July 15, 2025 • 57 mins
New Tax Law Just Changed Everything for Real Estate Investors
The “Big Beautiful Bill” just rewrote the tax code—and if you're a real estate investor, you need to know what changed. In this episode, tax strategist Kaden Hackney breaks down the biggest updates, including 100% permanent bonus depreciation, massive cost segregation advantages, and Opportunity Zone extensions that can help you build wealth tax-free over the next decade.
Here’s what’s inside:
• How to immediately write off ~20% of a property’s value
• Why keeping a rental could now beat a $30K wholesale flip
• How to stack bonus depreciation + Opportunity Zones to defer AND eliminate taxes
• What the 20% QBI deduction and lower tax brackets mean for your business
• And how to avoid depreciation recapture completely in 10 years
If you’re wholesaling, flipping, or buying rentals—you need to understand these updates. The investors who act on this info now are going to be way ahead when tax season hits.
💡 Bonus: Join our buyers list at WisconsinDiscountProperties.com and get our FREE BRRRR for Beginners course delivered instantly.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
What's going on?
Wisconsin investor audience.
Welcome back to another episode.
I've got an amazing guest foryou guys today, a very timely
guest for you guys.
Today we are gonna be gettinginto the big, beautiful bill and
so, regardless of yourpolitical affiliation, we're
gonna have a lot of greatinformation for you as a real
(00:22):
estate investor out there today,and I'm gonna introduce our
guest here in a second.
Before I do, as I do on everyepisode, I'm going to talk about
our sponsor, wisconsin DiscountProperties.
As you guys may or may not knowif this is your first time
listening we drop off-marketdeals in your inbox every single
week at 6 am if you're CentralTime and these are all heavily
discounted properties.
We've got our website.
(00:43):
We're working on improving andmaking some changes.
We're about to launch some casestudies on there to show you
guys actually some of the dealsthat if you were on our buyers
list, that you missed out on,and you're missing out on some
big numbers here, guys.
So we're going to break thatdown.
These are actually case studies.
We've gotten the numbersdirectly from the buyers who
bought these properties.
We're going to show you those.
Another thing we're doing aswell for our people who are
(01:05):
joining our buyers list.
If you join the buyers list,you can do that by going to the
websitewisconsindiscountpropertiescom,
plugging your information inthere.
We are giving away my BRRRR forbeginners course.
So at one point we charged$3,000 for this course.
That was when I was doing somemore one-on-one coaching along
with it.
We recently have been charging$2,000 for just the course and
we're going to give it away forfree now.
(01:26):
So go to the website, fill itout.
Connor Reese from my team willgive you a call after you join
the buyers list and they'll tellyou how to get that course and
you can start taking action onbuilding real wealth today.
With that, let's get intotoday's episode.
I have Mr Caden Hackney with mefrom Beck.
Cfo Caden just became a taxpartner, I believe.
Is that correct, caden?
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Yeah.
Yeah, that's exactly right.
We're real excited about it.
Got a lot of energy for it.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
Beautiful.
Can you tell people what doesthat mean when you become a
partner Because I didn't knowthis with like law firms and
accounting firms, Like I didn'tunderstand what it means.
But teleaudits, what does thatmean?
That's a big deal.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yeah, yeah.
So that means that, for lack ofbetter terms, I was able to
negotiate a buy-in, be able tobecome an owner in the
organization.
So, with my partner, marcusKrigler, we have decided to join
CARTs together for the nextforeseeable future.
(02:22):
That's awesome, man.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
And we had Marcus on maybe 10, 15 episodes ago.
We were just talking generalreal estate tax strategy things.
And then, right before 4th ofJuly July 3rd I believe is when
the big beautiful bill gotsigned into law and there's some
pretty big implications good,bad or ugly into that bill for
real estate investors.
And so Mr Caden here decided orreached out, asked if we'd want
(02:46):
to have Beck back on and breakdown this big beautiful bill.
And of course I jumped at thisopportunity because it's so
timely, so relevant and I thinkit's so important for our
audience out there, obviously inreal estate investing, to know
all about this bill.
So, caden, start out.
Man, wherever you want to takethis, I know you've been doing
calls left and right for our CGaudience and for your clients on
(03:09):
the big beautiful bill.
So we're kind of getting maybea refined version here, which is
great, but tell us a little bitabout what are some of the
highlights of this thing thatreal estate investors really
need to be aware of and takeadvantage of going forward.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Yeah, that's a really great question and I think you
know, before I jump and diveinto this a little bit, I want
to, you know, give you guys somecontext on how this bill has
kind of worked itself throughand even some upcoming changes
that I'm expecting to happenover the next few weeks.
Okay, so the bill gotintroduced back in March to the
(03:45):
House of Representatives.
They chewed on this and passedit in May.
It went to the Senate, had somechanges and revisions, went
back to the House and thenfinally that House version got
finalized, went to the president, got signed.
Well, to all of us who don'twork in Congress it seemed like
(04:05):
that was a long enough time tohave gotten it right, but they
felt like they were rushed.
So, even the signed bill,there's a lot of issues and
things being identified thatpeople actually want revisions
and corrections to be made.
So there's going to be acorrective bill actually getting
passed here in the next monthor two that's going to change
(04:26):
some of this stuff oh, wow,that's interesting.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
I know one thing I saw.
I was reading an article todayactually about this.
It was about the gamblers, thepeople who are professional
gamblers.
They're they're fighting to getget some things changed.
There was something where youcan explain this piece, probably
, if you can bear with me like Ican.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
But it sounded like a bad deal for gamblers.
Yeah, gamblers they were.
Basically, if they went andmade a million dollars, but they
spent a million to make amillion, they were going to get
taxed on 10% of what they maderegardless.
So they were only going to beable to take 90% of their losses
against their income.
(05:02):
So they're paying basically aphantom tax at that point on
money they didn't actually makeand that's something that's
definitely being lobbied to getupdated and changed.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Yeah, it doesn't really make sense.
Like, who put that in in thefirst place?
That seems kind of like what?
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Yeah, I don't know.
Frankly, didn't focus too muchon it.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Not really relevant too much for us real estate
investors, but interestingnonetheless.
Uh, that they're.
They're like you said, they'remaking some revisions, but
anything that you can see thatyou want to touch on with the
revisions that are kind ofjuggling right now, that is up
in the air, that that may affectreal estate investors.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Yeah.
So right now, you know, marcusand I we've kind of had this
conversation on some of theprior calls that we've been on.
This is the fifth one so far.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
We've kind of said, like everybody's out there
saying that these laws arepermanent, and we said, yes, the
law as it's written today saysthat, hey, this is not going
away until someone comes andchanges the law.
And we're about to see,potentially, that Right now,
bonus depreciation this has beena big, big thing that the real
(06:11):
estate community has beenlooking forward to and
anticipating.
It is back at 100%, so the rateis 100%.
There's no stair step whereit's sunsetting and going away
anymore and there's also noexpiry date.
So at least, as the law readstoday, 100% is here to stay.
I don't know if anybody'strying to touch that, but that
(06:39):
could be something where, hey,they're like, well, let's keep
100%, but maybe we want to put,because the first bill that got
introduced by the House actuallyhad 100% expiring, I believe,
in 2033.
So that was a timeline and theSenate removed that timeline.
So I don't know if we seesomething shift there where our
(07:00):
window of opportunity getsdefined a little bit more clear.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Okay, Can you just explain?
You know I've had had you hadMarcus on, I've had another
accountant on here talking aboutbonus depreciation and what
that is.
But can you just explain topeople who maybe this is their
first experience hearing thisthey didn't listen to those
episodes, they don't know whatbonuses.
Can you explain why that's,that's a big deal, why real
estate investors have beenwaiting to hear about this for a
while?
Speaker 2 (07:23):
Yeah, yeah, so big thing in real estate.
We're all trying to buildwealth.
Wealth is built through assetsand when we go and buy a rental
property or something like that,we may invest $300,000 into
that property and what happensis depreciation is how we are
able to take a tax benefit overtime.
(07:44):
So a single family hometypically gets depreciated over
27 and a half years.
Well, what makes bonus such abig deal is real estate
professionals.
They can say, hey, we want totake that $300,000 and we're
going to use what's called acost segregation study.
It kind of buckets it up andtwo of the three buckets are
(08:06):
qualified for bonus depreciation.
Bonus depreciation at 100% saysthat those buckets get written
off immediately in year one andthat usually produces massive
tax savings.
That helps strengthen thereturn on investment.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
What's the bucket that doesn't get touched?
So you mentioned there's threebuckets.
What are the three buckets,kate, and then what's the one
that doesn't get touched?
Speaker 2 (08:30):
Yeah, great question.
So when you buy a piece ofproperty, I'll just break it
down real easy using a dollar.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
We buy a dollar rental property, typically we're
going to split it into a storeof value for land and then a
building.
Okay, the store of value forland.
The golden rule says that'sgoing to be a 20% store of value
and then we get 80% taken intothe building.
Okay, the cost segregationstudy is going to split that 80
cents into three buckets.
(08:59):
One is going to stay thebuilding, the second will be
land improvements and then thethird will be fixtures,
furniture and equipment.
Land improvements is a fancyway of saying landscaping,
sidewalks, your driveway, thosekind of things.
Um, fencing, stuff like that.
Fixtures and furniture um,that's going to be stuff like
(09:19):
flooring in the house, lightfixtures in the house, hvac
could be, you know, appliancesin the kitchen and the bathrooms
, it's those kinds of things.
So your land improvements inthe fixtures and furniture and
equipment, those qualify forbonus and those get that
immediate write-off with 100%.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Okay, got it.
I always wondered that what theone was that didn't stay.
Now, the important part aboutthat for people to know is like
so when you're saying thisdollar, can correct me if I'm
wrong here if I had to writethat off, basically the 80% or
what percentage is it usuallythat you're writing off of the,
not the land, but everythingelse?
What kind of percentage?
Speaker 2 (10:00):
Yeah, so kind of break it down.
You take 80% and then usuallyon average, after seeing
thousands of cost segregationstudies, you're typically going
to see about 25% of the buildingvalue get put into those
depreciable classes that qualifyfor bonus.
So a good rule of thumb is$0.20 per dollar you invest is
(10:22):
what you could expect to have asa bonus write-off with 100%
bonus.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
Okay, so in normal years you'd have to take that 20
cents and then divide that by27 and a half, right?
And then every year that's yourwrite-off, correct?
Speaker 2 (10:39):
Not quite.
So the 27 and a half.
You take the 80 cents, dividethat by 27 and a half.
Okay, that's typical With thecost seg.
You end up saying, okay, 80%,we take 25% down into those
bonus eligibles, we write thoseoff.
The remaining 55, I thinkthat's right 55 cents.
(11:03):
That gets split over 27 and ahalf.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
Okay, so the other buckets that you're talking
about, are those a faster?
Normally a faster?
Is it a five and a 15-yeardepreciation?
Speaker 2 (11:13):
schedule.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
Okay.
So that is kind of where I wasgoing with this for the audience
.
So the 25% that Caden's talkingabout, or whatever that smaller
number is, normally you'd haveto take those in either
five-year depreciation schedulesor 15-year depreciation
schedules, so it's a smaller taxwrite-off basically every
single year.
What Caden's talking about isyou can accelerate that into one
year and now you're getting abig lump sum write-off.
(11:36):
And what's important about this, caden mentioned real estate
professional.
Caden, can you talk about whatis a real estate professional in
the eyes of the IRS?
Speaker 2 (11:44):
Yeah, so the IRS defines the real estate
professional in section 469.
This isn't like a license, it'snot like oh, I'm a realtor, I
qualify.
It has nothing to do with that.
It has everything to do withwhat you do and how you spend
your time and what you own.
Okay, so you have to get atleast 750 hours in a qualified
(12:06):
real estate trader business.
Um, you know, real estatetrader business.
You can think of propertymanagement, land development.
Um, you know, like a realestate brokerage, uh, you can be
realtor.
You know all of those types ofactivities are qualified real
estate activities.
You have to have 750 hours.
Um, you know the?
The next kind of thing thatreally matters, there is going
(12:29):
to be what's called materialparticipation.
This is where ownership comesinto play.
You actually have to own atleast 5% of the asset that you
are doing the real estatebusiness.
And so if you own 5% of apartnership.
Your hours can qualify towardsthat.
Material participation.
Um, so material participation,there's seven different tests.
(12:51):
Won't get too deep into it.
Your accountant can probablyhelp you figure that out.
Um, but it's just checking someboxes, to be honest.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
Okay, and so what you're basically saying is, if
you're just a real estate agentout there, you don't own any
assets, you're not going to beable to, obviously you're not
going to have a property towrite off anything with in the
first place, but you would notbe considered necessarily for
this purpose tax purposes a realestate professional.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Yeah, it really depends on how you get paid.
So a lot of realtors that I seethey're contractors for a
brokerage, so they'retechnically business owners, and
those hours that they spend inthat business would help towards
the bucket.
If they don't have assets,though, it doesn't really do
much for them.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
Yeah, it's kind of like a chicken or an egg thing.
You got to have one or theother there to get the tech
trade off right.
So that's important, guys.
One of the things that I thinkis interesting Katie and getting
correct me if I'm wrong on allthis stuff but one of the
examples.
Somebody explained to me this afew years ago when bonus was a
hundred percent, when I, when Iwas getting going, as I said,
like imagine you're a doctor andyou're making 500,000 a year,
something like that.
You're heavily taxed, right,you're highly taxed individual
(13:59):
at that on on your W-2.
Let's say your spouse is owning.
You guys own some propertiesand your spouse is managing said
properties and they're hittingthese litmus tests and now
they're able to become this realestate professional.
Theoretically, let's say, youhad enough depreciation to wipe
out the $500,000.
That doctor could essentiallypay $0 in federal income tax.
(14:19):
Is that correct?
Am I explaining that correctly?
Speaker 2 (14:23):
Yeah yeah, there's definitely some limitations on
how much you can do, and weactually I have a good example
of when that doesn't quite workout as how you would expect A
client of ours who has almostthat exact situation one of the
spouses is a doctor, makesreally, really high wages
(14:43):
through their job and the otherspouse is a real estate
professional.
Well, part of the old Trump 1.0tax bill, it introduced this
thing called excess businessloss.
That put a cap on how muchbusiness losses could actually
offset non-business income, likeyour wages, your interest, your
(15:05):
dividends, capital gains, lifeincome.
So we've got you know, for amarried couple you can only
offset up to $626,000.
So you've got someone who getslike a $700,000, $800,000,
$900,000 W-2.
You're going to get hit with alittle bit of an issue there if
you're trying to usedepreciation alone to offset
(15:25):
your income.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
Okay, interesting.
I never knew that.
See, that's why we do thispodcast, man.
I learn something new everytime.
It's great.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
There you go.
So the big beautiful bill hasnow extended that excess
business loss limitation andmade it permanent as well.
Okay so it's not going away,it's here to stay, got it.
Where one of our clients iskind of in big trouble with this
is they use business losses andthen, you know, the way that
they kind of still were able toget out of paying taxes was
(15:55):
using itemized deductions.
They do large charitabledonations so they'd go and use
you know they did a conservationeasement, they've done a
leveraged asset donation.
You know these type of things.
It's basically'd go and use youknow they did a conservation
easement, they've done aleveraged asset donation.
You know these type of things.
It's basically you go and youknow either give an asset that
has appreciated in value, youget a large deduction from the
IRS, you don't pay capital gainson it, or a conservation
(16:18):
easement saying, hey, I'mwilling to restrict the use of
some of my land and give that tothe government and you know
they'll preserve and and kind oftake care of the land for the
wildlife and the plants and allthat.
That's.
That's what those two thingsare.
Nevertheless, a new limitationon itemized deductions got
(16:38):
written into this tax bill andwe actually did a big case study
about this kind of led withthis almost with with folks Not
everybody's paying less taxesfrom this bill, this particular
individual in 24 paying zero.
That same situation against thenew tax bill.
They're paying $216,000 infederal taxes because the laws
(17:01):
changed.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Wow, that's insane.
Okay, so let's break that downfor a second Caden.
So what were the issues then?
Or what are the issues now withthe beautiful bill on those two
particular examples there ofthe easement and the leveraged
asset donation?
What changed?
Is it just that limitation thatyou were talking about?
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Yeah.
So we went from essentially nolimitation on the itemized
deductions that was coming intoplay versus now for folks that
are in the 37% tax bracketthat's the highest income tax
bracket they have to do thiscrazy calculation where they
take their income and subtractit's about 578,000.
(17:43):
That's where a married couplecrosses into the 37% bracket and
they can take three-sevenths ofa dollar for everything over
that $578,000.
So if we're talking a million,I'll get a little calculator out
here.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
Three-sevenths, again , who comes up with this stuff?
Speaker 2 (18:02):
Yeah, congress, they love to scratch our heads right
oh my goodness.
So if you had a million dollarsof of gross income, you have to
take that and subtract 578 andthen multiply that by three.
Divided by seven, that meansyour max itemized deduction is
only 181 000.
So you have a million dollarsof income.
(18:25):
You can only reduce it by181,000.
You're left with the difference.
Wow, and now you pay a lot moretaxes, and that's that's what
will happen if we don't changesomething.
So we're uh, you know one,hoping for some changes in this
correction bill.
Maybe they didn't mean toreduce the benefit of charity so
much, because it seems kind ofcrazy to place such a big
(18:48):
restriction on how charitablesomeone could be benefits for it
.
But otherwise we're talking tothem about hey, do you have any
way to do a deferred stockoption with the spouse, or is
there maybe another retirement?
We could put more of thesewages, reduce the non-business
income, so we're not so exposed.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Okay, so let me just give an example.
Let's say let's say I make amillion dollars in in
wholesaling right and then I'vegot I buy enough buildings where
I've got a million dollars ofbonus depreciation I can take.
Are you saying I wouldn't beable to take that whole million
dollars of depreciation now, oris that separate from what you
were describing?
Speaker 2 (19:28):
Yeah, great question.
So in that case, your wholesaleI'm assuming that that's your
wholesale business right.
Right, right, yep.
So your wholesale business isbusiness income.
Business losses can offsetbusiness income.
Okay yeah, so there's separateentities.
Speaker 1 (19:45):
So let's say we have a you know holding company llc
versus our s corp llc.
S corp llc is the onegenerating the wholesale income.
The holding company is going tobe just a pass-through entity.
Does that matter?
Speaker 2 (20:03):
Yeah.
So in that case, assuming thatyou have what's called basis,
basis is basically the tax bankaccount that allows losses to
pass through, which, in aholding company, should be no
problem.
You know, I think I could spendan hour talking about basis, so
, for listeners, you might wantto talk to your accountant about
(20:24):
what that is, to be honest.
You might want to talk to youraccountant about what that is to
be honest.
At any rate, the losses fromthe holding company will pass
through, the income from theS-corp will pass down.
Everything will kind of getreconciled dollar for dollar
down at your personal return.
So in that situation you shouldbe fine.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
Okay, all right, I'm like sitting here listening.
I'm like dang, if we good yearwe might screwed paying a bunch
of taxes, no matter how muchdepreciation I take.
Oh my goodness, what are youtalking about?
The downsides of bonusdepreciation, cause I know
there's the government's notgoing to get paid, you know at
some point.
So talk about what are therisks of doing some of these
accelerated depreciationschedules.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
Yeah, so this is a really, really interesting
conversation.
Depreciation, you know I don'tI don't know how other people
define it necessarily, but Icall it.
You know an interest-free loanfrom the IRS.
You know it's it's not reallyaccruing interest.
(21:23):
You will pay it back later, youknow, and you get to choose
when.
So you, you don't have toaccrue interest over time.
You get to know exactly howyou're exiting and you get to
choose when that is right.
That's one of the best forms of,you know, debt that you could
carry for sure Very, veryfavorable.
So when we go and take theseaccelerated write-offs, we're
(21:48):
lowering I'm going to use thatword basis again, so your asset.
Let's say you bought it for$300,000.
Okay, this is something thatwhere I'm going to kind of break
up two different calculationsand try to keep it simple.
Okay, real estate investor saysI bought it for 300,000.
(22:08):
Five years later, I sell it for450.
I made 150, right, that's whatlogic says.
Okay, the IRS is going to sayyou did buy it for 300, but we
gave you a tax saving benefitand you wrote off a hundred
thousand of it.
So, in their eyes, they'regoing to say four, 50 minus 200.
(22:30):
They say you made two, 50.
Okay, so the two equations looka little bit different.
You're getting taxed on higherlevel of income, the.
The way that we want to look atthis, though, and why this makes
sense, is, let's say that youdid write off a hundred thousand
dollars, and it was in year one, and you're saving at a 40% tax
(22:54):
rate.
You just saved $40,000 today,right, well, that that $40,000
goes back into your business orback into your pocket.
You get to hopefully use thatmoney to drive more wealth
growth.
So you know that 40,000 overfive years hopefully turns into,
you know, 60, 70, $80,000 ofvalue to you.
(23:15):
And now it's made borrowingthose benefits from the
government way more um valuableand beneficial to you so that
when you pay the tax back laterit still made sense and
beneficial to you.
So that when you pay the taxback later, it still made sense,
right, right.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
Yeah, I've always been told, and correct me if
you're wrong on this, but adollar today is better than a
dollar tomorrow.
That's exactly right.
Our dollar continues to losevalue every single day, and so
if we can use that dollar todayto create more than inflation,
then why wouldn't we use thattoday to beat out inflation and
get ahead of it, right?
Create some wealth, right.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
Exactly and an interesting case study that
Marcus and I went and looked atthere's actually some potential
where today, in a wholesalebusiness, if you're in the
highest tax bracket, incomebracket it's going to be really,
really interesting to look atthe numbers.
(24:12):
If you go and let's say youmake $30,000 in wholesale deal
and you're in a 40% tax bracket,you're going to pay like
$12,000 of taxes.
So your after-tax profit isonly $18,000, right?
Well, if you take that propertyand look at it and say what if,
(24:34):
what, if we actually just keptit and we're going to, instead
of wholesale it, we're going toget it, we're going to put some
dough into it, we're going tokeep it as a rental.
All right, let's say that, thatthat rental, you're all in
$250,000.
Let's say that your ARV is, youknow, after repair values
(24:54):
$333,000.
So you've got some equity inthere of 83.
Let's say that you were able toget loan to value at 75%.
That means you know that's asuccessful BRRRR.
Is what I'm giving you thenumbers for.
Sure, right, yep, so you don'treally leave anything in the
deal.
You've got this equity, the taxsavings on that $250,000 asset,
(25:17):
with a cost segregation study,what do you think that that
comes in at.
We just said your after-taxdeal is going to be $18,000.
Surely you make less right.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Well, dude, it's going to be insane, because now,
if you can accelerate thatdepreciation I'm just going to
do some basic math here realquick.
I don't know You're probablygoing to save $40,000 in taxes,
right?
Speaker 2 (25:41):
Yeah, maybe not that high, but the point is $20,000.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
That's about the number you're going to get.
So you go from an eight that'sa $38,000 swing.
That's what you're telling me,Just in taxes.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
Yeah, basically Exactly, you go from having to
pay 18 to getting 20.
Speaker 1 (25:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
Now, if you kind of look and try to compare more
apples to apples, though, youget 18,000 of liquid cash if you
sell and do the wholesale, orif you execute it as a rental,
you actually get more money backin your pocket, and now you
have the store of value as anasset, right?
So you're building wealth.
Oh that's good buddy.
That's good.
Speaker 1 (26:18):
We need to get somebody to go put this in
actual numbers and break it downon a little screen, because
that was really good right thereI'm tracking.
I just hope the audience pickedup on that.
But that makes a lot of senseversus.
You know, I think that's one ofthe things that we've always
done.
We wholesale but then we holdassets as well.
So we're wholesaling, holding,wholesaling holding and the
holding is to offset the taximplications.
(26:39):
Right, the cash is to live offof and to, you know, pay the
bills today and do all that kindof stuff.
But the goal is to buy enoughassets that I can write off a
good chunk, if not all, of thatfederal tax.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
Yeah, exactly, and, corey, for you I'm happy to go
and record a piece of contentthat you can share, to follow up
with that and show thosenumbers broken down to see the
apples to apples.
I've got that ready to go foryou.
Speaker 1 (27:06):
Let's go, buddy.
We will put that all over thesocials and we'll throw it up on
our website as well.
That'd be awesome.
We'd love to see that.
Yeah, for sure.
Perfect.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
Now the big key for people listening to that this
only works if you're in a hightax bracket.
If you're in the lower taxbrackets, the numbers, the math
doesn't math for you.
Okay, and my recommendation atthat point is go make more money
, Don't worry about the taxes,go make more money.
Speaker 1 (27:31):
Get yourself in that higher tax bracket.
Then start worrying a littlebit more about how the numbers
are going to pencil out this way.
Yep exactly Got it.
That's good stuff.
Going back to the big beautifulbill here, Caden, what are some
other things?
Are there other things in thereas it sits today, that real
estate investors are going to bekeen on or that you guys are
(27:53):
talking to your clients about?
Speaker 2 (27:55):
Yeah, yeah, so a few, I would say.
This is probably more basic.
It probably gets skipped over alot.
The tax bill is extending andmaking permanent our lower tax
rates.
So if you look back at 2017,before trump passed his first
bill, the highest tax bracketwas actually 39.6 percent.
(28:15):
We're now at 37 and that's, youknow, not set to increase.
So just by default we we've gotlower brackets.
The width of the brackets arebigger, so you end up scaling to
those higher tax brackets muchmore slowly and you pay less
(28:37):
taxes as a default.
And that's for everybody, richor poor, no matter what.
Everybody's getting a tax breakthat way.
Okay, got the standard deduction.
I think something like 70% or80% of taxpayers.
Okay, got this standarddeduction.
I think something like 70 or 80percent of taxpayers are using
the standard deduction.
That's a a gimme from thegovernment saying hey, for you
single folks out there, fifteenthousand seven hundred and fifty
(28:59):
is not getting taxed formarried couples.
That's thirty one thousand fivehundred.
We're not gonna tax you on thefirst.
You know, fill in the blankamount, okay.
So that's a give me toeverybody.
Before the tax cuts and job,back back in 18, those numbers
were like 6,000 and 12,000.
Speaker 1 (29:16):
So holy cow.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Yeah, Almost tripled.
And now they're.
They're here to stay at thathigher rate and keep growing
with inflation so big?
Deal there.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Oh, so they actually put some.
They put some, some things inthere to keep up with inflation
as well with the reduction, okayyeah, the standard deduction
and the the tax bracket.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
So today the highest tax bracket you cross at 578,
next year could be 600,000 forexample, okay, okay, yeah, well,
that's good.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
I didn't realize that .
Has that always been that waywith tax brackets, or is that?
Is that new as of 2017 or 2025?
Speaker 2 (29:54):
Yeah, it's.
It's kind of always been thatway.
The law is kind of writing,because they're noticing that
the rate of change is faster, sothey're trying to keep up with
you know what year they'rebasing it off of.
So, prior to the Tax Cuts andJob Act, I think it was like
2006 or something that they weresaying all right, we're basing
all of our adjustments based offof the 2006 market and then
(30:18):
they adjusted it up to 2015.
Now it's 2025.
And they're going to moreregularly take a look at that.
For us, Because we've all beenhere Prices have been jumping
really, really high, really fast.
Speaker 1 (30:33):
For sure, for sure, buddy, that is the truth.
Right there, my friend.
What else are you seeing inthere, caden?
Give us some more dirt.
What else is going on in thisbig old, 900-page, beautiful
bill?
Speaker 2 (30:44):
Yeah, so this was a provision that got introduced
and was going to go away afterthis year.
It's called qualified businessincome deduction.
Okay, this is for everybusiness out there that's a
qualified business, which mostbusinesses are qualified
businesses today.
I think you could go and lookup the exceptions is what I
(31:07):
would recommend there.
So, real estate businesses, ifyou're doing like a wholesale
business and you've got amillion dollars of profit, as
long as you kind of check somecompliance boxes, you're going
to get a 20% haircut off the top.
So let's say that you can't goand use all the bonus
depreciation and that's notsomething that's all on the
(31:29):
table for you.
You could get up to a $200,000deduction given to you by the
government through thisqualified business income
deduction.
Wow, and that's yeah, that's afree 20% discount.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Yeah, that's awesome.
And is this new in this bill,or was this something that was
in previously as well, that wassunsetting, or what?
Where did this come in?
Yeah, that's awesome.
And is this new in this bill?
Or was this something that wasin previously as well, that was
sunsetting, or where did thiscome in?
Speaker 2 (31:51):
Yeah, so this got introduced back in 2017.
It was going to go away afterthis year, but again, this one's
made permanent and there'sactually been a little bit of
misinformation on it, becausethere was like differing rates
getting thrown around.
The first bill said 23%.
The Senate changed it back to20%.
It's still 20%.
(32:11):
That's what it's always been a20% discount but it's here to
stay.
Now it's written permanentlyinto the tax code until the law
changes right.
Yeah, until the nextadministration comes in and says
I'm just kidding, we're goingto change that now, yeah, and
(32:32):
honestly, that's my curiosity isa lot of these things that
don't have an expiration date.
I wonder if they come back andsay, ah, we want to put an
expiration date, um, you know,2030, 2033, something like that,
cause, when they're notcharging us taxes, uh, you know
they've, they've got to pullthat money from somewhere.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
Well, that, was the hope of Doge right.
I mean again, regardless ofwhat side of the political aisle
you're on, I think everyAmerican agrees waste and fraud
is probably not good and nobodywants to pay for that right.
And so you look at where can wecut funds and money from
spending so that we aren'tgetting taxed?
I mean, we get taxed on so muchstuff like property taxes,
(33:08):
sales tax I got a wheel tax inour county or in one of the
counties here for the roadsystem and you just get taxed
through the gills and you justkind of get sick of it after a
while and it's like give us abreak a little bit.
Yes, we all need roads, we needsocial safety nets, all that
good stuff.
Everybody in America is onboard with that.
It's just how do we pay forthose things?
(33:31):
And then what are the thingsthat we can get rid of so that
we can all pay less in taxes?
Ultimately, I think the heartbehind what's happening right
now and everybody hasdisagreements, I'm sure, on how
we get there and what'sconsidered waste versus some
people is maybe different toother people, but I think the
heart is there that nobody likespaying taxes.
(33:52):
Our country was founded on thefact that we hate paying taxes.
So I think that that's just inour DNA here in America.
So I think, overall, payingless tax is a great thing, as
long as we can figure out a wayto still have the safety and the
national security and all theother things that we want to be
(34:14):
the best country in the world.
Somebody's got to pay for thatstuff too.
Yeah absolutely.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
Yeah, there's a couple of you know a few more
exciting things, I think, forthe real estate world.
This one's not new.
It was introduced back in 2017.
It was just going to go away.
It's called Opportunity Zones.
I don't know if you heard ofthat, oh yeah, oh yeah.
Okay.
Speaker 1 (34:36):
But you can go into that this might be new for our
audience.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
Okay, cool, so an Opportunity Zone.
The government went and definedqualified areas.
There's actually like a website.
You can go and see the wholemap of the us and it shows
exactly where these areas are sotypically going to be.
You know, lower income areas,places that maybe time has, uh,
(35:03):
eroded some of the luster of theneighborhood.
So the government says, hey, ifyou go and create a qualified
opportunity zone fund, thiscould be something where you go
(35:23):
into a fund, like we think abouta bunch of people together.
This could also be an LLC withthe right paperwork that got set
up the correct way andqualifies as a fund more of a
self-directed opportunity.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Okay, so a few different things going on there.
What the government has kind ofwritten into is this is an
alternative business strategyexit.
Okay, if you've got, let's say,a big portfolio of assets or a
business that you're trying tosell, something that's going to
result in a lot of capital gains, the government says, hey,
(35:57):
let's say that you've got, youknow, $2 million of capital
gains.
If you go on, instead ofkeeping that $2 million, you put
it into a qualified opportunityzone fund and invest that $2
million into an opportunity zone.
We're going to give you alittle bit of benefit for doing
this, a little incentive.
Okay, so you'll take that $2million instead of paying taxes
(36:21):
today, you get to defer it forfive years.
Speaker 1 (36:23):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (36:24):
So you're not going to pay that tax today and in
five years if you've held thatqualified opportunity property,
so the thing that you investedin with the money, if you've
held it for five years, we'regoing to give you a 10% discount
on your taxes.
So you know, $2 million at 20%,that'd be like a $400,000 tax
bill, right?
Speaker 1 (36:44):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
Well, they're going to give you a 10% discount, so
you're, in five years from now,paying 360 instead.
Okay, okay.
Okay so that's, that's benefitnumber one.
Speaker 1 (36:55):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (36:55):
Um, the big play, the big benefit is, if you hold
onto that qualified opportunityproperty for 10 years, they're
going to give you a 100%tax-free exit on that qualified
opportunity property.
So let's give you some forinstance, so $2 million that you
(37:18):
put in your capital.
Let's say that you went andbought a $10 million asset Okay,
let's say that it was realestate assets.
You're going to takedepreciation on it.
You're going to write it off.
Get some huge tax benefits fordoing that today right.
Well, five years into it, you'regoing to pay the taxes on the
deferral and add a discount.
(37:40):
Well, 10 years into it, let'ssay that a $10 million
investment is now a $20 millionasset value.
You bought for 10,.
Let's say that you'vedepreciated half of it, so
you've got, you know, $5 millionof cost left.
Well, on paper, the tax side ofit's going to say all right, 20
million minus five, $15 milliongain.
(38:02):
So you're going to be expectinga $3 dollar bill that bill's
going to be zero.
You don't even recapturedepreciation in this opportunity
zone exit wow, that is crazy.
Speaker 1 (38:15):
Holy cow.
How popular are these things,kate?
Are you seeing this with yourclients?
Are they doing this, or is it?
Is it not as common as what itmaybe sounds like it should be
for that kind of benefit?
Speaker 2 (38:26):
yeah, well, here's the kick.
So this was brand new.
Back in 2017, this stuff waslike so new and so out there.
It was so difficult tounderstand, yeah, the workings
of it, yeah, that by the timeeverybody understood it well
enough to actually do somethingwith it, the benefits were just
not there anymore.
(38:46):
You were going to get to deferfor two years.
Two years doesn't, you know,make the math, make sense, right
?
Um, so this is, I mean, in myopinion, this is awesome that
we're now getting to know aboutit and execute on it and use it
now, and it's going to be thereand available for us, at least
(39:07):
as the current tax law iswritten.
It's there permanently now.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
Yeah, wow, that's crazy.
I never knew that you couldjust get your own LLC with the
right paperwork.
I always assumed it had to besome big kind of syndication you
were getting involved in orsomething else, but it sounds
like what you're saying is itcould just be me go get an LLCc,
get my attorney to get theright opportunity to sell on
docs and and that kind of speaks.
Speaker 2 (39:32):
That kind of speaks to what I'm saying is the reason
that we all thought that wasbecause the big firms that could
, you know, act fast enough toput all these deals together.
They just did it for the massesand it was.
You know.
It was a little bit more costlyand expensive for one person to
go do this.
Well, now we've had experience,people can do it and know how
to set that up correctly.
Speaker 1 (39:53):
That's awesome, man.
I mean, I'm just thinking aboutmy own portfolio and I'm like
man, even just to diversify someof them into.
Can you 1031 into this thing?
Could I sell something and 1031in, or do I not even have quite
?
Speaker 2 (40:09):
Yeah, it's not quite so.
What you're going to takeadvantage of is that five-year
deferral.
So instead of the 1031 deferral, you're going to say, all right
, I'm going to do my five-yeardeferral in my opportunity zone
and you're going to go for thatdiscount.
So this is kind of like analternative to the 1031.
Speaker 1 (40:25):
Okay.
So let's say I'm just going totry to understand this I've got,
say, that, $10 million building.
Now I'm selling it for $20.
I got $15 million in gain.
Okay, I can now just take the15 and go buy some opportunity
zone stuff, or how.
What's the play there?
(40:45):
Cause normally I would think,okay, if I don't want to pay tax
, now I got a 10 31 intosomething else with this $15
million, or it's gotta be over20, right, whatever, your sale
price is at 10 31.
But what's the play?
Like, how are you utilizing,you know, an existing asset sale
to take and put it into anopportunity zone?
Or like, what's, what arepeople doing in order to get
(41:07):
into the get in the?
Speaker 2 (41:08):
zone, so to speak, Right yeah exactly Good
marketing.
Speaker 1 (41:15):
Good marketing auto zone, we all know it.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
There you go so answered by auto zone.
Well, hey, you know, maybe wego for it.
Speaker 1 (41:25):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (41:27):
Yeah.
So what are people doing?
They're saying okay, I've gotthis huge thing and this could
be.
Some people might get forcedinto this because their 1031
didn't work out.
Speaker 1 (41:37):
Oh, okay, there's all those time commitments.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
So I'm not saying that 1031 or Opportunity Zone is
one's better than the other.
I think it's all about yourvision and what you're trying to
do.
The 1031, remember we talkedabout cost segregation and some
buckets right.
The 1031 lets you defer thegain on land, it lets you defer
the gain on the building and itlets you defer the gain on the
(42:00):
land improvement.
You're going to be exposed forthe fixture, furniture and
equipment depreciation you took,no matter what, it doesn't get
you out of that.
You're still paying some taxes.
You're deferring the rest of it.
So you pay that tax today, youdefer it, and you could keep
that up all the way until youpass away.
Well, the difference betweenthat and the reason I say pass
(42:23):
away is, once you pass away,usually those assets get a step
up in basis.
The depreciation recapture isgone.
You're moving on to bigger andbetter things.
Your heirs are moving on tobigger and better things, yeah,
your heirs are doing well.
You're gone right theopportunity zone.
You're planning to pay thetaxes in five years at a
(42:44):
discount.
So you know you're going tosave 40,000 bucks.
But like we talked about, whatis that money in your pocket
today?
You know that extra 360 now isyou're planning on 360.
You get to have that money inyour pocket today in the form of
that opportunity zone fund andbuy a big asset that you can
(43:05):
plan a huge tax-free exit on in10 years.
So the opportunity zone can getyou out of depreciation
recapture in your lifetime 1031,on the other hand, can get your
heirs out of it instead, right?
Speaker 1 (43:19):
Well, that's what I was trying to wrap my brain
around.
So I sell this thing for $15million gain.
I go buy something now in anopportunity zone.
I hold it for 10 years.
Now I'm out of the gain.
Is that what's happening?
I'm not paying gain on that $15million that I sold.
Is that right?
Am I understanding thiscorrectly?
Speaker 2 (43:46):
correctly.
So in five years you're goingto pay gain on that first
deferral, right?
So if you had a gain of 15million and you're taking that
into the zone, in five yearsyou're going to pay capital
gains tax on that money that youput in and deferred.
So you will pay some taxes.
You get a 10% discount in fiveyears.
It's the new asset that youacquired with that deferred
money.
That new asset is going to be atax-free exit.
Speaker 1 (44:09):
Okay, so I get it.
So I still need to stash awaysome cash from that sale
somewhere in order to-.
Speaker 2 (44:16):
Yeah, you need to plan for paying some taxes in
five years.
Speaker 1 (44:19):
Okay, and then in the new one, yeah, because that's
what I'm thinking.
I'm like man for our youngeraudience out here.
This is a great opportunity foryou guys not have to keep
kicking the can down the roadLike with the 1031, you're just
continually kicking the can downthe road to avoid that tax.
This is a way to actually getliquid without having to pay
Uncle Sam in 10 years, right?
Speaker 2 (44:47):
Uncle Sam in 10 years .
Right, that's right.
Now there was some new tax lawthat was introduced on bonus
depreciation in this bill.
So this was actually kind of anexciting compound strategy that
I think a little bit of planningand kind of deal creating could
go into.
And I bring this up becausereal estate entrepreneurs are
really great at knowing how topartner with other people and
(45:09):
take advantage of real estatedriven moves right.
So manufacturing has a coupleof different code sections
that's coming into play.
I'm going to focus on aspecific code of bonus
depreciation.
We've been dealing with 168 Kdepreciation, 168 N.
(45:29):
These are code sections.
168 N is for qualified ummanufacturing activities, for
production activities.
Okay, this gets reallyinteresting.
Let's say that we take thatopportunity zone example.
You're going to exit on somemoney and you're going to go
into a manufacturing facilitythat qualifies as a qualified
(45:55):
production activity.
It's going to allow you to donot just like a cost segregation
study and then writing offpartial of that new building,
it's actually going to allow youto offset 100% of the cost of
that building.
So if you take your $2 millionof gain and let's say that you
(46:17):
and another person withexpertise in manufacturing go
into a qualified fund togetherand you guys build a $10 million
manufacturing plant and you'regoing to make a bunch of widgets
and that person hopefully hassome expertise Well, that $10
million asset that you justbought, you're writing that off
(46:37):
in the first year it's placed inservice.
Wow.
Speaker 1 (46:41):
So is that the whole thing?
Or you got to still subtractout the land.
Wow, so is that the whole?
Speaker 2 (46:44):
thing.
Or you got to still subtractout the land.
Um, your, your land is probablygoing to get some store of
value.
That's okay, that's right.
But other than the land, um,you know everything that's that.
You know manufacturing plantarea.
So if you've got a couple ofoffices, you kind of have to
partition that out.
You can still do regulardepreciation strategy with.
You know your office buildingbut the actual manufacturing
(47:08):
floor and everything there, allthe equipment, everything that's
in there, a hundred percentwritten off.
So in reality, of that $10million you're probably writing
off, you know, let's say, 8.5 to$9 million in that first year.
Well, that could be an awesomestrategy to get you out of
paying that five-year tax.
That's down.
(47:28):
We carry forward some losses tooffset that and what's crazy is
10 years later you don't payrecapture on that oh, wow, oh,
that's a genius yeah, the otherclever thing about this 168n is
the government even says youhave to use that facility as a
(47:50):
qualified manufacturing orproduction activity for 10 years
to avoid recapture, likeinstant recapture.
If you change the use in yeartwo, you're going to recapture
that depreciation.
So it says you need to do thisfor 10 years.
Well, those timelines line uptogether.
It's almost like they weretrying to hint to us hey, we
(48:10):
want you to do somemanufacturing and we're giving
you a way to have a massive exitWow, Without a recapture.
Speaker 1 (48:18):
That's huge, man.
You know, when I speak to someof the audience here, it's
probably like whew, like I'mjust getting started in real
estate.
This is not good, but for someof you guys out there that have
some things going on or you'reeven just thinking about your
own stuff in the next five years.
I think what Caden's talkingabout here is just some creative
things like using the tax codeto really again, it's not about
(48:39):
what you make, it's about whatyou keep and if you can keep all
the profit of some of thesethings.
It might take a while, right,10 years is a long time in
today's world, but, man, that'sa huge benefit to be able to,
especially if you're hittingsome bigger deals here.
That's a big time benefit thereto be thinking about.
Speaker 2 (48:59):
Yeah, and I mean, I even see maybe some of us aren't
at the scale to be able to goand execute that deal on our own
.
Speaker 1 (49:06):
Right.
Speaker 2 (49:06):
But I'm sure that we start seeing some dealmakers go
and put together a syndicatedversion of this, where maybe
we're successful but we're notat that stage in our wealth
building journey that maybe wecan go and participate in some
of this For sure.
Speaker 1 (49:22):
Yeah, that's exactly what I was thinking, man.
Yeah, that's great.
Man Caden, I know we're kind ofbumping up against time here
Anything else that you think isreally important that we need to
get out about this big,beautiful bill here as it sits
today, that our audience needsto know before we kind of wrap
things up for this session?
Speaker 2 (49:43):
Yeah, I think going through this we just talked
about somebody who's going topay more taxes.
We just talked about how youcould not pay any taxes, have
huge exits without taxes.
Hopefully, that paints apicture that your situation
could be anywhere on thatspectrum and it's probably
really, really important for youto go and find somebody who's
(50:06):
staying out ahead of this and ishelping you avoid pitfalls.
Take advantage of big benefits.
We had a webinar, which peopleare more than welcome to go and
watch that webinar, where wecovered some stuff more in depth
, covered some stuff more indepth.
(50:26):
We show you a lot of differentsituations where different
things that sound the sameactually play very differently
on the board for you.
I think that's probably themessage I'd leave, though, is
find somebody who's going towork on this with you.
We're happy to.
If it makes sense to, you cango and visit us at beccfocom and
get a free consultation to talkto us and see if it makes sense
to work with us.
(50:46):
But at the end of the day, gotalk to somebody and don't wait
until the end of the year.
Do it now.
Speaker 1 (50:53):
Yeah, this is.
I mean, this is the time of theyear when you know meeting with
your accountant is probably thebest time to do it.
A the big beautiful bills gotpassed and if your accountant's
on top of things, they're goingto be able to look at your
current year and how things aretrending and be able to help
start planning for year endstuff.
Right Like this is probably oneof the best times to be having
these conversations with theiraccountants.
Caden.
Speaker 2 (51:12):
Yeah, absolutely.
And the thing is the reallygood CPAs are going to have
their doors getting kicked downand busted down.
If you wait later, it's moreand more likely that you don't
get somebody that's going toreally take good care of you,
right?
Speaker 1 (51:29):
Exactly yeah, and so, guys, if you need some help, I
mean, obviously Caden clearlyknows his stuff here, right, and
if you're sitting out there andyou're going A my account that
I have, I think doesn't reallyknow real estate.
I think that's one of the bestpieces of advice I got.
I got when I got started inreal estate investing Caden's a
mentor of mine said go get areal estate specific account,
(51:49):
somebody who knows real estate,and that's what you guys do at
Beck CFO right.
Speaker 2 (51:54):
Yeah, yep, so we're doing real estate accounting,
real estate taxes and realestate CFO services, helping
people understand their businessbetter, know the numbers and,
hopefully, keep more of theirmoney in their pocket.
Speaker 1 (52:09):
Yeah, and you guys do the books for us on all of our
entities, which is awesome.
You guys do a great job on that.
So bookkeeping as well.
Another important thing itmakes your accounting bill a lot
lower when you have reallyclean books, so that's an
important thing.
You got to know your numbers,too, and you got to make sure
that you can trust your numbers.
I found that out over the yearsis I could look at my books,
but if I don't trust who's doingthe input there, I don't really
(52:31):
trust my numbers.
So that's another importantpart too.
So I highly recommend Beck CFOfor that as well.
Very reasonably priced for whatyou get in service there.
They've been awesome to workwith.
We've been with you guys liketwo years now.
Maybe it's been really good youguys have done it.
We just switched all of ourstuff.
We had some lower volume thingsthat we had a VA doing and I
just had to switch it becausethings were getting missed and I
(52:52):
just don't want to have messybooks.
Man, I trust you guys to do agreat job, and your team always
does.
We appreciate that.
Guys, guys again, if this isoverwhelming for you or you're
like gosh, I don't even knowwhere to start with this stuff,
reach out to Beck.
They'll hop on a free call withyou.
They'll talk some tax strategywith you and help hopefully, get
(53:13):
you started in the rightdirection, because this is stuff
you can take advantage of, likeyou said.
Caden said, you can either be onone end of the spectrum where
you're paying a bunch, or youcan be on the other end where
you're keeping a lot more ofyour money.
But a lot of times it's themoves you make between now and
December 31st or maybe April15th some of it, I know.
But regardless, have thatconversation sooner than later.
(53:33):
Cade, we always wrap with onefun question.
Now you're in Virginia, so thismight be tough for you, okay,
but I'm going to throw it outthere anyway and I'm going to
see what you come back with.
So do you have a favoriteWisconsin tradition or place you
have visited or would like tovisit here in this wonderful
state of Wisconsin?
Speaker 2 (53:53):
Yeah.
So I've got a good friend thatI met when we were doing some
service work in Finland.
He's from the Green Bay area.
Oh yeah, let's go, baby.
For the last like 10 years he'sbeen hyping up Green Bay
telling me oh man, you got toget out here.
The nature out here isbeautiful.
Go on camping.
There's beautiful, beautifullakes.
So I'm definitely.
(54:14):
I still talk to him every nowand then.
I just need to get a tripplanned to the Green Bay area.
Speaker 1 (54:21):
Get it done, buddy, I'm going to hold you
accountable to that.
Our office is in Green Bay,caden, so if you are coming to
town, let us know, and we'd loveto have you come, take a little
visit and get to meet some ofthe crew there.
It'll be a lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (54:32):
Yeah, absolutely, yeah, that'd be awesome.
Speaker 1 (54:34):
Well, brother, I appreciate you taking time out.
I know you're a hot commodityright now after all this stuff
Not that you're not normally,but especially after this bill
and everybody's trying tounderstand what the heck's all
in it and how do we make senseof it all and all that stuff and
I got a lot out of today.
So I appreciate thisinformation For you guys out
there.
If you're listening to this, aswe say on every episode, go
share this show.
A it helps us continue to bringgreat guests on the show for
(54:55):
you guys to bring a ton of value, like Caden did today.
But also it's going to help youguys build your network right.
People are going to know you'rein real estate investing.
They're going to know what youdo.
They're going to want to talkabout doing deals with you,
bring you private money.
Whatever the case is, it'sgoing to benefit you by sharing
the show and you're going tohelp out some other people.
There's people out there we'vehad on this show who got an
episode sent to them of maybenot our podcast, but somebody
(55:16):
else's podcast or our podcast,and it helped get them started
in real estate investing and itchanged their family's
trajectory for generations tocome.
So please go out there, sharethe show like, subscribe to all
that other fun stuff.
If you are out there and youwant to have a conversation
about just getting started inreal estate investing and you're
not ready to get on the buyer'slist, you can go to the contact
us part on our website, putthat information in or just give
(55:38):
us a call or text with thenumber on our on our website at
wisconsindiscountpropertiescom,and we will have a conversation
with you and try to help you getrolling in your own real estate
investing journey.
So until then, guys, thanks fortuning in.
We'll see you on the nextepisode.
What's going on?
Wisconsin investor audience.
Welcome back to another episode.
I've got an amazing guest foryou guys today, a very timely
guest for you guys.
Today we are gonna be gettinginto the big, beautiful bill and
so, regardless of yourpolitical affiliation, we're
gonna have a lot of greatinformation for you as a real
(00:22):
estate investor out there today,and I'm gonna introduce our
guest here in a second.
Before I do, as I do on everyepisode, I'm going to talk about
our sponsor, wisconsin DiscountProperties.
As you guys may or may not knowif this is your first time
listening we drop off-marketdeals in your inbox every single
week at 6 am if you're CentralTime and these are all heavily
discounted properties.
We've got our website.
(00:43):
We're working on improving andmaking some changes.
We're about to launch some casestudies on there to show you
guys actually some of the dealsthat if you were on our buyers
list, that you missed out on,and you're missing out on some
big numbers here, guys.
So we're going to break thatdown.
These are actually case studies.
We've gotten the numbersdirectly from the buyers who
bought these properties.
We're going to show you those.
Another thing we're doing aswell for our people who are
(01:05):
joining our buyers list.
If you join the buyers list,you can do that by going to the
websitewisconsindiscountpropertiescom,
plugging your information inthere.
We are giving away my BRRRR forbeginners course.
So at one point we charged$3,000 for this course.
That was when I was doing somemore one-on-one coaching along
with it.
We recently have been charging$2,000 for just the course and
we're going to give it away forfree now.
(01:26):
So go to the website, fill itout.
Connor Reese from my team willgive you a call after you join
the buyers list and they'll tellyou how to get that course and
you can start taking action onbuilding real wealth today.
With that, let's get intotoday's episode.
I have Mr Caden Hackney with mefrom Beck.
Cfo Caden just became a taxpartner, I believe.
Is that correct, caden?
Speaker 2 (01:48):
Yeah.
Yeah, that's exactly right.
We're real excited about it.
Got a lot of energy for it.
Speaker 1 (01:53):
Beautiful.
Can you tell people what doesthat mean when you become a
partner Because I didn't knowthis with like law firms and
accounting firms, Like I didn'tunderstand what it means.
But teleaudits, what does thatmean?
That's a big deal.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yeah, yeah.
So that means that, for lack ofbetter terms, I was able to
negotiate a buy-in, be able tobecome an owner in the
organization.
So, with my partner, marcusKrigler, we have decided to join
CARTs together for the nextforeseeable future.
(02:22):
That's awesome, man.
Speaker 1 (02:23):
And we had Marcus on maybe 10, 15 episodes ago.
We were just talking generalreal estate tax strategy things.
And then, right before 4th ofJuly July 3rd I believe is when
the big beautiful bill gotsigned into law and there's some
pretty big implications good,bad or ugly into that bill for
real estate investors.
And so Mr Caden here decided orreached out, asked if we'd want
(02:46):
to have Beck back on and breakdown this big beautiful bill.
And of course I jumped at thisopportunity because it's so
timely, so relevant and I thinkit's so important for our
audience out there, obviously inreal estate investing, to know
all about this bill.
So, caden, start out.
Man, wherever you want to takethis, I know you've been doing
calls left and right for our CGaudience and for your clients on
(03:09):
the big beautiful bill.
So we're kind of getting maybea refined version here, which is
great, but tell us a little bitabout what are some of the
highlights of this thing thatreal estate investors really
need to be aware of and takeadvantage of going forward.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
Yeah, that's a really great question and I think you
know, before I jump and diveinto this a little bit, I want
to, you know, give you guys somecontext on how this bill has
kind of worked itself throughand even some upcoming changes
that I'm expecting to happenover the next few weeks.
Okay, so the bill gotintroduced back in March to the
(03:45):
House of Representatives.
They chewed on this and passedit in May.
It went to the Senate, had somechanges and revisions, went
back to the House and thenfinally that House version got
finalized, went to the president, got signed.
Well, to all of us who don'twork in Congress it seemed like
(04:05):
that was a long enough time tohave gotten it right, but they
felt like they were rushed.
So, even the signed bill,there's a lot of issues and
things being identified thatpeople actually want revisions
and corrections to be made.
So there's going to be acorrective bill actually getting
passed here in the next monthor two that's going to change
(04:26):
some of this stuff oh, wow,that's interesting.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
I know one thing I saw.
I was reading an article todayactually about this.
It was about the gamblers, thepeople who are professional
gamblers.
They're they're fighting to getget some things changed.
There was something where youcan explain this piece, probably
, if you can bear with me like Ican.
Speaker 2 (04:42):
But it sounded like a bad deal for gamblers.
Yeah, gamblers they were.
Basically, if they went andmade a million dollars, but they
spent a million to make amillion, they were going to get
taxed on 10% of what they maderegardless.
So they were only going to beable to take 90% of their losses
against their income.
(05:02):
So they're paying basically aphantom tax at that point on
money they didn't actually makeand that's something that's
definitely being lobbied to getupdated and changed.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Yeah, it doesn't really make sense.
Like, who put that in in thefirst place?
That seems kind of like what?
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Yeah, I don't know.
Frankly, didn't focus too muchon it.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Not really relevant too much for us real estate
investors, but interestingnonetheless.
Uh, that they're.
They're like you said, they'remaking some revisions, but
anything that you can see thatyou want to touch on with the
revisions that are kind ofjuggling right now, that is up
in the air, that that may affectreal estate investors.
Speaker 2 (05:39):
Yeah.
So right now, you know, marcusand I we've kind of had this
conversation on some of theprior calls that we've been on.
This is the fifth one so far.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
We've kind of said, like everybody's out there
saying that these laws arepermanent, and we said, yes, the
law as it's written today saysthat, hey, this is not going
away until someone comes andchanges the law.
And we're about to see,potentially, that Right now,
bonus depreciation this has beena big, big thing that the real
(06:11):
estate community has beenlooking forward to and
anticipating.
It is back at 100%, so the rateis 100%.
There's no stair step whereit's sunsetting and going away
anymore and there's also noexpiry date.
So at least, as the law readstoday, 100% is here to stay.
I don't know if anybody'strying to touch that, but that
(06:39):
could be something where, hey,they're like, well, let's keep
100%, but maybe we want to put,because the first bill that got
introduced by the House actuallyhad 100% expiring, I believe,
in 2033.
So that was a timeline and theSenate removed that timeline.
So I don't know if we seesomething shift there where our
(07:00):
window of opportunity getsdefined a little bit more clear.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Okay, Can you just explain?
You know I've had had you hadMarcus on, I've had another
accountant on here talking aboutbonus depreciation and what
that is.
But can you just explain topeople who maybe this is their
first experience hearing thisthey didn't listen to those
episodes, they don't know whatbonuses.
Can you explain why that's,that's a big deal, why real
estate investors have beenwaiting to hear about this for a
while?
Speaker 2 (07:23):
Yeah, yeah, so big thing in real estate.
We're all trying to buildwealth.
Wealth is built through assetsand when we go and buy a rental
property or something like that,we may invest $300,000 into
that property and what happensis depreciation is how we are
able to take a tax benefit overtime.
(07:44):
So a single family hometypically gets depreciated over
27 and a half years.
Well, what makes bonus such abig deal is real estate
professionals.
They can say, hey, we want totake that $300,000 and we're
going to use what's called acost segregation study.
It kind of buckets it up andtwo of the three buckets are
(08:06):
qualified for bonus depreciation.
Bonus depreciation at 100% saysthat those buckets get written
off immediately in year one andthat usually produces massive
tax savings.
That helps strengthen thereturn on investment.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
What's the bucket that doesn't get touched?
So you mentioned there's threebuckets.
What are the three buckets,kate, and then what's the one
that doesn't get touched?
Speaker 2 (08:30):
Yeah, great question.
So when you buy a piece ofproperty, I'll just break it
down real easy using a dollar.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
We buy a dollar rental property, typically we're
going to split it into a storeof value for land and then a
building.
Okay, the store of value forland.
The golden rule says that'sgoing to be a 20% store of value
and then we get 80% taken intothe building.
Okay, the cost segregationstudy is going to split that 80
cents into three buckets.
(08:59):
One is going to stay thebuilding, the second will be
land improvements and then thethird will be fixtures,
furniture and equipment.
Land improvements is a fancyway of saying landscaping,
sidewalks, your driveway, thosekind of things.
Um, fencing, stuff like that.
Fixtures and furniture um,that's going to be stuff like
(09:19):
flooring in the house, lightfixtures in the house, hvac
could be, you know, appliancesin the kitchen and the bathrooms
, it's those kinds of things.
So your land improvements inthe fixtures and furniture and
equipment, those qualify forbonus and those get that
immediate write-off with 100%.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Okay, got it.
I always wondered that what theone was that didn't stay.
Now, the important part aboutthat for people to know is like
so when you're saying thisdollar, can correct me if I'm
wrong here if I had to writethat off, basically the 80% or
what percentage is it usuallythat you're writing off of the,
not the land, but everythingelse?
What kind of percentage?
Speaker 2 (10:00):
Yeah, so kind of break it down.
You take 80% and then usuallyon average, after seeing
thousands of cost segregationstudies, you're typically going
to see about 25% of the buildingvalue get put into those
depreciable classes that qualifyfor bonus.
So a good rule of thumb is$0.20 per dollar you invest is
(10:22):
what you could expect to have asa bonus write-off with 100%
bonus.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
Okay, so in normal years you'd have to take that 20
cents and then divide that by27 and a half, right?
And then every year that's yourwrite-off, correct?
Speaker 2 (10:39):
Not quite.
So the 27 and a half.
You take the 80 cents, dividethat by 27 and a half.
Okay, that's typical With thecost seg.
You end up saying, okay, 80%,we take 25% down into those
bonus eligibles, we write thoseoff.
The remaining 55, I thinkthat's right 55 cents.
(11:03):
That gets split over 27 and ahalf.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
Okay, so the other buckets that you're talking
about, are those a faster?
Normally a faster?
Is it a five and a 15-yeardepreciation?
Speaker 2 (11:13):
schedule.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
Okay.
So that is kind of where I wasgoing with this for the audience
.
So the 25% that Caden's talkingabout, or whatever that smaller
number is, normally you'd haveto take those in either
five-year depreciation schedulesor 15-year depreciation
schedules, so it's a smaller taxwrite-off basically every
single year.
What Caden's talking about isyou can accelerate that into one
year and now you're getting abig lump sum write-off.
(11:36):
And what's important about this, caden mentioned real estate
professional.
Caden, can you talk about whatis a real estate professional in
the eyes of the IRS?
Speaker 2 (11:44):
Yeah, so the IRS defines the real estate
professional in section 469.
This isn't like a license, it'snot like oh, I'm a realtor, I
qualify.
It has nothing to do with that.
It has everything to do withwhat you do and how you spend
your time and what you own.
Okay, so you have to get atleast 750 hours in a qualified
(12:06):
real estate trader business.
Um, you know, real estatetrader business.
You can think of propertymanagement, land development.
Um, you know, like a realestate brokerage, uh, you can be
realtor.
You know all of those types ofactivities are qualified real
estate activities.
You have to have 750 hours.
Um, you know the?
The next kind of thing thatreally matters, there is going
(12:29):
to be what's called materialparticipation.
This is where ownership comesinto play.
You actually have to own atleast 5% of the asset that you
are doing the real estatebusiness.
And so if you own 5% of apartnership.
Your hours can qualify towardsthat.
Material participation.
Um, so material participation,there's seven different tests.
(12:51):
Won't get too deep into it.
Your accountant can probablyhelp you figure that out.
Um, but it's just checking someboxes, to be honest.
Speaker 1 (12:59):
Okay, and so what you're basically saying is, if
you're just a real estate agentout there, you don't own any
assets, you're not going to beable to, obviously you're not
going to have a property towrite off anything with in the
first place, but you would notbe considered necessarily for
this purpose tax purposes a realestate professional.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Yeah, it really depends on how you get paid.
So a lot of realtors that I seethey're contractors for a
brokerage, so they'retechnically business owners, and
those hours that they spend inthat business would help towards
the bucket.
If they don't have assets,though, it doesn't really do
much for them.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
Yeah, it's kind of like a chicken or an egg thing.
You got to have one or theother there to get the tech
trade off right.
So that's important, guys.
One of the things that I thinkis interesting Katie and getting
correct me if I'm wrong on allthis stuff but one of the
examples.
Somebody explained to me this afew years ago when bonus was a
hundred percent, when I, when Iwas getting going, as I said,
like imagine you're a doctor andyou're making 500,000 a year,
something like that.
You're heavily taxed, right,you're highly taxed individual
(13:59):
at that on on your W-2.
Let's say your spouse is owning.
You guys own some propertiesand your spouse is managing said
properties and they're hittingthese litmus tests and now
they're able to become this realestate professional.
Theoretically, let's say, youhad enough depreciation to wipe
out the $500,000.
That doctor could essentiallypay $0 in federal income tax.
(14:19):
Is that correct?
Am I explaining that correctly?
Speaker 2 (14:23):
Yeah yeah, there's definitely some limitations on
how much you can do, and weactually I have a good example
of when that doesn't quite workout as how you would expect A
client of ours who has almostthat exact situation one of the
spouses is a doctor, makesreally, really high wages
(14:43):
through their job and the otherspouse is a real estate
professional.
Well, part of the old Trump 1.0tax bill, it introduced this
thing called excess businessloss.
That put a cap on how muchbusiness losses could actually
offset non-business income, likeyour wages, your interest, your
(15:05):
dividends, capital gains, lifeincome.
So we've got you know, for amarried couple you can only
offset up to $626,000.
So you've got someone who getslike a $700,000, $800,000,
$900,000 W-2.
You're going to get hit with alittle bit of an issue there if
you're trying to usedepreciation alone to offset
(15:25):
your income.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
Okay, interesting.
I never knew that.
See, that's why we do thispodcast, man.
I learn something new everytime.
It's great.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
There you go.
So the big beautiful bill hasnow extended that excess
business loss limitation andmade it permanent as well.
Okay so it's not going away,it's here to stay, got it.
Where one of our clients iskind of in big trouble with this
is they use business losses andthen, you know, the way that
they kind of still were able toget out of paying taxes was
(15:55):
using itemized deductions.
They do large charitabledonations so they'd go and use
you know they did a conservationeasement, they've done a
leveraged asset donation.
You know these type of things.
It's basically'd go and use youknow they did a conservation
easement, they've done aleveraged asset donation.
You know these type of things.
It's basically you go and youknow either give an asset that
has appreciated in value, youget a large deduction from the
IRS, you don't pay capital gainson it, or a conservation
(16:18):
easement saying, hey, I'mwilling to restrict the use of
some of my land and give that tothe government and you know
they'll preserve and and kind oftake care of the land for the
wildlife and the plants and allthat.
That's.
That's what those two thingsare.
Nevertheless, a new limitationon itemized deductions got
(16:38):
written into this tax bill andwe actually did a big case study
about this kind of led withthis almost with with folks Not
everybody's paying less taxesfrom this bill, this particular
individual in 24 paying zero.
That same situation against thenew tax bill.
They're paying $216,000 infederal taxes because the laws
(17:01):
changed.
Speaker 1 (17:02):
Wow, that's insane.
Okay, so let's break that downfor a second Caden.
So what were the issues then?
Or what are the issues now withthe beautiful bill on those two
particular examples there ofthe easement and the leveraged
asset donation?
What changed?
Is it just that limitation thatyou were talking about?
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Yeah.
So we went from essentially nolimitation on the itemized
deductions that was coming intoplay versus now for folks that
are in the 37% tax bracketthat's the highest income tax
bracket they have to do thiscrazy calculation where they
take their income and subtractit's about 578,000.
(17:43):
That's where a married couplecrosses into the 37% bracket and
they can take three-sevenths ofa dollar for everything over
that $578,000.
So if we're talking a million,I'll get a little calculator out
here.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
Three-sevenths, again , who comes up with this stuff?
Speaker 2 (18:02):
Yeah, congress, they love to scratch our heads right
oh my goodness.
So if you had a million dollarsof of gross income, you have to
take that and subtract 578 andthen multiply that by three.
Divided by seven, that meansyour max itemized deduction is
only 181 000.
So you have a million dollarsof income.
(18:25):
You can only reduce it by181,000.
You're left with the difference.
Wow, and now you pay a lot moretaxes, and that's that's what
will happen if we don't changesomething.
So we're uh, you know one,hoping for some changes in this
correction bill.
Maybe they didn't mean toreduce the benefit of charity so
much, because it seems kind ofcrazy to place such a big
(18:48):
restriction on how charitablesomeone could be benefits for it
.
But otherwise we're talking tothem about hey, do you have any
way to do a deferred stockoption with the spouse, or is
there maybe another retirement?
We could put more of thesewages, reduce the non-business
income, so we're not so exposed.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Okay, so let me just give an example.
Let's say let's say I make amillion dollars in in
wholesaling right and then I'vegot I buy enough buildings where
I've got a million dollars ofbonus depreciation I can take.
Are you saying I wouldn't beable to take that whole million
dollars of depreciation now, oris that separate from what you
were describing?
Speaker 2 (19:28):
Yeah, great question.
So in that case, your wholesaleI'm assuming that that's your
wholesale business right.
Right, right, yep.
So your wholesale business isbusiness income.
Business losses can offsetbusiness income.
Okay yeah, so there's separateentities.
Speaker 1 (19:45):
So let's say we have a you know holding company llc
versus our s corp llc.
S corp llc is the onegenerating the wholesale income.
The holding company is going tobe just a pass-through entity.
Does that matter?
Speaker 2 (20:03):
Yeah.
So in that case, assuming thatyou have what's called basis,
basis is basically the tax bankaccount that allows losses to
pass through, which, in aholding company, should be no
problem.
You know, I think I could spendan hour talking about basis, so
, for listeners, you might wantto talk to your accountant about
(20:24):
what that is, to be honest.
You might want to talk to youraccountant about what that is to
be honest.
At any rate, the losses fromthe holding company will pass
through, the income from theS-corp will pass down.
Everything will kind of getreconciled dollar for dollar
down at your personal return.
So in that situation you shouldbe fine.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
Okay, all right, I'm like sitting here listening.
I'm like dang, if we good yearwe might screwed paying a bunch
of taxes, no matter how muchdepreciation I take.
Oh my goodness, what are youtalking about?
The downsides of bonusdepreciation, cause I know
there's the government's notgoing to get paid, you know at
some point.
So talk about what are therisks of doing some of these
accelerated depreciationschedules.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
Yeah, so this is a really, really interesting
conversation.
Depreciation, you know I don'tI don't know how other people
define it necessarily, but Icall it.
You know an interest-free loanfrom the IRS.
You know it's it's not reallyaccruing interest.
(21:23):
You will pay it back later, youknow, and you get to choose
when.
So you, you don't have toaccrue interest over time.
You get to know exactly howyou're exiting and you get to
choose when that is right.
That's one of the best forms of,you know, debt that you could
carry for sure Very, veryfavorable.
So when we go and take theseaccelerated write-offs, we're
(21:48):
lowering I'm going to use thatword basis again, so your asset.
Let's say you bought it for$300,000.
Okay, this is something thatwhere I'm going to kind of break
up two different calculationsand try to keep it simple.
Okay, real estate investor saysI bought it for 300,000.
(22:08):
Five years later, I sell it for450.
I made 150, right, that's whatlogic says.
Okay, the IRS is going to sayyou did buy it for 300, but we
gave you a tax saving benefitand you wrote off a hundred
thousand of it.
So, in their eyes, they'regoing to say four, 50 minus 200.
(22:30):
They say you made two, 50.
Okay, so the two equations looka little bit different.
You're getting taxed on higherlevel of income, the.
The way that we want to look atthis, though, and why this makes
sense, is, let's say that youdid write off a hundred thousand
dollars, and it was in year one, and you're saving at a 40% tax
(22:54):
rate.
You just saved $40,000 today,right, well, that that $40,000
goes back into your business orback into your pocket.
You get to hopefully use thatmoney to drive more wealth
growth.
So you know that 40,000 overfive years hopefully turns into,
you know, 60, 70, $80,000 ofvalue to you.
(23:15):
And now it's made borrowingthose benefits from the
government way more um valuableand beneficial to you so that
when you pay the tax back laterit still made sense and
beneficial to you.
So that when you pay the taxback later, it still made sense,
right, right.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
Yeah, I've always been told, and correct me if
you're wrong on this, but adollar today is better than a
dollar tomorrow.
That's exactly right.
Our dollar continues to losevalue every single day, and so
if we can use that dollar todayto create more than inflation,
then why wouldn't we use thattoday to beat out inflation and
get ahead of it, right?
Create some wealth, right.
Speaker 2 (23:51):
Exactly and an interesting case study that
Marcus and I went and looked atthere's actually some potential
where today, in a wholesalebusiness, if you're in the
highest tax bracket, incomebracket it's going to be really,
really interesting to look atthe numbers.
(24:12):
If you go and let's say youmake $30,000 in wholesale deal
and you're in a 40% tax bracket,you're going to pay like
$12,000 of taxes.
So your after-tax profit isonly $18,000, right?
Well, if you take that propertyand look at it and say what if,
(24:34):
what, if we actually just keptit and we're going to, instead
of wholesale it, we're going toget it, we're going to put some
dough into it, we're going tokeep it as a rental.
All right, let's say that, thatthat rental, you're all in
$250,000.
Let's say that your ARV is, youknow, after repair values
(24:54):
$333,000.
So you've got some equity inthere of 83.
Let's say that you were able toget loan to value at 75%.
That means you know that's asuccessful BRRRR.
Is what I'm giving you thenumbers for.
Sure, right, yep, so you don'treally leave anything in the
deal.
You've got this equity, the taxsavings on that $250,000 asset,
(25:17):
with a cost segregation study,what do you think that that
comes in at.
We just said your after-taxdeal is going to be $18,000.
Surely you make less right.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
Well, dude, it's going to be insane, because now,
if you can accelerate thatdepreciation I'm just going to
do some basic math here realquick.
I don't know You're probablygoing to save $40,000 in taxes,
right?
Speaker 2 (25:41):
Yeah, maybe not that high, but the point is $20,000.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
That's about the number you're going to get.
So you go from an eight that'sa $38,000 swing.
That's what you're telling me,Just in taxes.
Speaker 2 (25:53):
Yeah, basically Exactly, you go from having to
pay 18 to getting 20.
Speaker 1 (25:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:58):
Now, if you kind of look and try to compare more
apples to apples, though, youget 18,000 of liquid cash if you
sell and do the wholesale, orif you execute it as a rental,
you actually get more money backin your pocket, and now you
have the store of value as anasset, right?
So you're building wealth.
Oh that's good buddy.
That's good.
Speaker 1 (26:18):
We need to get somebody to go put this in
actual numbers and break it downon a little screen, because
that was really good right thereI'm tracking.
I just hope the audience pickedup on that.
But that makes a lot of senseversus.
You know, I think that's one ofthe things that we've always
done.
We wholesale but then we holdassets as well.
So we're wholesaling, holding,wholesaling holding and the
holding is to offset the taximplications.
(26:39):
Right, the cash is to live offof and to, you know, pay the
bills today and do all that kindof stuff.
But the goal is to buy enoughassets that I can write off a
good chunk, if not all, of thatfederal tax.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
Yeah, exactly, and, corey, for you I'm happy to go
and record a piece of contentthat you can share, to follow up
with that and show thosenumbers broken down to see the
apples to apples.
I've got that ready to go foryou.
Speaker 1 (27:06):
Let's go, buddy.
We will put that all over thesocials and we'll throw it up on
our website as well.
That'd be awesome.
We'd love to see that.
Yeah, for sure.
Perfect.
Speaker 2 (27:14):
Now the big key for people listening to that this
only works if you're in a hightax bracket.
If you're in the lower taxbrackets, the numbers, the math
doesn't math for you.
Okay, and my recommendation atthat point is go make more money
, Don't worry about the taxes,go make more money.
Speaker 1 (27:31):
Get yourself in that higher tax bracket.
Then start worrying a littlebit more about how the numbers
are going to pencil out this way.
Yep exactly Got it.
That's good stuff.
Going back to the big beautifulbill here, Caden, what are some
other things?
Are there other things in thereas it sits today, that real
estate investors are going to bekeen on or that you guys are
(27:53):
talking to your clients about?
Speaker 2 (27:55):
Yeah, yeah, so a few, I would say.
This is probably more basic.
It probably gets skipped over alot.
The tax bill is extending andmaking permanent our lower tax
rates.
So if you look back at 2017,before trump passed his first
bill, the highest tax bracketwas actually 39.6 percent.
(28:15):
We're now at 37 and that's, youknow, not set to increase.
So just by default we we've gotlower brackets.
The width of the brackets arebigger, so you end up scaling to
those higher tax brackets muchmore slowly and you pay less
(28:37):
taxes as a default.
And that's for everybody, richor poor, no matter what.
Everybody's getting a tax breakthat way.
Okay, got the standard deduction.
I think something like 70% or80% of taxpayers.
Okay, got this standarddeduction.
I think something like 70 or 80percent of taxpayers are using
the standard deduction.
That's a a gimme from thegovernment saying hey, for you
single folks out there, fifteenthousand seven hundred and fifty
(28:59):
is not getting taxed formarried couples.
That's thirty one thousand fivehundred.
We're not gonna tax you on thefirst.
You know, fill in the blankamount, okay.
So that's a give me toeverybody.
Before the tax cuts and job,back back in 18, those numbers
were like 6,000 and 12,000.
Speaker 1 (29:16):
So holy cow.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
Yeah, Almost tripled.
And now they're.
They're here to stay at thathigher rate and keep growing
with inflation so big?
Deal there.
Speaker 1 (29:26):
Oh, so they actually put some.
They put some, some things inthere to keep up with inflation
as well with the reduction, okayyeah, the standard deduction
and the the tax bracket.
Speaker 2 (29:36):
So today the highest tax bracket you cross at 578,
next year could be 600,000 forexample, okay, okay, yeah, well,
that's good.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
I didn't realize that .
Has that always been that waywith tax brackets, or is that?
Is that new as of 2017 or 2025?
Speaker 2 (29:54):
Yeah, it's.
It's kind of always been thatway.
The law is kind of writing,because they're noticing that
the rate of change is faster, sothey're trying to keep up with
you know what year they'rebasing it off of.
So, prior to the Tax Cuts andJob Act, I think it was like
2006 or something that they weresaying all right, we're basing
all of our adjustments based offof the 2006 market and then
(30:18):
they adjusted it up to 2015.
Now it's 2025.
And they're going to moreregularly take a look at that.
For us, Because we've all beenhere Prices have been jumping
really, really high, really fast.
Speaker 1 (30:33):
For sure, for sure, buddy, that is the truth.
Right there, my friend.
What else are you seeing inthere, caden?
Give us some more dirt.
What else is going on in thisbig old, 900-page, beautiful
bill?
Speaker 2 (30:44):
Yeah, so this was a provision that got introduced
and was going to go away afterthis year.
It's called qualified businessincome deduction.
Okay, this is for everybusiness out there that's a
qualified business, which mostbusinesses are qualified
businesses today.
I think you could go and lookup the exceptions is what I
(31:07):
would recommend there.
So, real estate businesses, ifyou're doing like a wholesale
business and you've got amillion dollars of profit, as
long as you kind of check somecompliance boxes, you're going
to get a 20% haircut off the top.
So let's say that you can't goand use all the bonus
depreciation and that's notsomething that's all on the
(31:29):
table for you.
You could get up to a $200,000deduction given to you by the
government through thisqualified business income
deduction.
Wow, and that's yeah, that's afree 20% discount.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Yeah, that's awesome.
And is this new in this bill,or was this something that was
in previously as well, that wassunsetting, or what?
Where did this come in?
Yeah, that's awesome.
And is this new in this bill?
Or was this something that wasin previously as well, that was
sunsetting, or where did thiscome in?
Speaker 2 (31:51):
Yeah, so this got introduced back in 2017.
It was going to go away afterthis year, but again, this one's
made permanent and there'sactually been a little bit of
misinformation on it, becausethere was like differing rates
getting thrown around.
The first bill said 23%.
The Senate changed it back to20%.
It's still 20%.
(32:11):
That's what it's always been a20% discount but it's here to
stay.
Now it's written permanentlyinto the tax code until the law
changes right.
Yeah, until the nextadministration comes in and says
I'm just kidding, we're goingto change that now, yeah, and
(32:32):
honestly, that's my curiosity isa lot of these things that
don't have an expiration date.
I wonder if they come back andsay, ah, we want to put an
expiration date, um, you know,2030, 2033, something like that,
cause, when they're notcharging us taxes, uh, you know
they've, they've got to pullthat money from somewhere.
Speaker 1 (32:46):
Well, that, was the hope of Doge right.
I mean again, regardless ofwhat side of the political aisle
you're on, I think everyAmerican agrees waste and fraud
is probably not good and nobodywants to pay for that right.
And so you look at where can wecut funds and money from
spending so that we aren'tgetting taxed?
I mean, we get taxed on so muchstuff like property taxes,
(33:08):
sales tax I got a wheel tax inour county or in one of the
counties here for the roadsystem and you just get taxed
through the gills and you justkind of get sick of it after a
while and it's like give us abreak a little bit.
Yes, we all need roads, we needsocial safety nets, all that
good stuff.
Everybody in America is onboard with that.
It's just how do we pay forthose things?
(33:31):
And then what are the thingsthat we can get rid of so that
we can all pay less in taxes?
Ultimately, I think the heartbehind what's happening right
now and everybody hasdisagreements, I'm sure, on how
we get there and what'sconsidered waste versus some
people is maybe different toother people, but I think the
heart is there that nobody likespaying taxes.
(33:52):
Our country was founded on thefact that we hate paying taxes.
So I think that that's just inour DNA here in America.
So I think, overall, payingless tax is a great thing, as
long as we can figure out a wayto still have the safety and the
national security and all theother things that we want to be
(34:14):
the best country in the world.
Somebody's got to pay for thatstuff too.
Yeah absolutely.
Speaker 2 (34:19):
Yeah, there's a couple of you know a few more
exciting things, I think, forthe real estate world.
This one's not new.
It was introduced back in 2017.
It was just going to go away.
It's called Opportunity Zones.
I don't know if you heard ofthat, oh yeah, oh yeah.
Okay.
Speaker 1 (34:36):
But you can go into that this might be new for our
audience.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
Okay, cool, so an Opportunity Zone.
The government went and definedqualified areas.
There's actually like a website.
You can go and see the wholemap of the us and it shows
exactly where these areas are sotypically going to be.
You know, lower income areas,places that maybe time has, uh,
(35:03):
eroded some of the luster of theneighborhood.
So the government says, hey, ifyou go and create a qualified
opportunity zone fund, thiscould be something where you go
(35:23):
into a fund, like we think abouta bunch of people together.
This could also be an LLC withthe right paperwork that got set
up the correct way andqualifies as a fund more of a
self-directed opportunity.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (35:33):
Okay, so a few different things going on there.
What the government has kind ofwritten into is this is an
alternative business strategyexit.
Okay, if you've got, let's say,a big portfolio of assets or a
business that you're trying tosell, something that's going to
result in a lot of capital gains, the government says, hey,
(35:57):
let's say that you've got, youknow, $2 million of capital
gains.
If you go on, instead ofkeeping that $2 million, you put
it into a qualified opportunityzone fund and invest that $2
million into an opportunity zone.
We're going to give you alittle bit of benefit for doing
this, a little incentive.
Okay, so you'll take that $2million instead of paying taxes
(36:21):
today, you get to defer it forfive years.
Speaker 1 (36:23):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (36:24):
So you're not going to pay that tax today and in
five years if you've held thatqualified opportunity property,
so the thing that you investedin with the money, if you've
held it for five years, we'regoing to give you a 10% discount
on your taxes.
So you know, $2 million at 20%,that'd be like a $400,000 tax
bill, right?
Speaker 1 (36:44):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
Well, they're going to give you a 10% discount, so
you're, in five years from now,paying 360 instead.
Okay, okay.
Okay so that's, that's benefitnumber one.
Speaker 1 (36:55):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (36:55):
Um, the big play, the big benefit is, if you hold
onto that qualified opportunityproperty for 10 years, they're
going to give you a 100%tax-free exit on that qualified
opportunity property.
So let's give you some forinstance, so $2 million that you
(37:18):
put in your capital.
Let's say that you went andbought a $10 million asset Okay,
let's say that it was realestate assets.
You're going to takedepreciation on it.
You're going to write it off.
Get some huge tax benefits fordoing that today right.
Well, five years into it, you'regoing to pay the taxes on the
deferral and add a discount.
(37:40):
Well, 10 years into it, let'ssay that a $10 million
investment is now a $20 millionasset value.
You bought for 10,.
Let's say that you'vedepreciated half of it, so
you've got, you know, $5 millionof cost left.
Well, on paper, the tax side ofit's going to say all right, 20
million minus five, $15 milliongain.
(38:02):
So you're going to be expectinga $3 dollar bill that bill's
going to be zero.
You don't even recapturedepreciation in this opportunity
zone exit wow, that is crazy.
Speaker 1 (38:15):
Holy cow.
How popular are these things,kate?
Are you seeing this with yourclients?
Are they doing this, or is it?
Is it not as common as what itmaybe sounds like it should be
for that kind of benefit?
Speaker 2 (38:26):
yeah, well, here's the kick.
So this was brand new.
Back in 2017, this stuff waslike so new and so out there.
It was so difficult tounderstand, yeah, the workings
of it, yeah, that by the timeeverybody understood it well
enough to actually do somethingwith it, the benefits were just
not there anymore.
(38:46):
You were going to get to deferfor two years.
Two years doesn't, you know,make the math, make sense, right
?
Um, so this is, I mean, in myopinion, this is awesome that
we're now getting to know aboutit and execute on it and use it
now, and it's going to be thereand available for us, at least
(39:07):
as the current tax law iswritten.
It's there permanently now.
Speaker 1 (39:11):
Yeah, wow, that's crazy.
I never knew that you couldjust get your own LLC with the
right paperwork.
I always assumed it had to besome big kind of syndication you
were getting involved in orsomething else, but it sounds
like what you're saying is itcould just be me go get an LLCc,
get my attorney to get theright opportunity to sell on
docs and and that kind of speaks.
Speaker 2 (39:32):
That kind of speaks to what I'm saying is the reason
that we all thought that wasbecause the big firms that could
, you know, act fast enough toput all these deals together.
They just did it for the massesand it was.
You know.
It was a little bit more costlyand expensive for one person to
go do this.
Well, now we've had experience,people can do it and know how
to set that up correctly.
Speaker 1 (39:53):
That's awesome, man.
I mean, I'm just thinking aboutmy own portfolio and I'm like
man, even just to diversify someof them into.
Can you 1031 into this thing?
Could I sell something and 1031in, or do I not even have quite
?
Speaker 2 (40:09):
Yeah, it's not quite so.
What you're going to takeadvantage of is that five-year
deferral.
So instead of the 1031 deferral, you're going to say, all right
, I'm going to do my five-yeardeferral in my opportunity zone
and you're going to go for thatdiscount.
So this is kind of like analternative to the 1031.
Speaker 1 (40:25):
Okay.
So let's say I'm just going totry to understand this I've got,
say, that, $10 million building.
Now I'm selling it for $20.
I got $15 million in gain.
Okay, I can now just take the15 and go buy some opportunity
zone stuff, or how.
What's the play there?
(40:45):
Cause normally I would think,okay, if I don't want to pay tax
, now I got a 10 31 intosomething else with this $15
million, or it's gotta be over20, right, whatever, your sale
price is at 10 31.
But what's the play?
Like, how are you utilizing,you know, an existing asset sale
to take and put it into anopportunity zone?
Or like, what's, what arepeople doing in order to get
(41:07):
into the get in the?
Speaker 2 (41:08):
zone, so to speak, Right yeah exactly Good
marketing.
Speaker 1 (41:15):
Good marketing auto zone, we all know it.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
There you go so answered by auto zone.
Well, hey, you know, maybe wego for it.
Speaker 1 (41:25):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (41:27):
Yeah.
So what are people doing?
They're saying okay, I've gotthis huge thing and this could
be.
Some people might get forcedinto this because their 1031
didn't work out.
Speaker 1 (41:37):
Oh, okay, there's all those time commitments.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
So I'm not saying that 1031 or Opportunity Zone is
one's better than the other.
I think it's all about yourvision and what you're trying to
do.
The 1031, remember we talkedabout cost segregation and some
buckets right.
The 1031 lets you defer thegain on land, it lets you defer
the gain on the building and itlets you defer the gain on the
(42:00):
land improvement.
You're going to be exposed forthe fixture, furniture and
equipment depreciation you took,no matter what, it doesn't get
you out of that.
You're still paying some taxes.
You're deferring the rest of it.
So you pay that tax today, youdefer it, and you could keep
that up all the way until youpass away.
Well, the difference betweenthat and the reason I say pass
(42:23):
away is, once you pass away,usually those assets get a step
up in basis.
The depreciation recapture isgone.
You're moving on to bigger andbetter things.
Your heirs are moving on tobigger and better things, yeah,
your heirs are doing well.
You're gone right theopportunity zone.
You're planning to pay thetaxes in five years at a
(42:44):
discount.
So you know you're going tosave 40,000 bucks.
But like we talked about, whatis that money in your pocket
today?
You know that extra 360 now isyou're planning on 360.
You get to have that money inyour pocket today in the form of
that opportunity zone fund andbuy a big asset that you can
(43:05):
plan a huge tax-free exit on in10 years.
So the opportunity zone can getyou out of depreciation
recapture in your lifetime 1031,on the other hand, can get your
heirs out of it instead, right?
Speaker 1 (43:19):
Well, that's what I was trying to wrap my brain
around.
So I sell this thing for $15million gain.
I go buy something now in anopportunity zone.
I hold it for 10 years.
Now I'm out of the gain.
Is that what's happening?
I'm not paying gain on that $15million that I sold.
Is that right?
Am I understanding thiscorrectly?
Speaker 2 (43:46):
correctly.
So in five years you're goingto pay gain on that first
deferral, right?
So if you had a gain of 15million and you're taking that
into the zone, in five yearsyou're going to pay capital
gains tax on that money that youput in and deferred.
So you will pay some taxes.
You get a 10% discount in fiveyears.
It's the new asset that youacquired with that deferred
money.
That new asset is going to be atax-free exit.
Speaker 1 (44:09):
Okay, so I get it.
So I still need to stash awaysome cash from that sale
somewhere in order to-.
Speaker 2 (44:16):
Yeah, you need to plan for paying some taxes in
five years.
Speaker 1 (44:19):
Okay, and then in the new one, yeah, because that's
what I'm thinking.
I'm like man for our youngeraudience out here.
This is a great opportunity foryou guys not have to keep
kicking the can down the roadLike with the 1031, you're just
continually kicking the can downthe road to avoid that tax.
This is a way to actually getliquid without having to pay
Uncle Sam in 10 years, right?
Speaker 2 (44:47):
Uncle Sam in 10 years .
Right, that's right.
Now there was some new tax lawthat was introduced on bonus
depreciation in this bill.
So this was actually kind of anexciting compound strategy that
I think a little bit of planningand kind of deal creating could
go into.
And I bring this up becausereal estate entrepreneurs are
really great at knowing how topartner with other people and
(45:09):
take advantage of real estatedriven moves right.
So manufacturing has a coupleof different code sections
that's coming into play.
I'm going to focus on aspecific code of bonus
depreciation.
We've been dealing with 168 Kdepreciation, 168 N.
(45:29):
These are code sections.
168 N is for qualified ummanufacturing activities, for
production activities.
Okay, this gets reallyinteresting.
Let's say that we take thatopportunity zone example.
You're going to exit on somemoney and you're going to go
into a manufacturing facilitythat qualifies as a qualified
(45:55):
production activity.
It's going to allow you to donot just like a cost segregation
study and then writing offpartial of that new building,
it's actually going to allow youto offset 100% of the cost of
that building.
So if you take your $2 millionof gain and let's say that you
(46:17):
and another person withexpertise in manufacturing go
into a qualified fund togetherand you guys build a $10 million
manufacturing plant and you'regoing to make a bunch of widgets
and that person hopefully hassome expertise Well, that $10
million asset that you justbought, you're writing that off
(46:37):
in the first year it's placed inservice.
Wow.
Speaker 1 (46:41):
So is that the whole thing?
Or you got to still subtractout the land.
Wow, so is that the whole?
Speaker 2 (46:44):
thing.
Or you got to still subtractout the land.
Um, your, your land is probablygoing to get some store of
value.
That's okay, that's right.
But other than the land, um,you know everything that's that.
You know manufacturing plantarea.
So if you've got a couple ofoffices, you kind of have to
partition that out.
You can still do regulardepreciation strategy with.
You know your office buildingbut the actual manufacturing
(47:08):
floor and everything there, allthe equipment, everything that's
in there, a hundred percentwritten off.
So in reality, of that $10million you're probably writing
off, you know, let's say, 8.5 to$9 million in that first year.
Well, that could be an awesomestrategy to get you out of
paying that five-year tax.
That's down.
(47:28):
We carry forward some losses tooffset that and what's crazy is
10 years later you don't payrecapture on that oh, wow, oh,
that's a genius yeah, the otherclever thing about this 168n is
the government even says youhave to use that facility as a
(47:50):
qualified manufacturing orproduction activity for 10 years
to avoid recapture, likeinstant recapture.
If you change the use in yeartwo, you're going to recapture
that depreciation.
So it says you need to do thisfor 10 years.
Well, those timelines line uptogether.
It's almost like they weretrying to hint to us hey, we
(48:10):
want you to do somemanufacturing and we're giving
you a way to have a massive exitWow, Without a recapture.
Speaker 1 (48:18):
That's huge, man.
You know, when I speak to someof the audience here, it's
probably like whew, like I'mjust getting started in real
estate.
This is not good, but for someof you guys out there that have
some things going on or you'reeven just thinking about your
own stuff in the next five years.
I think what Caden's talkingabout here is just some creative
things like using the tax codeto really again, it's not about
(48:39):
what you make, it's about whatyou keep and if you can keep all
the profit of some of thesethings.
It might take a while, right,10 years is a long time in
today's world, but, man, that'sa huge benefit to be able to,
especially if you're hittingsome bigger deals here.
That's a big time benefit thereto be thinking about.
Speaker 2 (48:59):
Yeah, and I mean, I even see maybe some of us aren't
at the scale to be able to goand execute that deal on our own
.
Speaker 1 (49:06):
Right.
Speaker 2 (49:06):
But I'm sure that we start seeing some dealmakers go
and put together a syndicatedversion of this, where maybe
we're successful but we're notat that stage in our wealth
building journey that maybe wecan go and participate in some
of this For sure.
Speaker 1 (49:22):
Yeah, that's exactly what I was thinking, man.
Yeah, that's great.
Man Caden, I know we're kind ofbumping up against time here
Anything else that you think isreally important that we need to
get out about this big,beautiful bill here as it sits
today, that our audience needsto know before we kind of wrap
things up for this session?
Speaker 2 (49:43):
Yeah, I think going through this we just talked
about somebody who's going topay more taxes.
We just talked about how youcould not pay any taxes, have
huge exits without taxes.
Hopefully, that paints apicture that your situation
could be anywhere on thatspectrum and it's probably
really, really important for youto go and find somebody who's
(50:06):
staying out ahead of this and ishelping you avoid pitfalls.
Take advantage of big benefits.
We had a webinar, which peopleare more than welcome to go and
watch that webinar, where wecovered some stuff more in depth
, covered some stuff more indepth.
(50:26):
We show you a lot of differentsituations where different
things that sound the sameactually play very differently
on the board for you.
I think that's probably themessage I'd leave, though, is
find somebody who's going towork on this with you.
We're happy to.
If it makes sense to, you cango and visit us at beccfocom and
get a free consultation to talkto us and see if it makes sense
to work with us.
(50:46):
But at the end of the day, gotalk to somebody and don't wait
until the end of the year.
Do it now.
Speaker 1 (50:53):
Yeah, this is.
I mean, this is the time of theyear when you know meeting with
your accountant is probably thebest time to do it.
A the big beautiful bills gotpassed and if your accountant's
on top of things, they're goingto be able to look at your
current year and how things aretrending and be able to help
start planning for year endstuff.
Right Like this is probably oneof the best times to be having
these conversations with theiraccountants.
Caden.
Speaker 2 (51:12):
Yeah, absolutely.
And the thing is the reallygood CPAs are going to have
their doors getting kicked downand busted down.
If you wait later, it's moreand more likely that you don't
get somebody that's going toreally take good care of you,
right?
Speaker 1 (51:29):
Exactly yeah, and so, guys, if you need some help, I
mean, obviously Caden clearlyknows his stuff here, right, and
if you're sitting out there andyou're going A my account that
I have, I think doesn't reallyknow real estate.
I think that's one of the bestpieces of advice I got.
I got when I got started inreal estate investing Caden's a
mentor of mine said go get areal estate specific account,
(51:49):
somebody who knows real estate,and that's what you guys do at
Beck CFO right.
Speaker 2 (51:54):
Yeah, yep, so we're doing real estate accounting,
real estate taxes and realestate CFO services, helping
people understand their businessbetter, know the numbers and,
hopefully, keep more of theirmoney in their pocket.
Speaker 1 (52:09):
Yeah, and you guys do the books for us on all of our
entities, which is awesome.
You guys do a great job on that.
So bookkeeping as well.
Another important thing itmakes your accounting bill a lot
lower when you have reallyclean books, so that's an
important thing.
You got to know your numbers,too, and you got to make sure
that you can trust your numbers.
I found that out over the yearsis I could look at my books,
but if I don't trust who's doingthe input there, I don't really
(52:31):
trust my numbers.
So that's another importantpart too.
So I highly recommend Beck CFOfor that as well.
Very reasonably priced for whatyou get in service there.
They've been awesome to workwith.
We've been with you guys liketwo years now.
Maybe it's been really good youguys have done it.
We just switched all of ourstuff.
We had some lower volume thingsthat we had a VA doing and I
just had to switch it becausethings were getting missed and I
(52:52):
just don't want to have messybooks.
Man, I trust you guys to do agreat job, and your team always
does.
We appreciate that.
Guys, guys again, if this isoverwhelming for you or you're
like gosh, I don't even knowwhere to start with this stuff,
reach out to Beck.
They'll hop on a free call withyou.
They'll talk some tax strategywith you and help hopefully, get
(53:13):
you started in the rightdirection, because this is stuff
you can take advantage of, likeyou said.
Caden said, you can either be onone end of the spectrum where
you're paying a bunch, or youcan be on the other end where
you're keeping a lot more ofyour money.
But a lot of times it's themoves you make between now and
December 31st or maybe April15th some of it, I know.
But regardless, have thatconversation sooner than later.
(53:33):
Cade, we always wrap with onefun question.
Now you're in Virginia, so thismight be tough for you, okay,
but I'm going to throw it outthere anyway and I'm going to
see what you come back with.
So do you have a favoriteWisconsin tradition or place you
have visited or would like tovisit here in this wonderful
state of Wisconsin?
Speaker 2 (53:53):
Yeah.
So I've got a good friend thatI met when we were doing some
service work in Finland.
He's from the Green Bay area.
Oh yeah, let's go, baby.
For the last like 10 years he'sbeen hyping up Green Bay
telling me oh man, you got toget out here.
The nature out here isbeautiful.
Go on camping.
There's beautiful, beautifullakes.
So I'm definitely.
(54:14):
I still talk to him every nowand then.
I just need to get a tripplanned to the Green Bay area.
Speaker 1 (54:21):
Get it done, buddy, I'm going to hold you
accountable to that.
Our office is in Green Bay,caden, so if you are coming to
town, let us know, and we'd loveto have you come, take a little
visit and get to meet some ofthe crew there.
It'll be a lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (54:32):
Yeah, absolutely, yeah, that'd be awesome.
Speaker 1 (54:34):
Well, brother, I appreciate you taking time out.
I know you're a hot commodityright now after all this stuff
Not that you're not normally,but especially after this bill
and everybody's trying tounderstand what the heck's all
in it and how do we make senseof it all and all that stuff and
I got a lot out of today.
So I appreciate thisinformation For you guys out
there.
If you're listening to this, aswe say on every episode, go
share this show.
A it helps us continue to bringgreat guests on the show for
(54:55):
you guys to bring a ton of value, like Caden did today.
But also it's going to help youguys build your network right.
People are going to know you'rein real estate investing.
They're going to know what youdo.
They're going to want to talkabout doing deals with you,
bring you private money.
Whatever the case is, it'sgoing to benefit you by sharing
the show and you're going tohelp out some other people.
There's people out there we'vehad on this show who got an
episode sent to them of maybenot our podcast, but somebody
(55:16):
else's podcast or our podcast,and it helped get them started
in real estate investing and itchanged their family's
trajectory for generations tocome.
So please go out there, sharethe show like, subscribe to all
that other fun stuff.
If you are out there and youwant to have a conversation
about just getting started inreal estate investing and you're
not ready to get on the buyer'slist, you can go to the contact
us part on our website, putthat information in or just give
(55:38):
us a call or text with thenumber on our on our website at
wisconsindiscountpropertiescom,and we will have a conversation
with you and try to help you getrolling in your own real estate
investing journey.
So until then, guys, thanks fortuning in.
We'll see you on the nextepisode.
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