April 1, 2025 • 40 mins
The journey through life rarely follows neat categories of "all good" or "all bad" seasons - most of us walk through both valleys and victories simultaneously. In this vulnerable and wisdom-filled conversation, author Jennifer Mango shares her personal experience navigating these complex terrains with faith and resilience.
Jennifer opens up about current victories in her life - thriving adult children and certain areas of success - while simultaneously facing valleys of her husband's job loss, business challenges, and the economic uncertainties we all face. But rather than seeing this duality as confusing or unfair, she reveals how God teaches different lessons through recurring challenges.
"What happens is we go through something, we want to check off the list that it's done, and the minute it comes back in a different form, we get mad at God," Jennifer explains. Instead, she encourages listeners to turn their eyes toward God in these recurring struggles, understanding that each time we face similar situations, He's developing new wisdom within us.
Through captivating personal stories - from a teenage experience where God's protection came through an unexpected circumstance to finding a mysterious gift hidden in their Christmas tree during financial hardship - Jennifer illustrates how God shows up in both ordinary and extraordinary ways.
Whether you're currently walking through valleys, celebrating victories, or experiencing both simultaneously, this conversation offers profound encouragement about God's presence in every season. As Jennifer beautifully puts it: "If you start looking for Him, He will show up." Share this episode with someone who needs to hear that God sees them completely - both their struggles and their joys.
Get Jennifer's Book: https://a.co/d/5DPLp11
Join our fb community group and meet your hosts: https://www.facebook.com/share/g/1BQ6qhcd3A/?mibextid=wwXIfr
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Gianina (00:00):
I'm so excited for today's conversation because
we're diving into something thatI think we all experience,
walking through both valleys andvictories at the same time and
I couldn't think of a betterperson to have this conversation
with than my sweet friend,Jennifer Mango.
Jennifer is someone who knowsfirsthand what it means to trust
God through the highs and lows.
(00:20):
She's walked through deepvalleys, but she's also seen
God's faithfulness in incredibleways.
She's an author, and her bookRescued Heart is such a powerful
testimony of what God can dowhen we surrender our brokenness
to Him.
Jennifer, I'm so happy you'rehere.
Thank you, I'm excited to behere, so let's just start here.
Kiley (00:40):
Jennifer, would you say that you're in a valley season
or a victory right now?
Can I say both?
Jennifer (00:47):
I mean right, I think there's definitely areas in my
life right now that feel likethey're victories.
And I've got three kids.
They're all doing well, which Ithink as a mom, when your kids
are happy, you're happy, and sothey're thriving.
I have two in college, I haveone living in New York living
(01:08):
his best life, who's a recentgrad a year and a half ago, and
they're all thriving, and sothat makes me feel like I'm in a
victory season as a mama, as abusiness owner and maybe in my
health and a couple of otherthings.
I do feel like, oh, here we go,we've been in a valley of sorts
(01:32):
, and so I think you can be inboth.
Kiley (01:35):
Yeah, absolutely, and I think it's so important to
remember that we don't just livein one or the other, because we
can't experience God's goodnessin some areas while still
struggling in the others.
So what is something you feellike God is really teaching you
in this particular season?
Jennifer (01:52):
I think that, understanding that, no matter
what success we achieve, nomatter when we're on that
mountain top, I still have to becompletely dependent on the
Lord for my happiness, for mystability as a recent empty
nester, we're in a whole newseason of what we thought we
(02:14):
were going to walk out as emptynesters.
And then my husband lost hisjob, my business started to tank
, the market and the economy isthe way that it is, and we found
ourselves having to once againsay Lord, we depend on you, not
on man, not on a job, not on theworld, but on you to provide
for us and to bring us thethings that truly bring joy, not
(02:37):
just happiness.
Kiley (02:39):
Yeah, and I think one of the hardest things is when we go
through life and we know thatGod has been faithful before,
but when we face those otherchallenges it's like is he going
to be there for us again?
Have you struggled with that,wondering if he's going to pick
you up or, knowing that he hasin the past, that he's got you
(02:59):
For sure?
Jennifer (03:00):
So I think that we go through situations and a lot of
times we think God gets usthrough, he rescues us, we get
through that situation and wehave some victory and we're like
, okay, check mark, that's doneon the test of life.
And really what I think happensis that, and so many people
I've had conversations with likewhy do I keep dealing with the
(03:21):
same thing?
Because there's this recurringthing, whether it's a bent
towards a sin, whether it's abehavior, whether it seems like
a chronic situation, if it'schronic illness, if it's
chronically having financialissues, whatever it may be.
But I think that God takes usthrough things multiple times
with a very similar situation,because he's teaching us
(03:44):
different things with every timethat we walk through something.
You know we don't have theheavenly perspective that God
has in His omnipotence excuse meto be able to see all things
from all perspectives at onetime.
And so I don't know about you,but, like when I walked through,
when we walked throughfinancial loss when my kids were
(04:05):
little my daughter's 21 now andshe was two and she opened the
door to a Channel 5 news guywanting to know about our
business that we had shut down,there was something different in
that season that I learned infinancial hardship that now if
that happened I'd be like rightup in his face talking to him,
because there was nothing to beashamed of or scared of or like
(04:26):
intimidated by.
But I'm walking through aseason of complete dependence,
knowing that it's not about methis time.
And so I think you learn andGod can show up if we're willing
to look and to pay attention inthose three times, because I
think what happens is we gothrough something we want to
check off the list that it'sdone, and the minute it comes
back in a different form, we getmad at God, we shut down and we
(04:49):
don't turn our eyes to Him.
Gianina (04:50):
Yeah, that is so true.
I think one of the things thatI've kind of been learning, just
like walking into this throughthis grief season that I've kind
of been in for the last coupleyears, is I always knew, you
know, everyone says like griefisn't linear, Grief isn't
something that is just like frompoint A to point B you're going
to have bad days, you're goingto have good days, you're going
(05:10):
to have in between days andsometimes you're going to go
back 10 steps.
One thing I did not realize wasgoing to be part of that is
that it's not just that griefisn't linear, but it's layered,
and I think sometimes it's likeyou don't even catch your breath
from one situation and then itseems like something else is
kind of happening in addition tothat.
And it really just what youshared reminded me too of the
(05:34):
Israelites, and you know, theywent through the desert and they
went through that season for 40years, and a lot of times we
think, well, maybe it was just areally big mountain that they
had to get over, but really itwasn't.
It was just that they weremaking the same mistakes over
and over again and God wasshowing his faithfulness and
there were just different thingsthat he had to teach them
(05:56):
before they were ready to reallyget into the promised land.
And so I think sometimes we aregoing through things and we get
frustrated and it's like God isjust so faithful with us that
before we can enter into and Idon't even want to say OK the
promised land, because we reallyaren't going to reach that
until we get to heaven, becausethere's always going to be
(06:17):
something that sets us back.
It's not like, ok, I havearrived and the enemy can't
touch me anymore and I'm justinvincible.
That's not going to happenuntil we get to heaven.
But you know, just kind oflearning how to navigate those
things.
I think it's so beautiful thatyou've learned like you said.
Now, if that situation happenedand somebody came to your door,
(06:38):
you would know how to handle it,and what a blessing that you
would know how to handle it andnot like going through that and
not learning a lesson for sure,but I would love to hear a
little bit about how you came toknow the Lord and how he's
shown his faithfulness to youthrough that.
And then also, if you'recomfortable sharing just some of
like, maybe, the healthstruggles that you're dealing
(07:00):
with, sure.
Jennifer (07:01):
So I love what you just said, though, too, about
God's faithfulness, but it'salso such a beautiful picture of
His love, His unfailing lovefor us.
Right, and when you ask thatabout my salvation experience
and really my relationship withthe Lord, I am very, very
blessed, and would even use theword lucky to say that I feel
(07:22):
like most of my life.
I don't really remember a timewhere I didn't know the Lord.
I grew up in a Christian homewith two parents who loved each
other, parents that loved eachother.
Everyone was very present.
I had a younger brother who was14 months younger than me, and
we were inundated in a housethat woke up with praise music
(07:43):
on and went to church everySunday.
And I know, not just going tochurch doesn't make you a
believer, obviously, but I wasalways in an environment that
was conducive to feeling thethings of God, and so it was
very natural.
One day we were driving in thecar.
I went to a Christian schoolafter kindergarten.
I'm like what does it even meanto be saved?
(08:05):
And I had this conversationwith my mom and my dad in the
car and I asked Jesus into myheart in that moment, and it was
sweet, but it was also like.
It was like what are we havingfor dinner?
Okay, we're having chicken andrice.
Okay, moving on, there was nolike experience per se, but
because I was in thatenvironment obviously the
(08:26):
watering and the pouring of allthe people that God had in my
life and the environment I grewup in there were different
stages where my relationship, Icame to these little points
where I had to say yes and leanin to God or I could turn my
head and turn away from him.
And thankfully those turn awaymoments were relatively small.
(08:47):
When I have conversations withother people and when I know,
when I've lived as much life asI, have girls at 50 years old,
that it's easier right inhindsight to see God's hand on
your life and really to how muchI was protected in this bubble.
And so there was a rededicationmoment at 12.
Then there was a rededicationmoment at 12.
Then there was a like when I metmy husband and it's in the book
(09:08):
, but like we met when we were16 years old and I had the
opportunity to get to lead himto the Lord.
But that was also like anAntietam moment for me where,
like, if I'm going to be able tobe a walking, I needed to be a
walking example for someone thatI cared about in my life.
And then, when we got marriedand expecting him to be the head
of the household but he hadbeen only saved for like six or
(09:30):
seven years and really was stillso new in his relationship with
the Lord and be trusting God,to say I'm going to let him
serve, I'm going to let him lead, I will serve and submit.
And so and that's not a word Ilove but it's a biblical one,
and so anyway, it's just reallysweet to see.
Honestly, I wrote Rescued Heartfrom the realization of all the
(09:54):
things that I had gone throughin my life.
And, despite all of the thingsthat I had gone through in my
life, god was always there andhe always rescued me.
And it's important, I think,when we are in that season of
success and glory and everythingseems like it's going well or
more things are going well thanare not, because it's never,
like we said, perfect.
(10:15):
When other people see us andthey walk out, we're witnessing
with our testimony.
We have to share those valleyswith them and that's why I love
that you guys are doing this.
But that was also what God wasdoing in me, and allowing me to
write this book and to be sovulnerable is to show people
that were seeing me have so muchsuccess in certain areas
understand that it took a lot oftesting and it took a lot of
(10:38):
overcome to get to the pointthat I was at.
Kiley (10:42):
So I was just thinking like I feel like our stories are
pretty similar.
I grew up in the church as welland when you were talking, it
reminded me of a conversation Ihad had with one of my friends,
like I think it was high schoolor college, and we were talking
about testimonies and I, and Isaid I kind of feel like I don't
have, you know, a majortestimony, because hear the word
(11:02):
testimony and you think ofpeople who have kind of hit
their rock bottom and they'vecome to that moment where
they've turned to Jesus.
And I said I've never reallyhad that moment.
I've always just been walkingwith him.
And he said that's probably oneof the greatest testimonies,
because you haven't had a badfamily relationship or you
(11:23):
haven't had struggles withaddiction.
Like you haven't had struggleswith addiction, like you don't
have to have those situations inorder to be close to God.
Yeah, and you know, I wentthrough something similar when I
met my husband, because I wasthe one that that led him to the
Lord as well, and so it reallywas.
I remember having theconversation with him about
being the head of the householdand, like you said, when we got
(11:44):
married he was still very newand it's you know, it's always a
work in progress.
Yes, yes, for sure, but yeah.
So I just think it's beautifulthat, even though we do go
through those struggles, knowingthat God is always walking with
us, it really does make such ahuge difference in how you
handle those struggles.
Jennifer (12:04):
It really does make such a huge difference in how
you handle those struggles.
For sure, for sure.
I think that the beauty thatcomes in brokenness is an equal
beauty in seeing God sustainsomething and, like you said,
that testimony of always Godalways being there he was never
too far away.
That is hope and glory forthose that are coming, that are
(12:28):
coming from brokenness, becauseI think the fear is for so many
that I have had conversationsand prayed with and ministered
to, that have walked throughbrokenness is that there's so
much fear wrapped around.
I'm one decision away frombeing right back in that pit and
so when we can walk out a lifeof sustained glory not
(12:50):
perfection, but sustaining thatrelationship with the Lord and
having the things that we've hadthat have continued to hold us
up and away from those thingslike addiction or whatever else
it may be, that's a light and arescue for someone else.
Honestly, that's coming fromthat brokenness.
Gianina (13:10):
And I think it takes a lot of the pressure off of.
I think, sometimes, when peoplehave this big testimony with
the Lord, where they have likethat one moment where everything
changes for them, I almost feellike it could be a
discouragement when the nexttest comes, because it's like,
okay, well, I thought that Godrescued me, I thought that my
(13:31):
life's going to be better, Ithought it's going to be easier,
and so even hearing storieslike this, I think, is so
important because, although youdidn't have those struggles per
se, and God has just been thisconstant source of grace for you
, it's like you still struggled,but God has just been this
constant source of grace for you.
It's like you still struggled,but God has been right there,
and so that's such a powerfultestimony to be able to share
with people, because you know,once you get saved, that's not
(13:54):
the end all be all, that's notjust the end point.
And so we're still going to gothrough things, and so knowing,
okay, yes, now you're saved andyou're walking with the Lord,
but you're going to have tolearn how to find him in these
places when you're going throughsomething.
And so I think one of the thingsthat I definitely want to ask
our guests, as we have people on, is like where are you finding
(14:18):
God in the season you're in now?
But just knowing your story andhearing you talk, I would love
to hear some of the tests thatyou've gone through, if you can
think of one in particular.
Where is it that you found Godin that moment?
Did you just always know thathe was there?
Was it kind of in hindsight?
Or how did you train yourselfto seek God when you're going
(14:39):
through different valleys?
Jennifer (14:41):
Gosh, that's a great question and there's so many
things that come to mind.
I think I'll preface it all tosay this that I feel like and I
don't want to downplay it, but Ifeel like sometimes with
Christianity it's like puttingon a pair of new eyes or putting
on a pair of sunglasses right,and maybe even the opposite of
sunglasses, something that wheneverything's dark, when you look
(15:03):
at things through a lens of howGod sees things, you'll
understand and we see veryclearly how he's moving in the
big things but also in thelittle things, and where he's
showing up and being able toidentify it.
And when you are not asleep oryou're not unaware, but when
(15:23):
your eyes are open and you'relooking at things around you, if
you start asking God to showyou like where are you in my
life, lord, right now, in thismoment, so good to show up, it's
like just put the glasses on.
You don't have to do anythingbut put the glasses on and he's
there and you'll see him in somany different ways.
I know I share in the book.
(15:44):
This is kind of it's funny, butI don't know it's not funny.
It's funny only because I wassafe not safe, but so sheltered
I thought I always am.
Like everyone says this aboutme, jen you're just like not
callable, but like you alwaysthink that no one's going to do
anything bad.
And so we go on this trip.
(16:04):
That's for my brother.
He has a rare liver disease.
He's terminal Make-A-Wish givesour family a trip to Disneyland
or Disney World in Florida.
We go.
There's a lifeguard at the poolwhere we're at.
He starts talking and friendingup my mom, which then very
quickly led to flirting with me.
Of course he gets my attention.
(16:25):
He invites my family to anevent that night where we're all
together.
While we're there, he'swhispering in my ear that he
wants to take me somewhere andspend the day with me.
My parents are like sure, go goto the water park with him.
And my parents went like couldy'all imagine sending your 17
year old daughter with astranger for the day on a
(16:47):
vacation trip?
You'd like have had like twoconversations with this person.
Yeah, he was four years older.
Four or five years older, Ithink he was 21.
Anyway, long story short, heends up taking me to his house,
but we go to a water park andy'all.
This is.
This is where I think.
This is how creative our God isand how he uses everything.
(17:10):
I started my period at the waterpark on the second slide.
We got and I'm not.
I was like, without beinggraphic, it was a situation that
I was not going to be able tostay at the water park, right,
and so he wants to take me backto the hotel.
I'm like, I mean, I want him totake me back to the hotel.
(17:30):
He doesn't want me to be alone.
He takes me to his house, which, in a way, would seem like even
worse, which it could have beenbut because I was on my period,
the advances were made, I wasable to stop him and I feel like
that in itself protected me inthat moment, as weird and as
(17:51):
random as it could be right.
But then there's other momentswhere it's so concrete and you
know that God's hand is in it.
You know we had a Christmaswhere I'm a thrifter, I'm a
garage seller, I love doing allthat stuff anyway.
But we did have a year where wewere just broke as a joke and
Christmas was coming with threelittle kids and my mom had done
(18:11):
a few things for my kids.
But when you can't do somethingfor them, it's just the worst.
Yeah, regardless of what theworld would tell you and all of
that about materialism.
But God had just given me a lotof favor with getting little
things which I totally felt likewas God in the first place at
garage sales and differentthings.
And then we get what I think isdone, and I'm grabbing all the
(18:39):
empty boxes under the tree andthere's this card that's stuck
up in the bottom of ourChristmas tree and it's got
stickers on it like a ransomnote.
It says don't open it tillDecember 25th.
And I'm like what is this?
I asked my husband.
I asked Phil, what like did youdo this?
(18:59):
He's like it's not for me, whodid it?
And it was, I think, at thetime.
I think it was like a thousanddollars cash under our Christmas
tree on Christmas day.
And I just remember sittingthere and I start crying and the
kids are all like coming up,like why is mommy crying?
Like just so clearly seeing Godmeet.
Not, I mean, it was a need, butit was also a desire, like to
be able to provide.
And so I think he shows up inthose big, concrete ways for us
(19:22):
sometimes to make a mark in it,like I call those, like they're
little consecration moments inyour life where you know that,
no matter what you go through,no matter what it looks like, no
matter what it feels like that,no matter what you go through,
no matter what it looks like, nomatter what it feels like that,
when you put your trust in him,he will show up.
He will show up.
And then those situations thatwe put ourselves in a lot of
(19:43):
times out of just unawareness orstupidity or whatever, when we
say that God's our father, hetruly is that shepherd watching
out for every sheep, and thatsituation that I was in in high
school, that God will use themost unlikely thing but he'll
still show up.
So always there.
Gianina (20:06):
Yeah, I love what you said.
That reminds me of like when ittalks about you know, god is
our father.
Like, if we, as parents, desireto give good gifts to our kids,
even being evil, how much moreour father in heaven desires to
give us good gifts.
And I love what you said aboutit's not just filling our needs
but filling our desires, and Ithink sometimes, especially as
(20:29):
women, we feel selfish forhaving desires.
Sometimes, especially as women,we feel selfish for having
desires, especially somethingthat could seem so fleeting,
like something monetary ormaterialistic, and I just love
that.
It's like God just smiled downon you and it's like I got you,
even if it's something that theworld thinks is silly or that
(20:50):
you think is silly.
I see you.
We're actually reading inGenesis right now in our women's
Bible study in small groups andwe were talking about Hagar
this past week and that's justlike, really, something God has
been emphasizing is the God whosees.
And see all these moments whereGod just sees us.
(21:11):
He saw you, he saw your heart,he knew that your heart was for
your children and your heart wasforgiving.
I just think that's sobeautiful.
Like God, god's like.
I see you, I see that desireand that need and want, and so
that's just really beautiful.
Thank you, it is.
Kiley (21:26):
Well, and even going back to the situation when you were
a teenager, you know somebody atthat age could have been like
oh my gosh, this just totallyruined my day.
And then you had the hindsightto think well, thank you, lord.
Yes.
Jennifer (21:40):
Well, it might have also been that Jerry Springer
was on the TV when I was gettingready.
I was waiting, like my parentshad left and my dad had left the
TV on, and then Jerry Springercame on and I was like, oh my
Again, I remind you, I was verysheltered up until about that
season.
So, oh my goodness, we have aphrase around our house too,
(22:02):
that is with my kids.
I use this all the time and Ilearned this from my second
grade teacher, charlotte Jamison.
She just wrote her own book.
She's an amazing woman of God,but she shared with me years ago
and I use it and I still thinkit's so true and such a great
reminder Lots of people say it,but that when we experience
rejection, right in any form orfashion whether it's a plan that
(22:25):
gets messed up or your day getsruined or someone rejects you,
just full out that it's usuallyGod's protection.
Kiley (22:33):
Yes.
Jennifer (22:34):
Like 99.9% of the time , it's God protecting you from
something.
Gianina (22:40):
And that's so hard because we want to be mad.
Kiley (22:43):
Always Well, you want to be mad and you want what you
want and you can't understandwhy it hasn't happened for you.
And then, over time, most ofthe time, you realize okay, I
get it now Exactly, yeah, forsure.
So if someone is listeningright now and they're in a deep
valley, feeling like they'vemissed their moment with God,
(23:07):
kind of what was popping up inmy mind when you were talking
was thinking of people who maybefeel like they've never
experienced that goodness of God, like he's never shown up for
me.
I've never had that type ofblessing.
What would you say to encouragethem?
Jennifer (23:26):
Well, if I could give them a hug through the
microphone I would.
The microphone I would, becauseI think that the thing that
we've one of the things thatwe've been talking about already
, about just being seen that Goddoes see you and he sees it all
.
He sees the good, he sees thebad, he sees the ugly, but he
(23:46):
doesn't look at it and use itagainst us.
He just sees us for who we areand he's willing and ready to
wrap His arms around you theminute you say Jesus, the minute
you say God, the minute you sayI give up, the minute you say
help me.
There is a movie out that cameout about two years ago called
After Death.
You can find it on Netflix.
(24:10):
It's also on Hulu and Amazon.
You do have to pay for it.
Hopefully it will be free soon,but it is such a beautiful,
beautiful picture ofunderstanding.
It's done by a Christian moviehouse but it is scientific in
nature and they looked at asampling of people across
socioeconomics and status acrossreligions across the world,
(24:35):
socioeconomics and status acrossreligions across the world
geographic locations, and theyjust record their interpretation
of near-death and after-deathsituations where people have
gone through a near-deathexperience and then they've come
back and they just take, veryscientifically, the objective
information of what theyexperienced.
And you guys not surprising tous, but probably surprising to
the world they're all there'sthis recipe or order that things
(24:58):
happen and I won't give away.
I mean, we know how the storyends right.
Heaven is real as well as hellis real.
But there's an instance where agentleman, a young man in his
20s, has attempted to commitsuicide.
He comes out of his body, hesees himself OD'd in the
(25:19):
hospital, in the ER, and hestarts falling immediately and
has this, like just everyonethat went to hell or experienced
something about darkness, feelsthis like surge of going down
and he has the thought, thethought, urge of going down.
And he has the thought, thethought.
I remember going to vacationBible school with Joe when I was
eight or nine years old andthey talked about Jesus and he
(25:42):
said, the minute he had thatthought, he felt love, he felt
warmth, he felt arms around himand he started ascending up.
Wow, and if God shows up forsomebody in that instance where
they've turned away fromthemselves everything in the
world and they have the thoughtof Jesus, and he's there, he's
(26:06):
there.
He's there for you right now,wherever you are, you can't do
enough wrong, bad, whateverdamage, destruction you have
faced or felt.
There's not enough that you cando that will separate you from
the love of God.
If you want it, it's yours, andso I do tend to have a magnet
(26:28):
of sorts for people that havewalked through those kinds of
that are in those valleys, and Ithink that what is so cool
about God is that I tell them.
What I've already talked aboutjust a little bit already is
that if you start looking forHim, he will show up, and I
don't mean like a pile of moneyfalling from the sky and
suddenly it's not hard to dodrugs anymore.
(26:50):
Suddenly, you don't wanna pickup the alcohol.
Suddenly, you're not gonna behit, pick up the alcohol.
Suddenly, you're not going tobe hit.
There will be things, though,that you will see that God will
say I opened this opportunityfor you.
The bar's closed, you're notsupposed to be there.
Maybe let's pause and say God,help me right now, in this
moment.
Maybe the door for a job thatyou didn't want opens and you
(27:12):
think you don't want it.
Maybe you're supposed to gothere because God knows better
than we do, and it's just beingobedient when you have those
feelings, in those moments, tojust take a step and to invite
God in.
And that's why, with my book, Ifelt so strongly that, going
through every rescue that I wentthrough personally, now I
didn't go through a loss of ababy.
(27:32):
I haven't gone through adivorce.
Have I gone through some griefand losing a loved one?
Yes.
Have I gone through financialloss?
Yes.
Have I gone through healthstruggles?
Yes.
So I speak to each of thosethings that I've walked through
with an anchor of truth that theBible says.
And what God is so cool aboutdoing is that he can't go back
on His promises.
In the Bible, in the OldTestament, there was a time
(27:54):
where God started to break apromise and Moses reminded him
and said God, you promised yourpeople, and he's like you're
right, you're right, I'm notgoing to go back on my promise.
He will not go back on hispromise.
So if you know what the Biblesays, it's armor, it gives you
the power, and so you can stillbe doing all the stuff, all the
(28:16):
bad stuff, but if you know onething about God, you hold on to
that and I promise you'll startstopping some of that other
stuff and you'll start doingmore of the God stuff, and it's
just one step at a time.
It's not an overnight change.
But when you know that you'reloved and that you're seen,
that's where the transformationcan start and you'll see God
(28:37):
there, and so I have prayers inthis book.
You don't even have to know howto pray, you can just say Jesus,
help me.
But if you have a specificsituation, the Lord really
prompted me with my book to givepeople the words because I
think sometimes when we'rescared or we're mad or any of
those emotions that can get inthe way, they can block us from
(28:59):
speaking positive things overour lives out loud.
So hopefully that's a help topeople but, it's all good news.
It's all good news.
Gianina (29:09):
And I think one of the really cool things about that is
like God is not trying to bemysterious, he's not trying to
hold himself back from us.
And so when we just reach outand just say, god, show me where
you are in this situation, yeah, show me where you are in my
life.
I want to know you, I want tosee you he will, like he will
(29:32):
show up.
He's not, he's not sayingJennifer, I just want you to
chase me a little bit just justto see if you can catch me.
And then I'm just going totease you and not show you my
goodness and not reveal myselfto you.
And I remember kind of goingthrough a season, especially
when I really rededicated mylife to God, where I wanted to
(29:52):
know, like, what's my purpose,what does God want for my life,
where am I supposed to go, whatam I supposed to be doing?
And just striving in that.
And I just remember the Lordsaying Gianina, I want you to
fulfill your purpose more thanyou want to.
I want you to reach these peoplemore than you want to reach
them.
I have a purpose for you and soyou just have to rest in that
(30:16):
and trust in that and just askme.
And God wants to reveal himselfto us more than we want, than
we have that desire.
He wants to be with us morethan we want to be with him.
That's just like reallybeautiful.
And even what you shared aboutwhat happens in those moments
after death in people's lives,and I had kind of a similar just
(30:36):
vision that God has given me,where people were passing and
moving on to that next journeyin the afterlife, and God just
showed me people that we trulydid not think would be in heaven
and how he just was wrappinghis arms around them.
And there was one Sunday Ican't remember even the worship
(30:56):
song that was being sung and Godjust showed me this vision of
like this is what it's like inheaven right now.
And he showed me this vision ofjust you know all these
Christians and believers andpeople who are just kind of like
doing what we imagine peoplewould do in heaven and just
living their best life andcommuning with each other, but
also worshiping and just all thethings.
(31:19):
But then I saw people who justcould not leave the feet of
Jesus just attached to him, andhe just showed me how the people
who were attached to his feetare the people who they never
thought they were going to getthere and they knew what God
rescued them from and what Jesusrescued them from.
(31:39):
I just picture those people,like in those last moments where
they're like what if Jesus isreal?
Or just calling on the name ofJesus and they just barely make
it in.
But they make it in and they'rejust resting at his feet and so
that's just.
That's really really beautifulfor sure.
We don't have to strive in it,we just have to rest in who he
(32:00):
is, because he's already done it, we don't have to do anything.
Kiley (32:04):
So good.
I think one thing that'simportant for people to know and
understand is that he createdus to be in a relationship with
him, and all we need to do isjust want him back, and it
doesn't matter you know whatyou've done or where you've come
from.
He is, he is ready when you areand I swear, janina, I feel
(32:25):
like I'm going to cry, likeevery single episode we do.
It's just, it's so powerful tothink about.
Jennifer (32:32):
It really is beautiful I saw this, spoke to me
recently, especially with griefand yes, thank you, kylie,
because now I probably will cryas well but that this woman was
sharing her experience of losinga baby, a stillborn, and how
people were questioning theunbelievable peace that they
were experiencing as a familywhile still processing an
(32:55):
unimaginable loss.
And she was like I felt like Iwas enveloped in this blanket of
just protection and love andknowing that God's hand was in
all of it and that he saw me andshe's like.
I felt like I was doing so wellthat I got nervous.
It's going to come back fiveyears from now or 10 years from
now and I'm going to have acomplete breakdown.
And so she put herself intogrief, recovery and the first
(33:19):
week that she went, while theywere worshiping, before they
even started to teach the class,she had a vision.
The Lord said I want you to seewhat I was doing in that day in
that room.
And she was like I didn't wantto go back to that place to see
it.
I wanted to live in this placein my mind, where it was already
(33:40):
done and the baby was in heavenwith God and it was fine, even
though she was experiencing painon earth and he's like I want
you to see where I was in thatmoment with you.
And she saw the hospital roomand she's holding their baby,
who was gone.
The body, everyone's upset,weeping, the family's weeping,
the nurses are there, they'reupset, invisibly upset, and she
(34:03):
looks over and God is literallythere holding her baby and she's
alive and she's giggling Wow.
But God was crying and weepingand he was weeping for his
daughter who was in the bedholding the lifeless child, and
(34:24):
he was telling her I broke whenyou broke, and that's how great
his love is for every personthat's experiencing.
Maybe listening to this.
That is hurting in a way, whereit's not even about what you've
done, but what's been done toyou, and where you feel so much
loss and pain and you think thatGod doesn't see it.
(34:45):
He's not just there to pick youup, but he's there to cry with
you and to grieve with you.
Pick you up, but he's there tocry with you and to grieve with
you and I just I love thatpicture because we are not.
No matter what we do, whilewe're on this side of heaven,
we're going to continue to hurt,we're going to continue to have
challenges, we're going tocontinue to have valleys and
(35:08):
things that are hard, that wehave to walk through, that are
heavy, that want to take ourbreath away.
And yet he will not leave ourside and he carries the weight
of what we carry with us and forus.
Gianina (35:25):
That's so good.
Well, now that we're all crying, yeah, I really definitely want
to thank you for just being soopen today.
Just, I love the wisdom thatyou have, and so we're all kind
of different ages.
I'm in my late 30s.
Kylie, you just turned 40.
(35:45):
Is that right?
Oh, god bless you.
Kiley (35:47):
No, I'm about to be 43.
Bless you.
No, I'm about to be 43.
Yeah.
Gianina (35:53):
We have our 30s, 40s and 50s.
Jennifer (35:57):
I am going to be 51 in 14 days.
Gianina (36:01):
Wow.
Jennifer (36:02):
And, as my kids remind me, you're going into your 52nd
year.
Gianina (36:07):
They always try to make me older.
I definitely just love all ofthe wisdom, and even me, as you
know, 38, I don't considermyself a baby or young or
anything, but it's stuff that Ican learn as well and things
that I can gain from, and Idon't necessarily think that has
to just do with age, but theexperience that you have in the
wisdom, I definitely value thatand I think that it's something
(36:29):
that our listeners can really.
I think that it's something thatour listeners can really really
learn from as well, and I hopethat their ears are open to it.
And I just you mentioned theprayers that you have in your
book and you don't necessarilyhave to use something from that.
But if you could just pray forour listeners and specifically,
I think I feel I feel led.
(36:50):
What I'm kind of feeling rightnow is, even as somebody is
listening to this, they're goingwell, god's protection has been
in your life and you've seenGod in these different areas,
but I have been betrayed, I havebeen used, I have been hurt and
I don't see where God was inthose places.
(37:11):
If you can specifically prayfor that person, that's who I
feel like listener-wise, willreally benefit from that.
Jennifer (37:19):
Of course, all right.
Heavenly Father, thank you forgiving us this opportunity and
this moment to come before you.
And to lay it all down, we justlay it all down, I thank you,
god.
And to lay it all down, we justlay it all down.
I thank you, god, that you area God who sees it all, you know
all and you're ever present,meaning that you're always there
.
And I can only imagine.
(37:41):
I know there's times when Ifelt like you were far away, but
I knew that you weren't.
I just felt it in my emotions.
But I also know that there arepeople walking through right now
.
There may be people listeningright now that truly have never
been able to recognize or seeyou in the hurt and in the pain
and in the brokenness thatthey're walking in, god, and I,
just I lift that person up toyou.
(38:01):
I lift those people up to youright now, their broken hearts.
God, would you be so sweet andcould we be so trusting, even in
our brokenness, even in theirbrokenness and in their hurt,
right now, to lift up thatbroken thing to you, to lift up
every pain, to know that you canhold it all and that, if they
(38:26):
will be willing to give it toyou, god, that you would take it
and start giving them a newperspective of your hand in
their life, more than anythingfor today, but also for tomorrow
and, most importantly, overtime, god, that they would be
able to even look back and thatyou would illuminate something,
some situation, some person thatyou brought in their life, some
experience that seemed randomand didn't make sense, some
(38:49):
phone calls, some letter thatthey received in the mail, some
ad they saw on TV, something,god, to show that you were there
even in all of that pain.
God, I thank you that you canheal only the things that you
can only heal, god.
There are things that we can'theal, there are things that
doctors can't heal, but you cando it, god.
(39:10):
So I lift them up to you today.
I ask for a miracle in theirlife.
I ask for them to feel loved.
I ask for you to let them know,be known and be seen, and to
ask them to be brave enough totrust the people that you put in
their life and to trust youthat you'll carry all of their
(39:32):
todays, that you've forecastedand planned all of their
tomorrows, and that you'restrong enough and big enough to
heal all of their yesterdays,god.
We thank you, god, so much forbeing who you are In Jesus' name
amen.
Kiley (39:49):
Well, jennifer, thank you so so much For everyone
listening.
Just remember that God is notfinished with your story.
Whether you're in a valley or avictory, or both, he is still
working.
He is always working.
Thank you so much for joiningus today.
Please don't forget to sharethis episode with a friend that
you think may need encouragement.
(40:10):
Also, we're going to be sharingJennifer's book Rescued Heart
in the show notes of thisepisode, so be sure to check
that out as well.
We look forward to seeing younext time as we share more
stories from the valleys and thevictories.
I'm so excited for today's conversation because
we're diving into something thatI think we all experience,
walking through both valleys andvictories at the same time and
I couldn't think of a betterperson to have this conversation
with than my sweet friend,Jennifer Mango.
Jennifer is someone who knowsfirsthand what it means to trust
God through the highs and lows.
(00:20):
She's walked through deepvalleys, but she's also seen
God's faithfulness in incredibleways.
She's an author, and her bookRescued Heart is such a powerful
testimony of what God can dowhen we surrender our brokenness
to Him.
Jennifer, I'm so happy you'rehere.
Thank you, I'm excited to behere, so let's just start here.
Kiley (00:40):
Jennifer, would you say that you're in a valley season
or a victory right now?
Can I say both?
Jennifer (00:47):
I mean right, I think there's definitely areas in my
life right now that feel likethey're victories.
And I've got three kids.
They're all doing well, which Ithink as a mom, when your kids
are happy, you're happy, and sothey're thriving.
I have two in college, I haveone living in New York living
(01:08):
his best life, who's a recentgrad a year and a half ago, and
they're all thriving, and sothat makes me feel like I'm in a
victory season as a mama, as abusiness owner and maybe in my
health and a couple of otherthings.
I do feel like, oh, here we go,we've been in a valley of sorts
(01:32):
, and so I think you can be inboth.
Kiley (01:35):
Yeah, absolutely, and I think it's so important to
remember that we don't just livein one or the other, because we
can't experience God's goodnessin some areas while still
struggling in the others.
So what is something you feellike God is really teaching you
in this particular season?
Jennifer (01:52):
I think that, understanding that, no matter
what success we achieve, nomatter when we're on that
mountain top, I still have to becompletely dependent on the
Lord for my happiness, for mystability as a recent empty
nester, we're in a whole newseason of what we thought we
(02:14):
were going to walk out as emptynesters.
And then my husband lost hisjob, my business started to tank
, the market and the economy isthe way that it is, and we found
ourselves having to once againsay Lord, we depend on you, not
on man, not on a job, not on theworld, but on you to provide
for us and to bring us thethings that truly bring joy, not
(02:37):
just happiness.
Kiley (02:39):
Yeah, and I think one of the hardest things is when we go
through life and we know thatGod has been faithful before,
but when we face those otherchallenges it's like is he going
to be there for us again?
Have you struggled with that,wondering if he's going to pick
you up or, knowing that he hasin the past, that he's got you
(02:59):
For sure?
Jennifer (03:00):
So I think that we go through situations and a lot of
times we think God gets usthrough, he rescues us, we get
through that situation and wehave some victory and we're like
, okay, check mark, that's doneon the test of life.
And really what I think happensis that, and so many people
I've had conversations with likewhy do I keep dealing with the
(03:21):
same thing?
Because there's this recurringthing, whether it's a bent
towards a sin, whether it's abehavior, whether it seems like
a chronic situation, if it'schronic illness, if it's
chronically having financialissues, whatever it may be.
But I think that God takes usthrough things multiple times
with a very similar situation,because he's teaching us
(03:44):
different things with every timethat we walk through something.
You know we don't have theheavenly perspective that God
has in His omnipotence excuse meto be able to see all things
from all perspectives at onetime.
And so I don't know about you,but, like when I walked through,
when we walked throughfinancial loss when my kids were
(04:05):
little my daughter's 21 now andshe was two and she opened the
door to a Channel 5 news guywanting to know about our
business that we had shut down,there was something different in
that season that I learned infinancial hardship that now if
that happened I'd be like rightup in his face talking to him,
because there was nothing to beashamed of or scared of or like
(04:26):
intimidated by.
But I'm walking through aseason of complete dependence,
knowing that it's not about methis time.
And so I think you learn andGod can show up if we're willing
to look and to pay attention inthose three times, because I
think what happens is we gothrough something we want to
check off the list that it'sdone, and the minute it comes
back in a different form, we getmad at God, we shut down and we
(04:49):
don't turn our eyes to Him.
Gianina (04:50):
Yeah, that is so true.
I think one of the things thatI've kind of been learning, just
like walking into this throughthis grief season that I've kind
of been in for the last coupleyears, is I always knew, you
know, everyone says like griefisn't linear, Grief isn't
something that is just like frompoint A to point B you're going
to have bad days, you're goingto have good days, you're going
(05:10):
to have in between days andsometimes you're going to go
back 10 steps.
One thing I did not realize wasgoing to be part of that is
that it's not just that griefisn't linear, but it's layered,
and I think sometimes it's likeyou don't even catch your breath
from one situation and then itseems like something else is
kind of happening in addition tothat.
And it really just what youshared reminded me too of the
(05:34):
Israelites, and you know, theywent through the desert and they
went through that season for 40years, and a lot of times we
think, well, maybe it was just areally big mountain that they
had to get over, but really itwasn't.
It was just that they weremaking the same mistakes over
and over again and God wasshowing his faithfulness and
there were just different thingsthat he had to teach them
(05:56):
before they were ready to reallyget into the promised land.
And so I think sometimes we aregoing through things and we get
frustrated and it's like God isjust so faithful with us that
before we can enter into and Idon't even want to say OK the
promised land, because we reallyaren't going to reach that
until we get to heaven, becausethere's always going to be
(06:17):
something that sets us back.
It's not like, ok, I havearrived and the enemy can't
touch me anymore and I'm justinvincible.
That's not going to happenuntil we get to heaven.
But you know, just kind oflearning how to navigate those
things.
I think it's so beautiful thatyou've learned like you said.
Now, if that situation happenedand somebody came to your door,
(06:38):
you would know how to handle it,and what a blessing that you
would know how to handle it andnot like going through that and
not learning a lesson for sure,but I would love to hear a
little bit about how you came toknow the Lord and how he's
shown his faithfulness to youthrough that.
And then also, if you'recomfortable sharing just some of
like, maybe, the healthstruggles that you're dealing
(07:00):
with, sure.
Jennifer (07:01):
So I love what you just said, though, too, about
God's faithfulness, but it'salso such a beautiful picture of
His love, His unfailing lovefor us.
Right, and when you ask thatabout my salvation experience
and really my relationship withthe Lord, I am very, very
blessed, and would even use theword lucky to say that I feel
(07:22):
like most of my life.
I don't really remember a timewhere I didn't know the Lord.
I grew up in a Christian homewith two parents who loved each
other, parents that loved eachother.
Everyone was very present.
I had a younger brother who was14 months younger than me, and
we were inundated in a housethat woke up with praise music
(07:43):
on and went to church everySunday.
And I know, not just going tochurch doesn't make you a
believer, obviously, but I wasalways in an environment that
was conducive to feeling thethings of God, and so it was
very natural.
One day we were driving in thecar.
I went to a Christian schoolafter kindergarten.
I'm like what does it even meanto be saved?
(08:05):
And I had this conversationwith my mom and my dad in the
car and I asked Jesus into myheart in that moment, and it was
sweet, but it was also like.
It was like what are we havingfor dinner?
Okay, we're having chicken andrice.
Okay, moving on, there was nolike experience per se, but
because I was in thatenvironment obviously the
(08:26):
watering and the pouring of allthe people that God had in my
life and the environment I grewup in there were different
stages where my relationship, Icame to these little points
where I had to say yes and leanin to God or I could turn my
head and turn away from him.
And thankfully those turn awaymoments were relatively small.
(08:47):
When I have conversations withother people and when I know,
when I've lived as much life asI, have girls at 50 years old,
that it's easier right inhindsight to see God's hand on
your life and really to how muchI was protected in this bubble.
And so there was a rededicationmoment at 12.
Then there was a rededicationmoment at 12.
Then there was a like when I metmy husband and it's in the book
(09:08):
, but like we met when we were16 years old and I had the
opportunity to get to lead himto the Lord.
But that was also like anAntietam moment for me where,
like, if I'm going to be able tobe a walking, I needed to be a
walking example for someone thatI cared about in my life.
And then, when we got marriedand expecting him to be the head
of the household but he hadbeen only saved for like six or
(09:30):
seven years and really was stillso new in his relationship with
the Lord and be trusting God,to say I'm going to let him
serve, I'm going to let him lead, I will serve and submit.
And so and that's not a word Ilove but it's a biblical one,
and so anyway, it's just reallysweet to see.
Honestly, I wrote Rescued Heartfrom the realization of all the
(09:54):
things that I had gone throughin my life.
And, despite all of the thingsthat I had gone through in my
life, god was always there andhe always rescued me.
And it's important, I think,when we are in that season of
success and glory and everythingseems like it's going well or
more things are going well thanare not, because it's never,
like we said, perfect.
(10:15):
When other people see us andthey walk out, we're witnessing
with our testimony.
We have to share those valleyswith them and that's why I love
that you guys are doing this.
But that was also what God wasdoing in me, and allowing me to
write this book and to be sovulnerable is to show people
that were seeing me have so muchsuccess in certain areas
understand that it took a lot oftesting and it took a lot of
(10:38):
overcome to get to the pointthat I was at.
Kiley (10:42):
So I was just thinking like I feel like our stories are
pretty similar.
I grew up in the church as welland when you were talking, it
reminded me of a conversation Ihad had with one of my friends,
like I think it was high schoolor college, and we were talking
about testimonies and I, and Isaid I kind of feel like I don't
have, you know, a majortestimony, because hear the word
(11:02):
testimony and you think ofpeople who have kind of hit
their rock bottom and they'vecome to that moment where
they've turned to Jesus.
And I said I've never reallyhad that moment.
I've always just been walkingwith him.
And he said that's probably oneof the greatest testimonies,
because you haven't had a badfamily relationship or you
(11:23):
haven't had struggles withaddiction.
Like you haven't had struggleswith addiction, like you don't
have to have those situations inorder to be close to God.
Yeah, and you know, I wentthrough something similar when I
met my husband, because I wasthe one that that led him to the
Lord as well, and so it reallywas.
I remember having theconversation with him about
being the head of the householdand, like you said, when we got
(11:44):
married he was still very newand it's you know, it's always a
work in progress.
Yes, yes, for sure, but yeah.
So I just think it's beautifulthat, even though we do go
through those struggles, knowingthat God is always walking with
us, it really does make such ahuge difference in how you
handle those struggles.
Jennifer (12:04):
It really does make such a huge difference in how
you handle those struggles.
For sure, for sure.
I think that the beauty thatcomes in brokenness is an equal
beauty in seeing God sustainsomething and, like you said,
that testimony of always Godalways being there he was never
too far away.
That is hope and glory forthose that are coming, that are
(12:28):
coming from brokenness, becauseI think the fear is for so many
that I have had conversationsand prayed with and ministered
to, that have walked throughbrokenness is that there's so
much fear wrapped around.
I'm one decision away frombeing right back in that pit and
so when we can walk out a lifeof sustained glory not
(12:50):
perfection, but sustaining thatrelationship with the Lord and
having the things that we've hadthat have continued to hold us
up and away from those thingslike addiction or whatever else
it may be, that's a light and arescue for someone else.
Honestly, that's coming fromthat brokenness.
Gianina (13:10):
And I think it takes a lot of the pressure off of.
I think, sometimes, when peoplehave this big testimony with
the Lord, where they have likethat one moment where everything
changes for them, I almost feellike it could be a
discouragement when the nexttest comes, because it's like,
okay, well, I thought that Godrescued me, I thought that my
(13:31):
life's going to be better, Ithought it's going to be easier,
and so even hearing storieslike this, I think, is so
important because, although youdidn't have those struggles per
se, and God has just been thisconstant source of grace for you
, it's like you still struggled,but God has just been this
constant source of grace for you.
It's like you still struggled,but God has been right there,
and so that's such a powerfultestimony to be able to share
with people, because you know,once you get saved, that's not
(13:54):
the end all be all, that's notjust the end point.
And so we're still going to gothrough things, and so knowing,
okay, yes, now you're saved andyou're walking with the Lord,
but you're going to have tolearn how to find him in these
places when you're going throughsomething.
And so I think one of the thingsthat I definitely want to ask
our guests, as we have people on, is like where are you finding
(14:18):
God in the season you're in now?
But just knowing your story andhearing you talk, I would love
to hear some of the tests thatyou've gone through, if you can
think of one in particular.
Where is it that you found Godin that moment?
Did you just always know thathe was there?
Was it kind of in hindsight?
Or how did you train yourselfto seek God when you're going
(14:39):
through different valleys?
Jennifer (14:41):
Gosh, that's a great question and there's so many
things that come to mind.
I think I'll preface it all tosay this that I feel like and I
don't want to downplay it, but Ifeel like sometimes with
Christianity it's like puttingon a pair of new eyes or putting
on a pair of sunglasses right,and maybe even the opposite of
sunglasses, something that wheneverything's dark, when you look
(15:03):
at things through a lens of howGod sees things, you'll
understand and we see veryclearly how he's moving in the
big things but also in thelittle things, and where he's
showing up and being able toidentify it.
And when you are not asleep oryou're not unaware, but when
(15:23):
your eyes are open and you'relooking at things around you, if
you start asking God to showyou like where are you in my
life, lord, right now, in thismoment, so good to show up, it's
like just put the glasses on.
You don't have to do anythingbut put the glasses on and he's
there and you'll see him in somany different ways.
I know I share in the book.
(15:44):
This is kind of it's funny, butI don't know it's not funny.
It's funny only because I wassafe not safe, but so sheltered
I thought I always am.
Like everyone says this aboutme, jen you're just like not
callable, but like you alwaysthink that no one's going to do
anything bad.
And so we go on this trip.
(16:04):
That's for my brother.
He has a rare liver disease.
He's terminal Make-A-Wish givesour family a trip to Disneyland
or Disney World in Florida.
We go.
There's a lifeguard at the poolwhere we're at.
He starts talking and friendingup my mom, which then very
quickly led to flirting with me.
Of course he gets my attention.
(16:25):
He invites my family to anevent that night where we're all
together.
While we're there, he'swhispering in my ear that he
wants to take me somewhere andspend the day with me.
My parents are like sure, go goto the water park with him.
And my parents went like couldy'all imagine sending your 17
year old daughter with astranger for the day on a
(16:47):
vacation trip?
You'd like have had like twoconversations with this person.
Yeah, he was four years older.
Four or five years older, Ithink he was 21.
Anyway, long story short, heends up taking me to his house,
but we go to a water park andy'all.
This is.
This is where I think.
This is how creative our God isand how he uses everything.
(17:10):
I started my period at the waterpark on the second slide.
We got and I'm not.
I was like, without beinggraphic, it was a situation that
I was not going to be able tostay at the water park, right,
and so he wants to take me backto the hotel.
I'm like, I mean, I want him totake me back to the hotel.
(17:30):
He doesn't want me to be alone.
He takes me to his house, which, in a way, would seem like even
worse, which it could have beenbut because I was on my period,
the advances were made, I wasable to stop him and I feel like
that in itself protected me inthat moment, as weird and as
(17:51):
random as it could be right.
But then there's other momentswhere it's so concrete and you
know that God's hand is in it.
You know we had a Christmaswhere I'm a thrifter, I'm a
garage seller, I love doing allthat stuff anyway.
But we did have a year where wewere just broke as a joke and
Christmas was coming with threelittle kids and my mom had done
(18:11):
a few things for my kids.
But when you can't do somethingfor them, it's just the worst.
Yeah, regardless of what theworld would tell you and all of
that about materialism.
But God had just given me a lotof favor with getting little
things which I totally felt likewas God in the first place at
garage sales and differentthings.
And then we get what I think isdone, and I'm grabbing all the
(18:39):
empty boxes under the tree andthere's this card that's stuck
up in the bottom of ourChristmas tree and it's got
stickers on it like a ransomnote.
It says don't open it tillDecember 25th.
And I'm like what is this?
I asked my husband.
I asked Phil, what like did youdo this?
(18:59):
He's like it's not for me, whodid it?
And it was, I think, at thetime.
I think it was like a thousanddollars cash under our Christmas
tree on Christmas day.
And I just remember sittingthere and I start crying and the
kids are all like coming up,like why is mommy crying?
Like just so clearly seeing Godmeet.
Not, I mean, it was a need, butit was also a desire, like to
be able to provide.
And so I think he shows up inthose big, concrete ways for us
(19:22):
sometimes to make a mark in it,like I call those, like they're
little consecration moments inyour life where you know that,
no matter what you go through,no matter what it looks like, no
matter what it feels like that,no matter what you go through,
no matter what it looks like, nomatter what it feels like that,
when you put your trust in him,he will show up.
He will show up.
And then those situations thatwe put ourselves in a lot of
(19:43):
times out of just unawareness orstupidity or whatever, when we
say that God's our father, hetruly is that shepherd watching
out for every sheep, and thatsituation that I was in in high
school, that God will use themost unlikely thing but he'll
still show up.
So always there.
Gianina (20:06):
Yeah, I love what you said.
That reminds me of like when ittalks about you know, god is
our father.
Like, if we, as parents, desireto give good gifts to our kids,
even being evil, how much moreour father in heaven desires to
give us good gifts.
And I love what you said aboutit's not just filling our needs
but filling our desires, and Ithink sometimes, especially as
(20:29):
women, we feel selfish forhaving desires.
Sometimes, especially as women,we feel selfish for having
desires, especially somethingthat could seem so fleeting,
like something monetary ormaterialistic, and I just love
that.
It's like God just smiled downon you and it's like I got you,
even if it's something that theworld thinks is silly or that
(20:50):
you think is silly.
I see you.
We're actually reading inGenesis right now in our women's
Bible study in small groups andwe were talking about Hagar
this past week and that's justlike, really, something God has
been emphasizing is the God whosees.
And see all these moments whereGod just sees us.
(21:11):
He saw you, he saw your heart,he knew that your heart was for
your children and your heart wasforgiving.
I just think that's sobeautiful.
Like God, god's like.
I see you, I see that desireand that need and want, and so
that's just really beautiful.
Thank you, it is.
Kiley (21:26):
Well, and even going back to the situation when you were
a teenager, you know somebody atthat age could have been like
oh my gosh, this just totallyruined my day.
And then you had the hindsightto think well, thank you, lord.
Yes.
Jennifer (21:40):
Well, it might have also been that Jerry Springer
was on the TV when I was gettingready.
I was waiting, like my parentshad left and my dad had left the
TV on, and then Jerry Springercame on and I was like, oh my
Again, I remind you, I was verysheltered up until about that
season.
So, oh my goodness, we have aphrase around our house too,
(22:02):
that is with my kids.
I use this all the time and Ilearned this from my second
grade teacher, charlotte Jamison.
She just wrote her own book.
She's an amazing woman of God,but she shared with me years ago
and I use it and I still thinkit's so true and such a great
reminder Lots of people say it,but that when we experience
rejection, right in any form orfashion whether it's a plan that
(22:25):
gets messed up or your day getsruined or someone rejects you,
just full out that it's usuallyGod's protection.
Kiley (22:33):
Yes.
Jennifer (22:34):
Like 99.9% of the time , it's God protecting you from
something.
Gianina (22:40):
And that's so hard because we want to be mad.
Kiley (22:43):
Always Well, you want to be mad and you want what you
want and you can't understandwhy it hasn't happened for you.
And then, over time, most ofthe time, you realize okay, I
get it now Exactly, yeah, forsure.
So if someone is listeningright now and they're in a deep
valley, feeling like they'vemissed their moment with God,
(23:07):
kind of what was popping up inmy mind when you were talking
was thinking of people who maybefeel like they've never
experienced that goodness of God, like he's never shown up for
me.
I've never had that type ofblessing.
What would you say to encouragethem?
Jennifer (23:26):
Well, if I could give them a hug through the
microphone I would.
The microphone I would, becauseI think that the thing that
we've one of the things thatwe've been talking about already
, about just being seen that Goddoes see you and he sees it all
.
He sees the good, he sees thebad, he sees the ugly, but he
(23:46):
doesn't look at it and use itagainst us.
He just sees us for who we areand he's willing and ready to
wrap His arms around you theminute you say Jesus, the minute
you say God, the minute you sayI give up, the minute you say
help me.
There is a movie out that cameout about two years ago called
After Death.
You can find it on Netflix.
(24:10):
It's also on Hulu and Amazon.
You do have to pay for it.
Hopefully it will be free soon,but it is such a beautiful,
beautiful picture ofunderstanding.
It's done by a Christian moviehouse but it is scientific in
nature and they looked at asampling of people across
socioeconomics and status acrossreligions across the world,
(24:35):
socioeconomics and status acrossreligions across the world
geographic locations, and theyjust record their interpretation
of near-death and after-deathsituations where people have
gone through a near-deathexperience and then they've come
back and they just take, veryscientifically, the objective
information of what theyexperienced.
And you guys not surprising tous, but probably surprising to
the world they're all there'sthis recipe or order that things
(24:58):
happen and I won't give away.
I mean, we know how the storyends right.
Heaven is real as well as hellis real.
But there's an instance where agentleman, a young man in his
20s, has attempted to commitsuicide.
He comes out of his body, hesees himself OD'd in the
(25:19):
hospital, in the ER, and hestarts falling immediately and
has this, like just everyonethat went to hell or experienced
something about darkness, feelsthis like surge of going down
and he has the thought, thethought, urge of going down.
And he has the thought, thethought.
I remember going to vacationBible school with Joe when I was
eight or nine years old andthey talked about Jesus and he
(25:42):
said, the minute he had thatthought, he felt love, he felt
warmth, he felt arms around himand he started ascending up.
Wow, and if God shows up forsomebody in that instance where
they've turned away fromthemselves everything in the
world and they have the thoughtof Jesus, and he's there, he's
(26:06):
there.
He's there for you right now,wherever you are, you can't do
enough wrong, bad, whateverdamage, destruction you have
faced or felt.
There's not enough that you cando that will separate you from
the love of God.
If you want it, it's yours, andso I do tend to have a magnet
(26:28):
of sorts for people that havewalked through those kinds of
that are in those valleys, and Ithink that what is so cool
about God is that I tell them.
What I've already talked aboutjust a little bit already is
that if you start looking forHim, he will show up, and I
don't mean like a pile of moneyfalling from the sky and
suddenly it's not hard to dodrugs anymore.
(26:50):
Suddenly, you don't wanna pickup the alcohol.
Suddenly, you're not gonna behit, pick up the alcohol.
Suddenly, you're not going tobe hit.
There will be things, though,that you will see that God will
say I opened this opportunityfor you.
The bar's closed, you're notsupposed to be there.
Maybe let's pause and say God,help me right now, in this
moment.
Maybe the door for a job thatyou didn't want opens and you
(27:12):
think you don't want it.
Maybe you're supposed to gothere because God knows better
than we do, and it's just beingobedient when you have those
feelings, in those moments, tojust take a step and to invite
God in.
And that's why, with my book, Ifelt so strongly that, going
through every rescue that I wentthrough personally, now I
didn't go through a loss of ababy.
(27:32):
I haven't gone through adivorce.
Have I gone through some griefand losing a loved one?
Yes.
Have I gone through financialloss?
Yes.
Have I gone through healthstruggles?
Yes.
So I speak to each of thosethings that I've walked through
with an anchor of truth that theBible says.
And what God is so cool aboutdoing is that he can't go back
on His promises.
In the Bible, in the OldTestament, there was a time
(27:54):
where God started to break apromise and Moses reminded him
and said God, you promised yourpeople, and he's like you're
right, you're right, I'm notgoing to go back on my promise.
He will not go back on hispromise.
So if you know what the Biblesays, it's armor, it gives you
the power, and so you can stillbe doing all the stuff, all the
(28:16):
bad stuff, but if you know onething about God, you hold on to
that and I promise you'll startstopping some of that other
stuff and you'll start doingmore of the God stuff, and it's
just one step at a time.
It's not an overnight change.
But when you know that you'reloved and that you're seen,
that's where the transformationcan start and you'll see God
(28:37):
there, and so I have prayers inthis book.
You don't even have to know howto pray, you can just say Jesus,
help me.
But if you have a specificsituation, the Lord really
prompted me with my book to givepeople the words because I
think sometimes when we'rescared or we're mad or any of
those emotions that can get inthe way, they can block us from
(28:59):
speaking positive things overour lives out loud.
So hopefully that's a help topeople but, it's all good news.
It's all good news.
Gianina (29:09):
And I think one of the really cool things about that is
like God is not trying to bemysterious, he's not trying to
hold himself back from us.
And so when we just reach outand just say, god, show me where
you are in this situation, yeah, show me where you are in my
life.
I want to know you, I want tosee you he will, like he will
(29:32):
show up.
He's not, he's not sayingJennifer, I just want you to
chase me a little bit just justto see if you can catch me.
And then I'm just going totease you and not show you my
goodness and not reveal myselfto you.
And I remember kind of goingthrough a season, especially
when I really rededicated mylife to God, where I wanted to
(29:52):
know, like, what's my purpose,what does God want for my life,
where am I supposed to go, whatam I supposed to be doing?
And just striving in that.
And I just remember the Lordsaying Gianina, I want you to
fulfill your purpose more thanyou want to.
I want you to reach these peoplemore than you want to reach
them.
I have a purpose for you and soyou just have to rest in that
(30:16):
and trust in that and just askme.
And God wants to reveal himselfto us more than we want, than
we have that desire.
He wants to be with us morethan we want to be with him.
That's just like reallybeautiful.
And even what you shared aboutwhat happens in those moments
after death in people's lives,and I had kind of a similar just
(30:36):
vision that God has given me,where people were passing and
moving on to that next journeyin the afterlife, and God just
showed me people that we trulydid not think would be in heaven
and how he just was wrappinghis arms around them.
And there was one Sunday Ican't remember even the worship
(30:56):
song that was being sung and Godjust showed me this vision of
like this is what it's like inheaven right now.
And he showed me this vision ofjust you know all these
Christians and believers andpeople who are just kind of like
doing what we imagine peoplewould do in heaven and just
living their best life andcommuning with each other, but
also worshiping and just all thethings.
(31:19):
But then I saw people who justcould not leave the feet of
Jesus just attached to him, andhe just showed me how the people
who were attached to his feetare the people who they never
thought they were going to getthere and they knew what God
rescued them from and what Jesusrescued them from.
(31:39):
I just picture those people,like in those last moments where
they're like what if Jesus isreal?
Or just calling on the name ofJesus and they just barely make
it in.
But they make it in and they'rejust resting at his feet and so
that's just.
That's really really beautifulfor sure.
We don't have to strive in it,we just have to rest in who he
(32:00):
is, because he's already done it, we don't have to do anything.
Kiley (32:04):
So good.
I think one thing that'simportant for people to know and
understand is that he createdus to be in a relationship with
him, and all we need to do isjust want him back, and it
doesn't matter you know whatyou've done or where you've come
from.
He is, he is ready when you areand I swear, janina, I feel
(32:25):
like I'm going to cry, likeevery single episode we do.
It's just, it's so powerful tothink about.
Jennifer (32:32):
It really is beautiful I saw this, spoke to me
recently, especially with griefand yes, thank you, kylie,
because now I probably will cryas well but that this woman was
sharing her experience of losinga baby, a stillborn, and how
people were questioning theunbelievable peace that they
were experiencing as a familywhile still processing an
(32:55):
unimaginable loss.
And she was like I felt like Iwas enveloped in this blanket of
just protection and love andknowing that God's hand was in
all of it and that he saw me andshe's like.
I felt like I was doing so wellthat I got nervous.
It's going to come back fiveyears from now or 10 years from
now and I'm going to have acomplete breakdown.
And so she put herself intogrief, recovery and the first
(33:19):
week that she went, while theywere worshiping, before they
even started to teach the class,she had a vision.
The Lord said I want you to seewhat I was doing in that day in
that room.
And she was like I didn't wantto go back to that place to see
it.
I wanted to live in this placein my mind, where it was already
(33:40):
done and the baby was in heavenwith God and it was fine, even
though she was experiencing painon earth and he's like I want
you to see where I was in thatmoment with you.
And she saw the hospital roomand she's holding their baby,
who was gone.
The body, everyone's upset,weeping, the family's weeping,
the nurses are there, they'reupset, invisibly upset, and she
(34:03):
looks over and God is literallythere holding her baby and she's
alive and she's giggling Wow.
But God was crying and weepingand he was weeping for his
daughter who was in the bedholding the lifeless child, and
(34:24):
he was telling her I broke whenyou broke, and that's how great
his love is for every personthat's experiencing.
Maybe listening to this.
That is hurting in a way, whereit's not even about what you've
done, but what's been done toyou, and where you feel so much
loss and pain and you think thatGod doesn't see it.
(34:45):
He's not just there to pick youup, but he's there to cry with
you and to grieve with you.
Pick you up, but he's there tocry with you and to grieve with
you and I just I love thatpicture because we are not.
No matter what we do, whilewe're on this side of heaven,
we're going to continue to hurt,we're going to continue to have
challenges, we're going tocontinue to have valleys and
(35:08):
things that are hard, that wehave to walk through, that are
heavy, that want to take ourbreath away.
And yet he will not leave ourside and he carries the weight
of what we carry with us and forus.
Gianina (35:25):
That's so good.
Well, now that we're all crying, yeah, I really definitely want
to thank you for just being soopen today.
Just, I love the wisdom thatyou have, and so we're all kind
of different ages.
I'm in my late 30s.
Kylie, you just turned 40.
(35:45):
Is that right?
Oh, god bless you.
Kiley (35:47):
No, I'm about to be 43.
Bless you.
No, I'm about to be 43.
Yeah.
Gianina (35:53):
We have our 30s, 40s and 50s.
Jennifer (35:57):
I am going to be 51 in 14 days.
Gianina (36:01):
Wow.
Jennifer (36:02):
And, as my kids remind me, you're going into your 52nd
year.
Gianina (36:07):
They always try to make me older.
I definitely just love all ofthe wisdom, and even me, as you
know, 38, I don't considermyself a baby or young or
anything, but it's stuff that Ican learn as well and things
that I can gain from, and Idon't necessarily think that has
to just do with age, but theexperience that you have in the
wisdom, I definitely value thatand I think that it's something
(36:29):
that our listeners can really.
I think that it's something thatour listeners can really really
learn from as well, and I hopethat their ears are open to it.
And I just you mentioned theprayers that you have in your
book and you don't necessarilyhave to use something from that.
But if you could just pray forour listeners and specifically,
I think I feel I feel led.
(36:50):
What I'm kind of feeling rightnow is, even as somebody is
listening to this, they're goingwell, god's protection has been
in your life and you've seenGod in these different areas,
but I have been betrayed, I havebeen used, I have been hurt and
I don't see where God was inthose places.
(37:11):
If you can specifically prayfor that person, that's who I
feel like listener-wise, willreally benefit from that.
Jennifer (37:19):
Of course, all right.
Heavenly Father, thank you forgiving us this opportunity and
this moment to come before you.
And to lay it all down, we justlay it all down, I thank you,
god.
And to lay it all down, we justlay it all down.
I thank you, god, that you area God who sees it all, you know
all and you're ever present,meaning that you're always there
.
And I can only imagine.
(37:41):
I know there's times when Ifelt like you were far away, but
I knew that you weren't.
I just felt it in my emotions.
But I also know that there arepeople walking through right now
.
There may be people listeningright now that truly have never
been able to recognize or seeyou in the hurt and in the pain
and in the brokenness thatthey're walking in, god, and I,
just I lift that person up toyou.
(38:01):
I lift those people up to youright now, their broken hearts.
God, would you be so sweet andcould we be so trusting, even in
our brokenness, even in theirbrokenness and in their hurt,
right now, to lift up thatbroken thing to you, to lift up
every pain, to know that you canhold it all and that, if they
(38:26):
will be willing to give it toyou, god, that you would take it
and start giving them a newperspective of your hand in
their life, more than anythingfor today, but also for tomorrow
and, most importantly, overtime, god, that they would be
able to even look back and thatyou would illuminate something,
some situation, some person thatyou brought in their life, some
experience that seemed randomand didn't make sense, some
(38:49):
phone calls, some letter thatthey received in the mail, some
ad they saw on TV, something,god, to show that you were there
even in all of that pain.
God, I thank you that you canheal only the things that you
can only heal, god.
There are things that we can'theal, there are things that
doctors can't heal, but you cando it, god.
(39:10):
So I lift them up to you today.
I ask for a miracle in theirlife.
I ask for them to feel loved.
I ask for you to let them know,be known and be seen, and to
ask them to be brave enough totrust the people that you put in
their life and to trust youthat you'll carry all of their
(39:32):
todays, that you've forecastedand planned all of their
tomorrows, and that you'restrong enough and big enough to
heal all of their yesterdays,god.
We thank you, god, so much forbeing who you are In Jesus' name
amen.
Kiley (39:49):
Well, jennifer, thank you so so much For everyone
listening.
Just remember that God is notfinished with your story.
Whether you're in a valley or avictory, or both, he is still
working.
He is always working.
Thank you so much for joiningus today.
Please don't forget to sharethis episode with a friend that
you think may need encouragement.
(40:10):
Also, we're going to be sharingJennifer's book Rescued Heart
in the show notes of thisepisode, so be sure to check
that out as well.
We look forward to seeing younext time as we share more
stories from the valleys and thevictories.
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