February 5, 2025 • 42 mins
Prepare to be swept away to magical realms and epic love stories as we dive into the enchanting world of diverse sci-fi and fantasy romance with the incredible author, Elizabeth Stephens. In this fun conversation, Alesia and Elizabeth explore the unique approaches, character dynamics, and powerful representation that make Elizabeth's books stand out in the genre.
Elizabeth Stephens is an author of dark SciFi and fantasy romances, and specializes in sizzling, diverse reads starring characters of color.
In this episode, we're discussing:
- Elizabeth's writing journey and the inspirations behind her innovative storytelling
- The nuanced way she handles the concept of fated mates, creating believable and complex relationships
- The fascinating dystopian power hierarchies and diverse characters in her Omega Verse series
- The importance of representation and inclusivity in Elizabeth's worlds, and the challenges and rewards of traditional publishing
Elizabeth Stephens' books are a must-read for anyone seeking immersive, empowering, and genre-bending sci-fi and fantasy romance. Dive into her captivating worlds, where diverse characters navigate intricate relationships and power dynamics, all while showcasing the transformative power of storytelling. Be inspired to explore Elizabeth's expansive bibliography and connect with her online to stay up-to-date on her latest releases.
CONNECT WITH ELIZABETH STEPHENS:
BOOKS/AUTHORS MENTIONED:
Population Series (Amazon)
Beasts of Gatamora Series (Amazon)
Xiveri Mates Series (Amazon)
His to Claim by Taylor Vaughn (Amazon)
Venomous by P. Fletcher (Amazon)
Running list of books mentioned (Doc)
Thank you for listening to the We Read Smut Podcast! If you enjoyed this episode, take a screenshot of the episode to post in your stories and tag @WeReadSmut. Don’t forget to follow, rate, and review the podcast.
Connect with Alesia:
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Alesia Galati (00:00):
Prepare to be swept away to magical realms and
(00:03):
epic love stories. Today, we'rejoined by the incredible
ELIZABETH STEVENS to talk aboutThe enchanting world of diverse
sci fi and fantasy romance.
Listener discretion is advisedthis podcast contains mature
content intended for adultaudiences only. Elizabeth, I am
fangirling so hard, so excitedto have you on the podcast. I
(00:28):
have been, oh man, reading yourbooks. I want to say, since
about 2021 I want to say, end of2021 I blew through the
population series and was like,Oh my God, yes, I need more.
Loved it so much. Loved thecharacters. He created this post
(00:51):
apocalyptic, dystopian type ofworld with a badass FMC owning
her ability to be like, I don'tneed anybody else. I'm just
gonna do my thing. And then gotinto the Xavier mate series, and
actually did not read a lot ofalien romances. But in the same
sense, I feel like your approachis very different than a lot of
(01:16):
other authors, in that a lot ofother authors tend to do the
crash landed or Mars Needswomen, or the space and apps
type of stuff, whereas yours islike 1000s of years of humans
being on another planet and theninteracting with aliens, and so
(01:39):
I feel like it just it createdso much more backstory. Probably
gave you a lot more flexibilitywith your approach, which kind
of leads me to, how did you getinto writing and creating these
really incredible stories,
Elizabeth Stephens (01:58):
like my writing origin story, that I
always say is pretty muchattributed directly to my mom,
because I really was into theAmerican Girl dolls when I was a
small child, and in order to getone, I had to read all of the
books in the series, but thereare shocker no black American
Girl dolls, so I wanted one thatlooked like Me, and in order to
(02:22):
get one, my mom said I had towrite a story. And so I ended up
writing Funny enough, like a scifi Space Odyssey, middle grade
Space Odyssey, like on this old,ancient hunk of junk computer
that I still think I havesomewhere. Never ended up
punishing it, but I did get myAmerican goal doll, and so that
(02:42):
was kind of the the origin, butwith the very main series, just
the different approach that Ikind of had that started from
just sheer frustration with thecrash landing trope or the
abduction trope, because there'sactually, logically, only one
possible storyline there, whichis, I've been abducted. How do I
(03:03):
get back home? Or I crash landedhere? How do I get back home?
And I really can't tell you howit makes me, like, twitchy when
you get to that end scene andthey're like, actually, I've
decided to stay. I'm like, No,we all knew already you were
gonna stay. Oh, it's this wasjust a complete waste of my
time. So I was like, How can Icircumvent that as a storyline
(03:27):
and actually have something moreinteresting? And I did read
like, I think two of kind of mymajor inspo books were venomous
by Penelope Fletcher, becausethat was one where it was an
alien abduction, but therewasn't ever really a talk of
going home. It was just, that'sit. And then there was his
acclaim by Taylor Vaughn, whichis Theodore Taylor, and Yvonne,
(03:49):
which I thought was really good.
It was just very dark andcreepy. So I was hoping to do
something maybe on the lighterside of that.
Alesia Galati (04:00):
Yes, I read Taylor Vaughn's after, like,
more recently, like, in the lastmonth or two, and trying to
explain to my husband what abreeding ceremony was. I'm sure
I'm on a list somewhere, like,trying to explain this. And I
was like, it's fine. It worksout, but also it's really
(04:22):
intense. But I did not get thatat all from yours. It, while
they does have some elements of,wait a minute, we have this
negotiation. And this isactually not aligned with the
supreme ruler and what he wantsto be happening on this planet.
But you have faded mates inthere, which I think you do this
(04:43):
so beautifully. A lot of them,like, it doesn't matter you're
with this person, period, andthat can be really frustrating.
And even thinking about, I wantto say it's your second book,
where it's like, he does notwant to be with her at all. He
has so many pred. This isagainst humans. And she's like,
(05:04):
Look, I'm just trying to do thebest thing for my people. I'm
trying to just make this work.
She's religious. He is not like,there's just so many opposing
things that even though they'refaded mates, maybe it's Book
Three, because second one is onthe ice planet four. Oh my
goodness, it's like all of themare together in my brain,
because they're all sowonderful. They're seriously go
(05:24):
read the whole thing. I think Iblew through all of them within
a couple months. But I feel likeit's just such a beautiful way
of approaching faded mates,where it's not like, No, we're a
slave to this thing inside of usthat's telling that we're
telling us that we're supposedto be with this other person,
even if we don't want to. So whywas that important for you?
Elizabeth Stephens (05:46):
Like, a lot of my writing comes from like,
what I've seen and read andliked, but I think could be a
little bit better. And so one ofthe things that I realized that
fated mates does and doesn't dois that what it doesn't do is it
doesn't create a believable lovestory, because it just is a
trigger, and then there's asexual attraction. And after
(06:07):
you've had sex with the sameperson enough times like you can
kind of probably like thatanybody you know. So there has
to be something else there,which is why this is a very mate
series. I do a one sided, fadedmates. So for the varaxians and
like the alien species, who arefamiliar with the concept, like
theirs is usually instantlytriggered, whereas the human
(06:28):
females have to like come intotheir like faded mate thing, the
Zana. Zana has to hit them at acertain point for it to be
triggered, which I thought wasfun, because it's an easy way to
create an enemies to loversfriction without having to try
super duper hard. The otherthing that faded mates does,
however, is that, unlike abelievable love story, it lets
(06:52):
you create, Oh, what did myfriend call it the other day? My
in real life friend was like thebook community needs to start
adopting, not like a spicemeter, but like a spice
frequency or something. I don'tremember what you called it, but
basically to say, this isn't aslow burn, this is like a fast,
slow, slow, slow, fast, fast.
Like, it's like different, likespice like patterns. And that's
(07:15):
one thing that I really like todo in my books, is create
different spice patterns. Somaybe one couple doesn't have
sex until the very end, but thenthe other couples have explosive
sex from on page one, you know.
And so that's the thing thatfaded mates can do, is that you
can use it for that at any pointin the story, which I think is
great, because you can work onbuilding a believable love
(07:36):
story, while at the same timenot depriving your readers of
what they want to read. Here
Alesia Galati (07:40):
for the smut, I totally get it.
Elizabeth Stephens (07:43):
Gotta have go yes.
Alesia Galati (07:45):
And now your omega verse series takes a
slightly different approach. Socould you talk through that as
well? For anyone who's like,wait, what's Omega verse? What
is it? And then, how do youincorporate the fated mates
differently in that series,versus like the severe mate
series.
Elizabeth Stephens (08:02):
It's funny when I describe Omega verse,
because to me, Omega verserepresents a dystopian power
hierarchy, not a sex thing, butlike most people will associate
it with, like, Wolf's packdynamics, where you have an
alpha, a beta, and then, likeomega, or I don't even really, I
don't know how wolves work, butin either case, it's kind of a
(08:23):
sexual tool. So if you haveomegas, then they go into heats
and alphas can go into ruts andalphas and omegas pair and lots
of fun, spicy stuff happens. ButI really like it for the way
that I use it in my dark fantasyseries, which is Dark City omega
and Shadowlands omega, morebooks coming. The Alpha sit at
(08:46):
the very top. There's not,there's not that many of them.
Betas make the dominant class,and then Omegas are the fewest.
And my omegas all have magic,and my alphas rule the cities,
and some of them can shift intothese monster creatures, because
I just thought that would besuper duper fun. And where faded
mates comes in is that obviouslyyou have this chemistry between
alphas and omegas, a naturalsexual chemistry. And that was
(09:10):
really fun to use, particularlywith this dystopian structure,
because my Omegas are all kindof living in fear of being
discovered or being owned by analpha, which again, creates a
nice enemies to lovers, tension,and then my alphas are all as
soon as an omega is discovered,they're trying to claim that one
(09:30):
because it increases their powerand can enhance their legacy
with offspring and that kind ofstuff. So that's the way that I
can use it.
Alesia Galati (09:39):
When I was reading your it's beast of get
beasts of gadamora Correct. Ishow you say that last one,
because we're all reading it.
Nobody's reading this to us,unless you're listening to the
audiobook in that one. What Ithought you did so incredibly
was the hierarchy under.
(10:00):
Understanding of the betas beingsuch a huge class of people that
were seen as less than becauseof their lack of either being
alphas or omegas, and themrising up and being like, wait a
minute, we're important too. Andlike having a legit reason of
(10:20):
being like, No, this is why I'mtalking about trash city people
here, like that side. I reallythought that how you approached
that was just so realistic tohumanity. And then adding in the
Omega element of being like,seen as they have to be
(10:41):
protected. They used to be putaway. They have to not be seen,
not be heard, all of that, whichI think a lot of women can
sympathize and empathize withand be like, Yeah, I've been
there, done that, but lettingthem come into their power and
having such incredible power tobe like, No, I actually saved
(11:02):
the guy one or two times. I justthink that how you do that is so
empowering for the readers. Wasthat intentional? And what is
the maybe some feedback thatyou've gotten from people around
that dynamic? Yeah,
Elizabeth Stephens (11:17):
I think that's definitely it's hard to
call it intentional, because Ithink it's there's a reason that
all of my main female characterstend to be women of color, and
tend to be in these positions ofcoming into their power with the
support of their partner,because I think it's something
that we could probably use a lotmore of in regular society. And
so it makes me feel good, butgosh, hearing you talk about
(11:39):
that those books just gets me soexcited because of where the
series is going. But likeMerlin, I have to say she's the
beta leader of this gang ofpeople called Trash city, and
they're all betas, and they areworking in cahoots with the big
bad guy in this thing becausethey want to be the right hand
of the devil so that they canget theirs when they dismantle
(12:00):
the regime, but she is actually,I think my all time. She's,
like, closely tied with Jack,who's the bad guy from
population, but she might be,like, my all time favorite
villain character, and I'm just,like, deeply obsessed with her.
Yeah, she's a lot. She's reallyfun. But yeah, I think more of
the feedback I get is less aboutlike, how my books feel it's
(12:23):
like a woman reading them, andmore how it feels as like a
woman of color reading them. Iget a lot of feedback about,
Wow, I like, picked up thisfantasy book because it had the
black woman on the cover. Butlike, I'm just so not used to
reading a black woman in thisrole. Like, it's just so
important to me to just have,like representation, just in any
(12:43):
book, not just like blacksuffering books, and it's hard
to find or like books aboutblackness in general. Like it
doesn't even have to be blacksuffering, but it's, oh, here's
this amazing fantasy rooted inAfrican mythology. And I think
that's really cool. But Iactually just I want to read
Harry Potter, not Harry Potteranymore, because that woman's
lost the card, but I want toread the Hunger Games. And just
(13:06):
so happen to find the maincharacter in those books be
somebody I can relate to. And sothat's just more my style.
Within that there are obvious,like, very clear, heavy handed
elements of like racism andsexism and just classism and
dealing with all of the ismsthroughout all of my books. Is
Alesia Galati (13:29):
that something that just happens, or is it
something that you're reallyintentional about as you're
creating these
Elizabeth Stephens (13:35):
Well, I think I tend to write just the
nature of the books that I writetend to be dark, and because I
work in fantasy and sci filandscapes, like, it just lends
itself to creating those kindsof class and hierarchical
structures. I think, like, maybebook like Lord the rings didn't
really have that kind of setup.
Everyone was just like, livingin perfect harmony in their
(13:58):
little communities. But like, Ithink maybe that just seems so
fantastical to me. It doesn'tseem realistic enough. And yeah,
so it just, it seems to just bewhat comes most naturally,
Alesia Galati (14:11):
I think, like Star Wars, but make it black and
women leading everything. Yes,yeah, that's more
Elizabeth Stephens (14:19):
Yeah, or even, like Dune, but remove all
of the crazy over the top sexistelements. I really, I can't. I
have a whole dune rant. I can'tstand it. But yeah, like, more
like on those vibes than on theLord of the Rings side of the
spectrum,
Alesia Galati (14:32):
you have beasts of gadamora being a and I
actually so funny. And this isprobably me being like, wait,
what where are we? What do we?
What is happening? I did notrealize that it was more of like
a dystopian future type of book.
And so there were moments whereI was reading it and you said,
(14:55):
like superhero landing. And Iwas like, Wait, how do they know
what that is? I. And then it waslike, Wait, oh, okay. Or you
there was like a Jesusreference, like, something about
something. And I was just like,how do they know what that is?
Oh, and then it just tied, like,it made me realize, like, Oh,
this is the direction that we'regoing in. The story, cool, okay,
(15:18):
I'm here for it,
Elizabeth Stephens (15:19):
yeah, beasts of catamora, I was actually like
a return to my messy roots,because I wrote the population
series first, and that was likewhen I was still like a hobby
author, and was just likeputting books out wasn't
intending to make any money offof it. That book had to go
through three different COVIDrevisions because I just
(15:39):
couldn't figure out what it was.
It's sci fi, it's fantasy, it'svampires, it's aliens, it's
super bloody, really violent,and there's like, sex, like lots
of spice, like, it's just allover the place. And I love that.
I love not writing to genre. Ithink it's so fun to blend. But
then I was like, when 2020 I gotreally into sci fi romance. And
(16:03):
then I was like, let me try todo this properly. And so then I
wrote, like, this very mateseries, which is just alien
romance. Sci fi romance, likevery clearly fits into its box,
but beasts of gadamora came tome, and I was just like, I just
wanted it to be what it was,without having to try to make it
like a real fantasy and sothat's why you like, go in. And
it's a complaint I've gotten.
(16:25):
People are like, this is afantasy book, but there's like,
this modern city with like,coffee shops in it and stuff.
And I'm like, Yeah, that'sbecause that's exactly what I
wanted to write. And one of thethings that I like writing a lot
is, and what I did in this verymate series is I cannot
understand how authors spendlike, 30 books on the same
planet. I'm like, This is soboring, there's no there's
(16:50):
nothing new to be discoveredhere. And one of the things that
I wanted to avoid when I saidabout writing beasts of gadamora
was I didn't want to get trappedin the same world building with
every book. So that's why everybook is in a different city, and
every city is completelydifferent. Like Dark City is
like a modern metropolis.
Shadowlands is an ancientmedieval civilization. Book
(17:10):
Three is a Viking Village. It'sjust out there. Yeah,
Alesia Galati (17:19):
I love it, though. I think that it really
makes it unique. And youmentioned a little bit ago about
how all of your female maincharacters, or the majority of
them are black, obviously that'simportant to you, because you're
black woman, and being able tocreate that representation and
(17:40):
create really satisfyingrelationships where they have
partners that are lifting themup, that are supporting them,
that believe them to the ends ofthe earth, or will follow them
to the ends of the earth. Ithink is just such a beautiful
dynamic to create. You had thiselement of religion in the
Xavier mate series, and I'mcurious how you because this is
(18:03):
1000s of years after thesehumans have crash landed, and so
many of their religions havemelded together. Is what I got
as I was reading it. How did youcreate that? And why did you
feel like that was important? I
Elizabeth Stephens (18:16):
lived in the Middle East for a while, and so
it's always just been a secondhome to me, and like, the use of
the Arabic language comes backin book seven, because my main
female character, she's anEgyptian interpreter, and I
think that it also just seemslike a natural thing that there
(18:38):
would still be religion, even inlike a super far off future. But
I liked the idea that one Ididn't want to use one
particular religionspecifically, but I thought that
it made sense that, like theAbrahamic religions would melt
into one. Maybe that's my utopicvision for how religion could
(18:58):
look. Yeah. So I thought Sparrowwas like an interesting use case
for that, and to get to explore,you get to explore that a little
bit more also in the littlenovella that comes exiled from
Nobu that comes after book two.
But it was just it was a funthing to include, though it's
obviously outside of my comfortzone. I'm not mahajabi, I don't
wear a headscarf, and I'm notparticularly religious myself.
(19:20):
So I I always tell, likeauthors, when you're doing
something you're not familiarwith, try to do as little as
possible, maximize where you'regoing with it, but do as little
as possible. And so I don't havea whole lot of characters that
are deeply religious and stuff,just because it's so far outside
of my wheelhouse. But Idefinitely, I thought Sarah was
such an important character. Shedefinitely needed her own book.
(19:42):
Yeah,
Alesia Galati (19:44):
and I think that how you did it was so beautiful,
especially as someone who has alot of religious trauma,
fundamentalist Christian trauma,it didn't feel like it took me
out of the story, because it wassprinkled in. And so beautifully
as a way of like devotion andmorals, rather than a deity,
(20:08):
which I think is where,personally, where I feel that a
lot of organized religionsnotice I said organized
religions tend to veer toward,is the idea of like, very cult
like behavior. We're the onlyones that have the truth. We're
the only ones that know the wayeveryone else is going somewhere
else. But I feel like what youdid was just very beautiful,
(20:31):
from the point of devotiontoward something higher than
oneself, but also from a moralsstandpoint of being good, doing
good, encouraging others to alsolive that kind of life. I
thought you did it sobeautifully. You mentioned the
one where you go back to Earth.
And why can I not? I've got youhave your own, like, whole shelf
(20:52):
over here. So if you're notwatching the video, I'll have to
post a picture of it, but youhave your whole shelf over here,
but the one where they go backto Earth, I want more of that,
and I believe you have more ofthat coming. Is that true? Let
us know. Yeah,
Elizabeth Stephens (21:11):
I'm super excited. I was invited to
participate in the crazy, coolproject next year. I'm really
excited to hopefully someday, inthe near future, get to tell you
guys what it actually is, butthat will involve a short it's a
short story, a shorter story forme, but a return to that planet.
(21:32):
And it's I had written part ofthe story already, and then I
wasn't sure if I was going touse it. I was like, maybe this
is not right for this particularproject. And then I reread the
opening. It's just like I wrote,like, the dumbest female
character I've ever written, andshe everything. I'm just
obsessed with her, like shedoesn't do anything right. And
it's just like such a departurefor me, because all of my female
(21:54):
characters tend to be, like,very capable and serious and
like determined, and she's justlike a floundering idiot, and
it's a lot of fun. Yeah, it'sreally a lot of fun.
Alesia Galati (22:05):
Oh, I love that.
You just follow your creativity.
You are also a self publishedand Trad published author.
Elizabeth Stephens (22:14):
The Trad book doesn't come out until
June,
Alesia Galati (22:17):
okay, but very soon this year, for sure that
we're this episode goes out, youwill have had both. How does
that kind of differ for you inwhat you're able to create for
the readers? I know I went toKennedy Ryan's book tour
recently. Absolutely lovely, andwas wonderful. But she was
talking about how she had triedto start as traditionally
(22:40):
published and as a black woman,it was very difficult, because
they wanted her to write whitepeople. They wanted her to write
a certain style of book. And shewas like, I don't want to do
that. But now that she's I don'twant to say proven, because she
didn't have anything to prove.
But now that she has shown theindustry that, like, hey, black
romances can make money theysell that now she's able to
(23:03):
demand what she deserves forthese stories. And so as someone
who's doing both, how does thatkind of feel? What do you think
the future is for people wholook like you and I to either
Trad publish or indie publish?
Yeah,
Elizabeth Stephens (23:21):
I am. I could talk forever about this. I
think it's a really coolposition to be in, and I'm
really grateful to be in it. ButI also started, originally
trying to try to publish, like,way decades, literally a couple,
like, over a decade ago, now,way over a decade ago, I was in
college when I finished my firstbook, which I still have. I
don't know what I'm doing withit, but I Yeah, rejection after
(23:45):
rejection, just tons ofrejections. Like, never really
got a definitive answer as to,like, why my books weren't
getting picked up or anythinglike that, but then eventually
decided to do it myself. Andthen, of course, as you prove
that you can make money. Thingshappen for you. But I will also
say that in this entireexperience, and it makes me want
(24:05):
to cry my Trad experience, theperson and the reason that I
actually have a Trad contract isa black woman in the industry.
So she actually reached out tome, because I would never have
gone back into the querytrenches. That's just not for
me. And indie has been reallyfun so far. It was, to me,
always like a nice to have to beable to try and publish, but it
wasn't something I was activelygoing to pursue just because of
(24:27):
my previous experience. But Iwas contacted by an editor at
the time at Harper Collins, andshe was like, working with this
particular imprint, which was,like digital rights only or
something. And so it wasn'treally my speed, but she kind of
sensed like that wasn't reallywhere I was at in my career, and
she hooked me up with an agent,and it's because of her that I
(24:47):
got my agent who then got me adeal. And I think that woman was
either demoted or fired later,and I just it pinches. I can
just feel of my heart, justlittle pieces of my heart
shattering off. Because I thinkeven like. Like the woman who
wrote yellow face, whose nameI'm blanking on, she did the
speech that really sat with me,and she talked about how in the
90s or the 2000s or something,there was a small spike in,
(25:09):
like, black women authors beingpublished. And it all went back
directly to one single acquiringeditor at a publishing house.
And like, this is shocking and,like, appalling to me that this
is actually the case. So it'stough, and, like, I have a lot
of misgivings about Trad, forsure, and I have the constant
(25:30):
feeling that I'm being underpaidwhether or not it's true,
whether or not it's true, andI'm again, that's not to say
that I'm not super happy aboutmy contract, and I am so excited
about my book, and I have beenreally happy with my editors and
stuff at Montlake so far. Like,I asked for a black
developmental editor, and they,like, scrambled and found me
(25:50):
what I was looking for. I waslike, made sure that the people
represented on my cover wereactually both black and not
weirdly whitewashed or anythinglike that. And that was very
clearly done. Everything's beentaken super seriously, and it's
made me feel like, verycomfortable, but it is still
just, I think it's a precariousplace to be in. You know, when
one of my complaints on socialmedia, before I took a little
(26:12):
social break, was just in myorbit, just naturally, I see a
lot of white authors being like,oh my gosh, I got my deal. Like,
it six figures. Cool. Oh my god,I got a seven figure deal. And
I'm just like, it's crazy thatthat's just like, randomly
happening to the people that Iknow, and it's only happening to
one of the people I know. It'sonly happening to white women
(26:33):
authors. And I'm not seeing anyof my author besties of color
coming out. I think I'veliterally seen one, and that was
Kimberly lemming. And I'm like,so happy for her, like, yeah,
like, she deserves it. It'sjust, it's like, a little
frustrating when you feel likethere's a big imbalance in
what's going on. Still, thatsaid, despite all of my like,
(26:57):
general harping about Trad, I amreally excited about what I was
able to deliver. I think I had alot of apprehension about what
they were going to let meinclude in the book. And I'm
pleased to announce that I wasable to slip in a nice nodding
scene in my contemporaryromance. Yeah, I went a totally
(27:23):
insane direction with it. Andwas like, I wonder if they're
gonna mind that be like,anyways, I don't want to spoil
it, um, but like, halfwaythrough the book, the genre
just, like, dramaticallychanges. And no, they were like,
super down with it, and a lot offun. And it's a longer book two,
which I always really like, andyeah, and it's just, it's been
super fun working on thisseries. For sure. I'm working on
(27:46):
Book Two right now andabsolutely stoked. The other
great thing about Trad, I willsay, is just also, like the
actual delivery of it. So rightnow, it feels so strange because
I don't have anything like, Idon't have a pre order or
anything to announce yet, evenfor me personally, but I
actually have four books due byMay, and I've finished two of
them so far, two for Montlake,and then the other two are for
(28:09):
like, secret projects coming outin 2025 and 2026 but both
following a Trad model where Ijust delivered the book and then
they do everything else. And soit's just been strange because
I'm in a writing frenzy, and itdoes feel very good at the end
of the day to just be able to,like, shove something off and
then just be done and not haveto worry about it. Right now, I
also have another book that'sfinished that I was hoping to be
(28:30):
able to get out by February, butI really want to simultaneously
release Audio, and I don't knowif I'm going to get there, but
yeah, I finished writing thebook, and it was just like,
after dealing with Trad and justbeing able to send it to
somebody. Just that I was like,Oh, dang it. Like I have to,
like, I have to go through andedit it, like, clean it up
myself before I can send it toanybody. And then I have to
(28:51):
figure even out what kind of acover I want. And just, it's
been really nice just gettingbrief sent to me, and me just
being able to say what I likeand don't like. So definitely
trade offs for sure, but so far,trad's been a nice experience.
Alesia Galati (29:06):
Yeah, I think that in the future, and I'm
seeing this in podcasting, sinceI work in the industry, that I
think in the near future, withthe algorithm changes that I
think we're gonna see in thecoming years, as well as
censorship that I think a lot ofpeople are going to move towards
mediums that they have morecontrol over, because I think a
(29:28):
lot of projects will get cut, orpeople will be denied being able
to write or speak or postcertain things, and so I think
It'll be interesting to see howthat impacts the romance
industry specifically. Butthat's why things like this are
really important, because thenwe can get the message out there
(29:49):
without anybody editing us down,because it's just us talking.
But yeah, I think that it'sgoing to be really interesting
to see over the next 10 years orso how these changes are going
to impact. Uh, the future ofwritten word, spoken word, etc.
But I think we're gonna see moreindie authors going that route,
(30:09):
which I think will be veryinteresting. But you do, you
have more control over it.
There's but there is more workto be done, because you have to
do everything from finding aneditor or doing the edit it to
yourself, to figuring out thecover, or hiring someone to do
it, and a lot of it is upfrontcosts, rather than, Oh, I made
the money with the company orthe publisher, so there's a lot
(30:29):
of trade offs there. But yeah,that's, I'm glad that you're
seeing something different rightnow for you, because one you
deserve it. Like 100% youdeserve it. And so I'm glad that
you're seeing some positivefeedback with you having that
Trad deal, because, yes, youdeserve it. Your books are
(30:52):
incredible, and the world youcreate are just so incredibly
luxurious. Like, I feel likethat's like, the only way that I
can describe the world.
Sometimes I'll just randomlythink about one of the worlds
that you created, or one of theplanets that you created, and
I'm just like, man, wonder whatthey're doing on that Pleasure
Planet. I sometimes
Elizabeth Stephens (31:12):
think about that too. I'm like, man, what I
wouldn't give you on that benchright now, right? I will. I also
realized that in theconversation about Trad, I was
really only thinking about, likemy traditional publisher, but
actually, like one of the otherTrad experiences I've had this
past year was with audio, andthat has been like game changer
for me, only because audio is soexpensive and the return on your
(31:37):
investment as an author is quitepoor. So I did an experiment
where I was going to try to doall three, but my German
translator didn't work out. Andso I ended up doing the first
three very mates books in Frenchand audio, and I launched them
both around the same time. Andthe plan was then to just pick
up whichever one did better andjust finish that out and then go
(32:00):
back and my French translationsprobably cost me around 3000 a
book and earned out maximum, andthree months a book, and my
audio cost me around 5000 ormore a book, and took 10 months
(32:20):
on average to earn out. And it'sbecause audible takes 60% or 40%
or whatever it is, and thealternative is to try to go
wide, which is just reallycomplicated. And so when I was
picked up for audio, it justfelt like such a blessing,
because it wasn't. It's not thatI feel like I'm actually, I
haven't really earned anythingyet, after my advance, but
(32:42):
you're being paid up front foryour work, which is a huge coup,
and you're actually being ableto just provide access. So for
me, the access piece is reallyimportant, just because I would
love to be able to provide mybooks in all formats, but it's
just not possible. So I've been,like, deeply happy with the
audio experience so far?
Alesia Galati (33:02):
Yeah, I don't think people realize how much
goes into audio creation, eventhinking about I know the
numbers are very similar forthose who work in voice acting
as well as podcast production,which is what I work in. And one
thing that my company does it'svery different than a lot of
(33:23):
other ones like podcastproduction, is that they'll just
listen, especially if you'resending it over to the
Philippines or just like avirtual assistant, they'll
listen for those like longpauses or those types of things.
They'll clean out some UMS usingAI features, whereas my team
listens to every word, we're allwomen in the United States, and
(33:44):
we will listen to every word andmake sure that you and your
guest sound fantastic, becausewe've had moments where we're
like, Nope, that's that was notwhat you meant to say at all.
Cut, delete, or, Oh, wait, thatdoesn't align with my clients
values, right? Like I had, I hada guest say that ADHD happens
(34:10):
because of what we eat, how wesleep, etc. And I was like,
that's not medical information.
And I was like, team, take thatout. I feel like they would know
that, but just in case, no, wedon't agree with that. That's
actually not true. We're notgoing to put that. I'm not going
to have that on my platform. Butit takes four times the length
of the audio to edit it.
Elizabeth Stephens (34:32):
Yeah. I mean, I can't even imagine,
because you're like, thinkingabout editing a book with just
Microsoft Word, Cut, delete. Butlike, audio is a whole different
ball game, yes,
Alesia Galati (34:42):
making sure that it's all leveled to the right
way that it goes back and forthbetween, especially if you have
dual voice actors. Like, there'sso much that goes into it that I
don't think people even realize.
They're just like, oh, pop inthe new audiobook. It'd be good.
Yes, it will be good. Because alot of effort. Went into that so
yes, please don't get thingsillegally, first and foremost.
(35:04):
But also, like kudos to thosevoice actors and the authors and
all the people that put in somuch effort to make books
accessible to people who maybecannot read books visibly, right
or physically, who need to beable to listen to audiobooks, or
that's how they enjoy processingthe information, right? There's
(35:25):
so many benefits to it, but itis. It's so much effort and
time. But yeah, that's reallycool, though, that you had that
experience as well. Because I'mstarting to see a lot more of
those, just from the people thatI interact with, of those Trad
deals coming up, where theyalready have the book, but then
they're selling their audiorights to be able to make the
book more accessible, yeah,which I think is wonderful,
(35:48):
especially for people who needthat. Yeah.
Elizabeth Stephens (35:53):
I mean, any halfway decently successful
author will tell you, don't sellyour audio rights. Do it
yourself. But for a lot of us,that's just not an option. So I
want to have audio books, andsome of the distributors I work
with, dreamscape and podiumright now, and both have been
fantastic. Yeah,
Alesia Galati (36:13):
that's really good. You have some fun. Is
there any fun projects you cantell us about your books. So
your Trad book is coming out inthe summertime, right? So what
can we expect from that? Sincethat is something you can tell
us,
Elizabeth Stephens (36:28):
yes, that is. So I have a two book deal
with montlick. Now, I'm hopingthat I will be able to do three
books in the theory, possiblyfour, but no more than four, but
it's like a really weird. Iwanted to write something in,
like a contemporary romancestyle. But actually, do you like
I just think that people thatwrite contemporary romance and a
(36:50):
contemporary romance author willbe like writing fantasies so
hard, like the world building,trying to get everything right,
like new languages, new customs,new cultures. But to me, that's
all really easy because it'sjust stuff in your head. But
trying to write contemporaryromance where you have to abide
by the laws of man and nature isjust so hard, even if you're
(37:10):
trying to the worst for me istrying to set something in a
real city where you're like, No,I have to, like, Google Maps, my
I don't want, like, some NewYorker be like, that's not what
that part of the Central Parklooks like. It's really
annoying. So I approachedcontemporary romance from what I
would call like an ELIZABETHSTEVENS lens. So it's set in
(37:31):
modern times, but we havebasically, like Superman style,
like a bunch of aliens fell outof the sky 20 years ago as
children, and they didn'tremember where they came from.
They look like people, but eachof them has a unique and
fantastic ability. And Iactually wrote this before
watching the boys, but after Itold a couple people about it,
(37:52):
they were like, oh, you shouldwatch the boys. And then I
watched the boys, and I waslike, Okay, I guess that's what
I wrote, but it's basically thecorporatization, the
commodities, the capitalization,whatever you know, what I'm
trying to say of superheroes andgovernments got involved, and
then they created theseorganizations to manage them as
(38:14):
brands, and there became like asuperhero cohort And a villain
cohort, and trying to place bidsto try to get some of the
unaffiliated ones to join eitherside, and then they perform like
heroic deeds around the worldand get brand endorsements and
shine pretty for pictures. Butthe first book opens with a PR
(38:35):
firm run by like a very shy kindof neuro divergent woman, and
she's tasked with trying toconvince this unaffiliated guy
who has, like, firepowers and islike, very gruff and doesn't
like people to join the heroesteam. And it's obviously in my
style, kind of like an enemystill lovers, they have, like, a
(38:56):
lot of friction and just don'tget along, and that kind of
thing. But there's obviously,because I couldn't control
myself, like, a lot of layersinto this. And so there's
actually, like, some supervillains that you don't meet
right on the first page. Andthen there's some unusual, like
Alien stuff that ends uphappening. And so there's a
(39:18):
little bit of a monster romanceelement that comes into play in
this and I don't know if thatwas a good description, it
probably was, but
Alesia Galati (39:28):
literally, just contemporary romance with an
ELIZABETH STEVENS bin, I willbuy that.
Elizabeth Stephens (39:35):
I call it a contemporary superhero workplace
romance with a monster twist.
Alesia Galati (39:44):
So much so if someone has never read your
books, shame first. But if theyhave never read your books,
where should they begin betweenall of your different series
that you have available at this
Elizabeth Stephens (39:58):
time? I think it depends. Depends on how
dark you like your books. I'dsay like the very mates that
series tends to be on thelighter ish side, which is not
saying much, because it's also alittle bit of a darker sci fi
romance. But you can start withtaken to veraxia, which is like
high sci fi takes place on otherworlds, alien heroes who look
like aliens and human women. Oryou can move slightly darker and
(40:23):
go to beasts of gadamora, whichis my chaotic, dark fantasy
series with an Omega versehierarchy. Omegas have magic and
berserker shifts and shift intomonsters. Or you can go darkest
yet, which is based on Earthdystopian post apocalyptic vibes
with alien vampire heroes andhuman heroines. But all of my
(40:47):
books have happily ever aftersand just follow one couple. So
you can start pretty muchanywhere, and you'll get a full
story out of it. Yeah,
Alesia Galati (40:59):
yes, literally, you could start with any of
those. I know I started withpopulation first, and then went
into severe and then beast ofgadamora. But yeah, I think you
could literally start with anyof them, and you would be
thoroughly happy definitely gocheck those out. Elizabeth, this
has been so much fun. Thank youso much for being on where can
(41:23):
people find you? Get to know youhang out with you by your books.
Yeah,
Elizabeth Stephens (41:27):
my website is books by elizabeth.com but
you can also find me on socialmedia, e Stevens author,
ELIZABETH STEVENS author, or onAmazon. And my books are all
available on audio everywhere,except population series, which
is audible exclusive. And all ofmy books were in the KU program.
(41:48):
But I've actually just recentlymoved to the very main series
wide as a test. So you cancurrently find the very mates
books anywhere in ebook. And allof my books are available
everywhere. Too awesome. And
Alesia Galati (41:59):
we'll make sure we have links for that in the
show notes, in the descriptionfor anyone who's doing other
things while they're listening,and that way, they can make sure
to grab those links again. Thankyou so much.
Elizabeth Stephens (42:09):
Thank you so much. I'm super happy to have
been invited. Thank you. You.
Prepare to be swept away to magical realms and
(00:03):
epic love stories. Today, we'rejoined by the incredible
ELIZABETH STEVENS to talk aboutThe enchanting world of diverse
sci fi and fantasy romance.
Listener discretion is advisedthis podcast contains mature
content intended for adultaudiences only. Elizabeth, I am
fangirling so hard, so excitedto have you on the podcast. I
(00:28):
have been, oh man, reading yourbooks. I want to say, since
about 2021 I want to say, end of2021 I blew through the
population series and was like,Oh my God, yes, I need more.
Loved it so much. Loved thecharacters. He created this post
(00:51):
apocalyptic, dystopian type ofworld with a badass FMC owning
her ability to be like, I don'tneed anybody else. I'm just
gonna do my thing. And then gotinto the Xavier mate series, and
actually did not read a lot ofalien romances. But in the same
sense, I feel like your approachis very different than a lot of
(01:16):
other authors, in that a lot ofother authors tend to do the
crash landed or Mars Needswomen, or the space and apps
type of stuff, whereas yours islike 1000s of years of humans
being on another planet and theninteracting with aliens, and so
(01:39):
I feel like it just it createdso much more backstory. Probably
gave you a lot more flexibilitywith your approach, which kind
of leads me to, how did you getinto writing and creating these
really incredible stories,
Elizabeth Stephens (01:58):
like my writing origin story, that I
always say is pretty muchattributed directly to my mom,
because I really was into theAmerican Girl dolls when I was a
small child, and in order to getone, I had to read all of the
books in the series, but thereare shocker no black American
Girl dolls, so I wanted one thatlooked like Me, and in order to
(02:22):
get one, my mom said I had towrite a story. And so I ended up
writing Funny enough, like a scifi Space Odyssey, middle grade
Space Odyssey, like on this old,ancient hunk of junk computer
that I still think I havesomewhere. Never ended up
punishing it, but I did get myAmerican goal doll, and so that
(02:42):
was kind of the the origin, butwith the very main series, just
the different approach that Ikind of had that started from
just sheer frustration with thecrash landing trope or the
abduction trope, because there'sactually, logically, only one
possible storyline there, whichis, I've been abducted. How do I
(03:03):
get back home? Or I crash landedhere? How do I get back home?
And I really can't tell you howit makes me, like, twitchy when
you get to that end scene andthey're like, actually, I've
decided to stay. I'm like, No,we all knew already you were
gonna stay. Oh, it's this wasjust a complete waste of my
time. So I was like, How can Icircumvent that as a storyline
(03:27):
and actually have something moreinteresting? And I did read
like, I think two of kind of mymajor inspo books were venomous
by Penelope Fletcher, becausethat was one where it was an
alien abduction, but therewasn't ever really a talk of
going home. It was just, that'sit. And then there was his
acclaim by Taylor Vaughn, whichis Theodore Taylor, and Yvonne,
(03:49):
which I thought was really good.
It was just very dark andcreepy. So I was hoping to do
something maybe on the lighterside of that.
Alesia Galati (04:00):
Yes, I read Taylor Vaughn's after, like,
more recently, like, in the lastmonth or two, and trying to
explain to my husband what abreeding ceremony was. I'm sure
I'm on a list somewhere, like,trying to explain this. And I
was like, it's fine. It worksout, but also it's really
(04:22):
intense. But I did not get thatat all from yours. It, while
they does have some elements of,wait a minute, we have this
negotiation. And this isactually not aligned with the
supreme ruler and what he wantsto be happening on this planet.
But you have faded mates inthere, which I think you do this
(04:43):
so beautifully. A lot of them,like, it doesn't matter you're
with this person, period, andthat can be really frustrating.
And even thinking about, I wantto say it's your second book,
where it's like, he does notwant to be with her at all. He
has so many pred. This isagainst humans. And she's like,
(05:04):
Look, I'm just trying to do thebest thing for my people. I'm
trying to just make this work.
She's religious. He is not like,there's just so many opposing
things that even though they'refaded mates, maybe it's Book
Three, because second one is onthe ice planet four. Oh my
goodness, it's like all of themare together in my brain,
because they're all sowonderful. They're seriously go
(05:24):
read the whole thing. I think Iblew through all of them within
a couple months. But I feel likeit's just such a beautiful way
of approaching faded mates,where it's not like, No, we're a
slave to this thing inside of usthat's telling that we're
telling us that we're supposedto be with this other person,
even if we don't want to. So whywas that important for you?
Elizabeth Stephens (05:46):
Like, a lot of my writing comes from like,
what I've seen and read andliked, but I think could be a
little bit better. And so one ofthe things that I realized that
fated mates does and doesn't dois that what it doesn't do is it
doesn't create a believable lovestory, because it just is a
trigger, and then there's asexual attraction. And after
(06:07):
you've had sex with the sameperson enough times like you can
kind of probably like thatanybody you know. So there has
to be something else there,which is why this is a very mate
series. I do a one sided, fadedmates. So for the varaxians and
like the alien species, who arefamiliar with the concept, like
theirs is usually instantlytriggered, whereas the human
(06:28):
females have to like come intotheir like faded mate thing, the
Zana. Zana has to hit them at acertain point for it to be
triggered, which I thought wasfun, because it's an easy way to
create an enemies to loversfriction without having to try
super duper hard. The otherthing that faded mates does,
however, is that, unlike abelievable love story, it lets
(06:52):
you create, Oh, what did myfriend call it the other day? My
in real life friend was like thebook community needs to start
adopting, not like a spicemeter, but like a spice
frequency or something. I don'tremember what you called it, but
basically to say, this isn't aslow burn, this is like a fast,
slow, slow, slow, fast, fast.
Like, it's like different, likespice like patterns. And that's
(07:15):
one thing that I really like todo in my books, is create
different spice patterns. Somaybe one couple doesn't have
sex until the very end, but thenthe other couples have explosive
sex from on page one, you know.
And so that's the thing thatfaded mates can do, is that you
can use it for that at any pointin the story, which I think is
great, because you can work onbuilding a believable love
(07:36):
story, while at the same timenot depriving your readers of
what they want to read. Here
Alesia Galati (07:40):
for the smut, I totally get it.
Elizabeth Stephens (07:43):
Gotta have go yes.
Alesia Galati (07:45):
And now your omega verse series takes a
slightly different approach. Socould you talk through that as
well? For anyone who's like,wait, what's Omega verse? What
is it? And then, how do youincorporate the fated mates
differently in that series,versus like the severe mate
series.
Elizabeth Stephens (08:02):
It's funny when I describe Omega verse,
because to me, Omega verserepresents a dystopian power
hierarchy, not a sex thing, butlike most people will associate
it with, like, Wolf's packdynamics, where you have an
alpha, a beta, and then, likeomega, or I don't even really, I
don't know how wolves work, butin either case, it's kind of a
(08:23):
sexual tool. So if you haveomegas, then they go into heats
and alphas can go into ruts andalphas and omegas pair and lots
of fun, spicy stuff happens. ButI really like it for the way
that I use it in my dark fantasyseries, which is Dark City omega
and Shadowlands omega, morebooks coming. The Alpha sit at
(08:46):
the very top. There's not,there's not that many of them.
Betas make the dominant class,and then Omegas are the fewest.
And my omegas all have magic,and my alphas rule the cities,
and some of them can shift intothese monster creatures, because
I just thought that would besuper duper fun. And where faded
mates comes in is that obviouslyyou have this chemistry between
alphas and omegas, a naturalsexual chemistry. And that was
(09:10):
really fun to use, particularlywith this dystopian structure,
because my Omegas are all kindof living in fear of being
discovered or being owned by analpha, which again, creates a
nice enemies to lovers, tension,and then my alphas are all as
soon as an omega is discovered,they're trying to claim that one
(09:30):
because it increases their powerand can enhance their legacy
with offspring and that kind ofstuff. So that's the way that I
can use it.
Alesia Galati (09:39):
When I was reading your it's beast of get
beasts of gadamora Correct. Ishow you say that last one,
because we're all reading it.
Nobody's reading this to us,unless you're listening to the
audiobook in that one. What Ithought you did so incredibly
was the hierarchy under.
(10:00):
Understanding of the betas beingsuch a huge class of people that
were seen as less than becauseof their lack of either being
alphas or omegas, and themrising up and being like, wait a
minute, we're important too. Andlike having a legit reason of
(10:20):
being like, No, this is why I'mtalking about trash city people
here, like that side. I reallythought that how you approached
that was just so realistic tohumanity. And then adding in the
Omega element of being like,seen as they have to be
(10:41):
protected. They used to be putaway. They have to not be seen,
not be heard, all of that, whichI think a lot of women can
sympathize and empathize withand be like, Yeah, I've been
there, done that, but lettingthem come into their power and
having such incredible power tobe like, No, I actually saved
(11:02):
the guy one or two times. I justthink that how you do that is so
empowering for the readers. Wasthat intentional? And what is
the maybe some feedback thatyou've gotten from people around
that dynamic? Yeah,
Elizabeth Stephens (11:17):
I think that's definitely it's hard to
call it intentional, because Ithink it's there's a reason that
all of my main female characterstend to be women of color, and
tend to be in these positions ofcoming into their power with the
support of their partner,because I think it's something
that we could probably use a lotmore of in regular society. And
so it makes me feel good, butgosh, hearing you talk about
(11:39):
that those books just gets me soexcited because of where the
series is going. But likeMerlin, I have to say she's the
beta leader of this gang ofpeople called Trash city, and
they're all betas, and they areworking in cahoots with the big
bad guy in this thing becausethey want to be the right hand
of the devil so that they canget theirs when they dismantle
(12:00):
the regime, but she is actually,I think my all time. She's,
like, closely tied with Jack,who's the bad guy from
population, but she might be,like, my all time favorite
villain character, and I'm just,like, deeply obsessed with her.
Yeah, she's a lot. She's reallyfun. But yeah, I think more of
the feedback I get is less aboutlike, how my books feel it's
(12:23):
like a woman reading them, andmore how it feels as like a
woman of color reading them. Iget a lot of feedback about,
Wow, I like, picked up thisfantasy book because it had the
black woman on the cover. Butlike, I'm just so not used to
reading a black woman in thisrole. Like, it's just so
important to me to just have,like representation, just in any
(12:43):
book, not just like blacksuffering books, and it's hard
to find or like books aboutblackness in general. Like it
doesn't even have to be blacksuffering, but it's, oh, here's
this amazing fantasy rooted inAfrican mythology. And I think
that's really cool. But Iactually just I want to read
Harry Potter, not Harry Potteranymore, because that woman's
lost the card, but I want toread the Hunger Games. And just
(13:06):
so happen to find the maincharacter in those books be
somebody I can relate to. And sothat's just more my style.
Within that there are obvious,like, very clear, heavy handed
elements of like racism andsexism and just classism and
dealing with all of the ismsthroughout all of my books. Is
Alesia Galati (13:29):
that something that just happens, or is it
something that you're reallyintentional about as you're
creating these
Elizabeth Stephens (13:35):
Well, I think I tend to write just the
nature of the books that I writetend to be dark, and because I
work in fantasy and sci filandscapes, like, it just lends
itself to creating those kindsof class and hierarchical
structures. I think, like, maybebook like Lord the rings didn't
really have that kind of setup.
Everyone was just like, livingin perfect harmony in their
(13:58):
little communities. But like, Ithink maybe that just seems so
fantastical to me. It doesn'tseem realistic enough. And yeah,
so it just, it seems to just bewhat comes most naturally,
Alesia Galati (14:11):
I think, like Star Wars, but make it black and
women leading everything. Yes,yeah, that's more
Elizabeth Stephens (14:19):
Yeah, or even, like Dune, but remove all
of the crazy over the top sexistelements. I really, I can't. I
have a whole dune rant. I can'tstand it. But yeah, like, more
like on those vibes than on theLord of the Rings side of the
spectrum,
Alesia Galati (14:32):
you have beasts of gadamora being a and I
actually so funny. And this isprobably me being like, wait,
what where are we? What do we?
What is happening? I did notrealize that it was more of like
a dystopian future type of book.
And so there were moments whereI was reading it and you said,
(14:55):
like superhero landing. And Iwas like, Wait, how do they know
what that is? I. And then it waslike, Wait, oh, okay. Or you
there was like a Jesusreference, like, something about
something. And I was just like,how do they know what that is?
Oh, and then it just tied, like,it made me realize, like, Oh,
this is the direction that we'regoing in. The story, cool, okay,
(15:18):
I'm here for it,
Elizabeth Stephens (15:19):
yeah, beasts of catamora, I was actually like
a return to my messy roots,because I wrote the population
series first, and that was likewhen I was still like a hobby
author, and was just likeputting books out wasn't
intending to make any money offof it. That book had to go
through three different COVIDrevisions because I just
(15:39):
couldn't figure out what it was.
It's sci fi, it's fantasy, it'svampires, it's aliens, it's
super bloody, really violent,and there's like, sex, like lots
of spice, like, it's just allover the place. And I love that.
I love not writing to genre. Ithink it's so fun to blend. But
then I was like, when 2020 I gotreally into sci fi romance. And
(16:03):
then I was like, let me try todo this properly. And so then I
wrote, like, this very mateseries, which is just alien
romance. Sci fi romance, likevery clearly fits into its box,
but beasts of gadamora came tome, and I was just like, I just
wanted it to be what it was,without having to try to make it
like a real fantasy and sothat's why you like, go in. And
it's a complaint I've gotten.
(16:25):
People are like, this is afantasy book, but there's like,
this modern city with like,coffee shops in it and stuff.
And I'm like, Yeah, that'sbecause that's exactly what I
wanted to write. And one of thethings that I like writing a lot
is, and what I did in this verymate series is I cannot
understand how authors spendlike, 30 books on the same
planet. I'm like, This is soboring, there's no there's
(16:50):
nothing new to be discoveredhere. And one of the things that
I wanted to avoid when I saidabout writing beasts of gadamora
was I didn't want to get trappedin the same world building with
every book. So that's why everybook is in a different city, and
every city is completelydifferent. Like Dark City is
like a modern metropolis.
Shadowlands is an ancientmedieval civilization. Book
(17:10):
Three is a Viking Village. It'sjust out there. Yeah,
Alesia Galati (17:19):
I love it, though. I think that it really
makes it unique. And youmentioned a little bit ago about
how all of your female maincharacters, or the majority of
them are black, obviously that'simportant to you, because you're
black woman, and being able tocreate that representation and
(17:40):
create really satisfyingrelationships where they have
partners that are lifting themup, that are supporting them,
that believe them to the ends ofthe earth, or will follow them
to the ends of the earth. Ithink is just such a beautiful
dynamic to create. You had thiselement of religion in the
Xavier mate series, and I'mcurious how you because this is
(18:03):
1000s of years after thesehumans have crash landed, and so
many of their religions havemelded together. Is what I got
as I was reading it. How did youcreate that? And why did you
feel like that was important? I
Elizabeth Stephens (18:16):
lived in the Middle East for a while, and so
it's always just been a secondhome to me, and like, the use of
the Arabic language comes backin book seven, because my main
female character, she's anEgyptian interpreter, and I
think that it also just seemslike a natural thing that there
(18:38):
would still be religion, even inlike a super far off future. But
I liked the idea that one Ididn't want to use one
particular religionspecifically, but I thought that
it made sense that, like theAbrahamic religions would melt
into one. Maybe that's my utopicvision for how religion could
(18:58):
look. Yeah. So I thought Sparrowwas like an interesting use case
for that, and to get to explore,you get to explore that a little
bit more also in the littlenovella that comes exiled from
Nobu that comes after book two.
But it was just it was a funthing to include, though it's
obviously outside of my comfortzone. I'm not mahajabi, I don't
wear a headscarf, and I'm notparticularly religious myself.
(19:20):
So I I always tell, likeauthors, when you're doing
something you're not familiarwith, try to do as little as
possible, maximize where you'regoing with it, but do as little
as possible. And so I don't havea whole lot of characters that
are deeply religious and stuff,just because it's so far outside
of my wheelhouse. But Idefinitely, I thought Sarah was
such an important character. Shedefinitely needed her own book.
(19:42):
Yeah,
Alesia Galati (19:44):
and I think that how you did it was so beautiful,
especially as someone who has alot of religious trauma,
fundamentalist Christian trauma,it didn't feel like it took me
out of the story, because it wassprinkled in. And so beautifully
as a way of like devotion andmorals, rather than a deity,
(20:08):
which I think is where,personally, where I feel that a
lot of organized religionsnotice I said organized
religions tend to veer toward,is the idea of like, very cult
like behavior. We're the onlyones that have the truth. We're
the only ones that know the wayeveryone else is going somewhere
else. But I feel like what youdid was just very beautiful,
(20:31):
from the point of devotiontoward something higher than
oneself, but also from a moralsstandpoint of being good, doing
good, encouraging others to alsolive that kind of life. I
thought you did it sobeautifully. You mentioned the
one where you go back to Earth.
And why can I not? I've got youhave your own, like, whole shelf
(20:52):
over here. So if you're notwatching the video, I'll have to
post a picture of it, but youhave your whole shelf over here,
but the one where they go backto Earth, I want more of that,
and I believe you have more ofthat coming. Is that true? Let
us know. Yeah,
Elizabeth Stephens (21:11):
I'm super excited. I was invited to
participate in the crazy, coolproject next year. I'm really
excited to hopefully someday, inthe near future, get to tell you
guys what it actually is, butthat will involve a short it's a
short story, a shorter story forme, but a return to that planet.
(21:32):
And it's I had written part ofthe story already, and then I
wasn't sure if I was going touse it. I was like, maybe this
is not right for this particularproject. And then I reread the
opening. It's just like I wrote,like, the dumbest female
character I've ever written, andshe everything. I'm just
obsessed with her, like shedoesn't do anything right. And
it's just like such a departurefor me, because all of my female
(21:54):
characters tend to be, like,very capable and serious and
like determined, and she's justlike a floundering idiot, and
it's a lot of fun. Yeah, it'sreally a lot of fun.
Alesia Galati (22:05):
Oh, I love that.
You just follow your creativity.
You are also a self publishedand Trad published author.
Elizabeth Stephens (22:14):
The Trad book doesn't come out until
June,
Alesia Galati (22:17):
okay, but very soon this year, for sure that
we're this episode goes out, youwill have had both. How does
that kind of differ for you inwhat you're able to create for
the readers? I know I went toKennedy Ryan's book tour
recently. Absolutely lovely, andwas wonderful. But she was
talking about how she had triedto start as traditionally
(22:40):
published and as a black woman,it was very difficult, because
they wanted her to write whitepeople. They wanted her to write
a certain style of book. And shewas like, I don't want to do
that. But now that she's I don'twant to say proven, because she
didn't have anything to prove.
But now that she has shown theindustry that, like, hey, black
romances can make money theysell that now she's able to
(23:03):
demand what she deserves forthese stories. And so as someone
who's doing both, how does thatkind of feel? What do you think
the future is for people wholook like you and I to either
Trad publish or indie publish?
Yeah,
Elizabeth Stephens (23:21):
I am. I could talk forever about this. I
think it's a really coolposition to be in, and I'm
really grateful to be in it. ButI also started, originally
trying to try to publish, like,way decades, literally a couple,
like, over a decade ago, now,way over a decade ago, I was in
college when I finished my firstbook, which I still have. I
don't know what I'm doing withit, but I Yeah, rejection after
(23:45):
rejection, just tons ofrejections. Like, never really
got a definitive answer as to,like, why my books weren't
getting picked up or anythinglike that, but then eventually
decided to do it myself. Andthen, of course, as you prove
that you can make money. Thingshappen for you. But I will also
say that in this entireexperience, and it makes me want
(24:05):
to cry my Trad experience, theperson and the reason that I
actually have a Trad contract isa black woman in the industry.
So she actually reached out tome, because I would never have
gone back into the querytrenches. That's just not for
me. And indie has been reallyfun so far. It was, to me,
always like a nice to have to beable to try and publish, but it
wasn't something I was activelygoing to pursue just because of
(24:27):
my previous experience. But Iwas contacted by an editor at
the time at Harper Collins, andshe was like, working with this
particular imprint, which was,like digital rights only or
something. And so it wasn'treally my speed, but she kind of
sensed like that wasn't reallywhere I was at in my career, and
she hooked me up with an agent,and it's because of her that I
(24:47):
got my agent who then got me adeal. And I think that woman was
either demoted or fired later,and I just it pinches. I can
just feel of my heart, justlittle pieces of my heart
shattering off. Because I thinkeven like. Like the woman who
wrote yellow face, whose nameI'm blanking on, she did the
speech that really sat with me,and she talked about how in the
90s or the 2000s or something,there was a small spike in,
(25:09):
like, black women authors beingpublished. And it all went back
directly to one single acquiringeditor at a publishing house.
And like, this is shocking and,like, appalling to me that this
is actually the case. So it'stough, and, like, I have a lot
of misgivings about Trad, forsure, and I have the constant
(25:30):
feeling that I'm being underpaidwhether or not it's true,
whether or not it's true, andI'm again, that's not to say
that I'm not super happy aboutmy contract, and I am so excited
about my book, and I have beenreally happy with my editors and
stuff at Montlake so far. Like,I asked for a black
developmental editor, and they,like, scrambled and found me
(25:50):
what I was looking for. I waslike, made sure that the people
represented on my cover wereactually both black and not
weirdly whitewashed or anythinglike that. And that was very
clearly done. Everything's beentaken super seriously, and it's
made me feel like, verycomfortable, but it is still
just, I think it's a precariousplace to be in. You know, when
one of my complaints on socialmedia, before I took a little
(26:12):
social break, was just in myorbit, just naturally, I see a
lot of white authors being like,oh my gosh, I got my deal. Like,
it six figures. Cool. Oh my god,I got a seven figure deal. And
I'm just like, it's crazy thatthat's just like, randomly
happening to the people that Iknow, and it's only happening to
one of the people I know. It'sonly happening to white women
(26:33):
authors. And I'm not seeing anyof my author besties of color
coming out. I think I'veliterally seen one, and that was
Kimberly lemming. And I'm like,so happy for her, like, yeah,
like, she deserves it. It'sjust, it's like, a little
frustrating when you feel likethere's a big imbalance in
what's going on. Still, thatsaid, despite all of my like,
(26:57):
general harping about Trad, I amreally excited about what I was
able to deliver. I think I had alot of apprehension about what
they were going to let meinclude in the book. And I'm
pleased to announce that I wasable to slip in a nice nodding
scene in my contemporaryromance. Yeah, I went a totally
(27:23):
insane direction with it. Andwas like, I wonder if they're
gonna mind that be like,anyways, I don't want to spoil
it, um, but like, halfwaythrough the book, the genre
just, like, dramaticallychanges. And no, they were like,
super down with it, and a lot offun. And it's a longer book two,
which I always really like, andyeah, and it's just, it's been
super fun working on thisseries. For sure. I'm working on
(27:46):
Book Two right now andabsolutely stoked. The other
great thing about Trad, I willsay, is just also, like the
actual delivery of it. So rightnow, it feels so strange because
I don't have anything like, Idon't have a pre order or
anything to announce yet, evenfor me personally, but I
actually have four books due byMay, and I've finished two of
them so far, two for Montlake,and then the other two are for
(28:09):
like, secret projects coming outin 2025 and 2026 but both
following a Trad model where Ijust delivered the book and then
they do everything else. And soit's just been strange because
I'm in a writing frenzy, and itdoes feel very good at the end
of the day to just be able to,like, shove something off and
then just be done and not haveto worry about it. Right now, I
also have another book that'sfinished that I was hoping to be
(28:30):
able to get out by February, butI really want to simultaneously
release Audio, and I don't knowif I'm going to get there, but
yeah, I finished writing thebook, and it was just like,
after dealing with Trad and justbeing able to send it to
somebody. Just that I was like,Oh, dang it. Like I have to,
like, I have to go through andedit it, like, clean it up
myself before I can send it toanybody. And then I have to
(28:51):
figure even out what kind of acover I want. And just, it's
been really nice just gettingbrief sent to me, and me just
being able to say what I likeand don't like. So definitely
trade offs for sure, but so far,trad's been a nice experience.
Alesia Galati (29:06):
Yeah, I think that in the future, and I'm
seeing this in podcasting, sinceI work in the industry, that I
think in the near future, withthe algorithm changes that I
think we're gonna see in thecoming years, as well as
censorship that I think a lot ofpeople are going to move towards
mediums that they have morecontrol over, because I think a
(29:28):
lot of projects will get cut, orpeople will be denied being able
to write or speak or postcertain things, and so I think
It'll be interesting to see howthat impacts the romance
industry specifically. Butthat's why things like this are
really important, because thenwe can get the message out there
(29:49):
without anybody editing us down,because it's just us talking.
But yeah, I think that it'sgoing to be really interesting
to see over the next 10 years orso how these changes are going
to impact. Uh, the future ofwritten word, spoken word, etc.
But I think we're gonna see moreindie authors going that route,
(30:09):
which I think will be veryinteresting. But you do, you
have more control over it.
There's but there is more workto be done, because you have to
do everything from finding aneditor or doing the edit it to
yourself, to figuring out thecover, or hiring someone to do
it, and a lot of it is upfrontcosts, rather than, Oh, I made
the money with the company orthe publisher, so there's a lot
(30:29):
of trade offs there. But yeah,that's, I'm glad that you're
seeing something different rightnow for you, because one you
deserve it. Like 100% youdeserve it. And so I'm glad that
you're seeing some positivefeedback with you having that
Trad deal, because, yes, youdeserve it. Your books are
(30:52):
incredible, and the world youcreate are just so incredibly
luxurious. Like, I feel likethat's like, the only way that I
can describe the world.
Sometimes I'll just randomlythink about one of the worlds
that you created, or one of theplanets that you created, and
I'm just like, man, wonder whatthey're doing on that Pleasure
Planet. I sometimes
Elizabeth Stephens (31:12):
think about that too. I'm like, man, what I
wouldn't give you on that benchright now, right? I will. I also
realized that in theconversation about Trad, I was
really only thinking about, likemy traditional publisher, but
actually, like one of the otherTrad experiences I've had this
past year was with audio, andthat has been like game changer
for me, only because audio is soexpensive and the return on your
(31:37):
investment as an author is quitepoor. So I did an experiment
where I was going to try to doall three, but my German
translator didn't work out. Andso I ended up doing the first
three very mates books in Frenchand audio, and I launched them
both around the same time. Andthe plan was then to just pick
up whichever one did better andjust finish that out and then go
(32:00):
back and my French translationsprobably cost me around 3000 a
book and earned out maximum, andthree months a book, and my
audio cost me around 5000 ormore a book, and took 10 months
(32:20):
on average to earn out. And it'sbecause audible takes 60% or 40%
or whatever it is, and thealternative is to try to go
wide, which is just reallycomplicated. And so when I was
picked up for audio, it justfelt like such a blessing,
because it wasn't. It's not thatI feel like I'm actually, I
haven't really earned anythingyet, after my advance, but
(32:42):
you're being paid up front foryour work, which is a huge coup,
and you're actually being ableto just provide access. So for
me, the access piece is reallyimportant, just because I would
love to be able to provide mybooks in all formats, but it's
just not possible. So I've been,like, deeply happy with the
audio experience so far?
Alesia Galati (33:02):
Yeah, I don't think people realize how much
goes into audio creation, eventhinking about I know the
numbers are very similar forthose who work in voice acting
as well as podcast production,which is what I work in. And one
thing that my company does it'svery different than a lot of
(33:23):
other ones like podcastproduction, is that they'll just
listen, especially if you'resending it over to the
Philippines or just like avirtual assistant, they'll
listen for those like longpauses or those types of things.
They'll clean out some UMS usingAI features, whereas my team
listens to every word, we're allwomen in the United States, and
(33:44):
we will listen to every word andmake sure that you and your
guest sound fantastic, becausewe've had moments where we're
like, Nope, that's that was notwhat you meant to say at all.
Cut, delete, or, Oh, wait, thatdoesn't align with my clients
values, right? Like I had, I hada guest say that ADHD happens
(34:10):
because of what we eat, how wesleep, etc. And I was like,
that's not medical information.
And I was like, team, take thatout. I feel like they would know
that, but just in case, no, wedon't agree with that. That's
actually not true. We're notgoing to put that. I'm not going
to have that on my platform. Butit takes four times the length
of the audio to edit it.
Elizabeth Stephens (34:32):
Yeah. I mean, I can't even imagine,
because you're like, thinkingabout editing a book with just
Microsoft Word, Cut, delete. Butlike, audio is a whole different
ball game, yes,
Alesia Galati (34:42):
making sure that it's all leveled to the right
way that it goes back and forthbetween, especially if you have
dual voice actors. Like, there'sso much that goes into it that I
don't think people even realize.
They're just like, oh, pop inthe new audiobook. It'd be good.
Yes, it will be good. Because alot of effort. Went into that so
yes, please don't get thingsillegally, first and foremost.
(35:04):
But also, like kudos to thosevoice actors and the authors and
all the people that put in somuch effort to make books
accessible to people who maybecannot read books visibly, right
or physically, who need to beable to listen to audiobooks, or
that's how they enjoy processingthe information, right? There's
(35:25):
so many benefits to it, but itis. It's so much effort and
time. But yeah, that's reallycool, though, that you had that
experience as well. Because I'mstarting to see a lot more of
those, just from the people thatI interact with, of those Trad
deals coming up, where theyalready have the book, but then
they're selling their audiorights to be able to make the
book more accessible, yeah,which I think is wonderful,
(35:48):
especially for people who needthat. Yeah.
Elizabeth Stephens (35:53):
I mean, any halfway decently successful
author will tell you, don't sellyour audio rights. Do it
yourself. But for a lot of us,that's just not an option. So I
want to have audio books, andsome of the distributors I work
with, dreamscape and podiumright now, and both have been
fantastic. Yeah,
Alesia Galati (36:13):
that's really good. You have some fun. Is
there any fun projects you cantell us about your books. So
your Trad book is coming out inthe summertime, right? So what
can we expect from that? Sincethat is something you can tell
us,
Elizabeth Stephens (36:28):
yes, that is. So I have a two book deal
with montlick. Now, I'm hopingthat I will be able to do three
books in the theory, possiblyfour, but no more than four, but
it's like a really weird. Iwanted to write something in,
like a contemporary romancestyle. But actually, do you like
I just think that people thatwrite contemporary romance and a
(36:50):
contemporary romance author willbe like writing fantasies so
hard, like the world building,trying to get everything right,
like new languages, new customs,new cultures. But to me, that's
all really easy because it'sjust stuff in your head. But
trying to write contemporaryromance where you have to abide
by the laws of man and nature isjust so hard, even if you're
(37:10):
trying to the worst for me istrying to set something in a
real city where you're like, No,I have to, like, Google Maps, my
I don't want, like, some NewYorker be like, that's not what
that part of the Central Parklooks like. It's really
annoying. So I approachedcontemporary romance from what I
would call like an ELIZABETHSTEVENS lens. So it's set in
(37:31):
modern times, but we havebasically, like Superman style,
like a bunch of aliens fell outof the sky 20 years ago as
children, and they didn'tremember where they came from.
They look like people, but eachof them has a unique and
fantastic ability. And Iactually wrote this before
watching the boys, but after Itold a couple people about it,
(37:52):
they were like, oh, you shouldwatch the boys. And then I
watched the boys, and I waslike, Okay, I guess that's what
I wrote, but it's basically thecorporatization, the
commodities, the capitalization,whatever you know, what I'm
trying to say of superheroes andgovernments got involved, and
then they created theseorganizations to manage them as
(38:14):
brands, and there became like asuperhero cohort And a villain
cohort, and trying to place bidsto try to get some of the
unaffiliated ones to join eitherside, and then they perform like
heroic deeds around the worldand get brand endorsements and
shine pretty for pictures. Butthe first book opens with a PR
(38:35):
firm run by like a very shy kindof neuro divergent woman, and
she's tasked with trying toconvince this unaffiliated guy
who has, like, firepowers and islike, very gruff and doesn't
like people to join the heroesteam. And it's obviously in my
style, kind of like an enemystill lovers, they have, like, a
(38:56):
lot of friction and just don'tget along, and that kind of
thing. But there's obviously,because I couldn't control
myself, like, a lot of layersinto this. And so there's
actually, like, some supervillains that you don't meet
right on the first page. Andthen there's some unusual, like
Alien stuff that ends uphappening. And so there's a
(39:18):
little bit of a monster romanceelement that comes into play in
this and I don't know if thatwas a good description, it
probably was, but
Alesia Galati (39:28):
literally, just contemporary romance with an
ELIZABETH STEVENS bin, I willbuy that.
Elizabeth Stephens (39:35):
I call it a contemporary superhero workplace
romance with a monster twist.
Alesia Galati (39:44):
So much so if someone has never read your
books, shame first. But if theyhave never read your books,
where should they begin betweenall of your different series
that you have available at this
Elizabeth Stephens (39:58):
time? I think it depends. Depends on how
dark you like your books. I'dsay like the very mates that
series tends to be on thelighter ish side, which is not
saying much, because it's also alittle bit of a darker sci fi
romance. But you can start withtaken to veraxia, which is like
high sci fi takes place on otherworlds, alien heroes who look
like aliens and human women. Oryou can move slightly darker and
(40:23):
go to beasts of gadamora, whichis my chaotic, dark fantasy
series with an Omega versehierarchy. Omegas have magic and
berserker shifts and shift intomonsters. Or you can go darkest
yet, which is based on Earthdystopian post apocalyptic vibes
with alien vampire heroes andhuman heroines. But all of my
(40:47):
books have happily ever aftersand just follow one couple. So
you can start pretty muchanywhere, and you'll get a full
story out of it. Yeah,
Alesia Galati (40:59):
yes, literally, you could start with any of
those. I know I started withpopulation first, and then went
into severe and then beast ofgadamora. But yeah, I think you
could literally start with anyof them, and you would be
thoroughly happy definitely gocheck those out. Elizabeth, this
has been so much fun. Thank youso much for being on where can
(41:23):
people find you? Get to know youhang out with you by your books.
Yeah,
Elizabeth Stephens (41:27):
my website is books by elizabeth.com but
you can also find me on socialmedia, e Stevens author,
ELIZABETH STEVENS author, or onAmazon. And my books are all
available on audio everywhere,except population series, which
is audible exclusive. And all ofmy books were in the KU program.
(41:48):
But I've actually just recentlymoved to the very main series
wide as a test. So you cancurrently find the very mates
books anywhere in ebook. And allof my books are available
everywhere. Too awesome. And
Alesia Galati (41:59):
we'll make sure we have links for that in the
show notes, in the descriptionfor anyone who's doing other
things while they're listening,and that way, they can make sure
to grab those links again. Thankyou so much.
Elizabeth Stephens (42:09):
Thank you so much. I'm super happy to have
been invited. Thank you. You.
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Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
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If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.