September 26, 2025 • 12 mins
Rep. James Clyburn, (D-SC) explains why he believes the policies of the Trump administration are having a negative effect on the Black community.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello, I'm Vanessa Tyler, reporting at the Congressional Black Hawks
fifty fourth Annual Legislative Conference on the Black Information Network,
your home for Black News.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
First.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
He is the Grand Gentleman of Congress Congressman James Clyburn.
We can use your insight now. Welcome.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Thank you so much for having me. It's good to
be here.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
What do you think of America now with the stunning
and historic indictment of x FBI Director James Coomy.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
Well, the country is at the crossroads. I've noticed a
lot of the media reaction to this indictment is that
we may have reached the threshold of moving into a
genuine autocracy. I've been saying now since twenty eighteen that
(00:55):
I thought the country was on a trajectory towards totalitarianism.
It may not be as bad as that. Autocracy could
be just as bad. And if you have an elected
official who can use his or her power to ruin
(01:22):
the lives of people, which is what's happening here, is
one thing to be indicted on scrupulous charges is something
else to have to use your children's wealth to defend
yourself in something like this. And so I tell people
all the time don't tell me about how fruitless this is.
(01:45):
It's never fruitless. If what you're trying to do is
ruined somebody's life, you can successfully do that without ever
convicting that person of whatever crime he or she may
be accused of.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
In case the case goes away, you still have to
pay legal fees.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
You've got to pay legal fees. He's gonna pay a
whole lot of legal fees. Now. He made here oft
enough to do all of that. But I know a
lot of people who are in the shape that I'm here,
and that means that these kinds of accusations, when you
defend yourself, you have destroyed your children's inheritance.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
New Jersey, New York Attorney General Tis James, I understand,
is also on the list.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
Yeah, and Adam Schiff out in California. So they will
be going through all of this and then. But we
should not take this in isolation. There's a new report
this morning that the Democratic candidate for governor of New Jersey,
who happens to be a woman who spent ten years
I think in the Navy, she just had all of
(02:48):
her records made public to her opponent or to someone
who is supporting her opponent, Right, what is this about?
We just heard that the Secretary of Defense has ordered
all eight hundred of his line officer to come here
to marsity. What is this about? On my way here today,
(03:11):
I saw these National Guard troops standing on the corners.
What is that about? Well, let me tell you what
it's about. It is about that which happened after Reconstruction,
when we saw this country give up on its democracy
(03:32):
and put in place really an autocracy for us people
of color. And so what you have to see happening
today is exactly what happened after the Civil War reconstruction
that brought Reconstruction to an end. And I tell people,
(03:54):
let's not get so happy with our current existence that
we forget that we are brought one moment away from
destruction of our lives, depletion of our resources, and the
stripping of our dignity.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
That is very scary.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
So you're saying that you see what's happening now, of
course from history, looking here, man of history, looking at history,
that it can turn around, and what we already precarious,
many of us as it is, that is going to
be easily slipped away.
Speaker 3 (04:36):
So yeah, not just can it's already in the process
if you are stripping all of the constributions of African
Americans off of the walls of our museums, in our
public buildings, as you see happening with Jackie Robinson, with
the Tusky get airmen. Now we are seeing the present
(05:00):
ordering that references and depictions of slavery be removed from
our public buildings, from the National Historic Trusts, from our parts.
This is not about discrimination. This is about elimination. This
(05:23):
is about pretending you do never exist, which is what
was going on when my parents took it upon themselves
to get me involved in the study of history, because
our schools were not teaching the history that I could
relate to. And so yes, that's what's going on, and
were repeated that, now what we've got to do is
(05:45):
get smart. These are lessons. Have we learned them? And
I used to teach and I could tell that a
lot of people in my classrooms who would not listening
to a thing I was saying, And.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
We're not listening. Now are we listening?
Speaker 3 (06:04):
Now? I don't think enough people are. I think that
people think this is some passing fancy. You know. One
of the things I grew up in the postage, and
my dad was a fundamentalism and as to who preaches
much from the Old Testament as did from the news,
But my dad used to say to me all the time, son,
(06:27):
you pray every day for good health and strength, and
if the Good Lord respond with a good martyrum of both,
then you get up off your knees and you work
like hell. That's what he used to say to me.
That is what the fundamentalists menstal said to me, and
that's what I grew up believe in. It's not what
(06:49):
they say, it's what they do. And so when people
come tell me, well, the president said this, his administration
has written this, I says, what are they going to do?
And what are they doing?
Speaker 2 (07:05):
What are the Democrats going to do? What are we
going to do?
Speaker 1 (07:08):
I mean, we see the writing on the wall and
it's a horror show. What are we going to do?
Speaker 3 (07:13):
Well? I'm glad that you put we in there, because
people keep asking me what the Democrat's going to do? Well,
let me tell you why this is not about democrats,
because I'm a Democrat. I've been in office for thirty
two years. What I'm saying to you is going out
on your airwaves. I do speeches, I send out press releases,
(07:33):
I do videos. And guess what when you've got the
owner of the Washington Post telling his editorial staff you
cannot run that editoria of the Jitus Road in Dawson,
the Democrat Kamala Harris, and he mixed them, cut the endorsement.
(07:56):
Is that a democratic problem? No, that's a public problem.
Someone tell me, ask me what I'm going to do.
We got a candidate who's a black woman, who is
well qualified and who you're bored. This big editorial board
says were going indorsed for president the Washington Post. Yeah,
(08:18):
and then the owner comes in and says, no, you're not.
Is that a democratic problem? No? And this is happening
over and over and over again.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
And speaking of former VP Harris, she will be here tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
Do you think she should run again?
Speaker 3 (08:35):
Oh? I don't know. I never tell anybody to run.
I never tell them not to run. When people talk
about me and Joe Biden, Joe Biden called me and
asked me for my endorsement. I didn't call him and
tell him to run.
Speaker 1 (08:49):
And speaking of you mentioned thirty you said thirty two.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Years, thirty three years into Congress.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Yes, what's what's next?
Speaker 3 (08:59):
Year?
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Are your election is what next?
Speaker 3 (09:01):
What's next? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (09:02):
Your reelection is next? To are you grouping the next
behind us?
Speaker 3 (09:08):
I'm not. I know there are a lot of well
qualified people, yeah, who are probably interested. But for me,
there are two things that are next. My rock and
cheer in the evenings and the golf course in the mornings.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Oh my goodness, not yet.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
We still need you.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
In terms of what's next for our party, the Democratic Party,
not our party, the Democratic Party.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
What's next?
Speaker 1 (09:34):
Do you see an emerging leader who could take the
take on the next president presidential?
Speaker 3 (09:42):
Contrary to what you may see in some of the media,
Hockem Jefferson is an outstanding media. You know. In order
to run the Democratic Caucus, you have got the ham
and a roks that accommodates just about fifteen different agenda.
(10:10):
I'm from South Carolina. My approach to legislating is totally
different from Hakim Jeffers from New York. Now a lot
of my constituents I've been to church with him, and
when I go through his church, I think it's Cornerstone
(10:30):
Baptist Church there in Brooklyn, New York. I see people
that I know whose parents I mean, whose parents were
born raised in my district, who left go to New York.
It's a different agenda for him than this for me.
And I think that people are being unfair when they
(10:55):
expect him to accommodate the Black Caucus, the Hispanic Caucus,
the Blue Dog Caucus, these are very serious CAUCUSUS, the
Progressive Caucus, the New Democratic Caucus. All of these people
have constituents, and none of those constituents except maybe the
(11:18):
Congression of Black Caucus that he necessarily is experienced with,
and so he has to do a job of keeping
all of these caucuses engage in the process and given
due respect to all of them. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
So I think similar to President Obama, the way he
had to accommodate everybody. Yeah, so are you saying you're
you think he would be a leader?
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Jeffries would be a great president. Is that what I'm getting?
Speaker 3 (11:47):
No, you got to get the leadership first. I'm not
dealing with the president until I finished twenty twenty six.
So what we've got to do is concentrate on getting
the House back, getting the sense, and then we'll have
two years to work on getting the president.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
Final question, do you think Democrats would get the House.
We'll get the House back in midterms.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
Well if they could. Yeah, if people turn out to vote.
But if the voting takes place next year the way
it took place last year, no, we.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
Won't and that will be a problem.
Speaker 3 (12:20):
That would be a B B. Joe Biden problem.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
Excellent Congressman James Clyburn, legend and a leader.
Speaker 2 (12:30):
Thank you for everything you've done and you're doing.
Speaker 3 (12:33):
Thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (12:34):
Oh, it's a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
I'm Vanessa Tyler reporting at the Congressional Black Caucuses fifty
fourth annual legislative conference on the Black Information Network.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
You're home for Black News First
Hello, I'm Vanessa Tyler, reporting at the Congressional Black Hawks
fifty fourth Annual Legislative Conference on the Black Information Network,
your home for Black News.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
First.
Speaker 1 (00:11):
He is the Grand Gentleman of Congress Congressman James Clyburn.
We can use your insight now. Welcome.
Speaker 3 (00:17):
Thank you so much for having me. It's good to
be here.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
What do you think of America now with the stunning
and historic indictment of x FBI Director James Coomy.
Speaker 3 (00:29):
Well, the country is at the crossroads. I've noticed a
lot of the media reaction to this indictment is that
we may have reached the threshold of moving into a
genuine autocracy. I've been saying now since twenty eighteen that
(00:55):
I thought the country was on a trajectory towards totalitarianism.
It may not be as bad as that. Autocracy could
be just as bad. And if you have an elected
official who can use his or her power to ruin
(01:22):
the lives of people, which is what's happening here, is
one thing to be indicted on scrupulous charges is something
else to have to use your children's wealth to defend
yourself in something like this. And so I tell people
all the time don't tell me about how fruitless this is.
(01:45):
It's never fruitless. If what you're trying to do is
ruined somebody's life, you can successfully do that without ever
convicting that person of whatever crime he or she may
be accused of.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
In case the case goes away, you still have to
pay legal fees.
Speaker 3 (02:01):
You've got to pay legal fees. He's gonna pay a
whole lot of legal fees. Now. He made here oft
enough to do all of that. But I know a
lot of people who are in the shape that I'm here,
and that means that these kinds of accusations, when you
defend yourself, you have destroyed your children's inheritance.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
New Jersey, New York Attorney General Tis James, I understand,
is also on the list.
Speaker 3 (02:26):
Yeah, and Adam Schiff out in California. So they will
be going through all of this and then. But we
should not take this in isolation. There's a new report
this morning that the Democratic candidate for governor of New Jersey,
who happens to be a woman who spent ten years
I think in the Navy, she just had all of
(02:48):
her records made public to her opponent or to someone
who is supporting her opponent, Right, what is this about?
We just heard that the Secretary of Defense has ordered
all eight hundred of his line officer to come here
to marsity. What is this about? On my way here today,
(03:11):
I saw these National Guard troops standing on the corners.
What is that about? Well, let me tell you what
it's about. It is about that which happened after Reconstruction,
when we saw this country give up on its democracy
(03:32):
and put in place really an autocracy for us people
of color. And so what you have to see happening
today is exactly what happened after the Civil War reconstruction
that brought Reconstruction to an end. And I tell people,
(03:54):
let's not get so happy with our current existence that
we forget that we are brought one moment away from
destruction of our lives, depletion of our resources, and the
stripping of our dignity.
Speaker 2 (04:15):
That is very scary.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
So you're saying that you see what's happening now, of
course from history, looking here, man of history, looking at history,
that it can turn around, and what we already precarious,
many of us as it is, that is going to
be easily slipped away.
Speaker 3 (04:36):
So yeah, not just can it's already in the process
if you are stripping all of the constributions of African
Americans off of the walls of our museums, in our
public buildings, as you see happening with Jackie Robinson, with
the Tusky get airmen. Now we are seeing the present
(05:00):
ordering that references and depictions of slavery be removed from
our public buildings, from the National Historic Trusts, from our parts.
This is not about discrimination. This is about elimination. This
(05:23):
is about pretending you do never exist, which is what
was going on when my parents took it upon themselves
to get me involved in the study of history, because
our schools were not teaching the history that I could
relate to. And so yes, that's what's going on, and
were repeated that, now what we've got to do is
(05:45):
get smart. These are lessons. Have we learned them? And
I used to teach and I could tell that a
lot of people in my classrooms who would not listening
to a thing I was saying, And.
Speaker 2 (06:02):
We're not listening. Now are we listening?
Speaker 3 (06:04):
Now? I don't think enough people are. I think that
people think this is some passing fancy. You know. One
of the things I grew up in the postage, and
my dad was a fundamentalism and as to who preaches
much from the Old Testament as did from the news,
But my dad used to say to me all the time, son,
(06:27):
you pray every day for good health and strength, and
if the Good Lord respond with a good martyrum of both,
then you get up off your knees and you work
like hell. That's what he used to say to me.
That is what the fundamentalists menstal said to me, and
that's what I grew up believe in. It's not what
(06:49):
they say, it's what they do. And so when people
come tell me, well, the president said this, his administration
has written this, I says, what are they going to do?
And what are they doing?
Speaker 2 (07:05):
What are the Democrats going to do? What are we
going to do?
Speaker 1 (07:08):
I mean, we see the writing on the wall and
it's a horror show. What are we going to do?
Speaker 3 (07:13):
Well? I'm glad that you put we in there, because
people keep asking me what the Democrat's going to do? Well,
let me tell you why this is not about democrats,
because I'm a Democrat. I've been in office for thirty
two years. What I'm saying to you is going out
on your airwaves. I do speeches, I send out press releases,
(07:33):
I do videos. And guess what when you've got the
owner of the Washington Post telling his editorial staff you
cannot run that editoria of the Jitus Road in Dawson,
the Democrat Kamala Harris, and he mixed them, cut the endorsement.
(07:56):
Is that a democratic problem? No, that's a public problem.
Someone tell me, ask me what I'm going to do.
We got a candidate who's a black woman, who is
well qualified and who you're bored. This big editorial board
says were going indorsed for president the Washington Post. Yeah,
(08:18):
and then the owner comes in and says, no, you're not.
Is that a democratic problem? No? And this is happening
over and over and over again.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
And speaking of former VP Harris, she will be here tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
Do you think she should run again?
Speaker 3 (08:35):
Oh? I don't know. I never tell anybody to run.
I never tell them not to run. When people talk
about me and Joe Biden, Joe Biden called me and
asked me for my endorsement. I didn't call him and
tell him to run.
Speaker 1 (08:49):
And speaking of you mentioned thirty you said thirty two.
Speaker 3 (08:54):
Years, thirty three years into Congress.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Yes, what's what's next?
Speaker 3 (08:59):
Year?
Speaker 2 (08:59):
Are your election is what next?
Speaker 3 (09:01):
What's next? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (09:02):
Your reelection is next? To are you grouping the next
behind us?
Speaker 3 (09:08):
I'm not. I know there are a lot of well
qualified people, yeah, who are probably interested. But for me,
there are two things that are next. My rock and
cheer in the evenings and the golf course in the mornings.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Oh my goodness, not yet.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
We still need you.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
In terms of what's next for our party, the Democratic Party,
not our party, the Democratic Party.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
What's next?
Speaker 1 (09:34):
Do you see an emerging leader who could take the
take on the next president presidential?
Speaker 3 (09:42):
Contrary to what you may see in some of the media,
Hockem Jefferson is an outstanding media. You know. In order
to run the Democratic Caucus, you have got the ham
and a roks that accommodates just about fifteen different agenda.
(10:10):
I'm from South Carolina. My approach to legislating is totally
different from Hakim Jeffers from New York. Now a lot
of my constituents I've been to church with him, and
when I go through his church, I think it's Cornerstone
(10:30):
Baptist Church there in Brooklyn, New York. I see people
that I know whose parents I mean, whose parents were
born raised in my district, who left go to New York.
It's a different agenda for him than this for me.
And I think that people are being unfair when they
(10:55):
expect him to accommodate the Black Caucus, the Hispanic Caucus,
the Blue Dog Caucus, these are very serious CAUCUSUS, the
Progressive Caucus, the New Democratic Caucus. All of these people
have constituents, and none of those constituents except maybe the
(11:18):
Congression of Black Caucus that he necessarily is experienced with,
and so he has to do a job of keeping
all of these caucuses engage in the process and given
due respect to all of them. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
So I think similar to President Obama, the way he
had to accommodate everybody. Yeah, so are you saying you're
you think he would be a leader?
Speaker 2 (11:45):
Jeffries would be a great president. Is that what I'm getting?
Speaker 3 (11:47):
No, you got to get the leadership first. I'm not
dealing with the president until I finished twenty twenty six.
So what we've got to do is concentrate on getting
the House back, getting the sense, and then we'll have
two years to work on getting the president.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
Final question, do you think Democrats would get the House.
We'll get the House back in midterms.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
Well if they could. Yeah, if people turn out to vote.
But if the voting takes place next year the way
it took place last year, no, we.
Speaker 2 (12:17):
Won't and that will be a problem.
Speaker 3 (12:20):
That would be a B B. Joe Biden problem.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
Excellent Congressman James Clyburn, legend and a leader.
Speaker 2 (12:30):
Thank you for everything you've done and you're doing.
Speaker 3 (12:33):
Thank you very much.
Speaker 2 (12:34):
Oh, it's a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
I'm Vanessa Tyler reporting at the Congressional Black Caucuses fifty
fourth annual legislative conference on the Black Information Network.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
You're home for Black News First
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