Dr. Eric Bloom is transforming physical therapy by bridging the critical gap between rehabilitation and wellness at his Arizona-based practice. After witnessing diminishing care quality throughout his 16-year career, he founded Bloom Performance and Rehab to create something revolutionary—a practice that maintains clinical excellence while building a sustainable business model.
"Medicine and wellness exist on the same spectrum," Dr. Bloom explains, highlighting the core philosophy driving his innovative approach. "If somebody's sick or injured, they're more medical-driven. Once they've passed that process, their medical care doesn't stop—it becomes wellness." This refreshing perspective challenges the reactive nature of traditional healthcare, where patients receive attention only when problems arise rather than receiving support to maintain their health.
The practice incorporates cutting-edge modalities like red light therapy, pulsed electromagnetic field therapy, and exercise with oxygen training—technologies with scientific foundations dating back decades but underutilized in clinical settings. What sets Dr. Bloom's approach apart is his commitment to data-driven care, establishing comprehensive baseline measurements before implementing these wellness modalities. "We don't know where you're going to go if we don't know where you're starting from," he notes, emphasizing the importance of measurable outcomes.
Perhaps most exciting is how Dr. Bloom has expanded beyond individual patient care into corporate wellness partnerships. By bringing preventative care directly to workforces—including healthcare institutions themselves—he's addressing a critical irony: providers often neglect their own wellbeing while caring for others. These partnerships demonstrate that wellness initiatives improve employee retention, reduce time off, and create healthier workplaces.
Dr. Bloom's vision extends to education as well. As clinical faculty at Tufts University, he's bridging what he sees as problematic gaps between academia, research, and clinical practice. By teaching students how to apply academic knowledge in real-world settings, he's preparing a new generation of providers who understand integrated, evidence-based approaches.
Ready to experience a healthcare approach that doesn't just fix problems but helps prevent them? Discover how physical therapy can be reimagined as part of your complete wellness journey by exploring what's possible when rehabilitation meets prevention.
Contact & Social Handles
Guest: Dr. Eric Bloom, PT, DPT, OCS, Cert. SMT
Business: Bloom Performance and Rehab
📍 Location: Arizona, USA
📞 Phone: 480-357-6500
🌐 Website: https://www.bloomperformance.com
📧 Email: eric@bloomperformance.com
💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eric-bloom-5aa35947/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr Andrew Greenland (00:07):
Okay, so welcome back to Voices in Health
and Wellness.
This is the podcast where weexplore what's shaping the
future of care, from inside theclinic to the heart of the
community.
I'm your host, dr AndrewGreenland, and today's guest
brings a rare blend of clinicalinsight and entrepreneurial
energy to the table.
Joining me today is Dr EricBloom, doctor of Physical
Therapy, board CertifiedOrthopaedic Clinical Specialist
(00:27):
and founder of Bloom Performanceand Rehab.
Eric has built something uniquea fast-growing practice that's
not only redefining patient carein Arizona, but also extending
its impact through corporatewellness partnerships across the
US.
At the intersection of rehabperformance and preventative
care, eric is helping to bridgethe often-missing link between
clinical outcomes and everydaywellness.
(00:48):
So in today's episode, we'lldive into how he's scaling his
vision and why integration, notspecialization, is the future of
medicine.
So, eric, thank you very muchfor joining us on the show
Thanks for having me, Dr Lee.
Dr Eric Bloom (01:00):
I appreciate being here.
Dr Andrew Greenland (01:01):
Thank you Really appreciate your time, so
could you maybe talk throughwhat your role looks like at
Bloom Performance and Rehab?
Just to kick us off.
Dr Eric Bloom (01:08):
Yeah, so I started this probably about
eight years ago.
So I've been out in practice 16years.
So I wanted to figure out.
I saw the trend early on in mycareer with just the way
medicine was going and I thinkthis is not just here in the
States, but you know, care isgetting a little bit diminished
for whatever reason, whetherit's revenue is the, the prime
(01:31):
driver or some other you knowcomponent of it.
So I want to kind of find a wayto try to bridge the gap
between still providing qualitycare but having a sustainable,
successful business.
So I'm eight years in and beenthrough quite a unique dynamic
with you know kovat and someother avenues that as business
owners, you know we run intoroadblocks and other problems
(01:54):
that we can't expect, so kind ofalways it's up and down with it
.
So I was knowing, as time wasgoing on, I've always wanted to
have an integrated practice atsome point.
So I was able back in 2019 topurchase my own suite that I
work in right now to be able tointegrate other forms of you
know health care providers,whatever it might be.
(02:15):
So for a little while prior toCOVID, I had an anesthesiologist
that was in here doing somework with me, so he was a friend
of mine and kind of got tiredof, you know, just doing
specific surgical work.
So we wanted to integrate someclinical work.
So we were working together totry to find a more efficient,
effective way to address patientproblems in office from a you
(02:36):
know, management of truly themedical side, along with, like,
the physical therapy side, toexpedite that process, give
patients, you know, care thatthey typically wouldn't get as
efficiently and quickly and finda way to alter that.
And so that kind of started thewhole process with it.
And then back in 2022, early 23,I'm a founder, one of the
co-founders, of Unwind Wellness,which basically is bringing
(02:58):
non-traditional modalities likered light therapy, exogen with
oxygen, pemf, things like that,to figure out how those, from a
science standpoint, can beintegrated into a practice to
provide alternative measuresbesides just medicine.
So my big premise was medicine,wellness it's all on the same
spectrum.
(03:19):
It depends on where thatpatient is.
If somebody's sick, injured,hurt, have surgery, they're more
medical driven.
Someone's passed that processand now they're recovering Well,
their medical care doesn't stopand now becomes wellness.
So we wanted to find a way tomake it medically driven from a
wellness side versus you know,some of these just random
(03:39):
wellness facilities that pop upand may not have a medical
component to it and figure outwhere along that spectrum is a
patient and how do we keep themin that spectrum and more on the
healthy wellness side versushaving to resort back to the
medical injured side.
Because we see that all thetime, right, people get better,
they're done well.
We don't do much to sustainthat and keep them from getting
back um, whether or not hurt orinjured.
(04:01):
So I wanted to find a way tohave them continue to be in my
practice but not always treatthem on the medical injured hurt
side, and so that's kind of howwe integrated a wellness
component and it's still in theearly stages but we're seeing
some pretty cool changes andbenefits for people.
Dr Andrew Greenland (04:17):
Amazing.
I think you mentioned in ouremail conversation that you were
blending clinical and corporatewellness.
Is that right and are you can?
Dr Eric Bloom (04:25):
you tell?
how you structure that from thekind of the corporate side yeah,
that's kind of dependent on theindividual kind of corporate
component.
So, um, one of my co-foundershere has kind of been more in
the business corporate world andso he was at a huge company
around here and, interestinglyenough, their companies, one of
their biggest focuses, wasadding wellness services to
(04:45):
their employees.
Because they're starting tofigure out helps with retention,
helps reduce costs, things likethat which most maybe companies
don't focus on as much.
So we wanted to find a way well, how can we integrate
data-driven, research-basedmodalities to help that?
So we recently just wereinvolved with one of our local
hospitals in a fairly well-knowninstitution in dignity health
(05:07):
care out here with one of thehospitals that's two miles down
the road, in their nurses weekand providers week the last
couple of weeks.
So we opened up doors for them.
Free services, just kind oftreat them on.
Hey, listen to wellness aspectsof it, how it impacts you as a
provider, what can you do foryou, how can we integrate care
for you as well?
And so that's kind of a slowstart of the corporate wellness
(05:27):
that we're adding.
And then as time goes on and wefigure out what the needs of
each corporate partner might be.
What are they looking for Oneof the partners we've been
looking at.
They do like BMI testing, oldschool testing, body weight
nothing that's really thataccurate.
And so we've got like a 3D bodyscanner that we've been using
for a while, and so now it givesus more data, and so our whole
(05:48):
premise of everything we do iswe don't know where you're going
to go if we don't know whereyou're starting from, and so we
try to get as much baseline dataas we can to figure out, when
we're doing some of thesenon-traditional modalities,
where are we seeing changes downthe road, and not just, you
know, external changes.
So we've also been trying tofind, you know, companies to do
(06:08):
different blood work ordifferent biometric testing,
things like that that we'reslowly getting into, because
then we can actually show thatnot only are you looking better,
maybe externally, you'refeeling better, we're actually
seeing those changes internallyin your body as well.
So it's not just an appearance,look, it's kind of a total
package that somebody'simproving on got it.
Dr Andrew Greenland (06:26):
Do you have any particular kinds of clients
or companies that you'reworking with on the wellness
side, and is there a particularkind of companies that are more
on the uptake for this kind ofapproach?
Dr Eric Bloom (06:36):
So I think getting in the in the healthcare
system I mean you and I bothknow as providers I think
sometimes we prioritize ourhealth maybe less than you know
some of the patients, becauseour whole role and I see it in
the community you know I go outand you know people talk about
like oh hey, I see one of myhealthcare people like we always
run into patients with it andthen if I take time off, you
know they're like hey where wereyou?
(06:57):
I'm like well, I had a doctor'sappointment or had to take care
of my own stuff.
You know and I think sometimesit's a misconception that you
know healthcare workers don'tneed any health care themselves,
you know, and so I think that'sone big trend that we're seeing
is a lot of these hospitals orcompanies are trying to figure
out how to provide treatments orwellness modalities to their
(07:18):
own healthcare providers, sothat we don't forget about them,
because I think we're.
It's a very common thing thatgets left behind is how do we
take care of ourselves when ourprimary goal is to take care of
others, and it's just somethingthat's harder to trend, and I
think companies that value thatwe're starting to see better
retention rates.
They're noticing that, you know,there may be less resources
(07:38):
spent for time off and having tofind coverage and things like
that, and so we also looklocally right now on companies
that value wellness, and sowe're trying to find companies
that have wellness programs orthat are looking to add wellness
programs.
So we know that there's atleast interest from them, and
maybe they don't know how tointegrate it or implement it
into their own business, but wedo, and our goal is to figure
(08:01):
out okay, what are your needs,how can we work together?
And so we goal is to figure outokay, what are your needs, how
can we work together?
And so we're trying to figureout how to have the baseline
information and productsavailable for them, and so we
just partner with them so theydon't have to figure out how to
do it on their own.
That's where our job is cominginto play, is we're trying to
integrate that into the wellnessaspect for them so they don't
have to do it because that's nottheir primary role.
So if you're, you know, anengineering company or a tech
(08:34):
company, you're likely not goingto have.
You know, you may have awellness person on staff or
something like that, but you'renot going to probably have as
much experience that we mighthave integrating this, you know,
for several years.
And so we're just trying tofind people that have an
interest of adding this to theirbusiness to hopefully, you know
, keep their employees healthier, happier and just enjoy where
they go to work every dayBrilliant.
Dr Andrew Greenland (08:46):
What major shifts are you seeing in rehab
and wellness space right now,and especially in your local
area in the Arizona market?
Dr Eric Bloom (08:54):
So the big change is a lot of, you know, smaller
companies like myself, you know,especially the last five years,
have kind of gone to a biggercorporate realm and so within
the last year or so there's beenseveral different single owners
like myself that have kind ofcome together and we've kind of
created our own little mininetwork where we kind of have
(09:15):
like a sister company.
Now that we've created thatoversees all of us just to help
expedite with some of the backend things, as it's harder to
run all your own billing, allyour own HR, all of that stuff.
So instead of having to go to atrue corporate field, we can
still run and own our businesseslike we've created with it.
But it's taking some of thatback end burden off of our hands
and so that's a big thing thatwe've been trying to add.
(09:36):
And so with that kind ofpartnership and merger we've got
a like a physician assistantthat comes in, and so she comes
in once a week, and so she comesin once a week and so if we
need something medical we don'thave to worry about referring
out to somebody else, waitingfor that time frame and
referring potentially to anorthopedic specialist.
So we're trying to integrateeven more than just the wellness
side.
(09:57):
Like how can we add a truemedical side as needed, quicker
and efficiently?
Like in my clinic, in all ofour locations we do diagnostic
ultrasound.
So you know there's a lot ofeffectiveness with that with
certain conditions.
So if somebody walks in, we'renot waiting, you know, weeks
sometimes for a high cost MRI.
If it's not necessary we canget a baseline, look then
(10:19):
determine kind of what route togo.
So we're just trying to makethings more efficient and
effective, and arizona is one ofthe.
I guess you can kind of stayleader with what's being done in
the pt world.
So a year ago they've given allkind of physical therapists the
right to order any imaging asneeded as well, and so we can do
simple x-rays.
There's even a potential thatwe're trying to figure out how
(10:39):
to use it like simple blood workif we need that for a patient.
Um, things that we can do.
So we're trying to figure outone what's our scope of care?
What works for us?
How do we integrate with amedical provider as needed, like
where do we find that limit ofwhat's appropriate for us?
But also efficiently with thepatient?
And having somebody in herethat's kind of a sports med,
non-op trained person allows usto bounce ideas off them, work
(11:01):
together together and we'reseeing massive changes.
So, like an example is I had alady that came in here.
She went to go get an MRI, tookher three or four weeks to get
in there.
She shows up and they canceledit on her because it said oh,
your insurance requiredsomething that they told they
didn't right.
So by the time we actually hadher come in here to take a look,
she literally was almost donewith care by the time.
Somebody else needs to getanother image, and so people are
(11:24):
getting treated.
They're getting what they needquicker and faster and more
efficiently, and so we'retrained to understand.
Is it appropriate for, you know, pt?
Is it appropriate for areferral?
Where are we at?
And so we're trying to minimize, you know, an immediate
referral to a surgeon ifunnecessary, because for them
they're getting overwhelmed too.
I mean, there's so many patientsin arizona that's growing.
(11:46):
We know there's a massive needfor health care providers.
So if we can kind of ease someof the burden for the I want to
say, less important but not asspecific surgical cases, a lot
of doctors are liking it.
So then they know when we referto them they've kind of passed
all of those non-op things thatare, hey, these are not working,
or here's what they've done,and it's expediting that process
for them as well too.
(12:06):
So we're seeing kind of aseamless transition, which often
you don't get in many states orwho knows around
internationally as well how thatworks.
But we're seeing a huge changewith integration and really
patients are loving it.
Dr Andrew Greenland (12:18):
Amazing, would you say.
Companies are becoming moreopen to preventative and
wellness focused care.
I think, by the previous thingyou were saying in conversation,
you've had some health careproviders which are wanting to
do things for their staff, whichis great because obviously
medical professionals need it.
Or is it an uphill climb?
Dr Eric Bloom (12:35):
in general, I think it's still an uphill climb
to an extent because they'relarger companies, but there's a
lot more people that arechanging for it and I think
generationally things justchange.
You know, I think Whoa, lightshit off here.
I think it's kind of agenerational change.
So some of the younger, youknow generations, I think, have
(12:57):
more things that they'reinterested when they come out of
school as a job than maybe whatI did 15 years ago, than maybe
what somebody did 30 years ago,just because there's new
technology and things availablethat we didn't have.
So we're having to adapt to themarket, the technology, to what
that generation wants and Ithink for them they want a job
that feels like they can beintegrated, stay there kind of,
(13:20):
have a lot of their needs metand you know, sometimes it's not
easy to meet all of those.
But we're seeing a health andwellness program is a big thing.
So I've been on forums andlooking at different research
things and they're finding outthat you know a lot of people
want health and wellness and sowe can talk to, you know,
different companies or you knowwe're even trying to integrate
what we call kind of a strategicpartnership with other medical
(13:44):
practices that want to add this.
Like they're finding thatretention rates are better,
employees are maybe wanting togo work there because now they
have access to something thatnormally they might have to pay
on their own to go elsewhere.
Well, now it's actually intheir own office, so it's still
an uphill climb.
I'm big on looking at theliterature and researching
everything, and so we alwaysknow that the research says one
thing, but to get into clinicalpractice it takes some time.
(14:06):
So, but someone's got to try tokind of grind away and get that
change done, because if not, ifno one's willing to push
through, and you know we getstagnant or we know it's going
to go in the opposite direction.
Dr Andrew Greenland (14:18):
Got it.
So, with the changes in theindustry, how are you
positioning yourself at Bloom tostay ahead of things and sort
of be market leader, bloom?
Dr Eric Bloom (14:25):
Johnson.
So I think the big thing isreally that integration and
pushing like the wellness aspect.
So just looking around andknowing the market like it's
very unknown to a lot of people,you know, and we're finding out
that as patients are coming inthey're looking for some of this
stuff and not knowing where togo.
(14:45):
So if we offer this, knowingthey're already looking for it,
for us it makes sense.
Then why do we need topotentially refer them elsewhere
?
So it's great from kind of atwofold standpoint.
Patients want it.
I mean it could be good for akind of a secondary revenue
generation, because if they'retrusting what we're doing on one
aspect of it, then why can't wefind a way to integrate
something else that patients arealready looking for, that we
(15:08):
know they're going to gosomewhere else too.
But now if they know they trustwhat we're doing medically, why
would they not trust us on adifferent avenue with it?
And so it's trying to educate,inform, teach people that.
But I think if we're not makinga change and pushing forward, I
mean I think we're going to seea big decline, especially with
some control from insurance,reimbursement, things like that
that we can't control.
So we've got to be able tocontrol the things that we can,
(15:30):
and some of those are differentbusiness models, different
approaches, modalities,techniques, things like that to
continue to increase revenue butalso provide quality care and
services that patients are goingto be looking for to help in
their healing process, got it.
Dr Andrew Greenland (15:48):
So what's working well for you at Bloom
right now in terms of all yourinitiatives and the things that
you do and some of these thingsyou've mentioned, but what's
particularly working well foryou as a business?
Dr Eric Bloom (15:57):
You know, I think the things that are really
working the best are workingwith you know either those other
, you know doctors, physicians,surgeons, that understand what
we have to offer and so we'vegot people that come directly to
us that'll be like hey, go tothis pt place because we know
they offer wellness modalitiesas well.
That, I think, would be good foryou.
So we're starting to see asmall little trend of you know,
(16:20):
not even just physicaltherapists but other health care
providers that are starting toknow more about this stuff,
because it's not reallytraditional medicine by any
standards.
And the thing that people don'trealize, like a lot of this
stuff has been around since the70s and 80s.
I mean, nasa was kind of thefirst one to experiment with
some of the, you know, pemf andsome of the red light, and then
they use it for kind of otherreasons and they slowly kind of
integrated it.
(16:40):
There's more research on whatit did at the cellular level,
things like that.
So for me it's always been amedical component, but it's just
never been well known.
So if we're now able to figureout how to work with other
providers that know the benefitsof it, now when a patient comes
, I think their expectation is,hey, I'm not just going to get
(17:01):
pt, or like what they think isthe basic care, they're getting
additional things that a lot ofother places don't offer,
because both their provider andthen coming to see us, our goal
was trying to be as efficientand effective in your care, and
so here's how we're integratingthese together.
So, and as time goes on, tryingto find more and more people
that understand about it, and Ithink it's with anything that's
new out there, you're alwaysgonna have some of those early
(17:22):
adopters that want it, peoplethat are hesitant and say no,
and then that middle populationthat wants to learn more, and so
we're really trying to workwith those providers that
understand the benefit of it,that maybe they've used it, and
I think what we're finding is,you know, even kind of like
yourself with whether you're anon-traditional medical writer,
whether you're a naturopath,functional medicine doctor, even
(17:44):
chiropractic care, things likethat that we would consider
non-traditional.
We're typically more open tosome of those changes and ideas
because they're already usingsome of that, and so that's kind
of where we're seeing thatbenefit, and so I think there's
always been too much of a clashbetween providers.
Like I always tell all mypatients I'm like, if you're
going somewhere and you'regetting the benefit that you
need, I'm never going to tellyou to stop doing something.
(18:04):
Let's find a way to workcollectively together and find,
maybe something that's beingmissed.
Instead of being like, well, no, that's not being done the
right way, like, how can we addto your care and not feel like
you're starting over and so I?
That's a big push that I do.
I think a lot of people getturned off and they say like,
well, I told me that you'regetting benefit from them, so
why am I going to tell you notto go?
Let's find a way to add thingsthat are being that you aren't
(18:27):
currently getting with differentthings that we can offer, and
then see how, collectively, thattreatment together is going to
improve your care.
And so we're starting to noticemore and more of those
providers that you know are morecollaborative.
Instead of, you know, feelinglike we're, um, you know, two
different businesses fightingfor the same patients, we're
seeing that, hey, we canactually work together and be
successful and not push againsteach other interesting and, on
(18:52):
the flip side, what's been sortof frustrating or slower than
expected as you sort of grow andtake your business forward
number one thing.
Like anything, patients don'treally fully understand a lot of
the new additions and we kindof get stuck in our old ways.
And you know there's still somethat's like, well, let me see
if I can, you know, do moreresearch or figure it out, or
(19:13):
I've never heard of it, so Idon't know about it, and you
know that that's kind of achallenge.
And then you get some peoplewho are like, well, I don't know
about it.
However, you know, I trust whatyou've done for me, so if
you're bringing something in,I'm willing to learn more about
it.
So I think it's it's always aunique challenge because I think
patients are always hesitant.
And I mean the reality is, Ithink to some extent we've all
(19:34):
probably been burned a littlebit by something in the
healthcare community, whetherit's a provider, you know an
insurance bill or somethingwhere it's like you show up and
it gets canceled, like I thinkthere's just that natural
hesitation at times, and so Ithink they're they're they're
kind of that fear drivencomponent of well, I need to
make sure I'm fully ready tounderstand what this new part is
(19:56):
, because in the past it hasn'tworked well for me and so I see
a very kind of unique, complexpatient population myself here,
where that is definitely what'shappened.
They feel like they've gottenburned by the community, the you
know different medicalproviders, maybe even from like
medications, because they havereactions to it and they're told
well, this is the only thingthat can help and so they're not
(20:17):
sure where to go.
So anything that's new to themit's kind of an immediate like
hesitation that kicks in becausethey're like well, here we go
again.
This is the same thing I'vedone before.
So it's trying to be honest andopen with people and say, hey,
here's the information, here'smore information, we do research
on it, like this is where it'sat like and just just exposing
people to the reality of this.
(20:38):
There's a lot of falseinformation that's out there.
They may hear one thing fromsomebody but don't completely
understand the story and it'slike well, that's, that's not
the normal.
You know that's, that'sprobably a bad story or
something that you didn't hurtcorrectly.
But you know how do we getpatients to understand and what
I tell them?
I said my goal is for you notto come back and see me on the
medical side, if we're addingthis, my goal is for you to stay
(20:59):
healthy and to continue, maybeunder my care, on a different
realm, so we don't have to treatyou to get you back to baseline
.
Why can't we keep you frombaseline and beyond?
I don't want to just get youback to your baseline levels.
And so, as they start tounderstand that, more we give
them more information about it,I think they're starting to
realize, you know, beingproactive is really the best way
(21:20):
, instead of being reactive inmedicine, which is mostly what
we do we don't focus on keepingpeople healthy.
We focus on keeping or gettingsomeone sick to get them back to
being.
You know that baseline health.
So how can we be proactive?
And there's some people thatare interested, but I think
there's just naturally ahesitation from patients.
Dr Andrew Greenland (21:38):
Are there any particular modalities that
patients are more skeptical overthan others?
Dr Eric Bloom (21:48):
more skeptical over than others.
So I think right now the andhere the pemf right, that's not
as known um, like ewot.
The ewt is similar to like ahyperbaric chamber, so they've
kind of heard of that.
Red light, I think is the morewell-known thing.
I mean, you know a lot of likedermatology places have been
using.
I tell people like, well, thinkabout blue light.
You see, they probably don'trealize it, but I'm like.
Your dentist has been using thatfor you for years different
lightweight spectrum differentprocess, but lights being used
(22:10):
all over the place.
You may just not realize it.
So that's more known.
I think it's more of like theflashy modality, but, um, I
think pemf was just notunderstanding and like they're
thinking magnets and electriclike do what?
How is that going to work?
And so that, ironically, isprobably the one that got the
most medical value more thananything with it.
So that's the one.
(22:31):
I think that's a little bit ofa harder push initially until
they use it, they see it, tounderstand the changes to it.
The other ones are a little bitmore known, I guess, and uh,
whether it's online or byfriends that have done something
to it or they least have heardabout it where the pmf is kind
of the more unknown one.
Dr Andrew Greenland (22:47):
But I think honestly probably has some of
the most advantageous benefitsfor people if you understand how
to use it correctly um, isthere any particular metrics or
kpis that you focus on in yourbusiness, the ones that are most
important to you, and oranything that you're
particularly focused on tryingto improve?
Dr Eric Bloom (23:06):
Yeah, I think the big one is trying to figure out
.
You know, retention is always,is always, key for me.
I think there's, and I'vetalked with other business
owners and everybody alwayswants new patients and I'm like
I that's not really my focus.
My focus is to retain the goodones that we have.
So if you're always trying toget a new patient, it feels like
(23:26):
you're trying to start fromground zero all the time.
We're now being in business longenough, like a lot of my I
guess you would call like newcases that come into my office
are old patients because theyknow where we're at and so
that's an easier not sell inmedicine.
But their expectation isalready understanding like, hey,
I know you've helped me before,this is something new, I don't
(23:47):
have to try to.
You know, hey, here's what wedo in pt, here's how our company
works, here's what our plan islike.
They already know that thatworks and so we also try to look
at you know how many peoplecome to us from past or former
patients.
Same thing like withexpectations.
Their expectation is probablyalready going to be that, hey,
they may get some help herebecause they know somebody
(24:09):
that's already been here.
Where, if you just findsomebody new, random online that
just finds your office doesn'tknow anything about you.
It's like you're starting, likeI said, from like day one all
over again and now you've got togain that trust and
understanding where, if you cankeep a variety of people that
have been through here, thathave been shared with others,
you know.
That's why you know personaltestimony or referrals from past
(24:32):
and current patients are alwayseasier typically to work with
because their expectation is,hey, I know I'm likely going to
get better here, whether, evenif they don't think about it or
not, because they know somethingthat's been through here.
Where the harder ones are, youknow I have been to PT several
times, or other medicalproviders.
I never got much relief.
I know that they're already inthat guarded state which
(24:55):
interesting with my backgroundfrom a neuroscience standpoint
we know that that increasestheir pain response.
So I'm already dealing withsomebody that's in a heightened
state coming in to see me on dayone because they've already
been built by the system.
So that's a much harder changeversus somebody coming in
expecting like, hey, I know I'mgoing to get better because I've
been here, or my friend orwhoever was got better.
(25:16):
So that's what I'm anticipatingwhen I walk in the door.
Dr Andrew Greenland (25:20):
Interesting .
So you mentioned retention.
So have you got any sort of keyinsights about the things that
lead to good retention andthings where you find is
probably a cause for them todrop?
Dr Eric Bloom (25:31):
I think benefits of showing up right.
I think value is the biggestthing and I think you know value
is kind of a word, but thevalue is going to be like what
are you here for?
Like, what are you trying toachieve?
And so if your goal is like,hey, here's, I want to get out
of this, I try to be asrealistic with them on day one,
like somebody's trying to comein with a major injury and their
goal is to go back and run.
(25:52):
You know, a marathon everymonth, like, okay, it may not be
realistic.
However, let's figure out whatis realistic to get you back to
that.
Where do we kind of find acommon ground?
So I think the retention isreally tied to realistic
expectations, both from theprovider and from the patient.
So we've had, like, a currentpatient that's come here and she
(26:13):
told us she left another officebecause she's like oh, I'll get
you back, you know full runningin two weeks.
And she's like, well, based offwhat I've looked up online,
she's like that just doesn'tmatch up, and so she was already
hesitant because what she foundonline as a patient didn't seem
to match up with what was beingsaid in clinic.
And so I think, realisticexpectations.
(26:34):
I always tell people some of thegreatest things I can tell you
is I don't know, but I canprobably find out.
So I think we try to solve allthe problems for everybody or
think we know all the answers,and that's probably the greatest
answer I can tell somebody or Idon't, but I know somebody that
does.
Or hey, here's what we need todo first, before you come back,
because then they feel likethey're getting the care they
need and not just trying to bekept as a patient for purely a
(26:58):
business model.
And so that's something that Idefinitely found is people
having the trust which, honestly, has been lost a lot in
healthcare, because they feellike a lot of times they're just
a number versus an actualpatient in a problem.
So I think retention is reallytied to trust and realistic
expectations on both patient andprovider interesting, so fast
(27:19):
forwarding, sort of six totwelve months.
Dr Andrew Greenland (27:21):
What would you let?
Where would you like to seebloom go in the next six to
twelve months?
Dr Eric Bloom (27:25):
my ultimate goal is I'd like to be a little bit
less in clinic and do more froma teaching standpoint.
So I'm also clinical facultyfor tufts university and their
PT program down here, so Iactually get ready to go teach
here in a few weeks, and so Ithink the biggest thing, the
reason why I like to teach, isthere's a lost integration, I
think, between academia andresearch and clinical, and so at
(27:50):
least here in the States that'skind of the big trifecta of
what we're doing as far as likethe big three with it.
How do you integrate researchwith, you know, patient
preference, the clinical side,academia, and I think there's a
disconnect.
So like I've got a student hereright now that's from Tufts that
I taught and he's quicklylearning that, wow, like there's
(28:13):
a little bit of a differencebetween what we're we're taught
in school versus what the clinicis like, and so when I try to
teach, I want to be able to berealistic with students that,
hey, this is the baseline infoyou got to understand how to
work this, but now let's teachyou how to clinically reason and
have rational for what we'redoing and why we're doing it in
the clinic.
And so I would love to be ableto have a clinic that's
continuing to grow without mebeing the primary provider, and
(28:36):
be able to educate and teachsome of the younger up and
coming clinicians on how do yousustain and run a business like
this in a world that's everchanging.
How do you integrate a medicalmodel that we have with a
wellness model?
How do you actually take, youknow, what you learn in school
into the clinic?
And I think that's a lost artlost art not just in PT, but I
think that's for every studentthat comes in.
(28:56):
I know that's how I was.
You know I had.
I went to Duke University forPT school and I feel like I had
a great training, but there'sonly so much that you can do at
school before you get into theclinic, and so just trying to
figure out.
How do you integrate thatbetter?
Um, so, as a patient or theprovider starts early in his
career, they're not feeling likethey're on an island and
(29:16):
they're like, wow, man, this isway different than I taught in
school.
So when I try to teach, I teachthem you know what we need to
do clinically for the academicsession, but it's like, okay,
now how do we actually integratethis to real life practice and
use this on a patient?
That's where they seem to startto get a better understanding
of that, because they're nowreasoning versus just picking a
technique and using it I'm bigon education as well, so I've
(29:40):
got some academic roles at theuniversity.
Dr Andrew Greenland (29:42):
So I'm completely aligned with you in
education, especially when youwant to kind of spread your word
about how you do things and togive a different approach.
But I suppose the question ishow you're going to release
yourself from your business todo so I've I've already started
a little bit so with kind ofsome of this partnership.
Dr Eric Bloom (29:58):
It's giving me the ability to not have to work
as much behind the scenes and sothey can take care of the
things that I was putting oddhours into.
And, you know, something simpleis just like HR and hiring some
of that.
So part of why I did it is oneit allows us to have a more
integrated practice that Icouldn't really do fully on my
own, gave me the ability to openup and do more, and so now I
(30:20):
can really push the wellnessside.
You can kind of push theteaching side, like things that
I feel like.
For me, when things started toget become a better provider and
understand the whole system,all of these things were
integrated like you need tounderstand what you got to do in
academia.
But then what does the researchsay that supports that?
But then how do you take thoseto integrate it with the clients
?
Okay, now the clients there,the patients there, now they're
(30:42):
at a point where they're back towhere they want to go.
Well then, how do we integratea wellness program to keep them
healthy, right?
So I feel like we get taught inlittle blocks of certain things
.
So this is the medical side.
You know this is the academicside.
Here's this side.
Well, how do we fully integratethat so that the spectrum of
care for a patient, from theirkind of starting point to their
(31:03):
ending point, is more consistent?
And so the only way to do thatis someone that's willing to
kind of take that chance and tryand integrate it and hopefully
see it works and have morepeople wanting to do it.
Dr Andrew Greenland (31:19):
If you could remove one roadblock
overnight, or challenge or athing which is limiting what you
do, what do you think thatwould be?
Dr Eric Bloom (31:24):
I'm mostly in the insurance world out here, and
so this is one of my immediatechanges I wish every clinic,
every hospital could take everyinsurance right, everybody,
regardless of where you at, gotreimbursed the same, because
then you're now at a standardwhere care drives the quality,
(31:44):
not the other way around.
So like if I, if a patient knew, like hey, if I go anywhere,
like I'm going to have to paythe same Providers know I'm
going to have to make the sameright Now.
Like well, I only have oneoption, well, that's your only
option with it.
Like it makes it harder for it.
So if we can make everything ona level playing field, then I
think you're gonna see adifference where quality is
(32:05):
gonna have to eventually come tothe top with it, because the
patients know well, like, hey,if I go somewhere else and
everything's on a level playingfield, I'm gonna go get what I
want to do.
And I think we've heldourselves less accountable over
time as providers and it's notas simple as just you know that
aspect, but because there'sobviously a lot to do with
patients and their mindsets andwhat they have to do.
(32:25):
But I think if you just make itas simple as you can, where
competition will speak foritself which is a good thing
where it should boost thequality of everybody that's
being done, because if you'renot really putting in quality to
your patients but you'regetting paid 25 more than what I
am for the same contract andI'm having to do, more work just
(32:46):
to make up that difference,like, for some reason there's a
level of you know, fairness thatI think it's thrown out the
door with it.
So if we make everything acrossthe field reimburse the same,
pay the same, no regards withany of that then it's thrown out
the door with it.
So if we make everything acrossthe field reimbursed the same,
paid the same, no regard withany of that then it's going to
really make those people thatare higher quality stand out and
patients will know that becausethere's not going to be any
difference for them or for usGot it.
Dr Andrew Greenland (33:05):
I think I've spoken to quite a few
people in the US and I thinkeverybody has mentioned the
whole insurance reimbursementthing as one of their roadblocks
.
And we don't have in the uk inthe same way.
We have a sort ofgovernment-funded health system,
but it seems to be a universalissue with all the us based
health and wellness practices.
Dr Eric Bloom (33:23):
So that's interesting yeah, and it's kind
of interesting because we get alot of canadians that come down
here too, and so we get a lot ofamericans like, oh, I would
love to be in canada.
They're like, I come down herefor us because the system up
there limits what I can do Right.
So I think the the guidingsolution and answer is all of
healthcare is probably not thegreatest.
It could be, whether it's, youknow, nationally funded,
(33:46):
privately funded, a combinationlike we've got to figure out a
way to get back to what's thepremise of what healthcare is
about.
And we all know in healthcare Imean it's one of the largest
business industries, you knowfor each economic source in each
country like it's a humongousrevenue generator but we didn't
go into it for just that right.
Like obviously we wanna make agood living, but we're here to
(34:08):
treat patients and so how do wenot let a system govern what we
do for somebody?
But knowing that right nowwe've got to kind of play in the
system, that we have to be ableto still make a living to get
quality for a patient, and Ithink that's why you're seeing,
you know, even retention of justproviders is dropping all the
time.
I mean, I forget what the statsare, but man, the number of
(34:30):
like pt specifically that I knowthat basically get out of the
profession every year is, Idon't think, at a point where
we're having that same comebackas new providers.
So I think our total number iseither very steady over each
year or even starting to drop alittle bit below that, because
people are just getting burntout a little bit or they don't
look at alternative options.
And so I mean, entrepreneurs arevery different.
(34:51):
You have a different mindset ofwhat you want to do, and we
know that nothing is ever easy,so you always have to encounter
roadblocks and so it's alwayslike, well, how can we change
that?
And if you don't have anentrepreneurial mindset and
you're just a provider which isgreat, because we need those but
you're starting to see thatthis isn't, it's not working for
me, like why would I do allthis work?
And it's just just, you know,making my quality of life worse.
(35:13):
And I think we're seeing peoplechange the industry.
I know in my class of school,like I already know, a ton of
people that have gotten out ofthe field the last five or ten
years.
You know they didn't last long,so that's not a good trend for
health care and you put all thetime and effort and knowledge
into it and you know people areleaving.
Then this kind of waters downthe quality of medicine that
we're providing.
So there's got to be a betterway to do it from both a private
(35:34):
and a kind of federal nationallevel too.
But not sure what that is, buthopefully someday we'll get
there.
Dr Andrew Greenland (35:40):
Brilliant.
Eric, thank you so much foryour time this afternoon.
It's been such an insightfulconversation.
I'm sure there's lots oflearnings here that will
resonate with our audience, soreally do appreciate you giving
up your time for this session.
Thank you so much appreciate it.
Dr Eric Bloom (35:52):
Yeah Well, thank you, dr Greenland, and we'll
keep in contact and you keeppushing along with what you're
doing, like the only way we makechanges is someone steps out
and tries to make the change, soI appreciate your time with
getting me on here.
Thank you, all right, take care, have a good one.
Okay, so welcome back to Voices in Health
and Wellness.
This is the podcast where weexplore what's shaping the
future of care, from inside theclinic to the heart of the
community.
I'm your host, dr AndrewGreenland, and today's guest
brings a rare blend of clinicalinsight and entrepreneurial
energy to the table.
Joining me today is Dr EricBloom, doctor of Physical
Therapy, board CertifiedOrthopaedic Clinical Specialist
(00:27):
and founder of Bloom Performanceand Rehab.
Eric has built something uniquea fast-growing practice that's
not only redefining patient carein Arizona, but also extending
its impact through corporatewellness partnerships across the
US.
At the intersection of rehabperformance and preventative
care, eric is helping to bridgethe often-missing link between
clinical outcomes and everydaywellness.
(00:48):
So in today's episode, we'lldive into how he's scaling his
vision and why integration, notspecialization, is the future of
medicine.
So, eric, thank you very muchfor joining us on the show
Thanks for having me, Dr Lee.
Dr Eric Bloom (01:00):
I appreciate being here.
Dr Andrew Greenland (01:01):
Thank you Really appreciate your time, so
could you maybe talk throughwhat your role looks like at
Bloom Performance and Rehab?
Just to kick us off.
Dr Eric Bloom (01:08):
Yeah, so I started this probably about
eight years ago.
So I've been out in practice 16years.
So I wanted to figure out.
I saw the trend early on in mycareer with just the way
medicine was going and I thinkthis is not just here in the
States, but you know, care isgetting a little bit diminished
for whatever reason, whetherit's revenue is the, the prime
(01:31):
driver or some other you knowcomponent of it.
So I want to kind of find a wayto try to bridge the gap
between still providing qualitycare but having a sustainable,
successful business.
So I'm eight years in and beenthrough quite a unique dynamic
with you know kovat and someother avenues that as business
owners, you know we run intoroadblocks and other problems
(01:54):
that we can't expect, so kind ofalways it's up and down with it
.
So I was knowing, as time wasgoing on, I've always wanted to
have an integrated practice atsome point.
So I was able back in 2019 topurchase my own suite that I
work in right now to be able tointegrate other forms of you
know health care providers,whatever it might be.
(02:15):
So for a little while prior toCOVID, I had an anesthesiologist
that was in here doing somework with me, so he was a friend
of mine and kind of got tiredof, you know, just doing
specific surgical work.
So we wanted to integrate someclinical work.
So we were working together totry to find a more efficient,
effective way to address patientproblems in office from a you
(02:36):
know, management of truly themedical side, along with, like,
the physical therapy side, toexpedite that process, give
patients, you know, care thatthey typically wouldn't get as
efficiently and quickly and finda way to alter that.
And so that kind of started thewhole process with it.
And then back in 2022, early 23,I'm a founder, one of the
co-founders, of Unwind Wellness,which basically is bringing
(02:58):
non-traditional modalities likered light therapy, exogen with
oxygen, pemf, things like that,to figure out how those, from a
science standpoint, can beintegrated into a practice to
provide alternative measuresbesides just medicine.
So my big premise was medicine,wellness it's all on the same
spectrum.
(03:19):
It depends on where thatpatient is.
If somebody's sick, injured,hurt, have surgery, they're more
medical driven.
Someone's passed that processand now they're recovering Well,
their medical care doesn't stopand now becomes wellness.
So we wanted to find a way tomake it medically driven from a
wellness side versus you know,some of these just random
(03:39):
wellness facilities that pop upand may not have a medical
component to it and figure outwhere along that spectrum is a
patient and how do we keep themin that spectrum and more on the
healthy wellness side versushaving to resort back to the
medical injured side.
Because we see that all thetime, right, people get better,
they're done well.
We don't do much to sustainthat and keep them from getting
back um, whether or not hurt orinjured.
(04:01):
So I wanted to find a way tohave them continue to be in my
practice but not always treatthem on the medical injured hurt
side, and so that's kind of howwe integrated a wellness
component and it's still in theearly stages but we're seeing
some pretty cool changes andbenefits for people.
Dr Andrew Greenland (04:17):
Amazing.
I think you mentioned in ouremail conversation that you were
blending clinical and corporatewellness.
Is that right and are you can?
Dr Eric Bloom (04:25):
you tell?
how you structure that from thekind of the corporate side yeah,
that's kind of dependent on theindividual kind of corporate
component.
So, um, one of my co-foundershere has kind of been more in
the business corporate world andso he was at a huge company
around here and, interestinglyenough, their companies, one of
their biggest focuses, wasadding wellness services to
(04:45):
their employees.
Because they're starting tofigure out helps with retention,
helps reduce costs, things likethat which most maybe companies
don't focus on as much.
So we wanted to find a way well, how can we integrate
data-driven, research-basedmodalities to help that?
So we recently just wereinvolved with one of our local
hospitals in a fairly well-knowninstitution in dignity health
(05:07):
care out here with one of thehospitals that's two miles down
the road, in their nurses weekand providers week the last
couple of weeks.
So we opened up doors for them.
Free services, just kind oftreat them on.
Hey, listen to wellness aspectsof it, how it impacts you as a
provider, what can you do foryou, how can we integrate care
for you as well?
And so that's kind of a slowstart of the corporate wellness
(05:27):
that we're adding.
And then as time goes on and wefigure out what the needs of
each corporate partner might be.
What are they looking for Oneof the partners we've been
looking at.
They do like BMI testing, oldschool testing, body weight
nothing that's really thataccurate.
And so we've got like a 3D bodyscanner that we've been using
for a while, and so now it givesus more data, and so our whole
(05:48):
premise of everything we do iswe don't know where you're going
to go if we don't know whereyou're starting from, and so we
try to get as much baseline dataas we can to figure out, when
we're doing some of thesenon-traditional modalities,
where are we seeing changes downthe road, and not just, you
know, external changes.
So we've also been trying tofind, you know, companies to do
(06:08):
different blood work ordifferent biometric testing,
things like that that we'reslowly getting into, because
then we can actually show thatnot only are you looking better,
maybe externally, you'refeeling better, we're actually
seeing those changes internallyin your body as well.
So it's not just an appearance,look, it's kind of a total
package that somebody'simproving on got it.
Dr Andrew Greenland (06:26):
Do you have any particular kinds of clients
or companies that you'reworking with on the wellness
side, and is there a particularkind of companies that are more
on the uptake for this kind ofapproach?
Dr Eric Bloom (06:36):
So I think getting in the in the healthcare
system I mean you and I bothknow as providers I think
sometimes we prioritize ourhealth maybe less than you know
some of the patients, becauseour whole role and I see it in
the community you know I go outand you know people talk about
like oh hey, I see one of myhealthcare people like we always
run into patients with it andthen if I take time off, you
know they're like hey where wereyou?
(06:57):
I'm like well, I had a doctor'sappointment or had to take care
of my own stuff.
You know and I think sometimesit's a misconception that you
know healthcare workers don'tneed any health care themselves,
you know, and so I think that'sone big trend that we're seeing
is a lot of these hospitals orcompanies are trying to figure
out how to provide treatments orwellness modalities to their
(07:18):
own healthcare providers, sothat we don't forget about them,
because I think we're.
It's a very common thing thatgets left behind is how do we
take care of ourselves when ourprimary goal is to take care of
others, and it's just somethingthat's harder to trend, and I
think companies that value thatwe're starting to see better
retention rates.
They're noticing that, you know,there may be less resources
(07:38):
spent for time off and having tofind coverage and things like
that, and so we also looklocally right now on companies
that value wellness, and sowe're trying to find companies
that have wellness programs orthat are looking to add wellness
programs.
So we know that there's atleast interest from them, and
maybe they don't know how tointegrate it or implement it
into their own business, but wedo, and our goal is to figure
(08:01):
out okay, what are your needs,how can we work together?
And so we goal is to figure outokay, what are your needs, how
can we work together?
And so we're trying to figureout how to have the baseline
information and productsavailable for them, and so we
just partner with them so theydon't have to figure out how to
do it on their own.
That's where our job is cominginto play, is we're trying to
integrate that into the wellnessaspect for them so they don't
have to do it because that's nottheir primary role.
So if you're, you know, anengineering company or a tech
(08:34):
company, you're likely not goingto have.
You know, you may have awellness person on staff or
something like that, but you'renot going to probably have as
much experience that we mighthave integrating this, you know,
for several years.
And so we're just trying tofind people that have an
interest of adding this to theirbusiness to hopefully, you know
, keep their employees healthier, happier and just enjoy where
they go to work every dayBrilliant.
Dr Andrew Greenland (08:46):
What major shifts are you seeing in rehab
and wellness space right now,and especially in your local
area in the Arizona market?
Dr Eric Bloom (08:54):
So the big change is a lot of, you know, smaller
companies like myself, you know,especially the last five years,
have kind of gone to a biggercorporate realm and so within
the last year or so there's beenseveral different single owners
like myself that have kind ofcome together and we've kind of
created our own little mininetwork where we kind of have
(09:15):
like a sister company.
Now that we've created thatoversees all of us just to help
expedite with some of the backend things, as it's harder to
run all your own billing, allyour own HR, all of that stuff.
So instead of having to go to atrue corporate field, we can
still run and own our businesseslike we've created with it.
But it's taking some of thatback end burden off of our hands
and so that's a big thing thatwe've been trying to add.
(09:36):
And so with that kind ofpartnership and merger we've got
a like a physician assistantthat comes in, and so she comes
in once a week, and so she comesin once a week and so if we
need something medical we don'thave to worry about referring
out to somebody else, waitingfor that time frame and
referring potentially to anorthopedic specialist.
So we're trying to integrateeven more than just the wellness
side.
(09:57):
Like how can we add a truemedical side as needed, quicker
and efficiently?
Like in my clinic, in all ofour locations we do diagnostic
ultrasound.
So you know there's a lot ofeffectiveness with that with
certain conditions.
So if somebody walks in, we'renot waiting, you know, weeks
sometimes for a high cost MRI.
If it's not necessary we canget a baseline, look then
(10:19):
determine kind of what route togo.
So we're just trying to makethings more efficient and
effective, and arizona is one ofthe.
I guess you can kind of stayleader with what's being done in
the pt world.
So a year ago they've given allkind of physical therapists the
right to order any imaging asneeded as well, and so we can do
simple x-rays.
There's even a potential thatwe're trying to figure out how
(10:39):
to use it like simple blood workif we need that for a patient.
Um, things that we can do.
So we're trying to figure outone what's our scope of care?
What works for us?
How do we integrate with amedical provider as needed, like
where do we find that limit ofwhat's appropriate for us?
But also efficiently with thepatient?
And having somebody in herethat's kind of a sports med,
non-op trained person allows usto bounce ideas off them, work
(11:01):
together together and we'reseeing massive changes.
So, like an example is I had alady that came in here.
She went to go get an MRI, tookher three or four weeks to get
in there.
She shows up and they canceledit on her because it said oh,
your insurance requiredsomething that they told they
didn't right.
So by the time we actually hadher come in here to take a look,
she literally was almost donewith care by the time.
Somebody else needs to getanother image, and so people are
(11:24):
getting treated.
They're getting what they needquicker and faster and more
efficiently, and so we'retrained to understand.
Is it appropriate for, you know, pt?
Is it appropriate for areferral?
Where are we at?
And so we're trying to minimize, you know, an immediate
referral to a surgeon ifunnecessary, because for them
they're getting overwhelmed too.
I mean, there's so many patientsin arizona that's growing.
(11:46):
We know there's a massive needfor health care providers.
So if we can kind of ease someof the burden for the I want to
say, less important but not asspecific surgical cases, a lot
of doctors are liking it.
So then they know when we referto them they've kind of passed
all of those non-op things thatare, hey, these are not working,
or here's what they've done,and it's expediting that process
for them as well too.
(12:06):
So we're seeing kind of aseamless transition, which often
you don't get in many states orwho knows around
internationally as well how thatworks.
But we're seeing a huge changewith integration and really
patients are loving it.
Dr Andrew Greenland (12:18):
Amazing, would you say.
Companies are becoming moreopen to preventative and
wellness focused care.
I think, by the previous thingyou were saying in conversation,
you've had some health careproviders which are wanting to
do things for their staff, whichis great because obviously
medical professionals need it.
Or is it an uphill climb?
Dr Eric Bloom (12:35):
in general, I think it's still an uphill climb
to an extent because they'relarger companies, but there's a
lot more people that arechanging for it and I think
generationally things justchange.
You know, I think Whoa, lightshit off here.
I think it's kind of agenerational change.
So some of the younger, youknow generations, I think, have
(12:57):
more things that they'reinterested when they come out of
school as a job than maybe whatI did 15 years ago, than maybe
what somebody did 30 years ago,just because there's new
technology and things availablethat we didn't have.
So we're having to adapt to themarket, the technology, to what
that generation wants and Ithink for them they want a job
that feels like they can beintegrated, stay there kind of,
(13:20):
have a lot of their needs metand you know, sometimes it's not
easy to meet all of those.
But we're seeing a health andwellness program is a big thing.
So I've been on forums andlooking at different research
things and they're finding outthat you know a lot of people
want health and wellness and sowe can talk to, you know,
different companies or you knowwe're even trying to integrate
what we call kind of a strategicpartnership with other medical
(13:44):
practices that want to add this.
Like they're finding thatretention rates are better,
employees are maybe wanting togo work there because now they
have access to something thatnormally they might have to pay
on their own to go elsewhere.
Well, now it's actually intheir own office, so it's still
an uphill climb.
I'm big on looking at theliterature and researching
everything, and so we alwaysknow that the research says one
thing, but to get into clinicalpractice it takes some time.
(14:06):
So, but someone's got to try tokind of grind away and get that
change done, because if not, ifno one's willing to push
through, and you know we getstagnant or we know it's going
to go in the opposite direction.
Dr Andrew Greenland (14:18):
Got it.
So, with the changes in theindustry, how are you
positioning yourself at Bloom tostay ahead of things and sort
of be market leader, bloom?
Dr Eric Bloom (14:25):
Johnson.
So I think the big thing isreally that integration and
pushing like the wellness aspect.
So just looking around andknowing the market like it's
very unknown to a lot of people,you know, and we're finding out
that as patients are coming inthey're looking for some of this
stuff and not knowing where togo.
(14:45):
So if we offer this, knowingthey're already looking for it,
for us it makes sense.
Then why do we need topotentially refer them elsewhere
?
So it's great from kind of atwofold standpoint.
Patients want it.
I mean it could be good for akind of a secondary revenue
generation, because if they'retrusting what we're doing on one
aspect of it, then why can't wefind a way to integrate
something else that patients arealready looking for, that we
(15:08):
know they're going to gosomewhere else too.
But now if they know they trustwhat we're doing medically, why
would they not trust us on adifferent avenue with it?
And so it's trying to educate,inform, teach people that.
But I think if we're not makinga change and pushing forward, I
mean I think we're going to seea big decline, especially with
some control from insurance,reimbursement, things like that
that we can't control.
So we've got to be able tocontrol the things that we can,
(15:30):
and some of those are differentbusiness models, different
approaches, modalities,techniques, things like that to
continue to increase revenue butalso provide quality care and
services that patients are goingto be looking for to help in
their healing process, got it.
Dr Andrew Greenland (15:48):
So what's working well for you at Bloom
right now in terms of all yourinitiatives and the things that
you do and some of these thingsyou've mentioned, but what's
particularly working well foryou as a business?
Dr Eric Bloom (15:57):
You know, I think the things that are really
working the best are workingwith you know either those other
, you know doctors, physicians,surgeons, that understand what
we have to offer and so we'vegot people that come directly to
us that'll be like hey, go tothis pt place because we know
they offer wellness modalitiesas well.
That, I think, would be good foryou.
So we're starting to see asmall little trend of you know,
(16:20):
not even just physicaltherapists but other health care
providers that are starting toknow more about this stuff,
because it's not reallytraditional medicine by any
standards.
And the thing that people don'trealize, like a lot of this
stuff has been around since the70s and 80s.
I mean, nasa was kind of thefirst one to experiment with
some of the, you know, pemf andsome of the red light, and then
they use it for kind of otherreasons and they slowly kind of
integrated it.
(16:40):
There's more research on whatit did at the cellular level,
things like that.
So for me it's always been amedical component, but it's just
never been well known.
So if we're now able to figureout how to work with other
providers that know the benefitsof it, now when a patient comes
, I think their expectation is,hey, I'm not just going to get
(17:01):
pt, or like what they think isthe basic care, they're getting
additional things that a lot ofother places don't offer,
because both their provider andthen coming to see us, our goal
was trying to be as efficientand effective in your care, and
so here's how we're integratingthese together.
So, and as time goes on, tryingto find more and more people
that understand about it, and Ithink it's with anything that's
new out there, you're alwaysgonna have some of those early
(17:22):
adopters that want it, peoplethat are hesitant and say no,
and then that middle populationthat wants to learn more, and so
we're really trying to workwith those providers that
understand the benefit of it,that maybe they've used it, and
I think what we're finding is,you know, even kind of like
yourself with whether you're anon-traditional medical writer,
whether you're a naturopath,functional medicine doctor, even
(17:44):
chiropractic care, things likethat that we would consider
non-traditional.
We're typically more open tosome of those changes and ideas
because they're already usingsome of that, and so that's kind
of where we're seeing thatbenefit, and so I think there's
always been too much of a clashbetween providers.
Like I always tell all mypatients I'm like, if you're
going somewhere and you'regetting the benefit that you
need, I'm never going to tellyou to stop doing something.
(18:04):
Let's find a way to workcollectively together and find,
maybe something that's beingmissed.
Instead of being like, well, no, that's not being done the
right way, like, how can we addto your care and not feel like
you're starting over and so I?
That's a big push that I do.
I think a lot of people getturned off and they say like,
well, I told me that you'regetting benefit from them, so
why am I going to tell you notto go?
Let's find a way to add thingsthat are being that you aren't
(18:27):
currently getting with differentthings that we can offer, and
then see how, collectively, thattreatment together is going to
improve your care.
And so we're starting to noticemore and more of those
providers that you know are morecollaborative.
Instead of, you know, feelinglike we're, um, you know, two
different businesses fightingfor the same patients, we're
seeing that, hey, we canactually work together and be
successful and not push againsteach other interesting and, on
(18:52):
the flip side, what's been sortof frustrating or slower than
expected as you sort of grow andtake your business forward
number one thing.
Like anything, patients don'treally fully understand a lot of
the new additions and we kindof get stuck in our old ways.
And you know there's still somethat's like, well, let me see
if I can, you know, do moreresearch or figure it out, or
(19:13):
I've never heard of it, so Idon't know about it, and you
know that that's kind of achallenge.
And then you get some peoplewho are like, well, I don't know
about it.
However, you know, I trust whatyou've done for me, so if
you're bringing something in,I'm willing to learn more about
it.
So I think it's it's always aunique challenge because I think
patients are always hesitant.
And I mean the reality is, Ithink to some extent we've all
(19:34):
probably been burned a littlebit by something in the
healthcare community, whetherit's a provider, you know an
insurance bill or somethingwhere it's like you show up and
it gets canceled, like I thinkthere's just that natural
hesitation at times, and so Ithink they're they're they're
kind of that fear drivencomponent of well, I need to
make sure I'm fully ready tounderstand what this new part is
(19:56):
, because in the past it hasn'tworked well for me and so I see
a very kind of unique, complexpatient population myself here,
where that is definitely what'shappened.
They feel like they've gottenburned by the community, the you
know different medicalproviders, maybe even from like
medications, because they havereactions to it and they're told
well, this is the only thingthat can help and so they're not
(20:17):
sure where to go.
So anything that's new to themit's kind of an immediate like
hesitation that kicks in becausethey're like well, here we go
again.
This is the same thing I'vedone before.
So it's trying to be honest andopen with people and say, hey,
here's the information, here'smore information, we do research
on it, like this is where it'sat like and just just exposing
people to the reality of this.
(20:38):
There's a lot of falseinformation that's out there.
They may hear one thing fromsomebody but don't completely
understand the story and it'slike well, that's, that's not
the normal.
You know that's, that'sprobably a bad story or
something that you didn't hurtcorrectly.
But you know how do we getpatients to understand and what
I tell them?
I said my goal is for you notto come back and see me on the
medical side, if we're addingthis, my goal is for you to stay
(20:59):
healthy and to continue, maybeunder my care, on a different
realm, so we don't have to treatyou to get you back to baseline
.
Why can't we keep you frombaseline and beyond?
I don't want to just get youback to your baseline levels.
And so, as they start tounderstand that, more we give
them more information about it,I think they're starting to
realize, you know, beingproactive is really the best way
(21:20):
, instead of being reactive inmedicine, which is mostly what
we do we don't focus on keepingpeople healthy.
We focus on keeping or gettingsomeone sick to get them back to
being.
You know that baseline health.
So how can we be proactive?
And there's some people thatare interested, but I think
there's just naturally ahesitation from patients.
Dr Andrew Greenland (21:38):
Are there any particular modalities that
patients are more skeptical overthan others?
Dr Eric Bloom (21:48):
more skeptical over than others.
So I think right now the andhere the pemf right, that's not
as known um, like ewot.
The ewt is similar to like ahyperbaric chamber, so they've
kind of heard of that.
Red light, I think is the morewell-known thing.
I mean, you know a lot of likedermatology places have been
using.
I tell people like, well, thinkabout blue light.
You see, they probably don'trealize it, but I'm like.
Your dentist has been using thatfor you for years different
lightweight spectrum differentprocess, but lights being used
(22:10):
all over the place.
You may just not realize it.
So that's more known.
I think it's more of like theflashy modality, but, um, I
think pemf was just notunderstanding and like they're
thinking magnets and electriclike do what?
How is that going to work?
And so that, ironically, isprobably the one that got the
most medical value more thananything with it.
So that's the one.
(22:31):
I think that's a little bit ofa harder push initially until
they use it, they see it, tounderstand the changes to it.
The other ones are a little bitmore known, I guess, and uh,
whether it's online or byfriends that have done something
to it or they least have heardabout it where the pmf is kind
of the more unknown one.
Dr Andrew Greenland (22:47):
But I think honestly probably has some of
the most advantageous benefitsfor people if you understand how
to use it correctly um, isthere any particular metrics or
kpis that you focus on in yourbusiness, the ones that are most
important to you, and oranything that you're
particularly focused on tryingto improve?
Dr Eric Bloom (23:06):
Yeah, I think the big one is trying to figure out
.
You know, retention is always,is always, key for me.
I think there's, and I'vetalked with other business
owners and everybody alwayswants new patients and I'm like
I that's not really my focus.
My focus is to retain the goodones that we have.
So if you're always trying toget a new patient, it feels like
(23:26):
you're trying to start fromground zero all the time.
We're now being in business longenough, like a lot of my I
guess you would call like newcases that come into my office
are old patients because theyknow where we're at and so
that's an easier not sell inmedicine.
But their expectation isalready understanding like, hey,
I know you've helped me before,this is something new, I don't
(23:47):
have to try to.
You know, hey, here's what wedo in pt, here's how our company
works, here's what our plan islike.
They already know that thatworks and so we also try to look
at you know how many peoplecome to us from past or former
patients.
Same thing like withexpectations.
Their expectation is probablyalready going to be that, hey,
they may get some help herebecause they know somebody
(24:09):
that's already been here.
Where, if you just findsomebody new, random online that
just finds your office doesn'tknow anything about you.
It's like you're starting, likeI said, from like day one all
over again and now you've got togain that trust and
understanding where, if you cankeep a variety of people that
have been through here, thathave been shared with others,
you know.
That's why you know personaltestimony or referrals from past
(24:32):
and current patients are alwayseasier typically to work with
because their expectation is,hey, I know I'm likely going to
get better here, whether, evenif they don't think about it or
not, because they know somethingthat's been through here.
Where the harder ones are, youknow I have been to PT several
times, or other medicalproviders.
I never got much relief.
I know that they're already inthat guarded state which
(24:55):
interesting with my backgroundfrom a neuroscience standpoint
we know that that increasestheir pain response.
So I'm already dealing withsomebody that's in a heightened
state coming in to see me on dayone because they've already
been built by the system.
So that's a much harder changeversus somebody coming in
expecting like, hey, I know I'mgoing to get better because I've
been here, or my friend orwhoever was got better.
(25:16):
So that's what I'm anticipatingwhen I walk in the door.
Dr Andrew Greenland (25:20):
Interesting .
So you mentioned retention.
So have you got any sort of keyinsights about the things that
lead to good retention andthings where you find is
probably a cause for them todrop?
Dr Eric Bloom (25:31):
I think benefits of showing up right.
I think value is the biggestthing and I think you know value
is kind of a word, but thevalue is going to be like what
are you here for?
Like, what are you trying toachieve?
And so if your goal is like,hey, here's, I want to get out
of this, I try to be asrealistic with them on day one,
like somebody's trying to comein with a major injury and their
goal is to go back and run.
(25:52):
You know, a marathon everymonth, like, okay, it may not be
realistic.
However, let's figure out whatis realistic to get you back to
that.
Where do we kind of find acommon ground?
So I think the retention isreally tied to realistic
expectations, both from theprovider and from the patient.
So we've had, like, a currentpatient that's come here and she
(26:13):
told us she left another officebecause she's like oh, I'll get
you back, you know full runningin two weeks.
And she's like, well, based offwhat I've looked up online,
she's like that just doesn'tmatch up, and so she was already
hesitant because what she foundonline as a patient didn't seem
to match up with what was beingsaid in clinic.
And so I think, realisticexpectations.
(26:34):
I always tell people some of thegreatest things I can tell you
is I don't know, but I canprobably find out.
So I think we try to solve allthe problems for everybody or
think we know all the answers,and that's probably the greatest
answer I can tell somebody or Idon't, but I know somebody that
does.
Or hey, here's what we need todo first, before you come back,
because then they feel likethey're getting the care they
need and not just trying to bekept as a patient for purely a
(26:58):
business model.
And so that's something that Idefinitely found is people
having the trust which, honestly, has been lost a lot in
healthcare, because they feellike a lot of times they're just
a number versus an actualpatient in a problem.
So I think retention is reallytied to trust and realistic
expectations on both patient andprovider interesting, so fast
(27:19):
forwarding, sort of six totwelve months.
Dr Andrew Greenland (27:21):
What would you let?
Where would you like to seebloom go in the next six to
twelve months?
Dr Eric Bloom (27:25):
my ultimate goal is I'd like to be a little bit
less in clinic and do more froma teaching standpoint.
So I'm also clinical facultyfor tufts university and their
PT program down here, so Iactually get ready to go teach
here in a few weeks, and so Ithink the biggest thing, the
reason why I like to teach, isthere's a lost integration, I
think, between academia andresearch and clinical, and so at
(27:50):
least here in the States that'skind of the big trifecta of
what we're doing as far as likethe big three with it.
How do you integrate researchwith, you know, patient
preference, the clinical side,academia, and I think there's a
disconnect.
So like I've got a student hereright now that's from Tufts that
I taught and he's quicklylearning that, wow, like there's
(28:13):
a little bit of a differencebetween what we're we're taught
in school versus what the clinicis like, and so when I try to
teach, I want to be able to berealistic with students that,
hey, this is the baseline infoyou got to understand how to
work this, but now let's teachyou how to clinically reason and
have rational for what we'redoing and why we're doing it in
the clinic.
And so I would love to be ableto have a clinic that's
continuing to grow without mebeing the primary provider, and
(28:36):
be able to educate and teachsome of the younger up and
coming clinicians on how do yousustain and run a business like
this in a world that's everchanging.
How do you integrate a medicalmodel that we have with a
wellness model?
How do you actually take, youknow, what you learn in school
into the clinic?
And I think that's a lost artlost art not just in PT, but I
think that's for every studentthat comes in.
(28:56):
I know that's how I was.
You know I had.
I went to Duke University forPT school and I feel like I had
a great training, but there'sonly so much that you can do at
school before you get into theclinic, and so just trying to
figure out.
How do you integrate thatbetter?
Um, so, as a patient or theprovider starts early in his
career, they're not feeling likethey're on an island and
(29:16):
they're like, wow, man, this isway different than I taught in
school.
So when I try to teach, I teachthem you know what we need to
do clinically for the academicsession, but it's like, okay,
now how do we actually integratethis to real life practice and
use this on a patient?
That's where they seem to startto get a better understanding
of that, because they're nowreasoning versus just picking a
technique and using it I'm bigon education as well, so I've
(29:40):
got some academic roles at theuniversity.
Dr Andrew Greenland (29:42):
So I'm completely aligned with you in
education, especially when youwant to kind of spread your word
about how you do things and togive a different approach.
But I suppose the question ishow you're going to release
yourself from your business todo so I've I've already started
a little bit so with kind ofsome of this partnership.
Dr Eric Bloom (29:58):
It's giving me the ability to not have to work
as much behind the scenes and sothey can take care of the
things that I was putting oddhours into.
And, you know, something simpleis just like HR and hiring some
of that.
So part of why I did it is oneit allows us to have a more
integrated practice that Icouldn't really do fully on my
own, gave me the ability to openup and do more, and so now I
(30:20):
can really push the wellnessside.
You can kind of push theteaching side, like things that
I feel like.
For me, when things started toget become a better provider and
understand the whole system,all of these things were
integrated like you need tounderstand what you got to do in
academia.
But then what does the researchsay that supports that?
But then how do you take thoseto integrate it with the clients
?
Okay, now the clients there,the patients there, now they're
(30:42):
at a point where they're back towhere they want to go.
Well then, how do we integratea wellness program to keep them
healthy, right?
So I feel like we get taught inlittle blocks of certain things
.
So this is the medical side.
You know this is the academicside.
Here's this side.
Well, how do we fully integratethat so that the spectrum of
care for a patient, from theirkind of starting point to their
(31:03):
ending point, is more consistent?
And so the only way to do thatis someone that's willing to
kind of take that chance and tryand integrate it and hopefully
see it works and have morepeople wanting to do it.
Dr Andrew Greenland (31:19):
If you could remove one roadblock
overnight, or challenge or athing which is limiting what you
do, what do you think thatwould be?
Dr Eric Bloom (31:24):
I'm mostly in the insurance world out here, and
so this is one of my immediatechanges I wish every clinic,
every hospital could take everyinsurance right, everybody,
regardless of where you at, gotreimbursed the same, because
then you're now at a standardwhere care drives the quality,
(31:44):
not the other way around.
So like if I, if a patient knew, like hey, if I go anywhere,
like I'm going to have to paythe same Providers know I'm
going to have to make the sameright Now.
Like well, I only have oneoption, well, that's your only
option with it.
Like it makes it harder for it.
So if we can make everything ona level playing field, then I
think you're gonna see adifference where quality is
(32:05):
gonna have to eventually come tothe top with it, because the
patients know well, like, hey,if I go somewhere else and
everything's on a level playingfield, I'm gonna go get what I
want to do.
And I think we've heldourselves less accountable over
time as providers and it's notas simple as just you know that
aspect, but because there'sobviously a lot to do with
patients and their mindsets andwhat they have to do.
(32:25):
But I think if you just make itas simple as you can, where
competition will speak foritself which is a good thing
where it should boost thequality of everybody that's
being done, because if you'renot really putting in quality to
your patients but you'regetting paid 25 more than what I
am for the same contract andI'm having to do, more work just
(32:46):
to make up that difference,like, for some reason there's a
level of you know, fairness thatI think it's thrown out the
door with it.
So if we make everything acrossthe field reimburse the same,
pay the same, no regards withany of that then it's thrown out
the door with it.
So if we make everything acrossthe field reimbursed the same,
paid the same, no regard withany of that then it's going to
really make those people thatare higher quality stand out and
patients will know that becausethere's not going to be any
difference for them or for usGot it.
Dr Andrew Greenland (33:05):
I think I've spoken to quite a few
people in the US and I thinkeverybody has mentioned the
whole insurance reimbursementthing as one of their roadblocks
.
And we don't have in the uk inthe same way.
We have a sort ofgovernment-funded health system,
but it seems to be a universalissue with all the us based
health and wellness practices.
Dr Eric Bloom (33:23):
So that's interesting yeah, and it's kind
of interesting because we get alot of canadians that come down
here too, and so we get a lot ofamericans like, oh, I would
love to be in canada.
They're like, I come down herefor us because the system up
there limits what I can do Right.
So I think the the guidingsolution and answer is all of
healthcare is probably not thegreatest.
It could be, whether it's, youknow, nationally funded,
(33:46):
privately funded, a combinationlike we've got to figure out a
way to get back to what's thepremise of what healthcare is
about.
And we all know in healthcare Imean it's one of the largest
business industries, you knowfor each economic source in each
country like it's a humongousrevenue generator but we didn't
go into it for just that right.
Like obviously we wanna make agood living, but we're here to
(34:08):
treat patients and so how do wenot let a system govern what we
do for somebody?
But knowing that right nowwe've got to kind of play in the
system, that we have to be ableto still make a living to get
quality for a patient, and Ithink that's why you're seeing,
you know, even retention of justproviders is dropping all the
time.
I mean, I forget what the statsare, but man, the number of
(34:30):
like pt specifically that I knowthat basically get out of the
profession every year is, Idon't think, at a point where
we're having that same comebackas new providers.
So I think our total number iseither very steady over each
year or even starting to drop alittle bit below that, because
people are just getting burntout a little bit or they don't
look at alternative options.
And so I mean, entrepreneurs arevery different.
(34:51):
You have a different mindset ofwhat you want to do, and we
know that nothing is ever easy,so you always have to encounter
roadblocks and so it's alwayslike, well, how can we change
that?
And if you don't have anentrepreneurial mindset and
you're just a provider which isgreat, because we need those but
you're starting to see thatthis isn't, it's not working for
me, like why would I do allthis work?
And it's just just, you know,making my quality of life worse.
(35:13):
And I think we're seeing peoplechange the industry.
I know in my class of school,like I already know, a ton of
people that have gotten out ofthe field the last five or ten
years.
You know they didn't last long,so that's not a good trend for
health care and you put all thetime and effort and knowledge
into it and you know people areleaving.
Then this kind of waters downthe quality of medicine that
we're providing.
So there's got to be a betterway to do it from both a private
(35:34):
and a kind of federal nationallevel too.
But not sure what that is, buthopefully someday we'll get
there.
Dr Andrew Greenland (35:40):
Brilliant.
Eric, thank you so much foryour time this afternoon.
It's been such an insightfulconversation.
I'm sure there's lots oflearnings here that will
resonate with our audience, soreally do appreciate you giving
up your time for this session.
Thank you so much appreciate it.
Dr Eric Bloom (35:52):
Yeah Well, thank you, dr Greenland, and we'll
keep in contact and you keeppushing along with what you're
doing, like the only way we makechanges is someone steps out
and tries to make the change, soI appreciate your time with
getting me on here.
Thank you, all right, take care, have a good one.
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