#343 - Kane Brown’s Manager Martha Earls on How He Was Discovered + Overcoming People Who Refused to Play His Music + How An Artist Gets A Manager and What the Job Entails

Martha Earls has been Kane Brown’s manager since he was just an artist posting covers on Facebook. This was long before signing his first record deal. In addition to Kane Brown she also works with Restless Road, Nightly, Dylan Schneider and Feather. Martha talks about how she got started in music as the office receptionist at a publishing company in Nashville. She describes the road she took to get to managing her first artist that led her to founding her own management company.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
All right, this is Martha Earls. Uh, just so good
at what she does. She's Kane Brown's manager, amongst other things.
So she is the owner manager of E f G Management,
one or two Entertainment. She works with Kane Brown, Restless Road,
and a list of others. And she's just done so
much that she has moved to Nashville. I mean, she's

(00:24):
now somebody who others look at as an innovator. And
I think at the time, at least my perspective is
when she started, especially with Kane, people were like, well,
what's going on here? And then now they're like, oh, well,
we see what's going on there. She's smarter than most folks.
So just like to bring in people who were changing
how business is done here in Nashville. And we talked
about music. We talked about how she went from working

(00:46):
as a receptionist all the way to you know what
she's doing now with multiple artists including Kane Brown, like
Massive Massive Massive've just super lucky to get her on
this and maybe you guys like myself, because I did
learn learn something here, Mike, any notes from this you
remember here? I did learn something from her. She said
something interesting about work life balance that I took away
from this. Yeah, I think I took it away too,

(01:07):
but then I forgot while working too much. Yeah, but
I remember her talking about when she maybe it's when
she was with people she is focused, something like that. Yeah,
be where you are. She says it better than we
do because we get here. Is Martha Earls Kine Brown's manager,
but she's so much more. I'm really proud to present

(01:27):
this one to you, and I hope you like it.
Thank you enjoy Episode three forty three. So did you
watch the Grammys last night? You know, I watched a
little bit of the Grammy's last night. I'm always curious
with you know, people like yourself who you know, you
have a different perspective than I do. Who has a
different perspective? You know, it just depends where you are
on kind of the spectrum here, Like when you watch

(01:47):
the Grammys, I just wonder, has Haskin never been nominated? Okay,
and that's gonna be something else. I'm gonna get to
where I feel like Kine is the most underappreciated massive
artist have and I mean massive in an apple in
the truth. So I will get to that. But you
watch the Grammys a bit of it, Yeah, much a

(02:09):
bit of it. What do you think when you see
the Grammys like on TV? What's What's what comes to
your mind? I mean, I've seen the Grammys in person,
and I've seen the Grammys on TV, and I try
when I look at it on TV, I try to
think of it like a fan would think. So I
hope they're getting the experience that they want. Um, you know,
and you just know everything that goes into it. And

(02:30):
you know on these TV shows, their their ratings are
unfortunately falling, and so I sometimes watch it thinking are
they doing certain things to try to help their ratings.
It's an interesting ratings question because I have been asked
to host without saying which one is an award show

(02:52):
or two here? And when they say, hey, we're going
to do it like all the other years, it's like, Man,
everything is pointing down because we have more options. We
you know, there's more stimuli everywhere, and so if you're
doing it the same and I'm going to be a

(03:13):
part of it and then it goes down, I'm going
to be blamed for it going down as the hope.
That's That's what I'm feeling, because it's going to go down.
It's going to go down. If it's flat, that's a
huge victory. Yes, So my approach has been, let's do
some things that are a bit different, and I understand
when they go well, if we do it different, it

(03:33):
hasn't been tested, has been researched, and it could really
bomb out. And in my mind, we're either going to
bomb or we're gonna do worse. And I would rather
bomb with the chance of crushing, just generally from my career,
and I guess that's what I'm getting to here is
I would rather take a swing so hard that I
may miss seven times in a row. And you know what,

(03:55):
I'm okay because that's one with my gut as hard
as I could, you have to. And it feels a
bit like that's a bit what your methodology is in general. Yes,
was did all of that kind of make sense together
that I'm tied all together into how I I see
you as a visionary? Well, I appreciate that. That's very nice. Um, yes, no,

(04:18):
but you're accurate. I mean, that's completely accurate. I don't
think I don't like to play small, but I also
am so drawn to things. I like things that can
move and shape and shift culture like that's that is
my personal mission statement. That is what I love. That's
what I get so excited about. And so when you

(04:38):
have anything that's going to affect culture, a a lot
of people are not going to like it, and they're
not supposed to. Great makes people uncomfortable. People don't like change.
Growth hurts, and physically and creatively growth growth hurts. No,
it's true, but then you wind up in a better place.
But um, yeah, so to me, because that's what I'm
drawn to. Then naturally, of course there is you're taking

(05:01):
big chances. You you know, I said this the other day.
You can't be afraid to fail. People are so afraid
to fail, and I think in the social media era
they're even more afraid to fail because now everybody's watching
them fail. You don't. You can't do fail quietly anymore,
and so you have to just not worry about that,
not be afraid. My my last book is called fail

(05:22):
until you Don't and it's basically that. And what I
did was not only that write my thoughts on it. Um,
I grabbed my most successful friends and had them not
talk about success. But they're big fat failures. Yes, And
so I had the governor of Arkansas. I had Stapleton,
I had at the time songwriter that hadn't had any
songs on the radio, but was plugging away and he

(05:43):
had lots of failure. Walker Hayes, Yes and so and
and his thing was he just did it. Even then
when he wrote this on a book, what he did
was different and it wasn't catching, and it what but
he wasn't going to stop doing it. And it's as
such a testament to just what you said are if
you're trying to change a culture, a lot of people
aren't gonna like it because a lot of people just

(06:04):
living in that culture where they think they're happy, right,
there's even know happy they can be well, they're comfortable.
There's a difference right between happiness and comfortable. And I like,
I also personally am very um driven by like becoming
your best version of yourself, not just me but those
around me, probably to an annoying point. And so I

(06:27):
also think if you're comfortable, then are you You're not growing,
Thus you're not becoming the best version of yourself, you're
not evolving. But a lot of people, i'd say fifty
people would rather sit in comfort, even if they know
it's not the right situation, then feel the pain of change.
When you said that people don't want to fail now

(06:49):
because everything is so public, you're absolutely right. But the
thing is, if we think about our failures, and we
think about, for me, the times that I've either I
don't I mean, I do so much radio, I don't
think about failure there because it's just hours, so I'm
gonna take that out. But like when I'm on live television,
if I'm doing American Idol or or presenting in an
award show, there have been times that I'm screwed up

(07:10):
pretty bad. Nobody remembers it, remember it. We remember it
because it's us. So therefore we feel like, well, since
we remember it, everybody else must remember it too. Know
they're remembering their own stuff, that's right, they don't. It's
like the thing about like when you go to the
beach and you're worried about how you look, and then
it's like, don't be worried, because everybody else is worried
about how they look. Like that's life, and if we

(07:31):
could just assign that too, if we gave ourselves the
grace to realize that people aren't really keeping trying. They
don't have a no pad of all of our failures.
They don't care. They're But that's ego, though, because our
ego thinks people care, right. And Nikki, one of the
people that works with me, she got tattooed on her
arm kill your Ego and huge letters on her arm
to remind her, like, don't worry about what other people think,

(07:54):
because that's just feeding your egos. Set your ego aside,
and just be driven by purpose and you'll be fine.
So I was watching the Grammys. Another takeaway I had
was I and maybe it's because I'm getting older, but
I don't think that's it. I just don't like celebrities anymore.
I don't that's troublesome for your line of work. Well, no,
because I am not a celebrity, and I don't like

(08:17):
the artists who present themselves as untouchable at and I
think the consumers are annoyed by untouchable celebrities as well.
And that's that's really the feeling that I got when
even watching clips of it, was You're not better than us,
And I feel like that is that's one of the
last pieces of culture with Hollywood and a little bit

(08:40):
of Nashville that hasn't been broken down yet where I
think it's just lagging. I get annoyed with really famous
people who know they're really famous and actually famous Sue
and I. But I think that's where Kane has been
able to thrive. Yeah. No, he's he is who he is,
that's all I mean. He is the person that you
see on social media, on television or he's painfully honest,

(09:02):
and I appreciate that about him, and it's the new
generation like Luke Holmbs is the same way, completely true.
When Luke got a new role x, he was like, listen,
I don't buy a role I didn't used to buy
role xes, but now like I've made money and I
bought my first one. And he told the story and
you're like, hey, listen. I think some artists who have
fort ye roll xes wouldn't admit to anything like that

(09:22):
because they don't want to be something that they think
they shouldn't be, when in reality, we just want to
feel like it's a real person. Yes, and I think
Kane has done an excellent job there. I'm sure a
lot with your guidance, but it's a lot of who
he is too, of low to high however, you want
to define that he's just remained the same person even

(09:43):
though the circumstances have been changing around him. Yeah, well
he's he's also vulnerable, confidently vulnerable, if that makes sense.
And I think that's critical too. He'll admit when he
doesn't know something. I've seen him minute interview and he'll
just look at the person asking him some sort of question, know, say,
I don't know what that word means that you just used.
You know, Like, he just is very confident and comfortable

(10:06):
in who he is. And I think that then you
don't have to front, and you don't have to put
on a persona that people think, like you were saying,
is disingenuous. I feel like, and then I want to
get to your origin. But I feel like I am
not smart enough to lie and keep up a front,
because I would just forget. I would just forget. And

(10:27):
I think that's a bit why now. And I also
understand that people can be rubbed the wrong way by
me quite frequently, because I do push against culture a lot,
and I do have opinions, and I'm also hardheaded right,
and I think a lot of times when the ven
diagram happens to all the way overlap and you get
all of them. I like, I understand it, but it's

(10:48):
hard for me to be something i'm not just because
I can't remember, well, I can't remember the lies I've
told it. It's exhausting, Right, You're exhausting, and your energy
is going more into being a person you aren't then
to being the person you are, and that I think
would be very tiring. So when you moved to Nashville, Oh,

(11:09):
apparently were being raided right now by law enforcement. Yeah right,
that's actually my entourage. They're coming right now. They're late. Yeah,
that's that's a bad that's a bad place. Escort, the
one that follows you here. You grew up in Pennsylvania,
Central Pennsylvania. Yes, Like, well, what was hometown? Like small
town every town in America, you know, fly over state town. Um, yeah,

(11:29):
it's weird. The neighborhood I live in now in Nashville
is larger than my entire hometown. It's really strange. Um.
And I didn't know about the music industry, of course,
but um, but you know, my parents were, especially my dad,
really into traveling. Travel Like they love travel. They love
to take his places and see things and not like

(11:50):
the beach. I never went to the beach. I never
went to the beach until it was I think one
years old. But we went to England, you know, we
went to you know what, weird Scotland places like that,
and so I always was interested in the world and
a larger world view. So when I left, you know,
it was no I mean, I knew I was going
to leave. I knew I was going to live there,

(12:10):
So it wasn't a big It's obviously a jump, but
it wasn't a big jump that you had never imagined
when you left. It was the only thing I could
imagine was was being on my own. I mean, I
was seventeen and I went to college. I went to
college in New Jersey for a year and a half
before I moved down to Nashville, And uh, yeah, it
was just the most natural transition for me. Why did
your parents travel so much? Who which one? And what

(12:32):
was why? What? I think it was? I mean it
was my dad. I think, you know, they're both my
parents are really intelligent, curious people, and I think they
just wanted to see the world as I do. I
love traveling. I love it. Yeah, I perk, yes, until
you do it all the time, like I'm so torn
on it now. I never travel I mean I never
left my state until I don't know, teenage, like late teenager.

(12:55):
But then you're like, I can't wait to travel on that.
So I started to go places even by myself that
I had seen television. Japan because the Full House Jessie
and the Rippers was there. Um, Hawaii because of the
Brady Bunch. So I didn't know anybody that drump from
a really small town in Arkansas and nobody traveled, but
I just knew places from television. I went to London

(13:15):
because Friends was went to London. So that's how I
made my first grid of where to travel. And so
traveled and then started touring doing stand up and doing
and I was like, god, Dan, I never want to
go anywhere again. Yeah, that's a grind, and it's a
it's a I'm pulled back and forth because I like it,
and then you get exhausted of it, and then you
really just want to pick your places? Do you do

(13:35):
that now? Where you have to travel a bit? The
last few years obviously have been different with the pandemic.
I've traveled more though, um since Kane went and and
Restless Roads is on that tour, was on that tour.
I've traveled more for that tour than any time before because, yeah,
pandemic hit, right, we were traveling and whatever. And then

(13:56):
when we got back out on the road, it just
felt different. Things just felt different and they're Unfortunately, we
thought we would get back out on the road in
September of twenty one and it would be like all
just like butterflies and popping bottles of champagne and pats
on the back, and instead it was just this like
specter of this When is the other shoe gonna drop?

(14:17):
When is this all going to go away again? And
that's a heavy feeling, right, And so we found like
I found like I needed to be out there every
single weekend. And so instead of in the past maybe
I would go to two shows a month, I was
now going. Now I'm going at eight ten. Just the
way it goes. You go to school for a year
and a half, did you drop out? No? I transferred.

(14:39):
I I this is I've told this story before. It's
fun I've okay, so I treat me as somebody new.
It's kind of embarrassing. Everybody thinks it's funny, but so
I went to I was good. I liked and call
or in when I was young. In high school, I
like track and field running, and I was good at

(15:00):
playing the piano, and so I got a better scholarship
for playing the piano. So I went to this music
school in New Jersey and it was a classical music
school where I had, you know, got a piano whatever scholarship,
and so um, you had to declare your major. And
I didn't want to be a piano player. I didn't
think that like, and I didn't want to be a
music educator because those people are like the bottom of

(15:20):
the barrel abused. You know, in an elementary school or
a high school, the music teacher gets picked on the most.
So um, you had to declare a major. And I
was like looking at the options and they were pretty
limited in school's smallest three hundred fifty people. And I
was like, what job works two days a week and
gets a full time salary church organist? So my major

(15:43):
in college and seventeen pipe organ major? Right, And so
I was a pipe organ major. And after like two months,
I was like, oh my god, what am I doing? What? What? Like?
What am I doing? This is insanity and so um,
I started trying to figure out, like where, what what
I could possibly do? And of the girls who was there,
who was graduating, she's going to n y U to
be in an entertainment attorney. She's going to law school.

(16:05):
And I was like, oh wow, I didn't know that
you could be in the music business. That's amazing. And
so I just got online and learned about the music
business and how do you go to college for the
music business? And I ended up down here. So you
moved from New Jersey to Nashville. This is probably what
I mean. Ish, let's just you know, good enough. So
you moved down and the way I feel, so you

(16:32):
you moved down from New Jersey to Nashville, especially then,
it seems like that would be a little bit of
a culture shock, A little bit. I mean it was, Honestly,
it was more of a culture shock moving from central
Pennsylvania to New Jersey because central small towns are small
towns regardless of where you are north or south of
Dixon line. So moving back down, moving down here, I

(16:53):
felt the energy felt similar, more similar to where I
grew up. But it was just such a big town
even that long twenty plus years ago. Nashville was so big,
and I loved it, and I u I went to
Mt s U. Belmont and Mt. S U were the
two colleges, and Mt. S U just spoke more to me,
and so that's where I went. I graduated. It was
a great experience. Did you live in Nashville or did

(17:15):
you live out your campus? I lived in Murfreesboro. I
did what everybody does. I lived in Murfreesboro, and then
I made that transition into Antioch, and then I made
the transition into town. So what was your first entry
level You're done with school Nashville job? Well, I was
an intern. I interned the summer between my junior and
senior year at Warner Chapel Music Publishing. And I didn't

(17:35):
really know a lot about music publishing and I got
in there and I really liked it because you're on
the ground level of the creative process. But I was
always drawn to the artists and the artist songwriters, not
like I love regular songwriters, but there's something really interesting
to me. So like Jason Aldine and I had talked
about this all the time. He I was the intern,
and he had just gotten his publishing deal and he

(17:57):
was brand new to Nashville, and so every time we
see each other we tell stories like everybody looks at
like we're crazy, but twenty year old stories. And so
watching these artists, it was Jason, it was a little
big town, was signed there. It was watching these people
come up through their careers and write their albums and
develop their art and become artists was really I loved it.

(18:18):
And so they offered me a job. I became the
receptionist and then I went and worked in like the
tape copy room of Warner Chapel and just work my
way up. When you are in this town and you're
working in the industry, but not all the way in
the industry, like your goal is to be but you
are there, like, hey, if you come and do this
and you do well, eventually you can move into this
part of it. Is that kind of a yes, an

(18:38):
unspoken rollers I spoken. It's completely how it works. No,
I mean I I tell everybody, anybody, even now, like
when we hire an intern or something, it's like this
could turn into a job if you do what needs
to be done. It's so hard to find dependable people.
It's so hard to find people that will show up.
And because I've had this experience with I mean, even

(18:59):
Mike over here, he was an intern. Then he got
him an assistant producer job, and I say, he moved
to Nashville and just be my assistant for a minute.
And I swear to God, if you just show up,
got an assistant producer job on the show Answered Phones.
Now he's running the whole thing. But it's really because
he's dependable and trustworthy and everything else was developed out

(19:21):
great smart. I think it's important, but I wouldn't know
that from the entry level stuff that he was doing
it first, he had all the opportunity to prove that,
like he's not even here, right, and he's and the
fact that he's this elevated is because he's really quite brilliant.
But early on, I don't need you to be that smart.
I just need you to color in the circles. And
if you do that wonderfully, Holy crap. Now you need

(19:43):
the opportunity to do this and then you start to expand.
And that's just been the problem that I have had
with hiring people in the last three or four years,
is they just want to come and do it all immediately, right,
and it's we're not we're not looking for that quite yet.
You're gonna have a time to shine. But if you
show up on time the good attitude and a good
worth work ethic, you can do anything in the whole world.

(20:03):
You can do anything. Somebody put it best where they said,
to do what I'm doing, you have to do what
I did, And I think sometimes people forget that and
there they just say, well, I want to do what
you're doing, and then you have to do what I did.
Because that all of my experience, I have no regrets.
All of my experience, job experience has led me and
given me the tools to do what I do now.

(20:24):
And if I had just jumped to the front of
the line, you know, I wouldn't have gotten that. I
wouldn't be where I am, wouldn't be able to do
this job. Did you feel working and publishing, especially early
on with your music background. A lot of folks have
a music background here in some way that you could
like to hear a song and like here the hook

(20:44):
and be pretty good to going hey to priack a song.
Did you have that talent? Yeah, I mean I think so.
I don't um, yeah, I think so. I mean, I
think I know what I like, I think I have
pretty down the middle of the road and musical taste. UM.
But I also think I learned in publishing that, um

(21:05):
that everybody likes different things, and not everybody's gonna like
every single song. I don't like every single song that's
on the radio right now, but somebody else likes that
song too. So I think you also, publishing was a
great way to learn to sort of get over maybe
your own personal preference and just kind of think about
is there some is this going to reach somebody somewhere
out there? What was your first big uh to scale

(21:28):
because obviously we're you're pretty new success that allowed you
more opportunities over there at the publishing company. UM, I
think my first UH. I think getting to work with
Little Big Town was a big deal. And what do that?
What do you mean getting to work with so they
so they signed them to they signed them as songwriters
and they said, okay, Martha, you're gonna work with a
little Big Town. And so it's basically you get they'll

(21:49):
send you their new songs, or they'll allow you to
set up a co write or you know, sitting on
a song meeting or something like that. I think that
was great. I think I did work with some really
great songwriters back in the day. That one I remember. Actually,
I'll tell you one thing that for me from a
career perspective, there was a song that Rascal Flast put
out called I'm Moving On. I don't know if you
know that. It's brilliant. It's brilliantly written. And I worked

(22:14):
with I wrapped that writer, and I remember it one
a c M Song of the Year, and that was
back in the day when they allowed the publisher to
come on stage when the songwriter accepted the award, and
so I remember going up on stage and I was like,
it doesn't this is it doesn't get any bigger or
better than this, because in my life at that moment,
it never had, you know, and I can still feel
like talking about it, I still like I feel it.

(22:35):
And so I would say that for me was like
a turning point of going, Okay, wow, I'm I'm I'm
attaching myself to great talent. Did you feel like publishing
was where you were going to live? No? No, I
was no terrible publisher. So then you're working, Are you
just accumulating skills in your mind or are you just

(22:58):
trying to find your next spot. Trying to find your
next spot, right, And that's the thing is you have
to do. I was trying to do do. I mean,
I started my own company. I my own publishing company
with a colleague. We started a second company that became
what's now Big Machine Music. I mean we did like
we did a good job, but I always knew. I
always felt like I was wearing like a shoe that

(23:18):
was like a size too smaller or something. And so
it was the discovery process for me. When you say
you started a company that became Big Machine what publishing publishing?
So okay, so did Big Machine buy? Yeah? So basically,
Mike Milliner, who still works for Big Machine, we started

(23:39):
a company. We had a first company with an investor
sold UM, sold that back to him at the ability
to do a second company. The second company UM we
signed some artists and talent that Scott had signed to
his label as well, and we helped develop them. And
Scott came to us and said, hey, I don't have
anybody developing talent and songwriters like you guys are. I

(24:00):
want to start a publishing wing of Big Machine. Can
I do that with your company that you guys have
And I knew at that point I wanted to get
into management, and I think from Mike Key that really
was an aspiration of his to have the resources to
really they're killing it. He's killing it right now. And
and so here we are. When you want to get

(24:20):
into management at that age, you know, twenties, early thirties,
What does management? What did it mean to you? Then?
Oh my gosh, I had no idea. I mean, it's
really I'm so fortunate because the first artist that I
managed was just up and coming, and so he allowed
me to learn alongside him. So I remember, I thought

(24:42):
we had him. He was opening up for Rodney Atkins.
His name is Greg Bates. He doesn't he had won.
He did it for the girl, great songwriter and he
so we So he was opening for Rodney Atkins like
a casino in Bullocks in Mississippi. And I was like,
all right, this, we got a gig. And so I
didn't know, so I thought you had to advance the gig.
And so I don't know why I called the casino.

(25:06):
I should have just called Rodney. Whatever you learned, I
called the casino. And this like Grouchy Man was like
you want to you want to advance the gig and
I was like, yeah, yes I do. And he was like, okay,
well all right, what do you need? And I was like,
I have no idea and he goes, okay, how many
d eyes do you need? I don't know what a
d I is, he was like, and then he just

(25:26):
starts laughing. And so then he just starts telling me,
is your guy playing a guitar? Yes, okay, you need
a d I because he's going to plug his guitar
and is he singing? And I said, yes, okay, you
need a microphone? Is he bringing anyone else? No? Okay,
you just advance your first show. And I was like,
all right, that's crazy. And so I guess you go

(25:46):
to your first show? Yeah, we go. We drove down there.
I had a I had a red um Folkswagen Jetta
and drove although it's a long long drive to Biloxi
because it's water the water way down there. Yeah. Yeah,
So are you finished your first show? Is it? Like?
Is it a high? Is it your first amazing? You're like,
we just did it, our first show. I just got
me and you know what a yeah? I mean it wasn't.

(26:07):
I mean, if you do the math it's not. It wasn't.
I spent more in gas, but that's okay. So what
did you learn from your time with Greg? If I
were to say you get one lesson to share with
the world about your time with Gregg as a manager,
would you learn? I would say that I learned that. God,
that's a great question. I would say during my time

(26:28):
with him, I learned how to be confident in being
a manager and be confident in asking questions and saying
I don't know, but I'm going to go figure it out.
I'm gonna go find out. I'm going to go I'm
going to admit that I don't know the answer to
something because you were inexperienced. I'm assuming there was a
fear in admitting you were in experience because the people

(26:48):
would think of you as an experience. Yeah, I mean
there was there was some of that, But you know,
I did I did ask a lot of questions, and
a lot of people helped me. You know a lot
of people. His booking agent, Mark Dennis, who works at
c A. He was really helpful um early days, the label,
Jimmy Harnan Scott, they were great. They were very patient
with me. So from Greg then what happens. So, when

(27:12):
I was working at another management company, so I had
we did the big Machine deal, I knew I wanted
to do management full time. I went to work with
a management company and I really learned a ton there.
And that was with UM a manager named Jayson Nowen
who manages Kasey Musgraves and Dana Say and a bunch
of people. And so when I started working there, they
had just launched the Casey album that first, that amazing record. Yeah,

(27:37):
And I remember just observing how they did it, and
it was so different than coming from a big, big
machine where country radio was the that was the biggest promotion,
the way you promoted an artist to more like media
marketing with Casey, it was just fascinating to watch, and
so I was able to learn, Wow, there's different ways

(27:57):
that you can reach people, and that I think is
something it I've applied even now with Kine. We have
to reach people in different ways because not everybody is
paying attention to a New York Times article, but also
not everybody is listening to radio all the time either.
So working with Jason, what was your job there? Was
it to help on a bunch of artists? Did you
have your own artists, your day to day on line.

(28:18):
So I had I was a day to day because
I brought Greg with me, and I was a day
to day. And then Jason was uh that his company
was going through and I don't want to say too
much of his business, but it was going through a
transitional periods, so I wasn't able to really sign anything.
And then um, so then I left because I was
bored and I wanted to work on more projects, and

(28:39):
so I left, and uh, that would have been in January.
I left and kind of said, I'm going to go
out on my own. I want to sign some more
things because I wasn't really able to do that at Sandbox,
which is his company. And so then I was just
kind of on my own and I signed some arts.
So just was working with some artists and um, and
I said, and this sounds like a very um oprah

(29:01):
thing to say, but in January was like, I'm going
to say yes to everything because because something is out there,
I can feel it. I know there's something coming and
I don't want to miss it because I say no.
So I was approached by a guy named Jay Frank
to be a consultant for his company that he had,
which was an independent record label, and so I said, okay, yeah,

(29:22):
all right, I'll go try this out. Yes, I'll do it.
Meanwhile managing a couple other little acts. And then I
got in there and Jay said, hey, also, we have
this one guy. He's a country guy. We signed. We
saw him online. Um his name is Came Brown. He's
from Chattanooga, Tennessee. And Jay was Jay admitted he said,
I don't really know if I know what to do
with it. And I said, well, let me meet him.
And I met Kane and I said to Ja, I said,

(29:44):
everything else you're working on, like respectfully, this is the thing.
This is the thing. And he was like, okay, alright,
why what struck you in a meeting with well Kane
when the first thing I had with him, he didn't,
you know, Kane's shy. He's very very shy and so
and he's come out of shell quite a bit as
he's gotten older. But he was very shy and didn't
say much. But he just has there is a he

(30:05):
has a charisma to him where when he walks in
the room, like you turn your head, like you know
what I mean, Like he has like almost that like
entered force field energy that like draws you in. And
so I was he's an incredible singer, and I, um,
he's obviously by racial and I was fascinated by um
how he had marketed himself online on Facebook. He marketed himself,

(30:29):
you know, and he was and he understood. He would say,
you know those early videos when he was going viral,
I mean he was. He was growing. He was growing
twenty five thousand followers a day, and we would watch
it because he would post a video and he would say,
I'm going to sing a cover of check Yes or
No by George Strait and most people were like this guy,
you know, because country music didn't look like Came Brown.

(30:52):
And that's part of that's part of the attraction to
me too, is that country music didn't look like Cam
Brown and now it does a little bit more. I
think with you meeting Kane mean I he maybe he didn't,
but he kind of had to say yes to you too.
Or did he just not have any leverage at all?
I was like, I'll take anybody that's smart it knows
what's going on. No, he did. He had another guy
that was working with him at the company, and UM

(31:13):
and so I was always just very like, hey, if
you ever need if you have a question, I can
help you answer it. And then, uh, one day he
sent me a text message. It's like classic Kate. He
sent me a text message and said, hey, do you
want to be my person? And I was like I
paid to the phone called it was like dude, of course, yeah,
I'll be your person. And he's like okay, And then

(31:34):
that was that was kind of that which I asked
that question asking why do you think Kane felt like
you were the right person for him? I think because, um,
even before I was his quote person, I took him
he wanted to hear some songs and he wanted to
meet some songwriters, and I I think he creatively, I

(31:56):
think he knew that I understood like musically where he
wanted to go and and put and introduced him to
some people and and I never asked anything in return
for that. Um. And then I don't know personality wise,
like we like we always just kind of connected. Maybe
he and I have the same birthday. Maybe that's it.

(32:16):
I don't know. How do you do with balance? Balance?
Like well, yeah, no, the work life, bounce, the work
life found the work life balances. Take notes on this
and I struggle with this time. Well, well, somebody's not
gonna like my answer, because the work life balance is

(32:38):
a fool's mission in my opinion. Like you can't, like,
you can't. You can't put that pressure on yourself, right,
you can't put your pressure on yourself. Okay, this week,
I'm gonna do X number of hours with my family,
X number of hours with work. I'm going to turn
off my phone. Like it doesn't work like that. And
I think when you put that pressure on yourself, things

(32:58):
actually become harder. I think what I try to do
and people with you know, probably if you asked my family,
they would, oh, Martha works all the time. Yeah probably okay, fair,
but but I like it. I enjoy it. But um
but I try to be where I am. That's the
whole thing. I try to be where I am. So
if I have two kids, and if I'm with my

(33:19):
kids and we're playing uh, they're like big game players,
you know, they love games and gambling and all that,
which is I love it. So we're in an intensive
Uno game, I am in that Uno game. I'm not.
If I'm at my kids uh soccer game, I'm not
on my phone sending emails. But if I'm at work,
I'm at work. If I'm traveling, I'm traveling. And so
I think that's part of it. Just being being where

(33:39):
you are. I think that's a I think that's a
version of balance, though, being ever present wherever you are.
I mean, I don't know that I've heard a better
definition of balance than where you are. Being where you are.
I struggle with that. I think you know. I've been
married now since July of last year. Otherwise I've been
single my whole life, and I have worked. And one

(34:00):
of the big struggles at the houses as soon as
I wake up, laptop open, either start working on the
show or start writing. And I could literally and I have,
and she's actually just let me know because you should
just watch and like just letting you know. I will
go until it's time to go to sleep and then
write before going to sleep down. And I've just stayed
at it in one version the whole time. And when

(34:20):
I'm not at it, I'm still at it, which I'm
on the phone, which I don't like. That's the old
version of me that was never going to change. I
was never going to grow being that I was going
to be more successful, but as a human being, I
wasn't really growing because I was only working. There was
nothing outside of these blinders except A B, C, D,
E f G. That's all My struggle is being present,

(34:44):
you know. The thing that made me be present most
more than anything is when I had kids. We know
we're talking, we're in when I had kids, and it's
and and and and I will say this. I was
never like a kid's person. I never even really saw
myself as a having kids. The second baby I ever
held in my life was when I had my daughter.

(35:04):
My life, my life, imagine was the other one? No,
I think it was, Yeah, I don't know. I think
it was after I got married and they just assumed like, oh,
you want the baby, and then I think they could
tell but like I was like, it's it going to explode,
Like I don't know, yeah, and then all of a sudden,

(35:26):
like I was so comfortable being a parent. But it
makes it is such a gift, and it makes me
better at my job, and it makes you cut out
the the deadwood, right because there's so much stuff we
have that comes at us. It's just time wasting, you know.
And I and I became more focused and more efficient.

(35:46):
I liked it. You're present, like I think that I
just learned something or that is a new version of balance,
being present and be where you are when you're there. Yeah,
because I still work fourteen hours a day, but I
try to actually have dinner and put my phone away,
try just forty minutes most Yes, on the weekends, I

(36:07):
try to make sure to go we're going to I'm
going to plan this and we're going to do and
it has nothing to do with me writing jokes or work.
And so that has been something that I've been working on.
But I imagine when you start with Kine and you're
kind of starting over in a sense of you got
your guy, now you're together, I get imagine it's the
big snowball is coming at you again. As far as
like we got everything to do now to work on. Yeah,

(36:28):
I mean I let other I let go of other
things or other people, other clients I had fired me.
I remember when person fired me like the night of
the c m A is because I was paying too
much attention to Kine and and and honestly that was
all a gift, right because for the first two two
and a half three years we worked together. It was
all we did. We were so focused. Kine and I

(36:50):
were like laser beam locked in and if something came
at me that didn't have anything to do with what
our mission, I know, I just ignored it. When when
you guys were kind making your early plan was that, hey,
people are going to tell you you don't look like
country music, and here's what we're going to do back
at that, Um, yeah, I mean people, it wasn't even

(37:11):
a well, I didn't even think about, oh, we're going
to retaliate that we're not retaliable, but but it can be.
We're gonna put out great songs over and over again,
keep doing what we're doing right and super serve the
fans and super serve the people that they are there
for you, you know. And that's even the advice now.
It's like even Kane and I talked about it now
where people are so mean on the internet, and it's like,

(37:32):
just lean into the ones that are kind, you know. Yeah,
when whenever I moved here, it was awful. I mean
that the first two and half years were awful for me.
You're awful. I can't imagine. And it wasn't just Nashville
because Nashville kicked the crap out of me for a
long time. But it was, you know, they took us
and put us on all of these country radio stations,
which meant a lot of these stations had radio guys

(37:55):
that were either retiring or they were firing because ratings
weren't good. And so we weren't just feeling it on
a level here at home them, we were getting it
in every single market. So I had to tell my guys, like,
stay off of everything, let me handle it, stay off
of it. But what we're going to do, We're never
going to get those people. They are never they are.
They made a couple of years come back around. But
we got to take our people who are with us

(38:16):
and make sure they know that they are the most
important thing and that's who we're here for. And so
it was a version of that where we just knew
we weren't getting those people who were that were upset
that we existed. Yeah you can't, and that'll that'll exhaust you.
And why not lean into what's working and because eventually
they'll start growing and and for you, for kine, for whoever.

(38:37):
Those then they start out numbering the dissenters and then
all of a sudden they start quieting the dissenters, and
that's where you want to be. And then some of
the dissenters come back around and go, you know what,
I don't really give you a chance at first, but
they don't. They never said they're wrong, by the way,
they never said they were wrong. They're just like, you know,
I hated you at first, and now you know, I'm

(38:57):
sister like you. They won't even say they like us,
but they're like, hey, my sister like Sha, but I
just I know what that feels like to go and
and and not the same way at all because we
do different things. But just have everyone immediately go you're
not us and you don't represent us, when in the
end I represented them more than anything in the past
that had claimed to do so, which was the craziest

(39:19):
thing to me exactly. But you never had that opportunity
to even express that. So when Kane is putting out
the first music as a managed was he signed yet
or did you do that with him? Um? Yeah, it
feels complicated. Yeah, it's complictly Okay, So when you put

(39:41):
you when you put out your first music that you're
going to go to DSPs, digital or radio, like your
first this is our first big release together. Why did
you choose the body of work that you chose? Like,
what was it to you that that said here, this
is our entrance into a big world. Yeah? When he So,

(40:02):
when I first started working with Kane, he had put
some songs out independent, he was in a production deal
and independently had put some songs out and they did
really well. So then when he made his first like
you said, it was an EP, it was a five
or six song EP for Sony, it was um it
was a couple of those songs that he had put out,

(40:23):
you know, they never really been including a collection of work.
And then the other were when came he did really
work on his songwriting. When he came to town, he
really worked on songwriting and found his small group. And
so the others were songs that he had written that
he was proud of. And Kane was touring, he was
selling out. What was crazy is he was selling out
undred two thousand cap rooms without having any product out.

(40:48):
It was wild and so we really couldn't get that
first EP out quick enough. So when you put out
what was the first song, I'm trying to think that
was used to Love You Sober was his first kind
of song. So why that um? That one was a
song that he That was the first song he ever
wrote when he came to Nashville and he put it
on social media and came was one of the first

(41:10):
artists to tease their music in Nashville, at least, I
don't want to outside Nashville. Other people were doing it,
but in Nashville to really tease his music on social media,
and the demand for it was so high that he
put it out. Were you satisfied with the reaction and

(41:30):
also the success of the song because it wasn't a
number one I don't think it was the thirties number seven,
But did you feel like, hey, we got some good
traction here with the first one, or we disappointed him? Well,
we put it out and it at the time, iTunes
was the thing, you know. iTunes really mattered, and it
did really well on iTunes and number one on iTunes.
We're like, oh my gosh, when we put this, take

(41:51):
this to the radio, It's going to be like an
instant hit. And it wasn't. And so that was a
bit of a reality check. And the thing about it
is with Kane was selling all these tickets, and so
we were like, you know what, we're still connecting with
people obviously because they're coming out and seeing the show
and there this song was a gold record and all
of this stuff. So we just you just have to

(42:14):
kind of keep moving, keep working towards something. The second song, UM,
the label chose it was called Thunder in the Rain.
You know, I don't remember that one. I remember that.
I know the first one, Thunder in the Rain was
went to like number forty eight. It was not UM,
not not necessarily the greatest one we had, and so
thunder in the Rain, uh, I remember when that was out.

(42:36):
It was up tempo and it was like, okay, this
is but it's real musically, it wasn't really as much Kine.
It's not like he performs it live every night or whatever.
But UM, by this point he had made a full album,
and so we put out his first full album UM
with a number forty eight song coming off the chart.
Are you guys like it's like two worlds, it's like

(42:57):
one world. You're selling both the tickets and music. Yeah,
because at the time that was the thing. We actually
sold downloads. But then you have I'm assuming these old
school UM gatekeeper radio programmers that just aren't buying it.
I mean, is buying it the term that you would use.

(43:19):
I mean there was I think, you know, and I
would never say who. I don't. I don't even know
if they were still around, but I remember there was
one UM one person at a station, and I didn't
really get in the weeds on that because you know,
the record labels have like whole teams of people that
talked to the radio and stuff. And but somehow, I

(43:39):
don't know, I think because we were doing a show
in the market and I remember I was talking to
this guy and and he uh, I was like, hey, Kane,
sold out the show in your market, and uh, it
would be awesome, like if you could, you know, maybe
like play the song. We'd love to sold out the
show in their market. And you're begging for some little
radio sport. Oh yeah, that happened everywhere. And he and
the guy said, well, we don't. I don't play urban music.

(44:02):
I play country music. And I said, oh, I know,
that's that's wonderful because Cam Brown is a country artist.
And he said, no, he's not, and I said, yes,
he is. It's like this like it was like comic almost,
and yes he is, and he goes, I know he's not.
I just looked at him and I said, okay, well
maybe you should go listen to him. And that was
the end of the conversation and he did not play

(44:24):
the song. I looked at him. I know he's not country.
I looked at him, and I'm assuming again. I'm gonna
do a lot of assuming here that as Kane has again,
and we're going to end this in a little bit
talking about how MASSI if he is yet still under
appreciated that again, how massive he is in places that's
probably still happening in a way, and I think that's

(44:46):
probably why he's not getting the respect he deserves. I think,
do you mean, like for award nominations for everything? You know?
I don't. I don't know. I mean I think sometimes, uh,
I don't know, maybe people put their vote behind what
they see themselves in and maybe they're superficial and don't

(45:11):
see themselves and how somebody looks. Well, then I will
say it. I do think that is a major There's
just no reason that an artist, if you take away
faces and skin color and genitals, let's pull all that off. Okay,
it's the weirdest shape and you just line up body

(45:31):
of work, songs, uh streams, hits, radio, radio, number one concert.
There's no reason that Kane shouldn't be and he is
to people like me and fans, but to the people
that are organizing these higher level awards, there's no reason

(45:54):
he shouldn't be in those conversations, right, So what's the
factor keeps him from being there? If you can answer
that question, I mean, yeah, I don't. I don't know
how to answer that question. Was the question I just did.
What's well? And what's interesting is it's not everywhere, right.
Cane's on the Time one hundred list, the Time one

(46:14):
hundred list when the one hundred most influential people in
the world, because he's changing. He has changed the country
format I think, and perceptions of what is country music,
and so it's not it's not everywhere right. But in
the same respect, to your point, came Brown should be
nominated for CMA Entertainer of the Year and not I'm

(46:36):
glad you said that, and not Male Artist because he
definitely nominated for that too. But that's what I was saying.
He definitely should be. But you're absolutely right. He should be.
He sold out all twenty nine NBA arenas. You know,
he has god billion streams. I don't even know how
many feel like just buying a billboard and going here
are the facts, listen facts, or you could do like

(46:58):
they do sometimes and with sports, like this person has
all these accolades, this person has gone for this many yards,
which one are you taken? And then they don't say
who it is, and then they pop them up and
it's like, oh, I didn't know that Kirk Cousins had
better stats than and you're like, oh, I had no idea.
I've just been led to believe, because I mean I
would I would be going crazy. He's the big He

(47:18):
is the most unappreciated massive artist that I have ever
seen here, right And I and is that a is
how how do you how do you change people's habits?
Because I also think sometimes like with the with voting
for those awards and stuff, people vote out of habit too.
Oh yeah, so and so, and you're like that that

(47:38):
person hasn't put an album out in six years, but
they've won the last six times, so you just kind
of vote for them out of habit. That's happening less
and less. I understand that point, but I don't know
that that's applicable to Kane necessarily. I don't either. I
think that you still have a small selection of folks
that are not going to give Kane his due because

(47:59):
of the same reason the first program director said he
wasn't going to play Kine's urban music. And I believe
that is being shaved down every single day, and that
is being filtered out a little more all the time.
But I would be lying if I didn't say that

(48:19):
it wasn't there. And to be as again, you said
he sold at every NBA arena. He goes to uh
l A. And so when you play the forum, where
do you play Stable Scrypto? Yeah, twice in a year,
two years? Who else can do? Who else can do?
There's a few and they're for Entertainer of the Years. Yeah, no,

(48:39):
it's true. I mean, but what's interesting is if you
look at the fan voted awards, UM, the CMT Awards
always wins, always nominated, always once he hosted them last year. Well,
and I don't want to keep beating this up, but
I just feel like he is vastly um. And I
won't say disrespected, because it's hard to say disrespect when

(49:00):
someone has done so much, but he's done it all,
yet he still hasn't been given what I think is deserved,
maybe underappreciated. Well, I have said like four times already,
and I don't want to keep saying the same word
because we said underproach at nineteen times in the stupid podcast.
There are people to count those things. But yeah, I
just it's just it's amazing for me to see what
you guys have done together, and it is at times

(49:24):
frustrating to see what other people won't allow. And it's
only a very small it's a select group, but that's
a big enough group to actually not allow it to happen. Right,
So does the group need to change? And the group
is changing slowly, But like you said, people don't like
when the cultures being changed on a on a smaller level.

(49:45):
I just have empathy because I've been there and I
know what it's like to win everything and have everything,
and you're still to some people enough people to matter
a joke undeserving in right. So and that's me. I'm
not talking about kin, but I'm sure that it's very

(50:06):
I mean, it's a parallel situation, and I think that you, Um, again,
like you just like trust me, Like anytime those nominations
come out, like it's most people, it's like Christmas morning
and oh my gosh. And for me, it's just like dread.
You know, it's it's and it's um. And Kane's always
gracious and if they invite him to come to the

(50:27):
show and perform, he always comes and and performs and
does all of that and he tries to be very
gracious about it. And I appreciate that and always take
the high road. But do you ever like, dude, you
don't have to do that. Yeah? Sometimes, yeah, my my
people do that to me too. Sometimes We've really been
dicked over a couple of times in a couple of situations,
and like, don't do it? Yeah, why, like they don't
respect to you, why are you going to respect it back? Well,

(50:49):
I just I love what you guys have done and
are doing, and I do feel like you're underappreciate it, Um,
And again, I think you'll be looked up on your it.
You can your team as one of the real game
changers for an entire era of country music that in
the future when it's looked upon it's going to be

(51:09):
normal because you guys have normalized it. Did you know
you actually built the road six ft over to the
left or right? I don't mean left or right, but
you built the road in a new place. And people
are gonna try to that road in the future and
they're not even gonna know and they're just gonna look
at you someone, Wow. Yeah, we're all doing it because,
like Kane, that's what my hope. It's my hope is
that the eight year old doesn't ever know country music

(51:31):
where they don't necessarily see them all types of people represented,
because there are all types of country fans out there.
So what's what's the goal then? Now? Is that when
you and Caine talk about goals, we have, you know,
my little team. We have a meeting at the end
of every year, or mostly the beginning. We're tired at
the end of the year. We always plan at the
end of the year and then we're like, we'll just
catch back up in like mid January. What what do

(51:53):
you talk about this year? Like, what is what's the
goal this year? In the next five years? Yeah, I
mean for Kane, he doesn't like to he would say
this him of if he doesn't like to set goals.
I think it's a lot of pressure for me, Um,
I'm always every success we have. I will say this
for both of us, he and I, we never um
when we do have a big success, we don't really
like revel in it, you know, we don't like can

(52:16):
you enjoy it? Though? I I mean maybe for a
split second. But for me, like any time you have success,
it's simply an opportunity and almost like for me, I
feel an obligation to build and grow the next thing.
So how do we build and grow? Oh you whatever
you host the CMT wars, Okay, how do we build
and grow the next thing or whatever it may be.

(52:36):
So I would say for me, Um, for Kane, those
short term goal next year is I'd like to really
expose the world to him, you know, and we'll do
that through touring, and we'll do that through probably some
other collaborate like musical collaborations. You're now working with Restless Road, Yes,

(52:57):
so what what is that story on you with them? So?
I mean the Restless Road backstories been told a couple
of times, but they know Kane from years ago. And
so when we um For me, when Caine and I
a few years of twenty nineteen pre pandemic, UM I

(53:18):
felt like we were in a good place and I
and I we sat down and we had a meeting
and I asked him, I said, do you want to
be UM like the type of artist who tour six
months out of the year and you know, we had
some hits, unders about some selling records and tickets and
then chills for six months out of the year. Or
do you want to be the type of artists that
is building like businesses, but kind of working all the

(53:39):
time and putting their hand in different things and whatever.
And he was like, I want to take advantage of
this opportunity as much as I possibly can. That's what
I want to do. And I said, okay, then we're
gonna build out some other like verticals or whatever term
you want to use. And so we started to joint
venture label with Sony. We started production company, UM he
started publishing company and Restless Road. We'd signed there the

(54:01):
first stars we signed to our joint venture label. So
we have, yes, we manage them, but we also have
a different type of investment and in them and so
UM my goal is to grow them so that this
can be that they can be. We don't have anything
in the format like them, and I think that they're
incredibly talented and they're good people, so I want them
to be successful for the rest of their lives. What

(54:22):
is your most emotional career moment? Um, my most emotional
career moment? Would you know? I don't want to go
to the negative, right, but like any of those disappointments
like you're talking about, you know, um, oh you're not
nominated for this, You're not nominated for that, you know,
like that stuff, I take it pretty hard because I
take it as a personal failure. You know, I really do.

(54:44):
Like if if Cain Brown is not nominated for a
c M Award, I take it as a personal failure.
And so that's very like emotional, like like oh I
couldn't do enough. Um. But on the positive, I would say,
I would say, on the positive, probably um, Like like
the A m A Awards with Kine were amazing, his
first one where he won three a m as and

(55:05):
got to go up on stage and in front of
his you know, all types of formats of music. That
was a really big deal. And you know, I think
just that our tour, getting back to touring after the
pandemic was very emotional, you know, because it was such
a complex set of emotions. We felt we'll kind of
wrap with this. I mean we've done an hour. I

(55:25):
could do three. Honestly, this you's just been great. Um.
When it comes to new artists and where there are
a lot of new artists that listened to this podcast.
This this podcast was kind of born out of me
talking to songwriters and people to do so much of
the creating, if it's a person in a job like yours,
or a songwriter or a publisher, a producer. Um. And

(55:46):
it's kind of swollen so big that artists commend because
they want to talk about the second layer. So we
have all these new artists that listen to this, going,
all right, how do I go from new, unsigned, unmanaged
to meeting those kinds of people. So all that being said, like,
how does someone get a manager? Yeah, someone that's not

(56:07):
in Nashville, especially right, I think, um, honestly, it's easier now,
believe it or not, than ever before because we have
social media and you have TikTok, and I think the
way you get a manager and the way you get
a team around you is you create a fan base
and you start figuring out how to connect with people
and how to create your little world online. Um, and

(56:32):
that I mean, I think that that's the first step
build your fan base. Well, I'll end it how I started.
I just think you're such a visionary for a lot
of the things that you do that we didn't even
talk about here. I also think Kane is like such
a good dude aside from just the music part of it. Like,
I just love the guy just le mean, yeah, he
is who he is, and it took me a long
time to understand because he didn't talk, and I was

(56:54):
always like, Okay, I don't know if he's a jerk
or if he's shoy. He comes off aloof oh again,
I do too at times if I if I'm not
when I'm on, I'm completely off and people are like why,
guy's a dick, and I'm like, no, no no, no, I
don't want to bother people, so I'm just gonna sit back.
And I think I was like, I don't know if

(57:15):
I like this guy because he doesn't talk. Maybe he
hates me. And then I'm projecting and making assumption and
he's probably jumping the same conclusions. Just so that being said,
I'm the longer I've been here and been able to
spend time alongside him and then even with him, and
you know, I think we have kind of a minor
almost friendship now. It's what a miner almost what I

(57:37):
call it, because he'll text you know, well, he's a
vital in basketball. You know, that's kind of stuff happens.
But it's just like, I just like the guy for
a lot of the things he does that people don't
know about. And I'm not even gonna say some of
the stuff they are now, but he just does a
lot because I think he's been through a lot and
he wants to help people not go through the same

(57:58):
crap that he went through or similar things. Yes, so
I feel like like Nashville got lucky to have them,
and I feel like, and I'm Nashville is the country
music world, and I feel like that that is not
understood yet. I agree with you, and I feel like
Kane got really lucky to have you, and I just

(58:20):
I just love what you guys are doing, so thank
you so much. And I think Mike, I think we
hit an hour here, huh so usually we do ten minutes,
but we didn't. I'm just getting no, we don't a minute,
we don't, we don't. Well, thank you for for coming by,
thank you for having I think I think people will
take a lot from this. And UM, Kane Brown, Restless Road.
Who do you have on your arsenal? Now that's UM.

(58:42):
We just signed a band, a non country band and
all pop sort of since pop band called Nightly that
we're really excited about. UM. And then kind of all
of the nineteen and then UM an artist named Jylan
Schneider who just signed a deal with Broken Boat. All
right there she has, thank you and much salt to

(59:07):
h