January 2, 2025 • 53 mins
What happens when societal pressures lead us into life-altering decisions? Our guest bravely shares her story of marrying at 40, navigating the complexities of cultural expectations, and facing the heart-wrenching ordeal of a miscarriage with limited support. Her narrative is a powerful reminder of the courage it takes to prioritize personal happiness over fulfilling others' dreams. Her insights provide comfort and solidarity for those facing similar struggles, highlighting the often-overlooked strength required to break free from an unhappy marriage.
Before saying "I do," are we truly prepared for the lifelong commitments we're about to make? We shine a spotlight on crucial conversations every couple should have—finances, parenting, and the potential need for a prenuptial agreement. By sharing personal experiences of financial and emotional trials, we delve into the importance of understanding daily habits and achieving financial independence to safeguard against future conflicts. Our host brings to light the repercussions of being the primary financial supporter in a marriage and the importance of open, honest communication from the beginning.
Rediscovering life after divorce isn't just about survival—it's about thriving and fostering resilience in ourselves and our children. We discuss the multifaceted journey of healing, emphasizing mental health and the empowerment found in reclaiming control over one's circumstances. Our story explores navigating a challenging divorce while maintaining a positive environment for children, and the importance of a supportive community. We stress teaching future generations the value of independence and accountability, ensuring they are equipped to break free from cycles of dependency and lead empowered lives.
Hi and welcome to Thrive and Decide. I’m your host Sarah Thress. This podcast is intended to help women who are going through a divorce, continplating divorce or have lost a spouse feel seen, heard, understood and not alone. All the beautiful souls who share on here are coming from a place of vulnerability and a common belief that sharing your story will help others. You will also hear from industry experts on what to do and not do while going through a divorce.
Sarah Thress
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
sarah (00:00):
Hi and welcome to this week's episode of Thrive and
Decide.
This week I have a very braveand vulnerable individual that
is going to share her divorcestory.
You know everyone's story isunique and I always let people
know that.
You know they can share as muchor as little as they want to,
(00:24):
and they can use their name ornot, because people's names are
not what is important in thishealing process.
Their story is what isimportant.
So I just like to throw thatout there so that if anybody
listening is thinking, man, I'dreally love to share my story,
just know that you are free toshare as much or as little as
(00:48):
you want.
You are also free to use yourname, make up a name, whatever
you'd like to do.
Uh, the whole point of this isto help other women that are
going through a divorce or theloss of a spouse to feel seen,
heard, understood and not alone.
So that is the whole ideabehind this.
So thank you so much for takingtime out to share your divorce
(01:11):
story, of course.
So, um, yeah, I guess just kindof walk us through.
I mean, clearly nobody evergoes into a marriage thinking,
wow, this is going to be supercool for like three years and
then I'm going to peace outbecause this is just my, this is
my trial.
Um, you know and I mean maybepeople do, I don't know, I
(01:31):
haven't ever met anybody that isjust wanting a trial marriage,
but, um, so I guess, just kindof walk us through, like you
know your, your marriage, andthen how it just kind of it, it
turned and you know, I've I'vehad some people on the show that
tell me like oh my God, I knewbefore I even got married that
this was not the right person,but I didn't know it enough,
(01:52):
like it wasn't clear enough forme to stop it, so I went on
ahead and got married andthought everything was going to
be better, and then, and then itwasn't.
So, um, again, I just sharethat to just say you know,
everyone's story is unique andI'd love to hear yours, of
course.
guest (02:08):
Yes, well, so I met my ex and we quickly fell in love and
I knew that because of my age Iwas probably 40 years old when
I met him, I was probably 40years old when I met him that,
(02:32):
um, it was probably my lastchance um at potentially having
children, and so I think thatwas one of the things that kind
of led me to the path of quickmarriage.
Um, and I think you know, wewere probably together perhaps a
year and I I was pregnantbefore we even got married.
sarah (02:50):
Wow and um, that was a wow, not as in judgment.
That was a wow as in, like wow,you did move fast, like good
for you.
guest (02:58):
Oh yeah, no, no, and we were trying, and, and the fact
of the matter was I had amiscarriage the first time, um,
and, quite honestly, during thatprocess we weren't married.
This is still in the beginning.
We're dating, um, and we weretrying to have children.
Um, because of my age andbecause I've had a chronic
(03:20):
hypertension my entire life, Iknew I was going to be advanced
maternal age, giving birth, andI have an OBGYN as a cousin who
kept telling me you can't waitany longer.
And my own OBGYN kept saying yougot to do something.
(03:42):
If you're going to do something, it needs to be now, within six
months.
And then I had a miscarriageand I knew quite honestly during
that time that I did not wantto marry this person.
But for religious purposes andthe culture that I come from, I
knew that my parents would beheavily disappointed in me if I
(04:07):
didn't marry him.
Yeah, so I proceeded to getmarried to him on the back porch
of my home.
Um, it was lovely, um, and Iwas six months pregnant.
Seven months pregnant, yeah, um.
And then we proceeded to have afull blown wedding later, after
(04:34):
she was born.
Um, but I knew in that moment,because of the lack of support
that I had from him during mymiscarriage and the lack of
prioritizing me over his um, twoother children, um, I knew that
(04:56):
, probably really early on.
But when they say love is blind, it's blind, it's blind, yeah,
it, it is truly.
It blinds you and no matter, atthat point I was, I was
pregnant, so I knew in my heartright.
I knew in my mind there's noturning back at this point.
Um, my parents would never andyou know you say my parents
(05:20):
would never allow it.
You're 40 years old, what thehell.
Go have your baby by yourselfand fuck the man.
But in my world you don't dothat, and I'm first generation
here and you still obey yourelders, be it anyone, an aunt,
(05:44):
an uncle, but in particular yourparents.
Um, this was a huge no, no forme.
I mean, call me black sheep,yeah, um, because no one in my
family did what I did.
And then we were married forfive years and I just I was fed
(06:10):
up.
At one point I just said tomyself is this the existence
that I want to continue havingthe misery, misery?
(06:31):
I was close to 230 pounds atfive, three, and I've never been
that weight in my entire.
I was miserable, I wasdepressed.
I didn't care.
I ate away my emotions.
Yeah, I ate until I wascompletely stuffed and then,
when I was completely stuffed, Iate even more.
Mm-hmm, you were eating yourfeelings.
I was eating my feelings and Iremember this as clear as day.
(06:53):
My father was not here, he wasoverseas, and I was FaceTiming
him and I said I can't do thisanymore and I said, please tell
me that I have your support.
And I did not mean financially,I didn't.
(07:15):
I meant I needed his support.
I'm going to cry, it's okay,but I needed his support
emotionally.
I needed him to tell me it'sokay that you're doing this
because, quite honestly, I wasstill in that path of I need to
do as my parents tell me to do.
(07:37):
So if he tells me not todivorce my husband, I'm not
going to do it yeah, but he saidhe would support me and even my
mother said she would supportme in this, which was quite
surprising because we come froma very religious background and
(08:00):
for us it was.
It was that was important for meto have both of their supports
and, quite honestly, I lived inmisery and didn't tell anyone.
I didn't tell not a soul aboutthe misery that I was living in.
My parents didn't know.
My best friends didn't know.
(08:20):
My cousins didn't know who Igrew up with, as my family
didn't know.
My cousins didn't know who Igrew up with as my family.
No one knew the amount ofmisery that I was going through
and the fact that he wasn'tprioritizing me ever and the
only time he gave me emotion wasduring sex.
The only time he showed meaffection or support, Support
(08:46):
what support?
He didn't give me, support ofany kind and I'm just talking
emotionally right now but hedidn't give me even financial
support, so I did everything onmy own.
I took him and his two childreninto my home initially, which
(09:08):
ended up being too small for us,and then we ended up moving.
So I ended up purchasing a homelater that had more space for
all of us, dollar for dollar.
In his kid's savings, in mykid's savings, in my savings, I
(09:36):
was the one paying for mortgage,I was the one that was paying
for vehicles, I was the one thatwas paying for the entirety,
right, yeah.
And there was a certain pointwhere I was like and there was a
certain point where I was likewhat the fuck is going on?
Right now, I had to step out ofmy body for a minute and look
at myself and say this is notyou.
Why are you doing this?
Why are you doing this for aperson that keeps, when you try
(09:58):
to keep, getting back up, hestomps you back down into the
ground and then allows hischildren to do the same thing.
And you've got a baby.
Yeah, what are you doing?
sarah (10:13):
I know well, but you're, you're true.
Back to your point.
Love is blind, love wascompletely blind and you just,
you just do what you need to doto survive, and then it's not
until later on.
Once, once you've gotten intolike okay cool, like now I'm out
of fight or flight mode, nowI'm just in like survival mode,
and but once you stop and youtake a second, you're like holy
(10:35):
shit, why, why, why am I beingthis doormat?
Why am I, you know, like beingthe ATM for these people and why
do I feel like this is all myresponsibility when none of my
needs are met?
Yeah, but you don't see thatwhen you're in the moment.
guest (10:49):
Totally get it, don't, don't, don't, you're never seen.
And and here is I don't knowwhat clicked.
I honestly don't, because hehad made me and not I do not
have low self-esteem had made me, and not I do not have low
(11:10):
self-esteem, but I did.
During our marriage he causedme to have low, low self-esteem.
I did not.
I mean there were low thoughts,but I knew I had a baby.
Yeah, she, she needed me andI'll be damned if I was going to
let this man and his childrentreat me like this.
(11:31):
So there was a straw and I askedhim to get out and I gave him a
deadline and I said you willget out.
And his parents were visitingat that time and they helped him
move out and he did, and theyknew that we were having
marriage problems because theywere staying with us, uh,
(11:51):
frequently, right, um, and Iwould open up to them and I
would tell them, um, and theywould talk to him and, quite
honestly, he just didn't listen,yeah, and that made me feel
like I wasn't important enoughand I was like I am important
enough.
There was a point where I justsaid and my daughter's important
(12:14):
enough.
I'll be damned if I'm going toallow this man to for me not to
prioritize me but then to do thesame shit to my daughter?
No, yeah, absolutely not.
And I put my foot down and hegot out and, um close to
(12:34):
probably two years later, wewere divorced.
I paid for all attorney costsduring that time.
Uh, because I threw him out, hefiled bankruptcy.
I had, during our marriage,co-signed a loan um for him to
consolidate some debt which Iended up having to pay that
(12:59):
completely off um $20,000.
I ended up having to pay all onmy own because he filed
bankruptcy and I co-signed myfault.
So if I could give any advice,it would be there is light at
the end of the tunnel.
But prenup, prenup, prenup, ifyou're going to do something,
(13:20):
don't rush into anything.
Prenup, prenup, if you're goingto do something, don't rush
into anything.
Love isn't everything.
You need to talk about financesahead of time.
And I remember during ourmarriage he would ask why don't
we combine our checking accounts?
Don't do that, no.
sarah (13:37):
I've never had a combined checking account.
guest (13:39):
Don't do that, Absolutely do not do that.
And prenup, even if you think,well, I don't have anything, you
never know.
Down the road you could ownyour business and half of that
is his, half of the house is hisand you could be a male
listening, I'm not saying viceversa.
(14:00):
It can go both ways.
So you never know.
The one person could own abunch of properties and have a
lot of liquidity, but you know,you just never know what happens
down inside your marriage.
You can become this verysuccessful person and, quite
(14:20):
honestly, you could come, youcan inherit money.
Yeah, that half of it would beyour husband or your wife's in a
divorce and that's not yourchoice to make, right?
So in my divorce, I decided todo a disillusion.
(14:41):
I knew he didn't have any money.
He just filed bankruptcy, right, right.
And I knew he didn't have anymoney, he just filed bankruptcy,
right, right.
And I ended up just paying hisdebt consolidation.
And oh, by the way, this waslike the third or fourth time
during our marriage, which wasonly five years, that he had to
consolidate debt.
Um, our, yeah, so anyway.
(15:02):
Um, this man was, I knew, wasnever going to be financially
well off.
He was never going to be ableto support himself and his
children.
I knew that.
So I did a dissolution and Ihired an attorney who I ended up
(15:24):
paying all costs for and duringthe negotiations, like I said,
that was two years of two and ahalf, maybe years of
negotiations and all attorneycosts were paid by me.
So that was suffocating for me.
It was horrible.
And at that time he didn't havevisitation of my daughter Not
(15:50):
that he ever supported her fromthe get-go.
It was always me Financially,emotionally, everything, I mean.
Even today, I was cutting hernails and he never does that.
sarah (16:04):
Yeah.
guest (16:04):
And he never reads to her and he never tries to better
her for the world.
I want her to be.
I have a religious background,so I want her to be religious.
I want her to believe in God.
Well, one day he said, just outof the blue I don't believe in
God, and so you can believe inwhatever you want to believe in.
(16:29):
It doesn't have to be God.
I understand that there aredifferent, but for me, I want
her believing that there is aGod.
Yeah, hence the reason she goesto a school that talks about
God.
Right, she goes to a schoolthat talks about God, right, um,
but it doesn't.
It's not just about thereligion piece, it's about, I
(16:52):
know her reading skills aren'twhere they need to be, so I work
on them with her.
Instead, he has her playingvideo games and playing on her
iPad.
Well, I think there needs to bea limit on her iPad.
Our parenting differences wereextreme.
They were extremely different.
(17:13):
Mine were very strict andstructured, and he thought that
bad behavior should not haveconsequences, and I know there
are a lot of people out therethat believe that too.
I get that, but we were notthere.
So before you get married,prenup, talk about finances,
(17:33):
keep them separate and talkabout your parenting, because
you need to be on the same page.
If you're going to havechildren, you might not have
children, but if you're going tohave children or dogs even
because that goes for the samething the training piece of it
he left it all to me need todiscuss, prior to engaging in a
(18:11):
lifelong commitment with someonethat you're going to live with,
cleanliness, live with thembeforehand, right, live with
them beforehand.
And if you're going to getmarried, then prenup, because
then you get to know their dailyhabits.
You get to know, oh, he doesn'tpick up his underwear and if
you're okay with it, fine, Iwasn't, I'm a very clean person.
He would literally leave cupsand plates by the bedroom door
(18:38):
and step over them to getdownstairs and then I would take
them down.
sarah (18:46):
Wow, he really had it good.
I don't think he understood.
guest (18:50):
That's what I thought when I came, when I came out of
my cloud of love.
I finally came to therealization.
I was like he really doesn'tknow, and even if I told him, he
wasn't going to understand.
So I feel like that's somethingpeople need to know too.
(19:11):
When people say the zebra isnot going to change its stripes,
it's not no matter what you sayto them or how much you love
them or how much you feel like.
Whatever you do or buy or putinto savings for their kids,
(19:31):
like I did, it's not going tomake him love me anymore.
It's not going to change hisbehavior.
It's not going to make him giveme the support that I wanted,
which was emotional, notfinancial.
That's all I was asking for andthe support in prioritizing me.
(19:51):
I'm not saying that I wasbetter than his children, but I
was taught God right, and thenyourself, and then your your
marriage Right.
sarah (20:06):
So at any rate, um so clearly you were the breadwinner
in you know, in your marriage,and then, unfortunately, during
the divorce, you also were thefinancial person involved in
that.
Now, a lot of times what wehear in divorce is that you know
(20:27):
, the male has to pay spousalsupport or child support or
whatever.
I have to imagine that it mightbe a little bit different.
Um, in your you know, in yoursituation, do you now have to
pay spousal support or childsupport?
Or you know how did you guys goabout that Cause?
I'm sure that was not an easything for you.
(20:49):
I mean, it took two and a halfyears to even get to that point.
So I'm sure none of this waseasy, because nothing about
divorce is easy.
guest (20:55):
Correct.
Um, yes, um.
There were so many negotiationsand so much money and I had a
terrific attorney she wasfantastic.
But the problem was he wasn'tgiving in and I knew he was
never going to have money.
(21:15):
And I knew that if and towardsthe end was where he brought up
the fact that he wanted to sueme for child support.
And I thought I know this personbecause I've lived with him for
five years and knew him oneyear prior, right Two years
(21:40):
prior prior, and I knew thatthis man was never going to be
financially stable enough to do.
And so for me, and he had twochildren still from another
marriage and this new child.
So I thought, for thebetterment of my own child, I
(22:04):
would give in to whatever hewanted so that I wouldn't have
to pay child support and justsay I'll pay for pretty much
everything in regards to mydaughter in order to avoid child
support.
And there is a very seriousreason behind that.
I knew that if I paid him500,000, whatever it is a month
(22:30):
it would go towards his habitsof eating and his other children
who still hadn't been tocollege, right, or to whatever.
Yeah, but he's a very selfishman.
It was a very um one-sided andhe, you know, during our
marriage he made me believe thatI was um wrong.
(22:54):
He made me every single time wehad an argument I was wrong.
That's incorrect.
No, that's crazy.
And when your self-esteem is solow, you start believing it.
So I, honestly, I'm thankfuland I'm blessed, because God
(23:14):
fate, whatever you want tobelieve it was.
For me it was God right.
He helped me see outside ofthat cloud and be like you are.
Are you crazy?
What are you doing?
It was almost as though Godslapped me across the face and
said get out.
sarah (23:32):
Yeah.
guest (23:33):
I know that you're not supposed to in your religion to
get divorced, but get out.
This man doesn't appreciate youand his children don't
appreciate you and he's teachingthem to not appreciate you.
And then I thought mydaughter's not going to
appreciate me because everyonearound me in my family is not
(23:59):
appreciating what I do.
Yeah, she needs to see a happymom, a happy, healthy, and
appreciate the stuff that I cando for her.
So if I was going to give intothe custody, I knew that my
funds were not going to go tosupport my daughter.
So I agreed to pay forextracurricular.
(24:22):
I have her in private schoolNow I have um help with that.
I I uh go through a programcalled ed choice.
That um allows me to get somesupport for her tuition.
Um, ed choice, and I don't knowhow many people know about this.
(24:45):
I was going to say I would lovefor you to talk about that.
Yeah, this is, this isimportant because I'm getting
high quality education right nowfor my daughter.
Um, she's learning, she's inkindergarten, she was learning
multiplication and addition and,uh, she already knows in first
(25:06):
grade how to write in cursive,which they don't teach anymore.
Right, um and um.
So anyway, at any rate, edchoice.
They have two options for you.
It it could be um, they couldanalyze your financials to see
if you qualify for a higheramount in a scholarship for for
(25:43):
from EdCho.
You're living in a failingschool district, you qualify,
and it pretty much gives me halfof her tuition right now.
Yeah, so, uh, her tuition islike 13,000 and um, they pay for
(26:06):
six, 6,600 of that.
Ed choice, no matter what my,my um income is, as long as I'm
in a failing, which is my solereason for purchasing a home in
a failing school district.
Yeah, so that I could continueto send her there and I'll do
(26:26):
whatever it takes.
Little by little, I put moneyaway so that I have enough to
send her again next year, and ifI can't, we'll figure things
out.
sarah (26:38):
Yeah, but I love that and I didn't even know that that
existed and that's good to knowthat you know.
If somebody you know, maybe, isliving in a situation you know
their marital home is in alocation that is not a failing
school district passing, thenthey could move into a failing
(27:01):
school district.
There are some to choose fromaround here.
We won't mention them, butthere are some that they can
choose from and they could thenlook into this ed choice and be
able to send their childsomewhere else.
guest (27:19):
Yeah, their child somewhere else, yeah, and so I
think the thing that I would sayis and I pay for her to go to,
um, our language school.
I'm not going to say, but I payfor her to go there so that she
could learn our native language.
And, um, I pay for her to go toa private school and I'm
(27:39):
grateful.
I you know going through theprocess and paying my attorney,
and each time I would get aninvoice I'd be ticked off and I
would be like fucking bastardand yeah, no, there is an end to
all of this.
Okay, it fucking costs me allthat shit, but you know what?
I have my daughter.
I have my happiness now she'sgot a quality education.
(28:01):
Things keep happening that arebenefiting me now, more so than
when I was married.
Right, good things arehappening, great job.
My daughter's got a highquality education.
I found EdChoice for, crying outloud in the first year that I
was offering that.
They were offering it at herschool and, quite honestly,
(28:24):
something in my head said you'renever going to get approved for
this.
You're never.
Yes, you are, because thetraditional doesn't matter what
income you're making.
Wow, they offer it if you livein a.
And I only did it because whenI got out of my marital home and
we sold it, I moved into afailing school district,
(28:48):
columbus.
So it was.
You know, if you're living inColumbus, look into it and you
want to send your children to ahigh quality school, you can
probably do it.
Yeah, and the income based oneis nice because you can play
around with a calculator and youcan choose either.
(29:11):
So if you're a W two person,you can choose, like if you're
incented on your work that youdo, let's say you get bonuses
you can use your pay stubs toqualify for your income, your
tax returns or your W-2s,depending on what's like less.
sarah (29:33):
What's going to be the best?
guest (29:34):
Right, right, and so you can play around with it.
It's really nice, I haven't doneit.
But I had another parent whowas talking to me about it and
she was doing it.
It's really nice.
Uh, I haven't done it, um, butI had a?
Um, another parent who wastalking to me about it and she
was doing it.
But, um, the thing that I wouldsay to people who are afraid of
going through divorce, there'ssupport out there, there are
(29:59):
people, there are friends and,more so than not, people
understand.
Maybe people don't talk about itbecause in our society,
everyone, and you see it, it'son Facebook, it's in social
media oh, my husband, this, mywife, this.
Look at my children.
Oh, a straight A's.
(30:20):
It's not behind the scenes,things are going on.
I'm telling you.
There are people who have beenmarried for 40 years that are
getting divorced.
It was never right, and whatI'll say is it's because they're
living in that mentality ofdivorce is not acceptable.
It's not good.
(30:42):
But you know what?
Is it good for my mental health?
It was in my case.
It was for my mental health Ineeded to get out of there and
for my daughter's mental healthfuture.
She was young, so it was good,right?
So she didn't know.
She didn't know, yeah, and shedoesn't remember us.
But then you run the risk of hewas the emotional one in our
(31:08):
relationship.
He cried a lot and I knew it.
So after I threw him out and hehad visitation rights with her
afterwards he would cry with herand say I wish we were all in
the same house.
So then she would come back.
And so you have to filter thatsomehow.
You have to just make themunderstand that that's not going
(31:30):
to happen and it was because itwasn't a good situation for you
and it wasn't a good situationfor me.
Honey, we can't ever be in thesame house ever again.
You have to explain it so thisyoung child understands.
And she still brings it up tome because she remembers those
conversations after the fact.
(31:50):
So do I want her to livethrough that turmoil?
No, and I don't want her to seeme that way.
No, an unhappy parent, yeah,all the time.
I want her to see that thriving, confident, successful,
(32:11):
independent.
You can do this on your own.
It's not a big deal, you can doit.
You can make it happen andthere's ways.
Yeah, ed, choice is one of thereasons why I'm here.
Yeah, and she's in a greatschool.
Yeah, everything kind of fate,god, whatever placed things in
my way to make things positiveafter the divorce.
(32:35):
It seems like they're not goingto be, but they are.
Yeah, there's light.
sarah (32:42):
Yeah.
guest (32:43):
And you've experienced it .
sarah (32:50):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
I mean, I still remember when Ifirst started going through my
divorce.
I was so ashamed, I just feltlike a failure.
I didn't even tell anyone in myoffice that I was getting a
divorce.
For six months I continued towear my ring, I continued to go
into work and just act likeeverything was great.
I would go home and I'd actlike everything was great and
(33:10):
I'd put, you know, my daughterto bed and then I would sob
uncontrollably for hours in thefetal position on my bathroom
floor and I'd get up and repeatevery single day for a year.
And then I started slowlytalking about it and realized,
oh, okay, this isn't that scary.
And oh, people do.
Actually, you know, they'vebeen through this.
(33:31):
I'm not the very first person toever get a divorce, nor am I
the last.
And I learned, you know, likejust all of the things that I
had let go of.
I, you know, just like you, Iwent into the marriage very
confident and very capable andthen, slowly, my self-esteem
went away to the point that Ididn't even recognize my self.
(33:56):
Yeah, sets in, yeah.
And then I was like Holy crap,like I just really became a
whole nother person.
Like this sucks.
Um so yes, so to your point.
You know I love that now yourdaughter gets to see a confident
, competent, successful mom whomade the right choices.
(34:17):
And even if it is ugly for alittle bit when she goes to see
her dad and he's crying about itand whatever, eventually she's
going to know the truth andshe's going to understand it.
You don't even have to say it,she's just she's going to see it
.
Yeah.
guest (34:34):
Yeah, I don't have to say anything.
Uh, he does, on his end he doesand his kids do, and that's
okay.
At this point I need the women,the men out there to know there
is life after divorce.
sarah (34:49):
Trust me.
guest (34:50):
You may not want to date right away, but divorce is
acceptable, especially if itmeans your mental health is
going to be 100% better.
Your mental health is going tobe 100% better.
I'm telling you, I lost 60pounds as soon as I threw him
out of the house.
I just started cleaning andgetting rid of things, because
(35:12):
my intent was to sell this hugehome that we all lived in.
I wasn't going to live therewith my daughter, and so I ended
up getting rid of things andyou know, you start doing spring
cleaning and you're movingaround, you forget to eat and
you just, I just, and I feltgood, I felt like I was
accomplishing things, and I knewdeep down.
(35:34):
Maybe I didn't say my say it tomyself at that time, but I knew
deep down right then, and thereI was doing what was better for
her and I was doing what wasbetter for me at that moment,
but I learned it later.
You keep thinking, even throughthe negotiations with your
attorney and everything.
You're like there's not life,it's dark, it's all bad, it's
(36:00):
not, though.
Open up to somebody that knowsand has experienced it, because
there is light at the end of thetunnel and it doesn't mean that
you have to.
What I would say is don't talkabout it with your children,
about how you hate that man oryou hate that woman.
(36:23):
That's another thing, because Idon't want her to see me in that
light.
I don't want her to see mehating her father.
I do not want to be that person, and if he does, that's okay,
and if his kids want to, that'sokay.
But I'm not going to be thatperson that's bad-mouthing the
(36:43):
other one.
I'd love to have a betterco-parenting situation, but it
is what it is now.
Yeah, and there are times whereyou have to just bite your
tongue and not say anything,especially through the
negotiations, when you're goingback and forth with the
attorneys.
You have to just bite yourtongue at that moment and not
(37:05):
say anything wrong.
But there is positivity behindit all.
Definitely, as long as you canlift yourself out of that cloud
of love what you thought waslove and know that there can be
success.
sarah (37:21):
Definitely it's almost like you're on.
Um, I always tell people you'rekind of on a roller coaster and
you know, some days are goingto be like you're going to go
down low, and some days you'rejust going to feel so low and
that's okay, cry it out, leaninto it, feel those feelings
fully, because then the next dayyou can pull up your big girl
panties and you can move on, andthen it's going to go up and
(37:42):
like, eventually your highs gethigher, your lows don't get as
low and you start to kind ofeven out a little bit.
But it's a process, you know,you're never just going to.
It's not a light switch, it'snot a you know, there's not just
some quick fix at all.
(38:04):
So you know, obviously you knowthat, know that, um, when you
were going through it, did youhave like good friends that you
could turn to, or did you havepeople that maybe even?
What I find too in talking withpeople is that sometimes they
lose friendships over it,because either they were friends
with both you know both spousesand they don't know they don't
want to choose a side or they dochoose a side, or they're just
like what.
I don't know, they don't wantto choose a side, or they do
choose a side, or they're justlike well, I don't know what to
(38:25):
say Like I'm super uncomfortable.
guest (38:27):
Yeah, I guess I would say that I because a lot of my
family were my friends I didn'tlose any friends.
I will say that during thechaos of the marriage, none of
my family kind of knew what Iwas going through.
(38:48):
I kept it silent.
But if you're in that kind ofrelationship where you feel like
you can't tell people or you'reputting on a facade for some
reason, Um, you know, I wasdoing that.
sarah (39:03):
I was doing.
guest (39:04):
I was one of those people .
I was like, oh, my husband'sexcellent, he's helping me with
this and fuck, no, he wasn'tright, you know.
But don't do that, but open upto someone and talk to them,
because they're going throughsimilar things for sure.
If you have a trusted friendthat you can talk to, um, I, I,
(39:25):
I know that that you will getthat support that you need, um,
but I, I didn't lose anybody.
But what I will say is um, evennow, those friends who are my
family, um, those friends whoare my family, um, are telling
(39:46):
me what a strong person I was,even though I doubted myself
during the process.
I doubted how could I getthrough this process?
It's so horrible.
I'm divorced, I have a baby, Idon't have anywhere to live, I,
you know, there it was.
It was a seller's market thenand not enough inventory, so it
(40:06):
was like I selling my house thatI can't afford anymore, and you
know so there were a lot of badthings that you went through.
But, um, if you can open up tosomeone and talk to them, that's
what's really key.
Even if it means going to tosomeone and talk to them, that's
what's really key.
Even if it means going to acounselor.
Talk to them.
(40:26):
If you feel like you can't trustthe people that are around you
because they're also friendswith your partner, then talk to
somebody else, because you cando this on your own.
But in that moment that you'regoing through all this chaos,
you probably don't think youhave the strength to do it.
But you can I think it was God,but at any, because I didn't go
(40:53):
to a counselor and then I didhave the support.
I can't tell you how many timessome of my best friends were
telling me you're the strongestperson that I know.
You get knocked down, you getback up, you get knocked down,
you get back up Every singletime.
I've noticed you don't ask foranything, you just continue
going on your path and no oneever supports you, but you just
(41:17):
keep doing it.
Somehow you have a negativething happen, something blacks
you out, punches you out, andyou get back up and you do it
and you just find a way.
And it's true.
I look back on my past in thosemoments.
There have been several timeswhere I've been knocked down,
(41:40):
punched down, and you thinkshe's not getting back up, right
?
No, she is.
I am.
It was me.
Hello, yeah.
sarah (41:50):
So, yeah.
Yeah, well, and I, um, I lovedthat.
Um, you know, before we startedrecording, you had made a
comment about how you know, hereyou were trying to help your ex
and you know he just was justpushing you down and pushing you
down and pushing you down, Likeyou know.
I don't know if you rememberwhat you were talking about, but
(42:12):
if you wanted to repeat that.
It was so powerful.
guest (42:15):
Yeah, there were times I literally I recall this, and
there was one time in particularand his parents were visiting.
At that time I was on my kneesand I was in tears and I was
like you keep stomping on me.
I used that.
I used that phrase because Iwanted him to know I am the dirt
(42:40):
beneath your feet.
You make me feel like that.
I don't understand how somebodywho does so much for you, how
can you continue to put yourfoot on top of my head?
Every time I try to get a deepbreath, you're pushing me down
underneath the water.
Let's just say to use another,use another phrase.
(43:01):
Because he was drowning me andI remember going through
marriage counseling.
We had three marriage counselorsin that time frame, in the five
years that we were married.
I told the last counselor thatwe were with.
I said I've got one kid on myleft side choking me with their
(43:22):
arms around me.
I've got the other kid, his kidon the right side of me.
He is choking me from the back,so he's got his hands on my
neck, holding me on the frontand then my daughter, who's just
a baby, is on my leg, who isdependent on me.
So where do I go from here?
Because they're choking the airdependent on me.
So where do I go from here?
Because they're choking the airout of me, yeah, but my
(43:45):
daughter needs me, but they'rechoking me.
So now, what do I do?
I've got to get out of thischoke hold, but there are three
people who are choking me.
That's how I felt.
Um, I know, I know that soundsso drastic, but that's how it is
yeah.
(44:05):
Uh, you know how they say theball and chain.
It wasn't a ball and chain, itwas.
People's hands were literallychoking me out of the air.
I felt like I did not want tolive anymore.
I hate to say that, becausethat's the worst thing that God
would want me to say is that youdon't want to live anymore.
I hate to say that becausethat's the worst thing that God
would want me to say is that youdon't want to be in this world
(44:26):
anymore.
But there was reason for me tolive my daughter.
sarah (44:31):
Yeah, but I think that it's okay to recognize that you
had that feeling and honor thatfeeling and also know that you
didn't make that choice and youknow you grew from it.
So you know, I want to makesure that like you know anyone
that's ever felt that I meanI've felt that way where I'm
like, oh my God, I just want tofucking crawl into a hole Like I
(44:54):
can't, but I think theimportant thing is when you feel
that.
guest (44:57):
It's not that you don't want to live anymore, it's you
don't want to live like thisanymore, you don't want to live
in that chaos.
It's not that you don't want tolive in this world.
There is another world that youcan live in, apart from that
chaos there is.
(45:19):
Yeah, I think that's where Idon't know where that strength
came from, because I was there,right, I was feeling like I
don't want to live anymore, butI know I have to live for my
daughter.
I guess I know where it came.
I knew that if I didn't dosomething, he wasn't going to be
there to support her in themanner that I could.
(45:41):
And I'm not talking financially, I'm talking about to be there
to support her, to do the thingsfor her that she needs, to help
her, along with her education.
And I'm not just talkingprivate education, fuck that,
even if she didn't have privateeducation.
I'm talking supporting herwhere it's needed, not sitting
(46:01):
her in front of a fucking TV,right.
I'm talking about being anactual parent and teaching her
to be independent.
I watched him throughout ourmarriage and he would.
His kids would forget cleatsand they would forget
Chromebooks or Chrome chargersand he would take.
He would drop whatever he wasdoing at work, leave his work
(46:25):
and go, take it to school.
No, I'm the type of parentwhere I'm like you forget it,
then you get in trouble.
Sorry, you suffer theconsequences with your teacher
or whoever, whatever it is.
If you can't, then I'm sorry,that's your problem.
You forgot your cleats?
You can't play football, thenthat's your problem.
(46:47):
Sorry, then my daughter, if sheforgets her dance shoes, that's
your problem.
I'm sorry.
Well, she's too young now, butI'm just saying the problem is
we, we in today's society, weprovide too much for our
children in that manner.
Right?
We get their lunches, we gettheir bags, we get everything.
(47:07):
She forgot her water bottle.
I said is it mommy'sresponsibility to get your water
bottle?
It's not mommy's responsibility, right?
So I'm trying to teach herright now to be the most
independent in charge leader,woman of the new world, right?
Like we have to we have to teach, even if it's not a girl.
(47:28):
I'm just saying these boys whoare dependent on their moms and
and they're doing everything forthem right yeah which, raising
another generation of mama'sboys.
This is what I'm saying.
So I don't want my daughtergrowing up thinking that mom's
(47:48):
always going to be there toprovide or remember to grab my
socks, or to grab my shoes, orto grab my water bottle.
I want her to be an independent, strong woman so she doesn't
end up in the same situationthat I did.
Yeah, and if she does okay,that's okay.
Yeah, but she can lift herselfout of that chaos.
(48:11):
Yeah.
sarah (48:13):
I think that's such a really, really good point too,
and I, you know, thank you somuch for being so vulnerable and
sharing that Um.
But I think that's such a goodthing for women and men that are
going through this process toremember that, if there are
children involved, children arewatching and they're going to
(48:34):
see what you do and, even thoughyou don't want them to have to
go through what you went through, maybe they're going to end up
going through that and that'sokay.
Again, we just need tonormalize that.
Whatever you're going through,that's okay because you're going
to get through it.
But to your point, by youhelping to raise a strong,
independent woman if she was toget in a situation like that
(48:57):
because we all hope that youknow our children make better
choices than we did and theydon't have to go through this
and all that blah, blah, blah.
But you know, knowing that shesaw a strong, independent woman
pull herself up, become, youknow, that person that you know,
even if she doesn't rememberyou as the, you know, pushed,
(49:18):
beat down woman, she's going tojust see this positive person,
and so I think that's, you know,definitely a strong point to
make sure that people that arelistening, understand that your
kids, whether they're you knowtalking to you or not, they're
watching they're seeing whatyou're doing and they're
learning from you.
guest (49:35):
Yeah, I will say, uh, I think it may have been my mother
because she went through itRight.
I think it may have been mymother because she went through
it Right.
And I recall that, um, I hateto say it, but my father had cut
her off financially, right, andshe was, um, you know, in a
different country, not where shegrew up.
(49:56):
Um, she had two children.
So what did she do?
She was like I can lay down andplay dead, and then what
happens to my children, right,or will I have my children, you
know, in my home with me, livingwith me, if I don't step up to
the plate and do something?
She got three jobs.
She paid for the mortgage, shepaid for groceries, she paid for
(50:17):
us to do extracurricularactivities.
She did what she had to, yeah,and so I think, in watching that
, like you said, my daughter iswatching everything that I do.
Well, so did I.
I watched it and she wentthrough.
It was a difficult divorce andit was way unacceptable back
(50:38):
then in our culture and ourreligion and in our society.
Even, yeah, still, it wasunacceptable to be divorced,
right, and to watch her do that,I think, gave me the strength
to go through my own divorce andknow that it was going to be
okay.
She made it through.
She made it through verysuccessfully.
sarah (50:59):
So, yeah, I love it, made it through.
She made it through verysuccessfully.
So, yeah, I love it.
Thank you so much for being soopen, so vulnerable, um, and
just so gracious to share yourstory.
I really appreciate it and Iguarantee that you know someone
listening, or multiple peoplelistening are.
You know they're gettingsomething from this and you are
(51:20):
helping to heal other women justby by talking.
guest (51:23):
Glad to help.
Thanks, excellent.
sarah (51:26):
Thanks for having me.
Yeah, thank you so much, andthank you so much for tuning in
and I will see you next time onthrive and decide.
Hi and welcome to this week's episode of Thrive and
Decide.
This week I have a very braveand vulnerable individual that
is going to share her divorcestory.
You know everyone's story isunique and I always let people
know that.
You know they can share as muchor as little as they want to,
(00:24):
and they can use their name ornot, because people's names are
not what is important in thishealing process.
Their story is what isimportant.
So I just like to throw thatout there so that if anybody
listening is thinking, man, I'dreally love to share my story,
just know that you are free toshare as much or as little as
(00:48):
you want.
You are also free to use yourname, make up a name, whatever
you'd like to do.
Uh, the whole point of this isto help other women that are
going through a divorce or theloss of a spouse to feel seen,
heard, understood and not alone.
So that is the whole ideabehind this.
So thank you so much for takingtime out to share your divorce
(01:11):
story, of course.
So, um, yeah, I guess just kindof walk us through.
I mean, clearly nobody evergoes into a marriage thinking,
wow, this is going to be supercool for like three years and
then I'm going to peace outbecause this is just my, this is
my trial.
Um, you know and I mean maybepeople do, I don't know, I
(01:31):
haven't ever met anybody that isjust wanting a trial marriage,
but, um, so I guess, just kindof walk us through, like you
know your, your marriage, andthen how it just kind of it, it
turned and you know, I've I'vehad some people on the show that
tell me like oh my God, I knewbefore I even got married that
this was not the right person,but I didn't know it enough,
(01:52):
like it wasn't clear enough forme to stop it, so I went on
ahead and got married andthought everything was going to
be better, and then, and then itwasn't.
So, um, again, I just sharethat to just say you know,
everyone's story is unique andI'd love to hear yours, of
course.
guest (02:08):
Yes, well, so I met my ex and we quickly fell in love and
I knew that because of my age Iwas probably 40 years old when
I met him, I was probably 40years old when I met him that,
(02:32):
um, it was probably my lastchance um at potentially having
children, and so I think thatwas one of the things that kind
of led me to the path of quickmarriage.
Um, and I think you know, wewere probably together perhaps a
year and I I was pregnantbefore we even got married.
sarah (02:50):
Wow and um, that was a wow, not as in judgment.
That was a wow as in, like wow,you did move fast, like good
for you.
guest (02:58):
Oh yeah, no, no, and we were trying, and, and the fact
of the matter was I had amiscarriage the first time, um,
and, quite honestly, during thatprocess we weren't married.
This is still in the beginning.
We're dating, um, and we weretrying to have children.
Um, because of my age andbecause I've had a chronic
(03:20):
hypertension my entire life, Iknew I was going to be advanced
maternal age, giving birth, andI have an OBGYN as a cousin who
kept telling me you can't waitany longer.
And my own OBGYN kept saying yougot to do something.
(03:42):
If you're going to do something, it needs to be now, within six
months.
And then I had a miscarriageand I knew quite honestly during
that time that I did not wantto marry this person.
But for religious purposes andthe culture that I come from, I
knew that my parents would beheavily disappointed in me if I
(04:07):
didn't marry him.
Yeah, so I proceeded to getmarried to him on the back porch
of my home.
Um, it was lovely, um, and Iwas six months pregnant.
Seven months pregnant, yeah, um.
And then we proceeded to have afull blown wedding later, after
(04:34):
she was born.
Um, but I knew in that moment,because of the lack of support
that I had from him during mymiscarriage and the lack of
prioritizing me over his um, twoother children, um, I knew that
(04:56):
, probably really early on.
But when they say love is blind, it's blind, it's blind, yeah,
it, it is truly.
It blinds you and no matter, atthat point I was, I was
pregnant, so I knew in my heartright.
I knew in my mind there's noturning back at this point.
Um, my parents would never andyou know you say my parents
(05:20):
would never allow it.
You're 40 years old, what thehell.
Go have your baby by yourselfand fuck the man.
But in my world you don't dothat, and I'm first generation
here and you still obey yourelders, be it anyone, an aunt,
(05:44):
an uncle, but in particular yourparents.
Um, this was a huge no, no forme.
I mean, call me black sheep,yeah, um, because no one in my
family did what I did.
And then we were married forfive years and I just I was fed
(06:10):
up.
At one point I just said tomyself is this the existence
that I want to continue havingthe misery, misery?
(06:31):
I was close to 230 pounds atfive, three, and I've never been
that weight in my entire.
I was miserable, I wasdepressed.
I didn't care.
I ate away my emotions.
Yeah, I ate until I wascompletely stuffed and then,
when I was completely stuffed, Iate even more.
Mm-hmm, you were eating yourfeelings.
I was eating my feelings and Iremember this as clear as day.
(06:53):
My father was not here, he wasoverseas, and I was FaceTiming
him and I said I can't do thisanymore and I said, please tell
me that I have your support.
And I did not mean financially,I didn't.
(07:15):
I meant I needed his support.
I'm going to cry, it's okay,but I needed his support
emotionally.
I needed him to tell me it'sokay that you're doing this
because, quite honestly, I wasstill in that path of I need to
do as my parents tell me to do.
(07:37):
So if he tells me not todivorce my husband, I'm not
going to do it yeah, but he saidhe would support me and even my
mother said she would supportme in this, which was quite
surprising because we come froma very religious background and
(08:00):
for us it was.
It was that was important for meto have both of their supports
and, quite honestly, I lived inmisery and didn't tell anyone.
I didn't tell not a soul aboutthe misery that I was living in.
My parents didn't know.
My best friends didn't know.
(08:20):
My cousins didn't know who Igrew up with, as my family
didn't know.
My cousins didn't know who Igrew up with as my family.
No one knew the amount ofmisery that I was going through
and the fact that he wasn'tprioritizing me ever and the
only time he gave me emotion wasduring sex.
The only time he showed meaffection or support, Support
(08:46):
what support?
He didn't give me, support ofany kind and I'm just talking
emotionally right now but hedidn't give me even financial
support, so I did everything onmy own.
I took him and his two childreninto my home initially, which
(09:08):
ended up being too small for us,and then we ended up moving.
So I ended up purchasing a homelater that had more space for
all of us, dollar for dollar.
In his kid's savings, in mykid's savings, in my savings, I
(09:36):
was the one paying for mortgage,I was the one that was paying
for vehicles, I was the one thatwas paying for the entirety,
right, yeah.
And there was a certain pointwhere I was like and there was a
certain point where I was likewhat the fuck is going on?
Right now, I had to step out ofmy body for a minute and look
at myself and say this is notyou.
Why are you doing this?
Why are you doing this for aperson that keeps, when you try
(09:58):
to keep, getting back up, hestomps you back down into the
ground and then allows hischildren to do the same thing.
And you've got a baby.
Yeah, what are you doing?
sarah (10:13):
I know well, but you're, you're true.
Back to your point.
Love is blind, love wascompletely blind and you just,
you just do what you need to doto survive, and then it's not
until later on.
Once, once you've gotten intolike okay cool, like now I'm out
of fight or flight mode, nowI'm just in like survival mode,
and but once you stop and youtake a second, you're like holy
(10:35):
shit, why, why, why am I beingthis doormat?
Why am I, you know, like beingthe ATM for these people and why
do I feel like this is all myresponsibility when none of my
needs are met?
Yeah, but you don't see thatwhen you're in the moment.
guest (10:49):
Totally get it, don't, don't, don't, you're never seen.
And and here is I don't knowwhat clicked.
I honestly don't, because hehad made me and not I do not
have low self-esteem had made me, and not I do not have low
(11:10):
self-esteem, but I did.
During our marriage he causedme to have low, low self-esteem.
I did not.
I mean there were low thoughts,but I knew I had a baby.
Yeah, she, she needed me andI'll be damned if I was going to
let this man and his childrentreat me like this.
(11:31):
So there was a straw and I askedhim to get out and I gave him a
deadline and I said you willget out.
And his parents were visitingat that time and they helped him
move out and he did, and theyknew that we were having
marriage problems because theywere staying with us, uh,
(11:51):
frequently, right, um, and Iwould open up to them and I
would tell them, um, and theywould talk to him and, quite
honestly, he just didn't listen,yeah, and that made me feel
like I wasn't important enoughand I was like I am important
enough.
There was a point where I justsaid and my daughter's important
(12:14):
enough.
I'll be damned if I'm going toallow this man to for me not to
prioritize me but then to do thesame shit to my daughter?
No, yeah, absolutely not.
And I put my foot down and hegot out and, um close to
(12:34):
probably two years later, wewere divorced.
I paid for all attorney costsduring that time.
Uh, because I threw him out, hefiled bankruptcy.
I had, during our marriage,co-signed a loan um for him to
consolidate some debt which Iended up having to pay that
(12:59):
completely off um $20,000.
I ended up having to pay all onmy own because he filed
bankruptcy and I co-signed myfault.
So if I could give any advice,it would be there is light at
the end of the tunnel.
But prenup, prenup, prenup, ifyou're going to do something,
(13:20):
don't rush into anything.
Prenup, prenup, if you're goingto do something, don't rush
into anything.
Love isn't everything.
You need to talk about financesahead of time.
And I remember during ourmarriage he would ask why don't
we combine our checking accounts?
Don't do that, no.
sarah (13:37):
I've never had a combined checking account.
guest (13:39):
Don't do that, Absolutely do not do that.
And prenup, even if you think,well, I don't have anything, you
never know.
Down the road you could ownyour business and half of that
is his, half of the house is hisand you could be a male
listening, I'm not saying viceversa.
(14:00):
It can go both ways.
So you never know.
The one person could own abunch of properties and have a
lot of liquidity, but you know,you just never know what happens
down inside your marriage.
You can become this verysuccessful person and, quite
(14:20):
honestly, you could come, youcan inherit money.
Yeah, that half of it would beyour husband or your wife's in a
divorce and that's not yourchoice to make, right?
So in my divorce, I decided todo a disillusion.
(14:41):
I knew he didn't have any money.
He just filed bankruptcy, right, right.
And I knew he didn't have anymoney, he just filed bankruptcy,
right, right.
And I ended up just paying hisdebt consolidation.
And oh, by the way, this waslike the third or fourth time
during our marriage, which wasonly five years, that he had to
consolidate debt.
Um, our, yeah, so anyway.
(15:02):
Um, this man was, I knew, wasnever going to be financially
well off.
He was never going to be ableto support himself and his
children.
I knew that.
So I did a dissolution and Ihired an attorney who I ended up
(15:24):
paying all costs for and duringthe negotiations, like I said,
that was two years of two and ahalf, maybe years of
negotiations and all attorneycosts were paid by me.
So that was suffocating for me.
It was horrible.
And at that time he didn't havevisitation of my daughter Not
(15:50):
that he ever supported her fromthe get-go.
It was always me Financially,emotionally, everything, I mean.
Even today, I was cutting hernails and he never does that.
sarah (16:04):
Yeah.
guest (16:04):
And he never reads to her and he never tries to better
her for the world.
I want her to be.
I have a religious background,so I want her to be religious.
I want her to believe in God.
Well, one day he said, just outof the blue I don't believe in
God, and so you can believe inwhatever you want to believe in.
(16:29):
It doesn't have to be God.
I understand that there aredifferent, but for me, I want
her believing that there is aGod.
Yeah, hence the reason she goesto a school that talks about
God.
Right, she goes to a schoolthat talks about God, right, um,
but it doesn't.
It's not just about thereligion piece, it's about, I
(16:52):
know her reading skills aren'twhere they need to be, so I work
on them with her.
Instead, he has her playingvideo games and playing on her
iPad.
Well, I think there needs to bea limit on her iPad.
Our parenting differences wereextreme.
They were extremely different.
(17:13):
Mine were very strict andstructured, and he thought that
bad behavior should not haveconsequences, and I know there
are a lot of people out therethat believe that too.
I get that, but we were notthere.
So before you get married,prenup, talk about finances,
(17:33):
keep them separate and talkabout your parenting, because
you need to be on the same page.
If you're going to havechildren, you might not have
children, but if you're going tohave children or dogs even
because that goes for the samething the training piece of it
he left it all to me need todiscuss, prior to engaging in a
(18:11):
lifelong commitment with someonethat you're going to live with,
cleanliness, live with thembeforehand, right, live with
them beforehand.
And if you're going to getmarried, then prenup, because
then you get to know their dailyhabits.
You get to know, oh, he doesn'tpick up his underwear and if
you're okay with it, fine, Iwasn't, I'm a very clean person.
He would literally leave cupsand plates by the bedroom door
(18:38):
and step over them to getdownstairs and then I would take
them down.
sarah (18:46):
Wow, he really had it good.
I don't think he understood.
guest (18:50):
That's what I thought when I came, when I came out of
my cloud of love.
I finally came to therealization.
I was like he really doesn'tknow, and even if I told him, he
wasn't going to understand.
So I feel like that's somethingpeople need to know too.
(19:11):
When people say the zebra isnot going to change its stripes,
it's not no matter what you sayto them or how much you love
them or how much you feel like.
Whatever you do or buy or putinto savings for their kids,
(19:31):
like I did, it's not going tomake him love me anymore.
It's not going to change hisbehavior.
It's not going to make him giveme the support that I wanted,
which was emotional, notfinancial.
That's all I was asking for andthe support in prioritizing me.
(19:51):
I'm not saying that I wasbetter than his children, but I
was taught God right, and thenyourself, and then your your
marriage Right.
sarah (20:06):
So at any rate, um so clearly you were the breadwinner
in you know, in your marriage,and then, unfortunately, during
the divorce, you also were thefinancial person involved in
that.
Now, a lot of times what wehear in divorce is that you know
(20:27):
, the male has to pay spousalsupport or child support or
whatever.
I have to imagine that it mightbe a little bit different.
Um, in your you know, in yoursituation, do you now have to
pay spousal support or childsupport?
Or you know how did you guys goabout that Cause?
I'm sure that was not an easything for you.
(20:49):
I mean, it took two and a halfyears to even get to that point.
So I'm sure none of this waseasy, because nothing about
divorce is easy.
guest (20:55):
Correct.
Um, yes, um.
There were so many negotiationsand so much money and I had a
terrific attorney she wasfantastic.
But the problem was he wasn'tgiving in and I knew he was
never going to have money.
(21:15):
And I knew that if and towardsthe end was where he brought up
the fact that he wanted to sueme for child support.
And I thought I know this personbecause I've lived with him for
five years and knew him oneyear prior, right Two years
(21:40):
prior prior, and I knew thatthis man was never going to be
financially stable enough to do.
And so for me, and he had twochildren still from another
marriage and this new child.
So I thought, for thebetterment of my own child, I
(22:04):
would give in to whatever hewanted so that I wouldn't have
to pay child support and justsay I'll pay for pretty much
everything in regards to mydaughter in order to avoid child
support.
And there is a very seriousreason behind that.
I knew that if I paid him500,000, whatever it is a month
(22:30):
it would go towards his habitsof eating and his other children
who still hadn't been tocollege, right, or to whatever.
Yeah, but he's a very selfishman.
It was a very um one-sided andhe, you know, during our
marriage he made me believe thatI was um wrong.
(22:54):
He made me every single time wehad an argument I was wrong.
That's incorrect.
No, that's crazy.
And when your self-esteem is solow, you start believing it.
So I, honestly, I'm thankfuland I'm blessed, because God
(23:14):
fate, whatever you want tobelieve it was.
For me it was God right.
He helped me see outside ofthat cloud and be like you are.
Are you crazy?
What are you doing?
It was almost as though Godslapped me across the face and
said get out.
sarah (23:32):
Yeah.
guest (23:33):
I know that you're not supposed to in your religion to
get divorced, but get out.
This man doesn't appreciate youand his children don't
appreciate you and he's teachingthem to not appreciate you.
And then I thought mydaughter's not going to
appreciate me because everyonearound me in my family is not
(23:59):
appreciating what I do.
Yeah, she needs to see a happymom, a happy, healthy, and
appreciate the stuff that I cando for her.
So if I was going to give intothe custody, I knew that my
funds were not going to go tosupport my daughter.
So I agreed to pay forextracurricular.
(24:22):
I have her in private schoolNow I have um help with that.
I I uh go through a programcalled ed choice.
That um allows me to get somesupport for her tuition.
Um, ed choice, and I don't knowhow many people know about this.
(24:45):
I was going to say I would lovefor you to talk about that.
Yeah, this is, this isimportant because I'm getting
high quality education right nowfor my daughter.
Um, she's learning, she's inkindergarten, she was learning
multiplication and addition and,uh, she already knows in first
(25:06):
grade how to write in cursive,which they don't teach anymore.
Right, um and um.
So anyway, at any rate, edchoice.
They have two options for you.
It it could be um, they couldanalyze your financials to see
if you qualify for a higheramount in a scholarship for for
(25:43):
from EdCho.
You're living in a failingschool district, you qualify,
and it pretty much gives me halfof her tuition right now.
Yeah, so, uh, her tuition islike 13,000 and um, they pay for
(26:06):
six, 6,600 of that.
Ed choice, no matter what my,my um income is, as long as I'm
in a failing, which is my solereason for purchasing a home in
a failing school district.
Yeah, so that I could continueto send her there and I'll do
(26:26):
whatever it takes.
Little by little, I put moneyaway so that I have enough to
send her again next year, and ifI can't, we'll figure things
out.
sarah (26:38):
Yeah, but I love that and I didn't even know that that
existed and that's good to knowthat you know.
If somebody you know, maybe, isliving in a situation you know
their marital home is in alocation that is not a failing
school district passing, thenthey could move into a failing
(27:01):
school district.
There are some to choose fromaround here.
We won't mention them, butthere are some that they can
choose from and they could thenlook into this ed choice and be
able to send their childsomewhere else.
guest (27:19):
Yeah, their child somewhere else, yeah, and so I
think the thing that I would sayis and I pay for her to go to,
um, our language school.
I'm not going to say, but I payfor her to go there so that she
could learn our native language.
And, um, I pay for her to go toa private school and I'm
(27:39):
grateful.
I you know going through theprocess and paying my attorney,
and each time I would get aninvoice I'd be ticked off and I
would be like fucking bastardand yeah, no, there is an end to
all of this.
Okay, it fucking costs me allthat shit, but you know what?
I have my daughter.
I have my happiness now she'sgot a quality education.
(28:01):
Things keep happening that arebenefiting me now, more so than
when I was married.
Right, good things arehappening, great job.
My daughter's got a highquality education.
I found EdChoice for, crying outloud in the first year that I
was offering that.
They were offering it at herschool and, quite honestly,
(28:24):
something in my head said you'renever going to get approved for
this.
You're never.
Yes, you are, because thetraditional doesn't matter what
income you're making.
Wow, they offer it if you livein a.
And I only did it because whenI got out of my marital home and
we sold it, I moved into afailing school district,
(28:48):
columbus.
So it was.
You know, if you're living inColumbus, look into it and you
want to send your children to ahigh quality school, you can
probably do it.
Yeah, and the income based oneis nice because you can play
around with a calculator and youcan choose either.
(29:11):
So if you're a W two person,you can choose, like if you're
incented on your work that youdo, let's say you get bonuses
you can use your pay stubs toqualify for your income, your
tax returns or your W-2s,depending on what's like less.
sarah (29:33):
What's going to be the best?
guest (29:34):
Right, right, and so you can play around with it.
It's really nice, I haven't doneit.
But I had another parent whowas talking to me about it and
she was doing it.
It's really nice.
Uh, I haven't done it, um, butI had a?
Um, another parent who wastalking to me about it and she
was doing it.
But, um, the thing that I wouldsay to people who are afraid of
going through divorce, there'ssupport out there, there are
(29:59):
people, there are friends and,more so than not, people
understand.
Maybe people don't talk about itbecause in our society,
everyone, and you see it, it'son Facebook, it's in social
media oh, my husband, this, mywife, this.
Look at my children.
Oh, a straight A's.
(30:20):
It's not behind the scenes,things are going on.
I'm telling you.
There are people who have beenmarried for 40 years that are
getting divorced.
It was never right, and whatI'll say is it's because they're
living in that mentality ofdivorce is not acceptable.
It's not good.
(30:42):
But you know what?
Is it good for my mental health?
It was in my case.
It was for my mental health Ineeded to get out of there and
for my daughter's mental healthfuture.
She was young, so it was good,right?
So she didn't know.
She didn't know, yeah, and shedoesn't remember us.
But then you run the risk of hewas the emotional one in our
(31:08):
relationship.
He cried a lot and I knew it.
So after I threw him out and hehad visitation rights with her
afterwards he would cry with herand say I wish we were all in
the same house.
So then she would come back.
And so you have to filter thatsomehow.
You have to just make themunderstand that that's not going
(31:30):
to happen and it was because itwasn't a good situation for you
and it wasn't a good situationfor me.
Honey, we can't ever be in thesame house ever again.
You have to explain it so thisyoung child understands.
And she still brings it up tome because she remembers those
conversations after the fact.
(31:50):
So do I want her to livethrough that turmoil?
No, and I don't want her to seeme that way.
No, an unhappy parent, yeah,all the time.
I want her to see that thriving, confident, successful,
(32:11):
independent.
You can do this on your own.
It's not a big deal, you can doit.
You can make it happen andthere's ways.
Yeah, ed, choice is one of thereasons why I'm here.
Yeah, and she's in a greatschool.
Yeah, everything kind of fate,god, whatever placed things in
my way to make things positiveafter the divorce.
(32:35):
It seems like they're not goingto be, but they are.
Yeah, there's light.
sarah (32:42):
Yeah.
guest (32:43):
And you've experienced it .
sarah (32:50):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
I mean, I still remember when Ifirst started going through my
divorce.
I was so ashamed, I just feltlike a failure.
I didn't even tell anyone in myoffice that I was getting a
divorce.
For six months I continued towear my ring, I continued to go
into work and just act likeeverything was great.
I would go home and I'd actlike everything was great and
(33:10):
I'd put, you know, my daughterto bed and then I would sob
uncontrollably for hours in thefetal position on my bathroom
floor and I'd get up and repeatevery single day for a year.
And then I started slowlytalking about it and realized,
oh, okay, this isn't that scary.
And oh, people do.
Actually, you know, they'vebeen through this.
(33:31):
I'm not the very first person toever get a divorce, nor am I
the last.
And I learned, you know, likejust all of the things that I
had let go of.
I, you know, just like you, Iwent into the marriage very
confident and very capable andthen, slowly, my self-esteem
went away to the point that Ididn't even recognize my self.
(33:56):
Yeah, sets in, yeah.
And then I was like Holy crap,like I just really became a
whole nother person.
Like this sucks.
Um so yes, so to your point.
You know I love that now yourdaughter gets to see a confident
, competent, successful mom whomade the right choices.
(34:17):
And even if it is ugly for alittle bit when she goes to see
her dad and he's crying about itand whatever, eventually she's
going to know the truth andshe's going to understand it.
You don't even have to say it,she's just she's going to see it
.
Yeah.
guest (34:34):
Yeah, I don't have to say anything.
Uh, he does, on his end he doesand his kids do, and that's
okay.
At this point I need the women,the men out there to know there
is life after divorce.
sarah (34:49):
Trust me.
guest (34:50):
You may not want to date right away, but divorce is
acceptable, especially if itmeans your mental health is
going to be 100% better.
Your mental health is going tobe 100% better.
I'm telling you, I lost 60pounds as soon as I threw him
out of the house.
I just started cleaning andgetting rid of things, because
(35:12):
my intent was to sell this hugehome that we all lived in.
I wasn't going to live therewith my daughter, and so I ended
up getting rid of things andyou know, you start doing spring
cleaning and you're movingaround, you forget to eat and
you just, I just, and I feltgood, I felt like I was
accomplishing things, and I knewdeep down.
(35:34):
Maybe I didn't say my say it tomyself at that time, but I knew
deep down right then, and thereI was doing what was better for
her and I was doing what wasbetter for me at that moment,
but I learned it later.
You keep thinking, even throughthe negotiations with your
attorney and everything.
You're like there's not life,it's dark, it's all bad, it's
(36:00):
not, though.
Open up to somebody that knowsand has experienced it, because
there is light at the end of thetunnel and it doesn't mean that
you have to.
What I would say is don't talkabout it with your children,
about how you hate that man oryou hate that woman.
(36:23):
That's another thing, because Idon't want her to see me in that
light.
I don't want her to see mehating her father.
I do not want to be that person, and if he does, that's okay,
and if his kids want to, that'sokay.
But I'm not going to be thatperson that's bad-mouthing the
(36:43):
other one.
I'd love to have a betterco-parenting situation, but it
is what it is now.
Yeah, and there are times whereyou have to just bite your
tongue and not say anything,especially through the
negotiations, when you're goingback and forth with the
attorneys.
You have to just bite yourtongue at that moment and not
(37:05):
say anything wrong.
But there is positivity behindit all.
Definitely, as long as you canlift yourself out of that cloud
of love what you thought waslove and know that there can be
success.
sarah (37:21):
Definitely it's almost like you're on.
Um, I always tell people you'rekind of on a roller coaster and
you know, some days are goingto be like you're going to go
down low, and some days you'rejust going to feel so low and
that's okay, cry it out, leaninto it, feel those feelings
fully, because then the next dayyou can pull up your big girl
panties and you can move on, andthen it's going to go up and
(37:42):
like, eventually your highs gethigher, your lows don't get as
low and you start to kind ofeven out a little bit.
But it's a process, you know,you're never just going to.
It's not a light switch, it'snot a you know, there's not just
some quick fix at all.
(38:04):
So you know, obviously you knowthat, know that, um, when you
were going through it, did youhave like good friends that you
could turn to, or did you havepeople that maybe even?
What I find too in talking withpeople is that sometimes they
lose friendships over it,because either they were friends
with both you know both spousesand they don't know they don't
want to choose a side or they dochoose a side, or they're just
like what.
I don't know, they don't wantto choose a side, or they do
choose a side, or they're justlike well, I don't know what to
(38:25):
say Like I'm super uncomfortable.
guest (38:27):
Yeah, I guess I would say that I because a lot of my
family were my friends I didn'tlose any friends.
I will say that during thechaos of the marriage, none of
my family kind of knew what Iwas going through.
(38:48):
I kept it silent.
But if you're in that kind ofrelationship where you feel like
you can't tell people or you'reputting on a facade for some
reason, Um, you know, I wasdoing that.
sarah (39:03):
I was doing.
guest (39:04):
I was one of those people .
I was like, oh, my husband'sexcellent, he's helping me with
this and fuck, no, he wasn'tright, you know.
But don't do that, but open upto someone and talk to them,
because they're going throughsimilar things for sure.
If you have a trusted friendthat you can talk to, um, I, I,
(39:25):
I know that that you will getthat support that you need, um,
but I, I didn't lose anybody.
But what I will say is um, evennow, those friends who are my
family, um, those friends whoare my family, um, are telling
(39:46):
me what a strong person I was,even though I doubted myself
during the process.
I doubted how could I getthrough this process?
It's so horrible.
I'm divorced, I have a baby, Idon't have anywhere to live, I,
you know, there it was.
It was a seller's market thenand not enough inventory, so it
(40:06):
was like I selling my house thatI can't afford anymore, and you
know so there were a lot of badthings that you went through.
But, um, if you can open up tosomeone and talk to them, that's
what's really key.
Even if it means going to tosomeone and talk to them, that's
what's really key.
Even if it means going to acounselor.
Talk to them.
(40:26):
If you feel like you can't trustthe people that are around you
because they're also friendswith your partner, then talk to
somebody else, because you cando this on your own.
But in that moment that you'regoing through all this chaos,
you probably don't think youhave the strength to do it.
But you can I think it was God,but at any, because I didn't go
(40:53):
to a counselor and then I didhave the support.
I can't tell you how many timessome of my best friends were
telling me you're the strongestperson that I know.
You get knocked down, you getback up, you get knocked down,
you get back up Every singletime.
I've noticed you don't ask foranything, you just continue
going on your path and no oneever supports you, but you just
(41:17):
keep doing it.
Somehow you have a negativething happen, something blacks
you out, punches you out, andyou get back up and you do it
and you just find a way.
And it's true.
I look back on my past in thosemoments.
There have been several timeswhere I've been knocked down,
(41:40):
punched down, and you thinkshe's not getting back up, right
?
No, she is.
I am.
It was me.
Hello, yeah.
sarah (41:50):
So, yeah.
Yeah, well, and I, um, I lovedthat.
Um, you know, before we startedrecording, you had made a
comment about how you know, hereyou were trying to help your ex
and you know he just was justpushing you down and pushing you
down and pushing you down, Likeyou know.
I don't know if you rememberwhat you were talking about, but
(42:12):
if you wanted to repeat that.
It was so powerful.
guest (42:15):
Yeah, there were times I literally I recall this, and
there was one time in particularand his parents were visiting.
At that time I was on my kneesand I was in tears and I was
like you keep stomping on me.
I used that.
I used that phrase because Iwanted him to know I am the dirt
(42:40):
beneath your feet.
You make me feel like that.
I don't understand how somebodywho does so much for you, how
can you continue to put yourfoot on top of my head?
Every time I try to get a deepbreath, you're pushing me down
underneath the water.
Let's just say to use another,use another phrase.
(43:01):
Because he was drowning me andI remember going through
marriage counseling.
We had three marriage counselorsin that time frame, in the five
years that we were married.
I told the last counselor thatwe were with.
I said I've got one kid on myleft side choking me with their
(43:22):
arms around me.
I've got the other kid, his kidon the right side of me.
He is choking me from the back,so he's got his hands on my
neck, holding me on the frontand then my daughter, who's just
a baby, is on my leg, who isdependent on me.
So where do I go from here?
Because they're choking the airdependent on me.
So where do I go from here?
Because they're choking the airout of me, yeah, but my
(43:45):
daughter needs me, but they'rechoking me.
So now, what do I do?
I've got to get out of thischoke hold, but there are three
people who are choking me.
That's how I felt.
Um, I know, I know that soundsso drastic, but that's how it is
yeah.
(44:05):
Uh, you know how they say theball and chain.
It wasn't a ball and chain, itwas.
People's hands were literallychoking me out of the air.
I felt like I did not want tolive anymore.
I hate to say that, becausethat's the worst thing that God
would want me to say is that youdon't want to live anymore.
I hate to say that becausethat's the worst thing that God
would want me to say is that youdon't want to be in this world
(44:26):
anymore.
But there was reason for me tolive my daughter.
sarah (44:31):
Yeah, but I think that it's okay to recognize that you
had that feeling and honor thatfeeling and also know that you
didn't make that choice and youknow you grew from it.
So you know, I want to makesure that like you know anyone
that's ever felt that I meanI've felt that way where I'm
like, oh my God, I just want tofucking crawl into a hole Like I
(44:54):
can't, but I think theimportant thing is when you feel
that.
guest (44:57):
It's not that you don't want to live anymore, it's you
don't want to live like thisanymore, you don't want to live
in that chaos.
It's not that you don't want tolive in this world.
There is another world that youcan live in, apart from that
chaos there is.
(45:19):
Yeah, I think that's where Idon't know where that strength
came from, because I was there,right, I was feeling like I
don't want to live anymore, butI know I have to live for my
daughter.
I guess I know where it came.
I knew that if I didn't dosomething, he wasn't going to be
there to support her in themanner that I could.
(45:41):
And I'm not talking financially, I'm talking about to be there
to support her, to do the thingsfor her that she needs, to help
her, along with her education.
And I'm not just talkingprivate education, fuck that,
even if she didn't have privateeducation.
I'm talking supporting herwhere it's needed, not sitting
(46:01):
her in front of a fucking TV,right.
I'm talking about being anactual parent and teaching her
to be independent.
I watched him throughout ourmarriage and he would.
His kids would forget cleatsand they would forget
Chromebooks or Chrome chargersand he would take.
He would drop whatever he wasdoing at work, leave his work
(46:25):
and go, take it to school.
No, I'm the type of parentwhere I'm like you forget it,
then you get in trouble.
Sorry, you suffer theconsequences with your teacher
or whoever, whatever it is.
If you can't, then I'm sorry,that's your problem.
You forgot your cleats?
You can't play football, thenthat's your problem.
(46:47):
Sorry, then my daughter, if sheforgets her dance shoes, that's
your problem.
I'm sorry.
Well, she's too young now, butI'm just saying the problem is
we, we in today's society, weprovide too much for our
children in that manner.
Right?
We get their lunches, we gettheir bags, we get everything.
(47:07):
She forgot her water bottle.
I said is it mommy'sresponsibility to get your water
bottle?
It's not mommy's responsibility, right?
So I'm trying to teach herright now to be the most
independent in charge leader,woman of the new world, right?
Like we have to we have to teach, even if it's not a girl.
(47:28):
I'm just saying these boys whoare dependent on their moms and
and they're doing everything forthem right yeah which, raising
another generation of mama'sboys.
This is what I'm saying.
So I don't want my daughtergrowing up thinking that mom's
(47:48):
always going to be there toprovide or remember to grab my
socks, or to grab my shoes, orto grab my water bottle.
I want her to be an independent, strong woman so she doesn't
end up in the same situationthat I did.
Yeah, and if she does okay,that's okay.
Yeah, but she can lift herselfout of that chaos.
(48:11):
Yeah.
sarah (48:13):
I think that's such a really, really good point too,
and I, you know, thank you somuch for being so vulnerable and
sharing that Um.
But I think that's such a goodthing for women and men that are
going through this process toremember that, if there are
children involved, children arewatching and they're going to
(48:34):
see what you do and, even thoughyou don't want them to have to
go through what you went through, maybe they're going to end up
going through that and that'sokay.
Again, we just need tonormalize that.
Whatever you're going through,that's okay because you're going
to get through it.
But to your point, by youhelping to raise a strong,
independent woman if she was toget in a situation like that
(48:57):
because we all hope that youknow our children make better
choices than we did and theydon't have to go through this
and all that blah, blah, blah.
But you know, knowing that shesaw a strong, independent woman
pull herself up, become, youknow, that person that you know,
even if she doesn't rememberyou as the, you know, pushed,
(49:18):
beat down woman, she's going tojust see this positive person,
and so I think that's, you know,definitely a strong point to
make sure that people that arelistening, understand that your
kids, whether they're you knowtalking to you or not, they're
watching they're seeing whatyou're doing and they're
learning from you.
guest (49:35):
Yeah, I will say, uh, I think it may have been my mother
because she went through itRight.
I think it may have been mymother because she went through
it Right.
And I recall that, um, I hateto say it, but my father had cut
her off financially, right, andshe was, um, you know, in a
different country, not where shegrew up.
(49:56):
Um, she had two children.
So what did she do?
She was like I can lay down andplay dead, and then what
happens to my children, right,or will I have my children, you
know, in my home with me, livingwith me, if I don't step up to
the plate and do something?
She got three jobs.
She paid for the mortgage, shepaid for groceries, she paid for
(50:17):
us to do extracurricularactivities.
She did what she had to, yeah,and so I think, in watching that
, like you said, my daughter iswatching everything that I do.
Well, so did I.
I watched it and she wentthrough.
It was a difficult divorce andit was way unacceptable back
(50:38):
then in our culture and ourreligion and in our society.
Even, yeah, still, it wasunacceptable to be divorced,
right, and to watch her do that,I think, gave me the strength
to go through my own divorce andknow that it was going to be
okay.
She made it through.
She made it through verysuccessfully.
sarah (50:59):
So, yeah, I love it, made it through.
She made it through verysuccessfully.
So, yeah, I love it.
Thank you so much for being soopen, so vulnerable, um, and
just so gracious to share yourstory.
I really appreciate it and Iguarantee that you know someone
listening, or multiple peoplelistening are.
You know they're gettingsomething from this and you are
(51:20):
helping to heal other women justby by talking.
guest (51:23):
Glad to help.
Thanks, excellent.
sarah (51:26):
Thanks for having me.
Yeah, thank you so much, andthank you so much for tuning in
and I will see you next time onthrive and decide.
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