A bigger ad budget won’t fix a leaky back door. Dr Larry Stanleigh joins us to show how sustainable growth in healthcare comes from relationships, not campaigns—and why most clinics overspend on SEO while underinvesting in trust. Larry’s path spans general dentistry, cosmetic work, periodontal care, and a deep niche in orofacial pain and TMJ, plus leadership in sports performance mouthguards that have supported Olympians to gold. That breadth shapes a clear stance: treat the person first, align care to what they value, and let results fuel referrals.
We dig into the diamond rule—learning what each patient truly wants and matching your recommendations to their goals—so conversations land and acceptance rises. Larry breaks down the marketing trap: local patients search “near me,” maps take over, and a clean site with accurate listings outperforms pricey ranking wars. He shares how one superfan generated tens of thousands in revenue, why sponsoring what your fans care about beats billboards, and how simple tracking turns anecdotes into strategy.
Inside the practice, we tackle the bottlenecks that stall growth: turf wars between front and back, gossip that corrodes trust, and schedules built without clinical context. Larry’s team agreements push issues to direct conversations, while Insights Discovery profiles give everyone a common language to adapt and lead. From there, we zoom out to whole-person care—spotting pelvic imbalance behind clenching, linking sleep-disordered breathing to day-time symptoms, and coordinating with the right partners so results stick. And for the numbers-minded, Larry explains how he cut supply costs in half by fixing systems, not haggling line items, then scaled capacity with pre-planned triggers for hiring and fit-outs.
If you manage a clinic or lead a wellness business, you’ll leave with a practical blueprint: build trust, track what matters, design your growth path, and make sales unnecessary. If this resonated, follow the show, share with a colleague, and leave a quick review—what’s one tactic you’ll drop and one relationship you’ll deepen this week?
👤 Guest Biography
Dr. Larry Stanleigh is a Calgary-based general practice dentist, speaker, and coach who helps health professionals create relationship-driven systems that build trust, improve retention, and transform team culture. With over 38 years of clinical experience, Larry is also the CTO of a Canadian sports performance mouthguard company, a lecturer on business systems, and the author of The People in Your Life Are a Gift. His focus on human-centered leadership and internal marketing has helped practices scale from six figures to multimillion-dollar operations.
- Website:
- Email: 📨 drlarry@drlarry.net
- YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/captdrlarry
- Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/CaptDrLarry
- Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/captdrlarry/
- Linked In: https://www.linkedin.com/in/larry-stanleigh-a964449/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (00:00):
Welcome back to Voices in Health and
Wellness.
This is the show where wespotlight leaders who are
reimagining how care isdelivered in today's ever
fast-changing landscape.
I'm your host, Dr.
Andrew Greenland, and today'sguest is someone who brings deep
experience, heart, and a wholelot of practical wisdom to the
table.
Joining me today is Dr.
Larry Stanleigh, aCanadian-based dentist, speaker,
(00:21):
and educator whose work focuseson transforming internal
systems and elevatingrelationship-based care in
health practices.
With credentials too long tolist and decades of clinical
experience, Dr.
Larry helps teams rethinkeverything from how we greet
patients to how we hire, train,and lead.
Larry, thank you so much forjoining us this afternoon and
(00:41):
welcome to the show.
Dr Larry Stanleigh (00:43):
It's a pleasure to be here.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (00:45):
So perhaps we could start at the top.
Would you mind um sharing alittle bit about your journey
and how you ended up where youare today and the work that
you're most passionate about?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (00:54):
Sure.
It's uh, you know, one of thethings that I found um in in
small business, yeah, especiallyin healthcare, is having not
only you understand your why,but having your team understand
your why.
And then and then it becomes amission and a vision of of how
you want to practice and how youwant to live.
(01:15):
And um I'm uh I'm the secondyoungest of 13 children born and
raised in Toronto.
Uh when I got into dentalschool, I'm the only one in my
family who's in healthcare.
Uh, and uh, and uh when Iwanted to uh get into medical
school uh or dental school, um Icouldn't afford it at the time,
and so I joined the Canadianforces and they sent me out
(01:36):
west.
I'm now in Calgary, Alberta.
I've been here 38 years now anduh uh love the city, love the
uh this part of our country.
It's uh it's an amazing uhplace to live and work and play
and raise a family and andstuff.
But I I um I like being ageneral practice dentist.
I like um uh doing a little bitof everything, and then over
(01:58):
the years, just naturally um Ihave found myself going into a
bit of a niche.
So although I'm a generalpractice dentist with a focus on
uh cosmetic uh components ofdentistry, as well as uh
periodontal care, uh gum health,and and uh and sports uh
medicine and dentistry, uh I'mthe chief technology officer of
(02:22):
a Canadian sports performancemouth guard company and uh
athletes we fitted have won 11Olympic medals, including gold
and silver, gold in uh summerand winter Olympics.
But I've uh now 80% of what Ido is I deal with oral facial
pain and TMJ dysfunction onpeople who have had trauma, car
accidents, workplace accidents,victims of violence, that kind
of thing.
(02:42):
Um, and it's um it'sfascinating work I uh I get to
do.
My uh my moniker on my businesscard is building smiles and
changing lives, and everything Iwant to do in my life is that.
And and then the most recentthing that I've been doing, uh,
and I say most recent over thelast uh eight years or so, I am
also um speaking, coaching, umuh working with people.
(03:04):
And I don't speak in theclinical realm.
I find dentists are verycritical of whoever is speaking
if they're not affiliated with auniversity, and even if they
are, they're very critical.
And I just didn't want to be upon a stage and having a bunch
of people in the audience, andit's usually only a handful of
them uh that are very criticalbecause I just uh my life is too
(03:26):
busy to stand up and take itfrom colleagues that don't know
any better.
So I um speak on the businessside of things.
Um I have uh uh businesssystems that I call success is
all about relationships.
And uh it's my um belief thatuh that uh relation building
relationships uh takes away theneed for sales, and building
(03:46):
relationships leads to success.
Uh so um uh it's all about howwe meet, greet, treatment plan,
schedule our patients or ourclients, how we hire, train,
lead our teams, and how wemarket internally and externally
on these big these uhrelationship-based business
systems that uh that truly work,uh they're low cost and very
(04:07):
effective.
And um that's what I do.
Amazing.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (04:11):
Um, with that, I mean you said that you
don't generally speak in frontof dentists.
So so who is your audience andwhat are you what are you
looking to help them achieve?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (04:20):
Well, well, uh uh I'm I'm incorrect if I if
I gave that illusion.
Uh a large part of the peoplewho hire me to speak are
dentists, dental organizations,dental study clubs.
But the topic isn't clinical,it's business.
Um, but my business lectureshave gone beyond that.
The business systems that I'veworked with, I've worked with a
(04:42):
uh chain of tea houses in uh inTaiwan, uh I worked with a
health spa in Singapore.
Uh so the the breadth of groupswho can utilize these
relationship-based businessprinciples and systems uh is
across the board.
If you deal with people, thesesystems work.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (05:05):
So, how does your week pan out at the
moment?
You're doing lots of differentthings.
There's clinical work there,speaking and mentoring.
How do you um carve up yourtime?
What does your week look likeif there is such thing as a
typical week for you?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (05:17):
Um a typical week, Monday, Tuesday,
Wednesday uh is when I workclinically.
Uh that's when I have the joyof having a team of uh of uh
mostly women who I get to workwith every day um and treat the
people who have trusted me withtheir their health and and to do
my work to get them better.
Um I use my Thursdays, Fridays,and Sundays to do medical legal
(05:41):
reports, to uh to fly aroundand uh give my lectures and
coach uh um businesses uh and umand uh things along those
lines, develop new topics totalk on, to be part of uh
podcasts.
Uh that's what I do on theother three days.
Saturdays are my days to donothing that has to do with
(06:03):
work.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (06:04):
Yeah, work-life balance, all
important.
I'm glad you're giving yourselfone day officer.
Um I find correct.
I think you've spoken beforeabout how most healthcare
marketing is ineffective andexpensive.
What's not working that usedto, or did it never work?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (06:19):
Well, one one of the things that I think
never works is the idea of SEO,search engine optimization.
The Google and other searchengines are constantly changing
their algorithms.
And so to stay on top ofwanting to be the first page on
(06:41):
Google can be very expensive,and causing you or somebody you
hire to change your websitefrequently just to try and be at
the top of Google.
But I know that in mostbusinesses, um, most healthcare
businesses, and now if you'vegot a product, that's a
(07:01):
different story.
Like if you're selling infraredsaunas, that's a different
story.
But if you're in healthcare,it's not about being at the top
of Google because someone indentistry isn't just doing a
random search, cosmetic dentistNew York.
That's not what they're doing,they're doing dentist near me.
(07:25):
And then the search engine goesto the maps, and you can put
your website on Google Maps andon Apple Maps for free.
Although they're changing that,I think you now have to pay a
small fee.
But it's a small fee.
We're talking dollars, nothundreds or thousands.
And once you're on there, ifyou're physically close to them
(07:47):
and you've got a basic goodwebsite, you show up in the top
four or five because you're onthe map and you fit the
algorithm, dentist near me,doctor near me.
So you don't have to spendthousands.
I know some dentists arespending $40,000, $50,000 a year
(08:07):
on their websites in searchengine optimization.
And the general rule of thumbin marketing is a three to one
return on your investment.
So if you're spending $50,000on your internet marketing, you
should be getting $150,000 or$150,000 of new business in the
(08:30):
first year from that expense.
And most of my colleagues nevertrack what they spend on their
marketing, and they have no cluewhere the money's coming, but
they think they have to do it.
So it's a it's a waste of time,it's a waste of money.
The number one source ofreferrals uh to my practice are
from other people who alreadyknow us.
(08:52):
So it's building thoserelationships, and that doesn't
cost money either.
So I'm not saying you spend nomoney, you need to have a good
website, it needs to be clean,it needs to be modern, it needs
to be refreshed regularly.
So there's an expense involvedwith that.
You should have a social mediaprofile, being on Facebook and
Instagram and YouTube andLinkedIn, and for those who are
(09:14):
interested, TikTok.
I'm not on TikTok, but I thinkmy clinical practice is those
are the things you should be on,and you should be contributing
to them regularly.
So there may be an expenseinvolved with that, but it's not
thousands of dollars or tens ofthousands of dollars to do
every year, to do that kind ofthing.
(09:36):
But those are how you build andmaintain relationships with
people.
This is really fascinating.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (09:43):
So Google really Google my business for
the local stuff, but not the SEOstuff.
What about um where where doyou see practices wasting money
in terms of trying to grow?
And obviously, we've talked alittle bit about the marketing
side and the the use or misuseof Google, where else are they
wasting their money?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (10:01):
Well, you know, we we have this idea that
we need to grow fast.
But what we really want in atleast in health care and the
health and wellness realm, evenif you're having um a yoga
studio or or uh or a healthcarefacility that involves some sort
of movement, you aren't lookingfor someone for a single
(10:24):
purchase.
You want someone who's gonnacome and they're you want them
to repeat.
So it's about building thoserelationships.
And so you you don't need tospend money.
I know a dentist who spends$40,000 a year on a billboard,
and he said he got two peoplefrom it.
$40,000.
I don't, I don't get it.
(10:44):
I don't get what the what whythey do that.
Um uh so uh the focus reallyshould be on finding who your
fans are and and marketing tothem.
So if you've got um uh I've gota patient who's got who's
really big, I'm not a petperson, but she's a big fan.
(11:07):
She's referred about 25, 30different people to me.
And the average new patientwill bring in about 20 to $2,250
in the first year.
So she sent, you know, 30 ofthose people.
She's you know, I've I've shesent me about $75,000 worth of
work, uh, of income from oneperson.
(11:27):
So I pay attention to thisperson, and she's really big
into pets and stuff like that.
And so she was involved with arun to raise money for the local
pet society, and I became asponsor of that run, and and it
didn't cost me a lot of money,but the presence supporting
someone who is a fan of minejust increased that fandom, and
(11:50):
I got people from that, and soyou so it's finding your
targets, it's paying attentionto the people who are doing
business with you, and thenfinding a way to support them,
build those relationships.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (12:05):
Some really great lessons in marketing
here.
I really love this.
What trends are you seeingaround patient expectations or
team dynamics that others mightbe missing?
Because I know this is part ofyour work and your speaking
work, talking about the thepatient side of things and the
operation side of things.
What are you seeing?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (12:20):
Well, you know, uh interesting.
I I um I was talking to um uh abusiness that is considering
bringing me on uh to coach theirtheir business, and they're
involved in uh uh practicecoaching sales, uh that kind of
stuff.
And and uh they're nationwide.
And they have a coach who workswith them who's all about adult
(12:43):
education.
And you know, in dentistry,especially, we we uh we have we
see a problem in a in a person'soral health, and then we have a
treatment plan that we want toto uh provide for them or
recommend to them.
And what do we do?
We we educate them about what'swrong.
And people don't want to beeducated, they really don't.
(13:06):
Um, we have to find a way toget them to want what we want
for them, and so it's not thegolden rule.
What do we want for ourpatients?
So, what do we want them tohave?
Uh, it's not what we want umfor ourselves, because what if
they don't want what we want?
Um, and so it's a matter aboutwhat I call the diamond rule.
(13:28):
It's about finding out what aperson wants in front of you and
then finding a way to deliverto them what they uniquely
desire.
So it takes time to get to knowpeople, and once you get to
know them and you understandwhere they come from, then you
can customize your conversationso that you what you want for
(13:51):
them resonates with how theyare, where they are, and then
they're gonna want what you wantfor them, and uh, and so it's
it's a bit of a trick in uhunderstanding conversations and
understanding personalities anduh and go from there.
So, from a team standpoint, Iactually have the team go
through personality testing.
(14:13):
And and in this case, I likethe Discovery Insights system,
which is a company based out ofScotland, uh, your neighbor.
Um, and uh it's a it's a greatsystem where they assign colors
to personalities and and it'sintuitive, it just makes sense,
it's easy to understand.
And then you can customize howyou deal, train, lead your team
(14:35):
members based on theirpersonality profile and then
your personality.
So the more you understandyourself, the easier it is you
understand how you need tocommunicate with others as well.
So, but the big key is um is isthe mistake is not educating
people about what you think theyshould have, it's about
(14:55):
learning who those people are,finding out what it is that they
want, and then to give themwhat they uniquely desire.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (15:03):
Lots of psychology in there.
Yeah, are you seeing a broadershift in how uh patients are
choosing their providers now, orin how providers think about
leadership?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (15:13):
Yes.
Um people are savvy, theinternet is uh ubiquitous, and
the people's ability to accessinformation, whether it's right
or wrong, or good information orbad information, their ability
to access information is easyand expensive.
And so people are naturallyskeptical, especially uh the
(15:38):
younger generation, the peoplein their 20s and 30s, they are
very skeptical and they are verycognizant that the rich are
getting richer and the poor aregetting poorer, and they all
think that if you're proposingsomething to them that is
expensive or extensive, yet theydon't understand the need for
(15:59):
it themselves, they're gonnaquestion everything.
And I don't think questioningthings is a bad thing, um, uh,
but we're seeing a lot of it.
A lot of distrust, a lot of uhanimosity, a lot of anger, a lot
of polarization.
It's a challenging world to bein today, and so we need to
build trust.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (16:19):
Thank you.
Um, obviously, you spend timeworking with practices.
What are the most impactfulbottlenecks that you're seeing
in practices right now in termsof and in terms of how you
advise um these practices, howto kind of overcome these
things?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (16:33):
Well, you know what's interesting.
Um different businesses havedifferent issues.
Sometimes it's just an internalissue with the team not talking
to each other.
Sometimes it's about uh theback door being so wide open
that you'll get you'll get twonew patients, but you'll have
three people leaving thebusiness at the same time.
(16:55):
And so that the business isshrinking.
So it's a matter of againcustomizing, finding out what it
is that that people want, whatthey need, um, and and talking.
When it comes to the team,often you'll have businesses
where you've got administrationteams, you've got salespeople,
and or in my in my case, uhassistants, uh, people providing
(17:19):
clinical treatment, dentalhygienists, um, dentists, and
they don't talk well to eachother.
They they they have this sortof turf protection.
They have this idea that, oh,the people and admin don't
understand the complexities ofour jobs, and they create this
schedule that doesn't work, andall they do is complain or or um
pardon the expression, bitch,um, or or get angry with each
(17:43):
other.
But solutions happen whenpeople talk to each other, and
so we have in our business, wehave agreements, and I got this
uh from Tony Robbins actually.
And the agreement is if I'vegot a problem with Betty, I
don't tell Sue about it, I haveto talk to Betty, and then the
(18:06):
other agreement is if Sue if Italk to Sue about it, about
Betty, the agreement is Sue hasto say, Well, don't tell me that
you've got a problem withBetty.
You need to talk to Betty.
So it's a way of forcing teammembers to talk to each other,
and once you open up that doorof communication, you find a way
(18:28):
to resolve the issues, andsometimes you'll find a team
member is just not willing toengage in conversations directly
with other team members, andthen you have to find a way to
say, you know what, you're not afit for our team.
We need to help you findanother place to work, and uh
(18:48):
and that happens.
Um, but when you find the teamthat's right, who talk to each
other, who communicate with eachother, uh you build long-term
sustainable teams that thatwork.
Uh, I have two people, twowomen who've been working with
me for 31 years now.
I've got another one who's beenwith me for 22.
I've got another one who's beenwith me for 16.
(19:10):
And the patients, our customerscome back and they see the same
faces time and again, andthere's this continuity of their
care, and we've built theserelationships that matter, and
the practice grows.
The practice I'm in right now,um uh eight years ago, was doing
600,000 in the in the year.
Um, and we have I helped manageto grow that in six years to
(19:34):
over 3.2 million on theserelationship-based principles.
So it can be done.
You don't have to spend a tonof money, but you need to be
patient becauserelationship-based systems takes
time.
Uh, you know, you're not gonnamake it overnight, you're not
gonna make it next month, butyou're gonna build something
that's gonna be long-termsustainable.
(19:54):
So if you're not retiring inthe next two to three years, you
can do this.
Um, but so that's so the teamis that's a big one.
Having those agreements is isis huge.
And you apply those principlesacross the board, it works
great.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (20:10):
Thank you.
If you had a magic wand and youcould fix one thing overnight
in a typical healthcarebusiness, and let's we'll say
we've dealt with the teamdynamics.
Uh, what would it be?
If it's not a team dynamicsproblem, what's the next biggest
problem that you see in thebusinesses you work with?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (20:26):
Um and again, I guess it gets back to
these relationships.
Um, so many of my colleagues indentistry see a person as teeth
attached to a body as opposedto a body that just happens to
have teeth.
So you need to flip thenarrative and look at the whole
(20:48):
person.
It's like confunctionalmedicine.
So much in medicine andhealthcare is specialized.
We tend to, you know, you'vegot the you've got orthopedic
surgeons, and what do they do?
They specialize.
So you've got there's onesurgeon, all he does is
shoulders.
And so if you go to him andyou've got a knee problem, he
says, I can't help you.
All I do is shoulders.
(21:09):
And in uh the healthcare systemin Canada, the way physicians,
general physicians, are umcompensated is they you've only
got enough time to see someoneand take care of one problem.
But the human body is complex,and you know, in functional
medicine, sometimes there's fiveor six issues that are
(21:29):
interacting with each other, andyou need to address them all if
you want that person to getbetter.
And the same thing happens indentistry.
We tend to get focused on justteeth or just gums or just one
thing or just two things, andnot understanding that the mouth
is attached to the whole body,and there are systemic
(21:50):
influences on the mouth, andthere's bodies in this in the
whole, there are uh portions ofthe body that's affecting the
mouth region.
And if we don't step back andlook at the whole body, then
we're missing the forest for thetrees, and people don't get
better.
If we want to elevate our care,we need to look at the whole
(22:10):
person as a whole person thatjust happens to have the small
specific portion that you dealwith.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (22:18):
I can agree with you more.
You're singing my language,because um I mean even my day
job, I'm actually an emergencyphysician, I'm still one of the
few generalists around.
And I think the trouble is weare in a healthcare system now
where everybody is so superspecialized, nobody's joining
the dots, nobody's taking aholistic view.
You know, you can be seen byfour different specialists in a
hospital, all you know, amazingat what they do, nobody's
(22:40):
joining the dots.
There's no cross-communication,there's no understanding of
anything outside of the regionthey're working in.
And I often joke with mypatients is a shoulder problem
or a knee problem, or a rightknee problem, or a left knee
problem.
That's how super specialized itfeels like it is these days.
Dr Larry Stanleigh (22:54):
Yes, yeah, yeah.
Yet uh, you know, I I havepeople come to me and they're
clenching and uh and there'swear on their teeth and they've
got headaches and stuff becausethey're clenching.
And um uh one of the commoncauses of clenching is a pelvic
imbalance.
And so I have people stand upand I look at them and I have
(23:15):
them walk and I look at how theywalk, and then they realize,
and so that I need to get themwith someone who can deal with
their pelvic imbalance todecrease their clenching.
People don't do that, you know.
You do, but but uh, but toomany of our colleagues don't.
I know it's sad.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (23:34):
What can you perhaps share something that
you've learned the hard way interms of building systems or
teams that you now teach toothers to avoid because of your
you know you've learned fromlearned from your own experience
and you pass it on to others?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (23:46):
Well, you know, uh people I I'm uh I'm not
a young man anymore, and peoplesay, When are you gonna retire?
And and I'm I'm well on the oneside, I'm grateful that I love
what I get to do, and I have nointention of stopping it.
I mean, some of the richestpeople in the world, uh uh
Warren Buffett, for example,he's in his mid-90s, and he
still wakes up in the morning,puts on a suit and tie, and he
(24:06):
goes to work.
He doesn't need to.
He's one of the richest men inthe world, but he does it
because what he does stillmatters and and it still drives
him.
He still makes a difference inpeople's lives, not just his
own.
And uh, and I'm that in thatposition.
I I'm gonna keep doing what Ido because I'm making a
difference in people's lives.
I'm building smiles andchanging lives every day.
(24:28):
Um, so I'm not retiring fromthat standpoint.
But the other side of the coin,I've been in my past very good
at spending money and very badat saving money.
So I haven't saved enough forretirement as well.
And so one of my things that Italk about, um one, you know, I
will I will often many of thepeople who uh uh ask me to help
them are younger dentists whoare fairly early in their career
(24:49):
and they've bought a practiceand they've spent seven figures
buying this practice, andthey're having trouble managing
everything because uh trying tofinance seven figures is a very
hefty monthly outlay.
And so the money is a big deal,and you go to bed and you worry
about that, and you lie awakeat night, you know, worrying
about that.
And and so we need to look athow we spend our money as well.
(25:10):
We're often we're spendingpoorly and we're not paying
attention to what we're spendingour money on.
So you need to look at that,and there are ways to to do
that.
I I early in my career, forexample, I bought my practice
from a guy who had retired after44 years, and he walked out on
Friday and I walked in onMonday.
But we had the same personalityand the same philosophy of
(25:32):
treatment, so it worked.
We I had over a 90% retentionrate.
Uh, in dentistry, the averageretention rate, when you when a
practice is sold for the newdentist, the average retention
rate is 40%.
I mean, 60% of that practiceleaves when a new dentist comes
on board, even if that newdentist was endorsed by the
previous dentist.
(25:52):
Uh it's a terrible retentionrate.
And that's a ton of money thatjust sort of walks out the door
in the first month.
So I didn't want that tohappen.
So I worked very hard inretention.
Um, and uh, but I had I and Ikept the relationships with the
dental lab that he used to workwith, and with the specialists
that he used to refer to, andwith the dental supply company
(26:15):
and dental repair company thathe was working with.
And, you know, things went by,and and I was I was uh learning
about uh accounting and as smallbusiness people, we've got to
not just be uh a practitioner,we have to be an accountant, we
need to be a marketingspecialist, we need to be an HR
specialist, we need to have allthese different hats on.
(26:35):
And of course, we didn't getthat training in in medical
school and in dental school andand and physiotherapy school and
massage therapy school andchiropractic colleges, they
don't teach us this stuff.
We have to find out a way.
So my bank, thankfully, wasgreat, and they and they
provided courses for a lot ofthis.
And I learned about how in uhin dentistry the top uh four
(26:59):
expenses are um uh salaries, uhrent, uh, dental supplies, and
dental lab.
Those are the uh top fourexpenses.
And other than salaries andrent, which are somewhat fixed,
the other two are variable.
And they should be fallingwithin a window, the supplies in
the lab.
And the dental supplies shouldbe falling in the five to seven
(27:21):
percent window.
So if I've got $100 ofexpenses, five to seven dollars
of those expenses should be mysupplies.
Well, I was spending 12% on mysupplies, and I went to my rep
and I said, you know, my supplycosts are too high.
And he said, Well, I'll lowerthe price of this product or
(27:41):
I'll lower the price of thatproduct.
And I said, Great, yeah, yeah.
And months went by and itdidn't change, it was still too
high.
And so I was talking to umanother uh company, and uh, and
after um, and this is a wholelonger story, which we don't
have time for, but we got to theend of him exploring what my
(28:04):
goals in my career was, and andhe said to me, instead of just
lowering prices on specificproducts, if I helped refine
your business so that we gotyour supply costs from 12% down
to six percent, would you dobusiness exclusively with me
wherever we can?
And I said, Yeah, because thatwas thousands of dollars every
(28:29):
month that I could then have mydental assistants not spend time
looking for bargains and justbe able to work clinically.
And they did, they came onboard, and within three months
my dental supplies costs droppedto where they were supposed to
be.
So the the lesson is know yournumbers, know where you're
(28:52):
spending.
And if your numbers are out ofalign with industry norms for
whatever business you're in,then you need to find a way to
get them back into industrynorms.
If you're within industrynorms, then you need to look at
not how do you cut your costs,how do you increase your
revenue.
So it's you know, it's it'sabout finding that balance.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (29:15):
Thank you.
I guess um many of the clinicsor that you're working with are
interested in growth.
And if they suddenly had aflood of new patients, what's
the first thing that would breakin those businesses in your
experience?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (29:31):
The the joyous trouble we all um we all
desire to have is too muchbusiness.
Well, first um um build thoserelationships and people who if
they if they think you're great,then they're gonna wait for
you.
Uh right now it is uh earlyOctober, and uh people who want
(29:53):
to see me are booking in midFebruary right now.
So I'm booked out four months,and in dentistry, that's unheard
of.
Some people are impatient andthey want to be seen next week.
But I'm not dealing with peoplewho have acute pain, like, oh,
my tooth is hurting.
For those, we people we willsee them right away, get them
out of pain, but then thetreatment will be booked in our
(30:15):
regular schedule.
But you need to build in theidea of how are you going to
grow?
You need to understand beforeyou start if this is successful,
because you go in with the ideathat, yeah, this is going to be
successful.
How are you going to grow?
You have the room in thephysical facility to bring on
more people and to be ready.
(30:36):
And when you reach certainnumbers, you hire the additional
uh assistant, you hire theadditional administrator, you
get more hygienists, you getother dentists, you get other
operators.
And then uh in our facility,for example, we had 3,500 square
feet.
We had space for sevenoperatories where we could do
clinical dentistry, but we onlyhad four with equipment in them.
(30:59):
But we reached a certain pointwithin about two and a half
years that we needed more space,and we uh negotiated with our
supplier to for the equipment tobuild and equip the other four
operatories.
And we rapidly filled those upwith hiring more people and
building it up.
And but it you need to have atthe beginning the understanding
(31:22):
of where you're gonna go, whereyou want to be, and then plan
how to get there so that when ithappens, you've got the plan in
place, and it doesn't take aton of time or money to do that.
You just have to think theprocess through.
It's it's about a half a day tosit down and work it out with
your coach.
But once you've got it inplace, then you're just you're
(31:42):
just following the plan.
It's it's easy, it's likehaving an instruction manual in
plain English.
You just follow it, it's theway you go.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (31:50):
Thank you.
Um, so looking ahead, what's onthe cards for you in the next
six to 12 months?
Where would you like yourpractice, your teaching, or your
um other businesses to be?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (32:00):
Well, I I had this this uh dream of uh
getting paid to fly somewhere,um, speak on a stage, uh, get
paid, and then get off the stageand then stick around and be a
tourist for a couple of dayswherever it is.
That's that's one of my dreams.
Um, and so uh I have uh uh I'mworking more on on my keynote
(32:22):
talks to so that I can have achance to do that.
Uh one of them is uh outside ofbusiness altogether.
It's called The People in YourLife Are a Gift.
And it's a series of truestories that have four key
points uh that uh we want tostay uh identify and stay
connected to the people whomatter in our life, that we want
to be um remove uh unconsciousor sub excuse me, subconscious
(32:43):
biases to achieve true equality,uh, that great things are to
live for and the people in yourlife are a gift.
And from that come uh workshopsand stuff like that.
I've got a book written on thattitle, uh, that title, uh The
People in Your Life are a gift.
And there's um been a demand todo um to convert that book into
an audio book.
So in the next uh three to sixmonths, that's one of my goals.
(33:04):
Um, but I've got some full-daytraining sessions coming up in
February in in uh Winnipeg,Manitoba, and in Portland,
Oregon in the US, where uh I'llbe touching on uh all these
business uh lectures, the peoplein your life are a gift, then
and another topic, uh sleepdisordered breathing,
identifying it and treatment forthe for the team.
So these are all team-basedlectures, uh, not just uh
(33:26):
clinicians, but the wholebusiness.
We want them to all cometogether and learn together, and
that's how businesses willgrow, is if everyone understands
what the goals are.
So uh just doing more of that,more more uh speaking,
traveling, and getting anopportunity to get paid to do
it.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (33:43):
Amazing, Larry.
Thank you so much for your timethis afternoon.
It's been such an interestingconversation, so many rich
lessons in business andmarketing, hearing about your
journey, what you do, reallyfascinating.
Really grateful for your time.
Massively appreciate it.
Thank you so much.
Dr Larry Stanleigh (33:58):
You are most welcome.
It's a pleasure and an honor,and thank you for asking me to
be part of this podcast.
Welcome back to Voices in Health and
Wellness.
This is the show where wespotlight leaders who are
reimagining how care isdelivered in today's ever
fast-changing landscape.
I'm your host, Dr.
Andrew Greenland, and today'sguest is someone who brings deep
experience, heart, and a wholelot of practical wisdom to the
table.
Joining me today is Dr.
Larry Stanleigh, aCanadian-based dentist, speaker,
(00:21):
and educator whose work focuseson transforming internal
systems and elevatingrelationship-based care in
health practices.
With credentials too long tolist and decades of clinical
experience, Dr.
Larry helps teams rethinkeverything from how we greet
patients to how we hire, train,and lead.
Larry, thank you so much forjoining us this afternoon and
(00:41):
welcome to the show.
Dr Larry Stanleigh (00:43):
It's a pleasure to be here.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (00:45):
So perhaps we could start at the top.
Would you mind um sharing alittle bit about your journey
and how you ended up where youare today and the work that
you're most passionate about?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (00:54):
Sure.
It's uh, you know, one of thethings that I found um in in
small business, yeah, especiallyin healthcare, is having not
only you understand your why,but having your team understand
your why.
And then and then it becomes amission and a vision of of how
you want to practice and how youwant to live.
(01:15):
And um I'm uh I'm the secondyoungest of 13 children born and
raised in Toronto.
Uh when I got into dentalschool, I'm the only one in my
family who's in healthcare.
Uh, and uh, and uh when Iwanted to uh get into medical
school uh or dental school, um Icouldn't afford it at the time,
and so I joined the Canadianforces and they sent me out
(01:36):
west.
I'm now in Calgary, Alberta.
I've been here 38 years now anduh uh love the city, love the
uh this part of our country.
It's uh it's an amazing uhplace to live and work and play
and raise a family and andstuff.
But I I um I like being ageneral practice dentist.
I like um uh doing a little bitof everything, and then over
(01:58):
the years, just naturally um Ihave found myself going into a
bit of a niche.
So although I'm a generalpractice dentist with a focus on
uh cosmetic uh components ofdentistry, as well as uh
periodontal care, uh gum health,and and uh and sports uh
medicine and dentistry, uh I'mthe chief technology officer of
(02:22):
a Canadian sports performancemouth guard company and uh
athletes we fitted have won 11Olympic medals, including gold
and silver, gold in uh summerand winter Olympics.
But I've uh now 80% of what Ido is I deal with oral facial
pain and TMJ dysfunction onpeople who have had trauma, car
accidents, workplace accidents,victims of violence, that kind
of thing.
(02:42):
Um, and it's um it'sfascinating work I uh I get to
do.
My uh my moniker on my businesscard is building smiles and
changing lives, and everything Iwant to do in my life is that.
And and then the most recentthing that I've been doing, uh,
and I say most recent over thelast uh eight years or so, I am
also um speaking, coaching, umuh working with people.
(03:04):
And I don't speak in theclinical realm.
I find dentists are verycritical of whoever is speaking
if they're not affiliated with auniversity, and even if they
are, they're very critical.
And I just didn't want to be upon a stage and having a bunch
of people in the audience, andit's usually only a handful of
them uh that are very criticalbecause I just uh my life is too
(03:26):
busy to stand up and take itfrom colleagues that don't know
any better.
So I um speak on the businessside of things.
Um I have uh uh businesssystems that I call success is
all about relationships.
And uh it's my um belief thatuh that uh relation building
relationships uh takes away theneed for sales, and building
(03:46):
relationships leads to success.
Uh so um uh it's all about howwe meet, greet, treatment plan,
schedule our patients or ourclients, how we hire, train,
lead our teams, and how wemarket internally and externally
on these big these uhrelationship-based business
systems that uh that truly work,uh they're low cost and very
(04:07):
effective.
And um that's what I do.
Amazing.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (04:11):
Um, with that, I mean you said that you
don't generally speak in frontof dentists.
So so who is your audience andwhat are you what are you
looking to help them achieve?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (04:20):
Well, well, uh uh I'm I'm incorrect if I if
I gave that illusion.
Uh a large part of the peoplewho hire me to speak are
dentists, dental organizations,dental study clubs.
But the topic isn't clinical,it's business.
Um, but my business lectureshave gone beyond that.
The business systems that I'veworked with, I've worked with a
(04:42):
uh chain of tea houses in uh inTaiwan, uh I worked with a
health spa in Singapore.
Uh so the the breadth of groupswho can utilize these
relationship-based businessprinciples and systems uh is
across the board.
If you deal with people, thesesystems work.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (05:05):
So, how does your week pan out at the
moment?
You're doing lots of differentthings.
There's clinical work there,speaking and mentoring.
How do you um carve up yourtime?
What does your week look likeif there is such thing as a
typical week for you?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (05:17):
Um a typical week, Monday, Tuesday,
Wednesday uh is when I workclinically.
Uh that's when I have the joyof having a team of uh of uh
mostly women who I get to workwith every day um and treat the
people who have trusted me withtheir their health and and to do
my work to get them better.
Um I use my Thursdays, Fridays,and Sundays to do medical legal
(05:41):
reports, to uh to fly aroundand uh give my lectures and
coach uh um businesses uh and umand uh things along those
lines, develop new topics totalk on, to be part of uh
podcasts.
Uh that's what I do on theother three days.
Saturdays are my days to donothing that has to do with
(06:03):
work.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (06:04):
Yeah, work-life balance, all
important.
I'm glad you're giving yourselfone day officer.
Um I find correct.
I think you've spoken beforeabout how most healthcare
marketing is ineffective andexpensive.
What's not working that usedto, or did it never work?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (06:19):
Well, one one of the things that I think
never works is the idea of SEO,search engine optimization.
The Google and other searchengines are constantly changing
their algorithms.
And so to stay on top ofwanting to be the first page on
(06:41):
Google can be very expensive,and causing you or somebody you
hire to change your websitefrequently just to try and be at
the top of Google.
But I know that in mostbusinesses, um, most healthcare
businesses, and now if you'vegot a product, that's a
(07:01):
different story.
Like if you're selling infraredsaunas, that's a different
story.
But if you're in healthcare,it's not about being at the top
of Google because someone indentistry isn't just doing a
random search, cosmetic dentistNew York.
That's not what they're doing,they're doing dentist near me.
(07:25):
And then the search engine goesto the maps, and you can put
your website on Google Maps andon Apple Maps for free.
Although they're changing that,I think you now have to pay a
small fee.
But it's a small fee.
We're talking dollars, nothundreds or thousands.
And once you're on there, ifyou're physically close to them
(07:47):
and you've got a basic goodwebsite, you show up in the top
four or five because you're onthe map and you fit the
algorithm, dentist near me,doctor near me.
So you don't have to spendthousands.
I know some dentists arespending $40,000, $50,000 a year
(08:07):
on their websites in searchengine optimization.
And the general rule of thumbin marketing is a three to one
return on your investment.
So if you're spending $50,000on your internet marketing, you
should be getting $150,000 or$150,000 of new business in the
(08:30):
first year from that expense.
And most of my colleagues nevertrack what they spend on their
marketing, and they have no cluewhere the money's coming, but
they think they have to do it.
So it's a it's a waste of time,it's a waste of money.
The number one source ofreferrals uh to my practice are
from other people who alreadyknow us.
(08:52):
So it's building thoserelationships, and that doesn't
cost money either.
So I'm not saying you spend nomoney, you need to have a good
website, it needs to be clean,it needs to be modern, it needs
to be refreshed regularly.
So there's an expense involvedwith that.
You should have a social mediaprofile, being on Facebook and
Instagram and YouTube andLinkedIn, and for those who are
(09:14):
interested, TikTok.
I'm not on TikTok, but I thinkmy clinical practice is those
are the things you should be on,and you should be contributing
to them regularly.
So there may be an expenseinvolved with that, but it's not
thousands of dollars or tens ofthousands of dollars to do
every year, to do that kind ofthing.
(09:36):
But those are how you build andmaintain relationships with
people.
This is really fascinating.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (09:43):
So Google really Google my business for
the local stuff, but not the SEOstuff.
What about um where where doyou see practices wasting money
in terms of trying to grow?
And obviously, we've talked alittle bit about the marketing
side and the the use or misuseof Google, where else are they
wasting their money?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (10:01):
Well, you know, we we have this idea that
we need to grow fast.
But what we really want in atleast in health care and the
health and wellness realm, evenif you're having um a yoga
studio or or uh or a healthcarefacility that involves some sort
of movement, you aren't lookingfor someone for a single
(10:24):
purchase.
You want someone who's gonnacome and they're you want them
to repeat.
So it's about building thoserelationships.
And so you you don't need tospend money.
I know a dentist who spends$40,000 a year on a billboard,
and he said he got two peoplefrom it.
$40,000.
I don't, I don't get it.
(10:44):
I don't get what the what whythey do that.
Um uh so uh the focus reallyshould be on finding who your
fans are and and marketing tothem.
So if you've got um uh I've gota patient who's got who's
really big, I'm not a petperson, but she's a big fan.
(11:07):
She's referred about 25, 30different people to me.
And the average new patientwill bring in about 20 to $2,250
in the first year.
So she sent, you know, 30 ofthose people.
She's you know, I've I've shesent me about $75,000 worth of
work, uh, of income from oneperson.
(11:27):
So I pay attention to thisperson, and she's really big
into pets and stuff like that.
And so she was involved with arun to raise money for the local
pet society, and I became asponsor of that run, and and it
didn't cost me a lot of money,but the presence supporting
someone who is a fan of minejust increased that fandom, and
(11:50):
I got people from that, and soyou so it's finding your
targets, it's paying attentionto the people who are doing
business with you, and thenfinding a way to support them,
build those relationships.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (12:05):
Some really great lessons in marketing
here.
I really love this.
What trends are you seeingaround patient expectations or
team dynamics that others mightbe missing?
Because I know this is part ofyour work and your speaking
work, talking about the thepatient side of things and the
operation side of things.
What are you seeing?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (12:20):
Well, you know, uh interesting.
I I um I was talking to um uh abusiness that is considering
bringing me on uh to coach theirtheir business, and they're
involved in uh uh practicecoaching sales, uh that kind of
stuff.
And and uh they're nationwide.
And they have a coach who workswith them who's all about adult
(12:43):
education.
And you know, in dentistry,especially, we we uh we have we
see a problem in a in a person'soral health, and then we have a
treatment plan that we want toto uh provide for them or
recommend to them.
And what do we do?
We we educate them about what'swrong.
And people don't want to beeducated, they really don't.
(13:06):
Um, we have to find a way toget them to want what we want
for them, and so it's not thegolden rule.
What do we want for ourpatients?
So, what do we want them tohave?
Uh, it's not what we want umfor ourselves, because what if
they don't want what we want?
Um, and so it's a matter aboutwhat I call the diamond rule.
(13:28):
It's about finding out what aperson wants in front of you and
then finding a way to deliverto them what they uniquely
desire.
So it takes time to get to knowpeople, and once you get to
know them and you understandwhere they come from, then you
can customize your conversationso that you what you want for
(13:51):
them resonates with how theyare, where they are, and then
they're gonna want what you wantfor them, and uh, and so it's
it's a bit of a trick in uhunderstanding conversations and
understanding personalities anduh and go from there.
So, from a team standpoint, Iactually have the team go
through personality testing.
(14:13):
And and in this case, I likethe Discovery Insights system,
which is a company based out ofScotland, uh, your neighbor.
Um, and uh it's a it's a greatsystem where they assign colors
to personalities and and it'sintuitive, it just makes sense,
it's easy to understand.
And then you can customize howyou deal, train, lead your team
(14:35):
members based on theirpersonality profile and then
your personality.
So the more you understandyourself, the easier it is you
understand how you need tocommunicate with others as well.
So, but the big key is um is isthe mistake is not educating
people about what you think theyshould have, it's about
(14:55):
learning who those people are,finding out what it is that they
want, and then to give themwhat they uniquely desire.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (15:03):
Lots of psychology in there.
Yeah, are you seeing a broadershift in how uh patients are
choosing their providers now, orin how providers think about
leadership?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (15:13):
Yes.
Um people are savvy, theinternet is uh ubiquitous, and
the people's ability to accessinformation, whether it's right
or wrong, or good information orbad information, their ability
to access information is easyand expensive.
And so people are naturallyskeptical, especially uh the
(15:38):
younger generation, the peoplein their 20s and 30s, they are
very skeptical and they are verycognizant that the rich are
getting richer and the poor aregetting poorer, and they all
think that if you're proposingsomething to them that is
expensive or extensive, yet theydon't understand the need for
(15:59):
it themselves, they're gonnaquestion everything.
And I don't think questioningthings is a bad thing, um, uh,
but we're seeing a lot of it.
A lot of distrust, a lot of uhanimosity, a lot of anger, a lot
of polarization.
It's a challenging world to bein today, and so we need to
build trust.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (16:19):
Thank you.
Um, obviously, you spend timeworking with practices.
What are the most impactfulbottlenecks that you're seeing
in practices right now in termsof and in terms of how you
advise um these practices, howto kind of overcome these
things?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (16:33):
Well, you know what's interesting.
Um different businesses havedifferent issues.
Sometimes it's just an internalissue with the team not talking
to each other.
Sometimes it's about uh theback door being so wide open
that you'll get you'll get twonew patients, but you'll have
three people leaving thebusiness at the same time.
(16:55):
And so that the business isshrinking.
So it's a matter of againcustomizing, finding out what it
is that that people want, whatthey need, um, and and talking.
When it comes to the team,often you'll have businesses
where you've got administrationteams, you've got salespeople,
and or in my in my case, uhassistants, uh, people providing
(17:19):
clinical treatment, dentalhygienists, um, dentists, and
they don't talk well to eachother.
They they they have this sortof turf protection.
They have this idea that, oh,the people and admin don't
understand the complexities ofour jobs, and they create this
schedule that doesn't work, andall they do is complain or or um
pardon the expression, bitch,um, or or get angry with each
(17:43):
other.
But solutions happen whenpeople talk to each other, and
so we have in our business, wehave agreements, and I got this
uh from Tony Robbins actually.
And the agreement is if I'vegot a problem with Betty, I
don't tell Sue about it, I haveto talk to Betty, and then the
(18:06):
other agreement is if Sue if Italk to Sue about it, about
Betty, the agreement is Sue hasto say, Well, don't tell me that
you've got a problem withBetty.
You need to talk to Betty.
So it's a way of forcing teammembers to talk to each other,
and once you open up that doorof communication, you find a way
(18:28):
to resolve the issues, andsometimes you'll find a team
member is just not willing toengage in conversations directly
with other team members, andthen you have to find a way to
say, you know what, you're not afit for our team.
We need to help you findanother place to work, and uh
(18:48):
and that happens.
Um, but when you find the teamthat's right, who talk to each
other, who communicate with eachother, uh you build long-term
sustainable teams that thatwork.
Uh, I have two people, twowomen who've been working with
me for 31 years now.
I've got another one who's beenwith me for 22.
I've got another one who's beenwith me for 16.
(19:10):
And the patients, our customerscome back and they see the same
faces time and again, andthere's this continuity of their
care, and we've built theserelationships that matter, and
the practice grows.
The practice I'm in right now,um uh eight years ago, was doing
600,000 in the in the year.
Um, and we have I helped manageto grow that in six years to
(19:34):
over 3.2 million on theserelationship-based principles.
So it can be done.
You don't have to spend a tonof money, but you need to be
patient becauserelationship-based systems takes
time.
Uh, you know, you're not gonnamake it overnight, you're not
gonna make it next month, butyou're gonna build something
that's gonna be long-termsustainable.
(19:54):
So if you're not retiring inthe next two to three years, you
can do this.
Um, but so that's so the teamis that's a big one.
Having those agreements is isis huge.
And you apply those principlesacross the board, it works
great.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (20:10):
Thank you.
If you had a magic wand and youcould fix one thing overnight
in a typical healthcarebusiness, and let's we'll say
we've dealt with the teamdynamics.
Uh, what would it be?
If it's not a team dynamicsproblem, what's the next biggest
problem that you see in thebusinesses you work with?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (20:26):
Um and again, I guess it gets back to
these relationships.
Um, so many of my colleagues indentistry see a person as teeth
attached to a body as opposedto a body that just happens to
have teeth.
So you need to flip thenarrative and look at the whole
(20:48):
person.
It's like confunctionalmedicine.
So much in medicine andhealthcare is specialized.
We tend to, you know, you'vegot the you've got orthopedic
surgeons, and what do they do?
They specialize.
So you've got there's onesurgeon, all he does is
shoulders.
And so if you go to him andyou've got a knee problem, he
says, I can't help you.
All I do is shoulders.
(21:09):
And in uh the healthcare systemin Canada, the way physicians,
general physicians, are umcompensated is they you've only
got enough time to see someoneand take care of one problem.
But the human body is complex,and you know, in functional
medicine, sometimes there's fiveor six issues that are
(21:29):
interacting with each other, andyou need to address them all if
you want that person to getbetter.
And the same thing happens indentistry.
We tend to get focused on justteeth or just gums or just one
thing or just two things, andnot understanding that the mouth
is attached to the whole body,and there are systemic
(21:50):
influences on the mouth, andthere's bodies in this in the
whole, there are uh portions ofthe body that's affecting the
mouth region.
And if we don't step back andlook at the whole body, then
we're missing the forest for thetrees, and people don't get
better.
If we want to elevate our care,we need to look at the whole
(22:10):
person as a whole person thatjust happens to have the small
specific portion that you dealwith.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (22:18):
I can agree with you more.
You're singing my language,because um I mean even my day
job, I'm actually an emergencyphysician, I'm still one of the
few generalists around.
And I think the trouble is weare in a healthcare system now
where everybody is so superspecialized, nobody's joining
the dots, nobody's taking aholistic view.
You know, you can be seen byfour different specialists in a
hospital, all you know, amazingat what they do, nobody's
(22:40):
joining the dots.
There's no cross-communication,there's no understanding of
anything outside of the regionthey're working in.
And I often joke with mypatients is a shoulder problem
or a knee problem, or a rightknee problem, or a left knee
problem.
That's how super specialized itfeels like it is these days.
Dr Larry Stanleigh (22:54):
Yes, yeah, yeah.
Yet uh, you know, I I havepeople come to me and they're
clenching and uh and there'swear on their teeth and they've
got headaches and stuff becausethey're clenching.
And um uh one of the commoncauses of clenching is a pelvic
imbalance.
And so I have people stand upand I look at them and I have
(23:15):
them walk and I look at how theywalk, and then they realize,
and so that I need to get themwith someone who can deal with
their pelvic imbalance todecrease their clenching.
People don't do that, you know.
You do, but but uh, but toomany of our colleagues don't.
I know it's sad.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (23:34):
What can you perhaps share something that
you've learned the hard way interms of building systems or
teams that you now teach toothers to avoid because of your
you know you've learned fromlearned from your own experience
and you pass it on to others?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (23:46):
Well, you know, uh people I I'm uh I'm not
a young man anymore, and peoplesay, When are you gonna retire?
And and I'm I'm well on the oneside, I'm grateful that I love
what I get to do, and I have nointention of stopping it.
I mean, some of the richestpeople in the world, uh uh
Warren Buffett, for example,he's in his mid-90s, and he
still wakes up in the morning,puts on a suit and tie, and he
(24:06):
goes to work.
He doesn't need to.
He's one of the richest men inthe world, but he does it
because what he does stillmatters and and it still drives
him.
He still makes a difference inpeople's lives, not just his
own.
And uh, and I'm that in thatposition.
I I'm gonna keep doing what Ido because I'm making a
difference in people's lives.
I'm building smiles andchanging lives every day.
(24:28):
Um, so I'm not retiring fromthat standpoint.
But the other side of the coin,I've been in my past very good
at spending money and very badat saving money.
So I haven't saved enough forretirement as well.
And so one of my things that Italk about, um one, you know, I
will I will often many of thepeople who uh uh ask me to help
them are younger dentists whoare fairly early in their career
(24:49):
and they've bought a practiceand they've spent seven figures
buying this practice, andthey're having trouble managing
everything because uh trying tofinance seven figures is a very
hefty monthly outlay.
And so the money is a big deal,and you go to bed and you worry
about that, and you lie awakeat night, you know, worrying
about that.
And and so we need to look athow we spend our money as well.
(25:10):
We're often we're spendingpoorly and we're not paying
attention to what we're spendingour money on.
So you need to look at that,and there are ways to to do
that.
I I early in my career, forexample, I bought my practice
from a guy who had retired after44 years, and he walked out on
Friday and I walked in onMonday.
But we had the same personalityand the same philosophy of
(25:32):
treatment, so it worked.
We I had over a 90% retentionrate.
Uh, in dentistry, the averageretention rate, when you when a
practice is sold for the newdentist, the average retention
rate is 40%.
I mean, 60% of that practiceleaves when a new dentist comes
on board, even if that newdentist was endorsed by the
previous dentist.
(25:52):
Uh it's a terrible retentionrate.
And that's a ton of money thatjust sort of walks out the door
in the first month.
So I didn't want that tohappen.
So I worked very hard inretention.
Um, and uh, but I had I and Ikept the relationships with the
dental lab that he used to workwith, and with the specialists
that he used to refer to, andwith the dental supply company
(26:15):
and dental repair company thathe was working with.
And, you know, things went by,and and I was I was uh learning
about uh accounting and as smallbusiness people, we've got to
not just be uh a practitioner,we have to be an accountant, we
need to be a marketingspecialist, we need to be an HR
specialist, we need to have allthese different hats on.
(26:35):
And of course, we didn't getthat training in in medical
school and in dental school andand and physiotherapy school and
massage therapy school andchiropractic colleges, they
don't teach us this stuff.
We have to find out a way.
So my bank, thankfully, wasgreat, and they and they
provided courses for a lot ofthis.
And I learned about how in uhin dentistry the top uh four
(26:59):
expenses are um uh salaries, uhrent, uh, dental supplies, and
dental lab.
Those are the uh top fourexpenses.
And other than salaries andrent, which are somewhat fixed,
the other two are variable.
And they should be fallingwithin a window, the supplies in
the lab.
And the dental supplies shouldbe falling in the five to seven
(27:21):
percent window.
So if I've got $100 ofexpenses, five to seven dollars
of those expenses should be mysupplies.
Well, I was spending 12% on mysupplies, and I went to my rep
and I said, you know, my supplycosts are too high.
And he said, Well, I'll lowerthe price of this product or
(27:41):
I'll lower the price of thatproduct.
And I said, Great, yeah, yeah.
And months went by and itdidn't change, it was still too
high.
And so I was talking to umanother uh company, and uh, and
after um, and this is a wholelonger story, which we don't
have time for, but we got to theend of him exploring what my
(28:04):
goals in my career was, and andhe said to me, instead of just
lowering prices on specificproducts, if I helped refine
your business so that we gotyour supply costs from 12% down
to six percent, would you dobusiness exclusively with me
wherever we can?
And I said, Yeah, because thatwas thousands of dollars every
(28:29):
month that I could then have mydental assistants not spend time
looking for bargains and justbe able to work clinically.
And they did, they came onboard, and within three months
my dental supplies costs droppedto where they were supposed to
be.
So the the lesson is know yournumbers, know where you're
(28:52):
spending.
And if your numbers are out ofalign with industry norms for
whatever business you're in,then you need to find a way to
get them back into industrynorms.
If you're within industrynorms, then you need to look at
not how do you cut your costs,how do you increase your
revenue.
So it's you know, it's it'sabout finding that balance.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (29:15):
Thank you.
I guess um many of the clinicsor that you're working with are
interested in growth.
And if they suddenly had aflood of new patients, what's
the first thing that would breakin those businesses in your
experience?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (29:31):
The the joyous trouble we all um we all
desire to have is too muchbusiness.
Well, first um um build thoserelationships and people who if
they if they think you're great,then they're gonna wait for
you.
Uh right now it is uh earlyOctober, and uh people who want
(29:53):
to see me are booking in midFebruary right now.
So I'm booked out four months,and in dentistry, that's unheard
of.
Some people are impatient andthey want to be seen next week.
But I'm not dealing with peoplewho have acute pain, like, oh,
my tooth is hurting.
For those, we people we willsee them right away, get them
out of pain, but then thetreatment will be booked in our
(30:15):
regular schedule.
But you need to build in theidea of how are you going to
grow?
You need to understand beforeyou start if this is successful,
because you go in with the ideathat, yeah, this is going to be
successful.
How are you going to grow?
You have the room in thephysical facility to bring on
more people and to be ready.
(30:36):
And when you reach certainnumbers, you hire the additional
uh assistant, you hire theadditional administrator, you
get more hygienists, you getother dentists, you get other
operators.
And then uh in our facility,for example, we had 3,500 square
feet.
We had space for sevenoperatories where we could do
clinical dentistry, but we onlyhad four with equipment in them.
(30:59):
But we reached a certain pointwithin about two and a half
years that we needed more space,and we uh negotiated with our
supplier to for the equipment tobuild and equip the other four
operatories.
And we rapidly filled those upwith hiring more people and
building it up.
And but it you need to have atthe beginning the understanding
(31:22):
of where you're gonna go, whereyou want to be, and then plan
how to get there so that when ithappens, you've got the plan in
place, and it doesn't take aton of time or money to do that.
You just have to think theprocess through.
It's it's about a half a day tosit down and work it out with
your coach.
But once you've got it inplace, then you're just you're
(31:42):
just following the plan.
It's it's easy, it's likehaving an instruction manual in
plain English.
You just follow it, it's theway you go.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (31:50):
Thank you.
Um, so looking ahead, what's onthe cards for you in the next
six to 12 months?
Where would you like yourpractice, your teaching, or your
um other businesses to be?
Dr Larry Stanleigh (32:00):
Well, I I had this this uh dream of uh
getting paid to fly somewhere,um, speak on a stage, uh, get
paid, and then get off the stageand then stick around and be a
tourist for a couple of dayswherever it is.
That's that's one of my dreams.
Um, and so uh I have uh uh I'mworking more on on my keynote
(32:22):
talks to so that I can have achance to do that.
Uh one of them is uh outside ofbusiness altogether.
It's called The People in YourLife Are a Gift.
And it's a series of truestories that have four key
points uh that uh we want tostay uh identify and stay
connected to the people whomatter in our life, that we want
to be um remove uh unconsciousor sub excuse me, subconscious
(32:43):
biases to achieve true equality,uh, that great things are to
live for and the people in yourlife are a gift.
And from that come uh workshopsand stuff like that.
I've got a book written on thattitle, uh, that title, uh The
People in Your Life are a gift.
And there's um been a demand todo um to convert that book into
an audio book.
So in the next uh three to sixmonths, that's one of my goals.
(33:04):
Um, but I've got some full-daytraining sessions coming up in
February in in uh Winnipeg,Manitoba, and in Portland,
Oregon in the US, where uh I'llbe touching on uh all these
business uh lectures, the peoplein your life are a gift, then
and another topic, uh sleepdisordered breathing,
identifying it and treatment forthe for the team.
So these are all team-basedlectures, uh, not just uh
(33:26):
clinicians, but the wholebusiness.
We want them to all cometogether and learn together, and
that's how businesses willgrow, is if everyone understands
what the goals are.
So uh just doing more of that,more more uh speaking,
traveling, and getting anopportunity to get paid to do
it.
Dr Anfrew Greenland (33:43):
Amazing, Larry.
Thank you so much for your timethis afternoon.
It's been such an interestingconversation, so many rich
lessons in business andmarketing, hearing about your
journey, what you do, reallyfascinating.
Really grateful for your time.
Massively appreciate it.
Thank you so much.
Dr Larry Stanleigh (33:58):
You are most welcome.
It's a pleasure and an honor,and thank you for asking me to
be part of this podcast.
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