March 20, 2025 • 49 mins
SERIES: Everything We Wish We Knew at The Start
(Part 1)
This week, we’re diving into one of the biggest truths about healing—it’s messy, unpredictable and full of lessons you didn’t know you needed. We will be sharing our personal experience with setbacks (hello, flare-ups!) and why they aren’t the enemy—they’re the teachers.
We’ll talk about reframing failure, finding resilience when you feel stuck and how to bounce back stronger after setbacks. Plus, you’ll get practical tips for staying grounded when progress feels out of reach.
If you’ve ever felt like you’re moving backwards, this one’s for you. Let’s embrace the highs, the lows and everything in between.
Takeaways:
→ Why setbacks don’t mean failure
→ How to reset your mindset when you feel defeated
→ Practical tools to refocus on progress
If you loved this episode, it would mean the world if you’d take a moment to subscribe, leave a review, or share it with someone who needs to hear this. Your support helps this podcast reach more people who are ready to take control of their health and start thriving.
You are stronger than you think, healing is possible, and we'll be here every step of the way. Until next time—take care and keep going.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Katie (00:00):
So yeah, this is episode one of a five-part series which
is all about everything we wishwe knew at the very start, which
is a lot.
Amanda (00:12):
There's a lot we wish, we knew.
Katie (00:15):
We will try and condense this, but this particular
episode is all geared around whyhealing isn't linear and why
setbacks are all part of theprocess.
So failure is feedback morethan failure is failure.
Amanda (00:31):
Yeah, that is profound.
Failure is feedback.
More than failure is failure.
That took me so long to learn.
I grew up as a kid who justkind of was naturally good at
things, and I feared failure sohard.
Katie (00:53):
Oh God, yes, You're telling me Good Lord.
Amanda (00:56):
I think there's something here Like if we think
about those perfectionist vibesand people who end up with
autoimmune disorders.
Someone should do a study onthat, I believe.
Katie (01:08):
I agree.
Amanda (01:10):
I think there's a connection.
Yeah, maybe we can get somefunding to start a study, but I
think that part of the biggestthing that my healing journey
has taught me was to be okaywith failure, to learn how to
use failure as feedback and keepmoving forward.
(01:31):
I think that is huge and I thinkthat there's so much of this on
our healing journey.
When we want to correct aproblem, when there's a
dysfunction in our body or we'vebeen diagnosed with an illness
or we just maybe we don't have adiagnosis, we just have
symptoms, there's thisunderstanding that there's this
(01:51):
dysfunction in our body and wewant to fix it somehow in the
easiest, fastest way humanlypossible.
It can be so easy to create thatexpectation.
Easy to create that expectationwe were talking about this a
little bit before the episodehere about not only this
expectation that we are going toprogress in this very clear,
(02:15):
linear way, steadily get alittle bit better every day, but
we can also put thatexpectation of a time frame on
our healing, as if if, if we doeverything right will, we should
be healed by this date, andit's just not true no, and that
adds a considerable amount ofpressure as well onto someone
(02:38):
who doesn't need any extrapressure if they're in a
dysfunctional state, because, atthe end of the day, even going
through your own healing journey, whatever that might mean to
you, is messy and unpredictableand full of lessons that you
might not necessarily have knownthat you needed yeah, I was
(03:01):
just having a thought, as youwere saying, that when we are
young and our bodies arefunctioning in a predictable
fashion and we're maybe notdealing with symptoms or health
issues, we really don't know alot about our bodies, do we?
Katie (03:16):
No.
Amanda (03:24):
We just take it for granted that everything is
working, that our body is thismiraculous machine full of
complex systems, and we justtake that for granted, that all
of those systems are justworking in harmony at any given
point and we feel good and wehave nothing to worry about.
And then it's when things startto break down or dysfunction
starts to happen that we areforced to really learn about our
(03:45):
bodies and the way they work,and so the healing journey
really is a learning journey, alearning how to understand our
bodies and how to support ourbodies yeah, and it's kind of
exactly the same, even if youget a cold and you get really
congested and you're like, ohgod, you know I'm just thinking
(04:06):
about it when I didn't have thecold and I could actually
breathe through my nose and howmuch.
I took that for granted yes,that's huge.
Yeah, you think about laying inbed and you're like I just wish
my sinuses were clear and Icould breathe right now, so that
I could sleep.
Katie (04:24):
So yeah, it's so true, but it's obviously on a much
greater scale when it comes tochronic illness, but it's the
same kind of situation.
Amanda (04:34):
Yeah, where, suddenly.
What is that saying?
You don't really appreciateyour health until you lose it?
Yeah.
Katie (04:44):
Yeah, exactly, that's's a huge one and it's like that for
everything you know, even whenit comes to relationships and
people, and sometimes we takethings for granted and it's not
until that person, or health orwhatever it might be is gone do
you actually begin to change ormiss that person so, if so, if
(05:05):
we back it up a little bit, andwe're talking about this series
of everything we wish we knewwhen we began our healing
journey, why don't we start bydefining what healing means to
each of us?
Well, ultimately it's a lifetimeendeavor.
So healing isn't just temporary.
It's, you know, looking afteryourself and disease prevention
(05:29):
should be something that is ournorth star that we work towards.
So I feel like healing is notjust a chapter in life.
For me, healing means you knowthat we're putting ourselves
first and we're on this journeyof being just like one percent
(05:50):
better every single day, nomatter how small that is, and
transforming our body, our mind,always growing, not just when
we're sick or when we're poorlyor when we're not feeling great.
Amanda (06:02):
We should be working on this every single day yeah, and
recognizing that this healingjourney isn't just a means to an
end.
It's not, like we said, justreturning to factory settings.
So there is no reset button.
If you've been diagnosed with achronic illness and you think,
(06:22):
well, I well, I want to reversethis, I want to heal, I want to
cure myself, I want to undo thiscondition, that is very rarely
the case and I don't say that tosound cynical.
It's not a message of healingisn't possible.
Message of healing isn'tpossible.
(06:47):
It's healing might lookdifferent than what you think or
expect it to look like and it'snot something that okay, you
just, if I just eat perfectlyand I take all the supplements
and I manage my stress and Isleep enough and I do all the
right things for this period oftime, then I'll be able to heal
myself and then I'll be able togo on living life normally, the
way I did before.
I think that when we comethrough these journeys, we come
(07:11):
out different on the other side.
We come out profoundly changed,because this experience not
only teaches us about ourselves,about our bodies, about our
failures, it kind of transformsus at the same time.
So we're not the same personwho went in at the beginning
when we come out the other side.
Katie (07:32):
Well, yeah, and the feeling as well, the feeling
that they experience afterthat's over, compared to how
they felt before they started.
Why would you want to revertback to that situation?
Like you can progress in lifein many different ways, whether
that be like at work, in apromotion or self-growth, or in
(07:55):
terms of exercise whatever goalthat person might have, they're
actually setting themselves upfor success.
So, reverting back to the, theold ways that wasn't serving
them and was creating all thislike disease, disease within the
body they don't want to revertback to that, so it's just an
(08:16):
upward journey to live life tothe fullest, which is what
everyone deserves yeah, exactly,and that that truly is my
definition of healing.
Amanda (08:26):
It's being able to live in a way where your symptoms or
your illness don't consume youand aren't always top of mind
and don't run your life, andjust being in a place where you
have the ability to experiencelife through joy and really just
(08:46):
enjoy and be present with whereyou're at.
That's, that's my, I'd say,that's my definition of healing.
Katie (08:53):
I remember when I was um getting ready for my first
bodybuilding competition and Iwas having a emotional breakdown
because, of the lack of carbsyeah, yes and uh.
I was speaking to my coach, john, and I remember I always
remember this moment.
(09:13):
I was sitting at the entranceto the gym crying and he was
saying Katie, your Crohn'sdisease doesn't define you.
Why are you letting it defineyou?
Because I was going through apretty rough time with my
Crohn's at this point too, andthat statement just hit me
because I was allowing it tocontrol me and consume me and
(09:37):
all of that energy that I waspumping into these thoughts in
my head and all the cognitiveenergy that it was using up.
I was actually not putting thatenergy into my body and, yeah,
it was just such a profoundmoment for me and it was like
more or less the turning pointfor drawing myself out of a
(10:00):
little bit of victim mentalityand really like taking control
of my health and where I wantedit to go yeah, and recognizing
that you have some control, uh,that you aren't just a victim or
powerless because we really do,at least I know in my
experience.
Amanda (10:19):
I received my diagnosis and I kind of put it on like a
cape or a a cloak, you know, itbecame like what I wore became a
part of my identity for a while, and there's just layers and
layers to unpack with that.
You know, if I was having, ifI'm being 100% honest with
(10:42):
myself, I look back and I thinkof those hard days where I was
struggling with pain,inflammation, digestive symptoms
, and it was almost like attimes I used that diagnosis as
an excuse to not achieve or notfully participate in life.
Katie (11:05):
It was like, well, I can't, I can't do those things
because I have an illness, and Ithink that that's probably a
normal stage that we all gothrough yeah, for sure, and the
words that we tell ourselves are, so they have such power and,
(11:27):
from a psychological perspective, how we speak to ourselves, it
really impacts how we feel andhow we behave.
So it's always like thought,belief in action and learning
how to speak to ourselves in acompassionate way and a positive
way, and not not beingcontrolled by these negative
(11:50):
thoughts, anxious thoughts, whatcould happen because we're
believing this narrative thatwe've conjured up because of how
we feel is so important whenturning things around and, yeah,
starting to like come out theother side.
Yeah, because why setbacks feelso personal too, and this kind
(12:10):
of reverts back to what you weresaying at the beginning of not
being able to cope with failureemotionally and knowing that any
healing journey is an emotionalroller coaster and normalizing
that so the setbacks don't feellike failure because they
actually aren't.
It's just lessons learned andthat feeding into expectation
(12:34):
versus reality and why we thinkprogress should be, should be
linear when it's actually it'snot, and that's okay, you know
yeah, every setback is aopportunity to learn something
and make a different choice.
Amanda (12:51):
And if I think back to earlier on in my journey and how
I would respond when I wouldstart to go into a flare so
anybody who's on a chronicillness journey knows what a
flare up feels like, whereyou're kind of just cruising
(13:14):
along in your life and all of asudden the symptoms start to hit
you.
And I remember how I used toreact to that, with so much fear
and anxiety and worry and Iwould start to experience the
slightest symptom and my brainwould just go on this.
(13:38):
It would just run out ofcontrol and start thinking
thoughts like oh my god, likehow am I going to handle this?
I have so much going on in mylife right now.
I'm so busy I don't have timefor this um, everything from
those type of thoughts to thoseperfectionistic type thoughts
(14:02):
where, like, what have have Idone?
What did I eat?
Um, did I not sleep enough?
Was I not managing my stress?
I knew I shouldn't have went onthat trip.
I knew I shouldn't have takenon that responsibility.
I knew I shouldn't have saidyes when I wanted to say no and
and almost beating yourself upabout not being perfect and, um,
at some point I don't know whenit was, but at some point on my
(14:26):
journey I started to recognizethat that my body would just get
100% worse as soon as my mindwould start reacting in that way
and that stress that was beingpulled out of me through my
thoughts was just manifesting inmy body tenfold.
And I finally made thatconnection and started to do
(14:52):
things differently and practicea bit of a pause when I would
experience symptoms and likeokay, and you know that, like
you said the self talk okay,this isn't the end of the world,
you're going to get throughthis.
That makes such a hugedifference.
Katie (15:08):
Yeah, and we can put that back into this funnel of like
thoughts, beliefs, actions,because your thoughts in that
situation were creating thesebeliefs in your head that
something was going to gotragically wrong and then you
would perhaps not go out fordinner or not go on the
(15:29):
excursion, or say no to datenight or wherever it might be,
but actually you didn'tnecessarily need to do that
because that might have not beenthe end situation.
So it's so like our thoughtsare so powerful.
Yeah, I have a question for you.
Amanda (15:53):
What's been one of the hardest setbacks for you on your
healing journey, both speakingabout transitioning from being
on medication, on severaldifferent medications, to making
that decision to take ourselvesoff our medications and really
trust our body and our abilityto heal.
(16:14):
I think that that was one ofthe biggest.
I would call it a setback.
The biggest I would call it asetback mainly because of the
(16:53):
fear around that thought processof making that decision to
shift um and really switching mythought process to um.
I'm going to learn how tosupport my body because I
believe it can heal if I supportit properly was probably one of
the biggest hurdles that I'vehad to overcome.
Katie (17:03):
When I took myself off my medication I so I knew I had
the tools through, likeeducation and 11 years of study
and trial and error andeverything, and I knew I was
going to go through a period ofmaybe things getting slightly
(17:23):
worse before they got better,and I had to mentally prepare
myself for that on apsychological front.
Did you go through the samething?
Amanda (17:33):
Yes, I feel like I went through those thoughts of
preparing for, almost preparingfor the worst and being okay
with that, being accepting ofthat.
And the timing of it for me wasinteresting also because I took
myself off my medications,started changing my diet,
(17:54):
started some few key supplementsand then I got pregnant with my
son.
So there was this reallyinteresting thing that happened
during this time because whenyou are pregnant, your hormones
shift greatly in your body allthroughout your pregnancy, like
your hormones ramp up and thenafter you give birth, your
(18:17):
hormone levels just comecrashing down like they do a
complete 180.
So I I went from feelingamazing throughout my whole
pregnancy.
Basically when I got pregnant,my symptoms turned off and I was
like oh, people say this, somany people say this yeah.
I was like, oh, this is, this isbeautiful.
(18:39):
I feel amazing, I could eatalmost anything I wanted and I
just felt wonderful.
And then, after my son was born, I had tried to mentally
prepare myself for that switch,that stress on my body of
childbirth and that change in myhormones.
(19:01):
But then you pair that with notgetting enough sleep in the
first few weeks of postpartumand you know the stress of
having another child and all ofthat, and that sent me into a
flare up.
And that was another one,another hard one to overcome,
(19:27):
because now I not only washaving to support myself through
this flare up, but I had thisbrand new baby who didn't
understand.
Yeah, who needed my support, nomatter what, no matter how I
was feeling.
Yeah, who needed my support, nomatter what, no matter how I
(19:59):
was feeling.
So it really added pressure forme to.
Once again, my brain went backto that, those expectations of
healing and that timeline ofhealing.
Like I need to have the depthof knowledge that I have now on
supporting my body, especiallynutritionally, and I was
breastfeeding, so my nutritionaldemands went up, but I was also
in a flare up and was notabsorbing my nutrients, which
(20:22):
left me feeling depleted, andanyone who I think anyone who's
ever had a baby, knows what thatfeeling of depletion in the
first few weeks postpartum feelslike, because literally the
majority of your nutrients thatyou're taking in are going to
grow this baby right.
So we can feel very depleted,um, just in general.
(20:45):
But then you pair that with theinflammation of a flare-up and
and then what that does to yourmental health and your energy
levels, and so that was a thatwas a tricky one that took me
several months to really pullmyself out of.
Katie (21:02):
So in that moment, how, in that moment, when you were
pulling yourself out of thissituation, how did it feel
exactly, if you was to describeit, and what kind of thoughts
were running through your head?
Amanda (21:15):
I think I had less, less calm and less control over my
emotions at the time.
So those a lot of fear thoughts, a lot of that, like I said,
that panic kind of sets in andhow am I going to navigate this?
How am I going to navigate thisflare up with this new baby,
(21:38):
because I can't just rest when Ihave this baby who needs to be
looked after and you know heneeds to come first and so a lot
of fear thoughts, a lot of howam I going to do this, maybe
kind of sinking back into thefeeling of victim mentality and
like this, this is just anotherthing that I have on my plate
(22:02):
that I have to deal with.
And you know, I was running mybusiness at the time, which
doesn't stop, and also had mydaughter and who is in school,
and so it was a lot to navigateand it just felt like, oh, this
is just another thing beingthrown on my plate that I don't
(22:23):
need right now.
Yeah, it's interesting to thinkback to those thoughts because
they are so far from my realitynow and I know and have so much
trust in my body.
I know how to navigate theseflare-ups, I know what to do if
(22:44):
I start to feel off.
I know how to take action rightaway if, if my system starts to
feel off and really just deeplycare for myself.
But at that time I didn't haveas much understanding of how to
do that.
So then the fear thoughtsnaturally just kind of take over
.
Katie (23:03):
And what lesson did you learn from that experience that
you didn't realize during thosemoments of difficulty?
Amanda (23:11):
I think the biggest lesson that I learned in that
moment was how importantnourishment really is.
I recognize now that I was notmeeting my daily requirements
for calories and nutrientsbecause I was busy, I was
(23:32):
looking after a newborn andspread too thin trying to do all
the things and not properlylooking after myself.
And I think about it now and Iremember having to buy all new
clothes because my clothes werejust hanging off of me.
I lost so much weight in thefirst six weeks after having my
(23:53):
son and I think about all thewomen that are like oh, I got
back into my pre-pregnancy jeansand they're all excited and
like my pre-pregnancy genes.
And they're all excited andlike my pre-pregnancy genes were
hanging off my butt, you know,like falling off my body and I
and I didn't even clue in atfirst that like that is not okay
(24:14):
and had I, had I understoodwhat I know now, I would have
taken that as a very clear signthat I was undernourished and
that I believe that one of thekey nutrients that we can be
lacking, like our B vitamins andour minerals, and and how
(24:50):
important that is, because thatreally sets the stage for the
function of our cells or thedysfunction of our cells, and so
that should have been a deadgiveaway for me that I was
undernourished because I waslosing weight so rapidly.
(25:15):
We try to eliminate all thesetriggers, but we're not putting
a lot of or enough emphasis on,are we getting the nutrition we
need, and especially when wehave inflammation of our
digestive system which isaffecting our ability to absorb
(25:37):
nutrients, it's not necessarilywhat we're putting into the tank
, it's what our body is able toabsorb and utilize, and clearly
at that point my body wasn'tabsorbing or utilizing much of
anything.
So, yeah, I think I would havecome out of that episode a lot
(25:58):
quicker if I had recognized thatand started focusing on
nourishment from the get-go.
Katie (26:05):
When we're talking about in this episode anyway, when
we're talking about setbacks andnormalizing setbacks and
essentially reframing setbacksand how setbacks are actually
progress.
Would you say that goingthrough that experience shaped
(26:26):
you into the person that you aretoday?
Amanda (26:28):
Yeah, absolutely, and I think that I can look back at
that situation and I can make somany connections now.
So not only do I have thiscompassion for that version of
me, and I think everything'sconnected.
So that state of depletion thatI was in and that lack of
(26:51):
nourishment that I was receivingat the time, that led to the
quality of my thoughts, that ledto where my mental health was
at at the time where my mentalhealth was at at the time.
And I think about this oftenwhen I think about women who
suffer from postpartumdepression and how the research
(27:12):
shows that there's a very stronglink between our DHEA levels in
our body postpartum and whetherwe experience postpartum
depression or not.
And so much of it tells me thatour mental health is dependent
on our nutrient status.
But we don't get taught thatand we don't.
(27:35):
It's not reiterated by ourdoctors, the importance is
barely mentioned.
So I think about that now and ithelps me, yeah, just have more
of a compassionate understandingfor my own body and but also
for others and what other peopleare going through and so
(27:56):
knowing that these things gohand in hand and that if you are
struggling with these physicalsymptoms and lack of nourishment
and inflammation and poorabsorption of nutrients, that
your mental health is going tobe affected and it just kind of
creates this negative feedbackloop that can be really
(28:17):
difficult to get out of.
That can be really difficult toget out of.
So I definitely I value thatexperience because I can see
those connections now, and notjust from a research perspective
but from a lived experience,and I think that's why I love
(28:38):
working with the people that Iwork with in a coaching capacity
, because they're in a similarplace and I can relate to them
so deeply.
Katie (28:47):
Even people who suffer from chronic illness, and
especially on a chronic fatiguelevel.
Again going back to DHEA,there's so many links between
that and chronic fatigue, linksbetween that and chronic fatigue
.
So when it comes to absorbingon a cellular level, this
(29:08):
creates such a large amount ofchronic fatigue in patients and
that then sets off this like youmentioned negative feedback
loop in their mind becausethey're unable to like actually
just genuinely live life, um,and they can't play with their
kids and they can't go out tothe shop and they can barely do
day-to-day things that you knowthey would have been able to do
(29:30):
x amount of years ago.
So it's definitely a reallyprofound problem that so many
people are suffering from, notjust postpartum, but just
generally with with their health, when it comes to feeling like
tired all the time and it'ssomething that we're taught is
just normal or we just we acceptit.
Amanda (29:50):
We don't make those connections until we get to a
place where we're forced to lookat that and, as I said before,
I feel like that's a gift thatmy illness has given me.
Is that awareness, thatawareness of my body, that
awareness of how these systemswork and how we can really
(30:12):
support ourselves so that wetruly feel our best, not just
physically but mentally, so thatwe don't end up in these
endless loops?
Katie (30:23):
Yes, absolutely.
And in terms of that situationthat you went through, knowing
that setbacks isn't like a caseof starting over, but an
opportunity to learn and torecalibrate so probably when you
was in the depths of it, youliterally just had the complete
opposite mindset.
But transforming people's mindsto take a different stance on
(30:48):
this and look at it as a growthopportunity will completely
change your entire vision onwhere you're at right now and
where you could could be,depending on what protocol and
intervention you did next.
Amanda (31:04):
Yeah, and I think that that's why it's so important to
choose to work withpractitioners who not only are
compassionate to your situationand get it, but also that kind
of challenge you to look atthings in a different way.
Like you talk about yourconversation with John in that
moment and and him reallyshaking up the way that you were
(31:27):
looking at yourself and the waythat you were viewing your
illness.
Like we need those people inour lives who are going to do
that, who are going to questionour belief systems and say this
is this really serving you rightnow in your life?
Katie (31:43):
yeah, and have and have that and have those challenging
conversations, because thescience behind healing
fluctuations stems from the factthat symptoms can return even
when you're doing everythingright, and that's where the
mindset strength needs to reallystep in, um, yeah, and take
(32:04):
charge in those moments is youknow, even when you were going
through that postpartum, thatwould have been a great example
where mindset needed to.
You know, take control in thatsituation and think about your
nutrition, etc.
Etc.
So having someone behind youthat's keeping you accountable
(32:24):
when it comes to working with apractitioner is is so valuable
yeah, and the mindset piecereally is the thing that gets
you through these setbacks.
100 yeah, what's your stance onthe difference between
perceived failure and actualregression?
Amanda (32:44):
honestly, I feel like my mindset has completely shifted
and I don't I don't perceivesetbacks as regression at all
anymore.
Um, and I think that you, ifyou choose to view it that way,
that it can be a slippery slope,it can be easy to ride that
(33:07):
wave, kind of like we said, thatnegative feedback loop that's
created if you're allowing thosethoughts, if you're, if you're
experiencing a flare up, ifyou're in a setback, and you're
allowing those thoughts to runaway and say this is what's
going to happen next, you'regoing to have to have the
surgery and you're going to haveto go back on these medications
and you let those thoughts runwild.
(33:29):
I honestly believe that thatcan end up being your reality,
just based on that feedback loopthat is created because it's
just creating this internalstress and, like you said,
taking so much of your mentalcapacity and is creating worse
(33:51):
physical outcomes for you.
So in my life I don't evenentertain those thoughts anymore
.
They're not even a blip on myradar.
Katie (34:00):
Do you think that came from practicing how to deal with
emotions and logic, sosplitting them, being able to
split them, taking more of alogical stance, perhaps if
you're beginning a flare up orif you're feeling a bit off?
Amanda (34:17):
Yeah, I think that the biggest difference now for me is
that I have tools in my toolboxfor navigating setbacks and
flares and as soon as I start tofeel a little bit off, I have
an entire list of things in mymyself right now so that I can
give my body what it needs sothat it can heal.
(34:46):
And I know that those things forme are focusing on rest, as
much rest as possible, and maybethat's not the time to be
trying to hit PRs in the gym,letting go of that for a couple
of days or a couple of weeks, aslong as it takes to just focus
on rest and focus on recoveryand focus on nourishing my body,
(35:08):
eating things that are easy todigest or kind on my digestive
system and promotinganti-inflammatory properties,
and all of those things are kindof just my go-to strategies to
start feeling better.
And, um, when you take thosefear thoughts and those
(35:29):
emotional thoughts because I dofeel that I'm way more
emotionally regulated now, um,than I used to be a few years
ago and I think that it's a,it's a direct correlation
between things running moresmoothly in my body and my
(35:49):
physical body that then help thequality of my thoughts and and
support my mental health,because it goes both ways
absolutely yeah, and I thinkit's so important for people to
be aware of the fact that it'snot just one thing, it's you
need to be taking a multifacetedapproach to this when it comes
(36:12):
to flare-ups and not feelinggreat in yourself, because just
focusing on one thing is notgonna give the impact that your
body needs to provide the spacethat it needs to heal.
Katie (36:25):
And this is why I work on four pillars within my coaching
program, which is nutrition andthen supplements, layered on
top of that, because we can'tjust rely on supplements, like
so many people think.
Oh, I'm taking X, y, zsupplement, nothing's changing.
These are just an extension ofwhat you should be doing
(36:48):
nutritionally.
And well, like you said,movement, tuning into your body
and realizing what it needs inthat time and not causing
excessive amounts ofinflammation through training
super important when we'retrying to actually reduce
inflammation levels.
We don't want musclehypertrophy at that time.
And then it all comes down tomindset and behavior change,
because this is what's runningconstantly, like turning the
(37:09):
clogs.
That's your number one and theneverything else will feed in,
but it's it needs to be viewedas a multi-faceted perspective,
because you can't just rely onone thing and expect a profound
change and unfortunately, youknow, the human body is so
complex, it just doesn't worklike that yeah, and I also like
to think of it.
Amanda (37:29):
the approach that I take with dealing with setbacks or
dealing with flare-ups is verysimilar to the approach that I
take when I get a cold or whenmy kids get a cold.
So if you are one of thosepeople who is super busy and has
a busy work schedule and youstart to experience cold
(37:49):
symptoms, you kind of have twooptions.
You can dial things back inyour schedule, focus on rest,
focus on nourishing your body,giving it what it needs, taking
the time to heal early on sothat this doesn't turn into
something bigger and more severe.
(38:10):
Or you can be that person whosays I don't have time for this
right now, I've got this projectdue at work and just starts
popping cold meds to dampen thesymptoms yeah, to suppress the
symptoms and just keep plowingforward, which quite often
results in longer healing timesbecause we're not actually
(38:33):
honoring our body, listening toour body and giving it what it
needs to heal early on.
So I use that same approach withdealing with flare ups.
I could kind of disassociateand say this isn't happening to
me and just keep pushing through.
Or I could listen early on tomy body and give it what it
needs so that healing happensfaster and it doesn't turn into
(38:57):
this big prolonged battle formonths.
Katie (38:59):
And I think there's like a beautiful, like spiritual
element to that, because I knowme and you are so aligned with
spirituality coming into this.
But I think tuning into ourbody and doing what's best for
our higher self is well.
Making ourselves a priority,basically, and not putting work
(39:22):
first or gym first or whateverit might be, is another learning
curve for people, because a lotof the time we're on this
fast-paced life just on thehamster wheel and learning how
to slow down is so difficult forso many people it's the most
difficult, especially for women.
Amanda (39:43):
I find this especially for women.
Asking a woman, a busy woman,to slow down is probably the
hardest thing sometimes and alsogoing back to setbacks.
Katie (39:59):
Um, a lot of people have this all or nothing mindset,
where you know they have asetback and they just throw in
the towel because they don'tknow how to cope with it, and
they don't know how to workthrough it, because one bad day
doesn't undo months of progress.
So, yeah, I think that's alsoquite a large element all or
nothing mindset around acceptingwhat they deem to be failure or
(40:25):
setbacks yeah, and I think thatties right into that
perfectionist mentality if Ican't do something perfect, then
it's not worth doing.
Amanda (40:33):
Or you see this a lot with people in their
relationship to exercise.
They'll start these new year'sresolutions and I'm going to hit
the gym five days a week andit's going to be amazing and I'm
going to transform my body andit's going to be awesome.
And then, as soon as they don'tmeasure up to that expectation
(40:53):
of perfection that they placedon themselves, it's oh, I knew I
wasn't going to be able to dothis.
You know I'm a failure.
Who was I kidding?
And, like you said, they throwin the towel.
And I think there's so muchpower in recognizing those
patterns and choosing to do it adifferent way and playing the
long game and really recognizingthat your health and
(41:16):
prioritizing yourself is thelong game and we're doing this
for the rest of our lives, so wemay as well get comfortable
here, stop trying to aim forperfection and just do our best
and just keep going and justkeep moving forward step by step
and forget about thoseexpectations of how long it's
(41:37):
going to take or what it's goingto look like.
Katie (41:40):
And also learning how to detach your self-worth from the
actual healing process, becauseyour health journey doesn't
define your value, and I thinkthat's so important.
Amanda (41:53):
Oh, yes, yeah.
Katie (41:55):
So you might be thinking like okay, be thinking like okay
, I hear you, but how do Iactually put that in practice in
real time?
What practical ways can Ireframe failure essentially?
So what kind of things wouldyou say in your head to reframe
these negative words like Ifailed for, for example, whereas
(42:21):
in that case it should bereally, what did this setback
teach me?
Amanda (42:25):
Recognizing that setbacks or perceived failures
are just part of the journey andthat it doesn't define you.
It doesn't define your worth.
You are not failing because youhave reached a setback.
It's just more information andwhen you look back later on,
those are your growth moments.
Katie (42:47):
Those challenging setbacks are just an opportunity
to learn and then grow, andthat's ultimately what builds
resilience in us making thesesmall, tiny little changes and
adjustments in how you speak toyourself and the words that you
(43:07):
use is what's going toessentially create this larger
movement where you're taking adifferent stance on things and
not perceiving setbacks in aparticular way, but it's all
about how you speak to yourself.
That is the first thing thatyou would address when it comes
(43:29):
to awareness and then behaviorchange.
Amanda (43:33):
Yeah, 100%.
And I think, when I think backto all of the setbacks that I've
experienced, it really was amental game more than it was a
physical.
Yeah it's, it's the moving pastthose mental plateaus is where
the work truly is.
Katie (43:52):
Yeah, and staying grounded in those moments when
progress feels just completelyout of reach, and installing
these rituals into your dailylife so that they become
habitual, because it's all welland good saying all this stuff,
but it's like, well, how do I,how do I put that into practice?
These are the kind of thingsthat you can be doing at home to
(44:13):
start changing the way that youthink and the way that you feel
and how you deal withsituations when they come up.
Amanda (44:20):
Yeah, and I think that community can be a really huge
component to that as well,having supportive people around
you that get it, and that can betricky to find, because I know
I don't know about you, but whenI first started navigating my
journey with colitis, I wentlooking for like online
(44:42):
communities, online supportgroups to try to understand my
illness a little bit more, andwhat I found in a lot of these
Facebook groups is a lot of themare really toxic and a lot of
them were people projectingtheir experience on to others,
saying like oh, this happened tome, and as if this is going to
be your fate.
(45:03):
So I would say, be very carefulwith those types of communities
and really just gravitate towardthe people who are encouraging
and supportive and compassionateand building you up and telling
you like you're going to getthrough this, versus the the
ones that are doom and gloom andfear-mongering oh, it's just no
(45:29):
, it's just not going to help inany way if someone is going
through a setback right now andthey feel like giving up, what
advice would you give them?
I think that trying to look atthings from too broad of a
perspective can be reallyharmful.
So just taking things day byday is probably the easiest way
(45:50):
to make things more manageable.
So don't focus on a year downthe road or two years down the
road.
Focus on today and what you cando.
What can I do in this moment,today.
And then, if you have someonethat you can reach out to for
support, definitely reach out,because things get less heavy
(46:13):
when you share them withsomebody else.
If you're the only one who isdrowning in your thoughts and
trying to navigate this yourself, life can just feel very lonely
and isolating.
But as soon as you ask someoneto join you in that, it all of a
sudden just feels a little bitlighter.
Katie (46:33):
And they can also offer accountability, because when
you're in a really hard time andyou might be feeling super low
and a little bit helpless,having someone there to to share
this experience with um, theycan actually, in a way, be your
accountability system.
(46:54):
So for us, it's obviously we'reour client's accountability
system.
That's really how you start totrack and see progress is when
you have that accountabilitybehind you, because they're not
going to let you have thisnegative self-talk loop going on
, because they'll be there,they'll be your cheerleader and
(47:14):
they'll be able to pick out thesmall wins that you're going to
be experiencing whilst you'rehealing that you will just
normally bypass, because wedon't ever acknowledge any kind
of win unless it's like thelottery or something yeah, that
damn negativity bias in ourbrain
Amanda (47:33):
yeah just doesn't let us celebrate no, it just takes
over.
Katie (47:37):
so yeah, I completely agree, if you could reach out
and get that support networkingsystem in place, it's going to
really really help you yeahabsolutely.
So yeah, this is episode one of a five-part series which
is all about everything we wishwe knew at the very start, which
is a lot.
Amanda (00:12):
There's a lot we wish, we knew.
Katie (00:15):
We will try and condense this, but this particular
episode is all geared around whyhealing isn't linear and why
setbacks are all part of theprocess.
So failure is feedback morethan failure is failure.
Amanda (00:31):
Yeah, that is profound.
Failure is feedback.
More than failure is failure.
That took me so long to learn.
I grew up as a kid who justkind of was naturally good at
things, and I feared failure sohard.
Katie (00:53):
Oh God, yes, You're telling me Good Lord.
Amanda (00:56):
I think there's something here Like if we think
about those perfectionist vibesand people who end up with
autoimmune disorders.
Someone should do a study onthat, I believe.
Katie (01:08):
I agree.
Amanda (01:10):
I think there's a connection.
Yeah, maybe we can get somefunding to start a study, but I
think that part of the biggestthing that my healing journey
has taught me was to be okaywith failure, to learn how to
use failure as feedback and keepmoving forward.
(01:31):
I think that is huge and I thinkthat there's so much of this on
our healing journey.
When we want to correct aproblem, when there's a
dysfunction in our body or we'vebeen diagnosed with an illness
or we just maybe we don't have adiagnosis, we just have
symptoms, there's thisunderstanding that there's this
(01:51):
dysfunction in our body and wewant to fix it somehow in the
easiest, fastest way humanlypossible.
It can be so easy to create thatexpectation.
Easy to create that expectationwe were talking about this a
little bit before the episodehere about not only this
expectation that we are going toprogress in this very clear,
(02:15):
linear way, steadily get alittle bit better every day, but
we can also put thatexpectation of a time frame on
our healing, as if if, if we doeverything right will, we should
be healed by this date, andit's just not true no, and that
adds a considerable amount ofpressure as well onto someone
(02:38):
who doesn't need any extrapressure if they're in a
dysfunctional state, because, atthe end of the day, even going
through your own healing journey, whatever that might mean to
you, is messy and unpredictableand full of lessons that you
might not necessarily have knownthat you needed yeah, I was
(03:01):
just having a thought, as youwere saying, that when we are
young and our bodies arefunctioning in a predictable
fashion and we're maybe notdealing with symptoms or health
issues, we really don't know alot about our bodies, do we?
Katie (03:16):
No.
Amanda (03:24):
We just take it for granted that everything is
working, that our body is thismiraculous machine full of
complex systems, and we justtake that for granted, that all
of those systems are justworking in harmony at any given
point and we feel good and wehave nothing to worry about.
And then it's when things startto break down or dysfunction
starts to happen that we areforced to really learn about our
(03:45):
bodies and the way they work,and so the healing journey
really is a learning journey, alearning how to understand our
bodies and how to support ourbodies yeah, and it's kind of
exactly the same, even if youget a cold and you get really
congested and you're like, ohgod, you know I'm just thinking
(04:06):
about it when I didn't have thecold and I could actually
breathe through my nose and howmuch.
I took that for granted yes,that's huge.
Yeah, you think about laying inbed and you're like I just wish
my sinuses were clear and Icould breathe right now, so that
I could sleep.
Katie (04:24):
So yeah, it's so true, but it's obviously on a much
greater scale when it comes tochronic illness, but it's the
same kind of situation.
Amanda (04:34):
Yeah, where, suddenly.
What is that saying?
You don't really appreciateyour health until you lose it?
Yeah.
Katie (04:44):
Yeah, exactly, that's's a huge one and it's like that for
everything you know, even whenit comes to relationships and
people, and sometimes we takethings for granted and it's not
until that person, or health orwhatever it might be is gone do
you actually begin to change ormiss that person so, if so, if
(05:05):
we back it up a little bit, andwe're talking about this series
of everything we wish we knewwhen we began our healing
journey, why don't we start bydefining what healing means to
each of us?
Well, ultimately it's a lifetimeendeavor.
So healing isn't just temporary.
It's, you know, looking afteryourself and disease prevention
(05:29):
should be something that is ournorth star that we work towards.
So I feel like healing is notjust a chapter in life.
For me, healing means you knowthat we're putting ourselves
first and we're on this journeyof being just like one percent
(05:50):
better every single day, nomatter how small that is, and
transforming our body, our mind,always growing, not just when
we're sick or when we're poorlyor when we're not feeling great.
Amanda (06:02):
We should be working on this every single day yeah, and
recognizing that this healingjourney isn't just a means to an
end.
It's not, like we said, justreturning to factory settings.
So there is no reset button.
If you've been diagnosed with achronic illness and you think,
(06:22):
well, I well, I want to reversethis, I want to heal, I want to
cure myself, I want to undo thiscondition, that is very rarely
the case and I don't say that tosound cynical.
It's not a message of healingisn't possible.
Message of healing isn'tpossible.
(06:47):
It's healing might lookdifferent than what you think or
expect it to look like and it'snot something that okay, you
just, if I just eat perfectlyand I take all the supplements
and I manage my stress and Isleep enough and I do all the
right things for this period oftime, then I'll be able to heal
myself and then I'll be able togo on living life normally, the
way I did before.
I think that when we comethrough these journeys, we come
(07:11):
out different on the other side.
We come out profoundly changed,because this experience not
only teaches us about ourselves,about our bodies, about our
failures, it kind of transformsus at the same time.
So we're not the same personwho went in at the beginning
when we come out the other side.
Katie (07:32):
Well, yeah, and the feeling as well, the feeling
that they experience afterthat's over, compared to how
they felt before they started.
Why would you want to revertback to that situation?
Like you can progress in lifein many different ways, whether
that be like at work, in apromotion or self-growth, or in
(07:55):
terms of exercise whatever goalthat person might have, they're
actually setting themselves upfor success.
So, reverting back to the, theold ways that wasn't serving
them and was creating all thislike disease, disease within the
body they don't want to revertback to that, so it's just an
(08:16):
upward journey to live life tothe fullest, which is what
everyone deserves yeah, exactly,and that that truly is my
definition of healing.
Amanda (08:26):
It's being able to live in a way where your symptoms or
your illness don't consume youand aren't always top of mind
and don't run your life, andjust being in a place where you
have the ability to experiencelife through joy and really just
(08:46):
enjoy and be present with whereyou're at.
That's, that's my, I'd say,that's my definition of healing.
Katie (08:53):
I remember when I was um getting ready for my first
bodybuilding competition and Iwas having a emotional breakdown
because, of the lack of carbsyeah, yes and uh.
I was speaking to my coach, john, and I remember I always
remember this moment.
(09:13):
I was sitting at the entranceto the gym crying and he was
saying Katie, your Crohn'sdisease doesn't define you.
Why are you letting it defineyou?
Because I was going through apretty rough time with my
Crohn's at this point too, andthat statement just hit me
because I was allowing it tocontrol me and consume me and
(09:37):
all of that energy that I waspumping into these thoughts in
my head and all the cognitiveenergy that it was using up.
I was actually not putting thatenergy into my body and, yeah,
it was just such a profoundmoment for me and it was like
more or less the turning pointfor drawing myself out of a
(10:00):
little bit of victim mentalityand really like taking control
of my health and where I wantedit to go yeah, and recognizing
that you have some control, uh,that you aren't just a victim or
powerless because we really do,at least I know in my
experience.
Amanda (10:19):
I received my diagnosis and I kind of put it on like a
cape or a a cloak, you know, itbecame like what I wore became a
part of my identity for a while, and there's just layers and
layers to unpack with that.
You know, if I was having, ifI'm being 100% honest with
(10:42):
myself, I look back and I thinkof those hard days where I was
struggling with pain,inflammation, digestive symptoms
, and it was almost like attimes I used that diagnosis as
an excuse to not achieve or notfully participate in life.
Katie (11:05):
It was like, well, I can't, I can't do those things
because I have an illness, and Ithink that that's probably a
normal stage that we all gothrough yeah, for sure, and the
words that we tell ourselves are, so they have such power and,
(11:27):
from a psychological perspective, how we speak to ourselves, it
really impacts how we feel andhow we behave.
So it's always like thought,belief in action and learning
how to speak to ourselves in acompassionate way and a positive
way, and not not beingcontrolled by these negative
(11:50):
thoughts, anxious thoughts, whatcould happen because we're
believing this narrative thatwe've conjured up because of how
we feel is so important whenturning things around and, yeah,
starting to like come out theother side.
Yeah, because why setbacks feelso personal too, and this kind
(12:10):
of reverts back to what you weresaying at the beginning of not
being able to cope with failureemotionally and knowing that any
healing journey is an emotionalroller coaster and normalizing
that so the setbacks don't feellike failure because they
actually aren't.
It's just lessons learned andthat feeding into expectation
(12:34):
versus reality and why we thinkprogress should be, should be
linear when it's actually it'snot, and that's okay, you know
yeah, every setback is aopportunity to learn something
and make a different choice.
Amanda (12:51):
And if I think back to earlier on in my journey and how
I would respond when I wouldstart to go into a flare so
anybody who's on a chronicillness journey knows what a
flare up feels like, whereyou're kind of just cruising
(13:14):
along in your life and all of asudden the symptoms start to hit
you.
And I remember how I used toreact to that, with so much fear
and anxiety and worry and Iwould start to experience the
slightest symptom and my brainwould just go on this.
(13:38):
It would just run out ofcontrol and start thinking
thoughts like oh my god, likehow am I going to handle this?
I have so much going on in mylife right now.
I'm so busy I don't have timefor this um, everything from
those type of thoughts to thoseperfectionistic type thoughts
(14:02):
where, like, what have have Idone?
What did I eat?
Um, did I not sleep enough?
Was I not managing my stress?
I knew I shouldn't have went onthat trip.
I knew I shouldn't have takenon that responsibility.
I knew I shouldn't have saidyes when I wanted to say no and
and almost beating yourself upabout not being perfect and, um,
at some point I don't know whenit was, but at some point on my
(14:26):
journey I started to recognizethat that my body would just get
100% worse as soon as my mindwould start reacting in that way
and that stress that was beingpulled out of me through my
thoughts was just manifesting inmy body tenfold.
And I finally made thatconnection and started to do
(14:52):
things differently and practicea bit of a pause when I would
experience symptoms and likeokay, and you know that, like
you said the self talk okay,this isn't the end of the world,
you're going to get throughthis.
That makes such a hugedifference.
Katie (15:08):
Yeah, and we can put that back into this funnel of like
thoughts, beliefs, actions,because your thoughts in that
situation were creating thesebeliefs in your head that
something was going to gotragically wrong and then you
would perhaps not go out fordinner or not go on the
(15:29):
excursion, or say no to datenight or wherever it might be,
but actually you didn'tnecessarily need to do that
because that might have not beenthe end situation.
So it's so like our thoughtsare so powerful.
Yeah, I have a question for you.
Amanda (15:53):
What's been one of the hardest setbacks for you on your
healing journey, both speakingabout transitioning from being
on medication, on severaldifferent medications, to making
that decision to take ourselvesoff our medications and really
trust our body and our abilityto heal.
(16:14):
I think that that was one ofthe biggest.
I would call it a setback.
The biggest I would call it asetback mainly because of the
(16:53):
fear around that thought processof making that decision to
shift um and really switching mythought process to um.
I'm going to learn how tosupport my body because I
believe it can heal if I supportit properly was probably one of
the biggest hurdles that I'vehad to overcome.
Katie (17:03):
When I took myself off my medication I so I knew I had
the tools through, likeeducation and 11 years of study
and trial and error andeverything, and I knew I was
going to go through a period ofmaybe things getting slightly
(17:23):
worse before they got better,and I had to mentally prepare
myself for that on apsychological front.
Did you go through the samething?
Amanda (17:33):
Yes, I feel like I went through those thoughts of
preparing for, almost preparingfor the worst and being okay
with that, being accepting ofthat.
And the timing of it for me wasinteresting also because I took
myself off my medications,started changing my diet,
(17:54):
started some few key supplementsand then I got pregnant with my
son.
So there was this reallyinteresting thing that happened
during this time because whenyou are pregnant, your hormones
shift greatly in your body allthroughout your pregnancy, like
your hormones ramp up and thenafter you give birth, your
(18:17):
hormone levels just comecrashing down like they do a
complete 180.
So I I went from feelingamazing throughout my whole
pregnancy.
Basically when I got pregnant,my symptoms turned off and I was
like oh, people say this, somany people say this yeah.
I was like, oh, this is, this isbeautiful.
(18:39):
I feel amazing, I could eatalmost anything I wanted and I
just felt wonderful.
And then, after my son was born, I had tried to mentally
prepare myself for that switch,that stress on my body of
childbirth and that change in myhormones.
(19:01):
But then you pair that with notgetting enough sleep in the
first few weeks of postpartumand you know the stress of
having another child and all ofthat, and that sent me into a
flare up.
And that was another one,another hard one to overcome,
(19:27):
because now I not only washaving to support myself through
this flare up, but I had thisbrand new baby who didn't
understand.
Yeah, who needed my support, nomatter what, no matter how I
was feeling.
Yeah, who needed my support, nomatter what, no matter how I
(19:59):
was feeling.
So it really added pressure forme to.
Once again, my brain went backto that, those expectations of
healing and that timeline ofhealing.
Like I need to have the depthof knowledge that I have now on
supporting my body, especiallynutritionally, and I was
breastfeeding, so my nutritionaldemands went up, but I was also
in a flare up and was notabsorbing my nutrients, which
(20:22):
left me feeling depleted, andanyone who I think anyone who's
ever had a baby, knows what thatfeeling of depletion in the
first few weeks postpartum feelslike, because literally the
majority of your nutrients thatyou're taking in are going to
grow this baby right.
So we can feel very depleted,um, just in general.
(20:45):
But then you pair that with theinflammation of a flare-up and
and then what that does to yourmental health and your energy
levels, and so that was a thatwas a tricky one that took me
several months to really pullmyself out of.
Katie (21:02):
So in that moment, how, in that moment, when you were
pulling yourself out of thissituation, how did it feel
exactly, if you was to describeit, and what kind of thoughts
were running through your head?
Amanda (21:15):
I think I had less, less calm and less control over my
emotions at the time.
So those a lot of fear thoughts, a lot of that, like I said,
that panic kind of sets in andhow am I going to navigate this?
How am I going to navigate thisflare up with this new baby,
(21:38):
because I can't just rest when Ihave this baby who needs to be
looked after and you know heneeds to come first and so a lot
of fear thoughts, a lot of howam I going to do this, maybe
kind of sinking back into thefeeling of victim mentality and
like this, this is just anotherthing that I have on my plate
(22:02):
that I have to deal with.
And you know, I was running mybusiness at the time, which
doesn't stop, and also had mydaughter and who is in school,
and so it was a lot to navigateand it just felt like, oh, this
is just another thing beingthrown on my plate that I don't
(22:23):
need right now.
Yeah, it's interesting to thinkback to those thoughts because
they are so far from my realitynow and I know and have so much
trust in my body.
I know how to navigate theseflare-ups, I know what to do if
(22:44):
I start to feel off.
I know how to take action rightaway if, if my system starts to
feel off and really just deeplycare for myself.
But at that time I didn't haveas much understanding of how to
do that.
So then the fear thoughtsnaturally just kind of take over
.
Katie (23:03):
And what lesson did you learn from that experience that
you didn't realize during thosemoments of difficulty?
Amanda (23:11):
I think the biggest lesson that I learned in that
moment was how importantnourishment really is.
I recognize now that I was notmeeting my daily requirements
for calories and nutrientsbecause I was busy, I was
(23:32):
looking after a newborn andspread too thin trying to do all
the things and not properlylooking after myself.
And I think about it now and Iremember having to buy all new
clothes because my clothes werejust hanging off of me.
I lost so much weight in thefirst six weeks after having my
(23:53):
son and I think about all thewomen that are like oh, I got
back into my pre-pregnancy jeansand they're all excited and
like my pre-pregnancy genes.
And they're all excited andlike my pre-pregnancy genes were
hanging off my butt, you know,like falling off my body and I
and I didn't even clue in atfirst that like that is not okay
(24:14):
and had I, had I understoodwhat I know now, I would have
taken that as a very clear signthat I was undernourished and
that I believe that one of thekey nutrients that we can be
lacking, like our B vitamins andour minerals, and and how
(24:50):
important that is, because thatreally sets the stage for the
function of our cells or thedysfunction of our cells, and so
that should have been a deadgiveaway for me that I was
undernourished because I waslosing weight so rapidly.
(25:15):
We try to eliminate all thesetriggers, but we're not putting
a lot of or enough emphasis on,are we getting the nutrition we
need, and especially when wehave inflammation of our
digestive system which isaffecting our ability to absorb
(25:37):
nutrients, it's not necessarilywhat we're putting into the tank
, it's what our body is able toabsorb and utilize, and clearly
at that point my body wasn'tabsorbing or utilizing much of
anything.
So, yeah, I think I would havecome out of that episode a lot
(25:58):
quicker if I had recognized thatand started focusing on
nourishment from the get-go.
Katie (26:05):
When we're talking about in this episode anyway, when
we're talking about setbacks andnormalizing setbacks and
essentially reframing setbacksand how setbacks are actually
progress.
Would you say that goingthrough that experience shaped
(26:26):
you into the person that you aretoday?
Amanda (26:28):
Yeah, absolutely, and I think that I can look back at
that situation and I can make somany connections now.
So not only do I have thiscompassion for that version of
me, and I think everything'sconnected.
So that state of depletion thatI was in and that lack of
(26:51):
nourishment that I was receivingat the time, that led to the
quality of my thoughts, that ledto where my mental health was
at at the time where my mentalhealth was at at the time.
And I think about this oftenwhen I think about women who
suffer from postpartumdepression and how the research
(27:12):
shows that there's a very stronglink between our DHEA levels in
our body postpartum and whetherwe experience postpartum
depression or not.
And so much of it tells me thatour mental health is dependent
on our nutrient status.
But we don't get taught thatand we don't.
(27:35):
It's not reiterated by ourdoctors, the importance is
barely mentioned.
So I think about that now and ithelps me, yeah, just have more
of a compassionate understandingfor my own body and but also
for others and what other peopleare going through and so
(27:56):
knowing that these things gohand in hand and that if you are
struggling with these physicalsymptoms and lack of nourishment
and inflammation and poorabsorption of nutrients, that
your mental health is going tobe affected and it just kind of
creates this negative feedbackloop that can be really
(28:17):
difficult to get out of.
That can be really difficult toget out of.
So I definitely I value thatexperience because I can see
those connections now, and notjust from a research perspective
but from a lived experience,and I think that's why I love
(28:38):
working with the people that Iwork with in a coaching capacity
, because they're in a similarplace and I can relate to them
so deeply.
Katie (28:47):
Even people who suffer from chronic illness, and
especially on a chronic fatiguelevel.
Again going back to DHEA,there's so many links between
that and chronic fatigue, linksbetween that and chronic fatigue
.
So when it comes to absorbingon a cellular level, this
(29:08):
creates such a large amount ofchronic fatigue in patients and
that then sets off this like youmentioned negative feedback
loop in their mind becausethey're unable to like actually
just genuinely live life, um,and they can't play with their
kids and they can't go out tothe shop and they can barely do
day-to-day things that you knowthey would have been able to do
(29:30):
x amount of years ago.
So it's definitely a reallyprofound problem that so many
people are suffering from, notjust postpartum, but just
generally with with their health, when it comes to feeling like
tired all the time and it'ssomething that we're taught is
just normal or we just we acceptit.
Amanda (29:50):
We don't make those connections until we get to a
place where we're forced to lookat that and, as I said before,
I feel like that's a gift thatmy illness has given me.
Is that awareness, thatawareness of my body, that
awareness of how these systemswork and how we can really
(30:12):
support ourselves so that wetruly feel our best, not just
physically but mentally, so thatwe don't end up in these
endless loops?
Katie (30:23):
Yes, absolutely.
And in terms of that situationthat you went through, knowing
that setbacks isn't like a caseof starting over, but an
opportunity to learn and torecalibrate so probably when you
was in the depths of it, youliterally just had the complete
opposite mindset.
But transforming people's mindsto take a different stance on
(30:48):
this and look at it as a growthopportunity will completely
change your entire vision onwhere you're at right now and
where you could could be,depending on what protocol and
intervention you did next.
Amanda (31:04):
Yeah, and I think that that's why it's so important to
choose to work withpractitioners who not only are
compassionate to your situationand get it, but also that kind
of challenge you to look atthings in a different way.
Like you talk about yourconversation with John in that
moment and and him reallyshaking up the way that you were
(31:27):
looking at yourself and the waythat you were viewing your
illness.
Like we need those people inour lives who are going to do
that, who are going to questionour belief systems and say this
is this really serving you rightnow in your life?
Katie (31:43):
yeah, and have and have that and have those challenging
conversations, because thescience behind healing
fluctuations stems from the factthat symptoms can return even
when you're doing everythingright, and that's where the
mindset strength needs to reallystep in, um, yeah, and take
(32:04):
charge in those moments is youknow, even when you were going
through that postpartum, thatwould have been a great example
where mindset needed to.
You know, take control in thatsituation and think about your
nutrition, etc.
Etc.
So having someone behind youthat's keeping you accountable
(32:24):
when it comes to working with apractitioner is is so valuable
yeah, and the mindset piecereally is the thing that gets
you through these setbacks.
100 yeah, what's your stance onthe difference between
perceived failure and actualregression?
Amanda (32:44):
honestly, I feel like my mindset has completely shifted
and I don't I don't perceivesetbacks as regression at all
anymore.
Um, and I think that you, ifyou choose to view it that way,
that it can be a slippery slope,it can be easy to ride that
(33:07):
wave, kind of like we said, thatnegative feedback loop that's
created if you're allowing thosethoughts, if you're, if you're
experiencing a flare up, ifyou're in a setback, and you're
allowing those thoughts to runaway and say this is what's
going to happen next, you'regoing to have to have the
surgery and you're going to haveto go back on these medications
and you let those thoughts runwild.
(33:29):
I honestly believe that thatcan end up being your reality,
just based on that feedback loopthat is created because it's
just creating this internalstress and, like you said,
taking so much of your mentalcapacity and is creating worse
(33:51):
physical outcomes for you.
So in my life I don't evenentertain those thoughts anymore
.
They're not even a blip on myradar.
Katie (34:00):
Do you think that came from practicing how to deal with
emotions and logic, sosplitting them, being able to
split them, taking more of alogical stance, perhaps if
you're beginning a flare up orif you're feeling a bit off?
Amanda (34:17):
Yeah, I think that the biggest difference now for me is
that I have tools in my toolboxfor navigating setbacks and
flares and as soon as I start tofeel a little bit off, I have
an entire list of things in mymyself right now so that I can
give my body what it needs sothat it can heal.
(34:46):
And I know that those things forme are focusing on rest, as
much rest as possible, and maybethat's not the time to be
trying to hit PRs in the gym,letting go of that for a couple
of days or a couple of weeks, aslong as it takes to just focus
on rest and focus on recoveryand focus on nourishing my body,
(35:08):
eating things that are easy todigest or kind on my digestive
system and promotinganti-inflammatory properties,
and all of those things are kindof just my go-to strategies to
start feeling better.
And, um, when you take thosefear thoughts and those
(35:29):
emotional thoughts because I dofeel that I'm way more
emotionally regulated now, um,than I used to be a few years
ago and I think that it's a,it's a direct correlation
between things running moresmoothly in my body and my
(35:49):
physical body that then help thequality of my thoughts and and
support my mental health,because it goes both ways
absolutely yeah, and I thinkit's so important for people to
be aware of the fact that it'snot just one thing, it's you
need to be taking a multifacetedapproach to this when it comes
(36:12):
to flare-ups and not feelinggreat in yourself, because just
focusing on one thing is notgonna give the impact that your
body needs to provide the spacethat it needs to heal.
Katie (36:25):
And this is why I work on four pillars within my coaching
program, which is nutrition andthen supplements, layered on
top of that, because we can'tjust rely on supplements, like
so many people think.
Oh, I'm taking X, y, zsupplement, nothing's changing.
These are just an extension ofwhat you should be doing
(36:48):
nutritionally.
And well, like you said,movement, tuning into your body
and realizing what it needs inthat time and not causing
excessive amounts ofinflammation through training
super important when we'retrying to actually reduce
inflammation levels.
We don't want musclehypertrophy at that time.
And then it all comes down tomindset and behavior change,
because this is what's runningconstantly, like turning the
(37:09):
clogs.
That's your number one and theneverything else will feed in,
but it's it needs to be viewedas a multi-faceted perspective,
because you can't just rely onone thing and expect a profound
change and unfortunately, youknow, the human body is so
complex, it just doesn't worklike that yeah, and I also like
to think of it.
Amanda (37:29):
the approach that I take with dealing with setbacks or
dealing with flare-ups is verysimilar to the approach that I
take when I get a cold or whenmy kids get a cold.
So if you are one of thosepeople who is super busy and has
a busy work schedule and youstart to experience cold
(37:49):
symptoms, you kind of have twooptions.
You can dial things back inyour schedule, focus on rest,
focus on nourishing your body,giving it what it needs, taking
the time to heal early on sothat this doesn't turn into
something bigger and more severe.
(38:10):
Or you can be that person whosays I don't have time for this
right now, I've got this projectdue at work and just starts
popping cold meds to dampen thesymptoms yeah, to suppress the
symptoms and just keep plowingforward, which quite often
results in longer healing timesbecause we're not actually
(38:33):
honoring our body, listening toour body and giving it what it
needs to heal early on.
So I use that same approach withdealing with flare ups.
I could kind of disassociateand say this isn't happening to
me and just keep pushing through.
Or I could listen early on tomy body and give it what it
needs so that healing happensfaster and it doesn't turn into
(38:57):
this big prolonged battle formonths.
Katie (38:59):
And I think there's like a beautiful, like spiritual
element to that, because I knowme and you are so aligned with
spirituality coming into this.
But I think tuning into ourbody and doing what's best for
our higher self is well.
Making ourselves a priority,basically, and not putting work
(39:22):
first or gym first or whateverit might be, is another learning
curve for people, because a lotof the time we're on this
fast-paced life just on thehamster wheel and learning how
to slow down is so difficult forso many people it's the most
difficult, especially for women.
Amanda (39:43):
I find this especially for women.
Asking a woman, a busy woman,to slow down is probably the
hardest thing sometimes and alsogoing back to setbacks.
Katie (39:59):
Um, a lot of people have this all or nothing mindset,
where you know they have asetback and they just throw in
the towel because they don'tknow how to cope with it, and
they don't know how to workthrough it, because one bad day
doesn't undo months of progress.
So, yeah, I think that's alsoquite a large element all or
nothing mindset around acceptingwhat they deem to be failure or
(40:25):
setbacks yeah, and I think thatties right into that
perfectionist mentality if Ican't do something perfect, then
it's not worth doing.
Amanda (40:33):
Or you see this a lot with people in their
relationship to exercise.
They'll start these new year'sresolutions and I'm going to hit
the gym five days a week andit's going to be amazing and I'm
going to transform my body andit's going to be awesome.
And then, as soon as they don'tmeasure up to that expectation
(40:53):
of perfection that they placedon themselves, it's oh, I knew I
wasn't going to be able to dothis.
You know I'm a failure.
Who was I kidding?
And, like you said, they throwin the towel.
And I think there's so muchpower in recognizing those
patterns and choosing to do it adifferent way and playing the
long game and really recognizingthat your health and
(41:16):
prioritizing yourself is thelong game and we're doing this
for the rest of our lives, so wemay as well get comfortable
here, stop trying to aim forperfection and just do our best
and just keep going and justkeep moving forward step by step
and forget about thoseexpectations of how long it's
(41:37):
going to take or what it's goingto look like.
Katie (41:40):
And also learning how to detach your self-worth from the
actual healing process, becauseyour health journey doesn't
define your value, and I thinkthat's so important.
Amanda (41:53):
Oh, yes, yeah.
Katie (41:55):
So you might be thinking like okay, be thinking like okay
, I hear you, but how do Iactually put that in practice in
real time?
What practical ways can Ireframe failure essentially?
So what kind of things wouldyou say in your head to reframe
these negative words like Ifailed for, for example, whereas
(42:21):
in that case it should bereally, what did this setback
teach me?
Amanda (42:25):
Recognizing that setbacks or perceived failures
are just part of the journey andthat it doesn't define you.
It doesn't define your worth.
You are not failing because youhave reached a setback.
It's just more information andwhen you look back later on,
those are your growth moments.
Katie (42:47):
Those challenging setbacks are just an opportunity
to learn and then grow, andthat's ultimately what builds
resilience in us making thesesmall, tiny little changes and
adjustments in how you speak toyourself and the words that you
(43:07):
use is what's going toessentially create this larger
movement where you're taking adifferent stance on things and
not perceiving setbacks in aparticular way, but it's all
about how you speak to yourself.
That is the first thing thatyou would address when it comes
(43:29):
to awareness and then behaviorchange.
Amanda (43:33):
Yeah, 100%.
And I think, when I think backto all of the setbacks that I've
experienced, it really was amental game more than it was a
physical.
Yeah it's, it's the moving pastthose mental plateaus is where
the work truly is.
Katie (43:52):
Yeah, and staying grounded in those moments when
progress feels just completelyout of reach, and installing
these rituals into your dailylife so that they become
habitual, because it's all welland good saying all this stuff,
but it's like, well, how do I,how do I put that into practice?
These are the kind of thingsthat you can be doing at home to
(44:13):
start changing the way that youthink and the way that you feel
and how you deal withsituations when they come up.
Amanda (44:20):
Yeah, and I think that community can be a really huge
component to that as well,having supportive people around
you that get it, and that can betricky to find, because I know
I don't know about you, but whenI first started navigating my
journey with colitis, I wentlooking for like online
(44:42):
communities, online supportgroups to try to understand my
illness a little bit more, andwhat I found in a lot of these
Facebook groups is a lot of themare really toxic and a lot of
them were people projectingtheir experience on to others,
saying like oh, this happened tome, and as if this is going to
be your fate.
(45:03):
So I would say, be very carefulwith those types of communities
and really just gravitate towardthe people who are encouraging
and supportive and compassionateand building you up and telling
you like you're going to getthrough this, versus the the
ones that are doom and gloom andfear-mongering oh, it's just no
(45:29):
, it's just not going to help inany way if someone is going
through a setback right now andthey feel like giving up, what
advice would you give them?
I think that trying to look atthings from too broad of a
perspective can be reallyharmful.
So just taking things day byday is probably the easiest way
(45:50):
to make things more manageable.
So don't focus on a year downthe road or two years down the
road.
Focus on today and what you cando.
What can I do in this moment,today.
And then, if you have someonethat you can reach out to for
support, definitely reach out,because things get less heavy
(46:13):
when you share them withsomebody else.
If you're the only one who isdrowning in your thoughts and
trying to navigate this yourself, life can just feel very lonely
and isolating.
But as soon as you ask someoneto join you in that, it all of a
sudden just feels a little bitlighter.
Katie (46:33):
And they can also offer accountability, because when
you're in a really hard time andyou might be feeling super low
and a little bit helpless,having someone there to to share
this experience with um, theycan actually, in a way, be your
accountability system.
(46:54):
So for us, it's obviously we'reour client's accountability
system.
That's really how you start totrack and see progress is when
you have that accountabilitybehind you, because they're not
going to let you have thisnegative self-talk loop going on
, because they'll be there,they'll be your cheerleader and
(47:14):
they'll be able to pick out thesmall wins that you're going to
be experiencing whilst you'rehealing that you will just
normally bypass, because wedon't ever acknowledge any kind
of win unless it's like thelottery or something yeah, that
damn negativity bias in ourbrain
Amanda (47:33):
yeah just doesn't let us celebrate no, it just takes
over.
Katie (47:37):
so yeah, I completely agree, if you could reach out
and get that support networkingsystem in place, it's going to
really really help you yeahabsolutely.
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