November 26, 2024 • 37 mins
Christina Poehlitz, an international policy advisor at Arnold & Porter Kaye Scholar LLP, helps us demystify the world of lobbying. Christina redefines lobbying as advocacy at its core—helping individuals and organizations navigate the intricate political and policy landscape of Washington, D.C. She highlights the critical role of amplifying constituents’ voices and strategically communicating their priorities to policymakers. Christina also shares practical insights into the timing of advocacy efforts, the workings of the congressional calendar, and how to make meetings impactful. This conversation is an eye-opening guide to understanding the importance of advocacy in shaping meaningful policy change.
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Guest Info:
Christina Poehlitz, International Policy Advisor
Arnold & Porter Kaye Scholar LLP
Website: https://www.arnoldporter.com/en/people/p/poehlitz-christina
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/christina-poehlitz-a3380b157/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Music
(00:27):
And we are back with the advocate next door.
Music
I am Kelby Baleno.
Music
Today I'm without a co-host.
Music
But we're going to make up for it because today I have very special guests with us.
Music
Today I have a, actually she was a former colleague of mine, Christina Pulitz.
(00:49):
Welcome Christina to the show.
Thank you.
I'm so excited to be here.
I love the music.
I feel like I'm about to break out into dance.
That was the purpose.
You do have a karaoke background, is that right?
Oh my gosh.
Don't even bring that up.
Every once in a while someone from my past life brings up my stars board rendition and
(01:09):
I'm like, oh my god.
It was legendary.
It was legendary.
I think the Spine Museum still talks about it to this day.
Stop.
So thank you very much for coming down to the show.
So to introduce you, you are currently working at Arnold & Porter and you are not an attorney,
but you are working in the legal field and you are working in the area of lobbying.
(01:30):
That's correct.
Is it more expensive than that or is it just generally just lobbying?
I think it's so much more than just lobbying.
I mean, for me, it's really about strategic advice and having an understanding of what's
going on in Washington and around the world and just really trying to help our clients
understand the political dynamics, the policy that's changing and how do our clients
(01:55):
fit into that world and how can we help them and their business and help policymakers understand
how their decisions that they make impact their business as well.
That's fascinating because working in Washington, DC, you grew up in Miami.
No, no.
Florida?
So my parents were diplomats.
(02:16):
Well, my dad was, but and I grew up moving all around the world.
I was born in Bonn, Germany and then moved countries every two to three years.
But my dad retired when I was in 11th grade and then I moved to Florida in Tampa, which
is the new Miami.
So not too far off.
But yeah, I spent most of my life living outside of the United States and moved to Washington
(02:40):
for college.
I've been here about 10 years.
Going to college and living in Tampa was the dream to be in the lobbying field?
No.
You were a non-attorney?
No, I had no idea what lobbying was.
I just growing up outside of the US, I was just fascinated with how the US interacted
(03:01):
with other countries and just being in very different, I lived in Latin America, I lived
in Europe.
How those countries perceive the United States was always really interesting to me.
So I wanted to be in the international affairs, foreign policy field.
I saw my dad in the work that he did through the perspective of the US government.
(03:23):
I always grew up thinking I was going to do the same.
And then I went to college here in DC and everyone in DC was like, oh, you have to be
in Hill Turn.
I was like, what is that?
A Hill Turn?
A Hill Turn.
Okay.
I've never heard that.
Really?
Yeah.
So it's an intern that interns on Capitol Hill.
(03:43):
And I was like, what is that?
It wasn't short enough?
Yeah, Hill Turn.
So I was like, okay, well, I guess I got to do that too.
And I remember at that time, the midterm elections were happening and everyone around me, all
of my friends were so fascinated by that.
We were in the lounge and in Florida, I mean, nothing against it, but you go to restaurants
(04:05):
and bars and the news is never playing on TV, at least not back then.
It was always sports or something else of entertainment, but everyone was watching C-SPAN
and watching the elections.
I was like, can someone explain this to me?
I just moved to this country a few years ago.
I don't understand what's going on.
People were more than happy to mansplain or explain it to me.
(04:29):
And there are actually certain bars that play one channel versus another channel.
So you'd have to also know which bar or which place to go to.
Yeah, absolutely.
So they explained everything to do with US politics, which to be honest, living my life
mostly outside the US, it's not something that I really paid attention to growing up.
And so I did my first internship, my first hillturnship for a Florida representative
(04:53):
who's also Cuban-American.
So I was getting that perspective of what was happening in the world at that time with
Latin America and the Caribbean and still kind of getting that perspective from the
congressional side.
I was so, I mean, my eyes really opened up to how Congress can play a role in foreign
policy and I just, I really, really enjoyed that.
(05:13):
But my dream was still to hopefully one day work at the State Department.
So my senior year, I did an internship at the US embassy in Bolivia and I loved it.
It was amazing.
But I just felt that at that point in my life, I spent so much time abroad.
And for the first time I was alone by myself away from my family and my friends for about
(05:38):
four months and I was just like, I don't know if I can do this.
And also I think I was a little too young for the foreign service exam and I was really,
really lost.
How old do you have to be for that?
I mean, it's not like there's an age, but I think, you know, speaking to my mentors
there, they kind of encouraged me to either go to grad school or to have a job a little
(06:00):
bit more experienced before going into the exam because it's a very difficult exam.
So that internship with the State Department was my senior year.
So I took the semester off my first semester and I did that and I came back.
I was like, wait, I'm so lost.
What am I going to do?
I was like, I don't know if I want to do this.
I've spent my whole life moving and I thought that's all I knew.
(06:22):
So I was like, that's just what I thought would continue.
And then I was like, maybe I should stay put for a little bit, but I have no, literally
no idea what I'm going to do.
Maybe one of my friends was looking for jobs or either had jobs and I was so lost at that
point.
But at the time, you probably didn't realize that you were gaining knowledge, except right
now you just didn't know how to use that knowledge.
(06:44):
100%.
Right.
Because a lot of people might live in just one area.
Like you said, if maybe they grew up born and raised in one town, that's all they know.
They don't know what it's like when you're living in Bolivia or living in DC or other
places.
So that's fascinating.
So what happened after college, you went to American.
Yes, I did.
I went to American University.
Yes, I graduated and I was like, I got a little bit of graduation money and I was like, I'm
(07:09):
just going to apply to different jobs, hopefully in the foreign affairs field and figure it
out.
I was thinking about consulting.
I mean, that's a big thing in DC that people do that I still don't fully understand what
consulting is.
I need a consultant to tell me what a consultant does.
Yeah, that's probably why I didn't get any of those jobs.
Because I didn't know what they do.
I still don't.
(07:29):
But I was like, I was just kind of seeing what my friends were doing.
But at that point too, I was like, I don't really know if I want to go into the congressional
field.
So I was exploring different things.
All of my internship experiences had been in government and I worked with my career
counselor who I still speak to this day and he connected me with you.
And he was like, David, I think.
(07:51):
Yes, David.
He's amazing.
Anyone at American University, if you're lost or your resume needs serious help like mine
did, he is a genius.
He's amazing.
So yeah, so I connected with David and he really helped me out.
He put me in touch with you and he was like, well, you never said you were interested in
the law firm, but talk to Kelby.
(08:11):
He works with foreign governments.
I was like, okay, I mean, sure.
I literally never until he connected me with you, never one day that I think I would end
up at a law firm.
I never thought I would, every one of my friends I were pre-law, I was like, you're crazy.
I would never, ever do that.
So you've never wanted to be a lawyer?
(08:32):
No, never.
Okay.
Never, never crossed my mind.
Yeah.
You want to work in policy.
I mean, people who deal with policy, write policy, many of them are lawyers.
No, they're not.
They're not.
No?
I mean, if you go to the Hill, the people that are writing these laws and policies,
yes, a lot of them are lawyers, but a lot of them are people, young 20s coming out of
(08:55):
undergrad, a lot of legislative assistants, they're not lawyers and they're writing these
bills.
That's fascinating.
Did you expect that?
No, absolutely not.
And that's why a lot of lobbyists or people like me, they are younger in their 20s.
But yeah, that's part of the reason why a lot of advocates are young because you want
to be able to connect with the people that are helping write these laws.
(09:18):
That's inspiring because there are a lot of people who are young, yet they don't know
how to get involved.
Yeah.
And this is one area that you can get involved.
You don't have to be an old fart like me.
You can actually get involved and help with policy and not have to be an attorney.
You get to be a step.
You could be like, I've seen advocates and families make a really big difference.
(09:41):
I've seen people lobby on the Hill that are in high school or even younger than that.
There's not an age too young where you can make a difference in policy.
And that's so inspiring.
My first internship was on the Hill.
There is an insane amount of internships.
Think about it.
There's 535 representatives and senators.
That's an amazing number.
(10:03):
I'm really nervous and maybe that's wrong.
I need you to cut that out if that's wrong.
But there's at least 500 representatives who have openings for internships and people come
from all over the United States to have an opportunity to do that.
I think it's great.
I've had people on the show who actually interned and they said it was heartbreaking because
(10:26):
they would talk to constituents all the time.
They would deal with certain matters and just didn't end up being for them.
Did you ever have that kind of same issue where there's a lot of policies or a lot of
frustrations with policy?
Yeah.
I think if policy is very frustrating, that's never going to change.
And I think right now it was a little bit different when I interned, but the political
(10:47):
margins are so slim.
It's really hard to get anything done.
And I think every internship is different.
I'm not going to sit here and say that I learned everything I wanted to learn.
I'm telling you, I had no idea what I was walking into.
But seeing the process from the inside, it's deliberately made to be very slow.
(11:07):
But I think that's good in a sense because it's like, do you really want to swing the
pendulum that fast?
It could have an enormous amount of effects on businesses and on people's lives that unless
you have the chance to hear from them and hear from your constituents, you're not going
to be able to fully develop your position unless things move slowly.
But yeah, I mean, it is frustrating and it can be very disheartening at times.
(11:31):
So jumping then, I would call it now a pause in your career.
Now you're doing paralegal work at a law firm.
Oh, it's not a pause.
Don't say that.
I'm grateful every day for that experience.
Why?
What did you end up learning?
Somebody who hasn't worked at a law firm, what did you end up learning there that is
(11:52):
helping you now in the lobbying area?
Yeah, legal assistant, paralegals, what is that?
I remember you came in and taught us so much going through these thousands of exhibits.
I think it really taught me the importance and attention that you need to pay to detail.
Anyone that works in the legal field, you have to be good at that.
(12:12):
I mean, one simple mistake, it can cause a huge, huge, tremendous waterfall of effects
if you're not paying close attention and you never know what the opposing counselor or
what the other side is paying attention to.
I think that was really, really helpful.
And I think, just on a personal note, it taught me how to act and how to be in a professional
(12:35):
manner.
I think that's something that COVID had a really big effect on people.
How do you navigate and how do you act in a professional setting?
I'm very different when I'm with my friends and when I'm with my client, there's a rapport
that you need to learn to develop.
That was extremely helpful to me.
I traveled a lot working in teams.
(12:56):
That was a huge, huge part of my development.
I have friends that don't really work in team-based groups and it's definitely an art.
Learning how to work with different personalities is very important.
And I think if you can learn how to work with different personalities and different people,
that will definitely lead you to success.
(13:18):
So working in a law firm, you're working in teams.
Is it the same in lobbying or maybe working on the Hill where you're working long hours,
late nights, things like that?
It's not as many late nights.
I will always say to my teams now, I'm like, you guys, you don't even have any idea.
I mean, at least with arbitration, I will say, I think in arbitration, you did have
(13:41):
the benefit of it's cyclical.
You know when you have a filing, when you have a hearing that you're going to be working
really late times.
But when things are slower, you can actually have a day of rest and get some sleep, but
you'll know those weeks.
But when you're working with Congress, you're kind of at the disposal of their schedule.
(14:03):
But it's not like you're pulling an all-nighter to submit a brief.
It's not like that.
And once you were working as a paralegal there at Arnold Porter, then the opportunity came
in the legislative group.
I'm not a lawyer yet.
You're going to accept my help in this group.
(14:23):
What did you do initially?
Yeah, I think COVID was a big factor for me.
And I think it's important to acknowledge that.
I feel like I was in the job maybe around two years.
When COVID hit, I went back to Florida.
Everything was virtual.
And I just really started to think about what I wanted to do next.
Because I thought back to my internship experiences and I thought back as to the reason why I
(14:46):
came to DC, which is to work in international affairs and foreign policy.
But like I said, I only had the experience from the government side.
So I was like, oh, it would be interesting to look at and see how I can have an impact
from the other side of things.
And I thought looking within the firm was the first place to start.
When it comes to not being a lawyer, I did not really understand or appreciate that a
(15:09):
lot of lobbyists are not lawyers.
And you can be really, really successful in not being a lawyer.
And for a variety of reasons, I just did not have an interest in going to law school.
So I thought that this was a really interesting avenue to explore.
For somebody who's a student, what would you suggest for them to get into this field?
You said something about attention to detail.
(15:29):
Anything else other than, I guess, you just don't accept knowing for an answer?
Or is it just a lot of strategy?
No, I think DC is one of those places.
And I think people usually say this as a negative.
It's a relationship based town.
And I do, I really do understand why that's a negative in many ways.
But in a lot of other ways, it's actually a huge positive.
(15:51):
Like I don't, I mean, I've only lived in DC in my professional life, so I don't know.
But how many places can you go where you can just email someone and ask for coffee?
Maybe that's something that you could do in any city.
But I've never been really turned down for coffee.
I mean, sometimes people don't answer.
But for the most part, people are very willing to sit with you and help you.
(16:12):
And maybe it's like a selfish thing because they know, like you never know where someone's
going to end up.
But I've cold emailed, cold linked in so many people, asking them to meet, doing what you
do, which I think is so great, but just trying to learn how they got to where they were and
tried to see everyone got here in a different way and taking their advice and people have
(16:36):
been so helpful in connecting me with other people.
I mean, maybe it's not like they have a job opening, but just learning the experiences
that they had, where they worked, who I should talk to, what publications I should be reading.
I think that that was so helpful, just get and meet with your professors.
Professors have always been very willing to help me and connect me with their network
(16:57):
as well.
So definitely take advantage of your friends.
And if you have an internship, making sure that you're connecting with people on a personal
level is so important because people want to help people that they like.
When you were in school, did anyone tell you this today?
When he say this is the way you would network, this is how you would meet people or go to
(17:19):
events or things like that.
Is that just something you had to learn on your own?
Networking is so funny, that word.
I feel so many different ways about it, even though I just said the exact opposite, but
networking is hard and it's awkward.
And I think it's important to acknowledge that because if you're by yourself, it is
intimidating to walk into a room if you don't know anyone.
(17:43):
And I do that all the time.
I've been here in DC 10 years and I walk into rooms where I don't know anyone all the time.
I'm still intimidated.
I'm still scared.
But I think what I love about DC is that people usually are very open to you coming in and
being like, hey, can I join your group?
I've never had anyone say no.
I mean, that would be crazy.
(18:05):
Who's going to go to a networking event and be rude?
That defeats the entire purpose.
Everyone's there for the same reason.
You come in with an understanding that you're interested in some of the same things.
And there's a lot of people at networking events that also come by themselves and they
also want to come and they want to meet people.
Everyone's there for different reasons.
(18:25):
But yeah, I mean, it's hard and it can be really awkward in DC.
I think that's probably why DC is known as a happy hour town because we do so much networking
and so awkward.
But no, I don't remember ever having a class.
I think if I had any advice, it's just stick by the food table.
No, I'm joking.
By the food table?
(18:46):
Yeah.
No, I know.
But I mean, just go up to a group of people who you think look somewhat friendly and just
say, hey, can I join your group?
What are you guys talking about?
Or what brought you to this event today?
And just start from there.
And I think you'll always meet at least one person that will be willing to speak to you.
(19:07):
It sounded like you put it into almost two categories.
And I don't know if you did this intentionally, but one of them is that one-on-one cold coffee.
You want to just talk to somebody.
And I think that one's fairly easy because you get that interaction.
You know what you're there for and you can actually just have a one-on-one conversation.
Whereas networking and you're just in a group of 100 trying to figure out what do you do?
(19:30):
What do you come from?
Are there any tips when you're trying to sell yourself or sell a service or casually just
get to know people?
I always like to ask people about themselves.
People love to talk about themselves.
And I think that's the easiest thing to talk about.
If you just keep asking someone about them and their career, it comes very easy to them.
(19:50):
And then hopefully eventually they ask you one question.
But I think that's a really great way.
And I think as a woman, I prefer to speak to other women.
It's just more comfortable for me.
That's great advice though.
I think that's really great advice.
People like to talk about themselves all the time.
I agree.
It's a very easy way to get people to open up.
But I think speaking to women similar to your age can be very helpful because more likely
(20:13):
than not they're feeling the same way as you do.
And they're probably feeling very grateful that you're speaking to them.
But I mean, even if you don't, let's say you're going to a panel event, even if you didn't
speak to the person who was speaking during the panel, just try to get their contact info
and be like, hey, I really like what you said during this event on this date about this
(20:34):
topic.
If you'd have time, I'd love to grab coffee and talk to you a little bit more about your
experience.
That's really great.
I mean, I think for me, as a person who's been on panels before, if I get that message,
I feel like at least it was worth it.
Because a lot of times I'm like, I feel like maybe I'm talking to the air.
I don't know if I'm reaching anyone, if anyone's really interested in this topic.
It really sucks to be on a panel and then you're done and there was nothing.
(20:58):
And I feel like previously I was saying like every person I reach out to wants to help
me.
No, that's not the case.
And maybe I did not explain that correctly.
But for the most part, I really feel like DC professionals are interested in exciting
to try to help young professionals grow.
Because at the end of the day, we're all here because I think everyone in DC wants to change
(21:20):
the world and at least that's why they come.
But we're all here because we are passionate about policy or about our careers and about
our jobs or just about the city.
And there are so many things that you can find that you have in common with someone
else.
I think for the most part, if you send out 10 emails, if you get one or two back, I think
it's worth it.
(21:40):
I'm curious about the kind of work that you end up doing because I don't know if there's
someone out there who might be inspired by this and thinking, oh, I'd love to do that.
I'd like to be part of the change, but I don't want to go to law school.
So what is it that you end up doing?
What does lobbying really mean?
Are you just giving somebody a briefcase of money and just saying, please vote my way?
(22:02):
Or is it more about that?
Yeah, that's such a great point and great question.
Lobbying is such a dirty word.
I mean, I think in DC, it's still maybe a little bit less, but I'm hesitant to go back
home and tell people I'm a lobbyist.
Like first, it sounds so pretentious.
It sounded great when you said you're advocating for people.
Yes.
(22:23):
I mean, at the end of the day, it's advocacy work.
I've only been in this field for the last five, six years and then in the policy game
for about three.
And it's truly advocacy work.
What you're doing is you're taking a group or a business or even maybe a person and you're
helping them understand the political and policy landscape that's in DC.
(22:44):
And you're helping them understand how their voice and their experience, how it fits into
that.
And DC is very intimidating, especially if you don't live here or even in college, how
I said, I didn't really understand DC and Washington politics.
And it's very intimidating.
(23:05):
Going into that, there's always going to be people that know more than you and that's
okay.
I think that it's so important that we as advocates are able to explain how the process
works to people so that you can come and tell your story and make a difference.
Every single representative, their job, regardless of what anyone says, their most important
(23:31):
job and what they prioritize the most is the voice of their constituent because that's
how they get reelected.
That's because that's why they spent so much time at home.
And I get that people say like, oh, they only work X amount of days because they want to
go back home on vacation.
No, these people, they want to be back home because they want to connect with you as a
constituent.
(23:52):
That is extremely powerful.
You should be able to go to DC, get a meeting with their staff.
You should be able to explain your perspective and they will listen to you.
They will listen to you way more than they'll ever listen to me.
So my job is just hearing them, helping them put that in terms that they'll easily understand
(24:15):
and also helping them understand even just the small things.
No meeting in DC with your representative is going to be longer than 30 minutes unless
you know something I don't.
Yeah.
I usually don't give meetings more than 30 minutes either.
Or just helping them explain, helping people understand the congressional calendar.
(24:36):
What days are your members or representatives actually going to be in DC?
What days are they going to be in your district?
What issues are they focusing on this week?
Are they going to pass a budget this week?
Maybe that's not the best week to come in and have you explain your position.
But yeah, lobbying is really just, I think, helping people explain their position to their
(25:00):
representatives.
And because your window is so small, that's where you come in and you basically put everything
in one package so you can present effectively, efficiently, all in one package so that you
make use of every minute that you get with those representatives.
Yeah.
I mean, you're talking about a 30 minute meeting and this could be on a variety of subjects.
(25:21):
Like it could be someone's entire life.
It could be on the topic of hazing.
It could be parents who have lost their children who they worked really hard to be able to
save enough money to send their kids to school and maybe they passed away in a hazing incident
and you're trying to be able to communicate that message in a matter of minutes.
(25:43):
That's really difficult.
But how can we package your experience and what you're asking Congress to do in a very
short limited amount of time with a staffer who's dealing with a thousand issues on a
daily basis?
How can we best communicate that message and tailor in a way that also coincides with their
interests?
Because members always are going to have different priorities, but your message is the same,
(26:08):
but how can we tailor that so that there are certain words or certain phrases that you
can say that could kind of appeal to them a little bit more?
That makes a lot of sense because if I was going through some tragedy or I was really
pushing some agenda and I was really passionate about it, I can totally see myself just talking
and talking about it and not really getting to the point or not appealing to what that
(26:31):
person is hearing.
So someone like you who comes in and will help me package that to deliver the best message
possible.
I think lobbying has changed a lot in the last, I don't know, since the smoke filled rooms
last 100 years and rightfully so lobbying has been very regulated.
(26:52):
You have to disclose everything, which I think is a great thing.
Everyone should, I mean, you could look up.
Like what's being said or what?
No, not exactly what's being said, but you could look up any corporation and see who
their lobbyists are and see the topics that they're discussing.
You're not going to have a transcript of every conversation or every meeting that you've
had.
But a general idea before you would know nothing.
(27:14):
You wouldn't know who the lobbyists was.
Yeah.
Or before you could theoretically push someone in a direction if you have the money.
But now I'm just speaking from my experience.
The constituents perspective is always way more important than a blank check that a lobbyist
is going to write because that's what's going to get them reelected.
And also there are a lot of members that won't take meetings with a lobbyist.
(27:38):
You have to have a constituent present.
The money should not be what's speaking.
It should be about the policy perspective.
That's great.
That's great to hear because hopefully that inspires other people to get into this area.
Yeah.
I mean, I'm on the Hill multiple times a week when we're in session and you see all types
of groups in there.
High school students, big corporations.
You could see literally families there.
(28:01):
It's the people's house.
You should be able to go in and communicate your perspective because I mean, so many people
are so turned off by politics and rightfully so, but they're there because they're elected
to be there.
They're entitled to you.
If it wasn't for you, they wouldn't be there.
You have every right.
Those doors are open.
I remember in college, I literally knew nothing.
(28:22):
I was like, oh, do you need an appointment to go in?
Those doors are open.
That's your home.
So I think it's really important that people know that.
And it is very intimidating, but they do want to hear from you and they really value your
opinion.
I mean, for the most part, I do think and staff too, they are there.
Some of them hopefully are there for the right reasons.
They want to better the lives of all Americans and they're dedicating a lot of their life
(28:47):
and previously the salaries were so bad, but they were there for a reason.
They're not, I mean, at least on the staff level, they're not there for the money.
Occasionally I would go to congressional hearings and never realized that you can just go in.
Yeah.
And you sit in, if it's public and most of them are, you sit in and you can listen on
many topics and the rooms are semi empty.
(29:08):
So there's a lot of space for people to come in.
And as a lobbyist, I guess you make it more effective, but at one point we're talking
about being a woman in this industry, is it diverse or is it difficult to get in?
From my experience, my crew at my firm, we're mostly women and I'm so, so beyond grateful
(29:28):
for that.
That's great.
Yeah.
I can't speak for personal offices or committee offices, but I rarely am in a room with my
colleagues or on the Hill with just men.
I think that's great.
That's really great.
Yeah.
That sounds great.
Is there anything that you see will improve the lobbying field?
(29:48):
Like to actually have a voice, is AI going to be some way of being able to connect better
with other people, pass on information or is it just always going to be a person, personal
area or field?
I think there's so much that AI can do for our industry.
When I first started, a lot of my job was tracking what's happening in Congress and
(30:14):
different policies and how that's going to affect my clients' businesses.
Or just like you said, watching a hearing and digesting that information and being able
to package that up to a client so that they know what's being said and what positions
are being taken or if their name was mentioned.
AI being able to transcribe a hearing that quickly can be very, very, very helpful.
(30:37):
But I do think that AI could never take away from this industry is really building relationships.
It's so important to have those relationships with policymakers and congressional committees.
The legal field is probably one of the slower industries that wants to adopt AI.
(30:57):
But I hope at least that relationships are really important and people's experiences
and knowledges are really, really important.
I don't know how AI would help someone go into a meeting and tell their story.
I think it could help with the preparation.
It could help with the monitoring and tracking.
But no, I don't think anything can take away from a one-on-one conversation between two
(31:20):
people.
Politics and issues are just a part of life and a part of us.
But is there anything that you do to de-stress, get away from this area?
Because you did say that you are a different person at work and then with your friends.
Yeah.
Besides karaoke, I guess.
Oh, no.
Oh my gosh.
(31:41):
I think it is hard to get away.
I mean, I'm just being honest.
I think there's always something going on.
There's always more that you can read.
There's always someone saying something that you should be aware of and blah, blah, blah.
It is hard to get away.
I guess it makes it a case for traveling maybe.
Maybe that's literally getting away.
(32:01):
Yeah.
I mean, even still then, you tell anyone abroad you're an American, they want to talk to you
about politics.
Oh, really?
Wow.
I think having a little bit of a disconnect, not a little bit, having a disconnect is very
important or else you're going to burn out.
Because this is a very intense world where you feel like sometimes you feel like you're
always a little bit behind.
(32:23):
I think everyone feels that way.
But yeah, I try.
Exercise is something that I'm trying to prioritize a little bit more.
Something like cooking forces me to stay off my electronics.
And also, I think communicating with your team is really important because people I
work with have kids and they have to leave during the middle of the day to pick up their
(32:44):
kids at daycare.
So I know that maybe from the hours of three to four, they're going to be unavailable and
that's their time that they should have with their kids.
And they come back online, let's say at eight or nine PM after their kids are back to bed
and I'm getting emails at those times when I've already worked from, let's say eight
to six straight and that's my time to decompress and have dinner.
(33:07):
So you can feel a little bit stressed when people are on different schedules.
I think communicating and sometimes people don't even know that they're stressing you
out when they're sending you an email.
Communicating with your team and being like, hey, I'm going to this event today.
I'm not able to do this or I'm traveling this weekend for a wedding or whatever.
I'm disconnecting.
It's important.
(33:28):
And people, they need to understand that you need to get away a little bit.
I'll apologize to the audience, I know that there's a lot of ambulances and things going
on in this area, but that is the background and that is DC life.
That's the DC anthem, the national anthem.
The sirens.
That's true because it's not just the police, but there's always a diplomat or a motorcade.
(33:49):
If Biden or whoever the political candidates are going around, there's motorcades.
I will say one of my highlights of this year and this is my 10th year in DC, I rode in
my first motorcade.
Oh yeah.
And that was so cool.
That's great.
That was really awesome.
I was like, I feel cool, especially because we also picked up McDonald's.
(34:10):
In the motorcade?
Yeah.
Like just like going to the drive through.
No, I personally did not.
I think they put it in for lunch, but yeah, the guys, these diplomats and these high level
officials, they still eat McDonald's in their motorcade.
It was so cool.
Yeah.
Also, they did say Secret Service said that it really isn't that much faster and I don't
know if I believe them.
(34:30):
They said it just cuts down five minutes of travel time when you have the sirens on, but
I don't know about that.
I believe them because at some point I've gone behind them.
I don't know.
It was still cool.
Do you get to ride the Senate train a lot?
Oh, that is cool.
I really like that.
You have to have an escort for that, but that is really cool.
Oh, do you?
Okay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I loved it.
(34:51):
I thought it was great knowing that there's a whole little subway system underneath at
DC that's only for Congress.
Yeah.
If you guys are ever in a congressional meeting, ask them, can you take me on the subway?
Yeah.
They should say yes.
Yeah.
And one thing I thought was kind of funny is how clean it was.
Oh, yeah.
As opposed to Metro.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's funny.
(35:11):
Well, hopefully their students or anyone who's interested in this field will reach out to
you and ask for that coffee or something like that.
But very much appreciate you coming in and taking time to talk to me.
No, I can't thank you enough.
I think what you're doing is really great and the professional world is very intimidating.
And I don't think that's ever going to go away.
(35:32):
And I think speaking with you and other professionals, I've asked people the highest levels before
going into meetings.
I'm like, Hey, do you ever still get nervous?
Like, does this ever go away?
Yeah.
And they say, no, everyone feels the same way you do.
And that's kind of the imposter syndrome.
Yes.
I was fortunate enough to go to the Hispanic heritage awards last night and there was some
(35:53):
really, really great people, really important people who have done amazing things there.
And in a lot of their speeches, they all mentioned imposter syndrome.
And sorry, I'm going on another rant.
I know that you wanted to finish, but I think that's so important to remember.
Everyone feels nervous sometimes and that's okay.
(36:14):
And just start up a conversation with someone.
And even if five people are rude to you, which they probably won't be if they're at a networking
event, you'll find at least one person that wants to help.
But yeah, no, I can't thank you enough for doing this.
I think it's so important to hear different people's perspectives and just hearing their
background and how they got to the places that they did is really, really helpful.
(36:38):
So thank you so much.
Yeah.
It's a never ending journey of just learning from people because everybody has a different
experience.
And that's one of the reasons I asked you to come on the show is that you have a unique
journey.
And I think many others do as well.
And we all learn from that.
So thank you very much for coming on the show.
Thank you.
Help me largest 100 would like to thank you so much for the language and the focus you
Music
(00:27):
And we are back with the advocate next door.
Music
I am Kelby Baleno.
Music
Today I'm without a co-host.
Music
But we're going to make up for it because today I have very special guests with us.
Music
Today I have a, actually she was a former colleague of mine, Christina Pulitz.
(00:49):
Welcome Christina to the show.
Thank you.
I'm so excited to be here.
I love the music.
I feel like I'm about to break out into dance.
That was the purpose.
You do have a karaoke background, is that right?
Oh my gosh.
Don't even bring that up.
Every once in a while someone from my past life brings up my stars board rendition and
(01:09):
I'm like, oh my god.
It was legendary.
It was legendary.
I think the Spine Museum still talks about it to this day.
Stop.
So thank you very much for coming down to the show.
So to introduce you, you are currently working at Arnold & Porter and you are not an attorney,
but you are working in the legal field and you are working in the area of lobbying.
(01:30):
That's correct.
Is it more expensive than that or is it just generally just lobbying?
I think it's so much more than just lobbying.
I mean, for me, it's really about strategic advice and having an understanding of what's
going on in Washington and around the world and just really trying to help our clients
understand the political dynamics, the policy that's changing and how do our clients
(01:55):
fit into that world and how can we help them and their business and help policymakers understand
how their decisions that they make impact their business as well.
That's fascinating because working in Washington, DC, you grew up in Miami.
No, no.
Florida?
So my parents were diplomats.
(02:16):
Well, my dad was, but and I grew up moving all around the world.
I was born in Bonn, Germany and then moved countries every two to three years.
But my dad retired when I was in 11th grade and then I moved to Florida in Tampa, which
is the new Miami.
So not too far off.
But yeah, I spent most of my life living outside of the United States and moved to Washington
(02:40):
for college.
I've been here about 10 years.
Going to college and living in Tampa was the dream to be in the lobbying field?
No.
You were a non-attorney?
No, I had no idea what lobbying was.
I just growing up outside of the US, I was just fascinated with how the US interacted
(03:01):
with other countries and just being in very different, I lived in Latin America, I lived
in Europe.
How those countries perceive the United States was always really interesting to me.
So I wanted to be in the international affairs, foreign policy field.
I saw my dad in the work that he did through the perspective of the US government.
(03:23):
I always grew up thinking I was going to do the same.
And then I went to college here in DC and everyone in DC was like, oh, you have to be
in Hill Turn.
I was like, what is that?
A Hill Turn?
A Hill Turn.
Okay.
I've never heard that.
Really?
Yeah.
So it's an intern that interns on Capitol Hill.
(03:43):
And I was like, what is that?
It wasn't short enough?
Yeah, Hill Turn.
So I was like, okay, well, I guess I got to do that too.
And I remember at that time, the midterm elections were happening and everyone around me, all
of my friends were so fascinated by that.
We were in the lounge and in Florida, I mean, nothing against it, but you go to restaurants
(04:05):
and bars and the news is never playing on TV, at least not back then.
It was always sports or something else of entertainment, but everyone was watching C-SPAN
and watching the elections.
I was like, can someone explain this to me?
I just moved to this country a few years ago.
I don't understand what's going on.
People were more than happy to mansplain or explain it to me.
(04:29):
And there are actually certain bars that play one channel versus another channel.
So you'd have to also know which bar or which place to go to.
Yeah, absolutely.
So they explained everything to do with US politics, which to be honest, living my life
mostly outside the US, it's not something that I really paid attention to growing up.
And so I did my first internship, my first hillturnship for a Florida representative
(04:53):
who's also Cuban-American.
So I was getting that perspective of what was happening in the world at that time with
Latin America and the Caribbean and still kind of getting that perspective from the
congressional side.
I was so, I mean, my eyes really opened up to how Congress can play a role in foreign
policy and I just, I really, really enjoyed that.
(05:13):
But my dream was still to hopefully one day work at the State Department.
So my senior year, I did an internship at the US embassy in Bolivia and I loved it.
It was amazing.
But I just felt that at that point in my life, I spent so much time abroad.
And for the first time I was alone by myself away from my family and my friends for about
(05:38):
four months and I was just like, I don't know if I can do this.
And also I think I was a little too young for the foreign service exam and I was really,
really lost.
How old do you have to be for that?
I mean, it's not like there's an age, but I think, you know, speaking to my mentors
there, they kind of encouraged me to either go to grad school or to have a job a little
(06:00):
bit more experienced before going into the exam because it's a very difficult exam.
So that internship with the State Department was my senior year.
So I took the semester off my first semester and I did that and I came back.
I was like, wait, I'm so lost.
What am I going to do?
I was like, I don't know if I want to do this.
I've spent my whole life moving and I thought that's all I knew.
(06:22):
So I was like, that's just what I thought would continue.
And then I was like, maybe I should stay put for a little bit, but I have no, literally
no idea what I'm going to do.
Maybe one of my friends was looking for jobs or either had jobs and I was so lost at that
point.
But at the time, you probably didn't realize that you were gaining knowledge, except right
now you just didn't know how to use that knowledge.
(06:44):
100%.
Right.
Because a lot of people might live in just one area.
Like you said, if maybe they grew up born and raised in one town, that's all they know.
They don't know what it's like when you're living in Bolivia or living in DC or other
places.
So that's fascinating.
So what happened after college, you went to American.
Yes, I did.
I went to American University.
Yes, I graduated and I was like, I got a little bit of graduation money and I was like, I'm
(07:09):
just going to apply to different jobs, hopefully in the foreign affairs field and figure it
out.
I was thinking about consulting.
I mean, that's a big thing in DC that people do that I still don't fully understand what
consulting is.
I need a consultant to tell me what a consultant does.
Yeah, that's probably why I didn't get any of those jobs.
Because I didn't know what they do.
I still don't.
(07:29):
But I was like, I was just kind of seeing what my friends were doing.
But at that point too, I was like, I don't really know if I want to go into the congressional
field.
So I was exploring different things.
All of my internship experiences had been in government and I worked with my career
counselor who I still speak to this day and he connected me with you.
And he was like, David, I think.
(07:51):
Yes, David.
He's amazing.
Anyone at American University, if you're lost or your resume needs serious help like mine
did, he is a genius.
He's amazing.
So yeah, so I connected with David and he really helped me out.
He put me in touch with you and he was like, well, you never said you were interested in
the law firm, but talk to Kelby.
(08:11):
He works with foreign governments.
I was like, okay, I mean, sure.
I literally never until he connected me with you, never one day that I think I would end
up at a law firm.
I never thought I would, every one of my friends I were pre-law, I was like, you're crazy.
I would never, ever do that.
So you've never wanted to be a lawyer?
(08:32):
No, never.
Okay.
Never, never crossed my mind.
Yeah.
You want to work in policy.
I mean, people who deal with policy, write policy, many of them are lawyers.
No, they're not.
They're not.
No?
I mean, if you go to the Hill, the people that are writing these laws and policies,
yes, a lot of them are lawyers, but a lot of them are people, young 20s coming out of
(08:55):
undergrad, a lot of legislative assistants, they're not lawyers and they're writing these
bills.
That's fascinating.
Did you expect that?
No, absolutely not.
And that's why a lot of lobbyists or people like me, they are younger in their 20s.
But yeah, that's part of the reason why a lot of advocates are young because you want
to be able to connect with the people that are helping write these laws.
(09:18):
That's inspiring because there are a lot of people who are young, yet they don't know
how to get involved.
Yeah.
And this is one area that you can get involved.
You don't have to be an old fart like me.
You can actually get involved and help with policy and not have to be an attorney.
You get to be a step.
You could be like, I've seen advocates and families make a really big difference.
(09:41):
I've seen people lobby on the Hill that are in high school or even younger than that.
There's not an age too young where you can make a difference in policy.
And that's so inspiring.
My first internship was on the Hill.
There is an insane amount of internships.
Think about it.
There's 535 representatives and senators.
That's an amazing number.
(10:03):
I'm really nervous and maybe that's wrong.
I need you to cut that out if that's wrong.
But there's at least 500 representatives who have openings for internships and people come
from all over the United States to have an opportunity to do that.
I think it's great.
I've had people on the show who actually interned and they said it was heartbreaking because
(10:26):
they would talk to constituents all the time.
They would deal with certain matters and just didn't end up being for them.
Did you ever have that kind of same issue where there's a lot of policies or a lot of
frustrations with policy?
Yeah.
I think if policy is very frustrating, that's never going to change.
And I think right now it was a little bit different when I interned, but the political
(10:47):
margins are so slim.
It's really hard to get anything done.
And I think every internship is different.
I'm not going to sit here and say that I learned everything I wanted to learn.
I'm telling you, I had no idea what I was walking into.
But seeing the process from the inside, it's deliberately made to be very slow.
(11:07):
But I think that's good in a sense because it's like, do you really want to swing the
pendulum that fast?
It could have an enormous amount of effects on businesses and on people's lives that unless
you have the chance to hear from them and hear from your constituents, you're not going
to be able to fully develop your position unless things move slowly.
But yeah, I mean, it is frustrating and it can be very disheartening at times.
(11:31):
So jumping then, I would call it now a pause in your career.
Now you're doing paralegal work at a law firm.
Oh, it's not a pause.
Don't say that.
I'm grateful every day for that experience.
Why?
What did you end up learning?
Somebody who hasn't worked at a law firm, what did you end up learning there that is
(11:52):
helping you now in the lobbying area?
Yeah, legal assistant, paralegals, what is that?
I remember you came in and taught us so much going through these thousands of exhibits.
I think it really taught me the importance and attention that you need to pay to detail.
Anyone that works in the legal field, you have to be good at that.
(12:12):
I mean, one simple mistake, it can cause a huge, huge, tremendous waterfall of effects
if you're not paying close attention and you never know what the opposing counselor or
what the other side is paying attention to.
I think that was really, really helpful.
And I think, just on a personal note, it taught me how to act and how to be in a professional
(12:35):
manner.
I think that's something that COVID had a really big effect on people.
How do you navigate and how do you act in a professional setting?
I'm very different when I'm with my friends and when I'm with my client, there's a rapport
that you need to learn to develop.
That was extremely helpful to me.
I traveled a lot working in teams.
(12:56):
That was a huge, huge part of my development.
I have friends that don't really work in team-based groups and it's definitely an art.
Learning how to work with different personalities is very important.
And I think if you can learn how to work with different personalities and different people,
that will definitely lead you to success.
(13:18):
So working in a law firm, you're working in teams.
Is it the same in lobbying or maybe working on the Hill where you're working long hours,
late nights, things like that?
It's not as many late nights.
I will always say to my teams now, I'm like, you guys, you don't even have any idea.
I mean, at least with arbitration, I will say, I think in arbitration, you did have
(13:41):
the benefit of it's cyclical.
You know when you have a filing, when you have a hearing that you're going to be working
really late times.
But when things are slower, you can actually have a day of rest and get some sleep, but
you'll know those weeks.
But when you're working with Congress, you're kind of at the disposal of their schedule.
(14:03):
But it's not like you're pulling an all-nighter to submit a brief.
It's not like that.
And once you were working as a paralegal there at Arnold Porter, then the opportunity came
in the legislative group.
I'm not a lawyer yet.
You're going to accept my help in this group.
(14:23):
What did you do initially?
Yeah, I think COVID was a big factor for me.
And I think it's important to acknowledge that.
I feel like I was in the job maybe around two years.
When COVID hit, I went back to Florida.
Everything was virtual.
And I just really started to think about what I wanted to do next.
Because I thought back to my internship experiences and I thought back as to the reason why I
(14:46):
came to DC, which is to work in international affairs and foreign policy.
But like I said, I only had the experience from the government side.
So I was like, oh, it would be interesting to look at and see how I can have an impact
from the other side of things.
And I thought looking within the firm was the first place to start.
When it comes to not being a lawyer, I did not really understand or appreciate that a
(15:09):
lot of lobbyists are not lawyers.
And you can be really, really successful in not being a lawyer.
And for a variety of reasons, I just did not have an interest in going to law school.
So I thought that this was a really interesting avenue to explore.
For somebody who's a student, what would you suggest for them to get into this field?
You said something about attention to detail.
(15:29):
Anything else other than, I guess, you just don't accept knowing for an answer?
Or is it just a lot of strategy?
No, I think DC is one of those places.
And I think people usually say this as a negative.
It's a relationship based town.
And I do, I really do understand why that's a negative in many ways.
But in a lot of other ways, it's actually a huge positive.
(15:51):
Like I don't, I mean, I've only lived in DC in my professional life, so I don't know.
But how many places can you go where you can just email someone and ask for coffee?
Maybe that's something that you could do in any city.
But I've never been really turned down for coffee.
I mean, sometimes people don't answer.
But for the most part, people are very willing to sit with you and help you.
(16:12):
And maybe it's like a selfish thing because they know, like you never know where someone's
going to end up.
But I've cold emailed, cold linked in so many people, asking them to meet, doing what you
do, which I think is so great, but just trying to learn how they got to where they were and
tried to see everyone got here in a different way and taking their advice and people have
(16:36):
been so helpful in connecting me with other people.
I mean, maybe it's not like they have a job opening, but just learning the experiences
that they had, where they worked, who I should talk to, what publications I should be reading.
I think that that was so helpful, just get and meet with your professors.
Professors have always been very willing to help me and connect me with their network
(16:57):
as well.
So definitely take advantage of your friends.
And if you have an internship, making sure that you're connecting with people on a personal
level is so important because people want to help people that they like.
When you were in school, did anyone tell you this today?
When he say this is the way you would network, this is how you would meet people or go to
(17:19):
events or things like that.
Is that just something you had to learn on your own?
Networking is so funny, that word.
I feel so many different ways about it, even though I just said the exact opposite, but
networking is hard and it's awkward.
And I think it's important to acknowledge that because if you're by yourself, it is
intimidating to walk into a room if you don't know anyone.
(17:43):
And I do that all the time.
I've been here in DC 10 years and I walk into rooms where I don't know anyone all the time.
I'm still intimidated.
I'm still scared.
But I think what I love about DC is that people usually are very open to you coming in and
being like, hey, can I join your group?
I've never had anyone say no.
I mean, that would be crazy.
(18:05):
Who's going to go to a networking event and be rude?
That defeats the entire purpose.
Everyone's there for the same reason.
You come in with an understanding that you're interested in some of the same things.
And there's a lot of people at networking events that also come by themselves and they
also want to come and they want to meet people.
Everyone's there for different reasons.
(18:25):
But yeah, I mean, it's hard and it can be really awkward in DC.
I think that's probably why DC is known as a happy hour town because we do so much networking
and so awkward.
But no, I don't remember ever having a class.
I think if I had any advice, it's just stick by the food table.
No, I'm joking.
By the food table?
(18:46):
Yeah.
No, I know.
But I mean, just go up to a group of people who you think look somewhat friendly and just
say, hey, can I join your group?
What are you guys talking about?
Or what brought you to this event today?
And just start from there.
And I think you'll always meet at least one person that will be willing to speak to you.
(19:07):
It sounded like you put it into almost two categories.
And I don't know if you did this intentionally, but one of them is that one-on-one cold coffee.
You want to just talk to somebody.
And I think that one's fairly easy because you get that interaction.
You know what you're there for and you can actually just have a one-on-one conversation.
Whereas networking and you're just in a group of 100 trying to figure out what do you do?
(19:30):
What do you come from?
Are there any tips when you're trying to sell yourself or sell a service or casually just
get to know people?
I always like to ask people about themselves.
People love to talk about themselves.
And I think that's the easiest thing to talk about.
If you just keep asking someone about them and their career, it comes very easy to them.
(19:50):
And then hopefully eventually they ask you one question.
But I think that's a really great way.
And I think as a woman, I prefer to speak to other women.
It's just more comfortable for me.
That's great advice though.
I think that's really great advice.
People like to talk about themselves all the time.
I agree.
It's a very easy way to get people to open up.
But I think speaking to women similar to your age can be very helpful because more likely
(20:13):
than not they're feeling the same way as you do.
And they're probably feeling very grateful that you're speaking to them.
But I mean, even if you don't, let's say you're going to a panel event, even if you didn't
speak to the person who was speaking during the panel, just try to get their contact info
and be like, hey, I really like what you said during this event on this date about this
(20:34):
topic.
If you'd have time, I'd love to grab coffee and talk to you a little bit more about your
experience.
That's really great.
I mean, I think for me, as a person who's been on panels before, if I get that message,
I feel like at least it was worth it.
Because a lot of times I'm like, I feel like maybe I'm talking to the air.
I don't know if I'm reaching anyone, if anyone's really interested in this topic.
It really sucks to be on a panel and then you're done and there was nothing.
(20:58):
And I feel like previously I was saying like every person I reach out to wants to help
me.
No, that's not the case.
And maybe I did not explain that correctly.
But for the most part, I really feel like DC professionals are interested in exciting
to try to help young professionals grow.
Because at the end of the day, we're all here because I think everyone in DC wants to change
(21:20):
the world and at least that's why they come.
But we're all here because we are passionate about policy or about our careers and about
our jobs or just about the city.
And there are so many things that you can find that you have in common with someone
else.
I think for the most part, if you send out 10 emails, if you get one or two back, I think
it's worth it.
(21:40):
I'm curious about the kind of work that you end up doing because I don't know if there's
someone out there who might be inspired by this and thinking, oh, I'd love to do that.
I'd like to be part of the change, but I don't want to go to law school.
So what is it that you end up doing?
What does lobbying really mean?
Are you just giving somebody a briefcase of money and just saying, please vote my way?
(22:02):
Or is it more about that?
Yeah, that's such a great point and great question.
Lobbying is such a dirty word.
I mean, I think in DC, it's still maybe a little bit less, but I'm hesitant to go back
home and tell people I'm a lobbyist.
Like first, it sounds so pretentious.
It sounded great when you said you're advocating for people.
Yes.
(22:23):
I mean, at the end of the day, it's advocacy work.
I've only been in this field for the last five, six years and then in the policy game
for about three.
And it's truly advocacy work.
What you're doing is you're taking a group or a business or even maybe a person and you're
helping them understand the political and policy landscape that's in DC.
(22:44):
And you're helping them understand how their voice and their experience, how it fits into
that.
And DC is very intimidating, especially if you don't live here or even in college, how
I said, I didn't really understand DC and Washington politics.
And it's very intimidating.
(23:05):
Going into that, there's always going to be people that know more than you and that's
okay.
I think that it's so important that we as advocates are able to explain how the process
works to people so that you can come and tell your story and make a difference.
Every single representative, their job, regardless of what anyone says, their most important
(23:31):
job and what they prioritize the most is the voice of their constituent because that's
how they get reelected.
That's because that's why they spent so much time at home.
And I get that people say like, oh, they only work X amount of days because they want to
go back home on vacation.
No, these people, they want to be back home because they want to connect with you as a
constituent.
(23:52):
That is extremely powerful.
You should be able to go to DC, get a meeting with their staff.
You should be able to explain your perspective and they will listen to you.
They will listen to you way more than they'll ever listen to me.
So my job is just hearing them, helping them put that in terms that they'll easily understand
(24:15):
and also helping them understand even just the small things.
No meeting in DC with your representative is going to be longer than 30 minutes unless
you know something I don't.
Yeah.
I usually don't give meetings more than 30 minutes either.
Or just helping them explain, helping people understand the congressional calendar.
(24:36):
What days are your members or representatives actually going to be in DC?
What days are they going to be in your district?
What issues are they focusing on this week?
Are they going to pass a budget this week?
Maybe that's not the best week to come in and have you explain your position.
But yeah, lobbying is really just, I think, helping people explain their position to their
(25:00):
representatives.
And because your window is so small, that's where you come in and you basically put everything
in one package so you can present effectively, efficiently, all in one package so that you
make use of every minute that you get with those representatives.
Yeah.
I mean, you're talking about a 30 minute meeting and this could be on a variety of subjects.
(25:21):
Like it could be someone's entire life.
It could be on the topic of hazing.
It could be parents who have lost their children who they worked really hard to be able to
save enough money to send their kids to school and maybe they passed away in a hazing incident
and you're trying to be able to communicate that message in a matter of minutes.
(25:43):
That's really difficult.
But how can we package your experience and what you're asking Congress to do in a very
short limited amount of time with a staffer who's dealing with a thousand issues on a
daily basis?
How can we best communicate that message and tailor in a way that also coincides with their
interests?
Because members always are going to have different priorities, but your message is the same,
(26:08):
but how can we tailor that so that there are certain words or certain phrases that you
can say that could kind of appeal to them a little bit more?
That makes a lot of sense because if I was going through some tragedy or I was really
pushing some agenda and I was really passionate about it, I can totally see myself just talking
and talking about it and not really getting to the point or not appealing to what that
(26:31):
person is hearing.
So someone like you who comes in and will help me package that to deliver the best message
possible.
I think lobbying has changed a lot in the last, I don't know, since the smoke filled rooms
last 100 years and rightfully so lobbying has been very regulated.
(26:52):
You have to disclose everything, which I think is a great thing.
Everyone should, I mean, you could look up.
Like what's being said or what?
No, not exactly what's being said, but you could look up any corporation and see who
their lobbyists are and see the topics that they're discussing.
You're not going to have a transcript of every conversation or every meeting that you've
had.
But a general idea before you would know nothing.
(27:14):
You wouldn't know who the lobbyists was.
Yeah.
Or before you could theoretically push someone in a direction if you have the money.
But now I'm just speaking from my experience.
The constituents perspective is always way more important than a blank check that a lobbyist
is going to write because that's what's going to get them reelected.
And also there are a lot of members that won't take meetings with a lobbyist.
(27:38):
You have to have a constituent present.
The money should not be what's speaking.
It should be about the policy perspective.
That's great.
That's great to hear because hopefully that inspires other people to get into this area.
Yeah.
I mean, I'm on the Hill multiple times a week when we're in session and you see all types
of groups in there.
High school students, big corporations.
You could see literally families there.
(28:01):
It's the people's house.
You should be able to go in and communicate your perspective because I mean, so many people
are so turned off by politics and rightfully so, but they're there because they're elected
to be there.
They're entitled to you.
If it wasn't for you, they wouldn't be there.
You have every right.
Those doors are open.
I remember in college, I literally knew nothing.
(28:22):
I was like, oh, do you need an appointment to go in?
Those doors are open.
That's your home.
So I think it's really important that people know that.
And it is very intimidating, but they do want to hear from you and they really value your
opinion.
I mean, for the most part, I do think and staff too, they are there.
Some of them hopefully are there for the right reasons.
They want to better the lives of all Americans and they're dedicating a lot of their life
(28:47):
and previously the salaries were so bad, but they were there for a reason.
They're not, I mean, at least on the staff level, they're not there for the money.
Occasionally I would go to congressional hearings and never realized that you can just go in.
Yeah.
And you sit in, if it's public and most of them are, you sit in and you can listen on
many topics and the rooms are semi empty.
(29:08):
So there's a lot of space for people to come in.
And as a lobbyist, I guess you make it more effective, but at one point we're talking
about being a woman in this industry, is it diverse or is it difficult to get in?
From my experience, my crew at my firm, we're mostly women and I'm so, so beyond grateful
(29:28):
for that.
That's great.
Yeah.
I can't speak for personal offices or committee offices, but I rarely am in a room with my
colleagues or on the Hill with just men.
I think that's great.
That's really great.
Yeah.
That sounds great.
Is there anything that you see will improve the lobbying field?
(29:48):
Like to actually have a voice, is AI going to be some way of being able to connect better
with other people, pass on information or is it just always going to be a person, personal
area or field?
I think there's so much that AI can do for our industry.
When I first started, a lot of my job was tracking what's happening in Congress and
(30:14):
different policies and how that's going to affect my clients' businesses.
Or just like you said, watching a hearing and digesting that information and being able
to package that up to a client so that they know what's being said and what positions
are being taken or if their name was mentioned.
AI being able to transcribe a hearing that quickly can be very, very, very helpful.
(30:37):
But I do think that AI could never take away from this industry is really building relationships.
It's so important to have those relationships with policymakers and congressional committees.
The legal field is probably one of the slower industries that wants to adopt AI.
(30:57):
But I hope at least that relationships are really important and people's experiences
and knowledges are really, really important.
I don't know how AI would help someone go into a meeting and tell their story.
I think it could help with the preparation.
It could help with the monitoring and tracking.
But no, I don't think anything can take away from a one-on-one conversation between two
(31:20):
people.
Politics and issues are just a part of life and a part of us.
But is there anything that you do to de-stress, get away from this area?
Because you did say that you are a different person at work and then with your friends.
Yeah.
Besides karaoke, I guess.
Oh, no.
Oh my gosh.
(31:41):
I think it is hard to get away.
I mean, I'm just being honest.
I think there's always something going on.
There's always more that you can read.
There's always someone saying something that you should be aware of and blah, blah, blah.
It is hard to get away.
I guess it makes it a case for traveling maybe.
Maybe that's literally getting away.
(32:01):
Yeah.
I mean, even still then, you tell anyone abroad you're an American, they want to talk to you
about politics.
Oh, really?
Wow.
I think having a little bit of a disconnect, not a little bit, having a disconnect is very
important or else you're going to burn out.
Because this is a very intense world where you feel like sometimes you feel like you're
always a little bit behind.
(32:23):
I think everyone feels that way.
But yeah, I try.
Exercise is something that I'm trying to prioritize a little bit more.
Something like cooking forces me to stay off my electronics.
And also, I think communicating with your team is really important because people I
work with have kids and they have to leave during the middle of the day to pick up their
(32:44):
kids at daycare.
So I know that maybe from the hours of three to four, they're going to be unavailable and
that's their time that they should have with their kids.
And they come back online, let's say at eight or nine PM after their kids are back to bed
and I'm getting emails at those times when I've already worked from, let's say eight
to six straight and that's my time to decompress and have dinner.
(33:07):
So you can feel a little bit stressed when people are on different schedules.
I think communicating and sometimes people don't even know that they're stressing you
out when they're sending you an email.
Communicating with your team and being like, hey, I'm going to this event today.
I'm not able to do this or I'm traveling this weekend for a wedding or whatever.
I'm disconnecting.
It's important.
(33:28):
And people, they need to understand that you need to get away a little bit.
I'll apologize to the audience, I know that there's a lot of ambulances and things going
on in this area, but that is the background and that is DC life.
That's the DC anthem, the national anthem.
The sirens.
That's true because it's not just the police, but there's always a diplomat or a motorcade.
(33:49):
If Biden or whoever the political candidates are going around, there's motorcades.
I will say one of my highlights of this year and this is my 10th year in DC, I rode in
my first motorcade.
Oh yeah.
And that was so cool.
That's great.
That was really awesome.
I was like, I feel cool, especially because we also picked up McDonald's.
(34:10):
In the motorcade?
Yeah.
Like just like going to the drive through.
No, I personally did not.
I think they put it in for lunch, but yeah, the guys, these diplomats and these high level
officials, they still eat McDonald's in their motorcade.
It was so cool.
Yeah.
Also, they did say Secret Service said that it really isn't that much faster and I don't
know if I believe them.
(34:30):
They said it just cuts down five minutes of travel time when you have the sirens on, but
I don't know about that.
I believe them because at some point I've gone behind them.
I don't know.
It was still cool.
Do you get to ride the Senate train a lot?
Oh, that is cool.
I really like that.
You have to have an escort for that, but that is really cool.
Oh, do you?
Okay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I loved it.
(34:51):
I thought it was great knowing that there's a whole little subway system underneath at
DC that's only for Congress.
Yeah.
If you guys are ever in a congressional meeting, ask them, can you take me on the subway?
Yeah.
They should say yes.
Yeah.
And one thing I thought was kind of funny is how clean it was.
Oh, yeah.
As opposed to Metro.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's funny.
(35:11):
Well, hopefully their students or anyone who's interested in this field will reach out to
you and ask for that coffee or something like that.
But very much appreciate you coming in and taking time to talk to me.
No, I can't thank you enough.
I think what you're doing is really great and the professional world is very intimidating.
And I don't think that's ever going to go away.
(35:32):
And I think speaking with you and other professionals, I've asked people the highest levels before
going into meetings.
I'm like, Hey, do you ever still get nervous?
Like, does this ever go away?
Yeah.
And they say, no, everyone feels the same way you do.
And that's kind of the imposter syndrome.
Yes.
I was fortunate enough to go to the Hispanic heritage awards last night and there was some
(35:53):
really, really great people, really important people who have done amazing things there.
And in a lot of their speeches, they all mentioned imposter syndrome.
And sorry, I'm going on another rant.
I know that you wanted to finish, but I think that's so important to remember.
Everyone feels nervous sometimes and that's okay.
(36:14):
And just start up a conversation with someone.
And even if five people are rude to you, which they probably won't be if they're at a networking
event, you'll find at least one person that wants to help.
But yeah, no, I can't thank you enough for doing this.
I think it's so important to hear different people's perspectives and just hearing their
background and how they got to the places that they did is really, really helpful.
(36:38):
So thank you so much.
Yeah.
It's a never ending journey of just learning from people because everybody has a different
experience.
And that's one of the reasons I asked you to come on the show is that you have a unique
journey.
And I think many others do as well.
And we all learn from that.
So thank you very much for coming on the show.
Thank you.
Help me largest 100 would like to thank you so much for the language and the focus you
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