December 11, 2024 • 57 mins
Have you ever felt the weight of societal expectations pushing you into life decisions you weren't ready for? Toni joins us to share her deeply personal journey through the complexities of young marriage and the tough, yet transformative process of divorce. She opens up about the emotional challenges she faced, likening divorce to the grief of losing someone still alive, and how navigating this difficult chapter became a catalyst for her personal growth and self-discovery. Toni's story is a powerful reminder that life's significant milestones don't adhere to a fixed timeline, and finding one's true path is more important than conforming to societal norms.
Toni's journey didn't stop at the end of her marriage; it was just the beginning of an empowering transformation. As she reflects on the pain of losing herself in an unfulfilling relationship, she discusses the importance of recognizing when to leave toxic environments and the necessity of being financially prepared for such decisions. With courage and resilience, Toni rebuilt her identity, overcoming the fear of judgment and embracing self-care and personal growth. Her insights on maintaining a positive relationship with her ex for the sake of their children highlight the value of civility and effective co-parenting, emphasizing that personal strength can emerge from adversity.
Life after divorce brings its own set of challenges and opportunities for growth. Toni's narrative is filled with practical wisdom, from engaging in self-help resources and therapy to finding joy and community through activities like yoga and Zumba. She shares her experiences of career transitions and the fears accompanying financial independence, underscoring the importance of taking risks and following one's passion. With humor and grace, Toni reminds us that it's okay to seek help and cherish the unpredictability of life, underscoring the value of community support and the courage it takes to embrace each day with gratitude.
Hi and welcome to Thrive and Decide. I’m your host Sarah Thress. This podcast is intended to help women who are going through a divorce, continplating divorce or have lost a spouse feel seen, heard, understood and not alone. All the beautiful souls who share on here are coming from a place of vulnerability and a common belief that sharing your story will help others. You will also hear from industry experts on what to do and not do while going through a divorce.
Sarah Thress
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi and welcome to this week's episode of Thrive
and Decide.
This week we have Toni, who hasvery graciously agreed to come
on and share her story and, likeI always try and tell people
whenever they're tuning intothis in case this is your first
time the reason that I feelreally strongly about working
(00:23):
with women that are goingthrough these life changes, you
know, like a divorce or like a,you know, loss of a spouse the
reason that I like to havepeople come on and share their
story is because everyone'sstory is unique but there may be
something that is said that canhelp you, and the whole idea
here is to help women feel seen,heard, understood, validated
(00:49):
and just to make sure thatyou're not alone.
So, tony, thank you so much foryou know being so gracious and
vulnerable, because this is avulnerable, you know, topic.
So I appreciate you coming onand, you know, just kind of
sharing, sharing your story withus.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Oh gosh, Well, thank you so much for having me.
And it is a vulnerable, it's anuncomfortable topic as well as
well.
I think when we go throughdivorce, we we feel like we're a
failure.
Yeah, we are a failure, and ittakes two people to make a
marriage work.
I know I come from a family.
My parents just celebrated 56years Wow 56 years, and that was
(01:32):
the goal that I had set formyself.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
And you know I have been divorced.
It'll be 17 years next monthand but it feels like yesterday.
Yeah, it's been 17 years.
Time definitely goes fast.
But there are moments that Ihave like my gosh.
Every time my parents celebratean anniversary as happy as I am
, there's a part of me that'ssad that I didn't get that
chance.
(01:55):
I didn't have that chance togrow old with the person, but
what I did get a chance of isgetting into the correct life
that I'm supposed to be leading.
Um, I think a lot of times wewe think that we're supposed to
go down this path and thisjourney and stay in a situation
that we're we're not happy andthat's not the case.
(02:16):
I tell friends all the time.
I have so many friends that arecontemplating divorce, going
through a divorce, arecontemplating divorce, going
through a divorce, and I justwant to say divorce is okay.
Yeah, divorce is okay.
There is no rule that you haveto stay married and we all come
from very different situationsin relationships that we've had
(02:37):
and you know I've heard so manystories over the years.
But divorce is okay and, yes,is it difficult?
Absolutely.
You go through every singleemotion the anger, the hate, the
sadness, the you know the, thescared.
You go through every emotion.
It's it's like a death, butthey're still around.
It's like a death of a personbut they're still there.
(03:00):
No, but you go through all ofthese emotions and and what I
have found over all of theseyears.
I, even to this very day, I'llhave a trigger, even though it's
been 17 years.
I'll have a trigger, but it's,but it's.
I've grown so much and I lovewhere my life is and I love who
I am as a human being.
And you know, I was a verydifferent person back in the day
(03:22):
.
So so I'm going to take youback in that day, a long time
ago, back in that day.
So I met my ex at a place ofemployment and he was a bad boy,
fresh out of the Navy.
Bad boy.
He was super hot and all thegirls wanted him.
So guess what?
Of course I had to win thatbattle.
(03:46):
Of course you did.
I had to win because I, like Ilike a challenge and, um, you
know I was.
I was definitely a moreinsecure person at that time.
Um, I was.
I was a little bit overweight.
Um, you know, I just got out ofa bad relationship, um, that I
was really distraught over, andum, so I was I was very
vulnerable and I was very naiveand you know, he and I, we
(04:09):
connected.
He couldn't be more oppositethan I am, even to this day.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
Just I look at him, I'm like what was I thinking?
We all have those moments.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
But I look at it now and I'm like but I had to have
him, yeah, because he was achallenge and he was a bad boy,
um, so you know it.
Um, you know it started out fun, because opposites do attract.
And there there's, there's somefun in those first two years.
And you know, I'll start out bysaying we got together and then
we moved in together.
Gosh, eight months after westarted dating, my father was
(04:46):
not happy about that at all.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Oh, I can imagine.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
And my pitch to my dad I think I was, I was just
turning 24 years old.
My pitch to my dad was well,dad, this is great, we have to
like we'll figure it out beforewe get married.
Right, we'll figure it out.
Well, that really didn't happen.
That line doesn't really work.
So when my if my son ever cameto me and said that I'd be like
no dude, that, trust me, thatdoesn't work.
Okay, so we, so we, we moved intogether and again, the first
(05:13):
couple of years were fine.
It was exciting, you know, thiswhole new thing or whatever,
but I always knew in my gut, inmy gut, something was something
that I always knew in my gut hewasn't my person.
But when you're in your earlytwenties, you're on that
timeline yes, timeline.
I got to lock and load somebodybecause I want to be married by
(05:36):
then and I want to start havingkids by then, yep, and you know
, that's unfortunate, and ifthere's one thing that I can
tell anybody, we're not on anykind of timeline.
I know people that are justgetting married for the first
time in their 50s and guess what?
That's okay.
Yep, that's okay.
So I know people that have beenmarried for 30 some years that
(05:58):
are getting divorced, and that'sokay.
So it's all part of yourindependent, it's all part of
our personal journey and we haveto go with our gut and we have
to go with what is making ushappy.
I think what we tend to do iswe tend to try to make other
people happy before we makeourselves happy.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
One million percent.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
And this is our life and we've got one shot at this.
So what?
What are we doing to makeourselves happy?
And if I could go back and redoit all, but I have to say, let
me just say I have the mostamazing son from this human.
So, most amazing son I like tocall my sperm donor, and that's
(06:39):
okay.
That's okay.
Sperm donor.
My son is just the best thingever, so um, it's a great sperm
donor.
My son is just the best thingever, so um.
But so we, we moved in togetherand don't you know, we were
together, living together, sixyears before we finally got
married, wow yeah.
So, okay, that's a big red flag.
Yeah, that's a big red flag.
And my older self knows now whatI've heard from all of my male
(07:00):
friends that a man knows in fourto five months of male friends,
that a man knows in four tofive months if you are the one
he wants to be with, yeah, andso, as I am in this world of
dating now, I tell myself thatthat if I get into a
relationship and if it's at fourto five month point we're
having a conversation, and ifthey don't, if it's not, if
there's no feeling there,whatever, we're moving on.
(07:21):
But anyways, this is in yourtwenties.
Things are different back then,um, you know, different
generation, um, so so we gotmarried and a year later I get
pregnant and just things justjust start to decline, just
start to decline and so many ofthe factors that happened to us,
um, but I do want to backtrackjust a little bit and tell you
(07:44):
about the work environment weworked in.
We worked in a very young workenvironment at a very exciting,
edgy, popular company and Iwon't name the name because
everybody knows somebody thatworked at this company back in
the day technology company andyou know the work environment.
Everybody was so flirty.
And I was just talking to agirlfriend about this the other
(08:04):
night that worked there with me.
She's actually my life mentor,but we were talking about this.
You know, everybody was soflirty and you know the younger
version of myself in my twentiesdefinitely overweight at the
time, insecure, dating a bad boy.
You know that everybody flirtedwith him.
He flirted with everybody.
There was a lot of insecurityon my part and that's just ugly,
(08:25):
yeah.
And I think we've all been inthose phases where we have that
insecurity.
I became a different person.
To make him happy, yeah, myparents even to this day would
tell me gosh, you were just anugly nasty person because I
changed who I was to make himhappy.
(08:45):
Try to make him happy.
Yeah, and now in hindsight,nothing was going to make him
happy, right?
Speaker 1 (08:51):
Even to this day.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Nothing makes him happy.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
Well, and you probably didn't even realize
that you were changing who youwere to fit that mold, not at
all, not at all, not at all.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
I was so focused on being the perfect girlfriend,
the perfect wife, and then cometo be the perfect mother.
And just I was accepting notbeing treated how I wanted to be
treated, you know.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
I'll give you a great example.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
You know I'm Italian.
We are like we are huggers.
We are I love yous to.
You know, we never hang up thephone with people we love
without saying I love you, youknow, because we believe in the
fact that that could be the lasttime you talk to a person so
and on a good note right.
And I'll never forget this.
And this was not.
This was about maybe halfway inthe dating thing, we already
living together and all thatstuff.
(09:41):
But I had a conversation withhim saying, my gosh, you know,
you never told me you love me.
And he said I don't have to,you should know how I feel.
Oh, boom, red flag right there.
Wow, red flag.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Guys, I had a million red flags.
I ignored them all because Iwas on this track.
Yep, I got my guy.
He's locked and loaded.
We live together.
Now we're going to get married,or you know we got married, now
we're going to get married, oryou know, we got married, now
we're gonna.
You know, I stayed in therebecause I thought I had to, okay
, and that was just was, justwas just wrong.
We should not stay in situationswhere we are not comfortable
(10:16):
now let's let's say I'm notencouraging everybody to go out
there and get a divorce right.
But, my gosh, do you reallywant to lead a life where you're
just not happy and your partneris not treating you with the
respect?
And there's so many things thatare going on in relationships?
You know, I have a familymember that's that's in a very
tumultuous relationship and it'sso hard for me to watch what
she's going through and she'snot in a position where she can
(10:41):
get out, and that's the whole.
Other part of a conversation wecan get into is getting
yourself in a position to where,if you need to get out of a
situation, you can financiallydo it, because most people are
not there.
So, um, but back to back to mystory.
You know, we we worked in thisvery flirtatious environment and
you know I'm going to go downthis path.
I'm going to, I'm going to talkabout it.
(11:02):
You know what?
There was a work colleague thathe was very, very, very close
to and she was married to agreat guy, you know, to a guy
that if I saw on the street tothis day I'd still hug him
because he's an amazing guy.
But but you know, she was a bitof a busybody, always in
business, and my ex was veryjust, for whatever reason, just
very drawn to her.
(11:23):
Um, you know, um, he invitedthem to the wedding and I was
devastated because she wasn't myfriend, I didn't want her at
the wedding.
Yeah, um, and you know,ultimately, his, his
relationship, you know, I don'tthink they had a physical affair
, but they definitely had anemotional affair and if you're
familiar with that, I thinkthat's worse than a physical
(11:46):
affair, because that emotionalconnection is what we as humans
are supposed to be drawntogether on.
Is that emotional connection?
And when your husband at thetime is is spending more time
hanging out at this girl's housewith her husband, which is just
so weird, versus being homewith his wife and his son,
(12:07):
there's a problem, there's a bigproblem, and that was
ultimately the the the bigdemise of this.
You know we won't get intodetails of all that other stuff,
Um, but you know, my gosh, youknow, going through that divorce
, it was.
It's a devastating situation,but I am here to say it is going
(12:30):
to be okay and it's going to bebetter than okay when you, when
you're at the bottom, the onlyplace you can go is up and it's
baby steps, it's getting throughall of those emotions and it's
figuring out who you are.
I mean, one of the best feelingswas when my parents, years
(12:50):
after the divorce, were like ohmy gosh, we're so glad to have
you back.
You're back.
And it made me cry because Inever realized that I wasn't
there.
Yeah, but it just sucked thelife out of me and just
everything I was going throughwas just it was painful.
Yeah, but it just sucked thelife out of me and just
everything I was going throughwas just it was painful, yeah,
yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:07):
You bounce back and you become better.
Yeah, now, when you were goingthrough that and you were, you
know this, quote unquote likedifferent person, um, did you
have a lot of people in your youknow kind of inner circle that
were like helpful or not helpful?
Because I feel like it's acommon theme that people quote
(13:33):
unquote, mean well, but some ofthe things that they think
they're doing to be helpfulactually are very hurtful.
Or having someone that doesn'tunderstand your situation and
tells you oh, you can make itwork, like just suck it up,
you've got a kid.
You can't do that to your kid,you're going to completely fuck
them up, you know.
So I would love to just kind ofhear, like, did you, did you
(13:58):
have that inner circle?
Were you able to create thatinner circle?
Did you have haters?
Speaker 2 (14:03):
What's funny?
Bring that up.
Let's talk about friends.
Let's talk about how that workswhen you go through this.
So he and I, having worked atthe same company, we had a lot
of mutual friends.
Yeah, and to this day, many ofthem I still don't talk to.
When you start going throughthese difficult relationship
times, what I've learned ispeople don't know how to react,
(14:24):
so they disappear.
They disappear.
I mean my gosh, the friend Ihad.
She was such a good friend tome at the time she threw our
bridal shower.
For God's sake, you know, payfor it, pay for the whole bridal
shower out of her pocket.
I've not talked to her in allof these years and it's still to
this day kind of chokes me upbecause how can you go from that
(14:46):
to nothing?
Yeah, but I learned veryquickly.
And then I've had some friendscome back into my world.
They left me back in the daywhen I was going through this
time and then, over the courseof time, they kind of came back
into my world and we've hadthese conversations and they're
like we just didn't know how totalk to you and I said all you
(15:07):
had to do was just talk to me.
I didn't expect anything fromyou.
Just continue to be my friend.
You know I was the same personyou knew.
You know now I'm a betterperson because my real identity
is back after going through allof that.
But I think people just have afear.
They just want to stay out ofit and don't want to get
involved.
Um, was there judging?
(15:27):
Um, yeah, there was judging.
Of course people like to judge.
That's what humans like to do,for whatever gross reason it's.
It is gross.
Um, they don't know.
They don't know your world.
They don't know what goes onbehind those closed doors.
They don't know.
You know I hired a privateinvestigator because of things
(15:49):
that I uncovered in my situationand they don't know what that
was.
They don't know what Iuncovered on that.
Speaker 1 (15:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
They don't know what I saw, they don't know the
emails that I was able to read.
They don't know.
So they do tend to judge andsay you know, gosh, you know
you've only been married sevenyears.
Shouldn't you make it work?
You've got this young child,like you said.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
And it's like you know what?
Speaker 2 (16:10):
First of all, there's no good time to get a divorce.
It doesn't matter if your childis young or if your child is a
teenager or an adult.
Your child could be 30.
It's still going to be hard forthem to watch their parents,
you know, not be one unitedperson.
But what you have to do, what Ihad to do, was just make it
(16:34):
okay for my son.
I had to train my friends.
Guys, I'm going to be so muchbetter.
I'm going to be a better friendto you because I'm not going to
be miserable anymore.
Yeah, I'm getting myself out ofa miserable situation where I
am not being treated like I wantto be treated, and that's what
you should embrace me for andcongratulate me.
And let's go out and have somefun, let's do some things and
(16:57):
help keep my mind focused on thefuture versus what I'm going
through now.
Just let me get through this.
And you know, yeah, it's, it'severybody.
It's so funny because when yougo through a divorce, it's not
really, it's not just you goingthrough a divorce.
Everybody around you is goingthrough it your family, your
friends.
You know the, the, the familymember that I have, when she's
not going through a divorce now,but she is.
She's not going through adivorce now, but she is, she's
(17:19):
close to making it happen andit's affecting our whole family
and it's it's not a good thing.
You know, we have all of thesebeautiful holidays coming up.
It's going to be very awkward,yeah, so we have to put on the
happy faces and go.
Okay, you know you are thefather of these two beautiful
children that are still veryyoung and I'm going to always
(17:39):
respect you because of that.
You know what I mean.
So it affects everybody and Ithink that people need to
understand.
Like I said before, you don'tknow what people are really
going through.
Yeah, that's why it's alwaysgood to be kind to anybody you
see on the street.
You don't know what they'refacing in their life, yeah, so
we all need to learn to just bemore accepted and respectful and
(18:00):
understand that you know.
If somebody you care about isgoing through something like
this, you know, ask themquestions, how can you help?
They're probably going to say,oh, there's nothing you can do.
Just when I need to vent, whenI need to cry, can I?
Can I text you?
Can I call you?
Can I have five minutes?
You know, just last night Ipicked up the phone because I
(18:21):
was having a moment and calledone of my girlfriends and said
okay, I need five minutes ofyour time, because the last
relationship I was in I had atrigger and I needed five
minutes, and that's that's allpeople really need.
We just need to understand thesensitivity to all of this.
But again, I just really want toreiterate that you know we all
go through these situations fora reason.
(18:42):
It's part of our life journey.
It's not something that weintended to do, but it happened
and it's okay.
It's okay and I think that'sthe biggest thing I can stress
that it's okay to do somethingthat's going to put you on a
better journey in your life.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
Yeah, so you, um, you had the private investigator,
you uncovered information andall of that, and so did you then
confront him with anything?
Oh, I did, and, and like, howdid that conversation go?
And is that what ultimately ledto?
Speaker 2 (19:14):
like, we're done Well my ex was and still is to this
very day which still fires me up.
See, it's a trigger to this day.
If I have something I need totalk to him about regarding our
son, when he doesn't want totalk, he just shuts down.
And then there's me.
That's like blah, blah, blah,blah, blah, blah.
(19:35):
The Italian one I want to knowBlah, blah, blah.
So that confrontation, I meanit was a joke, because of course
you're going to get that's nottrue.
That's not true.
You know, I can't believe youdid this, whatever.
You know all this stuff, youknow you, you go through all of
that stuff.
But I think the important partof it was that he needed to
understand that I knew what hewas doing.
(19:55):
I was onto him, I confrontedher about it and she's like
we're just friends.
No, it is not appropriate to belike that with somebody else's
husband.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
It just isn't.
Speaker 2 (20:08):
Um, and there's so much of that that goes on in
this day and age.
Oh my gosh, we need to have aseparate podcast for dating.
But anyways, we will.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
I'll have you back.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
We'll talk about dating, yeah no, but um, but
yeah, no it, um.
It's kind of funny because whenit comes to counseling, I am
the biggest fan of counseling.
Yep, I actually did personalcounseling just for me.
I met with a counselor before alot of this major stuff was
(20:36):
going down, because I wasstruggling so much internally,
thinking what am I doing wrong?
This man won't even tell me heloves me.
I should know it.
Um, you know, just doesn't,just doesn't treat me like I'm.
And so I basically went to acounselor to find out what was
wrong with me yes, and I'm ahuge fan of that, I promote it
all the time and only to findout there was nothing wrong with
me.
I was just not with my person,yeah, and so to me, that was
(21:00):
kind of my first aha moment.
But having said that, I hired aPI.
We go through all this stuff, alot of other situations during
this whole thing and I convincedhim let's go to marriage
counseling.
But there is a fine line.
There's a fine line tocounseling as a couple.
Yep, If you get to counselingbefore it is so far in, you're
(21:24):
going to be great.
Marriage counseling is awesome,but there's a fine line where,
if you're just too far past andthere's too much hatred and
there's too much lack of trust.
It's not going to work.
So we go, we go to thiscounselor.
This, this poor guy can just Ican still visualize his face Um,
we sit down and my ex and I arenot saying a word to each other
(21:48):
.
There are so much anger in usbetween this.
I mean you could.
I feel, like I could feel theheat from the bodies, that anger
and the hatred and the notwanting to be there and we sat
down and I'll never forget thiscouncil.
He just, he was just like wow,um, I'm having a feeling this
session is not going to lastvery long and I just I kind of
(22:12):
laughed and again I was beingchildish and I'm like, yeah,
probably not.
I had so much anger in me.
Who wants to have that kind ofanger?
Right, who wants to be that?
You were sitting there with theperson you married that was
supposed to be till death?
Do you part and the father ofyour child?
You have so much hatred andanger.
Who wants that?
(22:32):
Nobody wants that.
Um, and I think that sessionlasted 15 minutes and basically
the the counselor said guys, I'msorry, I just I really do just
just think that you guys have,you know, it's just not going to
work.
Yeah, and to hear that 15minutes in from a marriage
counselor, you're just kind oflike wow.
And but one of the things Iwant to point out about that one
(22:53):
session we went to just one, um, my ex had said something
because you know, I think we'reall under the common notation of
you've got one soulmate outthere, right, you've got your
one true love.
And my ex actually made thecomment she's not my person,
she's not my one love, she's notmy one true love.
(23:14):
And you know what thatcounselor said and I will never
forget it and I believe in this.
And he's like well, he goes.
I'm going to correct you onthat he goes.
I don't believe in you havingone true soulmate out there, one
true love he goes.
I believe you have manysoulmates and you have many
loves, because we go throughmany phases in our life where we
change.
Yeah, and I will never forgetthat.
(23:37):
That was one of the mostpowerful things that came out of
that 15-minute counselormeeting where he basically said
you guys are done.
I believe that to this day.
I don't believe you have Now myparents.
Again, they're the exception.
Yeah, I think what they have isso unique and so rare, and
(23:59):
again, they're in a completelydifferent generation, but in our
generations, in this day andage.
I don't mean you should go outthere, get married and get
divorced just to see who else isout there, gosh, no.
But if it's not working andyou're miserable and you have
anger and so much animosity andanimosity that's a hard word
Animosity, yeah, animosity,great job, lord, thank you, um,
towards somebody you know, Ijust, I think it's just you just
(24:22):
you'd have to proceed how yourgut is telling you to do but
I'll never forget that you havemany loves for the different
times in your lives.
Maybe you yeah, you just do so.
I'll never forget that Verypowerful.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
Yeah, I agree, and I think that's something that you
don't learn until you're older,you know older and kind of look
back on it because you know, Iknow, I believed that in my
twenties, like I'm just lookingfor my soulmate, and I thought
you know my husband was mysoulmate, you know obviously
right, yeah, Well.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
I, should you want to kill him and then, you're like.
Speaker 1 (24:57):
well, death did us part then you're like, well,
death did us part?
Yeah, no, exactly so.
But I, you know, I hate thefact that you had to go through
that and I hate the fact thatanyone has to go through this.
But what I have learned throughmy healing journey and how I've
(25:17):
gotten to this point, you know,11 years out from my divorce,
um, is just by constantlyfocusing on how to grow, how to
become a better version ofmyself.
Recognizing that I, you know,did put, you know, my ex on a
pedestal.
I did think that, you know,like that was it.
And then I thought my wholeworld was, you know, crumbling
(25:39):
and falling apart and I was, youknow, like I was going to be
fucked up forever.
Uh, you know, to then realizelike, no, it's okay, and that
happened for a reason.
And, you know, and that's okay,and it's led me now to this
point and, uh, you know, allowedme to then help others to
understand, like it's okay, whatyou're feeling.
It doesn't matter what you'refeeling, it's okay, it's okay.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
It's so okay, and that's what everybody needs to
understand that you're not alone.
Yeah, you are not alone.
So many, so many people havegone through this, are going
through this, will go throughthis and don't know it yet, or
want to go through this, butdon't know how to to make things
happen.
And I just can't stress enoughthat you know we have one life
(26:22):
to live.
We have to make every momentcount and you know, just like
with your friends, and you knowwhere you work or whatever just
every element of your life needsto make you happy yeah but gosh
, your spouse should be yourbest friend.
My ex was not best my bestfriend you know what he told me
when I confronted him againearly on in in the relationship
and other red flag guys Um, Isaid you should be my best
(26:45):
friend.
He's like no, he's like you'reyou're.
You know you're my girlfriend,you know you can't be my best
friend.
That's just weird.
And that again I should haveran right.
I should have ran again Like,oh my gosh, I could have run
like 5,000 miles all the redcards, I would run for back in
the day.
But you know, I mean again, it'sit's hindsight on all these
things you look back on.
But you know I think yourspouse should be your best
(27:07):
friend, the person that youtrust and they trust you and
that person that is your ride ordie.
And you know I'm I'm excited tofind that person If I ever do.
I may not, and that's okay aswell, it's okay to not have that
person Again my path.
I am just taking these stepsevery day.
I'm just glad to wake uphealthy every morning and I just
(27:30):
embrace what the day holds andI am grateful.
People ask me all the time, youknow, because my ex and I, you
know, we raised this amazing son.
He played college sports, sowe've had to spend a lot of time
together through all theseyears and a lot of times we
really mastered the craft ofdivorce.
(27:50):
We didn't make it ugly, okay,we kept it very clean for the
sake of our son and a lot offolks in my community for the
longest time when he was likemiddle school sports, even some
high school, they didn't evenknow we were divorced because we
can be very civil together.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
And that's very important.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
Even though down deep I still get gurgles, like you
know, I'm able to put on thatpoker face and know that.
You know what I am strong, I amsolid, I've made it through
this.
I've been independent on my ownfor a long time now and it's
been such a godsend, such ablessing.
And you know my son, he's sogood because he's an adult now.
(28:29):
He still will make sure tospend equal time with myself and
his father during the week.
I mean, isn't that crazy?
He doesn't have to.
That's so sweet it is because heunderstands the importance of
having a relationship with bothof us, and you know.
So when I sit back at the endof the day and you know, if I
have a trigger or I think aboutsome of these things from the
(28:50):
past, I get a little grumpyabout it.
I think about the end resultand the fact that we have an
amazing child together who is agood, humble human being, even
though he went through this veryearly on in his life.
He, as an adult, has skills andstuff.
His organizational skills areimpeccable when you have to
divide your time between twohouses.
(29:11):
He learned never to forgetanything or whatever.
But you know he has skills andhe has knowledge on learning
from his father and I and whatwe've been dealt with and all of
that and I just there's so muchpositive in that whole outcome.
Did you know was painful to gothrough, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Would I want to go through it again.
Speaker 2 (29:30):
No, yeah, but it happened for a reason and I just
embrace that fact and it's, andagain, it's OK, you're not
alone.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
Like I said, so many have been through it, so many
are going through it now and Ithink the key thing is just to
be there for people that youknow are going through this.
And if you are going through itnow yourself, my gosh.
Reach out to friends, thosefriends that may be shunning you
.
Reach out to them and say hey,I could really use a quick
(30:03):
conversation with you.
Or can we meet for coffee or aglass of wine, or whatever it is
?
Can we just talk?
I just need to vent and I thinkthat you'll find that they'll
embrace that.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
They're afraid to reach out to you Because they
don't know what to say.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
They don't know what to say.
They're terrified.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
Yeah, well, and they don't want to minimize it by
like, hey, you want to go grab adrink, let's pretend like
nothing's happening.
And it's like, hey, you want togo grab a drink, you know like,
let's, let's pretend likenothing's happening.
And it's like, well, no, likeyou reaching out, like that's
what they need.
But you know when, if you'renot going through it, or you
know, you don't know, you don'tknow what to say, it is very
difficult to do that.
Speaker 2 (30:33):
Absolutely, and you know it's so funny.
It comes full circle becauseone of my very dear friends who
I've known for over 30 years.
She shunned me during mydivorce.
I was devastated and then shereached out to me years later,
and don't you know, she reachedout to me at the time when she
started wanting to get a divorce.
And so she reached out to me forguidance, yeah, for guidance.
(30:57):
And in the beginning I was kindof like, huh well, where were
you, where were you when I wasgoing through mine?
But I put those feelings asideand decided to become that
friend again and just kind of,you know, just make those
thoughts that I had go away andwas able to kind of coach her
and give her the strength thatshe needed to get out of a
(31:19):
really unfortunate situationherself.
Yeah, and so she is now happilydivorced, which I know sounds
very happily divorced, um, andshe's thriving and doing very
well.
So, you know, you may have thatsituation where those people
that did disappear from yourworld do come back because
they're going to go through thatsituation or it could be
another situation they're goingthrough in their life that you
(31:41):
know they need your guidance on.
And it's kind of funny becausewhen you do come out on the
other side of this, peoplereally look at you as a point of
strength.
Yeah, they really do Like, wow,she's she went through it.
Yeah, and I need to tap into herbrain because she she
understands stuff that I don'tyeah.
(32:01):
So you really do become the Idon't know the expert if you
will, not that you want to be anexpert in divorce, but you
become a a life expert ofdealing with something that's
very traumatic because it isyeah.
Speaker 1 (32:14):
Well, and what I found, too, was that, uh, some
people that were friends of minedidn't want to really get
involved because they, too wereunhappy in their marriage, and
they thought, well, if I'mfriends with you while you're
going through this, it's goingto make me want to go through it
, or it's going to make me facethose demons and face those
(32:38):
issues and maybe you don't evenrealize it.
I think a lot of times it'ssubconsciously.
You know that you're about togo through that too, and so
you're like, well, I can't be apart of this, because that's
going to make me want to do itor whatever.
Like it's, it's not contagious,right, you know like?
Speaker 2 (32:57):
that's the thing I love.
That, yeah, so not contagiousyou can be happily married.
Speaker 1 (33:02):
That's totally fine.
Good with that.
I'm happy for you, you know Iwant you to be happy.
Speaker 2 (33:06):
Are you happy, right?
No, no, you nailed something.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
It's not contagious like I'm not gonna come tell you
about my divorce and you'regonna go oh my god, that sounds
amazing, I'm gonna get divorced?
Speaker 2 (33:16):
let's do it.
How do I do this?
How do I get?
What do I do?
What's my first?
Speaker 1 (33:20):
step.
Yeah, yeah, it's a club that,like, no one really wants to be
a member of, but once you are init and you are healed, then
it's.
I don't want to say it's abadge of honor, but it is a
piece of your story that helpsyou put that armor back on and
(33:40):
build up and become the personthat you want to be.
Speaker 2 (33:42):
And I think that's how we have to look at it.
You know, like I mentionedearlier, it is nothing that any
of us want to deal.
We didn't get married to getdivorced.
No, we don't sign up for that,no, um, but marriage takes two
people, very dedicated to makeit work.
You know, the biggest, biggestissue, I think, in every
relationship, not even justmarriage, but every relationship
, is communication.
I think we as humans, withtechnology, I think we've really
(34:04):
lost the art of communicationsand, as grateful as I am for
technology.
I think we have just lost thatart of being able to pick up the
phone or sit down with somebodyin person and have that
communication, and you know it,it starts with that and no, it's
definitely.
It is a badge of honor because,you know you, you got through a
(34:28):
very, you know, difficult.
You know, like I said, you gothrough every single emotion
that you can possibly go through, like a death.
You know, and you got throughit and you're coming out on the
other side.
Does it happen right away,where you're strong?
Oh my gosh, no, I'm stillgrowing after 17 years.
Yeah, I'm still growing.
Every day I have my triggers.
You know, not every day, butonce in a while I'll have a
trigger and I'm like, oh, Ididn't like that.
Yeah, you know, sometimes Ilaugh about it.
(34:50):
Sometimes it does get meemotionally, you know,
challenged um you know, andthat's normal.
Yeah, we're humans and we'regoing to always have those.
That's normal.
Yeah, we're humans and we'regoing to always have those.
But I think what you have tofocus on is that I like that
badge of honor.
Yeah, because, boy, do you growfrom this situation.
Yes, you grow so much as ahuman.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
If you allow it, if you allow it, know you're right.
Yes, I unfortunately have knownseveral people that go through
it and they continue to stay inthat victim mentality and never
learn and grow from it.
So I love that.
You know, we've kind of we'vekind of touched on you know that
(35:33):
, like you and I have a verysimilar path after divorce.
Everybody has a unique story oftheir divorce in their marriage
and all of that.
But the the part that you and Idid afterwards was the work.
We did the work to figure outlike I mean, I did the same
thing you did.
I was like I went to therapyand I was like what did I do
(35:54):
wrong?
Why was I not the perfect wife?
Like what can I do to be better?
Like what can I do to to be abetter wife and a better mom?
And and how did I make himleave me whenever it was like
right, yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
And my therapist was like, no, no, like that.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
No, no, like it's not you, Like I'm certain there are
things that you know maybe youcould have done differently, but
this is not all you.
It takes two to be in themarriage.
It takes two to keep the, tosustain the marriage, and you
can't be the only person wantingit for both of you.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
You're so right.
No, you are so right, and youbrought up a good point.
You know, because I too haveknown people that um, still, to
this day, play victim.
Um, that's who they are.
Um, I don't know if they'llever change, but you know, when
you go through this, you havethat option.
You have a choice you can playvictim or you can grow and
(36:48):
become a beast.
I wanted to be a beast.
My my first goal was to show myex I don't need you?
Yeah, I don't need you and, tothis day, I'm very proud of you.
Know him, witnessing thingsthat I've done in my life, um,
where I've not needed him, yeah.
So, but yeah, you have to makethat choice.
(37:08):
Do you want to play the victimwhat was me or do you want to be
, you know, the beast and havethat badge of honor for sure?
Speaker 1 (37:14):
Yeah, now I really leaned so far into books and
like really just you know likeself-help learning.
You know, and I still am inthat, like I don't think I'll
ever reach a point, I don'tthink anyone ever reaches a
point where you're like oh myGod, I've reached the pinnacle.
(37:35):
I am now like my… top person,like I can never be better
Always growing, yes, alwaysgrowing.
I found that, uh, anything byBrene Brown was so helpful, like
daring greatly, um, you know.
Uh.
Then, also reading ArianaHuffington, um, you know, things
like that Did you have anybooks or anything that you, any
(37:59):
songs, anything that you reallylistened to that helped you kind
of get through that?
That maybe someone listeningwould go, oh my gosh, like I
need that book or I need youknow, because what helped me may
not have helped you, it may nothelp anybody listening, but you
know, I think just knowledge ispower.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
Oh, knowledge is totally power and to this day, I
still love self-help books ofany type.
I don't think I don't even knowif I have a particular author,
but I just gravitate towardsanything.
I just read one.
You know the beginning of thelast year when I was in a
relationship I knew I needed toget out of and it was called and
I can't remember the name ofthe author how to Win your
Breakup.
And this book I swear it waswritten for me.
(38:37):
Everything that she was writingin there was my story and my
journey with this person.
So I think knowledge is powerand those those types of things,
like you said, whether it'sbooks or documentaries, you can
watch or you know, you know justor songs, music is such a music
is, oh, it's for the soul.
It's amazing Anything you cando to and to help strengthen
(39:03):
yourself and enrich yourknowledge and just help you cope
.
This is about coping, yeah, um,this is about waking up the
next day and making it a betterday than the day before, and,
again, it's about baby steps.
I think one of the biggestchallenges that I've watched
some of my friends when they gothrough these difficult
situations is they just want itdone all at once.
(39:24):
Yeah, this is a journey.
Once you start that process,you're at the bottom and it is
walking up those stairs again tothe top, and every stair is a
different, challenge is adifferent.
You know just something that'sso good Um and um.
I think you continually, nomatter what age you are or where
you are in your life, youcontinually need to grow as a
person.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
Absolutely do.
Speaker 2 (39:45):
Because, even though you get through this divorce,
you might start dating again.
You're going to be put intoanother relationship, um, where
you might deal with differentsituations and different things
that you're not comfortable with.
And, even though you tookgrowth from that divorce,
there's a whole new set ofchallenges that might be waiting
for you.
So you got to figure out how doyou deal with those challenges.
So, um, absolutely, knowledgeis power, for sure.
Speaker 1 (40:09):
Yeah, I agree and I love that you, you know you kind
of shared that that you went onthat growth journey.
You had therapy, um, you know,was there anything else that
maybe you did?
Like, did you?
Cause I know you mentioned that, you know, you weren't, you
weren't entirely happy with, uh,you know, maybe your your body
image, um, you know, and thingslike that, because I think that
(40:29):
those, uh, you know I only saythat because you mentioned a
couple of times that you were.
You know that you were like outof shape, um, and overweight,
which I think we, we all, youknow, get to that point.
So I'd love to just, you knowagain, make sure that everyone,
you know, kind of understandsthe steps that you took, that
(40:51):
you know again, this wasn't anovernight, like you know.
I'm going to cry it out, youknow, for a week and then I'm
going to be like all right, youknow, screw it, I'm good, you
know, and then and then justmove on.
So therapy, that was huge forme, I know it was huge for you,
um, you know, reading the books,things like that, like, was
there anything else that maybeyou think really helped you get
through the day to day?
(41:11):
Because obviously, as I'veshared before, um, it's it's a
roller coaster and you know,some days you're going to be so
sad and you're just going tofeel like you just want to crawl
into a hole.
And I always say lean into that, cry it out, feel all the
feelings and then the next dayyou can put on your big girl
panties and you can go back andthen you're going to go up on
the roller coaster and then yourhighs, you know, are going to
(41:33):
be.
Speaker 2 (41:34):
Oh, so high.
Speaker 1 (41:35):
Yeah, yeah, and eventually your highs get higher
and your lows don't get as lowand you start to kind of even
out.
But it's a massiverollercoaster.
So I'd love to kind of hearwhat did you do to get through
that rollercoaster?
Speaker 2 (41:46):
So you know what one of the biggest things that I
started doing um is?
I did start working out andagain, I'm not a gym buff by any
means, um, but I did findrelease.
And by working out I don't meanbe going to the gym and doing
the weights and all that stuff.
I mean I was joining yogaclasses and Pilates classes and
bar classes.
(42:07):
I taught Zumba.
I taught Zumba.
Never in my path would I everthought I would have taught a
group fitness class, but Itaught Zumba and that I think
that release and being around anew group of people with a
certain interest, that was hugefor me.
That was, that was huge.
(42:28):
It still is huge to me.
Yeah, it's still a big thing.
I try to incorporate that kindof concept into my life every
day.
You know what group of peoplecan I be involved with that?
We have something in commonthat we can do together.
Do I have a walking group?
Do I have this?
Do I have that?
Um.
So that was kind of my release,um.
(42:49):
You know, there was somethingthat my ex said to me again,
another big red flag.
This is this is really brutal,but this is just kind of.
We'll give you a little bit ofan inkling of some of the mental
abuse that I did go through.
Um'll never forget.
There was a time when I waswalking in front of him and I've
always had thick thighs and hemade a comment and guys, why did
(43:09):
I not leave him?
Then I don't know.
Okay, we've all done this, allright, we stay for stupid
reasons.
But he made a comment and heasked me he goes, doesn't that
hurt when your legs rub together?
I can remember this like it wasyesterday.
Those things will always stayetched in your head.
So again, you know, afterstarting going through this
(43:30):
thing, my goal was to reallytake care of me, which was
something I had put to the puton the back burner all those
years.
Yeah, and one of those bigthings was to get myself into
better shape.
I knew career-wise I was goingto be fine because I'm very
driven for work, but I needed totake care of myself physically.
(43:52):
And so I really focused on thatand we all have a different
thing.
You know, maybe you know a lotof you out there are already
physically fit or whatever, soyou'll find a different means to
do that, but that was my thingand it was.
It's still to this day.
Like I said, it's such arelease for me to, even if I'm
on a laptop doing Pilates from aYouTube.
It's a release.
It helps my mind at my age Now,the physical appearance of
(44:16):
things, it's not so much asimportant as my mindset every
day.
What can I do to cleanse mymind and my soul and make me
feel better?
And if the physical gets inbetter shape, that's great, but
I'm not dwelling on it.
Uh, you know, like I did yearsago, so, but that was where I
that was how I kind of turnedthat journey and that path.
Speaker 1 (44:36):
Yeah, well, and I know you mentioned, um, you know
that you were always good inyour uh, career.
Um, so do you think?
A lot of times, people eitherdon't go through with the
divorce or they struggle with itbecause they're like I've been
a stay at home mom, I don't know.
(44:56):
You know how I'm going to payfor things, you know.
So, even though you were securein your, in your career, I'm
sure there was still a part ofyou that was like holy shit, I'm
going to go from having twoincomes to just me, and it's
just me.
So, you know, yeah, I was goingto say how did you feel about
(45:18):
that?
Speaker 2 (45:18):
It was terrifying, um , and we had just it was.
It was kind of funny, you know,um, because at the time one of
the other icings on the cake ofour marriage was, you know, I
was in a corporate position andI went through a layoff and it
was my first time losing my joband I was the breadwinner, the
(45:39):
big breadwinner, and we had just, you know, we'd been living in
this big, beautiful home we justbuilt blah, blah, blah and we
were definitely living paycheckto paycheck because we had built
outside of our means, and sothat again was added stress onto
our marriage, in addition tohaving a young child at the time
, and then just all of the otherstuff that had been building up
(46:01):
, not just with me over theyears you know, he had stuff
building up within him about meover years as well, but just all
of that.
The icing on the cake was whenI lost that big corporate, big
paying job.
And what's funny about it?
I was actually relieved andhappy Because I was miserable at
that job.
Speaker 1 (46:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (46:22):
Completely miserable.
So again another added stressonto that.
When you're not happy whereyou're working, it's just one
more thing that adds to the pile.
And that is actually whatcatapulted me to go into my
insurance industry.
You know, and do what I do now,which I absolutely love, and
take that risk, yeah, um, andtake that risk, yeah, and there
was so much excitement for mebecause I wasn't being confined
(46:46):
into this corporate entityanymore.
I was on my own and I knew, allthese years down deep, I wanted
to be on my own, but he was, um, the type of person that is
very I'm going to stay at acompany for a hundred years,
yeah, and that wasn't me.
I'm like, oh no, I want to makemore money.
I'm going to leave a companyand ask for like 10,000 more a
(47:06):
year.
That's how you get those big payincreases is when you take that
gamble and that was always meand he didn't like that.
So, you know, during that time,that was the icing on the cake
of of the divorce is me taking agamble and, you know, losing
the job but yet going aftersomething that I really wanted
to do and just really working mytail off because, again, I was
(47:30):
going to show him what I coulddo and I did.
Oh boy, did I show.
And it feels so good to thisvery day, yeah.
Speaker 1 (47:40):
Now.
So you created, um, somethingkind of for yourself.
Uh, once, like all of that wasdone, so again you've been able
to just kind of Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (47:50):
You know, I'm always planning for myself.
Every, even on a weekly basis,I'm always planning.
Speaker 1 (47:55):
What's my?
Speaker 2 (47:56):
next step, what's my next goal?
You know I, I, I think that'simportant that we're always
looking 10 steps ahead.
You know I, I, I think that'simportant that we're always
looking 10 steps ahead.
You know we can't change thepast.
We can't fix anything.
That past has made me who I amtoday.
Speaker 1 (48:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (48:12):
Am I perfect?
Oh Lord, no.
I have so much growth and somuch potential and I don't even
know what that is.
But every week I'm alwayslooking for what are my next
steps?
How can I help people on mynext steps?
Who needs to help me with mynext steps?
You know it's it's a big,beautiful circle of life that we
go through and and um.
(48:32):
I think that's the importantthing, that, even though you're
going through that tough journeyof divorce or contemplating it,
like I said, I have so manyfriends contemplating it right
now and they're so scared andand I'm trying to really help
them understand, look, I'm herefor you.
I'm not going anywhere, yeah,so you need me.
You call me.
However, you need me.
Yeah, I'm going to help youthrough this journey.
I'll introduce you to people.
(48:54):
You know, what can we go do?
Let's go do yoga.
Let me, what can I do to helpyour mindset today?
You know, from all those stages, I think just the important
thing is to just just really bethere for people and be there
for yourself, yeah, and alwaysplan your future.
Plan your future.
As sad and difficult as it isto lose that person, you know I
(49:18):
have many friends that are stillreally good friends with their
exes.
Yeah, that's great.
You know that wasn't going tohappen for me, just because of
some of the things that happened, but that's great, that's
awesome.
Everybody has a differentjourney, but I think we just all
need to understand.
It is okay.
Yeah, there are no set rules tohow your life is supposed to
(49:41):
happen.
Set rules to how your life issupposed to happen.
You make those rules and youchoose those paths to walk on
and walk through.
And you know what, my gosh, Ihope, I hope everybody can skip
on those paths.
Let's skip to our future.
Let's be happy, let's smile,let's make a difference in our
lives and our kids' lives andfamily and our friends.
(50:01):
You know that's.
You know, I think the big thingabout life is leaving a legacy
and I know that, with my son,he's going to look back someday
when his dad and I are no longerhere and go wow, they did a
great job at divorce.
They may have not liked eachother very much, but they sure
made my life comfortable with it.
(50:21):
Not liked each other very much,but they sure made my life
comfortable with it.
Um, and to me, that gives mepeace, knowing that you know my
friends that have watched myjourney, or whatever.
You know, it's just leaving alegacy and doing what you want
to do in life and accomplishingyour goals, and if divorce has
to be a part of you being happy,then you know what?
Guess what?
Speaker 1 (50:43):
of you being happy, then you know what?
Guess what?
It's okay, yeah, okay, I lovethat, I love that.
You, you know, have saidseveral different times, you
know, whether it was a negativething or a positive thing like,
and it's okay.
And I think that's the biggestthing that people need to know,
that we're all on this journey,we're all on our individual
journey and it's okay.
Like you're going to have bumpsin the road, and that's okay.
Like you're going to have bumpsin the road and that's okay.
And you're going to have greatdays, and that's okay.
(51:04):
And you're going to have baddays, that's okay too, like you
can, you know.
But I think the biggest thing,you know, the biggest theme that
I I wouldn't even say thebiggest thing, but one of the
themes that continues to comethrough is, you know, asking for
that help.
Because we, as women me, meincluded we have such a hard
(51:25):
time asking for help because wejust want to do it ourselves, we
just want to be independent, wedon't need anybody, especially
when you're going through adivorce You're like, well, screw
you, then I don't need you, Idon't need anybody, I'm fine,
you know.
But I think the biggest thingto remember is you do actually
need people.
You do.
You do actually need to reachout and ask for help, and it's
okay to ask for help.
(51:46):
You don't have to do it all.
Speaker 2 (51:47):
Here's a funny story about asking for help.
I just met with a girlfriend mymentor.
I mentioned earlier that I'veknown for years and it's really
funny because, you know, beingsingle, okay, and I'm at the age
I have to get a colonoscopy,guess what.
I need somebody to take me.
Yeah, she needs somebody totake her.
(52:08):
We're like, yes, we arecolonoscopy buddies now, but you
know little things like that.
That.
You know you, you you're goingto go through if you don't have
a partner.
Speaker 1 (52:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (52:14):
Who's going to take you?
You know I don't have familymembers in town to take me, or?
whatever so it's kind of funny,you do, you.
You.
You never stop asking for help,and I do think we get better at
asking her for help Once we getolder, even though we know we
can handle so many things.
I'm at the point in my liferight now where I'm just like
I'm asking for help.
Yeah, you know.
Hey, can you take me to mycolonoscopy?
(52:35):
Oh, my God, will you take me tomine?
Yeah, I mean, we were having amargarita over.
It was great.
Yeah, we were so excited.
Let's get it done in January.
Okay, yeah, great, what dayworks for you?
This works for me.
Let me know when you scheduleand then I'll let you know when
I schedule.
Yeah, just silly little thingslike that.
You know you always.
You know people, people.
(52:55):
Just you know we need to helpeach other.
Yeah, yeah, because life is verychallenging and we just need to
be there for each other, youknow, during whatever, whatever
situation we're dealing with.
Yeah, I agree.
Speaker 1 (53:08):
Well, thank you so much.
I really really appreciate youbeing so vulnerable, so open,
you know kind of just walking usthrough your story, but also
just you know giving so manylike nuggets of wisdom.
I just appreciate you, you knowbeing so open and sharing of
wisdom.
I just appreciate you, you knowbeing so open and sharing.
Speaker 2 (53:24):
Oh my gosh.
Absolutely.
I appreciate the time.
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (53:27):
Yeah, absolutely.
I just want to make sure thatI'm honoring you.
Is there anything else that youfeel like you didn't cover or
you didn't say or any anythingelse, and it you don't have to
like think of something, oh mygosh.
Speaker 2 (53:42):
There are a million things I could say right now.
Right.
Speaker 1 (53:45):
Yeah, I just want to make sure you feel seen, heard,
validated and that you got tosay what you wanted to say,
absolutely.
Speaker 2 (53:53):
You know what I again the biggest point is that it is
okay and you are not alone.
Yes, I can't stress that enough.
And you know, try to not be thevictim, try to be that person,
to just move on with your life,because life is precious and
whatever you're going throughnow, it's your journey and it's
(54:15):
it's going to help you so much,it's going to help you grow so
much as a person.
Speaker 1 (54:19):
Yeah, I agree, I think recently I heard like a
really good nugget of advice andit was like when you're going
through something negativeinstead of going, why is this
happening to me?
It is.
Why is this happening for me?
Love it.
Speaker 2 (54:38):
That's so true.
Speaker 1 (54:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (54:39):
Everything happens for a reason.
Yes.
There's nothing more truer thanthat statement.
Everything happens for a reason, good or bad, yeah.
And you just have to embrace itand make it.
Make it into the good, yeah,don't make it into a bad
situation.
Take it and make it good.
Speaker 1 (54:58):
Yeah, I love it.
I love it.
Well, thank you so much.
Absolutely Thank you, yeah, andthank you everyone for tuning
in.
We'll see you next time onthrive and decide.
Hi and welcome to this week's episode of Thrive
and Decide.
This week we have Toni, who hasvery graciously agreed to come
on and share her story and, likeI always try and tell people
whenever they're tuning intothis in case this is your first
time the reason that I feelreally strongly about working
(00:23):
with women that are goingthrough these life changes, you
know, like a divorce or like a,you know, loss of a spouse the
reason that I like to havepeople come on and share their
story is because everyone'sstory is unique but there may be
something that is said that canhelp you, and the whole idea
here is to help women feel seen,heard, understood, validated
(00:49):
and just to make sure thatyou're not alone.
So, tony, thank you so much foryou know being so gracious and
vulnerable, because this is avulnerable, you know, topic.
So I appreciate you coming onand, you know, just kind of
sharing, sharing your story withus.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Oh gosh, Well, thank you so much for having me.
And it is a vulnerable, it's anuncomfortable topic as well as
well.
I think when we go throughdivorce, we we feel like we're a
failure.
Yeah, we are a failure, and ittakes two people to make a
marriage work.
I know I come from a family.
My parents just celebrated 56years Wow 56 years, and that was
(01:32):
the goal that I had set formyself.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
And you know I have been divorced.
It'll be 17 years next monthand but it feels like yesterday.
Yeah, it's been 17 years.
Time definitely goes fast.
But there are moments that Ihave like my gosh.
Every time my parents celebratean anniversary as happy as I am
, there's a part of me that'ssad that I didn't get that
chance.
(01:55):
I didn't have that chance togrow old with the person, but
what I did get a chance of isgetting into the correct life
that I'm supposed to be leading.
Um, I think a lot of times wewe think that we're supposed to
go down this path and thisjourney and stay in a situation
that we're we're not happy andthat's not the case.
(02:16):
I tell friends all the time.
I have so many friends that arecontemplating divorce, going
through a divorce, arecontemplating divorce, going
through a divorce, and I justwant to say divorce is okay.
Yeah, divorce is okay.
There is no rule that you haveto stay married and we all come
from very different situationsin relationships that we've had
(02:37):
and you know I've heard so manystories over the years.
But divorce is okay and, yes,is it difficult?
Absolutely.
You go through every singleemotion the anger, the hate, the
sadness, the you know the, thescared.
You go through every emotion.
It's it's like a death, butthey're still around.
It's like a death of a personbut they're still there.
(03:00):
No, but you go through all ofthese emotions and and what I
have found over all of theseyears.
I, even to this very day, I'llhave a trigger, even though it's
been 17 years.
I'll have a trigger, but it's,but it's.
I've grown so much and I lovewhere my life is and I love who
I am as a human being.
And you know, I was a verydifferent person back in the day
(03:22):
.
So so I'm going to take youback in that day, a long time
ago, back in that day.
So I met my ex at a place ofemployment and he was a bad boy,
fresh out of the Navy.
Bad boy.
He was super hot and all thegirls wanted him.
So guess what?
Of course I had to win thatbattle.
(03:46):
Of course you did.
I had to win because I, like Ilike a challenge and, um, you
know I was.
I was definitely a moreinsecure person at that time.
Um, I was.
I was a little bit overweight.
Um, you know, I just got out ofa bad relationship, um, that I
was really distraught over, andum, so I was I was very
vulnerable and I was very naiveand you know, he and I, we
(04:09):
connected.
He couldn't be more oppositethan I am, even to this day.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
Just I look at him, I'm like what was I thinking?
We all have those moments.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
But I look at it now and I'm like but I had to have
him, yeah, because he was achallenge and he was a bad boy,
um, so you know it.
Um, you know it started out fun, because opposites do attract.
And there there's, there's somefun in those first two years.
And you know, I'll start out bysaying we got together and then
we moved in together.
Gosh, eight months after westarted dating, my father was
(04:46):
not happy about that at all.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Oh, I can imagine.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
And my pitch to my dad I think I was, I was just
turning 24 years old.
My pitch to my dad was well,dad, this is great, we have to
like we'll figure it out beforewe get married.
Right, we'll figure it out.
Well, that really didn't happen.
That line doesn't really work.
So when my if my son ever cameto me and said that I'd be like
no dude, that, trust me, thatdoesn't work.
Okay, so we, so we, we moved intogether and again, the first
(05:13):
couple of years were fine.
It was exciting, you know, thiswhole new thing or whatever,
but I always knew in my gut, inmy gut, something was something
that I always knew in my gut hewasn't my person.
But when you're in your earlytwenties, you're on that
timeline yes, timeline.
I got to lock and load somebodybecause I want to be married by
(05:36):
then and I want to start havingkids by then, yep, and you know
, that's unfortunate, and ifthere's one thing that I can
tell anybody, we're not on anykind of timeline.
I know people that are justgetting married for the first
time in their 50s and guess what?
That's okay.
Yep, that's okay.
So I know people that have beenmarried for 30 some years that
(05:58):
are getting divorced, and that'sokay.
So it's all part of yourindependent, it's all part of
our personal journey and we haveto go with our gut and we have
to go with what is making ushappy.
I think what we tend to do iswe tend to try to make other
people happy before we makeourselves happy.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
One million percent.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
And this is our life and we've got one shot at this.
So what?
What are we doing to makeourselves happy?
And if I could go back and redoit all, but I have to say, let
me just say I have the mostamazing son from this human.
So, most amazing son I like tocall my sperm donor, and that's
(06:39):
okay.
That's okay.
Sperm donor.
My son is just the best thingever, so um, it's a great sperm
donor.
My son is just the best thingever, so um.
But so we, we moved in togetherand don't you know, we were
together, living together, sixyears before we finally got
married, wow yeah.
So, okay, that's a big red flag.
Yeah, that's a big red flag.
And my older self knows now whatI've heard from all of my male
(07:00):
friends that a man knows in fourto five months of male friends,
that a man knows in four tofive months if you are the one
he wants to be with, yeah, andso, as I am in this world of
dating now, I tell myself thatthat if I get into a
relationship and if it's at fourto five month point we're
having a conversation, and ifthey don't, if it's not, if
there's no feeling there,whatever, we're moving on.
(07:21):
But anyways, this is in yourtwenties.
Things are different back then,um, you know, different
generation, um, so so we gotmarried and a year later I get
pregnant and just things justjust start to decline, just
start to decline and so many ofthe factors that happened to us,
um, but I do want to backtrackjust a little bit and tell you
(07:44):
about the work environment weworked in.
We worked in a very young workenvironment at a very exciting,
edgy, popular company and Iwon't name the name because
everybody knows somebody thatworked at this company back in
the day technology company andyou know the work environment.
Everybody was so flirty.
And I was just talking to agirlfriend about this the other
(08:04):
night that worked there with me.
She's actually my life mentor,but we were talking about this.
You know, everybody was soflirty and you know the younger
version of myself in my twentiesdefinitely overweight at the
time, insecure, dating a bad boy.
You know that everybody flirtedwith him.
He flirted with everybody.
There was a lot of insecurityon my part and that's just ugly,
(08:25):
yeah.
And I think we've all been inthose phases where we have that
insecurity.
I became a different person.
To make him happy, yeah, myparents even to this day would
tell me gosh, you were just anugly nasty person because I
changed who I was to make himhappy.
(08:45):
Try to make him happy.
Yeah, and now in hindsight,nothing was going to make him
happy, right?
Speaker 1 (08:51):
Even to this day.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Nothing makes him happy.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
Well, and you probably didn't even realize
that you were changing who youwere to fit that mold, not at
all, not at all, not at all.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
I was so focused on being the perfect girlfriend,
the perfect wife, and then cometo be the perfect mother.
And just I was accepting notbeing treated how I wanted to be
treated, you know.
Speaker 1 (09:18):
I'll give you a great example.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
You know I'm Italian.
We are like we are huggers.
We are I love yous to.
You know, we never hang up thephone with people we love
without saying I love you, youknow, because we believe in the
fact that that could be the lasttime you talk to a person so
and on a good note right.
And I'll never forget this.
And this was not.
This was about maybe halfway inthe dating thing, we already
living together and all thatstuff.
(09:41):
But I had a conversation withhim saying, my gosh, you know,
you never told me you love me.
And he said I don't have to,you should know how I feel.
Oh, boom, red flag right there.
Wow, red flag.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:52):
Guys, I had a million red flags.
I ignored them all because Iwas on this track.
Yep, I got my guy.
He's locked and loaded.
We live together.
Now we're going to get married,or you know we got married, now
we're going to get married, oryou know, we got married, now
we're gonna.
You know, I stayed in therebecause I thought I had to, okay
, and that was just was, justwas just wrong.
We should not stay in situationswhere we are not comfortable
(10:16):
now let's let's say I'm notencouraging everybody to go out
there and get a divorce right.
But, my gosh, do you reallywant to lead a life where you're
just not happy and your partneris not treating you with the
respect?
And there's so many things thatare going on in relationships?
You know, I have a familymember that's that's in a very
tumultuous relationship and it'sso hard for me to watch what
she's going through and she'snot in a position where she can
(10:41):
get out, and that's the whole.
Other part of a conversation wecan get into is getting
yourself in a position to where,if you need to get out of a
situation, you can financiallydo it, because most people are
not there.
So, um, but back to back to mystory.
You know, we we worked in thisvery flirtatious environment and
you know I'm going to go downthis path.
I'm going to, I'm going to talkabout it.
(11:02):
You know what?
There was a work colleague thathe was very, very, very close
to and she was married to agreat guy, you know, to a guy
that if I saw on the street tothis day I'd still hug him
because he's an amazing guy.
But but you know, she was a bitof a busybody, always in
business, and my ex was veryjust, for whatever reason, just
very drawn to her.
(11:23):
Um, you know, um, he invitedthem to the wedding and I was
devastated because she wasn't myfriend, I didn't want her at
the wedding.
Yeah, um, and you know,ultimately, his, his
relationship, you know, I don'tthink they had a physical affair
, but they definitely had anemotional affair and if you're
familiar with that, I thinkthat's worse than a physical
(11:46):
affair, because that emotionalconnection is what we as humans
are supposed to be drawntogether on.
Is that emotional connection?
And when your husband at thetime is is spending more time
hanging out at this girl's housewith her husband, which is just
so weird, versus being homewith his wife and his son,
(12:07):
there's a problem, there's a bigproblem, and that was
ultimately the the the bigdemise of this.
You know we won't get intodetails of all that other stuff,
Um, but you know, my gosh, youknow, going through that divorce
, it was.
It's a devastating situation,but I am here to say it is going
(12:30):
to be okay and it's going to bebetter than okay when you, when
you're at the bottom, the onlyplace you can go is up and it's
baby steps, it's getting throughall of those emotions and it's
figuring out who you are.
I mean, one of the best feelingswas when my parents, years
(12:50):
after the divorce, were like ohmy gosh, we're so glad to have
you back.
You're back.
And it made me cry because Inever realized that I wasn't
there.
Yeah, but it just sucked thelife out of me and just
everything I was going throughwas just it was painful.
Yeah, but it just sucked thelife out of me and just
everything I was going throughwas just it was painful, yeah,
yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:07):
You bounce back and you become better.
Yeah, now, when you were goingthrough that and you were, you
know this, quote unquote likedifferent person, um, did you
have a lot of people in your youknow kind of inner circle that
were like helpful or not helpful?
Because I feel like it's acommon theme that people quote
(13:33):
unquote, mean well, but some ofthe things that they think
they're doing to be helpfulactually are very hurtful.
Or having someone that doesn'tunderstand your situation and
tells you oh, you can make itwork, like just suck it up,
you've got a kid.
You can't do that to your kid,you're going to completely fuck
them up, you know.
So I would love to just kind ofhear, like, did you, did you
(13:58):
have that inner circle?
Were you able to create thatinner circle?
Did you have haters?
Speaker 2 (14:03):
What's funny?
Bring that up.
Let's talk about friends.
Let's talk about how that workswhen you go through this.
So he and I, having worked atthe same company, we had a lot
of mutual friends.
Yeah, and to this day, many ofthem I still don't talk to.
When you start going throughthese difficult relationship
times, what I've learned ispeople don't know how to react,
(14:24):
so they disappear.
They disappear.
I mean my gosh, the friend Ihad.
She was such a good friend tome at the time she threw our
bridal shower.
For God's sake, you know, payfor it, pay for the whole bridal
shower out of her pocket.
I've not talked to her in allof these years and it's still to
this day kind of chokes me upbecause how can you go from that
(14:46):
to nothing?
Yeah, but I learned veryquickly.
And then I've had some friendscome back into my world.
They left me back in the daywhen I was going through this
time and then, over the courseof time, they kind of came back
into my world and we've hadthese conversations and they're
like we just didn't know how totalk to you and I said all you
(15:07):
had to do was just talk to me.
I didn't expect anything fromyou.
Just continue to be my friend.
You know I was the same personyou knew.
You know now I'm a betterperson because my real identity
is back after going through allof that.
But I think people just have afear.
They just want to stay out ofit and don't want to get
involved.
Um, was there judging?
(15:27):
Um, yeah, there was judging.
Of course people like to judge.
That's what humans like to do,for whatever gross reason it's.
It is gross.
Um, they don't know.
They don't know your world.
They don't know what goes onbehind those closed doors.
They don't know.
You know I hired a privateinvestigator because of things
(15:49):
that I uncovered in my situationand they don't know what that
was.
They don't know what Iuncovered on that.
Speaker 1 (15:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
They don't know what I saw, they don't know the
emails that I was able to read.
They don't know.
So they do tend to judge andsay you know, gosh, you know
you've only been married sevenyears.
Shouldn't you make it work?
You've got this young child,like you said.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
And it's like you know what?
Speaker 2 (16:10):
First of all, there's no good time to get a divorce.
It doesn't matter if your childis young or if your child is a
teenager or an adult.
Your child could be 30.
It's still going to be hard forthem to watch their parents,
you know, not be one unitedperson.
But what you have to do, what Ihad to do, was just make it
(16:34):
okay for my son.
I had to train my friends.
Guys, I'm going to be so muchbetter.
I'm going to be a better friendto you because I'm not going to
be miserable anymore.
Yeah, I'm getting myself out ofa miserable situation where I
am not being treated like I wantto be treated, and that's what
you should embrace me for andcongratulate me.
And let's go out and have somefun, let's do some things and
(16:57):
help keep my mind focused on thefuture versus what I'm going
through now.
Just let me get through this.
And you know, yeah, it's, it'severybody.
It's so funny because when yougo through a divorce, it's not
really, it's not just you goingthrough a divorce.
Everybody around you is goingthrough it your family, your
friends.
You know the, the, the familymember that I have, when she's
not going through a divorce now,but she is.
She's not going through adivorce now, but she is, she's
(17:19):
close to making it happen andit's affecting our whole family
and it's it's not a good thing.
You know, we have all of thesebeautiful holidays coming up.
It's going to be very awkward,yeah, so we have to put on the
happy faces and go.
Okay, you know you are thefather of these two beautiful
children that are still veryyoung and I'm going to always
(17:39):
respect you because of that.
You know what I mean.
So it affects everybody and Ithink that people need to
understand.
Like I said before, you don'tknow what people are really
going through.
Yeah, that's why it's alwaysgood to be kind to anybody you
see on the street.
You don't know what they'refacing in their life, yeah, so
we all need to learn to just bemore accepted and respectful and
(18:00):
understand that you know.
If somebody you care about isgoing through something like
this, you know, ask themquestions, how can you help?
They're probably going to say,oh, there's nothing you can do.
Just when I need to vent, whenI need to cry, can I?
Can I text you?
Can I call you?
Can I have five minutes?
You know, just last night Ipicked up the phone because I
(18:21):
was having a moment and calledone of my girlfriends and said
okay, I need five minutes ofyour time, because the last
relationship I was in I had atrigger and I needed five
minutes, and that's that's allpeople really need.
We just need to understand thesensitivity to all of this.
But again, I just really want toreiterate that you know we all
go through these situations fora reason.
(18:42):
It's part of our life journey.
It's not something that weintended to do, but it happened
and it's okay.
It's okay and I think that'sthe biggest thing I can stress
that it's okay to do somethingthat's going to put you on a
better journey in your life.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
Yeah, so you, um, you had the private investigator,
you uncovered information andall of that, and so did you then
confront him with anything?
Oh, I did, and, and like, howdid that conversation go?
And is that what ultimately ledto?
Speaker 2 (19:14):
like, we're done Well my ex was and still is to this
very day which still fires me up.
See, it's a trigger to this day.
If I have something I need totalk to him about regarding our
son, when he doesn't want totalk, he just shuts down.
And then there's me.
That's like blah, blah, blah,blah, blah, blah.
(19:35):
The Italian one I want to knowBlah, blah, blah.
So that confrontation, I meanit was a joke, because of course
you're going to get that's nottrue.
That's not true.
You know, I can't believe youdid this, whatever.
You know all this stuff, youknow you, you go through all of
that stuff.
But I think the important partof it was that he needed to
understand that I knew what hewas doing.
(19:55):
I was onto him, I confrontedher about it and she's like
we're just friends.
No, it is not appropriate to belike that with somebody else's
husband.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
It just isn't.
Speaker 2 (20:08):
Um, and there's so much of that that goes on in
this day and age.
Oh my gosh, we need to have aseparate podcast for dating.
But anyways, we will.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
I'll have you back.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
We'll talk about dating, yeah no, but um, but
yeah, no it, um.
It's kind of funny because whenit comes to counseling, I am
the biggest fan of counseling.
Yep, I actually did personalcounseling just for me.
I met with a counselor before alot of this major stuff was
(20:36):
going down, because I wasstruggling so much internally,
thinking what am I doing wrong?
This man won't even tell me heloves me.
I should know it.
Um, you know, just doesn't,just doesn't treat me like I'm.
And so I basically went to acounselor to find out what was
wrong with me yes, and I'm ahuge fan of that, I promote it
all the time and only to findout there was nothing wrong with
me.
I was just not with my person,yeah, and so to me, that was
(21:00):
kind of my first aha moment.
But having said that, I hired aPI.
We go through all this stuff, alot of other situations during
this whole thing and I convincedhim let's go to marriage
counseling.
But there is a fine line.
There's a fine line tocounseling as a couple.
Yep, If you get to counselingbefore it is so far in, you're
(21:24):
going to be great.
Marriage counseling is awesome,but there's a fine line where,
if you're just too far past andthere's too much hatred and
there's too much lack of trust.
It's not going to work.
So we go, we go to thiscounselor.
This, this poor guy can just Ican still visualize his face Um,
we sit down and my ex and I arenot saying a word to each other
(21:48):
.
There are so much anger in usbetween this.
I mean you could.
I feel, like I could feel theheat from the bodies, that anger
and the hatred and the notwanting to be there and we sat
down and I'll never forget thiscouncil.
He just, he was just like wow,um, I'm having a feeling this
session is not going to lastvery long and I just I kind of
(22:12):
laughed and again I was beingchildish and I'm like, yeah,
probably not.
I had so much anger in me.
Who wants to have that kind ofanger?
Right, who wants to be that?
You were sitting there with theperson you married that was
supposed to be till death?
Do you part and the father ofyour child?
You have so much hatred andanger.
Who wants that?
(22:32):
Nobody wants that.
Um, and I think that sessionlasted 15 minutes and basically
the the counselor said guys, I'msorry, I just I really do just
just think that you guys have,you know, it's just not going to
work.
Yeah, and to hear that 15minutes in from a marriage
counselor, you're just kind oflike wow.
And but one of the things Iwant to point out about that one
(22:53):
session we went to just one, um, my ex had said something
because you know, I think we'reall under the common notation of
you've got one soulmate outthere, right, you've got your
one true love.
And my ex actually made thecomment she's not my person,
she's not my one love, she's notmy one true love.
(23:14):
And you know what thatcounselor said and I will never
forget it and I believe in this.
And he's like well, he goes.
I'm going to correct you onthat he goes.
I don't believe in you havingone true soulmate out there, one
true love he goes.
I believe you have manysoulmates and you have many
loves, because we go throughmany phases in our life where we
change.
Yeah, and I will never forgetthat.
(23:37):
That was one of the mostpowerful things that came out of
that 15-minute counselormeeting where he basically said
you guys are done.
I believe that to this day.
I don't believe you have Now myparents.
Again, they're the exception.
Yeah, I think what they have isso unique and so rare, and
(23:59):
again, they're in a completelydifferent generation, but in our
generations, in this day andage.
I don't mean you should go outthere, get married and get
divorced just to see who else isout there, gosh, no.
But if it's not working andyou're miserable and you have
anger and so much animosity andanimosity that's a hard word
Animosity, yeah, animosity,great job, lord, thank you, um,
towards somebody you know, Ijust, I think it's just you just
(24:22):
you'd have to proceed how yourgut is telling you to do but
I'll never forget that you havemany loves for the different
times in your lives.
Maybe you yeah, you just do so.
I'll never forget that Verypowerful.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
Yeah, I agree, and I think that's something that you
don't learn until you're older,you know older and kind of look
back on it because you know, Iknow, I believed that in my
twenties, like I'm just lookingfor my soulmate, and I thought
you know my husband was mysoulmate, you know obviously
right, yeah, Well.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
I, should you want to kill him and then, you're like.
Speaker 1 (24:57):
well, death did us part then you're like, well,
death did us part?
Yeah, no, exactly so.
But I, you know, I hate thefact that you had to go through
that and I hate the fact thatanyone has to go through this.
But what I have learned throughmy healing journey and how I've
(25:17):
gotten to this point, you know,11 years out from my divorce,
um, is just by constantlyfocusing on how to grow, how to
become a better version ofmyself.
Recognizing that I, you know,did put, you know, my ex on a
pedestal.
I did think that, you know,like that was it.
And then I thought my wholeworld was, you know, crumbling
(25:39):
and falling apart and I was, youknow, like I was going to be
fucked up forever.
Uh, you know, to then realizelike, no, it's okay, and that
happened for a reason.
And, you know, and that's okay,and it's led me now to this
point and, uh, you know, allowedme to then help others to
understand, like it's okay, whatyou're feeling.
It doesn't matter what you'refeeling, it's okay, it's okay.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
It's so okay, and that's what everybody needs to
understand that you're not alone.
Yeah, you are not alone.
So many, so many people havegone through this, are going
through this, will go throughthis and don't know it yet, or
want to go through this, butdon't know how to to make things
happen.
And I just can't stress enoughthat you know we have one life
(26:22):
to live.
We have to make every momentcount and you know, just like
with your friends, and you knowwhere you work or whatever just
every element of your life needsto make you happy yeah but gosh
, your spouse should be yourbest friend.
My ex was not best my bestfriend you know what he told me
when I confronted him againearly on in in the relationship
and other red flag guys Um, Isaid you should be my best
(26:45):
friend.
He's like no, he's like you'reyou're.
You know you're my girlfriend,you know you can't be my best
friend.
That's just weird.
And that again I should haveran right.
I should have ran again Like,oh my gosh, I could have run
like 5,000 miles all the redcards, I would run for back in
the day.
But you know, I mean again, it'sit's hindsight on all these
things you look back on.
But you know I think yourspouse should be your best
(27:07):
friend, the person that youtrust and they trust you and
that person that is your ride ordie.
And you know I'm I'm excited tofind that person If I ever do.
I may not, and that's okay aswell, it's okay to not have that
person Again my path.
I am just taking these stepsevery day.
I'm just glad to wake uphealthy every morning and I just
(27:30):
embrace what the day holds andI am grateful.
People ask me all the time, youknow, because my ex and I, you
know, we raised this amazing son.
He played college sports, sowe've had to spend a lot of time
together through all theseyears and a lot of times we
really mastered the craft ofdivorce.
(27:50):
We didn't make it ugly, okay,we kept it very clean for the
sake of our son and a lot offolks in my community for the
longest time when he was likemiddle school sports, even some
high school, they didn't evenknow we were divorced because we
can be very civil together.
Speaker 1 (28:05):
And that's very important.
Speaker 2 (28:06):
Even though down deep I still get gurgles, like you
know, I'm able to put on thatpoker face and know that.
You know what I am strong, I amsolid, I've made it through
this.
I've been independent on my ownfor a long time now and it's
been such a godsend, such ablessing.
And you know my son, he's sogood because he's an adult now.
(28:29):
He still will make sure tospend equal time with myself and
his father during the week.
I mean, isn't that crazy?
He doesn't have to.
That's so sweet it is because heunderstands the importance of
having a relationship with bothof us, and you know.
So when I sit back at the endof the day and you know, if I
have a trigger or I think aboutsome of these things from the
(28:50):
past, I get a little grumpyabout it.
I think about the end resultand the fact that we have an
amazing child together who is agood, humble human being, even
though he went through this veryearly on in his life.
He, as an adult, has skills andstuff.
His organizational skills areimpeccable when you have to
divide your time between twohouses.
(29:11):
He learned never to forgetanything or whatever.
But you know he has skills andhe has knowledge on learning
from his father and I and whatwe've been dealt with and all of
that and I just there's so muchpositive in that whole outcome.
Did you know was painful to gothrough, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (29:29):
Would I want to go through it again.
Speaker 2 (29:30):
No, yeah, but it happened for a reason and I just
embrace that fact and it's, andagain, it's OK, you're not
alone.
Speaker 1 (29:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
Like I said, so many have been through it, so many
are going through it now and Ithink the key thing is just to
be there for people that youknow are going through this.
And if you are going through itnow yourself, my gosh.
Reach out to friends, thosefriends that may be shunning you
.
Reach out to them and say hey,I could really use a quick
(30:03):
conversation with you.
Or can we meet for coffee or aglass of wine, or whatever it is
?
Can we just talk?
I just need to vent and I thinkthat you'll find that they'll
embrace that.
Speaker 1 (30:08):
They're afraid to reach out to you Because they
don't know what to say.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
They don't know what to say.
They're terrified.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
Yeah, well, and they don't want to minimize it by
like, hey, you want to go grab adrink, let's pretend like
nothing's happening.
And it's like, hey, you want togo grab a drink, you know like,
let's, let's pretend likenothing's happening.
And it's like, well, no, likeyou reaching out, like that's
what they need.
But you know when, if you'renot going through it, or you
know, you don't know, you don'tknow what to say, it is very
difficult to do that.
Speaker 2 (30:33):
Absolutely, and you know it's so funny.
It comes full circle becauseone of my very dear friends who
I've known for over 30 years.
She shunned me during mydivorce.
I was devastated and then shereached out to me years later,
and don't you know, she reachedout to me at the time when she
started wanting to get a divorce.
And so she reached out to me forguidance, yeah, for guidance.
(30:57):
And in the beginning I was kindof like, huh well, where were
you, where were you when I wasgoing through mine?
But I put those feelings asideand decided to become that
friend again and just kind of,you know, just make those
thoughts that I had go away andwas able to kind of coach her
and give her the strength thatshe needed to get out of a
(31:19):
really unfortunate situationherself.
Yeah, and so she is now happilydivorced, which I know sounds
very happily divorced, um, andshe's thriving and doing very
well.
So, you know, you may have thatsituation where those people
that did disappear from yourworld do come back because
they're going to go through thatsituation or it could be
another situation they're goingthrough in their life that you
(31:41):
know they need your guidance on.
And it's kind of funny becausewhen you do come out on the
other side of this, peoplereally look at you as a point of
strength.
Yeah, they really do Like, wow,she's she went through it.
Yeah, and I need to tap into herbrain because she she
understands stuff that I don'tyeah.
(32:01):
So you really do become the Idon't know the expert if you
will, not that you want to be anexpert in divorce, but you
become a a life expert ofdealing with something that's
very traumatic because it isyeah.
Speaker 1 (32:14):
Well, and what I found, too, was that, uh, some
people that were friends of minedidn't want to really get
involved because they, too wereunhappy in their marriage, and
they thought, well, if I'mfriends with you while you're
going through this, it's goingto make me want to go through it
, or it's going to make me facethose demons and face those
(32:38):
issues and maybe you don't evenrealize it.
I think a lot of times it'ssubconsciously.
You know that you're about togo through that too, and so
you're like, well, I can't be apart of this, because that's
going to make me want to do itor whatever.
Like it's, it's not contagious,right, you know like?
Speaker 2 (32:57):
that's the thing I love.
That, yeah, so not contagiousyou can be happily married.
Speaker 1 (33:02):
That's totally fine.
Good with that.
I'm happy for you, you know Iwant you to be happy.
Speaker 2 (33:06):
Are you happy, right?
No, no, you nailed something.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
It's not contagious like I'm not gonna come tell you
about my divorce and you'regonna go oh my god, that sounds
amazing, I'm gonna get divorced?
Speaker 2 (33:16):
let's do it.
How do I do this?
How do I get?
What do I do?
What's my first?
Speaker 1 (33:20):
step.
Yeah, yeah, it's a club that,like, no one really wants to be
a member of, but once you are init and you are healed, then
it's.
I don't want to say it's abadge of honor, but it is a
piece of your story that helpsyou put that armor back on and
(33:40):
build up and become the personthat you want to be.
Speaker 2 (33:42):
And I think that's how we have to look at it.
You know, like I mentionedearlier, it is nothing that any
of us want to deal.
We didn't get married to getdivorced.
No, we don't sign up for that,no, um, but marriage takes two
people, very dedicated to makeit work.
You know, the biggest, biggestissue, I think, in every
relationship, not even justmarriage, but every relationship
, is communication.
I think we as humans, withtechnology, I think we've really
(34:04):
lost the art of communicationsand, as grateful as I am for
technology.
I think we have just lost thatart of being able to pick up the
phone or sit down with somebodyin person and have that
communication, and you know it,it starts with that and no, it's
definitely.
It is a badge of honor because,you know you, you got through a
(34:28):
very, you know, difficult.
You know, like I said, you gothrough every single emotion
that you can possibly go through, like a death.
You know, and you got throughit and you're coming out on the
other side.
Does it happen right away,where you're strong?
Oh my gosh, no, I'm stillgrowing after 17 years.
Yeah, I'm still growing.
Every day I have my triggers.
You know, not every day, butonce in a while I'll have a
trigger and I'm like, oh, Ididn't like that.
Yeah, you know, sometimes Ilaugh about it.
(34:50):
Sometimes it does get meemotionally, you know,
challenged um you know, andthat's normal.
Yeah, we're humans and we'regoing to always have those.
That's normal.
Yeah, we're humans and we'regoing to always have those.
But I think what you have tofocus on is that I like that
badge of honor.
Yeah, because, boy, do you growfrom this situation.
Yes, you grow so much as ahuman.
Speaker 1 (35:12):
If you allow it, if you allow it, know you're right.
Yes, I unfortunately have knownseveral people that go through
it and they continue to stay inthat victim mentality and never
learn and grow from it.
So I love that.
You know, we've kind of we'vekind of touched on you know that
(35:33):
, like you and I have a verysimilar path after divorce.
Everybody has a unique story oftheir divorce in their marriage
and all of that.
But the the part that you and Idid afterwards was the work.
We did the work to figure outlike I mean, I did the same
thing you did.
I was like I went to therapyand I was like what did I do
(35:54):
wrong?
Why was I not the perfect wife?
Like what can I do to be better?
Like what can I do to to be abetter wife and a better mom?
And and how did I make himleave me whenever it was like
right, yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
And my therapist was like, no, no, like that.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
No, no, like it's not you, Like I'm certain there are
things that you know maybe youcould have done differently, but
this is not all you.
It takes two to be in themarriage.
It takes two to keep the, tosustain the marriage, and you
can't be the only person wantingit for both of you.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
You're so right.
No, you are so right, and youbrought up a good point.
You know, because I too haveknown people that um, still, to
this day, play victim.
Um, that's who they are.
Um, I don't know if they'llever change, but you know, when
you go through this, you havethat option.
You have a choice you can playvictim or you can grow and
(36:48):
become a beast.
I wanted to be a beast.
My my first goal was to show myex I don't need you?
Yeah, I don't need you and, tothis day, I'm very proud of you.
Know him, witnessing thingsthat I've done in my life, um,
where I've not needed him, yeah.
So, but yeah, you have to makethat choice.
(37:08):
Do you want to play the victimwhat was me or do you want to be
, you know, the beast and havethat badge of honor for sure?
Speaker 1 (37:14):
Yeah, now I really leaned so far into books and
like really just you know likeself-help learning.
You know, and I still am inthat, like I don't think I'll
ever reach a point, I don'tthink anyone ever reaches a
point where you're like oh myGod, I've reached the pinnacle.
(37:35):
I am now like my… top person,like I can never be better
Always growing, yes, alwaysgrowing.
I found that, uh, anything byBrene Brown was so helpful, like
daring greatly, um, you know.
Uh.
Then, also reading ArianaHuffington, um, you know, things
like that Did you have anybooks or anything that you, any
(37:59):
songs, anything that you reallylistened to that helped you kind
of get through that?
That maybe someone listeningwould go, oh my gosh, like I
need that book or I need youknow, because what helped me may
not have helped you, it may nothelp anybody listening, but you
know, I think just knowledge ispower.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
Oh, knowledge is totally power and to this day, I
still love self-help books ofany type.
I don't think I don't even knowif I have a particular author,
but I just gravitate towardsanything.
I just read one.
You know the beginning of thelast year when I was in a
relationship I knew I needed toget out of and it was called and
I can't remember the name ofthe author how to Win your
Breakup.
And this book I swear it waswritten for me.
(38:37):
Everything that she was writingin there was my story and my
journey with this person.
So I think knowledge is powerand those those types of things,
like you said, whether it'sbooks or documentaries, you can
watch or you know, you know justor songs, music is such a music
is, oh, it's for the soul.
It's amazing Anything you cando to and to help strengthen
(39:03):
yourself and enrich yourknowledge and just help you cope
.
This is about coping, yeah, um,this is about waking up the
next day and making it a betterday than the day before, and,
again, it's about baby steps.
I think one of the biggestchallenges that I've watched
some of my friends when they gothrough these difficult
situations is they just want itdone all at once.
(39:24):
Yeah, this is a journey.
Once you start that process,you're at the bottom and it is
walking up those stairs again tothe top, and every stair is a
different, challenge is adifferent.
You know just something that'sso good Um and um.
I think you continually, nomatter what age you are or where
you are in your life, youcontinually need to grow as a
person.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
Absolutely do.
Speaker 2 (39:45):
Because, even though you get through this divorce,
you might start dating again.
You're going to be put intoanother relationship, um, where
you might deal with differentsituations and different things
that you're not comfortable with.
And, even though you tookgrowth from that divorce,
there's a whole new set ofchallenges that might be waiting
for you.
So you got to figure out how doyou deal with those challenges.
So, um, absolutely, knowledgeis power, for sure.
Speaker 1 (40:09):
Yeah, I agree and I love that you, you know you kind
of shared that that you went onthat growth journey.
You had therapy, um, you know,was there anything else that
maybe you did?
Like, did you?
Cause I know you mentioned that, you know, you weren't, you
weren't entirely happy with, uh,you know, maybe your your body
image, um, you know, and thingslike that, because I think that
(40:29):
those, uh, you know I only saythat because you mentioned a
couple of times that you were.
You know that you were like outof shape, um, and overweight,
which I think we, we all, youknow, get to that point.
So I'd love to just, you knowagain, make sure that everyone,
you know, kind of understandsthe steps that you took, that
(40:51):
you know again, this wasn't anovernight, like you know.
I'm going to cry it out, youknow, for a week and then I'm
going to be like all right, youknow, screw it, I'm good, you
know, and then and then justmove on.
So therapy, that was huge forme, I know it was huge for you,
um, you know, reading the books,things like that, like, was
there anything else that maybeyou think really helped you get
through the day to day?
(41:11):
Because obviously, as I'veshared before, um, it's it's a
roller coaster and you know,some days you're going to be so
sad and you're just going tofeel like you just want to crawl
into a hole.
And I always say lean into that, cry it out, feel all the
feelings and then the next dayyou can put on your big girl
panties and you can go back andthen you're going to go up on
the roller coaster and then yourhighs, you know, are going to
(41:33):
be.
Speaker 2 (41:34):
Oh, so high.
Speaker 1 (41:35):
Yeah, yeah, and eventually your highs get higher
and your lows don't get as lowand you start to kind of even
out.
But it's a massiverollercoaster.
So I'd love to kind of hearwhat did you do to get through
that rollercoaster?
Speaker 2 (41:46):
So you know what one of the biggest things that I
started doing um is?
I did start working out andagain, I'm not a gym buff by any
means, um, but I did findrelease.
And by working out I don't meanbe going to the gym and doing
the weights and all that stuff.
I mean I was joining yogaclasses and Pilates classes and
bar classes.
(42:07):
I taught Zumba.
I taught Zumba.
Never in my path would I everthought I would have taught a
group fitness class, but Itaught Zumba and that I think
that release and being around anew group of people with a
certain interest, that was hugefor me.
That was, that was huge.
(42:28):
It still is huge to me.
Yeah, it's still a big thing.
I try to incorporate that kindof concept into my life every
day.
You know what group of peoplecan I be involved with that?
We have something in commonthat we can do together.
Do I have a walking group?
Do I have this?
Do I have that?
Um.
So that was kind of my release,um.
(42:49):
You know, there was somethingthat my ex said to me again,
another big red flag.
This is this is really brutal,but this is just kind of.
We'll give you a little bit ofan inkling of some of the mental
abuse that I did go through.
Um'll never forget.
There was a time when I waswalking in front of him and I've
always had thick thighs and hemade a comment and guys, why did
(43:09):
I not leave him?
Then I don't know.
Okay, we've all done this, allright, we stay for stupid
reasons.
But he made a comment and heasked me he goes, doesn't that
hurt when your legs rub together?
I can remember this like it wasyesterday.
Those things will always stayetched in your head.
So again, you know, afterstarting going through this
(43:30):
thing, my goal was to reallytake care of me, which was
something I had put to the puton the back burner all those
years.
Yeah, and one of those bigthings was to get myself into
better shape.
I knew career-wise I was goingto be fine because I'm very
driven for work, but I needed totake care of myself physically.
(43:52):
And so I really focused on thatand we all have a different
thing.
You know, maybe you know a lotof you out there are already
physically fit or whatever, soyou'll find a different means to
do that, but that was my thingand it was.
It's still to this day.
Like I said, it's such arelease for me to, even if I'm
on a laptop doing Pilates from aYouTube.
It's a release.
It helps my mind at my age Now,the physical appearance of
(44:16):
things, it's not so much asimportant as my mindset every
day.
What can I do to cleanse mymind and my soul and make me
feel better?
And if the physical gets inbetter shape, that's great, but
I'm not dwelling on it.
Uh, you know, like I did yearsago, so, but that was where I
that was how I kind of turnedthat journey and that path.
Speaker 1 (44:36):
Yeah, well, and I know you mentioned, um, you know
that you were always good inyour uh, career.
Um, so do you think?
A lot of times, people eitherdon't go through with the
divorce or they struggle with itbecause they're like I've been
a stay at home mom, I don't know.
(44:56):
You know how I'm going to payfor things, you know.
So, even though you were securein your, in your career, I'm
sure there was still a part ofyou that was like holy shit, I'm
going to go from having twoincomes to just me, and it's
just me.
So, you know, yeah, I was goingto say how did you feel about
(45:18):
that?
Speaker 2 (45:18):
It was terrifying, um , and we had just it was.
It was kind of funny, you know,um, because at the time one of
the other icings on the cake ofour marriage was, you know, I
was in a corporate position andI went through a layoff and it
was my first time losing my joband I was the breadwinner, the
(45:39):
big breadwinner, and we had just, you know, we'd been living in
this big, beautiful home we justbuilt blah, blah, blah and we
were definitely living paycheckto paycheck because we had built
outside of our means, and sothat again was added stress onto
our marriage, in addition tohaving a young child at the time
, and then just all of the otherstuff that had been building up
(46:01):
, not just with me over theyears you know, he had stuff
building up within him about meover years as well, but just all
of that.
The icing on the cake was whenI lost that big corporate, big
paying job.
And what's funny about it?
I was actually relieved andhappy Because I was miserable at
that job.
Speaker 1 (46:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (46:22):
Completely miserable.
So again another added stressonto that.
When you're not happy whereyou're working, it's just one
more thing that adds to the pile.
And that is actually whatcatapulted me to go into my
insurance industry.
You know, and do what I do now,which I absolutely love, and
take that risk, yeah, um, andtake that risk, yeah, and there
was so much excitement for mebecause I wasn't being confined
(46:46):
into this corporate entityanymore.
I was on my own and I knew, allthese years down deep, I wanted
to be on my own, but he was, um, the type of person that is
very I'm going to stay at acompany for a hundred years,
yeah, and that wasn't me.
I'm like, oh no, I want to makemore money.
I'm going to leave a companyand ask for like 10,000 more a
(47:06):
year.
That's how you get those big payincreases is when you take that
gamble and that was always meand he didn't like that.
So, you know, during that time,that was the icing on the cake
of of the divorce is me taking agamble and, you know, losing
the job but yet going aftersomething that I really wanted
to do and just really working mytail off because, again, I was
(47:30):
going to show him what I coulddo and I did.
Oh boy, did I show.
And it feels so good to thisvery day, yeah.
Speaker 1 (47:40):
Now.
So you created, um, somethingkind of for yourself.
Uh, once, like all of that wasdone, so again you've been able
to just kind of Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (47:50):
You know, I'm always planning for myself.
Every, even on a weekly basis,I'm always planning.
Speaker 1 (47:55):
What's my?
Speaker 2 (47:56):
next step, what's my next goal?
You know I, I, I think that'simportant that we're always
looking 10 steps ahead.
You know I, I, I think that'simportant that we're always
looking 10 steps ahead.
You know we can't change thepast.
We can't fix anything.
That past has made me who I amtoday.
Speaker 1 (48:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (48:12):
Am I perfect?
Oh Lord, no.
I have so much growth and somuch potential and I don't even
know what that is.
But every week I'm alwayslooking for what are my next
steps?
How can I help people on mynext steps?
Who needs to help me with mynext steps?
You know it's it's a big,beautiful circle of life that we
go through and and um.
(48:32):
I think that's the importantthing, that, even though you're
going through that tough journeyof divorce or contemplating it,
like I said, I have so manyfriends contemplating it right
now and they're so scared andand I'm trying to really help
them understand, look, I'm herefor you.
I'm not going anywhere, yeah,so you need me.
You call me.
However, you need me.
Yeah, I'm going to help youthrough this journey.
I'll introduce you to people.
(48:54):
You know, what can we go do?
Let's go do yoga.
Let me, what can I do to helpyour mindset today?
You know, from all those stages, I think just the important
thing is to just just really bethere for people and be there
for yourself, yeah, and alwaysplan your future.
Plan your future.
As sad and difficult as it isto lose that person, you know I
(49:18):
have many friends that are stillreally good friends with their
exes.
Yeah, that's great.
You know that wasn't going tohappen for me, just because of
some of the things that happened, but that's great, that's
awesome.
Everybody has a differentjourney, but I think we just all
need to understand.
It is okay.
Yeah, there are no set rules tohow your life is supposed to
(49:41):
happen.
Set rules to how your life issupposed to happen.
You make those rules and youchoose those paths to walk on
and walk through.
And you know what, my gosh, Ihope, I hope everybody can skip
on those paths.
Let's skip to our future.
Let's be happy, let's smile,let's make a difference in our
lives and our kids' lives andfamily and our friends.
(50:01):
You know that's.
You know, I think the big thingabout life is leaving a legacy
and I know that, with my son,he's going to look back someday
when his dad and I are no longerhere and go wow, they did a
great job at divorce.
They may have not liked eachother very much, but they sure
made my life comfortable with it.
(50:21):
Not liked each other very much,but they sure made my life
comfortable with it.
Um, and to me, that gives mepeace, knowing that you know my
friends that have watched myjourney, or whatever.
You know, it's just leaving alegacy and doing what you want
to do in life and accomplishingyour goals, and if divorce has
to be a part of you being happy,then you know what?
Guess what?
Speaker 1 (50:43):
of you being happy, then you know what?
Guess what?
It's okay, yeah, okay, I lovethat, I love that.
You, you know, have saidseveral different times, you
know, whether it was a negativething or a positive thing like,
and it's okay.
And I think that's the biggestthing that people need to know,
that we're all on this journey,we're all on our individual
journey and it's okay.
Like you're going to have bumpsin the road, and that's okay.
Like you're going to have bumpsin the road and that's okay.
And you're going to have greatdays, and that's okay.
(51:04):
And you're going to have baddays, that's okay too, like you
can, you know.
But I think the biggest thing,you know, the biggest theme that
I I wouldn't even say thebiggest thing, but one of the
themes that continues to comethrough is, you know, asking for
that help.
Because we, as women me, meincluded we have such a hard
(51:25):
time asking for help because wejust want to do it ourselves, we
just want to be independent, wedon't need anybody, especially
when you're going through adivorce You're like, well, screw
you, then I don't need you, Idon't need anybody, I'm fine,
you know.
But I think the biggest thingto remember is you do actually
need people.
You do.
You do actually need to reachout and ask for help, and it's
okay to ask for help.
(51:46):
You don't have to do it all.
Speaker 2 (51:47):
Here's a funny story about asking for help.
I just met with a girlfriend mymentor.
I mentioned earlier that I'veknown for years and it's really
funny because, you know, beingsingle, okay, and I'm at the age
I have to get a colonoscopy,guess what.
I need somebody to take me.
Yeah, she needs somebody totake her.
(52:08):
We're like, yes, we arecolonoscopy buddies now, but you
know little things like that.
That.
You know you, you you're goingto go through if you don't have
a partner.
Speaker 1 (52:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (52:14):
Who's going to take you?
You know I don't have familymembers in town to take me, or?
whatever so it's kind of funny,you do, you.
You.
You never stop asking for help,and I do think we get better at
asking her for help Once we getolder, even though we know we
can handle so many things.
I'm at the point in my liferight now where I'm just like
I'm asking for help.
Yeah, you know.
Hey, can you take me to mycolonoscopy?
(52:35):
Oh, my God, will you take me tomine?
Yeah, I mean, we were having amargarita over.
It was great.
Yeah, we were so excited.
Let's get it done in January.
Okay, yeah, great, what dayworks for you?
This works for me.
Let me know when you scheduleand then I'll let you know when
I schedule.
Yeah, just silly little thingslike that.
You know you always.
You know people, people.
(52:55):
Just you know we need to helpeach other.
Yeah, yeah, because life is verychallenging and we just need to
be there for each other, youknow, during whatever, whatever
situation we're dealing with.
Yeah, I agree.
Speaker 1 (53:08):
Well, thank you so much.
I really really appreciate youbeing so vulnerable, so open,
you know kind of just walking usthrough your story, but also
just you know giving so manylike nuggets of wisdom.
I just appreciate you, you knowbeing so open and sharing of
wisdom.
I just appreciate you, you knowbeing so open and sharing.
Speaker 2 (53:24):
Oh my gosh.
Absolutely.
I appreciate the time.
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (53:27):
Yeah, absolutely.
I just want to make sure thatI'm honoring you.
Is there anything else that youfeel like you didn't cover or
you didn't say or any anythingelse, and it you don't have to
like think of something, oh mygosh.
Speaker 2 (53:42):
There are a million things I could say right now.
Right.
Speaker 1 (53:45):
Yeah, I just want to make sure you feel seen, heard,
validated and that you got tosay what you wanted to say,
absolutely.
Speaker 2 (53:53):
You know what I again the biggest point is that it is
okay and you are not alone.
Yes, I can't stress that enough.
And you know, try to not be thevictim, try to be that person,
to just move on with your life,because life is precious and
whatever you're going throughnow, it's your journey and it's
(54:15):
it's going to help you so much,it's going to help you grow so
much as a person.
Speaker 1 (54:19):
Yeah, I agree, I think recently I heard like a
really good nugget of advice andit was like when you're going
through something negativeinstead of going, why is this
happening to me?
It is.
Why is this happening for me?
Love it.
Speaker 2 (54:38):
That's so true.
Speaker 1 (54:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (54:39):
Everything happens for a reason.
Yes.
There's nothing more truer thanthat statement.
Everything happens for a reason, good or bad, yeah.
And you just have to embrace itand make it.
Make it into the good, yeah,don't make it into a bad
situation.
Take it and make it good.
Speaker 1 (54:58):
Yeah, I love it.
I love it.
Well, thank you so much.
Absolutely Thank you, yeah, andthank you everyone for tuning
in.
We'll see you next time onthrive and decide.
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