Matthew Ramsey of Old Dominion started out playing music and painting in his parents basement. He made the decision to pursue music when he realized that his dreams of being an illustrator may not add up to what he wanted to be. He talks about grinding for years working random jobs in Nashville until he finally landed a publishing deal and started to get his songs recorded by Kenny Chensey and Sam Hunt. He talks about the dynamic of the band, how they formed and to which they owe their success.
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hey guys, Welcome to episode three four with Matthew Ramsay
of Old Dominion talks about the origin of the band,
his career before music. It's a really good interview. He
drove over and his pretty normal truck. Still pretty normal guy.
Considering all the massive success he's had. He didn't seem
(00:23):
that rich, but he is. I mean, he can't write
all those songs. I not being I mean, the guys
had so much success, but he just seems like a normal,
normal dude. I like him a lot. And we spent
five minutes, fifty minutes talking, right, Yeah. I told Mike,
I was like, and I never know how long they're
gonna be. And I was like, it's gonna be about
a half hour. So I knew he just had just
gotten off the road and be tired, but came in.
(00:43):
I thought it was great. So, okay, here are the
top five releases this week. At number five, Kanye West
finally put out Donda and this actually was out Sunday.
Here's a new song called Jail. It's twenty seven tracks,
(01:06):
a lot of tracks, and he even says the record
they will put it out without his permission. I don't
know what to believe. I think if that were the case,
they would have done that earlier. They would have that's
jay Z there made in the image of God. That's Selfie.
I still love Kanye. You're never gonna maybe not love Kanye.
(01:27):
I mean, I guess you would have you told me
for I love Kanye. Number four. Lauren Elena has a
new album out called Sitting Pretty on Top of the World.
Here's a new song called here on Top of the World,
Sitting pay back tears, Playing It Cool but back Tears. Jacken,
(01:49):
Carrie Underwood, and Dan and Shay released a new song
from the Dear Evan Hansen soundtrack called only Us. That's
my third one, but Us. At number two, Cody Johnson
(02:11):
has two new songs out. One's called Treasure and here's
a new one called Son of a rambling Man. And
new country trio Restless Road have a new song out
called Headlights. Fun Fact Kane Brown signed them to his
record label back in Uh Funner Fact, they sent me
(02:32):
a bunch of shampoo like three days ago, really for
what I was at the opera and I went out
and did something with them and this one guy and
maybe the one of the singers. They're all singers, but
maybe the lad singer if there is one, has big,
curly fuffy here and I just like, I gotta touch it.
And so they sent me some really expensive shampoo. Nice. Yeah,
here's restless road headlights to have every summer and then
(02:57):
move side. See Si more new albums. Drake put out
his sixth album, Certified lover Boy. I've had no time
to spend with any of it yet, of you, I
was reading a thing that he has so many features
on this one. I haven't even looked at the track list.
Jay Z Young Doug Future twenty one, Savage, Little Baby,
Little Dirk, not familiar with a little dirt the rest
(03:19):
of now. Elton John has announced a Star Studic collaborations album.
Was pretty cool as Jimmy Allen's on that with Miley
Cyrus Stevie Nicks do a leap at Charlie Pooth. Casey
Musgrave's announces a new tour she has hit in the
road its support of her upcoming album Star Crossed. It's
fifteen cities. I thought would be a little more than that. Honestly,
it's pretty sure. Fifteen cities. This is a small tour,
and you know she can sell old Dominion playing the
(03:41):
sec kick off. If you hear this on Friday, that
will be tomorrow on Saturday. Justin Bieber is now Spotify's
most streamed artist in a single month. He earned the
record of eighty three million streams in July. That's a lot.
I mean, he's making so much money from streaming. Think
it's so much funny from everything post Malone's teaming up
with Yeager my Stir to help artists and venues that
(04:02):
took a hit from the coronavirus. And I think that's
it on the headlines. All right, here we go matt
Ramsey from Old Dominion. It's a great talk. Enjoy this
all right with Matthew Ramsey from Old Dominion. And I
guess the question is, before we start this and get
in depth, like what do your friends call you madam Matthew?
Like what do you feel most comfortable? It's both. I've
(04:22):
gone through my whole life with both. I mean it's
like if you meet someone though and they're like, hey,
I'm Jim. You are I usually say Matthew, But um
then there's there's been people that have that it feels
weird for them to call me Matthew. But like my
family growing up, Mom, dad, grandparents called me Matthew. For example,
(04:46):
Thomas Rhett. If someone calls him Thomas, he knows they're
not that close to him because his name is not Thomas. Yeah,
he's like, so the people that know me because it's
it's it's he's like t r Thomas rhet because that's
what he was called as a kid. That's not his
last name. So if they come up and they go, ey, Thomas,
how are you, He's like, I don't really know, you
don't really know me would do it with sure? So
I have I told you the story about So. I mean,
(05:09):
I was matt for a long time. My family was Matthew.
They all call me Matthew. Matt war all was on
my friends and everything. And then I was in Virginia,
you know, recording music on my own, and um, I
was putting out CDs and playing stuff and had a
website and uma I had a MySpace all that stuff,
and then um, I gotta started getting some messages from
(05:32):
some people that were looking for a different Matt Ramsey
who happened to be in the adult film untram Yeah.
So um and people were like, I really like your music,
but You're not the Matt Ramsey I was looking for
just heads up. So I started then to delineate Matthew
(05:53):
was just to set myself apart a little bit. Does
that Matt Ramsey still exist in a way that it's
still does? Well, no, it's not confusing. He actually has
another name, a more famous name, but he when he
performs a certain type of pornography, he goes by Matt Ramsey.
So so it's a fun fact. Yeah, I'm not going
(06:15):
to google him. Yeah you'll you'll get some interesting images
if you do. But when you were in Virginia making music,
about what year was that when you were when you
were dedicated to music, but you were not in Nashville.
That was probably two thousand and so you're years old? No,
I mean yeah, yeah, probably twenty. How would am I now?
(06:37):
I'm I'm actually forty three. So so if that's the case,
then why not move to Nashville? Then? Did you have
a different career path in mind where you were going
to do it from Virginia? Was it slightly different than
what you expected? Yeah? Well, I mean I went to
art school. I kind a degree in illustration, and um,
(06:57):
you know those are two I was passionate. I'm still
passionate about both things, and um, I kind of got
to the end of college and thought, I can't half
ass both of these things. I need to focus on one.
And music wound up being the thing I chose. So
then I sort of did. Yeah, I made like a
(07:20):
self funded you know, CD, and and just got to
the point where I felt like I had exhausted everything
in that area and played everywhere I could, and you know,
made my money back in my CD, and it was
time to to take another step that going into art school.
What was that plan? Let's say the music thing didn't
work out, or you were at the crossroads and you
(07:41):
didn't choose music. I think that's the better question, Like
what was the plan with the illustration? What what was
a career outlook? There? I mean there, you know, you
start to realize I started to realize on my senior
year when you're you're kind of just doing all these
independent studies and things, and you start to realize that
all your professors are starting to view you as you
as their competition. So you start to see like, well,
(08:02):
I'm going to be able to maybe teach or you know,
pick up some you know magazine illustrations or that drawing.
I talk to me like a dumb guy. Becau's what
I am. It's all of it, painting, drawing, m printmaking,
stuff like that. So painting a picture on a canvas, Yah,
you can do that. Yeah, you're a good artist like that.
(08:23):
Pretty it can hold my own. Yeah. Do you ever?
Do you do that for fun at all? Yes? I
mean for I just painted recently a picture, um, for
the first time in a while, um, which was very therapeutic,
and um, I don't want to do it more. I
posted a little thing on my own Instagram of it,
but it's gone now. But um, like if I was naked.
(08:46):
I took several years of figure drawing classes where someone
would come in, and we had those in college, maybe
like fifty bucks if you go staying naked up, and
I was broke, But I wasn't that broke, right. I
always thought about those people are like, man, you must
need this money. I thought about in the same way
in two ways. Either, I was envious of the fact
(09:06):
that they had no inhibition at all, that they would go, hey, whatever,
if people need to draw something, I'll show my wiener.
I was so embarrassed and I'm still so embarrassed at
my wiener that I just wouldn't. We had a bit
on the show one and I'm, I mean my quarter joking.
I guess you're laughing, so I guess I gotta be like,
I'm joking. But we had a thing. This is when
(09:28):
we were in Austin and I was, um, it's pretty
early in my career. I just started to build my
syndication company. We were doing mostly popping hip hop stations,
and we were you know, at the time, it was
a wild and crazy guy. Now I'm just the guy
that gets trouble because I say things sometimes that the
industry doesn't want me to say. But then I was
just being an idiot for no other reason than just
being an idiot. And so we did a bit where
(09:48):
we had an artist come in and the loser had
to get naked and be drawn and I lost, and
I had to sit in a room like a closet
and he and him I remember him for no other
reason than just drawing it the right he had eyeball
my Yeah, so you did. You did what I avoided
for years a radio segment. Wow, Well, I mean you
faced your fear though, So that's good, right, So would
(10:08):
you do that to me? If I if I says
like I would like to pose nude and have you
draw a picture, I don't think I could do that.
That's pretty cool though, that like, because that an artist musically,
You're right, you perform like it's it's more of a
three sixty thing when it comes to art with you.
That was just that side of my brain is is
the one that's active. You have an analytical side, Uh,
(10:31):
you know, I mean I can, but you know, I'm
not like into math and stuff like that. But Dave
Heywood is a guy who I'm friends with who is
i mean creative but also extremely linear as well. He's
able to I sometimes can't do. I can't balance both
(10:51):
at the same time. And he's the guy who's who's
exceptional at that in your band because everybody kind of
has roles in old dominion, like what is your role
creative in that group? Creatively, I mean it's tough because
we are. That's what makes it really hard to be
in this band sometimes is is everyone is extremely creative.
So um, you know anymore, I would say that it's
(11:15):
kind of evolved and I've I've recently learned especially in
this last album in the process of making it that
my role is not necessarily in the tracking room while
we're recording it's it's in the control room with our
producer Shane and I'm I'm a better guide in that way.
(11:35):
And um, and I'm I'm a strong writer, I think too.
So I think I have a strong voice in the
writing of our songs. But everyone does. Everyone is so talented.
Do you have to submitting it? Isn't you use the frustrator?
You have to submit yourself a bit when you go
to record an album, because when you write it and
you make you know, your work tape or your demo
(11:55):
and you have you can get demo itis and wanted
to sound like there. But then Shane come is in, Um,
Shane mcinally, who obviously is is the best at what
he does. I mean, I don't I don't think you
would have a problem with saying he's better at being
a producer than you are. Yeah, oh yeah, for sure.
It's gonna make sure we're cold. And if he's like, hey,
this is how I see it, Like I really am
(12:16):
passionate about this. Do you ever have to submit and
go like you know what? You know what you're doing
and I only kind of know what I'm doing, so
I'm gonna do that. Yeah, definitely. But we have a
close enough of relationship that, um, if if we still
will go down that road, if we if we're not
fully believing in it, and I'm not fully believing in it,
but he strongly is will go down that road for
however long it takes until it until we see it
(12:39):
or we go you're wrong. And and he's great at
going Okay, thanks for trying, and we do the same thing.
He'll he'll listen to us and our ideas, and you know,
if we are feeling it one way, he'll say, I
trust you, guys, let's let's go down that road until
he either sees it or doesn't. It seems this is
just my memory years later that he was involved really
(13:00):
early with you guys. Yeah, he was, um you know,
we were writing music with him, songs, um before he
had any success. So I think when I met him
he had one he had just gotten um Leeann Walmack
song recorded his first one, and you know we were
all just broke, you know, he just I think he
(13:21):
had just like moved out of his car into a house,
you know, so, yeah, he's been around for us for
since the beginning. I want to go back to in Virginia,
the first instrument you pick up is it the drums?
It was the drums? Why the drums? Uh? You know?
When I was I had an older brother and um
he's he's four years older than me, and he had
(13:42):
a friend who was a drummer, and it just enamored me.
Just today, he would come over to our house and
set his drum kid up and I would sneak down
there and look at it. And then he played like
a drum solo at the middle school talent show or whatever.
It blew the whole place's mind and I just saw
how that affected everyone. And um, so I just was
drawn to banging on stuff for their bands that you
(14:07):
listen to and drummed along with, and you liked the
most as a fourteen fifteen year old kid, where you thought,
all right, if I'm gonna do this, Yeah, I mean
at that point it was starting to get into um
is starting to get into a lot of grunge. I mean,
for me, when I first learned not play guitars, chili peppers,
it was metallic because it's some really easy intros totally. Yeah. Yeah,
(14:29):
so I had at that point, once I started really
digging in and playing along to music, Um, I had.
I was my parents had a basement and I had
a drum kit down there, and I had guitar amps
and guitars, and I just and it was kind of
like split even then. I had half of the basement
was art supplies and canvases and things, and half of
it was musical instruments. So I would just kind of
(14:50):
live down in the basement and play along to mostly
things like Pearl Jam and Nirvana and Smashing Pumpkins and
stuff like that. And I asked this question, and I'm
being as respectful that possibly can with this question, because
what happened to me may have happened to you. But
being an art kid and a music kid, did you
get beat up a lot? I never got beat up,
but I definitely, um, I mean I got tugged on
(15:11):
a little bit. You know, um actually ended up. I've
never really talked about this ever, but uh, I actually
ended up getting plastic surgery on my ears because uh,
they were yanked on quite a bit and they kind
of they were like, you know, I always think about this.
It must have been really bad because I kind of
(15:32):
don't think about it that much, but it must have
been really bad for me to beg my parents to
fix this problem and for them to go through with it,
because you know, I have kids, and I know if
if they if a kid and my kid in the
sixth grade was begging you know, me to physically change
them because of what people were doing, it would must
(15:52):
have been heartbreaking for my parents, and I know what
stuff for me, so so they did so for a
while there, Yes, I went through some you know, some order,
you know, punishments. There. I suffered similar you know, consequences
for not being a you know, finger quotes normal kid.
But you're a lot cooler than I am. That's why
(16:13):
I asked. I mean, you're like cooler and you're talented,
something like did you like break the mold or you're
They're like, he's so talented, let's just celebrate him. I mean,
I did wind up once I got into high school.
I was kind of friends with everybody, you know, I
was friends with the athletes, and I was also in
the marching band, so you know, I kind of made
(16:35):
peace with with everyone. So when did you transition from
being the percussion guy to kind of go on, I
don't even really want to do that much anymore, Like
I want to play guitar. I want to. My first
band was born out of the Marching band because the
whole drum line we were such good friends, uh, and
we all wanted to be in a band, but we
were all drummers. And so it was, you know, one
(16:56):
guy going well, I have a guitar, and another guy saying, well,
I'll have the drum kit. And I was like, well,
I can find a bass, I'll borrow a base. I
borrowed a basse from somebody. So it was just we
wanted to play music, but we only thing we knew
how to play with drums, so we just kind of
learned together and you know, just by ear figuring out that.
(17:16):
So then once I started figuring out things on the base,
and I had a piano that I would, you know,
kind of mess around with, and and and a guitar
that my uncle had given me. My dad was like,
you're really good at figuring things out. You should pick
up that guitar and try that. So so then once
I picked that up, I didn't know how to play it.
So that's when I immediately started writing stuff so that
(17:37):
I could play what I was writing, that it was
music natural to you, even though it was hard, it was, Yes,
it was natural to me. Was wild for you to
be able to play a E. G. C. E. Minor,
you know, all the ones that you can let me
be on, all the ones I play for you to play. Like,
(17:58):
how quickly were we able to adapt and actually play
you know, those main chords with your guys? I mean
pretty pretty quickly. You know, it didn't take very long
before we were all writing songs together as a band.
You know, they all sounded like pro jam ripoffs, but
you know, but didn't everyone. But yeah, it wasn't at
that point. Yeah, okay, so you you you go to school,
(18:19):
You're gonna do graphic art illustration. I'm messing that episode.
You're also playing music. I again, I would understand that
nine nine people out of a hundred are going to
make more money doing that graphic art job because they
could probably get work. Maybe I think it depends on
(18:39):
not not necessarily in the in the field that I
was headed towards, it was kind of equal to the music,
I think because I wasn't interested in sitting at a
computer and coming up with like graphic design. I wasn't.
I was more tactile and would rather get my hands
in paint or sculpt or, you know. So, And at
that point, I have a couple of friends that are
(19:00):
classmates that are successful artists now and it's been the
same road, you know, it's just been grinding it out
and keeping you know, keeping their head down and painting
and painting and painting and painting until they finally we
all at the same age. They're they're having success as
artists and I'm having success in music. You're playing music.
(19:22):
What are you playing by yourself? When you when you
dedicate your life to it now as a craft to
pay your your and what other job are you doing?
Every job possibly could, I've worked, um, oh man everything.
I worked as a at a recycling plant Virginia. In Virginia,
I worked at landscaping companies, at signed companies, UM and
(19:44):
then UM. Then moved to Nashville and worked for a
moving company and where you know, I worked. The first
year I was here, worked I think probably seven different
jobs in the first year, just you know, trying to
keep my bills paid and and then right at night
and play. It was going to ask because there's no
I mean, there is writing at night, but for the
(20:04):
most part, any of my friends who are established writers
don't write at night, not anymore. And so when you're
a young guy, I'm assuming there are other just hungry
people that will write any time. And you're working all
day and you're just like, hey, let's just try to
write at eight o'clock to night. Have to. Yeah, if
you're gonna if you're gonna pay your bills, you gotta
do that. And then then you gotta write in your
(20:24):
free time. So I mean, I even had, like I
wish I still had them. I had a job where
I worked at a stained glass place. This is still
in Virginia, and I would you know, they had the
old school time punch cards a hobby lobby. Yeah, and
that you would I had them sitting there and I
would write songs on the time punch cards while while
I was working. I would I would be writing those
songs on the time punches. So you have to write
(20:47):
every possible moment. Did you feel like you were a
good writer though before people told you you were a
good writer? Um, yeah, I think well, I mean that's
interesting question. I think you're always questioning whether or not
you are a good writer. Even at this point you
know you're like, do I know how to do this anymore? Um?
So I think there's a certain amount of at that
(21:11):
point early on arrogance that you have to have for sure,
for sure to do something. And I say this all
the time. For me to think somebody's gonna pay a
fifty bucks to come watch me do comedy, I better
think I'm pretty danger. You have to have an ego
about and then you gotta have humility at the same time,
So you gotta be able to look back and realize
why it wasn't working then. So I think if you
(21:31):
can do that, you can keep growing. But um, but
you know, I think I when I first started, I
was I was really writing because I really needed to.
I was really was expressing things that I had had
no other way to express. So it wasn't about being good.
It was about, um getting some feelings out and and
(21:53):
working through things in a way that I can only
figure out how. So I mean spend off questions comes
from that they that you say, I guess the first
one is what you're working full time doing things other
than what you would like to do. Full time, which
is be creative. What was the first mini break you
had that didn't make you have to go work at
the plant or the restaurant? Um Well, I moved to
(22:18):
um Well in Virginia. The first thing I did. I
was working at this thing glass company. And then I
was making enough money, um playing you know, gigs that
I was booking myself that I could go part time,
like regionally, so you'd booked drive a couple of hours
you need to or locally, yeah, I would play. I
would play all the surroundings basically the whole state of Virginia.
(22:40):
And I made enough money there for about a year
that I could work part time, and luckily they were
supportive and of me and let me do that. And
then moved to Nashville, and it took probably, i don't know,
for a good five six years before I got a
publishing deal with Phil Vassar, who allowed me to stop working.
(23:03):
So let me get this straight, just so our listeners
they see the massive success of all Dominion, right, and
everything you guess put out is seemingly the world is
your oyster. Musically, for five or six years, you're talking
about five times three and sixty five days you worked well, Yeah,
(23:23):
and I still worked when I had that publishing deal.
I still had to find other means of income. But
it did loosen the it lessened the pressure a little bit,
and it still was. I still went through that hole,
that whole publishing deal without getting any any song recorded
or anything. So it gave me a little money, but
(23:45):
that was it. Is there a guilt that you have
because I've experienced this when people have signed me to
certain projects that didn't do as well as I had hoped.
Is there a guilt that you would have in a
publishing deal where nothing got record, did or cut? Guilty
that they were paying me? No? Um, no, because that's
(24:09):
a that's a risk they assume. You know, most people,
most people that you know, if if if I signed
a writer, I would sign them expecting nothing to happen
in the first like a few years at least. You know,
it's really just about learning at that point. So that's
all I was trying to do was learn, And I
(24:29):
was very upfront about that and with any any publisher
that signed me was I'm just trying to learn how
to write better. And most of them see that, they
see a glimmer of of talent. Most of the song sucks,
but maybe there's one line in there that gives them
some hope and and they can give you a little
(24:50):
bit of money to keep going. So I never really
felt guilty about that. I mean, especially like I was
saying earlier, I can go back and listen to those
songs and go see why in the time you were
like these are great? Why is no one recording them?
They're not great that you know. I had a lot
of growing to do for sure. So you're writing and
(25:16):
you start to just write songs for a living. What
was the first writer, I won't even we'll say break
that you earned. What what was your first break there
where you go, Okay, I'm not just now treading water,
like I might be able to have some real success
with this. Yeah. Um, the first sign of hope was
guy named Steve Holly recorded a song that Trevor and
(25:39):
I wrote with our friend Matt Jenkins, And then, um,
really was watching my friends have some success. Was really
what gave you the real hope was is that because
you knew that you could do what they do well,
I was doing what they were doing. I mean, we
were doing it all together. So it was like it
(25:59):
like Shane for instance, he came in and played um
remember he played us the demo for Somewhere with You
and Una, and we were just like, damn, like that's different,
that whatever that is is the next step. And we
(26:21):
even though we weren't writers on it, we knew that
that was going to change the game for all for
all of us. And even now when we watched Kenny
play it, like we sit there and go we none
of us would be here without that song because he
wrote that, Kenny cut it. It changed Kenny's career and
because of that, me and Josh Osborne and Trevor Rosen,
(26:44):
Matt Jenkins, Brandy Clark and you know, we're all in
that rider circle and we get we get to reap
the benefits really of of that exposure. So watching our
our each other succeed was really what kept us go.
And we're like, it's not like I'm doing it, but
it's weird doing it. You know what about first success
(27:05):
for you were a song actually good, a single like
a real life it's got a chance single That was
wake Up, Loving You Buy Craig Morgan. So that was
the first one. I can't remember. I can't remember Hot
went on the chart if it was top ten or not.
But um, but it was close, which was you know
that's back then that's all you want, is like you
(27:27):
want top twenty and then you get that and you're like,
can you watch that? It was your first you are
you watching the charts everything back then? For sure? Watching
it all the time. I don't watch anymore. But when
you hear that at the beginning, the first time you
hear it actually cut, are you like, I like what
they did with that production? Or that was my alarm clock?
Actually it really was, Yeah, yeah I did. I did
(27:49):
that on the demo. I made a little home demo
of it with that alarm clock, and and they here
Theredith and then everyone who cut it after that, A
couple of artists cut it. Everyone used that A long o'clock.
Then it's just my A long o'clock. A couple cut it,
but they didn't put on a record. Um. I think
Keith Keith Anderson cut it, and I think it made
(28:14):
a record for him, but it wasn't a single. So
then what's the rule there? Because Eric Passley, who embuddies with,
he wrote Friday Night. I think Friday Nights sung. I'm
thinking of lady A cut it but on the record.
He then said, well he didn't use this single. I
want to use this single one number one for him.
I want to be Oh friend, is there a rule
(28:36):
that if it doesn't go as a single, you can
still probably cut it somewhere else? Sure? I mean once
it you know, once it is out, once somebody cuts it,
anybody can cut it. So so you can put it
out as a single anytime. Do you have to ask
for single rights? Though? No, only one? I don't think so. No.
I mean you do that one time, you give you
(28:57):
give the license out one time, and once you approve it,
it's it's a fair game. So you're telling me I
could cut I was on a boat. Yeah, put it
out of a single and then once it beat you guys,
is the best streaming song? That's just life. Yeah. But
we reaped the benefits of that, soot why good? Good
(29:19):
for us all? Like we all went there. Nice first
number one song you wrote say you Do for Dirk
Spanley And was that a rocket ship number one or
was that a we don't know if he's gonna cut it.
He did cut it. We don't know if it's gonna
be on the record, we don't know it. All of
them are like that. I feel like, um, that one
(29:40):
was you know, talking about breakthroughs and stuff that as
far as the writing that song, that was one that
I was sure it was something special. Really you knew
when you wrote it. Yeah, was there any chance you
were keeping these songs because old dominion was maybe if
we were a band at that point you signed. Uh No,
(30:01):
So even like wake Up Loving You was our like
show closer man, like, to let Craig Morgan have that
song was a really tough decision because at that point
it started to feel like maybe we were gonna We
were so far away from getting signed, but it felt
like maybe we were going to. Um So it was
tough to kind of let that one go. Say you
do wasn't tough for us because we we did play
(30:22):
that song and every show and um but at that point, man,
you know, we're just trying to pay the bills and
and we moved here to be songwriters anyway, that's what
we wanted, so um So it was awesome and and
he did an incredible job. There was a moment where
I was going to sing background vocals on it, but
it didn't pan out. Um, man, it was just an
exhilarating feeling to hear that song and watch that song
(30:46):
climb to get your first number one. Amazing. This chainsaw
from the Bam Perry wrote this one. Yeah, here's the
was it written as aggressive? It's way more aggressive. Our
version is way more aggressive. This one is the light
version of it. So my dad actually, my dad actually
(31:08):
made a comment one time about He was like, man,
your version is like, you know, I can kind of
picture you out in the woods, like with like frozen
snot in your beard, cutting down the tree. It's definitely
a lot more aggressive our version. Before we get over
to the old dominion stuff. Ecstasy from Sam Hunt is probably,
in my opinion, his biggest non single song. It wasn't
a single, but everybody knows it. Um, I wish that
(31:32):
was a single. One to me, I kind of had
to be reminded it wasn't a single. I'm a big
Sam guy. I like Sam away from work, you know, Yeah,
I love Sam at work, you know so, But I
love this song. When he cuts it again, he kind
of though, if I'm not mistaken, this was on the
pre Yeah, I think so. Yeah. Um, and Sam wasn't
(31:55):
Sam Hunt, Right, but did you when you guys wrote,
it wasn't written like Wow, this is different, like say
something like new Territory type stuff. I mean we knew
before everyone knew that it was you know, Sam Hunt.
Like writing with that guy, you're like, damn, this guy
is something entirely different. And what means, like just his
(32:15):
creative mind is is he attacks things at different angles.
So the things that come out of his mouth, you're like,
I don't know how you thought of that, but you know,
even like with make You Missed Me, he throws out
a line like to keep a slip knot and the
strings you attached like something some obscure thought like that,
he can make seem very palatable. So just writing with him,
(32:41):
that was a moment where you knew something was big
was going to happen. So that song, it's funny like
he he overthinks a lot of things and to you know,
to his credit, it works, you know, but he, like
most people, you sit in the room and you write
and at the end of the day you got the song.
You can write for weeks and weeks and weeks on
the same song with Sam, So that's what happened. I
(33:03):
never really knew the final version of Ecstasy until it
came out, Like I knew what I thought it was
gonna Were the other little changes that you heard in
it that you're like, well, I don't remember that at all. Yeah, yeah,
thats all like talking part at the end that there's
like a whole like kind of down bridge where he's
kind of talking and you look kind of cute and
all this stuff. I didn't remember any of that stuff,
(33:23):
But I mean it's amazing. Were you surprised to see
the explosion of him? Yeah, No, I mean I'm excited.
I mean, I'm supposed to thee any explosion of anybody,
right because it's always so unpredictable of who it's gonna be,
when it's gonna be, on why it's gonna be yea,
And with Sam, it hits so hard, so fast, And
I feel like Sam is the most reluctant superstar that
(33:46):
I know, And when people are kind of bagging on him,
I'm like, well, first of all, he's way smarter, way
more talented than you, and he doesn't because he loves
to be an artist, but he didn't want to be be
the guy out and people forget because everything now sounds
like m hunt, so it didn't. Then he changed it
and everything on country radio. Half of it is just
watered down Sam months Kenny save it for rainy Day.
(34:10):
I have this hook up here. When you write a
song like this, how quickly do you send it to Kenney?
This one you never like, I didn't know Kenny at
that point, and you never ever right aiming at a
certain artist. But this song has the like quickest journey ever,
(34:32):
but a huge journey. But we used to write. Brad
and I and our late friend Andrew Doff used to
write every morning at nine in the not every morning
every week at nine in the morning, so we would
have double booked ourselves. We would write from nine to
eleven and then we would go to our normal right,
So that morning I didn't have any ideas, but in
(34:54):
the shower on the way or getting ready to go there,
that kind of course popped into my head. So I
showed up and I was like, Hey, what about this?
And they were like yeah, And we wrote that song
in forty five minutes. And at that time, Brad was
making a little home demos and I kept kind of
egging him on, like, dude, you gotta make a demo,
and I was joking. I was like, man, you want
(35:16):
to Kenny Tesney cut or not, like make the demo.
So he was like okay, okay, and he made the
demo and um, sure enough, like we got it right
to him and he picked it up like it was.
It never happens like that, but that's the only time
that's ever happened is And then he went and recorded
it and the studio musicians told us they only did
(35:36):
one take of it. They played it and they were
moved on, so they thought, no way that's ever making it.
So we wrote it in forty five minutes. They did
one take of the recording session, and then it becomes
a three week number one songs. Pretty crazy, When did
your mindset change? And Okay, I'm an artist and I'm
you're always a songwriter. Yeah, but now like I'm the
(35:58):
guy and we're the guy. Is where we're looking out
for us first, because if we don't, nobody else is
going to Yeah what No. I think it was hard
man to even throw throughout the whole first album, which
was you know, two thousand, fourteen fifteen ish. Um, it
was hard for us to turn that songwriter switch off
(36:19):
and hold on to even song for another time, we
pitched two, We pitched at to Kenny Like at that
point we were still trying to We didn't know if
it was gonna work, but we knew we were successful songwriters.
So I mean, honestly, probably for me, not until the
last album with like Maga Sweet and One Man Band.
All that stuff was when I finally felt like we
(36:41):
as a band were confident in ourselves and we're able to, like,
you know, kind of live in our own skin. How
do you form a band five people? Right? How do
you form a band? I know how to form a band,
but how do you form the band when you've been
in town a long time? All you guys weren't righting.
It didn't seem like when I look back at the oh,
but I mean so with you know, when and I
(37:03):
went to middle school together and we're in competing drum
lines together, and then he was in a band with
Um Jeff all through college, and and Brad was at
the same college. They were all taking classes together and
playing music together, and Um and then I was going
and opening for their band. We just this is just
my guys that I've known for forever, since we were kids. So, uh,
(37:27):
those are the people that I always played music with,
so it wasn't very hard to like. We moved down
to Nashville sort of one by one. They were still
in a band. I was calling them trying to get
them to move down here because I was such a
fan of them. I knew they could come down here
and crush it. Then they broke up, moved down one
by one, and the other members of that band did
to their One of them in Taylor Swists Band, Um,
(37:50):
one of them. Um. There's another guy in Taylor Swiss
Band from the same group. Um, and one of them
plays on every country, he plays on all Sam stuff.
He plays along Dustin Lynch's music. And so everyone just
moved down there. I was right, they were super successful.
But you know, when I'm looking for someone to come
and play the songs I'm writing, I'm gonna call my
buddies that I've always played music with. And I guess
(38:11):
that was my question. You know, do you come to Nashville,
the Land of the Giants, and cherry picked the giants
or do what you did? You grabbed your guys who
were also really great, but they were your guys. Yeah,
I mean, at that point, you don't have access to
the giants. You can't cherry picked them because the people
at the top are cherry picking them. So you gotta
make do you know, you gotta you gotta call your
(38:32):
buddies that will play for nothing because you can't give
them any money. So you know, you just kind of
roll with what you got. All five of you, guys,
were you in the all five of you in the
official like start of Old Dominion? Brad was not the
guy was mentioning his name is Devin Malone, who played
the studio musician here in town, was at the time
(38:53):
the original guitar player. And then, um, you know, at
that point we weren't making any money and but we
were touring like we were, you know, we were just
losing our assets. But um, and he started to be
asked to play on the road and in the studio
with some other artists, news paying his bills, and you know,
(39:14):
it's to the point where he couldn't make a bunch
of Brad started subbing for him a bunch. So the
time came where it was like, hey, man, are you
are you into this or not? And he was like,
I don't think I can do it, man. So so
he left and Brad was the was the guy. Was
Brad already making money as a songwriter? No, it was
too early on that that front for him too. Yeah, yeah,
(39:36):
he was just he was just starting to get into
the songwriting world and kind of make some noise. How
do you guys talk. It's so it's you're like the
elite songwriters out of old dominion. Let's just remove the
band old dominion, Like you legitimately have elite songwriters in
your band yourself that that didn't get together because of
(39:57):
your elite songwriting success. No, but you know, I mean
Trevor and I got together because of songwriting, not because
of the success, but but because he and I hit
it off as as co writers and friends. So we
had we knew we had something um and then we
just kind of built it from there. Same thing with Brad.
(40:18):
You know, Brad, we had a we had a sort
of friendship. We knew him, but we also knew was
extremely talented. But then we write with him and we're like,
this guy's kind of got the same thing that we have. So,
you know, it's just about finding your people and luckily
that our people are our friends. Are you able to
switch off front man of a I mean of my
(40:40):
favorite band of probably the biggest band in country music
right now. Are you able to switch that to dad
husband like that? No, No, it's it's been. Um. You know,
that's hard. That's that's been you know, quite honestly, um,
a challenge. So it's it takes some therapy, some work
(41:00):
to figure that out. I wasn't like I was kind
of stupid, um thinking about working on this the whole time.
I never thought about being like famous or like a
rock star or anything. I always thought about songs and
music and and and that being known. But I didn't
think about people wanting to know about me, and that
(41:23):
freaked me out, honestly. So kind of the beginning of it,
the first few years, it's kind of a mess of
trying to figure out how to handle that. Do you
like that part of it? Do you like being the
(41:43):
lead singer of Old Dominion? I have learned to. I
didn't at first, but I do not. I've I've been
able to kind of switch it in my brain and
realize that that I'm kind of in the service industry now,
you know, like, it's not it's not about me, it's
(42:04):
about serving other people. I can, I can visibly see
what we are doing is affecting and helping other people.
So in when I can remember that, I absolutely love it.
Like it's there's nothing better than going out there realizing
that something you created from an emotion or or just
(42:26):
a grouping of words, it has a really big effect
on people. Then by all means I would not want
to be doing anything else. Can you guys do five
tour buses for all five members? We cannot. That's expensive.
But you got And I asked that now because again
in the last pandemic years weird to quantify. But like
(42:51):
you guys have you're the elite now right. You also
became very elite at a time when there was no
money going around to which is which is an odd
thing because here you are don anating and you can't
really capitalize on what the success that you've had. So
no five buses yet? What we got three? I mean
we're all in the same bus. So um, okay, we
got listen. I think I'll be your business manager. It's time.
(43:14):
I's time to get another at least another bus. Here.
Our business manager right now is like, what what no
one bus? Please? But I mean we have I think
we're on three buses total with our crew and everything,
but but there's six of us on our bus, and
so it's the five of us and our tour manager.
It is a weird dynamic. And I'll speak from experience too,
because I've had the guys on my show for the
(43:36):
most part for ten fifteen years. Like I just grabbed
my people that had never done that before and was like,
let's go along for the ride together. Trust me, I
got you, and then at times they've had to have
me too. But there is always weird inner personal dynamics
because everybody's still so different living human lives are growing
up on our show. I mean, we've got people get me,
(43:57):
getting married, if people have an extra kid. You got
with five people, it just like I'm dealing with that
five people. You guys have grown have adulted quite a
bit together. Do you do any sort of therapy as
as a group. We just got asked that, um by
someone else, and no, we we haven't done that. UM.
(44:18):
I mean it would probably be helpful, I think, but
we haven't gotten to the point where I don't think
we need it. Do you vote? We do vote. We
had like right in the beginning, we were sat down
with an attorney and he was like, Okay, we're gonna
come up with the system here of voting, and we
were like, we're never going to need that. And it
was literally like the next week, I want to play
(44:42):
just a clip if I was on a boat that day,
which is number ten right now, is we're recording that
living Son and Wrong. Just at this long of all
the old Dominion songs, seems, I won't say the most
(45:05):
fun has maybe the most love. There's a different feel
to it. You have other fun songs, but this one
feels purposefully a little more like, hey, we're just putting
out a song to freaking have fun, like a little
goofy even exactly what it is, Yeah, is that is
does that happen in conversation? Like you, guys, we've done
the deep songs we've done, why don't we just put
(45:25):
one out that makes us go a screw it, man,
We're just have fun. Well, I think we weren't thinking
about that when we were writing it, but once we
had written it, it felt that for that reason, it
was like, you know, coming out of pandemic and all
this stuff, it was just like, man, let's just let's
just not even worry about let's just put a fun
song out. Let's and in the groove, you know that shuffle.
(45:46):
It doesn't matter people dance if they don't know what,
they dance to that beat, no matter what song it is.
So it just felt like, man, we had so much
fun recording that song. Let's just keep that party going
because you know, there's no needs. We pride ourselves on
the happy sad mix. Easier to do a song like
that when you have the cred of success of really deep,
(46:09):
substitantive songs. Yeah, you know, as if you're putting out
a bunch of songs like that, people are like, well,
they're the goofy band. But no one's gonna take you
for the goofy band, right, But we are, you know,
inherently goofy. People like, we're goofy friends with each other
and we laugh constantly all day long. So that is
a big part of us. So you know, it's it's
(46:29):
I'm glad it's finally showing a new album on the
eighth of next What number we are in? We're nine?
We're nine now, I guess the Pandemics also eliminated in
the ability to know it's number month. It's impossible. October
would be October October eight time Tequila and Therapy. Why
(46:51):
that title? I'm sure you guys kind of mess around
with a few different titles. Why why those words? Yeah,
well those are lyrics from one of the songs. UM
and we've you know, bounced around a bunch of different
titles for a long time, and finally that came out,
and what it did, It's the first time we all
five went immediately went that's it, you know, And I
(47:15):
think because you know that is man, that's that's old
dominion in a nutshell right there. We've been together for
so long, there's so much time in history behind us.
And you know, tequila is a is a big part
of our you know, pre show ritual, and you know
we work with the tequila company, and you know that's
(47:36):
just kind of part of our culture. And um, and
the therapy has been a lot of therapy in the past,
you know, a couple of years between me and a
couple other members, and and we're learning a lot about
ourselves and and you know, music itself is therapeutic, and
UM it just seemed like the perfect snapshot of of
what this whole album is. Did you ever have the fear,
(47:58):
because I did and struggle with it for a while.
Going to therapy was going to make you have less
of an edge, And I don't mean edges like a
bad boy, but I mean edge and creatively. I think
that thought crossed my mind some. Yeah. I learned pretty
quickly that whatever you know, I don't say demons or
(48:19):
darkness or whatever, whatever you're carrying around therapy isn't gonna
make go away. So I'm always going to have that stuff.
I just maybe have the tools to deal with it
a little bit better so I can go back there
and access that all I want. As far as creativity goes,
(48:39):
it's always going to be there, whether I wanted to
or not. I don't want it to be there, but
you know, I would trade all of that going away
for you know, I'm already successful, so I can say
that I'll lend on this. And being a Tory musician
is exhausting. Are you writing anything that's not maybe for
(49:01):
you guys? Yeah, um, you will just write and go
maybe we'll send this off. Yeah, I mean we do
that all the time. I mean, Brad just got he's
got the new um Keith Urvan Wild hearts with with
Eric Pasling. Um, yeah, and I think we hold onto
him for a little longer. But for the most part,
(49:25):
the chances even still of getting a song recorded by
another artist are so slim, even even with our success.
It's gotta all the stars have to line up perfectly,
and so at this point we're just kind of like, yeah,
send it to him if if they if they like it,
great chances are there not going to and then it's
(49:45):
still ours. So the question that I would have then
is if you're writing for the sake of writing, I
would think artists would go, well, if I doesn't want
to cut it because I didn't think it's good enough
for him, probably, yeah, I mean, and that's all we
ever do is right for the sake of writing. We
(50:06):
don't try to write an Old Dominion song even we
just write. But yeah, I think that probably is happening
some you know, I think, Um, you know, there's been
some talk about maybe recording demos without my vocal on
them so that people don't hear it as Old Dominion,
you know. Yeah. I have a buddy who writes in
(50:27):
a different name at times for similar reason. Yeah, He's like,
I don't want people to think that I'm only writing
and not cutting them because I think they suck or
not good enough for me, right, And it's just it's
just about whether or not it's right or not, you know.
I mean, it's not like you're gonna pitch a song
you don't believe in. Like I have plenty of bad
(50:48):
songs that I would never let anyone here. So if
they're hearing the song, I believe in it, and I
would cut it if it was the right song to cut.
So maybe it is for for the other artists. I
think we're gonna we're gonna end it there and listen,
I was on about the day is gonna be a
number one soon. I don't even I don't even need
to promote anything, like you've been generous with even coming here,
(51:08):
because you need no promotion. You guys just walk in.
It's turnkey. You got hit after hit. I think I
don't speaking candidly. I don't even like albums anymore. I
don't have the patience for them. And I know that's
that's not the comfortable thing to say in an artist
community where people are still fighting. But I don't feel
like i'm I'm I feel like I'm gonna not get
(51:30):
to experience certain songs because I don't have patience for them,
and so I feel like I lose if somebody puts
out an album. I'm getting to a compliment. Don't worry.
I'm with you. I feel like I lose when someone
puts out thirteen songs because I don't invest enough time
that as much time as I should in all thirteen songs.
You're you're most people. I go through a couple of times,
(51:51):
and the ones I like a swipe over and save,
swipe save um, and I'm not it's not fair because
I would like to give it all the songs time. Yeah,
that being here, there's a compliment sory, like when you
guys put out an album, it's every every track, thank you,
and I don't. I don't say that to anybody. May
I would say that to Mayor. But then Mayor started
(52:11):
doing smaller practice, right, and we talked about that we
were gonna kind of split this up. I think what
the plan is for us instead is we write so much,
we're just gonna keep recording and make another one pretty quick,
I think. But I think you know, most people are
like that. We just we like the music. We're just
gonna put it out. We have fans that will listen
(52:33):
to it and some people won't. We'll have, you know,
we'll have a few singles that people know, and that's great.
That's the same as any other album. You know, So
do a concept album. That's what I want from all
the concept. I don't even know what the concept was,
you know, I don't know what the concept is. But
nineteen twenties, that's where we need to bring wit in all.
That's when his mind would would be that he would
(52:55):
set the concept like a cool old Dominion concept album
about eight try so you tell me a story. It's
the wall. I just like one day. That's like the
announcement is all Dominions doing. It's it's about dinosaurs. What dinosaurs?
I'm here for this, Okay, listen, Hey, thank you very much.
I appreciate you coming vibe. I know, um you're doing
a lot so to spend a little time here. We
(53:16):
appreciate it. You guys can follow all Dominion music on
Instagram or empt Ramsey. Um. That's that's that's Matt's private account,
all right, I guess not private public but account yea
which everyone Yeah, yeah, the private private account. The only
I have. That's the other metory, all right, thanks Matt,
Hey guys, Welcome to episode three four with Matthew Ramsay
of Old Dominion talks about the origin of the band,
his career before music. It's a really good interview. He
drove over and his pretty normal truck. Still pretty normal guy.
Considering all the massive success he's had. He didn't seem
(00:23):
that rich, but he is. I mean, he can't write
all those songs. I not being I mean, the guys
had so much success, but he just seems like a normal,
normal dude. I like him a lot. And we spent
five minutes, fifty minutes talking, right, Yeah. I told Mike,
I was like, and I never know how long they're
gonna be. And I was like, it's gonna be about
a half hour. So I knew he just had just
gotten off the road and be tired, but came in.
(00:43):
I thought it was great. So, okay, here are the
top five releases this week. At number five, Kanye West
finally put out Donda and this actually was out Sunday.
Here's a new song called Jail. It's twenty seven tracks,
(01:06):
a lot of tracks, and he even says the record
they will put it out without his permission. I don't
know what to believe. I think if that were the case,
they would have done that earlier. They would have that's
jay Z there made in the image of God. That's Selfie.
I still love Kanye. You're never gonna maybe not love Kanye.
(01:27):
I mean, I guess you would have you told me
for I love Kanye. Number four. Lauren Elena has a
new album out called Sitting Pretty on Top of the World.
Here's a new song called here on Top of the World,
Sitting pay back tears, Playing It Cool but back Tears. Jacken,
(01:49):
Carrie Underwood, and Dan and Shay released a new song
from the Dear Evan Hansen soundtrack called only Us. That's
my third one, but Us. At number two, Cody Johnson
(02:11):
has two new songs out. One's called Treasure and here's
a new one called Son of a rambling Man. And
new country trio Restless Road have a new song out
called Headlights. Fun Fact Kane Brown signed them to his
record label back in Uh Funner Fact, they sent me
(02:32):
a bunch of shampoo like three days ago, really for
what I was at the opera and I went out
and did something with them and this one guy and
maybe the one of the singers. They're all singers, but
maybe the lad singer if there is one, has big,
curly fuffy here and I just like, I gotta touch it.
And so they sent me some really expensive shampoo. Nice. Yeah,
here's restless road headlights to have every summer and then
(02:57):
move side. See Si more new albums. Drake put out
his sixth album, Certified lover Boy. I've had no time
to spend with any of it yet, of you, I
was reading a thing that he has so many features
on this one. I haven't even looked at the track list.
Jay Z Young Doug Future twenty one, Savage, Little Baby,
Little Dirk, not familiar with a little dirt the rest
(03:19):
of now. Elton John has announced a Star Studic collaborations album.
Was pretty cool as Jimmy Allen's on that with Miley
Cyrus Stevie Nicks do a leap at Charlie Pooth. Casey
Musgrave's announces a new tour she has hit in the
road its support of her upcoming album Star Crossed. It's
fifteen cities. I thought would be a little more than that. Honestly,
it's pretty sure. Fifteen cities. This is a small tour,
and you know she can sell old Dominion playing the
(03:41):
sec kick off. If you hear this on Friday, that
will be tomorrow on Saturday. Justin Bieber is now Spotify's
most streamed artist in a single month. He earned the
record of eighty three million streams in July. That's a lot.
I mean, he's making so much money from streaming. Think
it's so much funny from everything post Malone's teaming up
with Yeager my Stir to help artists and venues that
(04:02):
took a hit from the coronavirus. And I think that's
it on the headlines. All right, here we go matt
Ramsey from Old Dominion. It's a great talk. Enjoy this
all right with Matthew Ramsey from Old Dominion. And I
guess the question is, before we start this and get
in depth, like what do your friends call you madam Matthew?
Like what do you feel most comfortable? It's both. I've
(04:22):
gone through my whole life with both. I mean it's
like if you meet someone though and they're like, hey,
I'm Jim. You are I usually say Matthew, But um
then there's there's been people that have that it feels
weird for them to call me Matthew. But like my
family growing up, Mom, dad, grandparents called me Matthew. For example,
(04:46):
Thomas Rhett. If someone calls him Thomas, he knows they're
not that close to him because his name is not Thomas. Yeah,
he's like, so the people that know me because it's
it's it's he's like t r Thomas rhet because that's
what he was called as a kid. That's not his
last name. So if they come up and they go, ey, Thomas,
how are you, He's like, I don't really know, you
don't really know me would do it with sure? So
I have I told you the story about So. I mean,
(05:09):
I was matt for a long time. My family was Matthew.
They all call me Matthew. Matt war all was on
my friends and everything. And then I was in Virginia,
you know, recording music on my own, and um, I
was putting out CDs and playing stuff and had a
website and uma I had a MySpace all that stuff,
and then um, I gotta started getting some messages from
(05:32):
some people that were looking for a different Matt Ramsey
who happened to be in the adult film untram Yeah.
So um and people were like, I really like your music,
but You're not the Matt Ramsey I was looking for
just heads up. So I started then to delineate Matthew
(05:53):
was just to set myself apart a little bit. Does
that Matt Ramsey still exist in a way that it's
still does? Well, no, it's not confusing. He actually has
another name, a more famous name, but he when he
performs a certain type of pornography, he goes by Matt Ramsey.
So so it's a fun fact. Yeah, I'm not going
(06:15):
to google him. Yeah you'll you'll get some interesting images
if you do. But when you were in Virginia making music,
about what year was that when you were when you
were dedicated to music, but you were not in Nashville.
That was probably two thousand and so you're years old? No,
I mean yeah, yeah, probably twenty. How would am I now?
(06:37):
I'm I'm actually forty three. So so if that's the case,
then why not move to Nashville? Then? Did you have
a different career path in mind where you were going
to do it from Virginia? Was it slightly different than
what you expected? Yeah? Well, I mean I went to
art school. I kind a degree in illustration, and um,
(06:57):
you know those are two I was passionate. I'm still
passionate about both things, and um, I kind of got
to the end of college and thought, I can't half
ass both of these things. I need to focus on one.
And music wound up being the thing I chose. So
then I sort of did. Yeah, I made like a
(07:20):
self funded you know, CD, and and just got to
the point where I felt like I had exhausted everything
in that area and played everywhere I could, and you know,
made my money back in my CD, and it was
time to to take another step that going into art school.
What was that plan? Let's say the music thing didn't
work out, or you were at the crossroads and you
(07:41):
didn't choose music. I think that's the better question, Like
what was the plan with the illustration? What what was
a career outlook? There? I mean there, you know, you
start to realize I started to realize on my senior
year when you're you're kind of just doing all these
independent studies and things, and you start to realize that
all your professors are starting to view you as you
as their competition. So you start to see like, well,
(08:02):
I'm going to be able to maybe teach or you know,
pick up some you know magazine illustrations or that drawing.
I talk to me like a dumb guy. Becau's what
I am. It's all of it, painting, drawing, m printmaking,
stuff like that. So painting a picture on a canvas, Yah,
you can do that. Yeah, you're a good artist like that.
(08:23):
Pretty it can hold my own. Yeah. Do you ever?
Do you do that for fun at all? Yes? I
mean for I just painted recently a picture, um, for
the first time in a while, um, which was very therapeutic,
and um, I don't want to do it more. I
posted a little thing on my own Instagram of it,
but it's gone now. But um, like if I was naked.
(08:46):
I took several years of figure drawing classes where someone
would come in, and we had those in college, maybe
like fifty bucks if you go staying naked up, and
I was broke, But I wasn't that broke, right. I
always thought about those people are like, man, you must
need this money. I thought about in the same way
in two ways. Either, I was envious of the fact
(09:06):
that they had no inhibition at all, that they would go, hey, whatever,
if people need to draw something, I'll show my wiener.
I was so embarrassed and I'm still so embarrassed at
my wiener that I just wouldn't. We had a bit
on the show one and I'm, I mean my quarter joking.
I guess you're laughing, so I guess I gotta be like,
I'm joking. But we had a thing. This is when
(09:28):
we were in Austin and I was, um, it's pretty
early in my career. I just started to build my
syndication company. We were doing mostly popping hip hop stations,
and we were you know, at the time, it was
a wild and crazy guy. Now I'm just the guy
that gets trouble because I say things sometimes that the
industry doesn't want me to say. But then I was
just being an idiot for no other reason than just
being an idiot. And so we did a bit where
(09:48):
we had an artist come in and the loser had
to get naked and be drawn and I lost, and
I had to sit in a room like a closet
and he and him I remember him for no other
reason than just drawing it the right he had eyeball
my Yeah, so you did. You did what I avoided
for years a radio segment. Wow, Well, I mean you
faced your fear though, So that's good, right, So would
(10:08):
you do that to me? If I if I says
like I would like to pose nude and have you
draw a picture, I don't think I could do that.
That's pretty cool though, that like, because that an artist musically,
You're right, you perform like it's it's more of a
three sixty thing when it comes to art with you.
That was just that side of my brain is is
the one that's active. You have an analytical side, Uh,
(10:31):
you know, I mean I can, but you know, I'm
not like into math and stuff like that. But Dave
Heywood is a guy who I'm friends with who is
i mean creative but also extremely linear as well. He's
able to I sometimes can't do. I can't balance both
(10:51):
at the same time. And he's the guy who's who's
exceptional at that in your band because everybody kind of
has roles in old dominion, like what is your role
creative in that group? Creatively, I mean it's tough because
we are. That's what makes it really hard to be
in this band sometimes is is everyone is extremely creative.
So um, you know anymore, I would say that it's
(11:15):
kind of evolved and I've I've recently learned especially in
this last album in the process of making it that
my role is not necessarily in the tracking room while
we're recording it's it's in the control room with our
producer Shane and I'm I'm a better guide in that way.
(11:35):
And um, and I'm I'm a strong writer, I think too.
So I think I have a strong voice in the
writing of our songs. But everyone does. Everyone is so talented.
Do you have to submitting it? Isn't you use the frustrator?
You have to submit yourself a bit when you go
to record an album, because when you write it and
you make you know, your work tape or your demo
(11:55):
and you have you can get demo itis and wanted
to sound like there. But then Shane come is in, Um,
Shane mcinally, who obviously is is the best at what
he does. I mean, I don't I don't think you
would have a problem with saying he's better at being
a producer than you are. Yeah, oh yeah, for sure.
It's gonna make sure we're cold. And if he's like, hey,
this is how I see it, Like I really am
(12:16):
passionate about this. Do you ever have to submit and
go like you know what? You know what you're doing
and I only kind of know what I'm doing, so
I'm gonna do that. Yeah, definitely. But we have a
close enough of relationship that, um, if if we still
will go down that road, if we if we're not
fully believing in it, and I'm not fully believing in it,
but he strongly is will go down that road for
however long it takes until it until we see it
(12:39):
or we go you're wrong. And and he's great at
going Okay, thanks for trying, and we do the same thing.
He'll he'll listen to us and our ideas, and you know,
if we are feeling it one way, he'll say, I
trust you, guys, let's let's go down that road until
he either sees it or doesn't. It seems this is
just my memory years later that he was involved really
(13:00):
early with you guys. Yeah, he was, um you know,
we were writing music with him, songs, um before he
had any success. So I think when I met him
he had one he had just gotten um Leeann Walmack
song recorded his first one, and you know we were
all just broke, you know, he just I think he
(13:21):
had just like moved out of his car into a house,
you know, so, yeah, he's been around for us for
since the beginning. I want to go back to in Virginia,
the first instrument you pick up is it the drums?
It was the drums? Why the drums? Uh? You know?
When I was I had an older brother and um
he's he's four years older than me, and he had
(13:42):
a friend who was a drummer, and it just enamored me.
Just today, he would come over to our house and
set his drum kid up and I would sneak down
there and look at it. And then he played like
a drum solo at the middle school talent show or whatever.
It blew the whole place's mind and I just saw
how that affected everyone. And um, so I just was
drawn to banging on stuff for their bands that you
(14:07):
listen to and drummed along with, and you liked the
most as a fourteen fifteen year old kid, where you thought,
all right, if I'm gonna do this, Yeah, I mean
at that point it was starting to get into um
is starting to get into a lot of grunge. I mean,
for me, when I first learned not play guitars, chili peppers,
it was metallic because it's some really easy intros totally. Yeah. Yeah,
(14:29):
so I had at that point, once I started really
digging in and playing along to music, Um, I had.
I was my parents had a basement and I had
a drum kit down there, and I had guitar amps
and guitars, and I just and it was kind of
like split even then. I had half of the basement
was art supplies and canvases and things, and half of
it was musical instruments. So I would just kind of
(14:50):
live down in the basement and play along to mostly
things like Pearl Jam and Nirvana and Smashing Pumpkins and
stuff like that. And I asked this question, and I'm
being as respectful that possibly can with this question, because
what happened to me may have happened to you. But
being an art kid and a music kid, did you
get beat up a lot? I never got beat up,
but I definitely, um, I mean I got tugged on
(15:11):
a little bit. You know, um actually ended up. I've
never really talked about this ever, but uh, I actually
ended up getting plastic surgery on my ears because uh,
they were yanked on quite a bit and they kind
of they were like, you know, I always think about this.
It must have been really bad because I kind of
(15:32):
don't think about it that much, but it must have
been really bad for me to beg my parents to
fix this problem and for them to go through with it,
because you know, I have kids, and I know if
if they if a kid and my kid in the
sixth grade was begging you know, me to physically change
them because of what people were doing, it would must
(15:52):
have been heartbreaking for my parents, and I know what
stuff for me, so so they did so for a
while there, Yes, I went through some you know, some order,
you know, punishments. There. I suffered similar you know, consequences
for not being a you know, finger quotes normal kid.
But you're a lot cooler than I am. That's why
(16:13):
I asked. I mean, you're like cooler and you're talented,
something like did you like break the mold or you're
They're like, he's so talented, let's just celebrate him. I mean,
I did wind up once I got into high school.
I was kind of friends with everybody, you know, I
was friends with the athletes, and I was also in
the marching band, so you know, I kind of made
(16:35):
peace with with everyone. So when did you transition from
being the percussion guy to kind of go on, I
don't even really want to do that much anymore, Like
I want to play guitar. I want to. My first
band was born out of the Marching band because the
whole drum line we were such good friends, uh, and
we all wanted to be in a band, but we
were all drummers. And so it was, you know, one
(16:56):
guy going well, I have a guitar, and another guy saying, well,
I'll have the drum kit. And I was like, well,
I can find a bass, I'll borrow a base. I
borrowed a basse from somebody. So it was just we
wanted to play music, but we only thing we knew
how to play with drums, so we just kind of
learned together and you know, just by ear figuring out that.
(17:16):
So then once I started figuring out things on the base,
and I had a piano that I would, you know,
kind of mess around with, and and and a guitar
that my uncle had given me. My dad was like,
you're really good at figuring things out. You should pick
up that guitar and try that. So so then once
I picked that up, I didn't know how to play it.
So that's when I immediately started writing stuff so that
(17:37):
I could play what I was writing, that it was
music natural to you, even though it was hard, it was, Yes,
it was natural to me. Was wild for you to
be able to play a E. G. C. E. Minor,
you know, all the ones that you can let me
be on, all the ones I play for you to play. Like,
(17:58):
how quickly were we able to adapt and actually play
you know, those main chords with your guys? I mean
pretty pretty quickly. You know, it didn't take very long
before we were all writing songs together as a band.
You know, they all sounded like pro jam ripoffs, but
you know, but didn't everyone. But yeah, it wasn't at
that point. Yeah, okay, so you you you go to school,
(18:19):
You're gonna do graphic art illustration. I'm messing that episode.
You're also playing music. I again, I would understand that
nine nine people out of a hundred are going to
make more money doing that graphic art job because they
could probably get work. Maybe I think it depends on
(18:39):
not not necessarily in the in the field that I
was headed towards, it was kind of equal to the music,
I think because I wasn't interested in sitting at a
computer and coming up with like graphic design. I wasn't.
I was more tactile and would rather get my hands
in paint or sculpt or, you know. So, And at
that point, I have a couple of friends that are
(19:00):
classmates that are successful artists now and it's been the
same road, you know, it's just been grinding it out
and keeping you know, keeping their head down and painting
and painting and painting and painting until they finally we
all at the same age. They're they're having success as
artists and I'm having success in music. You're playing music.
(19:22):
What are you playing by yourself? When you when you
dedicate your life to it now as a craft to
pay your your and what other job are you doing?
Every job possibly could, I've worked, um, oh man everything.
I worked as a at a recycling plant Virginia. In Virginia,
I worked at landscaping companies, at signed companies, UM and
(19:44):
then UM. Then moved to Nashville and worked for a
moving company and where you know, I worked. The first
year I was here, worked I think probably seven different
jobs in the first year, just you know, trying to
keep my bills paid and and then right at night
and play. It was going to ask because there's no
I mean, there is writing at night, but for the
(20:04):
most part, any of my friends who are established writers
don't write at night, not anymore. And so when you're
a young guy, I'm assuming there are other just hungry
people that will write any time. And you're working all
day and you're just like, hey, let's just try to
write at eight o'clock to night. Have to. Yeah, if
you're gonna if you're gonna pay your bills, you gotta
do that. And then then you gotta write in your
(20:24):
free time. So I mean, I even had, like I
wish I still had them. I had a job where
I worked at a stained glass place. This is still
in Virginia, and I would you know, they had the
old school time punch cards a hobby lobby. Yeah, and
that you would I had them sitting there and I
would write songs on the time punch cards while while
I was working. I would I would be writing those
songs on the time punches. So you have to write
(20:47):
every possible moment. Did you feel like you were a
good writer though before people told you you were a
good writer? Um, yeah, I think well, I mean that's
interesting question. I think you're always questioning whether or not
you are a good writer. Even at this point you
know you're like, do I know how to do this anymore? Um?
So I think there's a certain amount of at that
(21:11):
point early on arrogance that you have to have for sure,
for sure to do something. And I say this all
the time. For me to think somebody's gonna pay a
fifty bucks to come watch me do comedy, I better
think I'm pretty danger. You have to have an ego
about and then you gotta have humility at the same time,
So you gotta be able to look back and realize
why it wasn't working then. So I think if you
(21:31):
can do that, you can keep growing. But um, but
you know, I think I when I first started, I
was I was really writing because I really needed to.
I was really was expressing things that I had had
no other way to express. So it wasn't about being good.
It was about, um getting some feelings out and and
(21:53):
working through things in a way that I can only
figure out how. So I mean spend off questions comes
from that they that you say, I guess the first
one is what you're working full time doing things other
than what you would like to do. Full time, which
is be creative. What was the first mini break you
had that didn't make you have to go work at
the plant or the restaurant? Um Well, I moved to
(22:18):
um Well in Virginia. The first thing I did. I
was working at this thing glass company. And then I
was making enough money, um playing you know, gigs that
I was booking myself that I could go part time,
like regionally, so you'd booked drive a couple of hours
you need to or locally, yeah, I would play. I
would play all the surroundings basically the whole state of Virginia.
(22:40):
And I made enough money there for about a year
that I could work part time, and luckily they were
supportive and of me and let me do that. And
then moved to Nashville, and it took probably, i don't know,
for a good five six years before I got a
publishing deal with Phil Vassar, who allowed me to stop working.
(23:03):
So let me get this straight, just so our listeners
they see the massive success of all Dominion, right, and
everything you guess put out is seemingly the world is
your oyster. Musically, for five or six years, you're talking
about five times three and sixty five days you worked well, Yeah,
(23:23):
and I still worked when I had that publishing deal.
I still had to find other means of income. But
it did loosen the it lessened the pressure a little bit,
and it still was. I still went through that hole,
that whole publishing deal without getting any any song recorded
or anything. So it gave me a little money, but
(23:45):
that was it. Is there a guilt that you have
because I've experienced this when people have signed me to
certain projects that didn't do as well as I had hoped.
Is there a guilt that you would have in a
publishing deal where nothing got record, did or cut? Guilty
that they were paying me? No? Um, no, because that's
(24:09):
a that's a risk they assume. You know, most people,
most people that you know, if if if I signed
a writer, I would sign them expecting nothing to happen
in the first like a few years at least. You know,
it's really just about learning at that point. So that's
all I was trying to do was learn, And I
(24:29):
was very upfront about that and with any any publisher
that signed me was I'm just trying to learn how
to write better. And most of them see that, they
see a glimmer of of talent. Most of the song sucks,
but maybe there's one line in there that gives them
some hope and and they can give you a little
(24:50):
bit of money to keep going. So I never really
felt guilty about that. I mean, especially like I was
saying earlier, I can go back and listen to those
songs and go see why in the time you were
like these are great? Why is no one recording them?
They're not great that you know. I had a lot
of growing to do for sure. So you're writing and
(25:16):
you start to just write songs for a living. What
was the first writer, I won't even we'll say break
that you earned. What what was your first break there
where you go, Okay, I'm not just now treading water,
like I might be able to have some real success
with this. Yeah. Um, the first sign of hope was
guy named Steve Holly recorded a song that Trevor and
(25:39):
I wrote with our friend Matt Jenkins, And then, um,
really was watching my friends have some success. Was really
what gave you the real hope was is that because
you knew that you could do what they do well,
I was doing what they were doing. I mean, we
were doing it all together. So it was like it
(25:59):
like Shane for instance, he came in and played um
remember he played us the demo for Somewhere with You
and Una, and we were just like, damn, like that's different,
that whatever that is is the next step. And we
(26:21):
even though we weren't writers on it, we knew that
that was going to change the game for all for
all of us. And even now when we watched Kenny
play it, like we sit there and go we none
of us would be here without that song because he
wrote that, Kenny cut it. It changed Kenny's career and
because of that, me and Josh Osborne and Trevor Rosen,
(26:44):
Matt Jenkins, Brandy Clark and you know, we're all in
that rider circle and we get we get to reap
the benefits really of of that exposure. So watching our
our each other succeed was really what kept us go.
And we're like, it's not like I'm doing it, but
it's weird doing it. You know what about first success
(27:05):
for you were a song actually good, a single like
a real life it's got a chance single That was
wake Up, Loving You Buy Craig Morgan. So that was
the first one. I can't remember. I can't remember Hot
went on the chart if it was top ten or not.
But um, but it was close, which was you know
that's back then that's all you want, is like you
(27:27):
want top twenty and then you get that and you're like,
can you watch that? It was your first you are
you watching the charts everything back then? For sure? Watching
it all the time. I don't watch anymore. But when
you hear that at the beginning, the first time you
hear it actually cut, are you like, I like what
they did with that production? Or that was my alarm clock?
Actually it really was, Yeah, yeah I did. I did
(27:49):
that on the demo. I made a little home demo
of it with that alarm clock, and and they here
Theredith and then everyone who cut it after that, A
couple of artists cut it. Everyone used that A long o'clock.
Then it's just my A long o'clock. A couple cut it,
but they didn't put on a record. Um. I think
Keith Keith Anderson cut it, and I think it made
(28:14):
a record for him, but it wasn't a single. So
then what's the rule there? Because Eric Passley, who embuddies with,
he wrote Friday Night. I think Friday Nights sung. I'm
thinking of lady A cut it but on the record.
He then said, well he didn't use this single. I
want to use this single one number one for him.
I want to be Oh friend, is there a rule
(28:36):
that if it doesn't go as a single, you can
still probably cut it somewhere else? Sure? I mean once
it you know, once it is out, once somebody cuts it,
anybody can cut it. So so you can put it
out as a single anytime. Do you have to ask
for single rights? Though? No, only one? I don't think so. No.
I mean you do that one time, you give you
(28:57):
give the license out one time, and once you approve it,
it's it's a fair game. So you're telling me I
could cut I was on a boat. Yeah, put it
out of a single and then once it beat you guys,
is the best streaming song? That's just life. Yeah. But
we reaped the benefits of that, soot why good? Good
(29:19):
for us all? Like we all went there. Nice first
number one song you wrote say you Do for Dirk
Spanley And was that a rocket ship number one or
was that a we don't know if he's gonna cut it.
He did cut it. We don't know if it's gonna
be on the record, we don't know it. All of
them are like that. I feel like, um, that one
(29:40):
was you know, talking about breakthroughs and stuff that as
far as the writing that song, that was one that
I was sure it was something special. Really you knew
when you wrote it. Yeah, was there any chance you
were keeping these songs because old dominion was maybe if
we were a band at that point you signed. Uh No,
(30:01):
So even like wake Up Loving You was our like
show closer man, like, to let Craig Morgan have that
song was a really tough decision because at that point
it started to feel like maybe we were gonna We
were so far away from getting signed, but it felt
like maybe we were going to. Um So it was
tough to kind of let that one go. Say you
do wasn't tough for us because we we did play
(30:22):
that song and every show and um but at that point, man,
you know, we're just trying to pay the bills and
and we moved here to be songwriters anyway, that's what
we wanted, so um So it was awesome and and
he did an incredible job. There was a moment where
I was going to sing background vocals on it, but
it didn't pan out. Um, man, it was just an
exhilarating feeling to hear that song and watch that song
(30:46):
climb to get your first number one. Amazing. This chainsaw
from the Bam Perry wrote this one. Yeah, here's the
was it written as aggressive? It's way more aggressive. Our
version is way more aggressive. This one is the light
version of it. So my dad actually, my dad actually
(31:08):
made a comment one time about He was like, man,
your version is like, you know, I can kind of
picture you out in the woods, like with like frozen
snot in your beard, cutting down the tree. It's definitely
a lot more aggressive our version. Before we get over
to the old dominion stuff. Ecstasy from Sam Hunt is probably,
in my opinion, his biggest non single song. It wasn't
a single, but everybody knows it. Um, I wish that
(31:32):
was a single. One to me, I kind of had
to be reminded it wasn't a single. I'm a big
Sam guy. I like Sam away from work, you know, Yeah,
I love Sam at work, you know so, But I
love this song. When he cuts it again, he kind
of though, if I'm not mistaken, this was on the
pre Yeah, I think so. Yeah. Um, and Sam wasn't
(31:55):
Sam Hunt, Right, but did you when you guys wrote,
it wasn't written like Wow, this is different, like say
something like new Territory type stuff. I mean we knew
before everyone knew that it was you know, Sam Hunt.
Like writing with that guy, you're like, damn, this guy
is something entirely different. And what means, like just his
(32:15):
creative mind is is he attacks things at different angles.
So the things that come out of his mouth, you're like,
I don't know how you thought of that, but you know,
even like with make You Missed Me, he throws out
a line like to keep a slip knot and the
strings you attached like something some obscure thought like that,
he can make seem very palatable. So just writing with him,
(32:41):
that was a moment where you knew something was big
was going to happen. So that song, it's funny like
he he overthinks a lot of things and to you know,
to his credit, it works, you know, but he, like
most people, you sit in the room and you write
and at the end of the day you got the song.
You can write for weeks and weeks and weeks on
the same song with Sam, So that's what happened. I
(33:03):
never really knew the final version of Ecstasy until it
came out, Like I knew what I thought it was
gonna Were the other little changes that you heard in
it that you're like, well, I don't remember that at all. Yeah, yeah,
thats all like talking part at the end that there's
like a whole like kind of down bridge where he's
kind of talking and you look kind of cute and
all this stuff. I didn't remember any of that stuff,
(33:23):
But I mean it's amazing. Were you surprised to see
the explosion of him? Yeah, No, I mean I'm excited.
I mean, I'm supposed to thee any explosion of anybody,
right because it's always so unpredictable of who it's gonna be,
when it's gonna be, on why it's gonna be yea,
And with Sam, it hits so hard, so fast, And
I feel like Sam is the most reluctant superstar that
(33:46):
I know, And when people are kind of bagging on him,
I'm like, well, first of all, he's way smarter, way
more talented than you, and he doesn't because he loves
to be an artist, but he didn't want to be be
the guy out and people forget because everything now sounds
like m hunt, so it didn't. Then he changed it
and everything on country radio. Half of it is just
watered down Sam months Kenny save it for rainy Day.
(34:10):
I have this hook up here. When you write a
song like this, how quickly do you send it to Kenney?
This one you never like, I didn't know Kenny at
that point, and you never ever right aiming at a
certain artist. But this song has the like quickest journey ever,
(34:32):
but a huge journey. But we used to write. Brad
and I and our late friend Andrew Doff used to
write every morning at nine in the not every morning
every week at nine in the morning, so we would
have double booked ourselves. We would write from nine to
eleven and then we would go to our normal right,
So that morning I didn't have any ideas, but in
(34:54):
the shower on the way or getting ready to go there,
that kind of course popped into my head. So I
showed up and I was like, Hey, what about this?
And they were like yeah, And we wrote that song
in forty five minutes. And at that time, Brad was
making a little home demos and I kept kind of
egging him on, like, dude, you gotta make a demo,
and I was joking. I was like, man, you want
(35:16):
to Kenny Tesney cut or not, like make the demo.
So he was like okay, okay, and he made the
demo and um, sure enough, like we got it right
to him and he picked it up like it was.
It never happens like that, but that's the only time
that's ever happened is And then he went and recorded
it and the studio musicians told us they only did
(35:36):
one take of it. They played it and they were
moved on, so they thought, no way that's ever making it.
So we wrote it in forty five minutes. They did
one take of the recording session, and then it becomes
a three week number one songs. Pretty crazy, When did
your mindset change? And Okay, I'm an artist and I'm
you're always a songwriter. Yeah, but now like I'm the
(35:58):
guy and we're the guy. Is where we're looking out
for us first, because if we don't, nobody else is
going to Yeah what No. I think it was hard
man to even throw throughout the whole first album, which
was you know, two thousand, fourteen fifteen ish. Um, it
was hard for us to turn that songwriter switch off
(36:19):
and hold on to even song for another time, we
pitched two, We pitched at to Kenny Like at that
point we were still trying to We didn't know if
it was gonna work, but we knew we were successful songwriters.
So I mean, honestly, probably for me, not until the
last album with like Maga Sweet and One Man Band.
All that stuff was when I finally felt like we
(36:41):
as a band were confident in ourselves and we're able to, like,
you know, kind of live in our own skin. How
do you form a band five people? Right? How do
you form a band? I know how to form a band,
but how do you form the band when you've been
in town a long time? All you guys weren't righting.
It didn't seem like when I look back at the oh,
but I mean so with you know, when and I
(37:03):
went to middle school together and we're in competing drum
lines together, and then he was in a band with
Um Jeff all through college, and and Brad was at
the same college. They were all taking classes together and
playing music together, and Um and then I was going
and opening for their band. We just this is just
my guys that I've known for forever, since we were kids. So, uh,
(37:27):
those are the people that I always played music with,
so it wasn't very hard to like. We moved down
to Nashville sort of one by one. They were still
in a band. I was calling them trying to get
them to move down here because I was such a
fan of them. I knew they could come down here
and crush it. Then they broke up, moved down one
by one, and the other members of that band did
to their One of them in Taylor Swists Band, Um,
(37:50):
one of them. Um. There's another guy in Taylor Swiss
Band from the same group. Um, and one of them
plays on every country, he plays on all Sam stuff.
He plays along Dustin Lynch's music. And so everyone just
moved down there. I was right, they were super successful.
But you know, when I'm looking for someone to come
and play the songs I'm writing, I'm gonna call my
buddies that I've always played music with. And I guess
(38:11):
that was my question. You know, do you come to Nashville,
the Land of the Giants, and cherry picked the giants
or do what you did? You grabbed your guys who
were also really great, but they were your guys. Yeah,
I mean, at that point, you don't have access to
the giants. You can't cherry picked them because the people
at the top are cherry picking them. So you gotta
make do you know, you gotta you gotta call your
(38:32):
buddies that will play for nothing because you can't give
them any money. So you know, you just kind of
roll with what you got. All five of you, guys,
were you in the all five of you in the
official like start of Old Dominion? Brad was not the
guy was mentioning his name is Devin Malone, who played
the studio musician here in town, was at the time
(38:53):
the original guitar player. And then, um, you know, at
that point we weren't making any money and but we
were touring like we were, you know, we were just
losing our assets. But um, and he started to be
asked to play on the road and in the studio
with some other artists, news paying his bills, and you know,
(39:14):
it's to the point where he couldn't make a bunch
of Brad started subbing for him a bunch. So the
time came where it was like, hey, man, are you
are you into this or not? And he was like,
I don't think I can do it, man. So so
he left and Brad was the was the guy. Was
Brad already making money as a songwriter? No, it was
too early on that that front for him too. Yeah, yeah,
(39:36):
he was just he was just starting to get into
the songwriting world and kind of make some noise. How
do you guys talk. It's so it's you're like the
elite songwriters out of old dominion. Let's just remove the
band old dominion, Like you legitimately have elite songwriters in
your band yourself that that didn't get together because of
(39:57):
your elite songwriting success. No, but you know, I mean
Trevor and I got together because of songwriting, not because
of the success, but but because he and I hit
it off as as co writers and friends. So we
had we knew we had something um and then we
just kind of built it from there. Same thing with Brad.
(40:18):
You know, Brad, we had a we had a sort
of friendship. We knew him, but we also knew was
extremely talented. But then we write with him and we're like,
this guy's kind of got the same thing that we have. So,
you know, it's just about finding your people and luckily
that our people are our friends. Are you able to
switch off front man of a I mean of my
(40:40):
favorite band of probably the biggest band in country music
right now. Are you able to switch that to dad
husband like that? No, No, it's it's been. Um. You know,
that's hard. That's that's been you know, quite honestly, um,
a challenge. So it's it takes some therapy, some work
(41:00):
to figure that out. I wasn't like I was kind
of stupid, um thinking about working on this the whole time.
I never thought about being like famous or like a
rock star or anything. I always thought about songs and
music and and and that being known. But I didn't
think about people wanting to know about me, and that
(41:23):
freaked me out, honestly. So kind of the beginning of it,
the first few years, it's kind of a mess of
trying to figure out how to handle that. Do you
like that part of it? Do you like being the
(41:43):
lead singer of Old Dominion? I have learned to. I
didn't at first, but I do not. I've I've been
able to kind of switch it in my brain and
realize that that I'm kind of in the service industry now,
you know, like, it's not it's not about me, it's
(42:04):
about serving other people. I can, I can visibly see
what we are doing is affecting and helping other people.
So in when I can remember that, I absolutely love it.
Like it's there's nothing better than going out there realizing
that something you created from an emotion or or just
(42:26):
a grouping of words, it has a really big effect
on people. Then by all means I would not want
to be doing anything else. Can you guys do five
tour buses for all five members? We cannot. That's expensive.
But you got And I asked that now because again
in the last pandemic years weird to quantify. But like
(42:51):
you guys have you're the elite now right. You also
became very elite at a time when there was no
money going around to which is which is an odd
thing because here you are don anating and you can't
really capitalize on what the success that you've had. So
no five buses yet? What we got three? I mean
we're all in the same bus. So um, okay, we
got listen. I think I'll be your business manager. It's time.
(43:14):
I's time to get another at least another bus. Here.
Our business manager right now is like, what what no
one bus? Please? But I mean we have I think
we're on three buses total with our crew and everything,
but but there's six of us on our bus, and
so it's the five of us and our tour manager.
It is a weird dynamic. And I'll speak from experience too,
because I've had the guys on my show for the
(43:36):
most part for ten fifteen years. Like I just grabbed
my people that had never done that before and was like,
let's go along for the ride together. Trust me, I
got you, and then at times they've had to have
me too. But there is always weird inner personal dynamics
because everybody's still so different living human lives are growing
up on our show. I mean, we've got people get me,
(43:57):
getting married, if people have an extra kid. You got
with five people, it just like I'm dealing with that
five people. You guys have grown have adulted quite a
bit together. Do you do any sort of therapy as
as a group. We just got asked that, um by
someone else, and no, we we haven't done that. UM.
(44:18):
I mean it would probably be helpful, I think, but
we haven't gotten to the point where I don't think
we need it. Do you vote? We do vote. We
had like right in the beginning, we were sat down
with an attorney and he was like, Okay, we're gonna
come up with the system here of voting, and we
were like, we're never going to need that. And it
was literally like the next week, I want to play
(44:42):
just a clip if I was on a boat that day,
which is number ten right now, is we're recording that
living Son and Wrong. Just at this long of all
the old Dominion songs, seems, I won't say the most
(45:05):
fun has maybe the most love. There's a different feel
to it. You have other fun songs, but this one
feels purposefully a little more like, hey, we're just putting
out a song to freaking have fun, like a little
goofy even exactly what it is, Yeah, is that is
does that happen in conversation? Like you, guys, we've done
the deep songs we've done, why don't we just put
(45:25):
one out that makes us go a screw it, man,
We're just have fun. Well, I think we weren't thinking
about that when we were writing it, but once we
had written it, it felt that for that reason, it
was like, you know, coming out of pandemic and all
this stuff, it was just like, man, let's just let's
just not even worry about let's just put a fun
song out. Let's and in the groove, you know that shuffle.
(45:46):
It doesn't matter people dance if they don't know what,
they dance to that beat, no matter what song it is.
So it just felt like, man, we had so much
fun recording that song. Let's just keep that party going
because you know, there's no needs. We pride ourselves on
the happy sad mix. Easier to do a song like
that when you have the cred of success of really deep,
(46:09):
substitantive songs. Yeah, you know, as if you're putting out
a bunch of songs like that, people are like, well,
they're the goofy band. But no one's gonna take you
for the goofy band, right, But we are, you know,
inherently goofy. People like, we're goofy friends with each other
and we laugh constantly all day long. So that is
a big part of us. So you know, it's it's
(46:29):
I'm glad it's finally showing a new album on the
eighth of next What number we are in? We're nine?
We're nine now, I guess the Pandemics also eliminated in
the ability to know it's number month. It's impossible. October
would be October October eight time Tequila and Therapy. Why
(46:51):
that title? I'm sure you guys kind of mess around
with a few different titles. Why why those words? Yeah,
well those are lyrics from one of the songs. UM
and we've you know, bounced around a bunch of different
titles for a long time, and finally that came out,
and what it did, It's the first time we all
five went immediately went that's it, you know, And I
(47:15):
think because you know that is man, that's that's old
dominion in a nutshell right there. We've been together for
so long, there's so much time in history behind us.
And you know, tequila is a is a big part
of our you know, pre show ritual, and you know
we work with the tequila company, and you know that's
(47:36):
just kind of part of our culture. And um, and
the therapy has been a lot of therapy in the past,
you know, a couple of years between me and a
couple other members, and and we're learning a lot about
ourselves and and you know, music itself is therapeutic, and
UM it just seemed like the perfect snapshot of of
what this whole album is. Did you ever have the fear,
(47:58):
because I did and struggle with it for a while.
Going to therapy was going to make you have less
of an edge, And I don't mean edges like a
bad boy, but I mean edge and creatively. I think
that thought crossed my mind some. Yeah. I learned pretty
quickly that whatever you know, I don't say demons or
(48:19):
darkness or whatever, whatever you're carrying around therapy isn't gonna
make go away. So I'm always going to have that stuff.
I just maybe have the tools to deal with it
a little bit better so I can go back there
and access that all I want. As far as creativity goes,
(48:39):
it's always going to be there, whether I wanted to
or not. I don't want it to be there, but
you know, I would trade all of that going away
for you know, I'm already successful, so I can say
that I'll lend on this. And being a Tory musician
is exhausting. Are you writing anything that's not maybe for
(49:01):
you guys? Yeah, um, you will just write and go
maybe we'll send this off. Yeah, I mean we do
that all the time. I mean, Brad just got he's
got the new um Keith Urvan Wild hearts with with
Eric Pasling. Um, yeah, and I think we hold onto
him for a little longer. But for the most part,
(49:25):
the chances even still of getting a song recorded by
another artist are so slim, even even with our success.
It's gotta all the stars have to line up perfectly,
and so at this point we're just kind of like, yeah,
send it to him if if they if they like it,
great chances are there not going to and then it's
(49:45):
still ours. So the question that I would have then
is if you're writing for the sake of writing, I
would think artists would go, well, if I doesn't want
to cut it because I didn't think it's good enough
for him, probably, yeah, I mean, and that's all we
ever do is right for the sake of writing. We
(50:06):
don't try to write an Old Dominion song even we
just write. But yeah, I think that probably is happening
some you know, I think, Um, you know, there's been
some talk about maybe recording demos without my vocal on
them so that people don't hear it as Old Dominion,
you know. Yeah. I have a buddy who writes in
(50:27):
a different name at times for similar reason. Yeah, He's like,
I don't want people to think that I'm only writing
and not cutting them because I think they suck or
not good enough for me, right, And it's just it's
just about whether or not it's right or not, you know.
I mean, it's not like you're gonna pitch a song
you don't believe in. Like I have plenty of bad
(50:48):
songs that I would never let anyone here. So if
they're hearing the song, I believe in it, and I
would cut it if it was the right song to cut.
So maybe it is for for the other artists. I
think we're gonna we're gonna end it there and listen,
I was on about the day is gonna be a
number one soon. I don't even I don't even need
to promote anything, like you've been generous with even coming here,
(51:08):
because you need no promotion. You guys just walk in.
It's turnkey. You got hit after hit. I think I
don't speaking candidly. I don't even like albums anymore. I
don't have the patience for them. And I know that's
that's not the comfortable thing to say in an artist
community where people are still fighting. But I don't feel
like i'm I'm I feel like I'm gonna not get
(51:30):
to experience certain songs because I don't have patience for them,
and so I feel like I lose if somebody puts
out an album. I'm getting to a compliment. Don't worry.
I'm with you. I feel like I lose when someone
puts out thirteen songs because I don't invest enough time
that as much time as I should in all thirteen songs.
You're you're most people. I go through a couple of times,
(51:51):
and the ones I like a swipe over and save,
swipe save um, and I'm not it's not fair because
I would like to give it all the songs time. Yeah,
that being here, there's a compliment sory, like when you
guys put out an album, it's every every track, thank you,
and I don't. I don't say that to anybody. May
I would say that to Mayor. But then Mayor started
(52:11):
doing smaller practice, right, and we talked about that we
were gonna kind of split this up. I think what
the plan is for us instead is we write so much,
we're just gonna keep recording and make another one pretty quick,
I think. But I think you know, most people are
like that. We just we like the music. We're just
gonna put it out. We have fans that will listen
(52:33):
to it and some people won't. We'll have, you know,
we'll have a few singles that people know, and that's great.
That's the same as any other album. You know, So
do a concept album. That's what I want from all
the concept. I don't even know what the concept was,
you know, I don't know what the concept is. But
nineteen twenties, that's where we need to bring wit in all.
That's when his mind would would be that he would
(52:55):
set the concept like a cool old Dominion concept album
about eight try so you tell me a story. It's
the wall. I just like one day. That's like the
announcement is all Dominions doing. It's it's about dinosaurs. What dinosaurs?
I'm here for this, Okay, listen, Hey, thank you very much.
I appreciate you coming vibe. I know, um you're doing
a lot so to spend a little time here. We
(53:16):
appreciate it. You guys can follow all Dominion music on
Instagram or empt Ramsey. Um. That's that's that's Matt's private account,
all right, I guess not private public but account yea
which everyone Yeah, yeah, the private private account. The only
I have. That's the other metory, all right, thanks Matt,
Host
Bobby Bones
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