September 16, 2025 • 46 mins
AI didn’t appear overnight — it’s been part of computing’s DNA since Turing’s universal machine. In this episode Jason and Melanie trace AI back to the 1930s, wrestle with the question “Can AI lie?”, and talk about how machines and humans make decisions differently. Plus — play along with our podcast game Founders vs. Fictionals (prompt on WinternetWeb.com).
Listen on Apple, Spotify, iHeart, YouTube, Amazon Music — anywhere you get podcasts. Or our website. Share if you like it — we appreciate you!
🎧 Wired Together is produced by WinternetWeb Technologies, a family-run web design and tech studio based in Bracey, Virginia.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:05):
Alright, well, uh, thank you so much for joining us
again um on Wired Together.
I am Melanie Winter.
SPEAKER_05 (00:14):
And I'm Jason Winter.
SPEAKER_01 (00:16):
And today we are super excited.
It is National IT ProfessionalsDay.
Um, we do lots of differentthings here at WinterNet Web,
uh, which is our the the parentcompany of Wired Together.
Yeah, and um one of the thingsthat we do, and I say we very
loosely I do a lot of contentdesign, I do um a lot of the the
(00:39):
prep for things.
Uh I do not do computer repair.
I am still learning myself, so Idefinitely understand those that
come in to the store and say,you know, I don't know if I'm
saying this right.
I sympathize or empathizecompletely.
I am still learning myself.
(01:01):
Um, I find what he does likeabsolute sorcery.
So happy National ITProfessionals Day, Jason.
SPEAKER_05 (01:08):
Oh, come on now.
It I mean, see, when it comes totechnology, it's always a
lifetime of learning.
SPEAKER_02 (01:15):
It is, and I know I didn't have all that.
Right.
SPEAKER_05 (01:18):
I started very, very oddly young.
Um, but it's one of those thingsyou learn what you need to know.
And you know, for many of us,that might be, you know, I know
how to do Google search, findthese different things, and know
how to use a word processor.
Uh, you might have a hobby andyou have software you use for
that hobby, and you know that.
(01:38):
And um, you know, the more youuse it, that's fine.
I mean, you you you learnthings, but I took typing in
high school.
I mean, and and that's great.
I mean, you you've done a lot ofgreat things.
SPEAKER_01 (01:50):
So I am again still learning.
SPEAKER_05 (01:52):
Right.
But see, I've learned just likefrom like my teaching roots,
I've learned so much from mystudents.
In this case, over this pastsince we've had a storefront two
and a half years, I've probablytouched 400 computers with 250
different things.
And because I've done it,obviously I know more because
I've had the you know, had thetrivia thrown at me.
(02:15):
So now I've learned new things.
So yeah, it's um and better whensomething is thrown at me.
SPEAKER_01 (02:21):
Right.
Just yesterday I was able to dojust a small amount of
troubleshooting uh while youwere still in a meeting.
So um, and so that's I I can.
SPEAKER_05 (02:32):
Of course you can.
SPEAKER_01 (02:33):
And and I can answer questions that can troubleshoot
a little.
Uh so I guess I am sellingmyself self short, but um
definitely it's definitely yourday.
SPEAKER_05 (02:42):
That's not the reason for the podcast, but we
just stumbled upon it.
We happen to stumble upon it.
I think I was scrolling socialmedia and some someone posted,
and I'm like, oh well, we gottamention that, I guess.
SPEAKER_01 (02:55):
Maybe we celebrate national wine day, right?
Yeah, exactly.
Stuff like that.
So every day.
Wine.
SPEAKER_05 (03:02):
Yeah.
So well, all right.
SPEAKER_01 (03:07):
So um that was not exactly what we had as far as
what we wanted to set up fortoday.
Um, but it kind of does go alongwith everything um in IT, if you
will.
Um, we wanted to talk a littlebit about kind of the founder,
the founding of um the AImovement.
(03:28):
Um we feel like a lot of people,I'm sure, and and myself
included, feel like IT, I mean,AI just kind of happened.
It just kind of like presenteditself, and all of a sudden now
it's this big hot button issue.
SPEAKER_02 (03:42):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (03:43):
Um, and and really it didn't, it did not just
happen.
Um and so that is kind of wherewe wanted to just do a little
bit of uh dig into that, andthen you know, as we do,
sometimes it's fun to play agame.
So of course we'll play a game.
SPEAKER_05 (03:58):
We'll talk more about that later.
But uh, you know, it I think onereason why people feel like AI
just happened is um what justover two years ago, I think it
was uh it was you know, I thinkit the ChatGPT thing was the
bigger bigger player that kindof came out so having a
platform, right?
(04:19):
And then people startedunderstanding right, looking at
it, and then all of a sudden,because people started messing
with it and got feedback thatwas above and beyond anything
they ever experienced.
And you know, usually you wouldhave to like pay a lot of money
for a tool that would convertwhatever you're trying to do,
(04:41):
and you know, you feel likeyou're getting that payload.
Uh, this was something thatanyone could just mess with, and
we're like, whoa, this is bigdeal.
I mean, it really was like, youknow, we fired up the big boys
and just handed it to people andsaid, all right, look what this
can do.
And it, I mean, there were therewere conferences or businesses
that all got together and waslike, hey, what does this AI
(05:02):
mean?
So yeah, but I guess to whatyou're getting at is AI as a
concept didn't start then, thatit had origins.
SPEAKER_01 (05:12):
Right.
And so we, you know, we we didfind an article um that you can
obviously look up and and readfor yourself.
It's only a few paragraphs, soit's not like you know, bulky or
anything.
Um, it's quidgest.
Is that how we evenquidgest.com.
SPEAKER_05 (05:29):
Q-U-I-D-G-E-S-T.com.
SPEAKER_01 (05:32):
And so uh this was written in um March 19th of 2021
about the founding fathers ofthe artificial intelligence.
So it kind of just gives alittle bit of an overview of
some of the people that were inearly computing, but really by
definition, the early computingum, which would be um you know
(05:55):
started in in the early turn ofthe last century, so the the 19
early 1900s going, you know,more like 1930s, 1950s, where
things were starting to reallyprogress.
Um, the the large computers, asyou know, and things like that,
um, they were starting torealize what these things were
capable of um and how they couldum manipulate the and and have
(06:20):
these things run real fast.
And so we think we think a lotof times is computing is just
calculations, and really even inthe early time period with Alan
Turning and that kind of thing,it's it's not just calculations,
he's actually trying to get moreinto that self-modifying,
self-improving.
(06:41):
And so that by it definition isan AI concept.
So it's if it can start to kindof formulate uh what it wants to
give you as far as informationbased on the experiences it's
having, right?
Then that's giving it a littlebit more than just calculations,
(07:05):
so it's not just input-output.
SPEAKER_05 (07:07):
Right, yeah, I was gonna say input output, yeah.
Because I mean computer was aterm that was a person's title,
you know, and then we had themachines that started performing
that better.
So you could have an employee,and um females are like really
big and formative in thisindustry.
Uh most of the computers werefemale, and actually, because
(07:28):
all right, let's just say youhad your engineers that were
stereotypically male, you know,we built this wonderful big
thing, and um, I know in myexperience of a lot of things,
it's like okay, they they buildit, and I say, How's it work?
Well, we don't know.
We were told to build it.
The females were more intent onactually, okay, fine.
We need to make use of this, andpeople need to understand how it
(07:51):
works.
So they tinkered, put ittogether, and all that.
A lot of your software, a lot ofthis was created.
SPEAKER_01 (07:57):
Oh, so are you saying that early computing is
almost like your your mom andpop?
You've got to have kind of bothsides working together as far as
that is exactly what I'm saying.
SPEAKER_05 (08:06):
Um beautiful.
Um, we'll just um okay.
Yeah, I've really stumped younow.
No, no, no.
I just I just don't want tosound too stereotypical, but I
mean, I mean, females largelytend to be caring for the house,
the nest, and the we gotta makethis work.
(08:27):
Males sometimes get tunnelvision or very frequently.
It's like, okay, I went to work,did this, what I made this
money, whatever.
Here's here's the path I'm on.
And the female goes, how can wemake best out of all of this?
And I feel like um the unsungheroes of the computing movement
largely were females.
And if you do the research, youwill find, you know, time and
(08:50):
time again, that wasn't what Iwas going to talk about right
now, but it's what it led into.
But how and all you know, thesegue being the computer was a
role, your job was to help withyou know figuring out
calculations, you know, you havedata, and for businesses, data
was very important.
That controlled your next pathand what direction you're going.
(09:11):
And that's important, of course,with competition.
How do we outperform thesepeople and grab the market
before they do?
So, as computers as the umdevice came to be, then it was
okay, yes, it can do simpleinput-output.
But what is this like what elsecan it do?
(09:33):
How do we push it further?
And that's when the idea of AIreally started growing because
you know, you're interactingwith this device, and you know,
you're telling it to dosomething, it's giving you
feedback.
And I remember as a young childwith Dolphs and all that, and
early years of programming, thatwas interesting.
(09:55):
It was almost like I found thisfriend that I can work with, you
know, and it's as sad as that itmight sound.
SPEAKER_02 (10:01):
That does sound a little bit.
SPEAKER_05 (10:02):
It does sound sad, but I mean, I mean, the
nostalgia of the buzz, the glowof the screen.
I mean it's okay.
SPEAKER_01 (10:08):
I had a Tamagotchi.
I am this.
SPEAKER_05 (10:11):
But anyone out there in my age group, you know, that
um enjoyed tinkering withcomputers probably can relate to
that.
SPEAKER_01 (10:20):
Um can I dive in here?
Please do, because I need to betaken away from the show.
The female voice, um, whatyou're talking about earlier,
um, makes perfect sense.
You have uh, of course, youryour builders of the
input-output kind of concept,but then you need that to be
communicated.
SPEAKER_03 (10:38):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (10:39):
So who better in ways of communication than uh
like you're talking about withthe the the female inputs of of
uh early technology?
Yeah, uh, minus lovelace.
I we unfortunately did not lookup anything to help with the
twist of what you decided to do.
(11:06):
Minus that, you know, um I can'tthrow anybody out there uh off
the fly, unfortunately.
And that's actually reallyunfortunate.
I would recognize their names.
SPEAKER_05 (11:15):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (11:15):
We're gonna do an episode on that.
SPEAKER_05 (11:17):
We will.
We will do an episode of all theum the female pioneers in
computing.
You will be very surprised.
SPEAKER_01 (11:24):
I mean, we wouldn't be on the moon, we wouldn't have
half the crap we got there nowbecause um you know we wouldn't
have uh continued generationswithout females, right?
SPEAKER_05 (11:36):
That too.
We would we would have died off25 years ago, you know.
SPEAKER_01 (11:41):
So but also is true, is like you said, it it the two
things have to go together.
Like I was saying with mom andpop, you gotta build it.
That is true.
So everything needs to be built,everything's communicated.
So there you go with wiredtogether.
SPEAKER_05 (11:57):
Huzzah, all right, full circle, yep.
Um just a happenstance, ahappenstance, yep.
SPEAKER_01 (12:06):
Um so within this article, again, we're talking.
Um I'm trying to get back.
You you've rubbed me with this alittle bit.
SPEAKER_05 (12:15):
I'm sorry.
No, but I mean you just gotta gowith where it goes, right?
SPEAKER_01 (12:19):
Um kind of what they were thinking in the early time
period, and again, I really urgeyou to read the article.
Um, we've got a couple ofdifferent names here that
they're kind of dropping in theum the early time period, and
like you said, Alan Turning.
Yeah.
Um they there's one guy theywere talking about with Marvin
(12:40):
Minsky, and one thing that hewas really um one one thing I
wanted to pull from the article.
Um please read what he did, andthat's cool.
Yeah, we just don't want to readto you, so we're trying we're
trying to just spit out ourpoints and not it was neat what
he was talking about with um hereally believed that what they
(13:02):
were building would um helpsolve a lot of humanity
problems, and so um that's onething that he was um kind of
saying against people that werestarting to feel uncomfortable
in that that at this time in the50s, uh people were getting a
(13:23):
lot of information with uh thesci fi um genre building that
movement started where all of asudden everything starts to feel
like it's closing in and maybetechnology is not the way.
So people start having someproblems with that now.
This was this actually was backin the 50s as well, right um,
(13:45):
where are is technology gonnatake over?
Can technology really replacehumanity?
Um, that kind of thing.
And so he was um one of thosethat's like, you know, this
might actually help humanity,but we're talking about the
difference between computing andum a self-involv evolving
(14:05):
machine versus a human.
So uh that's kind of what wewanted to lay the groundwork on
in discussion is the the machineversus the human.
SPEAKER_05 (14:19):
Um it's interesting because uh we've tried to always
make computers to um communicatewith us, to some people may say
to replace us, but you know, aswe try to approve upon the
computer as a tool, you'retrying to get closer and closer
to the human.
(14:40):
But we both have very distinctdifferences, you know, you know,
us as humans are very differentfrom a computer.
And I think with AI becomes thatconfusing uh notion of wow, it
it's almost like I'm talking toa person.
It feels too close, it feels tooclose, right?
SPEAKER_01 (14:59):
And then is it well, and and actually one of my
points with AI is or any of thisum computing is do we sometimes
feel too close to it on theother side of are we trying too
hard to be the computer and notthe human?
(15:20):
And I think we've got toeventually create this big
distinctive difference betweenthe two of us.
Um that A, you know, the I Iasked, I actually did ask AI
whether or not it could lie, andit it told me why it it can lie,
but it can't.
Um, because it can lie, but ithas no intention of lying
(15:43):
because it has no motivation.
SPEAKER_05 (15:44):
So it's in its ability to, but that's not a
choice it makes when responding.
SPEAKER_01 (15:50):
Because it doesn't really need to survive, it
doesn't have an emotionalintention.
SPEAKER_05 (15:56):
Oh, that's interesting.
SPEAKER_01 (15:57):
And so it actually means to me in a very deep dive
um that it cannot lieintentionally because it doesn't
need to.
That's true.
I guess it's not living.
And so it doesn't need tosurvive, it doesn't need to um,
you know, have an emotionalcontext with anything.
It's just facts.
SPEAKER_05 (16:17):
The young child, it breaks the vase, you know, and
the mother's like, what happenedto the vase?
You know, the child may be like,um, you know, I I I don't know.
The cat did it.
Um the vase fell, which isgreat.
You know, using passive, youknow, the passive voice always
came out of taking the subjectout of the sentence, which is a
great way of lying because youtake yourself out, but anyway,
(16:38):
that's all another thing.
So, but yes, that is anemotional moment.
Mama's mad, you know, and I wantto save my tail.
Right.
So I'm going to say maybe this.
So AI has no reason forsurvival.
It doesn't know when when I turnit off or turn it on, it's not
like, oh, now I need to get backin my box.
(16:59):
It's not the genie in the lamp,you know.
So because of the lack of thatemotional thing, right?
There's no need.
Huh, it's interesting.
SPEAKER_01 (17:09):
There is no emotion, therefore it does not need to
have, or there is no survival,therefore it doesn't need
emotion, therefore it doesn'treally need intention.
SPEAKER_05 (17:19):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (17:20):
So that is our distinction here is is that line
in the sand of it can lie.
And so what AI actually did sayis it can lie.
But if you challenge its lie, ifit realizes it lied, it it's uh
also unlike a human, um, will goahead and correct itself.
SPEAKER_05 (17:41):
Oh, yeah.
Many times we've said something,it said something back, and I'm
like, but no, maybe youmisunderstood me because that's
not entirely true.
And it's like, yep, I I made awrong assumption there.
You're exactly right, and youknow, and you know,
apologetically just broughtitself back to center.
SPEAKER_01 (17:58):
But I mean, all it's truly doing is an algorithm.
It's scouring the the internetand and gathering information.
Yes, information can be wrong,sure.
And so that's why it was saying,yes, I can lie because
information can be wrong.
SPEAKER_05 (18:12):
Right.
Or what you chose to look at.
SPEAKER_01 (18:14):
I mean, right, you know, but it cannot lie by um by
its own omission, if you will.
Yeah, it cannot just kind ofcreate something, yeah.
Um, which is what humans can dois create right so because of
our creative nature, we can lie.
(18:35):
Sure.
Because we are creative, but andso yes, we can create we we
imagine we create our ownreality, we can create like
massive and extensive lies, youknow, technically all fiction,
right?
Every fictional um you know workof art is is you know a lie.
Yeah, because what we can do iscreate something that is
(18:57):
nothing.
SPEAKER_05 (18:58):
So yeah, and by creating something that is
nothing is a fit.
SPEAKER_01 (19:03):
Right.
SPEAKER_05 (19:03):
You know, it's yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (19:05):
So um that's one thing that it cannot do, it
cannot create something that itdoes not see.
SPEAKER_05 (19:10):
True.
SPEAKER_01 (19:12):
So um that was a very interesting discussion that
AI and I had.
SPEAKER_05 (19:17):
That's interesting.
SPEAKER_01 (19:18):
Um so I ended up coming up with a new AI
catchphrase of uh back in the umgosh, what is this 1970s cop
show, Just a Facts Man?
SPEAKER_05 (19:28):
Oh, just a oh yeah.
Just a Facts Man, yeah.
So pretty much just give it theinformation and or it's what
it's giving you is it thinksit's fact.
Yep.
I gotcha.
Okay.
Um that was more than I expectedon that, and we we definitely
(19:50):
went into some things that I'mglad we did because it made some
parallels and some connections.
SPEAKER_01 (19:56):
Um and be really being able to um establish that
um that major difference.
And I think that that is um likeI was talking about with the AI
going in, um, you know, are wegetting too close to computing,
or is uh computing getting tooclose to us?
(20:19):
Right.
And so I think we need to reallytake a lot of time some uh out
as all of this comes to play,maybe we need to come up with
these distinctions betweenourselves, our human psyche, and
the um the AI itself.
SPEAKER_05 (20:39):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (20:39):
Uh or computing in general.
So um, because I mean this isagain long before what has been
created with right there in ourhands, chat GPT kind of AI
concepts.
Yeah.
This is long before all of that.
Um where it's it's again it'smoving and it's creating its own
identity.
(21:00):
Um, we are not that identity.
And so that's a um, I guesssometimes my my struggle with um
things like education, where wetry a little too hard to you
know do an input-output concept.
Where, you know, if I give youinformation and then I give you
(21:22):
a test, then the information Igave you need to needs to be
able to be seen on the test.
SPEAKER_05 (21:28):
Right.
The goal is it should betranslated perfectly.
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (21:31):
Which is not and so that's that's input-output,
right?
It's input-output.
So that means children arecomputers?
Well, no, of course they're not.
So, you know, they they the theMercury Mercury might be in
retrograde, yeah.
SPEAKER_05 (21:44):
Or Microsoft is in retrograde.
SPEAKER_01 (21:46):
Microsoft's in retrograde.
SPEAKER_05 (21:48):
Um sorry, I had to throw that in there.
SPEAKER_01 (21:50):
We we do need to coin that.
Yeah, we do.
SPEAKER_05 (21:52):
Um we did now.
SPEAKER_01 (21:54):
You know, and didn't have the right breakfast this
morning or so many factors.
SPEAKER_05 (22:00):
We're humans, we're not, you know.
SPEAKER_01 (22:02):
You just not not feeling the test or things like
that.
Um and so our input output's notexactly the same.
Right.
And then we get reallydiscouraged with the our
humanness when our humannessdoesn't react like the computer.
Well, if I put information if Iput a formula in the computer,
yeah, that computer will take myformula and output exactly what
(22:28):
uh the outcome I'm looking for.
Children, humans, we're none ofus are that way.
SPEAKER_05 (22:34):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (22:35):
Um, I think what we have to remember is the beauty
of that.
SPEAKER_05 (22:38):
Right.
That um technology fails too.
SPEAKER_01 (22:42):
What technology does fail.
So even technology is probablyon a normal basis of the failure
of technology, yeah, but thebeauty of humanity.
SPEAKER_02 (22:51):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (22:52):
Because uh they come into here, they they my my tech
has failed.
What what do I do?
Yeah.
And we meet the most incrediblepeople.
SPEAKER_05 (23:01):
Well, we really do, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (23:02):
We have uh discussions that are way beyond
technology and into you know,God everything, you know, just
spirituality, you name it.
Yes, I I love it.
SPEAKER_05 (23:12):
And it's just I I really do.
And I I'm I'm so glad that Imean God really played a role in
us making this jump.
And you know, it like the firsttime in my life, of course, it's
been almost two and a halfyears, I don't fear going to
work.
I don't know if fear is theright thing, but maybe it could
have been.
(23:32):
I can't, you know, but it's likeI and I know things are gonna be
thrown at me that I don'tanticipate or anything, or I
don't know who I'm gonnanecessarily meet.
Yes, I have a schedule, but andGod laughs, uh you ain't doing
that right.
Um, but it's I don't know, it itI I really feel like we've been
(23:55):
intentionally placed here, andI'm not saying it's because
we're saving our community.
No, that's not the point.
But when you know and when Godhas kind of, I guess, put on
your heart what you're supposedto do, and you've been fighting
it for maybe two decades, andyou finally give in and say,
fine, okay, I will.
(24:19):
Um it's just amazing how I guessthings fall into place.
SPEAKER_01 (24:24):
This couple of years has been very synchronistic,
very it just moves very well,um, and and not perfectly by any
means.
SPEAKER_05 (24:34):
But it's also been the hardest I've worked my whole
life.
SPEAKER_01 (24:37):
Yes.
SPEAKER_05 (24:37):
You know, but it but uh it doesn't feel that way
because you're going to be a badthing with passion.
SPEAKER_01 (24:43):
Hard work is a bad thing when you don't connect
with it.
SPEAKER_05 (24:46):
Yeah, that's true.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (24:47):
A lot of times, you know, you can you can be in a
situation where you're you'redoing the things, you're putting
your all into something.
Both of us have had jobs wherewe're putting our all into it,
yeah, but we're not connectedwith it.
Because there's absolutelysomething, and of course, what
was missing was you know thefuture of what we needed to do.
(25:10):
Yeah, but uh we weren'tconnected with the the the
passion wasn't there and so yes,you're right.
We work so much more, we worknights and weekends, we work
constant, uh but not in a waythat's um seems as invasive,
right?
SPEAKER_04 (25:27):
True.
SPEAKER_01 (25:28):
Because it's it's such a a passion for what we're
doing, and I love that.
SPEAKER_05 (25:33):
I think getting back to your conversation, that is
the humanness.
We have passion.
SPEAKER_01 (25:39):
Thank you for running that back out.
SPEAKER_05 (25:41):
Hey, look, and that's what we do.
So the humanness has passion.
Passion is an abstract variablethat can be tapped in through
the spirit.
Now, it's never predictable.
It's never it can be somethingthat leads you into answering a
question and making a decisionright there, you know, the whole
(26:02):
raising your hand and saying,okay, I will.
SPEAKER_01 (26:05):
Oh, that's to you, John.
SPEAKER_05 (26:06):
Yeah, that's you, John.
So it's a machine will never dothat.
That is where the spirit and theheart speak.
SPEAKER_01 (26:17):
That's where the human ends.
SPEAKER_05 (26:18):
Humans are notoriously adaptable.
You know, we talk about theendangered species.
We're only endangered if we donot promote ourselves and we
don't love ourselves and lovehumanity.
Yeah, and love humanity.
You know, we are actuallyextincting ourselves, whether
physically or just you know bytrying to pretend we're not
(26:43):
right.
By trying to pretend we're not.
I mean, there are things thereare things worse than death, and
that is when you're living alife with no love and no
passion.
Um so I guess what I'm gettingat is a computer can't pivot
using passion.
Um a computer cannot adapt.
(27:05):
It is using algorithms, it isusing formulas, and it's has
access to data.
So it can very convincingly makeit seem like, wow, you just
pulled that out of whatever.
No, it's it's able to makereally interesting connections.
Um humans can too.
I mean, we all have aha momentsthat had nothing to do with a
(27:28):
computer where we go, wait, Igot it.
And that could have beensomething you've been waiting 10
years to think of.
And all of a sudden now I'vecompletely changed my life,
formed a new business, and movedon.
I've heard those successstories.
A computer didn't do thateither.
Um we shortchange our abilities,I think, all the time.
SPEAKER_01 (27:47):
Um so and let's not shortchange ourselves in
thinking that we need to matchthe AI or the computing system.
SPEAKER_02 (27:56):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (27:57):
That what we're trying to do is have a tool that
only is an assistant or ahelpful guy, you know, helpful
um piece of the puzzle.
SPEAKER_05 (28:08):
Sure.
SPEAKER_01 (28:09):
But will never ever get to the point of matching the
human spirit.
SPEAKER_05 (28:13):
Yeah.
And and I hear all the timepeople go, Well, you know, I'm
I'm computer illiterate, or Idon't know.
There's intimidation when itcomes to technology, and I mean,
rightfully so.
I understand why.
There are people like uh maybelearned about technology and
(28:33):
have PTSD from it because, youknow, well, you don't are not
getting this, or you're notdoing this right, and blah,
blah, blah.
And don't touch that.
Don't touch that, exactly.
And there are people like, I'mafraid to touch it, I'll break
it.
And it's like, well, what awonderful thing.
You break it, and you can learnhow to fix it with guidance,
then now you know something new.
And now you can show your friendwhen they break it.
So I mean, it's really how youknow we've really learned and
(28:55):
shared knowledge from you know,sticks and rocks.
But I guess when it when itcomes down to it, we um the uh
with even web design, which isanother layer of computing with
servers and you know, design andwhat have you.
Um, so many times we'll have aclient come in and we have a
(29:16):
meeting, and we like meetingwith the people.
Uh, we had a wonderful one thispast week where it it's we help
them to understand, I'm notsure, whatever.
It's like just spit everythingout.
When we spit everything out, wedraw connections, we have
conversation.
That's how you kind of build theweb, if you will, of how of the
concepts you want to do.
SPEAKER_01 (29:35):
Actually, that's why a lot of people like to come to
us because they're not sure whatthey want.
SPEAKER_05 (29:40):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (29:40):
And it's like throw it all on the table, and then
we'll collect the things thatare necessary.
Right.
We will put it together.
SPEAKER_05 (29:46):
And then help you have the conversation.
Yeah, it was just like um lastweek, where or this past week,
where he's describing well,here's why I want to do this.
Here's this person, and such andsuch.
And I'm like, all right.
What would you want to tell themto convince them that you're the
right guy for the job?
SPEAKER_01 (30:04):
Right.
SPEAKER_05 (30:05):
He's like, ah, I see what you mean.
SPEAKER_01 (30:08):
So now we need to talk to your audience.
SPEAKER_05 (30:10):
So we're talking now.
Because that is why yourwebsite's now powerful.
Exactly.
But I've I've said, you know, inwhat 17, 18 years, I guess we've
been doing this.
I've, you know, have foundmyself saying many times, look,
you are the expert in what youdo.
Right.
As we talk, I can learn fromthat.
(30:31):
I'm the expert in what I do, butit all involves collaboration.
You just can't find a web designtool and just say, okay, I'm
going to make my website, youknow?
And maybe you can.
And that's that's great.
But there's so many factors inthe same respect.
I can't act like I understandrefrigeration.
I can't say I understand how totake care of septic, you know,
(30:53):
those things or any of the I'mso glad people do.
Yeah.
And it's so cool when you have aclient and you kind of learn so
much about their industry.
It's like, I had no idea.
SPEAKER_01 (31:03):
And I love that the they they trust us because our
industry is communications.
We want to take exactly what youdo, right?
Put it in this format, wrap itin a beautiful bow, and promote
you.
SPEAKER_05 (31:17):
With some of the magic you may not know, but it's
only magic because you don'tunderstand it.
But honestly, what you do, Ifeel is magic.
SPEAKER_02 (31:24):
Right.
SPEAKER_05 (31:25):
You know, so and and that that's respect for
humanity.
And again, that is thehumanness, that is the passion.
That are all these conceptshere.
The computer itself is there.
Yes, we use technology, but weset them all on a table, it
ain't gonna do it for us.
No, and it never will.
SPEAKER_01 (31:41):
Because it'll never have the passion, it won't.
SPEAKER_05 (31:43):
And or intent.
You always still have that inputand output.
You always still have thatdichotomy.
You have this human and thishuman, the computer's in the
middle as the tool.
And how can we both reach andcollaborate with this tool to
help us communicate better?
But we both want, we both needto want to in the first place.
SPEAKER_01 (32:08):
I guess before we get to our game, the the
finishing point right now.
SPEAKER_05 (32:12):
We need game time here.
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (32:14):
We do have a game.
Um the finishing point is it'sit can't be human.
So we're not actually afraid ofAI.
But we're afraid of what thehuman will do with AI.
SPEAKER_05 (32:30):
Yeah, I think that's a that's a point too.
SPEAKER_01 (32:33):
Yeah, I think we need to sometimes realize that
we're actually more afraid ofthe other human, right?
The human that's gonna dosomething wrong with the AI.
Yes, what is a possibility?
We're not actually afraid of thetechnology, we're afraid of the
human behind the curtain.
SPEAKER_05 (32:47):
I think you're right, and that is true.
Um, I mean, and and again, Ithink in the earlier podcast,
very recently, we made thereference to Terminator and all
these other glorified thingswhere it was kind of like, oh my
gosh, and um just justyesterday.
SPEAKER_01 (33:02):
Um not Terminator, right, Mary.
SPEAKER_05 (33:04):
Look, y'all, if you never saw it, and you know, I'm
not one to always doom scrolland find stuff, but I stumbled
upon some funny things in the2001 Space Odyssey.
Um there is a YouTube segmentwhere they say, What if the HAL
9000 was like Alexa?
If you got a minute and 19seconds, look it up on YouTube,
(33:24):
and it is hilarious.
The point I want to make withthat is the fact that um we saw
this movie when it came out in1968 as being one of the first
examples of fear with technologywhere this um robot entity was
(33:45):
previous right, Hal, which youknow is one letter off IBM
anyway, um, was don't berevived.
All right, you go ahead andbring sticks up in here, did
you?
SPEAKER_01 (33:55):
Sorry, sticks is my love.
SPEAKER_05 (33:57):
So it's uh threatening his life essentially
by not opening the pod babedoors.
So, but he's communicating withit, and of course, we know the
frustration of it is not doingwhat he wants.
But not to ruin anything, haveyou spoken to Alexa and asked
him to do something, and it wentway off on a tangent, and it's
like that is not even what Isaid.
(34:18):
So look that up if you want toas a fun segue.
SPEAKER_01 (34:23):
Into into well, are we gonna do our game?
SPEAKER_05 (34:27):
Yes, we're gonna do our game.
SPEAKER_01 (34:28):
We've gotta do our game.
SPEAKER_05 (34:29):
Now, look, I I kind of want to preface this.
Um first off, I'll explain thegame, but that'll also explain.
SPEAKER_01 (34:36):
How do we find the game?
Because we're gonna put it outthere.
Yeah, we're gonna put it outthere.
So I'm so sorry, I want to getyou.
SPEAKER_05 (34:42):
No, you're fine.
No, we're good.
Nope, we're good.
So, anyway, the game this timeis gonna be founders versus
fictionals.
And and any grammar hammers outthere, don't tell me fictionals
is not a word.
I know fictionals and adjective,fictionals is a noun.
We can create nouns fromadjectives, you do it all the
time.
Something can be sweet, but whatdo we eat?
(35:04):
We eat sweets.
So, anyway, we just did that.
We made up a word.
SPEAKER_01 (35:07):
So Did you just make it okay for your English degree?
Yes, I did.
SPEAKER_05 (35:11):
I have two English degrees.
That means I can make up twowords a day.
So I'm only halfway there andliving on a prayer.
I'm um so yeah, anyway.
Okay, so not six.
No, that would be Bonjo used todo, right?
SPEAKER_02 (35:26):
I I'm good with that.
SPEAKER_05 (35:27):
So we're gonna play that game, but uh look, um,
we've had a couple people talkto us about the games.
They're like, oh, that soundedreally fun.
So we decided on our website,which is winternetweb.com, okay,
and you look under our podcasts.
That's of course where we youcan listen to um probably 60
(35:47):
some percent of the people havefound our website to listen to
our podcasts.
Uh majority of the people are onum you know either Spotify or
Apple Podcasts or whatever.
And 50 some of the things allover the country, all over the
country.
Yeah, I mean, places I'm like,so who lives in Connecticut?
Right?
(36:08):
Who lives out who who lives inSanta Barbara, California?
I mean, yeah, so we know it'sgetting out there and it's
growing, but it and it'll growmore as people support it, and I
do appreciate people sharing andyou know following.
Like if you use Apple Podcastsor something like that, um,
hitting the follow button, and Ifeel like I'm one of those
people on a YouTube video, pushit right now, and I'll give you
(36:30):
10% off whatever.
No.
But anyway, it it does help thealgorithm, and I do appreciate
those that have.
What we've done on that page isI've created prompts so that for
any of the games we've played, Ithink this one right here will
be um our fourth one.
Fifth game.
Or fifth game, yeah, I think so,yeah.
(36:51):
Um, and it will you can take thetext of that prompt and put it
in the chat GPT or put it intowhatever AI of your choice, and
it should be able to give it theinformation it needs to so that
you can play or play along withothers.
So we'll try to get into that umright now.
(37:15):
Okay, so for this game, uh, Iknow we're talking about
founders versus fictionals.
The idea was we want a namegiven to us, and we need to
figure out is this someone thatis a founder within, say, the
technology movement historicallyor up until toward the present.
SPEAKER_01 (37:36):
Which would be a real person, right?
SPEAKER_05 (37:37):
A real person, right?
Or the name of a fictionalcharacter in books, and I
believe it may even dip intoscreenplays and all that,
possibly, because I don't thinkI'll put limitations on that.
So we and this will be fun forus.
Any fictional character.
So, in other words, this is areal person in technology field,
(37:58):
or is this the name of someoneelse?
SPEAKER_01 (38:00):
So Moriarty to Dr.
McDreamy, anybody that is therewe go.
SPEAKER_05 (38:05):
That's right.
So we're gonna wing it.
Let's go.
So, anyway.
All right, AI, let's playfounders versus fictionals.
You ready?
unknown (38:17):
Absolutely, I'm ready.
Let's play founders versusfictionals.
I'll give you a name and you canguess if they're a real life
tech founder or a fictionalcharacter.
Let's get started.
Here's the first name for youElon Tusk.
SPEAKER_00 (38:30):
Is that a real tech founder or a fictional
character?
Let me know your guess.
SPEAKER_01 (38:36):
So why is he really hard when we do practices and
then he gets weird when we areon air?
SPEAKER_05 (38:43):
I know.
And Elon Tusk?
SPEAKER_01 (38:47):
Which was this a probably something that has been
created into a fictional fanfiction thing?
SPEAKER_05 (38:56):
There's no way.
Why would you try to throw atrick question at us?
SPEAKER_01 (39:00):
I know.
SPEAKER_05 (39:01):
Alright, I'm gonna fuss at him.
I'm gonna go ahead on this.
Alright, you said Elon Tusk.
And first I think you're unfairto us.
You're throwing something weirdat us.
Look, we're trying to at leastseem like we know what the heck
we're talking about on ourpodcast.
We know Elon Musk, but Elon Tuskhas to be like some type of fan
(39:21):
fiction or some extrapolationfrom the real person.
unknown (39:27):
You got it.
SPEAKER_00 (39:28):
Elon Tusk is definitely a fictional name,
kind of a playful twist button,Elon Musk.
So, you know then.
I promise I'll keep the names abit more uh straightforward from
here on out.
Let me know when you're readyfor the next one.
SPEAKER_04 (39:39):
Alright, let's go, man.
unknown (39:42):
Alright, here we go.
SPEAKER_00 (39:43):
The next name is Ada Lovelace.
Is she a real life tech pioneeror a fictional character?
SPEAKER_04 (39:49):
I recognize it.
What do you think, Babe?
SPEAKER_01 (39:51):
Well, we mentioned that earlier.
Ada Ada Lovelace is uh Right,right.
As far as females in thecomputing world, that is one of
Well, that's right.
SPEAKER_05 (40:01):
She was the one of the babbage computing.
SPEAKER_01 (40:03):
Yes, that's one of the main names.
Um so when you think females inearly computing, Ada Lovelace is
like uh so real founder,absolute.
SPEAKER_05 (40:14):
Alright, do you want to respond or AI or me?
Alright.
SPEAKER_01 (40:20):
All right, Ada Lovelace is a founder in
technology and not a fictional.
SPEAKER_00 (40:26):
Absolutely right.
Ada Lovelace is indeed a realhistorical figure and is often
considered the first computerprogrammer.
Nicely done.
unknown (40:34):
Let me know if you want to keep going.
SPEAKER_04 (40:36):
Alright, I think we'll do about three more.
So go ahead, let's go.
unknown (40:41):
Perfect.
Let's do it.
Alright, the next name is ZaraTechman.
SPEAKER_00 (40:46):
Is that a real tech doctor or a fictional character?
Let me know your guess.
SPEAKER_05 (40:51):
Zara Techman.
SPEAKER_01 (40:53):
Zara Techman?
SPEAKER_05 (40:55):
This sounds like probably a fictional sci-fi
novel.
Yeah.
And this some this person wasprobably on their way to I don't
know, Jupiter somewhere goingtraveling through the space or
something, you know.
SPEAKER_01 (41:11):
Some sort of like sci-fi fictional.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_05 (41:14):
Alright, we're gonna, I mean, might as well.
Alright, we think that is maybea sci-fi character name being
fictional.
unknown (41:24):
You got it.
SPEAKER_00 (41:28):
Great job in that one.
unknown (41:30):
Uh alright.
Let's keep the momentum going.
Here comes the next name.
Grace Hopper.
SPEAKER_00 (41:35):
Is she a real tech pioneer or a fictional
character?
SPEAKER_05 (41:39):
Gotta do recognize a name.
Which Grace?
Grace Hopper.
SPEAKER_01 (41:43):
Hopper.
SPEAKER_05 (41:45):
That's that's technology, gosh.
SPEAKER_01 (41:48):
Um if you recognize a name, that is probably a well
probably, yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_05 (41:52):
I know.
It that's considering how many Igot two degrees in English, but
I can get to how many books Iread.
SPEAKER_01 (41:58):
Well, I thought the fictionals would be a little
more, you know, like maybe Yeah.
SPEAKER_05 (42:03):
Um something recognizable.
SPEAKER_01 (42:05):
Well, not necessarily recognizable, but
maybe literary.
SPEAKER_05 (42:09):
Yeah, I know what you mean.
Yeah.
And it gets pulling from allsources.
SPEAKER_01 (42:13):
Right.
SPEAKER_05 (42:14):
Oh, geez.
I I do, I feel like it is thisgonna be one of those.
I don't be like, oh yeah.
It's like Eli Whitney.
SPEAKER_01 (42:22):
It's like, oh, the cotton chin.
Oh, of course, you know.
Everybody should know that.
If they don't, then some wrong.
SPEAKER_05 (42:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (42:29):
They didn't go to third grade, fourth grade, and
eighth grade.
SPEAKER_05 (42:32):
All right, I'm moving.
Grace Hopper is a technologypioneer.
SPEAKER_00 (42:39):
Absolutely correct.
Grace Hopper was a legendarycomputer scientist.
Nicely done.
All right, just two more to go.
SPEAKER_05 (42:46):
Well, hold on, hold on.
I want to interrupt you.
Um, what did Grace Hopper do?
SPEAKER_00 (42:51):
Grace Hopper was an incredible pioneer in computer
science.
She was one of the firstprogrammers of the Harvard Micro
One computer and developed thefirst compiler for a computer
programming language, which madeit much easier to mount
software.
She also popularized the termdebugging or fixing computer
glitches.
Oh, she was truly a trailblazer.
SPEAKER_05 (43:09):
So, of course.
I knew the hope of the thing.
Yeah, the debugging thing and mymy time in programming.
Yes, of course.
And um I did, but you I've nowofficially said.
SPEAKER_01 (43:21):
Oh yeah.
Well, thank you, Grace Hopper.
Yep for debugging all of us.
SPEAKER_05 (43:28):
All right, go ahead and give us our last one for
today.
Um, I'm not gonna say make ithard, make it like look through
everything in your, you know,data brain.
Something fun, somethingworthwhile to go out with a bang
on.
unknown (43:46):
I love it.
All right, here we go.
For the final one, the name isLara Codsworth.
Is that a real tech founder or afictional character?
Let me know what you think.
SPEAKER_05 (43:56):
Oh boy.
SPEAKER_01 (43:59):
Lyra Codsworth.
For some reason that Codsworthmakes me feel like that um I'm
with you.
SPEAKER_05 (44:08):
Yes.
Um I'm thinking Lara Codsworthis definitely a fictional
character.
SPEAKER_00 (44:16):
You got it.
Larry Codsworth is indeed afictional name, so you nailed it
on the head.
Uh great job.
That's a lot of fun.
SPEAKER_05 (44:22):
Hold on.
Oh, well, I'm glad, yes, youwere very helpful.
Um, I agree.
But we need to know where LaraCodsworth was a part of, because
we recognize it, but apparentlywe haven't read it in a minute.
unknown (44:38):
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (44:39):
Uh Lara Codsworth is a name that's reminiscent of the
Fallout series.
Particularly from the Fallout 4game.
Uh Codsworth is actually acharacter in the game.
SPEAKER_01 (44:48):
All right, be sure to go and check our games out
that we have on the website, andsome extras that we have that
are part of each episode on thewebsite as well.
SPEAKER_05 (45:00):
Yeah, we still got the um keyboard cat there, and
we'll add other items.
But why not?
I know, you can't get rid of it.
In fact, I thought about havingkeyboard cat soundtrack um
before every game we play.
I'm still working on that, butwe'll see.
But look, I I think we're there.
And look, um, appreciateeveryone uh taking the time to
listen and for our fans thatbinge watch and all that.
SPEAKER_01 (45:22):
Um had so many people say, Hey, I've started
listening, and and I'm veryexcited.
Thank you so much.
SPEAKER_05 (45:29):
Yeah, I mean it's just it's fun to do.
So, you know, and it's uh we'reglad that it resonates with
people.
So I guess um we're gonna besigning off here on Wired
Together, and you can find us onall the different channels, uh
Heart Radio, Apple Podcasts,Spotify, whatever you got.
And um, thanks for you knowhelping us out.
(45:50):
But I'm plugging for now.
SPEAKER_01 (45:52):
But always stay connected.
Alright, well, uh, thank you so much for joining us
again um on Wired Together.
I am Melanie Winter.
SPEAKER_05 (00:14):
And I'm Jason Winter.
SPEAKER_01 (00:16):
And today we are super excited.
It is National IT ProfessionalsDay.
Um, we do lots of differentthings here at WinterNet Web,
uh, which is our the the parentcompany of Wired Together.
Yeah, and um one of the thingsthat we do, and I say we very
loosely I do a lot of contentdesign, I do um a lot of the the
(00:39):
prep for things.
Uh I do not do computer repair.
I am still learning myself, so Idefinitely understand those that
come in to the store and say,you know, I don't know if I'm
saying this right.
I sympathize or empathizecompletely.
I am still learning myself.
(01:01):
Um, I find what he does likeabsolute sorcery.
So happy National ITProfessionals Day, Jason.
SPEAKER_05 (01:08):
Oh, come on now.
It I mean, see, when it comes totechnology, it's always a
lifetime of learning.
SPEAKER_02 (01:15):
It is, and I know I didn't have all that.
Right.
SPEAKER_05 (01:18):
I started very, very oddly young.
Um, but it's one of those thingsyou learn what you need to know.
And you know, for many of us,that might be, you know, I know
how to do Google search, findthese different things, and know
how to use a word processor.
Uh, you might have a hobby andyou have software you use for
that hobby, and you know that.
(01:38):
And um, you know, the more youuse it, that's fine.
I mean, you you you learnthings, but I took typing in
high school.
I mean, and and that's great.
I mean, you you've done a lot ofgreat things.
SPEAKER_01 (01:50):
So I am again still learning.
SPEAKER_05 (01:52):
Right.
But see, I've learned just likefrom like my teaching roots,
I've learned so much from mystudents.
In this case, over this pastsince we've had a storefront two
and a half years, I've probablytouched 400 computers with 250
different things.
And because I've done it,obviously I know more because
I've had the you know, had thetrivia thrown at me.
(02:15):
So now I've learned new things.
So yeah, it's um and better whensomething is thrown at me.
SPEAKER_01 (02:21):
Right.
Just yesterday I was able to dojust a small amount of
troubleshooting uh while youwere still in a meeting.
So um, and so that's I I can.
SPEAKER_05 (02:32):
Of course you can.
SPEAKER_01 (02:33):
And and I can answer questions that can troubleshoot
a little.
Uh so I guess I am sellingmyself self short, but um
definitely it's definitely yourday.
SPEAKER_05 (02:42):
That's not the reason for the podcast, but we
just stumbled upon it.
We happen to stumble upon it.
I think I was scrolling socialmedia and some someone posted,
and I'm like, oh well, we gottamention that, I guess.
SPEAKER_01 (02:55):
Maybe we celebrate national wine day, right?
Yeah, exactly.
Stuff like that.
So every day.
Wine.
SPEAKER_05 (03:02):
Yeah.
So well, all right.
SPEAKER_01 (03:07):
So um that was not exactly what we had as far as
what we wanted to set up fortoday.
Um, but it kind of does go alongwith everything um in IT, if you
will.
Um, we wanted to talk a littlebit about kind of the founder,
the founding of um the AImovement.
(03:28):
Um we feel like a lot of people,I'm sure, and and myself
included, feel like IT, I mean,AI just kind of happened.
It just kind of like presenteditself, and all of a sudden now
it's this big hot button issue.
SPEAKER_02 (03:42):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (03:43):
Um, and and really it didn't, it did not just
happen.
Um and so that is kind of wherewe wanted to just do a little
bit of uh dig into that, andthen you know, as we do,
sometimes it's fun to play agame.
So of course we'll play a game.
SPEAKER_05 (03:58):
We'll talk more about that later.
But uh, you know, it I think onereason why people feel like AI
just happened is um what justover two years ago, I think it
was uh it was you know, I thinkit the ChatGPT thing was the
bigger bigger player that kindof came out so having a
platform, right?
(04:19):
And then people startedunderstanding right, looking at
it, and then all of a sudden,because people started messing
with it and got feedback thatwas above and beyond anything
they ever experienced.
And you know, usually you wouldhave to like pay a lot of money
for a tool that would convertwhatever you're trying to do,
(04:41):
and you know, you feel likeyou're getting that payload.
Uh, this was something thatanyone could just mess with, and
we're like, whoa, this is bigdeal.
I mean, it really was like, youknow, we fired up the big boys
and just handed it to people andsaid, all right, look what this
can do.
And it, I mean, there were therewere conferences or businesses
that all got together and waslike, hey, what does this AI
(05:02):
mean?
So yeah, but I guess to whatyou're getting at is AI as a
concept didn't start then, thatit had origins.
SPEAKER_01 (05:12):
Right.
And so we, you know, we we didfind an article um that you can
obviously look up and and readfor yourself.
It's only a few paragraphs, soit's not like you know, bulky or
anything.
Um, it's quidgest.
Is that how we evenquidgest.com.
SPEAKER_05 (05:29):
Q-U-I-D-G-E-S-T.com.
SPEAKER_01 (05:32):
And so uh this was written in um March 19th of 2021
about the founding fathers ofthe artificial intelligence.
So it kind of just gives alittle bit of an overview of
some of the people that were inearly computing, but really by
definition, the early computingum, which would be um you know
(05:55):
started in in the early turn ofthe last century, so the the 19
early 1900s going, you know,more like 1930s, 1950s, where
things were starting to reallyprogress.
Um, the the large computers, asyou know, and things like that,
um, they were starting torealize what these things were
capable of um and how they couldum manipulate the and and have
(06:20):
these things run real fast.
And so we think we think a lotof times is computing is just
calculations, and really even inthe early time period with Alan
Turning and that kind of thing,it's it's not just calculations,
he's actually trying to get moreinto that self-modifying,
self-improving.
(06:41):
And so that by it definition isan AI concept.
So it's if it can start to kindof formulate uh what it wants to
give you as far as informationbased on the experiences it's
having, right?
Then that's giving it a littlebit more than just calculations,
(07:05):
so it's not just input-output.
SPEAKER_05 (07:07):
Right, yeah, I was gonna say input output, yeah.
Because I mean computer was aterm that was a person's title,
you know, and then we had themachines that started performing
that better.
So you could have an employee,and um females are like really
big and formative in thisindustry.
Uh most of the computers werefemale, and actually, because
(07:28):
all right, let's just say youhad your engineers that were
stereotypically male, you know,we built this wonderful big
thing, and um, I know in myexperience of a lot of things,
it's like okay, they they buildit, and I say, How's it work?
Well, we don't know.
We were told to build it.
The females were more intent onactually, okay, fine.
We need to make use of this, andpeople need to understand how it
(07:51):
works.
So they tinkered, put ittogether, and all that.
A lot of your software, a lot ofthis was created.
SPEAKER_01 (07:57):
Oh, so are you saying that early computing is
almost like your your mom andpop?
You've got to have kind of bothsides working together as far as
that is exactly what I'm saying.
SPEAKER_05 (08:06):
Um beautiful.
Um, we'll just um okay.
Yeah, I've really stumped younow.
No, no, no.
I just I just don't want tosound too stereotypical, but I
mean, I mean, females largelytend to be caring for the house,
the nest, and the we gotta makethis work.
(08:27):
Males sometimes get tunnelvision or very frequently.
It's like, okay, I went to work,did this, what I made this
money, whatever.
Here's here's the path I'm on.
And the female goes, how can wemake best out of all of this?
And I feel like um the unsungheroes of the computing movement
largely were females.
And if you do the research, youwill find, you know, time and
(08:50):
time again, that wasn't what Iwas going to talk about right
now, but it's what it led into.
But how and all you know, thesegue being the computer was a
role, your job was to help withyou know figuring out
calculations, you know, you havedata, and for businesses, data
was very important.
That controlled your next pathand what direction you're going.
(09:11):
And that's important, of course,with competition.
How do we outperform thesepeople and grab the market
before they do?
So, as computers as the umdevice came to be, then it was
okay, yes, it can do simpleinput-output.
But what is this like what elsecan it do?
(09:33):
How do we push it further?
And that's when the idea of AIreally started growing because
you know, you're interactingwith this device, and you know,
you're telling it to dosomething, it's giving you
feedback.
And I remember as a young childwith Dolphs and all that, and
early years of programming, thatwas interesting.
(09:55):
It was almost like I found thisfriend that I can work with, you
know, and it's as sad as that itmight sound.
SPEAKER_02 (10:01):
That does sound a little bit.
SPEAKER_05 (10:02):
It does sound sad, but I mean, I mean, the
nostalgia of the buzz, the glowof the screen.
I mean it's okay.
SPEAKER_01 (10:08):
I had a Tamagotchi.
I am this.
SPEAKER_05 (10:11):
But anyone out there in my age group, you know, that
um enjoyed tinkering withcomputers probably can relate to
that.
SPEAKER_01 (10:20):
Um can I dive in here?
Please do, because I need to betaken away from the show.
The female voice, um, whatyou're talking about earlier,
um, makes perfect sense.
You have uh, of course, youryour builders of the
input-output kind of concept,but then you need that to be
communicated.
SPEAKER_03 (10:38):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (10:39):
So who better in ways of communication than uh
like you're talking about withthe the the female inputs of of
uh early technology?
Yeah, uh, minus lovelace.
I we unfortunately did not lookup anything to help with the
twist of what you decided to do.
(11:06):
Minus that, you know, um I can'tthrow anybody out there uh off
the fly, unfortunately.
And that's actually reallyunfortunate.
I would recognize their names.
SPEAKER_05 (11:15):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (11:15):
We're gonna do an episode on that.
SPEAKER_05 (11:17):
We will.
We will do an episode of all theum the female pioneers in
computing.
You will be very surprised.
SPEAKER_01 (11:24):
I mean, we wouldn't be on the moon, we wouldn't have
half the crap we got there nowbecause um you know we wouldn't
have uh continued generationswithout females, right?
SPEAKER_05 (11:36):
That too.
We would we would have died off25 years ago, you know.
SPEAKER_01 (11:41):
So but also is true, is like you said, it it the two
things have to go together.
Like I was saying with mom andpop, you gotta build it.
That is true.
So everything needs to be built,everything's communicated.
So there you go with wiredtogether.
SPEAKER_05 (11:57):
Huzzah, all right, full circle, yep.
Um just a happenstance, ahappenstance, yep.
SPEAKER_01 (12:06):
Um so within this article, again, we're talking.
Um I'm trying to get back.
You you've rubbed me with this alittle bit.
SPEAKER_05 (12:15):
I'm sorry.
No, but I mean you just gotta gowith where it goes, right?
SPEAKER_01 (12:19):
Um kind of what they were thinking in the early time
period, and again, I really urgeyou to read the article.
Um, we've got a couple ofdifferent names here that
they're kind of dropping in theum the early time period, and
like you said, Alan Turning.
Yeah.
Um they there's one guy theywere talking about with Marvin
(12:40):
Minsky, and one thing that hewas really um one one thing I
wanted to pull from the article.
Um please read what he did, andthat's cool.
Yeah, we just don't want to readto you, so we're trying we're
trying to just spit out ourpoints and not it was neat what
he was talking about with um hereally believed that what they
(13:02):
were building would um helpsolve a lot of humanity
problems, and so um that's onething that he was um kind of
saying against people that werestarting to feel uncomfortable
in that that at this time in the50s, uh people were getting a
(13:23):
lot of information with uh thesci fi um genre building that
movement started where all of asudden everything starts to feel
like it's closing in and maybetechnology is not the way.
So people start having someproblems with that now.
This was this actually was backin the 50s as well, right um,
(13:45):
where are is technology gonnatake over?
Can technology really replacehumanity?
Um, that kind of thing.
And so he was um one of thosethat's like, you know, this
might actually help humanity,but we're talking about the
difference between computing andum a self-involv evolving
(14:05):
machine versus a human.
So uh that's kind of what wewanted to lay the groundwork on
in discussion is the the machineversus the human.
SPEAKER_05 (14:19):
Um it's interesting because uh we've tried to always
make computers to um communicatewith us, to some people may say
to replace us, but you know, aswe try to approve upon the
computer as a tool, you'retrying to get closer and closer
to the human.
(14:40):
But we both have very distinctdifferences, you know, you know,
us as humans are very differentfrom a computer.
And I think with AI becomes thatconfusing uh notion of wow, it
it's almost like I'm talking toa person.
It feels too close, it feels tooclose, right?
SPEAKER_01 (14:59):
And then is it well, and and actually one of my
points with AI is or any of thisum computing is do we sometimes
feel too close to it on theother side of are we trying too
hard to be the computer and notthe human?
(15:20):
And I think we've got toeventually create this big
distinctive difference betweenthe two of us.
Um that A, you know, the I Iasked, I actually did ask AI
whether or not it could lie, andit it told me why it it can lie,
but it can't.
Um, because it can lie, but ithas no intention of lying
(15:43):
because it has no motivation.
SPEAKER_05 (15:44):
So it's in its ability to, but that's not a
choice it makes when responding.
SPEAKER_01 (15:50):
Because it doesn't really need to survive, it
doesn't have an emotionalintention.
SPEAKER_05 (15:56):
Oh, that's interesting.
SPEAKER_01 (15:57):
And so it actually means to me in a very deep dive
um that it cannot lieintentionally because it doesn't
need to.
That's true.
I guess it's not living.
And so it doesn't need tosurvive, it doesn't need to um,
you know, have an emotionalcontext with anything.
It's just facts.
SPEAKER_05 (16:17):
The young child, it breaks the vase, you know, and
the mother's like, what happenedto the vase?
You know, the child may be like,um, you know, I I I don't know.
The cat did it.
Um the vase fell, which isgreat.
You know, using passive, youknow, the passive voice always
came out of taking the subjectout of the sentence, which is a
great way of lying because youtake yourself out, but anyway,
(16:38):
that's all another thing.
So, but yes, that is anemotional moment.
Mama's mad, you know, and I wantto save my tail.
Right.
So I'm going to say maybe this.
So AI has no reason forsurvival.
It doesn't know when when I turnit off or turn it on, it's not
like, oh, now I need to get backin my box.
(16:59):
It's not the genie in the lamp,you know.
So because of the lack of thatemotional thing, right?
There's no need.
Huh, it's interesting.
SPEAKER_01 (17:09):
There is no emotion, therefore it does not need to
have, or there is no survival,therefore it doesn't need
emotion, therefore it doesn'treally need intention.
SPEAKER_05 (17:19):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (17:20):
So that is our distinction here is is that line
in the sand of it can lie.
And so what AI actually did sayis it can lie.
But if you challenge its lie, ifit realizes it lied, it it's uh
also unlike a human, um, will goahead and correct itself.
SPEAKER_05 (17:41):
Oh, yeah.
Many times we've said something,it said something back, and I'm
like, but no, maybe youmisunderstood me because that's
not entirely true.
And it's like, yep, I I made awrong assumption there.
You're exactly right, and youknow, and you know,
apologetically just broughtitself back to center.
SPEAKER_01 (17:58):
But I mean, all it's truly doing is an algorithm.
It's scouring the the internetand and gathering information.
Yes, information can be wrong,sure.
And so that's why it was saying,yes, I can lie because
information can be wrong.
SPEAKER_05 (18:12):
Right.
Or what you chose to look at.
SPEAKER_01 (18:14):
I mean, right, you know, but it cannot lie by um by
its own omission, if you will.
Yeah, it cannot just kind ofcreate something, yeah.
Um, which is what humans can dois create right so because of
our creative nature, we can lie.
(18:35):
Sure.
Because we are creative, but andso yes, we can create we we
imagine we create our ownreality, we can create like
massive and extensive lies, youknow, technically all fiction,
right?
Every fictional um you know workof art is is you know a lie.
Yeah, because what we can do iscreate something that is
(18:57):
nothing.
SPEAKER_05 (18:58):
So yeah, and by creating something that is
nothing is a fit.
SPEAKER_01 (19:03):
Right.
SPEAKER_05 (19:03):
You know, it's yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (19:05):
So um that's one thing that it cannot do, it
cannot create something that itdoes not see.
SPEAKER_05 (19:10):
True.
SPEAKER_01 (19:12):
So um that was a very interesting discussion that
AI and I had.
SPEAKER_05 (19:17):
That's interesting.
SPEAKER_01 (19:18):
Um so I ended up coming up with a new AI
catchphrase of uh back in the umgosh, what is this 1970s cop
show, Just a Facts Man?
SPEAKER_05 (19:28):
Oh, just a oh yeah.
Just a Facts Man, yeah.
So pretty much just give it theinformation and or it's what
it's giving you is it thinksit's fact.
Yep.
I gotcha.
Okay.
Um that was more than I expectedon that, and we we definitely
(19:50):
went into some things that I'mglad we did because it made some
parallels and some connections.
SPEAKER_01 (19:56):
Um and be really being able to um establish that
um that major difference.
And I think that that is um likeI was talking about with the AI
going in, um, you know, are wegetting too close to computing,
or is uh computing getting tooclose to us?
(20:19):
Right.
And so I think we need to reallytake a lot of time some uh out
as all of this comes to play,maybe we need to come up with
these distinctions betweenourselves, our human psyche, and
the um the AI itself.
SPEAKER_05 (20:39):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (20:39):
Uh or computing in general.
So um, because I mean this isagain long before what has been
created with right there in ourhands, chat GPT kind of AI
concepts.
Yeah.
This is long before all of that.
Um where it's it's again it'smoving and it's creating its own
identity.
(21:00):
Um, we are not that identity.
And so that's a um, I guesssometimes my my struggle with um
things like education, where wetry a little too hard to you
know do an input-output concept.
Where, you know, if I give youinformation and then I give you
(21:22):
a test, then the information Igave you need to needs to be
able to be seen on the test.
SPEAKER_05 (21:28):
Right.
The goal is it should betranslated perfectly.
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (21:31):
Which is not and so that's that's input-output,
right?
It's input-output.
So that means children arecomputers?
Well, no, of course they're not.
So, you know, they they the theMercury Mercury might be in
retrograde, yeah.
SPEAKER_05 (21:44):
Or Microsoft is in retrograde.
SPEAKER_01 (21:46):
Microsoft's in retrograde.
SPEAKER_05 (21:48):
Um sorry, I had to throw that in there.
SPEAKER_01 (21:50):
We we do need to coin that.
Yeah, we do.
SPEAKER_05 (21:52):
Um we did now.
SPEAKER_01 (21:54):
You know, and didn't have the right breakfast this
morning or so many factors.
SPEAKER_05 (22:00):
We're humans, we're not, you know.
SPEAKER_01 (22:02):
You just not not feeling the test or things like
that.
Um and so our input output's notexactly the same.
Right.
And then we get reallydiscouraged with the our
humanness when our humannessdoesn't react like the computer.
Well, if I put information if Iput a formula in the computer,
yeah, that computer will take myformula and output exactly what
(22:28):
uh the outcome I'm looking for.
Children, humans, we're none ofus are that way.
SPEAKER_05 (22:34):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (22:35):
Um, I think what we have to remember is the beauty
of that.
SPEAKER_05 (22:38):
Right.
That um technology fails too.
SPEAKER_01 (22:42):
What technology does fail.
So even technology is probablyon a normal basis of the failure
of technology, yeah, but thebeauty of humanity.
SPEAKER_02 (22:51):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (22:52):
Because uh they come into here, they they my my tech
has failed.
What what do I do?
Yeah.
And we meet the most incrediblepeople.
SPEAKER_05 (23:01):
Well, we really do, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (23:02):
We have uh discussions that are way beyond
technology and into you know,God everything, you know, just
spirituality, you name it.
Yes, I I love it.
SPEAKER_05 (23:12):
And it's just I I really do.
And I I'm I'm so glad that Imean God really played a role in
us making this jump.
And you know, it like the firsttime in my life, of course, it's
been almost two and a halfyears, I don't fear going to
work.
I don't know if fear is theright thing, but maybe it could
have been.
(23:32):
I can't, you know, but it's likeI and I know things are gonna be
thrown at me that I don'tanticipate or anything, or I
don't know who I'm gonnanecessarily meet.
Yes, I have a schedule, but andGod laughs, uh you ain't doing
that right.
Um, but it's I don't know, it itI I really feel like we've been
(23:55):
intentionally placed here, andI'm not saying it's because
we're saving our community.
No, that's not the point.
But when you know and when Godhas kind of, I guess, put on
your heart what you're supposedto do, and you've been fighting
it for maybe two decades, andyou finally give in and say,
fine, okay, I will.
(24:19):
Um it's just amazing how I guessthings fall into place.
SPEAKER_01 (24:24):
This couple of years has been very synchronistic,
very it just moves very well,um, and and not perfectly by any
means.
SPEAKER_05 (24:34):
But it's also been the hardest I've worked my whole
life.
SPEAKER_01 (24:37):
Yes.
SPEAKER_05 (24:37):
You know, but it but uh it doesn't feel that way
because you're going to be a badthing with passion.
SPEAKER_01 (24:43):
Hard work is a bad thing when you don't connect
with it.
SPEAKER_05 (24:46):
Yeah, that's true.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (24:47):
A lot of times, you know, you can you can be in a
situation where you're you'redoing the things, you're putting
your all into something.
Both of us have had jobs wherewe're putting our all into it,
yeah, but we're not connectedwith it.
Because there's absolutelysomething, and of course, what
was missing was you know thefuture of what we needed to do.
(25:10):
Yeah, but uh we weren'tconnected with the the the
passion wasn't there and so yes,you're right.
We work so much more, we worknights and weekends, we work
constant, uh but not in a waythat's um seems as invasive,
right?
SPEAKER_04 (25:27):
True.
SPEAKER_01 (25:28):
Because it's it's such a a passion for what we're
doing, and I love that.
SPEAKER_05 (25:33):
I think getting back to your conversation, that is
the humanness.
We have passion.
SPEAKER_01 (25:39):
Thank you for running that back out.
SPEAKER_05 (25:41):
Hey, look, and that's what we do.
So the humanness has passion.
Passion is an abstract variablethat can be tapped in through
the spirit.
Now, it's never predictable.
It's never it can be somethingthat leads you into answering a
question and making a decisionright there, you know, the whole
(26:02):
raising your hand and saying,okay, I will.
SPEAKER_01 (26:05):
Oh, that's to you, John.
SPEAKER_05 (26:06):
Yeah, that's you, John.
So it's a machine will never dothat.
That is where the spirit and theheart speak.
SPEAKER_01 (26:17):
That's where the human ends.
SPEAKER_05 (26:18):
Humans are notoriously adaptable.
You know, we talk about theendangered species.
We're only endangered if we donot promote ourselves and we
don't love ourselves and lovehumanity.
Yeah, and love humanity.
You know, we are actuallyextincting ourselves, whether
physically or just you know bytrying to pretend we're not
(26:43):
right.
By trying to pretend we're not.
I mean, there are things thereare things worse than death, and
that is when you're living alife with no love and no
passion.
Um so I guess what I'm gettingat is a computer can't pivot
using passion.
Um a computer cannot adapt.
(27:05):
It is using algorithms, it isusing formulas, and it's has
access to data.
So it can very convincingly makeit seem like, wow, you just
pulled that out of whatever.
No, it's it's able to makereally interesting connections.
Um humans can too.
I mean, we all have aha momentsthat had nothing to do with a
(27:28):
computer where we go, wait, Igot it.
And that could have beensomething you've been waiting 10
years to think of.
And all of a sudden now I'vecompletely changed my life,
formed a new business, and movedon.
I've heard those successstories.
A computer didn't do thateither.
Um we shortchange our abilities,I think, all the time.
SPEAKER_01 (27:47):
Um so and let's not shortchange ourselves in
thinking that we need to matchthe AI or the computing system.
SPEAKER_02 (27:56):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (27:57):
That what we're trying to do is have a tool that
only is an assistant or ahelpful guy, you know, helpful
um piece of the puzzle.
SPEAKER_05 (28:08):
Sure.
SPEAKER_01 (28:09):
But will never ever get to the point of matching the
human spirit.
SPEAKER_05 (28:13):
Yeah.
And and I hear all the timepeople go, Well, you know, I'm
I'm computer illiterate, or Idon't know.
There's intimidation when itcomes to technology, and I mean,
rightfully so.
I understand why.
There are people like uh maybelearned about technology and
(28:33):
have PTSD from it because, youknow, well, you don't are not
getting this, or you're notdoing this right, and blah,
blah, blah.
And don't touch that.
Don't touch that, exactly.
And there are people like, I'mafraid to touch it, I'll break
it.
And it's like, well, what awonderful thing.
You break it, and you can learnhow to fix it with guidance,
then now you know something new.
And now you can show your friendwhen they break it.
So I mean, it's really how youknow we've really learned and
(28:55):
shared knowledge from you know,sticks and rocks.
But I guess when it when itcomes down to it, we um the uh
with even web design, which isanother layer of computing with
servers and you know, design andwhat have you.
Um, so many times we'll have aclient come in and we have a
(29:16):
meeting, and we like meetingwith the people.
Uh, we had a wonderful one thispast week where it it's we help
them to understand, I'm notsure, whatever.
It's like just spit everythingout.
When we spit everything out, wedraw connections, we have
conversation.
That's how you kind of build theweb, if you will, of how of the
concepts you want to do.
SPEAKER_01 (29:35):
Actually, that's why a lot of people like to come to
us because they're not sure whatthey want.
SPEAKER_05 (29:40):
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (29:40):
And it's like throw it all on the table, and then
we'll collect the things thatare necessary.
Right.
We will put it together.
SPEAKER_05 (29:46):
And then help you have the conversation.
Yeah, it was just like um lastweek, where or this past week,
where he's describing well,here's why I want to do this.
Here's this person, and such andsuch.
And I'm like, all right.
What would you want to tell themto convince them that you're the
right guy for the job?
SPEAKER_01 (30:04):
Right.
SPEAKER_05 (30:05):
He's like, ah, I see what you mean.
SPEAKER_01 (30:08):
So now we need to talk to your audience.
SPEAKER_05 (30:10):
So we're talking now.
Because that is why yourwebsite's now powerful.
Exactly.
But I've I've said, you know, inwhat 17, 18 years, I guess we've
been doing this.
I've, you know, have foundmyself saying many times, look,
you are the expert in what youdo.
Right.
As we talk, I can learn fromthat.
(30:31):
I'm the expert in what I do, butit all involves collaboration.
You just can't find a web designtool and just say, okay, I'm
going to make my website, youknow?
And maybe you can.
And that's that's great.
But there's so many factors inthe same respect.
I can't act like I understandrefrigeration.
I can't say I understand how totake care of septic, you know,
(30:53):
those things or any of the I'mso glad people do.
Yeah.
And it's so cool when you have aclient and you kind of learn so
much about their industry.
It's like, I had no idea.
SPEAKER_01 (31:03):
And I love that the they they trust us because our
industry is communications.
We want to take exactly what youdo, right?
Put it in this format, wrap itin a beautiful bow, and promote
you.
SPEAKER_05 (31:17):
With some of the magic you may not know, but it's
only magic because you don'tunderstand it.
But honestly, what you do, Ifeel is magic.
SPEAKER_02 (31:24):
Right.
SPEAKER_05 (31:25):
You know, so and and that that's respect for
humanity.
And again, that is thehumanness, that is the passion.
That are all these conceptshere.
The computer itself is there.
Yes, we use technology, but weset them all on a table, it
ain't gonna do it for us.
No, and it never will.
SPEAKER_01 (31:41):
Because it'll never have the passion, it won't.
SPEAKER_05 (31:43):
And or intent.
You always still have that inputand output.
You always still have thatdichotomy.
You have this human and thishuman, the computer's in the
middle as the tool.
And how can we both reach andcollaborate with this tool to
help us communicate better?
But we both want, we both needto want to in the first place.
SPEAKER_01 (32:08):
I guess before we get to our game, the the
finishing point right now.
SPEAKER_05 (32:12):
We need game time here.
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (32:14):
We do have a game.
Um the finishing point is it'sit can't be human.
So we're not actually afraid ofAI.
But we're afraid of what thehuman will do with AI.
SPEAKER_05 (32:30):
Yeah, I think that's a that's a point too.
SPEAKER_01 (32:33):
Yeah, I think we need to sometimes realize that
we're actually more afraid ofthe other human, right?
The human that's gonna dosomething wrong with the AI.
Yes, what is a possibility?
We're not actually afraid of thetechnology, we're afraid of the
human behind the curtain.
SPEAKER_05 (32:47):
I think you're right, and that is true.
Um, I mean, and and again, Ithink in the earlier podcast,
very recently, we made thereference to Terminator and all
these other glorified thingswhere it was kind of like, oh my
gosh, and um just justyesterday.
SPEAKER_01 (33:02):
Um not Terminator, right, Mary.
SPEAKER_05 (33:04):
Look, y'all, if you never saw it, and you know, I'm
not one to always doom scrolland find stuff, but I stumbled
upon some funny things in the2001 Space Odyssey.
Um there is a YouTube segmentwhere they say, What if the HAL
9000 was like Alexa?
If you got a minute and 19seconds, look it up on YouTube,
(33:24):
and it is hilarious.
The point I want to make withthat is the fact that um we saw
this movie when it came out in1968 as being one of the first
examples of fear with technologywhere this um robot entity was
(33:45):
previous right, Hal, which youknow is one letter off IBM
anyway, um, was don't berevived.
All right, you go ahead andbring sticks up in here, did
you?
SPEAKER_01 (33:55):
Sorry, sticks is my love.
SPEAKER_05 (33:57):
So it's uh threatening his life essentially
by not opening the pod babedoors.
So, but he's communicating withit, and of course, we know the
frustration of it is not doingwhat he wants.
But not to ruin anything, haveyou spoken to Alexa and asked
him to do something, and it wentway off on a tangent, and it's
like that is not even what Isaid.
(34:18):
So look that up if you want toas a fun segue.
SPEAKER_01 (34:23):
Into into well, are we gonna do our game?
SPEAKER_05 (34:27):
Yes, we're gonna do our game.
SPEAKER_01 (34:28):
We've gotta do our game.
SPEAKER_05 (34:29):
Now, look, I I kind of want to preface this.
Um first off, I'll explain thegame, but that'll also explain.
SPEAKER_01 (34:36):
How do we find the game?
Because we're gonna put it outthere.
Yeah, we're gonna put it outthere.
So I'm so sorry, I want to getyou.
SPEAKER_05 (34:42):
No, you're fine.
No, we're good.
Nope, we're good.
So, anyway, the game this timeis gonna be founders versus
fictionals.
And and any grammar hammers outthere, don't tell me fictionals
is not a word.
I know fictionals and adjective,fictionals is a noun.
We can create nouns fromadjectives, you do it all the
time.
Something can be sweet, but whatdo we eat?
(35:04):
We eat sweets.
So, anyway, we just did that.
We made up a word.
SPEAKER_01 (35:07):
So Did you just make it okay for your English degree?
Yes, I did.
SPEAKER_05 (35:11):
I have two English degrees.
That means I can make up twowords a day.
So I'm only halfway there andliving on a prayer.
I'm um so yeah, anyway.
Okay, so not six.
No, that would be Bonjo used todo, right?
SPEAKER_02 (35:26):
I I'm good with that.
SPEAKER_05 (35:27):
So we're gonna play that game, but uh look, um,
we've had a couple people talkto us about the games.
They're like, oh, that soundedreally fun.
So we decided on our website,which is winternetweb.com, okay,
and you look under our podcasts.
That's of course where we youcan listen to um probably 60
(35:47):
some percent of the people havefound our website to listen to
our podcasts.
Uh majority of the people are onum you know either Spotify or
Apple Podcasts or whatever.
And 50 some of the things allover the country, all over the
country.
Yeah, I mean, places I'm like,so who lives in Connecticut?
Right?
(36:08):
Who lives out who who lives inSanta Barbara, California?
I mean, yeah, so we know it'sgetting out there and it's
growing, but it and it'll growmore as people support it, and I
do appreciate people sharing andyou know following.
Like if you use Apple Podcastsor something like that, um,
hitting the follow button, and Ifeel like I'm one of those
people on a YouTube video, pushit right now, and I'll give you
(36:30):
10% off whatever.
No.
But anyway, it it does help thealgorithm, and I do appreciate
those that have.
What we've done on that page isI've created prompts so that for
any of the games we've played, Ithink this one right here will
be um our fourth one.
Fifth game.
Or fifth game, yeah, I think so,yeah.
(36:51):
Um, and it will you can take thetext of that prompt and put it
in the chat GPT or put it intowhatever AI of your choice, and
it should be able to give it theinformation it needs to so that
you can play or play along withothers.
So we'll try to get into that umright now.
(37:15):
Okay, so for this game, uh, Iknow we're talking about
founders versus fictionals.
The idea was we want a namegiven to us, and we need to
figure out is this someone thatis a founder within, say, the
technology movement historicallyor up until toward the present.
SPEAKER_01 (37:36):
Which would be a real person, right?
SPEAKER_05 (37:37):
A real person, right?
Or the name of a fictionalcharacter in books, and I
believe it may even dip intoscreenplays and all that,
possibly, because I don't thinkI'll put limitations on that.
So we and this will be fun forus.
Any fictional character.
So, in other words, this is areal person in technology field,
(37:58):
or is this the name of someoneelse?
SPEAKER_01 (38:00):
So Moriarty to Dr.
McDreamy, anybody that is therewe go.
SPEAKER_05 (38:05):
That's right.
So we're gonna wing it.
Let's go.
So, anyway.
All right, AI, let's playfounders versus fictionals.
You ready?
unknown (38:17):
Absolutely, I'm ready.
Let's play founders versusfictionals.
I'll give you a name and you canguess if they're a real life
tech founder or a fictionalcharacter.
Let's get started.
Here's the first name for youElon Tusk.
SPEAKER_00 (38:30):
Is that a real tech founder or a fictional
character?
Let me know your guess.
SPEAKER_01 (38:36):
So why is he really hard when we do practices and
then he gets weird when we areon air?
SPEAKER_05 (38:43):
I know.
And Elon Tusk?
SPEAKER_01 (38:47):
Which was this a probably something that has been
created into a fictional fanfiction thing?
SPEAKER_05 (38:56):
There's no way.
Why would you try to throw atrick question at us?
SPEAKER_01 (39:00):
I know.
SPEAKER_05 (39:01):
Alright, I'm gonna fuss at him.
I'm gonna go ahead on this.
Alright, you said Elon Tusk.
And first I think you're unfairto us.
You're throwing something weirdat us.
Look, we're trying to at leastseem like we know what the heck
we're talking about on ourpodcast.
We know Elon Musk, but Elon Tuskhas to be like some type of fan
(39:21):
fiction or some extrapolationfrom the real person.
unknown (39:27):
You got it.
SPEAKER_00 (39:28):
Elon Tusk is definitely a fictional name,
kind of a playful twist button,Elon Musk.
So, you know then.
I promise I'll keep the names abit more uh straightforward from
here on out.
Let me know when you're readyfor the next one.
SPEAKER_04 (39:39):
Alright, let's go, man.
unknown (39:42):
Alright, here we go.
SPEAKER_00 (39:43):
The next name is Ada Lovelace.
Is she a real life tech pioneeror a fictional character?
SPEAKER_04 (39:49):
I recognize it.
What do you think, Babe?
SPEAKER_01 (39:51):
Well, we mentioned that earlier.
Ada Ada Lovelace is uh Right,right.
As far as females in thecomputing world, that is one of
Well, that's right.
SPEAKER_05 (40:01):
She was the one of the babbage computing.
SPEAKER_01 (40:03):
Yes, that's one of the main names.
Um so when you think females inearly computing, Ada Lovelace is
like uh so real founder,absolute.
SPEAKER_05 (40:14):
Alright, do you want to respond or AI or me?
Alright.
SPEAKER_01 (40:20):
All right, Ada Lovelace is a founder in
technology and not a fictional.
SPEAKER_00 (40:26):
Absolutely right.
Ada Lovelace is indeed a realhistorical figure and is often
considered the first computerprogrammer.
Nicely done.
unknown (40:34):
Let me know if you want to keep going.
SPEAKER_04 (40:36):
Alright, I think we'll do about three more.
So go ahead, let's go.
unknown (40:41):
Perfect.
Let's do it.
Alright, the next name is ZaraTechman.
SPEAKER_00 (40:46):
Is that a real tech doctor or a fictional character?
Let me know your guess.
SPEAKER_05 (40:51):
Zara Techman.
SPEAKER_01 (40:53):
Zara Techman?
SPEAKER_05 (40:55):
This sounds like probably a fictional sci-fi
novel.
Yeah.
And this some this person wasprobably on their way to I don't
know, Jupiter somewhere goingtraveling through the space or
something, you know.
SPEAKER_01 (41:11):
Some sort of like sci-fi fictional.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_05 (41:14):
Alright, we're gonna, I mean, might as well.
Alright, we think that is maybea sci-fi character name being
fictional.
unknown (41:24):
You got it.
SPEAKER_00 (41:28):
Great job in that one.
unknown (41:30):
Uh alright.
Let's keep the momentum going.
Here comes the next name.
Grace Hopper.
SPEAKER_00 (41:35):
Is she a real tech pioneer or a fictional
character?
SPEAKER_05 (41:39):
Gotta do recognize a name.
Which Grace?
Grace Hopper.
SPEAKER_01 (41:43):
Hopper.
SPEAKER_05 (41:45):
That's that's technology, gosh.
SPEAKER_01 (41:48):
Um if you recognize a name, that is probably a well
probably, yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_05 (41:52):
I know.
It that's considering how many Igot two degrees in English, but
I can get to how many books Iread.
SPEAKER_01 (41:58):
Well, I thought the fictionals would be a little
more, you know, like maybe Yeah.
SPEAKER_05 (42:03):
Um something recognizable.
SPEAKER_01 (42:05):
Well, not necessarily recognizable, but
maybe literary.
SPEAKER_05 (42:09):
Yeah, I know what you mean.
Yeah.
And it gets pulling from allsources.
SPEAKER_01 (42:13):
Right.
SPEAKER_05 (42:14):
Oh, geez.
I I do, I feel like it is thisgonna be one of those.
I don't be like, oh yeah.
It's like Eli Whitney.
SPEAKER_01 (42:22):
It's like, oh, the cotton chin.
Oh, of course, you know.
Everybody should know that.
If they don't, then some wrong.
SPEAKER_05 (42:28):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (42:29):
They didn't go to third grade, fourth grade, and
eighth grade.
SPEAKER_05 (42:32):
All right, I'm moving.
Grace Hopper is a technologypioneer.
SPEAKER_00 (42:39):
Absolutely correct.
Grace Hopper was a legendarycomputer scientist.
Nicely done.
All right, just two more to go.
SPEAKER_05 (42:46):
Well, hold on, hold on.
I want to interrupt you.
Um, what did Grace Hopper do?
SPEAKER_00 (42:51):
Grace Hopper was an incredible pioneer in computer
science.
She was one of the firstprogrammers of the Harvard Micro
One computer and developed thefirst compiler for a computer
programming language, which madeit much easier to mount
software.
She also popularized the termdebugging or fixing computer
glitches.
Oh, she was truly a trailblazer.
SPEAKER_05 (43:09):
So, of course.
I knew the hope of the thing.
Yeah, the debugging thing and mymy time in programming.
Yes, of course.
And um I did, but you I've nowofficially said.
SPEAKER_01 (43:21):
Oh yeah.
Well, thank you, Grace Hopper.
Yep for debugging all of us.
SPEAKER_05 (43:28):
All right, go ahead and give us our last one for
today.
Um, I'm not gonna say make ithard, make it like look through
everything in your, you know,data brain.
Something fun, somethingworthwhile to go out with a bang
on.
unknown (43:46):
I love it.
All right, here we go.
For the final one, the name isLara Codsworth.
Is that a real tech founder or afictional character?
Let me know what you think.
SPEAKER_05 (43:56):
Oh boy.
SPEAKER_01 (43:59):
Lyra Codsworth.
For some reason that Codsworthmakes me feel like that um I'm
with you.
SPEAKER_05 (44:08):
Yes.
Um I'm thinking Lara Codsworthis definitely a fictional
character.
SPEAKER_00 (44:16):
You got it.
Larry Codsworth is indeed afictional name, so you nailed it
on the head.
Uh great job.
That's a lot of fun.
SPEAKER_05 (44:22):
Hold on.
Oh, well, I'm glad, yes, youwere very helpful.
Um, I agree.
But we need to know where LaraCodsworth was a part of, because
we recognize it, but apparentlywe haven't read it in a minute.
unknown (44:38):
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (44:39):
Uh Lara Codsworth is a name that's reminiscent of the
Fallout series.
Particularly from the Fallout 4game.
Uh Codsworth is actually acharacter in the game.
SPEAKER_01 (44:48):
All right, be sure to go and check our games out
that we have on the website, andsome extras that we have that
are part of each episode on thewebsite as well.
SPEAKER_05 (45:00):
Yeah, we still got the um keyboard cat there, and
we'll add other items.
But why not?
I know, you can't get rid of it.
In fact, I thought about havingkeyboard cat soundtrack um
before every game we play.
I'm still working on that, butwe'll see.
But look, I I think we're there.
And look, um, appreciateeveryone uh taking the time to
listen and for our fans thatbinge watch and all that.
SPEAKER_01 (45:22):
Um had so many people say, Hey, I've started
listening, and and I'm veryexcited.
Thank you so much.
SPEAKER_05 (45:29):
Yeah, I mean it's just it's fun to do.
So, you know, and it's uh we'reglad that it resonates with
people.
So I guess um we're gonna besigning off here on Wired
Together, and you can find us onall the different channels, uh
Heart Radio, Apple Podcasts,Spotify, whatever you got.
And um, thanks for you knowhelping us out.
(45:50):
But I'm plugging for now.
SPEAKER_01 (45:52):
But always stay connected.
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