June 23, 2025 • 42 mins
This might be the most important episode we've ever recorded.
Ash and Chris dive headfirst into the brutal reality of men’s mental health—from financial pressure and toxic masculinity to the silent suffering most men carry every day. This raw, emotional and honest episode pulls no punches. We talk about debt, divorce, addiction, suicide, social media, and why so many men feel like they’re barely holding it together.
But more importantly, we offer real-life perspective, personal stories, and some hope.
If you’re struggling, or you’ve got someone in your life who is, this episode might help you understand things in a way you never have before.
🔗 Need help?
We mention:
- Andy's Man Club
- MATES: Men and Their Emotions
- Citizens Advice
This one’s for the men who say “I’m fine” but aren’t.
You are not alone. You matter.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The internet has ruined everybody.
My brain told me my world wasgoing to collapse.
I owed a quarter of a millionquid and I had less than a
thousand pound in the bank.
The human race is fucked.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Reach out, be nice to people, speak to them.
Them stop hiding.
Um, it's just horrible to thinkabout, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (00:32):
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Speaker 2 (00:54):
Save money, support local with closer hi everybody,
welcome to today's episode ofthe untold podcast.
No des today, so it's just themain people, obviously me and
ash morning.
Ash morning, chris, how youdoing buddy, good mate, I'm good
, right, the Untold Podcast noDes today, so it's just the main
people, obviously Me and Ash.
Morning Ash, morning Chris.
How you doing, buddy?
I'm good mate, I'm good Right,anyone that's listening.
If you're expecting the usualpodcast lots of laughs, a bit of
piss taking and a bit of banterthis is going to be a little
bit different to usual, a littlebit more deeper.
(01:17):
We thought it was reallyimportant to kind of dive really
deep into men's mental health.
So I'm going to give you somestatistics first, just so you
can get an idea of how bad it isin the UK.
And please keep listening,because just because you don't
struggle with mental healthdoesn't mean that your husband,
your boyfriend, your brother,anyone, your mate, your sister.
So to start off with thesuicide rates among men, you'll
(01:41):
notice that I'm actually, ifyou're watching, I'm going to be
looking down at this becausethis is really important.
Rates among men You'll noticethat I'm actually, if you're
watching, I'm going to belooking down at this because
this is really important that Iget this right.
The highest suicide rates amongmen.
Men account for approximately75% of all suicides in the UK.
That is massive, it is.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
It's too big.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Is it.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Yeah Well, any suicide is too big.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
The leading cause of death of men under the age of 50
.
I mean, that's the leadingcause of death of all men male
under 50.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Is it really?
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Yeah, See I didn't know that it's not cancer, it's
not getting run over or anything.
It's suicide.
Yeah, the age group that mostaffected is between the age of
45 and 49.
Is it really so?
Basically me.
Yeah, the age group that mostaffected is between the age of
45 and 49.
Is it really so?
Basically me, yeah, you're notquite.
45.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
You're not that young , are you?
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Well, I'm 43, but I class myself as middle-aged.
Do you know what I mean?
The Northwest has a much, muchhigher suicide rate than the
South.
I think that is obvious, to befair.
I think the cost of living isbad across the country, but I
think the earnings are muchbetter down here than they are
up north, so I can kind ofunderstand that one the increase
in suicide rates in 2023.
(02:53):
These stats are all from 2023because there aren't any more
current ones.
The suicide rate in England andWales reached its highest level
since 1999.
Now you've got to put intoconcept there that obviously was
COVID, a lot of of that, wasn'tit?
You know the financial burdenof COVID, but they think that
obviously, because people aren'treporting attempted suicides
and stuff like that, thestatistics could be a lot higher
(03:15):
than that, which again is just.
It's just horrible to thinkabout.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
It's mad as well, because I that's 2023.
Yeah, the society has declinedmassively, I would say, since
2023.
The last 12 months, things just, see, keep seem to get harder
and harder and harder.
It's the squeeze, isn't?
Speaker 2 (03:37):
it, yeah, just a constant, constant squeeze.
And if you are, unless you havegot a really strong mentality,
it it's so odd, so odd.
Then we have got.
More than 90% of everybody thatcommits suicide has got some
sort of mental health issue or adrug or alcohol addiction.
So there's people out therethat know people have got mental
(03:57):
health issues and an alcohol ordrug addiction.
You need to look after thesepeople.
A drug addiction and an alcoholaddiction doesn't necessarily
mean it's that person's fault.
They just got lost along theway yeah, and it's easy, isn't
it?
Speaker 1 (04:09):
if you're fit, healthy, your life's going
fantastic.
You don't need to turn to drugsand alcohol.
Yeah, it's.
Do you know what I mean?
I spent a lot of time listeningto dapper laughs, dan
o'reilly's podcast about mentalsobriety and what, even just
watching his journey, and he'sgot lived experience of it.
You use drugs and alcohol.
(04:31):
I mean, I've done it before.
I went through a stage ofdrinking at least a bottle of
wine a night when I got home,just to mask real life.
So when life's shit, you wantto mask real life.
When life's good, then it'sobviously you have a drink to
enjoy it.
But when you're using drugs andalcohol to escape the reality
(04:53):
of life, that's when I think itbecomes really dangerous.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
And the sad realisation of that is if you go
to drugs and alcohol, it doesmask it, it doesn't get rid of
it.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
You're just pushing it down the rank and when you're
not drinking or taking thosedrugs.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
It becomes even worse because you're not only on the
comedown, you're also having todeal with all that mental health
issue anyway.
So it's not the way to go atall, really, really isn't?
The study suggests, actually,that individuals who die by
suicide had actually contactedtheir mental health advisors or
reached out for help at somepoint and been ignored.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Yeah, and that's another big problem, because you
can't do.
You know what I mean you.
You ring your GP up and say, oh, I'm suicidal.
Okay, you can have anappointment in six weeks time to
see me and then to get in frontof someone, unless you've got
money to pay privately.
And that's where the likes ofDan's man Club and stuff come in
(05:50):
, because they are helping, theyare trying to raise money to
make it more accessible forpeople to be able to actually
get the help they need, becauseit is up here, the brain is the
most powerful muscle in a bodyisn't it?
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Now, this is not a suicide one, but I think this is
really important to mentionthis, because everyone, when
they think about suicide, theytend to think, tend to think
about men, right?
This actually really upset mewhen I read this yesterday 33 of
every teenage boy between theage of 14 and 18 has at some
point tried to either self-harmthemselves or commit suicide.
(06:27):
That is fucking disgusting.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
Because they're not even old enough to understand
really to do that, and socialmedia has got a lot of things to
blame for that, I think.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
It's exactly the conversation me and my wife had
yesterday.
The exact same conversation.
If you would have gone back 20years, I guarantee you that
number would be five percent.
The kids.
Kids weren't stuck indoors,they were going out with their
friends, they were playing inthe mud and going up the park
and kicking the football about.
That thought process wasn'tthere.
But because it's always oversocial media everything, yeah,
(06:59):
it's horrible and it must be.
I'd hate to be a teenager nowand I worry so much about my
little boy, especially afterreading that last night.
Yeah, I've got two.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
I've got my 16-year-old.
He's quite streetwise, he knows, now he's learned.
But I've got two girls.
My 11-year-old is already very,very sensitive, very sensitive,
and, whereas you can't hideyour kids away from social media
, because it's there, whether welike it or not, if they're, not
(07:27):
on it they're taking the pissout of at school.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
Yeah, you know, it's just a newsworthy situation, but
then if they're on it, they'reposting a video.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
They're a little bit overweight, their hair's a bit
frizzy, their hair's a bitgreasy.
They start getting spots andthere are horrible.
Kids are fucking horrible andthere are horrible kids are
fucking horrible.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
Sorry, but kids are horrible.
I said it the other day, didn'tI Last week's?
Well, the one that's come outtoday, the internet, has ruined
everybody.
It's been great, but it hasbeen ruined by everybody.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
Back in our day, back in my day, growing up, msn
Messenger was a thing and thatjust come out, msn Messenger.
But you didn't spend the timeon it that you spend on now,
because you had to sit on thecomputer.
You had to make sure your mumand dad weren't picking up the
phone and making a phone call.
And I remember once there was acouple of girls and, as you do,
(08:20):
as a kid I was probably 14.
I was in the living roomdancing in my pants and they
were outside my house watchingme.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Bit weird now looking back at it.
Maybe they did fancy me.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
But then I went into school and I was getting a
barrage of abuse from five orsix girls on MSN messenger
saying we can see you, we'rewatching you through your window
.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
At least they didn't have the proof.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Well, exactly that's the difference between nowadays.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Nowadays it is scary.
It is scary.
Yeah, I mean going into thatteenage side of things.
You know, you've only got tolook at, you see, like you know
all the people sending picturesof each other and stuff like to
each other and like they'redating, and that you send a
(09:11):
picture of yourself.
Do never send a picture ofyourself, because I know
somebody at school near me itwas all over the, the mum's page
on on the where I live somebodyhad sent an explicit picture of
themselves to somebody else inclass and they'd shared it with
the whole school.
You know, it's just as it's soeasy now, bang, and you can kind
of understand.
Now we're talking about it, youcan kind of understand.
Well, that's the statistic.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Statistic is a thing, can't you, because it is so
easy to get trapped in to thatsocial media side of things at
that age yeah, they live theirlife through it, live their life
through it and their highlightreel is all they're ever going
to see, because that's allowedto post stuff on TikTok, but
she's not allowed to include herface.
(09:47):
Yeah, and the other day shecome to me and she was like oh
yeah, look, daddy, my video gotX amount of views and I said it
doesn't matter.
What matters is you're doing itbecause you enjoy doing it.
That's what matters.
It doesn't matter You're goingto have people hate you.
You're going to have peoplelove you.
You're going to have peopledisagree with you, but that's
like a stepping stone now forlife.
Yeah, obviously, with what youdo, there's people that probably
(10:10):
disagree with what you do.
There's people that support you, but you do what you do and you
can't let other people in andruin your mental stability
because they've got a differentopinion.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Yeah, I think that's very important.
That's a very valid point, mate.
To be fair, you're uh.
The difference is, thoughyou're, you're uh anyone that
listens you, then we know you'rea good parent.
You talk to your kids, youexplain things, and you do do
things with your parents, yourkids.
But there's a lot of kids outthere.
Don't get that in there.
I mean, they just just get freeflow, do whatever you want.
At 13 years old, you're notallowed on tiktok, but you can
have an account anyway.
Do what you want and read whatyou want.
(10:44):
Yeah, um right, let's get backto the men's, men's side of
things.
Um, what do you think thereasons are nowadays, like, as
in for the suicide rates, thatthey are like we've got stuff
like economic pressure I think,yeah, I think, economic pressure
, I think job pressure.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
Um, obviously I'd like to see how many of those
stats are within theconstruction industry.
Yeah, I think one of the bigthings is horrible, horrible
women using children againsttheir ex-partners after a
separation.
Because that system's fuckedLike.
That system is horrible.
The system always will favourthe mum, no matter who she is,
(11:24):
no matter what she's done.
I know people.
I went to an event that SamThompson did called Are you
Alright, mate, and there was alad there.
We sort of sectioned up intogroups and there was a lad there
told his story about he soldhis house, everything to fight
for his daughter Because the newstepdad was not being
(11:44):
particularly nice to her.
Won't go into details, but hehad to fight for that.
He had to go through the courtsand get himself into hundreds
of thousands of pounds worth ofdebt just to fight for his
daughter and he had the proofthat these things were happening
.
Yeah, the 13 year old sat therewith a solicitor and said look
this, this is happening and thisis happening.
I don't want to live thereanymore.
But he couldn't do.
(12:06):
You know what I mean?
He had to physically and that,I think, is a massive, massive
part of those rates.
Definitely, I think.
Job, job satisfaction.
Um, you go to work 7, 30, 5o'clock every day.
Your boss is a bit of an ar.
You're literally living to work, working, you're working to
(12:27):
live not living to work.
You're working to live everysingle day, no matter how much
you do, no matter how hard youwork.
You just can't seem to get tothe end of it, and I think
that's a big point.
So I think you've got womenusing children to manipulate
things.
I think that's massive and Ithink that needs a huge shakeup.
Then you've got the financialpressures and the fact that
(12:51):
you're working.
Now you're earning the same,but everything's costing 20%,
30% more.
People can't afford holidaysanymore, Whereas you look
forward to every year a nicefamily holiday.
People can't do that becauseit's so bloody expensive.
But what do you think?
What are your views?
Speaker 2 (13:11):
yeah, I have to agree with you there, mate.
I mean, you know I'm a onehousehold income and it is very
stressful.
You know, you, you have billsand you have bills, and you have
bills and you have bills andyou have a certain amount of
money put aside for it all thetime.
And I am quite an old schoolperson.
You know, I don't want my wifeto work particularly hard.
I don't expect her to.
I'm the alpha male in my house.
(13:31):
You know, I want to provide formy family.
But at the same time, when youact like that, it causes you so
much more stress because you putthis thing on your shoulder,
that you have to be this strongman.
You have to be the one thatdoesn cry.
You have to be the one thatdoesn't talk to your missus
because you don't want to shareyour problems with her, because
she's got problems of her own.
She's looking after the kid,she's upset when he's upset and
(13:51):
you know it plays a lot on yourmind.
And then the brakes go on yourcar and you get a bill for
£1,000 for some new discs andyou think she's got to use the
car.
Where am I going to get thatmoney from?
It's just a constant financialburden, isn't it?
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Everything's just so.
I would imagine that a lot ofthose statistics that you read
out earlier do boil down tofinancial reasons.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
And the thing is as well, it's easy.
Again, the same with drugs andalcohol.
It's easy to get into thatgambling.
I haven't got the money, whatcan I do?
It's easy to get into thatgambling.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
I haven't got the money.
What can I do?
I've got a hundred quid in mybank.
We spoke about that the otherday, didn't we Actually like how
easy it is to just spend yourmoney?
Speaker 1 (14:30):
online gambling.
Oh, let's go online online.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
And then you get all these things.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
And then you'll go on one website and then your
Instagram feed your tick slots,submit 20 pound and we'll
guarantee you a spin and a win.
And they're like oh yeah, let'sdo that.
I saw something the other day Ican't remember who it was Was
interviewing someone.
He said why have you just goneand bought 40 quid for scratch
cards?
And the guy was like well,because it's my last 40 quid, I
(14:56):
need to try and turn it intosomething.
But that's mad Cause.
That's the mentality, thepeople.
I need something to change.
I need something to change andthat's the easy option Quick fix
.
That could be the quick fix,but 99.998% of the time it ain't
going to happen because thesystem's rigged to not work in
(15:18):
your favor.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
I bought 10 of those scratch cards 10 quids worth the
other day on my birthday andwon two pound.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
That's a good return isn't it Basically the estate?
Quid Good return isn eight quidbut you still get.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Oh, I've won two pounds that's what they do it
for, and then you get thatlittle bit of endorphins in your
body and you think, oh,dopamine or whatever it's called
, and then you're going back formore.
I think a lot of things really.
I mean, I've got a very goodmate of mine.
I mentioned him in the podcastthe other day, a couple of weeks
ago in fact.
I his problems, while he nevertalks, and I think it's like a
(15:47):
stigma thing, isn't it?
Like the man has got to bestrong, the man can't talk.
It's the caveman theory, isn'tit?
I know he's been struggling.
I know he's been struggling.
I know there's no way the shitthat he's gone through in the
last two years that he hasn'twanted to reach out at some
point, but he just doesn't, andI think that is what men do
Unless he just doesn't.
And I think that is what men do, unless you've been to the
(16:09):
breaking point.
My other friend was at breakingpoint.
He reached out to me,thankfully, and I put him in
contact with a therapist that Iwas using previously and he
loved it, absolutely loved goingto see her, and it sorted him
right out.
He's sweet as a nut now Stillhas the odd day where he
messaged me or whatever, buthe's perfect, but I think it is
that stigma of I can't reach outbecause I don't want my wife to
(16:32):
see me weak, I don't want mychildren to see me crumble.
He might go up in his bedroomand shut the door at night and
cry his eyes out for 10 minutes,I don't know, but he would
never let us know that and Ithink that's a really sad thing,
because it's like that insilence, isn't it?
And that's kind of why peopledo what they do.
Yeah, because they go away ontheir own and they, their
thought process changes, and Idon't know it's is.
(16:54):
It actually really does upsetme when I think about it it's.
Speaker 1 (16:59):
It's crazy because it's always the one.
You see these stories, you seethese posts, you speak to people
.
It's always the one you neverexpect it from because they're
putting on that facade, they'retrying to be brave, they want to
be, they want to be again.
It boils down to the people notbeing themselves and not like
this stigmatism of a man, alphaman, cave man, bang on your
(17:21):
chest, get shit done.
Yes, you still need that,because that's attractive, that
will keep you going.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
I mean, otherwise, we live in a completely woke world
, don't we?
Where there is no masculinity,there is no femininity or
anything.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
But you've got to.
I mean, if you've got lovedones, you've got to share how
you're feeling with them, and Ithink it's really like your
friend went to therapy, reallyenjoyed it.
I think if you're strugglingmentally, there is lots of
different ways to try and getthat out of you, to try and work
(17:53):
with it and to build thatmental resilience.
Look, you've got debtcollectors letters dropping
through the door.
You've got.
Do you know what I mean?
You've got people people atwork, for example being horrible
to you.
You've got to go and speak tothe boss.
You don't want to speak to boss, you don't want to be a grass
and stuff.
It's again communication, isn'tit?
Speaker 2 (18:10):
and I think you've got to be able to communicate
with the people closest to youyour parents or I think you need
to go through something in yourlife that prepares you to be
mentally secure.
Yeah, I think that's important,like some people can.
Some people can process things,some people can't.
The people that can process arethe ones that are fine, the
they're the ones that get onwith their life.
They don't need the help.
They can box things up and theycan filter it out and do it
(18:32):
their own way, but obviously theother people that don't go
through that struggle.
Now I think it's important foreverybody listening that we kind
of show our own little bit ofvulnerability here.
There we go.
Which kind of leads that into mysection.
So I'm actually going to gofirst on this, yeah, yeah.
So I taught myself when I wasvery, very young to be very
stable and it took me to thepoint of nearly thinking maybe
(18:56):
this isn't for me, maybe this iswhat you're supposed to do in
life.
When shit hits the fan, it'sthe easy way out.
But because I was watching theperson in my life that was my
Superman do that, it made medecide no, I'm not going to do
that actually.
No, I need to be strong,because that is a bad way of
doing it.
He was going to leave me behindbecause it was the easiest
(19:18):
option for him.
Now I'm not going to say it is,but it's, obviously it is.
You know, I'm not I'm not goingto call him out on the, on the
uh, on the podcast, because thatwould be really unfair.
But if he, if he does listen,he's going to notice him anyway.
But you know he was the mostinfluential person in my life,
um, and we went throughsomething when I was like 13, 14
, uh, that I walked into, that Isaw and it wasn't particularly
(19:40):
nice, and then he obviously tookmassive responsibility for it
and things happened.
You know like I became.
I became a a weekend kid.
You know.
You went with one parent at oneweekend and the other one
another one.
But, um, for six months Iwatched that man regret every
single decision that he made inthe few months that he was doing
(20:01):
what he was doing, and when hewas regretting those decisions,
he was drinking very heavily.
He was trying to take his ownlife.
I was trying to stop him.
All the time I was phoning thepolice, I was chasing after him
and at 13, 14 years of age, thatwas not a nice thing to go
through, you know, um, andprobably six months ago I would
(20:22):
have sat here and I would haveactually probably been quite
upset about that.
But because we've spoken aboutstuff on the podcast before, I
think my emotions are nowopening up properly in my head
and I'm able to filter them outcorrectly where, as I taught
myself at that age, that is notwhat you do, because you are
responsible for other people.
Now I'm responsible for mychildren and, to a certain
(20:43):
extent, for my wife, you know,um.
So that is not something that Iwould ever allow my thought
process to to take hold of, um,so you know it's.
Everybody deals with mentalhealth issues.
At some point I went through umhealth anxiety when I had my
stroke six, seven months.
I was in pieces.
I didn't really know what to dobecause I thought I was going
(21:03):
to die.
I thought I had a brain tumorto start with, and then, all of
a sudden, I was all right and Iwas released from hospital.
And now you've got to come backonce a year for a test.
Fuck me, I've just had twostrokes in the same day and
you're telling me I can go homeand I'm fine, when I'm 39 years
of age and you're telling methat hang on a minute, I'm not
fine, am I?
What's going on?
So I dealt with social, with the.
(21:24):
You know, my health anxiety isnow on my son, my three-year-old
son.
If he's ill, I'm like, oh mygod, is he all right?
What's wrong with him?
Yeah, but I've trained myselfand I think that's what I said
about a minute ago.
If you go through something atan early age, I do think that
actually hardens you up and getsyou ready.
Yeah, you know.
So that's kind of my story.
So I want to do, I want to hearmaybe what you've got to say
(21:45):
now if you've ever dealt withanything like that I spoke about
it before, um, and it still.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
It still weighs on me a lot.
And this is where I've realizednow I've gone through my life
looking at people with mentalhealth, never really felt it, so
thinking that it's not real.
Um, and then I went through atough couple of years, me and my
wife who we're absolutely finenow, by the way.
(22:12):
We didn't see eye to eye and Isort of moved out for a couple
of weeks around Christmas time.
That was soul-destroying.
Moved out of the family home,ended up back with my parents
for a few weeks, trying myhardest, and we both saw a
therapist and spoke about ourdifferences.
And we both saw a therapist andspoke about our differences and
touch wood.
In four years we have neverbeen to bed upset with each
(22:35):
other.
I don't think there's been anargument in four years Now.
For me that's amazing becausenow we've learned to talk about
it as it comes and that can be abig thing.
But when I realized thatsomething in my life had to, had
to change was like I saidbefore my mom took some money
out of her pension pot and tookus away skiing for christmas.
(22:58):
My brother, my brother's missus, my mom and dad, my wife, the
kids, um, and it was beautiful.
It's like my most favoriteplace in the world, a little
village called latania, in thefree valleys in france.
We used to go there as a kid,um, and it was so amazing to
take my kids there and show mykids and go sledging with them
and stuff and go skiing in theday and see my kids on a pair of
(23:20):
skis, because I've beenprivileged enough to do it since
I was four years old, like.
But what I was doing is I was.
I remember.
I remember like vividlyremember I was not there.
I was there, but mentally Ijust was not there and the crazy
(23:41):
thoughts that go through yourhead that you sort of switch on
and switch off.
But for the whole seven days Idon't feel I was present at any
point other than in the eveningwhen I'd had a few drinks.
That's really sad, isn't it?
Cause you've wanted that, I'vewanted that and that was
probably the last time it wasgoing to happen.
Do you know what I mean?
And I remember going out on myown and my brother had gone off
(24:03):
on his own.
The kids didn't want to skianymore for the day.
And I remember going and I wentto my favorite place in the
world.
The top of the mountain iscalled salure anybody that's
been to three valleys will knowand it's a big long run all the
way down.
You've done it.
And it's a big long run backdown and I just sitting on the
(24:24):
chairlift, just crying my eyesout on my own in the most
beautiful place in the world thesun was shining crying my
fucking eyes out.
And for three days after that Iwas listening to podcasts.
I was doing everything Ipossibly could to get out of my
head and the real reason was Ihad a business.
(24:45):
I owed a quarter of a millionquid and I had less than a
thousand pounds in a bank.
That was the real reason foreverything For me not being
there, for me ruining thatmoment was financial and in my
head all the time my wholeworld's going to come crumbling
down.
I owe all this money.
There's nothing in the bankStruggling to buy the next
(25:07):
dinner on the holiday, and thekids want this, and the kids
want that, and we want to dothis and that.
And I'm, as a man, right.
How am I going to get thisright?
Let's pay a bit off of thatcredit card, move a bit to that,
and then I've got a couple ofhundred quid.
Beautiful let's, and that was.
Is it sad?
It is sad that it was that, butmy brain would told me that my
(25:30):
world was going to collapse.
This is three years ago now andit didn't did it.
It didn't, it didn't, it neverdoes.
And I kick myself to this daybecause that might've been the
last time we could do it as afamily.
Yeah, and I kick myself to thisday because of that.
And that was all in my head andI'd go to bed at night and I'd
(25:56):
have a few glass of wine withdinner, as you do, a few beers
and that, and I'd sit there andI'd be all fine.
And then, three o'clock in themorning, after the alcohol's
worn off and the anxiety kicksin, I'm awake, I'm pacing the
apartment, I'm going outside,I'm having a fag, I'm pacing the
apartment, I'm on the sofa, thewife what's up?
Why are you not coming to bed.
I can't sleep.
I can't sleep because myworld's gonna end crying on the
(26:17):
fucking sofa three o'clock inthe morning in a lovely chalet,
in my most happiest place in thefucking world.
And that's the moment Irealized this isn't right.
What?
What can I do to fix this?
And I came back and I did themindfulness course and the
mindfulness thing was mental forme because it allowed.
I didn't do it, I didn't go in110%, I didn't do the meditation
(26:42):
that I was supposed to do, butit allowed me to learn that
these thoughts come into yourbrain, let them pass.
I remember lying there one dayand she was going right, lie on
there, breathe.
You do the breathing and youcan.
It's amazing.
If you do it, you can breatheinto your toes, you can feel
your toes and and all this.
I remember I lying there one dayand said right, like, imagine
(27:03):
you lie there and your thoughtsare like clouds in the sky.
And I was there with my eyesclosed and I can see the blue
sky and the clouds.
And she's like your thoughtsare like clouds, they come into
vision and then let them goagain and then come and
acknowledge them.
Acknowledge they're there andthen let them go again, because
that's the present time, that'swhat you're doing.
(27:24):
So that was it for me.
That's when I realized thatsomething had to change and
touch wood, like I said before Iended up, I think, did that
business for another year,struggled on, showed up every
day, got the debt down, paideverybody I could begged,
borrowed and stole, got it done.
And that's what taught me, Ithink, the mental resilience
(27:46):
that I have today when it comesto business and you can move
that in other aspects of yourlife it's building.
That resilience isn't it.
It's like you said you buildthat, you learn.
I did a podcast yesterday witha couple of lovely girls who've
been in business and we justspoke.
We spoke about showing up.
(28:08):
Showing up and admitting thatthere's a problem Admitting in
everything in your life.
If you've been a dick to yourmissus, it's no good.
Well, I wasn't a dick, I wasn'ta dick, it wasn't me.
Admit that and then you canmove forward from it.
If you keep trying to pushthese problems down the road and
not acknowledge them, it's likeif you've got a drinking
problem, they say the firstthing is admitting you've got a
(28:30):
problem, yeah, and then you canmove on with it.
And that was me.
I admitted well, I've got afucking serious problem here.
I've got some really darkthoughts.
I'm in the best place in theworld and I'm crying on a
fucking chairlift.
What is wrong with you?
And then something clicked andI was on a mission then to get
myself out of that and I'mrambling now.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
Don't worry, no, it's good, it's good to hear, mate,
because it gives me an insightto things as well.
You know not obviously, justpeople just listening, but I
just want to pick out onsomething that you just said
about there, about debt.
So we've both said that moneyis kind of the the main reason
we think.
Right, I've learned over mylife this is for anybody that is
actually listening right nowI've learned in my lifetime that
debt is not a problem.
(29:13):
It's a problem that you cause,but it's a problem that you can
get out of.
So it's not a problem, right,if you're in debt and you've got
debt collectors after you bringthe debt collection.
They don't want your fuckingcar, they don't want your
fucking TV, they don't want yourhouse.
They want you to pay your debts.
Ring them.
If you owe the child supportagency a fuckload of money, ring
(29:34):
them.
Don't ignore them.
They want to work with you.
As men, we decide to blockeverything out because it's
easier.
I'll shut the fucking door.
No one can come in.
I'll put an extra lock on thefront door.
I'll I'll turn my phone off.
I won't answer that phone call.
Answer the phone calls, sortyour debts out, clear your
fucking head of all the shitthat goes on, because that will
(29:56):
make you feel one million timesbetter, and I can tell you it
does, because I've done itmyself.
Right, I've run away from bankswhen I was, when I was a.
I've been a tow rag mate.
Right, I've not always been thenice person that I'm here.
I mean I've always been nice,but I've been a tow rag.
I got an overdraft just to drawit all out and go out and get
absolutely fucked for aboutthree weeks, go on holiday and
(30:19):
just waste it.
Then I just threw all the bankletters in the bin, just open
another bank account withsomeone else until they came
chasing for me for thousands ofpounds.
And then I finally my mum saidto me just ring the bank, speak
to them, stop hiding.
Stopped hiding, paid the debtoff within about four months and
I was.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
I didn't have that pressure on my head anymore
that's it and it's and I'velearned this as well from like.
You go to sleep and I'll wakeup all my problems and my
brain's overactive about betweenthe hours of four and six in
the morning.
So you're trying to sleep andeverything comes into your head.
Now those thoughts wouldn'tcome in my head if I was living
life the best way that I could,if I was being the best person I
(30:58):
possibly could, if I wasphoning that person back, if I
wasn't burying my head in thesand and admitting okay, you
fucked up there, mate, what canyou do to make it better?
And I say to the team at workyes, you're going to have
problems in your life, but don'tfocus on the problem, focus on
the solution.
Yeah, because that and thatearly.
Speaker 2 (31:18):
Yeah, don't leave it to the last minute.
Speaker 1 (31:24):
Cause, don't leave it to the last minute, because
then that's when you're screwedagain.
It's admit, okay, I fuckingmade a mistake.
Yeah, how can I get?
What can I do to make thisbetter for myself?
And there are thousands ofthings, like, if you're in debt,
there's charities that you cango to, there's free advice you
can go to, citizens advice youcan go to, and that's one thing
in the uk I haven't used it foryears, but whenever, whenever I
need anything, citizens Adviceis brilliant and you can go
(31:47):
there and you can book anappointment and you can speak to
someone and just again, byspeaking about that problem and
not internalising it, makes youfeel better instantly.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
Now, I'm not sitting here preaching it's all our
problems, it's all our fault,because there are things in life
that aren't your fault and youdo get dealt with.
You know, when your ex-wife's abitch or whatever, you know, or
you're being used as ascapegoat, or you're being used
as like I don't know whatever.
But you know what I'm trying tosay.
It's not everybody, it's notall of our fault, but a lot um,
(32:20):
but this is, this is reallygoing on, this one as well.
So, um, which is good, becauseI kind of wanted it to.
Yeah, it's not something that Iwanted to just just skirt over
now.
There's loads of things outthere.
There's loads of communitiesand stuff you can join to help
out, especially for men.
You know we're talking aboutmen's mental health here, so you
know one that is fantastic andit's got so much support, yeah,
(32:43):
so, mates.
Speaker 1 (32:43):
So mates, men and their emotions.
It was something that, again,daniel set up.
Dapper laughs for people that Icall him Daniel, now Daniel
O'Reilly, daniel O'Reilly,because I feel that the dapper
laughs.
I think he's evolving intoDaniel O'Reilly.
Yeah, yeah, the sober dad who'spresent and in the moment.
Yeah, now, if you're not partof the mates community, it's a
(33:06):
Facebook group with like 50,000lads on it and it's very heavily
monitored.
All the comments, all the posts, everything you can post
anonymously, and some of theadvice like I look at it a lot.
I look at it a lot Becausesometimes you can help someone
out by just giving that onecomment.
Now, it's a wicked community ofpeople that have done a very
(33:30):
similar thing.
You could think that you're theonly one going through it.
I guarantee you there's someoneon that group 50,000 lads in
the UK.
I guarantee you there's someonein that group that has been
through what you've gone throughor going through what you're
going through.
Some of the posts is like look,my missus has kicked me out.
I've got nothing.
She's taking the kids away fromme.
What can I do?
I'll use this solicitor that Iuse.
(33:51):
Or mate, whereabouts are you?
Where do you live?
I've got a spare room.
You can have it for a week.
These are people that don'tknow each other, connecting
because they connect becausethey've lived experiences.
And I think what he's done withthe group is phenomenal and
he'll post in there and hescrolls through it and he's
actually turned it into aregistered charity and he's got
(34:13):
massive, massive plans for it tohelp lads get the help they
need, because you can't get iton the NHS, you can't get it
through your GP.
All they're going to do is giveyou happy pills Now.
In my opinion that's good forthe interim, but after seeing
people that have taken tabletsand prescribed tablets, they're
on them for five or six years.
Speaker 2 (34:34):
It kind of goes back to the statistic, doesn't it?
Exactly Most men that commitsuicide have actually already
reached out for help from GPsand stuff and obviously just not
get the help.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
I mean, if you're, if you're on Facebook, m A, t, e,
s, men and their emotions go andjoin the group and be a part of
it, or just sit on thesidelines and read, because I
guarantee you it will blow yourmind.
Speaker 2 (34:58):
The generosity of people in there, yeah, Then the
other one, of course, is Andy'sman Club.
Yeah, that's getting big now, Ididn't really know much about
the backstory about Andy's manClub.
To be fair, I didn't realise itwas set up for Andy, who killed
himself, which is quite strong,isn't it?
I like it when people do thingsfor people that have actually
passed away but, andy, recentlyI've run over 240 different
(35:25):
support groups across thecountry.
Yeah, there's a new one inBrighton.
Yeah, so 240.
Like we don't live that faraway from everybody in this
country, do we?
So 240 groups.
There's definitely one near you.
Guys, if you do need any help,then look it up online.
You'll find it really easily.
It's very straightforwardprocess to get involved as well.
But then, most importantly, Ithink the biggest help out there
is you, and that's not you, ash, I'm pointing at the camera,
(35:48):
but most people don't watch this.
It is you guys.
Reach out, be nice to people.
If somebody seems like they'restruggling, ask them if they're
struggling, because the bestthing to do is ask somebody if
they're struggling.
Don't go you all right, mate,because he'll go.
Yeah, I'm all right, and that'sit.
(36:08):
Ask him are you struggling?
You seem to be struggling orare you all right?
You seem a little bit down orsomething, because if you ask a
question with a question, yeah,you're more likely to get an
answer that you want rather thanare you okay, mate?
That's just a question, yeahyeah, yeah, what's up?
no, nothing, mate, I'm sweet,I'm sweet, dig in dive balls
deep and ask don't go balls deepon your mate.
Speaker 1 (36:28):
But sorry, I had to throw a bit of batter in just to
break it up a bit, or if you'rethat way and kind, then he
might enjoy it.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
Yeah, he might enjoy it but no, I think, the most
important people out thereourselves.
You know, if you feel like yourmates are struggling, if you
feel like your husband or yourboyfriend or your brother, your
cousin, whatever any man in yourlife or any woman, let's face
it, you know we should belooking after each other.
Just reach out we should.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
The human race?
Yeah, okay, the human race isfucked.
Yeah, let's be honest.
Like I don't want to get intopolitics, I don't want to get
into war, but let's be honest,human connection is at the
lowest that it has ever been.
Yeah, but surround yourselfwith people.
Surround yourself with peoplethat can better your life.
Surround yourself with peopleyou feel comfortable around.
(37:12):
Surround yourself with peopleyou can be yourself around.
If you're feeling shit, I thinkyou should be able to call your
mate.
Maybe not all of them, but youshould have two or three mates
that you can ring and say lads,I'm fucking feeling shit.
When me and my missus wentthrough the thing, I had one
friend who was fucking sound andI'd ring him and he'd tell me
you're being a drama queen.
(37:33):
No, I agree with you on that.
He wouldn't tell me what Iwanted to hear.
He told me the realness fromhim sitting on the outside.
Yeah, he offered me space.
I've got two friends in Ireland.
Mate, come over.
I said I can't come over, I'mskinned or we'll fly over.
This was during COVID and thesetwo lads flew from Ireland and
we had a doner kebab in apremier inn and we had to tell
(37:53):
the people.
We were all gay lovers becauseotherwise they wouldn't let us
in the room together.
Do you know what I mean?
And that, that building thatcircle of but be that person as
well.
Yeah, I think that's the thing,if we all aim to be that person
who supports their friends,their colleagues, their
everything, and just just tryand be a better person.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
Yeah, I'm going to use so obviously I do lives on
TikTok.
My favorite saying on TikTok iswhen I do a load of sales, I
always say at the end of thesales Ipin any products up.
So there's nothing on thescreen and I say, listen, hit
the follow button.
It's not for my benefit, it'sfor other people.
I always say this we live in aproper shit world at the moment
where nobody gives a fuck aboutanybody.
(38:35):
We should all be protecting andlooking after each other.
So don't listen to me babblingon.
You put a comment in sectionwhat you think of the products
and you tell the other peoplethat are watching the live,
because they're going to listento you rather than listen to me.
We do.
We live in a proper shit worldwhere nobody gives a shit about
anybody.
It is a fact.
You know.
Years and years ago they usedto have parties in the street
(38:57):
all the time.
Yeah, used to go around yournext door neighbours, else they
used to leave their back dooropen.
Alright, we have got a massiveproblem with crime now, so you
can't do that, but people usedto walk in and out of back doors
and go alright, sandra, put thekettle on or whatever you know
like it was a big community, getyourself involved in the
fucking community.
Get yourself a load of friendsthat all think the same and
that's what we're saying.
Like Andy's man Club, it's soimportant to be involved in
(39:21):
other things, because that iswhat it's a famous thing and it
don't suffer in silence.
Yeah, don't suffer in silence.
Speaker 1 (39:26):
And even if you're not having a pro, even if you're
not on in having dark thoughts,even if you're not being like
in that space, go and helpsomeone else who might be go to
just to try it out.
Go to find Google and his mancub.
Look for your local place andgo along to a meeting and see
(39:47):
what it's all about and getbehind it.
The more people that get behindthis stuff, the more that 75%
number will drop, guaranteed,the more we talk about it, the
less it'll become let's behonest the government do not
give a fuck about us.
we have to give a fuck abouteach other, exactly.
Speaker 2 (40:04):
Simple as that.
I think that's a good way towrap it up.
Mate to be fair.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
I think we should Fuck the government Right.
Speaker 2 (40:08):
This has been a long podcast, but it was really,
really important for meespecially.
That's why I've kind of hostedthis one.
I know Ash is writing to hismen at work as well.
Look out for each other.
Actually, I'm going to set youa challenge.
Anyone listening right now.
Next time you walk down theroad, say hello to somebody.
Yeah, Because that hello thatperson could be feeling like
(40:31):
shit, genuinely feeling likeshit.
Say hello to someone, try andengage in a conversation with
someone for no reason whatsoever, because you never know that
one conversation, male or female, could save somebody's life, or
I'm going to piggyback off theback of different hats.
Speaker 1 (40:46):
Sam, he did a post yesterday.
I shared it on my story.
Do something today.
Reach out to someone.
Send a whatsapp, send a text tosomeone you've not spoke to in
a while, not because you wantsomething, just to check in on
them yeah, see how they're doing.
Speaker 2 (40:58):
Do you know what I was going to do today?
But I didn't do it because desis in there, so he's kind of
ruined the idea that I had.
I was going to bring a bunch offlowers for both of you today,
and that is because the firsttime a man ever gets flowers is
at his funeral.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
Wow that's deep, isn't it?
That is deep.
Yeah, to be fair, I don't thinkI ever had any flowers.
No, never.
That's for if you want to goeven further.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
Buy a bunch of flowers and get into a random
geezer in the street yeah, notthe biggest.
Speaker 1 (41:24):
Yeah, yeah, you've got this bruv, or you've got
this mate.
Speaker 2 (41:27):
Yeah, and that's it.
Go on and ash, you can closethis out, mate if you enjoyed
the episode.
Speaker 1 (41:33):
Host of our quiz.
I really did actually.
Um, that was wicked.
And you're struggling withmental health.
I mean, reach out to us.
Reach out to us.
If you've got a story to tell,come and sit in this chair and
tell your story, because if youcan help one person by telling
your story, then it'll be worthit.
I promise you that you willfeel good.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
That's exactly why I wanted to do this podcast,
because if we can help oneperson exactly, I feel like I've
even been out myself yeah, well, we're helping each other out
all the time.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
So, yeah, yeah, well, we're helping each other out
all the time, aren't we?
So yeah, that's been the UntoldPodcast hosted by the one and
only Chris Stewart.
Give us a comment, give us alike, give us a share.
We're up to seven viewers now.
We're trying to get to eight.
No, I'm only kidding.
But yeah, mental health is aserious thing, so look after
your neighbour.
Speaker 2 (42:18):
And you're amazing.
Speaker 1 (42:20):
Yeah.
The internet has ruined everybody.
My brain told me my world wasgoing to collapse.
I owed a quarter of a millionquid and I had less than a
thousand pound in the bank.
The human race is fucked.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Reach out, be nice to people, speak to them.
Them stop hiding.
Um, it's just horrible to thinkabout, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (00:32):
today's episode is sponsored by closer, the app
that helps you discoverexclusive local deals right here
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Speaker 2 (00:54):
Save money, support local with closer hi everybody,
welcome to today's episode ofthe untold podcast.
No des today, so it's just themain people, obviously me and
ash morning.
Ash morning, chris, how youdoing buddy, good mate, I'm good
, right, the Untold Podcast noDes today, so it's just the main
people, obviously Me and Ash.
Morning Ash, morning Chris.
How you doing, buddy?
I'm good mate, I'm good Right,anyone that's listening.
If you're expecting the usualpodcast lots of laughs, a bit of
piss taking and a bit of banterthis is going to be a little
bit different to usual, a littlebit more deeper.
(01:17):
We thought it was reallyimportant to kind of dive really
deep into men's mental health.
So I'm going to give you somestatistics first, just so you
can get an idea of how bad it isin the UK.
And please keep listening,because just because you don't
struggle with mental healthdoesn't mean that your husband,
your boyfriend, your brother,anyone, your mate, your sister.
So to start off with thesuicide rates among men, you'll
(01:41):
notice that I'm actually, ifyou're watching, I'm going to be
looking down at this becausethis is really important.
Rates among men You'll noticethat I'm actually, if you're
watching, I'm going to belooking down at this because
this is really important that Iget this right.
The highest suicide rates amongmen.
Men account for approximately75% of all suicides in the UK.
That is massive, it is.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
It's too big.
Speaker 2 (01:56):
Is it.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
Yeah Well, any suicide is too big.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
The leading cause of death of men under the age of 50
.
I mean, that's the leadingcause of death of all men male
under 50.
Speaker 1 (02:14):
Is it really?
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Yeah, See I didn't know that it's not cancer, it's
not getting run over or anything.
It's suicide.
Yeah, the age group that mostaffected is between the age of
45 and 49.
Is it really so?
Basically me.
Yeah, the age group that mostaffected is between the age of
45 and 49.
Is it really so?
Basically me, yeah, you're notquite.
45.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
You're not that young , are you?
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Well, I'm 43, but I class myself as middle-aged.
Do you know what I mean?
The Northwest has a much, muchhigher suicide rate than the
South.
I think that is obvious, to befair.
I think the cost of living isbad across the country, but I
think the earnings are muchbetter down here than they are
up north, so I can kind ofunderstand that one the increase
in suicide rates in 2023.
(02:53):
These stats are all from 2023because there aren't any more
current ones.
The suicide rate in England andWales reached its highest level
since 1999.
Now you've got to put intoconcept there that obviously was
COVID, a lot of of that, wasn'tit?
You know the financial burdenof COVID, but they think that
obviously, because people aren'treporting attempted suicides
and stuff like that, thestatistics could be a lot higher
(03:15):
than that, which again is just.
It's just horrible to thinkabout.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
It's mad as well, because I that's 2023.
Yeah, the society has declinedmassively, I would say, since
2023.
The last 12 months, things just, see, keep seem to get harder
and harder and harder.
It's the squeeze, isn't?
Speaker 2 (03:37):
it, yeah, just a constant, constant squeeze.
And if you are, unless you havegot a really strong mentality,
it it's so odd, so odd.
Then we have got.
More than 90% of everybody thatcommits suicide has got some
sort of mental health issue or adrug or alcohol addiction.
So there's people out therethat know people have got mental
(03:57):
health issues and an alcohol ordrug addiction.
You need to look after thesepeople.
A drug addiction and an alcoholaddiction doesn't necessarily
mean it's that person's fault.
They just got lost along theway yeah, and it's easy, isn't
it?
Speaker 1 (04:09):
if you're fit, healthy, your life's going
fantastic.
You don't need to turn to drugsand alcohol.
Yeah, it's.
Do you know what I mean?
I spent a lot of time listeningto dapper laughs, dan
o'reilly's podcast about mentalsobriety and what, even just
watching his journey, and he'sgot lived experience of it.
You use drugs and alcohol.
(04:31):
I mean, I've done it before.
I went through a stage ofdrinking at least a bottle of
wine a night when I got home,just to mask real life.
So when life's shit, you wantto mask real life.
When life's good, then it'sobviously you have a drink to
enjoy it.
But when you're using drugs andalcohol to escape the reality
(04:53):
of life, that's when I think itbecomes really dangerous.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
And the sad realisation of that is if you go
to drugs and alcohol, it doesmask it, it doesn't get rid of
it.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
You're just pushing it down the rank and when you're
not drinking or taking thosedrugs.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
It becomes even worse because you're not only on the
comedown, you're also having todeal with all that mental health
issue anyway.
So it's not the way to go atall, really, really isn't?
The study suggests, actually,that individuals who die by
suicide had actually contactedtheir mental health advisors or
reached out for help at somepoint and been ignored.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Yeah, and that's another big problem, because you
can't do.
You know what I mean you.
You ring your GP up and say, oh, I'm suicidal.
Okay, you can have anappointment in six weeks time to
see me and then to get in frontof someone, unless you've got
money to pay privately.
And that's where the likes ofDan's man Club and stuff come in
(05:50):
, because they are helping, theyare trying to raise money to
make it more accessible forpeople to be able to actually
get the help they need, becauseit is up here, the brain is the
most powerful muscle in a bodyisn't it?
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Now, this is not a suicide one, but I think this is
really important to mentionthis, because everyone, when
they think about suicide, theytend to think, tend to think
about men, right?
This actually really upset mewhen I read this yesterday 33 of
every teenage boy between theage of 14 and 18 has at some
point tried to either self-harmthemselves or commit suicide.
(06:27):
That is fucking disgusting.
Speaker 1 (06:31):
Because they're not even old enough to understand
really to do that, and socialmedia has got a lot of things to
blame for that, I think.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
It's exactly the conversation me and my wife had
yesterday.
The exact same conversation.
If you would have gone back 20years, I guarantee you that
number would be five percent.
The kids.
Kids weren't stuck indoors,they were going out with their
friends, they were playing inthe mud and going up the park
and kicking the football about.
That thought process wasn'tthere.
But because it's always oversocial media everything, yeah,
(06:59):
it's horrible and it must be.
I'd hate to be a teenager nowand I worry so much about my
little boy, especially afterreading that last night.
Yeah, I've got two.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
I've got my 16-year-old.
He's quite streetwise, he knows, now he's learned.
But I've got two girls.
My 11-year-old is already very,very sensitive, very sensitive,
and, whereas you can't hideyour kids away from social media
, because it's there, whether welike it or not, if they're, not
(07:27):
on it they're taking the pissout of at school.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
Yeah, you know, it's just a newsworthy situation, but
then if they're on it, they'reposting a video.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
They're a little bit overweight, their hair's a bit
frizzy, their hair's a bitgreasy.
They start getting spots andthere are horrible.
Kids are fucking horrible andthere are horrible kids are
fucking horrible.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
Sorry, but kids are horrible.
I said it the other day, didn'tI Last week's?
Well, the one that's come outtoday, the internet, has ruined
everybody.
It's been great, but it hasbeen ruined by everybody.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
Back in our day, back in my day, growing up, msn
Messenger was a thing and thatjust come out, msn Messenger.
But you didn't spend the timeon it that you spend on now,
because you had to sit on thecomputer.
You had to make sure your mumand dad weren't picking up the
phone and making a phone call.
And I remember once there was acouple of girls and, as you do,
(08:20):
as a kid I was probably 14.
I was in the living roomdancing in my pants and they
were outside my house watchingme.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Bit weird now looking back at it.
Maybe they did fancy me.
Speaker 1 (08:32):
But then I went into school and I was getting a
barrage of abuse from five orsix girls on MSN messenger
saying we can see you, we'rewatching you through your window
.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
At least they didn't have the proof.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Well, exactly that's the difference between nowadays.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Nowadays it is scary.
It is scary.
Yeah, I mean going into thatteenage side of things.
You know, you've only got tolook at, you see, like you know
all the people sending picturesof each other and stuff like to
each other and like they'redating, and that you send a
(09:11):
picture of yourself.
Do never send a picture ofyourself, because I know
somebody at school near me itwas all over the, the mum's page
on on the where I live somebodyhad sent an explicit picture of
themselves to somebody else inclass and they'd shared it with
the whole school.
You know, it's just as it's soeasy now, bang, and you can kind
of understand.
Now we're talking about it, youcan kind of understand.
Well, that's the statistic.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
Statistic is a thing, can't you, because it is so
easy to get trapped in to thatsocial media side of things at
that age yeah, they live theirlife through it, live their life
through it and their highlightreel is all they're ever going
to see, because that's allowedto post stuff on TikTok, but
she's not allowed to include herface.
(09:47):
Yeah, and the other day shecome to me and she was like oh
yeah, look, daddy, my video gotX amount of views and I said it
doesn't matter.
What matters is you're doing itbecause you enjoy doing it.
That's what matters.
It doesn't matter You're goingto have people hate you.
You're going to have peoplelove you.
You're going to have peopledisagree with you, but that's
like a stepping stone now forlife.
Yeah, obviously, with what youdo, there's people that probably
(10:10):
disagree with what you do.
There's people that support you, but you do what you do and you
can't let other people in andruin your mental stability
because they've got a differentopinion.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Yeah, I think that's very important.
That's a very valid point, mate.
To be fair, you're uh.
The difference is, thoughyou're, you're uh anyone that
listens you, then we know you'rea good parent.
You talk to your kids, youexplain things, and you do do
things with your parents, yourkids.
But there's a lot of kids outthere.
Don't get that in there.
I mean, they just just get freeflow, do whatever you want.
At 13 years old, you're notallowed on tiktok, but you can
have an account anyway.
Do what you want and read whatyou want.
(10:44):
Yeah, um right, let's get backto the men's, men's side of
things.
Um, what do you think thereasons are nowadays, like, as
in for the suicide rates, thatthey are like we've got stuff
like economic pressure I think,yeah, I think, economic pressure
, I think job pressure.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
Um, obviously I'd like to see how many of those
stats are within theconstruction industry.
Yeah, I think one of the bigthings is horrible, horrible
women using children againsttheir ex-partners after a
separation.
Because that system's fuckedLike.
That system is horrible.
The system always will favourthe mum, no matter who she is,
(11:24):
no matter what she's done.
I know people.
I went to an event that SamThompson did called Are you
Alright, mate, and there was alad there.
We sort of sectioned up intogroups and there was a lad there
told his story about he soldhis house, everything to fight
for his daughter Because the newstepdad was not being
(11:44):
particularly nice to her.
Won't go into details, but hehad to fight for that.
He had to go through the courtsand get himself into hundreds
of thousands of pounds worth ofdebt just to fight for his
daughter and he had the proofthat these things were happening
.
Yeah, the 13 year old sat therewith a solicitor and said look
this, this is happening and thisis happening.
I don't want to live thereanymore.
But he couldn't do.
(12:06):
You know what I mean?
He had to physically and that,I think, is a massive, massive
part of those rates.
Definitely, I think.
Job, job satisfaction.
Um, you go to work 7, 30, 5o'clock every day.
Your boss is a bit of an ar.
You're literally living to work, working, you're working to
(12:27):
live not living to work.
You're working to live everysingle day, no matter how much
you do, no matter how hard youwork.
You just can't seem to get tothe end of it, and I think
that's a big point.
So I think you've got womenusing children to manipulate
things.
I think that's massive and Ithink that needs a huge shakeup.
Then you've got the financialpressures and the fact that
(12:51):
you're working.
Now you're earning the same,but everything's costing 20%,
30% more.
People can't afford holidaysanymore, Whereas you look
forward to every year a nicefamily holiday.
People can't do that becauseit's so bloody expensive.
But what do you think?
What are your views?
Speaker 2 (13:11):
yeah, I have to agree with you there, mate.
I mean, you know I'm a onehousehold income and it is very
stressful.
You know, you, you have billsand you have bills, and you have
bills and you have bills andyou have a certain amount of
money put aside for it all thetime.
And I am quite an old schoolperson.
You know, I don't want my wifeto work particularly hard.
I don't expect her to.
I'm the alpha male in my house.
(13:31):
You know, I want to provide formy family.
But at the same time, when youact like that, it causes you so
much more stress because you putthis thing on your shoulder,
that you have to be this strongman.
You have to be the one thatdoesn cry.
You have to be the one thatdoesn't talk to your missus
because you don't want to shareyour problems with her, because
she's got problems of her own.
She's looking after the kid,she's upset when he's upset and
(13:51):
you know it plays a lot on yourmind.
And then the brakes go on yourcar and you get a bill for
£1,000 for some new discs andyou think she's got to use the
car.
Where am I going to get thatmoney from?
It's just a constant financialburden, isn't it?
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Everything's just so.
I would imagine that a lot ofthose statistics that you read
out earlier do boil down tofinancial reasons.
Speaker 2 (14:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
And the thing is as well, it's easy.
Again, the same with drugs andalcohol.
It's easy to get into thatgambling.
I haven't got the money, whatcan I do?
It's easy to get into thatgambling.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
I haven't got the money.
What can I do?
I've got a hundred quid in mybank.
We spoke about that the otherday, didn't we Actually like how
easy it is to just spend yourmoney?
Speaker 1 (14:30):
online gambling.
Oh, let's go online online.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
And then you get all these things.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
And then you'll go on one website and then your
Instagram feed your tick slots,submit 20 pound and we'll
guarantee you a spin and a win.
And they're like oh yeah, let'sdo that.
I saw something the other day Ican't remember who it was Was
interviewing someone.
He said why have you just goneand bought 40 quid for scratch
cards?
And the guy was like well,because it's my last 40 quid, I
(14:56):
need to try and turn it intosomething.
But that's mad Cause.
That's the mentality, thepeople.
I need something to change.
I need something to change andthat's the easy option Quick fix
.
That could be the quick fix,but 99.998% of the time it ain't
going to happen because thesystem's rigged to not work in
(15:18):
your favor.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
I bought 10 of those scratch cards 10 quids worth the
other day on my birthday andwon two pound.
Speaker 1 (15:23):
That's a good return isn't it Basically the estate?
Quid Good return isn eight quidbut you still get.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Oh, I've won two pounds that's what they do it
for, and then you get thatlittle bit of endorphins in your
body and you think, oh,dopamine or whatever it's called
, and then you're going back formore.
I think a lot of things really.
I mean, I've got a very goodmate of mine.
I mentioned him in the podcastthe other day, a couple of weeks
ago in fact.
I his problems, while he nevertalks, and I think it's like a
(15:47):
stigma thing, isn't it?
Like the man has got to bestrong, the man can't talk.
It's the caveman theory, isn'tit?
I know he's been struggling.
I know he's been struggling.
I know there's no way the shitthat he's gone through in the
last two years that he hasn'twanted to reach out at some
point, but he just doesn't, andI think that is what men do
Unless he just doesn't.
And I think that is what men do, unless you've been to the
(16:09):
breaking point.
My other friend was at breakingpoint.
He reached out to me,thankfully, and I put him in
contact with a therapist that Iwas using previously and he
loved it, absolutely loved goingto see her, and it sorted him
right out.
He's sweet as a nut now Stillhas the odd day where he
messaged me or whatever, buthe's perfect, but I think it is
that stigma of I can't reach outbecause I don't want my wife to
(16:32):
see me weak, I don't want mychildren to see me crumble.
He might go up in his bedroomand shut the door at night and
cry his eyes out for 10 minutes,I don't know, but he would
never let us know that and Ithink that's a really sad thing,
because it's like that insilence, isn't it?
And that's kind of why peopledo what they do.
Yeah, because they go away ontheir own and they, their
thought process changes, and Idon't know it's is.
(16:54):
It actually really does upsetme when I think about it it's.
Speaker 1 (16:59):
It's crazy because it's always the one.
You see these stories, you seethese posts, you speak to people
.
It's always the one you neverexpect it from because they're
putting on that facade, they'retrying to be brave, they want to
be, they want to be again.
It boils down to the people notbeing themselves and not like
this stigmatism of a man, alphaman, cave man, bang on your
(17:21):
chest, get shit done.
Yes, you still need that,because that's attractive, that
will keep you going.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
I mean, otherwise, we live in a completely woke world
, don't we?
Where there is no masculinity,there is no femininity or
anything.
Speaker 1 (17:33):
But you've got to.
I mean, if you've got lovedones, you've got to share how
you're feeling with them, and Ithink it's really like your
friend went to therapy, reallyenjoyed it.
I think if you're strugglingmentally, there is lots of
different ways to try and getthat out of you, to try and work
(17:53):
with it and to build thatmental resilience.
Look, you've got debtcollectors letters dropping
through the door.
You've got.
Do you know what I mean?
You've got people people atwork, for example being horrible
to you.
You've got to go and speak tothe boss.
You don't want to speak to boss, you don't want to be a grass
and stuff.
It's again communication, isn'tit?
Speaker 2 (18:10):
and I think you've got to be able to communicate
with the people closest to youyour parents or I think you need
to go through something in yourlife that prepares you to be
mentally secure.
Yeah, I think that's important,like some people can.
Some people can process things,some people can't.
The people that can process arethe ones that are fine, the
they're the ones that get onwith their life.
They don't need the help.
They can box things up and theycan filter it out and do it
(18:32):
their own way, but obviously theother people that don't go
through that struggle.
Now I think it's important foreverybody listening that we kind
of show our own little bit ofvulnerability here.
There we go.
Which kind of leads that into mysection.
So I'm actually going to gofirst on this, yeah, yeah.
So I taught myself when I wasvery, very young to be very
stable and it took me to thepoint of nearly thinking maybe
(18:56):
this isn't for me, maybe this iswhat you're supposed to do in
life.
When shit hits the fan, it'sthe easy way out.
But because I was watching theperson in my life that was my
Superman do that, it made medecide no, I'm not going to do
that actually.
No, I need to be strong,because that is a bad way of
doing it.
He was going to leave me behindbecause it was the easiest
(19:18):
option for him.
Now I'm not going to say it is,but it's, obviously it is.
You know, I'm not I'm not goingto call him out on the, on the
uh, on the podcast, because thatwould be really unfair.
But if he, if he does listen,he's going to notice him anyway.
But you know he was the mostinfluential person in my life,
um, and we went throughsomething when I was like 13, 14
, uh, that I walked into, that Isaw and it wasn't particularly
(19:40):
nice, and then he obviously tookmassive responsibility for it
and things happened.
You know like I became.
I became a a weekend kid.
You know.
You went with one parent at oneweekend and the other one
another one.
But, um, for six months Iwatched that man regret every
single decision that he made inthe few months that he was doing
(20:01):
what he was doing, and when hewas regretting those decisions,
he was drinking very heavily.
He was trying to take his ownlife.
I was trying to stop him.
All the time I was phoning thepolice, I was chasing after him
and at 13, 14 years of age, thatwas not a nice thing to go
through, you know, um, andprobably six months ago I would
(20:22):
have sat here and I would haveactually probably been quite
upset about that.
But because we've spoken aboutstuff on the podcast before, I
think my emotions are nowopening up properly in my head
and I'm able to filter them outcorrectly where, as I taught
myself at that age, that is notwhat you do, because you are
responsible for other people.
Now I'm responsible for mychildren and, to a certain
(20:43):
extent, for my wife, you know,um.
So that is not something that Iwould ever allow my thought
process to to take hold of, um,so you know it's.
Everybody deals with mentalhealth issues.
At some point I went through umhealth anxiety when I had my
stroke six, seven months.
I was in pieces.
I didn't really know what to dobecause I thought I was going
(21:03):
to die.
I thought I had a brain tumorto start with, and then, all of
a sudden, I was all right and Iwas released from hospital.
And now you've got to come backonce a year for a test.
Fuck me, I've just had twostrokes in the same day and
you're telling me I can go homeand I'm fine, when I'm 39 years
of age and you're telling methat hang on a minute, I'm not
fine, am I?
What's going on?
So I dealt with social, with the.
(21:24):
You know, my health anxiety isnow on my son, my three-year-old
son.
If he's ill, I'm like, oh mygod, is he all right?
What's wrong with him?
Yeah, but I've trained myselfand I think that's what I said
about a minute ago.
If you go through something atan early age, I do think that
actually hardens you up and getsyou ready.
Yeah, you know.
So that's kind of my story.
So I want to do, I want to hearmaybe what you've got to say
(21:45):
now if you've ever dealt withanything like that I spoke about
it before, um, and it still.
Speaker 1 (21:50):
It still weighs on me a lot.
And this is where I've realizednow I've gone through my life
looking at people with mentalhealth, never really felt it, so
thinking that it's not real.
Um, and then I went through atough couple of years, me and my
wife who we're absolutely finenow, by the way.
(22:12):
We didn't see eye to eye and Isort of moved out for a couple
of weeks around Christmas time.
That was soul-destroying.
Moved out of the family home,ended up back with my parents
for a few weeks, trying myhardest, and we both saw a
therapist and spoke about ourdifferences.
And we both saw a therapist andspoke about our differences and
touch wood.
In four years we have neverbeen to bed upset with each
(22:35):
other.
I don't think there's been anargument in four years Now.
For me that's amazing becausenow we've learned to talk about
it as it comes and that can be abig thing.
But when I realized thatsomething in my life had to, had
to change was like I saidbefore my mom took some money
out of her pension pot and tookus away skiing for christmas.
(22:58):
My brother, my brother's missus, my mom and dad, my wife, the
kids, um, and it was beautiful.
It's like my most favoriteplace in the world, a little
village called latania, in thefree valleys in france.
We used to go there as a kid,um, and it was so amazing to
take my kids there and show mykids and go sledging with them
and stuff and go skiing in theday and see my kids on a pair of
(23:20):
skis, because I've beenprivileged enough to do it since
I was four years old, like.
But what I was doing is I was.
I remember.
I remember like vividlyremember I was not there.
I was there, but mentally Ijust was not there and the crazy
(23:41):
thoughts that go through yourhead that you sort of switch on
and switch off.
But for the whole seven days Idon't feel I was present at any
point other than in the eveningwhen I'd had a few drinks.
That's really sad, isn't it?
Cause you've wanted that, I'vewanted that and that was
probably the last time it wasgoing to happen.
Do you know what I mean?
And I remember going out on myown and my brother had gone off
(24:03):
on his own.
The kids didn't want to skianymore for the day.
And I remember going and I wentto my favorite place in the
world.
The top of the mountain iscalled salure anybody that's
been to three valleys will knowand it's a big long run all the
way down.
You've done it.
And it's a big long run backdown and I just sitting on the
(24:24):
chairlift, just crying my eyesout on my own in the most
beautiful place in the world thesun was shining crying my
fucking eyes out.
And for three days after that Iwas listening to podcasts.
I was doing everything Ipossibly could to get out of my
head and the real reason was Ihad a business.
(24:45):
I owed a quarter of a millionquid and I had less than a
thousand pounds in a bank.
That was the real reason foreverything For me not being
there, for me ruining thatmoment was financial and in my
head all the time my wholeworld's going to come crumbling
down.
I owe all this money.
There's nothing in the bankStruggling to buy the next
(25:07):
dinner on the holiday, and thekids want this, and the kids
want that, and we want to dothis and that.
And I'm, as a man, right.
How am I going to get thisright?
Let's pay a bit off of thatcredit card, move a bit to that,
and then I've got a couple ofhundred quid.
Beautiful let's, and that was.
Is it sad?
It is sad that it was that, butmy brain would told me that my
(25:30):
world was going to collapse.
This is three years ago now andit didn't did it.
It didn't, it didn't, it neverdoes.
And I kick myself to this daybecause that might've been the
last time we could do it as afamily.
Yeah, and I kick myself to thisday because of that.
And that was all in my head andI'd go to bed at night and I'd
(25:56):
have a few glass of wine withdinner, as you do, a few beers
and that, and I'd sit there andI'd be all fine.
And then, three o'clock in themorning, after the alcohol's
worn off and the anxiety kicksin, I'm awake, I'm pacing the
apartment, I'm going outside,I'm having a fag, I'm pacing the
apartment, I'm on the sofa, thewife what's up?
Why are you not coming to bed.
I can't sleep.
I can't sleep because myworld's gonna end crying on the
(26:17):
fucking sofa three o'clock inthe morning in a lovely chalet,
in my most happiest place in thefucking world.
And that's the moment Irealized this isn't right.
What?
What can I do to fix this?
And I came back and I did themindfulness course and the
mindfulness thing was mental forme because it allowed.
I didn't do it, I didn't go in110%, I didn't do the meditation
(26:42):
that I was supposed to do, butit allowed me to learn that
these thoughts come into yourbrain, let them pass.
I remember lying there one dayand she was going right, lie on
there, breathe.
You do the breathing and youcan.
It's amazing.
If you do it, you can breatheinto your toes, you can feel
your toes and and all this.
I remember I lying there one dayand said right, like, imagine
(27:03):
you lie there and your thoughtsare like clouds in the sky.
And I was there with my eyesclosed and I can see the blue
sky and the clouds.
And she's like your thoughtsare like clouds, they come into
vision and then let them goagain and then come and
acknowledge them.
Acknowledge they're there andthen let them go again, because
that's the present time, that'swhat you're doing.
(27:24):
So that was it for me.
That's when I realized thatsomething had to change and
touch wood, like I said before Iended up, I think, did that
business for another year,struggled on, showed up every
day, got the debt down, paideverybody I could begged,
borrowed and stole, got it done.
And that's what taught me, Ithink, the mental resilience
(27:46):
that I have today when it comesto business and you can move
that in other aspects of yourlife it's building.
That resilience isn't it.
It's like you said you buildthat, you learn.
I did a podcast yesterday witha couple of lovely girls who've
been in business and we justspoke.
We spoke about showing up.
(28:08):
Showing up and admitting thatthere's a problem Admitting in
everything in your life.
If you've been a dick to yourmissus, it's no good.
Well, I wasn't a dick, I wasn'ta dick, it wasn't me.
Admit that and then you canmove forward from it.
If you keep trying to pushthese problems down the road and
not acknowledge them, it's likeif you've got a drinking
problem, they say the firstthing is admitting you've got a
(28:30):
problem, yeah, and then you canmove on with it.
And that was me.
I admitted well, I've got afucking serious problem here.
I've got some really darkthoughts.
I'm in the best place in theworld and I'm crying on a
fucking chairlift.
What is wrong with you?
And then something clicked andI was on a mission then to get
myself out of that and I'mrambling now.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
Don't worry, no, it's good, it's good to hear, mate,
because it gives me an insightto things as well.
You know not obviously, justpeople just listening, but I
just want to pick out onsomething that you just said
about there, about debt.
So we've both said that moneyis kind of the the main reason
we think.
Right, I've learned over mylife this is for anybody that is
actually listening right nowI've learned in my lifetime that
debt is not a problem.
(29:13):
It's a problem that you cause,but it's a problem that you can
get out of.
So it's not a problem, right,if you're in debt and you've got
debt collectors after you bringthe debt collection.
They don't want your fuckingcar, they don't want your
fucking TV, they don't want yourhouse.
They want you to pay your debts.
Ring them.
If you owe the child supportagency a fuckload of money, ring
(29:34):
them.
Don't ignore them.
They want to work with you.
As men, we decide to blockeverything out because it's
easier.
I'll shut the fucking door.
No one can come in.
I'll put an extra lock on thefront door.
I'll I'll turn my phone off.
I won't answer that phone call.
Answer the phone calls, sortyour debts out, clear your
fucking head of all the shitthat goes on, because that will
(29:56):
make you feel one million timesbetter, and I can tell you it
does, because I've done itmyself.
Right, I've run away from bankswhen I was, when I was a.
I've been a tow rag mate.
Right, I've not always been thenice person that I'm here.
I mean I've always been nice,but I've been a tow rag.
I got an overdraft just to drawit all out and go out and get
absolutely fucked for aboutthree weeks, go on holiday and
(30:19):
just waste it.
Then I just threw all the bankletters in the bin, just open
another bank account withsomeone else until they came
chasing for me for thousands ofpounds.
And then I finally my mum saidto me just ring the bank, speak
to them, stop hiding.
Stopped hiding, paid the debtoff within about four months and
I was.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
I didn't have that pressure on my head anymore
that's it and it's and I'velearned this as well from like.
You go to sleep and I'll wakeup all my problems and my
brain's overactive about betweenthe hours of four and six in
the morning.
So you're trying to sleep andeverything comes into your head.
Now those thoughts wouldn'tcome in my head if I was living
life the best way that I could,if I was being the best person I
(30:58):
possibly could, if I wasphoning that person back, if I
wasn't burying my head in thesand and admitting okay, you
fucked up there, mate, what canyou do to make it better?
And I say to the team at workyes, you're going to have
problems in your life, but don'tfocus on the problem, focus on
the solution.
Yeah, because that and thatearly.
Speaker 2 (31:18):
Yeah, don't leave it to the last minute.
Speaker 1 (31:24):
Cause, don't leave it to the last minute, because
then that's when you're screwedagain.
It's admit, okay, I fuckingmade a mistake.
Yeah, how can I get?
What can I do to make thisbetter for myself?
And there are thousands ofthings, like, if you're in debt,
there's charities that you cango to, there's free advice you
can go to, citizens advice youcan go to, and that's one thing
in the uk I haven't used it foryears, but whenever, whenever I
need anything, citizens Adviceis brilliant and you can go
(31:47):
there and you can book anappointment and you can speak to
someone and just again, byspeaking about that problem and
not internalising it, makes youfeel better instantly.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
Now, I'm not sitting here preaching it's all our
problems, it's all our fault,because there are things in life
that aren't your fault and youdo get dealt with.
You know, when your ex-wife's abitch or whatever, you know, or
you're being used as ascapegoat, or you're being used
as like I don't know whatever.
But you know what I'm trying tosay.
It's not everybody, it's notall of our fault, but a lot um,
(32:20):
but this is, this is reallygoing on, this one as well.
So, um, which is good, becauseI kind of wanted it to.
Yeah, it's not something that Iwanted to just just skirt over
now.
There's loads of things outthere.
There's loads of communitiesand stuff you can join to help
out, especially for men.
You know we're talking aboutmen's mental health here, so you
know one that is fantastic andit's got so much support, yeah,
(32:43):
so, mates.
Speaker 1 (32:43):
So mates, men and their emotions.
It was something that, again,daniel set up.
Dapper laughs for people that Icall him Daniel, now Daniel
O'Reilly, daniel O'Reilly,because I feel that the dapper
laughs.
I think he's evolving intoDaniel O'Reilly.
Yeah, yeah, the sober dad who'spresent and in the moment.
Yeah, now, if you're not partof the mates community, it's a
(33:06):
Facebook group with like 50,000lads on it and it's very heavily
monitored.
All the comments, all the posts, everything you can post
anonymously, and some of theadvice like I look at it a lot.
I look at it a lot Becausesometimes you can help someone
out by just giving that onecomment.
Now, it's a wicked community ofpeople that have done a very
(33:30):
similar thing.
You could think that you're theonly one going through it.
I guarantee you there's someoneon that group 50,000 lads in
the UK.
I guarantee you there's someonein that group that has been
through what you've gone throughor going through what you're
going through.
Some of the posts is like look,my missus has kicked me out.
I've got nothing.
She's taking the kids away fromme.
What can I do?
I'll use this solicitor that Iuse.
(33:51):
Or mate, whereabouts are you?
Where do you live?
I've got a spare room.
You can have it for a week.
These are people that don'tknow each other, connecting
because they connect becausethey've lived experiences.
And I think what he's done withthe group is phenomenal and
he'll post in there and hescrolls through it and he's
actually turned it into aregistered charity and he's got
(34:13):
massive, massive plans for it tohelp lads get the help they
need, because you can't get iton the NHS, you can't get it
through your GP.
All they're going to do is giveyou happy pills Now.
In my opinion that's good forthe interim, but after seeing
people that have taken tabletsand prescribed tablets, they're
on them for five or six years.
Speaker 2 (34:34):
It kind of goes back to the statistic, doesn't it?
Exactly Most men that commitsuicide have actually already
reached out for help from GPsand stuff and obviously just not
get the help.
Speaker 1 (34:45):
I mean, if you're, if you're on Facebook, m A, t, e,
s, men and their emotions go andjoin the group and be a part of
it, or just sit on thesidelines and read, because I
guarantee you it will blow yourmind.
Speaker 2 (34:58):
The generosity of people in there, yeah, Then the
other one, of course, is Andy'sman Club.
Yeah, that's getting big now, Ididn't really know much about
the backstory about Andy's manClub.
To be fair, I didn't realise itwas set up for Andy, who killed
himself, which is quite strong,isn't it?
I like it when people do thingsfor people that have actually
passed away but, andy, recentlyI've run over 240 different
(35:25):
support groups across thecountry.
Yeah, there's a new one inBrighton.
Yeah, so 240.
Like we don't live that faraway from everybody in this
country, do we?
So 240 groups.
There's definitely one near you.
Guys, if you do need any help,then look it up online.
You'll find it really easily.
It's very straightforwardprocess to get involved as well.
But then, most importantly, Ithink the biggest help out there
is you, and that's not you, ash, I'm pointing at the camera,
(35:48):
but most people don't watch this.
It is you guys.
Reach out, be nice to people.
If somebody seems like they'restruggling, ask them if they're
struggling, because the bestthing to do is ask somebody if
they're struggling.
Don't go you all right, mate,because he'll go.
Yeah, I'm all right, and that'sit.
(36:08):
Ask him are you struggling?
You seem to be struggling orare you all right?
You seem a little bit down orsomething, because if you ask a
question with a question, yeah,you're more likely to get an
answer that you want rather thanare you okay, mate?
That's just a question, yeahyeah, yeah, what's up?
no, nothing, mate, I'm sweet,I'm sweet, dig in dive balls
deep and ask don't go balls deepon your mate.
Speaker 1 (36:28):
But sorry, I had to throw a bit of batter in just to
break it up a bit, or if you'rethat way and kind, then he
might enjoy it.
Speaker 2 (36:35):
Yeah, he might enjoy it but no, I think, the most
important people out thereourselves.
You know, if you feel like yourmates are struggling, if you
feel like your husband or yourboyfriend or your brother, your
cousin, whatever any man in yourlife or any woman, let's face
it, you know we should belooking after each other.
Just reach out we should.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
The human race?
Yeah, okay, the human race isfucked.
Yeah, let's be honest.
Like I don't want to get intopolitics, I don't want to get
into war, but let's be honest,human connection is at the
lowest that it has ever been.
Yeah, but surround yourselfwith people.
Surround yourself with peoplethat can better your life.
Surround yourself with peopleyou feel comfortable around.
(37:12):
Surround yourself with peopleyou can be yourself around.
If you're feeling shit, I thinkyou should be able to call your
mate.
Maybe not all of them, but youshould have two or three mates
that you can ring and say lads,I'm fucking feeling shit.
When me and my missus wentthrough the thing, I had one
friend who was fucking sound andI'd ring him and he'd tell me
you're being a drama queen.
(37:33):
No, I agree with you on that.
He wouldn't tell me what Iwanted to hear.
He told me the realness fromhim sitting on the outside.
Yeah, he offered me space.
I've got two friends in Ireland.
Mate, come over.
I said I can't come over, I'mskinned or we'll fly over.
This was during COVID and thesetwo lads flew from Ireland and
we had a doner kebab in apremier inn and we had to tell
(37:53):
the people.
We were all gay lovers becauseotherwise they wouldn't let us
in the room together.
Do you know what I mean?
And that, that building thatcircle of but be that person as
well.
Yeah, I think that's the thing,if we all aim to be that person
who supports their friends,their colleagues, their
everything, and just just tryand be a better person.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
Yeah, I'm going to use so obviously I do lives on
TikTok.
My favorite saying on TikTok iswhen I do a load of sales, I
always say at the end of thesales Ipin any products up.
So there's nothing on thescreen and I say, listen, hit
the follow button.
It's not for my benefit, it'sfor other people.
I always say this we live in aproper shit world at the moment
where nobody gives a fuck aboutanybody.
(38:35):
We should all be protecting andlooking after each other.
So don't listen to me babblingon.
You put a comment in sectionwhat you think of the products
and you tell the other peoplethat are watching the live,
because they're going to listento you rather than listen to me.
We do.
We live in a proper shit worldwhere nobody gives a shit about
anybody.
It is a fact.
You know.
Years and years ago they usedto have parties in the street
(38:57):
all the time.
Yeah, used to go around yournext door neighbours, else they
used to leave their back dooropen.
Alright, we have got a massiveproblem with crime now, so you
can't do that, but people usedto walk in and out of back doors
and go alright, sandra, put thekettle on or whatever you know
like it was a big community, getyourself involved in the
fucking community.
Get yourself a load of friendsthat all think the same and
that's what we're saying.
Like Andy's man Club, it's soimportant to be involved in
(39:21):
other things, because that iswhat it's a famous thing and it
don't suffer in silence.
Yeah, don't suffer in silence.
Speaker 1 (39:26):
And even if you're not having a pro, even if you're
not on in having dark thoughts,even if you're not being like
in that space, go and helpsomeone else who might be go to
just to try it out.
Go to find Google and his mancub.
Look for your local place andgo along to a meeting and see
(39:47):
what it's all about and getbehind it.
The more people that get behindthis stuff, the more that 75%
number will drop, guaranteed,the more we talk about it, the
less it'll become let's behonest the government do not
give a fuck about us.
we have to give a fuck abouteach other, exactly.
Speaker 2 (40:04):
Simple as that.
I think that's a good way towrap it up.
Mate to be fair.
Speaker 1 (40:07):
I think we should Fuck the government Right.
Speaker 2 (40:08):
This has been a long podcast, but it was really,
really important for meespecially.
That's why I've kind of hostedthis one.
I know Ash is writing to hismen at work as well.
Look out for each other.
Actually, I'm going to set youa challenge.
Anyone listening right now.
Next time you walk down theroad, say hello to somebody.
Yeah, Because that hello thatperson could be feeling like
(40:31):
shit, genuinely feeling likeshit.
Say hello to someone, try andengage in a conversation with
someone for no reason whatsoever, because you never know that
one conversation, male or female, could save somebody's life, or
I'm going to piggyback off theback of different hats.
Speaker 1 (40:46):
Sam, he did a post yesterday.
I shared it on my story.
Do something today.
Reach out to someone.
Send a whatsapp, send a text tosomeone you've not spoke to in
a while, not because you wantsomething, just to check in on
them yeah, see how they're doing.
Speaker 2 (40:58):
Do you know what I was going to do today?
But I didn't do it because desis in there, so he's kind of
ruined the idea that I had.
I was going to bring a bunch offlowers for both of you today,
and that is because the firsttime a man ever gets flowers is
at his funeral.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
Wow that's deep, isn't it?
That is deep.
Yeah, to be fair, I don't thinkI ever had any flowers.
No, never.
That's for if you want to goeven further.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
Buy a bunch of flowers and get into a random
geezer in the street yeah, notthe biggest.
Speaker 1 (41:24):
Yeah, yeah, you've got this bruv, or you've got
this mate.
Speaker 2 (41:27):
Yeah, and that's it.
Go on and ash, you can closethis out, mate if you enjoyed
the episode.
Speaker 1 (41:33):
Host of our quiz.
I really did actually.
Um, that was wicked.
And you're struggling withmental health.
I mean, reach out to us.
Reach out to us.
If you've got a story to tell,come and sit in this chair and
tell your story, because if youcan help one person by telling
your story, then it'll be worthit.
I promise you that you willfeel good.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
That's exactly why I wanted to do this podcast,
because if we can help oneperson exactly, I feel like I've
even been out myself yeah, well, we're helping each other out
all the time.
Speaker 1 (42:01):
So, yeah, yeah, well, we're helping each other out
all the time, aren't we?
So yeah, that's been the UntoldPodcast hosted by the one and
only Chris Stewart.
Give us a comment, give us alike, give us a share.
We're up to seven viewers now.
We're trying to get to eight.
No, I'm only kidding.
But yeah, mental health is aserious thing, so look after
your neighbour.
Speaker 2 (42:18):
And you're amazing.
Speaker 1 (42:20):
Yeah.
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