May 27, 2025 • 32 mins
This recap episode captures a conversation between Joe Rogan and AJ Gentile, the creator of a YouTube channel focused on unexplained phenomena and conspiracy theories. They discuss a wide range of topics including UFOs, ancient civilisations, government cover-ups, and other mysteries. Gentile explains his channel's format of presenting intriguing stories before often providing potential debunkings, while also sharing his personal fascination with these subjects since childhood. The discussion touches on specific cases such as the Roswell incident, alleged structures in the Grand Canyon, the Hollow Moon theory, and the potential for advanced technology being hidden or misunderstood.
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(00:00):
Welcome to the Joe Rogan recap. Great to be here.
This deep dive is all about a fascinating, really sprawling
conversation that happened recently featuring AJ Gentile,
the creator of the Y Files. Oh yeah, that one.
You sent us the sources and wow are they packed.
They really are. It touches on, well, everything
from ancient structures and lostcivilizations to UFO's,
(00:23):
potential alien life, and some seriously heavy topics about
government secrets and, frankly,the nature of reality itself, at
least as presented through this particular lens.
Right, so our mission today is to jump into this stack of
sources with you, unpack the core ideas, maybe highlight the
most surprising details. Look at the.
Claims the counter argument. Exactly.
(00:45):
And really figure out why these topics hold such a grip on our
imagination, you know? What are the real Nuggets of
insight for you in all this? And thinking critically about
these things is absolutely key, especially when the information
gets as weird as it does in these sources.
So to start, let's maybe understand where AJ Gentile is
coming from and the approach he takes with the Y files.
(01:05):
OK, let's unpack this. AJ grew up steeped in the
strange picture this his dad wasan overnight cop, so he was
always listening to overnight radio.
Think Doctor Demento and Art Bell.
You know, the king of the weird late night airwaves.
Art Bell, of course. Classic.
Plus classics like The Twilight Zone were basically like
required family viewing, so thatfoundation of strange stories
(01:28):
and fringe topics was always there for.
That totally sets the stage and the catalyst for him actually
starting his unique show sounds pretty intense.
He was running a successful podcast studio in LA, even
hosted some well known guys likeKill Tony and Jeremiah Watkins
out of there during the early COVID days.
Things were going well. Yeah, but then the city locked
(01:52):
down in a way he describes as like, impossible.
And then somehow things got violent.
He and his wife ended up having this harrowing experience racing
down Hollywood Blvd. being chased by people.
That was the tipping point he packed up and got out of.
LA whoa, that's, that's a dramatic shift.
And that intensity led him to pivot and create the Y files.
(02:13):
He explained the distinctive format, and this is what makes
it interesting. OK.
He starts by getting listeners really jazzed up with these
wild, classic fringe stories. We're talking Anunnaki, aliens,
secret bases, hollow Earth, the whole spectrum.
You know the stuff. All the hits, yeah.
But here's where it gets really interesting and where it hits on
a core tension of exploring these topics topics.
(02:35):
After presenting the wild story,he then tries to look for the
truth for evidence to, as he puts it, debunk these stories.
He actively seeks the most rational or even mundane
explanation. OK, so he builds it up then
tears it down essentially. Kind of, yeah.
And the reaction he gets to thisapproach?
He says he gets so much heat andhate mail.
(02:55):
Really. Why?
Because, and he says this directly, nobody wants to know
the truth. People just want to stay in the
fun story, the mystery. That's interesting people prefer
the fantasy. Exactly.
That right there is central to his show, and honestly, central
to our own curiosity about thesetopics, isn't it?
This tension between wanting to believe something amazing,
(03:16):
something that pushes the boundaries, and then being
confronted with the possibility that it might just be, as he
says, horseshit? Why are we, you included, so
drawn to these mysteries, even if the logical conclusion might
be less exciting? That's the million question,
isn't it? It speaks to a deep human desire
for wonder, for the world to be more mysterious than mundane.
(03:39):
And that desire is constantly bumping up against critical
thinking and, well, evidence. Or the lack of it sometimes.
Speaking of mysteries that bump up against evidence or lack
thereof, let's dive into some ofthe specific ancient enigmas
discussed in the source, the Grand Canyon one.
OK, first up is this incredible Grand Canyon story AJ talks
about based on an alleged 1909 Phoenix Gazette article.
(04:02):
It details a guy named GE Kincaid.
Kincaid, right, who was supposedly looking for gold
deposits and found man made steps carved into the rockface
leading up to a hidden cave entrance.
Man made steps in the Grand Canyon, 1909 and inside.
He described finding Egyptian like hieroglyphics, but they
weren't quite Egyptian. There was a statue described as
(04:23):
like Buddha. Again, not Egyptian, not quite
human. Weird.
Plus weapons, Shields, gold, artifacts, all sorts of strange
things that just didn't fit the known history of the area.
OK, so a whole treasure trove ofweirdness.
And as the story goes, he kept exploring deeper, allegedly
finding a vast deserted city in the caverns, with tunnels and
(04:43):
structures everywhere. A.
City inside the cliffs. That's the claim he tried to
map. It came out to get an expedition
together and then vanished, never to be heard from again.
Gone. And this is where the
Smithsonian enters the picture in the source.
Right, exactly. The claim is that the
Smithsonian went down there, grabbed the artifacts and
basically made them disappear, keeping them under wraps.
(05:03):
A cover up. The source points out that the
Smithsonian is known for holdingbillions of items nobody sees.
Billions. Wow.
And is even exempt from laws requiring the return of
artifacts in certain cases like Native American remains under
Naji PRA, they have an exemption.
OK, so there's precedent for them holding things back?
What makes this story particularly range, as
(05:24):
highlighted in the source, is that the exact area where this a
legend discovery occurred is nowdesignated as a forbidden zone
within the Grand Canyon. A forbidden zone?
What does that mean? You can't explore it, you can't
fly over it, you can't even fly under the rim.
It's completely off limits. Seriously, why?
That's the question, and people who've tried to hike or raft
(05:46):
near it report seeing things like white planes flying under
the rim and black helicopters showing.
Up black helicopters. Stopping them, sometimes even
arresting them. It's like they're actively
patrolling or protecting something there.
Someone even found a giant hook anchored into the ground up
there and artifacts from the early 1900s.
OK, that is weird, but what's the counter argument?
(06:08):
Well, the counter argument presented in the source is that
the original newspaper story waslikely a total hoax from the
early 1900s, maybe created for fun, maybe for a prize.
Back then, it suggested the individuals mentioned GE Kincaid
and an essay Jordan might not have even existed.
The Fake News from 1909. Potentially.
The Smithsonian official line debunks it, pointing to the
(06:30):
article itself as potentially fabricated.
But that's where the tension is,isn't it?
This is that belief versus debunking conflict playing out.
The mundane explanation is it's a hoax.
Right. But what are the odds that the
story originates from the exact area that is now off limits,
that has active military or government presence stopping
people? That's the kicker.
(06:51):
That's the part that makes you pause and wonder.
Even if the original story is embellished or fake, is
something being kept secret there?
What are the odds as AJ says? It's a powerful coincidence, or
maybe not a coincidence at all, that fuels the enduring mystery.
Even if the details are wrong, the restriction of the area is
real. That much seems true.
OK, shifting gear slightly within ancient mysteries, the
(07:13):
source brings up other engineering enigmas, like the
Baalbek stones in Lebanon. Oh yeah, those are incredible.
Described as like a skyscraper, on its side a single enormous
piece of carved stone weighing many, many tons.
And the fundamental mystery is simply how?
How did a civilization using known ancient technology quarry,
(07:34):
move and play something that massive?
We. Still don't really know?
Then, of course, the Egyptian pyramids.
The source highlights the stark contrast between the mind
blowing precision of the Great Pyramid of Giza.
The alignment, the cutting. The engineering and later
pyramids identified as definitely Egyptian built.
They describe the layer ones as like the Timu version, meaning
(07:56):
far less sophisticated. Basically just piles of rocks by
comparison. Right, like a cheap knockoff
compared to the great. Pyramid Exactly, and the stark
difference leads into the power plant theories discussed in the
source. OK, the idea that the Great
Pyramid wasn't just a tune. Right, the internal structure,
the different chambers, evidenceof chemical residues like
hydrochloric acid and zinc sulfide, which can react to
(08:17):
create hydrogen gas. Hydrogen gas inside the pyramid.
And the details about potential copper rods going down into the
aquifer beneath the pyramid, thehydrogen flow supposedly
resonating at 440 Hertz. Which is an F Sher chord.
And the use of dense rose granite, which has a high quartz
content potentially for its piezoelectric properties,
(08:39):
generating an electrical charge under pressure.
So all these clues pointing towards some kind of like
ancient machine. That's the theory.
These are all cited as clues suggesting a potential
technological function, not justa burial place.
Yet mainstream archaeology, according to the source, is
incredibly resistant to these alternative possibilities.
(08:59):
Oh yeah, it's described as intense gatekeeping where even
suggesting these ideas can ruin careers.
Really. The source mentions a friends
experience with Egyptian archaeologists who in private
admit the mainstream story abouthow they were built and their
purpose doesn't quite add up, but they won't say it publicly.
Wow, that speaks volumes, doesn't it?
Yeah. The difficulty of challenging
(09:20):
these deeply entrenched paradigms.
Especially in a field like Egyptology, so tied to national
identity in established history.And Speaking of established
history possibly being challenged, the source mentions
Gobekli Tepe in Turkey. Right, dating back around 12,000
years, which just pushes back the timeline for complex
structures way earlier than we thought.
And there's also that controversy discussed about the
(09:43):
Turkish government allegedly planting olive trees over the
site. Yeah, despite warnings that the
roots could damage the delicate ancient structures, which
apparently they did, they had toremove them later.
It just raises concerns about preserving these incredibly
important sites that are literally rewriting our
understanding of human history. These ancient mysteries start to
(10:04):
connect to the potential for lost civilizations and
cataclysmic events. The Richard Structure or the Eye
of the Sahara in Mauritania is discussed.
Yeah, some researchers, like Jimmy Corsetti mentioned in the
source, argue it matches Plato'sdescription of Atlantis.
Atlantis. How so?
Mountains to the north, a river that used to flow to the South,
(10:24):
the concentric rings of land andwater.
The size is about right and there's residual salt on the
ground, suggesting a flood. Wow.
The description fits. And the visual evidence of what
looks like it was completely delude or washed out by a
massive flood also supports thistheory, plus the idea there
might be multiple similar eyes elsewhere.
(10:45):
This really ties into Graham Hancock's concept discussed in
The Source of humans being a species with amnesia.
Right. The idea that sophisticated
civilizations may have existed multiple times in the last, say,
300,000 years. That's how long anatomically
modern humans have been around multiple times that these
civilizations were potentially knocked back to the Stone Age
(11:05):
repeatedly by cataclysmic events.
Like what? The Younger Dryas impact theory
is mentioned as a possible example.
An asteroid hitting the Yucatan around 12,800 years ago causing
widespread destruction. Climate change.
There's an Iridium layer in the geology that points to something
like that. So cosmic reset button.
Potentially, and the logical question that flows from this is
(11:28):
if an advanced civilization existed 10s or hundreds of
thousands of years ago, what physical evidence would even
survive? Right, erosion time.
The source concludes the only massive stone structures would
likely remain, which helps explain why the focus is so
often on these incredible, seemingly impossible megalithic
sites around the world. It provides a potential
framework for all these disparate anomalies, a lost
(11:50):
chapter of history. It offers a compelling, if
speculative, narrative that connects these ancient dots.
It makes you think anyway. OK.
Let's make a huge jump now from deep history to, well,
mysterious aerial phenomena, UFOs and the extraterrestrial
possibilities raised in the source.
This is where it gets really wild.
(12:10):
Buckle up, we have to start withthe legendary Admiral Byrd story
as it's presented. Oh, the hollow Earth guy.
Kind of flying over Antarctica, seeing Greenland woolly mammoths
being engulfed in light, encountering flying saucers with
swastikas on them. Swastikas.
Landing in a hollow Earth cavernand meeting tall aliens.
It's peak Fringe weirdness. That's a lot, yeah.
(12:32):
But the source debunks this, right?
Right. And the source immediately
follows that wild narrative withthe debunking.
The story largely comes from a later discovered diary That was
not his diary. And he flew the North Pole, not
the South Pole. OK, important details.
However, there's that lingering weirdness.
He did go radio silent for about3 hours during that North Pole
(12:54):
flight every. Hours.
Why? Nobody knows for sure, and later
he did warn that the poles were vulnerable space.
So even the debunking leaves a question mark.
It's not completely clean. Still strange.
What else? The conversation also touches on
things like HAARP, the High Frequency Active Auroral
Research program in Alaska. Right, that big antenna ray.
(13:15):
Essentially a powerful U.S. government radio transmitter
built to study the ionosphere, the source notes its high cost
and its capability to ionize parts of the atmosphere, linking
it to discussions about Direct Energy weapon conspiracies.
OK, so potential weather controlor weapon systems, got it.
And then there's the Jeep conspiracy.
Well of Project Bluebeam. Bluebeam, I've heard of this
(13:36):
one. This theory, allegedly promoted
by a guy named Serge Monist before his suspicious death, is
about manipulating minds and showing people what they want to
see or what controllers want them to see, potentially
projecting huge simulated eventsin the sky.
Like holograms? Yeah, like giant holograms
(13:56):
creating such fear and chaos that people would beg for
authority and willingly give up their freedom for perceived
safety. A mass psychological operation.
That's terrifying if true. From potential psychological
operations, we move to the topicof disclosure with a capital D.
Right. The source brings up how put off
a respected physicist and otherswho reportedly produced a report
(14:19):
for the George W Bush administration.
Was the report about? It weighed the pros and cons of
officially disclosing that the US had retrieved alleged alien
craft and biological entities like bodies.
What did they conclude? The finding?
The cons significantly outweigh the benefits, citing much more
disruption to society, leading to the decision not to disclose.
So basically, people can't handle the truth.
(14:40):
Seems like it, and this isn't the first time that idea has
surfaced. The source mentions the similar
finding in the 1960 Brookings report commissioned by NASA,
which also recommended against disclosure due to potential
societal upheaval. So this has been the thinking
for decades. Apparently, there's also the
fear aspect discussed. What if other countries like
(15:01):
China or Iran already have or are developing this kind of
technology? The.
Geopolitical angle. Reagan's famous UN speech about
a potential alien threat unitinghumanity comes up I.
Don't remember that one. But the source also links it to
the SDI program Star Wars developing laser weapons, just
in case. Hal Puthoff is cited as
believing the US has at least 10retrieved craft, and other
(15:23):
governments likely have similar numbers. 10 Craft Wow.
OK, what about actual sightings?The source sprinkles in witness
sightings, too, adding a human element like Gino's story of
seeing a giant orb of light overthe Pacific.
Gino, the Joe's producer. Yeah, and Dave Foley allegedly
seeing the exact same thing. The common theme in these
stories is being so in awe or shock that they didn't even
(15:45):
think to grab their phone and record it.
That's interesting. Too stunned to fill?
Which is fascinating, the directexperience overwriting the
modern instinct to document everything.
And then there are the more concrete sightings discussed,
like transmedium Uaps. Transmedium.
Objects picked up on radar, suggesting they have mass, heat
(16:05):
or electromagnetic displacement that can transition seamlessly
between air and water, go right into the ocean without slowing
down. Like the Tic Tac video?
Commander Fravers Tic Tac sighting is the prime example
referenced. Multiple credible witnesses, an
object under the water seeminglymimicking an aircraft carrier
target, jamming radar signals and performing impossible
(16:28):
maneuvers and acceleration speeds that are just unreal.
And the source mentions the debunking efforts.
Yeah, like those by Mick West are sometimes seen as trying too
hard to explain away everything.Like, maybe the explanations are
getting more convoluted than theoriginal phenomenon.
That tension, again, the incredible witness testimony
versus the drive to find a conventional explanation,
(16:48):
however unlikely. The conversation also delves
into potential hidden bases may be related to these Uaps or
other beings. Right, there's the detail about
a structure off the coast of Malibu that appeared on Google
Maps looking like a base, but isnow blurred out, gone from the
map. The theory presented is that the
weird stuff is in the ocean because it's the best place on
(17:11):
Earth to hide. Makes sense deep ocean is less
explored than space. Could be a base for visitors or
maybe even an evolved indigenousspecies we don't know about.
Underwater civilization. OK, anonymous sources are
mentioned claiming a base near the Bermuda Triangle that the
Navy is aware of and avoids, andwhich allegedly custom builds
craft for specific missions. Custom built craft near the
(17:33):
Bermuda Triangle that's specificit's.
Out there. And of course, the source goes
into EBE's extraterrestrial biological entities.
The bodies, the term. Allegedly used for recovered
alien bodies. The incredibly strange detail
about EBE One supposedly being housed and studied by the
government at Los Alamos for five years until 1952, is
shared. They had one living with them
(17:54):
for five years. According to this account, yes.
And the detail that always makesyou pause.
EBE one allegedly liked strawberry ice cream.
Strawberry ice cream. Get out of here.
Yeah, that's almost too weird tobe made-up.
Right. I mean, would they eat and
breathe our air? It's one of those details that
adds a layer of bizarre reality,or maybe disinformation, to an
(18:15):
already unbelievable story. Theories about their appearance
are discussed too. Yeah, often described as
genderless, with large heads andeyes that might have evolved
underground or perhaps function like natural sunglasses in a
highlight environment, it's a collection of truly peculiar
details drawn from these fringe narratives.
Peculiar is an understatement, and navigating all of this
(18:37):
requires a healthy dose of skepticism.
Absolutely. And an understanding that not
everything presented, even in seemingly credible accounts is
as it seems. Which naturally leads us to the
topic of government manipulationand disinformation raised in the
source. Yeah, this is crucial.
There's the explicit idea that some of the UFO phenomena or the
narrative surrounding them couldbe deliberate disinformation, a
(18:58):
SIOP, A psychological operation by the government.
Why would they do that? The theory being that they
release a bunch of horseshit about UFOs or attach really
kooky stuff to stuff that's realin order to muddy the waters.
Discredit legitimate researchers.
Guilt by the association. Or simply make people think the
real sensitive stuff is also just kooky plausible
(19:19):
deniability. This loops back to figures like
Mick West right with the playfulquestioning and source about who
you working for. Exactly.
And it ties into The Mirage Men documentary.
That film explored fake crop circles as an art experiment
that got tangled up with government disinformation
campaign. Oh yeah, allegedly involving
figures like Richard Doty, who fed Bill Moore bogus information
(19:42):
about Roswell and Majestic 12, seemingly to contaminate the UFO
research field on purpose. Wow, so intentionally polluting
the well of information. That's the allegation.
The recent drone scare phenomenon is also cited as a
potential more recent example ofa possible SIOP.
The drones over military bases, yeah.
Drones flying over sensitive sites note reports warning
(20:05):
pilots and then suddenly stopping before Inauguration
Day. The theory is it was a test of
public reaction or to highlight vulnerability, but it backfired
by just making people scared andconfused.
Nobody knew what was going on. It did seem very strange and
then just stopped. There's even the amusing meta
theory floating around certain online communities mentioned in
the source that Rogan and Gentile themselves are CIA
(20:27):
plants and that explains their success.
Seriously, CIA is back for podcasts.
It just shows how deep the well of distrust goes when you
discuss potential government secrecy.
Start seeing shadows everywhere.Yeah, no kidding.
The theme of gatekeeping information comes up again here,
tying back to the earlier point about this Smithsonian's power.
And it's exemption from laws requiring the return of Native
(20:49):
American burial artifacts holding on to things.
And this leads to a broader challenge of the idea of doing
your own research in a landscapefilled with potential
disinformation. Right.
The source presents a quote suggesting people aren't smart
enough to absorb complex information correctly and should
just leave it to experts. Which sounds pretty
condescending. Yeah, effectively in the sources
(21:11):
framing making us infants and denying people access to
information because they're deemed too stupid or not ready.
The Ivermectin example is used as a sharp case study in this
information distortion, the mainstream narrative presenting
it only as horse dewormer versusthe reality of it being a
required human medication for certain things, where a simple
(21:34):
Google search shows the more complex truth.
It illustrates how easily information can be twisted and
access to a fuller picture denied.
Regardless of where you stand onthat specific issue, it's about
the manipulation of the narrative.
Historical examples of potentialcover ups are also discussed.
The famous Tesla and JP Morgan story.
Yeah, Morgan funded Tesla initially for wireless
(21:55):
communication, but allegedly pulled funding for Tesla's free
energy concept. Free energy which couldn't be
metered and thus wouldn't make Morgan money.
The Warding Cliff tower was torndown and after Teslas death the
government allegedly seized his papers.
Seized his papers. Why?
J Edgar Hoover apparently sent Uncle John Trump, yes that
Trump's uncle, an MIT professor to review them.
(22:16):
Who knows what was in there? That's a piece of history you
don't hear every day. And then there's the truly
bizarre Nixon and Jackie Gleasonstory.
Oh, this one's wild. Nixon allegedly showed Gleason a
crashed UFO and embalmed alien bodies at a military base.
Maybe Homestead or Wright Patterson.
Nixon showed the honeymooner aliens.
Where did this story come from? Reportedly from Gleason's wife,
(22:39):
and the existence of Gleason's strained UFO house is noted as
circumstantial evidence of his interests.
A UFO house. OK, the source connects this
back to Nixon reportedly asking publicly about who killed JFK.
Yeah, that publicly. Apparently, and then
subsequently facing Watergate. This is framed as potentially
being related. Watergate presented as a coup
(23:00):
involving Operation Mockingbird and alleged FBI involvement in
the break in a way to shut him down.
Wow, that's a heavy implication connecting Watergate to UFOs and
JFK. It's deep conspiracy territory,
but presented as part of this web of secrets and control.
The conversation doesn't shy away from even darker
(23:21):
operations, and they're devastating human cost, pulling
no punches from the source material.
No, it goes there. Smedley Butler's famous book War
is a Racket is mentioned a. Classic.
Along with the business plot, anattempted coup by powerful
financiers like JP Morgan and others trying to recruit Butler,
a Marine general, to lead a military takeover in the 1930s.
(23:42):
A coup attempt in the US that. Butler exposed.
Then DARPA, the Defense AdvancedResearch Projects Agency, is
discussed in the context of its dark history, specifically
focusing on Agent Orange in Vietnam.
Agent Orange. The source highlights the
devastating long term health impacts on U.S. soldiers, which
reportedly resulted in more deaths than combat itself.
More than combat. The chemical companies like Dow
(24:05):
and DuPont involved, and the government's decades long denial
of responsibility. Just awful.
The source mentions a personal story.
Yeah, the heartbreaking story ofthe father-in-law waiting 40
years for Agent Orange settlement benefits and how
those benefits but still weren'tenough to cover the costs.
It's shared as a stark example of the human price paid.
This is clearly a point that resonates strongly in the
(24:27):
source. 40 years. Unbelievable.
Mcultra, the infamous CIA mind control program, is also brought
up. Right LSD experiment.
And worse, the discussion includes heartbreaking
testimonies of women subjected to horrific sexual abuse and
torture as part of the experiments.
That's horrifying. The Frank Olson case is shared a
scientist involved in him, Cultra, who developed doubts,
(24:48):
was given LSD without his knowledge, sent to a
psychiatrist linked to Sydney Gottlieb, the programs head.
Gottlieb the Poison Master. And later fell to his death from
a window. His family received a settlement
to be quiet. Officially ruled a suicide.
Later investigations suggested murder.
A settlement to be quiet tells you something.
And the equally disturbing Operation Midnight Climax, the
(25:10):
CIA using prostitutes and safe houses with two way glass in San
Francisco, again linked to mind control experiments.
Taxpayer money at work. Described bluntly in the source
as tax dollars at work by a bunch of weirdos.
It's hard to argue with that description.
It's noted that these programs like ML culture and bio weapons
been stockpiling recordedly continued in some form even
(25:31):
after executive orders were issued to stop them.
So they just kept going underground.
Showing the difficulty of truly dismantling entrenched
operations, Operation Gladio is another dark example from the
source. Is that?
A post WWIICIA program in Italy that trained a secret civilian
army. Their alleged goal?
(25:52):
To bomb civilians and blame it on communists.
Bomb their own allies. Blame it on Communists, the most
popular political party in Italyafter the fall of Mussolini's
fascism, in order to prevent them from gaining power.
Strategy of tension. You train them.
They were reportedly trained by a former Nazi general linked to
Allen Dulles, who later headed the CIA.
A Nazi general? Oh my God.
(26:13):
Civilians were killed in these massacres, like the Bologna
train station bombing. The source presents this as a
difficult point for anyone who holds patriotic or pro military
law enforcement views. Yeah.
How do you reconcile that? How do you reconcile that with
the reality of documented government actions like these?
How do you avoid becoming a monster when you're fighting
(26:33):
monsters? It's a heavy, challenging
thought drawn directly from the material, incredibly.
Heavy. That journey through secrets
from ancient ones to very recent, very dark ones naturally
brings us to the role of whistleblowers and the struggle
to find truth in this environment.
Right, and Bob Lazar's credibility is discussed as a
(26:53):
key example in the UFO context. Lazar, the guy who claimed to
work on alien tech at Area 51. The source presents him as
potentially the most credible whistleblower in the UFO space,
or at least the most significant.
Why credible? He's controversial.
Because he allegedly didn't profit immediately from his
claims and faced significant government targeting prosecution
(27:14):
for prostitution, which some seeas a setup.
A setup. And the FBI raid during the
filming of the Jeremy Korbel documentary about him.
They raided his business. What was the RAID supposedly
about? The theory presented is that the
raid wasn't really about the prostitution charges, but about
whether Lazar had a sample of stable element 115, element 1.
(27:35):
15 The fuel source. Which he claimed to have taken
from Area 51's S4 facility. The idea is that element 115 is
crucial for gravity propulsion technology.
Has it been synthesized? A temporary, unstable form has
been synthesized in laboratorieslike in Russia, but Lazar
claimed to have a stable versionused in the alien craft he
(27:56):
worked on. That's the key difference.
So the FBI might have been looking for that sample.
That's the speculation. The general skepticism around
whistleblowers is acknowledged, though.
Yeah, it's tough. The source mentions factors
considered when assessing credibility.
Do they have a background in intelligence?
Are they on the payroll? Do they have a book or movie
deal lined up immediately? Have they released fake photos?
(28:17):
Does Lazar pass that test according to the source?
Lazar, in the view presented, doesn't seem to have these
typical red flags in the way others might, especially early
on. He came forward, lost his
anonymity and face repercussions.
OK. Any other whistleblowers
mentioned? A more recent example is also
mentioned a whistleblower discussed by Jeremy Korbel and
George Knapp. This person is described as a
(28:38):
young kid, career ruined, clearly nervous.
Oh guy who allegedly found filesabout something called
Immaculate Constellation. Immaculate Constellation?
What's that? Supposedly a project related to
recovering alien craft. Non human technology retrieval.
Another secret project name. These cases just highlight how
difficult it is to discern truthwhen dealing with highly
(29:00):
classified information and individuals who might be under
immense pressure or have complexmotivations.
It's a murky world. So if we zoom out and try to
synthesize all of this, from ancient, seemingly impossible
stone structures and potential lost civilizations to alleged
underwater bases, modern UAP sightings, mind control
programs, disinformation campaigns and documents,
(29:22):
implemented, government operations with dark histories,
it's a vast interconnected web presented in the sources.
It's almost overwhelming. It is, and what runs through it
all is that core tension we talked about at the beginning,
the desire to believe in amazingpossibilities.
All right, ancient tech helpful aliens.
Versus the often uncomfortable, sometimes brutal truth of human
(29:43):
hoaxes, deliberate government deception, or simply our own
limitations in understanding theworld.
These species with amnesia idea from Graham Hancock really
resonates here, doesn't? It it does perhaps a lot of the
strangeness we encounter, these ancient anomalies, these lost
technologies, simply lost history and knowledge that we've
(30:04):
forgotten due to massive cataclysmic events that reset
civilization. A forgotten past haunting our
present. And it's also worth considering
the possibility that some of thephenomena we categorize as UFOs
or alien encounters are deliberate government actions.
Like Bluebeam or something less dramatic.
Perhaps disclosures, tests, or even psychological operations
(30:24):
intended to prepare the public or serve other strategic aims.
Even if, as the drone scare example suggested, they
backfired and were executed effectively, maybe they're not
as good at it as they think. That's an interesting thought.
Maybe some of it is disclosure just done badly.
Could be. It's fascinating how humor is
sprinkled throughout the source material discussing these
incredibly heavy topics. Mentioning Hecklefish, the
(30:46):
theory they're CIA backed. Right the fish puppet Co host on
Y files. The absurdity of the Ivermectin
situation, that stark quote about fighting monsters, that
light touch even when dealing with such dark subjects, is
almost necessary to make it digestible.
Absolutely. It helps maintain some
perspective when exploring thesedeep, sometimes disturbing
(31:07):
corners of history and speculation.
Keeps it from being purely overwhelming or depressing.
And ultimately, that feels like the value of exploring sources
like this in a deep dive and theapproach of shows like the Y
Files. They breakdown complex or fringe
topics. They force you to look at
different angles, including the potential debunking and the
uncomfortable truths. And they encourage you, the
(31:28):
listener, to stay curious and think for yourself about what
might be really happening behindthe veil.
Even if definitive answers remain elusive, the process of
questioning, exploring the possibilities, and critically
evaluating the information is where the real understanding is
gained. It's the journey, not just the
destination. Absolutely.
So we've taken this deep dive into a wide-ranging source,
(31:50):
exploring everything from alleged ancient cover ups and
potential alien visitors to veryreal government programs with
undeniably dark histories. It really highlights the
persistent nature of secrets, whether ancient, alien or
governmental, and their undeniable power to shape
narratives, control information,and influence public
(32:11):
understanding. What we don't know might be as
important as what we do and. It leaves us with a powerful
question to consider building oneverything we've discussed
today. If even a fraction of these
stories, yeah, particularly those involving hidden
technologies or concealed histories that suggest
alternative possibilities about our past or present, we're
definitively proven true. How fundamentally, with your
(32:31):
understanding of the world, our place in the cosmos and the true
capabilities of those in power have to change?
Exactly. Yeah.
And how much potential knowledge, progress, or even
safety you might have been sacrificed, hidden away by
keeping these secrets? What have we lost by not
knowing?
Welcome to the Joe Rogan recap. Great to be here.
This deep dive is all about a fascinating, really sprawling
conversation that happened recently featuring AJ Gentile,
the creator of the Y Files. Oh yeah, that one.
You sent us the sources and wow are they packed.
They really are. It touches on, well, everything
from ancient structures and lostcivilizations to UFO's,
(00:23):
potential alien life, and some seriously heavy topics about
government secrets and, frankly,the nature of reality itself, at
least as presented through this particular lens.
Right, so our mission today is to jump into this stack of
sources with you, unpack the core ideas, maybe highlight the
most surprising details. Look at the.
Claims the counter argument. Exactly.
(00:45):
And really figure out why these topics hold such a grip on our
imagination, you know? What are the real Nuggets of
insight for you in all this? And thinking critically about
these things is absolutely key, especially when the information
gets as weird as it does in these sources.
So to start, let's maybe understand where AJ Gentile is
coming from and the approach he takes with the Y files.
(01:05):
OK, let's unpack this. AJ grew up steeped in the
strange picture this his dad wasan overnight cop, so he was
always listening to overnight radio.
Think Doctor Demento and Art Bell.
You know, the king of the weird late night airwaves.
Art Bell, of course. Classic.
Plus classics like The Twilight Zone were basically like
required family viewing, so thatfoundation of strange stories
(01:28):
and fringe topics was always there for.
That totally sets the stage and the catalyst for him actually
starting his unique show sounds pretty intense.
He was running a successful podcast studio in LA, even
hosted some well known guys likeKill Tony and Jeremiah Watkins
out of there during the early COVID days.
Things were going well. Yeah, but then the city locked
(01:52):
down in a way he describes as like, impossible.
And then somehow things got violent.
He and his wife ended up having this harrowing experience racing
down Hollywood Blvd. being chased by people.
That was the tipping point he packed up and got out of.
LA whoa, that's, that's a dramatic shift.
And that intensity led him to pivot and create the Y files.
(02:13):
He explained the distinctive format, and this is what makes
it interesting. OK.
He starts by getting listeners really jazzed up with these
wild, classic fringe stories. We're talking Anunnaki, aliens,
secret bases, hollow Earth, the whole spectrum.
You know the stuff. All the hits, yeah.
But here's where it gets really interesting and where it hits on
a core tension of exploring these topics topics.
(02:35):
After presenting the wild story,he then tries to look for the
truth for evidence to, as he puts it, debunk these stories.
He actively seeks the most rational or even mundane
explanation. OK, so he builds it up then
tears it down essentially. Kind of, yeah.
And the reaction he gets to thisapproach?
He says he gets so much heat andhate mail.
(02:55):
Really. Why?
Because, and he says this directly, nobody wants to know
the truth. People just want to stay in the
fun story, the mystery. That's interesting people prefer
the fantasy. Exactly.
That right there is central to his show, and honestly, central
to our own curiosity about thesetopics, isn't it?
This tension between wanting to believe something amazing,
(03:16):
something that pushes the boundaries, and then being
confronted with the possibility that it might just be, as he
says, horseshit? Why are we, you included, so
drawn to these mysteries, even if the logical conclusion might
be less exciting? That's the million question,
isn't it? It speaks to a deep human desire
for wonder, for the world to be more mysterious than mundane.
(03:39):
And that desire is constantly bumping up against critical
thinking and, well, evidence. Or the lack of it sometimes.
Speaking of mysteries that bump up against evidence or lack
thereof, let's dive into some ofthe specific ancient enigmas
discussed in the source, the Grand Canyon one.
OK, first up is this incredible Grand Canyon story AJ talks
about based on an alleged 1909 Phoenix Gazette article.
(04:02):
It details a guy named GE Kincaid.
Kincaid, right, who was supposedly looking for gold
deposits and found man made steps carved into the rockface
leading up to a hidden cave entrance.
Man made steps in the Grand Canyon, 1909 and inside.
He described finding Egyptian like hieroglyphics, but they
weren't quite Egyptian. There was a statue described as
(04:23):
like Buddha. Again, not Egyptian, not quite
human. Weird.
Plus weapons, Shields, gold, artifacts, all sorts of strange
things that just didn't fit the known history of the area.
OK, so a whole treasure trove ofweirdness.
And as the story goes, he kept exploring deeper, allegedly
finding a vast deserted city in the caverns, with tunnels and
(04:43):
structures everywhere. A.
City inside the cliffs. That's the claim he tried to
map. It came out to get an expedition
together and then vanished, never to be heard from again.
Gone. And this is where the
Smithsonian enters the picture in the source.
Right, exactly. The claim is that the
Smithsonian went down there, grabbed the artifacts and
basically made them disappear, keeping them under wraps.
(05:03):
A cover up. The source points out that the
Smithsonian is known for holdingbillions of items nobody sees.
Billions. Wow.
And is even exempt from laws requiring the return of
artifacts in certain cases like Native American remains under
Naji PRA, they have an exemption.
OK, so there's precedent for them holding things back?
What makes this story particularly range, as
(05:24):
highlighted in the source, is that the exact area where this a
legend discovery occurred is nowdesignated as a forbidden zone
within the Grand Canyon. A forbidden zone?
What does that mean? You can't explore it, you can't
fly over it, you can't even fly under the rim.
It's completely off limits. Seriously, why?
That's the question, and people who've tried to hike or raft
(05:46):
near it report seeing things like white planes flying under
the rim and black helicopters showing.
Up black helicopters. Stopping them, sometimes even
arresting them. It's like they're actively
patrolling or protecting something there.
Someone even found a giant hook anchored into the ground up
there and artifacts from the early 1900s.
OK, that is weird, but what's the counter argument?
(06:08):
Well, the counter argument presented in the source is that
the original newspaper story waslikely a total hoax from the
early 1900s, maybe created for fun, maybe for a prize.
Back then, it suggested the individuals mentioned GE Kincaid
and an essay Jordan might not have even existed.
The Fake News from 1909. Potentially.
The Smithsonian official line debunks it, pointing to the
(06:30):
article itself as potentially fabricated.
But that's where the tension is,isn't it?
This is that belief versus debunking conflict playing out.
The mundane explanation is it's a hoax.
Right. But what are the odds that the
story originates from the exact area that is now off limits,
that has active military or government presence stopping
people? That's the kicker.
(06:51):
That's the part that makes you pause and wonder.
Even if the original story is embellished or fake, is
something being kept secret there?
What are the odds as AJ says? It's a powerful coincidence, or
maybe not a coincidence at all, that fuels the enduring mystery.
Even if the details are wrong, the restriction of the area is
real. That much seems true.
OK, shifting gear slightly within ancient mysteries, the
(07:13):
source brings up other engineering enigmas, like the
Baalbek stones in Lebanon. Oh yeah, those are incredible.
Described as like a skyscraper, on its side a single enormous
piece of carved stone weighing many, many tons.
And the fundamental mystery is simply how?
How did a civilization using known ancient technology quarry,
(07:34):
move and play something that massive?
We. Still don't really know?
Then, of course, the Egyptian pyramids.
The source highlights the stark contrast between the mind
blowing precision of the Great Pyramid of Giza.
The alignment, the cutting. The engineering and later
pyramids identified as definitely Egyptian built.
They describe the layer ones as like the Timu version, meaning
(07:56):
far less sophisticated. Basically just piles of rocks by
comparison. Right, like a cheap knockoff
compared to the great. Pyramid Exactly, and the stark
difference leads into the power plant theories discussed in the
source. OK, the idea that the Great
Pyramid wasn't just a tune. Right, the internal structure,
the different chambers, evidenceof chemical residues like
hydrochloric acid and zinc sulfide, which can react to
(08:17):
create hydrogen gas. Hydrogen gas inside the pyramid.
And the details about potential copper rods going down into the
aquifer beneath the pyramid, thehydrogen flow supposedly
resonating at 440 Hertz. Which is an F Sher chord.
And the use of dense rose granite, which has a high quartz
content potentially for its piezoelectric properties,
(08:39):
generating an electrical charge under pressure.
So all these clues pointing towards some kind of like
ancient machine. That's the theory.
These are all cited as clues suggesting a potential
technological function, not justa burial place.
Yet mainstream archaeology, according to the source, is
incredibly resistant to these alternative possibilities.
(08:59):
Oh yeah, it's described as intense gatekeeping where even
suggesting these ideas can ruin careers.
Really. The source mentions a friends
experience with Egyptian archaeologists who in private
admit the mainstream story abouthow they were built and their
purpose doesn't quite add up, but they won't say it publicly.
Wow, that speaks volumes, doesn't it?
Yeah. The difficulty of challenging
(09:20):
these deeply entrenched paradigms.
Especially in a field like Egyptology, so tied to national
identity in established history.And Speaking of established
history possibly being challenged, the source mentions
Gobekli Tepe in Turkey. Right, dating back around 12,000
years, which just pushes back the timeline for complex
structures way earlier than we thought.
And there's also that controversy discussed about the
(09:43):
Turkish government allegedly planting olive trees over the
site. Yeah, despite warnings that the
roots could damage the delicate ancient structures, which
apparently they did, they had toremove them later.
It just raises concerns about preserving these incredibly
important sites that are literally rewriting our
understanding of human history. These ancient mysteries start to
(10:04):
connect to the potential for lost civilizations and
cataclysmic events. The Richard Structure or the Eye
of the Sahara in Mauritania is discussed.
Yeah, some researchers, like Jimmy Corsetti mentioned in the
source, argue it matches Plato'sdescription of Atlantis.
Atlantis. How so?
Mountains to the north, a river that used to flow to the South,
(10:24):
the concentric rings of land andwater.
The size is about right and there's residual salt on the
ground, suggesting a flood. Wow.
The description fits. And the visual evidence of what
looks like it was completely delude or washed out by a
massive flood also supports thistheory, plus the idea there
might be multiple similar eyes elsewhere.
(10:45):
This really ties into Graham Hancock's concept discussed in
The Source of humans being a species with amnesia.
Right. The idea that sophisticated
civilizations may have existed multiple times in the last, say,
300,000 years. That's how long anatomically
modern humans have been around multiple times that these
civilizations were potentially knocked back to the Stone Age
(11:05):
repeatedly by cataclysmic events.
Like what? The Younger Dryas impact theory
is mentioned as a possible example.
An asteroid hitting the Yucatan around 12,800 years ago causing
widespread destruction. Climate change.
There's an Iridium layer in the geology that points to something
like that. So cosmic reset button.
Potentially, and the logical question that flows from this is
(11:28):
if an advanced civilization existed 10s or hundreds of
thousands of years ago, what physical evidence would even
survive? Right, erosion time.
The source concludes the only massive stone structures would
likely remain, which helps explain why the focus is so
often on these incredible, seemingly impossible megalithic
sites around the world. It provides a potential
framework for all these disparate anomalies, a lost
(11:50):
chapter of history. It offers a compelling, if
speculative, narrative that connects these ancient dots.
It makes you think anyway. OK.
Let's make a huge jump now from deep history to, well,
mysterious aerial phenomena, UFOs and the extraterrestrial
possibilities raised in the source.
This is where it gets really wild.
(12:10):
Buckle up, we have to start withthe legendary Admiral Byrd story
as it's presented. Oh, the hollow Earth guy.
Kind of flying over Antarctica, seeing Greenland woolly mammoths
being engulfed in light, encountering flying saucers with
swastikas on them. Swastikas.
Landing in a hollow Earth cavernand meeting tall aliens.
It's peak Fringe weirdness. That's a lot, yeah.
(12:32):
But the source debunks this, right?
Right. And the source immediately
follows that wild narrative withthe debunking.
The story largely comes from a later discovered diary That was
not his diary. And he flew the North Pole, not
the South Pole. OK, important details.
However, there's that lingering weirdness.
He did go radio silent for about3 hours during that North Pole
(12:54):
flight every. Hours.
Why? Nobody knows for sure, and later
he did warn that the poles were vulnerable space.
So even the debunking leaves a question mark.
It's not completely clean. Still strange.
What else? The conversation also touches on
things like HAARP, the High Frequency Active Auroral
Research program in Alaska. Right, that big antenna ray.
(13:15):
Essentially a powerful U.S. government radio transmitter
built to study the ionosphere, the source notes its high cost
and its capability to ionize parts of the atmosphere, linking
it to discussions about Direct Energy weapon conspiracies.
OK, so potential weather controlor weapon systems, got it.
And then there's the Jeep conspiracy.
Well of Project Bluebeam. Bluebeam, I've heard of this
(13:36):
one. This theory, allegedly promoted
by a guy named Serge Monist before his suspicious death, is
about manipulating minds and showing people what they want to
see or what controllers want them to see, potentially
projecting huge simulated eventsin the sky.
Like holograms? Yeah, like giant holograms
(13:56):
creating such fear and chaos that people would beg for
authority and willingly give up their freedom for perceived
safety. A mass psychological operation.
That's terrifying if true. From potential psychological
operations, we move to the topicof disclosure with a capital D.
Right. The source brings up how put off
a respected physicist and otherswho reportedly produced a report
(14:19):
for the George W Bush administration.
Was the report about? It weighed the pros and cons of
officially disclosing that the US had retrieved alleged alien
craft and biological entities like bodies.
What did they conclude? The finding?
The cons significantly outweigh the benefits, citing much more
disruption to society, leading to the decision not to disclose.
So basically, people can't handle the truth.
(14:40):
Seems like it, and this isn't the first time that idea has
surfaced. The source mentions the similar
finding in the 1960 Brookings report commissioned by NASA,
which also recommended against disclosure due to potential
societal upheaval. So this has been the thinking
for decades. Apparently, there's also the
fear aspect discussed. What if other countries like
(15:01):
China or Iran already have or are developing this kind of
technology? The.
Geopolitical angle. Reagan's famous UN speech about
a potential alien threat unitinghumanity comes up I.
Don't remember that one. But the source also links it to
the SDI program Star Wars developing laser weapons, just
in case. Hal Puthoff is cited as
believing the US has at least 10retrieved craft, and other
(15:23):
governments likely have similar numbers. 10 Craft Wow.
OK, what about actual sightings?The source sprinkles in witness
sightings, too, adding a human element like Gino's story of
seeing a giant orb of light overthe Pacific.
Gino, the Joe's producer. Yeah, and Dave Foley allegedly
seeing the exact same thing. The common theme in these
stories is being so in awe or shock that they didn't even
(15:45):
think to grab their phone and record it.
That's interesting. Too stunned to fill?
Which is fascinating, the directexperience overwriting the
modern instinct to document everything.
And then there are the more concrete sightings discussed,
like transmedium Uaps. Transmedium.
Objects picked up on radar, suggesting they have mass, heat
(16:05):
or electromagnetic displacement that can transition seamlessly
between air and water, go right into the ocean without slowing
down. Like the Tic Tac video?
Commander Fravers Tic Tac sighting is the prime example
referenced. Multiple credible witnesses, an
object under the water seeminglymimicking an aircraft carrier
target, jamming radar signals and performing impossible
(16:28):
maneuvers and acceleration speeds that are just unreal.
And the source mentions the debunking efforts.
Yeah, like those by Mick West are sometimes seen as trying too
hard to explain away everything.Like, maybe the explanations are
getting more convoluted than theoriginal phenomenon.
That tension, again, the incredible witness testimony
versus the drive to find a conventional explanation,
(16:48):
however unlikely. The conversation also delves
into potential hidden bases may be related to these Uaps or
other beings. Right, there's the detail about
a structure off the coast of Malibu that appeared on Google
Maps looking like a base, but isnow blurred out, gone from the
map. The theory presented is that the
weird stuff is in the ocean because it's the best place on
(17:11):
Earth to hide. Makes sense deep ocean is less
explored than space. Could be a base for visitors or
maybe even an evolved indigenousspecies we don't know about.
Underwater civilization. OK, anonymous sources are
mentioned claiming a base near the Bermuda Triangle that the
Navy is aware of and avoids, andwhich allegedly custom builds
craft for specific missions. Custom built craft near the
(17:33):
Bermuda Triangle that's specificit's.
Out there. And of course, the source goes
into EBE's extraterrestrial biological entities.
The bodies, the term. Allegedly used for recovered
alien bodies. The incredibly strange detail
about EBE One supposedly being housed and studied by the
government at Los Alamos for five years until 1952, is
shared. They had one living with them
(17:54):
for five years. According to this account, yes.
And the detail that always makesyou pause.
EBE one allegedly liked strawberry ice cream.
Strawberry ice cream. Get out of here.
Yeah, that's almost too weird tobe made-up.
Right. I mean, would they eat and
breathe our air? It's one of those details that
adds a layer of bizarre reality,or maybe disinformation, to an
(18:15):
already unbelievable story. Theories about their appearance
are discussed too. Yeah, often described as
genderless, with large heads andeyes that might have evolved
underground or perhaps function like natural sunglasses in a
highlight environment, it's a collection of truly peculiar
details drawn from these fringe narratives.
Peculiar is an understatement, and navigating all of this
(18:37):
requires a healthy dose of skepticism.
Absolutely. And an understanding that not
everything presented, even in seemingly credible accounts is
as it seems. Which naturally leads us to the
topic of government manipulationand disinformation raised in the
source. Yeah, this is crucial.
There's the explicit idea that some of the UFO phenomena or the
narrative surrounding them couldbe deliberate disinformation, a
(18:58):
SIOP, A psychological operation by the government.
Why would they do that? The theory being that they
release a bunch of horseshit about UFOs or attach really
kooky stuff to stuff that's realin order to muddy the waters.
Discredit legitimate researchers.
Guilt by the association. Or simply make people think the
real sensitive stuff is also just kooky plausible
(19:19):
deniability. This loops back to figures like
Mick West right with the playfulquestioning and source about who
you working for. Exactly.
And it ties into The Mirage Men documentary.
That film explored fake crop circles as an art experiment
that got tangled up with government disinformation
campaign. Oh yeah, allegedly involving
figures like Richard Doty, who fed Bill Moore bogus information
(19:42):
about Roswell and Majestic 12, seemingly to contaminate the UFO
research field on purpose. Wow, so intentionally polluting
the well of information. That's the allegation.
The recent drone scare phenomenon is also cited as a
potential more recent example ofa possible SIOP.
The drones over military bases, yeah.
Drones flying over sensitive sites note reports warning
(20:05):
pilots and then suddenly stopping before Inauguration
Day. The theory is it was a test of
public reaction or to highlight vulnerability, but it backfired
by just making people scared andconfused.
Nobody knew what was going on. It did seem very strange and
then just stopped. There's even the amusing meta
theory floating around certain online communities mentioned in
the source that Rogan and Gentile themselves are CIA
(20:27):
plants and that explains their success.
Seriously, CIA is back for podcasts.
It just shows how deep the well of distrust goes when you
discuss potential government secrecy.
Start seeing shadows everywhere.Yeah, no kidding.
The theme of gatekeeping information comes up again here,
tying back to the earlier point about this Smithsonian's power.
And it's exemption from laws requiring the return of Native
(20:49):
American burial artifacts holding on to things.
And this leads to a broader challenge of the idea of doing
your own research in a landscapefilled with potential
disinformation. Right.
The source presents a quote suggesting people aren't smart
enough to absorb complex information correctly and should
just leave it to experts. Which sounds pretty
condescending. Yeah, effectively in the sources
(21:11):
framing making us infants and denying people access to
information because they're deemed too stupid or not ready.
The Ivermectin example is used as a sharp case study in this
information distortion, the mainstream narrative presenting
it only as horse dewormer versusthe reality of it being a
required human medication for certain things, where a simple
(21:34):
Google search shows the more complex truth.
It illustrates how easily information can be twisted and
access to a fuller picture denied.
Regardless of where you stand onthat specific issue, it's about
the manipulation of the narrative.
Historical examples of potentialcover ups are also discussed.
The famous Tesla and JP Morgan story.
Yeah, Morgan funded Tesla initially for wireless
(21:55):
communication, but allegedly pulled funding for Tesla's free
energy concept. Free energy which couldn't be
metered and thus wouldn't make Morgan money.
The Warding Cliff tower was torndown and after Teslas death the
government allegedly seized his papers.
Seized his papers. Why?
J Edgar Hoover apparently sent Uncle John Trump, yes that
Trump's uncle, an MIT professor to review them.
(22:16):
Who knows what was in there? That's a piece of history you
don't hear every day. And then there's the truly
bizarre Nixon and Jackie Gleasonstory.
Oh, this one's wild. Nixon allegedly showed Gleason a
crashed UFO and embalmed alien bodies at a military base.
Maybe Homestead or Wright Patterson.
Nixon showed the honeymooner aliens.
Where did this story come from? Reportedly from Gleason's wife,
(22:39):
and the existence of Gleason's strained UFO house is noted as
circumstantial evidence of his interests.
A UFO house. OK, the source connects this
back to Nixon reportedly asking publicly about who killed JFK.
Yeah, that publicly. Apparently, and then
subsequently facing Watergate. This is framed as potentially
being related. Watergate presented as a coup
(23:00):
involving Operation Mockingbird and alleged FBI involvement in
the break in a way to shut him down.
Wow, that's a heavy implication connecting Watergate to UFOs and
JFK. It's deep conspiracy territory,
but presented as part of this web of secrets and control.
The conversation doesn't shy away from even darker
(23:21):
operations, and they're devastating human cost, pulling
no punches from the source material.
No, it goes there. Smedley Butler's famous book War
is a Racket is mentioned a. Classic.
Along with the business plot, anattempted coup by powerful
financiers like JP Morgan and others trying to recruit Butler,
a Marine general, to lead a military takeover in the 1930s.
(23:42):
A coup attempt in the US that. Butler exposed.
Then DARPA, the Defense AdvancedResearch Projects Agency, is
discussed in the context of its dark history, specifically
focusing on Agent Orange in Vietnam.
Agent Orange. The source highlights the
devastating long term health impacts on U.S. soldiers, which
reportedly resulted in more deaths than combat itself.
More than combat. The chemical companies like Dow
(24:05):
and DuPont involved, and the government's decades long denial
of responsibility. Just awful.
The source mentions a personal story.
Yeah, the heartbreaking story ofthe father-in-law waiting 40
years for Agent Orange settlement benefits and how
those benefits but still weren'tenough to cover the costs.
It's shared as a stark example of the human price paid.
This is clearly a point that resonates strongly in the
(24:27):
source. 40 years. Unbelievable.
Mcultra, the infamous CIA mind control program, is also brought
up. Right LSD experiment.
And worse, the discussion includes heartbreaking
testimonies of women subjected to horrific sexual abuse and
torture as part of the experiments.
That's horrifying. The Frank Olson case is shared a
scientist involved in him, Cultra, who developed doubts,
(24:48):
was given LSD without his knowledge, sent to a
psychiatrist linked to Sydney Gottlieb, the programs head.
Gottlieb the Poison Master. And later fell to his death from
a window. His family received a settlement
to be quiet. Officially ruled a suicide.
Later investigations suggested murder.
A settlement to be quiet tells you something.
And the equally disturbing Operation Midnight Climax, the
(25:10):
CIA using prostitutes and safe houses with two way glass in San
Francisco, again linked to mind control experiments.
Taxpayer money at work. Described bluntly in the source
as tax dollars at work by a bunch of weirdos.
It's hard to argue with that description.
It's noted that these programs like ML culture and bio weapons
been stockpiling recordedly continued in some form even
(25:31):
after executive orders were issued to stop them.
So they just kept going underground.
Showing the difficulty of truly dismantling entrenched
operations, Operation Gladio is another dark example from the
source. Is that?
A post WWIICIA program in Italy that trained a secret civilian
army. Their alleged goal?
(25:52):
To bomb civilians and blame it on communists.
Bomb their own allies. Blame it on Communists, the most
popular political party in Italyafter the fall of Mussolini's
fascism, in order to prevent them from gaining power.
Strategy of tension. You train them.
They were reportedly trained by a former Nazi general linked to
Allen Dulles, who later headed the CIA.
A Nazi general? Oh my God.
(26:13):
Civilians were killed in these massacres, like the Bologna
train station bombing. The source presents this as a
difficult point for anyone who holds patriotic or pro military
law enforcement views. Yeah.
How do you reconcile that? How do you reconcile that with
the reality of documented government actions like these?
How do you avoid becoming a monster when you're fighting
(26:33):
monsters? It's a heavy, challenging
thought drawn directly from the material, incredibly.
Heavy. That journey through secrets
from ancient ones to very recent, very dark ones naturally
brings us to the role of whistleblowers and the struggle
to find truth in this environment.
Right, and Bob Lazar's credibility is discussed as a
(26:53):
key example in the UFO context. Lazar, the guy who claimed to
work on alien tech at Area 51. The source presents him as
potentially the most credible whistleblower in the UFO space,
or at least the most significant.
Why credible? He's controversial.
Because he allegedly didn't profit immediately from his
claims and faced significant government targeting prosecution
(27:14):
for prostitution, which some seeas a setup.
A setup. And the FBI raid during the
filming of the Jeremy Korbel documentary about him.
They raided his business. What was the RAID supposedly
about? The theory presented is that the
raid wasn't really about the prostitution charges, but about
whether Lazar had a sample of stable element 115, element 1.
(27:35):
15 The fuel source. Which he claimed to have taken
from Area 51's S4 facility. The idea is that element 115 is
crucial for gravity propulsion technology.
Has it been synthesized? A temporary, unstable form has
been synthesized in laboratorieslike in Russia, but Lazar
claimed to have a stable versionused in the alien craft he
(27:56):
worked on. That's the key difference.
So the FBI might have been looking for that sample.
That's the speculation. The general skepticism around
whistleblowers is acknowledged, though.
Yeah, it's tough. The source mentions factors
considered when assessing credibility.
Do they have a background in intelligence?
Are they on the payroll? Do they have a book or movie
deal lined up immediately? Have they released fake photos?
(28:17):
Does Lazar pass that test according to the source?
Lazar, in the view presented, doesn't seem to have these
typical red flags in the way others might, especially early
on. He came forward, lost his
anonymity and face repercussions.
OK. Any other whistleblowers
mentioned? A more recent example is also
mentioned a whistleblower discussed by Jeremy Korbel and
George Knapp. This person is described as a
(28:38):
young kid, career ruined, clearly nervous.
Oh guy who allegedly found filesabout something called
Immaculate Constellation. Immaculate Constellation?
What's that? Supposedly a project related to
recovering alien craft. Non human technology retrieval.
Another secret project name. These cases just highlight how
difficult it is to discern truthwhen dealing with highly
(29:00):
classified information and individuals who might be under
immense pressure or have complexmotivations.
It's a murky world. So if we zoom out and try to
synthesize all of this, from ancient, seemingly impossible
stone structures and potential lost civilizations to alleged
underwater bases, modern UAP sightings, mind control
programs, disinformation campaigns and documents,
(29:22):
implemented, government operations with dark histories,
it's a vast interconnected web presented in the sources.
It's almost overwhelming. It is, and what runs through it
all is that core tension we talked about at the beginning,
the desire to believe in amazingpossibilities.
All right, ancient tech helpful aliens.
Versus the often uncomfortable, sometimes brutal truth of human
(29:43):
hoaxes, deliberate government deception, or simply our own
limitations in understanding theworld.
These species with amnesia idea from Graham Hancock really
resonates here, doesn't? It it does perhaps a lot of the
strangeness we encounter, these ancient anomalies, these lost
technologies, simply lost history and knowledge that we've
(30:04):
forgotten due to massive cataclysmic events that reset
civilization. A forgotten past haunting our
present. And it's also worth considering
the possibility that some of thephenomena we categorize as UFOs
or alien encounters are deliberate government actions.
Like Bluebeam or something less dramatic.
Perhaps disclosures, tests, or even psychological operations
(30:24):
intended to prepare the public or serve other strategic aims.
Even if, as the drone scare example suggested, they
backfired and were executed effectively, maybe they're not
as good at it as they think. That's an interesting thought.
Maybe some of it is disclosure just done badly.
Could be. It's fascinating how humor is
sprinkled throughout the source material discussing these
incredibly heavy topics. Mentioning Hecklefish, the
(30:46):
theory they're CIA backed. Right the fish puppet Co host on
Y files. The absurdity of the Ivermectin
situation, that stark quote about fighting monsters, that
light touch even when dealing with such dark subjects, is
almost necessary to make it digestible.
Absolutely. It helps maintain some
perspective when exploring thesedeep, sometimes disturbing
(31:07):
corners of history and speculation.
Keeps it from being purely overwhelming or depressing.
And ultimately, that feels like the value of exploring sources
like this in a deep dive and theapproach of shows like the Y
Files. They breakdown complex or fringe
topics. They force you to look at
different angles, including the potential debunking and the
uncomfortable truths. And they encourage you, the
(31:28):
listener, to stay curious and think for yourself about what
might be really happening behindthe veil.
Even if definitive answers remain elusive, the process of
questioning, exploring the possibilities, and critically
evaluating the information is where the real understanding is
gained. It's the journey, not just the
destination. Absolutely.
So we've taken this deep dive into a wide-ranging source,
(31:50):
exploring everything from alleged ancient cover ups and
potential alien visitors to veryreal government programs with
undeniably dark histories. It really highlights the
persistent nature of secrets, whether ancient, alien or
governmental, and their undeniable power to shape
narratives, control information,and influence public
(32:11):
understanding. What we don't know might be as
important as what we do and. It leaves us with a powerful
question to consider building oneverything we've discussed
today. If even a fraction of these
stories, yeah, particularly those involving hidden
technologies or concealed histories that suggest
alternative possibilities about our past or present, we're
definitively proven true. How fundamentally, with your
(32:31):
understanding of the world, our place in the cosmos and the true
capabilities of those in power have to change?
Exactly. Yeah.
And how much potential knowledge, progress, or even
safety you might have been sacrificed, hidden away by
keeping these secrets? What have we lost by not
knowing?
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