhad to make to like your parents
and your friend?
Like was that hard to do, to belike, I'm not pursuing this
thing anymore?
No.
I think because everyone in thistown understands.
Yeah, yeah.
I think everyone in this townunderstands that it's really
(12:16):
hard and it's really tiring.
And I think I also had a lot offriends who around the same
time, or very soon after me, orvery right before me, who, um,
also realized that they didn'tactually like acting that much
and they just was something thatthey were kind of good at.
And they, it was like, not too.
It wasn't like it, it didn'tfeel free.
(12:38):
It didn't feel like expression.
It just felt like this is whatI'm supposed to do.
And so I think I had peers thatfelt that way, which really
helped.
I mean, my parents wereecstatic.
Really?
Oh, yeah.
And it wasn't a fun journeythough, because stopping acting
was like in the midst of me alsolike going more into producing,
which I really hated.
Yes.
(12:58):
Right.
And was really upsetting andreally difficult and way too
stressful and just like notenough, like not enough bang for
your buck.
Not an emotional, not in a, um,in a financial way.
In an emotional way, yeah.
Like it's just way too stressfulto be.
To be like anything that I wouldever do.
(13:18):
Did you feel like your addictionto alcohol, like was there a
tie?
Were you addicted to the high ofperforming and getting
validation, getting attention?
Mm, no, but there is a verystrong connection between.
My, you know, using and artistryin that.
(13:40):
A really big fear of mine when Igot sober was that I was going
to be bad at performing, bad atpoetry, bad at acting bad on
stage.
Because, I believed that like,art comes from pain.
Mm.
And that, that was a way toconnect.
(14:00):
I also was like, you know,you're not scared to go on stage
when you're drunk.
Right.
You're not scared to dry standup, you're not scared to
whatever it is mm-hmm.
When you're drinking or using.
So there was definitely a feararound what, what is my, what am
I gonna look like as an artistwhen I'm not drinking?
Do you still think that artcomes from pain?
(14:20):
No.
No, I think that a, a lot ofgood art, a lot of good stuff is
written at all times, but like,I mean, I think about this,
like, I think about musicians.
I think a lot of people writeheartfelt, upsetting music.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
But I also think they don'tfinish it when they're in that
place.
You know what I mean?
Same with my poetry.
(14:41):
Like I wrote some, my, my poetrybook that is now feels so
ancient, but I wrote it when Iwas like, really in my
alcoholism really like, feltreally sorry for myself.
Mm-hmm.
And um, was like, you know, likein Italy, like I can't even go
outside because I just need todrink wine in this apartment and
(15:01):
like, make art and, um.
And I never finished it until Iwas sober.
You know, like I didn't publishit.
I was more brave, sober, mm-hmm.
Than not, which I, I thoughtwas, would be the opposite.
Yeah.
Well I guess that makes sense'cause they say the thing about
bravery, how there's no braverywithout fear.
(15:22):
Hmm.
Right.
Oh, I love that.
Is that really deep of me?
That's just, should I say itagain?
So where this was supposed tostart, but I'm glad we had all
this.
Yes.
What are your spiritualpractices that you do now?
Okay.
To keep yourself mentally sane.
Yeah.
There's a lot of'em.
(15:42):
Um, I was thinking about thisbecause I was like, I think two
of these you guys can't reallydo Okay.
But other ones you can do.
Okay.
Okay.
We still wanna hear about'em.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
We'll see.
I want you to actually live aweek in my shoes.
I got bunions.
So do I.
Oh, good.
Okay.
Look at that honey.
Look at that.
Um, okay, so, well we gottachoose, okay.
(16:05):
For people who aren't here, theyboth have little yellow
notebooks and a pen and they'reso primed and ready.
You, because you said I have alot of them.
You're giving us options we getto choose.
The only note I have for thissession right now is upright
steer to look it up and see whatit means.
Um, okay.
Uh, surf, be in the water.
Okay.
Um, you know, air airing.
You can do that.
Will you do it?
(16:25):
No.
It's too cold.
No, that's immediately crossedup.
I should have run that down.
Absolutely.
Um, surf, be in the water.
The water is my higher power.
My God.
Um, like water, sun, moon areall my higher power.
So connecting anyway to like thesun being outside, absorbing
sunlight in max capacity.
(16:45):
Um, those are all spiritual orlike basking in moonlight.
Um, any of those, um, a big onefor me is movement.
Any sort of movement, like forme specifically, it's like
weightlifting or right now yoga.
Um, another one is, uh, this isa second one you guys can't
really do.
I mean, I won't tell you what todo, but, um, like being gay and
(17:12):
like.
Like being queer and being,being, being, being gay, gay and
being queer, being in mycommunity, being around people I
love is a very spiritualexperience for me.
I think what it comes down to,honestly, and this is something
that anyone can do, is justbeing myself.
And being, you know, likefeeling truly myself, surrounded
by people I love who, um,understand me and can validate
(17:38):
me and, and I can validate them.
That's a very spiritual thingfor me.
Um, and then I also do a lot ofthe classics, meditation and
prayer.
Mm-hmm.
So I meditate every single day.
Um, usually only for fiveminutes, but I try to do it
every day.
I think that is honestly morespiritual like to me than the
(18:00):
amount of time right now.
Mm-hmm.
Uhhuh, like just the fact ofdoing it every single day and
then I pray a lot.
I talk to God, you know, to myhigher power or a lot.
So when you say, okay, so youbelieve in, do you, you believe
in God?
Yeah.
And then, my God.
Yeah.
Do you feel that, you said likeyou believe in the water, sun,
moon.
(18:20):
Mm-hmm.
Is that all a part of God?
Is it all one thing, or do youfeel like there are different
entities that you believe in?
Oh, um, I, I don't, I don't knowbecause I don't think about it
that hard.
Okay.
I find that if I like, thinkabout it too hard, then I, I
make it too complicated and Ijust need to keep it really
simple.
Because I know that there issomething bigger than me,
(18:41):
greater than myself.
And you know, like water, sun,moon, those all just feel like
so out of my control and theyfeel safe and they feel like
love.
And that's, I leave it at that.
Mm-hmm.
So, I, I don't know.
I Do you believe in spiritguides?
Yeah.
I believe in spirit guides.
I don't know who mine are.
Mm-hmm.
But yeah, absolutely.
(19:02):
I maybe the moon's my spiritguide.
When my spirit guides, you know?
Mm-hmm.
But when you talk to God, youfeel like you're talking to an
entity or to a person or just,or not any of that.
Not any of that.
Okay.
Yeah.
Just talking out loud and I knowsomething is listening.
Mm-hmm.
I mean, when I'm in the water, Italk a lot to the ocean.
Ooh, interesting.
A lot.
(19:23):
I like, um, I have the psychic Iadore and I will plug her right
now because I think everyoneshould go.
Chrissy Tulley.
Oh, yes.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
She helped me figure out a, howto channel a little bit, like
from my spirit guides, which Ido from time to time, but it
still really scares me, um, forsome reason.
But she also taught me, I washaving like this really crazy,
(19:45):
intrusive thought and, um, Ilike could not let it go and it
was giving me.
An extreme amount of anxiety.
And one of her suggestions andsomething that we figured out
through me channeling as well,was like, to go to nature, go to
the earth, or you know, even aplant and ask it to take your
self hatred.
(20:05):
And, um, because like the earthis a composter, like, it, it, it
takes trash and, and makes itinto, into flowers and plants
and, and beautiful and air, youknow, so.
Um, and have you done that?
And like, do you feel thatimmediately?
Oh yeah.
Is it like a, when she saidthat, I was like, next morning
I'm going out, I'm surfing,getting in the water, and I just
(20:26):
like sat in the water and I justwas like, God, ocean, please
take myself hatred from me.
And I literally, that intrusivethought.
I still get it like from time totime occasionally, but it does
not plague me.
It like happens once and then itpasses, and if I feel like I
need to again, I just go.
And I, that's my prayer towardsGod all the time, is please
release me from X.
(20:48):
Oh, okay.
Release me from anxiety, releaseme from my self hatred, release
me from my self pity.
I like that.
It's a release.
Yeah.
Yeah, it's a release.
It's because I feel like, Ialways thought of prayer as
asking for something.
Hmm.
Yeah.
And so I really like that thisis a release.
Yeah.
I tend to try to not ask foranything unless it's for someone
else or unless it would helpsomeone else.
(21:09):
Right.
Yeah.
So like that's why release, Ifeel like releasing my, and
that's not, I did not come upwith that.
That's stolen from many, manypeople, but I like.
I ask for release from anxietyand, you know, whatever it may
be because it will help someone,right?
I can be of service to somebody.
Mm-hmm.
I will be able to be present andnot like in my own self
(21:31):
obsession if I, um, can havesome relief.
Mm-hmm.
Did you feel like you were aspiritual person before you came
out?
Yes.
Oh yeah.
Did it change when you came out?
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, I just felt like I couldbe, I, I just felt like myself.
(21:52):
I mean, I felt connected tomyself.
I think the deeper I.
Get to know myself the, the moreI am like unabashedly connected
to God.
You know, like I, um, the more Iam myself, the more I can
connect with my higher power.
It's kind of interesting.
Like I feel like when I, I thinkI talk to my spirit guides the
(22:16):
most, I would say.
Mm.
And the more I take their, theirnudges, the more nudges I feel
like are given to me.
Mm-hmm.
And it's kind of interesting howyou're saying the more you feel
like yourself, the moreconnected to God you feel.
Mm-hmm.
Is what I took away from Yeah.
Yeah.
That's exactly it.
Yeah.
I agree with that.
Yeah.
The more I let my higher powerknow.
(22:37):
That I listen to my intuition,that I listen to my gut, you
know, gut is God in a way.
The more I hear myself.
And I mean, that was like thebiggest thing my gut has
probably ever told me is You'regay.
Mm-hmm.
This audio book I keep listeningto, it's called Code of the
Extraordinary Mind.
I keep talking about it'causeno, it's just on my brain a lot.
(22:59):
But they, they did a studyabout.
It was like poker players.
There was one player who waslike, lying or something.
Mm.
And they, they had some sort ofsensor on their hands and before
they even knew that, like thiswas the situation, that there
was a player that was lying,their hands were sweating He was
saying your body knows beforeyour mind does.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Your intuition is so strong.
(23:20):
Yeah.
In a way that like is somehownot even connected to you
registering what's happening.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That like your body just knowssomething.
Your brain also apparently knowswhat it's about to say.
Do.
Act out on seven seconds beforeyou do it.
Yeah, I read, I read that.
Oh really?
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's crazy.
It's really trippy.
You can't think about it toomuch or else you just wanna say,
'cause then you start thinkingabout, like, my brain knows what
(23:41):
I'm about to say in sevenseconds, but I don't know what
I'm about to say in sevenseconds.
What am I gonna say?
Was it this that I'm about tosay in seven seconds?
I was just gonna comment on.
Just, I was just thinking aboutspecifically water, sun, and
moon and it, I think it, to me,if the idea of intuition had a
(24:03):
symbol, it would be the moon orthe ocean, the sun.
Like it just, and, and, and alsolike you're surfing.
I've only done it once, but thatis, I can imagine the most
intuitive.
Because you're listening so muchto the water into yourself.
I don't know.
Just like I thought I found thatreally interesting that, that
there's something so connectedto listening.
(24:26):
I like that.
That's really beautiful.
Yeah.
Were you raised, I mean, I knowyou were raised Jewish.
Yeah.
But were you raised.
Spiritual praying?
No.
What was that like?
I think I was raised likeagnostic Jewish.
I think a lot of people were.
Culturally, I feel like that's,yeah.
Yeah.
Culturally Jewish.
But there was never like adiscussion of like, I mean, I
went to Hebrew school.
(24:47):
So we talked about God, but mychild's brain understood or
thought or perceived, I don'tknow if this is actually true,
but my child, brain perceivedthat my parents didn't really
care about God or believe inGod.
Atheism was discussed in ourhousehold, like okay.
Um, we were very open to havingdiscussions.
So have you talked to yourparents about it now?
(25:09):
Well, my dad is sober, so he'sextremely spiritual guy.
Like actually when he got soberand I was, um, 16, 17, whenever
he would talk about God, it wasso annoying.
Mm-hmm.
Because I'd be like, shut up.
Like there's no God.
You never believed in God beforethis, and now all of a sudden
you believe in God.
Like, what does that, you know,and then eventually that
happened to me, which is funny,and I hated the word God.
(25:30):
I hated when people say, youshould pray.
I hated when people were like, Iget to all my muse to pray.
I was like, wow, you guys aresuch losers.
And now I do all of that myself,but I, I really struggled with
the concept of God.
Um, my mom, I, I don't know.
I think she is this generallyspiritual person.
She really connects to nature,but I actually dunno.
I should ask her.
Mm-hmm.
Thanks for the prompt.
(25:50):
Yeah.
Has there been a time in your,it doesn't have to be your
artistic life, any part of yourlife where you feel like your
spirituality is what you leanedon to take you out of it?
And if so, what did you do?
Not to bring it all back, alwaysto being queer.
No, but you know, when I cameout, so I, y'all both know this,
(26:13):
but, um, I was with someone fortwo years and I like.
Kind of woke up one day and Iwas like, whoa, I'm gay.
I mean, there was things thatled up to that, but it was kind
of a light bulb moment.
And, um, it was so extremelyhard.
I mean, it was like grieving whoI was, grieving this
relationship, grieving thefuture I thought I was gonna
have, right?
(26:33):
Like, if I don't get married tocis man, it's a very different
process to have children.
It's a very different process toget married.
It's a very different process ofwhere we can live and be
accepted and yada, yada, yada.
So it was, it was a lot of.
Grief.
So yeah, I absolutely had torely on my spirituality.
I prayed a lot.
I screamed at God a lot.
I screamed, cried at God a lot.
Um, I don't think I was reallymeditating at that time, to be
(26:55):
honest, but I was, I did do alot of prayer and leaned on my
community, you know, leaned on.
I didn't have a queer communityat the time, but I've, you know,
sober community and leaned onthem.
I think community is extremelyspiritual, extremely.
Do you feel that you have soughta partner who is, is spiritually
similar to you at all?
(27:15):
Mm, no.
Really?
Yeah.
My, I, I've actually always hadpartners with a religious
trauma.
Really every partner I've everhad.
Yeah.
I didn't know that.
Yeah.
So my, my current partner has alot of religious trauma Jay grew
up Southern Baptist, which isvery different from how I grew
up, so.
Mm-hmm.
And they're gay, they're queer.
(27:36):
Do they have any resistance toyou praying to God at all?
No.
No.
Like does, okay.
No, no, no.
They have zero.
They don't have any qualms.
And I pray at night, like Ipray, like before.
Not always, but I'll just sit inbed and whisper.
Like while we're both layingthere, like with our eyes closed
and I'm like, God, thank youfor, and my, my prayer to God at
night is always like a, just agratitude list.
(27:57):
Mm-hmm.
Oh, just like a thank you.
Is it always out loud?
Yes.
It is always out loud.
Okay.
Always out loud.
I realized recently that I have,I mean I feel like for all of
it, for me can really easilybecome a form of control and
prayer can be because then it'slike I say the same prayer at
the same time and I feel like ifI don't say it, something bad
might happen.
It almost feels like.
Superstitious.
(28:18):
Mm-hmm.
Um, but yeah, I've recently beentrying to, instead of praying
the same prayer, just like kindof have a conversation with my
spirit guides.
But yeah, I don't know.
I don't know why I feel thatpressure.
I mean, I'm sure it's some sortof learned ingrained system in
me.
I, I'm very curious and, and Ithink this question for both of
(28:41):
you, is there a formality to itin any way I think it's elusive
for me now.
I mean, I think it's interestingyou said that you kind of try
not to think about it too hardbecause for me, I feel like I
believe in God, I believe in theuniverse.
I believe in spirit gods.
I think they're all probably thesame thing.
I don't really quite know theparticulars about.
Mm-hmm.
What is happening when or withwho or who I'm talking to more
(29:02):
You know, like it feels like ifyou're talking to one thing,
you're talking to all of it., Ithink I would probably say that
it's all the same thing.
Like all the religions, all thespirit, like it's all about just
making our lives better.
But yeah, I think it's startingto feel less formal, but I think
there's part of it, like we weretalking about with the cards,
the Oracle cards, that there waspart of me that felt like.
(29:24):
Some sort of voodoo witchcraft,like our evil spirit's gonna
come in, we ingest all thisinformation, from the media and
our families and our lives andour partners and whatever that,
I think it's like you don't evenquite know why you believe the
things you believe until youreally like take a look at them.
So I've never had formality toit.
Okay.
Because I had never prayed.
Mm-hmm.
Um, I mean, I say the SerenityPrayer because, which is.
(29:49):
God, grant me the serenity toaccept the things I cannot
change, the courage to changethe things I can and wisdom to
know the difference.
Mm-hmm.
But that's like a sober thing.
Um, and so I just say it becauseit's something I memorized and
now it's just easy to say outloud.
Yeah, yeah.
But I, I, it's never, yeah, it'sno formality whatsoever.
Yeah.
I guess, yeah, I think this cameup when you said you were like
(30:10):
screaming at God.
Yeah.
And I was like, oh, I wonder howYeah.
That's changed in like, is thatconsidered prayer still?
Oh, absolutely.
You know what I mean?
So that's, that was just curiousabout that.
Yeah.
I only started praying when Igot sober.
Because they, everyone was like,you have to pray.
And I was like, that's dumb.
Yes.
Right.
But I just like still did itbecause I really needed and
wanted to be sober.
(30:31):
And they were like, this is oneof the ways you stay sober.
And I was like, okay.
And the, the, what I learned wasAnything, you can say anything.
It could be a prayer, like justtalk to God.
Just open this line ofcommunication.
And like meditation.
I like to think of it as,meditation is listening to God
and prayer is talking to God.
Um, oh, but I, but I also, Idon't think about it that
(30:53):
strict.
Yeah.
I just started talking to Godand then like, you know.
Yeah.
So of course, yeah.
It's evolved.
Yeah.
When you meditate, you said youdo five minute meditations?
Mostly.
Mostly, yeah.
Is it guided or silent?
Um, usually silent.
Okay.
Usually silent.
Yeah.
I'll do guided sometimes if Ireally feel like I'm feeling
(31:14):
sticky or kinda mm-hmm.
In a difficult spot, but usuallysilent.
And part of my meditationpractice right now is just like.
Anything Is meditation similarto like anything is prayer,
Anything that comes up is stillmeditation.
So like, yes, I sit, I sitstill.
Sometimes I like stretch alittle.
I like move my neck around andI'm like, yeah, that's fine.
That's still meditation.
Sometimes I think about anentire list of what I have to do
(31:37):
for the day and I'm like, that'sfine.
That's still meditation.
Sometimes I like amazing andfeel zen and breathe, but I
don't think, um, I tried tobring as little judgment to it.
Mm.
Chew it as possible.
Do you feel like God speaks toyou during that with the
meditation is for listening?
Mm.
Um, sometimes, but not nothinglike quite always clear.
(31:59):
I mean, if it is, it's like slowdown, breathe, it's okay.
Mm-hmm.
That kind of stuff.
But I never hear like a, youknow, Moses voice come down and.
Tell'em, or, or spirit guide Ishould say.
Have you ever slipped into likea really deep meditation?
Um, no, because I fall asleep.
(32:22):
That is the form.
The highest.
Yeah.
That's the highest, yeah.
Whenever like Ari and I will goto yoga or do something air's
like sound baths, sound bathair's.
Like, I think you should thinkabout this specific thing while
you're in meditation.
Yeah.
I'm like, okay, I'm good.
Give it a go.
And then I, I don't think aboutit or I fall asleep.
Yeah.
Or I forget to.
I think that's fine.
I mean, I think part of it'sjust like, I think my life has
(32:44):
to be compartmentalized in someways with this phase of my life
with two little kids.
You know what I mean?
Yeah.
So like the time for me to thinkabout those things is.
That makes sense.
Oh, yeah.
But yeah, the sound bath, Islipped into a deep meditation.
It's only happened a coupletimes, but it's, it feels like
there's, I guess it's like theconscious and the subconscious,
it feels like I am underneathmyself, but I'm still awake.
(33:05):
Cool.
Oh, underneath, not above.
Yeah.
Cool.
It feels like my, like I am notsleeping.
But like I can kind of feelmyself here, laying down and
then I'm like underneathreceiving the information.
Cool.
That's cool.
Yeah.
I think we should try'cause wehave to choose one of your
practices.
I mean for, I, we can discuss,but I feel like meditating in
(33:28):
silence, I never do, I like thefive minutes of it all because I
feel like that is not tooimpeding on my life with two
small children.
But what, right now, what I'vebeen doing is meditating with
like this kind of meditatedmusic, just so I cannot hear the
children in the background.
But I would like to trymeditating in absolute silence
for ness to see.
(33:49):
If that changes things.
What do you think?
I, I, I've done that a lot insilence.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And the five minute bit.
So if you wanna take that.
Okay.
Do you wanna take something elseor?
I think I wanna take the water.
Going to the water.
I've been craving the watersince you said water.
Okay.
I was like.
How often do you surf?
Yeah.
How often do you go to thewater?
(34:09):
Uh, I try to go once or twice aweek.
Okay.
Twice a week.
Okay.
So for two weeks you'll go twicea week to the water.
Okay.
And I will meditate in silencefor five minutes Oh, I'm so
excited.
Good.
Is there anything you wanna plugor.
Any cause that you feel calledto tell us about, that you
(34:31):
donate your time or money orvolunteer at support trans
youth.
Okay.
Yes.
Love that.
I love that.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Trans and, and everyone who'strans.
Yeah.
Just give'em trans people.
Yeah.
Give them your money.
Give'em your time.
Give'em your, your love.
You know, stand up for them.
(34:52):
Mm-hmm.
Um.
Amen.
Listen to them.
Well, thank you so much forbeing here.
Yay.
I love you.
I love you guys.
This was really nice.
You guys are so smart.
Thank you for listening.
Yes, we call it boda.
Thanks for listening in Todaboda Spiritual Practices of the
Disgruntled Artist.
We'll see you next time andwe'll inform you how our, our
practices of the water.
(35:14):
Yes, I'm excited to listen.
Silent meditation.
Go.
Cool.
Yay.
Thanks Kate.
We love you.
Thank you so much.
Thank you.
Love you guys.
Spoa forever.
Popular Podcasts
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.