October 22, 2025 • 46 mins
Want to hear strength and toughness? Ema had two children, then decided to give pro tennis another shot at the age of 30. This is not easy but she is going for it. Tune in and listen to her story as she travels the world trying to get to the top of the game. She also re-started her pro career playing PTT events!!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome toepisode #15 of the James Mackay
UTR Podcast. Very special guest today as it
is actually my first female guest to join the show.
So, Emma Burgich, welcome on. I feel so special and so honored
(00:23):
right now that I'm the first female and on your podcast.
Thank you so much for having me.I'm excited.
I'm excited to chat. Absolutely.
Well, if you don't know, Emma's story is unique but also
special. I'm not going to be the one to
share that. I'm going to let Emma share
that. But she is currently, currently
(00:46):
embarking on a professional tennis career.
But Emma, if you could just start off by telling us a little
bit about your story, where you are in the world and what you're
doing. Yes, of course.
I'm going to try to shorten it up as much as I can, but I'm
originally from Bosnia and Herzegovina.
(01:07):
It's a small country in Europe. I moved to the US when I was 18.
I went to Baylor in Texas. Second Bears.
I play there, Division One. I always wanted to play pro.
So like for me, coming to the, you know, to the states was just
(01:27):
like a pathway to, you know, just keep going with my pro
career. And how do you say I'm from
Boston? It's a small country, you know,
the conditions are not the best.There's no resources, there's no
money. And for me, coming to college
was was amazing. But I played pro before, like
with 16, I won my first pro tournament.
I was already like 500 before coming to college.
(01:50):
My last tournament that I playedbefore going to college, I beat
Donovan catching the finals. And then, you know, like I had
some pretty good wins and results so I I could play tennis
and then, you know, like collegewas great.
I had a great experience. I think I was ranked like top
five in the nation, singles and double S Division One at one
(02:10):
point. And I had some surgeries.
I had some injuries. But anyways, after college, I
played for like a year, 2015 anda little bit 2016, and my
highest ranking singles in that year that I got was like 460 and
140 in double S in only a year. But then I stopped.
(02:38):
I stopped because of personal reasons.
I got married and by the time myhusband wanted the family and
wanted kids and I was kind of like forced to make that
decision, but it was still my decision.
So I made a decision to stop playing.
(02:59):
So I just stopped like cold Turkey, like nothing.
So I stopped completely. And from then on, like I was
only like 24 and from then from 24 to 31, I had two kids
back-to-back literally for like 5 years.
(03:23):
I was just like either pregnant or breastfeeding.
But while I was coaching and building my coaching career at
the time. So anyways, I, OK, first I
didn't want to do anything with tennis.
I'm like, I'm done with tennis, you know, like I don't want to
look at the tennis racket anymore.
I've had enough. And it was kind of like, it was
tough for me. So I did accounting for a little
bit because I have an accountingdegree.
(03:44):
I hated it, hated my life. I was like, this is not for me.
And I went into sales a little bit.
That was also like, no. And then one of the neighbors
asked me to teach his kid and I started teaching him and I was
like, wow, I love coaching. So I started one client, other
(04:06):
client. Then I started Tennis with Emma.
So everybody go follow Tennis with Emma 1.
And I started a YouTube channel,Instagram.
And at the time I was like one of the only female coaches out
there. That was like putting videos
out. And I just wanted to get more
clients. I want to grow my business.
But I was like, it was crazy. Like, it got like really, I, I
(04:28):
don't know, it got great. I at one point I had like so
many groups, clinics, kids, adults.
I had eight coaches working underneath me.
I got USTAPTR certified. I was doing so much.
I was really, really loving it. But throughout all this time and
having kids and family and I wasdoing good in my life
(04:50):
financially everything, you know, But there was a part of me
that was just, I couldn't fulfill that void that I had of
like asking myself all the time what would have happened if I
kept playing, You know, like, I would see all these girls, you
know, playing there and, you know, I beat them and I'm like,
(05:12):
ah, it was so hard for me to even watch tennis on TV, you
know, it was really painful. But I'm like, what am I going to
do? Like just decide to play at 30
years old, you know, like that'sinsane.
Start over from zero, no ranking, no points.
Started 15K's playing against 16year olds, 17 year olds.
(05:35):
I'm 30 years old. I have two kids.
I'm I'm doing well in my life, you know, like why, why do this
to yourself, you know, but I decided to do it.
I was like, you know, you know why?
I was at the Miami open at the coaches conference for like a
(05:56):
four day workshop thing. And one of the one of the ladies
there, her name is Anne Grossman.
She used to be top 30 WTA she's like in her 50s now, stopped
playing when she was around 29, had two boys like me.
And she was giving the speech right.
And I just like connected to herstory so much.
(06:16):
And after that I went to introduce myself.
I told her a little bit about meand I was like, what is 1 advice
that you would give to your 30 year old self?
And she said if there is a little desire in you to like to
play, to do it, she's like, you have to do it because you don't
want to be 50 years old and regret that she didn't try to
(06:37):
30, right. And, you know, it just hit me
because it's like, I knew that answer inside of me, but I was
like, so scared to make that, tomake that step, you know, and,
and, and yeah, she inspired me. And I was like, you know what,
because she wakes up at 50 and regrets that she didn't try it.
(06:57):
And she's like, you don't want to live.
You don't want to live with that.
And I was like, you know what? I'm like, I'm going to do it.
And I didn't honestly know what it's going to look like, you
know, with my kids and now my ex-husband, we separated at the
time. So for me personally, I went
(07:18):
through a lot like personal stuff.
So I couldn't even start playingimmediately.
It took me like a year to solve those things and start training
again, get in shape. I was in shape.
But you know, like playing, justrallying and coaching and going
on a run and doing Pilates or going to a gym here and there
(07:39):
versus playing professionally, playing points sets.
We can week out. You know, it took so much time
to like get my body ready or like I would get injured again,
like something would hurt. So I finally started playing,
playing for real again like last2024, like in May.
(08:05):
And from then to now I'm like 600.
I won my 35. I wanted 35K, which I never won
that big of an event. So for me like to make those, to
make those results and to prove to myself that I can do it again
was really like worth it. But it's honestly, it's more
(08:26):
than that. It's more than that.
It's more than winning and losing.
It's just like I, I really want to reach my full potential.
I want to I owe it to myself to close that chapter on my own
because maybe my biggest, maybe that's my, that's my limit, but
maybe it's not. I feel like I have so much more,
you know, like I started playingwell finally, the beginning of
(08:48):
this year where I won four PTTS in a row.
That helped me so much. And I really mean it, not just
because we're here with you, TR.I really mean it like it was, it
was amazing. I had so many matches.
I needed a match. The, the confidence.
I made really good money beginning of the year.
(09:11):
So I was like, you know, my bankaccount was looking solid too.
So, you know, it gave me the confidence and, you know, I
played. And anyways, that's kind of
where I'm at now. And now I'm currently in
Bakersfield, CA playing A35K. Well, I don't know about people
listening, but you are, you're starting to inspire me a little
(09:34):
bit. Although I've told myself
recently that I'm going to startplaying one to two sets a week.
And in the middle of the set, I asked myself, why am I doing
this to myself? So I'll say, like, I have two
kids, right? I think we are a similar age.
The thought of me going back at the age of 30 and and embarking
(09:58):
on professional tennis is is sounds still tough, right?
Like how do you actually do it? You've played 27 tournaments,
right? 31 including PTT events.
That's a lot of time on the road, right?
You have two young boys, Like, how do you actually do it?
Do they travel with you? Is it FaceTime?
(10:18):
Is it just you're just so drivento to reach your full potential
that it doesn't even cross your mind?
I wish. That's a great question.
I don't talk a lot about this because people think, oh, a lot
of people don't even know that I'm, you know, separated.
And the situation with the kids,when I see people like, Oh yeah,
(10:39):
their story inspire my story inspires them, you know, that
I'm going for my dreams and doing this at this age.
But like, they have like, no idea what I'm going through on a
daily basis. But I just started last year.
Oh my God it was brutal. Like I would go to tournaments
(11:00):
and literally after like 5 days on the road I'm crying like I
miss my kids so much. That did literally like
physically hurts as a mom. Oh my God it was awful right
awful. And you know because they can't
really come with me. I'm also very limited how much I
(11:22):
can talk to them because if I was together with their dad, I
would be able just to call them anytime and we can talk and they
can like fly in if I'm feeling sad or something like this.
I'm so limited. You know, I have like an hour to
hour and a half a day on FaceTime and you know, certain
(11:44):
hour like I have to, you know, organize it all.
It's it's super tough when I'm home.
I try to make up for that time. And that's why it's so hard to
find the balance because when I'm home, you know, I need to
train. I mean, I also need to work,
teach lessons. I'm doing my social media.
(12:04):
I'm doing like so much that it'slike so hard even when I'm home
to spend time with them because I'm working so much and training
so much and recover and this andthat.
But then I feel the guilt anyways.
At the beginning, the guilt was awful, right?
Awful. I would and as a mom, as a woman
as well, right. If it's a guy, you know, if he's
(12:25):
out there going and playing, it's a little bit different, but
it's a different story. You know, like you have a job,
you have to travel. The dad is OK, but the mom, it's
why you're doing it. You know, like there's a lot of
people that support by a lot of people like how can you leave
your kids? You know?
So anyways, number one, I wouldn't be able to do it if my
(12:45):
ex-husband wasn't a good father.He's a great dad.
When I'm gone, he takes such good care of them that it's it's
crazy. Like I'm very, very grateful for
that. We Co parent really good and
really healthy. So we're able to make it work
right. But they are fine because
(13:07):
they're young, you know, they talk to me everyday.
They don't really get it yet what's happening.
You know, by the time I'm done playing, they're going to be
like, I don't know, like 678. And then it's like more work and
take them here, take them there.Now it's kind of like, you know,
you have kids. So it was really tough for me at
the beginning. And by the end of like last
(13:30):
year, I was like, can I actuallydo this?
You know, I don't know if I can do it because it hurts.
But then I knew like I had, I had some like tough times, like
really like digging deep with myself and like asking myself
what I really want. And I know that I will regret.
(13:51):
And I know I'm not going to be the best mom to my kids if I
don't do this for myself, you know, and I have to.
So I decided beginning of this year, Emma, you're either doing
it or you're not doing it. If you're going to do it, you
have to be full in and you can'tfeel sorry for yourself and feel
sad and blah, blah, blah. I mean, this journey on its own,
(14:14):
traveling to these tournaments, not making money, You know, I'm
not 20 years old anymore. I'm 33, you know, like like
it's, it's tough and it gets lonely and you don't make money.
You know all that stuff we can week out.
Like for example, now I'm third week on the road and it's been 2
(14:38):
great weeks. I've been playing well.
I actually have been working with these coaches and an
Academy in California. They've been coming with me.
I'm staying in great housing with great people.
I'm meeting people like it's amazing, but it's still like so
hard. Like yesterday I spoke to my
coach and to my mom. I'm like, I'm just so sad today.
(15:00):
Like it. I miss them so much, right?
But OK, I got to be tough and I,I, I, I decided to do it and I'm
not going to do it for forever. I gave myself until May next
year. If I'm still, I don't know, if
I'm like 405 hundred, I'm not going to keep going.
If I'm 250300I will keep going alittle bit more.
(15:24):
So that's my realistic goal. And if I if I started playing
this and I was just like losing and like I see I have like I
don't have the level, I would have quit by now.
But I see I have it and I see I can improve so much more, you
know, So I'm like, I'm going to keep going until I can until I
(15:46):
know. OK, this is it.
I can't, can't do it anymore. But yeah, OK, I was going to do
it three weeks this now 330 fives in California and which is
still a lot. I do maximum two weeks in a row
without my kids. I'm like, OK, you know, I'm
already here. But next week I got into 100K in
(16:07):
Texas, right? So it's like I cannot not go and
play, you know, obviously if I didn't have my kids, it would be
a no brainer. I'd just go like I already
organized like next week I have to go to my kids like Halloween
party with there's this, there'sa birthday party, there's school
stuff that I need to do as a mom, you know, So now I'm like
(16:30):
reorganizing it because I have to spend another week on the
road and I'm trying not to thinkabout it.
I'm trying to take it one day ata time and, and be tough, you
know, and the social media stuffhonestly really helps me.
I have such an amazing support from people, honestly.
And I just tried to focus on thepositives that they're, they're,
(16:53):
they're bad people out there too.
I don't care. But the people that met along
the way, the connections that I made, like I was here last year
in Bakersfield and I came to class, I hear there's so many
people, they're like so happy tosee me and I'm here, they're
watching my progress. I don't know, it's so nice, you
know, and I'm just grateful at the end of the day that I still
(17:18):
can do what I love and, and I can, if I can inspire one person
with my story, you know? Yeah.
I mean. But I think the word that you
keep mentioning is, is strength and being strong.
Again, I can relate to this. I have two young kids.
The thought of being away from them for 31 weeks, right, or 27
(17:42):
weeks and travelling to Mexico, Santo Domingo, Europe, all over
the United States would be very challenging.
I would really, I think I would really, really struggle with
that, right? But what you've mentioned, and
this is something that I want tobring up and this is something I
always say is I'm a full believer in who you put yourself
around on a daily basis. The people you put yourself
(18:05):
around, whether you're making this much money or that much
money or whether you're embarking on this or that, if
you have great people around youthere, you can do anything you
really can. So I think what you're doing is
don't stop, keep going, keep going, keep pushing.
You've you've established gold for yourself.
With that being said, you brought up the the difficulties
(18:27):
of playing professional tennis, right?
You've played 30 tournaments in this year.
You've done very well. You're 500 or something like
that in the world. I don't have the exact thing,
but you've made just under $10,000 playing these events,
right? Like this frustrates, it really
(18:47):
frustrates me. I don't know how you feel as a
player or other, but you are embarking on this and making no
disrespect whatsoever, but it's,it's a not, it's not enough
money to be sustainable. What, what do you do?
What, what advice would you giveto other players?
Like how are you doing this, especially with two young kids
at home? It's so tough.
(19:09):
I mean, I'm looking from, from a, from a different perspective
than, you know, when I was 1617 starting to play pros or right
after college, you know, like now I have more experience, more
more mature. I would think it's crazy how
difficult they make it to actually make it almost
(19:34):
impossible, honestly. And I'm not saying that unless
you're like so talented, right? Like what?
What's her name with Manova or Jovic or whatever, The Canadian
Makobo, because I played some tournaments that they played
too. You can see the level of tennis,
like, you know, it is a little different, but also they have
(19:58):
the support. They have wild cards that this
and that just for a regular. Person that's coming out of
college or or you know, they're trying to make it pro.
It's honestly almost impossible.Why I'm saying this is the level
of tennis is insane. Like there is no easy matches.
(20:21):
All of these girls qualities of a 35 first round of a 35 or
finals. Like it's literally like you
look around, everybody is playing the level of tennis.
I mean, before when I played, I don't know, like 15 years ago,
there was a little bit more likeespecially in women's tennis,
(20:43):
like little holes here and therethat you can, you know, like if
I I know if I like make the ball, whatever, I got it.
Now there's no like that. Everybody's hitting, everybody's
physically strong. You come to a 35.
The girls are warming up, doing their mobility, stretching,
taking care of this, taking careof that.
Everybody's so professional. You come, they're like animals.
(21:06):
We all are like we wanted. I mean you see this guy now he's
224 in the world and he just wins the freaking masters.
You know, that just shows you that the level of tennis between
top 100, top 150 and a girl that's 900.
It's not big and it's really it's a fact.
(21:29):
It really is maybe OK, top 10 ortop five or I see you can see,
but there's really not. So with that said, it's so hard
to like what? OK, you have a good week.
Yes, OK, I went at 35, but I have to keep going.
Like I have to keep going like next week.
(21:50):
I need to show up. I need to win more and more.
I have to keep my body healthy. I have to travel and then
financially, OK, like we can talk about this so much.
It's so sad. It's so sad.
We get nothing, like literally nothing.
If you had to take the coach with you or somebody with you,
(22:11):
almost impossible. It's just like, OK, why am I
playing the tournaments here in the US?
Because I'm so grateful. There's so many good people that
take you into their homes, cook for you, take care of you.
So you save so much there, right?
But unless you're winning every week, and even if you're winning
(22:34):
every week, you're not, you're discovering expenses, you're not
making any money, right? So I don't know.
I, I don't know. I don't know.
It's like I, how I do it. I'm taking it one month at a
time. I know I'm good for like next
2-3 months, but then after 2-3 months, I don't know if I can
(22:58):
keep going. How do I do it?
Social media has some brand deals monthly that I get money.
I make on on the reels on some deals.
I teach lessons when I'm when I'm home.
I still have two coaches that dowork for me when I'm gone.
So I make a little bit money there.
I get an investor that gives me a little bit I, I don't know,
(23:22):
like I, I don't know if somebodyasked me how I'm doing.
I don't, I'm figuring it out. I don't have rich parents or
something that can support me orthis or that.
I am grinding and working so hard for this.
And yeah, I literally, I'm just a little bit from everywhere.
(23:44):
Plus, OK, it's not just tennis Ineed to provide for my kids.
I get no child support, no nothing.
We split everything 5050 with the kids, you know, pay for
their jiu jitsu, pay for their soccer, pay for their ice
hockey, pay for their school, pay for their clothes, the food.
I I have those expenses 1st and par and rent and you know, and
(24:08):
then my tennis so. Just to just to put this into
perspective again, if you are not ready to play professional
tennis physically or mentally, don't rush into it.
It is such a brutal sport. It's lonely, it's expensive
unless you are truly at the top of the game.
(24:29):
And what I mean by the top of the game is grand slams,
unfortunately, you're not. You're not making that much
money. You're just, you're just not.
It's, it's the reality and it's,it's something that doesn't
correlate to how brutal and tough the sport actually is.
Just to put this into perspective, Emma is 500 in the
world, a very, very, very good tennis player.
(24:51):
She's made 10,000, just under 10K playing these events.
She brought up at the start of the call here that she did start
the year playing 4 PTT events. She made closer to $15,000
playing those events and just four of them, right?
What I'm saying is find a way toactually sprinkle in the events
into your scheduling. Not only are you actually going
(25:12):
to make money, but you actually might establish some confidence
and actually improve. And again, I'm not just saying
that because I work for UTR. It's the truth.
It's something I believe in. I've always believed in.
I've kept up with your career, Emma.
So that's just how I feel. And I'm pretty, I'm pretty
passionate about that because I've seen a lot of players drop
out because simply they hate tennis or they run out of money.
(25:36):
It's so true and it's so sad to see like really talented
players, really good players. I mean, you have you have these
top players complaining about mental issues or struggle and
they have everything, you know, like they have, they don't have
to worry financially if they're going to make it or not this
(25:59):
week. Or, you know, they have the
physio with them, they have the coach with them, they have the
support, they have the nice hotel, they have the nice food,
you know, like, and they're still struggling mentally
because on its own, tennis is such a tough.
Why? Why is tennis so tough mentally?
(26:21):
Great question. It wasn't part of the script, I
just thought about why. Because I think it's more OK, I
think it's more the lifestyle meaning like the weekend, week
out really have to keep showing up that there's like no break.
(26:42):
You feel like you have no time off, right?
Like it just weighs in. And then you're like, you're
like you're improving, you're doing so good, You're putting in
the work. And then you come there.
You can't control how the other players going to play.
Maybe they have an amazing day, but you put in the work, you've
(27:02):
done everything right. And then you're like, what?
And then you have to stay positive and be like, OK, I got
this. You know, I can do it.
I keep working my week. Then the next week comes, you
come. But then like, maybe as a girl,
you're on your period, you know,you're not feeling the best.
You don't perform the best or something hurts her a little
(27:25):
bit, but then you can't perform your best.
But last week you did feel good,but that girl played well.
So you have to like, OK, stay positive.
OK, I'm going to show up next week.
Let me put in the word. You know, it's like there's so
many. Then like being in the match,
being present, staying, you know, taking one point at a
time. I mean, there's so much I can
(27:47):
talk about the mental side. It's not just like one thing.
Everybody deals with the different things.
The you know, it's it's. Yeah, question, Question for
you. How far away do you think you
actually are from being in thosemoments?
(28:08):
Some days I feel like. I'm OK.
I talked to somebody about this last last week.
Some days I feel like I'm so close, right?
I feel like it's there, right? I can smell it like it's there.
(28:28):
Some days I feel like I'm so farand I can never make it, you
know? And I asked him myself, what are
you actually doing? What are you actually doing?
But guess what? Every player that I talk to,
they feel the same, you know, especially when you see the
(28:49):
players that like do make it andthey breakthrough.
Like that can be me because I was there with her two months
ago. If she can do it, I can do it
too, you know, And that like gives you a little motivation.
But then you lose to somebody. You're not supposed to lose, not
supposed to lose or you play so bad and then you're like, can I
(29:11):
actually? Then you start questioning your
life. You start questioning everything
and it's honestly, I think it's just who is more persistent and
who can mentally stay tough and just show up.
(29:31):
You got to show up. You got to show up.
You have to turn off those voices in your head, the doubts,
the fear and and you just got tokeep going.
And if it doesn't work out, at least you know you gave it all.
But but God, it's. So what you're saying is you're
(29:55):
really, you know, there are times you're, you're not that
far away. The best players in the game on
the women's side, what do they do well?
Is it power? Is it movement?
Is it consistency? What is it?
Every all of the above. First of all, there's nobody now
(30:17):
that is physically not an animal, right And woman's tennis
that that's that's not even a question.
That's something that I still amworking on and is a 33 year old.
My recovery is like not the best.
So it's like finding the balanceof like how much I'm pushing
myself and also how much I'm like recovering and taking time
off. So getting there so physically
(30:40):
and everybody's hitting the balllike there's no like you can't
really push and get your maybe there's one or two girls there
in like top 100 that maybe play a little slower.
You have to hit the ball and youhave to be consistent.
And I think now it's also like having a good serve and women's
(31:04):
tennis is is huge. Like every girl that you see
that has a huge serve, but does he know like play that that
amazing? Like she's she can get there, I
think faster. That's just from what I've seen.
Got it got it what's it like? Few more questions here.
(31:26):
You have played some tournaments, UTR tournaments,
and I saw pictures of you and videos of you playing in front
of your kids and then watching you and then being in the
picture with the trophy and the check.
What's surely that has to motivate you to to want to just
(31:47):
keep pushing? It really does.
It really does get emotional now, but you know, they don't
get it now, like I said, but as they get older, they will
understand too and on as stuff as it is like being away from
(32:09):
them, you know, and struggling with that.
It's also so they give me so much motivation and so much
energy on the tough days, like especially during matches,
because I have, you know, some friends that come with me or
(32:31):
like, you know, or a coach or somebody, if I know or
somebody's helping me, they tellme, let's go, mommy, you know,
like during the match. And that just gives me first of
all, it gives me a smile on my like I smile and I'm happy and I
know there's like so much more to life than this tennis match,
you know, So I relax more and I don't know, I just play better.
(32:54):
But, you know, I want to really show them that, you know, their
mom went for it, you know, as cheesy as it sounds, you know,
she. Did.
You know, that one day when they're struggling with
something or they're, you know, like, I don't know if I should
do this or that they, they're like, OK, my mom was so strong.
(33:19):
She prevailed this, she went through so much and she, she
still did it because, you know, I chose the harder route and not
the easier route in life. And and it's really so worth it.
And I know that my reward is going to be very high.
(33:39):
Doesn't have to be playing a Grand Slam or accomplishing my
kind of dreams. You know, I'm not that that is
my dream and I really want it. But like I want if I'm there at
the Grand Slam and I accomplished my dream, I want to
feel the same then as I would feel if I didn't make it, if
(34:00):
that makes sense, because I do want it's so much more in this
story than just results right there in ideal world.
Great. But like it's honestly the
process, putting myself out there, doing the thing that
scares me. You know, I'm growing so much as
a person, their lives that I am impacting the time, you know,
(34:25):
like the, the people that I meet, the, I mean, it's so worth
it. It's so fulfilling that that for
me means so much more than actually winning a tennis match.
And one thing, and you asked about my kids, you know, like,
so there's, there have been so many matches this year that I
(34:46):
played like 4 hours or 4 1/2 hours that I'm grinding winning
75 and the 3rd 76 and the third against these like 20 year olds,
19 year olds, 21 year olds. And I'm like 33 grinding there.
And now everybody kind of like knows me as the player that like
grinds it and fights and I'm thefighter, right.
And they're like, how do you do it?
Like how do you have the energy and how you know what I always
(35:09):
tell myself I'm not walking off the squirt without any regrets.
I want to know that I put it allout there and whatever happens,
happens. I'm going to fight for every
ball. I'm going to fight for every
point. No matter if I feel great or if
I don't feel great or I feel my shots or I don't feel my shots.
I want to walk on that court without any regrets.
(35:32):
Like in life, honestly, you wantto know, you put it everything
out there and I am good, right? I'm not going to, you know, feel
sorry for myself. No, this happened or the wind or
this pastor, it wasn't my day. There's so many excuses,
especially as tennis players would find so many excuses why
(35:53):
we lost. No, I want to take
accountability. I want to take responsibility
for everything that I do, control what I can control and
and whatever happens, happens. I, I think what, what you're
explaining too is if you don't have kids and you are pursuing
professional tennis, my advice to you based on listening to
(36:15):
Emma now is things outside of the court.
Do things outside of the court that you are passionate about.
Read, write a book, start your own business, whatever it is, do
something outside so that when you are in those four hour
battles, you, you understand there's, there's other things
out there. And it's not just about this
one, this one tennis match. I want to shift gears just a
(36:38):
little bit. Sorry for taking up so much of
your time. And it's regarding professional
college tennis and professional tennis on the women's side,
right? What is on the men's side?
This is what, unless you are a top five junior, right?
And you are 500 in the world at the age of 17.
(36:59):
You're not a professional tennisplayer yet.
And I say that because you're not consistently putting money
away, right? You're not there yet.
Men's side, it takes time. Like I think it's 2829 now is
where players are really starting to reach their peak.
What's what's the do you know, like what do you think about on
the women's side, a really good junior, should they go to
(37:21):
college? Should they go to college?
And if they are top five in the country, should they GoPro at
the age of 20? What what's what's the
difference there on the women's?Side for me, it's a no brainer
that I'm going to college or not, especially now.
Like, I mean, I mean, look, I'm 33 and I'm trying to make a pro
(37:49):
call a crazy or whatever, but I mean, I'm doing it.
I'm not trying anymore. I'm in it.
So like I cannot say anymore. I'm trying.
I'm actually doing it and I'm there A lot of you know, players
think, oh, I'm going to be old. There's going to be late 2425,
you know, like 23. You're like literally in your
(38:10):
best years and college really develops you so much as a
person. Like you also figure out that
there is so much to life than just tennis.
The problem with tennis players,I think that just do tennis and
they don't, you know, they don'texplore other stuff.
And like with college or school or I don't know, some purpose,
(38:34):
you need to have some purpose inlife outside of tennis, because
if you're just into tennis, tennis, tennis, mentally you
will. It's, I don't know, it's, it's
not going to be healthy. This is just my opinion.
What I'm saying. I'm not saying this is right
around just from my experience, but I've seen as a coach, as a
player, as a mom, but definitelycollege.
(38:55):
I mean, picking the right college, that's for you.
That's number one. Like, you know, that, you know,
you're in the right environment with right teammates, with the
right coaches, because it is a huge adjustment that you have
people that are supporting you that but there's so much
opportunity and you can play still pro and they pay for you.
(39:17):
And you're like, I wish I could go back to college days, like,
you know, like where my coaches were taking, taking care of
everything, you know, and I justgo and I play when I see these
girls now coming with colleges, I like that was so nice.
I wish I used that more to my advantage.
You know, I took it for granted back in the day.
(39:37):
And I wish I realized that back then.
How it how important it was and the friendships that you make
for a lifetime. You know, the education that you
get, you know, it's really, really, really I, I think the
girls are, it's different than the guys because they are, they
(39:58):
think maybe they can like they're wasting time, you know,
in college. They're it's not they, you know,
they think they're too good to go to college or, you know, for
me that that's the wrong mindset.
So. I will say that I think you're
(40:19):
right. The the level of tennis is only
improving if if college coaches are out there and you and you
truly know that you have a player that's special and you
know, right, they are really good at this or they're really
good at that or they're incredibly competitive and
they're one of the best players in the country.
You have to find a way to schedule professional tennis
(40:40):
events amongst their school. You know, instead of playing
maybe certain dual, you take them to a professional tennis
tour. Instead of playing certain fall
events, you take them to a professional, allow them to
actually build their pro career whilst they're in college.
And I don't think that happens enough.
Actually. I made mistakes in scheduling
with some of my players and I wish I could take that back and
(41:03):
allow them to get to 400 so thatwhen they graduate they're
ready. Yes, I agree with that.
I agree with that. So anyway, last thing long term
if if you do decide one day to stop playing tennis, have you
thought about the next step and what that might look like?
(41:26):
And if you don't want to answer it, that is totally fine I.
Work for you, TR. It's my dream job to be
surrounded with such amazing people.
OK, actually, I'm joking with that part.
The working, I don't know. But honestly, like everyone that
(41:50):
I've met from UTR, like awesome people, awesome, awesome people.
And I really mean it. And I'm grateful that I've met,
you know, from referees, from everyone, everyone, the
organization. I just, it's a healthy
environment. So maybe I would, maybe I'll be
(42:12):
a part of it one day. You don't know.
I love it but. No, for me, the beauty and is
that I really don't know, you know, like, and I'm so OK with
that because I don't know where my life is going to take me.
If I really make it right, I'm playing against that.
(42:35):
My story is going to go Boo, youknow, and I'll have the money.
I'll have options to do what I really want to do.
I have I have some things in my ideal world that I would love to
do. I'm not going to share it now,
but ultimately when I'm really done with tennis, I want to be
(42:58):
flexible enough with my job and what I'm doing where I can still
impact others and continue with my story while being present
with my kids. I love it.
Like I want to be there for my kids.
I want to be at every soccer game, at every ice hockey game.
(43:21):
I want to be present while I'm building on my story and
building, just building and whatever that, whatever that is,
we will see. I'm just right now.
I'm here now and I need to focuson my match here tomorrow in
Bakersfield, CA. Well, just to recap, I'm going
(43:42):
to try and do this briefly, but it's the first thing that I want
people to hear is if you have the itch and you have this thing
in the back of your head, just like Emma's mentor said to her,
go for it. Cross your gut.
I've had changes in my career. I, I, I went with my gut and I
absolutely love what I'm doing. And it's the same situation with
(44:07):
Emma. She had a gut.
She saw players that were doing this and doing that, and she
wanted to give it a go. And as a professional tennis
player or a tennis player out there, you're always going to
want more like you, You always. I was talking to a player of the
day. He's 250 in the world.
He's asking me, do I think that he's doing a great job?
I said, you've been playing professional tennis for one year
(44:28):
and you're already 250 in the world.
To me, that sounds pretty good. But for a professional tennis
player, you always, always, always want more.
But my message to you, Emma, again, these are real
conversations. I truly hope people are
listening and and enjoy the the realness of it.
But keep pushing. Do not stop.
(44:49):
I would say my advice to you is if you fall out of love with the
sport, that may be the day. But you know deep down, you're a
competitor. You love to compete, you love to
win and you're doing many thingsoutside of the tennis court too.
So keep going. If you're not following Emma's
story, you definitely should. Her Instagram channel is called
(45:12):
Tennis with Sorry, actually I don't know what it's called.
I I was close, but I'll let her tell you and follow her results
and follow her story. Yeah, thank you so much for
having me on. Honestly, this was a great
conversation. I felt like that I can really
share and be so open about it and really, really it's so worth
(45:34):
it to go for that thing that scares you.
It brings so much peace and not for the fame, not for the money,
not for anything. But you have to trust your gut.
You have to trust what really you want to do and just go for
it because it's really, really, really worth it.
(45:55):
Emma, thank you for your time. Best of luck and we will be
following over here at UTR. Thanks guys.
Thanks. Thanks for having me.
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome toepisode #15 of the James Mackay
UTR Podcast. Very special guest today as it
is actually my first female guest to join the show.
So, Emma Burgich, welcome on. I feel so special and so honored
(00:23):
right now that I'm the first female and on your podcast.
Thank you so much for having me.I'm excited.
I'm excited to chat. Absolutely.
Well, if you don't know, Emma's story is unique but also
special. I'm not going to be the one to
share that. I'm going to let Emma share
that. But she is currently, currently
(00:46):
embarking on a professional tennis career.
But Emma, if you could just start off by telling us a little
bit about your story, where you are in the world and what you're
doing. Yes, of course.
I'm going to try to shorten it up as much as I can, but I'm
originally from Bosnia and Herzegovina.
(01:07):
It's a small country in Europe. I moved to the US when I was 18.
I went to Baylor in Texas. Second Bears.
I play there, Division One. I always wanted to play pro.
So like for me, coming to the, you know, to the states was just
(01:27):
like a pathway to, you know, just keep going with my pro
career. And how do you say I'm from
Boston? It's a small country, you know,
the conditions are not the best.There's no resources, there's no
money. And for me, coming to college
was was amazing. But I played pro before, like
with 16, I won my first pro tournament.
I was already like 500 before coming to college.
(01:50):
My last tournament that I playedbefore going to college, I beat
Donovan catching the finals. And then, you know, like I had
some pretty good wins and results so I I could play tennis
and then, you know, like collegewas great.
I had a great experience. I think I was ranked like top
five in the nation, singles and double S Division One at one
(02:10):
point. And I had some surgeries.
I had some injuries. But anyways, after college, I
played for like a year, 2015 anda little bit 2016, and my
highest ranking singles in that year that I got was like 460 and
140 in double S in only a year. But then I stopped.
(02:38):
I stopped because of personal reasons.
I got married and by the time myhusband wanted the family and
wanted kids and I was kind of like forced to make that
decision, but it was still my decision.
So I made a decision to stop playing.
(02:59):
So I just stopped like cold Turkey, like nothing.
So I stopped completely. And from then on, like I was
only like 24 and from then from 24 to 31, I had two kids
back-to-back literally for like 5 years.
(03:23):
I was just like either pregnant or breastfeeding.
But while I was coaching and building my coaching career at
the time. So anyways, I, OK, first I
didn't want to do anything with tennis.
I'm like, I'm done with tennis, you know, like I don't want to
look at the tennis racket anymore.
I've had enough. And it was kind of like, it was
tough for me. So I did accounting for a little
bit because I have an accountingdegree.
(03:44):
I hated it, hated my life. I was like, this is not for me.
And I went into sales a little bit.
That was also like, no. And then one of the neighbors
asked me to teach his kid and I started teaching him and I was
like, wow, I love coaching. So I started one client, other
(04:06):
client. Then I started Tennis with Emma.
So everybody go follow Tennis with Emma 1.
And I started a YouTube channel,Instagram.
And at the time I was like one of the only female coaches out
there. That was like putting videos
out. And I just wanted to get more
clients. I want to grow my business.
But I was like, it was crazy. Like, it got like really, I, I
(04:28):
don't know, it got great. I at one point I had like so
many groups, clinics, kids, adults.
I had eight coaches working underneath me.
I got USTAPTR certified. I was doing so much.
I was really, really loving it. But throughout all this time and
having kids and family and I wasdoing good in my life
(04:50):
financially everything, you know, But there was a part of me
that was just, I couldn't fulfill that void that I had of
like asking myself all the time what would have happened if I
kept playing, You know, like, I would see all these girls, you
know, playing there and, you know, I beat them and I'm like,
(05:12):
ah, it was so hard for me to even watch tennis on TV, you
know, it was really painful. But I'm like, what am I going to
do? Like just decide to play at 30
years old, you know, like that'sinsane.
Start over from zero, no ranking, no points.
Started 15K's playing against 16year olds, 17 year olds.
(05:35):
I'm 30 years old. I have two kids.
I'm I'm doing well in my life, you know, like why, why do this
to yourself, you know, but I decided to do it.
I was like, you know, you know why?
I was at the Miami open at the coaches conference for like a
(05:56):
four day workshop thing. And one of the one of the ladies
there, her name is Anne Grossman.
She used to be top 30 WTA she's like in her 50s now, stopped
playing when she was around 29, had two boys like me.
And she was giving the speech right.
And I just like connected to herstory so much.
(06:16):
And after that I went to introduce myself.
I told her a little bit about meand I was like, what is 1 advice
that you would give to your 30 year old self?
And she said if there is a little desire in you to like to
play, to do it, she's like, you have to do it because you don't
want to be 50 years old and regret that she didn't try to
(06:37):
30, right. And, you know, it just hit me
because it's like, I knew that answer inside of me, but I was
like, so scared to make that, tomake that step, you know, and,
and, and yeah, she inspired me. And I was like, you know what,
because she wakes up at 50 and regrets that she didn't try it.
(06:57):
And she's like, you don't want to live.
You don't want to live with that.
And I was like, you know what? I'm like, I'm going to do it.
And I didn't honestly know what it's going to look like, you
know, with my kids and now my ex-husband, we separated at the
time. So for me personally, I went
(07:18):
through a lot like personal stuff.
So I couldn't even start playingimmediately.
It took me like a year to solve those things and start training
again, get in shape. I was in shape.
But you know, like playing, justrallying and coaching and going
on a run and doing Pilates or going to a gym here and there
(07:39):
versus playing professionally, playing points sets.
We can week out. You know, it took so much time
to like get my body ready or like I would get injured again,
like something would hurt. So I finally started playing,
playing for real again like last2024, like in May.
(08:05):
And from then to now I'm like 600.
I won my 35. I wanted 35K, which I never won
that big of an event. So for me like to make those, to
make those results and to prove to myself that I can do it again
was really like worth it. But it's honestly, it's more
(08:26):
than that. It's more than that.
It's more than winning and losing.
It's just like I, I really want to reach my full potential.
I want to I owe it to myself to close that chapter on my own
because maybe my biggest, maybe that's my, that's my limit, but
maybe it's not. I feel like I have so much more,
you know, like I started playingwell finally, the beginning of
(08:48):
this year where I won four PTTS in a row.
That helped me so much. And I really mean it, not just
because we're here with you, TR.I really mean it like it was, it
was amazing. I had so many matches.
I needed a match. The, the confidence.
I made really good money beginning of the year.
(09:11):
So I was like, you know, my bankaccount was looking solid too.
So, you know, it gave me the confidence and, you know, I
played. And anyways, that's kind of
where I'm at now. And now I'm currently in
Bakersfield, CA playing A35K. Well, I don't know about people
listening, but you are, you're starting to inspire me a little
(09:34):
bit. Although I've told myself
recently that I'm going to startplaying one to two sets a week.
And in the middle of the set, I asked myself, why am I doing
this to myself? So I'll say, like, I have two
kids, right? I think we are a similar age.
The thought of me going back at the age of 30 and and embarking
(09:58):
on professional tennis is is sounds still tough, right?
Like how do you actually do it? You've played 27 tournaments,
right? 31 including PTT events.
That's a lot of time on the road, right?
You have two young boys, Like, how do you actually do it?
Do they travel with you? Is it FaceTime?
(10:18):
Is it just you're just so drivento to reach your full potential
that it doesn't even cross your mind?
I wish. That's a great question.
I don't talk a lot about this because people think, oh, a lot
of people don't even know that I'm, you know, separated.
And the situation with the kids,when I see people like, Oh yeah,
(10:39):
their story inspire my story inspires them, you know, that
I'm going for my dreams and doing this at this age.
But like, they have like, no idea what I'm going through on a
daily basis. But I just started last year.
Oh my God it was brutal. Like I would go to tournaments
(11:00):
and literally after like 5 days on the road I'm crying like I
miss my kids so much. That did literally like
physically hurts as a mom. Oh my God it was awful right
awful. And you know because they can't
really come with me. I'm also very limited how much I
(11:22):
can talk to them because if I was together with their dad, I
would be able just to call them anytime and we can talk and they
can like fly in if I'm feeling sad or something like this.
I'm so limited. You know, I have like an hour to
hour and a half a day on FaceTime and you know, certain
(11:44):
hour like I have to, you know, organize it all.
It's it's super tough when I'm home.
I try to make up for that time. And that's why it's so hard to
find the balance because when I'm home, you know, I need to
train. I mean, I also need to work,
teach lessons. I'm doing my social media.
(12:04):
I'm doing like so much that it'slike so hard even when I'm home
to spend time with them because I'm working so much and training
so much and recover and this andthat.
But then I feel the guilt anyways.
At the beginning, the guilt was awful, right?
Awful. I would and as a mom, as a woman
as well, right. If it's a guy, you know, if he's
(12:25):
out there going and playing, it's a little bit different, but
it's a different story. You know, like you have a job,
you have to travel. The dad is OK, but the mom, it's
why you're doing it. You know, like there's a lot of
people that support by a lot of people like how can you leave
your kids? You know?
So anyways, number one, I wouldn't be able to do it if my
(12:45):
ex-husband wasn't a good father.He's a great dad.
When I'm gone, he takes such good care of them that it's it's
crazy. Like I'm very, very grateful for
that. We Co parent really good and
really healthy. So we're able to make it work
right. But they are fine because
(13:07):
they're young, you know, they talk to me everyday.
They don't really get it yet what's happening.
You know, by the time I'm done playing, they're going to be
like, I don't know, like 678. And then it's like more work and
take them here, take them there.Now it's kind of like, you know,
you have kids. So it was really tough for me at
the beginning. And by the end of like last
(13:30):
year, I was like, can I actuallydo this?
You know, I don't know if I can do it because it hurts.
But then I knew like I had, I had some like tough times, like
really like digging deep with myself and like asking myself
what I really want. And I know that I will regret.
(13:51):
And I know I'm not going to be the best mom to my kids if I
don't do this for myself, you know, and I have to.
So I decided beginning of this year, Emma, you're either doing
it or you're not doing it. If you're going to do it, you
have to be full in and you can'tfeel sorry for yourself and feel
sad and blah, blah, blah. I mean, this journey on its own,
(14:14):
traveling to these tournaments, not making money, You know, I'm
not 20 years old anymore. I'm 33, you know, like like
it's, it's tough and it gets lonely and you don't make money.
You know all that stuff we can week out.
Like for example, now I'm third week on the road and it's been 2
(14:38):
great weeks. I've been playing well.
I actually have been working with these coaches and an
Academy in California. They've been coming with me.
I'm staying in great housing with great people.
I'm meeting people like it's amazing, but it's still like so
hard. Like yesterday I spoke to my
coach and to my mom. I'm like, I'm just so sad today.
(15:00):
Like it. I miss them so much, right?
But OK, I got to be tough and I,I, I, I decided to do it and I'm
not going to do it for forever. I gave myself until May next
year. If I'm still, I don't know, if
I'm like 405 hundred, I'm not going to keep going.
If I'm 250300I will keep going alittle bit more.
(15:24):
So that's my realistic goal. And if I if I started playing
this and I was just like losing and like I see I have like I
don't have the level, I would have quit by now.
But I see I have it and I see I can improve so much more, you
know, So I'm like, I'm going to keep going until I can until I
(15:46):
know. OK, this is it.
I can't, can't do it anymore. But yeah, OK, I was going to do
it three weeks this now 330 fives in California and which is
still a lot. I do maximum two weeks in a row
without my kids. I'm like, OK, you know, I'm
already here. But next week I got into 100K in
(16:07):
Texas, right? So it's like I cannot not go and
play, you know, obviously if I didn't have my kids, it would be
a no brainer. I'd just go like I already
organized like next week I have to go to my kids like Halloween
party with there's this, there'sa birthday party, there's school
stuff that I need to do as a mom, you know, So now I'm like
(16:30):
reorganizing it because I have to spend another week on the
road and I'm trying not to thinkabout it.
I'm trying to take it one day ata time and, and be tough, you
know, and the social media stuffhonestly really helps me.
I have such an amazing support from people, honestly.
And I just tried to focus on thepositives that they're, they're,
(16:53):
they're bad people out there too.
I don't care. But the people that met along
the way, the connections that I made, like I was here last year
in Bakersfield and I came to class, I hear there's so many
people, they're like so happy tosee me and I'm here, they're
watching my progress. I don't know, it's so nice, you
know, and I'm just grateful at the end of the day that I still
(17:18):
can do what I love and, and I can, if I can inspire one person
with my story, you know? Yeah.
I mean. But I think the word that you
keep mentioning is, is strength and being strong.
Again, I can relate to this. I have two young kids.
The thought of being away from them for 31 weeks, right, or 27
(17:42):
weeks and travelling to Mexico, Santo Domingo, Europe, all over
the United States would be very challenging.
I would really, I think I would really, really struggle with
that, right? But what you've mentioned, and
this is something that I want tobring up and this is something I
always say is I'm a full believer in who you put yourself
around on a daily basis. The people you put yourself
(18:05):
around, whether you're making this much money or that much
money or whether you're embarking on this or that, if
you have great people around youthere, you can do anything you
really can. So I think what you're doing is
don't stop, keep going, keep going, keep pushing.
You've you've established gold for yourself.
With that being said, you brought up the the difficulties
(18:27):
of playing professional tennis, right?
You've played 30 tournaments in this year.
You've done very well. You're 500 or something like
that in the world. I don't have the exact thing,
but you've made just under $10,000 playing these events,
right? Like this frustrates, it really
(18:47):
frustrates me. I don't know how you feel as a
player or other, but you are embarking on this and making no
disrespect whatsoever, but it's,it's a not, it's not enough
money to be sustainable. What, what do you do?
What, what advice would you giveto other players?
Like how are you doing this, especially with two young kids
at home? It's so tough.
(19:09):
I mean, I'm looking from, from a, from a different perspective
than, you know, when I was 1617 starting to play pros or right
after college, you know, like now I have more experience, more
more mature. I would think it's crazy how
difficult they make it to actually make it almost
(19:34):
impossible, honestly. And I'm not saying that unless
you're like so talented, right? Like what?
What's her name with Manova or Jovic or whatever, The Canadian
Makobo, because I played some tournaments that they played
too. You can see the level of tennis,
like, you know, it is a little different, but also they have
(19:58):
the support. They have wild cards that this
and that just for a regular. Person that's coming out of
college or or you know, they're trying to make it pro.
It's honestly almost impossible.Why I'm saying this is the level
of tennis is insane. Like there is no easy matches.
(20:21):
All of these girls qualities of a 35 first round of a 35 or
finals. Like it's literally like you
look around, everybody is playing the level of tennis.
I mean, before when I played, I don't know, like 15 years ago,
there was a little bit more likeespecially in women's tennis,
(20:43):
like little holes here and therethat you can, you know, like if
I I know if I like make the ball, whatever, I got it.
Now there's no like that. Everybody's hitting, everybody's
physically strong. You come to a 35.
The girls are warming up, doing their mobility, stretching,
taking care of this, taking careof that.
Everybody's so professional. You come, they're like animals.
(21:06):
We all are like we wanted. I mean you see this guy now he's
224 in the world and he just wins the freaking masters.
You know, that just shows you that the level of tennis between
top 100, top 150 and a girl that's 900.
It's not big and it's really it's a fact.
(21:29):
It really is maybe OK, top 10 ortop five or I see you can see,
but there's really not. So with that said, it's so hard
to like what? OK, you have a good week.
Yes, OK, I went at 35, but I have to keep going.
Like I have to keep going like next week.
(21:50):
I need to show up. I need to win more and more.
I have to keep my body healthy. I have to travel and then
financially, OK, like we can talk about this so much.
It's so sad. It's so sad.
We get nothing, like literally nothing.
If you had to take the coach with you or somebody with you,
(22:11):
almost impossible. It's just like, OK, why am I
playing the tournaments here in the US?
Because I'm so grateful. There's so many good people that
take you into their homes, cook for you, take care of you.
So you save so much there, right?
But unless you're winning every week, and even if you're winning
(22:34):
every week, you're not, you're discovering expenses, you're not
making any money, right? So I don't know.
I, I don't know. I don't know.
It's like I, how I do it. I'm taking it one month at a
time. I know I'm good for like next
2-3 months, but then after 2-3 months, I don't know if I can
(22:58):
keep going. How do I do it?
Social media has some brand deals monthly that I get money.
I make on on the reels on some deals.
I teach lessons when I'm when I'm home.
I still have two coaches that dowork for me when I'm gone.
So I make a little bit money there.
I get an investor that gives me a little bit I, I don't know,
(23:22):
like I, I don't know if somebodyasked me how I'm doing.
I don't, I'm figuring it out. I don't have rich parents or
something that can support me orthis or that.
I am grinding and working so hard for this.
And yeah, I literally, I'm just a little bit from everywhere.
(23:44):
Plus, OK, it's not just tennis Ineed to provide for my kids.
I get no child support, no nothing.
We split everything 5050 with the kids, you know, pay for
their jiu jitsu, pay for their soccer, pay for their ice
hockey, pay for their school, pay for their clothes, the food.
I I have those expenses 1st and par and rent and you know, and
(24:08):
then my tennis so. Just to just to put this into
perspective again, if you are not ready to play professional
tennis physically or mentally, don't rush into it.
It is such a brutal sport. It's lonely, it's expensive
unless you are truly at the top of the game.
(24:29):
And what I mean by the top of the game is grand slams,
unfortunately, you're not. You're not making that much
money. You're just, you're just not.
It's, it's the reality and it's,it's something that doesn't
correlate to how brutal and tough the sport actually is.
Just to put this into perspective, Emma is 500 in the
world, a very, very, very good tennis player.
(24:51):
She's made 10,000, just under 10K playing these events.
She brought up at the start of the call here that she did start
the year playing 4 PTT events. She made closer to $15,000
playing those events and just four of them, right?
What I'm saying is find a way toactually sprinkle in the events
into your scheduling. Not only are you actually going
(25:12):
to make money, but you actually might establish some confidence
and actually improve. And again, I'm not just saying
that because I work for UTR. It's the truth.
It's something I believe in. I've always believed in.
I've kept up with your career, Emma.
So that's just how I feel. And I'm pretty, I'm pretty
passionate about that because I've seen a lot of players drop
out because simply they hate tennis or they run out of money.
(25:36):
It's so true and it's so sad to see like really talented
players, really good players. I mean, you have you have these
top players complaining about mental issues or struggle and
they have everything, you know, like they have, they don't have
to worry financially if they're going to make it or not this
(25:59):
week. Or, you know, they have the
physio with them, they have the coach with them, they have the
support, they have the nice hotel, they have the nice food,
you know, like, and they're still struggling mentally
because on its own, tennis is such a tough.
Why? Why is tennis so tough mentally?
(26:21):
Great question. It wasn't part of the script, I
just thought about why. Because I think it's more OK, I
think it's more the lifestyle meaning like the weekend, week
out really have to keep showing up that there's like no break.
(26:42):
You feel like you have no time off, right?
Like it just weighs in. And then you're like, you're
like you're improving, you're doing so good, You're putting in
the work. And then you come there.
You can't control how the other players going to play.
Maybe they have an amazing day, but you put in the work, you've
(27:02):
done everything right. And then you're like, what?
And then you have to stay positive and be like, OK, I got
this. You know, I can do it.
I keep working my week. Then the next week comes, you
come. But then like, maybe as a girl,
you're on your period, you know,you're not feeling the best.
You don't perform the best or something hurts her a little
(27:25):
bit, but then you can't perform your best.
But last week you did feel good,but that girl played well.
So you have to like, OK, stay positive.
OK, I'm going to show up next week.
Let me put in the word. You know, it's like there's so
many. Then like being in the match,
being present, staying, you know, taking one point at a
time. I mean, there's so much I can
(27:47):
talk about the mental side. It's not just like one thing.
Everybody deals with the different things.
The you know, it's it's. Yeah, question, Question for
you. How far away do you think you
actually are from being in thosemoments?
(28:08):
Some days I feel like. I'm OK.
I talked to somebody about this last last week.
Some days I feel like I'm so close, right?
I feel like it's there, right? I can smell it like it's there.
(28:28):
Some days I feel like I'm so farand I can never make it, you
know? And I asked him myself, what are
you actually doing? What are you actually doing?
But guess what? Every player that I talk to,
they feel the same, you know, especially when you see the
(28:49):
players that like do make it andthey breakthrough.
Like that can be me because I was there with her two months
ago. If she can do it, I can do it
too, you know, And that like gives you a little motivation.
But then you lose to somebody. You're not supposed to lose, not
supposed to lose or you play so bad and then you're like, can I
(29:11):
actually? Then you start questioning your
life. You start questioning everything
and it's honestly, I think it's just who is more persistent and
who can mentally stay tough and just show up.
(29:31):
You got to show up. You got to show up.
You have to turn off those voices in your head, the doubts,
the fear and and you just got tokeep going.
And if it doesn't work out, at least you know you gave it all.
But but God, it's. So what you're saying is you're
(29:55):
really, you know, there are times you're, you're not that
far away. The best players in the game on
the women's side, what do they do well?
Is it power? Is it movement?
Is it consistency? What is it?
Every all of the above. First of all, there's nobody now
(30:17):
that is physically not an animal, right And woman's tennis
that that's that's not even a question.
That's something that I still amworking on and is a 33 year old.
My recovery is like not the best.
So it's like finding the balanceof like how much I'm pushing
myself and also how much I'm like recovering and taking time
off. So getting there so physically
(30:40):
and everybody's hitting the balllike there's no like you can't
really push and get your maybe there's one or two girls there
in like top 100 that maybe play a little slower.
You have to hit the ball and youhave to be consistent.
And I think now it's also like having a good serve and women's
(31:04):
tennis is is huge. Like every girl that you see
that has a huge serve, but does he know like play that that
amazing? Like she's she can get there, I
think faster. That's just from what I've seen.
Got it got it what's it like? Few more questions here.
(31:26):
You have played some tournaments, UTR tournaments,
and I saw pictures of you and videos of you playing in front
of your kids and then watching you and then being in the
picture with the trophy and the check.
What's surely that has to motivate you to to want to just
(31:47):
keep pushing? It really does.
It really does get emotional now, but you know, they don't
get it now, like I said, but as they get older, they will
understand too and on as stuff as it is like being away from
(32:09):
them, you know, and struggling with that.
It's also so they give me so much motivation and so much
energy on the tough days, like especially during matches,
because I have, you know, some friends that come with me or
(32:31):
like, you know, or a coach or somebody, if I know or
somebody's helping me, they tellme, let's go, mommy, you know,
like during the match. And that just gives me first of
all, it gives me a smile on my like I smile and I'm happy and I
know there's like so much more to life than this tennis match,
you know, So I relax more and I don't know, I just play better.
(32:54):
But, you know, I want to really show them that, you know, their
mom went for it, you know, as cheesy as it sounds, you know,
she. Did.
You know, that one day when they're struggling with
something or they're, you know, like, I don't know if I should
do this or that they, they're like, OK, my mom was so strong.
(33:19):
She prevailed this, she went through so much and she, she
still did it because, you know, I chose the harder route and not
the easier route in life. And and it's really so worth it.
And I know that my reward is going to be very high.
(33:39):
Doesn't have to be playing a Grand Slam or accomplishing my
kind of dreams. You know, I'm not that that is
my dream and I really want it. But like I want if I'm there at
the Grand Slam and I accomplished my dream, I want to
feel the same then as I would feel if I didn't make it, if
(34:00):
that makes sense, because I do want it's so much more in this
story than just results right there in ideal world.
Great. But like it's honestly the
process, putting myself out there, doing the thing that
scares me. You know, I'm growing so much as
a person, their lives that I am impacting the time, you know,
(34:25):
like the, the people that I meet, the, I mean, it's so worth
it. It's so fulfilling that that for
me means so much more than actually winning a tennis match.
And one thing, and you asked about my kids, you know, like,
so there's, there have been so many matches this year that I
(34:46):
played like 4 hours or 4 1/2 hours that I'm grinding winning
75 and the 3rd 76 and the third against these like 20 year olds,
19 year olds, 21 year olds. And I'm like 33 grinding there.
And now everybody kind of like knows me as the player that like
grinds it and fights and I'm thefighter, right.
And they're like, how do you do it?
Like how do you have the energy and how you know what I always
(35:09):
tell myself I'm not walking off the squirt without any regrets.
I want to know that I put it allout there and whatever happens,
happens. I'm going to fight for every
ball. I'm going to fight for every
point. No matter if I feel great or if
I don't feel great or I feel my shots or I don't feel my shots.
I want to walk on that court without any regrets.
(35:32):
Like in life, honestly, you wantto know, you put it everything
out there and I am good, right? I'm not going to, you know, feel
sorry for myself. No, this happened or the wind or
this pastor, it wasn't my day. There's so many excuses,
especially as tennis players would find so many excuses why
(35:53):
we lost. No, I want to take
accountability. I want to take responsibility
for everything that I do, control what I can control and
and whatever happens, happens. I, I think what, what you're
explaining too is if you don't have kids and you are pursuing
professional tennis, my advice to you based on listening to
(36:15):
Emma now is things outside of the court.
Do things outside of the court that you are passionate about.
Read, write a book, start your own business, whatever it is, do
something outside so that when you are in those four hour
battles, you, you understand there's, there's other things
out there. And it's not just about this
one, this one tennis match. I want to shift gears just a
(36:38):
little bit. Sorry for taking up so much of
your time. And it's regarding professional
college tennis and professional tennis on the women's side,
right? What is on the men's side?
This is what, unless you are a top five junior, right?
And you are 500 in the world at the age of 17.
(36:59):
You're not a professional tennisplayer yet.
And I say that because you're not consistently putting money
away, right? You're not there yet.
Men's side, it takes time. Like I think it's 2829 now is
where players are really starting to reach their peak.
What's what's the do you know, like what do you think about on
the women's side, a really good junior, should they go to
(37:21):
college? Should they go to college?
And if they are top five in the country, should they GoPro at
the age of 20? What what's what's the
difference there on the women's?Side for me, it's a no brainer
that I'm going to college or not, especially now.
Like, I mean, I mean, look, I'm 33 and I'm trying to make a pro
(37:49):
call a crazy or whatever, but I mean, I'm doing it.
I'm not trying anymore. I'm in it.
So like I cannot say anymore. I'm trying.
I'm actually doing it and I'm there A lot of you know, players
think, oh, I'm going to be old. There's going to be late 2425,
you know, like 23. You're like literally in your
(38:10):
best years and college really develops you so much as a
person. Like you also figure out that
there is so much to life than just tennis.
The problem with tennis players,I think that just do tennis and
they don't, you know, they don'texplore other stuff.
And like with college or school or I don't know, some purpose,
(38:34):
you need to have some purpose inlife outside of tennis, because
if you're just into tennis, tennis, tennis, mentally you
will. It's, I don't know, it's, it's
not going to be healthy. This is just my opinion.
What I'm saying. I'm not saying this is right
around just from my experience, but I've seen as a coach, as a
player, as a mom, but definitelycollege.
(38:55):
I mean, picking the right college, that's for you.
That's number one. Like, you know, that, you know,
you're in the right environment with right teammates, with the
right coaches, because it is a huge adjustment that you have
people that are supporting you that but there's so much
opportunity and you can play still pro and they pay for you.
(39:17):
And you're like, I wish I could go back to college days, like,
you know, like where my coaches were taking, taking care of
everything, you know, and I justgo and I play when I see these
girls now coming with colleges, I like that was so nice.
I wish I used that more to my advantage.
You know, I took it for granted back in the day.
(39:37):
And I wish I realized that back then.
How it how important it was and the friendships that you make
for a lifetime. You know, the education that you
get, you know, it's really, really, really I, I think the
girls are, it's different than the guys because they are, they
(39:58):
think maybe they can like they're wasting time, you know,
in college. They're it's not they, you know,
they think they're too good to go to college or, you know, for
me that that's the wrong mindset.
So. I will say that I think you're
(40:19):
right. The the level of tennis is only
improving if if college coaches are out there and you and you
truly know that you have a player that's special and you
know, right, they are really good at this or they're really
good at that or they're incredibly competitive and
they're one of the best players in the country.
You have to find a way to schedule professional tennis
(40:40):
events amongst their school. You know, instead of playing
maybe certain dual, you take them to a professional tennis
tour. Instead of playing certain fall
events, you take them to a professional, allow them to
actually build their pro career whilst they're in college.
And I don't think that happens enough.
Actually. I made mistakes in scheduling
with some of my players and I wish I could take that back and
(41:03):
allow them to get to 400 so thatwhen they graduate they're
ready. Yes, I agree with that.
I agree with that. So anyway, last thing long term
if if you do decide one day to stop playing tennis, have you
thought about the next step and what that might look like?
(41:26):
And if you don't want to answer it, that is totally fine I.
Work for you, TR. It's my dream job to be
surrounded with such amazing people.
OK, actually, I'm joking with that part.
The working, I don't know. But honestly, like everyone that
(41:50):
I've met from UTR, like awesome people, awesome, awesome people.
And I really mean it. And I'm grateful that I've met,
you know, from referees, from everyone, everyone, the
organization. I just, it's a healthy
environment. So maybe I would, maybe I'll be
(42:12):
a part of it one day. You don't know.
I love it but. No, for me, the beauty and is
that I really don't know, you know, like, and I'm so OK with
that because I don't know where my life is going to take me.
If I really make it right, I'm playing against that.
(42:35):
My story is going to go Boo, youknow, and I'll have the money.
I'll have options to do what I really want to do.
I have I have some things in my ideal world that I would love to
do. I'm not going to share it now,
but ultimately when I'm really done with tennis, I want to be
(42:58):
flexible enough with my job and what I'm doing where I can still
impact others and continue with my story while being present
with my kids. I love it.
Like I want to be there for my kids.
I want to be at every soccer game, at every ice hockey game.
(43:21):
I want to be present while I'm building on my story and
building, just building and whatever that, whatever that is,
we will see. I'm just right now.
I'm here now and I need to focuson my match here tomorrow in
Bakersfield, CA. Well, just to recap, I'm going
(43:42):
to try and do this briefly, but it's the first thing that I want
people to hear is if you have the itch and you have this thing
in the back of your head, just like Emma's mentor said to her,
go for it. Cross your gut.
I've had changes in my career. I, I, I went with my gut and I
absolutely love what I'm doing. And it's the same situation with
(44:07):
Emma. She had a gut.
She saw players that were doing this and doing that, and she
wanted to give it a go. And as a professional tennis
player or a tennis player out there, you're always going to
want more like you, You always. I was talking to a player of the
day. He's 250 in the world.
He's asking me, do I think that he's doing a great job?
I said, you've been playing professional tennis for one year
(44:28):
and you're already 250 in the world.
To me, that sounds pretty good. But for a professional tennis
player, you always, always, always want more.
But my message to you, Emma, again, these are real
conversations. I truly hope people are
listening and and enjoy the the realness of it.
But keep pushing. Do not stop.
(44:49):
I would say my advice to you is if you fall out of love with the
sport, that may be the day. But you know deep down, you're a
competitor. You love to compete, you love to
win and you're doing many thingsoutside of the tennis court too.
So keep going. If you're not following Emma's
story, you definitely should. Her Instagram channel is called
(45:12):
Tennis with Sorry, actually I don't know what it's called.
I I was close, but I'll let her tell you and follow her results
and follow her story. Yeah, thank you so much for
having me on. Honestly, this was a great
conversation. I felt like that I can really
share and be so open about it and really, really it's so worth
(45:34):
it to go for that thing that scares you.
It brings so much peace and not for the fame, not for the money,
not for anything. But you have to trust your gut.
You have to trust what really you want to do and just go for
it because it's really, really, really worth it.
(45:55):
Emma, thank you for your time. Best of luck and we will be
following over here at UTR. Thanks guys.
Thanks. Thanks for having me.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies!
The Breakfast Club
The World's Most Dangerous Morning Show, The Breakfast Club, With DJ Envy, Jess Hilarious, And Charlamagne Tha God!