November 18, 2025 • 34 mins
Molly Conlin Peterson is an executive and career transition coach with over 23 years of experience helping thousands of professionals, leaders, and executives find more meaningful work. Her approach blends positive psychology with the research of Dr. Brené Brown, guiding clients to lead with courage, purpose, and heart. Molly has worked with organizations like Wells Fargo, 3M, SoFi, Feeding America, Better Up, and the University of Minnesota, where she also taught Strategic Career Planning. She holds an MA in Human Development, is a PCC-level ICF Certified Coach, and is certified in a range of career and leadership assessments, including MBTI, Strong Interest Inventory, and Leadership Circle Profile.
Join us for Part 2 of our coonversation!
The folks snagging the best jobs? They’re not always the most qualified, but they sure know how to stretch their comfort zones. In this episode, we’re diving into how taking that extra little reach—like asking for help or putting yourself out there—can seriously amp up your job search game. We’re chatting about the importance of networking and sharing tips on how to do it without feeling like you’re begging for a handout. It’s all about building that muscle, folks; the more you flex it, the easier it gets to tackle those awkward conversations. So, grab your favorite drink, kick back, and let’s figure out how to make those connections count!
Let's get real for a moment – job hunting can feel like a personal attack sometimes, right? It’s like you’re laying your heart out there with every application, hoping for a little love in return. In today’s convo, we’re chatting with the fabulous Molly Conlon Peterson about navigating the job market post-layoff, and boy, does she have some solid advice! We start off by discussing how the best candidates aren’t always the ones with the most accolades but those who are willing to step out, take risks, and ask for help. It’s all about that hustle, baby!
In this second part of our conversation, Molly gives us the lowdown on the importance of networking, which can feel like climbing a mountain without gear. But fear not! She swears by 'The 20 Minute Networking Meeting' as a game-changer. This book lays out a killer framework for networking meetings that can turn those awkward coffee chats into productive conversations. And let’s face it, who wouldn’t want a plan to make those meetings feel less like pulling teeth? We also dive into the emotional aspect of job searching, like, how do you keep your chin up when rejection feels like it’s raining down?
By the time we wrap up, Molly shares her wisdom on embracing discomfort as part of the growth process and encourages listeners to keep pushing through the tough spots. It’s all about practicing that courage muscle! So if you’re feeling like a deer in headlights, tune in for some uplifting insights to guide you through the job market jungle.
Takeaways:
- Getting a job isn't just about being qualified; it's about being bold and taking risks.
- Networking can feel awkward, but it's essential; just reach out and start the convo.
- Building your networking muscle makes job hunting easier; practice makes it less scary, trust me!
- Don't just settle for any job; know what you want and ask the right questions.
- Resumes should show results; think about how your actions made a difference in your past roles.
- Self-care is crucial while job hunting; be kind to yourself and stay positive through the process.
Links for today's show:
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:04):
The people that get the bestjobs aren't always the most qualified.
They're the ones that arewilling to take that extra little
reach, little extra ask, youknow, and do the things that do feel
a little bit uncomfortable.And so I really encourage people
who are in that spot just keepbuilding that muscle. And that's
(00:26):
what also it does, is itbuilds that muscle of, I'm going
to try something new. I'mgoing to take a little risk here.
I'm going do this thing thatfeels a little uncomfortable.
Hi there and welcome to theStep Up Expert Voices for Leadership
Growth. I'm your host, KentKnieble. Every week I talk to experts
who focus on helping leadersstep up their leadership game. If
you're new to the show, thenon whatever platform you're using,
(00:48):
I encourage you to subscribeso you never miss an episode. One
last thing. As a leadershipdevelopment consultant and executive
coach, I have a particularinterest in supporting recent internally
promoted leaders. If that'syou or if you support a leader who
has been recently promoted, Iencourage you to visit my website
at Kent Coach Playbook anddownload a free copy of my 90 day
blueprint filled withpractical advice for you or the leader
(01:11):
you support in hitting theground running and truly stepping
up to their new leadershiplevel. Without further ado, on with
the show. Welcome back,everyone. This is gonna be part two
of my conversation with MollyConlon Peterson. We were talking,
I would say, kind of the firsthalf of the challenge, so to speak,
of being laid off. And I justwanted to continue this conversation.
(01:34):
So this will probably be ashorter episode because go back to
the previous. I can't, giventhat I'm a little ahead on scheduling.
I can't tell you what episodethat is, but it's the one that dropped
right before this one. And Ijust want to pick up the conversation
where we left off. Right. Sowe were talking about, you know,
you've been laid off, youknow, the need to kind of take a
beat. We talked a little bitabout resumes. Maybe we'll get into
(01:57):
that a little bit more. Wetalked a fair amount about networking,
taking care of yourselfthrough the process. So just wanted
to kind of pick up where weleft off. And I would say, I'll just
kick it right over to you,Molly. You know, where's your energy?
Where do you want to pick up?
Well, I just, I had a thoughtand a resource that I just wanted
to share about networking too,just to kick off, because I know
(02:18):
that's where a lot of people'sheads go is like, gosh, I got to
start this networking process.So there is a book that I always
recommend to people and Iusually send it out to my clients.
It's called the 20 MinuteNetworking Meeting.
My hands are way up in theair. That book is the tome for networking.
It changed my life. Say more.
I agree. And here's the thingis, is how you do anything is how
(02:41):
you do everything. And so ifyou are setting up a networking meeting
and you have it a clearagenda, you. I'm grateful. I have
some questions. I'm going tomake this a two way street. I'm going
to wrap it up, I'm going tofollow up. You're showing them how
you're going to be in worklike it. And it gives us a really
(03:02):
beautiful structure of how doI, how do I do these meetings that
feel really hard and I don't,I'm not sure, I've never done this
before. And so I highlyrecommend that book. And it also
gives you some structure onhow to talk about yourself.
I think there's a bunch ofadditions of it now too, from when
I think when I first read itit was just, it was the 20 minute
(03:22):
networking meeting for, Ithink it was for executives or something
like that. And it was the onlyone that existed. And I, you know,
I had to do, I wouldn't saytremendous mental gymnastics to apply
it to, you know, a 30 year oldme, but was recommended to me by
a former HR person who workedat the, at the PDI in Korn Ferry
(03:46):
where I was working. So Ireached out to her because I knew
she was a safe person. I wasjust like, how do I network? What
is networking? I don't get it.I feel like I'm asking people for
a job and she's, and you know,she was like, read this book and
then come back to me. And Ifelt like it was a huge unlock for
me. But I know there's mult. Idon't know which one, which ones.
(04:09):
I just tend to say read thator see what other editions exist
because I feel like there's afew additions that are targeted to
different career stages ormaybe even professions at this point.
I can't say I've exactly muchrecently though.
Yeah, exactly. I think thatyou, you know, look at the, there's
a professional, there's anexecutive. Look at the one that fits
(04:30):
you. I think there's one forstudents as well. So, you know, take
a look and just see which onefits for you.
You know, I think it's hardfor people to network. You know,
there is this, jokingly, I'vealways said, hey, if you want to
be taken down a notch or two,start applying jobs, right? Because
nothing, nothing feels morepersonal than your applications for
(04:53):
your jobs. You know, the jobsthat you want. Your, your, it's,
you know, this ultimate do youlove me? Do you not? You know, am
I going to be accepted? Am Inot like experience? And it's, it,
it can suck at times. And sonetworking can feel like this tremendous
putting yourself out therething. And I think one piece of advice
(05:16):
that I tend to give to peopleis it's a nothing to lose gamble,
really. Because today you havezero meetings on your calendar. And
all you have to lose is. Andthis is kind of also been, frankly,
any entrepreneurs orsalespeople out there listening.
This has been my mentalityabout sales as well, which is you've
(05:36):
got zero meetings on yourcalendar today. Like, what do you
have to lose by reaching outand just asking for someone's time?
Like, hey, can. And it's eveneasier now with virtual. I think
one of the things. Let me, letme go Back to the 20 minute networking
meeting, which was actuallywritten in our own backyard, I believe
is Martha Ballinger in our ownbackyard, who wrote that? Yeah, in
(05:58):
the Twin Cities here. And Ithink back then, you know, the virtual
wasn't as when I first readit. Virtual was not as prolific as
it is now. So the idea waslike, how do you make it really easy
and say, basically it's calledthe 20 Minute Networking Meeting,
so that, you know, think aboutit at the time, if you were working
in a downtown area and you'retalking to somebody else who's also
(06:19):
probably in the downtown area,you're baking in five minutes of
walk time on either end andpromising this person that you're
going to get them in and outof the meeting in 20 minutes that
they can get back to work.Right. Even easier now with virtual
face to face, always better,but virtual super easy now too. What's
the worst that will happen ifyou reach out is they say nothing,
(06:43):
right or no.
Right.
In which case you still havezero meetings on your calendar. But
the gamble is just so muchbetter on the other side of that,
which is most people are goingto say yes, and now you've got a
meeting on your calendar.
Right.
And at the very least, at thevery least with networking is you're
(07:03):
getting repetitions in andtalking about yourself. And if nothing
else, networking prepares youfor interviewing better than almost
anything can do, even mockinterviewing, frankly, because you
just get these repetitions inof having to kind of talk about yourself
off the cuff. So I'll climbdown off my soapbox.
(07:24):
Well, you're exactly right,Kent. I mean, I think you make so,
so many great points. First ofall, I mean that it's so much easier
now because you can actuallyreach out on email. You can reach
out on LinkedIn, you can askpeople to make it. You can look on
LinkedIn and see who does thisperson know, and you can reach out
to that person and say, hey,I'm. I see that you're connected
to this person and I want anintroduction. Would you be willing.
(07:47):
So it's, you can do all ofthat from the comfort of your own
home. And, you know, and thenyou can actually set up a zoom meeting
and meet somebody for 20minutes. You could do five of those
a day. But the point is thatif you don't, it feels scary, it
feels uncomfortable to reachout and ask for help. And this is
(08:08):
that courage piece because ifyou, you know, in, in logically we
can say, well, if you don't doit, you're not going to, you know,
you're not gonna move forwardyourself forward in the job search.
And there's that emotionalpiece of. I just have to be, be normalized
that this is gonna be alittle. It would call it embrace
(08:29):
the suck. Yeah, it does suckto reach out and ask for help. It
does feel uncomfortable. Andwhen you get to the other side, the
people that get the best jobsaren't always the most qualified.
They're the ones that arewilling to take that extra little
reach, little extra ask and,you know, and do the things that,
(08:55):
that do feel a little bituncomfortable. And so I really encourage
people who are in that spotjust keep building that muscle. And
that's what also it does, isit builds that muscle of, I'm going
to try something new. I'mgoing to take a little risk here.
I'm going to take, you know,do this thing that feels a little
uncomfortable.
Yeah.
And start to.
It does get easier though,right? I think it's, it's. Nothing's
(09:17):
more uncomfortable than thefirst message you send. Right. And
then each one after gets, youknow, a little easier, too. It's.
It's repetition. It's likegoing to the gym. It just gets easier.
So what else? I know this is abig part of what you do. So what
else is kind of top of mindfor you, for folks who, at this point,
(09:37):
when this episode drops, atleast the folks at Toronto, folks
at Target and Amazon will Beabout two weeks in. So what else
is kind of top.
So I want to say this becauseI think this is one where when there's
this scarcity mindset, whenyou feel like, oh gosh, there's not
going to be enough jobs, Ijust have take a job. We talk a lot,
(10:00):
you know, about this idea ofthe quick fix, you know, and, and
I'm going to just say outloud, sometimes a quick fix is needed.
You know, like there are timesI, I don't recommend that because
I think that, you know, thenyou're ending up in the same spot
again and you, you, and whenpeople are in transition, it feels
really unsettled and so theyoftentimes do want to do that quick
(10:22):
f fix.
And so what do you, what doyou mean by quick fix? Taking something
long.
It, like I just had a client,like, here's an example. She, she's
nine interviews in and she'sseen yellow flag, yellow flag, red
flag, red flag. She's like, Ishould just take the job. And I'm
(10:42):
like, let's go back to whatyou said at the beginning about what
you wanted for culture, whatkind of person you wanted to work.
You know, like, let's go backto those core values that you said
were important. And how do youask the questions to make sure that
this, this red, these littlered flags and, and yellow flags are
coming up. Make sure that, youknow, you can feel good about moving
(11:05):
forward. And so she did andher intuition was correct that this
was not going to be a good fitfor her. And so when you're in that
spot, like, I think she knewthis, you know, like we, it's a two
way street. I, I feel like tomake sure that when you are interviewing
for jobs that you're askingthose good questions so that you're
(11:28):
not just taking something justto land that you're taking something.
And she ended up landing in areally good spot. She landed in a
great spot. But, but she wasable to ask those questions there.
But I think sometimes when,when you're in that, that place of
oh, I just need to land,you're not asking the right questions
(11:49):
back because you don't want toknow or you don't want, don't want
to. So going back to thatfirst part of like really getting
clear about what's importantto you. So that, and I think that's
also the piece that alsoemployers want is why do you want
to work for me? What, what'smeaningful about that is so.
(12:12):
That is so hard in this whenyou're in this spot. Right, right.
And, and I have feelings onboth sides of that equation. One
is, first of all, I wouldalmost say if you're a recruiter
and it's November 2025 soon,you know, it's only today we're recording
(12:32):
on November 3rd. December isgoing to be here before we know it.
You know, we're then sittingat seven, eight months. There's 200,000
people out of work right now.Maybe think about some of these questions
like why do you want to workhere? Because frankly, I know you're
looking for someone to say,because I've loved your company forever
(12:53):
and I'm so bought into themission and, but there's a part of
me that's like, like have somehumanity and maybe give me a break
a little bit here on andquestions like that, to be perfectly
honest. But, and I get it in anormal time, you know, you're hoping
that someone's done hours of research.
Right.
(13:13):
And yet let's go to the otherside of the fence because I'm sure
you've got advice for peoplethere on and yet you should probably
do some research and say whyyou're interested.
Right. Well, I think the thingis, here's, here's what I would say
about that is that you'retrying to set yourself apart because
there's so many peopleapplying for roles, right. And there's
so many people. So how do you,we know that, you know, you take,
(13:38):
you take somebody, their skillset, their very best self profile,
you pair that with somethingthat's meaningful, they're going
to achieve at the highestlevels. So people who are hiring
now, they have a flood ofpeople who can probably competently
do that job. So they're nownot moving to just the competence
piece. But there's that thoseintangible things, right? Is there
(14:03):
a connection there? Didsomebody make that introduction?
Does this person, like, arethey really resonating with the work?
Do they have a story to tellaround why they want to do this?
So how do you set yourselfapart from the other, you know, X
number of applicants that toour point earlier, if you're using
AI, a lot of these resumeslook a lot alike. And so it, I think
(14:30):
that is, there's a few waysthat you set yourself apart as an
applicant and that can be oneof them.
We mentioned AI last time,right. You know, we kind of talked
about how well you probablyshould be using AI as a thought partner.
Don't have it. Do the work. Ialways say that. Don't Just spit
out a new resume because youno longer know what it did, what
(14:51):
it didn't do. And maybe itsuddenly it got into an AI hallucination
and said, you worked at NASAwhen you haven't. But, but, you know,
certainly ask it forrecommendations. How can I tweak
my resume best to match thisjob? Now, the other thing I keep
seeing people talking aboutpeople doing, and I'm seeing some
(15:11):
of the videos out theresuggesting that people do this is
like, you know, like, liketape your phone to the middle of
your monitor and use one ofthese AIs that can listen in and
give you your answers. Don'tdo that. Right. Like, I've. And I
was just at a SHRM conferencethe other week, and I don't remember
(15:33):
what company, but it was likea head of recruiting who was saying,
like, it is our policy that ifwe feel like you are using AI in
the interview and there'stelltale signs it takes you longer
to, you know, suddenly it'staking you a little bit longer to
think they can see your eyesscanning what you're reading, and
they will end the interviewand cancel the application immediately.
(16:00):
Now, you probably can use itto do some mock interviewing. You
probably can use an AI to belike, hey, what are some of the questions
that might be asked? Do youhave recommendations based on my
resume? Or depending on howyou're using AI, you know, for how
to answer, but do not use itmid interview as my, you know, I,
(16:21):
I agree with you.
Yeah. And, and that's, andthat's the, the one place you have
the opportunity to have thatauthentic connection and to have
those stories, you know, weall have, you know, the star stories.
I mean, that's still veryrelevant. You know, give me some
examples. Share, share somestories of when you've done these
(16:42):
different things, you'vesolved problems or you've demonstrated
leaders, you know, you.
Know, and then I know theTarget folks out there are. From
my memory, when I used to do alittle consulting with Target, they
were pretty well practiced in.They might even use the. Was it like
the Star or whatever, youknow, interview protocol or something
(17:04):
like that? Like, they'repretty good at that. But let me back
up a step and say, what's youradvice to people on cover letters?
Right. I think that was a,that was a big thing 15 years ago.
Yeah.
Is it still relevant? Do yourecommend people do it?
I think that it's, it can behelpful. But if you're applying online,
you know, oftentimes the COVIDletter isn't even needed anymore.
(17:27):
It's just easy. Sometimes itis and sometimes it's not. You know,
I think any time that you canset yourself apart, do it differently.
Send a resume. I mean, like, Ithink we're in this spot right now.
It's like, how do you getsomeone's attention? The first step
would be obviously if you canget an introduction. Everyone's applying
(17:49):
online. You absolutely shouldapply online. But you can also send
a hard copy with a coverletter and that might get somebody's
attention because nobody elseis doing that. And so it's thinking
about those creative ways ofhow do I set myself apart? How do
I get someone's attention?Sending a handwritten thank you note,
sending those, those ways thatpeople don't normally do. Sending
(18:11):
somebody a book, somebody, youknow, after an informational interview
or, or something that's tangible.
I like what you said in ourprevious episode, which was if they
said something relevant, thiscould both be for a hiring manager
that you've talked to and youknow, it's a three week process or
even someone you're networkingwith. If you're reading, you know,
(18:33):
staying current and readingmaybe articles that are in the space
that you both coexist in is,hey, saw this, thought of you, just,
you know, wasn't sure if yousaw it, wanted to send it your way.
All right, I'm going to pepperyou with some questions because I'm
looking at our time again andI know it's going to be a little
shorter than part one, but I,I asked you the COVID letter question
and I'm like, oh, I have otherlittle, like, let me throw these
(18:55):
questions at you too.Sometimes on LinkedIn they say who
the recruiter is. What's yourthoughts on reaching out to that
person and sending them a, a message?
What do you have to lose? Imean, that's, that, that's where
I'm at is what do you have tolose? You know, it's, it's, if you
don't reach out, then you,you're in the same boat that you
(19:17):
were when you started. So Iwould highly recommend, you know,
this is that those littlemoments of just do the reach out,
do you know, you, you want tobe persistent and, and not be a past,
obviously. But there isnothing to lose. I don't know an
opinion on that or not.
Here's what I'll add to that.If you've done the job and you know
(19:40):
that you are 100% qualifiedfor the job.
Yes.
Then go for it. Right? But Ihave heard, right and There might
be some danger in this currentenvironment with so many people out
of work that, you know, thatthey're getting, you know, they suddenly,
their job gets posted and theysuddenly get inundated with, you
know, a couple hundred inmails.
(20:00):
Yeah.
So if you're, if you're goingto reach out, I would say table stakes
would be you're actuallyqualified for the job. It's not a
stretch.
Right.
Or you've done the job. It'snot a stretch. Bonus points if you
know someone. Right. You know,like there's multiple connection
points for why they should payattention to your message. I like
(20:21):
the boldness, though. I likeyour boldness of. Because it kind
of goes back to even theboldness of networking, which is
what you really have to lose.So I'll, I'll go with that. I would
also say if you don't want toget 200inmails as a recruiter, you
probably shouldn't be taggedas the recruiter from the job posting.
Right. I feel like it's kind.This is where, like, I feel like
(20:42):
it's kind of asking for itbecause I'm pretty sure it's a toggle.
You have to click to have yourname associated with the posting.
So if you don't want inmails,maybe don't.
That's. That's a fairstatement. I mean, I think recruiters
are really struggling rightnow to sift through everything. And
(21:02):
so, I mean, I, My heart goesout to them because it's a, it's
an impossible job just bylooking at a bunch of resumes, how
am I going to sort through? SoI think they're like it. They need
help, they need guidance.Like, who. Who should I be? Like,
how do I even begin with this?Because I think just. I was at a
career conference and somebodysaid they had 30,000 applications
(21:25):
for a job. Like, I think it'sjust, it's. Who knows if it's just
AI and it's easy apply, easyapply, easy apply, you know, and
so how do these recruitersfigure out who they even start with?
Yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah, andthis is where it's like, you know,
everybody who's applying forjobs hates the applicant tracking
system. But the reality is ahuman cannot read through. You know,
(21:49):
if I think about, you know,and I'm thinking, this isn't even
just Fortune 500 companies whoare experiencing this, who probably,
you know, the largest HR teamat most, Fortune probably 1000 companies
is probably the largest HRteam. Maybe next to comp or benefits.
Right. You Know, but that alsomeans there's so many jobs being
(22:10):
posted. But again, so normal.You can't expect a human to read
30,000 resumes. You can'texpect a human to read 100 resumes
for an individual job opening.
Right.
How do you, as you think abouthelping people, prep for interviewing?
You know, what's some of your,what are some of your thoughts? There's.
(22:31):
Yeah. Well, I mean, I thinkthat those star stories are really,
I think like 80% of the workis, is thinking it through ahead
of time. So you really do wantto think about your stories. You
want to think about how youwant to message, how you talk about
yourself. You want to talkabout, you know, what are your strengths
and your, your weaknesses andbe strategic about that related to
(22:51):
the job. But I think thosestar stories and having, even if
they're not specificallyasking for examples, integrating
those and weaving them in,using having some numbers, things
at the ready that share youraccomplishment in tangible ways and.
Oh, go ahead.
Oh, sorry. Because you werekind of talking about results, right.
(23:13):
And it made me think aboutresumes, Right. Because it was probably
10 or 15 years ago now whenthe advice kind of started to turn
from just having your resumeslist out your job titles and job
duties to starting to say,what are the results? You know, what's
a result? Focused resume as,you know, as someone in HR that has
(23:36):
sometimes felt hard, right. Tothink about, like, well, geez, what
are the results? Because it'sreally, you know, it's really easy
to think about a salespersonor somebody who has a P and L, who's
managing a P and L to talkabout results, right? There's, there's
hard financial metrics thatthose folks can use. But I know when
it, when it came to hr andthen the counseling that I've given
(23:57):
other people is like, well,think about timelines, think about
numbers. Like how, you know,how long did it take you to get a
project from, you know, ideato launch? How many people did you
manage through that process?How many people did a program you
did touch? Did those programswin any internal or external awards?
(24:21):
I'm trying to think of other,other thoughts on that, but I know
that can be. But those, thosesame result stories need to make
their way into the interviewtoo, right?
100%. And being able toquantify it some way, it doesn't
have to be like, like, to yourpoint, a salesperson can say, I sold
X percent, where somebodycould say, hey, I accomplished this
in a tighter timeline, or weimpacted, you know, 50 people's you
(24:46):
know, lives in this way or,you know, my leadership team. Team.
We created a culture that wasreally like, it doesn't have to be
all numbers either. It can besome of those softer things that
are. And especially if you'regoing for a job in hr, that's what
they're going to be lookingfor. I mean, it's still reasonable.
It doesn't have to always havea number. Numbers are really great
(25:09):
if you can quantify it. Have acouple numbers on your resume.
If you manage people. How isretention? Right, right.
Yeah.
You know, did you, did youhave good retention? Did you have
good process for hiringpeople? Right. Like, think about
some of the things thatyou're, you know, proud of that as
(25:30):
a. A result, I'm, I'm watchingour time. It's gonna be a shorter.
Yeah, sorry, shorter episodethan the last one. So. But I want
to get to at least one more,you know, Molly, one more hot button
issue on your mind when itcomes to, to either how you're doing,
how you do career coaching, orjust with where this sheer number
(25:50):
of people might be at in theprocess right now.
Yeah. So let me think thatthrough. I would just say making
sure that, you know, I thinkeverybody's going to. For those bigger
companies oftentimes and, andthinking about like, there can be
smaller company, like there'sa million smaller businesses that
(26:15):
are out there and those mayhave one or two roles because everyone's
often goes to those largercompanies and floods those companies.
So look for some of thosehidden gems elsewhere.
I mean, I think most of usthese days are probably going to
LinkedIn. Where else do yourecommend people go to look?
I mean, your network,Obviously, but network LinkedIn can
(26:37):
be a really great place to.You can do, I mean, people do this
and, you know, to do this, butjob titles or industries and see
who comes up in your networkand see who you're connected to.
And so use that as a jumpingoff point, not the like then take,
take that extra step and reachout to that person and say, hey,
(26:58):
I see that you're connected tothis person. Would you be willing
to make an introduction for me?
Or indeed. Or monster. Any ofthose still relevant in your experience?
You know, I mean, I think, Ithink you can look at all of it to
find jobs, you know, but Ithink to the point we were just talking
about to find a job and tojust apply online is, Is maybe not
(27:24):
the best use of time.
Sure, fair enough.
You know, find the job, thenstart to do a little research and
digging to see who might be aconnection there or how you might
find somebody that's aconnection there. And then yes, you
probably will apply online,but you want someone to walk the
resume or make the call or doan email introduction or find that
(27:46):
side, step in if at all possible.
Yeah. So on that note, right,because I think you're calling, I
think, which is often the casewhen I'm talking about people who
are in transition. It allcomes back to networking. As much
as people may or may not wantto hear that. So I think maybe one
other piece on networking isare there local, in particular local
(28:09):
trade associations that youalready belong to or you know, can
join again? I was the mostrecent local society for HR management,
you know, association. I knowthat group has like a benefit, I
guess I don't know how you'dwant to call it, but like a program
(28:31):
for, for people who have beenrecently laid off where they will
just get, they will give you aone year membership to start joining,
to just join immediately.Right. And I, I would say with the
sheer number of layoffshappening, I would be, I mean I,
I guess I couldn't say howother trades outside of, you know,
how other job families outsideof HR do things, but in the times
(28:54):
I've gone to both that and,and the association for Talent Development
Groups, there's always beensome kind of conversation at the
beginning of those, eitherthose monthly calls or meetings or
the, the larger day longthings around like you know, even
having people, you know, ifyou're on the job market, raise your
hand. Right. And those, youknow, those of you who are, whose
hands are down, look aroundand you know, these are people we,
(29:18):
you know, they do encouragethat live networking, especially
with people who are displaced.
Right.
So I know it might not be theeasiest thing to think about around
like do I want, is this what Ireally want to spend a few hundred
dollars on right now when Idon't know where my next paycheck's
coming? But I would say it'sprobably worth, worth the gamble,
(29:39):
right. And even ask like, hey,do you have a program for people
who've been recently laid offto join? You never know.
And that's another way thatyou usually can bring a guest to
some of those. So not laidoff. If there's somebody in your
network that's laid out, bringthem as a guest. But I agree professional
associations can betremendously helpful and that's where
(30:02):
you can start to build thoserelationships. And, and I think that's
what we're talking about. Howdo you build more relationships or
deepen those relationshipsthat are existing. So it's not about
I'm asking you for a job, butwe're getting to know each other
and I can add value, maybe,maybe that.
Let's, let's add that ashomework. Right. To those of you
who are networking out there,Right. Ask if you don't know who
(30:23):
the, what, what tradeassociations are out there in your
space, ask the people thatyou're talking to, hey, what are
the other, you know, because Ican sit and rattle off some from
my own background andexperience, but you know, ask the
people that you're not workingwith. Right.
I agree. I think that's reallygreat. So yeah, I, I, I think that
sums it up that we're talkingabout the heart of this is human
(30:46):
connection and building thoseconnections. And that is the, the
doorway in and having thecourage to put yourself out there
and knowing that sometimesit's not going to work out and getting
back out there and, and havingsomebody to support you. Find, find
your people.
Love it. What's one last pieceof advice that you have for our listeners
(31:08):
of episode two?
You know, I think just beingreally, there's this idea that if
we're harder on ourselves,we're going to do better. And that
is actually not the case. Theresearch bears, does not bear that
out. The research bears outwhen you are kinder and soft to your,
(31:29):
to yourself. You give yourselfa soft place to land and you have
people around you because thisis hard work. This is going to require,
you know, it's an emotionalroller coaster in some cases. And
so just to be really kind toyourself. And then I think, you know,
just to take really good careof yourself, just emotionally, physically,
(31:51):
get out there and exercise.You need a place to process. You
know, do, do whatever you canto just stay, you know, active, mentally,
spiritually engaged in yourlife and all of those other ways.
Because at the end of the day,the, the more positive emotions you
can experience in your life,we know this, the more possibilities
(32:11):
you can see, the more you'regoing to show up for those people
when you are connecting in a,in a better way that that's going
to make them want to hire you.So by taking really good care of
yourself, you show up as abrighter light and that's who people
grab want to bring in.
Love it. All right? I know youneed to run. So for those people
out there who want a littlemore Molly Conlin Peterson in their
(32:33):
lives, how can they find you?You know, what, what would you encourage
them to go look for.
So my website is iswww.thedearingventure.com and right
now I am offering free 30minute sessions to anyone who just
needs a boost, needs a littleadvice, needs a little soft place
(32:56):
to land. If it, we cancontinue that. If you want to sign
up for coaching, but if youalso just are feeling stuck and you,
gosh, I just don't know whatto do here and I need somebody to
talk to. I am here and I'moffering that up right now. And you
can just get on my website andsign up for a 30 minute session.
So that's right on the website.
That's right on the website.
(33:17):
All right, well, take her upon it. Molly, thank you for going
a little long and ending updoing an ad hoc two part episode.
Really appreciate it. Can'twait to have you on again.
My pleasure. Ken. Thank you somuch. This was so lovely. It was
really lovely to be here. Andthanks for supporting people in transition
because that's what you'redoing. Like you're changing lives
(33:38):
with this podcast. It'sreally, really cool. Yeah, you're
doing your work.
All right, bye.
Take care.
That brings us to the end ofour episode. Thanks for listening.
I'd encourage you to head onover to my website, Kent Coach, and
start a conversation with methere. Or check out my promotion
playbook at Kent CoachPlaybook. Before you go on with your
(33:58):
day, I ask you please take amoment to leave a rating and a review
wherever you listen topodcasts. Five stars. That helps
put this podcast in front ofmore eyes and ears. Until next time,
take it easy.
The people that get the bestjobs aren't always the most qualified.
They're the ones that arewilling to take that extra little
reach, little extra ask, youknow, and do the things that do feel
a little bit uncomfortable.And so I really encourage people
who are in that spot just keepbuilding that muscle. And that's
(00:26):
what also it does, is itbuilds that muscle of, I'm going
to try something new. I'mgoing to take a little risk here.
I'm going do this thing thatfeels a little uncomfortable.
Hi there and welcome to theStep Up Expert Voices for Leadership
Growth. I'm your host, KentKnieble. Every week I talk to experts
who focus on helping leadersstep up their leadership game. If
you're new to the show, thenon whatever platform you're using,
(00:48):
I encourage you to subscribeso you never miss an episode. One
last thing. As a leadershipdevelopment consultant and executive
coach, I have a particularinterest in supporting recent internally
promoted leaders. If that'syou or if you support a leader who
has been recently promoted, Iencourage you to visit my website
at Kent Coach Playbook anddownload a free copy of my 90 day
blueprint filled withpractical advice for you or the leader
(01:11):
you support in hitting theground running and truly stepping
up to their new leadershiplevel. Without further ado, on with
the show. Welcome back,everyone. This is gonna be part two
of my conversation with MollyConlon Peterson. We were talking,
I would say, kind of the firsthalf of the challenge, so to speak,
of being laid off. And I justwanted to continue this conversation.
(01:34):
So this will probably be ashorter episode because go back to
the previous. I can't, giventhat I'm a little ahead on scheduling.
I can't tell you what episodethat is, but it's the one that dropped
right before this one. And Ijust want to pick up the conversation
where we left off. Right. Sowe were talking about, you know,
you've been laid off, youknow, the need to kind of take a
beat. We talked a little bitabout resumes. Maybe we'll get into
(01:57):
that a little bit more. Wetalked a fair amount about networking,
taking care of yourselfthrough the process. So just wanted
to kind of pick up where weleft off. And I would say, I'll just
kick it right over to you,Molly. You know, where's your energy?
Where do you want to pick up?
Well, I just, I had a thoughtand a resource that I just wanted
to share about networking too,just to kick off, because I know
(02:18):
that's where a lot of people'sheads go is like, gosh, I got to
start this networking process.So there is a book that I always
recommend to people and Iusually send it out to my clients.
It's called the 20 MinuteNetworking Meeting.
My hands are way up in theair. That book is the tome for networking.
It changed my life. Say more.
I agree. And here's the thingis, is how you do anything is how
(02:41):
you do everything. And so ifyou are setting up a networking meeting
and you have it a clearagenda, you. I'm grateful. I have
some questions. I'm going tomake this a two way street. I'm going
to wrap it up, I'm going tofollow up. You're showing them how
you're going to be in worklike it. And it gives us a really
(03:02):
beautiful structure of how doI, how do I do these meetings that
feel really hard and I don't,I'm not sure, I've never done this
before. And so I highlyrecommend that book. And it also
gives you some structure onhow to talk about yourself.
I think there's a bunch ofadditions of it now too, from when
I think when I first read itit was just, it was the 20 minute
(03:22):
networking meeting for, Ithink it was for executives or something
like that. And it was the onlyone that existed. And I, you know,
I had to do, I wouldn't saytremendous mental gymnastics to apply
it to, you know, a 30 year oldme, but was recommended to me by
a former HR person who workedat the, at the PDI in Korn Ferry
(03:46):
where I was working. So Ireached out to her because I knew
she was a safe person. I wasjust like, how do I network? What
is networking? I don't get it.I feel like I'm asking people for
a job and she's, and you know,she was like, read this book and
then come back to me. And Ifelt like it was a huge unlock for
me. But I know there's mult. Idon't know which one, which ones.
(04:09):
I just tend to say read thator see what other editions exist
because I feel like there's afew additions that are targeted to
different career stages ormaybe even professions at this point.
I can't say I've exactly muchrecently though.
Yeah, exactly. I think thatyou, you know, look at the, there's
a professional, there's anexecutive. Look at the one that fits
(04:30):
you. I think there's one forstudents as well. So, you know, take
a look and just see which onefits for you.
You know, I think it's hardfor people to network. You know,
there is this, jokingly, I'vealways said, hey, if you want to
be taken down a notch or two,start applying jobs, right? Because
nothing, nothing feels morepersonal than your applications for
(04:53):
your jobs. You know, the jobsthat you want. Your, your, it's,
you know, this ultimate do youlove me? Do you not? You know, am
I going to be accepted? Am Inot like experience? And it's, it,
it can suck at times. And sonetworking can feel like this tremendous
putting yourself out therething. And I think one piece of advice
(05:16):
that I tend to give to peopleis it's a nothing to lose gamble,
really. Because today you havezero meetings on your calendar. And
all you have to lose is. Andthis is kind of also been, frankly,
any entrepreneurs orsalespeople out there listening.
This has been my mentalityabout sales as well, which is you've
(05:36):
got zero meetings on yourcalendar today. Like, what do you
have to lose by reaching outand just asking for someone's time?
Like, hey, can. And it's eveneasier now with virtual. I think
one of the things. Let me, letme go Back to the 20 minute networking
meeting, which was actuallywritten in our own backyard, I believe
is Martha Ballinger in our ownbackyard, who wrote that? Yeah, in
(05:58):
the Twin Cities here. And Ithink back then, you know, the virtual
wasn't as when I first readit. Virtual was not as prolific as
it is now. So the idea waslike, how do you make it really easy
and say, basically it's calledthe 20 Minute Networking Meeting,
so that, you know, think aboutit at the time, if you were working
in a downtown area and you'retalking to somebody else who's also
(06:19):
probably in the downtown area,you're baking in five minutes of
walk time on either end andpromising this person that you're
going to get them in and outof the meeting in 20 minutes that
they can get back to work.Right. Even easier now with virtual
face to face, always better,but virtual super easy now too. What's
the worst that will happen ifyou reach out is they say nothing,
(06:43):
right or no.
Right.
In which case you still havezero meetings on your calendar. But
the gamble is just so muchbetter on the other side of that,
which is most people are goingto say yes, and now you've got a
meeting on your calendar.
Right.
And at the very least, at thevery least with networking is you're
(07:03):
getting repetitions in andtalking about yourself. And if nothing
else, networking prepares youfor interviewing better than almost
anything can do, even mockinterviewing, frankly, because you
just get these repetitions inof having to kind of talk about yourself
off the cuff. So I'll climbdown off my soapbox.
(07:24):
Well, you're exactly right,Kent. I mean, I think you make so,
so many great points. First ofall, I mean that it's so much easier
now because you can actuallyreach out on email. You can reach
out on LinkedIn, you can askpeople to make it. You can look on
LinkedIn and see who does thisperson know, and you can reach out
to that person and say, hey,I'm. I see that you're connected
to this person and I want anintroduction. Would you be willing.
(07:47):
So it's, you can do all ofthat from the comfort of your own
home. And, you know, and thenyou can actually set up a zoom meeting
and meet somebody for 20minutes. You could do five of those
a day. But the point is thatif you don't, it feels scary, it
feels uncomfortable to reachout and ask for help. And this is
(08:08):
that courage piece because ifyou, you know, in, in logically we
can say, well, if you don't doit, you're not going to, you know,
you're not gonna move forwardyourself forward in the job search.
And there's that emotionalpiece of. I just have to be, be normalized
that this is gonna be alittle. It would call it embrace
(08:29):
the suck. Yeah, it does suckto reach out and ask for help. It
does feel uncomfortable. Andwhen you get to the other side, the
people that get the best jobsaren't always the most qualified.
They're the ones that arewilling to take that extra little
reach, little extra ask and,you know, and do the things that,
(08:55):
that do feel a little bituncomfortable. And so I really encourage
people who are in that spotjust keep building that muscle. And
that's what also it does, isit builds that muscle of, I'm going
to try something new. I'mgoing to take a little risk here.
I'm going to take, you know,do this thing that feels a little
uncomfortable.
Yeah.
And start to.
It does get easier though,right? I think it's, it's. Nothing's
(09:17):
more uncomfortable than thefirst message you send. Right. And
then each one after gets, youknow, a little easier, too. It's.
It's repetition. It's likegoing to the gym. It just gets easier.
So what else? I know this is abig part of what you do. So what
else is kind of top of mindfor you, for folks who, at this point,
(09:37):
when this episode drops, atleast the folks at Toronto, folks
at Target and Amazon will Beabout two weeks in. So what else
is kind of top.
So I want to say this becauseI think this is one where when there's
this scarcity mindset, whenyou feel like, oh gosh, there's not
going to be enough jobs, Ijust have take a job. We talk a lot,
(10:00):
you know, about this idea ofthe quick fix, you know, and, and
I'm going to just say outloud, sometimes a quick fix is needed.
You know, like there are timesI, I don't recommend that because
I think that, you know, thenyou're ending up in the same spot
again and you, you, and whenpeople are in transition, it feels
really unsettled and so theyoftentimes do want to do that quick
(10:22):
f fix.
And so what do you, what doyou mean by quick fix? Taking something
long.
It, like I just had a client,like, here's an example. She, she's
nine interviews in and she'sseen yellow flag, yellow flag, red
flag, red flag. She's like, Ishould just take the job. And I'm
(10:42):
like, let's go back to whatyou said at the beginning about what
you wanted for culture, whatkind of person you wanted to work.
You know, like, let's go backto those core values that you said
were important. And how do youask the questions to make sure that
this, this red, these littlered flags and, and yellow flags are
coming up. Make sure that, youknow, you can feel good about moving
(11:05):
forward. And so she did andher intuition was correct that this
was not going to be a good fitfor her. And so when you're in that
spot, like, I think she knewthis, you know, like we, it's a two
way street. I, I feel like tomake sure that when you are interviewing
for jobs that you're askingthose good questions so that you're
(11:28):
not just taking something justto land that you're taking something.
And she ended up landing in areally good spot. She landed in a
great spot. But, but she wasable to ask those questions there.
But I think sometimes when,when you're in that, that place of
oh, I just need to land,you're not asking the right questions
(11:49):
back because you don't want toknow or you don't want, don't want
to. So going back to thatfirst part of like really getting
clear about what's importantto you. So that, and I think that's
also the piece that alsoemployers want is why do you want
to work for me? What, what'smeaningful about that is so.
(12:12):
That is so hard in this whenyou're in this spot. Right, right.
And, and I have feelings onboth sides of that equation. One
is, first of all, I wouldalmost say if you're a recruiter
and it's November 2025 soon,you know, it's only today we're recording
(12:32):
on November 3rd. December isgoing to be here before we know it.
You know, we're then sittingat seven, eight months. There's 200,000
people out of work right now.Maybe think about some of these questions
like why do you want to workhere? Because frankly, I know you're
looking for someone to say,because I've loved your company forever
(12:53):
and I'm so bought into themission and, but there's a part of
me that's like, like have somehumanity and maybe give me a break
a little bit here on andquestions like that, to be perfectly
honest. But, and I get it in anormal time, you know, you're hoping
that someone's done hours of research.
Right.
(13:13):
And yet let's go to the otherside of the fence because I'm sure
you've got advice for peoplethere on and yet you should probably
do some research and say whyyou're interested.
Right. Well, I think the thingis, here's, here's what I would say
about that is that you'retrying to set yourself apart because
there's so many peopleapplying for roles, right. And there's
so many people. So how do you,we know that, you know, you take,
(13:38):
you take somebody, their skillset, their very best self profile,
you pair that with somethingthat's meaningful, they're going
to achieve at the highestlevels. So people who are hiring
now, they have a flood ofpeople who can probably competently
do that job. So they're nownot moving to just the competence
piece. But there's that thoseintangible things, right? Is there
(14:03):
a connection there? Didsomebody make that introduction?
Does this person, like, arethey really resonating with the work?
Do they have a story to tellaround why they want to do this?
So how do you set yourselfapart from the other, you know, X
number of applicants that toour point earlier, if you're using
AI, a lot of these resumeslook a lot alike. And so it, I think
(14:30):
that is, there's a few waysthat you set yourself apart as an
applicant and that can be oneof them.
We mentioned AI last time,right. You know, we kind of talked
about how well you probablyshould be using AI as a thought partner.
Don't have it. Do the work. Ialways say that. Don't Just spit
out a new resume because youno longer know what it did, what
(14:51):
it didn't do. And maybe itsuddenly it got into an AI hallucination
and said, you worked at NASAwhen you haven't. But, but, you know,
certainly ask it forrecommendations. How can I tweak
my resume best to match thisjob? Now, the other thing I keep
seeing people talking aboutpeople doing, and I'm seeing some
(15:11):
of the videos out theresuggesting that people do this is
like, you know, like, liketape your phone to the middle of
your monitor and use one ofthese AIs that can listen in and
give you your answers. Don'tdo that. Right. Like, I've. And I
was just at a SHRM conferencethe other week, and I don't remember
(15:33):
what company, but it was likea head of recruiting who was saying,
like, it is our policy that ifwe feel like you are using AI in
the interview and there'stelltale signs it takes you longer
to, you know, suddenly it'staking you a little bit longer to
think they can see your eyesscanning what you're reading, and
they will end the interviewand cancel the application immediately.
(16:00):
Now, you probably can use itto do some mock interviewing. You
probably can use an AI to belike, hey, what are some of the questions
that might be asked? Do youhave recommendations based on my
resume? Or depending on howyou're using AI, you know, for how
to answer, but do not use itmid interview as my, you know, I,
(16:21):
I agree with you.
Yeah. And, and that's, andthat's the, the one place you have
the opportunity to have thatauthentic connection and to have
those stories, you know, weall have, you know, the star stories.
I mean, that's still veryrelevant. You know, give me some
examples. Share, share somestories of when you've done these
(16:42):
different things, you'vesolved problems or you've demonstrated
leaders, you know, you.
Know, and then I know theTarget folks out there are. From
my memory, when I used to do alittle consulting with Target, they
were pretty well practiced in.They might even use the. Was it like
the Star or whatever, youknow, interview protocol or something
(17:04):
like that? Like, they'repretty good at that. But let me back
up a step and say, what's youradvice to people on cover letters?
Right. I think that was a,that was a big thing 15 years ago.
Yeah.
Is it still relevant? Do yourecommend people do it?
I think that it's, it can behelpful. But if you're applying online,
you know, oftentimes the COVIDletter isn't even needed anymore.
(17:27):
It's just easy. Sometimes itis and sometimes it's not. You know,
I think any time that you canset yourself apart, do it differently.
Send a resume. I mean, like, Ithink we're in this spot right now.
It's like, how do you getsomeone's attention? The first step
would be obviously if you canget an introduction. Everyone's applying
(17:49):
online. You absolutely shouldapply online. But you can also send
a hard copy with a coverletter and that might get somebody's
attention because nobody elseis doing that. And so it's thinking
about those creative ways ofhow do I set myself apart? How do
I get someone's attention?Sending a handwritten thank you note,
sending those, those ways thatpeople don't normally do. Sending
(18:11):
somebody a book, somebody, youknow, after an informational interview
or, or something that's tangible.
I like what you said in ourprevious episode, which was if they
said something relevant, thiscould both be for a hiring manager
that you've talked to and youknow, it's a three week process or
even someone you're networkingwith. If you're reading, you know,
(18:33):
staying current and readingmaybe articles that are in the space
that you both coexist in is,hey, saw this, thought of you, just,
you know, wasn't sure if yousaw it, wanted to send it your way.
All right, I'm going to pepperyou with some questions because I'm
looking at our time again andI know it's going to be a little
shorter than part one, but I,I asked you the COVID letter question
and I'm like, oh, I have otherlittle, like, let me throw these
(18:55):
questions at you too.Sometimes on LinkedIn they say who
the recruiter is. What's yourthoughts on reaching out to that
person and sending them a, a message?
What do you have to lose? Imean, that's, that, that's where
I'm at is what do you have tolose? You know, it's, it's, if you
don't reach out, then you,you're in the same boat that you
(19:17):
were when you started. So Iwould highly recommend, you know,
this is that those littlemoments of just do the reach out,
do you know, you, you want tobe persistent and, and not be a past,
obviously. But there isnothing to lose. I don't know an
opinion on that or not.
Here's what I'll add to that.If you've done the job and you know
(19:40):
that you are 100% qualifiedfor the job.
Yes.
Then go for it. Right? But Ihave heard, right and There might
be some danger in this currentenvironment with so many people out
of work that, you know, thatthey're getting, you know, they suddenly,
their job gets posted and theysuddenly get inundated with, you
know, a couple hundred inmails.
(20:00):
Yeah.
So if you're, if you're goingto reach out, I would say table stakes
would be you're actuallyqualified for the job. It's not a
stretch.
Right.
Or you've done the job. It'snot a stretch. Bonus points if you
know someone. Right. You know,like there's multiple connection
points for why they should payattention to your message. I like
(20:21):
the boldness, though. I likeyour boldness of. Because it kind
of goes back to even theboldness of networking, which is
what you really have to lose.So I'll, I'll go with that. I would
also say if you don't want toget 200inmails as a recruiter, you
probably shouldn't be taggedas the recruiter from the job posting.
Right. I feel like it's kind.This is where, like, I feel like
(20:42):
it's kind of asking for itbecause I'm pretty sure it's a toggle.
You have to click to have yourname associated with the posting.
So if you don't want inmails,maybe don't.
That's. That's a fairstatement. I mean, I think recruiters
are really struggling rightnow to sift through everything. And
(21:02):
so, I mean, I, My heart goesout to them because it's a, it's
an impossible job just bylooking at a bunch of resumes, how
am I going to sort through? SoI think they're like it. They need
help, they need guidance.Like, who. Who should I be? Like,
how do I even begin with this?Because I think just. I was at a
career conference and somebodysaid they had 30,000 applications
(21:25):
for a job. Like, I think it'sjust, it's. Who knows if it's just
AI and it's easy apply, easyapply, easy apply, you know, and
so how do these recruitersfigure out who they even start with?
Yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah, andthis is where it's like, you know,
everybody who's applying forjobs hates the applicant tracking
system. But the reality is ahuman cannot read through. You know,
(21:49):
if I think about, you know,and I'm thinking, this isn't even
just Fortune 500 companies whoare experiencing this, who probably,
you know, the largest HR teamat most, Fortune probably 1000 companies
is probably the largest HRteam. Maybe next to comp or benefits.
Right. You Know, but that alsomeans there's so many jobs being
(22:10):
posted. But again, so normal.You can't expect a human to read
30,000 resumes. You can'texpect a human to read 100 resumes
for an individual job opening.
Right.
How do you, as you think abouthelping people, prep for interviewing?
You know, what's some of your,what are some of your thoughts? There's.
(22:31):
Yeah. Well, I mean, I thinkthat those star stories are really,
I think like 80% of the workis, is thinking it through ahead
of time. So you really do wantto think about your stories. You
want to think about how youwant to message, how you talk about
yourself. You want to talkabout, you know, what are your strengths
and your, your weaknesses andbe strategic about that related to
(22:51):
the job. But I think thosestar stories and having, even if
they're not specificallyasking for examples, integrating
those and weaving them in,using having some numbers, things
at the ready that share youraccomplishment in tangible ways and.
Oh, go ahead.
Oh, sorry. Because you werekind of talking about results, right.
(23:13):
And it made me think aboutresumes, Right. Because it was probably
10 or 15 years ago now whenthe advice kind of started to turn
from just having your resumeslist out your job titles and job
duties to starting to say,what are the results? You know, what's
a result? Focused resume as,you know, as someone in HR that has
(23:36):
sometimes felt hard, right. Tothink about, like, well, geez, what
are the results? Because it'sreally, you know, it's really easy
to think about a salespersonor somebody who has a P and L, who's
managing a P and L to talkabout results, right? There's, there's
hard financial metrics thatthose folks can use. But I know when
it, when it came to hr andthen the counseling that I've given
(23:57):
other people is like, well,think about timelines, think about
numbers. Like how, you know,how long did it take you to get a
project from, you know, ideato launch? How many people did you
manage through that process?How many people did a program you
did touch? Did those programswin any internal or external awards?
(24:21):
I'm trying to think of other,other thoughts on that, but I know
that can be. But those, thosesame result stories need to make
their way into the interviewtoo, right?
100%. And being able toquantify it some way, it doesn't
have to be like, like, to yourpoint, a salesperson can say, I sold
X percent, where somebodycould say, hey, I accomplished this
in a tighter timeline, or weimpacted, you know, 50 people's you
(24:46):
know, lives in this way or,you know, my leadership team. Team.
We created a culture that wasreally like, it doesn't have to be
all numbers either. It can besome of those softer things that
are. And especially if you'regoing for a job in hr, that's what
they're going to be lookingfor. I mean, it's still reasonable.
It doesn't have to always havea number. Numbers are really great
(25:09):
if you can quantify it. Have acouple numbers on your resume.
If you manage people. How isretention? Right, right.
Yeah.
You know, did you, did youhave good retention? Did you have
good process for hiringpeople? Right. Like, think about
some of the things thatyou're, you know, proud of that as
(25:30):
a. A result, I'm, I'm watchingour time. It's gonna be a shorter.
Yeah, sorry, shorter episodethan the last one. So. But I want
to get to at least one more,you know, Molly, one more hot button
issue on your mind when itcomes to, to either how you're doing,
how you do career coaching, orjust with where this sheer number
(25:50):
of people might be at in theprocess right now.
Yeah. So let me think thatthrough. I would just say making
sure that, you know, I thinkeverybody's going to. For those bigger
companies oftentimes and, andthinking about like, there can be
smaller company, like there'sa million smaller businesses that
(26:15):
are out there and those mayhave one or two roles because everyone's
often goes to those largercompanies and floods those companies.
So look for some of thosehidden gems elsewhere.
I mean, I think most of usthese days are probably going to
LinkedIn. Where else do yourecommend people go to look?
I mean, your network,Obviously, but network LinkedIn can
(26:37):
be a really great place to.You can do, I mean, people do this
and, you know, to do this, butjob titles or industries and see
who comes up in your networkand see who you're connected to.
And so use that as a jumpingoff point, not the like then take,
take that extra step and reachout to that person and say, hey,
(26:58):
I see that you're connected tothis person. Would you be willing
to make an introduction for me?
Or indeed. Or monster. Any ofthose still relevant in your experience?
You know, I mean, I think, Ithink you can look at all of it to
find jobs, you know, but Ithink to the point we were just talking
about to find a job and tojust apply online is, Is maybe not
(27:24):
the best use of time.
Sure, fair enough.
You know, find the job, thenstart to do a little research and
digging to see who might be aconnection there or how you might
find somebody that's aconnection there. And then yes, you
probably will apply online,but you want someone to walk the
resume or make the call or doan email introduction or find that
(27:46):
side, step in if at all possible.
Yeah. So on that note, right,because I think you're calling, I
think, which is often the casewhen I'm talking about people who
are in transition. It allcomes back to networking. As much
as people may or may not wantto hear that. So I think maybe one
other piece on networking isare there local, in particular local
(28:09):
trade associations that youalready belong to or you know, can
join again? I was the mostrecent local society for HR management,
you know, association. I knowthat group has like a benefit, I
guess I don't know how you'dwant to call it, but like a program
(28:31):
for, for people who have beenrecently laid off where they will
just get, they will give you aone year membership to start joining,
to just join immediately.Right. And I, I would say with the
sheer number of layoffshappening, I would be, I mean I,
I guess I couldn't say howother trades outside of, you know,
how other job families outsideof HR do things, but in the times
(28:54):
I've gone to both that and,and the association for Talent Development
Groups, there's always beensome kind of conversation at the
beginning of those, eitherthose monthly calls or meetings or
the, the larger day longthings around like you know, even
having people, you know, ifyou're on the job market, raise your
hand. Right. And those, youknow, those of you who are, whose
hands are down, look aroundand you know, these are people we,
(29:18):
you know, they do encouragethat live networking, especially
with people who are displaced.
Right.
So I know it might not be theeasiest thing to think about around
like do I want, is this what Ireally want to spend a few hundred
dollars on right now when Idon't know where my next paycheck's
coming? But I would say it'sprobably worth, worth the gamble,
(29:39):
right. And even ask like, hey,do you have a program for people
who've been recently laid offto join? You never know.
And that's another way thatyou usually can bring a guest to
some of those. So not laidoff. If there's somebody in your
network that's laid out, bringthem as a guest. But I agree professional
associations can betremendously helpful and that's where
(30:02):
you can start to build thoserelationships. And, and I think that's
what we're talking about. Howdo you build more relationships or
deepen those relationshipsthat are existing. So it's not about
I'm asking you for a job, butwe're getting to know each other
and I can add value, maybe,maybe that.
Let's, let's add that ashomework. Right. To those of you
who are networking out there,Right. Ask if you don't know who
(30:23):
the, what, what tradeassociations are out there in your
space, ask the people thatyou're talking to, hey, what are
the other, you know, because Ican sit and rattle off some from
my own background andexperience, but you know, ask the
people that you're not workingwith. Right.
I agree. I think that's reallygreat. So yeah, I, I, I think that
sums it up that we're talkingabout the heart of this is human
(30:46):
connection and building thoseconnections. And that is the, the
doorway in and having thecourage to put yourself out there
and knowing that sometimesit's not going to work out and getting
back out there and, and havingsomebody to support you. Find, find
your people.
Love it. What's one last pieceof advice that you have for our listeners
(31:08):
of episode two?
You know, I think just beingreally, there's this idea that if
we're harder on ourselves,we're going to do better. And that
is actually not the case. Theresearch bears, does not bear that
out. The research bears outwhen you are kinder and soft to your,
(31:29):
to yourself. You give yourselfa soft place to land and you have
people around you because thisis hard work. This is going to require,
you know, it's an emotionalroller coaster in some cases. And
so just to be really kind toyourself. And then I think, you know,
just to take really good careof yourself, just emotionally, physically,
(31:51):
get out there and exercise.You need a place to process. You
know, do, do whatever you canto just stay, you know, active, mentally,
spiritually engaged in yourlife and all of those other ways.
Because at the end of the day,the, the more positive emotions you
can experience in your life,we know this, the more possibilities
(32:11):
you can see, the more you'regoing to show up for those people
when you are connecting in a,in a better way that that's going
to make them want to hire you.So by taking really good care of
yourself, you show up as abrighter light and that's who people
grab want to bring in.
Love it. All right? I know youneed to run. So for those people
out there who want a littlemore Molly Conlin Peterson in their
(32:33):
lives, how can they find you?You know, what, what would you encourage
them to go look for.
So my website is iswww.thedearingventure.com and right
now I am offering free 30minute sessions to anyone who just
needs a boost, needs a littleadvice, needs a little soft place
(32:56):
to land. If it, we cancontinue that. If you want to sign
up for coaching, but if youalso just are feeling stuck and you,
gosh, I just don't know whatto do here and I need somebody to
talk to. I am here and I'moffering that up right now. And you
can just get on my website andsign up for a 30 minute session.
So that's right on the website.
That's right on the website.
(33:17):
All right, well, take her upon it. Molly, thank you for going
a little long and ending updoing an ad hoc two part episode.
Really appreciate it. Can'twait to have you on again.
My pleasure. Ken. Thank you somuch. This was so lovely. It was
really lovely to be here. Andthanks for supporting people in transition
because that's what you'redoing. Like you're changing lives
(33:38):
with this podcast. It'sreally, really cool. Yeah, you're
doing your work.
All right, bye.
Take care.
That brings us to the end ofour episode. Thanks for listening.
I'd encourage you to head onover to my website, Kent Coach, and
start a conversation with methere. Or check out my promotion
playbook at Kent CoachPlaybook. Before you go on with your
(33:58):
day, I ask you please take amoment to leave a rating and a review
wherever you listen topodcasts. Five stars. That helps
put this podcast in front ofmore eyes and ears. Until next time,
take it easy.
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