April 15, 2021 • 48 mins
Do you have a friend who you think could be a geek, if only you eased them into your fandom the right way? So do we. Join us as we talk about various gateway geek properties, for good, for bad, and for ugly. Including our own. Then stay tuned for a mashup that will have you saying "Oh. My. Trickster. God" *clapclapclapclap*
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
The Large Nerd Drunk Collider Podcast is a production of
My Heart Radio. Hi everybody, Welcome to The Large Nerd
Drunk Collider Podcast, the podcast that's all about the geeky
stuff happening in the world around us and how excited
(00:28):
we are about it. I'm Ariel Casting, and with me,
as always, is Jonathan tech Boy Strickland. Hey there, Ariel,
I got a question for you. You've been cursed. What
classic type of monster do you turn into? I would
(00:51):
turn into a swamp thing. Okay, all right, a swamp thing. No, well,
mermaids not a monster. I could be a side. Now
I want to be a swamp thing. I like the
swamp thing, so I mean it's fair enough. Yeah, I like.
(01:11):
I like how everyone can tell that we don't pre
share these questions because that proves it, right there, aerial
swamp thing casted, aerial swamp thing casting a club. Yeah,
I mean, well, just because again, like when I think
classic monster, I'm like, well, Siren, it's more of like
(01:33):
a mythological beast than a classic monster. Mermaids not really
a monster. Some people might find it monstrous. They're certainly
monstrous mermaids. But yeah, swamp thing that is like a
classic Hollywood level classic monster. It still has to do
with wet water stuff. Are you are you so? Are
you thinking like swamp thing like the mossy swamp thing,
(01:56):
gooey swamp thing, or are you thinking like a swamp
monster all creature from the Black Lagoon. I mean, I
wouldn't turn my nose up at either. I definitely think
like Creature from the Black Lagoon has better aesthetics. But
I do like having long hair, so maybe the mossy
swamp thing. Plus you know, if you go by the
(02:17):
d C version of that, then he's also kind of
uh he cares about the environment, So yeah, and a monster.
What about you the Blob? I ever since Lockdown the Blob?
Is that what you currently feel like or is that
(02:38):
what you would want to be? No, that's pretty much
what I feel like. I have a feeling that the
curse would just you know, amplify what I feel like.
And while right now I just kind of imagine myself
slowly using my way from place to place through osmosis, uh,
I think the Curse would just make it a reality,
and I wouldn't I would be the Blob. It sounds
(03:01):
relaxing and people would write little catchy pop tunes about me.
Beware of the blob. It creeps and sleeps and slides
and glides across the floor and through the door. I get.
I guess by that logic. Swamp thing is also accurate
because Georgia is really freaking humid. It's true. It's true.
We don't live near the swamps of Georgia. Those are
(03:25):
in the southern part of the state and we are
in Atlanta. But there are days when you step outside
and it feels like you just walked into a swamp.
So I totally get it. See now, I thought you
were gonna pick like a dracula, like a vampire, but
like the suave kind of vampire. Like that you say
a dracula, not not a vampire, but age, which reminds
(03:47):
me of a time when I watched an improv show
and there was an invading force. In the invading force
were three draculas, not three vampires, three draculas. I mean, yeah,
I get what you mean. Yeah, yeah, it's because I
say blah all the time. It's and you know, you're
(04:08):
pretty upper crust, and to me, dracula's fancy fancy pants monsters. Well,
you know, what this uh, incredibly fruitful conversation is going
to now lead into completely unrelated news items. And the
first that we're going to talk about is an upcoming
adaptation of Mark Miller and Frank Quietly's comic book series
(04:34):
Jupiter's Legacy that's now going to be a live action
series on Netflix. And there's a trailer for it. Yeah, yeah,
it's Um it's a Netflix show. Did you already say that?
I did, But go ahead and say it again, say
it proud? Oh fine, it is a Netflix show, um,
(04:55):
and it it focuses on the children of well established
superheroes who are now having to take up the mantle,
how they feel about that, whether you know some of
them obviously are hesitant, they don't feel like a hero,
don't want to be a hero, whatever the reason is,
and sort of the social commentary around that. I guess, yeah,
(05:17):
I think it. To me, it reminds me a lot
of series like or or you know, properties like Watchman
and uh maybe Invincible a couple of other series where
it's it's sort of an exploration of what what role
would superheroes really play and what do they really mean
(05:40):
and how would they fit within the context of actual
social crises, so interesting concepts, things that like go beyond
just the the surface level superhero stuff. But it's also
what we're already seeing in properties like the m c U.
I actually think we're entering into an era of superhero
(06:05):
property as a means of delivering social commentary, very much
in the same way that science fiction frequently plays that part.
I agree, and and even to the point of, like,
I see all of our superheroes aging up a little
bit and being, you know, family people. Not that that
doesn't happen in the comics, but even if you look
at DC, Superman and Lois, it's all about their family life.
(06:26):
It's about being a parent, And so I feel like
they're trying to hit hit two levels here. They're trying
to reach the aging, mainstream geek audience because let's face it,
m c you's been out for what more than a yeah, um,
while also pulling in their their kids. So I think
(06:48):
it's really interesting, and it's also touching on stuff that
we're seeing in upcoming series and movies as well. Like
one of the stories we did not include in our
lineup was about the first look of the power Puff Girls,
which we realize it's kind of hard to do that
in an audio only podcast to talk about the first look,
(07:08):
but we know that that series is going to be
a live action series about the three Powerpuff Girls who
have grown up their young adults now and they are
somewhat resentful over the fact that they weren't able to
have a real childhood because they were always saving the world.
And they're just a lot of similar themes, right, like
(07:28):
reluctant heroes or um heroes who are having second thoughts,
or people who question their heroism whether or not they
really are heroes or if they just happen to be
people who punt really hard. It's it's interesting. I do
wonder if this will create a kind of superhero burnout,
(07:49):
but to be fair, I was wondering that about seven
or eight years ago and we haven't hit it yet.
Same same. Now, did you like the trailer? Is this
a show that you would want to watch? Thought the
trailer looked really interesting? It didn't. I wouldn't say it
hooked me where I feel like it's a must watch
for me, but it was interesting enough where I thought
(08:10):
I might I might give this a couple episodes to
see if it clicks. With me because the effects actually
look really good for a made for like series type
of thing. The acting looks like it's really good. I
just uh, and even like stuff like the costumes and
things that kind of dig like they're very you know,
(08:30):
stereotypical superhero e. But I think I'm gonna need to
watch like a full episode and see how the narrative
is constructed before I really understand and feel if it's
it's for me or not. What about you? Um? You know,
I went into the trailer going I'm gonna love this.
I like Mark Miller's other work. I really enjoy kick
(08:50):
Ass and Kingsman and things like that and some of
his Marvel stuff. So I went into it going, yes,
this is this is a show that is made for me.
I don't know. It just had a slight edge of cheese,
but that just might have been them trying to hit
all of like the little hooks that they're putting into
the show so that anybody who watches the trailer would
(09:12):
get a little bit of something that would snag them.
You know, now that you say that, I am reminded
of a line that I absolutely detest because it's it's
such a cliche which is the world is changing. That
line is literally in the trailer. It's it feels like
that line is in like every movie from like forward right,
(09:33):
the world is changing and uh, and you're just like, oh,
come on, man, I don't I'm so tired. It's like
hearing someone talk about the last year and saying, it's
been a tough time for everybody. Can we just not
we just know it all right? Can we just skip
that part? Yeah? Yeah? Uh, something we don't know a
(09:57):
lot about and we don't want to skip at least
I don't want to skip. Jonathan might is a new
Star Trek film coming out in Uh. I have liked
all of the new Star Treks movies. Um, I like
the first half. Oh No Into Darkness, no bad movie,
(10:17):
No no cookie, no cookie for for that movie. Yeah,
this is a this is a new film. Uh. There
were a whole bunch of different Star Trek projects that
were in development over the last couple of years. From
what we understand, this is not reflective of any of those.
It's something entirely different. J. J. Abrams is going to
(10:39):
produce it. Um, but that's about all we know. We
don't know if it's going to be set in the
same timeline as the previous Star Trek the most recent
Star Trek films, or if it will be something different. Yeah, yeah,
that's all we know. I will say that one of
the rumors was that it was going to be written
by Glinda Vasquez, who is a writer and do sort
(11:00):
on Star Trek Discovery, which obviously, if it's J. J. Abrams,
it's probably not a collaboration. I would assume that's just
a complete factless assumption. But that being said, I have
been picking back up on Discovery, and you know, I
like it the sill through. Oh oh my heart, Oh
(11:23):
my heart. Do you also like Picard? I I haven't
watched all of that yet, but I have to. I
have to catch up. Like, okay, so I've watched I've
watched some of both, but I haven't watched it all
way through because we didn't have CBS access for a while,
so I was picking it up as I could, So
I'm re binging them all and re assimilating them all.
(11:44):
I think it's just I have such a fondness for
the characters and the universe that like, it's easy to
please me. I don't fault to you for liking it.
You can like things that I don't like, and that
is perfectly fine. Your side was first very faulting. But
I think what it is is I remember Discovery being
so dark the first go round that when I'm watching
(12:06):
it now, I see a lot more of the hope
and happiness, and that's kind of cool. I think I
just don't feel like it, Like I feel like there's
it's hard for me to feel like there's a cohesive
universe at play because things change so much, and especially
since Discovery is not not that long of a timeline
(12:27):
difference between that and the original series, it feels misaligned
to me. But but I'm also old and grouchy, so
I mean you're at least grouchy. Well, going from Spaceman
to Space Robots Robots. Netflix is working on a Gundham
(12:50):
live action movie. The live action part is the thing
that gets me. Yeah. Yeah, written by the comic book
writer Brian cave On, directed by the guy who directed
Kong Skull Island, and yeah, I mean, like, well, there
was a live action Transformers movie. There were several of them.
(13:11):
They're all terrible, and I highly recommend you never watched them.
I think what it was was that I watched Maga
sixty four do a ten minute version of Evangelian recently,
like the Swedish cut of Evangelion, and they were all
in homemade costumes and things like that. So when I
think of a live action Gundham, that's where my brain
immediately goes, which is probably not accurate. You probably probably
(13:33):
will be closer to Transformers. I do like that genre,
although I am not as familiar with Gundam myself. I
will also say I like the comic book Saga It's
a good space opera, and Gunham as a space opera,
so I'm hopeful. Yeah, I mean it's it's like the
next step up. Like the all the Giant Robots stuff
I used to watch, they all fell into the general
(13:54):
category of a little kid somehow gets control of an
enormous robot and that is seems to be okay, Like
it's a robot that could easily be a weapon of
mass destruction, but it's okay. This little kid controls it
and helps save the universe. That was like like Gigant
or like all the all the shows I've watched fell
(14:15):
into that category. And as as Polygon points out, and
we'll link to the story in our show notes, Polygon
points out that the Gundam was really kind of a stage,
a step in maturity when it comes to enormous space
robots fighting each other. Yeah. Yeah, um so I look
forward to it. Um I don't. I don't think I'll
(14:38):
have to watch the entire anime beforehand, but maybe. And uh,
We've got one last story for our little headlines here
that we want to conclude on that also ties back
to Netflix, which is that Netflix and Sony Pictures Entertainment
have signed an exclusivity deal where Netflix will get the
exclusive streaming rights to all new Sony Pictures Entertainment movies, which,
(15:03):
get ready, y'all, there's been a fighter bruin. That means
that the Spiderman movies are going to be exclusively streaming
to Netflix, which means Spiderman is not going to get
to join his buddies in the m c U over
at Disney. Plus. Yeah, that's it's a weird one for
me because they canceled all of the you know, the
(15:24):
Defenders level Marvel shows to get them to separate out
Disney material from Netflix. Although I know that there are
certain Marvel movies due to past deals that still continue
to be on Netflix as well. But it's also bad
news for Stars because Stars has been carrying a lot
of that Sony stuff. Yeah. Yeah, this is a kind
(15:46):
of leading into that world that people were worried about,
where you start seeing specific properties aligned with specific streaming services,
and it means that you have to make tough choice, say, is,
when it comes to which services you subscribe to, whether
you subscribe to multiple ones, how many do you subscribe
to until you're like, I'm spending way too much per
(16:09):
month just so that I have access to all these things.
Um yeah, no, me too. I actually was debating before
the recording of this podcast canceling one of my streaming
service subscriptions because I don't remember the last time I
actually accessed it. Yeah. I almost need like a Fantasy
(16:32):
football level spread chart of all of my different subscriptions
when the shows I like on each of them comes out,
so that I know when to start one and then
cancel it and start the other one. I have Netflix,
so and I do watch it. I love some of
the shows that are regular on there, and I can
also rewatch some of my old favorites. The other thing
about this is there I've heard a lot of speculation
(16:52):
on whether some of the two movies which is when
this is going to start, that are coming out or
going to go straight to streaming on Netflix things uncharted
or or more obous, or if they're going to do
what HBO max is doing and do a streaming and
theater release at the same time. I mean, that's all speculation,
but I am curious. I'm sure that I'm sure all
the theaters are now hoping that we'll go back to
(17:13):
the old ways of having, you know, several months in
between when a film comes out to hit theaters before
it starts streaming, so that it gives more reason to
go to theaters. But we still don't really know what
a post herd immunity world is going to look like.
I mean, there's no telling when we're going to actually
reach herd immunity vaccination rollout is still very much in
(17:37):
progress at the state we live in as is way behind,
so um, you know, there's there are a lot of
unanswered questions, and I think everyone is just sort of
hedging their bets right now. They're hoping to get back
to releasing films in theaters and getting those big box
office weekends. Then transitioning over to streaming. But I just
(17:58):
don't know if that's the world we're gonna go back
to yet or not. Yeah, me neither. I mean, I hope.
So I just got my second vaccination shot and I'm
not quite in the clear too to start, you know,
visiting friends yet. But even when I am, I don't
know how soon I'll be comfortable sitting in a theater
with people. I mean, if it's at an off time
(18:19):
and myself and my husband are the only people in there, sure,
but you know, if it's if it's a crowded theater,
I don't know when when I'll feel comfortable with you.
But now I feel the same way. Arial Well, we're
gonna take a quick break, and when we come back,
we're going to have a discussion about some things that
we think are sort of introductory materials to get people
(18:41):
into the geek world. Because for most of us, at
some point or another, we weren't geeks, but then we
had geek dum, either thrust upon us or we naturally
grew into it. So what properties are the ones that
kind of lead people down the geeky primrose path. We're
going to find that out after this quick break. So
(19:11):
you said that some of us were not geeks but
had geeks geeked m thrust upon us. I don't think
that actually applies to you or eye Jonathan. Well, no,
I was born into it. I mean my parents are
both science fiction authors. And uh yeah, I mean like
I my parents gave me a framed crayon picture that
(19:34):
I drew when I was four years old, and the
title of the picture is Gallum in the Ring. So yeah,
I was from birth a geek. But not everybody is, No. No.
I mean I've had quite a few friends that I've
had to introduce and ease into things like doctor Who.
So yeah, no, I mean, and some of us who
are lifelong geeks have had a physical rejection of doctor Who. Listen, Jonathan,
(19:59):
h That's okay. Even though I disagree with you, I'm
not saying it's bad. I'm just saying I couldn't get
into it, and I tried. I got all the way
to Matt Smith and I was like, I'm done. Look
that is that is definitely the case for I would
say a large group of people. You know, it is
pretty schlocky in some areas, But I do know that
(20:20):
you and I both have friends who are not necessarily geeks,
but we want to share that passion with them. I
know I do. I would say, like the thing that
I have found to be the most bridging and also
the most furious to me, it is something like Big
Bang Theory or even a little bit I T. Crowd.
(20:40):
I like the people who are on it. I don't
like this necessarily the stereotypes that it brings, but it
has opened up to like, you know a lot of
my coworkers or things like that, this love of geekdom
through the love of the geeks that are being portrayed. Yeah,
I feel you, They're Yeah. I have very strong links
about the Big Bang Theory. Uh. I have strong feelings
(21:03):
about the creator of the I T. Crowd for different,
totally different reasons. Um. I think the performances on the
I T. Crowd are really fun, and I think the
humor is really fun for most of it. There's some
episodes that are uh, you know, the word problematic is
used way too much, but there are some episodes that
(21:24):
are just not good. When you start to deconstruct where
the humor is coming from. There's one in particular I'm
thinking of, um, but Big Bang Theory has that problem
pretty much every every episode. After like halfway through the
first season, I felt Big Bang Theory started off cute.
In fact, let me tell you the first thing I
(21:45):
ever saw a Big Bang Theory which fooled me into
thinking this was a show that I was going to love.
It was an episode in which, uh, the characters are
bidding online for what they think of is I'm model
of the the H. G. Wells time Machine, the one
with a big disk. That is, it's like a chair
(22:06):
with a giant disc that's mounted behind it. The disc
slowly rotates, and they think they're they're bidding on a model,
and it turns out there bidding on a full scale
replica of the time machine. Like it's enormous, and they
set it up in their apartment and then they get
(22:27):
to take turns uh playing in the time machine, and
so one of them sits down and begins to move
the controls, and all the others suddenly start running around,
acting like they're moving in fast motion, like the idea
being that that the person is moving through time quickly.
That moment, I was like, this show is for me.
It's a celebration of geekdom. These are friends who are
(22:50):
encouraging this person's love of a particular piece of science fiction,
you know, icon iconography, and they are feeding into their
imagine Asian and that's wonderful. And then I watched another
episode and I thought, oh, that's not what this show is. No. Now,
I mean you laugh a lot at the geeks as
(23:10):
opposed to with them. Um, which is fine. I laugh
at myself and my friends all the time. But you know,
I do feel like, while it's not a proper uh
depiction of what a geek is in today's society, I
do feel like it has opened a lot of my
mundane friends up to looking at some of the superhero
(23:33):
stuff or sci fi stuff that those characters were interested in,
because they're interested in those characters. Well, let me ask
you this. So we both talked about being kind of
raised as geeks. Were there any kind of genres or
subgenres that you weren't necessarily a fan of from birth
that you kind of grew to love because of a
(23:56):
specific property. I know, I'm setting you up for like
a stumper of equation. If it helps, I can talk
about one for me. You go ahead and talk about
it first, because I do have to really think about this.
I've talked about this before, but for me, like the
movie Gremlins was kind of a gateway film into horror
for me because Gremlins, when you look at it's it's
(24:17):
a it's a horror comedy. Um. It's a little heavier
on the horror than well, a lot heavier on the
horror than its sequel, which is more of a zany comedy,
which I love, by the way. But the first Gremlins is, uh,
you know, it's not really scary if you're an adult,
not really. There's a couple of jump scares, but it's
not terrifying. As a kid, it was scarier, right, it's
(24:41):
playing upon your imagination. It's taking this cute little animal
and then spawning all these terrible monsters out of it,
and uh, the sort of the stuff of nightmares. But
it was also very accessible, like it wasn't over the
top gruesome or gory apart from like a blender scene
in a microwave scene. Um. And it was also had
(25:02):
entertaining moments, like funny moments in it, and that became
a gateway of what I got. The next movie I
can think of watching that falls into that category is
the Gate, which was another It's like a Canadian horror
movie that's really freaky but very accessible to kids. And
it also speaks to kids like, it doesn't speak down
to them. It speaks to kids like like they're adults
(25:26):
and it doesn't you know, patronize, And that, to me
is what started me watching horror films. And um, you know,
for a long time, I didn't really think that those
kind of movies existed anymore. And then a few years
ago the movie Crampus came out, and you know, it's
a Christmas themed horror movie, and Crampus felt a lot
(25:49):
like Gremlin's in spirit to me, and that again, it's
a movie that I feel like could be accessible to
a younger audience without it being you know, the gruesome
horror of say an Eli Roth movie, and uh, it
could get kids interested in horror and then sort of
lead them down that path of discovering other types of movies. See,
(26:10):
most of the genres that I've had to grow into,
I wouldn't have said as I was growing into them
that they were geek genres. So things like westerns or
military movies or or scary movies. You know, I enjoy
scary movies a lot more and scary television shows and
things like that as I've grown up and kind of
been able to separate the story from reality, which has
(26:31):
always been my big problem. Um. You know, the same
with with Western and and and war movies kind of
but again, like unless it's got that sci fi fantasy
aspect to it. Like I like King Arthur, I like
West World, but I'm not really gonna watch you know,
Apocalypse now. Um, I don't like a lot of military
(26:56):
sort of video games, but I like Halo. You know,
he's got that sci fi aspect to it. So that's
a hard one. Um, I would say that. Um, you know,
one of in our show notes, I wrote the m
c U is kind of a gateway because m c
U is definitely mainstream. I mean you look at like
some of the top performing movies in the last decade
(27:17):
and a half, and the vast majority of them, or
at least half of them, are superhero movies. And once
upon a time superheroes were kind of a niche thing,
but they are definitely mainstream, and I would argue that
sort of a gateway right there. I would say so too.
I think you know, myth busters or Sherlock or or
(27:40):
something like that that deals with the science, or the
mystery or or the at least the ideas of the fantastical,
because even though Sherlock, outside of the Irregulars, you know,
always has an explanation, there's always that little bit at
the beginning of what is what is happening here? You know,
Mr Robot Like, that's a sci fi but it's it's
kind of couched in a possible reality. I feel like
(28:01):
all of those are are great gateways for people into
things like science fiction. The one that really surprised me
that has spanned all of all of the people I
know almost is Game of Thrones. Yeah. Um, Game of Thrones.
You wouldn't think that high fantasy, would I mean? Granted,
Lord of the Rings that was a phenomenon too, right,
(28:24):
Like when the Lord of the Rings movies came out,
that also broke out beyond just fantasy geeks that was
filling up theaters. But Game of Thrones was such a
cultural phenomenon. You could argue that was because a lot
of the early shows were heavy on the violence and
the nudity, but there was obviously more than that. People
(28:46):
got connected to characters, they cared what was going on,
despite the fact that week after week they were taught
that you shouldn't like anybody because as soon as you do,
they're gonna die. Um, you know. But yeah, I would
say that that was one of those those shows where
if you had told me five years before Game of
Thrones came out that one of the top television series,
(29:09):
uh dominating ratings was going to be a fantasy series
based off of a series of novels, I would have
thought you were joking. Yeah, yeah, me too. And it's
it's weird because like some of the people I know
who are the fiercest fans are people who self admittedly
do not like any other fantasy. They don't like science fiction.
(29:32):
They barely like uh, you know, speculative fiction. So see,
it's that's weird to me because as a fan of
fantasy and science fiction and speculative fiction, I fell off
of Game of Thrones. Um. I've read the books as
far as they have been written so far, and then
(29:54):
I had only ever in fact, to this day, I've
only ever seen the first episode the television series. I
never watched beyond it. Um, I knew what happened, because
of course I did, because there was no way of
avoiding it. Everyone talked about it, but it was It
was at a point where the show finally got beyond
where the books left off, and a specific event happened
(30:18):
that convinced me to just walk away from the Game
of Thrones forever, uh and not look back. And it's
so interesting to me that so many people got heavily
invested and they stayed with that show all the way
to the end, and they don't care for other types
of fantasy, because I have the opposite experience, having a
love of fantasy but not being able to buy into
(30:41):
Game of Thrones, mostly because, if I'm being honest, it
felt like misery porn to me. I can definitely see that.
And I'll say, you know, I I watched the first
few seasons, and then I took a big break in
the middle, and then I watched the last two seasons
as well. Um, and I'll say that like the end
of it was much better than the getting of it,
and and much like the rebooted Battlestar Galactica or something
(31:03):
like that, I had to know what I was getting
into and like prepare myself to be able to appreciate it.
To be fair, I also have to do that with
Jurassic Park, which is I think another great gateway property
because it's science fiction based on something that people could
imagine happening. So yeah, at least a science fiction to me.
(31:24):
Maybe it's not officially science fiction. No, it's science fiction. Yeah,
it's absolutely. It's using science to to create clones of dinosaurs.
I mean that's about that's definitely science. I mean, if
you're telling me it's science fact, we gotta go Jurassic Park.
I know there's a new roller coaster. I mean that's
that's a Universal and I do want to ride that
(31:45):
as soon as it's safe for me to do. So, yeah, no,
I think it opens June eleven, and I'm like, uh,
when when will I feel comfortable enough to go to Universal?
First of all, I'm not going to Florida in June.
That's just not happening. It will be a little bit
warm then at the least, so interesting discussion. I'm very
(32:06):
curious if our listeners have suggestions of sort of gateway
properties that you feel are good introductions into the world
of geekdom, and you know, kind of maybe at a
at different age rage ranges as well, because obviously game
of Thrones would not be appropriate to show to like
a ten year old, but not at all. And so
here's the other thing is that, like my perception of
(32:28):
this is obviously shaped by my age. Like I brought
up Gremlins, which I don't know that I would show
that to a young kid, just because the pacing is different,
the effects are different. It's a you know, the way
things have changed. I'm not sure how well that movie
has aged with regard to a new audience, right, So
I'm curious if people have other suggestions. I mean, we
(32:51):
are getting a Gremlins cartoon, so maybe that'll reach the
newer generation. I wonder if Minecraft would be considered a
gateway property. Yeah, I don't know. Like whenever I see
anyone in a kid in a Minecraft shirt when we
were working the Renaissance Festival, if I saw them, I
would do the creeper thing, which sometimes they understood and
(33:13):
sometimes they didn't, and that's when I knew they just
played in creative mode. Yeah. Yeah, Well, we do hope
to hear from you on you know, your opinions of
of gateway properties, things that got you into the geekdom. Uh,
But first we've got to give you a mash up,
and before that, we've got to take a quick break aerial. Yes,
(33:53):
so no one told you life was going to be
this way. Your jobs, oke, you're broke, you love Life's
d o A. Looks like you always stuck in second year.
Hasn't been your day, your week, your month, or even
your year. What's our mash up? Um? It's Loki meets
(34:16):
Friends trying to work in. I'll be there for you. No,
I didn't give you any opportunity. No, no, it's fine. Yeah,
So Jonathan and I are both excited about Loki. That's
even though we didn't talk about it this week in
our new segment, We've talked about it plenty of times.
Really looking forward to that series, I mean The Falcon
and The Winter Soldier. I'm still enjoying despite some reservations
(34:39):
about some of the episodes. But I cannot wait for Loki.
Me me neither. And something people have waited for for
a long time is the Friends special coming out to
HBO Max we got which got delayed twice but has
finally finished up filming, so it's finally wrapped and I
(34:59):
know it. Friends is not it's more pop culture than
geek culture, although I feel like the lines are really
blurred nowadays because if you take a show like Friends
that was popular, you know, sixteen years ago, dear goodness,
and people are still enjoying it today, that kind of
makes it a geek, don't Oh yeah, no, I I
think so. And it's like the fact that I will
(35:22):
see some kids who weren't even born when the show
came out talking about watching the show blows my mind
because I never thought of it being a show that
would have that kind of staying power. Then again, I mean,
like I grew up watching reruns that had long been
off the air by the time I was a kid,
so it's not like it's that unusual. Um. But yeah,
(35:45):
So we decided that we were going to take the
property of Friends and mash it up with Loki and
find out what the heck happens. And I can't wait
to find out what Ariel did. Okay, so this may
not go the direction you expected to. It didn't go
the direction I expected to, and I was writing it,
but this is called Could you be anymore trickster? Uh?
(36:09):
I love it already all right? After past Loki stole
the test rack a k a. The Shiny Blue ventry Cube.
In two thousand twelve, we all know he got captured
by the Time Variance Authority. That's what the New Loki
shows about, and he was forced to fix all of
the timelines that his actions created. He was pretty good
at it, and the tv A decided to keep him
(36:30):
around once he had cleaned up his own mess. Unfortunately,
the t v A didn't trust Loki as far as
they could throw him, which isn't very far. I don't
know if you know this, but half frost giants are
actually pretty dense. Uh So, when they weren't using him,
he was relegated to a cell, and the only show
that played on his tiny cell television was reruns of Friends.
(36:53):
Loki hated it at first, but eventually the show grew
on him like Chandler's third nipple, and he started wishing
he could live in the Friends universe instead of at
the end of time with the Time Variants Authority. Uh So,
he started making plans each time the t v A
sent him out, and he encountered a variant of an
avenger in a timeline. Just as he was about to
(37:16):
prune and end that timeline, he would sneakily abduct that
adventure variant and stick them into his own little secret
pocket dimension to inhabit his own little friends world. Soon
he had variants of Bruce Banner, Scarlet Witch, Black Widow,
iron Man, and of course Thor, and he knew it
was time to make his move. He disappeared into the
(37:37):
pocket dimension, magick ng the portal behind him to lock
it closed, and created his own little corner of New
York in scepter perk Uh. He made himself the Monica
of the group because of course she's the master planner.
Iron Man, because he was neurotic, became Chandler, black Widow
with her outward put togetherness appearance, but secretly soft soft
(38:01):
heart became Rachel. Bruce Banner was ross who, if you
aren't familiar with friends, is kind of short tempered himself,
and Thor became, as Loki viewed it, the stupid dummy
poopoo head Joey, and Scarlett Witch was made Phoebe because mysticalness. Anyhow,
things went well for Loki at first, and he was
(38:22):
happy because everyone else was slightly miserable. Tony being was
really good at what he did, but no one knew
without was or even cared Bruce Geller constantly was a
doormat and an effort not to get mad or show
his cards, and only occasionally punched a dinosaur bone. Uh.
Tasha Green Natasha hated serving coffee and doory was living
(38:45):
in a state of constant rejection. How old thou doing
Wanda Buffet did seem a little off, but that wasn't
out of her character either. Unfortunately, what Loki didn't know
was that he had nabbed the variant of Scarlett Witch
that had just come out of the hex in one division,
(39:08):
and she quickly recognized the pattern uh that she was in.
It was so similar to what she had just been
through she knew something was up, and she devised a plan.
The plan would require her to out herself to Loki, though,
so she told Loki, Hey, I see what you're doing
one magic user to another. Uh. But it's cool. I'm
(39:28):
down with it. Uh. And she convinced Loki that his
little version of Scepter Perk didn't mean anything if other
people couldn't see his genius and appreciate it. So, in
a moment of vain oversight, Loki replaced all versions of
Friends across all universes with his own I want to
knew that someone would see the broadcast and realize what
(39:48):
was happening and stop Loki, But then she worried that
he would be too clever for that and see that coming,
so she had to get him to hobble his intelligence,
so she played to his pride and jealousy. He pointed
out how happy Thor was it getting all the girls
and having all the sandwiches and you know, all the
hell you doing, And if Loki switched places with him,
(40:09):
not only would he have this universe where people could
appreciate his genius, but he would also be the most
popular Thor being. Monica would realize what was wrong, but
wouldn't be able to fix it, and everything would be perfect.
Loki fell for it, locked away his intelligence to become
the perfect Joey, So when the tv A did track
(40:29):
him down and broke into his pocket to mention to
free everyone, he was unable to stop them. So the
tv A freed everybody, uh and unfortunately got rid of
them because that's what they do with alternate timelines. But
they didn't get rid of Loki. He was still really
good at what he did. They put him back in
his cell, took away his TV and to give him
(40:52):
a little bit extra bit of punishment, they made him
subsist on meatball subs and coffee for the rest of
his existence. I uh, I love your take. It is
so different from mine. It was amazing. I love that
there was some one division in there that was fantastic too,
really creative. I love it. Um Okay, So here's mine.
(41:16):
It's called with friends low keys. Um. Yeah, instead of
like with with like with friends like these Okay. Ross
has a problem. He was looking forward to sitting down
and eating the infamous turkey moist Maker sandwich. You know,
the sandwich has turkey stuffing, piece of gravy soaked bread
(41:38):
in the middle, some cranberries. But someone appears to have
eaten it again. And it's been years since he worked
for Dr Leadbetter. Who could have done such a thing. Well,
as it turns out that who is a trickster god
by the name of Loki, adopted son to Odin and
brother to Thor. Yes, Loki is Ross's new roommate. Chandler's
(41:59):
liveing with Monica. Joey is not really hanging out with
him anymore, and well, Ross just has to deal with this.
Ross discovers Loki's transgressions, and the god seems amused, that
is until Ross and righteous fury begins to advance on Loki.
Fearing for his life, and Ross is anchored is beyond
(42:21):
even that of a frost giant. Loki decides he has
to open up a portal and jump in it, but
he doesn't close it fast enough, and next thing he knows,
Ross is right on his tail in another dimension. Loki
on the Run begins a desperate series of jumps from
one reality to the next. One moment, he's in New
York running through a comedian's apartment as the comedians having
(42:42):
a conversation with his group of friends, and it's all
about nothing and all of his friends are terrible, and
Ross chases after him, saying excuse me, Mr Seinfeld. As
he does, then a portal opens into a restaurant called Riffs,
where a couple named Paul and Jamie Buckman are having
dinner and a waitress named Ursula is doing a really
bad job of taking their order, and Loki dives over
(43:05):
the table and out through the door, pursued by Ross,
who yells hi phoebe to Ursula, who looks like really annoyed,
and then Loki passes into a portal and then appears
in a living room where a small, furry brown creature
is chasing after a cat and calling it a snack.
He doesn't waste another second as Ross closes in goes
through another portal. Loki then jumps into yeah, another portal
(43:26):
stop short, looks around. Ross jumps right through behind Loki
collides with him, but before Ross can throw a punch,
he too stops and looks around, and the two are
in a vast building with these weird balconies that look
down into the open center of this very tall structure,
their elevators going up and down in a central bank
in the middle of it, and it is in fact
(43:48):
the Marriott Marquis in downtown Atlanta. I'm sorry, wait, wait, no,
I'm sorry. It's the Time Variance Authority or tv A headquarters. Ross,
catching his breath, asks Loki where they ended up, and
Loki doesn't know. But then they both encounter Owen Wilson,
who explains that in order to fix all the timelines
that have been broken, they're gonna have to go through
(44:09):
and have a series of adventures throughout all these different
realities of various NBC sitcoms, and he explains that sure
Friends in Seinfeld co exists because of a tenuous connection
thanks to Matt about You. But Alf is right out.
So Loki and Ross, the most unlikeliest of duo's, set
up out on a series of adventures to repair the multiverse,
(44:29):
and they visit different timelines, They get into scrapes, they
find clever escapes, and finally they end up back in
New York at Central Perk. Everything has been set right. Ross, flabbergasted,
exhausted trying to process everything that has happened, sits down
on the couch, just slumps into the couch. And during
(44:50):
their adventures, Loki managed to snag Ross's sandwich before past
Loki could actually eat it, so he hands over the
sandwich to a grateful Ross, who sets it reverently upon
the table. Loki walks out of the coffee shop just
as Ross's friends, you know, the ones from the title,
come inside and they sit down and they talk about
(45:11):
their day, and then they noticed that Ross is there
and they asked him how he's doing, and Ross, a
little bit at a loss for words, tries to explain,
but the friends kind of get really bored until Ross
Here's Joey said, say, man, this is a good sandwich.
And yes, Joey has picked up Ross's sandwich and started
eating it as Ross tried to talk about his day.
So of course Ross murders Joey the end. I loved it.
(45:37):
I now wish I had put more m c U
television shows into my mashup to match the level of
the only reason I did that was because I happened
to remember that Friends was linked to Mad About You,
because the character of Ursula showed up and Mad about
You before Friends was ever a thing. Then Friends established
(45:58):
that Ursula and Phoebe are twit ends, and then in
an episode about Mad About You, it was indicated that
at one point, Paul Riser's character lived in the apartment
that Kramer lived in, and so that means all three
of those shows have to exist in the same shared universe.
That's brilliant. I also love that Owen Wilson was owned. Yes,
(46:19):
Owen Wilson like this because I don't know what his
character name is and Loki, so he's just Owen Wilson.
It's Morbius and Morbius. But it was that was such
a great mashup. I loved it. I almost almost did
something with that turkey sandwich too. It's the one that
it's the it's the episode I always think about because
(46:40):
it's also the you referenced the fact that you know
Bruce Banner and yours was ross because of the rage thing,
and that's the episode that that started off that whole
rage storyline. That's where he had to start taking the
medication for his rage. Yes. Yes, so that was a
lot of fun. But if you guys out there have
an idea of how you would mash up Loki and Friends,
(47:04):
we really do want to hear it, so you should
write to us, Yes, right to us. The email address
is l n C at I heart media dot com.
That's where you can send your long form messages. If
you want to be brief you have a really short version,
you can reach out on Twitter. The handle we use
there is ellen c Underscore Podcast, or you can drop
(47:28):
us a line on Facebook or Instagram where we are
large nerdron Collider. And if you would like to visit
our website where we include stuff like show notes, that's
large nerdron collidor dot com. Yes, and if you like
the show, tell your friends, make sure you subscribe. You know,
the more people that listen, the more people right in
and give us great ideas for mashups or their takes
(47:51):
on our topics. And we just love having that conversation
with everything. It's a lot of fun. We really enjoy it.
Thank you for listening. Until next time. I am Jonathan
Strickland and I am Ariel swamp Thing Casting m m
(48:21):
m m hm. The Large Nur John Collider is production
of I Heart Radio and was created by Ariel cast In.
Jonathan Strickland is the executive producer. This show is produced,
edited and published by Tory Harrison. For more podcasts on
my heart Radio, visit the I heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
(48:43):
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
The Large Nerd Drunk Collider Podcast is a production of
My Heart Radio. Hi everybody, Welcome to The Large Nerd
Drunk Collider Podcast, the podcast that's all about the geeky
stuff happening in the world around us and how excited
(00:28):
we are about it. I'm Ariel Casting, and with me,
as always, is Jonathan tech Boy Strickland. Hey there, Ariel,
I got a question for you. You've been cursed. What
classic type of monster do you turn into? I would
(00:51):
turn into a swamp thing. Okay, all right, a swamp thing. No, well,
mermaids not a monster. I could be a side. Now
I want to be a swamp thing. I like the
swamp thing, so I mean it's fair enough. Yeah, I like.
(01:11):
I like how everyone can tell that we don't pre
share these questions because that proves it, right there, aerial
swamp thing casted, aerial swamp thing casting a club. Yeah,
I mean, well, just because again, like when I think
classic monster, I'm like, well, Siren, it's more of like
(01:33):
a mythological beast than a classic monster. Mermaids not really
a monster. Some people might find it monstrous. They're certainly
monstrous mermaids. But yeah, swamp thing that is like a
classic Hollywood level classic monster. It still has to do
with wet water stuff. Are you are you so? Are
you thinking like swamp thing like the mossy swamp thing,
(01:56):
gooey swamp thing, or are you thinking like a swamp
monster all creature from the Black Lagoon. I mean, I
wouldn't turn my nose up at either. I definitely think
like Creature from the Black Lagoon has better aesthetics. But
I do like having long hair, so maybe the mossy
swamp thing. Plus you know, if you go by the
(02:17):
d C version of that, then he's also kind of
uh he cares about the environment, So yeah, and a monster.
What about you the Blob? I ever since Lockdown the Blob?
Is that what you currently feel like or is that
(02:38):
what you would want to be? No, that's pretty much
what I feel like. I have a feeling that the
curse would just you know, amplify what I feel like.
And while right now I just kind of imagine myself
slowly using my way from place to place through osmosis, uh,
I think the Curse would just make it a reality,
and I wouldn't I would be the Blob. It sounds
(03:01):
relaxing and people would write little catchy pop tunes about me.
Beware of the blob. It creeps and sleeps and slides
and glides across the floor and through the door. I get.
I guess by that logic. Swamp thing is also accurate
because Georgia is really freaking humid. It's true. It's true.
We don't live near the swamps of Georgia. Those are
(03:25):
in the southern part of the state and we are
in Atlanta. But there are days when you step outside
and it feels like you just walked into a swamp.
So I totally get it. See now, I thought you
were gonna pick like a dracula, like a vampire, but
like the suave kind of vampire. Like that you say
a dracula, not not a vampire, but age, which reminds
(03:47):
me of a time when I watched an improv show
and there was an invading force. In the invading force
were three draculas, not three vampires, three draculas. I mean, yeah,
I get what you mean. Yeah, yeah, it's because I
say blah all the time. It's and you know, you're
(04:08):
pretty upper crust, and to me, dracula's fancy fancy pants monsters. Well,
you know, what this uh, incredibly fruitful conversation is going
to now lead into completely unrelated news items. And the
first that we're going to talk about is an upcoming
adaptation of Mark Miller and Frank Quietly's comic book series
(04:34):
Jupiter's Legacy that's now going to be a live action
series on Netflix. And there's a trailer for it. Yeah, yeah,
it's Um it's a Netflix show. Did you already say that?
I did, But go ahead and say it again, say
it proud? Oh fine, it is a Netflix show, um,
(04:55):
and it it focuses on the children of well established
superheroes who are now having to take up the mantle,
how they feel about that, whether you know some of
them obviously are hesitant, they don't feel like a hero,
don't want to be a hero, whatever the reason is,
and sort of the social commentary around that. I guess, yeah,
(05:17):
I think it. To me, it reminds me a lot
of series like or or you know, properties like Watchman
and uh maybe Invincible a couple of other series where
it's it's sort of an exploration of what what role
would superheroes really play and what do they really mean
(05:40):
and how would they fit within the context of actual
social crises, so interesting concepts, things that like go beyond
just the the surface level superhero stuff. But it's also
what we're already seeing in properties like the m c U.
I actually think we're entering into an era of superhero
(06:05):
property as a means of delivering social commentary, very much
in the same way that science fiction frequently plays that part.
I agree, and and even to the point of, like,
I see all of our superheroes aging up a little
bit and being, you know, family people. Not that that
doesn't happen in the comics, but even if you look
at DC, Superman and Lois, it's all about their family life.
(06:26):
It's about being a parent, And so I feel like
they're trying to hit hit two levels here. They're trying
to reach the aging, mainstream geek audience because let's face it,
m c you's been out for what more than a yeah, um,
while also pulling in their their kids. So I think
(06:48):
it's really interesting, and it's also touching on stuff that
we're seeing in upcoming series and movies as well. Like
one of the stories we did not include in our
lineup was about the first look of the power Puff Girls,
which we realize it's kind of hard to do that
in an audio only podcast to talk about the first look,
(07:08):
but we know that that series is going to be
a live action series about the three Powerpuff Girls who
have grown up their young adults now and they are
somewhat resentful over the fact that they weren't able to
have a real childhood because they were always saving the world.
And they're just a lot of similar themes, right, like
(07:28):
reluctant heroes or um heroes who are having second thoughts,
or people who question their heroism whether or not they
really are heroes or if they just happen to be
people who punt really hard. It's it's interesting. I do
wonder if this will create a kind of superhero burnout,
(07:49):
but to be fair, I was wondering that about seven
or eight years ago and we haven't hit it yet.
Same same. Now, did you like the trailer? Is this
a show that you would want to watch? Thought the
trailer looked really interesting? It didn't. I wouldn't say it
hooked me where I feel like it's a must watch
for me, but it was interesting enough where I thought
(08:10):
I might I might give this a couple episodes to
see if it clicks. With me because the effects actually
look really good for a made for like series type
of thing. The acting looks like it's really good. I
just uh, and even like stuff like the costumes and
things that kind of dig like they're very you know,
(08:30):
stereotypical superhero e. But I think I'm gonna need to
watch like a full episode and see how the narrative
is constructed before I really understand and feel if it's
it's for me or not. What about you? Um? You know,
I went into the trailer going I'm gonna love this.
I like Mark Miller's other work. I really enjoy kick
(08:50):
Ass and Kingsman and things like that and some of
his Marvel stuff. So I went into it going, yes,
this is this is a show that is made for me.
I don't know. It just had a slight edge of cheese,
but that just might have been them trying to hit
all of like the little hooks that they're putting into
the show so that anybody who watches the trailer would
(09:12):
get a little bit of something that would snag them.
You know, now that you say that, I am reminded
of a line that I absolutely detest because it's it's
such a cliche which is the world is changing. That
line is literally in the trailer. It's it feels like
that line is in like every movie from like forward right,
(09:33):
the world is changing and uh, and you're just like, oh,
come on, man, I don't I'm so tired. It's like
hearing someone talk about the last year and saying, it's
been a tough time for everybody. Can we just not
we just know it all right? Can we just skip
that part? Yeah? Yeah? Uh, something we don't know a
(09:57):
lot about and we don't want to skip at least
I don't want to skip. Jonathan might is a new
Star Trek film coming out in Uh. I have liked
all of the new Star Treks movies. Um, I like
the first half. Oh No Into Darkness, no bad movie,
(10:17):
No no cookie, no cookie for for that movie. Yeah,
this is a this is a new film. Uh. There
were a whole bunch of different Star Trek projects that
were in development over the last couple of years. From
what we understand, this is not reflective of any of those.
It's something entirely different. J. J. Abrams is going to
(10:39):
produce it. Um, but that's about all we know. We
don't know if it's going to be set in the
same timeline as the previous Star Trek the most recent
Star Trek films, or if it will be something different. Yeah, yeah,
that's all we know. I will say that one of
the rumors was that it was going to be written
by Glinda Vasquez, who is a writer and do sort
(11:00):
on Star Trek Discovery, which obviously, if it's J. J. Abrams,
it's probably not a collaboration. I would assume that's just
a complete factless assumption. But that being said, I have
been picking back up on Discovery, and you know, I
like it the sill through. Oh oh my heart, Oh
(11:23):
my heart. Do you also like Picard? I I haven't
watched all of that yet, but I have to. I
have to catch up. Like, okay, so I've watched I've
watched some of both, but I haven't watched it all
way through because we didn't have CBS access for a while,
so I was picking it up as I could, So
I'm re binging them all and re assimilating them all.
(11:44):
I think it's just I have such a fondness for
the characters and the universe that like, it's easy to
please me. I don't fault to you for liking it.
You can like things that I don't like, and that
is perfectly fine. Your side was first very faulting. But
I think what it is is I remember Discovery being
so dark the first go round that when I'm watching
(12:06):
it now, I see a lot more of the hope
and happiness, and that's kind of cool. I think I
just don't feel like it, Like I feel like there's
it's hard for me to feel like there's a cohesive
universe at play because things change so much, and especially
since Discovery is not not that long of a timeline
(12:27):
difference between that and the original series, it feels misaligned
to me. But but I'm also old and grouchy, so
I mean you're at least grouchy. Well, going from Spaceman
to Space Robots Robots. Netflix is working on a Gundham
(12:50):
live action movie. The live action part is the thing
that gets me. Yeah. Yeah, written by the comic book
writer Brian cave On, directed by the guy who directed
Kong Skull Island, and yeah, I mean, like, well, there
was a live action Transformers movie. There were several of them.
(13:11):
They're all terrible, and I highly recommend you never watched them.
I think what it was was that I watched Maga
sixty four do a ten minute version of Evangelian recently,
like the Swedish cut of Evangelion, and they were all
in homemade costumes and things like that. So when I
think of a live action Gundham, that's where my brain
immediately goes, which is probably not accurate. You probably probably
(13:33):
will be closer to Transformers. I do like that genre,
although I am not as familiar with Gundam myself. I
will also say I like the comic book Saga It's
a good space opera, and Gunham as a space opera,
so I'm hopeful. Yeah, I mean it's it's like the
next step up. Like the all the Giant Robots stuff
I used to watch, they all fell into the general
(13:54):
category of a little kid somehow gets control of an
enormous robot and that is seems to be okay, Like
it's a robot that could easily be a weapon of
mass destruction, but it's okay. This little kid controls it
and helps save the universe. That was like like Gigant
or like all the all the shows I've watched fell
(14:15):
into that category. And as as Polygon points out, and
we'll link to the story in our show notes, Polygon
points out that the Gundam was really kind of a stage,
a step in maturity when it comes to enormous space
robots fighting each other. Yeah. Yeah, um so I look
forward to it. Um I don't. I don't think I'll
(14:38):
have to watch the entire anime beforehand, but maybe. And uh,
We've got one last story for our little headlines here
that we want to conclude on that also ties back
to Netflix, which is that Netflix and Sony Pictures Entertainment
have signed an exclusivity deal where Netflix will get the
exclusive streaming rights to all new Sony Pictures Entertainment movies, which,
(15:03):
get ready, y'all, there's been a fighter bruin. That means
that the Spiderman movies are going to be exclusively streaming
to Netflix, which means Spiderman is not going to get
to join his buddies in the m c U over
at Disney. Plus. Yeah, that's it's a weird one for
me because they canceled all of the you know, the
(15:24):
Defenders level Marvel shows to get them to separate out
Disney material from Netflix. Although I know that there are
certain Marvel movies due to past deals that still continue
to be on Netflix as well. But it's also bad
news for Stars because Stars has been carrying a lot
of that Sony stuff. Yeah. Yeah, this is a kind
(15:46):
of leading into that world that people were worried about,
where you start seeing specific properties aligned with specific streaming services,
and it means that you have to make tough choice, say, is,
when it comes to which services you subscribe to, whether
you subscribe to multiple ones, how many do you subscribe
to until you're like, I'm spending way too much per
(16:09):
month just so that I have access to all these things.
Um yeah, no, me too. I actually was debating before
the recording of this podcast canceling one of my streaming
service subscriptions because I don't remember the last time I
actually accessed it. Yeah. I almost need like a Fantasy
(16:32):
football level spread chart of all of my different subscriptions
when the shows I like on each of them comes out,
so that I know when to start one and then
cancel it and start the other one. I have Netflix,
so and I do watch it. I love some of
the shows that are regular on there, and I can
also rewatch some of my old favorites. The other thing
about this is there I've heard a lot of speculation
(16:52):
on whether some of the two movies which is when
this is going to start, that are coming out or
going to go straight to streaming on Netflix things uncharted
or or more obous, or if they're going to do
what HBO max is doing and do a streaming and
theater release at the same time. I mean, that's all speculation,
but I am curious. I'm sure that I'm sure all
the theaters are now hoping that we'll go back to
(17:13):
the old ways of having, you know, several months in
between when a film comes out to hit theaters before
it starts streaming, so that it gives more reason to
go to theaters. But we still don't really know what
a post herd immunity world is going to look like.
I mean, there's no telling when we're going to actually
reach herd immunity vaccination rollout is still very much in
(17:37):
progress at the state we live in as is way behind,
so um, you know, there's there are a lot of
unanswered questions, and I think everyone is just sort of
hedging their bets right now. They're hoping to get back
to releasing films in theaters and getting those big box
office weekends. Then transitioning over to streaming. But I just
(17:58):
don't know if that's the world we're gonna go back
to yet or not. Yeah, me neither. I mean, I hope.
So I just got my second vaccination shot and I'm
not quite in the clear too to start, you know,
visiting friends yet. But even when I am, I don't
know how soon I'll be comfortable sitting in a theater
with people. I mean, if it's at an off time
(18:19):
and myself and my husband are the only people in there, sure,
but you know, if it's if it's a crowded theater,
I don't know when when I'll feel comfortable with you.
But now I feel the same way. Arial Well, we're
gonna take a quick break, and when we come back,
we're going to have a discussion about some things that
we think are sort of introductory materials to get people
(18:41):
into the geek world. Because for most of us, at
some point or another, we weren't geeks, but then we
had geek dum, either thrust upon us or we naturally
grew into it. So what properties are the ones that
kind of lead people down the geeky primrose path. We're
going to find that out after this quick break. So
(19:11):
you said that some of us were not geeks but
had geeks geeked m thrust upon us. I don't think
that actually applies to you or eye Jonathan. Well, no,
I was born into it. I mean my parents are
both science fiction authors. And uh yeah, I mean like
I my parents gave me a framed crayon picture that
(19:34):
I drew when I was four years old, and the
title of the picture is Gallum in the Ring. So yeah,
I was from birth a geek. But not everybody is, No. No.
I mean I've had quite a few friends that I've
had to introduce and ease into things like doctor Who.
So yeah, no, I mean, and some of us who
are lifelong geeks have had a physical rejection of doctor Who. Listen, Jonathan,
(19:59):
h That's okay. Even though I disagree with you, I'm
not saying it's bad. I'm just saying I couldn't get
into it, and I tried. I got all the way
to Matt Smith and I was like, I'm done. Look
that is that is definitely the case for I would
say a large group of people. You know, it is
pretty schlocky in some areas, But I do know that
(20:20):
you and I both have friends who are not necessarily geeks,
but we want to share that passion with them. I
know I do. I would say, like the thing that
I have found to be the most bridging and also
the most furious to me, it is something like Big
Bang Theory or even a little bit I T. Crowd.
(20:40):
I like the people who are on it. I don't
like this necessarily the stereotypes that it brings, but it
has opened up to like, you know a lot of
my coworkers or things like that, this love of geekdom
through the love of the geeks that are being portrayed. Yeah,
I feel you, They're Yeah. I have very strong links
about the Big Bang Theory. Uh. I have strong feelings
(21:03):
about the creator of the I T. Crowd for different,
totally different reasons. Um. I think the performances on the
I T. Crowd are really fun, and I think the
humor is really fun for most of it. There's some
episodes that are uh, you know, the word problematic is
used way too much, but there are some episodes that
(21:24):
are just not good. When you start to deconstruct where
the humor is coming from. There's one in particular I'm
thinking of, um, but Big Bang Theory has that problem
pretty much every every episode. After like halfway through the
first season, I felt Big Bang Theory started off cute.
In fact, let me tell you the first thing I
(21:45):
ever saw a Big Bang Theory which fooled me into
thinking this was a show that I was going to love.
It was an episode in which, uh, the characters are
bidding online for what they think of is I'm model
of the the H. G. Wells time Machine, the one
with a big disk. That is, it's like a chair
(22:06):
with a giant disc that's mounted behind it. The disc
slowly rotates, and they think they're they're bidding on a model,
and it turns out there bidding on a full scale
replica of the time machine. Like it's enormous, and they
set it up in their apartment and then they get
(22:27):
to take turns uh playing in the time machine, and
so one of them sits down and begins to move
the controls, and all the others suddenly start running around,
acting like they're moving in fast motion, like the idea
being that that the person is moving through time quickly.
That moment, I was like, this show is for me.
It's a celebration of geekdom. These are friends who are
(22:50):
encouraging this person's love of a particular piece of science fiction,
you know, icon iconography, and they are feeding into their
imagine Asian and that's wonderful. And then I watched another
episode and I thought, oh, that's not what this show is. No. Now,
I mean you laugh a lot at the geeks as
(23:10):
opposed to with them. Um, which is fine. I laugh
at myself and my friends all the time. But you know,
I do feel like, while it's not a proper uh
depiction of what a geek is in today's society, I
do feel like it has opened a lot of my
mundane friends up to looking at some of the superhero
(23:33):
stuff or sci fi stuff that those characters were interested in,
because they're interested in those characters. Well, let me ask
you this. So we both talked about being kind of
raised as geeks. Were there any kind of genres or
subgenres that you weren't necessarily a fan of from birth
that you kind of grew to love because of a
(23:56):
specific property. I know, I'm setting you up for like
a stumper of equation. If it helps, I can talk
about one for me. You go ahead and talk about
it first, because I do have to really think about this.
I've talked about this before, but for me, like the
movie Gremlins was kind of a gateway film into horror
for me because Gremlins, when you look at it's it's
(24:17):
a it's a horror comedy. Um. It's a little heavier
on the horror than well, a lot heavier on the
horror than its sequel, which is more of a zany comedy,
which I love, by the way. But the first Gremlins is, uh,
you know, it's not really scary if you're an adult,
not really. There's a couple of jump scares, but it's
not terrifying. As a kid, it was scarier, right, it's
(24:41):
playing upon your imagination. It's taking this cute little animal
and then spawning all these terrible monsters out of it,
and uh, the sort of the stuff of nightmares. But
it was also very accessible, like it wasn't over the
top gruesome or gory apart from like a blender scene
in a microwave scene. Um. And it was also had
(25:02):
entertaining moments, like funny moments in it, and that became
a gateway of what I got. The next movie I
can think of watching that falls into that category is
the Gate, which was another It's like a Canadian horror
movie that's really freaky but very accessible to kids. And
it also speaks to kids like, it doesn't speak down
to them. It speaks to kids like like they're adults
(25:26):
and it doesn't you know, patronize, And that, to me
is what started me watching horror films. And um, you know,
for a long time, I didn't really think that those
kind of movies existed anymore. And then a few years
ago the movie Crampus came out, and you know, it's
a Christmas themed horror movie, and Crampus felt a lot
(25:49):
like Gremlin's in spirit to me, and that again, it's
a movie that I feel like could be accessible to
a younger audience without it being you know, the gruesome
horror of say an Eli Roth movie, and uh, it
could get kids interested in horror and then sort of
lead them down that path of discovering other types of movies. See,
(26:10):
most of the genres that I've had to grow into,
I wouldn't have said as I was growing into them
that they were geek genres. So things like westerns or
military movies or or scary movies. You know, I enjoy
scary movies a lot more and scary television shows and
things like that as I've grown up and kind of
been able to separate the story from reality, which has
(26:31):
always been my big problem. Um. You know, the same
with with Western and and and war movies kind of
but again, like unless it's got that sci fi fantasy
aspect to it. Like I like King Arthur, I like
West World, but I'm not really gonna watch you know,
Apocalypse now. Um, I don't like a lot of military
(26:56):
sort of video games, but I like Halo. You know,
he's got that sci fi aspect to it. So that's
a hard one. Um, I would say that. Um, you know,
one of in our show notes, I wrote the m
c U is kind of a gateway because m c
U is definitely mainstream. I mean you look at like
some of the top performing movies in the last decade
(27:17):
and a half, and the vast majority of them, or
at least half of them, are superhero movies. And once
upon a time superheroes were kind of a niche thing,
but they are definitely mainstream, and I would argue that
sort of a gateway right there. I would say so too.
I think you know, myth busters or Sherlock or or
(27:40):
something like that that deals with the science, or the
mystery or or the at least the ideas of the fantastical,
because even though Sherlock, outside of the Irregulars, you know,
always has an explanation, there's always that little bit at
the beginning of what is what is happening here? You know,
Mr Robot Like, that's a sci fi but it's it's
kind of couched in a possible reality. I feel like
(28:01):
all of those are are great gateways for people into
things like science fiction. The one that really surprised me
that has spanned all of all of the people I
know almost is Game of Thrones. Yeah. Um, Game of Thrones.
You wouldn't think that high fantasy, would I mean? Granted,
Lord of the Rings that was a phenomenon too, right,
(28:24):
Like when the Lord of the Rings movies came out,
that also broke out beyond just fantasy geeks that was
filling up theaters. But Game of Thrones was such a
cultural phenomenon. You could argue that was because a lot
of the early shows were heavy on the violence and
the nudity, but there was obviously more than that. People
(28:46):
got connected to characters, they cared what was going on,
despite the fact that week after week they were taught
that you shouldn't like anybody because as soon as you do,
they're gonna die. Um, you know. But yeah, I would
say that that was one of those those shows where
if you had told me five years before Game of
Thrones came out that one of the top television series,
(29:09):
uh dominating ratings was going to be a fantasy series
based off of a series of novels, I would have
thought you were joking. Yeah, yeah, me too. And it's
it's weird because like some of the people I know
who are the fiercest fans are people who self admittedly
do not like any other fantasy. They don't like science fiction.
(29:32):
They barely like uh, you know, speculative fiction. So see,
it's that's weird to me because as a fan of
fantasy and science fiction and speculative fiction, I fell off
of Game of Thrones. Um. I've read the books as
far as they have been written so far, and then
(29:54):
I had only ever in fact, to this day, I've
only ever seen the first episode the television series. I
never watched beyond it. Um, I knew what happened, because
of course I did, because there was no way of
avoiding it. Everyone talked about it, but it was It
was at a point where the show finally got beyond
where the books left off, and a specific event happened
(30:18):
that convinced me to just walk away from the Game
of Thrones forever, uh and not look back. And it's
so interesting to me that so many people got heavily
invested and they stayed with that show all the way
to the end, and they don't care for other types
of fantasy, because I have the opposite experience, having a
love of fantasy but not being able to buy into
(30:41):
Game of Thrones, mostly because, if I'm being honest, it
felt like misery porn to me. I can definitely see that.
And I'll say, you know, I I watched the first
few seasons, and then I took a big break in
the middle, and then I watched the last two seasons
as well. Um, and I'll say that like the end
of it was much better than the getting of it,
and and much like the rebooted Battlestar Galactica or something
(31:03):
like that, I had to know what I was getting
into and like prepare myself to be able to appreciate it.
To be fair, I also have to do that with
Jurassic Park, which is I think another great gateway property
because it's science fiction based on something that people could
imagine happening. So yeah, at least a science fiction to me.
(31:24):
Maybe it's not officially science fiction. No, it's science fiction. Yeah,
it's absolutely. It's using science to to create clones of dinosaurs.
I mean that's about that's definitely science. I mean, if
you're telling me it's science fact, we gotta go Jurassic Park.
I know there's a new roller coaster. I mean that's
that's a Universal and I do want to ride that
(31:45):
as soon as it's safe for me to do. So, yeah, no,
I think it opens June eleven, and I'm like, uh,
when when will I feel comfortable enough to go to Universal?
First of all, I'm not going to Florida in June.
That's just not happening. It will be a little bit
warm then at the least, so interesting discussion. I'm very
(32:06):
curious if our listeners have suggestions of sort of gateway
properties that you feel are good introductions into the world
of geekdom, and you know, kind of maybe at a
at different age rage ranges as well, because obviously game
of Thrones would not be appropriate to show to like
a ten year old, but not at all. And so
here's the other thing is that, like my perception of
(32:28):
this is obviously shaped by my age. Like I brought
up Gremlins, which I don't know that I would show
that to a young kid, just because the pacing is different,
the effects are different. It's a you know, the way
things have changed. I'm not sure how well that movie
has aged with regard to a new audience, right, So
I'm curious if people have other suggestions. I mean, we
(32:51):
are getting a Gremlins cartoon, so maybe that'll reach the
newer generation. I wonder if Minecraft would be considered a
gateway property. Yeah, I don't know. Like whenever I see
anyone in a kid in a Minecraft shirt when we
were working the Renaissance Festival, if I saw them, I
would do the creeper thing, which sometimes they understood and
(33:13):
sometimes they didn't, and that's when I knew they just
played in creative mode. Yeah. Yeah, Well, we do hope
to hear from you on you know, your opinions of
of gateway properties, things that got you into the geekdom. Uh,
But first we've got to give you a mash up,
and before that, we've got to take a quick break aerial. Yes,
(33:53):
so no one told you life was going to be
this way. Your jobs, oke, you're broke, you love Life's
d o A. Looks like you always stuck in second year.
Hasn't been your day, your week, your month, or even
your year. What's our mash up? Um? It's Loki meets
(34:16):
Friends trying to work in. I'll be there for you. No,
I didn't give you any opportunity. No, no, it's fine. Yeah,
So Jonathan and I are both excited about Loki. That's
even though we didn't talk about it this week in
our new segment, We've talked about it plenty of times.
Really looking forward to that series, I mean The Falcon
and The Winter Soldier. I'm still enjoying despite some reservations
(34:39):
about some of the episodes. But I cannot wait for Loki.
Me me neither. And something people have waited for for
a long time is the Friends special coming out to
HBO Max we got which got delayed twice but has
finally finished up filming, so it's finally wrapped and I
(34:59):
know it. Friends is not it's more pop culture than
geek culture, although I feel like the lines are really
blurred nowadays because if you take a show like Friends
that was popular, you know, sixteen years ago, dear goodness,
and people are still enjoying it today, that kind of
makes it a geek, don't Oh yeah, no, I I
think so. And it's like the fact that I will
(35:22):
see some kids who weren't even born when the show
came out talking about watching the show blows my mind
because I never thought of it being a show that
would have that kind of staying power. Then again, I mean,
like I grew up watching reruns that had long been
off the air by the time I was a kid,
so it's not like it's that unusual. Um. But yeah,
(35:45):
So we decided that we were going to take the
property of Friends and mash it up with Loki and
find out what the heck happens. And I can't wait
to find out what Ariel did. Okay, so this may
not go the direction you expected to. It didn't go
the direction I expected to, and I was writing it,
but this is called Could you be anymore trickster? Uh?
(36:09):
I love it already all right? After past Loki stole
the test rack a k a. The Shiny Blue ventry Cube.
In two thousand twelve, we all know he got captured
by the Time Variance Authority. That's what the New Loki
shows about, and he was forced to fix all of
the timelines that his actions created. He was pretty good
at it, and the tv A decided to keep him
(36:30):
around once he had cleaned up his own mess. Unfortunately,
the t v A didn't trust Loki as far as
they could throw him, which isn't very far. I don't
know if you know this, but half frost giants are
actually pretty dense. Uh So, when they weren't using him,
he was relegated to a cell, and the only show
that played on his tiny cell television was reruns of Friends.
(36:53):
Loki hated it at first, but eventually the show grew
on him like Chandler's third nipple, and he started wishing
he could live in the Friends universe instead of at
the end of time with the Time Variants Authority. Uh So,
he started making plans each time the t v A
sent him out, and he encountered a variant of an
avenger in a timeline. Just as he was about to
(37:16):
prune and end that timeline, he would sneakily abduct that
adventure variant and stick them into his own little secret
pocket dimension to inhabit his own little friends world. Soon
he had variants of Bruce Banner, Scarlet Witch, Black Widow,
iron Man, and of course Thor, and he knew it
was time to make his move. He disappeared into the
(37:37):
pocket dimension, magick ng the portal behind him to lock
it closed, and created his own little corner of New
York in scepter perk Uh. He made himself the Monica
of the group because of course she's the master planner.
Iron Man, because he was neurotic, became Chandler, black Widow
with her outward put togetherness appearance, but secretly soft soft
(38:01):
heart became Rachel. Bruce Banner was ross who, if you
aren't familiar with friends, is kind of short tempered himself,
and Thor became, as Loki viewed it, the stupid dummy
poopoo head Joey, and Scarlett Witch was made Phoebe because mysticalness. Anyhow,
things went well for Loki at first, and he was
(38:22):
happy because everyone else was slightly miserable. Tony being was
really good at what he did, but no one knew
without was or even cared Bruce Geller constantly was a
doormat and an effort not to get mad or show
his cards, and only occasionally punched a dinosaur bone. Uh.
Tasha Green Natasha hated serving coffee and doory was living
(38:45):
in a state of constant rejection. How old thou doing
Wanda Buffet did seem a little off, but that wasn't
out of her character either. Unfortunately, what Loki didn't know
was that he had nabbed the variant of Scarlett Witch
that had just come out of the hex in one division,
(39:08):
and she quickly recognized the pattern uh that she was in.
It was so similar to what she had just been
through she knew something was up, and she devised a plan.
The plan would require her to out herself to Loki, though,
so she told Loki, Hey, I see what you're doing
one magic user to another. Uh. But it's cool. I'm
(39:28):
down with it. Uh. And she convinced Loki that his
little version of Scepter Perk didn't mean anything if other
people couldn't see his genius and appreciate it. So, in
a moment of vain oversight, Loki replaced all versions of
Friends across all universes with his own I want to
knew that someone would see the broadcast and realize what
(39:48):
was happening and stop Loki, But then she worried that
he would be too clever for that and see that coming,
so she had to get him to hobble his intelligence,
so she played to his pride and jealousy. He pointed
out how happy Thor was it getting all the girls
and having all the sandwiches and you know, all the
hell you doing, And if Loki switched places with him,
(40:09):
not only would he have this universe where people could
appreciate his genius, but he would also be the most
popular Thor being. Monica would realize what was wrong, but
wouldn't be able to fix it, and everything would be perfect.
Loki fell for it, locked away his intelligence to become
the perfect Joey, So when the tv A did track
(40:29):
him down and broke into his pocket to mention to
free everyone, he was unable to stop them. So the
tv A freed everybody, uh and unfortunately got rid of
them because that's what they do with alternate timelines. But
they didn't get rid of Loki. He was still really
good at what he did. They put him back in
his cell, took away his TV and to give him
(40:52):
a little bit extra bit of punishment, they made him
subsist on meatball subs and coffee for the rest of
his existence. I uh, I love your take. It is
so different from mine. It was amazing. I love that
there was some one division in there that was fantastic too,
really creative. I love it. Um Okay, So here's mine.
(41:16):
It's called with friends low keys. Um. Yeah, instead of
like with with like with friends like these Okay. Ross
has a problem. He was looking forward to sitting down
and eating the infamous turkey moist Maker sandwich. You know,
the sandwich has turkey stuffing, piece of gravy soaked bread
(41:38):
in the middle, some cranberries. But someone appears to have
eaten it again. And it's been years since he worked
for Dr Leadbetter. Who could have done such a thing. Well,
as it turns out that who is a trickster god
by the name of Loki, adopted son to Odin and
brother to Thor. Yes, Loki is Ross's new roommate. Chandler's
(41:59):
liveing with Monica. Joey is not really hanging out with
him anymore, and well, Ross just has to deal with this.
Ross discovers Loki's transgressions, and the god seems amused, that
is until Ross and righteous fury begins to advance on Loki.
Fearing for his life, and Ross is anchored is beyond
(42:21):
even that of a frost giant. Loki decides he has
to open up a portal and jump in it, but
he doesn't close it fast enough, and next thing he knows,
Ross is right on his tail in another dimension. Loki
on the Run begins a desperate series of jumps from
one reality to the next. One moment, he's in New
York running through a comedian's apartment as the comedians having
(42:42):
a conversation with his group of friends, and it's all
about nothing and all of his friends are terrible, and
Ross chases after him, saying excuse me, Mr Seinfeld. As
he does, then a portal opens into a restaurant called Riffs,
where a couple named Paul and Jamie Buckman are having
dinner and a waitress named Ursula is doing a really
bad job of taking their order, and Loki dives over
(43:05):
the table and out through the door, pursued by Ross,
who yells hi phoebe to Ursula, who looks like really annoyed,
and then Loki passes into a portal and then appears
in a living room where a small, furry brown creature
is chasing after a cat and calling it a snack.
He doesn't waste another second as Ross closes in goes
through another portal. Loki then jumps into yeah, another portal
(43:26):
stop short, looks around. Ross jumps right through behind Loki
collides with him, but before Ross can throw a punch,
he too stops and looks around, and the two are
in a vast building with these weird balconies that look
down into the open center of this very tall structure,
their elevators going up and down in a central bank
in the middle of it, and it is in fact
(43:48):
the Marriott Marquis in downtown Atlanta. I'm sorry, wait, wait, no,
I'm sorry. It's the Time Variance Authority or tv A headquarters. Ross,
catching his breath, asks Loki where they ended up, and
Loki doesn't know. But then they both encounter Owen Wilson,
who explains that in order to fix all the timelines
that have been broken, they're gonna have to go through
(44:09):
and have a series of adventures throughout all these different
realities of various NBC sitcoms, and he explains that sure
Friends in Seinfeld co exists because of a tenuous connection
thanks to Matt about You. But Alf is right out.
So Loki and Ross, the most unlikeliest of duo's, set
up out on a series of adventures to repair the multiverse,
(44:29):
and they visit different timelines, They get into scrapes, they
find clever escapes, and finally they end up back in
New York at Central Perk. Everything has been set right. Ross, flabbergasted,
exhausted trying to process everything that has happened, sits down
on the couch, just slumps into the couch. And during
(44:50):
their adventures, Loki managed to snag Ross's sandwich before past
Loki could actually eat it, so he hands over the
sandwich to a grateful Ross, who sets it reverently upon
the table. Loki walks out of the coffee shop just
as Ross's friends, you know, the ones from the title,
come inside and they sit down and they talk about
(45:11):
their day, and then they noticed that Ross is there
and they asked him how he's doing, and Ross, a
little bit at a loss for words, tries to explain,
but the friends kind of get really bored until Ross
Here's Joey said, say, man, this is a good sandwich.
And yes, Joey has picked up Ross's sandwich and started
eating it as Ross tried to talk about his day.
So of course Ross murders Joey the end. I loved it.
(45:37):
I now wish I had put more m c U
television shows into my mashup to match the level of
the only reason I did that was because I happened
to remember that Friends was linked to Mad About You,
because the character of Ursula showed up and Mad about
You before Friends was ever a thing. Then Friends established
(45:58):
that Ursula and Phoebe are twit ends, and then in
an episode about Mad About You, it was indicated that
at one point, Paul Riser's character lived in the apartment
that Kramer lived in, and so that means all three
of those shows have to exist in the same shared universe.
That's brilliant. I also love that Owen Wilson was owned. Yes,
(46:19):
Owen Wilson like this because I don't know what his
character name is and Loki, so he's just Owen Wilson.
It's Morbius and Morbius. But it was that was such
a great mashup. I loved it. I almost almost did
something with that turkey sandwich too. It's the one that
it's the it's the episode I always think about because
(46:40):
it's also the you referenced the fact that you know
Bruce Banner and yours was ross because of the rage thing,
and that's the episode that that started off that whole
rage storyline. That's where he had to start taking the
medication for his rage. Yes. Yes, so that was a
lot of fun. But if you guys out there have
an idea of how you would mash up Loki and Friends,
(47:04):
we really do want to hear it, so you should
write to us, Yes, right to us. The email address
is l n C at I heart media dot com.
That's where you can send your long form messages. If
you want to be brief you have a really short version,
you can reach out on Twitter. The handle we use
there is ellen c Underscore Podcast, or you can drop
(47:28):
us a line on Facebook or Instagram where we are
large nerdron Collider. And if you would like to visit
our website where we include stuff like show notes, that's
large nerdron collidor dot com. Yes, and if you like
the show, tell your friends, make sure you subscribe. You know,
the more people that listen, the more people right in
and give us great ideas for mashups or their takes
(47:51):
on our topics. And we just love having that conversation
with everything. It's a lot of fun. We really enjoy it.
Thank you for listening. Until next time. I am Jonathan
Strickland and I am Ariel swamp Thing Casting m m
(48:21):
m m hm. The Large Nur John Collider is production
of I Heart Radio and was created by Ariel cast In.
Jonathan Strickland is the executive producer. This show is produced,
edited and published by Tory Harrison. For more podcasts on
my heart Radio, visit the I heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,
(48:43):
or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
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